Unlike Berger Docs, Duplicates of Missing Roberts File May Not Exist
Unlike Berger Docs, Duplicates of Missing Roberts File May Not Exist
When news broke last year that former national security advisor Sandy Berger was under investigation for removing several National Archives documents, conservatives quickly jumped to sinister conclusions. They claimed that Berger was trying to keep the documents from being seen by members of the 9/11 Commission.
Fox News host Brit Hume claimed that Berger was afraid the documents showed that President Clinton had been “too soft†on terrorists. The theory that Berger was “trying to cover either his tracks or Bill Clinton’s tracks†made “more sense than anything else,†Hume said. Likewise, William Kristol asserted that Berger was trying to steal the original copies of the documents. “It’s not correct to say that there are copies of what Sandy Berger took away elsewhere.â€
And so went the attacks from prominent conservatives. House Speaker Dennis Hastert said Berger had tried to “hide information” from the 9/11 Commission. Tom DeLay even likened Berger’s behavior to “third-rate burglary.â€
Just one problem – the central claim of their argument turned out to be false. The papers that Sandy Berger removed were not originals at all. They were actually copies of a report that was reportedly spread widely around the administration when it was released in 1999. This explains why Justice Department investigators found that Berger “‘did not have an intent to hide any of the content of the documents’ or conceal facts from the commission investigating the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.”
The opposite is true in the case of the missing John Roberts documents. As the Washington Post stated today, “No duplicates of the folder’s contents were made before the lawyers’ review.†In other words, unlike the Berger case, the missing file may very well contain the sole original copies of some documents. And more importantly, unlike the Berger case, anyone interested in concealing the information in those documents could do so by stealing them.
So where are the right-wing super-sleuths now?
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At least Roberts files aren’t falling out of his zipper hole.
August 17th, 2005 at 4:38 pmYeah, if the story doesn’t involve a wang, Republicans aren’t interested.
August 17th, 2005 at 4:39 pmYou guys beat me to it — if it doesn’t involve the stuffing of pants – one way or other – the Republicans don’t care.
August 17th, 2005 at 4:46 pmOT but breaking
http://www.growohio.org/
RIP OHIO GOP
August 17th, 2005 at 5:18 pmThis is much ado about nothing. Who cares what Roberts thinks about Affirmative Action. There are a lot more important issues out there…
August 17th, 2005 at 5:53 pmThis is bullshit. Wait and see what comes out next:
Berger inadvertently took copies of several versions of an after-action memo on the millennium bombing plot from the Archives last fall, said his attorney Lanny Breuer. The lawyer said one or more of the copies were then inadvertently discarded…The missing copies, according to Breuer and their author, Richard A. Clarke, the counterterrorism chief in the Clinton administration and early in President Bush’s administration, were versions of after-action reports recommending changes following threats of terrorism as 1999 turned to 2000. Clarke said he prepared about two dozen ideas for countering terrorist threats. The recommendations were circulated among Cabinet agencies, and various versions of the memo contained additions and refinements, Clarke said last night
Clarke says your a full of shit TP, he said there were differant versions of the memo, not copies.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A62776-2004Jul19.html
An associate of Berger told CNN the former national security adviser admitted to the Justice Department he originally took five copies of an after-action report — one during his September 2003 visit to the Archives and four during his October 2003 trip.
When he returned to his office and compared the copies he had, he believed several were basically the same, the associate said.
He admitted to officials that he then used scissors to cut up three copies that night while at his office, they said. At first he had said he had either misplaced or unintentionally thrown them away.
When Archives officials contacted him after they realized documents were missing, he told them about the two copies he had and returned them, along with the handwritten notes he had taken, they said. He did not say anything about the three copies he had destroyed.
Clinton had asked Berger to review thousands of pages of documents related to the millennium terror plot and its aftermath for submission to the September 11th commission. While reviewing those documents, his lawyer said, Berger inadvertently took some classified documents and intentionally took handwritten notes he put together while reviewing the documents.
Last July, when the removal became public, Berger told reporters he had made an “honest mistake.”
“It is one I deeply regret. I dealt with this issue in October 2003, fully and completely. Everything that I have done all along in this process has been for the purpose of aiding and supporting the work of the 9/11 commission and any suggestion to the contrary is simply, absolutely wrong,” Berger said
http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/04/01/berger.plea/
When the CIA finally told the FBI that al-Midhar and al-Hazmi were in the country in late August, agents in New York searched for the suspects. But because of the wall, FBI Headquarters refused to allow criminal investigators who knew the most about the most recent al Qaeda attack to join the hunt for the suspected terrorists.
At that time, a frustrated FBI investigator wrote Headquarters, quote, “Whatever has happened to this — someday someone will die — and wall or not — the public will not understand why we were not more effective and throwing every resource we had at certain ‘problems’. Let’s hope the National Security Law Unit will stand behind their decision then, especially since the biggest threat to us, UBL, is getting the most protection.”
FBI Headquarters responded, quote: “We are all frustrated with this issue … These are the rules. NSLU does not make them up.”
But somebody did make these rules. Someone built this wall.
The basic architecture for the wall in the 1995 Guidelines was contained in a classified memorandum entitled “Instructions on Separation of Certain Foreign Counterintelligence and Criminal Investigations.” The memorandum ordered FBI Director Louis Freeh and others, quote: “We believe that it is prudent to establish a set of instructions that will more clearly separate the counterintelligence investigation from the more limited, but continued, criminal investigations. These procedures, which go beyond what is legally required, will prevent any risk of creating an unwarranted appearance that FISA is being used to avoid procedural safeguards which would apply in a criminal investigation.”
This memorandum established a wall separating the criminal and intelligence investigations following the 1993 World Trade Center attack, the largest international terrorism attack on American soil prior to September 11. Although you understand the debilitating impact of the wall, I cannot imagine that the Commission knew about this memorandum, so I have declassified it for you and the public to review. Full disclosure compels me to inform you that its author is a member of this Commission.
By 2000, the Justice Department was so addicted to the wall, it actually opposed legislation to lower the wall. Finally, the USA PATRIOT ACT tore down this wall between our intelligence and law enforcement personnel in 2001. And when the PATRIOT ACT was challenged, the FISA Court of Review upheld the law, ruling that the 1995 guidelines were required by neither the Constitution nor the law.
The third issue I would like to raise with the Commission this afternoon is another limitation government placed on our ability to “connect the dots” of the terrorist threat prior to September 11: the lack of support for information technology at the FBI.
After I became Attorney General in February 2001, it soon became clear that the FBI’s computer technology and information management was in terrible shape. The Bureau essentially had 42 separate information systems, none of which were connected. Agents lacked even the most basic Internet technology.
