President Bush’s War on Christmas
By on Dec 5th, 2005 at 2:05 pm
President Bush’s War on Christmas
This shocking event occured at the White House this morning:
Laura Bush ended the event by saying, “So have a very, very happy holiday to everybody. Have fun. ”
If Ms. Bush watched more Bill O’Reilly she’d know how offensive her remarks were to Christians:
GUEST: “Season’s Greetings” and “Happy Holidays,” Bill, does not offend Christians.
O’REILLY: Yes, it does. It absolutely does. And I know that for a fact.
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O’Reilly would not know what a fact is if it came up and bit him. When O’Reilly claims that “Happy Holidays” offends Christians, is he talking for all Christians, most Christians, some Christians or only for himself as an irrascible, disgruntled control freak? The last question is rhetorical and does not require a reply.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:11 pmFor the first time in a long time, I will say a Bush was right in this instance.
O’Lielly is an asshatty moonbattish tool.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:13 pmThis is disgraceful! Laura Bush is undermining Christmas with her vile, liberal ways.
LOL! Sounded like a fundie, didn’t I?
December 5th, 2005 at 2:13 pmThis is a tempest in O’Lielly’s kool aid pot. “Have some Bill it will do you good.”
December 5th, 2005 at 2:17 pmWHATEVER
There are so many more important issues… Jesus wouldn’t like the commercialization that has taken over Christmas anyway. He would throw them all out of the temple and give all of their beloved money to the poor.
It’s amazing how many self-righteous people forget that GREED and PRIDE are two of the Seven Deadly Sins!
December 5th, 2005 at 2:17 pmPresident Bush’s next economic proposal: The Satirists Full Employment Act of 2005
December 5th, 2005 at 2:17 pmChrist’s flipping out at the temple was more a venting about his impending crucifixion than anything else… I heard he later apologized and agreed to repay vendors for their broken stalls… it was settled out of court…
December 5th, 2005 at 2:19 pmIt must be a slow news day for the Leftist Losers.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:20 pmCan’t find anyone to tie to the back of your pickup today, Adolf?
December 5th, 2005 at 2:22 pmIt’s amazing how many self-righteous people forget that GREED and PRIDE are two of the Seven Deadly Sins!
Comment by Taco Loco
It’s more amazing that so many self righteous people on the Left never heard of any of them.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:22 pmIt must that i-right-i is a slow Rightest Loser.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:22 pmAs much as I’d enjoy 50 more comments of people insulting each other, let me suggest an alternative.
There is a serious point to this post. The right-wing is trying to whip up a frenzy about the War on Christmas. John Gibson even has a book out about it. This transcript helps demonstrate that it is more illusion than reality.
Am I right? Am I wrong?
Discuss.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:26 pmI lift my leg to your CHRISTmas tree, and salute with a forceful golden stream.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:26 pmI-RIGHT-I
Please note that my comment was directed at neither the right nor the left. It was intended for those that seek to criticize without offering positive soultions.
Only an intelligent dialogue will repair the rifts that challenge our society.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:26 pmHi I-R-I…here’s your cracker, parrot.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:27 pmIf “Happy Holidays” offends Christians, then I guess that George and Laura aren’t Christians, as O’Reilly defines them. Which means he’s just attacked the President.
WHY DO YOU HATE AMERICA, BILL O’REILLY?!
December 5th, 2005 at 2:27 pmGWB & Laura B HATE CHRISTIANS! Well, that was what the headline read. But just like the the magazines one sees at their supermarket checkout lines the headline was wildly misleading…
If you read the article it clearly says the President and Laura B prefer their christians quick friend then grilled over a bed of jasmine rice with fresh asparagus. MMM yummy!
See……read the WHOLE article.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:29 pmAnyone that is offended by the term “Happy Holidays” needs to look deep inside themself and find a little bit of self esteem. I would say the same for people that freak out over “Merry Christmas”. It’s a sad state of affairs when people are so fragile that words this simple can upset them.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:29 pmJudd,
December 5th, 2005 at 2:30 pmYou are right that this is an illusion…and to me responding to the FOX nutjobs is just a big waste of time. It is much more important to refute their propaganda on other issues.
#15
Hi I-R-I…here’s your cracker, parrot.
Comment by MLDB — December 5, 2005 @ 2:27 pm
Truth be known, Beta-Monkey’s prefer bananas…
December 5th, 2005 at 2:31 pmer…I meant responding to this Christmas boogeyman…not all of FOX’s idiocy
December 5th, 2005 at 2:31 pmAlso, what are we to make of the President’s offering as entertainment the work of Tchaikovsky, a gay composer? Has he no decency?
December 5th, 2005 at 2:36 pmmany of the same people who criticize others for being overly sensitive about some expressions (i.e. politically correct) flip out when a nice expression like “Happy holidays” is used… go figure!
December 5th, 2005 at 2:39 pmI-RIGHT-I, nothing makes me feel better than to read your posts.
Your every garbled thought, mangled rationalization, and clumsy attempt at misdirection fills me with more gladness of heart and utter relief that I’m a liberal than you’ll ever know.
Thanks for being you, and please, keep posting!
December 5th, 2005 at 2:41 pmI don’t see a war on Christmas in the numbers.
It is funny, though, that the fem-w would say EXACTLY what BO said.
I think overall we could do without BO and Coulter news. Although I’d like to spend some quality eros-time with Ann.
How about more critical stories about “Fox and Friends” in the am. Now that’s some offensive stuff…
December 5th, 2005 at 2:43 pmIt must be a slow news day for the Leftist Losers.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I — December 5, 2005 @ 2:20 pm
I-RIGHT-I, what do you make of the fact that Pres. Bush and his wife hosted a “Holiday Reception” instead of a “Christmas Reception”?
What do you make of the fact that Mrs. Bush closed by saying “So have a very, very happy holiday to everybody. Have fun.”, instead of wishing everybody a good ole fashioned Merry Christmas?
Are their remarks offensive to Christians? If so, why? If not, why not?
December 5th, 2005 at 2:43 pmIn this case I think publicity of people
December 5th, 2005 at 2:44 pmof all political stripes saying “Happy Holidays”
or “Merry Christmas” is important to diffuse the
illusion.
I generally think people like O’Reilly get away
with an illusion like this by “baffling with BS”.
If people THINK about all the people who say
“Happy Holidays” or “Merry Christmas” in an honestly
friendly fashion, the illusion of some conspiracy
is swept away.
The White House story gives people that “Wait a minute,
let me think about this controversy” moment of clarity.
Judd, as much as I agree with your sentiment, you raise an important point about the tone and tenor of the comments on this site.
I’ve tried numerous times to get commenters to simply avoid getting baited by troll postings, which I’ve given up as a losing battle. But lately the back-and-forth has just devolved into name calling and polemic. Sadly, I think the folks who run this site are as much to blame. there is virtually no moderation or oversight, spammers run wild, and people routinely break the terms of use as well as standards of common decency.
I get just as pissed as anyone about the opinions of some of the trolls on this site, but I don’t think any of them are going to change their mind, and simply insulting them certainly doesn’t do anything positive for the image of progressives.
I stopped coming here as often. The comment section is a disgrace.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:44 pmThe three Wise men from the EAST Brought Gold, Frankenscense, and Myrth. They did NOT put the Gifts in a tree.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:45 pmThe Tree was Actually used for the Making of the Crosses(one for the Thief, the other prisoner, and for Jesus.
then the cross was dangled with gold frankenscense and myrth and put at the site of the grave(Tomb) of Jesus.
If Bush wins his anti-Jesus War on Christmas whereby the secularization of the country will be put into a vicious tailspin, the economy will collapse!
Or, at least, that’s what i’m lead to believe.
Signed, My Mom
(Seriously, she said something like this the other day, just using “the liberals” instead of “Bush”… HOW am i from her womb?)
December 5th, 2005 at 2:46 pmTrampling an effigy of Christ on the cross is an illuminati ritual, so the mere exclusion of “Christmas words” means nothing to the Bush’s.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:49 pm“The Chistian Thing” is just for the consolidation of power over the masses, as many here already know.
Bushco worships power of all kinds, even SATAN.
#29 is the true origin of the christmas tree.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:49 pmObviously, since BO is such a good Christian, he speaks for all Christians — right?
December 5th, 2005 at 2:49 pm#12, I’m missing the point, I suppose. My reaction to the post was ’so what’?
