Cheney Casts Deciding Vote to Pass Budget That Hammers the Poor
By on Dec 21st, 2005 at 11:14 am
Cheney Casts Deciding Vote to Pass Budget That Hammers the Poor
Four days before Christmas, the U.S. Senate votes 51-50 in favor of a brutal budget package that cuts funding for health care, student loans, child support enforcement, foster care funding, and other programs by $40 billion over the next five years. Details here.
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Conservatives do not care about people, especially the poor. Halliburton and the oil companies have record profits thanks to this administration. The rich get richer and, as Cheney would say, the poor can go f**k themselves.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:19 amlook at the scowl on that guy! he’s Scrooge if ever there was one!
December 21st, 2005 at 11:19 amactually, come to think of it, he looks more like Mr. Potter from It’s A Wonderful Life…
December 21st, 2005 at 11:20 amAnd the definition of a Christian nation is?………
December 21st, 2005 at 11:21 amWhat a huge, huge boil on the ass of this already enornmously festering goverment. I REALLY hope people wake up and start realizing what’s going on.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:22 amGood job DICK! The poor should just die to help eliminate the surplus population, right? Scrooge said the same thing and was visited by three spirits to melt his heart of ice, but I doubt that could happen to the likes of you. Mainly because you DON’T HAVE A HEART!
IMPEACH! IMPEACH! IMPEACH!
December 21st, 2005 at 11:24 amThank you for your efforts Al Gore and John Kerry.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:24 am“Conservative Christian” must mean ignore the poor and stop gay marriage and abortions. Of course, the bible mentions helping the poor in HUNDREDS of places and abortion arguably in one or two places and gay marriage arguably once.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:25 amWhy should the government help the poor anyway? That might be something christ would do.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:26 amThat picture just shows how evil Cheney is. I wouldn’t be surprised if he sported a woody when he voted.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:29 amDarth Cheney struck a blow for the empire.
Upon hearing that, President Dumbya got all twitchy and nervous and was heard to ask an aide “Where’s the blow?”
December 21st, 2005 at 11:31 amYou’re too quick Theresa, just look at how the corner of his mouth is curled up. Pure evil — and wood.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:32 amHe looks like Burns in that picture.
Smithers!
December 21st, 2005 at 11:32 amWhat a good Christian he is… Mighty Afro, wwwingnut, Tank, IRI, you must really be proud!
Exactly why we need to stop electing fat, lazy, greedy rich, stupid white men to run the country. When has he ever missed a meal?
December 21st, 2005 at 11:32 amYOU DO NOT HAVE THE VOTES TO STOP IT!
AND you forgot one thing – this bill also cuts the DEFICIT.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:33 amBiggest Dick since Nixon! A Cold hearted bastard.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:34 am“You don’t have the votes to stop it.”
December 21st, 2005 at 11:34 am-Sen. Barbara Boxer, mocking Republicans in 2003 after Democrats sucessfully filibustered 10 of Bush’s court picks
“This bill also cuts the deficit,” huh. Pretty sure the excessive tax cuts will make sure that doesn’t happen. They have an amazing record of doing so already.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:36 amSad. :(
I’ll inform my HS students of this right when they come back from lunch in a half hour.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:36 amGO ANDREW!!! YAY!!! That just made my day right there — knowing that an influential person such as a high school teacher is going to be telling kids about how much DRECK this is. Wake ‘em up, Andrew!!!
December 21st, 2005 at 11:37 am#15=NeD
December 21st, 2005 at 11:38 amCompassionate conservatism at its
December 21st, 2005 at 11:38 ambestworst.#15 – No, we do not have the votes to stop the evil, the corruption and the breaking the backs of the poor. But, one day good will overcome evil and we will have a government for the people once again. Angry people like you always get back everything they give. Kharma wins everytime.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:41 amThis one cuts a deficit created by Dick and his bumbling sidekick in the first place.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:41 amNot quite, think you are wrong about it cutting the defecit. Heard on C-span this morning it will increase the defecit from 7 trillion to 11 trillion by the time it is done…..This is not a good thing. Please get real here. All the rules are being broken by this bunch of liers and thieves.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:41 am#15 You mean the deficit that was created by the bush administration? Good job!
December 21st, 2005 at 11:44 am11 trillion deficit? That’s as large as the entire GDP!
December 21st, 2005 at 11:46 amMerry Christmas, Mr. Scrooge.
These men are evil. Cheney and Bush must be removed from office. Now!
December 21st, 2005 at 11:47 am#21=treasonous liar
December 21st, 2005 at 11:48 amCheney looks so happy with himself. By looking at him, you’d have to think this was one of the best days of his wretched life.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:48 amUm, excuse me…has anybody seen my country?
December 21st, 2005 at 11:49 amHey Dick, haven’t you heard? You can’t take it with you.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:54 am“Congress should know that if the [budget-cutting] conference agreement becomes law, the AARP and its more than 36 million members will work tirelessly to hold those accountable for passing such irresponsible policy,” announced David Sloan, AARP’s managing director of government relations and advocacy.
They won’t be the only ones. When you piss off the senior citizens, you’re in serious trouble.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:55 amHappy Holidays, Povs! Love, Dick.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:56 amHey, these republicans just want people to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps. You know, like Smirky McCokespoon did.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:57 amMerry Christas from Darth Chenney, VP of Toture and Spying.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:57 am“21=treasonous liar”
Comment by Not Quite — December 21, 2005 @ 11:48 am
I’d watch how I throw around epithets like “treasonous liar” – especially since you support folks who actually ARE treasonous. It just makes you look willfully ignorant; but then that’s nothing new, eh?
December 21st, 2005 at 11:58 am#31, yeah, saw it for sale on e-bay. Seems the highest bidder is China. Maybe we should pass the hat and try to buy it before someone else does?
December 21st, 2005 at 11:58 amThis photo reminds me of a recent Bob Harris poll, particularly when coupled with the comment I heard last night “doesn’t Dick Cheney look Pasty?”
How the hell does Dick Cheney Sleep?
Answer: In a coffin, wearing a cape.
There were other options, but Cheney as Vampire seems way too likely.
Z.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:58 amNot only will it be and is the biggest defecit ever, Japan is # 1 in holding out IOU’s and China is #2. This from what use to be the strongest country in the world. We are now not a banana republic, but a mere pealing. All other countries are wondering what the hell happened to the USA. Our biggest enemy, this entire administration…..Impeach all
December 21st, 2005 at 11:58 amAnd HAPPY HOLIDAYS to you, too, Dickie. Fool!
December 21st, 2005 at 12:01 pmI AM SO DISGUSTED!!! THIS GOVERNMENT IS FULL OF CRIMINALS, TOP TO BOTTOM! They are so damn greedy. Karma will BITE them in the ass!
December 21st, 2005 at 12:01 pmIs everyone sad because Democrats got steam rolled again? Don’t worry – after ANWR is passed you cry with the caribou.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:03 pmNot Quite… your partisan, anti-life attitude doesn’t help things. There’s still time to think things over before what you say actually comes true. Why would you WANT the caribou to die? Why? Tell me, please!
December 21st, 2005 at 12:06 pm#40–the right wingers apparently think that’s a GOOD thing. I never see them engage the point so they must be down with it.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:08 pm#44 – I don’t want caribou to die. AND actually, they’re more of them now then before the pipeline was installed in Alaska.
My problem with liberals is their obsession with ANWR. You don’t want to go to war for oil, you hate the Saudis, you want your big homes and SUVs and you don’t want to drill domestically. On the issue of energy, liberals are huge hypocrites.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:08 pmI’m waiting. We’re all waiting to hear you tell us why you think it’s so important to kill other living beings in a Wildlife Refuge for profits.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:08 pmWhy do the “conservatives” love to destroy everything they touch? Why do they destroy our environment, our liberties, our safety, our health, our very way of life? Because they can?
December 21st, 2005 at 12:10 pmNot Quite -
So is that your retarded answer? Let’s run up the deficit and then make the poor pay for it? Your answer is to let the rich elite do whatever they want, but make the poor, who have no say in the matter, pay for it?
