College Sophomore Stumps President Bush
College Sophomore Stumps President Bush
Bush was stumped during the Q&A session of his speech today by a sophomore at Kansas State:
Q: My name is Tiffany Cooper. I’m a sophomore here at Kansas State and I was just wanting to get your comments about education. Recently 12.7 billion dollars was cut from education. I was just wondering how is that supposed to help our futures?
[snip]
Bush: Actually, I think what we did was reform the student loan program. We are not cutting money out of it.
Tiffany clearly confused Bush. Not only did he have to turn to his aide for advice, but he confused truthiness with the truth. The facts:
Student Loans: On Dec. 21, 2005, the Senate passed $12.7 billion in cuts to education programs — “the largest cut in student college loan programs in history.” Vice President Cheney cast the deciding vote in favor of the cuts. The bill also fixed the interest rate on student loans at 6.8 percent, “even if commercial rates are lower.” Despite Bush’s claims, students will be left off the program.
Pell Grants: Pell Grants have been frozen or cut since 2002; they are now stuck at a maximum of $4,050. In his 2000 election campaign, President Bush promised to increase the maximum Pell Grant amount to $5,100. “From 2004 to 2005, 24,000 students lost their Pell grants, according to a report pre-pared by the Congressional Research Service. This was the first drop in the number of students receiving the grants in several years; the number had been growing steadily since 1999.â€
Full transcript below:
Q: My name is Tiffany Cooper. I’m a sophomore here at Kansas State and I was just wanting to get your comments about education. Recently 12.7 billion dollars was cut from education. I was just wondering how is that supposed to help our futures?
Bush: Education budget was cut — say it again. What was cut?
Q: 12.7 billion dollars was cut from education. I’m wanting to know how is that supposed to help our futures?
Bush: At the federal level?
Q: Yes.
Bush: I don’t think we’ve actually — for higher education? Student loans?
Q: Yes, student loans.
Bush: Actually, I think what we did was reform the student loan program. We are not cutting money out of it. In other words, people aren’t going to be cut off the program. We’re just making sure it works better as part of the reconciliation package I think she’s talking about? Yeah — It is a form of the program to make sure it functions better. In other words, we’re not taking people off student loans. We’re saving money in the student loan program because it’s inefficient. So I think the thing to look at is whether or not there will be fewer people getting student loans. I don’t think so.
Secondly, on Pell Grants, we are actually expanding the number of Pell grants through our budget. Great question. The key on education is to make sure that we stay focused on how do we stay competitive into the 21st century, and I plan on doing some talking about math and science and engineering programs so that people who graduate out of college will have the skills necessary to compete in this competitive world. But I think i’m right on this. I will check when I get back to Washington, but thank you for your question.
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heckuva job Tiffany
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:28 pmUH ,uh, DOH!
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:29 pmGWB's response..... doh!
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:29 pmDid Bush's pants burst into flames.
Nice to see that the future of our country see Bush for what he really is.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:30 pmThat was funny. What a doofus. It's not a lie if you believe it.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:31 pmWell, that will put Tiffany on the "do not
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:31 pmallow to attend" list, won't it?
She might get monitored by the NSA as well.
Maybe even an IRS audit?
The wingnuts will say:
"Why does Tiffany hate America so much?"
This will then justify the NSA spying on her.
I am mostly suprised that a question that was not pre-screened and asked by a Bush sychopant was even allowed through the bubble. Wonder who screwed up?
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:32 pmTIffany on no-fly list now.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:33 pmYou all need to learn fuzzy math. When you cut funds for education, it improves the system, doncha know.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:34 pmBased on this article,cutting college funding may not be all that bad, since they're not learning a lot anyway.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:35 pmGeorge W. Bush is the wrong demon for the job...
The American dream is evaporating... the lifestyles of poor/middle working class citizens is disintegrating...
...and the Bushite as*holes on this board are defending the criminals responsible, solely because they mistakenly voted for them twice...
They are "suicide Bushites", and the rest of us need to stop them...
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:36 pmHow is this man president? What a moron.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:36 pmHe compounded his poor showing by fillibustering/rambling on unintelligably.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:40 pmJanuary 23rd, 2006 at 4:40 pm
In the MSM they are trumpeting the fact that Bushiva is attempting to "convince Americans" of the need to continue warrantless wiretapping...
What a fu*king joke...
America isn't located in lily-White Manhattan, KS...
No wide shots of the audience were provided, and the WH "reporter" on CNN felt compelled to tell us that there were upwards of 9,000 people in attendance...
Can't trust it!
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:41 pmRegarding the possible hole in their screening, I find the thunderous applause of the Kansas State audience following the question very telling. It almost seems as if they were waiting for some way they could voice their disapproval.
This is in contrast to what I heard this morning on NPR. Nixon also spoke at Kansas State during a war except Nixon got thunderous applause of approval.
Obviously the un-Christian liberals have got a hole of Kansas.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:42 pmOnce a greedy lying moron, always agreedy lying moron .
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:42 pmHow in hell did we end uo with this freak ?
Bush: Although funding is down by $12.7 B, more students will get Pell because we are limiting the amount of grants to $20.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:43 pmI wonder if we'll see this on the news tonight?
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:43 pmHow come CNN never showed the audience in attendance at Bush's Orwellian campaign stump? How come none of the questioners were shown on CNN? Not even the face of the so-called Iraqi woman was shown, but she yelled praise for Bush? The whole event was staged by Karl Rove, but what is CNN's excuse for being used as a patsy in broadcasting it?
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:44 pmOff topic: The WH has now decided that they want to reframe the illegal surveillance program as a "terrorist surveillance program". Question: if true, why are we eavesdropping on terrorists instead of "putting them out of business"? I mean, if they are terrorists, why are we getting them? Some great slogans could come from this one.
Republicans: Eavesdropping on terrorists, whether they like it or not.
The Republican party. You bomb our country, and we'll listen to your phone calls. It's as simple as that.
George Bush: Still hasn't found Osama Bin Laden, but guess what? OBL doesn't dare call America. Damn right.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:44 pm20 bucks that the Repubs bussed a couple thousand soldiers over from Fort Reilly to make this photo op look better.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:44 pmMy 14 yr. cousin could stump bush. That's why everything is heavily scripted. The guy's an embarrasment.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:45 pmOh well. Can't beat em' join em'!
::Crosses arms::: "I love big brother"
Yeah, interesting they never showed the audience, just big brother, and his sickening smiling smirking face. Oh yes, it's all one big joke and he was havin one heckuva time there in kansas. I guess there's alot to laugh about when we're at war.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:45 pmNo ignoramous. We on the right are able, unlike yourselves to have a good laugh now and then. And we dont expect our president to be a walking encyclopedia. He is allowed to have a brain fart. We laugh at Kennedy all the time as a matter of fact.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:45 pmBush in a wingnutshell.
More dangerous than a bandit or OBL.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:47 pmTiffany for secretary of education! No! Tiffany for president!
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:48 pmForest Gump is smarter than Bush
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:48 pmHe's an embarassment to the human race.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:49 pm"Tiffany, the last loose cannon that got into one of my speaches had a great...uh....truely American idea. You can work three jobs while you are going to school. Truely American"-President Bush
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:49 pm#25,
The guy is a brain fart, not just experiencing one occaisionally. That post will be shredded.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:50 pmI wouldn't ride in a car with Tiffany for a while.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:50 pm.
"He is allowed to have a brain fart."
I suppose so, if he had a brain to begin with. He rambled on and stuttered like a drunken slob.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:51 pmI can only imagine how ridiculous he looks to other leaders in the world. That whole speech about his daddy, Japan, and, oh his dog..... SO COMPELLING! ::eye roll::
blackeye, have a brain fart? Bush is a walking brain fart. If it's not on a teleprompter, he's lost.
Also, as regards to the president being a "walking encyclopedia", you're damn right I expect him to be knowledgable and at least to know what's going on with his own education policies. His job requires it. I don't think that's too much to ask since he's - you know - the President.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:51 pmPost 25 > I do not think Bush has a brain > PERIOD.
It was the most strange speech he ever gave! Claimed he was bringing PEACE to the entire world as he wages WAR! George Orwell, if still alive, would fall over dead after hearing Bush's "Big Brother" performance!
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:51 pmMan they need to find people that aren't so lame when hiring Right wing talking heads to post here.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:54 pmGeorge Orwell, if still alive, would fall over dead after hearing Bush’s “Big Brother†performance!
---------------
Indeed. Just seeing his head on the screen and nothing else was scaring my 3 year old. She kept crying..."No! No!"
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:55 pmMy husband had to take a mini movie of it because it was too funny.
Bush truly is an inept, dumb*ss.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:55 pmAnd we dont expect our president to be a walking encyclopedia. He is allowed to have a brain fart. We laugh at Kennedy all the time as a matter of fact.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 4:45 pm
Do I need to say this? Nobody expects Pres Bush to be a walking encyclopaedia -he is expected to do his homework.
He should have expected questions regarding his administration's policy on education, budget, grants, loans, etc. Even if he didn't have the exact figure in mind, he should have known that cuts have been made to educational programs at the federal level.
The fact that he was stumped and fumbled for an answer is very revealing.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:56 pmRemember, "strategery", that was a good one too.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:57 pmGood Morning America, how are ya,? For your viewing pleasure today we have a future Presidental candidate with a higher IQ than any of our present administration. Yes folks, we are here in Kansas and the young person is Tiffany Cooper, let's hear a big bravo for the Cooper family. Thank's Tiffany for having the moxi to ask the bully the good question. For all my blogger friends, stand up with me, get tough, get mad and get this bunch of liers and thieves out of our government and behind bars. You can change channels now....Blessings
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:57 pmThere are no preperations for questions like that, this administration is so arrogant, they think people are just going to be starstruck that the President is even there.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:58 pmAlso I do not think Bush is aware that Alfred Landon, whose name was plastered behind him, was a personal friend of Adolf Hitler and even received funding for his presidential campaign against President Roosevelt from the Nazi Party! Karl Rove is so fascistic he did not realize that he had Bush stumping for Landon the dead Nazi lover > lol.
January 23rd, 2006 at 4:59 pmA chair could stump George Bush...
Guess that's the last time he'll take questions from anyone over the age of 12, who isn't a sworn neocon.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:01 pmWhat a fu*king joke…
America isn’t located in lily-White Manhattan, KS…
No wide shots of the audience were provided, and the WH “reporter†on CNN felt compelled to tell us that there were upwards of 9,000 people in attendance…
Can’t trust it!
Comment by big papa
"Lily White"? That sounds rather like hate speech to me. I'm learning about that hate speech thing you know.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:01 pmAnd we dont expect our president to be a walking encyclopedia. He is allowed to have a brain fart. We laugh at Kennedy all the time as a matter of fact.
Comment by blackeye
Yes. We want an ignorant dumbass just like you in the WH! Someone that will make you feel special and smart!
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:02 pmMore to the point, not only is he inept, but he does not appear to know what is going on in his own government. Given that Cheney had to cast the deciding vote, you would think he would brief Bush on screwing college students across the country.
One thing to consider, it's not just student loans were cut but also other items related to education. So much for the No Child Left Behind Act.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:02 pm45,
Nice attempt to derail the talking point, you must hate America.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:03 pmLily white Manhattan?
You ain't never been to Manhattan. "Lily White" is the heartland, baby.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:04 pmYes post 37 > it was a "Big Brother" diatribe with nobody else shown on TV but Bush's upper body and bobbing head!
I do NOT understand why the CNN broadcast camera never moved and was locked onto him > either the camera guy worked for Rove or he was knocked out?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:05 pm45,
Nice attempt to derail the talking point, you must hate America.
Comment by For Truth
Hey! That's their job. It's a dirty job, but someone has to do it. Jeff Gannon does it.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:06 pmIf Bush didn't lie and twist the truth constantly, I'd be inclined to cut him a break on missing a fact here or there. But he says what he wants whether he knows the facts or not -- so knowing or not knowing makes no difference.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:06 pmI find the question she asked disturbing. It smacks of entitlement: "the government owes me college funding, how dare you take even a little of this away?" This is what happens when we set the expectation that the government is here to take care of us.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:06 pmOnce a greedy lying moron, always agreedy lying moron .
How in hell did we end uo with this freak ?
Comment by hardass — January 23, 2006 @ 4:42 pm
How? Our education system... it's why he doesn't want to improve it.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:06 pmAmerica isn’t located in lily-White Manhattan, KS…
Oh! My bad! That is Lillywhite.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:08 pm#13 ..so funny... you they can start calling bush-speak "fillibustering"!!! haha
But seriously who needs college when you got Intelligent Design! God can make us all geniouses for free... we just need to go to church every sunday and give 5% of our pay checkes as tithes.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:13 pmI find the question she asked disturbing. It smacks of entitlement: “the government owes me college funding, how dare you take even a little of this away?†This is what happens when we set the expectation that the government is here to take care of us.
Comment by Concerned Conservative
You are absolutely right! That's why we don't care for you! It's those damn entitlements! Like life, liberty, privacy and the pursuit of happiness. No wonder the GOP is opposed to them. For all of you who used to defend this guy, now you see exactly where he is coming from. Screw him, he's a useless tool. There is your personal attack. Now you may join the ranks of the rest of the useless trolls. Pardon us for thinking that education is important. It doesn't benefit everyone, as you so aptly demonstrate, but I'm still in favor of it and think it should be subsidized, rather than corporations.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:13 pmCC given that a person with a college degree will earn more money over thier lifetime, thus paying higher taxes, buying homes, and cause little or no crime. Wouldn't it be better to support education?
I don't have exact statistics on it, but in my opinion, poverty causes crime. If a few more of my tax dollars were spent to help a student earn a degree, thus reducing poverty, making a tax paying good citizen, I really don't have a problem with the "entitlement" you claim. Besides on a secondary note Bush already said he would raise the amount of money spent on education. Remember "No Child Left Behind".
Study after study suggests that higher education and reduction of poverty makes us a better country. I am unsure why you would not support that.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:14 pm#53
You allow wiretapping, wars, and lies all in the name of the Government taking care of your safety, don't you? Don't you drive on freeways, expect law enforcement to protect you, vote for people to represent your views? You sound like a snothead thats been taken care of by your rich daddy.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:15 pm"I will check when I get back to Washington, but thank you for your question."
He's not checking jack-shit when he gets back to Washington. I'm so embarassed.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:16 pmNow wasn't that progress? We are all a lttle retarded just being on this site.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:17 pmThis is what happens when we set the expectation that the government is here to take care of us.
Moron. What would you call defense? go away you fvcking moronic conservatard idiotologists. Is there no one who can rid us of these medddlesome idiotic high and low priests of the invisible hand of the church of the free market bullshit.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:17 pm#53,
Yeah, those damn sponges, they think they are entitled to the truth.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:18 pmI find the question she asked disturbing. It smacks of entitlement: "the government owes me college funding, how dare you take even a little of this away?"
Comment by Concerned Conservative — January 23, 2006 @ 5:06 pm
It is a legitimate question and it does not smack of anything but honest concern.
A budget is set to help students pay for their education. It is not entitlement, it's what a government does: Help its citizenry.
That you characterise a budget cut that happens to be the largest in history as taking a "little away" is jaw-dropping.
This is what happens when we set the expectation that the government is here to take care of us.
I hope you apply the same logic to the "war on terror". No need for the government to take care of us, no need for secret eavesdropping, no need to chase "terrorists" half way around the globe -right?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:19 pm#53,
Go back to Sister Toldja, and learn some better noise.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:20 pmSay, Unbelievable, I haven,t seen Debtonator comment in a while. Is he ok?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:21 pmCNN never panned to anyone asking a question, so how do we know there was a Iraqi woman there? Maybe it was Condi Rice with a head scarf playacting an Iraqi? We do not know how many people were in attendance? 50, 500, or 5000? We do not know if they were bussed in from Idaho, from some skinhead group, or some Republican Mormons from Utah? Why was Alfred Landon's name plastered in different sizes behind the president? Was that a message to his fascist followers that he is Landon's successor in DC? The whole speech was strange!!!