These problems did not just hamper interagency communication; they hindered information sharing with the Justice Department, the intelligence community, and state and local law enforcement. It is no wonder, given the state of its technology, that the Phoenix memo warning that terrorists may be training in commercial aviation was lost in the antique computers at Washington headquarters.
Yet for year after year, the FBI was denied the funds requested for its information technology. Over eight years, the Bureau was denied nearly $800 million of its information technology funding requests. To put this $800 million shortfall in perspective, the Trilogy program, which is now revolutionizing computer, data and information sharing at the Bureau, has cost $580 million.
On September 11, 2001, the FBI’s annual technology budget under the prior Administration was actually $36.1 million less than the last Bush budget eight years before. The FBI’s information infrastructure had been starved and by September 11 it collapsed from budgetary neglect.
When the Hannsen and McVeigh failures fully exposed that this neglect cost national security, I ordered four independent external reviews of the FBI’s information infrastructure under coordination from the Deputy Attorney General. And my first two budgets, both proposed before 9/11, requested a 50 percent increase for FBI information technology.
Finally, the Commission should study carefully the National Security Council plan to disrupt the al Qaeda network in the U.S. that our government failed to implement fully seventeen months before September 11.
The NSC’s Millennium After Action Review declares that the United States barely missed major terrorist attacks in 1999 — with luck playing a major role. Among the many vulnerabilities in homeland defenses identified, the Justice Department’s surveillance and FISA operations were specifically criticized for their glaring weaknesses. It is clear from the review that actions taken in the Millennium Period should not be the operating model for the U.S. government.
In March 2000, the review warns the prior Administration of a substantial al Qaeda network and affiliated foreign terrorist presence within the U.S., capable of supporting additional terrorist attacks here.
Furthermore, fully seventeen months before the September 11 attacks, the review recommends disrupting the al Qaeda network and terrorist presence here using immigration violations, minor criminal infractions, and tougher visa and border controls.
These are the same aggressive, often criticized law enforcement tactics we have unleashed for 31 months to stop another al Qaeda attack. These are the same tough tactics we deployed to catch Ali al- Marri, who was sent here by al Qaeda on September 10, 2001, to facilitate a second wave of terrorist attacks on Americans.
Despite the warnings and the clear vulnerabilities identified by the NSC in 2000, no new disruption strategy to attack the al Qaeda network within the United States was deployed. It was ignored in the Department’s five-year counterterrorism strategy.
http://www.usdoj.gov/ag/testimony/2004/041304terrorismtestimony.htm
http://www.usdoj.gov/ag/testimony/2004/1995_gorelick_memo.pdf
08/17/05 “New York Times” — WASHINGTON, Aug. 16 – A military intelligence team repeatedly contacted the F.B.I. in 2000 to warn about the existence of an American-based terrorist cell that included the ringleader of the Sept. 11 attacks, according to a veteran Army intelligence officer who said he had now decided to risk his career by discussing the information publicly.
The officer, Lt. Col. Anthony Shaffer, said military lawyers later blocked the team from sharing any of its information with the bureau.
Colonel Shaffer said in an interview on Monday night that the small, highly classified intelligence program, known as Able Danger, had identified the terrorist ringleader, Mohamed Atta, and three other future hijackers by name by mid-2000, and tried to arrange a meeting that summer with agents of the Washington field office of the Federal Bureau of Investigation to share its information.
But he said military lawyers forced members of the intelligence program to cancel three scheduled meetings with the F.B.I. at the last minute, which left the bureau without information that Colonel Shaffer said might have led to Mr. Atta and the other terrorists while the Sept. 11 attacks were still being planned.
The account from Colonel Shaffer, a reservist who is also working part time for the Pentagon, corroborates much of the information that the Sept. 11 commission has acknowledged it received about Able Danger last July from a Navy captain who was also involved with the program but whose name has not been made public. In a statement issued last week, the leaders of the commission said the panel had concluded that the intelligence program “did not turn out to be historically significant.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/17/politics/17intel.html?ei=5094&en=55bd2891c82760c6&hp=&ex=1124251200&partner=homepage&pagewanted=print
August 17th, 2005 at 5:58 pmWow, that’s some comment. Now if only it weren’t so rambling and nonsensical…
August 17th, 2005 at 6:04 pmrobin – I don’t know that there is any ONE issue that would make or break his candidacy within the progressive camp. Unlike the anti-abortion crowd where they really only care FULLY about one issue, we have many brands in the fire.
And that’s the point of our concern here. We want to be able to evaluate his position on MANY areas, and in our minds, the “missing” documents smells like rove outing Plame/Wilson. This administration stinks to hell & back.
Now, I know what I think, but I haven’t made up my mind yet. The way bushco & all his minions are acting though is pushing us into the forgetaboutit category. I would think you could see that. I would think that bushco knows that too. With that in mind it makes me wonder why they continually want to have a group to rally against.
Frankly, I think that’s his main offensive thrust. He baits a group, then rally’s his troops in the name of all that is good and pure.
Aren’t you bushies tired of being cannon fodder yet? Don’t you see you are being used?
Bush43 isn’t:
August 17th, 2005 at 6:08 pm1) conservative – he’s totalitarian.
2) fiscally responsible – 2 trillion dollars in debt & growing from dumbya alone.
3) small government – he’s increased government across the board for everything but the environmental side.
4) a friend of the little guy – that $300 refund sure was a stinker next to bush43’s buddies $50,000 and up refunds.
5) christian – christians aren’t supposed to lie like that.
6) nice. at least Clinton was genuinely a nice guy.
7) honest – he lies to us every single day.
8) a friend of our GI’s – can I say cannon fodder for oil profits one more time? Yea I will.
That was a lot of cutting and pasting – it is too bad that Bushie chose to ignore the previous administration’s advice – and instead criticized it for trying to shoot a “camel in the ass,” when an attempt was made on OBL. The Republican senate and house were way too absorbed in avoiding Monica-gate, and the discrediting of Clinton and the (s)election of their fair-haired boy. Clinton’s administration was avoiding another Somalia with charges of wag-the-dog.
August 17th, 2005 at 6:15 pmHindsight.
You only have ONE brand in the fire. Criticize the president and the United State of America while offering no ideas or solutions. When are you going to realize that Bush won’t be running for president in 08?
August 17th, 2005 at 6:24 pmMaybe he was hiding the State Department report, which the Clinton’s took so seriously and did so much to counteract al Qaida like _________, and ___________, then _________ and finally bombing al Shifa because Osama was working with Iraqi nerve gas agents, at least that is what they told us….
If Able Danger is correct, then how is the 9/11 Report to be valid in its assessment of Iraq and al Qaida when they cannot even unearth intelligence information from the United States?
