Iraq War Less Popular Than Vietnam
Iraq War Less Popular Than Vietnam
Fresh analysis from Gallup:
The latest quarterly average for Iraq shows that 50% say it was a mistake to send troops (the most recent single measure on this indicator, from an Aug. 5-7 Gallup Poll, shows 54% saying the war was a mistake).
In the comparable quarter for the Vietnam War (the third quarter of the war’s third year — that is, the third quarter of 1967), Gallup found 41% saying the conflict was a mistake. It was not until the third quarter of the fourth year of the Vietnam War (August-September 1968) that a majority of Americans said the war was a mistake. In short, it took longer for a majority of Americans to view the Vietnam War as a mistake than has been the case for Iraq.
A President less popular than Nixon and a war less popular than Vietnam. That’s quite a combo.
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The tide has turned and it’s against Bush and his war. May we begin drafting the Articles of Impeachment now?
August 24th, 2005 at 9:26 amYou guys don’t get it – as long as we are at war, you have no chance at getting back in power. Ask George McGovern what it’s like to run against an unpopular war and Republican President. Ask John Kerry for that matter.
The sooner the left realizes that Americans will never trust them with national security in a time of war, the better off you will be. Polls go up and down – they mean nothing. Bush can be one lazy SOB when he wants, but he won’t be like that when it counts.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:33 amThe Northeast Dilemma’s lack of knowledge of political history is stunning.
As I’ve always said, Bush’s genius is making stupid conservatives feel smart.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:46 amWish list: protests against the war grows. Come October someone big in the WH(rove)takes a fall. That the disgust reaches such a level that not even the corporate owned media, not the corrupted courts, not the police state, not the corrupted election system, that nothing will stop the people from taking back what was once a fairly decent country and restoring some semblance of a representative government in the 06′ elections.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:48 amFailing this than we have only two choices: accept our steady march towards fascism, or …
Gee NED,
August 24th, 2005 at 9:52 amI guess the beer didn’t help your
sour disposition.
Keep repeating that rant if it makes
you feel better about your incompetent
clown leader.
Lazy doesn’t even begin to describe chimpy.
Iraq and Vietnam aren’t the same: Bush had a plan for getting out of Vietnam, or at least one that worked.
Bush was a big Vietnam War supporter, too. Not surprising, since most pro-war advocates never have anything on the line themselves but prefer to be cheerleaders from a safe distance.
We need to advocate for more troops being sent, those guys over there are clamoring for reinforcements and more backing. We need at least 50,000 troops right now or we can’t win against the insurgents.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:52 amIf we’re not going to do the job right, then we should pull out.
for the record, NED actually admitted to watching Hannity and Colmes on another post. that statement alone could tell you so much more about him than any of his long winded, self-important, talking point type statements ever could.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:54 amTo Notheast Dilemma:
You state: “Bush can be one lazy SOB when he wants, but he won’t be like that when it counts.”
I assume you mean how he reacted on the morning of September 11? I saw one scared little boy sitting in that classroom. I guess that was one time it didn’t count. You may mean when he taunted the insurgents with “Bring Then On”?
August 24th, 2005 at 9:54 amive never heard someone make so many excuses for another man so shamelessly.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:55 amNED’s right. Monkey Man knows that losing an unpopular war through deceit, thievery and inept mismanagement is the best way to retain a Republican majority. Once he starts losing the war with Iran, the Republicans will be tougher to dislodge than zebra mussels.
Don’t underestimate the Crawford Crime Czar — he’s a regular Prof. Moriarty.
PS: Please visit Northeast Dilemma’s blog sites. If he gets any fewer hits than he’s receiving now, he has to reclassify his blogs from “online magazines” to “performance art.”
August 24th, 2005 at 9:58 amI don’t know RTg. If we went in with
August 24th, 2005 at 10:00 amthe 300K the military wanted I expect
thing would be very different at this
point. Mayby 50K would make a huge difference,
but so much potential has been cast away by
now…. I keep going back to the Powell
doctrine. Go in overwhelming power to keep bad
things from happening rather than going
in cheap. Sort of like putting out a fire,
if you smother it with overkill you are
done immediately. If you use a squirt gun
until it gets big you may not have enough
water in a lake to put it out.
“Ask George McGovern what it’s like to run against an unpopular war and Republican President.”
Yeah, I was going seriously consdering voting for McGovern until he announced his unilateral withdrawal plan. Dumbest idea that ever came down the pike.
I love how the left is touting negative poll numbers, as if wars ought to be fought by plebescite. America never would have won its independence from England if that had been the case in 1776, or 1777, or 1778 . . .
August 24th, 2005 at 10:01 amWho the hell cares about McGovern?
August 24th, 2005 at 10:03 amI feel better everytime you guys
fight the last war in a post.
Keep looking back to your glory
days guys.
Nixon beating McGovern as your
August 24th, 2005 at 10:04 amglory days…. now that’s rich.
Bush’s main argument for staying the course these days is to “finish the task that they gave their lives for”. In other words, send more troops to war to honor those already dead. And their deaths will justify sending even more troops. Repeat cycle. Forever.
