More McCain Attacks: Murtha ‘Sentimental,’ ‘Never Been a Big Thinker’
More McCain Attacks: Murtha ‘Sentimental,’ ‘Never Been a Big Thinker’
On Sunday, Sen. John McCain — regularly lauded for his nonpartisan “straight talk” — attacked Rep. John Murtha for having “become too emotional” over the Iraq war.
McCain was simply repeating the line he had given Byron York in an interview for the New Republic. That piece is now online, and as you’ll see below, McCain was even more personal when speaking to York:
John Murtha is “a lovable guy,” but “he’s never been a big thinker; he’s an appropriator.” Using language that Bush never could, McCain tells me that Murtha has become too emotional about the human cost of the war. “As we get older, we get more sentimental,” McCain says. “And [Murtha] has been very, very affected by the funerals and the families. But you cannot let that affect the way you decide policy.”
We’ll put aside whether 69-year-old John McCain should be referencing 73-year-old John Murtha’s age to dismiss his policy positions. But with McCain’s comments about Murtha’s intellectual capacity in mind, it’s worth noting some of Murtha’s accomplishments.
For three decades, U.S. presidents of both parties have turned to Murtha for advice on our nation’s most sensitive national security issues. For instance, he “worked closely with President George H.W. Bush” in the lead-up to the first Iraq war. Murtha also authored a highly-praised book that one reviewer described “an analytical history of defense and foreign affairs matters that Murtha has been involved in from the Vietnam War through Sept. 11.”
Pretty good for someone who’s “never been a big thinker.”
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Someone save us from the “big thinkers” that are defending this debacle in Iraq.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:14 pmI suppose what we need is a great “thinker” like Bush to get us out of Iraq.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:14 pmWhen are people finally gonna sink that flip flop, unprincipled, bush hugging crazy bastard McCain. I mean, what does he stand for? Do you want a leader who comes crawling back after being kicked in the teeth (by Rove for the 2000 race) so many times?
“McCain tells me that Murtha has become too emotional about the human cost of the war.”
Only a sociopath would not keep in mind the human cost for a war of lies and bullshit. Sociopaths turn out to be serial killers.
A maverick? I seriously doubt it. You must live the narrative if you want it to stick.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:15 pmMcCain looks like a koala bear.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:16 pmCaption : Can I crawl in your pouch and suckle W?
Whatever they are offering John McCain, but it ain’t enough.
I think the world of John McCain. What he did in VietNam, letting others go home before himself, was an act of courage beyond anything I have ever heard of.
It is shocking, depressing, and discouraging that such a good man could be so badly deceived.
I don’t know what they offered him (the nod maybe?), but it just ain’t enough.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:17 pmI have a feeling (sentimentally) that John Murtha will have an effectice reaction to this charge. I can’t wait to hear it. Calling John Murtha a wuss is ‘way off the reservation, and Murtha will (I trust) stick John MaCain back in the prison cell of failed ideas.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:20 pmhe’s hugging someone who’s not a big thinker in that picture…
December 6th, 2005 at 12:20 pmMcCain cannot be trusted. He is as much a creation of the supposed “liberal media” as he is his own man. He came to NH back in the 2000 primary as a “maverick”….he is much more of a horses ass than he is a maverick.
How he could embrace Bush/Rove after they assassinated his character in South Carolina tells you all you need to know about him.
And only in a nation so perverted by the mindsets of Bush/Rove/Rice/Pol Pot could McCain be considered a hero or a maverick for taking a stand against torture. That is considered a brave stand and not a no-brainer in this new Republican world order.
McCain is a trojan horse, not a maverick.
-GSD
December 6th, 2005 at 12:21 pmOnly a sociopath would not keep in mind the human cost for a war of lies and bullshit. Sociopaths turn out to be serial killers.
I don’t think he’s saying to FORGET the tolls of war … he’s saying said tolls cannot, alone, dictate policy. If loss of life solely dictated WWII policy, forget Normandy (although post Normandy, we chose to go with an A-Bomb instead of a Japan invasion). Look, it’s hard to say that McCain doesn’t have a solid grip on the costs of war, and to be fair, this is war hero vs. war hero. They both are entitled to their opinions and, I believe, their military distinction adds value to what they believe. By calling Murtha an appropriator (as opposed to a thinker) a was saying that Murtha’s not the “ideas guy” but the activator/facilitator of the ideas … these guys know each other personally.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:24 pmUnder no circumstances does John McCain deserve to be president — I just hope that in 2008 the American people remember how much he sucked up to the Bush & Co. political machinery over the years, and how little integrity he actually has shown.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:29 pm“We’ll put aside whether 69-year-old John McCain should be referencing 73-year-old John Murtha’s age to dismiss his policy positions.”
December 6th, 2005 at 12:29 pmMcCain better run for president now, he only has 4 years until he becomes mush-headed himself.
McCain is a rat bastard. He’s completely moderate in one instance, then a neocon the next. No spine. No convictions.
For him to insinuate that Murtha knows not what he speaks is a enormous politcal gamble. People want the troops HOME, and for McCain to claim Murtha’s plan is not good policy is a huge slap in the face to the American public.
McCain–go check the polls. Murtha represents a majority. Your sorry-ass does NOT. I hope this kills your prez bid in ‘08, cuz we don’t need another two-faced loser in the WH….
December 6th, 2005 at 12:31 pmJohn McCain is still young enough, I guess, at 69 to be a completely clear thinker and John Murtha, at 73 is not? Why in the world would an ex-POW from Viet Nam not support John Murtha’s thoughtful views in terms of the similarities of this war in Iraq and Viet Nam. Looking back now on Viet Nam, wouldn’t we have been better off as a nation if we would have pulled out years before we did (and saved thousands of young soldiers lives in the process). Wake up John McCain and smell the history.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:31 pmMcCain has become a spectacular jackass. He has sold his soul to the devil who is GW Bush. And like Faust, his day of reckoning will come. Soon.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:33 pmMcCain has lost ALL credibility. I could have voted for him in the past but not anymore. I don’t even bother to listen to him he’s just another talking head from the Bu$h camp. And by the way in 2008 won’t he be 72 when he’s running for the WH. To old!
December 6th, 2005 at 12:34 pmDonald Rumsfeld is 73!
December 6th, 2005 at 12:35 pmWhat is to make of that?
McCain is a ball-less side-of-the-mouth talker. The only reason he couldn’t best junior in the primaries is because isn’t bright enough. That’s not saying a lot for McBall-less. He knew he was swift-boated and didn’t do anything. He knew junior/rummy were wrong on their loony strateg-ery in Iraq, but didn’t say anything. He knows that this administration is looting our national treasury and he does nothing. What a loser is McCain.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:36 pmMcCain’s not much of a big thinker.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:36 pmIs it Munchausen biproxy? I can’t beleive how much respect I just lost for John McCain. I wouldn’t vote for a republican, but at least I used to go “Well, McCains above all this crap.” I’m nieve.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:38 pmI like/d McCain. It’s unfortunate he’s characterizing Murtha’s reasons for a withdrawal and redeployment as a source of geriatric sentimentality when generals have Murtha’s ear.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:41 pmMcCain will get swiftboated by the right again. Just like Charlie Brown trying to kick the ball held by Lucy….