But John Roberts, he is a sinister SOB for being in the Federalist Society, that jerk…
August 17th, 2005 at 6:33 pmYou guys are idiots. You don’t read what we say & just stand on your soapbox and cry.
August 17th, 2005 at 6:48 pmcolt you ignorant slut – does what you say follow what I said at all. I gave multiple reasons for wanting to know more about roberts. Have you no decency at long last sir? No you don’t.
strathmore- what’s up with a name like strathmore? Curt Waldon is a fool. the thread is about Roberts. Stay on topic or start your own blog.
Kindness, I see your name reflects your posts (ignorant sl_t)…
August 17th, 2005 at 6:54 pmCrying and soapbox are the province of this forum…
And I did not know you were the posting enforcer, will you beat me up if I don’t obey??
“If Able Danger is correct, then how is the 9/11 Report to be valid in its assessment of Iraq and al Qaida when they cannot even unearth intelligence information from the United States?”
The commission repeatedly made this complaint, that the Bush administration was not fully cooperative in releasing information. You’re right on there.
So help us get the uncooperative Republicans out of power, will you?
August 17th, 2005 at 6:56 pm“The NSC’s Millennium After Action Review declares that the United States barely missed major terrorist attacks in 1999 — with luck playing a major role.”
You know the old saying, the harder I work, the luckier I get. Bush wasn’t very lucky on his vacation ranch in 2001, was he?
August 17th, 2005 at 7:01 pmClinton was getting lucky in the oval office while OBL was formulating his plans to kill Americans.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:05 pmMore like Al Qaida was infiltrated and being watched, Clinton informed Bush and Bush chose to ignore accidently on purpose.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:11 pmWhy can’t these trolls be blocked? We all know who they are and they never have a meaningful comment. Take your crap to a republican blog site, Oh wait, you can’t make comments there because republicans don’t want to hear what anyone has to say.
The Roberts files are probably stashed in the same place as the Iran Contra files that King Ron Reagan lost when he was scheduled to testify after he left office. Although in his case, he might have forgot were he put them. The King is dead, long live the King.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:12 pmI see Nico has joined Mipe’s and Judd’s correspondence school of distorted news interpretation. This news and the Berger case are entirely different.
Unlike the Berger documents, these were not sensitive documents about our national security. Unlike the Berger documents, these documents never left the building in anyone’s trousers, but were merely reviewed under supervision. Unlike the Berger documents, the archivists in charge have determined that this file (it is a single file, one of thousands) was likely returned to its original place (archivist Sharon Fawcett says it is “very difficult to believe it’s anyone other than ourselves responsible for this loss”), but later was misplaced. Unlike the Berger documents, there is no evidence of deliberate document destruction. Unlike the Berger documents, this file was reconstructed with the help of one of the lawyers who reviewed it.
In other words, Sandy Berger broke the law (as he later admittted); there is no evidence here that anyone broke the law.
This is more evidence of paranoia and desperation on the left. In the meantime, John Roberts is sailing smoothly toward almost certain confirmation. Here’s an interesting question: what if Hillary votes in his favor?
Here’s another interesting question: how about a post on Able Danger? There’s a lot more smoke there than there is here.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:16 pmMonkey Boy Alert: Colt, Northeast Dumdass et all
Careful, be prophylactic they shallow!!!
August 17th, 2005 at 7:19 pmOoopps Blue/red swallows too!
August 17th, 2005 at 7:21 pmrepublicans are a bunch of faggot homos. all they care about is claiming nonsense about putting things down your pants, like jeff gannon did to karl rove.
security trumps “sexual relations” to democrats. no wonder we were attacked when the gop was in charge. they are perverted sexual fanatics who cant concentrate on keeping america safe.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:21 pmBilly
The thing about these monkey boys is they never served this great country of ours but they expect us to listen to their traitor asses.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:24 pmCheck that Citizen .They served allright. Self Served.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:27 pmHey Fake (#6): I don’t get your point. Could you go over all that again for me?
August 17th, 2005 at 7:35 pmDavid
He never read it, just cut and paste, suck and swallow.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:37 pmThe speed with which the left dissolves into namecalling hysteria is truly remarkable. I wish we could harness all that energy for peaceful uses.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:40 pmYour just such pussies we can’t help it. Go and serve like many of us, maybe (if you don’t get kicked out for your sexual acts, forgot they are doing don’t ask again) you will become a man.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:44 pmMore paranoia and desperation on the left. Okay, here’s an AP news flash regarding John Roberts’ views on affirmative action: he grew up in a community where some title deeds contained restrictive covenants.
“Like many towns across America, the exclusive lakefront community where Supreme Court nominee John G. Roberts Jr. grew up during the racially turbulent 1960s and ’70s once banned the sale of homes to nonwhites and Jews.
“Just three miles from the nearly all-white community of Long Beach, two days of looting and vandalism erupted when Roberts was 15, barely intruding on the Mayberry-like community that was largely insulated from the racial strife of that era.
“It was here that the 50-year-old Roberts lived from elementary school until he went away to Harvard in 1973, and that decade — as well as the rest of his life — is receiving intense scrutiny as the Senate gears up for its Sept. 6 confirmation hearings on President Bush’s first Supreme Court nominee…
“It is hard to know how much Roberts’ upbringing in this northern Indiana community on the shores of Lake Michigan influenced his views. Some say the fact that there were riots and restrictions on home ownership is not relevant at all.”
The good news is that the deed on John Roberts’ own home did not have a restrictive covenant. So America can sleep soundly tonight, thanks to this fine piece of investigative journalism by the Fourth Estate.
I wonder when they’ll get around to doing a companion piece on Robert Byrd’s days in the KKK? They could investigate whether Byrd’s Klan activities make more likely or less likely that he will vote for Roberts.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:57 pmWhat a twit strathmore. I guess you never saw the 2nd season Saturday Night Live w/ Bill Murry and Jane Curtain doing the news. For your info, that’s how he always addressed Jane by the end of the newscast. Don’t take it personally, but talk about tinfoil hats.
You guys are the conspiracy nuts….Talk about moonbats.
August 17th, 2005 at 7:57 pmDu-oh- a Homer Simpson moment – it was Dan Akroyd, not Bill Murry. Sorry ’bout that.
August 17th, 2005 at 8:00 pmFace it. Republican supporters don’t care if their guys cover up. It’s not important to them. If Clinton stonewalled the 9/11 commission the way Bush did, you can bet I’d be just as upset about it.
To them, winning is more important than honest debate.
