DeWine: ‘We Don’t Want To Have Any Kind of Debate About Whether Its Constitutional’
DeWine: ‘We Don’t Want To Have Any Kind of Debate About Whether Its Constitutional’
The White House announced its support for a legislative proposal by Ohio Sen. Mike DeWine to exclude Bush’s NSA wiretapping program from the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. ThinkProgress explained earlier why the proposal is a bad idea. Tonight, on Fox News, DeWine explained his motivations:
You know, there’s been some controversy about whether or not this program is legal or is not legal. I think we need to get beyond that. And the vast majority of American people believe these calls need to be listened to. But we don’t want to have any kind of debate about whether it’s constitutional or not constitutional. So I think we need to put that beyond us.
The reason DeWine and the White House don’t want to talk about the program’s legality is because the program is illegal. DeWine is attempting to fix a problem that he hasn’t even properly diagnosed. Even Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Arlen Specter isn’t buying DeWine’s spin:
Unless they’re prepared to have a determination on constitutionality as to their programs, window dressing oversight will not be sufficient.
President Bush said today, “I mean, a lot of lawyers looked at this, and they said, you bet, Mr. President, it’s legal.” If he’s so confident about that, why is he so afraid to have a debate?
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Once again, this is only the start. Remember, the NSA illegal wire tap scandal is only two months old. It took two and a half years for Watergate to reach critical mass. Time will cuff these skels.
February 17th, 2006 at 7:05 pmFor the latest news, legal documents, timelines and key statutes for the NSA domestic spying scandal, see:
February 17th, 2006 at 7:06 pm"The NSA Scandal Resource Center."
Glad I don't live in Ohio...
What is it about these guys that they Insist Big Gov't is bad but then Support This nonsense?
February 17th, 2006 at 7:06 pmthey dont support it..but the voting machines do.
February 17th, 2006 at 7:09 pmDeWine is done in 06. The same shit they got away with in 04 will not work in 06.
February 17th, 2006 at 7:12 pmI'm a pacifist, but these people really, really make me want to hit them...
February 17th, 2006 at 7:16 pmWe are NOT going to discuss Democracy...
because WE said so...
WTF is this Communist Russia?
February 17th, 2006 at 7:19 pmNative Americans have some kind of saying about how one shouldn't trust people who lack upper lips.
[checks out DeWine's photo]
Hm.
February 17th, 2006 at 7:20 pmWatch Bill Maher tonight on HBO. His New Rules segment has a funny take on the eavesdropping by the NSA. (Provided they don't change schedule when they air the show.)
February 17th, 2006 at 7:23 pmWTF is this Communist Russia?
Comment by mr ho — February 17, 2006 @ 7:19 pm
Yep. Just wait until they start building the Wall across our borders...
February 17th, 2006 at 7:24 pmThe spying is legal, but we don't want any debate about whether it is legal, so let's pass a law to to exempt it from the law that makes it illegal and then it will be legal just as we have always said it was.
Pass me an aspirin please.
February 17th, 2006 at 7:30 pmWhere did he get that "we" shit?
February 17th, 2006 at 7:30 pmDeWine's head has been to long in DeWine.
February 17th, 2006 at 7:34 pmThe word douchebag comes to mind...
February 17th, 2006 at 7:36 pmHow did this country come to be ruled by a bunch of former high school geeks?
February 17th, 2006 at 7:40 pmoh, mike, mike, mike... of COURSE we don't any kind of debate about whether or not nsa spying is constitutional... why in the world would we want THAT...? such a terrible waste of time and energy talking about whether or not the president of the united states is a criminal... why, EVEN president bush or, should i say, ESPECIALLY president bush, doesn't want to engage in such a fruitless activity...
Visit my blog: And, yes, I DO take it personally
February 17th, 2006 at 7:43 pm#11, you hit the nail right on the head.
February 17th, 2006 at 7:48 pmI guess those lot of lawyers didn't include the ABA
February 17th, 2006 at 7:52 pmWhere is the media campaign by the Democrats to go after these guys? Lets face it, here is the perfect opportunity to cast the Republicans as a bunch of party hacks with partisan motives ruling over constitutional interests.
We need to attack:
1. Note that the Republicans are running scared. The Senate Repugs originally want investigation. Then they realize that this could cost politically. Now we need to get beyond the violation of the constitution and squelch the investigation. Proclaim it LOUDLY - PARTISAN, PARTISAN PARTISAN
2. The Justice Department will defend the Texas redistricting plan. Note that the career attorneys said that the plan violated the Voting Rights Act. The political appointees have pushed for Justice Department involvement. Proclaim it LOUDLY - PARTISAN, PARTISAN, PARTISAN.
3. Budget problems, ethical problems etc - PROCLAIM IS LOUDLY - PARTISAN, PARTISAN, PARTISAN.
Call these Republican scum what they are: treasoness, corrupt, power hungery fascitst pigs that deserve to be rounded up, taken to GTMO, questioned aggressively and then after a fair hearing (in which they are given Democrats for counsel and not permitted to see they secret evidence against them) they are convicted and summarily executed. These people deserve to die. Nothing else is appropriate.
February 17th, 2006 at 7:55 pmThe spying is illegal.
The Democrats allowed this to happen.
Because they allowed this to happen,
they can't do anything about it.
Harman and Rockefeller.
February 17th, 2006 at 8:00 pmAsk every Senator and Congressperson who is against investigating this what the administration has uncovered by eavesdropping on them.
February 17th, 2006 at 8:02 pmJMohr,
I don't agree with the summary execution. However a stint in GTMO sounds good to me. They don't need to be convicted or even charged with a crime to go to GTMO. After all, what happens at GTMO is also legal ( but that should not be debated either).
February 17th, 2006 at 8:04 pmWe need to get the Bushistas behind us and the fastest way to do that is IMPEACHMENT! But I am preaching to the choir. I live in Texas in a Republican district, so though I write EVERY DAY to Kay Bailey and her cronies, I have no representation in the Senate or the House.
Please write your Senators and tell them how much of a rubber stap they have become. Shame them into doing their duty.
February 17th, 2006 at 8:05 pm21
No, I tried that. Noone is interested in that.
Write the DNC and tell them you will not vote for ANY democrat ever again until they flood the airwaves with the RIGHT MESSAGE ABOUT SPYING AND CIVIL LIBERTIES.
If the Dems won't defend us, noone will. And the Dems just aren't trying hard enough to expose this problem. They are stupid. They are incompetent. They are scared of Mr 40% and the last remaining goobers who support him.
February 17th, 2006 at 8:09 pmI have been flooded with email to sign petitions to do this and that regarding the Spying. But we saw with Alito that petitions aren't doing it.
PFAW aint gonna do it,
Feinstein aint gonna do it,
ACLU aint gonna do it,
Specter aint gonna do it,
The courts aint gonna do it
The Dems are hoping for a cumulative effect to end this problem without having to say anything about it because they are scared of looking "Soft on Terror"
DeWine is lying. People don't understand what's at risk here. How can people be for something when they don't know what it is???????
Why is this still going on?!?!?!?
February 17th, 2006 at 8:15 pmSome people are saying that George W. Bush is the Antichrist. That's inconceivable to me but I will say he is very much amiss. Wrong at very turn.
February 17th, 2006 at 8:24 pm"DeWine’s head has been to long in DeWine."
Comment by Clyde the Ripper — February 17, 2006 @ 7:34 pm
Do you mean he's a drunk, or a victim of recto-cranial insertion?
February 17th, 2006 at 8:34 pm"The reason DeWine and the White House don’t want to talk about the program’s legality is because the program is illegal. "....writes Faiz - nationally known authority on Constitutional Law. And Faiz, if I see your constitutional law grade and raise you an advanced course in constitutional law - what does that prove?? Not a thing - your opinion is just that - your opinion. Whipping out the FISA law does not trump constitutional law - although that approach may prove more convenient for progs.
Back on thread - Dems and Progs appear more loyal to their cause and party than country. This is an understandable position since "one-world" is an ultimate leftist goal, along with the demise of nation states. Telling terrorists tactics used by the US can be justified if spewing secrets about national defense will help the party and cause. Jane Harman and her crew of Dems on the Intelligence Committee have been in the loop - the others are just pissed they weren't included so they could run out and - is that AlJezeera on the line? ....lights....camera......action!!!!!
February 17th, 2006 at 8:36 pmThe majority of Americans want us to throw out the protections guaranteed by the 4th Amendment to the Constitution. Next year, the majority of Americans will agree there is no guarantee of one person, one vote in the Constitution. Then we'll really get to work.
February 17th, 2006 at 8:46 pm*** note sarcasm above ***
February 17th, 2006 at 8:46 pmTime to Impeach. The only way to return our country to the rule of law is to use the recourse the fab founding fathers gave us. Impeachment. Not too much investigating to do. There are reams of evidence already collected. I do believe the American people will rally round a call for accountability, impeachment, as opposed to yeah, let's have an investigation or someone appoint a prosecutor. We've been waiting. We need to see our government functioning again. Now not later. We demand Congress do its job and defend our constitution. Come on, we'll all up for a fight, right? Could be fun. Could be quick 'ya never know. I don't want to wait for the psycho pseudo president to start a preemptive nuclear war or trample on the constitution one more time. Action. Impeach.