December 5th, 2005 at 2:50 pmI thought the wise men brought GOLD. And FRANKS with GIRTH.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:51 pmDANIEL CHAPTER 12
——————————————————————————–
December 5th, 2005 at 2:51 pm1 ¶ And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
I can’t let IRI have crdeit for that-
I thought the wise men brought GOLD. And FRANKS with GIRTH.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:52 pm#34,
The point, I think, is the contrast between what
December 5th, 2005 at 2:53 pmyou (and most reasonable people) think, i.e., “So, what”
and the huge stink that O’Reilly is trying to create for his own
reasons.
No… Gold, Al Franken,and Murtha
December 5th, 2005 at 2:53 pmthere came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.
9 ¶ When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was.
10 When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy.
11 And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts;
December 5th, 2005 at 2:53 pm
no, goss al franken and murtha
December 5th, 2005 at 2:54 pmBetter
December 5th, 2005 at 2:55 pmMaybe I should justify my #34. If the post is celebrating the statement that BO is attacking people for saying ‘happy holidays’ and Dubya said ‘happy holidays’ – isn’t calling attention that just schoolyard name calling? I find it hard to get upset by that. So what?
December 5th, 2005 at 2:56 pmMyrrhy Xmas and Yuletide Greetings and, most importantly, Peace on Earth.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:58 pm“It must be a slow news day for the Leftist Losers.”
This is a right wing issue that we are responding to. If you don’t like it, feel free to not post.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:59 pmMurrah Crunkmiff. Peef own urff.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:00 pmThis is an issue that allows Fox to talk about something other than the WH implosion.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:03 pmSweet, Judd is at it again!
I think we may see a little more moderation here. I can say that I am guilty of the back and forth insults. I would welcome some moderation here. SOme of the trolls post only to annoy people and that is not debate.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:05 pmI see your point Terry, but doesn’t Bush
December 5th, 2005 at 3:06 pmsaying “Happy Holidays” simply take wind
out of O’Reilly and Gibson’s sails?
I did not see it as a dig at Bush, but
rather exposing the silliness in
O’Reilly’s quest.
Gibson is actually going to make money (I hope not,
but I suspect with O’Reilly’s help he will), which
is likely the real purpose behind the foolishness.
I think a number of the Winger heros are
just playing the followers for money like a
corrupt televangelist.
I should add that it would not surprise
December 5th, 2005 at 3:09 pmme if O’Reilly doesn’t really believe
this and much more of his own nonsense.
Go watch the video as Fox comes apart at the anchors.
From Crook and Liars:
http://movies.crooksandliars.com/Fox-News-Watch-WarOnChristmas.wmv
December 5th, 2005 at 3:12 pmSince the RNC sent out Holiday Cards and Fox News was selling Holiday Ornaments for the Holiday tree, we need to get the word out.
Everyone joining BO’s boycott needs to also boycott Fox News and the Republican Party!
December 5th, 2005 at 3:12 pmWell I could see a post going along these lines, if the Chimp had said ‘Happy Christmas’ – ‘Bush Endorses Christian Festival, Using Federal Property to Fuse Church and State’.
BO can tilt at as many windmills as he wants, if people buy the book or the bs, that’s their problem.
It’s just a kids party, for goodness’s sake.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:13 pmI think the right wing “Liberals are tring to destroy Christmas” schtick is about to backfire on them.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:13 pm#8.
The whiny right-wing Christian crusaders manufacture a “crisis” surrounding the “attack on Christmas” and it is the fault of loser lefties.
Comedy gold my friend, comedy gold.
-GSD
December 5th, 2005 at 3:21 pmIn respect to Judd for his wishes and comments, here’s my 2 cents. Warning – they aren’t completely neutral.
1) I don’t mind civic leaders/towns/states government officials saying and meaning Merry Christmas. I just want them to also wish people Happy Chaunakah, etc. Let’s not make Christianity the defacto religion, but one of many with the same rights.
2) I don’t care if towns put up Christmas trees and/or manger scenes. I just want these same towns to put up equal presentations from ANY OTHER religious group that wants one in their community. IE – menorahs, star & crescent moon, hemp leaf, whatever.
basically I’m looking for equal treatment. No more, no less. Just be careful about not declaring one above the others, but equal with the others.
It’s not like liberals don’t believe in god, or a higher “energy” or what have you, but we don’t think ANY religion should be the ONLY one allowed to display. So, if you want a tree or a manger, be prepared to put up with those crazed Rastafarians too……
December 5th, 2005 at 3:27 pmKindness… Jah Bless
December 5th, 2005 at 3:31 pmMy recollection is that the Christmas tree and Santa Claus actually came from pagan celebrations in Scandanavia which were then incorporated into the Western Christmas celebration scheme. The Christmas tree has nothing to do with either the three wise men or with the crucifixion.
Happy Holidays everyone!
December 5th, 2005 at 3:40 pmpass=past
December 5th, 2005 at 3:41 pmsorry to ruin your holidays bid al.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:46 pmThe Christmas tree has everything to do with both the three wise men or with the crucifixion.read #19 and 40.
the tree was used to crucify Jesus, once Jesus was dead and put into the Tomb(Cave) the Roman Soldiers put the cross at the head of the tomb and decorated it with ornaments.
its called funeral.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:47 pmJudd – Slow news day?? Trying to “make busy” around the bosses?
December 5th, 2005 at 3:49 pmsorry to ruin your holidays big al.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:50 pmThe Christmas tree has everything to do with both the three wise men and with the crucifixion.read #19 and 40.
the tree was used to crucify Jesus, once Jesus was dead and put into the Tomb(Cave) the Roman Soldiers put the cross at the head of the tomb and decorated it with ornaments.
its called”funeral”.
And there is so evergreens in Israel so stop saying that!
December 5th, 2005 at 3:50 pmMerry Christmas, MA.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:51 pmactually, i,m making part of it up. hehe.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:51 pmbut then again, where did the wood come from that was used to crucify Jesus?
December 5th, 2005 at 3:52 pmI don’t know why these wingnuts are so inflamed about the use of the word holiday.
holiday=holy day
I’d think it would be just as good. But then they’d have nothing to whine about…
December 5th, 2005 at 3:52 pmolive trees?
December 5th, 2005 at 3:53 pmFreedom……Actually, you are making all of it up, but I hope that Santa Claus brings you everything you wish for on Christmas Eve and that you find many presents under your tree.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:55 pmtrees=wood. wood=crosses.
they presented unto him gifts;
gold, and frankincense, and myrrh. = ornaments.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:57 pmgold scent embalming fluid
my wish is to end this stupid war, nothing more.
December 5th, 2005 at 3:58 pmExactly freedom, when Americans start dying in the “War on Christmas” then I’ll give a damn.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:00 pmMighty Aphrodite (#63)…. actually Judd receives a bonus anytime one of his postings gets at least 63 comments recorded….so on behalf of Judd and the entire Think Progress staff I want to thank you for putting Judd over the top and making Judd’s holidays just a little bit brighter!
December 5th, 2005 at 4:04 pmReality , when Americans start dying ?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:04 pmIn case you have forgotten, They are .
In Afganistan and Iraq.
So, I Do give a Damn, NOW!
“Merry Christmas, MA.’
December 5th, 2005 at 4:05 pmComment by TerrytheTurtle — December 5, 2005 @ 3:51 pm
****Thank you, Turdle – and a Happy Chanukuh to you!!
merry Christmas Afganistan and Iraq.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:06 pmSlow news day?? Trying to “make busy†around the bosses?
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 5, 2005 @ 3:49 pm
Mighty Aphrodite, what’s you opinion on the fact that Pres. Bush and his wife hosted a “Holiday Reception” instead of a “Christmas Reception”?
What do you think of the fact that Mrs. Bush wished a “happy holiday to everybodyâ€, instead of a Merry Christmas?
Is this offensive to Christians? If so, why? If not, why not?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:08 pmit’s myrrh, not myrth…
so, why does W hate Xmas?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:09 pmThe Christmas Tree is a pagna symbol from before Chritianity was formed.