August 17th, 2005 at 8:04 pmBlue balls
Your dealing with adults here, many of us have higher educations and do our own research. Stop trying to post your crap and call it “fair and balanced”. We don’t care, you are a young republican monkey boy who shills (you call it language) and throws your your shit all over the cage. If I thought you believed in evolution, I sure your parents would liked to have had an instance of natural selection.
August 17th, 2005 at 8:06 pmKindness you ignorant slut.
August 17th, 2005 at 8:07 pmKindness
Kidding, I did watch the second season.
August 17th, 2005 at 8:11 pmHere, free of charge to my left-wing friends, is the received wisdom of Dean Barrett’s “Advice to the Angry Young Blogger,” to wit: “…be aware of your inherent weak points and shore them up.”
Barrett observes:
“Left wing bloggers…are often guilty of confusing and conflating ’straight talk’ with vulgar talk. Look, I’m no prude, especially when it comes to coarse language. Those who personally know me, and especially those who have played golf with me, view me as a uniquely unlikely champion for obscenity-free communication.
“But politics is different from one’s rec-room or the golf course. There are a bunch of people who find obscenities offensive. In politics…there is no need to gratuitously offend a segment of the voting society with coarse language. And yet [many left wing bloggers] insist on writing like they’re politically obsessed Quentin Tarantino characters.
“I started this essay by talking about shoring up one’s perceived weaknesses. For left wing bloggers, the doubts they have to overcome is whether they are mature enough and sophisticated enough to take their act public. Some of them seem to know this. Chris Bowers at MyDD is doubtlessly one of the brightest liberal bloggers around, and he eschews a constant stream of obscenities in favor of well thought through and maturely expressed postings.
“Bowers is also seeking office, and he’s smart enough to understand all of this. The bigger question is, why aren’t all of them?”
Good question. If the left wants red state America to vote with them next time, left wing bloggers may want tone down the crass insults and obcenities.
August 17th, 2005 at 8:18 pmBlue balls
Did you look that up cut and paste (suck and swallow) all by yourself? Good job kid! Now go lock yourself in the closet.
August 17th, 2005 at 8:20 pmOn the other hand, maybe some on the left prefer to get beaten like a drum every four years. I wonder when they’ll figure out that their next opponent won’t be named Bush. Wouldn’t it be great if her name turns out to be Rice?
August 17th, 2005 at 8:26 pmBlue balls
Good boy. Good boy. Now go fetch.
August 17th, 2005 at 8:32 pmRice? You have got to be kidding! If justice is served, she’ll be doing time with the rest of BushCo.
August 17th, 2005 at 9:05 pmAt least ClintonCo. had the courtesy to give you a reach-around while they bent you over to screw you. BushCo. just keeps trying to blow smoke up the hole.
August 17th, 2005 at 9:08 pmFrom crooksandliars.com
Bill O’Reilly Poll on Cindy
Do you respect what Cindy Sheehan is doing?
Bill has been pounding on her for days now. Here’s his site and you actually don’t have to pay to vote in the poll.
August 17th, 2005 at 9:20 pmhttp://billoreilly.com/
Blue State Red @ August 17, 2005 @ 7:16 pm
Unlike the Berger documents, these were not sensitive documents about our national security. Unlike the Berger documents, these documents never left the building in anyone’s trousers, but were merely reviewed under supervision. Unlike the Berger documents, the archivists in charge have determined that this file (it is a single file, one of thousands) was likely returned to its original place (archivist Sharon Fawcett says it is “very difficult to believe it’s anyone other than ourselves responsible for this loss”), but later was misplaced. Unlike the Berger documents, there is no evidence of deliberate document destruction. Unlike the Berger documents, this file was reconstructed with the help of one of the lawyers who reviewed it.
Right… and PlameGate is a liberal conspiracy.
You wingers are a riot. Literally…
In other words, Sandy Berger broke the law (as he later admittted); there is no evidence here that anyone broke the law.
This is more evidence of paranoia and desperation on the left. In the meantime, John Roberts is sailing smoothly toward almost certain confirmation. Here’s an interesting question: what if Hillary votes in his favor?
Here’s another interesting question: how about a post on Able Danger? There’s a lot more smoke there than there is here.
Comment by
August 17th, 2005 at 9:50 pmThere have been some stories in the “Liberal Media” that the right is touting as proof that it’s… all Clinton’s fault. Bullshit. They omitted a few important points. Spinmonkeys.
Seeing The Forest helps you see the forest for the trees.
Here’s what they don’t want you to see from The All Spin Zone:
August 17th, 2005 at 9:53 pm
Wouldn’t it be great if her name turns out to be Rice?
Fat chance. Be great though. She’d get her ass kicked. And she deserves it. Powell would have been your best hope, but Karl burned him. You got zip. You won’t see the inside of the WH, even with an invite, for the next 20 years.
August 17th, 2005 at 9:58 pmOff topic but…
On Crooks & Liars, there is a summary of Cindy Sheehan on 360 w/Anderson Cooper
http://www.crooksandliars.com/
Is this her supposed letter?
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/bullyard/msg/7f523b1a73be1a36?hl=en
If it is, its quite a stretch to claim that she made anti-semetic remarks that her son died for Israel.
August 17th, 2005 at 10:38 pmWe progressives like a good food fight now and then just to blow the pipes out.
What we really prefer is a meaningful diologue. Both with each others and with those who don’t share our views. All too often, bush43/rove/cheney have gone out of their way to vilify their oposition. We see the results of that here all the time in our “discussions”.
My guess is that bush43 wants a Scalia, not an O’Conner. Roberts appears to be just that man.
In the 70’s, after Watergate & the resignation of Nixon, Democrats had the world at their fingertips and they blew it because they couldn’t reign in the extremes of their party to govern for the majority of all Americans. The pendulum swung the other way, giving us Reagan & Bush41. Now the republicans are facing the same forces. Their extremes have blown the wind out of their sails & the pendulum, well it’s swinging back.
It’s an interesting paradox that one of the most successful presidencies in the last 20 years was Clintons post 94. Governing with Republicans in control of the House and the Senate almost evenly divided. I won’t miss the crazy right. They along with the uber-orthodox religious are the true believer antichrists. They won’t see it of course.
I’m gonna hope Roberts isn’t a Scalia but a Souter. I fear I’m wrong. But the ‘06 elections, you far righties, your toast. You middle righties better take control of the party again or you’ll be a fat minority party again.
The pendulum, it keeps on swingin’.
August 17th, 2005 at 10:44 pm#9, DONT BE SO SURE OF THAT!
dumbya wanted to change the constitution so that he could remain in office as long as this war lasted.
sounds like he won’t leave the WH until something like the warden scene in shawshank redemption.
