Colin Powell on spying program:
By on Dec 21st, 2005 at 12:33 am
Colin Powell on spying program:
“My own judgment is that — it didn’t seem to me, anyway, that it would have been that hard to go and get the warrants [through FISA]. And even in the case of an emergency, you go and do it [begin surveillance]. The law provides for that. And three days later, you let the court know what you have done, and deal with it that way.” From an interview with George Stephanopoulos featured on ABC’s “Nightline.”
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Wow!
Did Collin Powell finally grow a spine. Can he restore his honor at this point or, is he past the point of no return?
I would have to take the latter.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:39 amYep, I heard him with my own ears.
A judge can be reached to sign a warrant at anytime. It’s done every day against citizens who break the law.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:42 amwwwwallace, come out to plaaaay!
Will we get the votes we need for impeachment? Done deal.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:43 amSusan,
The 1978 FISA act gives them 72 hours wihtout having to get a warrant. So, the excuse that they needed the secret wire tapping for speeds sake is a lame excuse.
This is really bad for them. I think you could say that the American puplic gave these guys an incredible amount of rope to play with after 9/11 and they went and hung themselves.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:48 amI think you could say that the American puplic gave these guys an incredible amount of rope to play with after 9/11 and they went and hung themselves.
Bubble boy will be on the next episode of
The Worlds Dumbest Criminals.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:50 amIf this has beeen going on for five years why have we not heard about it before now? Some serious thought should be given to aiding and abetting, failure to report, conspiracy, etc.
The whole damn Republican Party could and should be impeached.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:53 amToo late Colon Bowell! When you might have used your cajones to thwart the mad neocons` plans, you instead went along for the ride. Maybe in your memoirs you can tell it like it should have been. Enjoy retirement.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:56 amIn response to a question about the letter, Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) suggested that Rockefeller should have done more if he was seriously concerned. “If I thought someone was breaking the law, I don’t care if it was classified or unclassified, I would stand up and say ‘the law’s being broken here.’
According to the Nightline report, it is illegal for the Senators who knew about the program to disclose the info to anyone. THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN BREAKING THE LAW!
McCain should know better by now. If these guys and gals disclosed this info the Bushie Administration would have castrated them.
McCain, like always is thinking about his election bid. McCain is a traitor and should be impeached too.
December 21st, 2005 at 12:59 amTippersnore,
I’d have to agree. Somebody like Collin Powell, who came up from nothing and made something of himself in the US Army, should have a lot more honor than going in front of the UN and lying his a$$ off. He should have said “No!”
December 21st, 2005 at 1:01 amImpeach him I say! If the 1978 FISA act wasn’t good enough then you work to streamline the process not completely bypass it with a secret unsupervised surveillance program. This is flagrant disregard for Constitutional law. Now we know why Bush was so eager to stack the Supreme Court with right-wing lawyers. When will the media and the American public wake up to the Orwellian crap that this administration is shoveling? I’m happy to see both Democrats and Republicans speaking out against this massive abuse of so-called “war-time” power by President Bush.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:01 am“Too late Colon Bowell!”
It’s never too late to repudiate that which you believe is illegal, immoral, or unethical. I’ve lost respect for the man, but I still think he’s a thoughtful, patriotic, and loyal American who was shut out by the Cheney-Rumsfeld cabal, as described by his former aide, Col. Larry Wilkerson. As we have seen, America is the poorer for the Bush White House rejecting his counsel. It is a shame Colin Powell didn’t speak out earlier, though.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:02 am#11, good point about Powell. Just think of what BushCo would have done to Rockefeller, Pelosi, etc if they had disclosed this info when they got it.
McCain sure has some nerve to talk about them, he knows what happens to those who cross BushCo.
wwwallace would have called them traitors if they disclosed the info too. Plus they would be held legally accountable.
I can’t stand neocons, they are traitors.
December 21st, 2005 at 1:08 amSusan,
I love it when you’re in that “Warriors” mode. I’ll join you.
Wwaaaaalaaaaace. Come on out to plaaaaaaaaay.
Sorry I don’t have the beer bottles with me.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:32 amDon’t take Colin for granted, like McCain, he could be a flip flopper. I still haven’t forgiven his stupid son for trying to run satellite radio to the ground while he was running the FCC. His son, I could have easily slapped.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:41 amHe had no backbone like his daddy and got mad whenever Howard Stern showed him up.
To paraphrase Stanley Chinoffski (aka Bill Blake)Integrity? He never had it.
December 21st, 2005 at 4:01 amIt’s never too late to repudiate that which you believe is illegal, immoral, or unethical.