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:21 pmNow wasn’t that progress? We are all a lttle retarded just being on this site.
Comment by blackeye
You were born that way. Take it up with yer Mom, she might know who yer Dad was.
The thing about concerned conservative is that he has politicized his anal retentiveness. It's a riot, really. Anal retentives are funny, but they can be a real pain in the ass.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:21 pmI. Hate. This. President.
That budget cutting student loans was debated for weeks, and Cheney had to break the tie in the Senate for it to pass! If Bush isn't capable of being aware of the provisions in that budget, then he's not capable of learning basic high school courses.
And as for "smack[ing] of entitlement" when a college student asks about the cuts in federal student loans: you've gotta be kidding me. The student is required to pay it back, with interest. It's not free money. And if he claims to support higher education, then he will support giving the students loans to help them through college. After all, his administration is okay with giving more and more tax cuts to very wealthy people who do not need any more money. Why not give loans to students? It's not that much to ask.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:21 pmI find the question she asked disturbing. It smacks of entitlement
Actually, public investment in education has a high rate of return to the country at large, in terms of taxes paid, innovation, productivity, job creation, etc. One can actually make the case for educational funding being a matter of national economic security. The educational system is screwed up to be sure, but it still is better than the alternative.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:22 pmAs the Untied States of American under Bush makes eduction more difficult, nations like India and China are pouring out educated, doctors and scholars by the boat load.
Look on the bright side, as America sinks into a third world funk we will be entertained by all of the musicians, Nascar drivers, beer drinkers, mega-church goers, Winston smokers,plastic surgeons and reality show contestants.
Good time to be an American, this must be what Nicaragua was like in the Somoza days.
-GSD
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:23 pm'No Child Left Behind' is affectionately refered to as 'All Children Left Behind' by teachers with good reason...
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:23 pmUSGS National Earthquake Center goes 24/7 -- Staff now on-site night and day to locate and report worldwide quakes
Released: 1/19/2006 1:19:06 PM
Contact Information:
U.S. Department of the Interior, U.S. Geological Survey
Office of Communication
119 National Center
Reston, VA 20192 Dave Ozman - dozman@usgs.gov
Phone: 303-202-4744
Heidi Koontz - hkoontz@usgs.gov
Phone: 303-202-4763
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The U.S. Geological Survey (USGS) National Earthquake Center in Golden, Colo., today announced the implementation of a new 24/7 operation center and seismic event processing system, HYDRA. When combined, the round-the-clock on-site personnel and new technology are expected to cut in half the amount of time required to report information about earthquakes around the globe.
In response to the December 2004 Sumatra earthquake and resulting Indian Ocean tsunami, the USGS has carried out a wide range of activities to aid recovery in that region and reduce the impact of future tsunami events in the United States and around the globe.
The USGS is taking steps to improve seismic monitoring and information delivery in a number of ways including hiring new scientists and support staff. The enhancements at the USGS National Earthquake Center are possible due to an $8.1 million Emergency Supplemental Appropriation in FY 2005 and a $5.4 million request in the FY 2006 President’s Budget that was approved by Congress last fall.
A new seismic event processing system, HYDRA, identifies, locates, and measures earthquakes; these changes are already greatly speeding up and improving delivery of earthquake notifications. The state-of-the-art system is working in a provisional mode and will become fully operational in March, 2006. Other software and hardware enhancements to support subsystems are also being put into place.
One of these enhancements, Prompt Assessment of Global Earthquakes for Response or PAGER, is designed to predict damage from major earthquakes worldwide based on estimates of people and property exposed to potentially damaging levels of ground motion. The system is being developed specifically as a tool for emergency relief organizations such as U.S. Agency for International Development.
The USGS will also debut a new website and notification service for earthquake information at the end of January. The URL will remain: http://earthquake.usgs.gov.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:24 pmThere seems to be some confusion in the Democratic Party.
They oppose spending cuts for education, but at the same time they support taking discounted college educations away from U.S. citizens and giving them to citizens of other countries who are here illegally. (The DREAM Act, various state laws including one that was voted down recently in Mass.)
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:24 pmOh yeah, and only the children of rich people should be educated.
-GSD
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:24 pmSay, Unbelievable, I haven,t seen Debtonator comment in a while. Is he ok?
Comment by Flashback — January 23, 2006 @ 5:21 pm
I did recently - just a couple posts in a forum. Maybe he and Susan are busy with their documentary?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:25 pmFact: The federal education budget has gone UP dramatically in the last five years.
But you liberals have been screaming about violations of the Constitution - there's no constitutional authority for the federal government to pay for education at all. Hypocrites.
Now let's see how long it takes Judd to delete this dissenting opinion...
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:25 pmAre there any Right Wingers who can see all the idiotic Bushisms, his complete lack of being able to even answer a question, let alone read a speech wich has words of more than 3 syllables? This is not an attack on your decision to vote for him, just wondering if you can see how stupid this guy is?
Oh I guess not, I have read the Right Wing blogs, not much intelligence going on there. It's amusing when Right Wingers think they can take a stab at this blog. Very few do so.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:25 pm#53..its called team work. Something you learn in the U.S. Marines. We are on the same team so I EXPECT you will be there to help me help you.
Entitlement is the expectation that you can to break the law just because you are president and there is a semi-war going on.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:25 pmSo #53, only rich people can go to college? The only thing that reeks of entitlement is you.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:27 pmGeorge W. Bush=Upper Crust Affirmative Action in Action
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:28 pmWally,
You have been allowed back on, which means your posts are now welcome. But it makes sense you are paranoid, and expect to be treated unfairly, like your parents treated you.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:28 pmWallace you need to lay off the coffee.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:28 pmFact: The federal education budget has gone UP dramatically in the last five years.
But you liberals have been screaming about violations of the Constitution - there’s no constitutional authority for the federal government to pay for education at all. Hypocrites.
Now let’s see how long it takes Judd to delete this dissenting opinion…
Comment by "wallace" — January 23, 2006
there’s no constitutional authority for the federal government to pay for education at all. Hypocrites.
There is no constitutional authority for the federal government to have an Air Force either, and you can't become a fighter pilot without a college education, can you?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:29 pmSo wallace, how did you pay for college, if you went?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:29 pm"You sound like a snothead thats been taken care of by your rich daddy"
Not really For Truth -- my Dad was a teacher.
#64 -- Gregor, the role of our government as originally designed included defense but not federal money for education, welfare, etc. -- these relatively recent enhancements.
I am not arguing against people getting a college education -- even funding that with tax money to some degree. I'd just like the recipients to be a little more appreciative of what they are getting, you know?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:29 pmFor Truth -- President Bush has an MBA from Harvard, and consistently beats Democrats in elections. We can see how stupid you are though.
Now let's see if Judd deletes my insult or yours, which came first.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:29 pmHypocritical moron.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:29 pmoh, F U, "concerned" conservative...now you've got ME pissed off.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:30 pmboth my kids graduated high school with 3.9 gpa, but needed financial aid to get to college, a state college, mind you...
some of that aid was pell grants, a little scholarship money, but MOST is student LOANS.
you're damn right, they are ENTITLED to get financial help...however possible - no thanks to your ilk.
Yesterday Judd said that wallace is permanently banned and to help him out we should ignore wallace (and his pseudonyms) in order to help TP regulate his posts...
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:31 pmOK, so you shattered the Nixon record for presidential prevarication... do you
a) take it easy for the rest fot he season.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:31 pmb) share the glory with your teammates and let them score some lies
c) never let up. put your record out of reach so it stands the test of time.
What if we find out later she had a Bush Sucks Tatoo on her ass?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:31 pm"[. . .] the government owes me [a tax cut], how dare you take even a little of this away?†This is what happens when we set the expectation that the government is here to take care of us.
Comment by Concerned Conservative — January 23, 2006 @ 5:06 pm
Isn't that what you really meant?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:31 pmGordon -- "There is no constitutional authority for the federal government to have an Air Force either"
Uh, there is specific authorization for the armed forces in the Constitution. Have you ever read the document?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:31 pmI am not arguing against people getting a college education — even funding that with tax money to some degree. I’d just like the recipients to be a little more appreciative of what they are getting, you know?
Comment by Concerned Conservative
So you'd like them to bow and scrape, like in front of King George? You are a "useful tool", aren't you?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:32 pmHere is a Stupid Question of the Day from msm for ya:
Live Vote
Should President Bush spend time defending his domestic surveillance program? * 7133 responses
Yes. He can help clear up what is still confusing to many Americans.
38%
No. Why bother, Americans are clearly split along party lines on this issue.
62%
Not a scientifically valid survey. Click to learn more.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:34 pm"Yesterday Judd said that wallace is permanently banned and to help him out we should ignore wallace (and his pseudonyms) in order to help TP regulate his posts…"
Spoken like the good sniveling little brownshirt we know unbelievable to be.
katy, you are not entitled to a dime of your neighbor's earnings.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:34 pmUh, there is specific authorization for the armed forces in the Constitution. Have you ever read the document?
Comment by "wallace
Obviously you haven't. It specifically enumerates an Army and a Navy. That's why the original "air force" was part of the army, dumbass. The army air force.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:35 pmSocio-economic is one of the last bastions of unadulterated discrimination left in our country. Not that the others don't linger, it's just that they are illegal. Discrimination based upon socio-economic status is still very legal. And it's still very rampant. Case in point.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:35 pm#86, enhancements is the correct term. Bush and the right would like to dismember our society into have and have nots, the rich privledged few and the serfs for the 21st century. Cutting medicare, privatizing social security, health care crisis, education cuts. He's doing a bang up job so far. But it's easy to screw with social programs when you've been silver-spoon fed your whole life.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:35 pmWhich is another reason why you "originalists" are just so full of shit. You are throwbacks to two centuries ago now. The sooner you all die off, the better off the world will be.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:36 pmThe question asked by the student was a distraction, because the whole speech was out of Orwell's "1984"
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:36 pmbook about "Big Brother"! While everyone is debating or attacking the student, Bush gets away with slandering the entire nation, and calling himself a peacemaker, which is bullcrap! If this was a preview of his State of the Union address, then I want a ticket to Switzerland, before this man starts WWIII?!
So wallace, again - how did you pay for college?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:37 pmHooligan?
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:37 pmGordon -- If you'd like to quibble about the difference between "army" and "armed forces" that's your business.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:37 pm"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, it expects what never was and never will be..."
Thomas Jefferson
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:39 pmSo wallace, again - how did you pay for college?
Comment by morgan — January 23, 2006 @ 5:37 pm
You won't get an answer. He's still a high school student.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:41 pmWallace hasn't been let back on. He should be gone for the time being, but will be back tommorow. The only way to enforce the ban is to ignore him. I ask for your cooperation in order so we can build a real community on this site.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:44 pmMorgan, I love your connection to the results currently upon us of the Bush-Cheney era, but it is not that they wish those things upon us, those things are the unsightly consequences that come with their actions. Just look at the way they have no problem exhausting massive amounts of real capital, real Military bodies and political party loyality. The VP paints himself as John adams part 2. Wait for the State of the Union address. I know it seems hard but , try to think like they do , or did 230 years ago, these guys are there right now.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:47 pmKaty, congrats on having smart kids. I think kids with that high a GPA should get more financial help. Let's make it merit-based.
G. Gordon -- you are putting words in my mouth. I said "show a little appreciation" and you changed it to "bow and scrape in front of King George". Not an honest argument if you are changing the words of your opponent...
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:49 pmWhat Thomas Jefferson would think of the psuedo-legal constitutional doctrine of the "originalists". He would laugh at you like the rest of us.
I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and Constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors. -- Thomas Jefferson, letter to Samuel Kercheval, July 12, 1816
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:50 pmBack in October 1957, the USSR launched the first formal Earth satellite. By January of 1968, Explorer 1 was orbiting the Earth; I was shoved into courses in trig, advanced algebra, physics and astronomy. That was my sophomore year, second semester. As a senior (in high school), I took freshman courses at SMU. This was all financed by the Eisenhower administration which recognized that the need to jump start science programs in the United States was a national priority. Talk about trickle down economics - it did not run out of steam until 2001 with a slow down in the '80s. While I benefited from this experience, I was also a jock on the HS basketball team.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:50 pmThat's January 1958.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:53 pmG. Gordon — you are putting words in my mouth. I said “show a little appreciation†and you changed it to “bow and scrape in front of King Georgeâ€. Not an honest argument if you are changing the words of your opponent…
I wouldn't get that close to you to put anything anywhere. You said what you said and I said what I said. You have a problem with how I characterize your position. I have a problem with your position. So do most people. Deal with it or go back to the nineteenth century where you are more in tune with the environment.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:53 pmI can deal with it G. Gordon -- I just have to think back on how I reasoned with my kids when they were 8 years old.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:56 pmfly-man, it's a case of their cake and eat it too. The neo-cons get their war (and the rich get richer from it), the resulting cost has to come from somewhere (the poor and the middle class). So they try to dismantle our at least modestly egalitarian society by destroying social programs claiming there's no money. Basically they're feeding the conservative beast the same crap that it's shitting out.
It's the crazy neo-con/fiscal conservative/christian right coalition that allows this. The fiscal types, while seething at the costs of the war and some govt growth, love the death of the social safety nets. The neo-cons get their war. The christian right gets their rhetoric and moronic proposals like a ban on gay marriage. The whole thing is one big crap factory. And, rightly, it makes me sick.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:59 pmIf this was a preview of his State of the Union address, then I want a ticket to Switzerland, before this man starts WWIII?!
Comment by Jay Randal — January 23, 2006 @ 5:36 pm
Actually his SOTUS is all about selling his latest scam, the individual health accounts instead of employer provided health insurance, or what a majority of americans really want, single payer universal health insurance.
As far as WWIII is concerned, that began shortly after 9/11 and we are in one of the cold phases. It will last for decades.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:01 pmThe problem that is facing the nation is a matter of people who truly have experienced life and have the knowledge to make decisions off of their experiences and those who have not truly experienced life and have lived a sheltered life ( most likely because they have grown up with a wealthy family) From personal experience of my own and through dealing with one friend in particular, these people who are allowing criminals and hypocrytes take over our country do so because they are not truly living in the real world and as such they get bored and try and take control over the lives of the people who they have been force fed that they are superior to or they hate their lives so much because they arent as happy as people who arnt as rich as them and so in a bully mentality they have to try and make themselves look superior to the peons or poor people.
The economy as it is set up right now only works because we have people working like slaves and there are patches set up in the form of socialist balances. Without slavery or socialist balances the economy would become as bad as the depression. I dont think anything will happen to topple this regieme any time soon. I say this because until more than no people are hurt by this administration we wont see anyone take action.
also food for thought. if the republicans lie and dont go by the rules doesnt that negate the rules? or better yet doesnt that cause you to not be able to "win" when following the rules? as many republicans want to say to us "shut up" or keep quiet why dont we take heed of their request and instead of talking take action?
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:01 pmI can deal with it G. Gordon — I just have to think back on how I reasoned with my kids when they were 8 years old.
Comment by Concerned Conservative
You think back to the nineteenth century for all I care. That should be a snap for you. Almost normal.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:02 pm#110, CC - "I think kids with that high a GPA should get more financial help. Let’s make it merit-based."
well, that's mighty white of you...thanks...
i happen to think that ANY kid who wants to go to college should be able to get the help needed to get there...NEED-based...each school's requirements will determine who goes to what school...but ANYONE who wants to get a better education should be able to do just that - FOR THE COMMON GOOD.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:02 pm#22 -- About 1,000 soldiers were brought in from Ft. Bragg to attend the speech.
#47 -- Not only did Cheney cast the deciding vote, he cut short his international trip to do so and proudly told the news media that was why he was returning to Washington earlier than planned. That's right -- Bush doesn't read.
#60 -- Much like Scott McClellan checked on the Abramoff meetings and got back to the press about them. If Tiffany can ask Bush again in the future -- and name specific people who were turned down for Pell Grants who would have received them prior to Cheney's vote -- then Bush may answer. Otherwise, he's "not going to engage in speculation."