“Long before the advent of Christianity, plants and trees that remained green all year had a special meaning for people in the winter. Just as people today decorate their homes during the festive season with pine, spruce, and fir trees, ancient peoples hung evergreen boughs over their doors and windows. In many countries it was believed that evergreens would keep away witches, ghosts, evil spirits, and illness.”
http://www.historychannel.com/exhibits/holidays/christmas/trees.html
December 5th, 2005 at 4:12 pmgold, and frankincense, and myrrh
December 5th, 2005 at 4:12 pmIn a town near us here in San Diego, a few “enlightened” groups were upset that the parade reverted back to it’s original name “The Encinitas Christmas Parade”. No body excluded me or mine – but some chose not to participate. (FYI- I don’t celebrate Ramadan, but I don’t think Muslims should be forced to accommodate, “tolerate” or include me. I hope they enjoy their religious and family celebrations. And while they are welcome at Christmas events, please don’t ask Christians to hang a Crescent Moon next to the Star of Bethlehem or over a Jewish menorah at Chanukuh events and parties.)
December 5th, 2005 at 4:13 pmRyan,
I am really curious of their/his/her opinion on Pres. Bush using “Happy Holiday” instead of “Merry Christmas”.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:14 pmsorry, I dont believe in the history channel. even they are confused about history.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:19 pm#83 that’s their luck out, I suppose. Once again, people who project their prejudices onto their kids – only the kids lose out in the end.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:19 pmI’m offended every time I see Smirky and Pickles in the White House.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:20 pmMightyHermaphrodite,
We know you’re really MizzWrong sitting in Houston. Stop pretending to be a woman. Your preferred ‘position’ in the bedroom doesn’t make you female.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:22 pm#79 – “Mighty Aphrodite, what’s you opinion on the fact that Pres. Bush and his wife hosted a “Holiday Reception†instead of a “Christmas Receptionâ€?” – Gregrrrrr
December 5th, 2005 at 4:23 pm****They can do what they want in their own home. (Even though it’s the ‘people’s house’ – it IS their home.) Also, having friends of many backgrounds, they undoubtedly invited some Jewish children – Merry Christmas, Happy Chanukuh and Happy New Year!! I don’t offer the greeting “Thrilling Winter Solstice” yet – my atheist and pagan friends aren’t THAT sensitive.
so why does christmas nowadays involve everything from Bethlehem, Star of David, The Manger, The three wise men, etc, etc…..?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:23 pmif it were not for the Birth of Jesus Dec 25 0000?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:24 pmGregor,
Funny huh? She claimed she was in court all day, and that it let out early last week. But I noticed that she posted the entire day with no longer than a 30-45 minute gap between each posting. Can’t you see the image of a ‘lawyer’ going to sneak internet blog posts while the judge isn’t looking?
Bahaha, sure. Yeah. That’s right up there with ‘bush’ being smart. Bahaha, it’s just NOT credible.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:24 pmhhmmmm?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:25 pm#88, internet posts do not have gender
#89 the RNC also sent a “Holiday Card” this year, your political donations at work!
December 5th, 2005 at 4:26 pm“I don’t offer the greeting “Thrilling Winter Solstice†yet – my atheist and pagan friends aren’t THAT sensitive.
Comment by mighty aphrodite ”
You’ve already said the ‘unreligious’ people are hateful and the problem with america. Why do you call them ‘friends’ if they’re so evil? Isn’t that completely psychotic of you? Well of course it WOULD be, if anything you posted was true, or even based on a real person.
You’re such a bad and inept liar…
December 5th, 2005 at 4:26 pmAnd while we’re talking about the origin of the Christmas tree, Jeremiah 10: 3-4…”For the customs of the peoples are worthles; they cut a tree out of the forest, and a craftsman shapes it with his chisel. They adorn it with silver and gold; they fasten it with hammer and nails so it will not totter.” And that’s 500 years before the three wise men.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:26 pmActually, Jesus was born in the year 4.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:27 pmBut I noticed that she posted the entire day with no longer than a 30-45 minute gap between each posting.
Comment by Ryan Neat — December 5, 2005 @ 4:24 pm
Really? Is that so!? I guess I wasn’t paying attention to the timestamp on the posts…
And that further begs the question: Why would an average, run-of-the-mill conservative person spend so much time on a liberal blog?
Boggles the mind.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:28 pmSpudge is right…and it was probably in the early fall, because the shepherds were in the fields, which happens right after the September harvest. December 25 was picked as the date to celebrate in the 5th century, I think. It’s all been related to pagan rituals…the early church wanted to hijack the solstices, etc, to take them away from the pagans.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:31 pmgood catch Kiki. so it is all related to religion.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:31 pm#97
December 5th, 2005 at 4:32 pm…and in the spring, no less
#98. Paid advertisement.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:33 pm#101. Wasn,t Jesus born in a Barn? The Hotel had no more rooms?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:35 pmI thought that would be cruel had it been in the dead of winter.
#96
Your
“And while we’re talking about the origin of the Christmas tree, Jeremiah 10: 3-4…â€For the customs of the peoples are worthles; they cut a tree out of the forest, and a craftsman shapes it with his chisel. They adorn it with silver and gold; they fasten it with hammer and nails so it will not totter.†And that’s 500 years before the three wise men.”
Combined with mine:
“The Christmas Tree is a pagna symbol from before Chritianity was formed.”
“Long before the advent of Christianity, plants and trees that remained green all year had a special meaning for people in the winter. Just as people today decorate their homes during the festive season with pine, spruce, and fir trees, ancient peoples hung evergreen boughs over their doors and windows. In many countries it was believed that evergreens would keep away witches, ghosts, evil spirits, and illness.”
http://www.historychannel.com/ exhibits/ holidays/christmas/ trees.html
Would seem to fit very well. Considering that Christianity is based on the teachings of Christ who wasn’t born until the year 4.
People were decking the halls with everygreen plants and trees, long beofre he was around.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:35 pmRight on: Dec 25th was targeted at the Winter Solstice pagan festival – hijack that, hijack the tree thing and the Christians are in the driver’s seat and the people with blue paint on their faces are out in the cold. All the major religions use the same technique…
So Ryan, do you have MA’s ‘unreligious (sic) are hateful’ quote to hand?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:36 pm#99
“the early church wanted to hijack the solstices, etc, to take them away from the pagans.”
Yes, because the church wanted to stop the pagan running around having ritual sex, frolicking naked and having fun. The church always ruins everyones fun. They always have. Spanish Enquisition anybody?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:37 pmbut, they all tie into one.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:37 pmBoth Kiki and Ryans Stories are right.
They can do what they want in their own home. (Even though it’s the ‘people’s house’ – it IS their home.) Also, having friends of many backgrounds, they undoubtedly invited some Jewish children – Merry Christmas, Happy Chanukuh and Happy New Year!!
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 5, 2005 @ 4:23 pm
Thanks for your reply.
But this was an official event, wasn’t it? After all, the news release was made by the Office of the Press Secretary, and they didn’t invite friends: they hosted children from Stratford Landing Elementary School in Alexandria, and Glen Haven Elementary School in Silver Spring.
Isn’t this an official endorsement of the “attak” on Christmas? Isn’t this offensive to all Christians?
Or is it perfectly ok to say “Happy Holidays” when talking to a very broad audience that might include non-Christians?
December 5th, 2005 at 4:39 pmbut the Church started the pagan running around having ritual sex, frolicking naked and having fun.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:39 pmDidnt they?
Gregor,
I did a google search recently, found MizzWrong’s handle posting on a linux sysadmin board. Clearly he’s just some schmoe sysadmin pretending to be working while he spams liberal blogs. He tries to ‘talk big’, but obviously he’s an underqualified idiot nerd who doesn’t know crap about the real world. It’s why he’s such a whacko. And considering that MightyHermaphrodite and MizzWrong appear to ‘play together’, posting the same comments and arguments, they’re clearly the same (or same group) of idiots.
I saw pictures of the ‘nerd fest’ that was the pro-war rally. Clearly these losers are all cut from the same unsocialized and psychotic idiotic crowd. The ‘faithful 400′ as they’re called :()
December 5th, 2005 at 4:40 pmGregor,
You’re asking him/her to think rationally, she/he doesn’t have the mental capacity to comply.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:41 pmYou can find a pretty good resource for all of your Christmas tree history by clicking here.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:42 pmRead this Ryan and Kiki.
EXODUS CHAPTER 32
——————————————————————————–
December 5th, 2005 at 4:46 pm1 ¶ And when the people saw that Moses delayed to come down out of the mount, the people gathered themselves together unto Aaron, and said unto him, Up, make us gods, which shall go before us; for as for this Moses, the man that brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we wot not what is become of him.
2 And Aaron said unto them, Break off the golden earrings, which are in the ears of your wives, of your sons, and of your daughters, and bring them unto me.