Let’s discuss that when Colin Powell reveals that he knew he was lying about Iraq WMDs in 2002 which led to the invasion in 2003 in his memoirs in 2026.
December 21st, 2005 at 6:45 amI think Tank’s point in #16 is really the crux of the whole argument. Powell is one of the “Fallen Legion”www.antiwar.com/engelhardt/?articleid=8162.
December 21st, 2005 at 7:29 amThis is an old tactic Rush used to wail on and on about when the Clinton’s did this. Attack the messenger. The retribution Tank promises to the former Secretary of State sounds a litle like a threat doesn’t it? Calling him a liar. Susan keeps dropping these I-bombs , now it’s McCain, sure just impeach him too. Hey Susan where is that beauty of a chum blog you linked to before.? Only the GOP people have a problem withPowell and Mcain. . Great thread let a lot out of the bag.Wait till you start hearing Rudy Gulliani’s name being smeared over here. the Gop is crapping it’s pants.
It’s never too late to repudiate that which you believe is illegal, immoral, or unethical.
Let’s discuss that when Colin Powell reveals that he knew he was lying about Iraq WMDs in 2002 which led to the invasion in 2003 in his memoirs in 2026.
Comment by Tank
Who left this big pile of steaming stinking turd here? All the other trolls have left. He must be the dumb one. With a name like tank, that figures.
December 21st, 2005 at 7:52 amKillCon2006 if you think people who post here criticising members of the Bush administration for lying about why Iraq needed invading are the trolls… that makes you the stupid pile of shit.
December 21st, 2005 at 8:09 amIn fact you’re a very very lost one.
@ Fly-man — December 21,
The retribution Tank promises to the former Secretary of State sounds a litle like a threat doesn’t it?
Only if you’re not too bright.
The person I quoted said it is never too late to repent. I said for Colin Powell too late was March 2003.
Calling him a liar … Only the GOP people have a problem withPowell and Mcain.
Hey revisionist history isn’t just for Republicans anymore.
I’m getting the distinct impression you don’t actually know who Colin Powell is. Because Iraq WMD intelligence and the Bush administration misrepresentation of it isn’t so much a problem for the GOP.
December 21st, 2005 at 8:16 amColin: Where were your balls a year and 1/2 ago?
December 21st, 2005 at 8:19 amI will agree with Tank in that lies and distortions by Republicans are acceptable to Republicans. It’s only when anyone who isn’t a Republican tells lies or distorts truth that they get on their high-horse and claim that it’s wrong.
I thought Colin Powell was the most honorable person in the bush Administration. That is, until I heard him state that his presentation of “Facts concerning WMD’s we know Iraq has” in front of the UN was his most shameful act.
He had to know that if there was proof of mobile weapons labs, then they wouldn’t have to just show drawings of what they look like. They should have had pictures of the labs themselves.
I still think he’s one of the more respectable people from the administration, but he’s still a willing dupe to have “whored” himself and his honor.
December 21st, 2005 at 8:24 amNo I said McCain and Gulliani, see you won’t even repeat their names and then finish with a smoke screen of an answer, which we’ll have to see but your still pointing down the wrong road. I would love to know more Sec. Powell and any tenditious links you might supply will help me polish of a little of my apparent dull-ness. i’m never afraid to read anything. Thanks. By the way you did the exact same thing again. Attack the messenger, but this time it was me.
December 21st, 2005 at 8:34 amNow we get why he resigned…
Having common sense amid those whackos was giving him migraines or panic attacks or the sort.
December 21st, 2005 at 9:24 am#8
Agreed. We see how much respect Bush has for members of Congress. As most of you all now know, Rockefeller sent a letter to Cheney expressing concern over this program. Obviously he never received a response. Same with Murtha, who contacted the administration regarding the occupation of Iraq and finally, after several months passed, I believe, received little more than a “Thank you for your concern” response. And then we have John Conyers, who gathered over 500,000 signatures last summer on a petition and delivered them to the White House with a letter asking Bush to respond to a series of questions about the Downing Street Minutes. They wouldn’t even open the gate for him (not to mention inviting him inside the WH)…he had to pass the papers through the gate. As I understand it, to this date, the Bush Admin. has still not responded to his inquiries.
December 21st, 2005 at 9:51 amOh, and a few other things concerning this.
- CNN is reporting that one of the judges on the FISA court has stepped down in protest of Bush’s secret program.
- In the same story, Cheney is quoted as saying, “I believe in a strong, robust executive authority and I think that the world we live in demands it.”
He also said that executive authority has been eroding since the Vietnam and Watergate eras.