August 17th, 2005 at 11:49 pm#26, I believe you said left when you should have said right.
Unless you folks can dish it out, just not take it!
August 17th, 2005 at 11:53 pmRICE? HE HE HE….
dumbya probably calls her aunt jemima…. since he lovingly gives his closest fiends (spelled without R) such warm and cozy pet names.
he does have all the charm and class of a booger on a cracker.
August 17th, 2005 at 11:58 pmI’ll bust out the crayons.
“The missing copies, according to Breuer and their author, Richard A. Clarke, the counterterrorism chief in the Clinton administration and early in President Bush’s administration, were versions of after-action reports recommending changes following threats of terrorism as 1999 turned to 2000. Clarke said he prepared about two dozen ideas for countering terrorist threats. The recommendations were circulated among Cabinet agencies, and various versions of the memo contained additions and refinements, Clarke said last night”
Clarke says you are either lying or stupid TP, he said there were different versions of the memo, not copies.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ wp-dyn/ articles/ A62776-2004Jul19.html
Now we know Berger lied when he said it was an accident, you people are not that stupid are you? I would never say Rove didn’t mean to leak plames name if in fact he plead guilty. Berger gets sentenced in September, he withheld info from the 9/11 commission. He may have perjured himself. Gorelick built the wall, then democratic members lied about the briefing they had on Able Danger. TP is full of crap as usual, you should have never brought Berger up, but you did, so let’s talk about Berger. But you can’t talk about Berger without Gorlick and the “wall” coming up. Here is the link to the “wall” memo. http://www.usdoj.gov/ ag/ testimony/ 2004/ 1995_gorelick_memo.pdf
August 18th, 2005 at 12:21 amI would have loved to see Gorlicks face when Ashcroft was looking at her explaining under oath how she helped kill thousands of her fellow citizens and for no good reason. ” And when the PATRIOT ACT was challenged, the FISA Court of Review upheld the law, ruling that the 1995 guidelines were required by neither the Constitution nor the law.” Idiots or enemies? I’m starting to wonder.
What is the administration trying to hide? Until the original documents show up, there are no excuses.
It is just another example of the Bush administration showing contempt towards the American people.
Quite plain and simple.
August 18th, 2005 at 12:33 amHelp me get Hassert out of office. Support my cause by visiting my website. The signatures I get on my petition gets people talking about national issues too.
Allow me to keep talking and I will see to it that Hassert is thrown out of office.
I have the ability to change many minds in Illinois. I am confident that our discontent with Hassert will continue to spread as long as I am able to keep talking.
Know that the Bush supporters in my REPUBLICAN COUNTY ARE DWINDLING FAST!
I’ve seen great progress. Thanks to all that support the Debtonator.
August 18th, 2005 at 12:44 amA question…does Fake think that people actually read his rants?
I never have and never will. And strath, he’s gone completely off the deep end.
I bet they share a room at the pysch ward.
August 18th, 2005 at 12:49 amRight again Susan!!!
I always scroll to the bottom to see who posted before even reading. The long ones (I am guilty too) usually are “those” guys.
I am sorry I rant from time to time, but wingnuts piss me off. I hope I am not too much of a leftie.
August 18th, 2005 at 1:17 amI was data processing supervisor for a large hospital for a number of years, and we filmed everything.
I was in an audit position for a national bank chain and we filmed EVERYTHING!
I personally find it unlikely that these Missing documents weren’t filmed at some point. I also find it unlikely that the librarian’s didn’t notice that these sensitive files were not returned.
I don’t understand (or probably do) why no one will SPILL the names of the perps.
It smells like rotting-fish.
August 18th, 2005 at 1:21 amDon’t read it. Go give some money to suzy, her debotonater scam isn’t working out. I don’t care if the sheep drunk on the kool aid don’t read them. When people see that your old hero, Richard Clarke, who could do no wrong when he was trying to pin his failures on Condi directly contradicts the morons at TP, my work is done.
August 18th, 2005 at 1:33 amSuzy will let you put her book on your credit card so you can learn to get rid on your credit card debt. She calls this helping. LOL.
You cowards just can’t answer why Berger stole those documents? Why Gorlick put up the wall? Why the 9/11 commission covered up Able Danger? Why they then lied about it? So now you ignore it, stick your fingers in your ears and hum, like it isn’t there any longer, but it is. And Gorlick is tied to Hillary. There goes 2008, LOL.
I don’t read your rants fake. You are a speck on this planet and your opinion means nothing to me.
P.S. I am not asking for support from those who post from mental hospitals. Never have and never will.
August 18th, 2005 at 1:44 amKJ, we know that those documents disappeared for a reason. I worked for an insurance company that like most companies today went paperless. We scanned everything and I mean everything.
If Bushie thinks that he’s going to conquer America he is sadly mistaken. The people have spoken and he will be impeached. I guarantee it.
votetoimpeach.org
August 18th, 2005 at 1:49 amTo all that might be interested in purchasing my book. I suspect you are intelligent enough to understand that debit cards work perfectly for online purchases. I also recommend the All Access Card from NetSpend if you don’t have a checking account.
I know I didn’t have to tell you intelligent folks this but some people are still living in the dark ages and believe that credit cards are the only way to make online purchases.
Education is everything and I am doing my best to educate those who support the murder of innocent children. However it is very hard work.
August 18th, 2005 at 1:54 amIt’s nice suzy, the high tech equivalent of a cardboard sign on the corner. And you are asking people who are having financial trouble if they are at your site. Classy. But if you don’t read my posts why respond?
August 18th, 2005 at 1:56 amI thought your wife may need my help. Afterall she’s living with someone who is clueless about everything. She must suffer from severe anxiety from the enormous debt you’ve burdened her with.
I read some of your stuff but not the long posts. They are rants and make no sense to normal thinking people.
People buy my book to avoid debt, (the title says it all: Your Guide to Perfect Credit) you should have purchased one yourself. You could have saved your wife from the suffering of unmanagable debt.
Stay clueless, thats your choice.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:06 amI am doing my best to educate those who support the murder of innocent children- suzy
So you want to outlaw abortion? Then you should support Roberts, because he will end the murder of innocent children. But it doesn’t matter if you do or not, he is going to be approved. There is nothing you can do about it.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:07 amNow is your panhandling on subject here? You don’t want to discuss Berger?
Fake, if you want to walk the 200 miles to the Governors office I welcome you to join us.
We’re also having a party on the 27th and are serving burgers, hot dogs and beer.
What do you think? Are you up to it?
