What The Senate Intel Commitee Found: Bush Admin Manipulated Case For War
What The Senate Intel Commitee Found: Bush Admin Manipulated Case For War
Today, President Bush attempted to defend his manipulation of pre-war Iraq intelligence by citing the Senate Intelligence Committee’s report.
BUSH: These critics are fully aware that a bipartisan Senate investigation found no evidence of political pressure to change the intelligence community’s judgments related to Iraq’s weapons programs.
As has been previously documented by ThinkProgress and others, the answer to whether there was political pressure was left to phase II of the investigation and was not addressed in the report.
What the Senate Intelligence Committee did report, however, is that there was plenty of evidence demonstrating that the intelligence assessments made by intel officials WERE changed.
The Los Angeles Times (7/10/04) reported, “[I]n the unclassified version of the NIE — the so-called white paper cited by the Bush administration in making its case for war — those carefully qualified conclusions [in the classified version] were turned into blunt assertions of fact.”
Here’s what the Senate Intelligence Committee reported about the administration’s use of intelligence:
The intelligence community’s elimination of the caveats from the unclassified white paper misrepresented their judgments to the public, which did not have access to the classified National Intelligence Estimate containing the more carefully worded assessments.
Essentially, the Bush administration took the intelligence that was presented to them in the classified NIE and twisted it to present a stronger case for war in the public version of the NIE. Here are some examples:
Classified NIE: “Although we have little specific information on Iraq’s CW stockpile, Saddam Hussein probably has stocked at least 100 metric tons†of such poisons.
Unclassified NIE: The phrase “although we have little specific information†was deleted. Instead, the public report said, “Saddam probably has stocked a few hundred metric tons of CW agents.â€
[Senate Intel Cmte Report]
Classified NIE: “Iraq has some lethal and incapacitating BW [biological weapons] agents and is capable of quickly producing … a variety of such agents, including anthrax, for delivery by bombs, missiles, aerial sprayers and covert operatives.â€
Unclassified NIE: The words “potentially against the U.S. homeland†are inserted at the end of the statement.
[Senate Intel Cmte Report]
Classified NIE: Stated Iraq was developing unmanned aerial vehicles “probably intended to deliver biological warfare agents.”
Unclassified NIE: A footnote in the classified version from the Air Force stating its disagreement with this claim was eliminated. The Senate Committee report stated the public NIE missed “the fact that… [the] agency with primary responsibility for technological analysis on UAV programs did not agree with the assessment.”
[Senate Intel Cmte Report]
Classified NIE: Included a reference to State Department’s Bureau of Intelligence and Research dissenting view on whether Iraq would have a nuclear weapon this decade.
Unclassified NIE: Did not contain any mention of INR’s dissent.
[Senate Intel Cmte Report]
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See, Bush isn’t lying. There was no political pressure to change the information. Why apply political pressure when you can just make the changes yourself?
November 11th, 2005 at 1:52 pmWow. There it is in black and white folks. Can we end this charade now and send them packing? Go back to your ranches in Texas, Wyoming and wherever. Just stop running our country into the ground.
November 11th, 2005 at 1:54 pmWhen will the revolution finally start? Does President Shithead have to bomb the Appellate Court in San Fransisco, to get people off there asses? I just don’t feel like “the people” (as in the ones refered to as “We the People…”) are in control and maybe a time for a ‘re-address of grievenses (sp?)”. This may be my last post as I’m sure the SS is on its way to my office as I type… I like his reference to ‘not re-writting history”. Why end the lie now?
November 11th, 2005 at 2:02 pmIn other words, given disagreement in the intel community (which always exists), the propaganda pimps of ThinkProgress would rather have given Saddam Hussein the benefit of the doubt.
Fact: The bipartisan consensus before the war was that Iraq was a threat, was seeking WMD, and was a supporter of terrorism.
Now, Democrats are lying about all of that, undermining out troops for partisan gain.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:04 pmK A B O O O O M ! ! !
My head just exploded.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:06 pmwwallace
Wipe off your face idiot and swallow before speaking traitor.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:06 pm#6 Yes this was the consensus, but it was based on bogus information provided by the WH. Given the modified documentation they received, they did conclude that the evidence supported the WH.
But it has been shown time and time again, that the information was either false or greatly altered for gaining support for the war.
Yes, Saddam was a bad man. However, he did not threaten the US in any way. He kept that part of the world, at least Iraq, under control. Maybe not the way we wanted, but never the less it was under control. Look at it now.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:10 pm“The bipartisan consensus before the war was that Iraq was a threat, was seeking WMD, and was a supporter of terrorism.”
And it turned out all false! When we didn’t find any WMD’s in Iraq, why did we still send our troops in? The democrats voted for war believing that if we founD no WMD’s we would be cautious. But no, Bush jumped right in and behold, there was no WMD’s. How can you defend someone so incompetent?
November 11th, 2005 at 2:11 pmBut that was a lie, right wallace? The intelligence that Bush paraded around for all to see was just SHIT from Chalabi, right?
November 11th, 2005 at 2:11 pm“you think creative writing is easy??? It’s HARD WORK.
Goebells would be damn proud.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:13 pm[...] >> Rewriting History >> What The Senate Intel Commitee Found: Bush Admin Manipulated Case For War [...]
November 11th, 2005 at 2:14 pmFreedom in the form of a bomb, that’s the american way!
November 11th, 2005 at 2:17 pmChicken Hawks like wwallace are protecting traitors with attacks on “democrats”, which is the GOP attack the messenger program for idiots that can not argue on merit. If only these cowards would go serve like many of us, we would be able to have the constant war they want so badly but are afraid to serve in.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:17 pmwwallace,
You are an embarassment to this country. The fact that you are using wwallace as your screen name also makes you an embarassment to Scotland.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:23 pmBraawwwwwkkkk!!
Haven’t been in these parts for a while. Is wwallace a new Limbannity parrot or a recurring character?
November 11th, 2005 at 2:29 pmSo the WhackJobs aren’t quite ready to tell the truth. Color me surprised.
Trolls may believe their Sainted President. Everyone else knows what fools they are. Truth is ALWAYS better than Opinion.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:29 pmHey, the Bush admin. lied fair and square and now we have to live that lie.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:32 pmfreeeeeDUMB
What is so hard to understand? That Bush & Co. manipulated and cherry-picked intelligence, using only their choice of which intel to make the case for war?
November 11th, 2005 at 2:33 pmThat leaders in Congress were told ONLY what they were supposed to hear regarding that intelligence? That Bush & Co. riled the public fervor to extreme by claiming a false connection between Hussein and 9/11?
That Bush has a lifetime record of not being honest and truthful?
The dwindling number of people who believe as wwallace do are simply blinded by the bright shiny objects (flagrant, choreographed lies) wielded by Bush & Co. so they cannot see the truth.
The GOP has completely self-destructed. They can’t even pass a budget let alone revamp Social Security to further their theft of our treasury. At this point, arguing with the trolls no longer serves a purpose. You can’t stop people from wallowing in their own stupidity, let them argue with eachother about their own contrived realities, it’s over for them.
Time to start thinking about how the reality-based community goes about cleaning up this mess. Constructive ideas, pressure on the Democrats, aggressively pushing to reverse the damage to democracy that 5 years of hairbrained politics has inflicted. Howard Dean has excellent ideas and his lead a great place to start. I’m sending Howard and the Dems $25.00 RIGHT NOW.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:33 pmIn other words, given disagreement in the intel community (which always exists), the propaganda pimps of ThinkProgress would rather have given Saddam Hussein the benefit of the doubt.