Johnny, won’t you ever learn.
-GSD
December 6th, 2005 at 12:43 pmWow, and I thought I was a leftist, LoL.
Well at least McCain is fighting lil Busch on Torture. I am glad for that. You know, the enemy of my enemy and all that?
But as for what he said about Murtha, it’s timing? It’s clear he was manipulated into releasing this statement about Murtha now. Like I said, whatever they offered him, it wasn’t enough. It’s gonna hurt him in 08 more than he knows.
But as for me, hating McCain? Nahh, there are better people for me to hate. Like LILLYLIVERED LIEBERMAN!
What the hell was he thinking??? LILLYLIVERED WHINYPANTS LIEBERMAN just did more singlehandedly, to damage our cause against this illegal occupation of Iraq, and to bolster all the arguments of the right wingers. He has done more harm than he knows.
Him, Hillary, Kerry, all of em can pack their bags. I would not vote for any of them, even if they were handing out 1000 dollar bills wrapped in Angelina Jolies panties and promising to pay my mortgage for the next 20 years.
They’re through politically, unless the want to switch parties.
GOD I HATE JOE LIEBERMAN!!!
December 6th, 2005 at 12:47 pmAll I want for Christmas is to see Impeachment Proceedings Started!
December 6th, 2005 at 12:47 pmMcCain is a rat bastard. He’s completely moderate in one instance, then a neocon the next. No spine. No convictions.
I think that fact that he doesn’t follow an idealogical line shows he DOES have convictions. One who votes 100% with their party is not thinking for themselves b/c to be honest, the party isn’t ever 100% right. McCain follows his conscience … what more could we ask of him (or do we just want him to agree with what “we” think).
December 6th, 2005 at 12:48 pmWhy?
December 6th, 2005 at 12:49 pmWHY, did you have to post that picture of McCain giving Bush some love?
WHY?
I just had lunch and now I feel ill.
Cheney just made a speech in Fort Drum, and in a moment of frankness claimed that the United States “Influence in the Middle East” is after all what the soldiers are fighting for….
December 6th, 2005 at 12:50 pmMcCain is similar to Colin Powell in that they both sacrificed any kind of integrity that they may have had in order to worship at the altar of the Bush Administration. For McCain, it meant enduring degradation and humiliation from Karl Rove & Co. in order to ensure support from the Republicans for another shot at the Presidency. The hope is that the American people are not that gullible to place their trust in McCain and will, instead, hold him in scorn and contempt for the way that he has sucked up to this administration.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:51 pmHe thinks Murtha ia a sentimental old fool? Bad move John.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:51 pmCould you, or someone make up a list of all the people they have gone after with character or personal attacks like this?
We really need to keep score and expose it. otherwise we’re like charlie brown, shocked when the football is pulled away.
McCain is a total snake but to be honest, I was surprised to see him go this low.
Bush put this out earlier with the idea that his decisions were made by ’sober’ people. In apparent contrast with Murtha’s emotion.
That’s exactly the kind of tactic they used on him. What is it with these people?
All that crap when he ran for president was BS.
For our part the progressives do nothing to fight back. Thank you for at least posting this.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:52 pmJOE LIEBERMAN is part of the reason we did so poorly in 2000. His whiney voice augmented Gore’s drollness, and the result was they put everyone to sleep, and when we woke up, the election was over.
Oh yea, they one, but they were too droll and whiney to do anything about it.
JOE LIEBERMAN is one of the most dangerous enemies to the democratic party imaginable.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:52 pmWhat is not clear is the extent to which Murtha’s connections inside the military have influenced his thinking, and that we’re not likely to know for some time if ever.
Lacking that insight, what bothers me most is that Murtha’s call plays right into the hands of the repubs who always accuse the left of being soft on defense. Yes, wars are tragically wasteful but sometimes — certainly not this time — they are necessary. So long as the right can convice a slight majority that the left lacks the fortitude to stick with a fight, they win.
In politics and in war, don’t give the enemy any more ammunition than they already have.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:56 pmCan’t McCain it what’s coming in 2008?
December 6th, 2005 at 12:58 pmHe has crossed Rove/Bush they will NEVER
support him.
I can just see Rove planning the “too old”
whisper campaign against McCain even
as McCain spins that line.
I’m sorry, but McCain suffers from:
never learned “fool me once…..”
The Charlie Brown comparison is apt.
Geo,
I’m not interested in what you think he is saying. I am interested in what he is saying. He is saying that Murtha thinks too much about the dead, those that died for nothing. Those that were murdered for a bullshit pack of lies, for Israel, for oil and for military-industrial war profiteering.
I’m not getting into your apples and oranges arguement about WWII. You assume that this Iraq mission is somehow good and justified and comparable. Besides, you sat around for years watching Hitler, financing him until Pearl Harbour when you finally decided to get up off your asses and help out your allies.
This is not the time to engage in hypothetical, philisophical debates. This is the time to discuss the facts on the ground.
The fact is, the more people that mention “dead soldiers”, the more the spectre of Vietnam comes back. Now we all know these lunatics think it was the antiwar crowd that sunk that war but the truth is, the meatgrinder that chewed up 55,ooo young American boys and girls (not to mention hundreds of thousands of young Vietnamese who are just as equal as world citizens as Americans are…)for another pack of lies (read about the Tonkin incident lately?) is what finally made Americans come to their senses and get out of that failed mission. Did red communism come sweeping out of Vietnam and destroy your way of life in the last 30 years. No. That is the stuff of paranoid delusionals and official speechwriters to scare a gullible and extremely uninformed public, back in the 60’s. Commies are now Terrorists. Today, people are much more informed. They see no cause, no noble mission, no future and Bush can speechify all he wants, it ain’t changing minds….It’s too late.
In this day and age with technology and media, the public is swinging much faster and these warmongers know it. How can you not consider every last life in this. These soldiers are the ones who are dying, while you man the 50mm keyboard.
Please don’t give me any crap about “protecting freedom” I’m Canadian and I don’t buy that Madison Avenue bullshit.
P.S. McCain is not giving his opinion. He is toeing the GOP line because he wants to be Prez. Nothing more, nothing less. Just another unprincipled, opportunistic politician.
December 6th, 2005 at 12:59 pmMcCain, You have become ONE BIG DISAPPOINTMENT!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:00 pmDear Mr. Mcain,
I am an Ignorant man, often these words are used around me and for the life of me they are not comprehendable.
Perhaps a moment of your time sir?
When you say ‘Think’, what do you mean?
Perhaps you mean thought? Alas this word also confuses me Mr. Mcain?
You are saying, that Mr. Murtha is not capable of thought?
Pas tense perhaps, Sought?
So Mr. Mcain, Are YOU now saying that Mr. Murtha is Incapabale of Sought?
Does it MR. Mcain take a BIG Problem to have Big Thoughts?
or does a Small problem generate BIG THINKING?
Mr. Mcain, Did Mr. Murtha Reach into his Soul with Thought?
What was He Seeking Mr. Mcain?
Do We Seek THOUGHT or Do we Seek Truth?
DO small truths Create Big thoughts?
Do Big Truths create small thoughts?
As you can See I am very Confused Mr. Mcain?
Obviusly you KNOW much more than I.