Cutting funding for health care will mean more people getting sick possibly spreading more disease, cutting student loans means less kids with a chance at a successful future, cutting funding for child support enforcement means more kids will grow up with terrible childhood experiences, cutting of foster care funding means the same thing.
So now we’ll have a much worse off America, and it STILL looks like we’ll be throwing billions of dollars away, and thousands of lives in Iraq.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:10 pmWhy generalize like that? I’m liberal, and I don’t drive an SUV. In fact, most liberals I know don’t drive SUVs. Where I live, the SUVers mainly have W stickers on the back. Let’s not resort to glittering generalizations to make our points, ok.
Why don’t we focus instead on renewable energy produced agriculturally? What would be wrong with that?
December 21st, 2005 at 12:10 pm#43, True, we will cry over all the lives lost and wilderness distroyed. My question to you is, what country do you live in.? Unless you are out of the USA everthing that affects us will eventual affect you and yours. Our huge debts will transfer to you just as they do us and your rights are just as much in jepardy as ours, ever think of that.? Welcome to the Bush sinking boat.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:12 pmI think we need three ghosts to come up to Dickless Scrooge sometime before Christmas Eve.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:14 pmThis bill is immoral..it’s a simple as that. Taking from the poor and lining the pockets of the rich. And this is the party that is ‘restoring dignity to the presidency’? Get real. Welcome to Bush’s American..where only the rich need apply.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:14 pmCalling all trolls, report to headquarters to have a chip implanted in your brain…that is all.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:14 pm#49, I hope I’m completely wrong on this, but why would the conservatives want to have such an untenable deficit? Once we reach the $11T, 40% of our GDP would have to pay for the interest alone.
My guess is that this is part of their “continuous war” where they force us to fight after showing us how bad our economy is (and blame Clinton of course).
December 21st, 2005 at 12:14 pm#50 – the people that fund the Democratic party are all personal enemies of the environment. They consume huge amounts of energy and then trash Bush for being in bed with big oil.
John Kerry was symbolic of this. A man married to millions and heating large homes across the country has no place to tell me about the environment.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:15 pm#56
All liberals? I know that’s not true. I don’t know about your other statements, I’d have to look into them. So tell me, what is your party doing for the environment again?
December 21st, 2005 at 12:16 pm#46 You are describing republicans.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:17 pmBy executive order of the Vice President, Bob Cratchit will not get another piece of coal to warm the ink in his ink well.
Bah Humbug!
December 21st, 2005 at 12:21 pm#15
YOU DO NOT HAVE THE VOTES TO STOP IT!
AND you forgot one thing – this bill also cuts the DEFICIT.
Comment by Not Quite — December 21, 2005 @ 11:33 am
Cuts the deficit? How is that possible? Any savings that you could possibly garner from this bill will be eaten right up by the tax cuts coming down the pike. By the way, the reason that Cheney had to come in and cast the deciding vote was because some republicans broke ranks and refused to vote for this terrible legislation. It looks like some republicans have a conscience and can’t bring themselves to slash billions in aid to the working poor and middle class with one hand while giving tax breaks to the super rich with the other. Don’t think for one minute that this won’t come back to haunt the GOP
Is everyone sad because Democrats got steam rolled again? Don’t worry – after ANWR is passed you cry with the caribou.
Comment by Not Quite — December 21, 2005 @ 12:03 pm
This comment is amusing because it shows that you’re just a cheerleader for this administration, not a serious thinker. Again, it’s not just democrats that are against this ANWR provision. If that was the case, it would’ve passed sometime in the 25 years that Senator Stevens has been pursuing it. Adding this provision, and any other not associated with providing for our men and women in uniform to the defense spending bill is unpatriotic. Yes I said it. I believe that to be so because Sen. Stevens is putting funding for the troops at risk in order to accomplish his own agenda. He’s attempting to force those Senators (democrat and republican)who don’t want to vote for the ANWR provision to do so anyway since it is now attached to funding for our troops. I repeat, UNPATRIOTIC.
In case you aren’t aware, the only folks that will benefit from the ANWR provision are the Big Oil companies and the state of Alaska. The ANWR provision calls for oil revenue to be split 50-50 between the state of Alaska and the Government. To sweeten the deal, the government’s 50% has been promised for hurricane relief and such. What Senator Stevens doesn’t want you to know is that the government will never see that money. The state of Alaska has a law that says all oil revenues from the state must be split 90-10. The governor of Alaska is on record saying that once this provision passes, he will sue to guarantee that Alaska gets 90% instead of the 50% allocated in the provision. Look it up. I have no reason to lie.
So, go ahead and cheer. Yay!!! The american people get the short end of the stick again!
December 21st, 2005 at 12:22 pm#56 You don’t know how Kerry heats his home(s). If he uses solar power, wouldn’t you feel stupid? You assume way to much which about things you really know little about, thus proving to us you don’t do your homework or due diligence, you merely whine like a little girl or hurl insults at us clueless liberals. If you believed that you wouldn’t be here.
C’mon we know you hate every other thing. Who cares? How about that strike up there NeD?
December 21st, 2005 at 12:23 pm#60 – This is the angriest troll we have. He hates everything and everyone. He is alone and deserves to be.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:24 pm#56 Your wrong about Kerry and the Dems. What good have you done for our enviroment.? Do you Support Mr.Pombo who is dismanteling everything for the wildlife and enviroment he can.? The Republicans are on a march to sell off all our wilderness, parks and prestene areas for big oil and business, do you support them.? I alread know the answer to the above. This administration is also responsible for granting sweet heart deals to all their polluting companies that funded their take over of our country. Sadly sir you are wrong. Relegion and politics are big business…..Impeach all
December 21st, 2005 at 12:28 pmI am so glad the Big Oil companies got a $2B tax break. They need the money to buy off the republicans that voted for it!
December 21st, 2005 at 12:30 pm#60 I read all that also. One more thing that was added to that list was the fact that the oil would probably be sold and shipped by tankers to Japan. Interesting huh.? Sadly we had a lot of losses today. Untill we get the bad guys out our country is up for grabs to the highest bidders….
December 21st, 2005 at 12:38 pmSo my kids who are smart, but had the bad luck to not be born with a silver spoon in their mouths, are going to end up taking on more debt in order to get a college education so that they can contribute more to this country (a teacher, a nurse, a cop and an engineer)- and they will at the same time be shouldering the debt that has been dumped on them by the war that the current administration insisted was needed to protect us from… what? This administration??? WTF! My kids will contribute more to humanity in general than any of the Bush Dynasty offspring, and yet my kids are totally screwed before they can even start their own adult lives? I’m so angry, I don’t have the words to express how loathsome and evil and immoral the “leadership” of this country is. Where did my country go? I WANT IT BACK NOW. We have to get rid of this slime – and they have to pay for what they’ve done to this country. Talk is cheap – action has to happen in order to give strength to the words spoken by all of us who are want our country back. Any action plans out there?
December 21st, 2005 at 12:41 pmCloture of the Defense Appropriation Bill has failed. No extra Christmas present for the oil companies this year. 54-46.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:42 pmsorry, 56-44…
December 21st, 2005 at 12:44 pmCheney is a warlock and a terrorist.{:)Waterboard him and see if he melts.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:46 pm#66 Yes. Start writing all your editors of the press, representatives and join all the sites to patition for Impeachment. Next, keep screaming like I do, prepair to march and picket, last but not least keep your second amendment rights close at hand…..
December 21st, 2005 at 12:47 pmIndeed. Things are going too far. Citizens, wake up!!!
December 21st, 2005 at 12:48 pmSimple solution: Survival mode: Steal from, and cheat the rich by any means possible.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:49 pmVOICEMAIL
Tell us what you really think
The Situation encourages you to share your thoughts about a story in the news, the show, or Tucker Carlson himself. Call 1-877-TCARLSON to give your two cents. He checks the voicemail every night on-air.
President Bush’s approval ratings have risen eight points in the past month, and while they’re still low (47 percent, according to the Washington Post), the trend is clear: Bush is getting more popular. The conventional explanation is that a strong economy and a peaceful election in Iraq have allowed voters to forget about Hurricane Katrina and the CIA leak case. But that’s only partly right. The main reason more people like Bush, I think, is because he’s saying hopeful things about Iraq.