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:04 pmPaying for education is assinine - we are the richest country in the world. College should be free.
We just have to stop spending $380 billion on defense (second place country only spends $52 million), billions on pork and other bridges to nowhere, and repeal corporate welfare.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:07 pmMorgan, just start putting names to your Neocons and the world gets so small so fast, as you already have eluded to. Share as many details as possible with links, then print them, and hold them as gold. This is the D"vinci codes but with Tivo.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:08 pmThanks for your time.
No he hasn't and no they aren't.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:09 pmIsn't it obvious? Nobody except the rich should get an education. In fact, let's start with Kindergarten. How about a $3,500 tuition for the 5-year-olds? You know, get them to learn personal responsiblity.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:12 pmIf you don't have enough money for college, you are definately a good-for-nothing loser.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:14 pmI've relied on Pell Grants as well as state grants and student loans to pull me through college. With this administration, it's "every student must sacrifice ."
I like this Tiffany. You think we should lower the age limit for the Presidency and let her run?
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:20 pmQ: "Hi, I'm wised up from think progress and sir...YOUR PANTS ARE ON FIRE!!!!"
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:22 pmPaying for education is assinine - we are the richest country in the world. College should be free.
Then we'd be just like Cuba, where the illiteracy rate is just .02% instead of about 30% like here and no Republican could ever get elected. We can't have that!
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:26 pmCubans also get free medical care, like most of the other industrialized nations on the planet. Shocking!
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:27 pmThis picture says it all:
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:34 pmGregor, the role of our government as originally designed included defense but not federal money for education, welfare, etc. — these relatively recent enhancements.
Comment by Concerned Conservative — January 23, 2006 @ 5:29 pm
First, thanks for posting an honest opinion and not going off-topic on a long rant & hysterical attack on liberals as the boogeyman.
Regarding your post: Arguing "this is not what the government was originally designed for" is not really a strong position to take.
The government, its functions, and role have changed as has US society. A government -any democratic government- should be the reflection of the wishes of its people. Since the US gained its independence, the idiosyncrasy of the American people has changed and so -as a natural consequence- should the government. Contending otherwise smacks of ideology overtaking (what should be) a representative democracy.
You intuitively already know this since you called the changes "enhancements".
To really take the government back to what it was "originally designed for" you would need to take away women's right to vote, for starters. Let's remember that a constitutional amendment had to be introduced in order to grant women their right to suffrage.
Is that what you are advocating?
I am not arguing against people getting a college education — even funding that with tax money to some degree. I’d just like the recipients to be a little more appreciative of what they are getting, you know?
I think the young woman is appreciative -but she is also concerned. Rightly so. Aren't you? Again, this is the largest budget cut to the education budget in history. How are you going to pay for your college education? Or your kids'?
She is holding this administration accountable for their actions. Why don't you? The US is (supposed to be) a democracy. Citizens are allowed -no, expected- to ask questions. Why don't you?
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:35 pmShe is holding this administration accountable for their actions. Why don’t you? The US is (supposed to be) a democracy. Citizens are allowed -no, expected- to ask questions. Why don’t you?
Comment by Gregor Samsa
Simple. That is exactly what these regressive radical conservatards want. They want to go back to the way things were. You are not talking to reasonable, rational people. Think of biblical literalists and substitute the constitution. Sure, they may have fooled themselves, and others, into believing they are not sexist and racist pigs, but they are.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:46 pmIf they think the Department of Education is a disaster then let them fund it thru Disaster Relief.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:49 pm#87,
I have a Master's degree also, and you clearly think I am stupid.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:51 pmJudd,
Anyone who is banned can just use another IP address and get through, or is that too simplistic?
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:52 pmThen we’d be just like Cuba, where the illiteracy rate is just .02% instead of about 30% like here and no Republican could ever get elected. We can’t have that!
Comment by G.Gordon Giddy — January 23, 2006 @ 6:26 pm
What was I thinking? I mean, I guess I had a moment of insanity there. Seeing as how educated people in Prague managed to evict the Soviet Union from their city without anything but their minds! Beeter to fight 'em with gun powder even when they were no where near our cities... Thanks for correcting me Gordon. I'll try to learn from my mistake - no wait - I think I'm supposed to keep repeating it while expecting different results... :)
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:56 pmGregor,
You may find this of interest. It was in the conservative American Spectator. It's not specifically about the fallacy of constitutional originalism, but more about Libertarianism. These two "pseudo-philosophies" are often confused and conflated along with Ayn Rand's objectivism, another pseudo-philosophy from a third rate romance novelist.
The Marxism of the Right
The Constitution, Laws and Libertarianism
A good essay on original intent and the constitution.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:58 pmFor Truth,
wwallace aka USA Patriot aka NoCensorship aka who aka why has admitted he is not old enough to qualify for military service.
I wouldn't put too much stock into his assessment of your -or anyone else's- intelligence and accomplishments.
January 23rd, 2006 at 6:58 pmCubans also get free medical care, like most of the other industrialized nations on the planet. Shocking!
Comment by G.Gordon Giddy — January 23, 2006 @ 6:27 pm
Just don't say "National Healthcare" all in one sentance, or NSA tags your posts and send the CIA.... Wait a minute, there's a knock at my door... Who? What? Uh-oh...
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:00 pmJudd,
Anyone who is banned can just use another IP address and get through, or is that too simplistic?
Comment by For Truth
IPs are static (fixed) with cable, or dynamic (changing or randomly assigned) as with dial-up and most DSL. But essentially yes, if he switches to Netzero, from some other cheap dial-up, or knows how to spoof IPs, he's back.
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:00 pm“Lily White� That sounds rather like hate speech to me. I’m learning about that hate speech thing you know.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I #45
Did you see that audience?
Except for that lone Iraqi plant (the woman who begged us "(not to) question this administration's decisions to invade Iraq"...
...they were all related...
But I could never hate you IRI, what cat could hate his litter box?
Stick around now, don't go getting booted for being yourself...
...be human...
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:02 pmCubans also get free medical care, like most of the other industrialized nations on the planet. Shocking!
Comment by G.Gordon Giddy — January 23, 2006 @ 6:27 pm
Just don’t say “National Healthcare†all in one sentance, or NSA tags your posts and send the CIA…. Wait a minute, there’s a knock at my door… Who? What? Uh-oh…
Comment by unbelievable
It's nationalized in ever major industrial democracy but one. Can you guess which one?
Mexico. No wonder they come here in droves. Force Mexico to provide jobs and healthcare for their people and we won't have to worry about illegal immigration, but then big business would have to pay Americans a living wage. We can't have that! And don't give me that nonsense about we can't "force a sovereign country to do what we want!" Tell that to Castro and Hugo Chavez and Viet Nam and Nicauragua and El Salvador and ...
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:06 pmGeneral Michael Hayden,
Bushiva's new point man on illegal wiretapping says that it's his "professional opinion that had we had illegal wiretaps pre-9/11 the attacks on the twin towers would not have happened"....
Would somebody please tell that inbred sh*thead chickenhawk, Bushba*lickingscumsucking basta*d about the PDB entitled "bin Laden determined to carry out attacks on American soil"...
"Heckuva job Mikey"...
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:06 pmI’m learning about that hate speech thing you know.
Comment by I-RIGHT-I #45
Seriously Big Papa, he's being way too modest here. IRI has his PhD in Bigotry.
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:06 pmGordon,
Thanks for the links.
I like the short essay on original intent -don't have the time to read the others right now, but I will as soon as I can.
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:08 pmTell that to Castro and Hugo Chavez and Viet Nam and Nicauragua and El Salvador and …
Comment by G.Gordon Giddy — January 23, 2006 @ 7:06 pm
Speaking of Chavez, isn't he overdue for another Bush bash? The discounted heating oil to impoverished Massachusetts residents was pretty slick. Perhaps he could open the Hugo Chavez scholarship funding for needy Americans who've been denied student loans by their own richest-in-the-world government??? And Tiffany Cooper could be the first recipient...
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:12 pmI personally believe that anyone in the US should be able to get a college education at any university that would accept them at a rate equal to 1/3 of the minimum wage. The Federal Goverment would meet all excess costs where the alumni reenrollment rate was below 20%. All other institutions of higher learning would lose their tax exempt status.
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:22 pmSEVEN SOLDIERS DIE TODAY while BUSH LAUGHS AND JOKES in Kansas. DISGUSTING.
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:22 pmIt’s nationalized in ever major industrial democracy but one. Can you guess which one?
Mexico. No wonder they come here in droves. Force Mexico to provide jobs and healthcare for their people and we won’t have to worry about illegal immigration, (...)
Comment by G.Gordon Giddy — January 23, 2006 @ 7:06 pm
Mexico's national health care system is universal and free. It's called "Instituto Mexicano del Seguro Social", or IMSS for short. To qualify for its benefits all Mexicans have to do is show proof of citizenship. Another provider of free health care is the Secretaria de Salubridad y Asistencia, or SSA.
Both the SSA and IMSS run everything from hospitals to small rural clinics, nationwide vaccination programs, familiy planning educational programs, etc., for all Mexican nationals. All services are free.
If, a as Mexican national, you don't feel like going to a IMSS or SSA-run hospital, you can opt for a private hospital, clinic, or doctor.
Illegal Mexicans are driven into the US not for health care, but for jobs that will provide them with enough income to support their families.
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:23 pmHas CNN explained their coverage of the Bush diatribe speech yet? If CNN thinks it was cool to just show Bush and not the faces of his questioners, then CNN should have its broadcasting license revoked! Because it was slanted and bias coverage! Also WHY did CNN devote an hour & a half to Bush ranting in Kansas? There was NO reason to show his campaign stump speech in its entirety, since it was staged by Karl Rove with phony put-up questions!
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:24 pm141,
He can also just go to a internet cafe or something like that, right?
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:28 pmSeriously Big Papa, he’s being way too modest here. IRI has his PhD in Bigotry.
Comment by unbelievable #145
unbelievable,
IRI is lonely...
No self deserving human being with a modicum of common sense and the most rudimentary reading and writing skills would spend two minutes attempting a civil reparte with it...
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:47 pmCome-on, IRI has a mother. Why fault her for abandoning it at birth?
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:54 pm#144 chill out man. I know ..I get really pissed on here to sometimes... hehe. But what I am wondering is what is General Michael Haydens point? What is he saying exactly? From what I have learned about this issue THERE WAS WIRE TAPPING before 9/11. You just had to get a warrant to do it just like now. It has been that way since the 1970s because of Nixon and gang ...which happens to be the very same people in Bushes gang. They have come back from the Nixon years and are defying not only the will of the people today, but the will of the people that were pissed at Nixon then. They are flipping off the FISA rules which were created because of them. COME ON PEOPLE. They just swapped Nixon with Bush....
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:16 pmDid it ever occur to you to pay for your college by taking out loans? Its what most people do. We dont wait around hoping for hand outs. You simply make "big brother" biger when you give him that kind of power.
Another possibility is to actually earn, yes I know thats a four letter word to most of you but yes earn a scholorship by working hard and staying off the drugs that obviously most of you did way to much of.
Why should my tax dollars pay for your ignorant ass to go screw off for four years. I have seen it over and over boneheads wasting time, money and space. Its my money, Ill pay for my kids.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:21 pmPs I am an educator with probably more intelligence in my big toe than most of you have collectively.
way to go Tiffany
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:28 pm#156... You are also an ass that doesnt know the first thing about people like Jesus, Buddha, or Ghandi. I know republicans in general are very selfish people but you still have got to understand the idea of teamwork. It is far better for a nation of people that consider themselves under one name (Americans) to work together to make all its people as good as they can be...especially if that country goes around pushing Jesus... Your attitude is of a defeatist and selfish sort like "squidward" from that kids show spongebob square pants. You think far more highly of yourself than you should. ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:30 pmYou mean like the loans that Doctors get to pay for med school if they promise to work for five years in an isolated area that has no Dr., but go right to Hollywood and a lucrative plastic surgery practice? Just STFU you assklown. You are the Welfare Queen. Go away with your bullshit. You sound like Bowdler. Policeman never lie! Neither of you would know the truth or propaganda if it bit you on the ass.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:33 pmDid it ever occur to you to pay for your college by taking out loans? Its what most people do. We dont wait around hoping for hand outs. You simply make “big brother†biger when you give him that kind of power.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 8:21 pm
This is exactly what the thread is about: The fact that the federal government has cut the federally funded student loan program.
From the Chicago Sun Times article you didn't bother to read: Two-thirds of all college graduates take out loans to help pay for their college. The average debt of graduates is nearly $20,000. The student loan cuts just passed by Congress, according to experts cited by the Wall Street Journal, will raise the average cost over 10 years by $2,000 to students and $3,000 to parents.
The administration, through budget cuts, will increase the cost of getting an education instead of making it more affordable.
Another possibility is to actually earn, yes I know thats a four letter word to most of you but yes earn a scholorship by working hard and staying off the drugs that obviously most of you did way to much of.
So you think that not qualifying for a scolarship means you are lazy, on drugs, or both? What's the current percentage of students on a scolarship? How many scolarships do universities grant across the US?
Ps I am an educator with probably more intelligence in my big toe than most of you have collectively.
Given your less than thoughtful post, somehow I doubt it.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:34 pmWhy should my tax dollars pay for your ignorant ass to go screw off for four years. I have seen it over and over boneheads wasting time, money and space. Its my money, Ill pay for my kids.
Ps I am an educator with probably more intelligence in my big toe than most of you have collectively.
Comment by blackeye
LOL!
Hoamskoolin' don't kount!
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:35 pmFrigging moron. The sophomore kicked your ass, Dimbulb.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:43 pmAppropriation for Pell grants increased by about 58% from 1990 to 2000. They have increased about 57% from 2000 to 2004. The authorized max grant only increased $2000 from 1993 to 1994 and was stuck at $4500 from 1997 to 1999.
And according to factcheck.org...
Spending for Pell Grants grew from just under $8 billion in the academic year that was underway when Bush took office to nearly $12.7 billion three years later, a jump of nearly 60%.
Funding for the DOE was up %58 in the first 3 years of Bush's term, up more than it did during all of Clinton's eight years.
It looks Bush has been pretty generous with his funding of education, but it's never good enough for liberals, is it?
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:45 pmLies, Lies, Lies. It is completely impossible for the Chimp to tell the truth about anything. The only skill he has is lying, and he can't even do that right. IMPEACH, IMPEACH, IMPEACH.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:51 pmEducating our youth is a matter of national security. Quality higher education is quickly becoming an elitist activity, or haven't you heard the term 'adjunct', used more and more at the state level ...where tuitions are going up.
Quality higher education has to be available to all who qualify intellectually, not financially.
Of course we could always become a third-rate country that needs to send its kids to ... France, say, for a quality education.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:54 pm#173 No we are never happy. Because we are always looking for...
A More Perfect Union
http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/conlaw/conhist.html
On August 31 a weary George Mason, who had 3 months earlier written so expectantly to his son about the "great Business now before us," bitterly exclaimed that he "would sooner chop off his right hand than put it to the Constitution as it now stands." Mason despaired that the convention was rushing to saddle the country with an ill-advised, potentially ruinous central authority He was concerned that a "bill of rights," ensuring individual liberties, had not been made part of the Constitution. Mason called for a new convention to reconsider the whole question of the formation of a new government. Although Mason's motion was overwhelmingly voted down, opponents of the Constitution did not abandon the idea of a new convention. It was futilely suggested again and again for over 2 years.
Acting like you do makes you look like someone that misses the bad old days in the past. If you dont want to get better then just sit down and shutup while those of us that want to spend our lives improving things work at it.