December 21st, 2005 at 9:55 am#26
- In the same story, Cheney is quoted as saying, “I believe in a strong, robust executive authority and I think that the world we live in demands it.â€
He also said that executive authority has been eroding since the Vietnam and Watergate eras.
Comment by WC — December 21, 2005 @ 9:55 am
Yeah, I suppose that’s why the Legislative branch didn’t declare war in agreement withtheir Constitutional authority and the Executive branch did?? What an ass. He needs to be removed from the White House as well, because we know he’s behind all of this. Peeping George is just a ventroliquist’s dummy.
December 21st, 2005 at 10:07 amC’mon folks, be nice. Most of us want the same things. Let’s not immediately jump to the bad side.
Colin – you are so off the bushco payola list now. Congradulations btw.
This whole issue shows how power corrupts even “the best (snark)” of people. It obviously went to the heads of just about everyone in this administration. Just look at what they’ve done and their reasoning is 1) because I can & 2) I know better.
Vote in ‘06. Early and often. Write your local papers. We need all the help we can get people.
December 21st, 2005 at 10:08 amI wasa watching a bit of the Saddam trial this morning and got to thinking about something.
They are charging Saddam with the deaths of 142 people that someone killed after an attempt on his life. I dont know that Saddam, an evil bastard, killed those people himself, or had them killed.
I was wondering. What about the 30,000 to 100,000 that Bush has killed in Iraq? Surely }Bush is just as responsible for these deaths as Saddam was for the 142, right
December 21st, 2005 at 10:17 am#29
I was wondering. What about the 30,000 to 100,000 that Bush has killed in Iraq? Surely }Bush is just as responsible for these deaths as Saddam was for the 142, right
Comment by Pablo in Mexico — December 21, 2005 @ 10:17 am
Isn’t the hypocracy in this amazing? How it’s WRONG for anyone to maim, torture murder, lie, vandalize, corrupt, steal, etc. except for those fat cats in the White House? Saddam goes on trial and Peeping George condemns him. Oh the irony…
December 21st, 2005 at 10:26 amI was wondering. What about the 30,000 to 100,000 that Bush has killed in Iraq? Surely, Bush is just as responsible for these deaths as Saddam was for the 142, right.
So … shall we compare Clinton and Saddam as well since Clinton “was responsible” for deaths in Kosovo. Of course not, this “logic” is nonsense.
Why don’t we compare FDR in WWII to Hitler in WWII … they were both responsible for millions of deaths … who cares in what context or manner, right Pablo. Moral relativism … no one’s right … no one’s wrong … it’s all perspective ……
December 21st, 2005 at 10:29 am#31
who cares in what context or manner, right
Rationale and moral people care…
Giacomo you can’t compare Clinton to Bush because Bush lied to get us to go to war. That’s the difference you are missing. Someone who attacks is the offense – the murderer. Someone who defends does so out of self-preservation. Our own laws are riddled with persocution for the first and justification for the second.
For example. If I’m walking down the street and you stab me to death, you’re going to prison. But, if I’m walking down the street and you attempt to stab me to death, but I pull out a gun and shoot you first, it’s self-defense and I am free. See the difference? (No, I don’t own a gun, so don’t go down that road, it was just an example for clarification).
December 21st, 2005 at 10:40 amBubble-boy George and the rest of his alleged administration are so out of touch with the majority of the American public, it’s pathetic. The fact is though; it’s been that way his entire time in office…hell, maybe even his entire life! He is no more a man of the people than anyone else that was born of privilege with a silver spoon in his mouth, went to Andover, Yale and Harvard – riding on his family’s name recognition, donations and connections.
I believe the words “public servant” have no meaning to them at all – and especially to our Douche-Bag-in-Chief. Well, let me correct that; servant has a lot of meaning to him. That’s why the immigration bill is so important. Who’s going to clean his campaign contributors’ homes, feed and raise their children, do their landscape work, and clean the pool? We are so screwed.
December 21st, 2005 at 10:40 am#33
He’s the first born son to a graduate of Yale and Harvard who served in teh Navy (I believe) and became President. Georgie Jr. doesn’t know the first thing about being an average American. He knew nothing about the world, and hadn’t bothered to travel the world with all that money. Instead he ran company after company into bankruptcy and was still rich in spite of it. He’s never been hungry or destitute on any level. How can we expect him to understand, much less react to our real issues? Hell, he’s just playing a make-believe game of cowboys and injuns with other people’s children (his are old enough to enlist).
It’s why we need Campaign Reform. Make our elections free so true representatives can be elected to run our country of average Americans.