The invasion of Iraq was a horrible mistake. That’s my position, and (polls show) the position of most Americans. Even the administration concedes that the central assumption that spurred us to war (that Saddam possessed WMD) was false. No speech can change that fact. For the administration, the debate over why we went to war with Iraq is unwinnable. Bush seems to understand this.
The debate now is over what to do next. In his address Sunday night, Bush described America’s choice as one between victory and defeat. You can argue with his logic (stalemate is always an option), but not with his instincts. Bush understands that defeat is what Americans fear most, more than chaos in Iraq, more than an unstable Middle East, more even than thousands of dead U.S. soldiers. An American humiliation in Iraq would be devastating to America. Americans know this, on a gut level if nowhere else.
Bush’s answer to our fears is bluster: The war in Iraq is morally just, and we are winning it. Is this in fact true? I have doubts on both counts, but ultimately it doesn’t matter. Americans need to believe it. Why? Because self-confidence is the key to national success.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:55 pmPropaganda by Carl Tuckerson:
Bush understands that defeat is what Americans fear most, more than chaos in Iraq, more than an unstable Middle East, more even than thousands of dead U.S. soldiers.Bush understands that defeat is what Americans fear most, more than chaos in Iraq, more than an unstable Middle East, more even than thousands of dead U.S. soldiers. An American humiliation in Iraq would be devastating to America. Americans know this, on a gut level if nowhere else.
Americans know this, on a gut level if nowhere else.
Vietnam was not considered that defeat is what Americans feared most, more than chaos in , more than an unstable East, more even than thousands of dead U.S. soldiers. An American humiliation in Vietnam would be devastating to America. Americans know this, on a gut level if nowhere else.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:59 pmWas it?
THE SITUATION
Weeknights, 11 p.m. ET
Catch the situation with Tucker Carlson at his new time. The show is so fast, it’s changing the pace of news.
And the Spin Gets Faster for Sure.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:02 pmDO not let the Spin fool You.
Repubs are Propagandasts and Tyrannists along with treasonists at best.
December 20, 2005 | 9:23 a.m. ET
In Iraq, optimism is (our?) only option (Tucker Carlson)
December 21st, 2005 at 1:05 pmHey Carl , who is OUR? Not me Young un.
Carl is to Young to be News Propaganding.
Holding up this fat empty head with an arm pyramid is hard work.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:06 pmCall Carl and Ask Him to Step OUT Of the Big League, His propaganding is not helping America.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:07 pmHes to young to understand, Maybe he should go back to mommy.
Tuesday, September 27, 2005
National Guard sent to protect oil, not people
STACY BANNERMAN
December 21st, 2005 at 1:10 pmGUEST COLUMNIST
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/
oops. sorry. follow this.
Dear Military Families:
The following note is from MFSO member Stacy Bannerman from Washington State. Stacy’s husband served in Iraq as a member of the Washington National Guard. A couple of pieces that Stacy has written are available on the MFSO website (you can see one at http://www.mfso.org/article.php?id=390). If you would be willing to speak with Stacy, please contact her directly at the e-mail address or telephone number listed below.
In peace and solidarity
December 21st, 2005 at 1:11 pmCharley Richardson and Nancy Lessin
for MFSO
http://www.mfso.org
Dear MFSO members:
I am preparing an article about the wounds of war, and would like to speak with those of you dealing with loved ones’ physical or psychological injuries. The proposed project explores the impact of war on military family members and on service men and women struggling to heal combat-related injuries, providing compelling first-hand accounts of how people around the country are finding the strength to wait, grieve, heal, and recover as this country wages war in Iraq. The candid, singular accounts of the human toll of military action on our troops, their families and friends, will bring a personal perspective to the homeland consequences of the war in Iraq. Some of the potential issues to be explored are: How do you feel about the war now? Are you different? If so, how? Is the military providing adequate support? Have you encountered obstacles in receiving care and treatment?
I can be reached at sbannerman@comcast.net or 253-859-6465
Thanks!
Stacy Bannerman
December 21st, 2005 at 1:13 pmMay he be visited by the ghost of Jacob Marley and the rest.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:19 pmBah Humbug! Cheney not only lacks a functioning heart, his blood has been replaced with bile.
Author: Dr. Seuss
You’re a mean one, Mr. Grinch.
You really are a heel.
You’re as cuddly as a cactus,
You’re as charming as an eel.
Mr. Grinch.
You’re a bad banana
With a greasy black peel.
You’re a monster, Mr. Grinch.
Your heart’s an empty hole.
Your brain is full of spiders,
You’ve got garlic in your soul.
Mr. Grinch.
I wouldn’t touch you, with a
thirty-nine-and-a-half foot pole.
You’re a vile one, Mr. Grinch.
You have termites in your smile.
You have all the tender sweetness
Of a seasick crocodile.
Mr. Grinch.
Given the choice between the two of you
I’d take the seasick crockodile.
You’re a foul one, Mr. Grinch.
You’re a nasty, wasty skunk.
Your heart is full of unwashed socks
Your soul is full of gunk.
Mr. Grinch.
The three words that best describe you,
are, and I quote: “Stink. Stank. Stunk.”
You’re a rotter, Mr. Grinch.
You’re the king of sinful sots.
Your heart’s a dead tomato splot
With moldy purple spots,
Mr. Grinch.
Your soul is an apalling dump heap overflowing
with the most disgraceful assortment of deplorable
rubbish imaginable,
Mangled up in tangled up knots.
You nauseate me, Mr. Grinch.
With a nauseaus super-naus.
You’re a crooked jerky jockey
And you drive a crooked horse.
Mr. Grinch.
You’re a three decker saurkraut and toadstool
sandwich
With arsenic sauce.
Copyright © 1957, Dr. Seuss.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:29 pmHe actually looks like scrooge!
December 21st, 2005 at 1:31 pmThis blog allows more troll activity then any rightist Bush loving Heil Fureur blog out there…
December 21st, 2005 at 1:31 pm#85 – Well, we like to promote free speech. And we feel kind of sorry for the trolls; they obviously have no place to be.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:43 pmDick-tator…
December 21st, 2005 at 2:03 pmHoly crap, it is Mr. Potter! Now the gelatinous goo that morphs into Cheney when he’s needed can slither back to his hole, having screwed the poor once again.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:08 pmThe only thing that picture is missing are two horns coming out of his forehead. The man is the devil incarnate. Pure, unadulterated evil. May he suffer a thousand-fold for the pain and suffering he so gleefully brings to others.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:29 pmWe’ll all be living in Potter’s Field.
What was that speech? Something about replacing the lazy rabble with a thrifty working class? Cheney is sure not playing nursemaid to a bunch of garlic eaters.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:29 pmOkay “Not Quite” we get it. You’re about 12 years old or extremely immature. Your posts here are not moving anything along in a positive direction, so why don’t you go play with your XBox and leave the adults alone to have a mature discussion. Really, you’re adding nothing of value here with your nasty remarks.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:45 pmLike the Seniors weren’t pissed off enough at BushCo.
Good job Dickhead, you just lost the senior vote for all Republicans!
On election day, Seniors will be scammed into staying away from the polls. Mark my words, Dickhead understands the damage he just did.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:51 pm# 70 – thanks for your words of advice – I’m doing a lot of what you suggest, but I am amazed at the shrugs that I seem to get from a lot of the people that I contact. Half of the people that I work with (these are professionals -which doesn’t do much to convince me that having a PhD. does anything to increase the common sense quotient)just don’t deem to give a damn. I hope to see something organized that will let the idiotic MSM see that the majority of this country isn’t willing to let the administration continue rolling over us. Meantime, it’s still baffling me that one-third of this country isn’t able to think for themselves and see through these shysters.
December 21st, 2005 at 3:08 pmI AM OUTRAGED!!!!! CHILD SUPPORT, DISABILITY, MEDICAID, What the hell? The children, the elderly, the poor.. all will suffer. What an effing bastard, right before Christmas! This administration can take their happy “holidays” and shove it.