Comment by wwallace — November 11, 2005 @ 2:04 pm
Translation: We (warmongers, Bush & neo-con apologists) reserve for ourselves the right to present the public with propaganda, & manipulated information in order to steer public opinion in whatever way we want. We will never let reality get in our way. It is not unethical when we do it. Get used to that.
Fact: The bipartisan consensus before the war was that Iraq was a threat, was seeking WMD, and was a supporter of terrorism.
Comment by wwallace — November 11, 2005 @ 2:04 pm
Translation: Ditto
Now, Democrats are lying about all of that, undermining out troops for partisan gain.
Comment by wwallace — November 11, 2005 @ 2:04 pm
Translation: Ditto. Plus if you catch me red-handed in a deception, and call me on it, then it is you who are a liar and are undermining our troops’ morale.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:34 pmMe thinkst activists with the will to demonstrate the American people’s resolve to get to the bottom of the only question that matters today – Did this Administration’s lies lead our nation to war? – will organize such demonstration early and often, by and large for the months to come. If there’s a weasel in the hen house, don’t expect the fox will work to save any feathers. We yeoman farmers must actively work to take back the farm. -Kevo
November 11th, 2005 at 2:41 pmBy DEB RIECHMANN
Associated Press Writer
TOBYHANNA, Pa.
President Bush forcefully attacked critics of the war in Iraq on Friday, accusing them of trying to rewrite history and saying they are undercutting American forces on the front lines.
,“The stakes in the global war on terror are too high and the national interest is too important for politicians to throw out false charges,†the president said in his combative Veterans Day speech.
Well George it’s really quite simple. Those that attack America during a time of war are enemies and if they happen to hold American citizenship they are traitors. What did we USED to do with traitors George? That’s right George, we lined their asses up against a wall and poured hot lead into them.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:44 pmThe Dems must get out on this Bush speech TODAY . Reid, Kerry, Clinton, Biden, etc MUST say to the Amiercan people today that the speech the president gave was riddled with lies and distortions. Lies and disortion. They were NOT gievn the same info he was privy to. They did not know that the key figure behind the key info was called a liar months before the vote. OUR LEADERS mus hit back today. I have emailed Reid and I think we all should do that. Let Reid know that we will not stand pat while the president tries to blame us for being unpatriotic when 55% of americans think he is lying.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:45 pmHere is your blindfold I-Right-I. Don’t worry traitor we will aim for your head.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:47 pm“Well George it’s really quite simple. Those that attack America during a time of war are enemies and if they happen to hold American citizenship they are traitors. What did we USED to do with traitors George? That’s right George, we lined their asses up against a wall and poured hot lead into them. ”
So everything Bush does shouldn’t be questioned. That’s traitorous. Why not make Bush king if Democrats are such enemies.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:48 pmTime to start thinking about how the reality-based community goes about cleaning up this mess. Constructive ideas, pressure on the Democrats, aggressively pushing to reverse the damage to democracy that 5 years of hairbrained politics has inflicted. Howard Dean has excellent ideas and his lead a great place to start. I’m sending Howard and the Dems $25.00 RIGHT NOW.
Comment by Jay
“Reality based community”…..that’s a hoot, almost as funny as Howard Dean and excellent idea being used in the same sentence. Oh wait, I can do it; “I think it would be an excellent idea if this country tried Howard Dean for treason and hung him on the capital steps along with all the leaders of the Filthy Left.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:49 pm#6: wwallace: Obviously, since even when presented with undeniable evidence that Bush & Co. lied to the American people, you still support this corrupt/criminal administration, YOU are the “propaganda pimp” of Bush and the Republicans.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:49 pmInsulting the majority W? Again, not too bright.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:50 pmOnce again, I give you Colin Powell and Condi Rice:
http://www.thememoryhole.org/war/powell-no-wmd.htm
Mr Wallace, fact: the Bush admin concensus before 9-11 was that Saddam had no capability to rearm and was ‘contained’.
Fact: the UN weapons inspectors found pretty much jack in 2002-2003 – you’d think that counted for something over the ‘US intelligence concensus’ when 1000s of lives are at stake.
Check your fax, I’m sure you have some new talkings coming by now…
November 11th, 2005 at 2:50 pmSo everything Bush does shouldn’t be questioned. That’s traitorous. Why not make Bush king if Democrats are such enemies.
Comment by Andy
The Filthy Left doesn’t question anything. They make flat out statements that are lies and manipulation and distorsions of facts that undermine our war effort and cause our troops to die in larger numbers. I say hang the lot of them.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:51 pm#34, another Nazi solution from a Nazi.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:52 pmSo, I-RIGHT-I, what you’re saying is that you’re in favor of lying to the American people in order to attain strictly political gains that have nothing to do with protecting our great country. You’re quite the patriot.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:52 pmFact: the UN weapons inspectors found pretty much jack in 2002-2003 –
Comment by Terry the Termite
Fact: The UN weapons inspectors were working for Saddam.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:53 pmIn the end it is off with your head IRI, but not until after the mob throws their excrement at your face, eat up. Now that sounds fun!
November 11th, 2005 at 2:53 pm“The Filthy Left doesn’t question anything. They make flat out statements that are lies and manipulation and distorsions of facts that undermine our war effort”
Wipe Ken Melman’s material off your lips and swallow it, it is unseemly. Here is your blindfold traitor and gag, take it so we don’t see your traitor tears and sobs.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:56 pmDon’t forget that since 9/11 Bush reduced the number of members of Congress who could see the classified material.
The result is that Congress was never full informed about the Intell.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:59 pmSo, I-RIGHT-I, what you’re saying is that you’re in favor of lying to the American people in order to attain strictly political gains that have nothing to do with protecting our great country. You’re quite the patriot.
Comment by Ringo
I haven’t heard a single lie. But I’ll tell you this. In order to place the greatest military machine on earth smack dab in the middle of a region operated by multi-trillionaire muslim fanatics hell bent on destroying the West and turning us all into Mooslimes or smoldering nuclear ash I’d not only lie but I’d kill a few people too. My family is more important than your ill conceived peace/love/dove pass the bong ideals. And that’s a fact.
November 11th, 2005 at 2:59 pmBraaawwwwcckkk!!!
I-Right-I wanna cracker?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:02 pmDon’t forget that since 9/11 Bush reduced the number of members of Congress who could see the classified material.
The result is that Congress was never full informed about the Intell.
Comment by EasyRider
Considering how the Clinton administration boys traded military secrets and hardware for campaign donations with the blessing of the Democrats I’d say it was quite prudent. It’s not wise to allow your enemies to know everything you know.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:02 pmBraaawwwwcckkk!!!
I-Right-I wanna cracker?
Comment by MLDB
Wanna crack pipe?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:03 pmRyan
I have heard, on pretty good info, that Tall Buildings in New York have the Charges built into place for Demolition by Code.
IF, BIG IF, this IS so, then it Would be easy to ‘PULL’ the Buildings Down.
The Remark Made by some guy, I forget whom, to ‘PULL’ the Buildings.
Google Ex-FBI agent Gunderson.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:04 pmIn the end it is off with your head IRI, but not until after the mob throws their excrement at your face, eat up. Now that sounds fun!