Sure, we owe the troops something. Not endless war, but sound policy. That could start by us firing the president.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:06 amOh, and it takes a leader to “lead” in
August 24th, 2005 at 10:07 amtough times, like Churchill during the
blitz. Chimpy goes on vacation from his
vacation.
BS Red sayeth:
Yeah, I was going seriously consdering voting for McGovern until he announced his unilateral withdrawal plan.
Hee hee. Yes, of course you were. I remember what a burgeoning organization “neocon clowns for McGovern” was back then.
I love how the left is touting negative poll numbers, as if wars ought to be fought by plebescite.
Yeah, where did we get this silly idea that we lived in a democracy? Certainly not since Diebold, anyway.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:07 amNext dimwit who compares this fruitcake oil grab to the American Revolution should be immediately arrested by the Facile Acts of Sophistry Police.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:14 amNED, this has never been a war.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:17 amIt is an invasion.
Congress’ approval rating is like the lowest in history.
Junior’s approval rating is sinking like a rock.
They could break out Osama right now and no one would be impressed.
Junior’s supporters are now a serious minority.
That would be you.
#12 – Wrong comparison – in 1776 we were liberating ourselves from Empire. In the Iraq war we ARE the empire, when a majority of Americans don’t want us to be.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:18 amEven some of the knuckleheaded wingnuts that I know (hey we all know a few) are admitting that things have gone completely sour. They are so much less arrogant now, it’s as if the poor babies finally found out the truth about Santa Claus, only it’s not that he doesn’t exist but that he is in fact a murderer, a lias and a thug. These people are going to be more angry than some of us that have known the truth all along.
It’s gonna get interesting. Watch out for a major diversionary “attack” from the criminals. Soon, real soon.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:18 amActually Gary our form of government is not a pure democracy — it is a constitution-based republic based on democratic principles. This form of government does not allow us to vote on every policy decision directly — we elect people to make those decisions on our behalf. So talk about polls all you want but that is not how policy decisions should be made.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:18 amThe saddest thing is that the Americans waking up to the lies of the Bush Cartel is coming about 1800 soldiers too late.
Support the warrior, not the war.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:20 amThanks for clearing that up CC (yawn).
August 24th, 2005 at 10:20 amCC – we SHOULD be a grassroots participatory democracy, like the state of California is.. they get to vote on propositions. It backfires, very rarely, but overall it’s a far better system than our federal govt in my opinion.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:23 amI am glad that ONE comment can get everyone going. No need for coffee this morning, it looks like liar Sheehan is about to be exposed:
http://nerepublican.blogspot.com/2005/08/cindy-sons-murderers-are-freedom.html
August 24th, 2005 at 10:24 amIts all very sad for “hangers on” in the Rebublican party. Even their own party is turning on them – like rats deserting a sinking ship.
I feel pity for the wingnuts. For them the crash back to reality will be hardest.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:25 amConcerned conservative.
You are saying that the Bush poll numbers could be as low as 25 and he could still govern effectively?
What a crock, take a dip in your own shit.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:27 amDarth, we get to vote on propositions here in Massachusetts too. Problem is, most of the time the legislature blocks them. I’d like a more direct system as well.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:30 amI remember when polls were the greatest thing ever – but, of course, only when Bushco was up in them. You repubs are painfully obvious. I have no time to feed the trolls, gang. They are not able (or just care not too – lazy) to form their own opinions; they rely on what others that they emulate are saying and just hit “repeat.”
August 24th, 2005 at 10:31 amPablo, what I am saying is that on decisions he has the authority to make he should not base those decisions on poll numbers. And thanks for the suggestion.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:32 amHe should base his decisions on money and power and the need for more and more of it.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:33 amHey NED,
August 24th, 2005 at 10:36 amDon’t care about Sheehan one way or the
other. She was just a catalyst.
That is why the smear won’t work.
BTW, You guys seem to be off the reservation
lately. Has the leader (Rove, that is) been too
busy with his lawyers to keep y’all marching
straight?
Actually Gary our form of government is not a pure democracy — it is a constitution-based republic based on democratic principles. This form of government does not allow us to vote on every policy decision directly — we elect people to make those decisions on our behalf.
No shaving cream, Sherlock. I mean, I kind of figured that much out already when they told me I couldn’t cast a vote against the Patriot Act.
So talk about polls all you want but that is not how policy decisions should be made.
I am not advocating direct democracy, but when the government is clearly acting against the will of the people, continues to do so despite tons of propaganda by the corporate media in favor of the government’s actions, and generally makes it quite clear that it doesn’t give a [insert your choice of expletives here] what the public thinks and is only interested in talking to those who already agree with its policies, then something’s wrong.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:36 amCC – I guess we agree about a more direct system.The trick is to make it extremely difficult for lawmakers to veto props. Like two-thirds majority or something.