December 21st, 2005 at 3:18 pmSomeone explain to me how bush’ approval rating has gone up the past week? I see it heading straight to hell now!
December 21st, 2005 at 3:20 pmLike the Seniors weren’t pissed off enough at BushCo.
Good job Dickhead, you just lost the senior vote for all Republicans!
On election day, Seniors will be scammed into staying away from the polls. Mark my words, Dickhead understands the damage he just did.
Comment by Susan
Exactly They also pulled a fast one by having alot of polling places at areas the disabled couldn’t access and it was too late of course to vote absentee. Last election I spent helping drive a shuttle to get seniors to and from the polls. I’ll do what I can but they make it difficult.
December 21st, 2005 at 3:28 pm#95, they are using Diebold equipment now for the polling. But seriously, check:
http://mediamatters.org/items/200512210002
December 21st, 2005 at 3:29 pmSomeone explain to me how bush’ approval rating has gone up the past week?
Remember Bubble boy doesn’t pay attention to polls.
Bubble boy fooled millions of Americans into believing that “terrorists” attacked America on Sept. 11, 2001.
I’m certain he can fool a few more when polling trailer parks in West Virginia.
December 21st, 2005 at 3:31 pm#97 offers a good explanation too.
December 21st, 2005 at 3:34 pm#95 – His approval polls were up a bit in an ABC/Washington Post poll. In other polls, his approval ratings were flat or even down a bit.
December 21st, 2005 at 3:42 pm
http://mediamatters.org/items/200512210002
December 21st, 2005 at 3:43 pmNot quite is the new name for Northeast Dilemma
December 21st, 2005 at 4:13 pmThe New Pearl Harbor: Disturbing Questions About the Bush Administration and 9/11
David Ray Griffin, Michael Meacher MP
This is a must read BUSH knew of 911 theres hundreds of bit of proof in this book
Also just think if you want to cheat in an election the polls much show your equall to blindfold everyone
December 21st, 2005 at 4:24 pmBUSH knew of 911
With help from the Bin Laden’s, Bubble boy orchestrated 9-11.
Thats why he isn’t going after Osama. Osama is Bubble boys friend.
December 21st, 2005 at 4:35 pmThese people are the most fake Christians who ever walked the earth. Mike Malloy calls them the un-Christian Christians.
December 21st, 2005 at 4:50 pmI thought Democrats liked cutting the Deficit?
December 21st, 2005 at 5:46 pmNice Try Lyle, perhaps we can rephrase it as…
Republicans really enjoy cutting back Government…
Just as valid, but equally wrong.
I an’t speak for “Democrats” but I like cutting the Deficit. However I don’t want to do it at the expense of services that I consider essential. How about cutting Pork or Military spending instead? I don’t consider Alaskan bridges to be as important as healthcare or food programs.
Z.
December 21st, 2005 at 6:01 pm#95, they are using Diebold equipment now for the polling. But seriously
toys #97,
Anyone who (after what we’ve experienced since this junta took over in 2000) believes anything these Bushite wholly owned subsidiaries posing as news organizations say is an inbred idiot!
(Bushite media) They lie, they cheat, they spin, they misinform, they confuse, and obfuscate. Bushiva is ‘politically dead”.
There is a curse on Bush, Cheney and all of their worshippers, the manifestations of which are slowly but surely becoming a reality.
Patience…
December 21st, 2005 at 6:18 pmRepublicans want to wage a costly war, and not have to raise taxes to pay for it. That’s ‘fiscally’ and ‘economically’ irresponsible. But considering how ineptly the ‘occupation’ of Afghanistan and Iraq, along with the FEMA fiasco have been waged, it’s not surprising they wouldn’t have the ‘guts’ to do what it takes to run the country. The ‘hard’ choices are to raise taxes when necessary, not to invade people’s privacy on witchhunts and fishing expeditions. Republicans avoid the hard choices, by fabricating choices that aren’t necessary. It’s typical of people who live in a delusional state.
December 21st, 2005 at 6:19 pmWe who vote will remember what our representatives did to our nation’s have-nots today. We will also remember those who voted to give huge tax cuts to the already very rich. We get to vote in November, 2006 and November, 2008.
December 21st, 2005 at 6:53 pmOh yeah – we will remember these votes.
Has Dick the Grinch come back down the chimney yet to pinch that last little crumb left on the floor?
December 21st, 2005 at 7:06 pmREVOLUTION NOW!!!!!!!!!
December 21st, 2005 at 9:49 pmSeefleur, you’ve made some good comments tonight. I have encountered similar people; I have felt the same about my kids. Like you and Sharon, Susan and many others here, I march in protest, I write letters, I make phone calls, but I am at my wits’ end in finding whatever it takes to wake up the people who are all going to be affected sooner or later by the ruthless, heartless, greedy, selfish, bastards who are running this nation. They AND their children are all LOSERS – and we are all the worse for it. They have everything handed to them by servants on silver platters; they think their shit doesn’t stink; they lord their wealth and good fortune over the rest of us and think we should be grateful for any crumb that falls from their heavily laden table. They make me sick. I am not much of a believer, but if there is a God, I hope he strikes them hard – and soon.
December 22nd, 2005 at 12:43 amUgh and all of these programs are being cut just as I’m heading off to college…
I saw a report on BBC World News a few weeks ago saying that if you’re born poor in Canada and Europe you have a much higher chance of getting out of poverty than in America because their governments give lots of aid. As opposed to good ‘ole USA where it’s your fault and damned if the government will help you if you’re poor.
December 22nd, 2005 at 12:57 am$40 B slashed from the neediest Americans while squandering $9 B per month on an unjust war. Clearly the Bush League has its priorities. The military industrial complex, and big oil are the power elite. Follow the money to appreciate the true meaning of “freedom on the march” – our tax dollars freely marching into thier pockets.
December 22nd, 2005 at 5:50 amOh shit some people are going to have to get a job. Oh dear some Mexicans might have to go home. It’s a quagmire I tell you.
December 22nd, 2005 at 11:51 amThis bill is immoral..it’s a simple as that. Taking from the poor and lining the pockets of the rich. And this is the party that is ‘restoring dignity to the presidency’? Get real. Welcome to Bush’s American..where only the rich need apply.
Comment by Darin
Thank goodness for Republicans. Now I can take some of the money I earn and spend it on that ZR1 I want instead of feeding little Mexicans and grossly overweight black ladies with 10 bastard children. That’s what I call good government.
It’s about time the Blue states stepped up to the plate and gave to charity instead of funding their pet conscience soothing programs by confiscating my hard earned money.
December 22nd, 2005 at 11:57 amThey have everything handed to them by servants on silver platters; they think their shit doesn’t stink; they lord their wealth and good fortune over the rest of us and think we should be grateful for any crumb that falls from their heavily laden table. They make me sick. I am not much of a believer, but if there is a God, I hope he strikes them hard – and soon.
Comment by Marie
If I were you I’d just quit bitching and get a job. The gravy train is off the tracks.
December 22nd, 2005 at 11:59 am#118
It’s about time the Blue states stepped up to the plate and gave to charity instead of funding their pet conscience soothing programs by confiscating my hard earned money.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I — December 22, 2005 @ 11:57 am
What exactly is it that you do for a living? Can’t be that demanding if you are in here as frequently as you are.
And what makes pushing a mouse so much harder than scrubbing toilets, cleaning dishes, picking crops or mopping floors?
You said that you think it’s a sin to not pay people enough to eat. Were you just lying?
Efforts to increase the minimum wage are generally supported by unions and liberal anti-poverty organizations, who say it will help the nation’s working poor. A full time minimum wage worker makes just $10,712 per year, well below the poverty line for a family of three.
Opponents include conservative organizations and the business community, especially small businesses and retailers, who argue that increasing the minimum wage will simply increase unemployment, as small businesses who pay such wages are forced to make layoffs. Some argue that every ten percent increase in the minimum wage results in a loss of 100,000 jobs.