August 18th, 2005 at 2:08 amI’m not serving Bergers, I’m serving burgers. I don’t care about abortion, it doesnt apply to me. I don’t have them and don’t associate with folks who do have them. It’s not my problem.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:10 amI don’t send her out to beg, so I think you need to worry about you, not her. We are not in debt, we own our home and our vehicle. No mortgage. No payments. And we are not rich, both our parents are not rich. Our riches are our family, our friendship. You people alternate between fantasies of Republicans either being wealthy Christian bigots or trailertrash Christian bigots. I understand, I thought that way at one time, but like you libs are now, I was wrong. It’s OK to be wrong, when you are young and stupid, but you must wise up someday.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:20 amThe rising cost of gasoline is a major issue with me fake. Peoples incomes are less because they spend more of their income to get to and from work.
Not all people have jobs working at home, many travel 50 miles to work each day.
The cost of products and services increase when gas prices increase and that affects all of us.
Maybe I understand costs and budgets more than you do and realize the impact rising gas prices have on everybody. You are included in “everybody” if you drive a car. You must budget more of your income for travel expenses. Doesn’t that hurt your budget or are you in denial about it? Are you in debt denial?
August 18th, 2005 at 2:20 amYour losing me again fake. Who said anything about begging? Do you give money to charities that you feel strongly about? Do you support any cause you feel is important to you? If you do, you are giving in to beggars? Is that what your saying?
Are you willing to walk 200 miles to have your cause heard? Are you willing to finance the entire walk with your own money?
Maybe you don’t understand the costs of gathering 100,000 signatures on a petition. It takes hours and hours of manpower, web hosting, printed material and air time.
Any cause a person sets out to accomplish is costly. My husband and I have used more of our money than any other source. We feel strongly about something and we take action no matter what the cost. It’s the American way.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:28 amWell, thank you, it’s nice that you can treat me like a human even though we disagree. Could I walk 200 miles? Yes, I’m sure I could, but I’m afraid I must decline. Maybe one day we can walk together.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:32 amAs for abortion, it does effect you if it is allowed in our society. I’m glad you would not want to do it to yourself, your husband or your unborn child. But the premise of legalized abortion is it is a private matter, you would not know who you associate with who had. We know millions do. In the case of rape or the woman’s health I think it would be understandable. As form of birth control it is horrible. It cheapens life and the relationship between mothers and children as a whole.
Suzy, I want to say, from the bottom of my heart, I am truly sorry for the hateful things I have said to you in the past. There is no excuse for it. You don’t deserve that, no matter how angry we get with one another. Good luck on your walk. Goodnight.
Okay fake, I’ve tried to have an intelligent reasonable discussion with you but I see that your meds have worn off. Clinton killed 107 people, cool…Bushie has killed hundreds of thousand of people..What the hell is your argument here?
Don’t answer, your looney. Good night.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:33 amI’ll bust out the crayons.
Poor faccurate but baked. He needs a tin foil hat, children. And we can’t let him eat the crayons. The wild conspiracy theories he throws around are entertaining, like the ones in comment #50. But that last one… He’s gone off his meds. Did you boys and girls know he thinks crop circles caused evolution? He needs to stop relying on chain letters for his information.
This list, also known as the “Clinton Body Count,” is posted on several anti-Clinton sites. Conspiracy theorists and reputable press members alike have explored the possibility that these deaths are not merely coincidence and that these people may have been killed for what they knew. At the height of this chain’s popularity, I traced it to etherzone.com, a site that called itself “THE INTELLIGENT ALTERNATIVE NEWS AND OPINION SOURCE.” The site has since shut down.
But, body counts supposedly linked the former President date back to 1993 and a list started by Linda Thompson, the leader of a for-profit conservative advocacy group that supports pro-gun causes and a variety of conspiracy theories. It gained notoriety when former Rep. William Dannemeyer sent the list in a letter to other congressmen.
Not surprisingly for a list designed as anti-Clinton propaganda, the e-mail only provides sufficient details about each case to support the conspiracy theory. I looked into some of the details, like Jim McDougal and Mary Mahoney, and found both objective reports of the cases and conspiracy-laden “investigations.” Few of the claims in the e-mail can be proven true or false because they rely too heavily on conjecture and inference.
Could their deaths actually have been be mob-style hits to hide the truth about Clinton Scandals? It’s possible, but not provable. It is equally probable that they were all just unfortunate coincidences. But, if I ever get to meet Clinton, I’ll be sure to kiss his pinky ring, just to be safe. Break this Chain!
http://www.breakthechain.org/exclusives/bodycount.html
Then there is always Snopes.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:34 amClaim: Bill Clinton has been quietly doing away with those who oppose him.
Status: False.
http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/outrage/clinton.htm
Get a life, baked. Preferably on uranus.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:35 amNo more hate suzy, I will respect your cause. I understand, no begging, I didn’t mean that. I am sorry. Please understand. Take care.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:35 amSnopes. What a riot.
Claim: Bill Clinton has been quietly doing away with those who oppose him.
Status: False.
Origins: A new version of a lengthy list of deaths associated with Bill Clinton began circulating on the the Internet in August 1998. According to it,
there have been close to fifty suspicious deaths of colleagues, advisors and citizens who were about to testify against the Clintons, with the unstated implication that Bill Clinton or his henchmen were behind each untimely demise.
We shouldn’t have to tell anyone not to believe this claptrap, but we will anyway. In a frenzied media climate where the Chief Executive couldn’t boff a White House intern without the whole world finding out every niggling detail of each encounter and demanding his removal from office, are we seriously to believe the same man had been having double handfuls of detractors and former friends murdered with impunity?
Don’t be swayed by the number of names listed on screeds like this. Any public figure is bound to have a much wider circle of acquaintance than an ordinary citizen would. Moreover, the acquaintance is often one-sided — though many of the people enumerated on this list might properly claim to have known Clinton, he wouldn’t know or remember having met a great number of them.
“Body count” lists are not a new phenomenon. Lists documenting all the allegedly “suspicious” deaths of persons connected with the assassination of John F. Kennedy have been circulating for decades, and the same techniques used to create and spread the JFK lists have been employed in the Clinton version:
* List every dead person with even the most tenuous of connections to your subject. It doesn’t matter how these people died, or how tangential they were to your subject’s life. The longer the list, the more impressive it looks and the less likely anyone is to challenge it. By the time readers get to the bottom of the list, they’ll be too weary to wonder what could possibly be relevant about the death of Clinton’s mother’s chiropractor.
* Play word games. Make sure every death is presented as “mysterious.” All accidental deaths are to be labelled “suspicious,” even though by definition accidents occur when something unexpected goes wrong. Every self-inflicted death discussed must include the phrase “ruled a suicide,” to imply just the opposite. When an autopsy contradicts a “mysterious death” theory, dispute it; when none was performed because none was needed, claim that “no autopsy was allowed.” Make liberal use of words such as ‘allegedly’ and ’supposedly’ to dismiss facts you can’t contradict with hard evidence.