February 17th, 2006 at 8:47 pmTake care,J.C.
M.A.: this program is overtly unconstitutional. In other words: illegal and it cannot be fixed by statute. If you don't like the U.S. Constitution, then you should move out of the country.
February 17th, 2006 at 8:48 pmHas any member of Congress, from either party requested this program that's been ongoing since October of '01 should stop?
If you believe it's illegal stand up and say stop it, otherwise you're using it for political gain - either party.
if you think it's illegal, face your constituents, grow a spine and say so
February 17th, 2006 at 8:53 pmRep. Dewine must resign from his House seat or the voters of his district must vote him out of office next November!
He basically wants to paper over Bush's illegal wiretapping and then make it legal for Bush to bypass FISA Court Judges forever! Dewine's actions are beyond contemptible and are criminal too!
February 17th, 2006 at 9:03 pm"The vast majority of American people believe these calls need to be listened to." Hmmmm. Thanks to Alberto Gonzalez's unsworn non-testimony, the public has no idea what calls are being listened to as part of the program. And thanks to the Bush administration's refusal to assent to legally- and constitutionally-required oversight by the FISA court and Congress, those who are supposed to know what kind of calls are being listened to have no idea what kind of calls are being listened to. How can DeWine know what the "vast majority" of the American people believe about something they know nothing about?
February 17th, 2006 at 9:27 pmde whine, your FIRED, and 'WE' don't want any laws that say 'WE' can't FIRE you. And people wonder why i'm not a republican.
February 17th, 2006 at 9:27 pmWe keep hitting new lows. Now the Administration doesn't want to discuss whether its warrantless spying on Americans is constitutional. Why? Because their lawyers told them it's okay. Is that the new standard? Will that be okay for Republicans the next time Democrats take control? Not.
This Republican Administration and Congress are a failure. They hit the trifecta:
Failed execution.
Failed policy and planning.
Failed values.
Any reasonable person just can't avoid seeing these failures in the Iraq occupation. Katrina. Abramoff. Plame. Warrantless spying on Americans. Giant budget shortfalls. Bad, rejected suggestions for Medicare and Social Security. Growing disparity between rich and poor with oil prices exploding, the social safety net ripped up and tax cuts that are aimed at the super-rich. Leading by dividing.
Any Republican still wholeheartedly supporting this guy must have psychological issues causing him or her to not see or admit the obvious.
February 17th, 2006 at 9:33 pmDoes This fit what has happen to every republican ..
See, in my line of work you got to keep repeating things over and over and over again for the truth to sink in, to kind of catapult the propaganda."—†: George W. Bush - 43rd US President
He has kept repeating the refrain over and over no money for re election ,no money for pet projects ,no money for your state . The Aliens are coming The Aliens are coming
I can save you Trust Me give me your minds hearts and souls said The Devil I will show you this ..
Through clever and constant application of propaganda, people can be made to see paradise as hell, and also the other way round, to consider the most wretched sort of life as paradise†: Adolf Hitler - German Chancellor, leader of the Nazi party
But Then This comes alongs this at some point and time...
Laws just or unjust may govern men's actions. Tyrannies may restrain or regulate their words. The machinery of propaganda may pack their minds with falsehood and deny them truth for many generations of time. But the soul of man thus held in trance or frozen in a long night can be awakened by a spark coming from God knows where and in a moment the whole structure of lies and oppression is on trial for its life.: Sir Winston Churchill
Thanks to Info Clearing House..
Now We Who See what Is Happening Must Keep Talking And We Must Work Hard To Vote Out all Who Support bushco Out. It doesn't Matter What Party They Belong Too.
America must be protected from bushco .
February 17th, 2006 at 9:35 pmWould someone from Ohio please email DeWine about his remarks and blog them in Ohio? This guy has foot-in-mouth disease.
February 17th, 2006 at 9:40 pmmighty aphrodite,
"Amendment IV.
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
So what's the argument, that there is no mention of e-mail and telephone calls? Why should the Administration be scared of debate? Perhaps even Gonzales is not willing to advance an argument that the drafters of the constitution intentionally omitted telephone calls and email.
The intent seems abundantly clear. It is not good enough for Bush and co to assert otherwise but say there should be no debate.
February 17th, 2006 at 9:51 pmI'll agree to the constitution being irrelavent and outdated if the Bible gets the distinction of being irrelavent and outdated also.
February 17th, 2006 at 9:51 pmMike Dewine when voting to impeach Clinton.
"The law is indeed king in America. There isn't one law for the powerful and one for the meek. That is what we mean when we say we are a `nation of laws.' We elect a President to enforce these laws. In fact, the Constitution commands that the President `take care that the laws be faithfully executed."
"How can we allow a man who has obstructed justice and committed perjury to remain as the chief law enforcement officer of our country? How can we call ourselves a nation of laws and leave a man in office who has flouted those laws? We define ourselves as a people not just by what we hold up, not just by what we revere, but we also define ourselves by what we tolerate. I submit that this is something we simply, as a people, cannot tolerate."
"Mr. Chief Justice, I will vote to convict the President on both counts and to remove him from office."
Funny how he sings a different tune, when it comes to a President of his own party...
"You know, there’s been some controversy about whether or not this program is legal or is not legal. I think we need to get beyond that."
February 17th, 2006 at 9:51 pmAlthough the dems may be in a sticky wicket, if they are not vocal enough now, they may all get themselves all slimed up along with everyone else, that is if things ever really get ugly and slimey.
And I do think I see some Enron slime a'coming up soon, followed by what, we can only guess, but Fritz is still working away, and Abramoff is just beginning.
February 17th, 2006 at 9:56 pmThere is so much shit flying, some of it has got to stick.
February 17th, 2006 at 9:58 pmBack on thread - Dems and Progs appear more loyal to their cause and party than country.
Comment by mighty aphrodite
Reading the comments here and on other posts, should make it clear that Dems are not more loyal to their party than country.
February 17th, 2006 at 10:13 pmAnd as for their loyalty to their cause? Well, their cause is their country.
Lily,
February 17th, 2006 at 10:18 pmWrong. I'll have to side with mighty on this one.
The Dems have had every opportunity to stop this madness.
To a man they fear for their jobs.
Is this any different than the Repubs? No.
we need to get beyond whether it is legal or not? What?! We have all heard some completely inane comments from this administration but this one tops the cake. Unreal. I cant believe these liars brainwashed half the country to get them to reelect them. sickening...europe is looking better everyday
February 17th, 2006 at 10:19 pmGet a clue, no.1 and others we MUST get these corrupt aholes out and NOW! And I do mean NOW! This is PURE Bushit and those citizens need to run this ahole out off office and NOW! Bush and evil cohorts ILLEGALLY wiretapped innocent Americans who are opposed to their lying, murdering fascist asses! Get a clue,sheep! They were involved in and behind 9-11! We MUST get all of them out of office and NOW! And Dewine too! IF these ahole R's and D's too if need be, will NOT stand up to defend America from these enemies of America then they have to go too! They are literally destroying AMerica from within with HUGE debit and needless increases in defense spending and HUGE tax cuts for their rich friends at the expense of ALL the rest of us! Then these S.O.B's try to cover up Bush and cohorts illegal wiretapping of innocent Americans who disagree with Bush policies! This jerk and ALL like him from either party who can't or won't defend our Constitution and our Bill of rights against this aholes needs to be run out of Congress on a rail and NOW! While our nation goes down the tubes these aholes are making money on illegal wars off our dead G.I.'s and probably Halliburton too! Wake up America and demand the immediate removal of lying,murdering,fascist Bush regime and traitors in our gov't! And nOW
February 17th, 2006 at 10:20 pmWho cares what the White House agrees too!? This ahole doesn't want to debate the Constitutionally of illegally wiretapping BECAUSE HE/THEY KNOW WHAT BUSH AND EVIL COHORTS DID WAS UNCONSTITUTION! People RAISE HELL AND NOW! Bush has called our Constitution a "Goddamn piece of paper!" What does that tell you people? This jerk is helping cover up that fact! To hell with Dewine! Tell him to either defend our Constitution, which he took an oath to defend along with our nation or get the hell out of Congress!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:24 pmLook you sheep! They want to help shred our Constitution and NO we don't want to get pass this! Bush and evil cohorts ILLEGALLY spied on innocent Americans and it goes against our VERY foundation as a nation! They lie, lie and lie and Fox news sucks! Bush's relative works there is why they let Fox news handle all of their damn propaganda! People are NOT moving on on this issue and we are upset as should ALL Americans! They wiretapped Quakers for God's sake! Like their real terrorists? Come on people, get a clue! They illegal wire tap anyone who is in opposition to them! Goodbye, America, hello corporate fascist police states!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:28 pmSue - this is the type of people we are battling here, people with no brains.
Former Republican congressman Bob Barr, who led the House impeachment of President Bill Clinton, reminded the CPAC audience that our first loyalty is to the U.S. Constitution, not to a leader. The question, Barr said, is not one of disloyalty to Bush, but whether America "will remain a nation subject to, and governed by, the rule of law or the whim of men."