Supporters point to a controversial study by Princeton economists David Card and Alan Krueger of minimum wage employees in New Jersey, which found little or no impact on employment. Economist Robert Solow, an MIT Nobel Laureate, wrote in a 1995 New York Times article that the “main thing about the research is that the evidence of the job loss is weak…. And the fact that the evidence is weak suggests the impact on jobs is small.â€
Opponents argue that many minimum wage workers are teenagers or entry level workers with few skills who need these jobs to break into the labor force, and who are not the primary bread winners within their households. Supporters say that most of those affected by a minimum wage increase are adults aged 20 and over, and more than half of all teenagers earning the minimum wage are in households with below-average incomes.
source:
December 22nd, 2005 at 12:37 pmhttp://www.policyalmanac.org/economic/minimum_wage.shtml
#118
This is partly why Ryan questions your faith IRI:
Deuteronomy 15
[7] If there be among you a poor man of one of thy brethren within any of thy gates in thy land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not harden thine heart, nor shut thine hand from thy poor brother:
[8] But thou shalt open thine hand wide unto him, and shalt surely lend him sufficient for his need, in that which he wanteth.
http://www.biblegateway.com/
December 22nd, 2005 at 12:41 pmThank goodness for Republicans. Now I can take some of the money I earn and spend it on that ZR1 I want instead of feeding little Mexicans and grossly overweight black ladies with 10 bastard children. That’s what I call good government.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I
I-Trite-I #118,
Your father/grandfather/uncle/cousin taught you well. Inbreds like yourself have to be greedy and live life as selfishly as possible because your souls were condemned from the moment your mothers engaged in incestuous copulation with their fathers, uncles and brothers. We Progressives realize how difficult a burden your rural red state heritage has been upon your kind. The guilt you bear for having perpetuated such a sick tradition must be unbearable for you.
Blaming other races for your own shortcomings, and insecurities won’t raise you from the rank of LOSER and coward, nor cure your bizarre attraction to mating with barnyard animals and various poultry. No on blames you for the over abundance of defective recessive genes polluting your bloodline, but this does not justify your rude, mendacious assertions.
Also a word of caution, your pwt penchant for purchasing snazzy race cars while living in a trailer park is NOT financially sound investment.
December 22nd, 2005 at 12:41 pmI-T-I #118,
BTW:
THE MEXICANS ARE COMING! THE MEXICANS ARE COMING!
December 22nd, 2005 at 12:43 pm#123
THE MEXICANS ARE COMING! THE MEXICANS ARE COMING!
Comment by big papa — December 22, 2005 @ 12:43 pm
You figure a Texan who claimed to have dated a black girl wouldn’t be quite so tense about ‘brown’ people…
December 22nd, 2005 at 1:09 pmUnbelievable, IRI should probably also read Matthew (he can claim that Deuteronomy doesn’t apply because Jesus’s coming changed our relationship with God…
From Matthew 25 31:46
Either way he certainly isn’t a Christian.
Z.
December 22nd, 2005 at 1:31 pmGreat posts from all left and progressive writers. Bravo #122, 123, big papa. Like you I agree, on the unbred thought. The only diffrence between line breeding and inbreeding is monatery. The royal famalies of old did the line breeding and all went mad or had massive deformaties much like we are viewing from the trolls posting here. Their thought process is reduced to eating their own young, by the way, sooner or later they disappear. Maybe we are dealing with one or two presenting their skitzoid selfs as many. Work hard for impeaching all in this administrations…Blessings
December 22nd, 2005 at 1:32 pmIn France there are No waiting lists in hospitals ..You need to stop spending money on wars your losing ..you have created two new Talibans in Iraq well done that are gonna boot your ass from Iraq soon with no oil Monies ..You could have saved so many lifes in your own Hospitals …lets hope the rest of the world dont follow your Pathetic way of life
December 22nd, 2005 at 1:37 pmGreetings Liverpool,
Are you actually writing from Liverpool UK? I spent four years there, and enjoyed most of it.
I agree that the money spent by the US on the Military could provide tremendous benefits for the whole planet if spent differently. Of course some Americans have an almost Phallic attachment to their Guns so it’s not as easy as that.
Z.
December 22nd, 2005 at 2:26 pmEither way he certainly isn’t a Christian.
Z.
Comment by Zwack — December 22, 2005 @ 1:31 pm
Thanks Zwack! Though I doubt he’d make an argument. I’m convinced he only attends Bible study to pick up women… :)
December 22nd, 2005 at 2:51 pmIn France there are No waiting lists in hospitals ..You need to stop spending money on wars your losing ..you have created two new Talibans in Iraq well done that are gonna boot your ass from Iraq soon with no oil Monies ..You could have saved so many lifes in your own Hospitals …lets hope the rest of the world dont follow your Pathetic way of life
Comment by Liverpool — December 22, 2005 @ 1:37 pm
59 million of us voted against Bush (which means for national healthcare, against playing world police, and for global harmony). Unfortunately we had 3 million more who have no idea that the earth isn’t flat… We’re trtying to educate them though.
December 22nd, 2005 at 2:55 pmThink we should clue him in that they might like him more if he could actually discuss the Bible intelligently in Bible Study… :-)
Z.
December 22nd, 2005 at 3:06 pmA full time minimum wage worker makes just $10,712 per year, well below the poverty line for a family of three.
Comment by unbelievably large breasts
A loser working minimum wage has no business getting married and having a baby. Minimum wage is plenty to help a high school kid pay for his own car and insurance and by a few burgers and movies. That’s all it was ever meant to be.
December 22nd, 2005 at 3:30 pmTell that to the people who have been made redundant and could only get a minimum wage job to replace their previous one… I’m sure that they would love to be told that it’s their fault.
Federal minimum wage doesn’t EVEN pay for car, insurance a few burgers and a movie. Never mind Gas, maintenance, etc.
Companies love taking advantage of Minimum wage rules and paying the bare minimum… after all… “someone else would be glad to do it for that.”
Now go read Matthew 25 31:46 under your bridge…
Z.
December 22nd, 2005 at 3:38 pmRight crazy writes:
“A loser working minimum wage has no business getting married and having a baby. Minimum wage is plenty to help a high school kid pay for his own car and insurance and by a few burgers and movies. That’s all it was ever meant to be.”
A good example of why most of the world correctly believes that the United States is full of corrupt and arrogant degenerates. This loser would apparetnly like to sterilize most of the people of the world because they are poor and don’t make as much money as he does. When in fact, what the world needs least is more spoiled rotten, rude, foul-mouth yuppie American spawn of the sort that he would like to inflict upon the world.
We should sterilize the rich and confiscate their estates so that workers could be paid what they should have been paid all along, rather than wasting the money by perpetuating a class of lazy upper class parasites that the world could very well do without.
December 23rd, 2005 at 1:51 amA lot of heavy talk on this site but no action. If you keep sitting on your but it will not get better in the States.
I hate to see what is happening over there, people have no voice anymore, there’s only one voice, that of Mister Bush.
Get yourself together and impeach the silly man, he’s raping YOUR country, don’t let him!!!!
Please, for the sake of all mankind, stop the loonatic and get on the streets for your rights, it is still possible!!!
A friendly Dutch.
December 23rd, 2005 at 3:13 am#136
Ron,
Over here we have due process. Unfortunately in this case, it takes time. But it is happening. Don’t stress yourself into a panic attack. We are doing things. Just being here is a place for people to find unity (as there is greater strength in numbers). It takes a lot of effort to topple an empire… Give us some credit for being in here trying to make that happen. A lot of people don’t even care this much. We’re not happy about that either.
December 23rd, 2005 at 8:40 amUnfortunately we had 3 million more who have no idea that the earth isn’t flat… We’re trtying to educate them though.
Comment by unbelievable
unbelievable #123,
One cannot “educate” a rigged Diebold electronic voting machine.
December 23rd, 2005 at 2:33 pmA lot of heavy talk on this site but no action. If you keep sitting on your but it will not get better in the States.
Please, for the sake of all mankind, stop the loonatic and get on the streets for your rights, it is still possible!!!
A friendly Dutch.
Comment by ron
ron #135
I agree wholeheartedly with your post and its urgency.
We Americans- as a whole- are too “comfortable”, even when we’re being “raped”.
December 23rd, 2005 at 2:37 pmA loser working minimum wage has no business getting married and having a baby.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I
Careful I-Trite-I #132,
If you’re such a faithful Christian then you should be familiar with the biblical prognostication that (paraphrased) predicts that, “he who is first shall be last, and he who is last shall be first”.