I think Murtha was Seeking to reconcile with his Soul, But Hey , Im just a Small ‘thinker’ and being part of the ‘Herd’ who cares what I think? -Aj
December 6th, 2005 at 1:01 pmMcCain has lost all credibility. After everything BushCo has put him and his family through, I can’t believe he would even be in the same room with Bush, let alone hugging him like that. It makes me gag.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:01 pmThe “Uncle McCain” schtick aint gonna work. Everyone knows McCain has no dignity and and even weaker grip on reality. What a tortured mind.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:01 pmHere’s a heads-up in irony.
When a democrat or liberal will critize McCain in the future, you can sure bet that a Hannity or Limbaugh etc will scream these liberals or dems are attacking and smearing a war hero.
Yep, I am calling it now.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:01 pmI am from Johnstown and my family has known John Murtha for years. I think McCain is talking a lot of crap - if Mr Bush is indeed so “correct” on Iraq why wont he ever appear before a real audience and answer questions about where this war is going? Thank you “Jack” Murtha for making Johnstown proud!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:01 pmJack Murtha’s a big boy, he can handle that tiny little slap from McCain. I’m looking forward to hearing what Murtha has to say.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:03 pmThe real tragedy here is that with all the debate that men like John McCain are stirring up about Murtha, we are sucked right back into the old republican snare.
That is, we are debating the MAN, and not, the PLAN.
Jack Murtha’s plan is actually brilliant in it’s simplicity, and is in fact, the ONLY solution we will ever have in Iraq.
Republicans took the plan, took out all of the pertinent factors, like 6 Month draw downs, redeployments, rapid response strike forces, etc, and then worded it as a complete withdrawal, which of course would be a cut and run. Then they threw it out on the floor for a vote.
If the DEM’s voted for it, the repubs could say, see, they want to cut and run.
If the DEMS did not vote for it, which of course they couldn’t, then the repubs can do exactly what their slimely soulless selves are doing right now. Saying see, even the DEMS don’t support pulling out!
The truth is of course, they did not have the gnads to vote on the Murtha Plan, which is the ONLY plan at this point that can work.
The Murtha Plan calls for;
1.To immediately ‘redeploy’ U.S. troops consistent with the safety of U.S. forces.
2. To create a quick reaction force in the region.
3. To create an over- the- horizon presence of Marines.
4. To diplomatically pursue security and stability in Iraq
If the repubs had one shred of decency, or honesty, they would at least have put it on the floor for a vote. And if the DEM’s had one shred of gonads, then simps like LOUSY LIEBERMAN and Hillary and Kerry, and Pelosi, would have supported his plan the moment it was released.
At this point, if I were Howard Dean, I would announce TODAY! He is the only one of them who knew the emperor was naked from day 1, and said it.
HOWARD DEAN, WE NEED YOU NOW!!!
DEAN FOR PRESIDENT!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:09 pmRight. That settles it. John McCain has used up all his political capital with me. Any good feelings I had for him either as a vet or a caring politician (and yes I do believe they exist: MURTHA) are gone. He so desperately wants the GOP Prez Nom in 2008 that he is willing to carry this rancid bucket of water for Bush & Co. He has proven himself to be a moral loser.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:09 pmI think you are right on, Ryan Neat!
“a strategy of psychological innocence” - ie. an escape and denial mechanism for those who know they are doing the WRONG thing, but need to belong to the club, any club.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:10 pmMcCain is doing to Murtha what Bush did to McCain during the 2000 primaries. Revolting.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:10 pmWe are all seeing the results of the Big (brother) Thinker, maybe a look at the small things, that actual cost America is facing in not only lives, but global reputation/standing, money, and domestic confidence will help curpb this downward spiral
…we have tried PNACs Global Domination Plan for the past 4+ years, and every month more atrocities that sprang from this plan are being brought to light
…this is not the direction the US needs in ‘08
…we are no longer a super-power…we have no standing on nearly any international issue…you don’t become a super-power by going it alone, and I for one would like this country to get back to being a super-power, a country for the world to look up to, not hide from!!!
If you ask me, the terrorists have won, by us sinking down to their level! Where was the talk of torture & secret prisons prior to 9/11? They (if it was them) attacked us because we represented the freedom they condemed (according to Bush). Now we are as controling as they feel a govetrnment should be. Whether it is the administrations treatment of the media, environmental issues, due process, or nation building, we are spreading our message by any means neccessary.
You are either with us or against us is the same philosiphy the terrorists and abductors feel. America has lost, and we need to get the respect back by holding those who sold us out and misrepresented the Nation’s priciples/ideals accountable! If not, start learning Chinese.
Sorry to rant, it just buids up and spews out all at once!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:11 pmI’m calling it here: Bush will sink McCain in ‘08!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:11 pmAs an American who has lived overseas for most of the past 20 years, often ruing American politics, the results of our elections, and the seeming ignorance or apathy of my compatriots, I want to express my admiration of those who have posted the comments above in support of Murtha and in peace over war. You people are real patriots of our country.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:12 pmChris in AZ
Don’t forget about the American Taliban. How different are your respective countries?
December 6th, 2005 at 1:12 pmBig thinker??? I guess loss of lives is a SMALL problem for McCain now?
I guess that would be his arguement for running and kissing the tails of Bush and Rove to get into the Whitehouse?
So does this mean you were thinking BIG when you slandered your nation when you were a POW? Was that a portion of the BIG thinking?
Does that mean you were thinking small when the trounced you and your reputation when Bush was running for President?
Sounds to me, like what was a decent and straight-forward republican has now become a coward and deceitful rhetorical pawn from the Rove playbook.
CONGRATS SENATOR! YOU have finally made it back to their good graces and they may even let you sit at the table with them again!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:13 pmActually Chris in AZ, you are right on the money, and I couldn’t have said it better myself.
Amen brother, amen.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:14 pmMurtha is a moron. Thank you for that white flag - it will be helpful in destroying Dems next election. Of course, don’t forget that he is going to be investigated by the House Ethics committee because of pay for play with his brother. Awful convenient for liar Murtha to shore up the radical base right before he goes to the slammer - dontcha thinK?
December 6th, 2005 at 1:14 pmChris in AZ - how dare you compare America to terrorists. You PIG.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:15 pmMcCain new exactly what he was doing! NO politician goes into an interview or on National TV without a clue about what questions they will be asked. And, NO politician avoids an opportunity to use the media to launch a political dialog on an issue they’re handlers want them to address. This was not an innocent mis-speak. He was directed to do this. He is finally exposed as a manipulator, just like his GOP/GWB kissy-face buddies. I can’t wait to hear Senator Murtha’s reaction!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:15 pmAgreed Chris in AZ
Big Bro
and the Big Media
have colluded for 40 years.
for their ‘PLAN’
“That’s right. Outside the Law Courts. It was bombed in - oh many years ago. It was a church at one time. St Clement Danes, its name was. “Oranges and lemons, say the bells of St Clement’s!”
“What’s that?” said Winston.
“Oh, that was a rhyme we had when I was a little boy. How it goes on I don’t remember, but I do know it ended up, ‘Here comes a candle to light you to bed , Here comes a chopper to chop off your head.’ It was a kind of a dance. They held out their arms for you to pass under, and when they came to ‘Here comes a chopper to chop off you head’ they brought their arms down and caught you. It was just names of churches. All the London churchers were in it - all the principal ones, that is.”