The CPAC audience answered that they preferred to be governed by Bush. According to Dana Milbank, a member of the CPAC audience named Richard Sorcinelli loudly booed Barr, declaring: "I can't believe I'm in a conservative hall listening to him say Bush is off course trying to defend the United States." A woman in the audience told Barr that the Constitution placed Bush above the law and above non-elected federal judges.
http://www.rense.com/general69/conserv.htm
February 17th, 2006 at 10:37 pm#15, They are NOT geeks but total corporate whores including some D's as well! Our nation got this damn screwed up because we don't have public funding of all campaigns to take corporate $$ out of our elections, plus we as citizens don't pay ENOUGH attention to stuff going on around us and listen too much to corporate whore major press who is ruled by Big business! Plus too many people go along and DON'T question ANYTHING this or any Adminstration does by being good citizens and question authority before it questions you! Plus Bush fascist regime stole two elections and others in Congress are siding with them to destroy our nation from within! By huge debt over unnecessary wars over oil and empire started over lies,lies and more lies, while people believe there BS, and don't march or don't bitch and other patriotic stuff! If got this screwed up because We the People let our politicians the majority of them from BOTH parties and our major press be bought off and up by BIG BUSINESS who are now putting America last in favor of Big Business worldwide and Greed! And just because Dewine will be out in '06 we STILL need to raise hell and NOW and educate others on the need for a REAL investagation and NOW before they totally let Bush become the dictator he says he wants to become! Immediately remove Bush and evil PNAC cohorts and NOW! And all those who support them too in Congress!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:38 pm#19, while I agree with you in part, we have some house cleaning ourselves to do with D's as well! The damn DLC Democrats keeping siding with Bush and cohorts against the American people! They too are nothing but corporate whores! They suck too only not as badly but almost! Get a clue, #19, they are part of problem too! How many of those soo called D's did NOT filibuster the Patriot act which INCLUDES MAKING IT ILLEGAL FOR US TO PROTEST BUSH!?
February 17th, 2006 at 10:41 pm#51, For once I totally agree with Bob Barr! Good America, although on other issues we don't agree but good for him and to hell with those that say Bush is above the law! NOONE IS ABOVE THE LAW, they are using these illegal,immoral wars to erode our freedoms at home and totally destroy our Constitution and our nation and these SHEEP are letting them! RAISE UP PEOPLE AND DEMAND EITHER CONGRESS GETS RID OF THEM ASAP OR WE GET RID OF THEM TOO AND NOW! Now Bush and cohorts wants to sell our U.S. ports to UAE who are KNOWN to supporter terrorism! What does that tell you sheep!? They are out to literally destroy America from within! Wake the hell up! They were behind and involved in 9-11, too!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:46 pmThis makes twice today I've heard someone say "Americans support the spying".
This is a lie.
February 17th, 2006 at 10:48 pmPlease people write letters to editors, etc. we MUST get people to raise hell over this issue and NOW! They wiretapped Quakers for God's sake! They wire tap ANYONE who opposes them! Stand up for our nation from these murdering,lying fascists and stand up for our freedoms and stop letting them make you afraid and manpulate you and lies, lies and more lies. About Iraq, and catching Bin Laden and now about Iran and also lying about illegally wire tapping U.S. citizens and now they are building "detention centers" to house us protesters! We are seeing a total return to fascist Nazi Germany! wake the hell up people and NOW!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:50 pmIt's NOT communist Russia but corporate fascist police state!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:51 pmNow Roberts has reverted back to he wants to have an investigation!
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/18/politics/18nsa.html?hp&ex=1140238800&en=1c887f193bbd87fd&ei=5094&partner=homepage
What will it be on Monday? And they say that the Democrats are Flip FLoppers. I have seen the Republicans Flop, litteraly, for that last year. Now from day to day who knows where they stand. At least the Democrats seem to be more stable for the most part.
February 17th, 2006 at 10:55 pmSounds like DeWine wants to keep the program completely secret . . . . Whoops forget about the 4th amendment and the judicial branch!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:56 pmShame all of our Senators and Reps into standing up for our Constitution and our nation against these lying,murdering fascists who are literally destroying America from within and DEMAND NO, NO MORE DAMN ILLEGAL WARS, NONE AND NO MORE DAMN $$ FOR THEM EITHER AND OUR TROOPS HOME AND NOW! Period! While our troops die over lies,some these aholes in Congress and W.H. are war profiteering off our dead and injuried troops,from Halliburton,etc.! When Americans know the truth they don't support spying! These aholes are masters a BS and propaganda! They even spend our money putting out their BUSHIT!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:57 pmWe the people need to do something about this and NOW!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:57 pmSue - you are fired up arent you? ;)
February 17th, 2006 at 10:58 pmWhat these damn corporate whores in BOTH parties are doing is CRIMINAL! And we need to ALL make sure next election to get rid of Diebold voting machines and also run GOOD REAL Democratic candidates and NO DLC jerks either!
February 17th, 2006 at 10:59 pmDo you people know that now Bush is trying to sell our U.S. ports to UAE, KNOWN TERRORISTS? GET THIS NEWS OUT ASAP AS WE NEED TO STOP THIS ASAP AND NOW! What does this tell you sheep? They were behind 9-11, folks! They need to be immediately removed from office and NOW! Then Bush invited to hear his State of the Union address a known terrorist who the victims families of 9-11 sued over 9-11! Go to http://www.commondreams.org and read about it! While he was having Cindy Sheenan arrested for exercising her Constitutional rights, the ahole invited a KNOWN terrorist to listen to his BUSHIT state of Union speech!
February 17th, 2006 at 11:03 pm#27
Dano, my friend, the choice is yours! At the time I had reference to his partaking of the grape but I certainly like your analogy as well!
February 17th, 2006 at 11:07 pm#25, Feinstein and Specter are part of the damn problem! Feinstein's husband has a lucrative business in Iraq! I wonder how many of these aholes in Congress also are war profiteering off our dead and injuried G.I's and that is why they won't do anything about Bush and cohorts war profiteering either? We the real patriotic Americans MUST take our nation and media back and now to defend our nation against it's enemies! These aholes! And NOW! Our forefathers are rolling over in their graves! And like them, we need to ALL raise up in unision and RAISE HOLY HELL OVER ALL THIS BUSHIT AND NOW! And one of the problems is too many Congress critters take $$ from no.1 PAC AIPAC, which Israeli wants war with Iran. We need to tell these aholes that put America first, not Israeli nor Saudi's either nor any other damn country but our own!
February 17th, 2006 at 11:09 pmLook at that pic of DeWine at the top of this thread: He is a classic 100% milktoast nerd on prozac > lol. Ugly glasses and so frail that you could blow on him and knock him over! Yell at him and he probably would faint from fright! I bet he is even tiny in his crotch!
The Democrats in Congress just need to go up to him and tell him his plan to allow Bush to wiretap everybody sucks!
February 17th, 2006 at 11:20 pmGet in his face until he wets his pants or resigns!!!
The Clinton Admin has a proven record of how to run a country. What part of peace and prosperity did you wing-nuts not appreciate? This Admin has a proven record of how NOT to run a country. They have failed us miserably. Anyone that still supports this bunch best get their head examined.
IMPEACH. NOW is the time to start the movement and hold people accountable.
February 17th, 2006 at 11:22 pmNot much of a surprise. Usual Fox garbage.
I'm glad we're onto a thead I fullheartedly support:)
February 17th, 2006 at 11:26 pmHas anybody thought at all about the 4th Amendment impilcations of the FISA law? This is the one they are going to "fix-up" so the unconstitional, illegall spying can continue? you are just kiding..right! lol IrishDave
February 18th, 2006 at 12:18 amWho the hell is DeWine or anyone else to say they want to move on? The subject is likely a criminal act, and crimes are not selectively overlooked because someone of prominence is the perpetrator.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:21 amIt makes no difference what the popular opinion is, what the polls say, or what the pols say -- it must be examined by the courts and determined whether laws were broken and if so, punishment is to be meted out. The law can certainly be modified, but at this point, if it is proven that the prez ignored the law, regardless of how many good ol' boy lawyers pat him on the back, then he was out of the law at the time and that is a felony.
DeWine and the other sycophants, minions, and toadies can go suck an egg.
#67 - Jay Randal,
February 18th, 2006 at 12:24 amIn my time, we used to say - the bigger the balls, the smaller the brain. Recent scientific studies have borne this out in the animal kingdom. Intelligence is inversely proportional to reproductive prowess. That's why there are more squirrels than homo sapiens.