3 And all the people brake off the golden earrings which were in their ears, and brought them unto Aaron.
4 And he received them at their hand, and fashioned it with a graving tool, after he had made it a molten calf: and they said, These be thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.
5 And when Aaron saw it, he built an altar before it; and Aaron made proclamation, and said, To morrow is a feast to the LORD.
6 And they rose up early on the morrow, and offered burnt offerings, and brought peace offerings; and the people sat down to eat and to drink, and rose up to play.
7 ¶ And the LORD said unto Moses, Go, get thee down; for thy people, which thou broughtest out of the land of Egypt, have corrupted themselves:
Aaron is Identified as a Levite, or (Priest)
December 5th, 2005 at 4:52 pm#109
No, this stuff was going on for thousands of years before the church was created.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:54 pmSpudge, Yes you are Right. It started here.
6 And they rose up early on the morrow, and offered burnt offerings, and brought peace offerings; and the people sat down to eat and to drink, and rose up to play.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:55 pm7 ¶ And the LORD said unto Moses, Go, get thee down; for thy people, which thou broughtest out of the land of Egypt, have corrupted themselves:
concerning the right wing ‘trolls’…..how about at the next, and each subsequent, post, they are simply ignored. don’t comment, don’t insult, simply leave them alone with their own self righteous rantings. let them hang themselves with their ignorance, prejudice and hate. let’s not stoop to their level.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:56 pmSpudge, it started even before then. Before The Great flood
December 5th, 2005 at 4:57 pmPagans were on earth.
BO and Gibson, FOX anchors and others are trying to start up a skirmish between cons and libs with their false charges of “war on Chirstmas.” Frankly, it should be the cons who are criticizing the commercialization of Christmas, instead of demonizing libs who acknowledge that other religions (and non-religious) enjoy this time of year for their own religious practices, festivity, and parties. The light should be shone on the instigators for their false charges and unwarranted claims, as well as the very “unchristian” attitude they possess.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:59 pm“The right-wing is trying to whip up a frenzy about the War on Christmas”
Well, I’m sure not … I think the whole point is rather stupid. I do think that the ACLU does tend to sue way too much when equal representation is given (ie. menorah, manger, etc.)
As a Christian, I can confidently state that the Christmas tree is far more tradition than theology … some Christians don’t have them b/c they think it could be an “idol”. The tree is purely secular and likely from pagan holidays (like what’s been said).
I think Bill O’Reilly is making too big a deal about what companies say to their customers … Happy Holidays is inclusive and fair (although about 80 – 90% of us celebrate Christmas). GWB was being respectful to all those that were in attendance … I would think he’d earn some kudos for doing so.
Christmas (and what Christians believe it is) can never be hijacked/usurped by society b/c the celebration of Christ’s birth by the Christian is largely personal (when it’s corporate, one’s with one’s own family or one’s own church and we mostly agree anyway). I think Christians have felt that because we’re in the majority, other occasionally religions get preferential treatment (ie. My nieces are learning about Islam all week in school … try doing that with the Bible).
December 5th, 2005 at 4:59 pmSpudge, To get a little deep, Pagan ,Evil, Satan, how ever it got its name, was on Earth before Adam and Eve.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:00 pmIt was waiting in the Garden of Eden in the Tree of Knowledge.
So, Pagan has been around for a long time.
we just didnt see it. or we saw it and tried to Ignore it I suppose.
What do I know? Nothing.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:03 pm121 – Satan=Lucifer=the Accuser
If you want to get deep … the Bible says he’s an archangel (like Michael and Gabriel). All the archangels had jobs … Lucifer’s was the accuser. His was to confront God and reveal the wickedness of man (The story of Job plays this out). Some theologians say that the whole Satan thing is misinterpreted by early Christians (wishing to have something to blame for their weaknesses) and that Lucifer is still in heaven continuing to play this role … that is, he’s not against God, but is assigned to confront man. Sin exists, but there doesn’t need to be a pointy tailed demon to make that so.
As such, the whole evil Satan prowling around is a misnomer. The Christmas tree is a germanic tradition … nothing more. Or you can believe that a physical Satan tempts you with nudie pictures on the internet (maybe he does, who knows).
December 5th, 2005 at 5:07 pmfreedom is not free,
Why are you equating pagan with evil and satan.
Pagan
1. One who is not a Christian, Muslim, or Jew, especially a worshiper of a polytheistic religion.
2. One who has no religion.
3. A non-Christian.
4. A hedonist.
5. A Neo-Pagan.
Pagan is just a name given to people that don’t follow the mainstream religions.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:07 pm#123
“Sin exists, but there doesn’t need to be a pointy tailed demon to make that so.”
You are correct.
The Bible clearly states Lucifer was God’s most beautiful angel. There is no tail, no horns and no goatie.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:09 pmmerry xmas mr bush
Go there, wait and think…
December 5th, 2005 at 5:12 pmOK, this thread is baked now…
December 5th, 2005 at 5:14 pmBush? LEADER OF THE WORLD????
December 5th, 2005 at 5:16 pmSCARY THOUGHT!
yep Turtle, time to move on to the next big topic. seeya in the other room.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:17 pmI think Christians have felt that because we’re in the majority, other occasionally religions get preferential treatment (ie. My nieces are learning about Islam all week in school … try doing that with the Bible).
Comment by Giacomo (aka GeoMetro & Jocko-Homo & Jerkamo) — December 5, 2005 @ 4:59 pm
Giacomo,
Thanks for your thoughtful posts, so far removed from histrionics and hysterical rhetoric.
IMHO, Christians of all denominations needn’t worry: I don’t think the U.S. will cease to be an majoritarily Christian country any time soon.
Also, it is a good thing your niece is learning about Islam -it can only expand her general culture. I don’t know how old she is, but I think it would be even better if her school also taught about other religions, and then compared them.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:22 pmWhy do the liberals get all the crap over this. Are the republicans the ONLY christians in the world? I would like to think it shouldn’t really matter. Christmas, is in fact Christmas. No way around it. You can’t take Christ out of Christmas.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:32 pmHey folks….just calm down and have a Happy Winter Solstice….The reason for the season!!!!!
December 5th, 2005 at 5:39 pmLove this string, people!
The Right is casting about for themes which will resonate with us, the people:
Illegal immigration seems to poll pretty well, so let’s trot that one out and see who bites…
Liberals hating Christmas… that sounds pretty good… let’s see how far we can get with that…
Hmmmm. maybe something gay next… gay adoption, gay dating services, gays registering at Macy’s… maybe gays in politics… or teaching…
Evolution? Nah… can’t go near that one, they’ll eat us alive…
The people are growing tired of new “thems” for “us” to hate and revile. We’re still working on the batch from the first Bush II administration.
The problem is, all of our problems today require careful thought, moderation, consensus building, cooperation… and these approaches are anathema to the hard right, who require hate and ad hominem attacks to fuel their work.
Imagine if Joe McCarthy had held his papers up and yelled, “I have a list of two hundred state department employees who hold a wide array of views on many economic and social issues and would like to be heard!” Try building uop a red scare with THAT kind of tepid rhetoric…
No, the Bush people need fear to promote their failing agenda.
Doubt me? Remember the recent white house memo saying, in essence, “what we need is another 9 – 11 to bring up the president’s credibility and approval ratings.”
Who was it exactly whom Bush wanted “dead or alive?” Was it us?
December 5th, 2005 at 5:39 pm#123. Giacomo,Gregor , Ryan. You ruled out one minor detail that I havent forgotten, It is When St. Micheal Rose up and said”Who is unlike God” and he Gathered his Army together and Drove Satan and its Third OUT of Heaven and ONTO Earth.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:50 pmThis has to happen After the Earth was Created BUT, Before Eve went into the Garden.
Hence , Evil is in fact still on Earth.
sorry, had to get that out.
December 5th, 2005 at 5:50 pmAnd yes, Bush is part of that Evil third (Riech)
December 5th, 2005 at 5:52 pm#75 – “I want to thank you for putting Judd over the top and making Judd’s holidays just a little bit brighter!”
December 5th, 2005 at 6:04 pmComment by Big Al — December 5, 2005 @ 4:04 pm
**** I had a hunch that Think Pessimism was strictly numbers – I guess if they were rewarding quality employees, Judd would be SOL. Al, what is the secret of Judd’s success? Does he have his mom and sister write in and sign “Ryan Neat” “PP”, “Susan”, “Marie”, “True Blue”??