Comment by MY left EYE
I wade through Left Wing shit every day. The mob doesn’t bother me a bit. You’re just a pimple on the ass of America.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:05 pmU-WRONG-U,
You are a crack head.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:06 pmIt is Veterans Day and look at what happened because of Bush’s speech. Our veterans were largely ignored because, once again, he has used the military as a backdrop for political messages. How damn sad. This is the worse elected public official in my lifetime. He has no shame, no honor and especially no morals. I am sure his father must be very proud of him–NOT
November 11th, 2005 at 3:06 pmRyan
I have heard, on pretty good info, that Tall Buildings in New York have the Charges built into place for Demolition by Code.
IF, BIG IF, this IS so, then it Would be easy to ‘PULL’ the Buildings Down.
The Remark Made by some guy, I forget whom, to ‘PULL’ the Buildings.
Google Ex-FBI agent Gunderson.
You’re an idiot.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:06 pmWow, I-RIGHT-I is freaking insane. He is on a roll today. Very entertaining. I am laughing my ass of at the stuff he is posting.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:09 pmI-Right-I
He is the GOP bitch boy of the day. Your family, yea right, we know that you and Ken spend your nights together, so spare us your “white hetero male” b.s. and wipe off your chin.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:09 pmI think it is just a shame that Bush used Veterans day to mount a political attack against the left. Does he have no respect at all?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:09 pmIt is Veterans Day and look at what happened because of Bush’s speech. Our veterans were largely ignored because, once again, he has used the military as a backdrop for political messages. How damn sad. This is the worse elected public official in my lifetime. He has no shame, no honor and especially no morals. I am sure his father must be very proud of him–NOT
Comment by Aquarius
You have no shame or honor. Like that bitch who camped out at Bush’s ranch you use our dead to further the destruction of our country. One of these days you’ll pay.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:10 pmNo GOP bitch boy, you will pay in 2006.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:11 pmRIGHT, I would just as soon you say thank you and shut the F%ck up for my un-waivered service in the millitary. You are a discrace to the Veterans of this country.
You and your kind show no or little respect for the very people who give you the right to spew this crap you do.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:13 pmTell me again how Bush will be impeached and removed from office by both houses of congress that are Republican controlled? You guys have to win an election first for that to happen. Besides, there is no reason to impeach Bush, who history will define as one of the greatest war-time presidents of all time!
November 11th, 2005 at 3:14 pmYour calling the mother of a dead soldier a bitch?? You say you support the troops? Your just filthy scum, your good for nothing on this planet, who are you to speak out coward?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:14 pmCome on IRI, I’ll be in Houston Sunday, looks like you have a lot of pent up rage to let off – how about you and I take your pickup out, look for some homeless people and take them for a ‘drag’…
November 11th, 2005 at 3:14 pmThere’s no reasoning with someone as brainwashed as I-RIGHT-I. No doubt he’s buried food, guns, and munitions somewhere near his bunker in Idaho. Lost cause. Another one who’ll go down with the ship.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:15 pmIt’s not wise to allow your enemies to know everything you know.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I — November 11, 2005 @ 3:02 pm
Like the fact that we broke Iran’s secret codes? Or whose wife is working undercover at the CIA in the WMD/Counterproliferation group?
I didn’t realize Cheney was such a leftist.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:16 pm#62
“Besides, there is no reason to impeach Bush, who history will define as one of the greatest war-time presidents of all time!”
Boy..who let Harriet “greatest governor ever” Miers in here?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:17 pmI think all these trolls got a hard-on after watching Bush’s speech. Now they are all charged up to spew incoherant crap.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:17 pm“Bush, who history will define as one of the greatest war-time presidents of all time!”
Yea right randy
Please wipe the GOP spew from your face, it really is unseemly.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:17 pmTell me again how Bush will be impeached and removed from office by both houses of congress that are Republican controlled?
Tell me again how what is right and wrong doesn’t matter. It only matters that the side you like is in power.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:17 pmRandy, Greatest war-time presidents of all time? Cumon! This is a joke right?
The only thing this president is going to be noted for is the murder of thousands of innocent people. One day, and I hope not to far in the near future, the WH administration will be found guilty of performing or allowing the events of 9/11 to occur. There is no way that 4 planes could have performed so much damage unless they were allowed to.
It was planed that the Air Force would stand down that day. This information is undisputable, so once someone has the balls to investigate that the truth will come out.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:18 pmOh forgot…
Brrraaaawwwcckkk!
I-Right-I…throw Randy a cracker
November 11th, 2005 at 3:19 pmBLABLABLA
Knowing these traitors, I’m sure Osama is on the GOP payroll.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:24 pmDID NOT FIND OSAMA BIN LADEN
BUSH NEVER INTENDED TO FIND OSAMA, BUSH WAS INTENDED ON GETTING MIDDLE EAST OIL!FOR HIS SUPERRICH BUDDIES!
WHOS LEG DOES HE THINK HES PULLING ANYWAYS.
STUPID REPUB RIGHTOUS RICH CHURCH LDRS , THATS WHO.
Comment by BLABLABLABL
Ossam is dead. The oil goes on the open market and oil companies pay the going rate just like everyone else. The UN inspectors were bribed to look the other way and all those “allies” of the USA like France, Germany, Russia were shipping war materials along with sophisticated technology to Saddam then entire time. What you never heard of the “Food for Oil” scandal in the UN? Dumbass.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:25 pmThere is no way that 4 planes could have performed so much damage unless they were allowed to.
It was planed that the Air Force would stand down that day.
Comment by RemoveBush
Dumbass conspiracy freak. Is that you Justin the Rainman Raimondo?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:28 pmso spare us your “white hetero male†b.s. and wipe off your chin.
Comment by Citizen80203
You’ve been dating Ryan again haven’t you? I thought you two broke up?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:29 pmI-Right-I Bitch boy
“Ossam is dead.”
At least when you cough up the GOP spew you swallowed, make it half ass in the “realm”.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:30 pmDumbass.
such an intellegent use of words.
Comment by BLABLABLABLA
It’s all that’s required for you and yours.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:31 pmCheney sold military technology to Iran. Osama is in Pakistan, along with A.Q. Khan, living under the protection of Bush’s “allies.” Oliver North sold weapons to terrorists. For that, Bush’s allies call him a hero. Oil for food scam involved a lot of Americans, a lot of Texans too.
And what is the most pressing task necessary for national security? Stifling dissent, of course!
If you want to put me against the wall, put me along side everyone who criticized Clinton when we were at war bringing democracy to the Balkans.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:31 pmI-Right-I Bitch boy
“Ossam is dead.â€
At least when you cough up the GOP spew you swallowed, make it half ass in the “realmâ€.
Comment by Citizen80203
When was the last time you saw him?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:31 pmIf you want to put me against the wall, put me along side everyone who criticized Clinton when we were at war bringing democracy to the Balkans.
Comment by cyncial ex-hippie
We weren’t bringing democracy to the Balkans. We were slaughtering Christians so they wouldn’t kill Muslim terrorists. That’s how Donks operate don’t you know.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:33 pmFunny how these GOP bitch boy trolls all log on just after school is out. Grow balls and become men before you start posting here.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:33 pmRIGHT, you mean to tell me that 4 planes can fly for more than 20 minutes and crash into anything they want without Air Force intervension?
Whos the dumb ass? I can see maybe 1 plane, but after that I can guarantee that after that any plane that was not answering or fell off of radar, would be immediatly sought after by the Air Force. Are you that ignorant that you think that we cannot have air plane in the air in less than 5 minutes and intercept an aircraft within 15 minutes.