See:
http://www.thehumorarchives.com/attachment.do?attachmentId=150&ts=1140240216226&s=2F21D052B7338F52A7D2812536258681083EC56B
regardless of whether or not this abortion of a bill passes or not- dewine must be defeated. If it takes a door to door campaign in the state of Ohio, then it must succeed.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:24 amThis piece of shite declared hiself to be in support of a plan to investigate the nsa and now he proposes throwing out the Constitution! No good. The bastard is a Traitor. He has been bought - totally- I wonder how many pieces of silver it took! Start planning to support whoever gets the democratic nod. I know that it will be hard for the true dems in Ohio to once again go to the wall after 04 anf the handling of the Hackett situatio and I will state openly that I will not donate one cent to the national dem party but descum MUST be defeated! I am planning to go to Ohio and vol once the campaign begins in the fall and I am 68 yrs old. So, you folks - get on the wagon with respect to descum. HE MUST BE DESTROYED.
billjpa@aol.com
#42 AKA Dad
February 18th, 2006 at 12:31 amThanks for the quote -- I just sent it to DeWine and reminded him of his own words.
President Bush said today, “I mean, a lot of lawyers looked at this, and they said, you bet, Mr. President, it’s legal.†If he’s so confident about that, why is he so afraid to have a debate?
I'm not the brightest bulb in the bin, but I wish we had a list of every lawyer who told the President "you bet, it's legal" as well as where they got their law degree, whether or not they specialized in Constitutional Law, their rationale for their decision...and of course, if they are friends and/or financial supporters of Bush's presidential campaign.
I mean, it'd be easy for me to say "hey, most people I talk to agree Lindsay Lohan is meant to be my sex slave" but when push comes to shove, I oughta be able to back up that claim with names and testimonials, or else I should stop saying it.
I can't read as much news as I'd like, but is there ANYONE ANYWHERE who has a list on all the lawyers who say the wiretapping is legal? And again, as others have asked, if it's already legal, then why is there any attempt to change the law to make it legal? Simple logic dictates that this, then, proves the Administration knows it's wrong.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:34 am#72 WtM
February 18th, 2006 at 12:37 amI never noticed that before - but in thinking about it, I think I have to agree. We all know Bush and Cheney have brass ones, and Bush sure likes his to be noticed.
The only real alternative we had to DeWine was Hackett. The Dems swift boated him to get another Vichy Dem into the fold, Sherrod Brown. My campaign contribution goes to DeWine. I know that I'll get this kind of frustrating crap from him, but I'm not wasting a vote on a phony progressive from a party that wants to tell me who I get to vote for. This is one Independent who went from solidly in the Democrat column in 2006 in Ohio to solidly Republican. DeWine will at least be on the ropes coming out of 2006. I don't need an emboldened Democratic asshole thinking he won an election by engaging in a smear campaign against a veteran. The Dems really crossed my wires on this one, but, no way, no Dem vote from me in 2006.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:39 amHmmm... Let's see in the Democratic column we have Nelson (NE) Feinstein (CA) Johnson (SD) Byrd (WV) Clinton (NY) Biden (DE)... Gosh, the list goes on and on of Democrats who support Bush's policies. DeWine is so bad? Continuing Bush's policy is so bad? Well, no one supported Feingold when he tried to block the PATRIOT ACT. It's a bit disingenuous for Democrats to yelling about DeWine wanting to give Bush a free pass, when the Dems just did the same thing by passing the PATRIOT ACT. There is NO distinction between DeWine and Democrats excepting that he is articulating what they are endorsing.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:44 amWiretapping Legal, After The Crime?
Why would the Bush administration be for changing FISA from "probable cause" to "reasonable doubt" right now, if they had James A. Baker send a letter to Congress, on July 31, 2002, stating they "wouldn't support it?"
And yes, when Baker sent the letter saying they wouldn't support it, the warrantless NSA wiretapping program was already going. Bush said on December 17, 2005 that "In the weeks following" 9/11 he authorized the NSA program. This is 9 months later.
February 18th, 2006 at 1:00 am#76,
February 18th, 2006 at 1:11 amMarie, but those are his Depends. See:
http://www.depend.com/
for details. That bulge in his pants isn't due to balls.
#78 "It’s a bit disingenuous for Democrats to yelling about DeWine wanting to give Bush a free pass, when the Dems just did the same thing by passing the PATRIOT ACT. There is NO distinction between DeWine and Democrats excepting that he is articulating what they are endorsing."
*****
I don't follow your logic there. Passing the Patroit Act and looking the other way over illegal domestic spying are NOT THE SAME THING. DeWine wants us to ignore illegal activity (ok fine, "potentially" illegal... still deserves real legal scrutiny). Debating and passing the Patriot Act, even though I don't like it, is just ususual congressional business.
February 18th, 2006 at 1:31 amjust going through some stuff today and came across some info about the Anthrax scare.
Anyone remember the Anthrax scare?
Anybody remember who was exposed?
PBS
October 17, 2001
House To Shut Down After Senate Staffers Exposed To Anthrax
Yes, the Senate Minority Leader Senator Tom Daschle and Senator Russ Feingold.
Hmmmmmmm. Me thinks this wasn't done by a "terrorist sympathising" liberal. No. I am gonna have to go with right wing Neo-Nazi bastard.
February 18th, 2006 at 1:44 am[...] While I’m still not sure whether George Bush actually stated that the Constitution is “just a goddamned piece of paper,†it seems that Ohio Senator Mike DeWine did so on Fox News tonight. The quote in question referred to the NSA wiretapping program and is provided by ThinkProgress (emphasis added): You know, there’s been some controversy about whether or not this program is legal or is not legal. I think we need to get beyond that. And the vast majority of American people believe these calls need to be listened to. But we don’t want to have any kind of debate about whether it’s constitutional or not constitutional. So I think we need to put that beyond us. [...]
February 18th, 2006 at 2:07 amSpudge_Boy,
February 18th, 2006 at 2:11 amSorry, I have a granddaughter on the east coast. She is safe from missiles from China and North Korea. Both Russia and France are another matter. GB is a waffle point, but, I believe that they would stand down. It's a matter of survival! The Neanderthals in this admin have to realize that they do not represent the almighty.
DeWine and the rest of the GOP members that Rove "got to" are complete party sellouts. Come on people, you know this program is a disgrace and illegal. For once in your life, have a backbone and prove to your constituents that you're not some congressional pawn of Karl Rove and the White House.
February 18th, 2006 at 3:17 amThe people who think warrantless spying is okay tend to change their tune when informed that Hillary Clinton or someone like her for the democrats will be allowed to do the same thing once these dumb assholes from both parties have let this particular cat out of the bag. And once out it will not be easy, if at all possible to put back in.
February 18th, 2006 at 3:25 amWhat makes this country the USA are our civil rights. If we give them up we have nothing left. I have done my best through emails and phone calls to express this idea to my elected officials and those of other states as well, but they are not listening. They care more about keeping their jobs than about anything else. I am disgusted with virtually all of them and would be embarrassed to call myself either a democrat or a republican. The libertarians are just as bad, or worse.
DeWine is making the first "payment" on the promised assistance from the GOP for his upcoming race against Sherrod Brown. This little turd will need all the help he can get.
February 18th, 2006 at 4:33 amThis ahole and others are putting their damn re-election and that ahole lying,murdering fascist regime in White House ABOVE OUR NATION people and it MUST stop now if we are to save America! What makes America, America is our civil liberities! IF anyone gives them up without a hellva fight then they don't damn deserve them! What we also need to stop ASAP is the sale of our U.S. ports asap to KNOWN terrorists! Now Bush wants to sell 6 of our U.S. ports to known terrorists! The deal will be final on March 2.! Please write call, phone and demand ALL Senators and Reps. STOP this ahole President we have and others in this murderiing, lying fascist regime from selling those ports or camp on their door step and RAISE HOLY HELL! AND NOW! LET OTHERS KNOW ABOUT THIS SCHEME TO MAKE US LESS SAFE AND QUICKLY AND TELL ALL RADIO AND NEWSPAPERS TO RUN THE STORY ASAP, AND now! Hillary and others are introducing legislatin stopping it,don't know no. yet but people can find out! There is now a Republican sueing Bush over illegal wiretapping!
February 18th, 2006 at 5:11 amAnd just who is this "we" that DeWine mentions? Must be him, and that turd in his pocket... Not exactly a "mandate", is it?
February 18th, 2006 at 6:16 am#89 Cyra if you mean the turd is tued blossum then you are correct, turd blossum will be in a lot of congressional and senetorial pockets for a while making sure the king is not distrubed.
February 18th, 2006 at 7:03 amFerget the constitution, there's terr'ists in them hills! By the way, I completely agree with strict constructionism.
February 18th, 2006 at 7:44 amFrom the NYT, on Pat Roberts:
Senate Chairman Splits With Bush on Spy Program
The chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee said Friday that he wanted the Bush administration's domestic eavesdropping program brought under the authority of a special intelligence court, a move President Bush has argued is not necessary.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/18/politics/18nsa.html?ei=5088&en=6f93516435fa4e5b&ex=1297918800&adxnnl=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&adxnnlx=1140266996-MumvINGYVsw6KeHSJskflA
February 18th, 2006 at 7:56 amPresto-Change-o, Eh? Will wonders never cease?
February 18th, 2006 at 8:56 amLet him know how you feel ohioans! http://dewine.senate.gov/
February 18th, 2006 at 9:13 amHa-Ha, it's good to see the little internet toadies happily paving the way for the big fascists who could care less about their pathetic, puny lives.