Other good side effects would be: less secrecy in govt (they’d have to put everything on the table for educated prop votes) and less lobbying & corruption. Everybody wins.
http://www.citizen.org/
August 24th, 2005 at 10:37 amagain, discount everything NED says, he actually ADMITTED to being a loyal viewer of Hannity and Colmes. now what does that say about him?
August 24th, 2005 at 10:39 amThe Holloway story is out of control. I couldn’t even watch Hannity for weeks because of it. It’s plain nonsense if you ask me.
Comment by The Northeast Dilemma
August 24th, 2005 at 10:40 amthat says more about you than your talking points ever could.
#26 LOL Ned. Save that stuff for a post on why Chimpy is hiding in his ranch instead of going outside to explain what ‘Noble Cause’ means to Sheehan. But if you know the answer, why don’t you get on a plane and tell her yourself. Your post simply quotes Sheehan quoting a fact – that a lack of troops in the invasion (talk to Shinseki not me) led to a lack of security from the outset, porous borders and Chimpy can’t change direction and put more in because there would need to be a draft and he would appear ‘weak’. At least you didn’t repeat your demand to terminate Sheehan, that wasn’t very nice was it?
August 24th, 2005 at 10:44 am“Explain to the mothers and fathers of American servicemen that may come home in body bags why their son or daughter have to give up their life?”
August 24th, 2005 at 10:45 am–Sean Hannity, Fox News, 4/6/99
C – is there something wrong with Hannity? I also listen to Air America and read this site. I am interested in all points of views.
No thy enemy. It’s much more useful than hanging onto polls for dear life.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:45 amIf you want Bush impeached, start working on getting Democrates elected in 2006. They will need a majority in the House. Conviction may be a bit more difficult, as the Senate will be problem. Too many Republican lite Democates.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:46 amif your HONESTLY interested in hearing what Hannity has to say, i feel sorry for you.your a fan, admit it.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:48 amyou like to hear a right wing puppet talk all over a liberal puppet? you enjoy that?
August 24th, 2005 at 10:49 amOf course the Iraq War and the Vietnam War are different in their cause and in the military planning and execution. The problem for Bush is the area where they are very similar. The Vietnam War was marketed and sold as an aggressor nation attacking its neighbor with the primary intent on promoting world communism. Remember “the domino theory”? The fact was that Vietnam was essentially a civil war with Ho Chi Minh as the true patriot who had led the fight against the Japanese, the French, and finally the Americans. In the mid-sixties, remembrance of World War 2 was still very fresh and belief in the government being truthful was still the majority opinion. America at that time wanted to believe that we were doing the right thing. The war escalated very quickly and it took a while for most people to realize that this was not a small-scale intervention but a real and bloody war. The tide turns when people start asking the questions, that should have been asked by the politicians early on, and realize that the war is wrong. They realize that the war is not winnable in the strategic sense. History has proven that Vietnam was in fact a civil war. Vietnam today is an independent country and although we may not agree with the type of government, it was not one of the dominos.
The war in Iraq was started on false assumptions and has been marketed under a variety of themes. The sad case with this war is the way that Bush tries to use September 11 and states that this is part of a war on terror. Iraq was contained and Hussein was effectively in a box. I am quite sure that had we aggressively gone after the real terrorists and used diplomatic measures in Iraq, we would be in a much better situation today. Imagine if the resources that we have used and will continue to use in Iraq, had been applied to capturing the person who attacked us on September 11? As in Vietnam, the truth and facts will eventually end our involvement.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:50 ami mean, it is obvious you enjoy spewing talking points, i guess you have to get them from somewhere.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:50 amBut Ned, Hannity is a moron.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:50 amI’m glad you recognize him as your
enemy, but watching him? Yuck.
“is there something wrong Hannity?”
…..BAHAHAHAHA!!! That’s friggin priceless right there.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:51 amThe difference between Vietnam and Iraq? Bush knew how to get out of Vietnam
August 24th, 2005 at 10:57 ambut Bill, if they were to catch Bin Laden,than who would we blame all the “terrorist” threats on? they NEED that boogeyman out there.hes still free for a reason.this administartion is very good at selling fear.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:58 amEveryone was touched in some way by the VN war. It was a family member or a friend or neighbor. This one is still being fought by a few.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:00 amSo what’s the “noble” cause for this war? Bush likes to use nice and simple words, but they are meaningless. He is meaningless. He is a rich frat boy, pretending to be a cowboy, and 1868 are dead because of his folly. Some families are strongly opposed to their loved ones having died in vain. Some are strongly supportive because they can’t face their loved ones died in vain.
Sending up more troops to replace the dead so they haven’t been lost in vain, perpetuates this insane war. Some of us feared this scenario years ago, others are a little late, but the latecomers are growing in number. Watch the Bushies grow more desperate to keep their supporters happy – but the Emperor has no clothes. He is false. He is a born-again liar. He is an unsympathetic, uncaring, selfish, self-centered man/boy, who always had things handed to him, and his ego would never let him believe he wasn’t competent.
PAT – please run on that platform. Then, when you lose, I can laugh and point.