It must be a slow news day for the Leftist Losers.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I — December 5, 2005 @ 2:20 pm
I-RIGHT-I, what do you make of the fact that Pres. Bush and his wife hosted a “Holiday Reception†instead of a “Christmas Reception�
Comment by Gregor Samsa
What do you make of the fact that Mrs. Bush closed by saying “So have a very, very happy holiday to everybody. Have fun.â€, instead of wishing everybody a good ole fashioned Merry Christmas?
I think she is as sensitive as any politician to the fact that this country has more than a few people of other than Christian faith and that in her own deranged female mind she thinks she’s being Christian (in a politically correct sort of way) by not mentioning the fact that IT’S CHRISTMAS, STUPID. At least she didn’t call the cookies, “holiday cookies”.
Are their remarks offensive to Christians? If so, why? If not, why not?
Comment by Gregor Samsa
I’m not offended that she called her public get together a holiday thing-a-ma-jig instead of a Christmas thing-of-a-ma-jig, I’m disappointed. I would be offended (because I voted for her husband) if they had a big party at the White House and called it a “holiday” party. By the way, are you going to have the annual office Christmas party or holiday party this year? If it’s a holiday party, when did it change?
Political correctness is evil, isn’t it? Oh, one more thing. If you were invited to a Christmas party would you go or would you feel the hosts were dumb hicks to stupid to think for themselves because they still retain some of the American tradition of celebrating Christmas?
December 5th, 2005 at 6:08 pmNot to worry.
OLielly is only speaking for Christians who sexually harass their employees.
December 5th, 2005 at 6:09 pm#”You’ve already said the ‘unreligious’ people are hateful and the problem with america. Why do you call them ‘friends’ if they’re so evil? Isn’t that completely psychotic of you? Well of course it WOULD be, if anything you posted was true, or even based on a real person.
December 5th, 2005 at 6:10 pmYou’re such a bad and inept liar”
Comment by Ryan Neat — December 5, 2005 @ 4:26 pm
****As usual, you’re wrong…you might be confusing me with the other kids in the sand box who don’t like you either.
Ryan can’t keep his days straight – no surprise there!
December 5th, 2005 at 6:14 pmto say that Jesus was even born on December 25 is a falsehood that even theologians contest. see these links:
http://chi.gospelcom.net/DAILYF/2003/11/daily-11-17-2003.shtml
http://www.allaboutjesuschrist.org/was-jesus-born-on-december-25-faq.htm
the December date was chosen to coincide with pagan celebrations. Christian holidays in general were conveniently decided to occur on or near times of pagan celebrations in order to make it easier for pagans to accept christianity. The idea was ’sure we’re still celebrating, but now we just celebrate something different’.
a long indoctrination period of forcing pagans to accept the new christian “face” on their holidays ensued.
and now we get christianity: religion of war, hate, self-absorption and persecution.
i’m sure jesus would be proud.
December 5th, 2005 at 6:35 pmthe fact is that there has been a concerted effort by christianity since about 300 a.d. to subjegate every other religion. it’s a race to be the biggest, baddest religion of them all.
because, of course, if you’re not a christian, you’re wrong and you’re going to hell.
take some time to be proud of christianity, read this account of good old fashioned christian cannabalism:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ma%27arrat_al-Numan
a quote from that article:
now, i wonder why muslims don’t like christians?
December 5th, 2005 at 6:41 pmYou know Progressaurus Rex, At one time, Even Heaven Had a War Going on.
DANIEL CHAPTER 2
28 But there is a God in heaven that revealeth secrets
DANIEL CHAPTER 12
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December 5th, 2005 at 6:55 pm1 ¶ And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
Bill O’Reilly is doing this to get back at those people who sued him over his sexual harrassment to his co-worker. He figures people will forget what he did and he can now rein as Mr. big shot once again.
But no we will not forget Bill you are still a pervert and slime ball. Tis the season not to forget.
December 5th, 2005 at 6:58 pmnow, i wonder why muslims don’t like christians?
Comment by Progressaurus Rex
For the same reason they don’t like you. Infidel.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:13 pmfreedom,
how is the rashness of Nebuchadnezzar relevant here? in that Daniel was able to convince him of his rashness? would that we could do the same for bush and his ilk.
this is old testament stuff. it is basically out of context for christians to quote the old testament since the teachings of jesus were deemed as modernizing and, in many cases, superceding the teachings of the old testament — for christians, anyway.
of course, if you’re jewish, then the old testament still applies.
but to say ‘even heaven had a war going on’ is specious. we neither live in heaven nor are entitled to speak for what supposedly happened there. iraq is not heaven, and the inhabitants of heaven hardly equate to our mortal existences.
i’ll concern myself with terra firma, personally.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:14 pmthe December date was chosen to coincide with pagan celebrations. Christian holidays in general were conveniently decided to occur on or near times of pagan celebrations in order to make it easier for pagans to accept christianity.
i’m sure jesus would be proud.
Comment by Progressaurus Rex
I’m just as sure He doesn’t care. If he wanted you losers to trash Him on the correct day of His birth I think he’d have let us know what day it was. It’s bad enough to have to listen to you heathen seeth and whine on Dec. 25th.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:17 pm-RIGHT-I, nothing makes me feel better than to read your posts.
Your every garbled thought, mangled rationalization, and clumsy attempt at misdirection fills me with more gladness of heart and utter relief that I’m a liberal than you’ll ever know.
Thanks for being you, and please, keep posting!
Comment by ElectricBassPlayer
Funny, I like y’all for the very same reasons.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:18 pmbi-right-bi,
a snarky little statement like that doesn’t address at all my point. quite simply: christians cannabalized muslims during the first crusade. they ate their children. all while on a religious quest to ‘reclaim the holy land’.
it’s symbolic for what christianity is trying to do today — cannabalize other religions. christianity is no longer an ideal, it’s an institution (much like the u.s. government). the goal of the institution isn’t to promote the ideals and beliefs of christianity, it’s to promote the institution itself.
it’s no longer about faith. it’s about power.
however, to call me an infidel is technically correct, insofar as a muslim would define it. but are you a muslim?
you seem to merely be an idiot. but i can’t hold that against you if you were born that way.
ignorance, however, is an entirely different matter. you exhibit quite an abundant amount of that!
remember, all it takes is the willingness to learn.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:22 pmJOHN ADAMS
December 5th, 2005 at 7:23 pm“I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved — the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!”
–in a letter to Thomas Jefferson
“I’m just as sure He doesn’t care. If he wanted you losers to trash Him on the correct day of His birth I think he’d have let us know what day it was. It’s bad enough to have to listen to you heathen seeth and whine on Dec. 25th.”
Trollin’ in a different thread eh?
December 5th, 2005 at 7:24 pmJAMES MADISON
December 5th, 2005 at 7:24 pm“During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution.”
–from his ‘Memorial and Remonstrance against Religious Assessments’
THOMAS JEFFERSON
December 5th, 2005 at 7:25 pm“Question with boldness even the existence of a god.”
–letter to Peter Carr, 1787
BENJAMIN FRANKLIN
December 5th, 2005 at 7:25 pm“If we look back into history for the character of the present sects in Christianity, we shall find few that have not in their turns been persecutors, and complainers of persecution. The primitive Christians thought persecution extremely wrong in the Pagans, but practiced it on one another. The first Protestants of the Church of England blamed persecution in the Romish church, but practiced it upon the Puritans. These found it wrong in the Bishops, but fell into the same practice themselves both here [England] and in New England.”
–from his essay, “Toleration”
THOMAS PAINE
December 5th, 2005 at 7:26 pm“Of all the systems of religion that ever were invented, there is no more derogatory to the Almighty, more unedifiying to man, more repugnant to reason, and more contradictory to itself than this thing called Christianity.”
–from Paine’s book, “The Age of Reason”
“What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society? In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people. Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not.”
December 5th, 2005 at 7:26 pm–from his ‘Memorial and Remonstrance against Religious Assessments’
Also, a Dr. Priestley, an intimate friend of Ben Franklin, wrote of him:
December 5th, 2005 at 7:27 pm“It is much to be lamented that a man of Franklin’s general good character and great influence should have been an unbeliever in Christianity, and also have done as much as he did to make others unbelievers”
–from Priestley’s Autobiography
THOMAS PAINE
December 5th, 2005 at 7:28 pm“I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of. My own mind is my church.”