Funny how the righttards are always voicing their mistrust of the gubbmint--until one of their lying, spying own takes the helm. Now we have to go along unquestioningly (that hardly seems American, does it?).
February 18th, 2006 at 9:15 amMike DeWine= A wall-eyed munchkin with NO balls.
-GSD
February 18th, 2006 at 9:15 amMike Dewine, Pat Roberts, and every Bushite worshipper in the House and Senate should be tried for treason, found guilty and executed, PERIOD!
They (and their Bushite supporters and co-conspirators) are more of a threat to our representative form of government than any terrorist could EVER be!
They hate America, and our way of life.
They worship the criminal Bushite junta, and hold Bush and Cheney above their families, country and the Constitution.
What else do you call people like this?
It is THAT serious people...
February 18th, 2006 at 9:28 amI'm glad I moved from Ohio. They are right there with Kansas when it comes to..."Why would anyone want to live there..." I cannot believe that there are congressman that put their party and the president before 230 years of sacrifice and democracy. Civil liberty is at the very core of our existence. yet no debate! A few extremist lawyers like Yoo and Gonzales gave it the blessing, its OK, so no debate! Russ Fiengold the only dessenter to renewal of the Patriot Act! Wake-up America before its too late. This cabal needs to be dealt with swiftlya nd severely, they are ruining the country. Stand strong and be free.
February 18th, 2006 at 9:45 amYes, for years the rightwing told us the government wast the problem. Now that they control every branch, they defend the government at every step.
Conclusion: The rhetoric of government being the enemy was just used to gain control of the government. Power and and only power is what the right wing wants. They want the judges to decide cases their way. They want colleges to muzzle left-wing teachers and they want the government imposing their personal religious beliefs on every American no matter what faith.
Sickening.
-GSD
February 18th, 2006 at 9:52 amAlso, I would think that some conservatives of conscience would be a little sick and tired of being blackmailed, ingnored, extorted and bullied by Rove and Bush.
But, alas we see with all of the terrorist fear mongering that the right wing are really the pussies who need a big daddy, type to salve them and comfort them and make the big bad evil terrrorists go away.
-GSD
February 18th, 2006 at 9:55 amDe-whine's voice mailbox is full.
Seems he hit a nerve.
That's OK, I'll call again later.
February 18th, 2006 at 10:11 am#100- Hard to believe, well, perhaps not, that G. BUSH is the "Daddy" they chose. Ick- Yuk- Blehckhy- Plah! That's nasty... 'scuse me, I had to spit...
February 18th, 2006 at 10:22 amMr. DeWine's indifference to the Constitution aside, has anyone pointed out to him that--even if Congress should enact legislation permitting the NSA, FBI, or whomever to conduct warrantless surveillance of Americans and even if such legislation passes constitutional muster--the President is still liable and can still be prosecuted for any previous activities that violated the law (specifically F.I.S.A. in this case)? His illegal actions do not get grandfathered in.
February 18th, 2006 at 10:26 amDe-whine’s voice mailbox is full.
Seems he hit a nerve.
Comment by ohdave — February 18, 2006 @ 10:11 am
I hope it's a major nerve that makes him retract.
What's his number? Could be good to post it here so others can call as well.
February 18th, 2006 at 10:43 amDe-whine’s voice mailbox is full.
Seems he hit a nerve.
That’s OK, I’ll call again later.
Comment by ohdave #101
...his e-mail form is working...
February 18th, 2006 at 10:47 amWhat’s his number? Could be good to post it here so others can call as well.
Comment by unbelievable #104
ussenate.com
February 18th, 2006 at 10:48 amMike DeWine
Contact Information
Web Site: dewine.senate.gov
E-mail: Contact Via 'Web Form.'
Washington Office:
SR-140
Washington, D.C. 20510-3503
Phone: (202) 224-2315
Fax: (202) 224-6519
Main District Office:
February 18th, 2006 at 11:02 am37 W. Broad St., Ste. 300
Columbus, OH 43215
Phone: (614) 469-5186
Fax: (614) 469-2982
tO UNDERSTAND BETTER fRANCE and its specificities,visit GlobLog http://www.politique-info.org
February 18th, 2006 at 11:08 amMarie, #71
May I add to your list?
Parasite, flunky, bootlicker, fawner, footlicker, hanger-on, wheedler, turfhunter, lick-spittle, stooge, time-server, pickthank, tool, courtier, truckler, sponge, cringer, puffer, adolator, toadeater, rubber-stamp, and don't forget Graceculus esuriens.
And they can pound sand, pee up a rope, suck wind and/or buttermilk, take a flying F, eat s and die, and many others.
February 18th, 2006 at 11:17 amBush says ALOT of Lawyers looked at this; (yeh Right BS)
and they DIDNT all agree.
Former Attorney General John Ashcroft, who reportedly personally approved the program;(he got 'resigned' when he wouldnt approve any more)
• Former Deputy Attorney General James B. Comey, who reportedly expressed grave reservations about the program;
• Former Assistant Attorney General Jack Goldsmith, who reportedly objected to the program repeatedly;
• Former National Security Aide to the Deputy Attorney General Patrick Philbin, who reportedly shared Mr. Goldsmith’s concerns;
• Director of the Office of Intelligence and Policy Review, James Baker, who testified previously before the Senate that the Bush Administration did not support a proposal by Senator DeWine to amend FISA;
• Vice President Cheney’s former Counsel, now his Chief of Staff, David Addington, who reportedly played a lead role in advocating for the program; and
• Former Deputy Attorney General Larry Thompson, who was Mr. Comey’s predecessor.
February 18th, 2006 at 11:23 amIn Fact DeWine wanted to Change FISA and the Bush Admin Disagreed.
February 18th, 2006 at 11:25 amIs this Why Dewine is not Wanting a debate?
Can the american people sue congress for not doing their job? Or can we sue for them not acting as a seperate but equal branch of government? Is there rules in place stating that the Executive office can NOT lobby or influence congress?
As long as the Excutive branch is allowed to twist arms and and turn our democracy into a bribery fest I’m afraid that the laws wont matter anymore.
Does anyone know if these actions are against the law or ethics or anything?
February 18th, 2006 at 11:37 amCheck this out about Dewine & FISA;
FAS Note (01/27/06): The version of this Statement that was published by the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence does not include several key paragraphs of Mr. Baker's discussion of Senator DeWine's bill S. 2659 that are presented below. The reason for this discrepancy is currently unknown, but it appears that two versions of the Statement were prepared and circulated at the July 31, 2002 hearing. --Steven Aftergood
Department of Justice
STATEMENT OF JAMES A. BAKER
COUNSEL FOR INTELLIGENCE POLICY
BEFORE THE
SELECT COMMITTEE ON INTELLIGENCE
UNITED STATES SENATE
CONCERNING
PROPOSALS TO AMEND
THE FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE SURVEILLANCE ACT OF 1978
PRESENTED ON JULY 31, 2002
February 18th, 2006 at 11:51 am"I think we need to get beyond that."
??????????????
But we don’t want to have any kind of debate about whether it’s constitutional or not constitutional.
??????????????
Is this guy on crack????
Yet ANOTHER attempt by the Republican party to sweep illegality under the rug. "No big deal," they say. "Let's move on," they say. How is it POSSIBLE that they can believe that if they continue to downplay illegal activities, that if they continue to IGNORE and refuse to INVESTIGATE, that we're all gonna sit idly by like good little sheep, fingers up our noses, and say meekly, "um...okay."
ARRRGGGHHHH!
The NSA is spying on Americans, without a warrant, with the president's blessing and at his behest. HOW MUCH CLEARER CAN IT BE that this is ILLEGAL? Why is this even a debate?
Are Republicans THAT sick, that twisted that they will pledge allegiance to their party, come hell or high water, over and above their allegiance to the laws and basic tenets that govern this country?
Now I ask you, WHO are the traitors, here?
February 18th, 2006 at 12:08 pmI don't believe the numbers about approval.
Americans don't know what is going on.
Indications are this is Data Mining.
Data Mining is illegal.
Democrats allowed this to happen.
The Democrats aren't fighting this properly.
The Democrats are affording trust to known liars.
The Democrats are believe these guys criminals.
Yet they allowed this to happen.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:10 pmIf the Democrats allow the Bush administration to get away with
Blabbing classified information,
Illegally data mining American,
lying to Americans to go to war,
and deliberately neglecting New Orleans, we're done.
Glen Greenwald's article has good points, but Americans don't seem to care about political crimes against them because they are accustomed to it.
Nixon raised the bar for what is offensive. The Democrats have to be more diligent in explaning the crimes of this government.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:15 pmOh, and here's DeSwine's contact info. Make sure to give him a holler.
Washington, D.C. Office
140 Russell Senate Building
Washington, DC 20510
Phone: (202) 224-2315
Fax: (202) 224-6519
TDD: (202) 224-9921
or email him using this form:
http://dewine.senate.gov/request_form.cfm
February 18th, 2006 at 12:18 pm[...] In Washington yesterday, Rep Mike Dewine of Ohio announced that there is no reason for congress to investigate the legality of Bush’s warrantless domestic spying program. [...]
