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And step back from your ideological or self-interested blinders for a moment to consider one possibility. Unions are neither inherently good nor inherently bad. Neither are corporations watching the “bottom line” that half of you seem so pissed about. If there wasn’t a profit to be made, why would people run the businesses that produce the things we want? I promise you, if you make it unprofitable for people to produce things, they will stop and get other jobs.

But neither unions or companies can pretend like they are in any way morally superior to the other. Do any of you know what a union is? It is a business that sells labor! If the supply of certain types of labor can be consolidated under one organization, you can exert leverage upon those who want to buy it. With a union, you force companies to pay more for labor. If the companies find that this makes their entire enterprise unprofitable, they will go out of business, the owners will go become executives elsewhere, and no one is any better off. However, if the companies can do so, they will pass on the burden of paying the increased labor cost to the consumers.

One way or another…through taxes or through more expensive toothpaste, you will be paying for Wal-MArt’s workers.

Next, who has the right to tell anyone how to run their own business? If you want influence over Wal-MArt, buy their stock! Otherwise, it is like telling your neighbor how to raise their kids.

Furthermore, no one is forcing these people to work at Wal-Mart. If there was no wal-mart, these people would be working for the same amount of money. THink about that! If these people had the intelligence or skill to work anywhere else, they would do so. Taxpayers would still pay for their healthcare, and if the jobs were more dangerous, we’d pay more in health care. But they don’t, so they work at Wal-Mart…

Union plumber guy above, Dave I guess… don’t talk about the immense benefits of unions until you can spell correctly and use decent grammar. Do they have training for that? And don’t get pissed off…your parents could write well, and so can you. And also… Wal-Mart is not a nuclear power plant.

Cinder…there is much you have missed. See my comments above. Specifically, if you pay people more, they can buy more? Right? Wrong, cinder… you are using really sloppy logic. Your argument misses several things. Some people save money when they have it in excess. If you pay people more, the money to do so has to come from somewhere, right? Where does it come from? Either from consumers or from taxpayers or from other employees (in another region or in some other funcitonal capacity within the organization). Why should the workers become entitled to spend that money instead of the consumers or the taxpayers. The point is…buying power stays the same.

Also, a deficit is not the same as debt…google it to find out how.

Don’t even get me started on China…our stock market and our economic growth would be a good bit slower if it weren’t for those cheape chinese manufactured goods. We benefit because wealth chinese men sell us salve labor to make things that are unprofitable to make here (unprofitable means you have to pay someone more to make it than you can charge someone to buy it). Our economy…indeed, the entire world’s economy…is benefitting because of the near-slave conditions in China. If you want more american jobs, new businesses, more growth… buy more chinese goods! If you pay less for them, that is more money you have to spend on other things “made in america” like fast food and cigarettes and cable TV… yea, America!

Moreover, running trade deficits traditionally has no definite relationship to long-term economic growth. That depends on two things…the absense of contraining LAWS and the presence of good EDUCATION. The only way value (hence money) is created in the world is through people using their heads to figure out better ways of doing things. GOod education does better than any other method to create good thinkers. Good thinkers create value…they don’t just figure out a way to take it from someone else.

Finally…we should not be surprised about what is going on between Wal-MArt and the unions. THis is comeptition among powerful organizations with inhrently different interests. These interests are determined by the position the organization occupies in the economic chain. The more they fight, the more efficient they both have to be. Pitting power against power is the only way to ensure that both sides are kept in check. If either side brings the other to its knees, then we are all screwed until some other organization rises up to challenge it. Such is the way of the world, of politics, and of the market. We should be glad they are competing…wal-mart loking out for capital and the unions looking out for labor. The only problem is that there is no one looking out for the consumer (Wal-MArt does, but only after it looks out for itself).

In closing…let me make some suggestions. Quit getting your information from the TV news…any channel. It is all poison. You are worse off doing that than not keeping up at all. Read books, for God’s sake people…read the Economist magazine. Read anything besides mainstream american media. You’ll never know the answers if you keep doing so.

And please, try not to let your individual pshychology, your pride, your personal experience, or your arrogance get in the way of a reasoned debate. If you want to bitch at people becasue they see things differently from you, join a church. If you want to find the answers to questions about business strategy, economics, finance, and politics…pick up some books, study, do the math, abandon your own personal biases, and engage one another is calm, reasoned debate.

I shouldn’t ahve to be telling any of you about all of this.