Someone from a high authority had to stop those planes from being launched. This is not a conspiracy, this is a matter of fact. It has always been a matter of security to make contact with a stray plane, especially ones over the very secure air space of Washington DC
IDIOT!
November 11th, 2005 at 3:34 pmHeres your sign, I-RIGHT-I and Randy.
http://www.satanservice.org/coe/suicide/guide/
Comment by BLABLABLABLA
Good choice of website. So, you’ve been considering suicide have you? Let me know if there’s anything I can do to help you make up your mind.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:35 pmWe weren’t bringing democracy to the Balkans. We were slaughtering Christians so they wouldn’t kill Muslim terrorists.
If your standard for success is Iraq, then by that standard we did bring democracy to the Balkans, and brought a brutal dictator to justice. I bet you wish Milosevic was still in power, traitor.
Compare the number of terrorist attacks in Iraq since mission accomplished, with the number of terrorist attacks in the Balkans since Clinton brought Milosevic to justice. Hmmmm?
And before we intervened, the Balkans were an al Qaeda training ground. Thanks to Clinton, they have one less country in which to operate.
And you didn’t address Oliver North selling weapons to terrorists. I’d like to know what you think about that.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:37 pmLook people, I have volunteered to feed the trolls (parrots) crackers. Why crackers? Because the parrots cannot whistle their Limbannity hate while eating a cracker.
Keep feeding them and they’ll keep coming back for more. It’s what they live for.
I say either ignore them or participate in wild ridicule.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:38 pmI-Right-I
Well, well, well, now we know Ken Melman has been molesting you. Good god, Ken is also a pedophile.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:38 pmSomeone from a high authority had to stop those planes from being launched. This is not a conspiracy, this is a matter of fact. It has always been a matter of security to make contact with a stray plane, especially ones over the very secure air space of Washington DC
IDIOT!
Comment by RemoveBush
They did make contact or try to of course. But just like the passengers who flew into those buildings nobody dreamed that was what was going to happen. If you’ll recall the flight that crashed into the ground was being targeted by the air force but the point became mute as the passengers themselves destroyed the plane before it could kill anyone else. Why did they do that? Because they found out that was their fate too and were having none of it. I guarantee you that we will not lose another building.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:40 pm-Right-I
Well, well, well, now we know Ken Melman has been molesting you. Good god, Ken is also a pedophile.
Comment by Citizen80203
I don’t know a Ken Melman but he sounds like me he’s brilliant.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:43 pmRIGHT, if you look at the information regarding that crash you will determine that either a bomb went off or the plane was shot down.
There was part of the plane and bodies found 8 miles away from the crash site. If the plane just crashed, how can this be? Stop being a mindless fool and at least look at the evidence and question it, instead of being spoon fed the information.
Also, once the first plane crashed and another disappeared from radar it was no longer a guess as to what was going on. Even if there was a confussion factor there, the plane that hit the pentagon flew for 45 minutes. This was more than enough time for someone with any sort of brain to figure out that the missing planes from radar were hijacked.
The planes were not allowed or ordered to take off for a reason. What that reason was, nobody may know, but they were prevented from launching.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:46 pmIRI, What is your stance on the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus? I’m guessing you are a believer.
November 11th, 2005 at 3:50 pmTo anyone who believes in the conspiracy theories around 9/11, do you also believe that Bill Clinton was a mass murderer? There are alot of websites that have substantial evidence that he was responsible for the deaths of over 87 people that stood in the way of his agenda. See, how stupid it is to waste your time on conspiracy theories?
November 11th, 2005 at 3:56 pmRandy,
We’re talking ‘physics’, not conspiracy theories. This is a physics paper by a physicist. I know republicans don’t like math, science or reason, but it doesn’t change their existence. The world isn’t flat or 8000 years old despite your lunatic desires for that to be the case.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:00 pmMizzIWrongY sounds just like her fellow Nazi Rascist German fascist did when they claimed because they were ‘at war’, they had a right to invade the Netherlands. Fascists don’t change, neither does their fanatical and hysterical rhetoric. Republicans are such retarded fools.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:01 pmBushco allowed 911 to happen and we will find out the details soon.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:03 pmIRI, What is your stance on the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus? I’m guessing you are a believer.
Comment by the great pumpkin
I beat up the kid who first told me there was no Santa Claus. I hope that answers your question.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:03 pmOssam is dead. The oil goes on the open market and oil companies pay the going rate just like everyone else. The UN inspectors were bribed to look the other way and all those “allies†of the USA like France, Germany, Russia were shipping war materials along with sophisticated technology to Saddam then entire time. What you never heard of the “Food for Oil†scandal in the UN? Dumbass.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I — November 11, 2005 @ 3:25 pm
Take off your blinders IRI. Plenty of US Corps were involved in the Oil For Food scandal as well, but thanks for leaving that out.
And did you even bother to answer the question about supporting the slashing of veteran’s benefits in the budget by the Republican leadership? Of course not, because your so willfully ignorant and a traitor to this country. So drop the act about supporting our troops since you don’t support them with your words OR your actions.
This country is fed up with the riechwing whack job rhetoric. It shows with how much unrest there is in this country with the Bush Administration and the Republican leadership(what a joke). So prepare your bunker for 2006, because you are in for a shock.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:04 pmFor those that haven’t seen it, look at this flash video if you want to be even more concerned about 9/11 and the coverups still surrounding it.
http://www.freedomunderground.org/memoryhole/pentagon244.swf
November 11th, 2005 at 4:05 pmSo what you’re saying MizzIWrongY is that you have a long history of outbursts, uncontrolled violence and psychopatic tendencies that extend to childhood. How old were you when you were first sexually abused? Clearly this stems from childhood abuse, and it explains why you’re so pathologically compulsive and violent in your tendencies.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:06 pmYou beat up nobody cowardly right wing fairy. Go pull on your nub.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:06 pm“I don’t know a Ken Melman but he sounds like me he’s brilliant.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I ”
He’s the head of the GOP, and a closeted gay man just like you. I wouldn’t use the word brilliant, but you should go look him up for a date, he sounds as repressed and whacko as you clearly are. It’s a ‘republican thang’.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:08 pmIRIGHTI-
Your continuing nonsensical talk is starting to bore us
to tears and laughter. Kindly divest yourself from this blog before we send Jon Stewart, Stephen Colbert and Lewis Black to your house and make you read Scooter’s guide to caring for bears.
You’re still losing.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
November 11th, 2005 at 4:08 pmActually MizzIWrongY isn’t your classic chickenhawk, she’s more like the BTK killer. They’re dangerous because they have ‘anxious masculinity’, and thereby they exhibit unusual violent and dangerous tendencies to society. They’re actually complete cowards, but they mask that with bravado and ‘weapons’ that give them an advantage so they don’t have to feel weak any more.
She hates the APA (she’s already made this clear), because she knows she’s a lunatic. But she also refuses to let that stand in her way, so that’s why she’s such a whacko…
November 11th, 2005 at 4:11 pmThis is all that really counts.
1) Bush Admin Manipulated Case For War
2) Because of this the war itself is illegal by american law.
3) Because of this Bush legally should be impeached.
End of discussion!