February 18th, 2006 at 12:23 pmDems and Progs appear more loyal to their cause and party than country. This is an understandable position since “one-world†is an ultimate leftist goal, along with the demise of nation states. Telling terrorists tactics used by the US can be justified if spewing secrets about national defense will help the party and cause. Jane Harman and her crew of Dems on the Intelligence Committee have been in the loop - the others are just pissed they weren’t included so they could run out and - is that AlJezeera on the line? ….lights….camera……action!!!!!
Comment by mighty aphrodite — February 17, 2006 @ 8:36
For once MaD speaks Very Close to the Truth.
Just leave out one thing MaD. the Word 'Left.'
Bushs full Spectrum Dominance is the Same Thing just called 'Right'. The Leftie leaders come from the Same Righty Capitalist groups. Kerry is No Different than Bush. If you Look at what Hillary and Kerry have said they want MORE troops, not less.
The wanted to send 250,000 troops not 140,000.
Of course that Would have Shortened the war.
The Neo-Con 'right' Media is also helping to foment your 'left' World Order MaD. but Its not really left or Right MaD.
Its Green, its corrupt, its powerhungry, and its Ivey League thru and thru. Yes the Same Ivey league of Kerry And Bush. The Liberal Eastern Establishment some call it, others might say the Fifth Column, the German Socialists, or the Bohemes.
Like it or not MaD you have helped Put a 'right' 'Liberal' into office under the Guise of Neo-Con..
MaD is a Liberal Lover =)
February 18th, 2006 at 12:25 pmDemocrats have failed at distinguishing spying on terrorists and Data Mining Americans in the public arena.
When I turn on the TV I hear "Americans approve of spying".
This is a lie.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:28 pmCall or fax Dewine until he resigns from the Senate! He has completely sold out his position to the Bush Regime, so he
February 18th, 2006 at 12:30 pmmust be removed from office! Show him ZERO mercy!!!
"Telling terrorists tactics used by the US can be justified if spewing secrets about national defense will help the party and cause..."
Wow...you guys really ARE crazier than I thought....
February 18th, 2006 at 12:33 pmAboslutely. Why, because both versions (1, 2) of James Baker' letter to the Senate Intellegence Committee contained this same verbiage when discussing Senator DeWine's FISA Amendment:
"the proposed change raises both significant legal and practical issues."
February 18th, 2006 at 12:42 pmThe entire break down is here: Wiretapping Legal, After The Crime?
I have provided you with everything you need to shove this one in the right wingers' faces.
They were against amending FISA, before they were for amending FISA. And the warrantless NSA wiretapping program was already under way.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:44 pmthe proposed change raises both significant legal and practical issues.â€
Comment by Spudge_Boy — February 18, 2006 @ 12:42 pm
Yuppers. DeWine is just another 'Your Doing a Heckuva Job' groupie.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:52 pm“Telling terrorists tactics used by the US can be justified if spewing secrets about national defense will help the party and cause…â€
This is Crap, Bin Laden stopped using his SAT phone well before 9/11. Channel 13 has even produced a Show concerning this Echelon SIGINT. Their are no 'Secrets' Exposed.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:58 pmThis is just more Smoke Bush is blowing up your bum thru the 'news corporation' of the Monarchial Murdoch Queen Empire
Under One-Party Rule a Constitutional debate is irrelevant.
Under One-Party Rule, elections are irrelevant. The outcome for 2006 has already been decided.
February 18th, 2006 at 12:58 pmIt's proof that these "republicans" don't give a damn about the country, the constitution, the people, or anythng else besides their own power.
I loved the comment from the woman talking to Bob Barr (a man i have never agreed with before now, BTW). so the president is above the law, the courts, congress, etc? Then why do we have an impeachment clause in ANY gov't document? What was the whole thing about Clinton about, then? Why do we call him the "president" instead of "Your Majesty"? Welcome back to the divine right of kings!
These people are sheep, cannot think fo themselves, and quite frankly, DON'T WANT TO. They WANT to be lemmings and to go right over the cliff as long as they "believe in" the head lemming. Unfortunately, they are taking the whole country down because they don't understand ANYTHING but "winning". What the hell good is "winning" if you destroy everything in your path in doing so? I guess they believe in the old Aesop's fable that says that it's better to rule in hell than serve in heaven.
Good luck, Ohio, you will need it. So do the rest of us, what with a party that doesn't want the actual choice of the PEOPLE, but their own. Hackett should sue Harry Reid and the others who pressured him into leaving the race. In fact, the Dems in Ohio should do the same thing for interfering with their elections! Reid has NO business telling someone from Ohio what to do, he's from NEVADA, for Pete's sake. It's time to send them ALL home and start over.
That, and public financing of elections country wide. Until the money gets out of elections, we will have nothing but ass kissing money grubbers as elected officials. Is there any wonder that the rates of voting in this country are so low? They don't give us a chance to vote for those WE want, just who THEY want. Kind of like the Repubs gerrymandering in Texas... they get to choose who they will represent, not the other way around, like it's suppposed to be.
Throw them ALL out and start over with public financing and there is a chance that the will of the PEOPLE will be followed. As it is now, we're screwed.
February 18th, 2006 at 1:01 pmDeWine is DeAss... a sentence-by-sentence deconstruction of his brilliant words is here...
http://blogdebogs.blogspot.com/2006/02/spill-dewine.html
February 18th, 2006 at 1:12 pmThanks post 124 Spudge_Boy for the link on Sen. Dewine! I did NOT know that James Baker is involved in the NSA spying > he is a criminal GOP attorney that should have gone to prison years ago! He is the guy who got Bush Junior into office in 2000 by threatening members of the Supreme Court!
February 18th, 2006 at 1:13 pm#128 has it perfectly. "As is is now, we're screwed." We can write, call, fax, email but none of it matters. The people in office don't care. Why don't they care?? Because "These people are sheep, cannot think for themselves, and quite frankly, DON’T WANT TO. They WANT to be lemmings and to go right over the cliff as long as they “believe in†the head lemming."
February 18th, 2006 at 1:20 pmUntil the people in this country manage to inform themselves of what is really going on and demand change in overwhelming numbers, we are stuck with the current situation. Our 'fellow Americans' are poorly informed, and even that turn of phrase is giving them more credit than is due.
Honestly, ask yourselves how many people you know who would actually have any idea of what is being discussed in these comments. Most Americans don't know, and worse, don't want to know. Even if our chicken shit media were to actually do their job adequately, these people would still manage to stay uninformed.
Who was that comic strip character, "We have me the enemy and he is us."
131: was strip was Pogo if I recall correctly.
February 18th, 2006 at 1:22 pmMike DeWine published this statement after Bush's 2006 Stste Of The Union Address.
Mike DeWine's Web Site
January 31, 2006
DEWINE STATEMENT: REACTION TO THE STATE OF THE UNION ADDRESS
Did this freaking idiot here the State Of The Union? George Bush's Advanced Energy Initiative calls for:
White House
January 31, 2006
State Of The Union Address
Bush didn't push for new technologies, he is backing the same old sh!t. He says that we will invest more in the old sh!t and do some research into some new sh!t.
The Bush followed it up with a $17 billion taxe break for the oil companies who just posted record profits.
February 18th, 2006 at 1:27 pmJay Randal,
This stuff is very deep. The more I dig, the more I find. That is why I decided to start my own blog. There is too much for everybody to cover. I think more people should.
Check out: Why Gonzales Was Not Sworn In
February 18th, 2006 at 1:32 pmIt is also important to note that James A Baker III in both of his July 31, 2002 letters (1, 2) to the Senate Intellegence Committee stated:
So, on July 31, 2006 the Bush admintsration feels that their amendments to the FISA act brought on by the USA PATRIOT Act and the Intelligence Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2002, did not hinder them in the slightest.
Now they argue that it slows them down.
February 18th, 2006 at 1:46 pmAlso, don't forget:
USA PATRIOT Act is an acronym, which stands for:
UNITING AND STRENGTHENING AMERICA BY PROVIDING APPROPRIATE TOOLS REQUIRED TO INTERCEPT AND OBSTRUCT TERRORISM (USA PATRIOT ACT) ACT OF 2001
February 18th, 2006 at 1:50 pmLet's hope NSA is in a bit of trouble.
http://www.prosefights.org/baltimoresun/shanebowman.htm
http://www.prosefights.org/nmlegal/deptofjustice/codirector/codirector.htm
February 18th, 2006 at 1:51 pmThis is not an apple.
Oh sure, it may look like an apple. If it was sitting in front of you, it might even smell like an apple. If you were to pick it up and take a bite out of it, it might even taste like an apple.
But it is not an apple.
It's a string bean.
Look, I've had a lot of experts on apples look at this, and they said, you bet, Jen, this is not an apple.
In fact, we're going to be quickly and quietly changing the dictionary to read:
ap·ple
n.