Winston wondered vaguely to what century the church belonged. It was always difficult to determine the age of a London building.
“I never knew it had been a church,” he said.
“There’s a lot of them left, really,” said the old man, “though they’ve been put to other uses. Now, how did that rhyme go? Ah! I’ve got it! ‘Oranges and lemons, say the bells of St Clement’s, You owe me three farthings, say the bells of St Martin’s–’ There, now, that’s as far as I can get. A farthing, that was a small copper coin, looked something like a cent.”
“Where was St Martin’s?” said Winston.
“St Martin’s? That’s still standing. It’s in VICTORY SQUARE, alongside the picture gallery. A building with a kind of a triangular porch and pillars in front, and a big flight of steps.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Conserve
December 6th, 2005 at 1:20 pmCon=with
Serv =serve Serf=slave
T=To Rule /across the/ King/
ive = Eve, Gaia, Ge,Live, life
~~
Basically I get Neo-con
as this
‘With the New Slaves of Earth’ (loosely int.)
~~~
Say isnt BUSHIES plan NAMED VICTORY? -Aj
what Murtha’s response should be….
December 6th, 2005 at 1:21 pmA picture is worth a thousand words. Also, if Hillary, Kerry, Lieberman or any other Democratic wannabee’s of their ilk think they’re going to get my vote in 2008 they’ve got another think coming! It is time for Democrats to get a spine and stand for something. As they spinelessly equivocate on this illegal war my two nephews(brothers) are on there way back to Iraq (one today and the other on this coming Sunday) for their fourth deployment to the war zone! The older of these two brothers was eligible to retire this month except for Bush’s bad-faith stop-loss program. Congressman Murtha is right-on and he deserves our support; bring the troops home now!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:22 pmThe House Ethics Committee - what an oxymoron, just like the person who mentioned it.
P.S. Americans are terrorists. Get over it.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:23 pmDanny K.
Jack Murtha served his country for almost 4 decades in the US Marine Corps. He was decorated for heroism in combat, and bloodied thrice for his nation.
Do you honestly think your words impact him one little bit?
You just did what the repubs did on the floor. You IGNORED the FACTS of his plan, and just called it a “white flag”.
See your attempts to dismiss the Murtha plan just does not cut it. Redeployment means redeployment. Not cut and run.
You change the words, to change the meaning. In fact, you can’t even admit that your little repubs took the Murtha plan, took out ALL of the pertinent qualifiers, like REDEPLOY in the region, just outside of Iraq proper, and a Quick Response force to offer the Iraqi army support from Air and rapid response Ground troops and then just threw it out on the floor for a vote.
Answer that one genius. Why are you afraid of voting on Jack Murtha’s ACTUAL plan???
When you can answer that question, you will start to see how ugly the corruption is, that has so badly rusted your parties moral compass.
Murtha’s plan, which you ran from would mean no more boots on the ground inside of Iraq, and therefore taking the fire out of the insurgency, and letting the Iraqi people have what we promised them when we went in, sovereignty. Something they do NOT have now.
In fact, this idea was not at all foreign to your own Reichmarschall of war;
_______________________________
Secretary of Defense
Richard Cheney, April 29th, 1991
_________________________________
The Iraqi army is not standing up for one reason, cause they don’t have too. When I was a boy, my father threw me into the snappin turtle pond on our farm in upstate New York. Now I was only 3 ½ years old, and I had not yet learned to swim. But you can bet your arse on that day, I swam like Mark Spitz. And I have had no problem in the water since.
Sometimes the best way to get your kids to become self sufficient, is to shut the door and lock it.
We have been training the Iraqi army for over 2 years!
And there are a LOT of them now. Just listen to the commanders on the ground.
________________________________
Gen. George Casey, Commander of U.S. Forces in Iraq
March 8, 2005
_________________________________
Now that was back in March. According to a recent statement by the President, there are now, 215,000 trained, equipped troops!
That’s more than we have over there! But your glorious leader, and those of you who push his propaganda, tell us that they still need “more†training!
What are you guys training them to do?
Become the Power Rangers?
Hell by now these guys should be able to Fly F-22’s blindfolded while disassembling their AK 47’s!
When my Uncle Bill went off to fight the Germans in Bastogne in WW2, he said that many of the troops were fresh, green recruits, who had little more than “basic†training. My Uncle Jacob, who fought in the Philippines in the same war, said similar things.
We trained them in 8 weeks, and sent many off to save the world. But these Iraqi soldiers, who GREW UP with AK47’s under their pillows, these guys still aren’t trained after 2 years and 2 and half BILLION dollars?
As you good-ole-boys are so fond of saying, “that dog won’t huntâ€.
Redeploying to the outskirts, putting the responsibility squarely on the shoulders of the Iraqi people, well, as they say, “necessity is the mother of invention†, so too will the Iraqis take care of themselves.
Trust me, after a century of war, they know what to do with the guns.
Time will show that the Murtha plan is really the ONLY plan at this point, and we will end up doing it eventually.
And when we do, we know that you will be right here, to tell us all how it was YOUR plan all along.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:25 pmPost 31:
“JOE LIEBERMAN is part of the reason we did so poorly in 2000. His whiney voice augmented Gore’s drollness, and the result was they put everyone to sleep, and when we woke up, the election was over.
Oh yea, they one, but they were too droll and whiney to do anything about it.
droll
(adjective)
comical in an odd or whimsical manner;
Sorry to be a Vocabulary Nazi, but are you sure you would describe Gore / Lieberman as particularly “droll”? I don’t know about you but I didn’t find the 2000 presidential debates in any way “comical” or “whimsical”…
December 6th, 2005 at 1:25 pmWell danny…
If the SHOE fits…
BUSH stole 2 elections!
Isolated the country from everyone!
LIED to the WHOLE world!
Place INCOMPETENT people in high-level positions!
Abandoned his people!
Broke International laws in several countries!
Sold the United States to China!
Supported torture and human rights abuses!
and…
Killed over 20,000 people in a senseless war…
I agree with Chris! We are not s super power…WE are SUPER IDIOTS for allowing this fool to get away with it!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:26 pmIf I’m not mistaken, it was these same big thinkers (Fife, Hadley, Rice, Cheney, Wolfie, Rummy) that got us into this mess and then made it worse through an endless sequence of policy and planning failures.
As for McCain, the esteemed US Senator who referred to the Vietnamese people as “gooks” while visiting the country, he’s not fit to represent the American people. The same justifiable anger that explains that comment should disqualify him from the presidency. He doesn’t think before he speaks, unless it’s to further his political ambitions.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:27 pm“Forty years it had taken him to learn…but it was all right…the struggle was finished…He loved Big Brother”.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:29 pm…the glass paperweight, and the steel engraving in its rosewood frame. Almost at random he said:
‘Did you ever happen to hear an old rhyme that begins “Oranges and lemons, say the bells of St Clement’s�’
Again O’Brien nodded. With a sort of grave courtesy he completed the stanza:
‘Oranges and lemons, say the bells of St Clement’s,
You owe me three farthings, say the bells of St Martin’s,
When will you pay me? say the bells of Old Bailey,
When I grow rich, say the bells of Shoreditch.’
the Paperweight?…Wonder what that represents..