And dont start no crap about on your dime. I came from a very poor family and worked my way to making a very nice amount of money now as a software engineer. I get taxed alot and I am not crying around about it. In fact I do other things to help people around me...whether it is donating to the ACLU or doubling or trippling the normal tip amount for a pizza guy I try to make sure I am spreading it around. Not drawing it all up close and rubbing my money all over my body like you greedy $$$ worshipers surely do in private.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:55 pm#163 NOT 173... >-(
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:57 pmWhat you want it both ways you want to bash the religious when it works for you and become one when it suits your needs. Gibby you are truly the most vile person on this site. You claim intellectual superiority then are incensed when anyone else lays claim to any intelligence. You did not make an argument you simply behaved, predictably may I add, in your typical sophomoric fashion. How do you know that I know nothing of the particular religious figures you named? What is your religious education and backround you sound like one of the fanatics which you often berate. Do I not have a right to what is mine? If not then you are a bolshevik and should be clear about that in your rants.
However I do believe in social responsibility, but I think it can be reasonably argued as to where communal responsibility begins. I happen to have be of the opinion that higher education is not a right. Obviously you are no better than the President whom you despise in wanting to suppress opposition and limit true freedom of expression.
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:57 pmof course, blackeye-on-the-human race, it DOESN'T occur to YOU that many, MANY people don't qualify for bank loans - which is why financial aid is offered - which is actually LOANS.
you are NO "educator" or you would be familiar with that process...
regardless, ever hear the old saying "doctor heal thyself" ? i suggest you take some lessons in true compassion and citizenship.
oh, and another observation: those ignorant asses screwing off for four years are, as a great majority, the spoiled rich republican jerks much like your hero W.
ever hear of "corporate welfare"? educate yourself about that one, then come back and tell us all how you think it's extremely important that All people should get the education they want and deserve...it's an excellent investment, a really good deal...
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:01 pmNot on http://www.c-span.org?
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:01 pmSounds like his false claim on Martin Luther King Day last week when Bush said he supports renewal of the Voting Rights Act of 1965.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:02 pmBowdler,
Maybe you are too young to remember the Church Commission. That's Frank Church of the U.S. Senate, from Idaho, of all places.
I'm old enough to have been through all of this before. The Church Commission concluded that there was probable cause to believe that Fred Hampton was murdered - that he was shot by an officer or officers... and it's all happening again, because like roaches, you have to keep spraying to keep these fascist pigs under control. Look it up.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:04 pmCall him brown-eye. Y'all know what a brown-eye is, dontcha? Everyone has one, just one, and they are usually full of shit. If he was close enough I'd turn his brown-eye black and blue with my foot.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:06 pmWallace, who commented as 8:49, autta quit being so retarded. He meant to say Dept. of Education, when he used the acronym DOE, but he as a moronic righty used the acronym for Department of Energy. Such morons, frightfully, also control the executive branch.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:07 pmI happen to have be of the opinion that higher education is not a right.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 8:57 pm
I happen to be of the opinion that arrogance and greed are not rights either... yet that doesn't seem to stop you.
A society is only as strong as its weakest link. And why you may rant about the people who cannot afford an education due to the misfortune of being born into a family lacking financial resources - and call them lazy. What we civilized human beings call it is discrimination.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:08 pmJoe,
Please ignore wallace. He's a 16 year old hack who can't get a date to the prom unless it's his sister. So, to relieve his anxiety, he comes in here and harasses people.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:12 pm#169 ...Just like with Intellegent design ...once you get shot down you start talking about freedom of expression... You are not under attack... you are just wrong and FEEL under attack. You can talk all you want. But it is all talk. When it comes to politics talk translates into actions. And if your type of talking is translated into actions it harms people. So I will call you out and if you cant take it without FEELing bad inside...I suggest you look in there...not out here.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:15 pmGerald,
Bullseye...! The hypocracy among the oxymoron known as conservative christians is astounding. Just watch on Sunday how the nastiest posts are from neocons just out of church... And they wonder why we don't invite them to parties (or attend theirs for that matter...)
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:18 pmA pell grant you ignoramous will not pay for that tuition. maybe it is you who needs the lessons in compassion and good citizenship. You still resort to your verbal oppression rather than engage in meaningful dialogue.
Again you assume you know what you obviously do not and you make a very large ass out of youself when you do so. I am indeed an educator.
I dont care what W did your the one obsesed with him. I would prefer to discus ideas but you obviously are incapable of that and really should be the one banned.
As for corporate welfare in general I do not support that either.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:20 pmI am indeed an educator.
Oh really? An educator who writes this poorly:
I dont care what W did your the one obsesed with him. I would prefer to discus ideas but you obviously are incapable of that and really should be the one banned.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 9:20 pm
You must be one of the teachers I see screaming at children, making them hate school as a result. You demean them because you think that you are better than they are. Makes sense. It matches your other self-righteous commentary.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:26 pm#180 -"As for corporate welfare in general I do not support that either."
the smartest thing you said all evening.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:30 pm#175 You presume too much also. I am very familiar with lady poverty and would not assume that one who is lacking financial resources is lazy. I did not say that. You did.
I simply dont believe that it is wise or our moral obligation to hand over a 100k education to everyone who wants to give it a go. Let them earn it. That is a very reasonable position. There is my mistake I am appealing to reason with unreasonable people. Where do we stop does everyone get a single family home? I'd like my mortgage paid. I could use a new car it is in the nations best interest that my children be safe. Where do we draw the line?
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:31 pm#173 You lttle weasel youd be six feet unfer before you landed the first punch.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:33 pmWhat could be more demonstrative of the need for higher education than the ignorance displayed by Concerned Conservative and Wallace?
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:38 pmblackeye,
I assumed nothing, just read your rant...
Another possibility is to actually earn, yes I know thats a four letter word to most of you but yes earn a scholorship by working hard and staying off the drugs that obviously most of you did way to much of.
Why should my tax dollars pay for your ignorant ass to go screw off for four years. I have seen it over and over boneheads wasting time, money and space. Its my money, Ill pay for my kids.
Ps I am an educator with probably more intelligence in my big toe than most of you have collectively.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 8:21 pm
Or did you forget that quickly? Must be all the Prozac.
I simply dont believe that it is wise or our moral obligation to hand over a 100k education to everyone who wants to give it a go. Let them earn it.
Hell, by your theory, we should put toddlers to work to pay for that 12 years in the public education system. Though frankly, after graduating form our education system, I think everyone has earned the right to higher education.
You treat education as if it were some reward to only be doled out to those who could unlock its magical cupboard with a very pricey key. Hoarding knowledge is not in the best interest of this country.
That is a very reasonable position.
Oh, because you say so!!!
Try http://www.dictionary.com. It's free.
There is my mistake I am appealing to reason with unreasonable people.
Hardly. You are raging against people who want to share and spread knowledge. That hardly sounds coherent or reasonable.
Where do we stop does everyone get a single family home? I’d like my mortgage paid. I could use a new car it is in the nations best interest that my children be safe. Where do we draw the line?
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 9:31 pm
Apples and oranges. The reason cars and houses cost money is because they require resources. Knowledge itself doesn't cost a thing. Look how much you are getting for free right here? Should we send you a bill? I think if you want to post here, you should pony up. Send Judd a check.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:42 pmYou keep going back to the Jesus thing. Why do you insist on labeling me? I am not what you think I am. You hope to put me in a box when you know nothing about me. I dont believe intelligent design should be taught in school. Stick to the point I know its hard but focus.
181 I know I cant type for crap and to keep it going I let alot slide. But truly I dont demean my students because they are almost all more mature and sophisticated in their arguments.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:46 pmblackeye, Do you have a problem with public education being funded by taxing those that live in that school distict? Or do you believe that all education must be funded by the family and paid to private corporations that teach? Our history has been public education, You know the old one room school house. What is your problem with that and why not extend it to higher education?
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:46 pm181 I know I cant type for crap and to keep it going I let alot slide. But truly I dont demean my students because they are almost all more mature and sophisticated in their arguments.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 9:46 pm
You are typing poorly because you are angry. You clearly have a short fuse. It is obvious from your posts, no assuming required. I have let you go on to see how far you would carry this. I am a high school science teacher.
Please post your school district here so everyone who reads TP can move away. You should not be an educator. Though my bet is that you are either a school library assistant or a substitute.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:53 pmLate to the post.
#64 — Gregor, the role of our government as originally designed included defense but not federal money for education, welfare, etc. — these relatively recent enhancements.
Comment by Concerned Conservative — January 23, 2006 @ 5:29 pm
We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Speaking of Chavez, isn’t he overdue for another Bush bash? The discounted heating oil to impoverished Massachusetts residents was pretty slick. Perhaps he could open the Hugo Chavez scholarship funding for needy Americans who’ve been denied student loans by their own richest-in-the-world government??? And Tiffany Cooper could be the first recipient…
Comment by unbelievable — January 23, 2006 @ 7:12 pm
Bush is blocking Venezuela from buying Seaplanes from Spain, weapons are so destablizing. We'd never sell weapons to third world leaders that dump oil money into their own country's poor, sets a bad example.
Nixon and gang …which happens to be the very same people in Bushes gang. They have come back from the Nixon years and are defying not only the will of the people today, but the will of the people that were pissed at Nixon then. They are flipping off the FISA rules which were created because of them. COME ON PEOPLE. They just swapped Nixon with Bush….
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:57 pmComment by Gerald Gibson — January 23, 2006 @ 8:16 Nixon should never have been allowed to escape and neither should these thugs. Nixon Dead-Enders held a grudge against everyone to the left of Goldwater for persecuting their poor Tricky Dick. Many of them went to their graves in denial. The result has been the successive waves of regression and now/soon repression. These guys MUST stand trial, not just Bush, there's enough malfeasance to go around. A proper RICO investigation would haul down most of the marquee names in the executive branch, the Republican Congressional "Leadership" and the RNC.
What make anyone think that the snooping and data mining has anything to do with National Security? FISA would have approved that, no sweat. Several posters have suggested political targets, let me suggest another possibility. These guts are among the greedyest bas+ards going, Lots of sensitive business info passes through a phone system every day. That kind of knowledge can make people rich, it can also be used to thwart rivals.
Sorry about the dives off topic, couldn't be helped.
Access to higher education is the best investment our government can make, from the increased earnings, hence taxes to the increased productivity. We've led the world in technology and innovation, due in no small part to our universal public education. We abandon that endeavor at our peril.
If blackeye IS an educator it is most likely living off our hard earned money! Now that smarts.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:57 pmI think blackeye could be another I-RIGHT-I persona, actually... Something familiar in the tone and the rage.
Not getting enough attention IRI? Poor baby.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:57 pmDid you know there was no public education and it wasnt possible to get books without alot of money in the years before America came into being? Ben Franklin started a cabal of men that used their wealth to start and fund public schools and libraries. But then again Ben Franklin was a fool ...
Groups of people pooling their money to help others is exactly what liberals want the government for. The ultimate pool of money. For things like social security. And so that we can know that poor people are getting the basic essentials and that poor kids are given a good chance to get out of poverty. Also pooling our money for national health care sounds good to. Pooling our money for a good military has worked out as long as contracters are not stiring up wars to get more of our money. In fact if we could some how pool our money and get houses and cars for everyone without making America into a communist state that would be ok to. And I dont see anything wrong with that.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:58 pm"From 2004 to 2005, 24,000 students lost their Pell grants, according to a report prepared by the Congressional Research Service."
Gee, just think, that's 24,000 former students who might be tempted by a U.S. military recruiter to join so the former student can get the money to go back to school once their commitment is completed...if ever.
Naw, this couldn't be a Republican strategy, could it?
Cut students loans, while expanding the incentives for people to join a U.S. military that has been experiencing some recruiting problems?
Personally, I believe, the "culture of corruption" Republican Party of today will stop at nothing to get their way...including yanking students loans away to try to get more college-age students to join the military.
January 23rd, 2006 at 9:58 pmAccess to higher education is the best investment our government can make, from the increased earnings, hence taxes to the increased productivity. We’ve led the world in technology and innovation, due in no small part to our universal public education. We abandon that endeavor at our peril.
Comment by CV — January 23, 2006 @ 9:57 pm
Bears repeating... late but not lacking CV :)
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:00 pm#187 "Knowledge itself doesn’t cost a thing" good then you dont need any pell grants at all.
Where in my rant did I say I was from a family that had means? Can you read?
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:00 pmA high school education is not unreasonable again dont put words in my mouth.
Oh and my postion is unreasonable because you say so?
That idiocy goes both ways. Have a discussion or dont but why waste time just being belligerent.
I am indeed an educator.
I dont care what W did your the one obsesed with him. I would prefer to discus ideas but you obviously are incapable of that and really should be the one banned.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 9:20 pm
Let's hope it's not spelling or grammar.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:02 pm#195 GREAT then do it with your money dont force it on everyone.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:03 pm“Knowledge itself doesn’t cost a thing†good then you dont need any pell grants at all.
hehehe good come back browneye...
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:05 pmCut students loans, while expanding the incentives for people to join a U.S. military that has been experiencing some recruiting problems?
Comment by The Oracle — January 23, 2006 @ 9:58 pm
Oh wise one, you have just described 80% of the smartest kids in my classes. They come from working class families (like me) who can't afford to send them to college, so most of them are signing up and shipping out.
I have tried talking a few of them out of it. Suggested scholarships, loans and grants. But there's bigger competition for them now, and smart + hard working (like Paris Hilton no doubt), and no longer enough, as it was when I received my scholarships (take that blackeye).
Bush just didn't expect to be called on it. I bet Tiffany's parents get audited this year.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:06 pm#190 Because college students are adults and can and should take care of themslves.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:07 pmHey lily I speak four languages and you?
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:09 pm#195 GREAT then do it with your money dont force it on everyone.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:03 pm
Cool - then let's do the same with the defense budget... occupation of Iraq... tax breaks for churches.... and tax cuts for the wealthy... just think, with all the money we'd each get back, we could start our own free university system!
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:10 pmGee, just think, that’s 24,000 former students who might be tempted by a U.S. military recruiter to join so the former student can get the money to go back to school once their commitment is completed…if ever.
Naw, this couldn’t be a Republican strategy, could it?
Cut students loans, while expanding the incentives for people to join a U.S. military that has been experiencing some recruiting problems?
Personally, I believe, the “culture of corruption†Republican Party of today will stop at nothing to get their way…including yanking students loans away to try to get more college-age students to join the military.
Comment by The Oracle — January 23, 2006 @ 9:58 pm
That would explain why Quakers are now enemies of the stat.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:12 pmhttp://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/columnists/sfl-phoward20dec20,0,1450122.column
Win the elections and have the debate. Have at it.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:13 pm#200 ... no... why dont WE go do it. That is the point of teamwork.
Really really check out what America did in WWII. When America DEMANDS something to happen...it happens. At the start of the war America had like three old aircraft carriers. Japan had about 12. By the end Japan had zero and America had about 89 or some crazy number like that. Not to mention thousands of bombers and fighters and other ships like the 1000s and 1000s of troop landing craft. We paid the millions of people in the military. We kept England afloat with supplies. We funded the single most greatest human creation of all time (nuclear fission). The list goes on and on and on. That was all right after America stoped most of the countries flooding problems because of FDRs New Deal hired 10s of thousands of people to build dams and bridges all over the place. Highways and rail lines. If America could give itself a New Deal back then and mobilize people that want to work to make it happen then we should. If we wanted to replace gas with hydrogen we can...hell doing that would be NOTHING compared to the effort it took to make the nuclear bomb. Look up what it took to make all those nuclear plants (first ever in human history) and come up with all that technology and the logistics to move people and materials around in secrecy. THAT is the America I am proud of. We should do that with every generation over and over. If we do China wont even have a chance against us.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:15 pm“Knowledge itself doesn’t cost a thing.â€
But books, school buildings, and teachers are not free. If you weren’t a Special Ed dropout you’d understand that simple concept.
Tell that to Socrates, Plato, Nietzsche...
The government could build the buildings once and they'd last for 100s of years. Up front costs that are cheaper than one month in Iraq. Students can still buy their own books. And instead of billions for bombs, we would pay the educators. My point, that you clearly aren't capable of understanding is that a college education doesn't need to cost $100K. And a free college education is cheaper than war.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:17 pmHey lily I speak four languages and you?