December 21st, 2005 at 10:45 am#34,
I agree that the only way to save the country is to have massive Campaign Reforms. Currently money dictates all the policies and an average American has no voice at all. Given that an average american is also clueless, this is a recipe for disaster.
But I dont have any hope as lust for money is hard to give up. Unless there is a huge outcry by public, nothing is going to happen. But it will be too late by then. Most reasonable jobs have already left US and going to India/China while we have huge budget deficits so that we can fill pockets of rich. Nobody seems to care. Two party system does not work.
December 21st, 2005 at 10:55 am#31 You make little sense as you try to appear smarter than you really are. But really, what about Powell?
December 21st, 2005 at 11:06 amyea giacoma – that post was WAY below your normal level.
Clinton’s military applications in NO WAY compare to what bush43 has done. Are you suggesting we SHOULD’NT have gone into Kosovo or the Balkins? There was genocide going on and we stopped it. You can’t say the same thing about Iraq.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:12 am*Waiting for Giacomo’s response*
December 21st, 2005 at 11:32 am#35
Know anything about Corporate Personhood? I’ve read a couple of Thom Harmann’s books on this. Seems Berekeley, California has taken the first step of making Corporations secondary (instead of equal) to individual citizens. They’ve taken it to San Francisco. So, while I try to be a realist, I also try to keep the hope. Get’s depressing otherwise, you know?
I think we’re seeing a bigger public outrage too, so who knows what that might do. I do think that at this point (before Diebold takes over), that the Politicians still know that they need our votes.
December 21st, 2005 at 11:48 amSince it is so easy to get the FISA warrants, The FISA judge almost never says “no” to requests, and officials can move quickly and then get a warrant up to 72 hours later, the question must be raised “why didn’t they follow such a simple and efficient legal proceedure?” The only answer I can figure out (except terminal hubris!) is that what they wanted to or did do was so far outside any reasonable behavior that they simply couldn’t risk a normally compliant judicial review.
The Bush administrations behavior around this issue is pure cover up we have seen before. Cover up for actions that could not even withstand the most friendly judicial peek. Something from which even the most supportive judge would have recoiled. It will probably require a whistleblower and/or some courageous and very professional investigative reporting to find what must be an awful truth at the bottom of this slimey barrel. This is not over. Expect to be shocked before it is over.
December 21st, 2005 at 4:02 pm@ Fly-man — December 21, 2005 @ 8:34 am
By the way you did the exact same thing again. Attack the messenger, but this time it was me.
And just like everyone has done to Cheney everytime he links Saddam to 9/11. Hey it’s almost like it’s so much the messenger that’s getting attacked but their credibility.
When you take the people who lied like this to get the invasion of Iraq and absolve them of their sins based purely on whether or not they say something you like… you’re no different than the people you criticise. You just like your whores in a different position.
December 21st, 2005 at 6:22 pmNow, if a senior administration official in the white house commited treason and revealed the identity of a CIA agent, do you think they (Busheviks) could find someone to do a little snooping on the progress of the investigation? If so, I doubt they would want a court to know about it.
December 22nd, 2005 at 1:19 amBut he also said this
Appearing on ABC’s “This Week” Powell said he sees “absolutely nothing wrong with the president authorizing these kinds of actions” to protect the nation.
December 26th, 2005 at 11:36 amunbelievable—-Bush didn’t lie about anything. He was told there were WMD. Everyone was wrong, no one lied.
December 26th, 2005 at 11:39 amI wonder if Kennedy were here what he would say.
In October 10, 1963, U.S. Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy committed what is widely viewed as one of the most ignominious acts in modern American history: he authorized the Federal Bureau of Investigation to begin wiretapping the telephones of the Reverend Martin Luther King Jr. Kennedy believed that one of King’s closest advisers was a top-level member of the American Communist Party, and that King had repeatedly misled Administration officials about his ongoing close ties with the man.
Kennedy acted reluctantly, and his order remained secret until May of 1968, just a few weeks after King’s assassination and a few days before Kennedy’s own. But the FBI onslaught against King that followed Kennedy’s authorization remains notorious, and the stains on the reputations of everyone involved are indelible.
Yet at the time, neither Robert Kennedy nor anyone else outside the FBI knew more than a tiny part of the story that had led to that decision, or even the identities of the two FBI informants who had set the investigation in motion. Only in 1981 were their names—Jack and Morris Childs—publicly revealed, but even then the relevant documents were so heavily redacted that only the most bare-bones sketch of what had taken place was possible.
The Atlantic Monthly; July/August 2002; The FBI and Martin Luther King; Volume 290, No. 1
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