December 6th, 2005 at 1:30 pm#52, as you were in outlining the Republican plan to Cut & Run…that has to be thrown in their face before they can even finish the word Cowar…
#54, hey, i am completely against secret prisons being held unaccountable
I am completely against manipulating the media to have a one sided view
I feel discourse is the only way true progress can be achieved
I do not agree with fake wars and am in strong favor for DUE PROCESS FOR ANTONE
since the administration disagrees with all of these they are acting like terrorists
December 6th, 2005 at 1:31 pm…if something looks like shit, smells like shit, and feels like shit, guess what is it danny (i know I shouldn’t curse around a kid, but if you want to come on here with the adults)
I would like to know what Psyche Meds McCain is on.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:31 pmJOBABY, Maybe your right. Droll may have been a poor choice of words. How about “Anesthetizing “?
December 6th, 2005 at 1:33 pmLOL ATV, some X T SEA? Maybe?
Im gonna Say paperweight Guessing… Oracle? Or small Universe..Freedom?
December 6th, 2005 at 1:34 pmAl Swearengen, in post # 63 you hit the nail on the head. You said ### If I’m not mistaken, it was these same big thinkers (Fife, Hadley, Rice, Cheney, Wolfie, Rummy) that got us into this mess and then made it worse through an endless sequence of policy and planning failures ###
You know, your thought reminds me of an old saying. Now how does that go? Oh yea,
“Fool me once, shame on ,,er,,you,
Fool me twice,,,,er,,,,uh,,,,er,,
Can’t GIT fooled agin”
George “dubya” Busch
December 6th, 2005 at 1:36 pmHey Big Bro, If yer Watchn this FECK YEW!!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:36 pmSigned the -’Proles’
if you’re a big, big thinker, you get the ‘big picture,’ i.e. you’re for the ‘war.’ If you are for peace and not war, you’re numbskulled miniscule thinker.
John McCane should re-evaluate his thinking priorities.
If you are something other than a neocon, you’re a wishy-washy, emotional nitwit. If you’re a neocon, you’re a wise muscle head.
The ‘wise’ are neocons. The ‘gentlemen’ are those who lead us by the lies from the wise. The great unwashed are the ‘vulgar’ who need to be lied to all of the time by those big thinkers.
It’s getting worse. I think of Paul Wellstone and what happened to him.
Those ‘big thinkers’ are nothing more than evil making things look good when it has all gone to hell in a handbasket.
uff da
December 6th, 2005 at 1:37 pmI (a democrat) once had a high regard for McCain, but his lack of integrity and his overall groveling to that Bush War Machine during the past 4 years has completely turned me off. Too many compromises for my taste.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:41 pmRON, your post number 72? Oh God don’t get me started.
If this country had some real gnads, we would be asking what happened to Paul Wellstone.
I mean, imagine what a fortuitous event it was for our glorious leader, that his MOST outspoken critic of the war, and who just happened to be running for a seat that, if lost, would give the president an unprecedented control of both the House and the Senate, how fortuitous it was for him that his plane just happened to go down weeks before the debate between him and Norm Coleman, the presidents hand picked schmuck.
Of course the NTSB investigated the crash, and found nothing wrong. Too bad the NTSB answers to the EXECUTIVE branch.
Oh well, guess well never know what really happened.
Maybe Mel Carnahan knows.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:42 pmSeems like whenever anyone starts presenting a political threat to this president, and this war, something “bad” happens to them.
Just ask Scott Ritter.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:45 pmCONGRESS
The national legislative body of the United States, consisting of the House of Representatives and the Senate.
ACRONYM
A word formed from the initials or other parts of several words, for example, “NATO,†from the initial letters of “North Atlantic Treaty Organizationâ€
C.O.N.G.R.E.S.S.
Centrally Organized National Group Representing Exclusive Secret Societies
December 6th, 2005 at 1:48 pmCaption contest: “Freedom’s on the march! Now watch this wedgie”
December 6th, 2005 at 1:48 pmCaption:
See mom, we get along, can I borrow the car now!
December 6th, 2005 at 1:50 pmWORFEUS
Let’s not forget the most fortunate event - 9/11 itself. How fortunate for a loser prez with ratings in the toilet, in a grade school classroom reading his first challenging book, to be able to rise to the mantle of Commander-In-Chief.
That look on his face that day in the classroom wasn’t, “OMG what’s happening?”, it was “OMG, IT’S HAPPENING!”
How he held back that tell of tells, the smirk, is beyond me. Rove musta had him on tranqs.
It will all come out.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:51 pmSo let me get this straight….John McCain thinks a leader needs to be much more cold-blooded when sending out troops to die in defense of cheap oil? Are we sure that at age 69 he is just not being too emotional about this whole torture thing? Whose to say that the Viet Cong did not have a good statist reason when they tortured him all those years ago?
December 6th, 2005 at 1:54 pmMcCain has made a deal with the devil so that he can be the Republican nominee for President in 2008. Since the mainstream media is owned by the Republicans, they have been instrumental in spinning a positive image to a phoney who deserves contempt not praise. It’s obvious that he stands for nothing except his own political aspirations.
December 6th, 2005 at 1:54 pmCaption contest: “Err Vietman! I told you I’d rip your eyes out and puke into your dead skull if I ever saw you near WWE again…you can’t beat the Chimp, aaagggahha!”
December 6th, 2005 at 1:56 pmwhiskeypete ;
Like I said, don’t get me started :)
December 6th, 2005 at 2:10 pmThere was a time when I would have considered voting for McCain, and Im a democrat. More and more he’s proving to be just another opportunistic politician. Someone is yanking his chain for him to be making comments like that about Murtha. The fact that he’s letting them is reason enough to not vote for him. That plus the fact that he let the Bushies get away with smearing him in 2000. We need a leader…not a butt licker.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:12 pmWe need a leader…not a butt licker.
Comment by Adagio43
I really don’t trust you to judge between the two. Last time you voted for Cabanna Boy. You and I both know the butt he had to lick to get that job.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:20 pmSo I looked up what I could find on the US intelligence budget:
http://www.usatoday.com/ news/ washington/ 2005-11-08-pentagon-spending_x.htm?csp=34
Now when you consider this sum is being dispensed to John ‘Contras, never heard of them’ Negroponte, and is larger than the all but the top 56 world economies (Libya for example has less GDP than Negroponte’s budget). That’s a lot of Lear Jet flights… what else are they doing, do you know do you care?
December 6th, 2005 at 2:24 pmSorry wrong thread
December 6th, 2005 at 2:24 pmMcCain cannot be trusted. We must not be fooled by his “maverick” image- that’s created by the friendly media FOR him.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:26 pmHe’s one of THEM, and this just PROVES it. Make no mistake, McCain is the same as we’ve got now.
I lost all respect for McCain when he started campaigning for Bush in 2003, after having his personal life smeared by the very man he was now defending. Talk about not being a big thinker! That must have required a labotomy to forget. Perhaps McCain has had a stroke or something.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:26 pmMilq…you took the words right out of my mouth. I don’t understand what could be so compelling that McCain would still sidle up to the Bush circus.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:33 pmMcCain is a slimy, though sometimes witty, opportunist!