–from Paine’s book, “The Age of Reason”
#157 is James Madison, btw
December 5th, 2005 at 7:29 pmTHOMAS PAINE
“I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of. My own mind is my church.â€
–from Paine’s book, “The Age of Reasonâ€
Comment by Progressaurus Rex
I don’t know but I’d bet he regretted writing that book. Every friend he ever had left him. It’s a shame that he was brainwashed by the French Sophists.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:41 pmAlso, a Dr. Priestley, an intimate friend of Ben Franklin, wrote of him:
“It is much to be lamented that a man of Franklin’s general good character and great influence should have been an unbeliever in Christianity, and also have done as much as he did to make others unbelieversâ€
–from Priestley’s Autobiography
Comment by Progressaurus Rex
I think Dr. Priestley was a little hard on Franklin though I don’t doubt the general truth of his lament. On the other hand Franklin was well aware of the benefit of the Christian faith to the new nation. It was Franklin that ordered up the prayer before the meetings of the Continental Congress.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:44 pmyou like talking for other people don’t you bi-right-bi?
how about those others? do they regret their words? Do John Adams, James Madison, Ben Franklin, and Thomas Jefferson regret their words?
bi-right-bi communes with the founding fathers, everyone!
December 5th, 2005 at 7:47 pmhe’s a regular oracle!
#147. well, Yes, that was my Thought. who knows? all things considered, Bush might have a Change of Heart?
(Nah, Wishfull think,uh.)
how is the rashness of Nebuchadnezzar relevant here? in that Daniel was able to convince him of his rashness? would that we could do the same for bush and his ilk.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:52 pmBy the way, are you going to have the annual office Christmas party or holiday party this year?
Comment by I-RIGHT-I — December 5, 2005 @ 6:08 pm
I think HR are calling it a Holiday Party.
If it’s a holiday party, when did it change?
It’s a relatively new company. They’ve always called it Holiday instead of Christmas.
If you were invited to a Christmas party would you go or would you feel the hosts were dumb hicks to stupid to think for themselves because they still retain some of the American tradition of celebrating Christmas?
Now you are being passive-agressive, and just launched a pre-emptive strike for no good reason.
It’s Christmas as far as I am concerned, I-RIGHT-I. They can call it “Holiday” all they want. It’s still Christmas.
December 5th, 2005 at 7:55 pmbi-right-bi,
they were DEISTS.
moreover, the myth of Franklin “order”ing prayer, as you suggest, has been historically debunked. there were no prayers before continental congress meetings (for those that don’t want to read it all, skip down to ‘Summation’):
http://members.tripod.com/~candst/franklin.htm
of note:
just like most republicans, bi-right-bi likes to make statements with the hopes that no one will fact-check the accuracy.
those days are over.
December 5th, 2005 at 8:07 pmBoy our freedoms are going to hell.
December 5th, 2005 at 8:21 pmI think she is as sensitive as any politician to the fact that this country has more than a few people of other than Christian faith(…) At least she didn’t call the cookies, “holiday cookies”.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I — December 5, 2005 @ 6:08 pm
Ok, so calling it “Holiday” is not that bad. It is sensitive and reasonable.
I’m not offended that she called her public get together a holiday (…) I would be offended (…) if they had a big party at the White House and called it a “holiday” party.
But they had a big party. They called it a reception. Unless you think party necessarily involves dancing and alcohol.
Main Entry: re·cep·tion
Pronunciation: ri-’sep-sh&n
Function: noun
2 : a social gathering often for the purpose of extending a formal welcome
Main Entry: 1par·ty
Pronunciation: ‘pär-tE
Function: noun
6 : a social gathering; also : the entertainment provided for it
It is an official, formal gathering at the White House. And they called it “Holiday”.
Can we agree that calling it a “Holiday” is sensitive, reasonable and does not amount to an “attack” on the Christmas tradition?
December 5th, 2005 at 8:42 pmThis is the part where the trolls wait for a while until nobody is around thenthey post more attacks.
December 5th, 2005 at 8:47 pmWho cares what Laura or O’Reilly say.
December 5th, 2005 at 8:53 pmHappy Holidyas, if you can manage.
Here’s a switch – a Republicant being offended by a Christmas tree… school kids worked hard on it, and he made them take it down…
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051205/ap_on_re_us/lotto_tree_removed
December 5th, 2005 at 9:30 pm#171
Now that is funny stuff.
December 5th, 2005 at 9:33 pmapparently they did give him myrth as the earliest best edujumacated cristio religio crazy notated….and were it not for his overwhelming sense of humor would anything calling itself a god or even jesus lay claim to the likes of you go teach your children about intelligent design and please stay away from the more technical machinery…we can’t have your hair being tangled up in all these dangerous microprocessors….good grief and shame on you, you blurped a stupid idea and now you wish to perpetuate it on your fellow man just because it sounds good to you and wouldn’t it be great if we all felt that way….please just stop trying to defend your wretched post about the myths of christmas.
December 5th, 2005 at 9:43 pm#171, PB,
December 5th, 2005 at 9:45 pmThe guy was wrapped just a bit too tight wouldn’t you say?
AAAHHH! The Bushes made no reference to Jesus! That is an insult to…..uh….I don’t know……
December 6th, 2005 at 12:19 amhe Bushes made no reference to Jesus! That is an insult to…..uh….I don’t know……
Comment by Mark Marco — December 6, 2005 @ 12:19 am
So you say not making a reference to Jesus during the Holiday Season (aka Christmas) reception at the White House is not an insult to anyone.
What do you make of the fact that Bill O’Reilly has said that using the phrase “Happy Holiday” offends Christians?
What is your opinion on the fact that the White House officially called it a “Holiday Reception”? Is this offensive to Christians as O’Reilly says?
December 6th, 2005 at 12:37 am****As usual, you’re wrong…you might be confusing me with the other kids in the sand box who don’t like you either.
Ryan can’t keep his days straight – no surprise there! ” MightyHermaphrodite
You Sorry Tranny, you’ve been clocked!
http://thinkprogress.org/2005/11/30/oreilly-murtha-hitler/
#356
You were caught, you were exposed. You’re a liar and a stupid troll…
December 6th, 2005 at 12:59 amHyhahahaaaaaaaa -Aj
Hey IRI u Needa Job?
~~~~~~~~~~
12–1-5
http://www.insightmag.com/Media/MediaManager/Cheney2.htm
The sources said Mr. Bush has privately blamed Mr. Cheney and Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld for the U.S.-led war in Iraq. They said the president has told his senior aides that the vice president and defense secretary provided misleading assessments on Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction, as well as the capabilities of the regime of Saddam Hussein.
As a result, the sources said, Mr. Cheney has been ousted from his role as the administration’s point man in the area of national security. They said presidential staffers have kept Mr. Cheney out of the loop on discussions on policy as the White House has struggled with the political and intelligence fallout from the war in Iraq.
Mr. Bush is not expected to replace Mr. Cheney unless the vice president follows the fate of his former chief of staff. The sources also said Mr. Rumsfeld is expected to remain in his post until U.S. troops are withdrawn from Iraq.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:29 amOwwch Looks like RYAN has got your Number lmao -Aj
December 6th, 2005 at 1:32 amThis is just an attempt by the right wing spin doctors to paint liberal as the Grinch. Oh look at the nasty liberals trying to kill Christmas. It’s a Karl Rove talking point. They ALL start with the “war on christmas” thing ALL at the same time, from BO to the local FUX affiliate. It has nothing to do with Christians or Christmas. Jesus was not even born in winter, it was in Spring. December 25 is a pagan winter solstice celebration. But I digress… The main point is that the right wing spin doctors are using this to give liberals a black eye. That’s all this is about and it’s important to call them on it and expose their ploy. Otherwise, they get away with it.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:28 amFrom now on, I will keep saying Happy Holidays to anyone I meet. No more Merry Christmas. Besides Merry Christmas doesn’t sound good coming from my mouth.
I’d like to wish Billy Boy Happy Holidays! HAHHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA
December 6th, 2005 at 3:16 amDon’t you all realize … by arguing either for or against the validity of Fox News Channel’s claims of a ‘War on Christmas’, you further Fox’s cause. IGNORE IT. Fox News is pulling you into a false debate about a false ‘War on Christmas’ … the more you argue for or against, the more credibility you apply to Fox’s contentions. IGNORE IT … and make Fox lose this topic.
December 6th, 2005 at 5:13 amThis causes me to rethink the situation. if anyone knows “offensive” it’s Bildo O’Reilly. Shouldn’t we all bow to pervert who best knows how to offend when it comes to defining offensive ?