November 11th, 2005 at 4:12 pmI-Right-I GOP bitch boy
“I beat up the kid who first told me there was no Santa Claus. I hope that answers your question. ”
Don’t make the mistake that talking tough is the same as acting tough, your chickenhawk pes’dent is proof of that. Hell, I was serving in the first Gulf War before you were uttering you first chickenhawk rant bitchboy.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:20 pmWhy isn’t anyone telling that poor excuse for a person, I-R-I, all about how Bush SAT THERE….FOR OVER 1/2 AN HOUR….DOING NOTHING….while the planes flew into the towers.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:21 pmI-R-I, you are TRULY insane.
You are a scary individual, and need help.
TrueBlue,
IRI is insane, we established that months ago. I mean of the ‘clinical’ variety. He says the APA is nothing but a bunch of secular jews who don’t know anything. He’s a real life opus dei religiously bigotted nazi…
November 11th, 2005 at 4:28 pmHey, anyone who would go onto a website where they disagree with nearly 100% of the content is clearly sick. Anyone who enjoys spending a large portion of their day, everyday, to be with those that they don’t like and don’t like them has major psychological issues. It is obvious they like to be “punished.” I figure they just had bad childhoods and absentee parents.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:36 pmThere was an early sign that something was wrong with the declassified version of the NIE. Sen Durbin, the leading Dem on the Senate Intelligence Committee, had access to both the declassified AND classified verson of the NIE. Because of the caveats and qualifications on the classified version, he had not only been demanding additional information from the various agencies, but was also wanting to know why so much of the information had been redacted. Durbin felt much of the redacted portion posed no threat to national security, so why take it out? The answer, of course, was because the WH only wanted info in the declassified version that supported their views.
Because the redacted information was classified, Durbin could not make public the concerns he had. The Repugs pushed for a vote immediately after issuing the declassified verson to the Senate, before anyone had a change to ask questions.
Sen Durbin voted AGAINST the war resolution, but because redacted information was redacted, he could not fully disclose the reason for his vote.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:44 pmI meant, because the redacted information was CLASSIFIED, Durbin couldn’t disclose ….
I need a preview screen.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:46 pmIRI
Excuse me, but I am not a bitch for wanting to honor our veterans wihtout listening to political speeches. Your response is ridiculous, to the point of being certifiable. Have you taken your medicine today or is this just a normal behaviour for you? If you think you are “standing up” for George Bush, you are mistaken. Your comments lack thougth and maturity.
November 11th, 2005 at 4:49 pmI will not respond to you again, you are pissant not worthy of any rational conversation.
Republican Senator and Intelligence Committee Chair Pat Roberts also is insisting that there is no evidence of “political manipulation or pressure” in the use of pre-war intelligence.
Unfortunately for Bush and Roberts, a growing mountain of evidence suggests otherwise…
For the full story, see:
“Roberts’ Iraq Stonewall Crumbles.”
November 11th, 2005 at 5:27 pmFor your accusation to work though you need evidence it was the administration that changed the wording. Of course it’s possible they did. In fact that’s what I believe happened. But it is also possible that the CIA, due to the realization that they had previously underestimated threats in the past, changed the wording for fear that they would underrepresent the threat.
But of course this is why we need the second report, to get at these answers.
November 11th, 2005 at 5:33 pmI think IRI has gone off to beat up his wife..
November 11th, 2005 at 5:36 pmYour quotes from the classified NIE sure make the case to suspect WMDs.
November 11th, 2005 at 5:58 pm#121 EDWARDSSL – Thanks for clarifying that. It all adds up.
November 11th, 2005 at 7:00 pmIRI isn’t a righty. IRI is a terrorist. He is just like them.
November 11th, 2005 at 8:07 pmI really don’t have a feel for how this fits into the current thread, but the administration is going agog in the belief that advanced bomb triggering devices are being found based on laser technology and that Iran is the source (next invasion?). Haven’t these idiots ever visited a Radio Shack, Lowes or Home Depot?
November 11th, 2005 at 8:13 pmIran, Syria, whatever country they can conjure up a case for war — that’s where they will bomb.
November 11th, 2005 at 8:37 pmBush is about two millenia or so late — he is more suited as an emperor determined to dominate the world.
I hate Bushie and his entire administration (yes, neocon chickenhawk, I hate him).
If my father (decorated veteran) has any power from the grave, Bushie and his cronies will get what they deserve.
votetoimpeach.org
November 11th, 2005 at 9:00 pmI Right I,
Why did we support Saddam in the 80’s.
I ask this constantly, no answer. Maybe I will be a caller on Rush Limbo’s show and ask him, do you think he will know?
November 11th, 2005 at 9:46 pmThey will never admit the truth For Truth, all neocon chickenhawks are liars and delussional.
November 11th, 2005 at 10:21 pmI Right I,
Why did we support Saddam in the 80’s.
I ask this constantly, no answer. Maybe I will be a caller on Rush Limbo’s show and ask him, do you think he will know?
Comment by For Truth
The enemy of your enemy is your friend is the rule and explains much about realpolitik and our dealings with Iraq and Iran in the 80s.
Along with some US support Saddam was mainly armed by France, Germany, Russia and a host of other Zeropeans and Communists who stayed by Saddams side even after the first gulf war. The joke goes; “We know Saddam had weapons of mass destruction because we sold them to him”. But it’s no joke. Democrats are quick to forget they the majority in congress at the time voted those arms deals in. Hope you enjoyed the history lesson.
November 11th, 2005 at 10:28 pmI Right I,
Why did we support Saddam in the 80’s.
I ask this constantly, no answer. Maybe I will be a caller on Rush Limbo’s show and ask him, do you think he will know?
Comment by For Truth
The enemy of your enemy is your friend is the rule and explains much about realpolitik and our dealings with Iran and Iraq. Along with some US support Saddam also was mainly armed by France, Germany, Russia and a host of other Zeropeans and Communists who stayed by Saddam’s side even after the first gulf war.
The joke goes; “We know Saddam had weapons of mass destruction because we sold them to him”. But it’s no joke. Democrats are quick to forget that they, the majority in congress at the time voted those arms deals in.
Hope you enjoyed the history lesson.
November 11th, 2005 at 10:30 pmi-right-i…
i agree with you completely. bush is a great leader and if we follow though on his vision, the world will enjoy the freedom we were lucky enough to be born into. these liberals will burn in hell, if not on earth.
you’re obviously here in iraq, serving your country like me. where are you stationed? we should get together and talk about our c-in-c’s wonderful legacy.
November 11th, 2005 at 10:47 pm[...] Of course there is more…. What The Senate Intel Commitee Found: Bush Admin Manipulated Case For War [...]
November 11th, 2005 at 10:59 pmIWrong1 will never enlist. He’s a sissy chickenhawk.
November 11th, 2005 at 11:31 pm#
i-right-i…
i agree with you completely. bush is a great leader and if we follow though on his vision, the world will enjoy the freedom we were lucky enough to be born into. these liberals will burn in hell, if not on earth.
you’re obviously here in iraq, serving your country like me. where are you stationed? we should get together and talk about our c-in-c’s wonderful legacy.
Comment by w-right wingman — November 11, 2005 @ 10:47 pm
If this is the case, you haven’t been made aware of the facts of what this administration has done to mislead you. If you are in Iraq, perhaps your not getting access to the latest information about what is going on here back home. However, if you can post here, you easily could research your own statements and understand the FACTS don’t match your reality. Not only that, but your blanket statement about liberals is so far off the mark, its not even funny. I suspect you may just be IRI posting under another name. Where are you stationed? What outfit are you a part of?