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:09 pm
I can form contractions and I know what a proper noun is.
2 languages, btw.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:20 pmWhere in my rant did I say I was from a family that had means? Can you read?
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:00 pm
I can read and so can unbelievable. You did say that you would pay for your kids' education with your money -no grants or loans.
In most people's mind that translates into well-off, if not well-heeled.
Oh and my postion is unreasonable because you say so?
Implying that anyone who doesn't get a scolarship is either lazy, a drug addict or both, sounds very unreasonable to me. Doesn't it to you?
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:21 pmWhere in my rant did I say I was from a family that had means? Can you read?
A high school education is not unreasonable again dont put words in my mouth.
Oh and my postion is unreasonable because you say so?
That idiocy goes both ways. Have a discussion or dont but why waste time just being belligerent.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:00 pm
http://www.dictionary.com It's free and can help you out with your lack of understanding of what words mean. Unlike you, I use words I know how to define. And you are the epitome of irrational. Has nothing to do with me. You're pulling it off all on your own...
You probably did come from a working family. But your insecurity over your perceived lack of worth has driven you to become a holier-than-thou snob who puts others down to make yourself feel better. Doesn't seem to be working so well, now does it?
http://www.dictionary.com
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:22 pmI did not know we went to war in Iraq to get the "Saddamist".
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:27 pmHave a discussion or dont but why waste time just being belligerent.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:00 pm
By the way, you aren't having a discussion, you are condeming and ranting. I'm just stating the obvious. Only a rage-a-holic with self-esteem problems would take it as belligerent.
The difference is I won't give you a second thought after I log-off, you however, will steam about being unable to convert anyone to your nonsensical, gluttonous way of thinking. Now, who does that make irrational (hint: you). Good luck with that.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:28 pm#190 Because college students are adults and can and should take care of themslves.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:07 pm
Boy are you detached from reality.
Hey lily I speak four languages and you?
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:09 pm
Obviously English isn't one of them.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:31 pmWin the elections and have the debate. Have at it.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:13 pm
We do win elections. The Supreme Court overrode the will of the people in 2000 and Diebold did it in 2004. But by 2008, even the conservatives will be voting Democrat as much as Peeping George has frightened them away.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:34 pm#214
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Defense is one word in a list of words. What does "general welfare" mean? That COULD mean college unless you are talking relative to the Congo. And what are "the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity"? Doesnt Posterity mean our children and childrens children? Blessings of Liberty could sure mean college... It sure didnt sound like WAR! WAR! WAR! if you know what I mean?
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:36 pmBecause college students are adults and can and should take care of themslves.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:07 pm
Sure they can. And like any other adult, they will need financial help.
The self-reliance myth you are trying to put forth doesn't hold water. Everybody needs help -that's what we are talking about here, not "handing over 100k" like you wrongly stated. That was a strawman of your own fabrication.
We are talking about loans, and how the Bush administration will make it more costly for kids to get a college education instead of helping them.
Most everything you are trying to argue is unreasonable because you are attacking a strawman.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:36 pm#209 Because I and many like me dont want to. I have my ideas you have yours. I encourage you to find your path and follow it as best as you can but let others have there path and follow it. But its not that simple there are times when our paths collide. It is then we as civilized persons must agree on a new path towards a solution. Often we have winners and losers because at that point something has to give. The losers need to respect the process and their brothers with whom they disagree and to whom they lost. When they can not accept defeat then wars begin. I am sorry to say but the left for the time being has lost. They can accept it graciously and attept to change the future or they can wage war. It seems to me that many on the left as is evidenced here have unfortunately chosen the later. These post are not productive, progressive or civilized they have all become the animals they despise.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:36 pm#217 ..another good come back hehehe
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:37 pm#213 not with assh##es like you.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:39 pm“Up front costs†What happened to “free�
Government pays for the costs, hence free to the citizens for use - just like public libraries, parks, and courthouses (or jails in your case as this hacking thing seems to be headed) are free to use.
“And a free college education is cheaper than warâ€
Tell that to the Jews murdered in WW2. National defense is the primary role of thefederal government. It is explicitly authorized by the Constitution. There’s nothing at all about college in the Constitution. You should read it some time.
We spend $380 billion annually on national defense. Iraq is costing another $5 billion a day. The country spending the second most on national defense only spends $52 million.
It's actually education that saves people from tyranny - not guns.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:39 pm#213 You think too highly of yourself your just another pathetic weasel like giddy who Ill never give another thought to.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:41 pm#222. When Bush Sr won... the left lost... When Bush Jr. was appointed in 2000 and deibold handed it to him in 2004 America lost.
As far as I have learned in my life Reagan didnt get into office like Jr. did. And as much as many people on this site dont like Reagan I personally thought he did some very liberal things ... like TALKING to the russians one on one as people and made them see him as a person. That was smart. And of coarse his whole "bring down this wall!" thing was pretty nonConservative as well. Bush doesnt seem like Reagan at all. Bush seems to hate the Constituion and the American way in general... He seems to think alot like those jewish priests in the days of Jesus.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:44 pmThese post are not productive, progressive or civilized they have all become the animals they despise.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:36 pm
#213 not with assh##es like you.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:39 pm
Hmmmm..... pot's calling the kettle black again...
We'd have better luck debating a turnip. blackeye doesn't understand compromise or consensus - just winners and losers. Sad. Please tell us where you teach, so we can make sure to stay far, far away. No child should be subjected to your hostility against peace and sharing...
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:46 pmGuns liberated Auchwitz, not education.
Actually, a lack of education, and religious fantacism, created Auscwitz. Had there been education and knowledge, there wouldn't have been guns.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:48 pm#221 #190 Was discussing public education and I believe he was proposing full funding of higher education.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:52 pm#213 You think too highly of yourself your just another pathetic weasel like giddy who Ill never give another thought to.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:41 pm
Yeah, like I believe you... But whatever, you have to live with yourself, and I get to turn off my computer and go hatch some more of those peace mongering, sharing, compassion plots to ruin your life...
But, think about this - when someone like you gets the notion to start charging for a public education - and you watch your salary fall to a private school teacher's wage, you'll only have your greedy ego-centric self to blame.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:52 pm#228 Ignorance allowed prejudice to flurish in Europe till it got to the point that people would just nod when someone would call Jews devil monkeys. Look at the south with its prejudice against blacks... you couldnt say they were the brightest people around. (Why you readin them thar books fur?) When people are forced to learn they find out much of the BS they picked up as a kid was just that. When germany started all that nazi crap they had a major brain drain from their country.
Take me for example. Growing up I honestly believed all other religions including judeism was devil worship...not wrong or something ...but I thought they actually worshiped the devil. Then when I started going to the library and reading everything... I found out I wasnt being told the truth at church... education can save lives.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:53 pm#211 I did not say no loans. You cant read.
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:54 pm#211 I did not say no loans. You cant read.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:54 pm
It's actually 'you can't read'. When you contract two words into one, you use an apostrophe.
Well, enough of you for one evening. Please ask your doctor to up your lithium dosage for you.
'Night all...
January 23rd, 2006 at 10:58 pm#211 I did not say no loans. You cant read.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 10:54 pm
So, when you said:
Its my money, Ill pay for my kids.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 8:21 pm
you were not really talking about your money; is that what you are saying?
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:01 pmPresident Bush is insane, but the press refuses to notice or say anything, so our nation is screwed now! Everybody in the White House is afraid to confront Junior, out of fear he will have them eliminated or something! It is a sad time for America, because madmen cause escalating wars until they meet their "Waterloo" like Napoleon!
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:08 pmI'm sorry to see all the name calling. This needs to be a reasonable conversation, because it matters to a lot of people. My own children did excel academically; they were home-schooled through high school and went to community college with the help of student aid. They were able to attract scholarship money from 4 year colleges because of their high grades; even so, there was a gap in what college cost and what they were offered. without Federal aid, it would be unaffordable. My daughter had some savings from working and managed to graduated with only a few thousand dollars in outstanding loans. Next was my son; he also worked and had some savings; he graduated suma cum laude, buthad an $11,000 loan to pay. During his last year, the Pell Grant went down--
so I know that students are getting hit hard by the rising costs of college and falling amounts available to help them through.
You can rant and rave all you want with your fantasies of people messing around in college on the tax payers' dime, but the reality is that as we spend less on student aid, hard working kids are being hurt.
Medical care, education--the costs of these used to be somewhat affordable so that a person could work to pay for them. Now people can be working full time and still not be able to afford college (or health care)
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:08 pmWhat kind of a society do we want to create?
Tiffany had a well thought out question. We know nothing of this fine young student, though we can surmise that she personaly knows of someone that is either losing their loan or will not be able to continue theit education. Being in Kansas the Land of OZ, she dared to pull back the curtain on the mighty OZ.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:11 pmGuns liberated Auchwitz, not education.
WTF is that? LOL!
Guns and ignorance put people in Auschwitz. Guns and education took them out. What's your point? Oh, I forgot. It's under your tin foil hat.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:12 pmConcerned Conservative
I just love how "conservative" people have no recourse (after what they have said has been proven even to them to be a stupid thing) other than to demand that others be "more appreciative". And you do this by taking away the thing that they are supposed to appreciate? Sure thing, if you vote repukelican.
You said:
Now, as has already been mentioned, people receiving education LOANS are receiving LOANS. Hello? They pay the money back, with interest. Hello? As has also already been mentioned, educated folks are much more likely to be good public citizens. Hello?
What more do you require, thank you cards?
Idiot.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:13 pmblackeye, Let's say you were born Niger. Do you think you would be in the same relative position you are now-wealth, status, education??
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:14 pmGood-nite, Unbelievable.
Such a nice lady. She was a conservative once, yanno. Most of us used to be.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:14 pmblackeye, let me put it on money terms(you like that). Education is a capital investment. A large well educated work force pays back dividends (more money). Move to a third world country with an almost totally uneducated work force and what do you get? No dividends. That makes it very hard for people to build corparations and make lots of money. Do you get it? Of course if you are running a diamond mine like Jesus Robertson you don't need educated people.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:25 pm#225 How do we compromise between two opposing forces. A thing can not be and not be at the same time and in the same manner. A choice "A" or "B" show me the compromise. Abortion or no abortion? Gay marriage or no? War in Iraq or no? Its one or the other it cant be both. The compromise is an understanding or agreement to abide by the Election results or the courts.
You know whats funny I started out questioning not loans but grants for higher ed and now people are saying I am planning on doing away with public ed all together. Does anyone see the disconect here.
There are hundreds of millions of dollars of scholorships which go unclaimed each year. I suggested working hard to obtain these loans and my words are twisted to say that I called people who dont get scholarships "lazy" when the word did not appear anywhere in my post nor was it implied. You cant have civil discourse this way.
My assh##e comment was meant for 212 I did loose patients after I was personaly attacked.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:25 pmblackeye-Why should my tax dollars pay for your ignorant ass to go screw off for four years. I have seen it over and over boneheads wasting time, money and space. Its my money, Ill pay for my kids.
Ps I am an educator with probably more intelligence in my big toe than most of you have collectively.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 8:21 pm
There are hundreds of millions of dollars of scholorships which go unclaimed each year. I suggested working hard to obtain these loans and my words are twisted to say that I called people who dont get scholarships “lazy†when the word did not appear anywhere in my post nor was it implied. You cant have civil discourse this way.
My assh##e comment was meant for 212 I did loose patients after I was personaly attacked.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 11:25 pm
Yea right!
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:33 pmBrown-eye,
If you have a teaching certificate, good for you. I find it highly suspect. You sure as hell don't have Ph.D. or even a Masters that the rest of us couldn't get for a few bucks off the internet.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:35 pm#232 Right
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:38 pm#238 Who said I am white?
#234 What was wrong with the community college? Its an Education.
#240 I did not argue against the need for an educated workforce. I argued against giving away money to unworthy causes. You assume our workforce would not be educated if the pell grants did not exist. I dont think thats true. I think colleges would have to tighten their belts and stop the 10% annual tuition increases.
blackeye- get off this blog. I am trying to be nice because judd want's us to- but, I am about to lose it with you. You don't even lie well. What is that saying? those that can do- those that can't teach. If the shoe fits wear it. Say that in French, German and Niger.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:40 pmWho needs money for education when we have tax cuts and a war?
Learning is for commie-bastards who read anyways.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:42 pm#243 Who gives a crap what you think you have no respect for anyone but yourself or a carbon copy thereof.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:42 pm#245 got that fascist thing down good dont you?
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:44 pmI argued against giving away money to unworthy causes.
What is more important than education?
You assume our workforce would not be educated if the pell grants did not exist. I dont think thats true.
Considering that Pell grants are set aside for the not-as-well-off, the argument isn't about generalizations but about taking money from this specific group.
I think colleges would have to tighten their belts and stop the 10% annual tuition increases.
Or the government could tighten it's belt and invest in the future.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:47 pmblackeye- good night. Your a total waste of time.,Also, what most of us here are fighting against is fascist- more like you.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:48 pmEducation is a worthy cause. Some of the clowns who recieve the money either don't deserve it or are wasting it. Give it to them in loans and they will use it more wisely and it will be a great investment.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:51 pmDoes it even matter anymore? When will people realize that it will take the majority of the citizens to demand accountability from anyone in office... and the sad truth is those needed to fight corruption and injustice are tuned out and could care less.
This is a democracy where the the majority rules, and they have spoken by being silent and averting their eyes to this.
Heck, the President could shoot a toddler with a shotgun and it could be headlined in every paper in the world... but not enough people will care to do anything about it!
The ship isn't sinking, it's already sunk!
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:53 pmI suggested working hard to obtain these loans and my words are twisted to say that I called people who dont get scholarships "lazy" when the word did not appear anywhere in my post nor was it implied. You cant have civil discourse this way.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 11:25 pm
You didn't imply it? Let's go back to what you said:
(...)earn a scholorship by working hard and staying off the drugs that obviously most of you did way to much of.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 8:21 pm
Pray tell, how are you not implying that people who didn't get a scholarship are lazy or drug addicts? Plus you called everyone in this blog a drug addict too.
It is very difficult to have a civilised conversation when you say something and then claim not to have said it.
My assh##e comment was meant for 212 I did loose patients after I was personaly attacked.
You are being passive-agressive. Your very fist post started by calling someone an "ignoramus". That's a personal attack. Don't try to play victim.
January 23rd, 2006 at 11:55 pmHe!He!He!He!He!He!He!He!He!He!He!He!He!
The thing is Tiffany; I don't actually run the country. I have my minions to do that for me. Dick's the brains of the outfit. They just wheel me out once in a blue moon; to show the American public that I'm compos mentis as Dick so lovingly phrased it. Is that right because my psychiatrist told me I’m definitely non-compos mentis. Anyway they said I needed to be seen in public to show that I don’t just live on my ranch, and to stop me from drinking Texas dry. What did Dick mean by that? I haven’t got a drink problem. I haven’t had a drink since breakfast time.
They told me that the GOP needed me to do some photo-ops. As I'm more photogenic than Dick Cheney, who apparently scars the kids and little old women, when he looks at them. So please no hard questions to do with the running of the country. That's the Presidents job, and Karl Rove isn't here. Come to think of it, I haven’t seen him in a while; he must be busy doing Presidential things. Now where has that hip flask got to, I need a drink.
January 24th, 2006 at 12:03 am[...] Ripped from Think Progress. Check out their post for the President’s entire response and a video link. Q: My name is Tiffany Cooper. I’m a sophomore here at Kansas State and I was just wanting to get your comments about education. Recently 12.7 billion dollars was cut from education. I was just wondering how is that supposed to help our futures? [...]