Bush is NOT going anywhere. The country is too polarized to impeach him. With all the GOP senators gunning for the 2008 nod, they’d never let it happen. But, please try. It will be fun to watch.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:00 amC, I try not to think that this could be the case but at this point anything is possible and it would not surprise me.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:02 amNED, you’ve been exposed for the sheep-like loyal Hannity viewer you are. nothing you say from here on out can be taken seriously.let your talking points flow all you want. it doesnt matter.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:08 amThis article sums it up pretty well:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/237561_goldmanop.html
August 24th, 2005 at 11:08 amNeD appears to be a young money maker (or trying his best) in a city that despises (for the most part) his kind. Living in NYC was great. When the repub convention was there, we had a hoot. These guys (and let’s be honest, most of them were between the ages of 22-36, and white as ghosts) would come donned in their “W” finery and we gave them the business end of politics. The subway, if they dared, would leave them breathless and stunned (they really hate the homeless). They mostly hid their party affiliation because, I figure, of pure embarrassment. They don’t want to be singled out – they prefer to keep in their own company and feel comfortable. The only problem is, so many of these types want to be in the ultimate money and power haven – NYC. So they go to the internet (where they spend most of their time) and stay away from social settings where they could be “exposed.”
I worked with a couple. They are all smack talk in the office, but when we go to an afterwork bar or event – shhhhhhhhh. They didn’t know who would be attending such events, so they would cower and just act like “one of the gang.”
So NeD – is this you? Sound familiar? You think that the best way to get ahead, to be powerful, to make the big bucks, you MUST join the “rich team.” Admit it, the GOP stands for money and that is what you want. If you align yourself with these people, it will rub off on you. Or, maybe, it will get you “in” with the power brokers of NYC. Obviously greed is your game. I expect no less from a repub. We here in TN are rife with little young white BOYS who desperately need attention and power. This seems to stem from absent parents. Maybe, out making too much money to have time to raise children.
What gives, NeD?
August 24th, 2005 at 11:13 amPerhaps the American people are awake to the fact that there is more in play in Iraq than there was in Vietnam? Perhaps the American people realize the Bushy blew it, big time?
At least Iraq has a WHOLE BUNCH of our oil under their sands.
The only thing Vietnam had was a guiding idiology and Michelin’s rubber plantations for our tires. Those d***ed French, you know.
So who cares that we took a secular nation where women’s rights were greater than in other parts of the Middle East and turned Iraq into the newest theocratic state in Islam? The Iranians have got to be jumping for joy over this one!
August 24th, 2005 at 11:13 amDilEnema,
Your response in #51 shows that you have no problem beginning complicit in a crime to America and humanity, as long as it supports your ignorant view of your party’s political inclinations.
Did you get your Hannity pom-pons with fan club membership?
August 24th, 2005 at 11:14 amNed, I think that if the public mood swings far enough to threaten large numbers of GOP senators and congresspeople for 2006 even with Diebold and Chuck Hagel’s ESS fingers on the scale, then they will abandon the Christo-fascist/Neo-con alliance and possibly they just might chimpeach to save themselves – it depends how bad it gets. I noticed Bush basically called Hagel a friend of the terrorists yesterday.. I know you don’t think polls count, but these are the polls Hagel is watching… http://www.surveyusa.com/50StatePOTUS0805.htm
August 24th, 2005 at 11:16 amOh for full disclosure I think Hagel, McCain and Clinton are all two-faced opportunists.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:19 am“Polls go up and down – they mean nothing.”
Yes, but in the case of this reality, they are only going down. I haven’t seen a Bush poll go up in years. Next lie.
“Bush can be one lazy SOB when he wants, but he won’t be like that when it counts.”
Ummmm, it counts right this very minute and he is on vacation. Next lie.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:28 am“No thy enemy. It’s much more useful than hanging onto polls for dear life.”
No reason for us to listen to Hannity. You spew all of his talking points just fine.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:29 am#60 – polls go up and down. Bush approval fell to 46% last year in May. Then, at one point before the election it went up to 54%, then fell to 48% on election day. Peaked again in January at 57% and now is 44% – all according to Gallup.
What will you people do if Bush keeps Congress after 2006?
#59 – AGREED.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:31 am#61 – thank you, at least I know I am useful.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:31 amNeddy, Ann Coulter has no use for you: http://www.crooksandliars.com/2005/08/23.html#a4591
August 24th, 2005 at 11:33 am#58 – I stand by the statement “polls go up and down.” Reagan tumbled to 43% approval in March 1987 only to see his approval rise to 63% on election day 1988. A lot can and will happen.
AND Bush’s lowest poll, according to Gallup, is still higher than Clinton or Reagan’s lowest point.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:33 amWhen will the NeoCons stop hating America long enough to see the trail of distruction that have created?
If this were some other nation on earth, BushCo would have been run out of town on a rail long ago by his country’s own citizenry. And if this were any other nation on earth, the US would be calling us a Third World Bananna Republic for the way we wage war, run our elections, and govern our people.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:39 amWhen will the NeoCons stop hating America long enough to see the trail of distruction that THEY have created?