November 12th, 2005 at 3:31 amIf this is the case, you haven’t been made aware of the facts of what this administration has done to mislead you. If you are in Iraq, perhaps your not getting access to the latest information about what is going on here back home. However, if you can post here, you easily could research your own statements and understand the FACTS don’t match your reality. Not only that, but your blanket statement about liberals is so far off the mark, its not even funny. I suspect you may just be IRI posting under another name. Where are you stationed? What outfit are you a part of?
Comment by Catalyst for Change
The misinformation you speak of is entirely generated by the 5th column in this country and disseminated by the lackeys in the MSM. I look forward to the day when they will be held accountable for their treason.
Once we turn all the dope peddlers lose there will be plenty of jail cells for the Filthy Left, and just to rub salt in the wound we’ll legalize pot and not give you any.
By the way, honest and fearless Christian Conservatives don’t need to make up fake allies on Left Wing Loser web sites. Hell, I could whip the lot of you intellectually or otherwise by myself without breaking a sweat. You’re that easy.
PS….Wingman…I’m not in the service but I am in the service of my country.
November 12th, 2005 at 9:39 amI do not really believe that Bush intentionally “lied” to Congress and the American people in making his case for war. Nor do I think that too many people really ever believed that the War in Iraq was about weapons of mass destruction.
I think it’s unlikely that the “outing†of Valerie Plame was either a vindictive act of retribution or a way of sending a message to other would-be whistleblowers critical of the Administration. But let’s assume, further, that Libby and Rove and anyone else from the White House who may have told or confirmed for the press that Joe Wilson’s wife in the CIA was the one who suggested that he go to Niger were engaged in a completely innocent, legitimate, political debate.
Still: What was the point?
Does that mean Wilson’s not credible, for some reason? Or unqualified? Does his wife have some type of secret political agenda that we don’t know about? Was this some sort of private investigation, not sanctioned by the government? He was just over there free-lancing it, on his own dime, having some fun?
If the investigation was bunk, then aren’t these guys in the White House ultimately only criticizing themselves?
My wife was a top prosecutor in the New Orleans District Attorney’s Office. If she had suggested that I participate in some type of investigation, I don’t think we would have seen the D.A. running to the press complaining that my wife got me the job. I think people would be asking him the question: If this guy Herman is so unqualified, or biased, or unreliable, and only got the job because of his wife, what the hell kind of office are you running?
So, let’s accept the Administration’s spin on things. Our government needed to find out whether someone had arranged for the sale of yellowcake uranium to Iraq. So some low-level administrative non-covert non-sensitive unimportant CIA employee with a desk job suggests that we use her husband, and the Vice President or the CIA or whoever says, “Okay.†Then he comes back, and it turns out that he was completely incompetent, with a secret political agenda to attack the President, criticize the War in Iraq, and undermine the re-election campaign. Well, what the hell kind of office are you guys running?
I had an interesting conversation a few weeks ago with one of my parents’ neighbors about the War in Iraq. He made a very strong case that, although they couldn’t say it publicly, the Bush Administration sincerely believed, based on classified evidence, that will likely never come to light, and which may or may not have been reliable, but in which there was a reasonable and good faith belief, that the best way to protect America’s long-term security interests was to make a statement, take hold in the region, neutralize the most immediate likely threats of a bio or chemical or nuclear attack on American soil, and introduce a Westernized climate of freedom and modernity, which would move Muslim governments from extremist to more moderate positions, and which, in fact, is what the Iraqi people and the entire Middle East, if not the entire world, are longing for.
Of course, this is just the bottom line. The interesting thing about the discussion was the way in which the ground kept shifting. We were never really debating, but merely talking past each other. There was a disconnect. And later that evening I realized that the disconnect was ultimately a function of the fact that I am essentially Kantian, while my parents’ neighbor is essentially Utilitarian.
What I mean by this, (at least as I remember it from college), is that there are essentially two lines of moral thinking, from an ethical or philosophical point of view. One line of thinking, sometimes referred to as the Epicurean line, is utilitarian. The means essentially justify the ends. What is “right†is what maximizes the greatest public good. The other line of thinking, typified by Kant, is a rule-based system of right and wrong. The ends never justify the means. What is “right†is defined by a universal or ideal set of “categorical imperativesâ€.
There has always been, and will always be, an inherent tension between Kantians and Utilitarians. Intentionally or unintentionally, one genius of the American system is that it allows for a blending of both approaches. The legislative branch, and certainly the executive branch, enjoy the flexibility of adopting utilitarian solutions. But subject to the categorical imperatives set forth in the Constitution, and, in particular, in the Bill of Rights.
(Which is, parenthetically, why there is such frustration, from all sides, with what is perceived as “judicial activism†or “restraint†– Utilitarians become frustrated when the courts apply strict rules in challenging situations, and Kantians become frustrated when they don’t.)
So my parents’ neighbor and I were never going to see exactly eye to eye. But I did find his argument somewhat compelling.
So let’s assume that the real reason we went to War in Iraq was not, so much, to diffuse a short-term or immediate threat of terrorism, but a long-term, big-picture, idealistic plan for seizing political and economic stability throughout the world, and in particular for America, for generations to come.
It’s a tough decision. A hard choice. Will require much sacrifice. Will provoke, at least in the short term, political, diplomatic, economic and perhaps even military responses from many in the international community. But, in the long run, it’s the right decision, for not only America, but for Iraq, the Middle East, and the entire world.
Now that’s something I could get behind.
Questions, to be sure. Reservations. Doubts. Even fundamental disagreement. (See, for example, the issues raised in my original Bush Doctrine piece.)
But at least it’s something bold. Presidential. Visionary. Like Winston Churchill, (who, as Evan Thomas puts it, writing about Libby and Cheney, “warned in the 1930s about the gathering Nazi storm, who were ignored and shunned – but then vindicated at England’s finest hourâ€). Abraham Lincoln. John F. Kennedy.
So, (assuming that’s the truth), why not “sell†that to the American people?
The political Right frequently talks about the hubris of liberal politicians who are offensively paternalistic, believing that they understand, and can provide for, the needs of the underclass.
But isn’t the Bush Administration’s attitude toward the American people equally (if not more) paternalistic?
We can’t trust you, the American people, to decide whether this bold vision should be adopted. To commit the capital. To make the sacrifices. To send your children off to war.
Trust us. The Government. We will protect you. We know what’s best.
Isn’t that the Bush Administration’s attitude toward Iraq?
You don’t want Saddam. You don’t want Islam. You don’t want extremism. You want freedom. You want democracy. You want Christianity. You want capitalism.
Trust us. We will liberate you.
Isn’t that what the Bush Administration says to the rest of the world?
One problem with Utilitarianism is defining the “public†in public good. If the public is the United States, then that’s one thing. That’s who elected Bush; that’s the subject of his oath of office; that’s where his primary responsibility runs. If the public is something larger, like the entire world, with respect to foreign policy issues, or future generations, with respect to domestic issues, then the calculus is significantly altered.
Wasn’t Hitler sincerely, in his own mind, acting for the “good†of Germany when he invaded Poland? (Likely, in his own mind, he was acting for the good of Poland.) Wasn’t Saddam Hussein acting for the good of Iraq when he invaded Kuwait?
Of course, in the long run, the answer turns out to be: No.
Which is, perhaps, the same risk facing the United States.
Backlash. Reciprocation. Unintended consequences.
How can you expect other countries to respect your boundaries, or protect the environment, or refrain from torturing your soldiers and citizens, if you are not willing to do the same?