* Make sure every inconsistency or unexplained detail you can dredge up is offered as evidence of a conspiracy, no matter how insignificant or pointless it may be. If an obvious suicide is discovered wearing only one shoe, ignore the physical evidence of self-inflicted death and dwell on the missing shoe. You don’t have to establish an alternate theory of the death; just keep harping that the missing shoe “can’t be explained.”
* If the data doesn’t fit your conclusion, ignore it. You don’t have to explain why the people who claim to have the most damaging goods on Clinton — Gennifer Flowers, Paula Jones, Kathleen Willey, Linda Tripp, Monica Lewinsky, Kenneth Starr — are still walking around unscathed while dozens of bit players have been bumped off. It’s inconvenient for you, so don’t mention it.
* Most importantly, don’t let facts and details stand in your way! If you can pass off a death by pneumonia as a “suicide,” do it! If a cause of death contradicts your conspiracy theory, claim it was “never determined.” If your chronology of events is impossible, who cares? It’s not like anybody is going to check up on this stuff . . .
This Clinton “body count” list is not a new phenomenon — multiple versions have been circulating for years. New victim names are routinely added and old ones taken off, forming an endless variety of permutations. At this point, there is no one “official” list.
But where did all this craziness start? In 1994, in a letter to congressional leaders, former Rep. William Dannemeyer listed 24 people with some connection to Clinton who had died “under other than natural circumstances” and called for hearings on the matter.
Dannemeyer’s list of “suspicious deaths” was largely taken from one compiled by Linda Thompson, an Indianapolis lawyer who in 1993 quit her year-old general practice to run her American Justice Federation, a for-profit group that promotes pro-gun causes and various conspiracy theories through a shortwave radio program, a computer bulletin board and sales of its newsletter and videos.
Her list, called “The Clinton Body Count: Coincidence or the Kiss of Death?” then contained the names of 34 people she believed died suspiciously and who had ties to the Clinton family. Thompson admitted she had “no direct evidence” of Clinton killing anyone. Indeed, she said the deaths were probably caused by “people trying to control the President” but refused to say who they were. Thompson said her allegations of murder “seem groundless only because the mainstream media haven’t done enough digging.”
Ah, but they had. If not before she put her list together, at least afterwards. Anyone who continues to state the mainstream media has given these claims short shrift is being disingenuous.
Since 1994, various respected news outlets have been confronted with versions of the “Clinton Body Count” list, run their own investigations of a few of the claims, and found nothing to substantiate what they looked into. Those investigations would culminate in yet another story about an oddball conspiracy rumor.
But conspiracy theories don’t die that easily. These “body count” lists and the many specious claims contained therein continue to circulate in cyberspace and beyond: yesterday’s newspaper articles are forgotten with the next day’s delivery, but e-mail lives forever.
Let’s take this new version apart line by line. The sections which appear in a highlighted color are the “Clinton Body Count” e-mail, while the sections in ordinary text color are my comments.
Read the rest. It’s funny. Almost as funny as backward idiots like baked still trying to blame everything on Clinton. We all know it’s Reagan’s fault. Dead bad actors make lousy preznits. It’s the make up.
http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/outrage/clinton.htm
August 18th, 2005 at 2:43 amI didn’t post that tripe. Its cool, the facts about Clarke and Berger stand. Anyone can post in anyone else’s name, wow, nice job. Susan, what I said to you stands. No more personal attacks on you. We disagree, but I respect what you are doing and will not be hateful. Janitor just posted that BS in my name because I got TP again. The Berger docs are not copies, Clarke wrote them and said so. TP is wrong. Janitor is a little child it would seem. But like the forgeries that cost Rather his career, no good at details, they can’t even get my website to link on my name.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:46 amMommies in bed, so it’s time to play on her computer? Well done. You need fifty names to post here, because you have no credibilty so what differance would it make, just spam, maybe nobody will notice TP is full of shit. Thus your fantasy world stays intact. Pathetic.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:51 amThanks for being a good listener Fake. Your right, we don’t agree on much but I appreciate the fact that you acknowledge that people do what THEY feel is important.
As far as the Clinton debate, I dont live in the past. I act now for what I believe I can change today.
During the Clinton administration I was idle, I had no cause. I was content.
August 18th, 2005 at 2:58 amAfter the 1993 World Trade Centre bombing, which killed six and injured 1,000, President Clinton promised that those responsible would be hunted down and punished.
After the 1995 bombing in Saudi Arabia, which killed five US military personnel, President Clinton promised that those responsible would be hunted down and punished.
After the 1996 al-Khobar towers bombing in Saudi Arabia, which killed 19 and injured 200 US military personnel, President Clinton promised that those responsible would be hunted down and punished.
After the 1998 bombing of US embassies in Africa, which killed 257 and injured 5,000, President Clinton promised that those responsible would be hunted down and punished.
After the 2000 bombing of the USS Cole, which killed 17 and injured three US sailors, President Clinton promised that those responsible would be hunted down and punished.
Maybe if Mr Clinton had kept his promise, an estimated 7,000 more people would be alive today.
August 18th, 2005 at 3:10 amThanks Susan, life is to short for us to yell at each other about things neither of us control. I lump people together under the liberal term, but I do realize most people have good intentions. What you and your husband do is a positive thing. We all feel we are right and the subjects are so important we all get carried away. Someone is posting in my name. I have posted nothing about bill clinton tonight. To whomever is posting in my name, you are doing your side of the argument for harm than good. Grow up. That is the definition of a “troll”.
August 18th, 2005 at 3:20 amLike it matters what Clarke said and Berger did, baked but this… this matters and this is Iraqis speaking. Bush is a genius! He gave them the freedom to speak! And now they speak!
“Instead of Saddam we now have thousands of Saddams,” he fumed.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20050817/wl_nm/iraq_violence_dc
August 18th, 2005 at 3:26 amGood-bye, baked goods. Hello Ice Cream!
Bad Iraq War News Worries Some in G.O.P. on ‘06 Vote
Ya think?
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/18/politics/18repubs.html?hp&ex=1124424000&en=ef64c9ddde0157a7&ei=5094&partner=homepage
August 18th, 2005 at 3:29 amUm noo, but you have never been accurate about anything, have you.
Definition of a troll. (pretty damn comprehensive, too)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll
I’m just a “name stealer”, but that’s not ACCURATE either, since it isn’t really your name, it’s an alias. I’m an alias borrower. Aren’t we all? I think so.
August 18th, 2005 at 3:32 am#80 dumbya is a genes????
geneyas….genuass????