August 24th, 2005 at 11:40 amhey NED, i know your sick of me doing missing white girl stories, but its ok, im back to spewing the same talking points i always have. now hurry back.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:42 amhttp://online.wsj.com/public/article/0,,SB112481890611420718-_YHqCe_oM7fXMITSkTO2yCR8ZiM_20060824,00.html?mod=blogs
Interesting poll. Only problem is Democrats are actually less popular than even the Republicans right now. LOL! There is no way hell you people are taking back anything. People hates Democrats even more than they hate Bush!
August 24th, 2005 at 11:42 amDude, let’s see some links to these up polls. I have been watching them steadily decline over the last 3 years. No ups at all, not one. And before you try to use your right wing spin, I look at many different sites. Because like you said “Know thy enemy.”
August 24th, 2005 at 11:43 amAlso, Harris is a little misleading. Approve v. Disapprove is not the same as Excellent, Good, FAIR, and Poor. Fair is not necessarily negative.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:44 amNED, why cant you admit you love me? you’ve already admitted you enjoy my show.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:44 am#70 – http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm
August 24th, 2005 at 11:45 amNED’s right. Monkey Man knows that losing an unpopular war through deceit, thievery and inept mismanagement is the best way to retain a Republican majority. Once he starts losing the war with Iran, the Republicans will be tougher to dislodge than zebra mussels.
Don’t underestimate the Crawford Crime Czar — he’s a regular Prof. Moriarty.
PS: Please visit Northeast Dilemma’s blog sites. If he gets any fewer hits than he’s receiving now, he has to reclassify his blogs from “online magazines†to “performance art.â€
Comment by Rotwang — August 24, 2005 @ 9:58 am
Someone please tell me this is a parody site. Someone please tell me this is not the moron we are arguing with. I would hardly call it debate.
http://northeastdilemma.blogspot.com/
August 24th, 2005 at 11:47 amThanks for proving my point NED. That is a steady decline you freak.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:47 amThe Holloway story is out of control. I couldn’t even watch Hannity for weeks because of it. It’s plain nonsense if you ask me.
Comment by The Northeast Dilemma
August 24th, 2005 at 11:48 amcome on NED, whos your daddy?
#75 – up and downs. Besides, Democrats are more hated than Republicans!!!
August 24th, 2005 at 11:48 ami went to your blog NED, and i noticed your favorite book is by Ann Coulter. i thought you were a sheep for liking me, but Ann too? wow, you are a very good soldier NED. no wonder your sheep-like talking points are always so fresh. i noticed you like pop music too. sweet.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:50 amHmmm? The Northeast Dilemma… Is that like the Nazis’ Jewish Question, that became the Final solution?
August 24th, 2005 at 11:50 amalso, i like the racist touch you added to your front page.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:51 amNo NED, your a moron. Those are steadily going down. You proved my point. Everybody needs to go look at the poll results you posted, so they can see just what a wing nut you are. You just keep telling yourself that those are up and down numbers.
Oh and Democrats being hated more, here is why. See if you can remember this time. We don’t all agree with the Democrats, although all of you do agree with the republicans. See the difference. But come election day we vote Democrat anyway. So, that number is open for interpretation.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:52 ami mean, for you to actually admit on your blog that Ann Coulters Treason is your favorite book takes balls.not even i could be that typical.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:53 amNED,
1. When was the last time you picked up a rifle to stand post?
2. When was the last time you left your cushy investment banking job and actually visited countries rot with violence, depression, disease and malnutrition?
3. Have you ever been to places like Iraq, Darfur, Liberia, Congo, N. Korea?
4. Do you know what kind of oppression this country supports in those areas?
5. When was the last time you went without food or water for more then 2 days?
6. Have you ever been shot at in a time of war?
I ask because I’m curious to know how you have come to support the activities (the war in Iraq, and G.W.B. in general) that you do. I’m interested NED. Please enlighten all of us.
Chomsky writes: “States are not moral agents.â€
August 24th, 2005 at 11:58 amTry looking at the Graphic NED
http://www.pollingreport.com/national.htm#Bush
He’s a little slow. He’s the best argument for social engineering and against stagnant geene pool I have ever seen. Him and the two clowns at his blog. That’s the northeastern dilemma. How to keep those morons down on the farm or back in the trailer park.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:58 amNED failed the entance exam at Freep AND LGF.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:00 pmHey hey, I’m coming to Ned’s rescue here, since he’s been jilted by Ann Coulter http://www.crooksandliars.com/2005/08/23.html#a4591
Ned’s right about the Democrats – they have a serious problem. How come Chuck Hagel is the most vocal spokesman for change in Iraq? Have you seen how many times these people vote with the Chimp? Look at Politex – he’s been counting votes that these gutless sh**s have been casting: http://www.bushwatch.com/demwatch.htm
Chimpy is taking care of his side of the ‘taking back of Amurka’ – you locals need to sort your own house out.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:00 pmNED, i know your favorite books is by Ann Coulter(i still cant believe it says that on your blog), but you know, i wrote a few books too. you might wanna pick them up and bone up on your talking points.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:01 pmHARRIS POLL: DEMOCRATS ARE LESS POPULAR THAN BUSH
August 24th, 2005 at 12:04 pmNed offers laughter and a thought that democrats are less popular than the Chimp, I offer an idea: each and everyone of you write to your Senator and your local Cperson if they are one of these idiot Demos who vote for the Chimp all the time, and ask them what the hell they think they are doing? And if you have a like-minded friend tell them the same. Ned you can write to Hilary and ask her why she doesn’t vote with the Chimp the remaining 33% of the time, if you like.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:11 pmAnything to the left of Hitler is a democrat, right NED?