Sure, in the 24 situation, where the time-bomb is ticking, I, like Jack Bauer, am going to vote to shoot the guy in the kneecaps and sort out the legalities later.
But that’s got to be the exception, and not the rule.
If our policy is that torture is okay to protect our national interests, then it’s okay for other countries to use torture to protect theirs.
It’s one of Kant’s categorical imperatives: Don’t do unto others as you would have them not do unto you.
It is inherently nonsensical to promote self-rule through invasion. To prevent terrorism through torture. To promote freedom by quelling dissent. To protect the free market through no-bid contracts, and pork barrel projects, or heavily weighted tax cuts, and subsidies. To pursue uncompromising ideals by any means necessary.
Why “out†Valerie Plame? asks Jonathan Alter. Because Joe Wilson “had the temerity to offer public dissent…. The same president who seeks democracy, transparency and dissent in Iraq is irritated by it at home.â€
Bush pretends to be a man of uncompromising Kantian categorical imperatives and ideals. (And I think, in his own mind, he sincerely believes that.) But clearly, he isn’t. The question, in my mind, is whether he is simply Utilitarian; or whether he ultimately subscribes to the third type of moral structure, rare in today’s world, from the age of Greek Tragedy, which is simply: Help your friends; hurt your enemies.
Give the Bush Doctrine the benefit of every doubt. Cast it in the most favorable light.
It may turn out to be pro-American-Interests. (And I hope that it is.) But it’s, at the same time, in many respects, un-democratic, un-Christian, un-American, and un- everything else it purports to be.
For more on the Media, Politics, Literature, and the Law, visit my Blog at: http://www.gravierhouse.com.
November 12th, 2005 at 10:51 amThe Senate Intelligence Committee’s report states that “the intelligence community’s elimination of the caveats from the unclassified white paper misrepresented their judgments to the public . . .” It does not state that the White House eliminated the caveats.
Nonetheless, the unedited NIE language still supports Bush’s case for war, particularly in light of 9/11 and Hussein’s continued flouting of the UN resolutions.
Whoever was responsible for eliminating the caveats, the changes do not affect the overall equation.
And Senators of both parties indisputably had access to the unedited NIE before voting to authorize the war.
November 12th, 2005 at 2:16 pmgrithstole,
You’re lying. The caveats are sufficient to produce MORE INSPECTIONS, but not a legitimate case for war. In otherwords, you’re a stupid fool.
November 12th, 2005 at 3:53 pmRyan Neat,
Your tendentious statement that “[t]he caveats are sufficient to produce MORE INSPECTIONS, but not a legitimate case for war” ignores the undisputed fact that the unedited NIE was available for Senate review before the vote authorizing war.
You also conveniently ignore that the Senate Intelligence Committee’s report states that “the intelligence community’s elimination of the caveats from the unclassified white paper misrepresented their judgments to the public . . .†It does not state that the White House eliminated the caveats.
Your ad hominem attacks implicitly concede that your position is meritless.
November 12th, 2005 at 6:49 pmRyan Neat,
Your continued ad hominem attacks betray your inability or unwillingness to proffer reasoned argument backed by facts.
I quoted verbatim the language of the report – as quoted in this thread – and noted that it states the “intelligence community” eliminated the caveats, not the White House. Do you deny the accuracy of my quotation?
Do you deny that Senators of both parties indisputably had access to the unedited NIE before voting to authorize the war?
Do you deny that the CIA issued the subject NIE during the tenure of George Tenet – a Clinton appointee – not Porter Goss?
I said no more than the above. Your attacks against me based on arguments I did not make are straw men and red herrings – elementary logical fallacies educated people abandon in college if not sooner.
Have you graduated from high school yet? If so, please accept my condolences for your modest intellect.
November 13th, 2005 at 5:36 amIt so so fun to see the Nazi supporters fighting with the FREEDOM FIGHTERS!
My guess is this is what the blogs would have looked like 63 years ago in Germany.
The thinking people telling the Nazi supporters that Hiter was evil and committing war crimes, and the Nazis saying he was their hero, fighting for their salvation and SOULS!
The only and I mean only difference is: Hitler took a self imposed dirt nap when he knew all was lost, and Dumbya will fight all the way to the gallows.
I love it, Dumbya has NO DIGNITY WHAT-SO-EVER!
We don’t torture, we have no concentration camps, but DAMN YOU, you WON’T stop us if we want to!!!!
What did kinda sleezy rice’s report say…. Al Queda DETERMINED to strike inside the U.S.?
The Greedy Ole Parasites forgot the title, but the NON-NAZI’S didn’t.
Wrong-wronger-wrongest seems to be blaming everyone for his delusional posts, first Ryan, then me, and I saw somewhere he was blaming Joe-six-pack-turd-brain.
Come one, don’t make EVERY mis-step your der leader makes. You delusional fool, it may be all of us.
Back on topic,
Did dumbya and his fools mis-lead and lie America into a war-for-profit?
DUH, YES!
November 13th, 2005 at 5:53 amWhat a load of…
The White House had no role in the creation of the public NIE document. The intelligence community did.
Thus anyone who fell for ThinkProgress’ immense spin has the intellect of a gnat. Or is illiterate.
I mean, it is grade A comedy reading this. Let’s see what ThinkProgress quoted, and then let’s see how they spun it:
What they quoted: “The intelligence community’s elimination of the caveats from the unclassified white paper misrepresented their judgments to the public, which did not have access to the classified National Intelligence Estimate containing the more carefully worded assessments.”
The spin: “Essentially, the Bush administration took the intelligence that was presented to them in the classified NIE and twisted it to present a stronger case for war in the public version of the NIE. Here are some examples”
The truth: the intelligence community was wholly responsible for the NIE, the classified and unclassified versions
ThinkProgress lie: the administration was responsible for the public NIE assessment
Their own source directly contradicts them. Can you people not read?
What does the following phrase mean: “intelligence community’s elimination”?
Who was the one who eliminated things? The White House?
I guess I’m going to be told to “read between the lines” again. Standard for the “reality-based” community, since the evidence they believe is there isn’t actually written on the page. You just have to squint a bit and see the truth behind the text that isn’t written! You see, it’s all a conspiracy! Boooga!
Hey kjlovell, let me ask you, what are your views about Israel and the Jews? Would they happen to resemble the Nazis’ views on them? If so, I think you should pipe down about Nazism.
November 13th, 2005 at 9:04 amSexistion, you know no one ever reads your tripe. Quit trying. Be gone, you have NO power here!
It so so fun to see the Nazi supporters fighting with the FREEDOM FIGHTERS!
My guess is this is what the blogs would have looked like 63 years ago in Germany.
The thinking people telling the Nazi supporters that Hiter was evil and committing war crimes, and the Nazis saying he was their hero, fighting for their salvation and SOULS!
The only and I mean only difference is: Hitler took a self imposed dirt nap when he knew all was lost, and Dumbya will fight all the way to the gallows.
I love it, Dumbya has NO DIGNITY WHAT-SO-EVER!
We don’t torture, we have no concentration camps, but DAMN YOU, you WON’T stop us if we want to!!!!
What did kinda sleezy rice’s report say…. Al Queda DETERMINED to strike inside the U.S.?
The Greedy Ole Parasites forgot the title, but the NON-NAZI’S didn’t.
Wrong-wronger-wrongest seems to be blaming everyone for his delusional posts, first Ryan, then me, and I saw somewhere he was blaming Joe-six-pack-turd-brain.