January 24th, 2006 at 12:06 am251 - "Give it to them in loans and they will use it more wisely and it will be a great investment."
this is my last post to you, black-eye...the post above is proof that you are not interested in any kind of discourse - you are not paying attention, you are not "listening"...as a result YOU are coming across as the "ignoramus".
oh, and this: "colleges would have to tighten their belts and stop the 10% annual tuition increases."..........nah, never mind...it's just too stupid to bother with...
g'nite all
January 24th, 2006 at 12:14 am#253 Did you read the first twenty liberal assaults on the pres and those who voted for him? How come this Double standard? I truly appreciate your calling me on here but lets put things in perspective I was simply responding in like kind. But ok Ill stop the retaliatory name calling will the rest of you?
In #156 I said most of you not everyone. Read critically.
#252 Thats how the other side felt aboutClinton. Do you feel their pain.
January 24th, 2006 at 12:20 amGive it to them in loans and they will use it more wisely and it will be a great investment.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 11:51 pm
How many times do we have to tell you? This is exactly what the thread is about: The Bush administration is cutting the funds that are used to provide students with loans. You still haven't bothered to read the article in the Chicogo Sun Times or even try to understand the replies to your posts.
After ignoring the replies and calling people names you have the nerve to claim you want to engage in civil discourse and meaningful dialogue.
January 24th, 2006 at 12:23 am#256 What happened? I truly would like to hear your point. A fresh voice is a good thing.
January 24th, 2006 at 12:24 amI have to admit I F##ked up I've been thinking grants. I try to do to much and saw grants somewhere and got stuck on it. My Bad. Now you can call me names. I am very embarrased and apologize. I actually thought someone else was making the same error the other way.
Thank you Gregor
January 24th, 2006 at 12:36 amCut, Reform, Whats the Difference. Too much Money allready Wasted on Education. I say do away with Education alltogether .
January 24th, 2006 at 12:40 amHELL, Your Knowledge is going to KILL You anyway. It allready IS ! yet, you dont see it. Less than 300 million people in america, the babyboom is long gone, more dying than there is born, hence population on the Decline, While Other nations Such as Chin and Indias Population is on the UPRISE. Last I heard, Chinas Population was Four times GREATER Than Americas Population, You want to Stop Immagration, Yet You allways want War. You cannot have it Both Ways. Your Freedom of Knowledge WILL Kill You, I guarantee it. Not a Threat, Just the Facts.
Browneye, do you know the difference between your and you're? Hardly a typo, you wank job.
January 24th, 2006 at 12:59 amWhat are these mythical other languanges of which you speak? I speak 6 languages. Does that make me better than you? You and other reich wing Conservatives give new meaning to the C-word.
I was wanting to reply to Micheal Jones # 33...I was wanting to know where he found that quote?
January 24th, 2006 at 1:12 am[...] A hurrah to Tiffany Cooper, a sophomore at Kansas State who asked the president, “Recently 12.7 billion dollars was cut from education. I was just wondering how is that supposed to help our futures?†[...]
January 24th, 2006 at 1:20 amThere are hundreds of millions of dollars of scholorships which go unclaimed each year.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 11:25 pm
Ok, no name calling, I promise. But please tell us how you came up with this figure.
January 24th, 2006 at 1:25 amI have to admit I F##ked up I’ve been thinking grants. I try to do to much and saw grants somewhere and got stuck on it. My Bad. Now you can call me names. I am very embarrased and apologize. I actually thought someone else was making the same error the other way.
Comment by blackeye — January 24, 2006 @ 12:36 am
Thank you for your intellectual honesty. I won't call you names -not my style.
To be fair, the thread is not just about loans but also about grants. However, if the funds for loans are restricted and so are the grants provided, kids trying to get into college are going to be hit by a double-whammy.
There is no putting it mildly: This is not a reasonable policy. All the billions of dollars put towards the ongoing conflict in Iraq -that will bring no real benefit to the American people- could very well be put to use towards education: One of the oft-cited reasons by business executives for outsourcing jobs to India, China, the Philipines, etc. is the lack of an educated talent pool.
Making it harder for kids to obtain a college degree can only make the situation worse for them in the immediate term, and for the country as a whole in the long term: Even conservative outlets like BusinessWeek and the Wall Street Journal are beginning to sound the alarm on the huge flow of resources (capital, knowledge, technology, etc.) going from the US to potential commercial and military rivals.
The fact that Pres Bush didn't even bother to check the facts before going to engage people in a Q&A session is sobering (no pun intended). Given the stakes of what I have mentioned above, he should at least have an idea of the cuts made, the reason for them, and a clear strategy to get the upper hand in a competitive world where rivals are looming in the horizon. In other words, he should actually be a leader.
January 24th, 2006 at 1:30 am
January 24th, 2006 at 2:43 amFunny Blackeye likes lowering the minimal aid the federal government gives to some of the people who will with others help lead this nation in the future, but he has not expressed that giving a soldier $90,000 might not be the best use of the taxpayers money, FYI I am a vet so I'm not vet bashing, but I don't see that as the best use of money.
January 24th, 2006 at 2:52 amNothing like abortions to bring the crime rate down. Just ask Bill Bennett. Have enough of them and we won't need prisons or Pell Grants. We can just keep importing Mexicans, as King Katrina loves to do. I'm all for it. Abort, import--and how about a warrantless wiretap while your at it, Rover
January 24th, 2006 at 3:02 amHere's the sad fact about education...
So long as those with money in this country can outsource their labor to other countries, it doesn't matter how educated you are, you will lose.
I'm a poor white trash kid, raised in the country by a single mother. I was 18th in my class of 475 in 1978. I got a $500 scholarship from a local sponsor, and borrowed money and worked 20 hrs per week during school for my first 3 years, with full time employment during summers. My senior year I worked 40 hrs per week while going to shcool. Was Dean's list 6 of 12 quarters. Was given a management position at the company I worked at during senior year when I graduated. One year later, the company started lay-offs, and I was one of the victims. I bar tended until I could get into graduate school.
While I was the last person picked for my graduate program I graduated with honors, and got a couple of part time teaching gigs at local univerisities. In one instance, I had higher teacher ratings than anyone in my department, and received a letter from the department head praising my work... but there was no funding for my position in the next semester, so I was on the street.
I picked up a teaching position at a community college that paid $10 per hour ONLY FOR THE HOURS I WAS IN CLASS, meaning any hours devoted to writing lectures or grading papers weren't considered. Because I took the job seriously and wanted to give my students a strong educational experience, I ended up making less than minimum wage for my efforts.
I moved to Florida, where there was a line down the block for every teaching position, so I took a contract job with Measurement Incorporated. These folks score many of the grade school and high school aptitude tests that your kids are taking right now. They demanded a Masters Degree, paid $10 per hour with no benefits, and this was project work. No guarantee you'd have a job 2 months from now. The room was packed with 50-100 people for every job that offered no security whatsoever.
As I search for a better paying job, there are college educated people around the planet who will work for $3 a day American who will insure that I don't have a high paying job. Hell, there are Doctors who are being put out of business by Indian Doctors who will read x-rays for less American money than an American has the right to charge.
My point in this ramble: It doesn't matter how educated you become in America. So long as there is a 3rd world counterpart for you who works the exact amount of time, with the exact amount of sacrifices, you will lose your job to him so long as NAFTA and other world bank policies are in place.
January 24th, 2006 at 3:07 amSuperEdo asked, "How is this man president? What a moron!...
January 24th, 2006 at 7:12 amSimple answer!!!!! The Republican Party is the party of morons and they are representative of the uninformed morons of the USA. I am embarrassed to be an American every time this dolt opens his mouth. We have become the laughing stock of the world.
Anyone have any comments on stuffing a sweet and mild top shelf illegal Cuban into an interns vagina? just thought I'd ask...
January 24th, 2006 at 7:18 amTiffany Cooper was found dead in a dumpster this morning, along with five dead babies. Authorities allege that she killed the babies and had begun to eat them, when she was stoned to death by a horde of righteous and patriotic Republicans.
January 24th, 2006 at 7:26 amKarl Rove, Mr Bush's electoral guru, warned leaders of the Republican national committee at their winter convention in Washington on Friday that sleaze could cost them power.
He said the party needed to learn from the Democrats that it could lose its dominant status "when political power becomes an end in itself".
January 24th, 2006 at 7:42 am[...] I came across this post on Maud Newton’s blog, where she’s quoting from GW Bush about fixing interest rates on students loans (apparently, this is a new change in the student loan program), despite the fact that it will potentially (likely, actually) allow corporations and other borrowers to get money with a lower interest rate. Click here for a more complete version of the story. Yet another example why it is clear that the phrase “the education president” was meant to be ironic. [...]
January 24th, 2006 at 7:46 amWhy did CNN allow this circus to go on? Money, money and more money. There is 3.6 trillion dollars missing from the white house that no one seems to know what happened to it. Its in the pockets of CNN,NBC,CBS,MSNBC, FOX and all the rest of the media. The first thing Hitler did in his rise to power was to secure the media with what funds he had. Own the media and control the world. Those that ignore history are doomed to repeat it. What we are seeing first hand is the rise of Hitler II, the first being just a test run. They learned from their mistakes the first time around. We should also learn from our mistakes and we should punish the media for their treason if by chance should wake up in time and take back our country. infowars.com prisonplanet.tv are just 2 ways to wake people up. There are many more.
January 24th, 2006 at 7:50 amI am so sick of Republicans I could just scream. Today seems worse than usual. Everything in the paper today was about Republican wrongdoing. My God, where do they come up with so many awful ways to screw Americans over?
Bush doesn't give a poop about America or Americans. All he cares about is money and power for himself and his rich, powerful friends. They are plundering America like their personal piggybank in the manner of Idi Amin and the other evil tyrants that litter history.
I hate Bush so much I can taste it, and there's not a damn thing I can do about it. This must be Hell. It's awful.
January 24th, 2006 at 8:29 amI am looking forward to President Bush's open responses to elementary students on the impact of no child left behind and graduation from high school. Probably won't take much to stump ole George.
January 24th, 2006 at 8:32 amJunior's like, hey, if I just do my best John Wayne impression, they'll all love me!
January 24th, 2006 at 8:46 amhead...going to...explode...must...impeach...arrrrgggghhhhhh...
January 24th, 2006 at 8:57 amYou left wing losers are really reaching with a stupid story like this. Name one president who could discuss details on each budget items--on the fly. I doubt most of you could even recall what you did on your jobs a week ago.
January 24th, 2006 at 9:18 amYou left wing losers are really reaching with a stupid story like this. Name one president who could discuss details on each budget items–on the fly. I doubt most of you could even recall what you did on your jobs a week ago.
Comment by Michael #280
Miscreant,
your kind never cease to amaze me...
You'd kill and eat your children if you thought it would make Bushiva look good...
Listen post-secondary education is one of THE most important components of this country's future in competing in the business world...
What leader (especially an MBA) wouldn't know if his administration had cut funding for higher education?
Bushiva flat out lied when he said they hadn't cut funding, only made the college loan program 'more efficient"...
...tell that to the thousands of students from poor/middle working class families who've lost their Pell grants, and (many) have had to opt out of college or dropped out...
Miscreant, I pray that god curses your kind and your false god Bushiva... you are all subhuman...
January 24th, 2006 at 9:26 amI plan on doing some talking about math and science and engineering programs so that people who graduate out of college will have the skills necessary to compete in this competitive world
What? junior's going to 'do some talking' so that people who 'graduate out of college' will have the skills?
Un-freaking-believable.
January 24th, 2006 at 9:44 amYou would think that they could have installed someone with at least half a brain to lead their corporate serving, war mongering administration.
No wonder they like to keep him on vacation at the ranch, no opportunity to make a complete fool of himself.
Bush has repeatedly said, "You're either for us or against us."
Against us.
January 24th, 2006 at 9:49 am#280 George W. Bush was visiting an educational establishment. He was using these college students as a photo-op and to get some much needed good publicity, which has been sadly lacking for him and his party in the last few months.
The mistake his advisors made, was to let him take questions from college students. Ask him a question on the 'War In Iraq' or his overall 'War On Terrorism' and he can rattle off his and the GOP's talking points.
But he wasn't addressing the military, at one of his organised many photo-ops. Where the military personnel stand behind him with fixed grins, and cheer and clap on cue like sycophantic fans' at a pop concert. He was in a college, and a student asked him a question about the cutting of student finances. The cutting of 12.7 billion dollars from education budget, affected Tiffany and her fellow students. All she wanted was an answer to a simple question.
As Tiffany stated in her question to Bush, "I was just wondering how is that supposed to help our futures." She was worried about her and her fellow students futures, and whether she had one. Silly girl just shut-up, and think as we tell you to think, and everything will be just fine, in Bush's la-la land.
Maybe Bush should make a visit to a Ford car plant. But let's make sure no questions are asked about future car manufacturing.
January 24th, 2006 at 9:51 amI'm not a Bush fan at all but did notice part of his reaction was cut out-- why was part of his reaction cut out? Video jump cut occured after this dialogue:
Bush: Student loans?
Tiffany: Yes, students loans.
Bush grimishes then JUMP CUT. Bush was doing some great face freak out but then he back to talking. What was cut out from video and why?
January 24th, 2006 at 9:56 amYes, Bush is an idiot. You did not know that already?
But, on the flip side, cuts in loans are needed. The cost of higher education is out of control, and the reason colleges and univerities can keep raising their costs is that students can get the money they need from student loans. This turns students into long term debtors and universities into blood sucking leeches living off tax payer money passed through students in the form of loans.
Saddly, I am sure the Republicans did not make the cuts with any of this in mind. They just see it as a cut that will effect "other people". This is a real problem that effects real people, but no one will do anything about it.
January 24th, 2006 at 9:58 amWho in the name of God still believes anything this clown says? When are the Democrats going to stand up and fight against this tyranny? I for one am sick and tired of listening to this liar day after day. HE MUST GO!!!!
January 24th, 2006 at 9:59 amTiffany Cooper is my hero. Too bad Bush had no idea what she was talking about.
January 24th, 2006 at 10:00 amDumbya must not have had his earphone plugged in, there must have been a malfuction ! The sewer rat (Rove) must not have been able to squeek instructions to his low brow automaton...a.k.a. HIs Fruadulently, Emperior Dimwit. You would think the CABAL that put this moron in power could have come up with a more convincing candidate..! It's amazing that this guy went to yale ! Jethro went all the way to the sixth grade ! He's a Rhodes Scholar compared to our "I ain't got no learnin', and you ain't gonna get any learnin' either", policy presented to you by the "war president" and his allies...the Imperial Republicans in Congress. They have drained the treasury for reckless policies here at home, and a foolish imperial war in Iraq. (The AFghan War IS the ONLY justified war we should be in, ANY DUMMY should know that! right Dumbya ? ) I guess that when you have a guy that is dumber than a bucket of dirt, your going to get the kind of answers he gave yesterday..! Geez...all that learin' and three more clueless years to go..!
Gene Campbell
January 24th, 2006 at 10:12 amCentral Florida
There was never a good reason to have the federal government involved in student loans. The program has resulted in millions in fraud and abuse because the program covers not only college but trade schools as well. This is another state issue usurped by the feds that should be returned to the state level. States have the real interest in education and should be required to help finance it;which was why Texas and California for example had in-state tuition programs that were very cheap.As a result of the federal programs, state college tuitions have creeped inexorably toward that of private colleges.
January 24th, 2006 at 10:15 amThe federal programs are,of course,not the sole determinant of the costs of college but why should the feds be involved in these programs at all?
In all seriousness, it is embarrassing as an american to know that this is the best that we can come up with to be the leader of the free world. It is a sad commentary to think we are that stupid to have allowed it to happen not once but twice.
January 24th, 2006 at 10:29 amSomewhere in George Bush's "brain fart brain" he knows that his off-the-cuff remarks are less than intelligent or more likely his handlers do. That's why he tells lamer than lame jokes. And guess what folks? The media falls for it. This morning on Good Morning America, instead of focusing on his faltering moronic answers, they focused on his jokes. They thought he was sooooo cute!
January 24th, 2006 at 10:42 amAn excellent question from the student, however, I think the average kindergartner could stump Emperor Bush.