Chimpy’s a mongoloid idiot and doesn’t know his left from his right.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:15 pmYes, the problem is that 40% of the Dems vote Republican 70% of the time. I am not sure anybody here would follow a Dem to the death the way you would follow a Rep do your death NED. Oh wait, you won’t join the military, so I take that back. You only verbally follow your Republicans. You’re a little bitch. And steady decline.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:16 pmhttp://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/23/AR2005082301178.html
http://americablog.blogspot.com/2005/08/bush-hates-facts-example-2743.html
August 24th, 2005 at 12:17 pmDEMOCRATS LESS POPULAR THAN BUSH
August 24th, 2005 at 12:40 pmDEMOCRAT LESS POPULAR THAN MAJORITY REPUBLICANS
August 24th, 2005 at 12:41 pmDEMOCRATS LESS POPULAR THAN CHENEY
August 24th, 2005 at 12:41 pmNED,
Re: # 69
“There is no way hell you people are taking back anything.”
Yes, but…
As you indicated in #65, “A lot can and will happen.”
August 24th, 2005 at 12:41 pmNortheast Dilemma–next terrorist attack means martial law. Looks like that will affect you along with everyone else. I hope your papers are in order.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:43 pmOh look…NED’s catapulting the truth!
August 24th, 2005 at 12:43 pmHey NED, the caps lock key is rigth above the left hand shift key. I think yours is stuck.
Besides, don’t you as a rigth winger know that the Wall Street Journal is a right wing newspaper. Their info means nothing to us as it is skewed to the right.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:46 pm#93-95: “Well there you go again”
August 24th, 2005 at 12:50 pmI actually know of someone who very suddenly woke up from willfull ignorance and/or denial, after spending just a weekend reading noncorporate news. It was not a pretty sight, and we should be prepared for more of it.
August 24th, 2005 at 12:55 pmHadenuf, looks like Ned may be taking his ‘blue pill’ today, he’s been abandoned by Ann Coulter and is hanging on his sanity by a single Wall Street Journal poll… let’s wait and see…
August 24th, 2005 at 1:02 pmIt’s just like Star Trek when Kirk argues the evil computer into a paradox: “I don’t believe in polls, but look at this poll, I don’t believe in polls, but look, …danger, can’t compute”
August 24th, 2005 at 1:10 pmJust think of NED as a Republican punching bag. I do.
August 24th, 2005 at 1:25 pm#104 – that’s fine, this is my liberal “urinal”
August 24th, 2005 at 1:28 pmBut M5…., you said… that.. you.. never listen to polls. And yet… your only… argument…is… this …. Wall Street Journal poll….That is … illogical …. You are illogical… you… must… shut… down……
August 24th, 2005 at 1:30 pmGuess what, Northeast Dilemma–a fascist police state doesn’t care if you’re “liberal” or “conservative”. Take a piss where you can while you are able.
August 24th, 2005 at 1:34 pmWheeee! Bathroom humor!
#104 – that’s fine, this is my liberal “urinalâ€
Comment by The Northeast Dilemma — August 24, 2005 @ 1:28 pm
You can be #1 over here, NED. We don’t mind being #2 on your side of the aisle. It’s all crap over there anyway.
August 24th, 2005 at 1:53 pmWhy does NED confuse Progressives with Democrats? We have as many independents and disillusioned conservatives and Republicans here as any other group.
August 24th, 2005 at 1:58 pmHere here, Dot!!!
August 24th, 2005 at 2:13 pmUnhappiness with the war is understandable. It is based on a lot of things, including the fact that most people still get their war news from a biased MSM, whose reporters don’t even bother to report the good news. Many of them rarely go very far from their hotel, which begs the question of why they are there in the first place.
The impression given by MSM reporting is that we are losing in Iraq. People hear about our war dead, and they assume that our soldiers are miserable; whereas, in fact, every measure of troops morale shows that it is high. People hear about terrorist violence and assume the Iraqi people want us to leave; whereas, polls and troop anecdotes show how much they want us to stay the course. People hear words like “quagmire” and comparisons to Vietnam; whereas there is no factual basis for describing Iraq in these terms.
People have not been told about the good work we are doing in Iraq, and how much we are appreciated by the Iraqi people. They are not told that our average daily combat death toll in Iraq is less than half the average daily ACCIDENTAL death toll during peacetime. If people heard the kind of supportive reporting that occurred in World War II (now disparaged as “triumphalism”), they would have a much more positive view of the war, despite the death and destruction.