December 6th, 2005 at 5:24 amO’Reilly has completely succeeded in his effort to take peoples’ minds off real issues. What a bunch of suckers you are.
December 6th, 2005 at 7:03 amSuggestion for anyone interested in reading what Gibson actually wrote in his book (about the “so-called” War on Christmas) without paying for it: I have a c-worker who works in a library in another county. He got me a library card so he could get books for me. Whenever I want to read what any right-winger wrote without making them richer for it, I have him check the book out in my name. This not keeps the author from making money off me, but if the FBI decides to issue one of their unconstitutional “national security letters” and check my library records there, they’ll think that I’m a “good conservative” based on the books I “check out”.
I did this with Richard (?) Mintner (sp?)’s ridiculous “Losing bin Laden”. I didn’t think the author made a very credible case for his claims, and I have sinced learned that those claims have been refutably debunked.
Juat a thought. And, of course, I flat out buy the books by liberal authors that I like. I am willing to support them.
December 6th, 2005 at 8:39 amAccording to the bible, the decorating of the tree is a heathen custom. However it says that the tree has no power to do good nor evil. As to saying Happy Holidats. It actualy started because saying Merry Chritmas and Happy New Year was such a long statement, that people shortened it to Happy Holidays. Whether you agree or disagree, it was not a conspiracy to take religon out of it. Get real people.
December 6th, 2005 at 10:16 amA lesson in botany–Ever heard of the cedars of lebanon? Did you know that the Carthaginians, who lived in what is now Tunisia, built galleys made from local timber? The Middle East had forests at one time, but were cut down for shipbuilding, firewood, etc. They pretty much stripped the land of trees, increasing the rate of desertification that was already occurring.
December 6th, 2005 at 11:21 amThe question of Christmas and more importantly the role of religion in our society and its influence on the state is really very interesting. On one hand, we (the US) come from a socio-political tradition of “separation of church and state.” One where many of our building blocks as a nation are cemented in escaping religious persecution and championing religious tolerance. This tolerance is the whole basis of thanksgiving, of freedom of religion and to some extent freedom of speech. On the other hand, we cannot deny that American culture has been very much shaped by Christian traditions.
My personal view is that there should be a separation of church and state….a pure one. One that doesn’t favor any religion, doesn’t support fallacies about Islam and other faiths, respects other traditions and leaves all matters of religion to its citizens and the corresponding religious institutions. More importantly, I would like to see our president stop prostituting Christian beliefs in his asinine pursuit of a pseudo war on terror which is nothing but a greedy capitalist/imperialist war for greater control of oil.
I also think that our country is at times incredibly hypocritical. Why is it not okay to say “under God” in the pledge of allegiance, and not okay for a reference to the ten commandments be present in a court house BUT it is okay for our money to say “in God we trust” and for our president to forever ask “God Bless America?” Even with this whole Christmas tree bit, lets be serious, you can call the damn tree whatever you want, its still does not negate the fact that the whole reason for the tree, and what is being celebrated on 12/25 is essentially the birth of Christ.
Personally, I will most definitely be celebrating Christmas, will say Merry Christmas to all, and am proud to say that yes I was raised in a Christian tradition. Is it the only way to be – NO, should it be imposed on others – NO. And at the end of the day that should be a personal choice. That’s why many people came here in the first place. To make that choice for themselves. So I don’t know that I am ready to jump on the O’Reilly ultra conservative “nation without a god” bandwagon. That to me is the same kind of fundamentalist mentality we are quick to criticize of other faiths and cultures.
Merry Christmas.
December 6th, 2005 at 11:34 am#176 Greg- Only the left would anticipate “group offense” by one guy’s comments. Say it with me, “we are not victims!” Abandon lefty group think, choose liberty….blog on brother…
December 6th, 2005 at 11:35 amLiberals miss the point – as absurd as it is, this kind of Fox News generated crap does resonate with many red-staters, who will easily believe that secular humanists are trying to destroy Christmas. It takes two sides for there to be a “war – if we don’t acknowledge a war, does it exist? Instead, wish all conservative blowhard a**holes a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, and let them sputter…
December 6th, 2005 at 11:39 amSpeaking of Christmas and Christmas presents, Saddam Hussein’s trial is (unintended of course) giving the world a wonderful Christmas gift. Apparently, the witnesses (handpicked by the Iraqi judge, NOT the prosecution mind you) who have been testifying so far about atrocities that happened in a little village have not been able to identify Saddam in any of the “physical acts” of torture or murder. This is significant because Saddam is going to be convicted (and likely executed) on this (and other) circumstantial evidence of a leader being responsible for the actions of his minions. With the admission of this testimony as “background information” the Iraqi court is (unwittingly) setting a precedent that may well be used by an international tribunal that could well prosecute and convict Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld et. al. on war crimes and crimes against humanity for Abu Ghraib, shock and awe, numerous instances of collateral damage, white phosphorous use against civilians and on and on til the break-a-dawn!
Stay tuned…progressives and inbreds!
Merry Christmas, happy Holidays, Happy Hannukah, and Happy Kwanza! Whatever your flavor….
December 6th, 2005 at 12:05 pmWhen is the IMPEACHMENT Proceedings Going to Start?
December 6th, 2005 at 12:29 pmAmerica can Wait NO Longer!
All I want for Christmas is to see Impeachment Proceedings Started!
December 6th, 2005 at 12:32 pmAmerica is in a sad state of affairs under the Bushites. Another career FBI investigator has come forward with evidence of bungling of evidence in a terrorism case at the famed law enforcement agency- by (basically) “traitors”- and for his thanks he got retaliated against. Mike German (according to the NYT) exposed the mishandling of evidence and falsification of reports by fellow agents and was (according to an IG report backing his assertions) frozen out of teaching future undercover agents and basically blackballed in the agency. This adds yet another American patriot-turned-victim of the Bushite system of real heroes pack your bags and incompetent traitors get promoted. The Supreme Court (of right wing jesters) refused to even hear the case of a former FBI whistleblower.
Koleen Rowley, Sybil Edmonds, Richard Clark…how many more moral, ethical, conscientious American patriots are going to be ruined by this treasonous cabal in the Bushite White House and Justice Dept?
To borrow just a bit of a famous quote: “Verily I say unto you … anyone supporting the Bushite junta (and recent polls say 41% of voters approve of this traitor) are themselves traitors to this country. Bushites have to be dealt with, the CIA knows it, the Secret Service knows it, and the Justice Dept knows it, and that’s exactly why they (at least the ones who are true Americans) are leaking, and resigning!
December 6th, 2005 at 12:46 pmIt was Franklin that ordered up the prayer before the meetings of the Continental Congress.
He just did that so the red state hicks wouldn’t get all huffy and accuse him of waging a War on Christmas. :)
December 6th, 2005 at 12:47 pm—-Christmas tree bit, lets be serious, you can call the damn tree whatever you want, its still …..
December 6th, 2005 at 12:52 pmjust one out of many from a ‘clear cut’ forest.
You want to celebrate? Want a tree?
December 6th, 2005 at 12:54 pmPlant one!
Nobody seems upset that GW refers (repeatedly) to Rudolph. Rudolph is either a reference to the imaginary reindeer with the red nose, a literary illusion to his drunkenness and source of disgrace, or to Rudolph Hess. If it’s a reference to the reindeer, GW is promoting that whole “anti-Jesus Santa myth.” If it’s a reference to Hess, well, it explains his position on torture.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:12 pmIn reference to the Christmas Tree: You must also remember that after he betrayed Jesus, Judas ran off and hung himself from a tree: The first “ornament” of our beloved religion?
December 6th, 2005 at 1:29 pmA dear friend used to say, “Lots of religious folks here in this little town. Lots of churches. Not too many Christians, but lots of religion.” She was the wife of an ordained minister. What do you suppose she meant by that comment?
#199. Lotsa sin going on.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:32 pmin re: post #90: You didn’t capitalize “Christmas”. Why such disrespect? Simply trying to capitalize ON christmas?
December 6th, 2005 at 1:38 pmQuestions that should be asked:
by McCain–”Have you hugged your bush this season”
by Bennett–”Have you pulled the lever?”–remember if
three bush’s come up you win a jackpot.
by liberals–”if X-mass is destroyed will that put an
end to War?”
by Trolls—”huh?”