From your politics I can only aasume that someday you and your ilk are headed for life in public housing projects…or worse.
December 23rd, 2005 at 2:43 pm#138
unbelievable #123,
One cannot “educate†a rigged Diebold electronic voting machine.
Comment by big papa — December 23, 2005 @ 2:33 pm
True, but there were those who intentionally supported Chimp due to ignorance. Many of us, includingmyself have already help educate a few who consciously voted for the Neocons. They won’t again. :)
December 23rd, 2005 at 6:29 pmKnowing his history his vote doesn`t surprise me.If Dick Cheney had a soul he would sell it,who needs a soul when he`s wealthy.This vote and (martial law)are good examples of this administrations sincere desire to help all middle eastern countrys become just like us.With Dick Cheney looking out for them they`ll be living the good life in no time at all, just like us.
December 24th, 2005 at 2:57 amPlease, for the sake of all mankind, stop the loonatic and get on the streets for your rights, it is still possible!!!
A friendly Dutch.
Comment by ron
What would a Zeropean know about rights? Mind your own business, get your rabid head chopping Islamists in line and put down the bong before you try and tell us what to do.
December 27th, 2005 at 2:06 pmWhat would a Zeropean know about rights? Mind your own business, get your rabid head chopping Islamists in line and put down the bong before you try and tell us what to do.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I — December 27, 2005 @ 2:06 pm
Oh, now that’s just classic coming from someone who supports an administration that can’t mind its own business – and is playing school yard bully in the middle east right now…
December 27th, 2005 at 2:16 pmApparently more than you by the looks of it IRI…
Oh, and where is Zerope? I can’t find it in the CIA world factbook.
Can you please point me to some more information about Dutch “rabid head chopping islamists” as I hadn’t heard of them.
Has it occurred to you that not everyone in the Netherlands uses a Bong? In fact the majority of those I know don’t.
ron Dank U Wel… Sorry, that’s about the limit of my Dutch.
Z.
December 27th, 2005 at 2:24 pmThinking more about it “The Rabid Head Chopping Islamists” sounds like a good name for a death metal band…
Z.
December 27th, 2005 at 3:10 pmZwack- Somebody needs to check your humor indicator, “..get your rabid head chopping Islamists in line and put down the bong…” is funny stuff. C’MON! Besides, I thought you HAD to smoke a bong to vote lefty…it eases the sting…
December 27th, 2005 at 4:46 pmZwack- Somebody needs to check your humor indicator, “..get your rabid head chopping Islamists in line and put down the bong…” is funny stuff. C’MON! Besides, I thought you HAD to smoke a bong to vote lefty…it eases the sting…
December 27th, 2005 at 4:48 pmP.S. I do like the death metal band name…kudos
ron- Please stop the looney toones and march in the streets for your rig”….Dude! Unless you’ve got a “way-back” machine and smoked some bad hash, you may want to update your rhetoric…Where the hell IS Europe…the 1930’s?
December 27th, 2005 at 4:52 pmTurk, ron has made no secret of the fact that he is Dutch. How good is your Dutch? probably not as good as his English. I don’t see what good taking the piss out of him for not being able to write English as well as a native speaker is going to do.
Given that I-R-I has a habit of saying incredibly dumb things and taking them seriously I don’t find it funny. For some reason he feels that all of Europe is full of “rabid head chopping Islamists”… I have never heard that suggestion before and didn’t recognise it as humour… probably because it’s not funny.
As for the bong comment, it seems about all Americans know of the Netherlands is “Pot is legal in Amsterdam”. I’ve been to the Netherlands a few times and always found it to be a charming, friendly and enjoyable place… Without the need to take any drugs.
This is about as funny as telling an American to “get your fat ass out of your SUV and walk down the block instead of driving”. It plays on stereotypes without any regard for the truth.
Forgive me if I didn’t find it amusing… I still don’t. It is still a good band name though… :-)
Z.
December 27th, 2005 at 5:55 pmNot that you guys don’t know this, but I thought the first hand expreinece of a former conservative might help…
I have been to Amsterdam and the drugs were not any portion of my visit. In fact, my trip was culturally enlightening because they are extremely tolerant and open-minded. They also speak much better English than any of our resident trolls. It is one of my favorite cities and I’ve been to global cities from Rio to Stockholm to Beijing and many places in between. I felt safer in Amsterdam than in the Atlanta suburbs were I grew up, well aside from the rampant Dutch bicyclists without brakes :). It would do our country a world of good to require people to go out and see it for themselves. The Germans require it of their school children, and I think we should as well.
December 27th, 2005 at 6:45 pmI prefer Antwerp myself, and I’ve spent more time in Belgium than in the Netherlands.
FWIW, I’m Scottish, I’ve been to France, Ireland, Belgium, The Netherlands and I now live in the US.
Probably the most foreign experience for me was spending two weeks living in part of London where I was one of the few white people in that neighbourhood. Being in such a visible minority (I would guess one to five percent) was radically different.
But yes, people should be exposed to other cultures and societies. Perhaps if they were they would be more accepting.
It’s worth reading some of Bob Harris’s Travel writings. I believe he is working on a book at the moment, but his website has his impressions of all sorts of places he has visited. He makes it clear that he knows nothing about anything so his impressions are exactly that. His impressions of what he saw.
It reminds me to some extent of the tale of a Zen Master who was travelling, he was on his way from one town to another when he met a traveller going in the other direction. The traveller asked how the people were in the town he had just left. He responded by asking how the people were where he had just come from. The traveller said “they were rude, obnoxious and unpleasant.” The Zen Master said “You’ll find them much the same in the town ahead.” and continued on his way. Shortly thereafter he met a second traveller who asked him how the people were in the town he had just left. Again he asked how the people in the town the traveller had come from were. This time he was told that they were pleasant, friendly and welcoming. The Zen Master said “Youll find them much the same in the town ahead.”
I’ve found that learning a few basic words like please and thank you immediately in the local language is usually enough to make the locals more willing to help you. I’ve also found the same goes for a local Mexican restaurant that I like… While I can’t speak (much) Spanish, if I try and order in Spanish they help. They’ll repeat things slowly if need be and always seem pleased that I’m trying.
Having lived in a tourist town I know that there are two kinds of tourists. The loud, obnoxious tourists who are always disappointed that things aren’t exactly like at home, and the quiet, polite tourists who are open and friendly. I’ve had tourists tell me that they had a better X back home, and those are the ones that I tend to do my best to avoid. I’ve also had tourists tell me that they liked Y and ask for suggestions of where to go and what to do next. Those ones are usually fun to take through some of the less common places and show them things that they might have otherwise missed. I was not a tour guide, just unemployed… When I had nothing better to do some people got mini tours of odd places. For instance there was a large, well executed mural hidden down a small alley way just off a major street. Most people didn’t find it by accident.
Z.
December 28th, 2005 at 11:48 amI prefer Antwerp myself, and I’ve spent more time in Belgium than in the Netherlands.
Antwerp is beautiful. I only spent a day there though. Brugge is pretty amazing, eh?
FWIW, I’m Scottish, I’ve been to France, Ireland, Belgium, The Netherlands and I now live in the US.
I love the brogue… Where in Scotland? I’ve only been to Edinburgh and Oban…
Europe definitely has a much more tolerant, laid back approach that we didn’t manage to bring over on the Santa Maria.. We can be so paranoid here sometimes, it’s really making a mess of things. Makes a lot of my friends want to retire over there.
Why’d you come here?
Probably the most foreign experience for me was spending two weeks living in part of London where I was one of the few white people in that neighbourhood. Being in such a visible minority (I would guess one to five percent) was radically different.
But yes, people should be exposed to other cultures and societies. Perhaps if they were they would be more accepting.
I am convinced, having come from a family who was ignorant, that ignorance is one of the biggest problems we face. It’s so easy for people to hate what they don’t know or understand. To assume that their way is the only way, or the best way, and give themselves permission to hate and eventually destroy what is different when diversity is necessary for survival of our planet. Plus, how boring would it be if we were all the same? So, it’s becoming a well tested theory for me that people who travel with an open-mind and without a tour bus become more tolerant and accepting of others. At least, I have :).