January 24th, 2006 at 11:14 amIf I were Miss Cooper, I'd be a little scared. Kansas State seems to think it's okay to put home addresses and phone numbers for undergrads in a publicly available database.
January 24th, 2006 at 11:26 am#281
Reprobate,
I'm sure common sense, decency, and an honest perspective are quite foreign to you as well. It's so typical of you libs to expect handouts from the government. Perhaps if a lot of students were more concerned about working to pay for their own educations, than they were about partying and playing, this wouldn't be a problem. AND by the way reprobate, I don't know what god you're praying to, but he seems to have cursed you and your kind with blindness and madness--because of your absolute rage and hatred against things that are good.
January 24th, 2006 at 11:30 ammaybe they were right in cutting education funding, after all bush`s ivy league sheepskin was an entire waste of time and money...!
January 24th, 2006 at 11:31 am#290
"The federal programs are,of course,not the sole determinant of the costs of college but why should the feds be involved in these programs at all?"
Because collectively we are stronger. China and India are now graduating around ten times the number of electrical engineers each year than we are. If we leave the intellectual power of America up the States, then we will fail to compete globally. Competing in today's global economy requires a national strategy.
"The program has resulted in millions in fraud and abuse because the program covers not only college but trade schools as well."
I am so tired of hearing these "fraud" claims. Yes, some fraud exist. It exist everywhere. It is human nature. Compare the cost of this fraud to the benefits of the program and it is a moot point. Compare the cost of this program to the cost of one month of our military operations in Iraq and it makes it completely meaningless. We need to decide what is the best use of our money in America. Education is the best return on investment we can make.
January 24th, 2006 at 11:34 amYou guys !! Do't wonder why you ended up with him ...
YOU VOTED for him !
There was no and there is no "American" dream. The so-called american dream put you in your current situation. Pure ignorance for the rest of the world.
This man is the biggest disgrace any nation could hold in its history.
YOU should show him the way out !
ASAP!
January 24th, 2006 at 11:47 amBush is just window dressing a distraction, why do we keep falling for it. If you are so embarrassed and you should be.
January 24th, 2006 at 11:51 amStart organizing political meetings in your community with meaningful dialog and address all community, local and State issues and start from there. Move on and grow up.
#290 - Just because you don't understand why doesn't mean there isn't a good reason. This is a sickness that the republicans are infected with. They fail to understand or comprehend something, so they trash it. This is really similar to the way teenagers think before their brain kicks in to high gear after the hormone attacks.
How many of us as teenagers thought a certain class (like history or algebra) was ridiculous to take because we just couldn't see how it would help us later? "When am I going to need that"?
January 24th, 2006 at 11:53 amJust because YOU don't get it, doesn't mean that there is nothing to get!
That will be the last time Q&As are done without pre-screening by Bush's staff!
Under The Lobsterscope
January 24th, 2006 at 12:02 pm#279 - The admin is getting really worried about the thought of impeachment. That is why they are scurrying on this mission of "convincing" the public he is not a lawbreaker. This is always the sure sign they are feeling heat, they go on a 40-state tour. What rock stars they are.
January 24th, 2006 at 12:19 pm#62
January 24th, 2006 at 12:23 pmThe Republican'ts (as in can't think beyond provided "talking points") have made a bargain with Mamon...what moves them therefore is the invisible "cloven hoof" of the free market.
#25. a brain fart is one thing. An 8 year brain fart is quite another. People are dying and all this idiot can do is stand there, look stupid, and smirk. God help us all.
January 24th, 2006 at 12:39 pm#225 How do we compromise between two opposing forces. A thing can not be and not be at the same time and in the same manner. A choice “A†or “B†show me the compromise. Abortion or no abortion? Gay marriage or no? War in Iraq or no? Its one or the other it cant be both. The compromise is an understanding or agreement to abide by the Election results or the courts.
Comment by blackeye — January 23, 2006 @ 11:25 pm
Of course when you only see the world in absolutes, there will never be room for concensus or compromise. It's a big part of why I left the Republican Party and am a very loyal liberal.
None of the topics you listed are voted upon directly by in elections. They are all subjects that Congress and the Senate address. It's their job as our Representatives.
Abortion is not a matter of legal or illegal. It'a a matter of choice or no choice. A matter of personal freedom to say 'no' to abortion as much as to say 'yes' to it. That is the compromise. You don't force people to have chidlren they don't want to bear, while we don't force manditpry abortions when the population becomes unreasonable (see China).
Funding to education is also not a matter of 'yes we fund' or 'no we don't fund'. Funds can be directed and allocated for use in educaton for any range from $0 up to billions. The compromise would be somewhere in the middle. I might be an extreme liberal who wants free higher education, but I am also a realist who would be happy with equal opportunity loans for those born without priviledge. George Bush's Administration and the Republicans are desecrating that compromise between free and $100K education by removing access to student loans. This is where I am bothered. Free education is my ideal. Afforadable and available student loans is my relationship with reality. It's the stranglehold on them that is violating our middle of the road compromise and ignoring the balance. This is why we are upset. Because it's not about all or nothing - it's about middle ground concensus that works for the most people possible.
January 24th, 2006 at 1:46 pmGood-nite, Unbelievable.
Such a nice lady. She was a conservative once, yanno. Most of us used to be.
Comment by G.Gordon Giddy — January 23, 2006 @ 11:14 pm
Thanks Gordon... the feels mutual (but replace 'lady' with 'man' first of course :)
Ya know, I almost never believe anyone conservative who says "I used to be liberal"... :)
January 24th, 2006 at 1:49 pmTiffany, I have news for you, if your phone wasn't being tapped before, it is now. Remember the first commandment of our Constitution, Thou shalt not make our Leader look like a chimp, or a chump.
January 24th, 2006 at 1:59 pmThere is no putting it mildly: This is not a reasonable policy. All the billions of dollars put towards the ongoing conflict in Iraq -that will bring no real benefit to the American people- could very well be put to use towards education: One of the oft-cited reasons by business executives for outsourcing jobs to India, China, the Philipines, etc. is the lack of an educated talent pool.
Excellent posts Gregor, as usual... I thought this paragraph was especially worthy of repeating, because it is the basis for the forum, really. How our elected representatives are spending our hard earned tax dollars, and how we feel about that.
Definitely too many bombs. Not enough education. This IS a problem.
January 24th, 2006 at 2:01 pmThe president is getting beaten up in Kansas. KANSAS! Tiffany is now on the Pentagon spy list. Watch out, Tiffany ;-).
January 24th, 2006 at 2:09 pmbut he seems to have cursed you and your kind with blindness and madness–because of your absolute rage and hatred against things that are good.
Comment by Michael #295
Miscreant,
What's "good" about this administration?
What's "good" about racist, bigoted, homophobic, hypocritical, over zealous, treasonous, unsophisticated (politically and socially), incestuous, weak minded, frightened, cowardly, ignorant, isolated, xenophobic, mass murdering, corrupt, selfish, greedy, inhumane, subhuman, ill informed, shallow, mendacious, fraudulent, amoral, incurious, right wing Bushite inbreds?
January 24th, 2006 at 3:00 pmDefinitely too many bombs. Not enough education. This IS a problem.
Comment by unbelievable #308
unbelievable and Gregor,
This is almost certainly by design...
The network of military defense contractors, elected politicians and the investment community is a tawdry, vicious lesson in mercantile-political symbiosis...
..Those in power have a vested interest in keeping the "masses" divided through an elaborate system of sociopolitical and economic rewards and marginalization...
...the powerbrokers don't want their future generations of progeny to have to compete with too many from within this country, because they'll have enough "global" competition should their establishment of the New World Order not quite pan out...
January 24th, 2006 at 3:12 pm" ...and I plan on doing some talking about math and science and engineering programs...." Talking, and no more, even if he doesn't fathom any of those fields (Pseud-science aside.) And, oh, right: "But I think i’m right on this." Of course, he's always right. In the context of his exchange with student, right on what? Just another throw-away phrase.
January 24th, 2006 at 3:53 pmHow come nobody resopnded to #163? According to FactCheck, Bush has spent more on education than Clinton overall. Here is one of their articles:
http://www.factcheck.org/article162.html
January 24th, 2006 at 7:05 pmHow come nobody resopnded to...Bush has spent more on education than Clinton overall.
Comment by TimeForChange #313
TimeToChangeYourPad'erParty,
Cause that dumb sombitch STILL didn't learn anything...
January 24th, 2006 at 7:26 pmHow come nobody resopnded to #163? According to FactCheck, Bush has spent more on education than Clinton overall. Here is one of their articles:
http://www.factcheck.org/article162.html
Comment by TimeForChange — January 24, 2006 @ 7:05 pm
Welcome back-Wally/iri--Dirt bags. Why would die hard pepugs brag about the feds spending our "hard earned money"?
Is there anything that you really believe in? Just keep posting your talking points--they really impress us. I thought you few "dead enders" wanted to eliminate the Feds having anything to do with education--Now your proud of how much of my "hard earned money" your moron is spending on it.
What is it? The feds spend a lot on education or they have no business doing so? do you have an ansewer?, or do you not have a current "talking point" for that?. I give you 5 to check with your masters on this. GO!
January 24th, 2006 at 8:05 pmEnd of -timeforhavingchangeoflife. Masters are busy can't come up with talking point just now--might have a really good one soon as soon as someone gives it to me. Waiting! Should be a bute.
January 24th, 2006 at 8:16 pmMy Foot, Bush's Ass.
Anyone got a rope?
January 24th, 2006 at 8:48 pmActually, I think what we did was reform the student loan program
Translation, Tiffany: When a Republican starts talking reform it means one of two things: The poor get fucked while the rich get richer or More of the same shit, only slightly less obvious.
In either scenario, assholes pucker from coast to coast at the sound of the word "reform."
January 24th, 2006 at 8:57 pmTiffany, why do you need a student loan in the first place? Under GWB's Theocracy Plan, all the education you need to know is that 'God Did It All'. Why go into debt for years to learn this? If you want to get ahead in this world all you need is to wear a big cruxifix around your neck and say 'Praise Him' incessantly.
January 24th, 2006 at 9:29 pmTimeforchangeoflife--RNC busy? can't get talking points? Sounds real strange -try useing your own brain. It hurts at first but, try it-you'll like it.
January 24th, 2006 at 10:13 pm....And I was the one to get shot??
January 24th, 2006 at 11:48 pm-JFK
hey JoeFriday (dumbass) - i'm sorry that I have a life and don't sit refreshing thinkprogress.org every 5 minutes to see if someone replied to my responses. i don't need talking points. its very simple really. i think the government should increase spending on education when it can be afforded. as someone else put it, its an investment in the future of our country. according to factcheck.org, the bush administration has spent more than the clinton adminstration on eduction. so i'm happy about that. shouldn't you be too? or is the issue at hand actually unimportant to you as long as it makes the adminstration look bad?
you see, you are the one spouting the talking points. You can't seem to think outside the box of your bush hatred. first hate bush, then alter every issue so it fits into that view. not very smart. sad really. but keep it up please. it will only keep you further from power which helps the whole country.
oh and next time it would be nice if you responded to the content of the post rather than making ad hominem attacks. who am i kidding.
have a good life and keep the lights off in there.
TFC
January 24th, 2006 at 11:55 pmwally=blackeye=timeforchange= lame
January 25th, 2006 at 1:55 amThat statement was signed by Concerned Conservative. Concerned about what? That Student Grants and Loans may build a stronger, more independent America? That we will remain technologically advanced?That we will once again be able to compete in the world market? What you lack is the ability to carry a thought through to it's logical conclusion. That comes from never thinking for yourself , getting your "talking points" from the likes of Dittoheads.
January 25th, 2006 at 7:54 amWithout these education programs we will be left with an elitist society where only those born to priviledge can advance. That will leave us with leaders like GWB and his gang of thugs. Inept people who rise to great heights inspite of a clear lack of ability, using family ties and cronyism to cover up their bumbling.
Yes, you are right. We can't afford a country where ability,intelligence,results and hard work matter more than who your connections are.
what the hell does wally=blackeye mean? instead of being so paranoid on here it would be nice if someone would finally address the content of my comment.
January 25th, 2006 at 8:56 amI didn't know they were cutting the Education budget.
January 25th, 2006 at 12:31 pmAre you sure? I asked Bush and he didn't know anything about it.
I hope you guys realize you are all being monitored by the NSA. I'm for spying without authority. I'm for cutting student loans. I'm for whatever Bush is for. Ah, I'm for spending all of our money in Iraq. I'm against anyone who is against this administration's policies. I'm for a dictatorship if they are for it. I've got to be on the good side of these guys. It's dangerous to go against them.
January 25th, 2006 at 2:05 pmYou can’t seem to think outside the box of your bush hatred.
Comment by timeforchange #322
wristwatchpanhandler,
It comes in a box?
Geez, that's gotta be a real money maker...
Why didn't I think'a that?
January 25th, 2006 at 3:28 pm#267 I agree. But sometimes you don't have a choice.
#323 Not true. It seems I was shut off.
#305 You're mixing apples and oranges. There are times when compromise is possible and times when it is not. You don't compromise on the number of slaves one may own that's ridiculous. I don't see all in black and white but some things are in and of themselves right or wrong, good or bad. Isn't that what most of you are screaming about?
As a side note when anti-abortion forces try to compromise by proposing measures such as parental notification restrictions it is the left which refuses to compromise.
January 25th, 2006 at 7:12 pm[...] But the subject matter here directly impacts Abby and since it speaks for itself, here it is. Watch the video if you can, it speaks volumes. [...]
January 25th, 2006 at 11:57 pmIn listening to the audio of Bush respond to Tiffany Cooper's question, I am struck by one aspect: you can almost feel Bush's head snap to a state of wariness when he realizes the audience is applauding Tiffany's question. The attempt that follows, by Bush, to dismiss, to obfuscate, is pathetic and obvious, but reaches a high point when Bush comes up with the concept of "reform." The red-Kansas audience broke the zombie-love for just a minute when it responded (applause for Tiffany) to something real, but sadly fell back into the dutiful state of stuporous "respect" for authority as Bush groped for a way to deflect and distort the truth. Very sad. The students, all of the Young College Republicans, who behave this way are much scarier than Bush and cronies. Until these zombies break through the brainwashing they have undergone and start booing when leaders like Bush stand in front of them and LIE to them, nothing will change. I hate it so much.
January 26th, 2006 at 2:32 pm#305 You’re mixing apples and oranges. There are times when compromise is possible and times when it is not. You don’t compromise on the number of slaves one may own that’s ridiculous. I don’t see all in black and white but some things are in and of themselves right or wrong, good or bad. Isn’t that what most of you are screaming about?
No, it's not apples and oranges at all. Besides we were talking about concepts - not tangibles. The reality is that 'right' and 'wrong' are personal choices. In some cultures they think cannabalism is acceptable. Here, we do not. Right and wrong are subjective. So, even then, there are NOT absolutes.
As a side note when anti-abortion forces try to compromise by proposing measures such as parental notification restrictions it is the left which refuses to compromise.
Comment by blackeye — January 25, 2006 @ 7:12 pm
This is not compromise. It's still about controling someone other than yourself. Again, as you seem to be thick, I'll repeat myself - compromise is you deciding what to do with your body and everyone else getting to decide what they do with theirs. You having any say in anyone else's body is you wanting dominion over others. That is NOT a compromise.
Why do you people need to control others so desperately? Mind your own business and we won't mind yours. That's the compromise. Don't like it? You'll like it even less when someone is keeping you alive by a feeding tube, while you linger in excrutiating pain and you can't do anything about it for five, ten, twenty years...
January 26th, 2006 at 9:12 pmThis is the world conservatives want: When they outlaw condoms, so everybody has aides, and make the world safe for pollutors (so they can make enough money for an oxygen machine), and stop affirmative action (because Republicans are really racist pigs and they know it) and put the women back in the kitchen, (because that is what they really want, to put people where they want them)but you can't eat anything because there are no regulations for water or air (no EPA) and no food and drug administration to make sure your cows are safe to eat, (so they all die of mad cow disease) and they are never taxed so, they don't have any police, safe roads or a fire department. Then they will be in heaven right?