December 6th, 2005 at 2:33 pmMcCain really wants out of politics. Either that or he’s a bigger moron than I thought.
Have you seen how his neck hangs these days? He was on the Daily Show and his cockles were flailing about. It was gross.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:33 pm#88 right on CJ, Colin Powell has carefully cultivated the same, “I’m not really with them” image for many years. Still, you can read about the other Colin Powell here: http://www.usvetdsp.com/story13.htm My Lai and Iran-contra among other accolades
December 6th, 2005 at 2:35 pmthese republican idiots have proven they are capable of anything including mass murder…history will prove hitler to be a small thinker compared to bush…
December 6th, 2005 at 2:38 pmSince the mainstream media is owned by the Republicans,….
Comment by Art Ruth
Boy, there’s a meme that just won’t go away. I guess you believe that. How do you reconcile that little “fact” with the MSM giving Bush such a hard time and parroting everything the Democrats say? How much press and airtime did Cindy Sheahan get? Three times a day for how many weeks? That doesn’t sound too Republican to me. One more thing, how about the Left Wing Jews that own and operate the LA Times and the NY Times? Are they “special” friends of George Bush? I guess you think Ted Turner voted for Jeb and George?
I just want you to know that your comment is of course wrong and when people, even liberals hear something like that they know you’re about ten years old. Nobody but goofy little kids and retards can look at the product being produced by the MSM and think Republicans control it. Oh, one more thing, MSM is not the acronym for Fox News….just in case you were confused about that.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:38 pmCaption contest:
“Okay, now take my hand up here.”
“And then…1 2 3, 1 2 3, 1 2 3.”
“And now dip.”
“Eww, you’re not really supposed to kiss me!”
December 6th, 2005 at 2:39 pmI don’t know if it’s self-deception or a deep need to grovel before his vengeful Republican cohorts, but as soon as I begin to forget John McCain’s last shameful bow to the right, he does something else just as bad. If anything, the human cost of this war is too easily ignored by the right-wing chickenhawks in power and the arrogant deceivers in the mainstream media. It’s easy to be cavalier with someone else’s life, and that’s a shame.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:40 pmAs time goes on it starts to seem that people like Alex Jones aren’t that far off the mark with respect to the realities of the alledged 2 party system. I also read that Lieberman is on the docket as a replacement for Rumsfeld.. Oh my God, what has this country come to? With each passing day it becomes more of a farce which defies comprehension by people of the reality based community. Even Obama in his adress to the CFR was paying lip service to the Bush agenda in a subtle way. This country has a black hole when it comes to leadership. Just when you think it can’t get any worse… it does.. and that is much worse, not just worse.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:42 pmthese republican idiots have proven they are capable of anything including mass murder…history will prove hitler to be a small thinker compared to bush…
Comment by chuck
History will record that there were a small group of Left Wing anti-American zealots leading a small group of pimply faced Game-boy losers and the Democratic party self destructed under the sheer weight of their combined ignorance, hate and treason then thhe American people hung the lot of them. You read it here first.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:43 pm“How do you reconcile that little “fact†with the MSM giving Bush such a hard time and parroting everything the Democrats say?”
Because the dumbass keep sticking his foot in his mouth and looking dumb.
He is the only president I know of that likes to play dress up.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:47 pmMore anti-semitism from the resident Nazi. Wonder what his argument is besides “it’s the jews fault”
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=2447
December 6th, 2005 at 2:47 pmDemocrats better start pointing out the obvious, that McCain is not the principled, independent Republican the media so adores.
It is nice to hear a few libs, like Ed Schultz, finally calling him on it.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:48 pmThis country has a black hole when it comes to leadership. Just when you think it can’t get any worse… it does.. and that is much worse, not just worse.
Comment by Stolentime
You know there’s another explanation to all this. Maybe you’re just out of step with mainstream liberalism? You are aware the most of you on this site are considered fringe loon radicals by 99.9% of the people that voted for Kerry? Could it be the drugs and rap music? Yep, I bet that’s what it is.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:55 pmDon’t forget Cowboy Bush.
And “I’m a soldier” Bush.
December 6th, 2005 at 2:55 pm“You know there’s another explanation to all this. Maybe you’re just out of step with mainstream liberalism? You are aware the most of you on this site are considered fringe loon radicals by 99.9% of the people that voted for Kerry? Could it be the drugs and rap music? Yep, I bet that’s what it is.”
Still trollin’ right along eh?
December 6th, 2005 at 2:57 pmMcCain had the opportunity to show himself as a leader in 2000 when the infamous Rove whisper campaign literally ended his Presidential run! As Jean Schmitt said…only cowards cut and run…she should have directed her comments at Mr. McCain! Instead of bagging on Murtha you would think he’d want to set himself apart as a leader… Personally…McCain is gutless!
December 6th, 2005 at 2:58 pm#101
Terry,
How will they respond to:
“The findings include:
On select issues from corporate power and trade to Social Security and Medicare to health care and taxes, journalists are actually more conservative than the general public.
Journalists are mostly centrist in their political orientation.
The minority of journalists who do not identify with the “center” are more likely to identify with the “right” when it comes to economic issues and to identify with the “left” when it comes to social issues.
Journalists report that “business-oriented news outlets” and “major daily newspapers” provide the highest quality coverage of economic policy issues, while “broadcast network TV news” and “cable news services” provide the worst.”
December 6th, 2005 at 3:05 pmHistory will record that there were a small group of Right Wing anti-American zealots leading a small group of pimply faced Game-boy losers and the Republican party self destructed under the sheer weight of their combined ignorance, hate and treason then thhe American people hung the lot of them. You read it here first.
December 6th, 2005 at 3:16 pmSieg Heil,,Heil, the gangs all here…….
Yea, I wonder what makes them thing there won’t be a Nuremburg 2?
December 6th, 2005 at 3:18 pmEverything you need to know about McCain
Keating 5
December 6th, 2005 at 3:19 pmYOU owe Me three Farthings!
I RIGHT I former Masonic Lodge Member
Finished the poem.
Guilt Trip from all those Drugs he takes I guess.
what was that movie out? the Treasury?
Superman?
Remember where they took the % of every Dollar?
~~
dYeh Well ,the RAT is out of the BAG.
I will explain. Heres $10.00
ivide that in Half..and so on and so on this is called MARXIST KAPITALISM. AKA the KRISTOL CEILING.
~~~
10 divide /2= …….
5
2.5
1.25
.625
.3125
.15625
.078125
.0390625
.01953125
.009765625
.0048828125
.00244140625
.001220703125
.0006103515625
.00030517578125
So who gets the leftovers the Crumbs? the%?
Whom gave Control Over The Federal Cash Flow to a BANK? Bush Sr. in 1991 or so, to What Bank?
RIGGS bank.
Of course Jonathan Bush and Marvin as Well as Osama, And Saudi Ambassadors, and their wives, have banked there including Pinochet!…PLUS they have been fined by the OCC for 25 million for Banking Law Violations.
No Wonder Duhyba says “The Government has plenty of Money”
Of Course Yukos OIL also handed over its OIL stocks$$ to ROTHSCHILD thru RIGGS by a previously arranged agreement.