It’s worth reading some of Bob Harris’s Travel writings. I believe he is working on a book at the moment, but his website has his impressions of all sorts of places he has visited. He makes it clear that he knows nothing about anything so his impressions are exactly that. His impressions of what he saw.
I will do. Sounds great. Thanks for the recommendation. I love that sort of thing.
It reminds me to some extent of the tale of a Zen Master who was travelling, he was on his way from one town to another when he met a traveller going in the other direction. The traveller asked how the people were in the town he had just left. He responded by asking how the people were where he had just come from. The traveller said “they were rude, obnoxious and unpleasant.†The Zen Master said “You’ll find them much the same in the town ahead.†and continued on his way. Shortly thereafter he met a second traveller who asked him how the people were in the town he had just left. Again he asked how the people in the town the traveller had come from were. This time he was told that they were pleasant, friendly and welcoming. The Zen Master said “Youll find them much the same in the town ahead.â€
Oh, yes! Had a personal experience in Greece that was actually similar. I was in Mystras hiking the ruins of an old monestary when I met a teenager and her father along a trail. They stopped me to talk, and of course I asked them where had they been ontehir travels. Italy and France. The father said that he did not like Italy because the people were rude and the food was terrible. The French, to him were equally rude. I was surprised to hear this because my experiences were always wonderful in those places. So I asked him where specifically this happened. In the Rome airport and the Paris airport while they were changing planes… So all of Italy and France were tainted to him because he had bad airline food and service… I will wager that he thought Greece was rude iwth bad food as well :)
I’ve found that learning a few basic words like please and thank you immediately in the local language is usually enough to make the locals more willing to help you. I’ve also found the same goes for a local Mexican restaurant that I like… While I can’t speak (much) Spanish, if I try and order in Spanish they help. They’ll repeat things slowly if need be and always seem pleased that I’m trying.
I couldn’t agree more. I studied French for years in high school and a bit more in college, yet I’m never able to get past “Bonjour” in Paris because they immediate start speaking to me in English… Plus I had a great experience in Iguacu, Brazil where I spoke no Portuegese and the hotle concierge spoke no English, so we pointed to words in my guide book, drew pictures and gestured to communicate. It was basic stuff, but we did just fine and laughed the whole time.
Having lived in a tourist town I know that there are two kinds of tourists. The loud, obnoxious tourists who are always disappointed that things aren’t exactly like at home, and the quiet, polite tourists who are open and friendly. I’ve had tourists tell me that they had a better X back home, and those are the ones that I tend to do my best to avoid. I’ve also had tourists tell me that they liked Y and ask for suggestions of where to go and what to do next. Those ones are usually fun to take through some of the less common places and show them things that they might have otherwise missed. I was not a tour guide, just unemployed… When I had nothing better to do some people got mini tours of odd places. For instance there was a large, well executed mural hidden down a small alley way just off a major street. Most people didn’t find it by accident.
Oh yes, when I first started traveling, I did the organised tour stuff and just about everyone who travels like that complains about it not being just like back home, and they eat at McDonald’s. So funny. I learned quickly to avoid them and that mode of travel as well. A backpack and train pass is my prefered method.
And I’m sure the open-minded tourists you spent time with will remember their experiences warmly as a result… I will never forget the locals I meet in my travels who open up and share their stories or towns with me. Personally, I think that’s what makes life interesting and memorable…
Thanks for sharing your experiences with me. It was actually the kind of exchange I had hoped to find here… to learn about others and grow as a result.
Always nice talking with you Zwack.
December 29th, 2005 at 12:29 pmAntwerp is beautiful. I only spent a day there though. Brugge is pretty amazing, eh?
I liked Ghent but only spent a few hours there. Most of my time in Belgium was spent in Antwerp and Brussels (EU projects that the company I was working for at the time did)
I love the brogue… Where in Scotland? I’ve only been to Edinburgh and Oban…
Born in Glesgae brought up in Embra… That’s Glasgow and Edinburgh, but if you bear the “embra” spelling in mind you’ll get the pronunciation better than most Americans. I don’t have much of an accent, and it changes depending on who I’m talking to and what about. I was once on a bus behind a couple of American tourists on our way out to the Golf open (I was working as a dishwasher there, between high school and University) when the woman turned to her husband (I know I shouldn’t assume) and said
“Mussel-BERG, Do you think that’s related to Edin-BERG?” I almost replied “It’s Buh-Ruh and it means town, so what do you think?” The spelling includes borough, boro and burgh throughout the UK. Middlesbrough has the worst corruption I know of… it’s still pronounced middles-burrow though.
Europe definitely has a much more tolerant, laid back approach that we didn’t manage to bring over on the Santa Maria.. We can be so paranoid here sometimes, it’s really making a mess of things. Makes a lot of my friends want to retire over there.
Why’d you come here?
My wonderful wife. She’s an Oregonian, we met online in 1998, got engaged in December of 1998, Married in Edinburgh in March of 1999 (honeymooned in Inverness, co-incidentally the only other people at Castle Urquhart on the banks of Loch Ness were a couple from Lake Oswego in Oregon…) I got my Visa October 1999 and immigrated late November 1999. I’ve been living in Oregon ever since. My wife would have moved to the UK but her kids from her previous marriage were all still in School and it didn’t seem fair.
I am convinced, having come from a family who was ignorant, that ignorance is one of the biggest problems we face. It’s so easy for people to hate what they don’t know or understand. To assume that their way is the only way, or the best way, and give themselves permission to hate and eventually destroy what is different when diversity is necessary for survival of our planet. Plus, how boring would it be if we were all the same? So, it’s becoming a well tested theory for me that people who travel with an open-mind and without a tour bus become more tolerant and accepting of others. At least, I have :).
It’s not a requirement, but it helps. I know people who go on holiday to foreign parts and take everything with them… I know others who eat at McDonalds wherever they go… My wife is not so widely travelled (Scotland, England and Ireland, plus Western America) but is definitely pro-diversity. Of course the fact that her first husband is hispanic and they travelled with a carnival for several years might help.
I will do. Sounds great. Thanks for the recommendation. I love that sort of thing.
He’s currently in Australia (again) and seems to be enjoying himself. He also has a thing about Pudus… And who can blame him.
I couldn’t agree more. I studied French for years in high school and a bit more in college, yet I’m never able to get past “Bonjour†in Paris because they immediate start speaking to me in English… Plus I had a great experience in Iguacu, Brazil where I spoke no Portuegese and the hotle concierge spoke no English, so we pointed to words in my guide book, drew pictures and gestured to communicate. It was basic stuff, but we did just fine and laughed the whole time.
I learned French for five years in high school and can speak well enough to communicate. I was warned never to try speaking French in Flanders as English is preferable. I’ve only found one person who couldn’t speak English and we managed to communicate just fine with gestures.
Oh yes, when I first started traveling, I did the organised tour stuff and just about everyone who travels like that complains about it not being just like back home, and they eat at McDonald’s. So funny. I learned quickly to avoid them and that mode of travel as well. A backpack and train pass is my prefered method.
It’s fun. Package tours show you a lot in a small space of time but you don’t experience much of it. I prefer to travel at my own pace whether driving, hiking, public transit or trains… That way if I like somewhere I can stay as long as I want (within reason)… A friend and I went backpacking around Ireland one year (while both students)… The original plan was to spend a day or two each in Dublin, Limerick, Cork and Galway… Limerick got cut out almost immediately. Cork we stayed one night and moved on. Dublin was the first half and Galway the second half and we loved them both. When I went back with my Wife (Summer of 1999) we stayed in Dublin for several days, went up to Tralee for one night and then spent several days in Dingle. We loved every minute of it. We took camping equipment and stayed on campsites… Used public transit and just enjoyed ourselves. We were camping beneath palm trees in Dublin, watching the dolphins playing in the bay… It was so hot the tar was melting on the roads… I still don’t believe it was Ireland.