1. A bushy or climbing tropical American plant (Phaseolus vulgaris) widely cultivated for its narrow green edible pods.
2. The green pod of this plant, eaten as a vegetable. Also called green bean, snap bean.
3. Slang. A tall thin person.
There’s been some controversy about whether or not this is really an apple. I think we need to get beyond that. And the vast majority of American people believe that this is not an apple. But we don’t want to have any kind of debate about whether it’s an apple or not. So I think we need to put that beyond us.
It's a string bean. End of debate.
February 18th, 2006 at 1:54 pmGod forbid we would have a debate...
R2K
February 18th, 2006 at 1:56 pmbatjen,
Exactly.
"These are not the droids you are looking for."
February 18th, 2006 at 2:05 pm#109 CtR
February 18th, 2006 at 2:17 pmMay I add to your list?
Ha ha -- a few years ago, I made up a list of adjectives for the pompous right wing talking heads. It started out being alliterative, but I added more and now I will add yours to mine too, if you don't mind.
"squinty-eyed, sanctimonious, spiteful and smug, self-righteous, sneering, and sniffing; petulant and prickly, carefully coiffed, aristocratic prigs."
I had to sign on here as soon as I got home today because am so distressed -- my neighbor has placed a huge Dennis Hastert sign on his front lawn.
February 18th, 2006 at 2:33 pmWe live in townhomes and there are restrictions concerning signs, but I am on the Board. If I am the one to bring it up, it will seem self-serving; everyone sees my car's bumper stickers (he has his "W").
Did he do it to be "in your face" to us? I don't know -- he really is a nice guy, but he is a typical authoritarian, narrow minded Republican.
Confrontation will be bad for the neighborhood and my personal life. If I put up a Democratic sign, I will be reduced to his level, in addition to breaking our own association rules.
Aaarrgghhh!
#6
February 18th, 2006 at 3:05 pmOr at least push them down!
Marie,
I think this is your biggest problem. Somebody else is going to have to do it, but I would bet that everybody else are a bunch of sheeple that don't want to rock the boat.
If it was me, I would get a ginormous Fvck You! sign.
February 18th, 2006 at 3:15 pmMarie,
Perhaps an open letter to the Board describing things almost exactly as you said in your post except I would leave out most of the negative adverbs and adjectives and suggest the Board invite the Gentleman to defend his legal-illegal act to the whole community. If you have a newsletter for the community the incident should be reported on the first page. Leave out the politics in the first round but if he responds in a political vein one up Cheney and give him both barrels in return. Having suffered through the ills of HOA's several time I have come to the conclusion that no ones opinion will change for the worse if you take up a cause. There are probably several others in the same boat--too polite to rock the boat. You may be surprised about the amount of support you get. If all you get is static then put up the biggest Democratic signs you can find in your own yard and let them do the bitching. Then the old "What's good for etc." is appropriate.
February 18th, 2006 at 3:24 pm#142, Marie, I think America is heading towards a civil war the longer Republicans are in power.
The majority don't want repugs in power but their relentless spin - the latest by DeWine - and the high proportion of simple-minded people (like your neighbour) who fall for it, are making it impossible to remove repugs from power.
DeWine is another fascist and those who oppose fascists are being coerced to silence (e.g. Hagel and Snowe). The dems are losing just as badly (Alito confirmed etc.)
When will America wake up and realise you must all fight fascists, not just republicans.
Fascists, both political and religious, are the greatest threat to American and world peace and security. Is anyone over there fighting political and religious fascists as you all clearly need to?
You must perceive political and religious fascists as Americans once perceived Communists. Political, Religious Fascism must become the 3 filthiest words in the mind of ALL Americans.
February 18th, 2006 at 3:33 pmGary,
Is it you that post's the number of votes against Blair?
The reason I ask is because I don't think this is a US only problem.
Remember George H. W. Bush's "New World Order?"
February 18th, 2006 at 3:43 pmGreenwald:
And most important of all, there has been no real campaign to convince Americans of what is truly at stake with this scandal. Most Democrats can barely get themselves to utter the fact that the President broke the law, and yet half of all Americans have already reached that conclusion on their own.
20% also believe they have personally been wire tapped.
February 18th, 2006 at 3:55 pmSo how is it that when I turn on my TV I hear that Americans "support the spying"?
Oh, I agree 100% Gary. We are the last of the Super Powers, well, if you don't count China.
February 18th, 2006 at 4:15 pmO U T R A G E O U S
We are there. The country is in mortal danger.
February 18th, 2006 at 4:19 pmThe Republican pathology, Pt. 2...
There will soon be a time when statements like this from Sen. Mike DeWine, speaking about warrantless wiretapping, will be universally seen as ridiculous: You know, there's been some controversy about whether or not this program is legal or is...
February 18th, 2006 at 4:49 pm#144, Spudge
February 18th, 2006 at 5:07 pm#145, Clyde
#146, Gary
Thanks guys!! I knew I would find solace and support here on TP.
Spudge, The guy across the street who I work with is as strong a liberal as I am and he has no compunction about fighting fire with fire - he is not on the board - and he doesn't live next door to the guy.
Clyde, Your diplomatic reply is probably where I will go first. I can keep it civil and polite and make an inquiry of the Board.
Gary, From across the pond, you have a good grasp of things here and are able to see that unless things change in the country soon, we may indeed be revisiting something like a civil war.
My little problem is simply a microcosym.
i live in ohio and i can tell you that mike dewine is in his "last throes". he's outta here in november.
February 18th, 2006 at 5:30 pm#153 - Marie,
February 18th, 2006 at 5:30 pmHow big is a microcosm? I've been looking for years and have yet to find one.
I checked out your blog Spudge_ Boy and it is a nice format!
February 18th, 2006 at 6:58 pmGood luck to you on it and keep us all informed about the GOP and Emperor George!
#155 WTM
You just weren't looking in the right place. It is a particile in a particulate fraction that is a result of heavy centrifigation of broken cells and consists of various amounts of ribosomes, fragmented endoplasmic reticulum, and mitochrondial cristae. Our local Wal-Mart Super Center has them on the second shelf to the right on Aisle 34. My favorite corner Pub serves them at Happy Hour on Thursday night. Come on over and I'll buy!
February 18th, 2006 at 7:14 pmIf GW will show me his phone calls I'll show him mine.
February 18th, 2006 at 7:40 pmJust when I thought nothing DeWine said or did could surprise me, he comes up with this lame-brained partisan outrage. Why doesn't he just put a copy of our Constitution on the Senate floor and pee on it!! This clown cares a lot more about getting re-elected (and he clearly thinks Bush will see to it) than he does in representing the people of Ohio. I happen to be one of the people he's supposed to be representing, though I'm happy to report that I didn't vote for this twit. Will I be doing whatever I can to help Sherrod Brown get elected? You're damn right I will!!!! If DeWine does get re-elected you can probably assume that our Diebold voting machines, which are getting jammed down our throats, were tampered with. (Which is precisely why I'm going to be voting with a nice paper absentee ballot and I hope every other Democrat in the state does the same!!)
February 18th, 2006 at 8:05 pm[...] Some time ago I argued in a post that President Bush has blown away the system of checks and balances that had served the US more or less well for the 60 years it has been a world power. No better example could be found of this that the following sentences, uttered by Ohio Sen. Mike DeWine. Think Progress » DeWine: “We Don’t Want To Have Any Kind of Debate About Whether Its Constitutional†[...]
February 18th, 2006 at 8:11 pm#142 - Marie, Go ahead and put up your yard sign - your freedom of speech is important. You and I agree on very little - but the 2004 election was a terrific demonstration of democracy in action on our street. Five out of nine homes had Bush/Cheney yard signs - the remaining four houses had Kerry/Edwards. We all wave to each other and chat out front. But we don't BBQ together - Mr. Aphrodite HATES tofu.
February 18th, 2006 at 8:30 pm#40 - Dear Appalled Ally - Thank you for the refresher course on the Fourth Amendment - now go back and read the Articles.
February 18th, 2006 at 8:34 pm#
#142 - Marie, Go ahead and put up your yard sign - your freedom of speech is important. You and I agree on very little - but the 2004 election was a terrific demonstration of democracy in action on our street. Five out of nine homes had Bush/Cheney yard signs - the remaining four houses had Kerry/Edwards. We all wave to each other and chat out front. But we don’t BBQ together - Mr. Aphrodite HATES tofu.
Comment by mighty aphrodite — February 18, 2006 @ 8:30 pm
Rehashing the past again Again MaD?
And what the hell does tofu, bbq, and Yard Signs have to do with the price of Tea in China?
February 18th, 2006 at 8:40 pmIt's Jeffrey Shawn in drag again(MA). OHHH MYYYY
February 18th, 2006 at 9:22 pm#163 - mr ho,
February 18th, 2006 at 9:53 pm"What does that have to do with the price in China?" I first used that phrase 54 years ago in Dallas when a social studies teacher was ranting about inferior races and their drain on mankind. I spent the afternoon in the principal's office. Question - how old are you?
February 18th, 2006 at 10:46 pm
Everyone must protest in Ohio until that dweeb DeWine resigns from the Senate! Call and send him faxes bigtime!
February 18th, 2006 at 11:24 pmWaltTheMan,
I have been using "What does that have to do with the tea in China" for as long as I can remember. I picked it up from my Mom.