War is hell. Even those of us who can only imagine how bad it is cringe whenever we hear of more death and destruction. A lot of us even entertain thoughts of how nice it would be if we could bring our troops home. But that isn’t the same as favoring retreat. Americans never are in favor of retreat.
The Vietnam comparison is inapt for a whole bunch of reasons (most especially the fact that there is neither any Iraqi enemy leadership, nor any Iraqi popular support). In terms of domestic popular opinion, we withdrew from Vietnam amid massive street protests, campus riots and bombings, and political assasinations at home. Even then, American voters demonstrated a clear preference for peace with honor, instead of retreat and defeat.
Even with the Sheehan mini-boomlet, the left today is a mere shadow of its former self. There are no massive street protests. There is no campus violence. There is nothing like the domestic political turmoil of the 1960s. And the left still has never made a rational argument for leaving Iraq.
The left’s mantra, “Bush lied,” has grown old and tiresome. The fact that 2002 Iraq war resolution was supported by every leading contender for the 2004 Democratic presidential nomination, plus the leading contender for the 2008 nomination, just shows how out of touch the left really is. America will stay the course in Iraq, and America will prevail there. And the American left will, once again, find itself on the wrong side of history.
August 24th, 2005 at 2:18 pmNice cut-and-paste job, BSR. Who did you plagerize that from, since you didn’t cite it? It’s BS, R.
August 24th, 2005 at 2:49 pm59 million people voted for Bush we are told. If just 1 in a thousand of those people went down and enlisted we’d have all the troops we need. If merely 1 in one thousand of Bush’s supporters had the guts to stand up we’d be able to bring home the troops who–after all–didn’t volunteer for this madness. That’s how shallow Bush’s support is. In WWII every able-bodied man went down and enlisted whether they believed in the war or not. Quite a contrast. If I believed in this war I would go. Guess I have more guts than them.
August 24th, 2005 at 3:06 pmDo you want to live in a better world or, just a better neighborhood?
NED,
You never answered any of the questions in post #83. I assume then that you have never experienced any of these things, correct?
How then can you sit back and promote a war or a cause that you yourself are unwilling to take part in? If you support it, then go help, you’re young enough. Or are you waiting for the draft?
August 24th, 2005 at 3:08 pmBSR,
Where are you getting your information about the average daily death toll rates? Where are you getting your information in regards to troop moral?
You can’t claim these things without stating the evidence to back it up.
An accidental death that occurs during peace time is just that, and accident. Being shipped off some place and forced to fight a war under false pretenses is no accident and is inexcusable.
You go right on trying to justify the deaths of people other then you to make you feel better about your ignorance. That couch is pretty comfortable isn’t it?
“Americans never are in favor of retreat.” Get over yourself. There are Americans who favor retreat. There are people who see pride as a barrier to knowledge and refuse to let it be. Self-delusion breed’s pride-Pride breeds the inability to learn.
“The leading self-delusion of proud people is their false security in themselves and their resources.”
August 24th, 2005 at 3:31 pmThe Holloway story is out of control. I couldn’t even watch Hannity for weeks because of it. It’s plain nonsense if you ask me.
Comment by The Northeast Dilemma
August 24th, 2005 at 4:00 pmcome on NED, whos your daddy???
i went to your blog NED, and i noticed your favorite book is by Ann Coulter. i thought you were a sheep for liking me, but Ann too? wow, you are a very good soldier NED. no wonder your sheep-like talking points are always so fresh. i noticed you like pop music too. sweet. .
August 24th, 2005 at 4:02 pmComments to BSR:
1. Why don’t the reporters in Iraq get very far from their hotels? Could it be they don’t want to be killed or kidnapped?
August 24th, 2005 at 4:06 pm2. How many valid polls can be taken in Iraq? For most Iraqis survival and trying to get the basic necessities are their priorities.
3. Quagmire – defines the situation in Iraq perfectly. There isn’t a good solution whether we stay 1 year or 10 years. The US military did its job in Iraq. It defeated the Iraqi military in a brilliant campaign. It is not the job of our military to “nation build†and try to intervene in what will eventually become a civil war. Even if we left with a “democratic†government in place, eventually there will be a coup or another Islamic revolution. Let’s cut our losses.
4. I hope that you are not insinuating that the MSM is biased against the war. The MSM was absent discussing the real issues prior to the war and really had a pro-war posture especially before the 2004 elections. It’s hard not to report on the kind of attacks that occur daily in Iraq. In fact the MSM, actually only reports the big ones. You have to find other sources (usually foreign) that actually report all of the violence that occurs daily.
5. I’m sure that there are many good things happening in Iraq. The fact that it is almost impossible to get these stories out should make you wonder about the security situation. I find it remarkable that in Bagdad most Iraqis are lucky if they have electric power for 4 hours a day. While Hussein was a tyrant, the lives of everyday working Iraqis is much worse today than before the war. Why 2 1/2 years after the invasion, is the Iraqi infrastructure still in shambles? The war should have been won in the hearts and minds of the Iraqis in the first year.