And I’m sure the open-minded tourists you spent time with will remember their experiences warmly as a result… I will never forget the locals I meet in my travels who open up and share their stories or towns with me. Personally, I think that’s what makes life interesting and memorable…
Yup, and I’m sure the locals remember the nice tourists as well. It certainly makes up for the irritating ones.
Thanks for sharing your experiences with me. It was actually the kind of exchange I had hoped to find here… to learn about others and grow as a result.
Hey, it’s always good to reminisce about experiences and learn from others. I sometimes enjoy arguing with trolls though… When it gets frustrating the good conversations are a welcome relief.
Good talking to you too.
Z.
December 29th, 2005 at 1:42 pmBorn in Glesgae brought up in Embra… That’s Glasgow and Edinburgh, but if you bear the “embra†spelling in mind you’ll get the pronunciation better than most Americans. I don’t have much of an accent, and it changes depending on who I’m talking to and what about. I was once on a bus behind a couple of American tourists on our way out to the Golf open (I was working as a dishwasher there, between high school and University) when the woman turned to her husband (I know I shouldn’t assume) and said
“Mussel-BERG, Do you think that’s related to Edin-BERG?†I almost replied “It’s Buh-Ruh and it means town, so what do you think?†The spelling includes borough, boro and burgh throughout the UK. Middlesbrough has the worst corruption I know of… it’s still pronounced middles-burrow though.
Oh, yeah, that does make sense. I guess I had thought it was just another English attempt at spelling the names of places they’d invaded (like the Bombay – Mumbai thing :)
I was watching a Scottish film (after Trainspotting, I ran across another by the same Director or Writer), and although I had no problems when visiting Scotland and have even dated someone from Glasglow, I had to put up English subtitles to understand the people in this picture. Sorta felt a bit dense… but it was funny. I couldn’t understand someone speaking my own language. Sorta makes you understand the mispelling of things, I guess.
My wonderful wife. She’s an Oregonian, we met online in 1998, got engaged in December of 1998, Married in Edinburgh in March of 1999 (honeymooned in Inverness, co-incidentally the only other people at Castle Urquhart on the banks of Loch Ness were a couple from Lake Oswego in Oregon…) I got my Visa October 1999 and immigrated late November 1999. I’ve been living in Oregon ever since. My wife would have moved to the UK but her kids from her previous marriage were all still in School and it didn’t seem fair.
Well that’s rather romantic :). And you’re lucky that she’s from Oregon and not Texas (IRI’s home) or Alabama… I lived in Boise for 14 months and was able to spend some time in Oregon. It seems like a great place to live. Though, that castle in Edinburgh is sorta hard to compete with :).
It’s not a requirement, but it helps. I know people who go on holiday to foreign parts and take everything with them… I know others who eat at McDonalds wherever they go… My wife is not so widely travelled (Scotland, England and Ireland, plus Western America) but is definitely pro-diversity. Of course the fact that her first husband is hispanic and they travelled with a carnival for several years might help.
Carnival? Wow… she must have some great stories. I’m a gypsy at heart myself and have always been intrigued with that kind of nomadic lifestyle. Have any that she’d let you share?
I learned French for five years in high school and can speak well enough to communicate. I was warned never to try speaking French in Flanders as English is preferable. I’ve only found one person who couldn’t speak English and we managed to communicate just fine with gestures.
I was in a movie theatre in Belgium. It had been 3 months that I’d been in Europe and I was craving something American (off for me actually). Saving Private Ryan. They played it in English with the subtitles in French. So, during the movie, the kid in the seat behind me kept kicking the back of my chair. I would turn around, several times, and in French, ask him to stop. After the fifth time that turned around, he looks at me and says “Okay, lady I got it.” in a perfect American tone. Guess the subtitles in French we’re so necessary…
A friend and I went backpacking around Ireland one year (while both students)… The original plan was to spend a day or two each in Dublin, Limerick, Cork and Galway… Limerick got cut out almost immediately. Cork we stayed one night and moved on. Dublin was the first half and Galway the second half and we loved them both. When I went back with my Wife (Summer of 1999) we stayed in Dublin for several days, went up to Tralee for one night and then spent several days in Dingle. We loved every minute of it. We took camping equipment and stayed on campsites… Used public transit and just enjoyed ourselves. We were camping beneath palm trees in Dublin, watching the dolphins playing in the bay… It was so hot the tar was melting on the roads… I still don’t believe it was Ireland.
Palm trees? Isn’t it too cold for them there? They die here anywhere except the southern border states. And in Dublin? That’s a surprise. Sounds like you had a great time. But when don’t you traveling? I’ve had one trip I thought was okay (a friend talked me into a cruise from LA to Mexico that was too touristy).
When you were in Galway, did you get out to Inishmoor in the Aran Islands? I love that place. It’s the epitome of what I had excpected from Ireland. We rented bikes and were fortunate to have one of those partly cloudy days.
Yup, and I’m sure the locals remember the nice tourists as well. It certainly makes up for the irritating ones.
When I lived in San Francisco we could always pick out the obnoxious tourists as the ones wearing shorts… after all they were in California :)
Hey, it’s always good to reminisce about experiences and learn from others. I sometimes enjoy arguing with trolls though… When it gets frustrating the good conversations are a welcome relief.
Ditto here. Live without travel would be pointless for me… definitely nice to remember these places.
Know what you mean – I am definitely addicted to battling trolls myself. :).
Happy New Year!
January 2nd, 2006 at 8:24 am*Troll Alert*: Many of the trolls on this blog have been on vacation in various foreign countries, searching for WalMarts, fast food and gift shops. Soon, they’ll return for more fun with “lefty-speak” and the quicksand of morality only a lefty blog can provide. Blog on, leftys…
January 2nd, 2006 at 3:34 pmP.S. Zwack- You’re wife was married to a “carnie”??? Now THAT’S funny! Do you juggle or is she settling down? Good stuff…..
Face it, the Right Wing is all about misplaced machismo (funny how macho tends to focus on the worst aspects of masculinity) and cowardice. They cannot argue the point because they have none, they are the mediocre, the stupid, and the vile who seek not to pull themselves up but to drag everyone else down into the hole they are in.
To their minds charity, is an exceptional trait and is to be despised.
Truth is a threat to them, and thus to be destroyed.
Justice is a threat to be evaded.
And lastly might is right.
That is what the right wing is about. They are evil, not just the joking evil we speak about every day, but true evil, the tenacious evil which infects everything they touch, and calls power strength.
January 3rd, 2006 at 7:35 amTurk…
You mean “Your wife” not “You are wife”… I sure as heck find it funny… She has a lot of stories about travelling to small towns and flirting with young men to get them to spend good money on the game she ran (I can’t remember which one it was, a dart toss I think) and quite a few of them won the “big” prizes and gave them to her. Most of them went straight back on the prize board, and they had spent way more than the prize was worth to win it. Some guys are total idiots when faced with an attractive woman. She “settled down” as soon as her eldest son was school age.
Z.
January 3rd, 2006 at 1:31 pmTry Milngavie for a corrupted spelling (old maps show it as Mulguy which will give you a much more sensible pronunciation)…
It’s a small town just north of Glasgow. Then there are Kircudbright and Kirkcaldy (Kerr-cood-brie and Kerr-koh-dy) which always seemed reasonable to me.
fair.
“Carnival? Wow… she must have some great stories. I’m a gypsy at heart myself and have always been intrigued with that kind of nomadic lifestyle. Have any that she’d let you share?”
Only the one that I just told Turk… Most of the rest is fairly normal. Think of it as a small close-knit community that moves from place to place. The usual internal gossip (affairs, jealousy,…) but don’t try and cause problems for one of them because they will come together against you.
It’s pretty sheltered and the North West coast of Scotland has them too. It’s pretty mild weather wise (Eastern Oregon is more extreme than Britain) as the Gulf stream comes across from Mexico. If I remember correctly there are Palm trees. There used to be a banana plantation just up the street from me in Portland, it was removed this year for development… :-(
No, but while in Dingle we wandered around on Slea head and around the Dingle peninsula… It was incredible. My wife has put some of her photos up at Irish Eyes.
Happy new year to you and yours.
Z.
January 3rd, 2006 at 1:49 pm