No Iraqi’s speak???
Yep, they say get the fu****k out of my country…..
PITY THE AMERICAN PEOPLE HAD TO LOSE THEIR VOICE FOR IRAQI PEOPLE TO SPEAK.
You would follow dumbya over a cliff in a car.
geez. go back to O-LIE-lly
Susan,
More kudos to you. I hope you do very well. You are a well educated, well read, OPEN MINDED individual. Unlike some of the fly specks in this blog.
I feel the majority of Americans are waking up to debt and the moral deficit in the WH. I live in a hillbilly red state and I am finding that more than just the fringe are seriously questioning the arrogant monkeyboy.
Did you know that the saudi royal family own citibank?
I know you did Susan. You are enlightened.
The saudi royal family support terriorism and their causes. Every penny we spend gives them money to attack us. CHARGE IT!!!!!!
The Carlyle group is OWNED BY THE BIN LADENS AND THE BUSH FAMILY…. They sell arms to both sides, so NO MATTER WHO WINS, THEY WIN.
geez…. what a world, what a world.
Personally I check out the people that benefit from my money. I DO NOT SUPPORT THE EVIL BLUE EMPIRE…W-MART!
THEY HAVE SUPPORTED THE RIGHTWINGNUTS FOR FAR TOO LONG, again in the true fashion of the REPUGnicans, at the expense of the poor. Ever notice they NO LONGER BUY AMERICAN?
Everything like the neat flatscreen TV and your new computer and every piece of crap we buy is MADE IN CHINA…..EVER WONDER WHY???? It is because monkeyboy does not secure the sea ports…. WHY???? because the bush family makes money from the drugs smuggled into the states…….THE FAR EAST IS RESPONSIBLE FOR 95% OF THE OPIATES produced in the world. Why do you think dumbya the smarter was a real friend and met with CHINA>>>>>>?
BTW, dumbya is quoted as saying…. “I am in favor of a 95% POPULATION DECREASE in the world.”
HMMMM…. the chimp may get his wish.
August 18th, 2005 at 3:50 amBut anyway, keep up the good work Susan.
Fixing stupidity is HARD WORK. I know, I try my best to fix the stupid every day.
Funny thing about the truth as opposed to the LIES the WH tells us, you HAVE TO REPEAT THE TRUTH OVER AND OVER AND OVER FOR IT TO TAKE HOLD. The Lies can be repeated a fraction of the time and the people buy it faster….
SO WE NEED TO SHOUT IT FROM THE MOUNTIANS.
P.S.: Check out Bushwatch.com and go to guest comments….
I AM SO PROUD! I POSTED THERE, AND NOW I HAVE A FBI FILE…… WOOO HOOO!
August 18th, 2005 at 3:56 amSeriously, Baked. Seek help. Get medication, therapy and take a remedial reading and reading comprehension course. An english comp course wouldn’t hurt. Your comments are funny…
TP is wrong. Janitor is a little child it would seem. But like the forgeries that cost Rather his career, no good at details, they can’t even get my website to link on my name.
…but we are starting to feel uncomfortable and guilty. It’s like laughing at the kids who ride the short bus to school. We really shouldn’t do it but… we aren’t all that into political correctness, like the right thinks we are, and actually is.
August 18th, 2005 at 7:41 amRe – documents- GOP has a great new ally– C-Span– they just had a reporter on discussing release of documents and did NOT– I repeat NOT ever mentioned the missing docs. I just sent you folks at TP a E mail regarding the span
August 18th, 2005 at 8:55 ambilljpa@aol.com
Fake,
August 18th, 2005 at 9:52 amDidn’t the guy responsible for the first WTC bombing get sent to jail?
Didn’t Clinton send SCUD missiles to get OBL, but was criticized when they missed as teying to “shoot a camel in the ass” (quote by GWB).
When the perpetrators of the USS Cole attack became known as Al Qaeda, in late 2000, didn’t the Clinton Adm. inform the Bushies of the threat of that group and the high priority it should receive – and were promptly dismissed by the GWB team?
#77 what kind of stupid-jerk comment against women is that? You really are scum.
August 18th, 2005 at 9:54 am56. fake … what the f are you saying? Tha was some of the most inane, disconnected, OT BS I’ve seen. There must be a right wing manual you guys use when writing this stuff. No sane person could do so.
August 18th, 2005 at 10:21 amI think you mean #57, but yes, he’s tin foil hat wearing wingnut.
August 18th, 2005 at 12:30 pmThe missing copies, according to Breuer and their author, Richard A. Clarke, the counterterrorism chief in the Clinton administration and early in President Bush’s administration, were *VERSIONS* of after-action reports recommending changes following threats of terrorism as 1999 turned to 2000. Clarke said he prepared about two dozen ideas for countering terrorist threats. The recommendations were circulated among Cabinet agencies, and various versions of the memo contained additions and refinements, Clarke said last night
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ wp-dyn/ articles/ A62776-2004Jul19.html
Let’s get things straight. The person who admitted to posting in my name last night got called on it today, and in true insane fashion turned on TP for having rules for this forum. I didn’t ask TP to intercede on my behalf, they are just trying to keep this site taken seriously. What I posted contradicts this thread, and it is no Republican making the claim about the memos, but instead the author, Richard Clarke, someone whose every word the left hung on not to long ago. Now it would seem this thread is incorrect in stating those were copies Berger destroyed in violation of the law.
August 18th, 2005 at 10:38 pmExcuse me but Mr. Burger was in the “classifed” section, and for you people who have never seen it – you have to sign for a “copy” if you need to tale it to “another classifed location”. Mr
August 18th, 2005 at 10:43 pmBurger could have recieved 60 years for what he did. No documents have ever fell into my pants… So what was he really doing?
Excuse me – when the Bush lawyers took the files on Roberts — and there are no copies of those papers – don’t you think they should be revealed? Their names are on the register.
August 19th, 2005 at 1:16 amWhy do you Rep’s always like to insert little references to sex, pants, etc. in your comments — Berger DID take copies of papers, mixed in with his own notes, and those copies were widely distributed in Congress, there was no secret document.
On the contrary, the Roberts’ files are originals and they are missing.
Apparently the roberts files were missed by the monkey’s clean up crew, and they had to send in some more boys to “clean up the mess”. That is why these documents are missing.
This is the most seceretive Administration (for lack of a better term) since Nixon. Monkeyboy made it a priority to CLASSIFY much in his first er- term.
They can blame this one on Clinton too, as he was a wise man that was releasing and declassifying documents at a good clip.
August 19th, 2005 at 12:15 pm#17 – 100% CORRECT…
August 20th, 2005 at 12:29 am