January 27th, 2006 at 2:08 am#332
Now I know why you are "unbelievable". If there is no such thing as absolutes. Then no one is correct on any issue including you. It's simply your opinion.
You try to use an absolute statement to prove there are no absolutes. That is contradictory and not logical.
January 27th, 2006 at 7:44 am#332
January 27th, 2006 at 7:49 amI have no desire to control others bodies simply to protect the body of the defenseless unborn child.
#333
January 27th, 2006 at 7:53 amGrow up.
[...] http://thinkprogress.org/2006/01/23/sophomore-stumps-bush/. [...]
January 27th, 2006 at 11:03 am[...] http://thinkprogress.org/2006/01/23/sophomore-stumps-bush/. [...]
January 27th, 2006 at 11:03 amYour desire to save an unborn fetus? And yet you agree with the war in Iraq? The killlings of thousands of innocent people for a lie? How about when the baby comes out? You don't support agencies that help children and you want to cut welfare programs that directly affect poor children in need. Conservatives are nothing but a bunch of people who don't want to contribute to society accept to control them. You grow up!
January 27th, 2006 at 11:06 amIt strikes me with all the talk of idealogues in the media, that we dont talk about how that might apply outside of supreme court appointments. My point more directly might be, why are so many of the anti-Bush comments based on hyperbole (exaggeration)? Can the issue of whether or not Bush has cut money out of the grants and student aid be discussed? Is Bush awkward, yes. But even this liberal thinks that the discussion is slanted towards hatred from the left rather than discussion.
January 27th, 2006 at 11:36 amBy the way tax the rich, except rather than accept.
January 27th, 2006 at 11:38 am#339 Blah, Blah, Blah.
That's it change the subject when you can't have the debate.
January 27th, 2006 at 1:54 pm#341 If there are no absolutes how is it you find justification to call right or good those things which you prescribe? Or wrong and bad those things you proscribe?
January 27th, 2006 at 2:03 pmSorry Allen I meant that foe "TAX"
January 27th, 2006 at 2:16 pm25 years after I paid back my 7% student loan, I still don't see how that was an entitlement. I paid back the $20,000 and over half a million in federal taxes thrown in on top. My opinion: no limits on total loans and enforce the collection from deadbeats.
January 27th, 2006 at 3:18 pm#332
Now I know why you are “unbelievableâ€. If there is no such thing as absolutes. Then no one is correct on any issue including you. It’s simply your opinion.
You try to use an absolute statement to prove there are no absolutes. That is contradictory and not logical.
Comment by illuminate — January 27, 2006 @ 7:44 am
Yes, because I don't believe in your nonsense. I think for myself. Something you clearly do not to to not understand such a simple concept as 'perspective'. Right and wrong is subjective. http://www.dictionary.com in case you don't understand what those words mean either.
And as usual, no examples, facts or logic - just venom and nonsense. Give me some examples of real world absolutes, then. Or just shut up.
#332
I have no desire to control others bodies simply to protect the body of the defenseless unborn child.
Comment by illuminate — January 27, 2006 @ 7:49 am
January 29th, 2006 at 12:18 pm#332
I have no desire to control others bodies simply to protect the body of the defenseless unborn child.
Comment by illuminate — January 27, 2006 @ 7:49 am
Then you are a complete moron to think you can affect one without affecting the other. Have you actually considered that you need some one else's womb to grow a fetus inside?
And by the way, how many kids have you adopted that you forced into existence?
Get out of your fairytale and join us in reality where we live. Moron.
January 29th, 2006 at 12:20 pm#341 If there are no absolutes how is it you find justification to call right or good those things which you prescribe? Or wrong and bad those things you proscribe?
Comment by illuminate — January 27, 2006 @ 2:03 pm
Personal choice. It's why I think abortion is acceptable and you don't. There's no absolute to tell us. And for you to scream that there is, is proof that you live so far removed from reality that the only way to get people to have contact with you is to come in here and start insulting them without a single fact or logical thinking.
Give us some facts.... go ahead. I bet you can't.
January 29th, 2006 at 12:24 pmI love G. Bush!! All you hippy liberals are just media conformist pussy's.
January 29th, 2006 at 7:50 pmI love G. Bush!! All you hippy liberals are just media conformist pussy’s.
Comment by Kathryn — January 29, 2006 @ 7:50 pm
Couldn't get a date, so you came here to rant? Try cleaning up your vulgar mouth for starters...
January 30th, 2006 at 5:48 pmThank you #350. Apparently Kathryn still believed uncle Joe's (goebbels) "liberal media" myth. She probably also think that FOX is "fair and balanced."
dan
February 3rd, 2006 at 9:57 amI would hardly say this foolish girl 'stumped' our president. And it IS tough to come up with a nice way of telling students that the tax payers aren't going to support their life-long progessional student careers. Go out and GET a job and start PAYING some taxes. Stop leeching off the government to support you.
Oh, and while you're at it little Tiffany I hope you are majoring in a subject that has some use. The world doesn't need any more philosophers or english literature majors. People who major in those subjects should quit wasting tax dollars and jump to the chase: just get the job waiting tables right now. Save yourself the wasted time.
February 10th, 2006 at 1:46 pmWhat idiots. There needs to be a union for college students to force the nation to recognize that students are the future for this countries overall economic stability, and exemplify that the result of cutting funds is not the move needing to be taken if we are expected to better ourselves as individuals dictated by society. If society dictates you go to school and then to college, tax payers(us, the government and the media need to all come together and put their money where their mouth is.
February 11th, 2006 at 6:50 pmWorking students, especially, cannot handle these cuts. We must be recognized as courageous and moral indivuals with high esteemed goals that are appreciated and supported, not only by society, but the majority of the leaders in this nation.
Bush and David Horowitz - what a team in support of educational excellence.
February 20th, 2006 at 2:03 pmhm
February 27th, 2006 at 4:12 pmWell according to USA TODAY ,under the present administration , student aid has increased 17% over the last 5 years to the highest in the history of the program. Having said that I will also state that I am proud to be one of the few AMERICANS that worked two jobs and paid my own way through school . Too bad that we have become a nation of lazy people waiting for a handout from everyone around us. You splineless jellyfish need to find another country to go ruin. When the Mayflower came over here the people aboard looked to the new world as a place to work NOT a place to hold out their hands.
March 16th, 2006 at 12:58 am#310 racist, bigoted, homophobic, hypocritical, over zealous, treasonous, unsophisticated (politically and socially), incestuous, weak minded, frightened, cowardly, ignorant, isolated, xenophobic, mass murdering, corrupt, selfish, greedy, inhumane, subhuman, ill informed, shallow, mendacious, fraudulent, amoral, incurious, fits Clinton regime more than Bush
March 21st, 2006 at 3:20 amUh, Excuse me Jim West,
BUT YOU COULD WORK 14 JOBS WHILE IN COLLEGE AND STILL BARELY MAKE TUITION MORE THESS THAN ALL THE "FEES" , BOOKS AND LIVING EXPENSES ASSOCIATED WITH GETTING THAT DEGREE. Tuition is DESIGNED to get you in DEBT so that you become a WAGE SLAVE to the system.
Do you think people actually LIKE getting into debt 30K BEFORE even graduating and getting that first job which by the way more than likely in this crappy economy will be low wage, low skilled, no benefits, part time hours , non-major specific WORK?
P.S. And the people coming over on the Mayflower had a hidden agenda of stealing land from the indigenous people and then shipping blacks from Africa as slaves over for cheap labor to develop it,. Africans MADE the American economy...not no Europeans on the MAYFLOWER..
March 30th, 2006 at 1:44 pmDon't believe that GARBAGE history babble they feed you in high school.
WISE UP and actually stop being mentally lazy, dig deep and do your own scholarly research as to TRUE history!!!
#359
April 5th, 2006 at 4:28 amparagraph #1 All I am saying is if I can do it coming from a poor background and I know ohers have ......then why can't others ?
paragraph #2 We all get into debt in order to make a living .I was over 50K in RED beforte I saw profit in my business. The only thing wrong with this economy is a great majoity of our young people have become a bunch of lazy , depedent on entitlements , wothtless,narrow minded,puppets of the Liberal Media. I am 58 years old and I pay for my kids to go to two Universities PLUS I probably pay for about 10 other kids that I don't even know.....all because I am a hard worker. You come and follow me at my job everyday and watch what I have to do to make a living and I know will will then understand the UNFAIRNESS of our student support system as it is today. WORK WORK WORK TRY IT ITS GOOD FOR YOU.... WHAT A CONCEPT.HUH? My Daughters Boyfriend sells new cars and makes up to $700 a day Part-time and totally pays his way thru TEXAS TECH he is 22 years old . He never stops thinking about other ways to make money as well. If you want to in AMERICA you can the last four letters in AMERICAN SPELL I CAN. Go to TECH school learn a SERVICE trade you'll be in great demand and get a good paying job.
paragraph #3 I don't believe the people came here to enslave blacks that wasn't even on the burner when they landed here ....you revise history all the ways YOU want it. I am a GERMAN -AMERICAN and I grant you that we were not part of that group anyway. We cam e in 1850 and worked hard and struggled and pushed our way to the top...we were poor but managed to do better every generation. My Philosophy is WORK HARD ,AND THEN FEEL GOOD LOOKING AT WHAT YOU'VE ACHIEVED..................TRY IT !!
eyoung ..........................you there ...............i miss you...............I wish I could quit you !!
April 14th, 2006 at 11:02 ameyoung ....and if the Pilgrims did do that I would not like Pilgrims forever.....because now this country is being taken apart by them ....and you know "THEM " is
April 18th, 2006 at 9:20 pmlooks like this board was killed by "MR LOGIC"
April 29th, 2006 at 10:50 amMAYBE IT EYOUNG AND ESTUPID OR IS IT EWETBEHINDTHE EARS? EBEDWETTER ? elazyazz?ebigmouth?
April 29th, 2006 at 10:52 amEEEEEEEEEEEEEE......................................WHAT
April 29th, 2006 at 10:54 ammaybe this is the EEEEEE ENN
May 2nd, 2006 at 11:55 pmeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
May 16th, 2006 at 12:43 amGee, if we were immigrants we wouldn't have to worry about having the money for college, because we'd get to go for free. Along with free medical, tax free income, free everything. They get to live here while all of us pay for their education, while we struggle to save money for our own children to go to college. Our government is more worried about illegal immigrants future then it's citizens future.
May 17th, 2006 at 10:32 amu go amy
August 13th, 2006 at 9:20 amI was there. I'm a Kansas State Uni senior and decided to see what ol' Bush had to say. I went with an open mind, though I'm usually not very pro-Bush, simply because I AM of the mindset that once you're "stuck" with a President , you may as well try to make the best of it and not entertain too many thoughts of civil war.
Anyhow, I was APPALLED by what he had to say about education. While my friends and I snickered as he kept saying "nucular," when it came to Tiffany's question, I sat on the edge of my seat, eager to hear his response. I was awarded with an unintelligable, incorrect and downright dishonest answer. I couldn't have been more disappointed. For me personally, that was kind of the last nail in the coffin, laying any support I might have had for our President to rest. (The first nail was Fahrenheit 9/11) The man sickens me, honestly.
There really were about 9,000 people there, however. Yes, mostly white. Yes, a lot of military from Ft. Riley. Yes, a lot of down-home, good-ol'-boy types that seem prevalent here in Manhattan, a very agricultural-based town. Bramlage Coliseum was filled to maximum capacity, though I think a few students or staff must have stood in the mile-long line for a ticket just so they could not show up and leave some empty seats.
Anyway, that's my account.
August 14th, 2006 at 2:20 pm370 you are just another little lazy snott nosed excuse for an American......Why is it that stumbling around to search for an anser is dishonest ,while having a slick polished bunch of BS for every question is honest ..........CLINTON BAFFLED THEM WITH BULL SHIT and now you have to whine you betwetting little lazy -wont work-so illegals will do it for you asswipe..........and by the way the question was stupid if you look at the paragraph below Bush probably could understand why she asked it' I came from a time when everyone WORKED their way thru college...........WHAT A CONCEPT.......U LAZY SACKOSHIT
Well according to USA TODAY ,under the present administration , student aid has increased 17% over the last 5 years to the highest in the history of the program. Having said that I will also state that I am proud to be one of the few AMERICANS that worked two jobs and paid my own way through school . Too bad that we have become a nation of lazy people waiting for a handout from everyone around us. You splineless jellyfish need to find another country to go ruin. When the Mayflower came over here the people aboard looked to the new world as a place to work NOT a place to hold out their hands.
August 17th, 2006 at 10:16 pm[...] More importantly, this administration has had a particular aversion to increasing aid to compensate for increased costs and inflation. In particular, George Bush has failed to meet one of his campaign promises to increase the Federal Pell grant. Pell Grants: Pell Grants have been frozen or cut since 2002; they are now stuck at a maximum of $4,050. In his 2000 election campaign, President Bush promised to increase the maximum Pell Grant amount to $5,100. “From 2004 to 2005, 24,000 students lost their Pell grants, according to a report pre-pared by the Congressional Research Service. This was the first drop in the number of students receiving the grants in several years; the number had been growing steadily since 1999.†[...]
September 4th, 2006 at 1:03 am372 ......Was that a per capita reduction ? Did you ever think that there are more Parents( I FOR ONE) now able to pay for their kids edu and that more students are working higher paying jobs(MY DAUGHTERS BOYFRIEND PAYS HIS OWN WAY AND SUPPORTS HIS MOTHER AND SISTER BECAUSE HIS FATHER WAS A DEADBEAT DAD) to pay their own way thru school OR is it the usual DemocRAT montra of the far left .......
September 18th, 2006 at 9:32 pmI am glad you have the ability to work. I am an American Indian and the tribe I belong to was pushed way in the corner and not part of this country until the 70's. that is when we received money back from the government for our land they stole; however I am a returning student because, after having two strokes with some permanent side affects, I was denied SSI 3 times so I had to try to find something I could do at least for some money. I am receiving a Pale grant but it is not much considering I do not have any income whatsoever because I am unable to work and go to school becuase of my side affects. I came from not being able to walk and talk and without help from the goverment I can do both and I am just about to graduate with a degree that is not going to help me at all. I took the other classes to get the degree but it is the side classes I am taking that will actually benefit me in my pursuit of employment.
November 15th, 2006 at 12:54 amAs for paying for the addition amount of kids going to school I did the same for many years but when It comes to my time that my hard earned money and contributions that were given to help the less fortunate get education is barely helping me because the current adminstration worries more about abroad cercumstances than whats happening in their own land.
[...] The administration didn’t screen the Bush audience in Kansas. They never suspected that a college sophomore could stump a Harvard and Yale graduate. (We’ve known that for a long time. Here is the TV clip and transcript.) http://thinkprogress.org/2006/01/23/sophomore-stumps-bush/ *************************************************************** [...]
November 21st, 2006 at 5:42 pmBC Oh I forgot to mention I am 1/4 Blackfoot. Nam Vet carring schrapnel in left hip area. I fight here now to stay on top and send lazy asses kids to school ................Nothing can stop me.........Nothing !!! I work out and eat health food I plan to fight until I die of old age..............why not join me! That Hillary so and so was the only Senator that refused to visit the Gold Star Mothers.........yet she voted fro the War in Iraq ? Quit holding your hands out and put your mind and body to work ...If you were able to think up and write that post there is no reason you can't become a drop shipper making 10,000 a month on EBAY !!! Throw away your "stroke crutch"
January 23rd, 2007 at 11:35 pmCourage from Tiffany...
I’m not sure if anyone caught this, but a sophomore from Kansas State named Tiffany Cooper took a stand against Bush’s cuts to student loans and Pell grants. It took a lot of courage for her to do this. I know that, especially in Kansas, a ...
March 25th, 2007 at 9:50 pmCum Swallowing Cum Cum Eater
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