No Crap.
This also explains much of the SKull and Bones and the Masons Shannanigans that I RIGHT I belonged too.
Thank you I RIGHT I for the Tip.
December 6th, 2005 at 3:19 pmMcCain ?
Washed-up pro wrestler without his mask working for a fast food corp. or the guy that fought and killed his brother over who to got to knock bones with their mama in the book of Intelligent Design?
I’m CONfused.
December 6th, 2005 at 3:40 pm[…] have a reputation for political integrity without having actually sacrificed anything to earn it. Permalink| […]
December 6th, 2005 at 3:48 pmI wrote an email to Senator McCain. I am appalled that he is trying to portray Congressman Murtha as a “lovable old fool”. Guessing it’s the kinder, gentler form of swiftboating. This has to be stopped before it becomes main stream. Remember, McCain is just about Murtha’s age. If Murtha is old and sentemental then so is McCain. Let’s tell McCain to stop trying t o swiftboat Murtha.
December 6th, 2005 at 3:53 pmLet McCain’s family member’s head get blown off by a man whom is protecting his country. And then we’ll see who is “too emotional.” Common sense would tell us –it’s all emotional. Souless freak.
December 6th, 2005 at 3:53 pmCaption:
December 6th, 2005 at 4:00 pmBush throwing in the towel at the DeLay Dance Marathon fund raiser Saturday night.
Emotion can’t be allowed to effect our policy? Where was McCain after 9/11?! If emotion hadn’t entered policy making then, we wouldn’t be in Iraq. It sure is hard to fix policy that is horrible in the first place, is it not?
December 6th, 2005 at 4:14 pmMcCain may shoot straight on the torture issue, but let us not forget that he has been involved in political scandal himself. Don’t forget his involvement with Frank Keating and Lincoln Savings and Loan, during the S and L crisis during the Reagan Administration. He is just another Republican hack.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:16 pmHey IRI, We call you Trolls and you are not the majority on this site!
hehehe
Back to the catption contest:
December 6th, 2005 at 4:22 pm“McCain, if you give me another hickey I will smack the crap outta.”
Senator McCain; you are a cowardly person who hasn’t got the convictions of a butterfly. You are a corrupt, self serving putz that is in politics because you likely couldn’t hold another job.
when your ilk are gone, maybe we can have our country back
You are as despicable as anyone else in this lying, criminal conspiracy that some people call the US Government.
the news about bushit’s new press briefing with no questions; Martial Law folks, look for it. Coming soon to a government near you
December 6th, 2005 at 4:22 pmThis also explains much of the SKull and Bones and the Masons Shannanigans that I RIGHT I belonged too.
Thank you I RIGHT I for the Tip.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I Masonic Narc
I do have a coyright 1931 “Morals and Dogma” by Albert Pike. I do know a thing or two about the so called New World Order and the CFR/Trilateral connection to the Bilderburgers and the heirs of the Ancien Régime. I’m the only person you know that’s read the “Mémoires pour servir a l’histoire du Jacobinisme” by Abbé Augustine Barruel. I can tell you my opinion, it’s all bullshit.
I know you live and breath this stuff. I’m sorry for you.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:24 pmSenator McCain; you are a cowardly person who hasn’t got the convictions of a butterfly. You are a corrupt, self serving putz that is in politics because you likely couldn’t hold another job.
when your ilk are gone, maybe we can have our country back
You are as despicable as anyone else in this lying, criminal conspiracy that some people call the US Government.
Comment by oldtree
You Lefty wankers turn on a dime don’t you? You liked him well enough when he was stabbing Bush in the back.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:26 pmMcCain’s house in Phoenix is for sale, if anyone’s buying and has a couple mil. to throw around, though it’s probably haunted by *emotional* KIAs from Iraq, their Iraqi victims, and North and South Vietnamese *Gooks*, the 58,000 GIs KIAed in Vietnam, numerous Cambodians and Laotians, as well as the Ghosts of the Bill of Rights and Constitution past…
What’s really classy is that it has a regular ol’ “For Sale” sign out in front. Perhaps that’s just a reflection of McCain himself.
Ask any Arizonan who has some semblance of a heart about McCain — UGH could not begin to describe him…And his Dad covered up the Israeli attack on the USS Liberty. McCain himself is so in hoc to Zionists he should sign off as a representative of the Israeli Knesset rather than calling himself a US Senator.
But then that goes for most of our Congress Creeps — Iran and Syria anyone? Send your kids first ’cause mine aren’t going to fight Israel’s endless wars…
OK, I just read your rules — I’m not endorsing or disparaging any candidate, just telling the truth about what this particular resident of Arizona feels about my Senator.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:28 pmMission Accomplished. In post number 118 you said
### If emotion hadn’t entered policy making then, we wouldn’t be in Iraq ###
That is a THE point. Well said.
What everyone forgets is that the whole deal, the war, the torture, the tax breaks for the wealthy, the no-bid contracts that facilitate profiteering off the war, ALL of that is due to the Bush “warm and fuzzies” that everyone felt after 911.
After he did his “brave” thing (course for the life of me I can’t figure out what is brave about talking into a bullhorn)everyone started talking about how great he was and they all rallied behind him. Like any people do with a leader when they have been attacked. Heck I even got a little choked up when he did the Bullhorn thingy, although I never thought of it as brave.
Bush took that feeling, that emotion, and squandered it like a kid with his first 5 dollar bill at a flea market.
He used those emotions to tell us why we needed to go get Saddam. I remember the thunderous applause, the teary eyed audience member camera close ups, all the hype.
And that’s how we were suckered into committing Genocide. (and if you don’t think 100,000 dead is Genocide, then you need to straighten your armband).
Now, these guys who used emotions to get us into Iraq, are using emotions to keep us from leaving. How you ask?
Simple. His argument, “we must stay to honor the sacrifice of the troops“, thats how.
Think about that argument for a moment.
What the republicans are in saying, is that the reason we must continue to allow young Americans to die every day, is so we can feel good about why the others died?
So the reason we have to continue on with an average of 28 dead young Americans a week, is so we can feel good.
I see. So the only way George “dubya” Busch can “honor the sacrifice of our troops” is to sacrifice more troops.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:33 pmBush looks like a televangelist in the picture, pulling Mc Cain into the fold. (choke choke)
If the Republicans don’t have anything negative to say they make up something.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:46 pmOh please, tell me which Democrat in the Senate is calling for immediate withdrawal from Iraq?
Ditch both parties: NEITHER of them serve the American people. The Democrats are dependent on Zionist funding — the Hill, a publication that covers, guess what??? Capitol Hill — reported that 70% of Bill Clinton’s re-election funding came from American Jews. Hillary *larned* her lesson well.
And the Republicans depend on their *Rapture* *Christian* voting base, the fundies who think that all Jews have to be returned to the land between the Euphrates and the Nile for Christ to come again (at which point Jews who don’t convert will be promptly killed by the Messiah — yeah right…).
Seriously, after my friend died in the WTC I have done SO much research when before I really was not aware of geo-politics or basically anything to do about politics, but since I have done my research as a scientist, which is what I was trained as.
We are being led about by neo-cons with strong and VERY long ties to Israel. They control both parties and will get us into endless war.