6. It’s not the left that got us out of Vietnam. It was people who could look past labels and see what was really happening. The same thing is happening today.
7. War is hell? If you haven’t been there, I don’t think that you should comment. You don’t think we should ever retreat? Not even if we invaded a country by mistake?
8. What the warmongers don’t realize is that Cindy Sheehan did more for the cause than any demonstration could. She made a lot of people think about the “noble causeâ€. What is really pathetic is the attacks that have been made on her.
9. I’m quite sure that most of the senators (D and R) that supported the Iraq War Resolution would have used that resolution quite differently than George Bush. It was Bush’s intent to go to war and the War Resolution was just a way to legitimize that. I think that many of the senators were naïve to trust that he would use this resolution as leverage to find a diplomatic solution. He never had any intention to try and find a peaceful solution. The WMD evidence was never sufficient to go to war. Imagine if Bush had been president in October of 1962.
10. Stay the course. That was valid in the first year. If the situation changes and what you have been doing isn’t working, wouldn’t it make sense to change course? What really irks me about Bush is this pig-headed stupidity. He has had so many opportunities to truly become a “uniter†but I have come to the conclusion that he is either “stupid†or an “arrogant assâ€. I don’t think he’s stupid!
College Is A Killer
Here are the blogs mentioned on the air today on the WB42 5:30 Report. Plus links to many more.
August 24th, 2005 at 4:14 pmI’m a constitutionalist. I’m more Conservative in the true sense than any of these faux Republicans will ever be.
America is not supposed to be an EMPIRE. Its just to sick for words what this government is doing to the country and the world.
August 24th, 2005 at 4:14 pmLiberals mantra: let’s turn the Iraq over to our friends, the insurgency (terrorists), that hate freedom, democracy and George Bush. We want to destroy Bush. Whatever it takes, even if we have to align ourselves with our friends, the terrorists, who will murder their fellow Arabs and Americans without regard for political afilliation. Weakening America is our goal. Praise Allah.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:26 pmSteed, did Al-Qaeda attack us because they “hate our freedoms”? go back to watching Fox News you brainless, opinionless, talking point spewing moron.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:33 pmhey Steed, your talking points sound a little dated, tune back into my show for all the latest talking points. i know you will. sheep.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:36 pmThis seems like something that even cowardly, corporate ass-licking DLC types should be able to understand.
STOP BACKING THE WAR, you dumbass closet republicans!
Or at least have the decency to stop calling yourselves democrats.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:44 pmLiberal defense: name calling.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:02 pmSteed, you need to post on the active thread dude, cheap name calling doesn’t work unless someone sees it.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:22 pmNeddy could have used your help today, Steed, he was shot down in flames twice in one day.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:22 pmI was hoping the trolls would be hear to cry in their beer. Anyone who admits to supporting the Bushie now should be real embarrassed. How does it feel Steed and NED to be a speck in this country?
August 24th, 2005 at 11:01 pmHow does it feel to be not a speck…as in fat?
August 24th, 2005 at 11:16 pmSteed, get yourself over to the environmental thread, I’m sure you have something to offer besides cheap name calling.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:20 pmBTW Sewie, I’ve been to Iraq, you haven’t.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:24 pmYes, quite a combo. And we have to deal with the pres. for another 3.5 years and the war. . .well who knows really, rumor has it it will be 5 or so.
August 25th, 2005 at 12:04 amComment #37, don’t even get me started on the HOllowar story. That is just a real life soap opera that the networks are banking on because people love tabloid news. I yelled at my mom to stop watching it but she says she’s hooked. Just what FOX news wants, another viewer “hooked” on their “news”.
August 25th, 2005 at 12:06 amSteed, you have my talking points DOWN, your a good sheep. im proud of you.
August 25th, 2005 at 10:23 amJust like the FIRST TIME troops were sent into that region……
Sadam was frantically trying to withdraw troops from Kuiat. He had already said that he would remove his troops and was trying to have a dialog with America- and the U.N. But Dumbya the smarter wanted a war so there we go.
This time he was somewhat caught off guard, if you look at reports (turn off CNN and FAUX) you will see that Sadam was taking UN weapons inspectors ANYWHERE they wanted to go. It is a war based on lies and just a war-for-profit. (Anyone remember the Mobile-labs they had but didn’t have???? Faux news isn’t saying anything about these now are they?)
Here we are debating, and there they are building their bases in a foregin country. Anyone wonder why the U.S. needs SO MANY BASES IN ONE COUNTRY??? You won’t find this story on FAUX. FAUX has moved it’s entire operation to ARUBA to investigate the missing white chick.
Pity the Fairness Doctrine was killed by Ray-gun. That was truly the end for FAIR NEWS AND REAL JOURNALISM.
August 25th, 2005 at 12:14 pmWell what do you know? This quagmire is less popluar than the last quagmire. pathetic.
August 25th, 2005 at 5:40 pm[...] Fresh analysis from Gallup: [...]
March 18th, 2007 at 7:49 am