Come one, don’t make EVERY mis-step your der leader makes. You delusional fool, it may be all of us.
Back on topic,
Did dumbya and his fools mis-lead and lie America into a war-for-profit?
DUH, YES!
November 13th, 2005 at 2:16 pmYes kjlovell, don’t look the facts into the eyes, you might die with fright! What are your opinions on the Jews and Israel kjlovell? Do you want to answer that? Or are you too afraid that your position may sound eerily similar to that of the Nazis you are invoking?
November 13th, 2005 at 3:18 pmHate to be the last one to a bush-bash, but here goes. These pieces have been working their agenda for over one hundred years. They are, have been, and always will be pro fascist anti american, anti constitutional republic, traitors. For a good resource on the backgroun of the war on freedom waged by these p-o-s’es check this link.
The Nazi Hydra in America
If you haven’t read an honest(and to be honest biased, justifiably) bio of any bushes try this one
George Bush:The Unauthorized Biography
This is a much more serious threat to us all, than a lot of americans realize, and is almost beyond the point of no return.
November 13th, 2005 at 11:28 pmI also find it ironic that an idiot-nazi-bush-lover would say that someone else was nazi like.
Considering the fact that Prescott bush actually managed slave labor in GERMANY and profited greatly by it. I believe those are the funds (from plundered Jewish wealth) that are the foundation of the “blind trust” that finances some of the bush desires.
And further sextant, not that you care (since you hate people of color) I think all people in this world should be able to live and live anywhere they desire so long as they do it peacefully. A concept you are no doubt blind to.
This means:
Jewish people should be able to live along side REPUGnicans and not worry that their house will be confiscated, they will be deported or their wealth will be plundered.
I believe that black people deserve the same rights as any human (yes, the ones you love so much- the white ones).
I believe that it is WRONG to deny that gay people have the same rights to insure their loved ones, visit them in the hospital and get updates on their husbands/wives conditions just like you white loving racists.
And it pains me to say this, but I also believe that reich-wing wacko jerks (you included) be able to voice your twisted views.
So, you are sadly mistaken if you think for one moment that I believe that people should be taken from their homes for whatever reason, subjected to torture, and even killed for their views.
Actions however are the line in the sand. I believe you have crossed it.
But you will have to take that up on judgement day, because I AM A TRUE CHRISTIAN, PATRIOT, VICTIMS ADVOCATE……. I DO NO JUDGE!
So, I hope when you ring the door bell in Heaven, you don’t find that God is a BLACK JEWISH LESBIEN. If so, you may wish that she has more compassion in her heart than you did on earth.
Good Day!
November 14th, 2005 at 4:16 amRyan,
How ironic a FASCIST WHO HATES ARABS would be assuming others are rascist. You’re such a transparent fool! See, progressives and liberals like us fought your kind and your hatred, stupidity and bigotry during WWII. Now you’ve resurfaced with a new bogeyman, this time it’s Islam. The fact is RADICALS OF ALL STRIPES, including yours, are the real threat to the world. It’s not a war of religions, it’s a war BY religions, and conservative fascists like you who want to impose their idiocy and lunacy on the world.
First of all, I have never said I hate Arabs. Nor am I a fascist. That you would claim so falsely that I have in any way said anything of the sort shows how morally corrupt you are Ryan. I have never said that I hate Arabs, yet there you are claiming that I have. How imorally dishonest.
Yes, radicals are the real threat to this world, like al Qaeda and jihadists. Normal Muslims are caught in the middle. The only thing I want to impose on the world is for every person to be able to have the same freedoms as I do.
kjlovell,
And further sextant, not that you care (since you hate people of color) I think all people in this world should be able to live and live anywhere they desire so long as they do it peacefully. A concept you are no doubt blind to.
I hate people of color? Ehmm. Really? Have I said anything remotely to imply that? Or are you once again trying to tar and feather me as a racist bigot without that being true?
Why are you guys so intent on making me out to be a racist fascist? Is it because I tore you apart on the arguments and the only thing left for you to do is try to attack me personally and commit a character assassination so that no one will listen to me?
Hmm, I think it is.
I believe that it is WRONG to deny that gay people have the same rights to insure their loved ones, visit them in the hospital and get updates on their husbands/wives conditions just like you white loving racists.
I have nothing against any of that.
But you will have to take that up on judgement day, because I AM A TRUE CHRISTIAN, PATRIOT, VICTIMS ADVOCATE……. I DO NO JUDGE!
Judgment Day? Mmmmmk. Sorry, I’m an atheist and don’t believe in that stuff. So I’m afraid we won’t be meeting on any judgment day.
So once again kjlovell, what is your opinion on the Jews and Israel? You never answer me. Why?
November 14th, 2005 at 11:40 amHey “dude” pull your head out of your aZZ sexdeviant, if you actually spent as much time reasoning and reading as you do posting your anti-Christ bullCrap you would see that people have torn your twisted arguments apart.
You are clearly as uneducated as you are antisocial.
People like you are the reason most of the world hate America. But you don’t care, your idiotic posts prove you are a racist, nazi. You don’t care about anything truly. I would also draw the conclusion that you are also incapable of having a lasting romantic relationship and would deflect any comments about that by saying something as equally moronic as you aren’t into that sort of thing, and like casual sex with people in leiu of a normal relationship.
What did someone say to you….
Keep trying I am sure God is not finished with you yet.
November 14th, 2005 at 12:42 pmSeixon,
The only thing you’ve torn apart is your credibility. The rest is your self delusion, nothing more. Your arguments are hysterical and irrational, like those of the typical troll. And your ‘disinformation’ was readily debunked. You were just too stupid to recognize it.
NED,
You’re such a sick little pathetic whacko. No sex explains why you’re such a loser. Get a life nerd whanker.
November 14th, 2005 at 1:16 pm[...] Political pressure claims have not been investigated, and the Senate intelligence report showed at least some manipulation of evidence. The Senate Intelligence Report showed that there was manipulation of the evidence. President Bush claimed that “a bipartisan Senate investigation found no evidence of political pressure to change the intelligence community’s judgments related to Iraq’s weapons programs.” That argument is wrong on at least two counts. First, “the only committee investigating the matter in Congress, the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, has not yet done its inquiry into whether officials mischaracterized intelligence by omitting caveats and dissenting opinions.” The so-called Phase II of the pre-war intel investigation is not expected to be completed this year. Second, the Senate Intelligence Committee’s Phase I report found, according to the Los Angeles Times (7/10/04), that the unclassified public version of the National Intelligence Estimate (NIE) was manipulated. “[C]arefully qualified conclusions [in the classified NIE] were turned into blunt assertions of fact.” For example, the classified version of the NIE said, “Although we have little specific information on Iraq’s CW stockpile, Saddam Hussein probably has stocked at least 100 metric tons” of certain poisons. The phrase “although we have little specific information” was deleted from the unclassified version. Instead, the public report said, “Saddam probably has stocked a few hundred metric tons of CW agents.” [...]
November 14th, 2005 at 5:59 pmBlack Jewish Lesbian….
Thanks Ryan.
We’re changing the world, one reich-wing mind at a time.
November 15th, 2005 at 4:06 am[...] This is false — the answer to whether there was political pressure was left to Phase II of the Senate investigation, which is currently being stonewalled by Sen. Pat Roberts (R-KS). [...]
November 17th, 2005 at 10:53 am[...] The document in question, the NIE, or National Intelligence Estimate, that was leaked in order to prop up the case for war included the following assertations: [...]
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