It would be nice if a bus load of fox’ers and BO’r decorated each and every bullet and bomb destined for delivery to Iraq this season, without charge but with ‘compassion’ of course, with a Christian greeting of some kind. Oh, this December of our discontent.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:37 pmHAPPY HOLIDAYS TO ALL !
December 6th, 2005 at 4:48 pmThis war on Christmas crap is just another tool the right is using to make themselves look like victims of the evil left. Nobody gives a rats patootie what kind of greeting they get in stores, but you’ll have the O’Liely’s out screaming about persecution. Gimme a damn break.
December 6th, 2005 at 5:21 pma loser is a conservative in a liberal thread complaining that we discuss issues from a liberal point of view. yes, i-right-i, that would specifically mean you!
but, please, don’t stop posting! your oblivious comments and inane babble based on conjecture not reality keep us rational folks in stitches. thanks for the laughs.
by the way, i’m still waiting for your concrete proof on the validity of jesus in the xmas|holiday tree thread…
December 6th, 2005 at 7:44 pm[...] HT: Think Progress, Air America’s Majority Report, Daily Kos Posted by Chris on Wednesday, December 7th, 2005 at 12:02 am. Filed under Republicans , Religion [...]
December 6th, 2005 at 11:07 pmWhen O’Reilly objects to “Happy Holidays”, he conspicuously forgets about New Year’s Day. The traditional response to “Merry Christmas” is “Happy New Year”: “Happy Holidays” is a time-saving combination of the two.
Dare I mention Hannukah? Or how about Kwanzaa? Is O’Reilly saying those don’t count? Or that their celebrants don’t count?
As for Christmas, please note that 1) there is precisely zero support in Scripture for that exact date as Jesus’s birth (who herds sheep in midwinter?), and 2) nowadays, December 25 is really about Santa. It’s about spending money; and that, by contemporary American standards, is what makes it holy.
December 7th, 2005 at 12:31 amAttention Liberals,
Your comments are dripping with acid. Your continued dsiplay of arrogance, condecension, and elitism are appalling. You are the ones who preach tolerance, yet you are the very ones who are the least tolerant. Name calling, viscious attacks and ridicule is all you extend to those who disagree with you. In many comments, you allude to having greater thinking and reasoning abilities than conservatives, Christians, Republicans… the majority of people in this country. Try adding listening and understanding to your inflated views of your own intelligence. It would really cut down on the amount of gross misrepresentations and straw-man attacks on your opponents.
December 7th, 2005 at 9:45 amMichael #208
You almost had me feeling guilty ’til you made this comment:
“In many comments, you allude to having greater thinking and reasoning abilities than conservatives, Christians, Republicans… the majority of people in this country.”
You red state inbred, Bushite, conservative, so-called Christian, republiscum/ and Lieberman zionist Democrat- imposters (who still support the demons in the White House)are (by latest poll numbers) 41% of the “VOTING” public. Extrapolate the real numbers from the TOTAL number of Americans, then the percentage of eligible people in this country who even bother to vote (say 40% give or take) and that puts your puny “majority” at about 20% of the population as a whole.
Now close your eyes, click your heels three times and whisper “I need to go home.” America is for true patriots who believe in the constitutional separation of powers, not “idol worship” (like you Bushites practice). So please, if you love America take your “majority” back to where the people worship the monarchy Michael.
December 7th, 2005 at 11:49 amIf you throw a rock into a pack of dogs, the one who barks is the one you hit. Thanks for making my point big papa.
December 7th, 2005 at 1:20 pmTrumpets and Cheers
December 7, 2005
Again, twice, the perfect article and both times from the Press Democrat! In “Woolsey’s anti-war crusade gains steam†by Kerry Benefield spoke long denial volumes. Few Congress members have stood up against the unbearable and ruthless treatment than Lynn Woolsey’s opposition to this failed, corrupt, and immoral war in Iraq. From the very beginning, Representative Woolsey called it as it was, as it is, and what will be if this war continues: an authentic foreign policy disaster. The chronicle of Woolsey’s efforts against the war stated along with the article was marvelous, concise and very precise. But being a paragon of righteousness doesn’t come without its detractors and sour apples; Rep. Darrell Issa, R-Vista for one. Typically Republican in nature and in response, Issa does his best to discredit Woolsey as a loony lefty, groping for support, like with John Murtha. Again, Issa is typical of Republicans, who ushered truth, justice, and morality in Washington like the corrupted Medicare and Bankruptcy bills, like the culture of corruption with such sterling cast as Cunningham, DeLay, and Abramoff. And let’s not forget the Big Fat Lie known as the Iraq war, the Ultimate Lie. Three cheers for Woolsey!
December 7th, 2005 at 4:24 pmIn the name of fairness and balance and so as not to offend with sarcasm, we are supporting the War on Christmas and a War on the War on Christmas>.
December 7th, 2005 at 9:54 pmMichael #210,
Glad to be of service.
Now go find a bigger rock that does some damage!
December 8th, 2005 at 12:33 pmI agree with michael #208 in the sense that progressives promote tolerance and fight censorship, when they and the groups that protect them i.e. ACLU are willing to ruin anyone who disagrees.
December 9th, 2005 at 9:37 pmJust so you know, though Bill O’Reilly is definately not fair, there are actually examples of Christmas being unrightfully censored, such as a school in Plano recently banning the colors green and red in their “holiday celebrations” because, I don’t know, they might offend non-christians. Of course, most of you wouldn’t know about this story, because you spend most of your time making fun of people on sites where there are very few to counter you. By the way, If a menorah is ever called a holiday candelabra, I will take back everything I ever said about just Christmas being censored.
as an added note, you might as well cut the Bush lied crap, becuase we all realize he lied and nothing can be done about it. Unfortunately for #193, a president can only be impeached if he/she has commited a crime, and lying isn’t one.
December 9th, 2005 at 9:44 pmFor the record… Christmas trees are actually Christian.
In the 8th century a missionary named Boniface went to Germany to preach Christ. The Germanic tribes worshipped the oak tree as a symbol of deity. Boniface told them it was a poor symbol for God since it sheds its leaves and appears dead in winter. He told them the tree that should remind them of God was the evergreen. Always green and thriving.
Christmas trees became popular in England primarily through the influence of the German-born, Prince Albert, husband of England’s Queen Victoria. In America the trees were introduced by German immigrants in Pennsylvania.
December 10th, 2005 at 5:06 pmi AM a christian, and i AM offended that we can barely speak of our christ’s birth without it being “offending.” If somebody said to me “happy kwanza” i would smile and reply back with “happy kwanza.” Just because two people are not the same faith does not mean that they cannot support eachother and their holiday. We live in america people. Christianity is our national religion. If you don’t like it, you can leave. end of story.
December 12th, 2005 at 6:25 pmSwords
Swords Online Order
December 22nd, 2005 at 8:16 pmwedding ring
wedding rings
January 1st, 2006 at 1:15 pmwedding ring
wedding rings
January 1st, 2006 at 1:16 pmCelebrate Diversity, Celebrate CHRISTMAS. The United States is 85 percent Christian, which means we are more Christian than India is Hindu and Isreal is Jewish. Moreover, 96 percent of Americans celebrate Christmas. So why do we have to tippy-toe around the religious meaning of Christmas every December???? There is something sick about Friendship Trees, Winter Solstice Concerts, Holiday Parades and Holly Day Festivals. The neutering of Christmas extends to the banishment of Nativity Scenes from the public square, the expulsion of baby Jesus from creches not otherwise forbidden, the banning of red and green at school functions, the censoring of “Silent Night” at municipal concert, ect.
December 18th, 2006 at 10:25 amAll of this madness is done even though 97 percent of Americans say they are not offended by Christmas celebrations. So as not to be misunderstood, it is important to recognize that the few who are complaining do not belong to any one religious or ethnic group-there is plenty of diversity to be found amoung the ranks of the disaffected. No matter, fairness dictates that their intolerance should not trump the rights of the rest of us. Diversity means respect for the traditions and heritages of all groups, not just those which have been cherry-picked by the multicultural gurus. To be excluded is normal. Mother’ day, Fathers day, Veterans day, Black History month,Gay Pride parades- they all exclude someone. The Olympic Games are a showcase for segregation-men are barred from women’s sports- yet not even radical feminists call it sexist. Should all of these holidays and events be banned because some feel excluded? Don’t let the cultural fascists get their way this year. William A. Donohue President Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights- NY Times op-ed page ad Tues Nov. 28, 2006.