‘Explanations for this well-orchestrated campaign are to be found in the economic self-interest motivations of labor unions and Wal-Mart’s retail competitors. Wal-Mart has managed to succeed without too much interference from labor unions. Like political systems – which, in America, provide government certified unions with coercive, monopoly status over the workforce – labor unions depend upon creating conflict between “employees� and “employers.� To the degree they are successful, unions also generate conflict between “union� and “non-union� workers. By maintaining employment practices that minimize management/employee conflict, Wal-Mart has made it difficult for unions to solicit their employees for membership.�

Like the Bush administration you are DEAD WRONG!!!!
China mart has a lot of “management/employee conflicts” (Just do a google search). They show a one hour tape when they hire you.Thirty mins. devoted to anti-union babble. I have you know that my employer and many in the surrounding counties loves being union.. We are well qualified to do our jobs, we don’t get payed holidays or vacations. We work or don’t get payed. We come with all our welding certs, all of our OSHA certs, they don’t have to worried the rising health cost. When they need more help they just call..I haven’t but many of my brothers have ,more then once bailed out a non-union company.A lot of time, that contractor remains as a union contractor.Before I joined the union I heard all the babble also, and you know? NONE of it was true.Company’s are finding out its a pay me now or pay me later deal. Just cheaper to pay me now that save all the lawyer fees.

As far as Costco goes ALL retail stores sell Non-MADE IN USA goods. Its up to ALL OF US to NOT buy them when we have a choice. Is that “WE SUPPORT OUR TROOPS ” ribbon on your car made in the USA or some where else. Seems kinda silly doesn’t it. You support our American Troops, and you prove it with a Chinese sign…

Comment by cinder — April 10th, 2005 @ 11:42 am

Tony ~ COSTCO does fine. I go out of my way to go there and pass two WalMats and a Sam’s Club on the way. COSTCO benefits by paying their workers better wages because then they have less turn over. I refuse to step inside a WalMART with all their China comm (communist) goods. The truth is that most of our debt is to China. If they decide to ask for payment we lose and communism wins.

Great way to be cinder

There is nothing wrong with trading with Asian people – your guilt.

This article is so riddled with economic fallacies, I can’t help but smile. China is NOT the problem.

the blame must be laid on Bush and Greenspan. If you have lower interest rates to negative levels in real terms ( The Fed funds rate is even after the small increases lately at only 2.25% while the CPI has risen 3.5% and asset prices even more) then this will discourage savings and encourage investments. And a country which has lower savings than investments will have a trade deficit (or more strictly a current account deficit). And of course, the large budget deficit and the large dis-savings that constitute has further aggravated the problem.

In the past several years, a virtual industry has been created in bashing Wal-Mart. From leftist church groups to the AFL-CIO to the Chronicles, Wal-Mart has been the favorite whipping boy of people on all sides of the political spectrum. Thus, it was no surprise when I recently received an emailed article from the quasi-Marxist Sojourners magazine not only attacking Wal-Mart for the usual set of “sins” that the critics claim, but also a new transgression: Wal-Mart’s business practices, on net, make our economy worse off and leave us poorer.

http://www.mises.org/fullstory.aspx?Id=1714

Of course, Sojourners since its original inception about 30 years ago has railed against what it calls “consumerism.” Now, the term “ism” would seem to represent an ideology or way of thinking, but it is difficult to claim that choosing to purchase relatively inexpensive goods is an ideology. What the editors of Sojourners, along with their fellow ideological travelers, really dislike is the fact that low-income earners are able to purchase low-price goods without the aid of the state, or at least that Wal-Mart is a private, not state-run outfit.

(As a semi-regular reader of Sojourners since the magazine was begun, I can assure readers of this article that scarcely an issue passes without the editors or writers advocating more power to the state, along with the increase of government regulation and the demise of private property. Moreover, the editors and writers always invoke religious arguments to buttress their anti-capitalist ideology.)

‘Explanations for this well-orchestrated campaign are to be found in the economic self-interest motivations of labor unions and Wal-Mart’s retail competitors. Wal-Mart has managed to succeed without too much interference from labor unions. Like political systems – which, in America, provide government certified unions with coercive, monopoly status over the workforce – labor unions depend upon creating conflict between “employees” and “employers.” To the degree they are successful, unions also generate conflict between “union” and “non-union” workers. By maintaining employment practices that minimize management/employee conflict, Wal-Mart has made it difficult for unions to solicit their employees for membership.”

http://www.lewrockwell.com/shaffer/shaffer75.html