How often to you wake up in a cold sweat worrying about Iran attacking your local McDonalds?
Pump up the volume — but according to Israel, the only country in the Middle East known to have WMDs — Iran is just an amazingly long rocket flight away from nuking Kansas City. Much like Iraq was going to be giving us mushroom clouds, and not psychedelic ones, if we didn’t *dispose* of its threat IMMEDIATELY, before the UN weapons inspectors FOUND anything.
Gee whiz. Here we go again…
Fool me once — you know that ol’ Dubya saying — the one from Texas, or was it Tennessee :-) and whatever but fool me twice and then it’s the friggin’ Zionist press and Congress who get to eat sh*t after they’re tarred and feathered by TRUE AMERICANS WHO JUST WANT PEACE.
NO MORE WARS FOR ISRAEL.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:52 pmAnd don’t tell me it’s to stop Iraq from having a civil war.
Saddam kept them from doing that, that and the NO-FLY Zones. Now it’s up to them. They are a democracy. I am not saying I want to see a civil war in Iraq, but I am saying perhaps that choice is now theirs to make. It’s the choice we put in front of them.
And maybe they will, and maybe they won’t.
But one things for sure, they’re supposed to be turning into a democracy, so if they are truly free, the choice would have to be theirs.
America had a civil war, and I did not see England or France coming to stop it with force.
We made out ok, sorta.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:53 pmMcCain was nothing but a big party animal in the military until he got shot down and endured torture at the hands of the Viet Cong. He has proven himself to be less of a thinker and more of a lemming than almost any other politician in the US of A. How else do you explain his lying down and rolling over for Bush after that cretin trashed McCain and his family in public during the 2000 elections? For this idiot to call a far more decorated and deserving veteran names is beyond the pale.
December 6th, 2005 at 4:54 pmHere GovernmentforThePeople , let me help you with that quote.
It goes like this.
George “dubya” Bush
December 6th, 2005 at 4:58 pmThe Righty wankers turn on a dime don’t they? They like McCain well enough when he licking Bush’s boots, and when he’s not you stab him in the back as a RINO.
December 6th, 2005 at 5:05 pm” I’m the only person you know that’s read the “Mémoires pour servir a l’histoire du Jacobinisme†by Abbé Augustine Barruel. I can tell you my opinion, it’s all bullshit.
I know you live and breath this stuff. I’m sorry for you.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I ” AKA MizzWrong
You know your Opus PenDeiHo roots are showing :()
December 6th, 2005 at 5:07 pmIf he should run, McCain has lost the vote of any Democrat who may have once thought he was a worthy candidate. Why he would attach himself to the strings of Bush/Cheney after what he has suffered under their personal attacks is mystifying. To join them in their personal attacks of a respected congressman is demonstrating that he has debased himself for politics. That he has ever more closely asociated himself with Bush/Cheney is also a mystery,as B/C continue to spiral downward in polls.
December 6th, 2005 at 5:17 pmThis is the man who was whispered to be Kerry’s VP!
I can’t trust McCain, I see him as no better a politician than any other Republican right now.
I had the temerity to mention to McCain’s foreign policy aide at the time, a twerp named Matt Ruminkis (sp?), in the run-up to the invasion of Iraq that I knew where McCain lived — I didn’t say that to threaten McCain — I made that clear — I was a volunteer for a humanitarian aid organization and don’t even have an outstanding parking ticket.
I was just calling McCain’s office to say that people in the McCain’s neighborhood, many of whom I’d grown up with (Sesame Street chimes in here : Who are the people in your neighborhood, in your neighborhood, in your NEIGHBORHOOD), were really distressed about a war against a country, Iraq, that had nothing to do with the September 11 attacks and were hoping that McCain, being our neighbor, Senator, and all, would try to stop the egregious invasion.
Everyone in that neighborhood, and I’ve lived in it since I was a child, way before McCain moved there, knows where McCain’s house is, but since my call to McCain’s office I get flagged everytime I fly.
There is no Goddess ;-) If *Mur-Cans* fall for the McCain BS then we really do deserve what we get. BTW: Cindy McCain. McCain’s wife/heiress is very nice, though the girls are spoiled brats. One boy, Jack I believe, named after his grandfather, graduated from the Naval Academy but the oldest girl who must be now 20 or so, is NOT IN THE MILITARY. And she gets flown to LA on a private jet for haircuts.
While McCain continues to demand an increase in troop strength in Iraq, the troops being largely composed of kids who joined the military for a shot at an education or out of being force-fed the G-rated version of American history, McCain’s spawn live the high (I hope not literally) life.
They, and I think by *they*it’s the Zionists, have something on him. That would be easy to do as he did not live a monk’s life after the Hanoi Hilton, but this must be really bad. And his dad did sell out his comrades on the USS Liberty for Israel.
December 6th, 2005 at 5:17 pmGood Gawd!…..I RIGHT I is here!!!???……Heaven help us!?….just when I thought we were going to have a debate on the merits!!…..(sob…sob)
December 6th, 2005 at 5:23 pmWow, I actually have a miniscule amount of respect for McCain now.. the guy actually has balls and realizes that sometimes people must fight and yes *GASP* die in the fight to preserve the peace.. and looking at individual deaths, sad as they are, it isnt prudent to let them factor into the long term goal of what we’re trying to accomplish. Thank God our leaders didnt let it affect their policy during WWII, otherwise we’d all be speaking German right now. Though I bet you bunch of pansies would like that better than being American huh.. yes you, the same pansies that think pulling out of Iraq NOW will solve all our problems.. how I pity you and your lack of logical reasoning and inability to look to the past to learn how to deal with the future.
December 6th, 2005 at 5:31 pmCaption Contest:
“I was wrong!….he smells like Mom and Apple Pie!!
December 6th, 2005 at 5:41 pmThe trolls are showing off for you, Ryan. You know though, most truly smart people know what they are and don’t need to prove it to strangers. It just sounds forced and arrogant from IRI. I mean really, I’m the only one you know… Pahleeze we aren’t your beer swilling gay-bashing friends here, IRI.
December 6th, 2005 at 5:43 pmFrom Hardball
Chris Matthews; “so you say they take them to Syria for torture, what happens to them next?”
“Baer, They kill them. Then burn the bodies”
Bob Baer Former Covert CIA Officer
December 6th, 2005 at 5:45 pmDecember 6th, 2005
Trolls are redundant. What are we accomplishing, troll?
December 6th, 2005 at 5:45 pmIch verstehen deutsch
December 6th, 2005 at 5:46 pmHitler was trying to accomplish the same thing that the neo-cons are trying to do now and thanks Goddess he didn’t have children. And as to speaking German, there’s a big, deep, ocean between the US and Germany — many Americans have guns and even more did then.
The idea that Germany could have stormed the US, well, where’s that crack pipe when you need another hit…
We also had planes and submarines.
We defeated the British twice or are you disputing that? We didn’t go fight them in England, we trapped them here, on our own land. Obviously you think that Americans are inept cowards who can’t fight for their homes.
If the Bush, McCain and Clinton families believe in the fight, then let them have their kids or their own fat behinds lead the charge in Iraq, Iran and Syria, NOW.
Any person who believes in this war needs to deploy their kids or themselves — otherwise leave us alone. Israel’s wars are not ours