February 18th, 2006 at 11:35 pmJay Randal,
Thanks for the compliment.
mr ho,
Thanks for the comment. I gave you a hat tip for pointing out the second version of James A. Baker's July 31, 2002 letter to the Senate.
February 18th, 2006 at 11:37 pmmighty aphrodite,
You don't really think that all liberals eat tofu do you? No, of course you don't.
That would be like me syaing that I didn't want to drive somewhere with a republican "because I don't like pickup trucks."
Get real.
February 18th, 2006 at 11:39 pmSpudge_Boy,
February 19th, 2006 at 12:18 amI actually picked it up from my grandfather who served with Teddy (Roosevelt - not Kennedy) in the Spanish American War. The first instance on the web that I could find was 11/20/2005 in one of my posts.
The exact quote was:
“What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?â€
Republican Sues Bush, Cheney, NSA, TSA for Illegal Surveillance, Wiretapping
By Alan Gray, NewsBlaze
Scott Tooley, a Republican, and former Congressional aide and law school graduate, educated at renowned Christian universities, has filed suit against the President, Vice President and relevant federal agencies for their illegal surveillance programs.
According to the complaint, the Bush-Cheney Administration initiated numerous illegal and perpetual surveillance methods on Mr. Tooley and his family after he was incorrectly placed on the TSA's "selectee" or watch list.
Mr. Tooley's case is unique because the suit alleges the Bush Administration has used additional illegal surveillance methods on him in addition to the illegal wiretapping. Mr. Tooley is also the first Republican to file suit with regard to the Bush Administration's surveillance programs.
The suit alleges that RFID tags "that monitor their vehicle movements" were placed on his wife's car.
Prior to filing suit, Mr. Tooley says he asked federal agencies for the removal of his name from the TSA's watch list and any documents relating to the matter. He says he was stonewalled and told that the agencies could neither confirm nor deny that his name was placed on multiple watch lists.
The complaint was filed today in the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia on Friday, February 17, 2006. Mr. Tooley is represented by Larry Klayman, former Chairman of Judicial Watch and former U.S. Senate candidate from Florida. Mr. Klayman is now in private practice in Miami and Washington, D.C.
Wonder if anything will come of it?
February 19th, 2006 at 12:28 am[...] Ohio Republican Senator Mike DeWine thinks that Bush’s NSA spying program should be exempt from FISA. He had this to say on Fox News last Friday: You know, there’s been some controversy about whether or not this program is legal or is not legal. I think we need to get beyond that. And the vast majority of American people believe these calls need to be listened to. But we don’t want to have any kind of debate about whether it’s constitutional or not constitutional. So I think we need to put that beyond us. [...]
February 19th, 2006 at 12:29 amWaltTheMan,
You are probably correct. I don't think I have ever posted the phrase, but I do use it in everyday speech. I don't post exactly how I really speak. It would be weird saying things like "CNN, February 12, 2005 blah blah blah said blah blah at the blah blah on blah blah." You know.
But, you are correct. The saying it probably very old. It most likely comes from when we used the Chinese to build the Inter-Continental Railroad.
Wow, didn't ever think I would post something abou that.
February 19th, 2006 at 1:59 amMaybe it's time to turn to Rove's playbook. The key to defeating DeWine isn't illegal wiretapping, it's Jessica Cutler. Did't she write a novel? The Washingtonienne needs to be signing them at every bookstore in Ohio. Bet some local group, maybe NSA Veterans for Truth, could get a bulk discount.
February 19th, 2006 at 2:10 amAll the president's bag men...
NYT: "Is there any aspect of President Bush's miserable record on intelligence that Senator Pat Roberts, chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, is not willing to excuse and help to cover up?"...
February 19th, 2006 at 2:18 amThis NSA stuff is very Boring
Get back to world headlines such as shutting guantanamo and getting rid of Bush the Mass murderer
February 19th, 2006 at 5:11 amsmeg the NSA Spygate Scandal is one of the things that could remove Bush from the presidency, if the press would concentrate on it like they did on Cheney shooting somebody! King George can't be removed by just wishing it!
February 19th, 2006 at 9:28 amDems and Progs appear more loyal to their cause and party than country. This is an understandable position since “one-world†is an ultimate leftist goal
Comment by mighty aphrodite #28
Puny Hermaphrodite,
Give it a rest you rotten ovary carrying cu*t...
Your god's father Bush 41 is one of the main players in (the Carlyle Group) and coined the phrase "The New World Order"...
...the global plutocracy...
...you're a slave and don't even know it, you ignorant, al Cracker beeeotch...
Why do you hate freedom and democracy?
Why do you support the destruction of our Constitutional representative republic?
Why are you betraying your country?
Do you love Bushiva and L'il Dick so much that you are willing to sacrifice your children and grandchildren's futures?
O'h that's right, you have no eggs...
That's why dic*less Mr Hermaphrodite chose you...
February 19th, 2006 at 9:32 amDeWine is absolutely right. It is not up to Congress to determine the Constitutionality of a law. The only way to test it is to immediately have Bush arrested and tried for breaking it. If he is convicted, he has the right to appeal all the way to the Supreme Court which will make the final judgment on Bush's flagrant violation of a standing statute.
February 19th, 2006 at 12:00 pmThis country's direction scares the hell out of me. I keep thinking of when the right time is to leave! We can't count on voting or having our votes counted. We can't protest and be heard by the national media. We can't petition, because they don't care. We can't take them to the supreme court. That court is now stacked. We can't even investigate anything. With the exception of a very few in congress and the senate, it looks like we have a choice between the right-wing-right-wing, or the left-wing-right-wing, and the left-wing-right-wing is totally spineless. I can't condone violence despite this horrible anger and frustration inside. Is there any saving this country?
February 19th, 2006 at 5:00 pm#170 - You don’t really think that all liberals eat tofu do you? No, of course you don’t.
That would be like me syaing that I didn’t want to drive somewhere with a republican “because I don’t like pickup trucks.†- SpudgeMAN
*****You're right, Spudge, the ONLY liberals I think eat tofu are the "nature-girls", metrosexuals, PETA members, libs who hate ANYTHING corporate, pro-"choice" vegans,anti-death penalty Catholic nuns and Buddhist monks, environmental activists who despise nuclear power, bi-sexual circus performers, narcissistic Hollywood types, progs who take their pets to acupuncturist or psychiatrist, faux fur wearers - I'm sure there are other libs who eat tofu. I'm sorry if I excluded you....
But - gasp - had to agree with a Dem today - mark your calendar, Spudge! This morning Evan Bayh noted with incredulity the Dubai based company named to manage six US ports!! (I understand trade expansion - I DON'T UNDERSTAND A DUBAI BASED COMPANY MANAGING US PORTS!!) I don't care if TSA is managing security - no comfort there!!
February 19th, 2006 at 5:17 pmSpudge - You might want to reconsider that pick-up truck phobia you have. The 3/4 ton diesels are a comfortable ride, visibility is good and Prius', Scion, and Passats bounce right off them. I have nothing against tiny, cramped cars - it's just that they remind me of Diet Coke cans - SMOOOOOSH1111
February 19th, 2006 at 5:23 pmma is back again and once again committing character suicide. The Prius has a better occupant accident survival record then any SUV. The problem is that SUVs suffer from a roll-over syndrome that defies sanity, especially when you consider that their roofs generally end up pushing on the door locks when they do flip.
February 19th, 2006 at 6:41 pmAnd by the bye, light pick-ups are worst then SUVs. But that is not totally the fault of the vehicle - it's also the two six packs and the 500 ml. of Jack Daniels.
February 19th, 2006 at 7:05 pmTHIS is the issue to impeach the president on...He conducts warantless wiretaps against citizen's with no oversight. He does this against the Constitution. More importantly, he does this in violation of our unalienable rights. AND he pledges to continue breaking the law.
Let's impeach Bush. And let's impeach any successor of any party who has the nerve to violate the rights of "we the people."
We should worry about who controls Congress. Their authority is derived from us. If we withdraw our consent (and we can), they have to fold.
February 19th, 2006 at 9:47 pmUmmm... we shouldn't worry who controls Congress...
February 19th, 2006 at 9:48 pmIt's kind of funny, in a sad funny way, that the Republicans who just wave the Bushco Agenda through, without a word, do not seem to grasp the fact that it is really THEIR power and authority that they are giving to the Bushco crowd. And they do not like to share. But by the time they catch on, it will be far to late, because according to them, Bush has the right to do whatever he wants, even rendering them powerless to act. Live and learn, I suppose....
February 20th, 2006 at 2:33 amSpudge - You might want to reconsider that pick-up truck phobia you have. The 3/4 ton diesels are a comfortable ride, visibility is good and Prius’, Scion, and Passats bounce right off them. I have nothing against tiny, cramped cars - it’s just that they remind me of Diet Coke cans - SMOOOOOSH1111
Comment by mighty aphrodite — February 19, 2006 @ 5:23 pm
As usual, all about you - don't worry about anyone or anything else but your own ultimate comfort, Princess...
I find it really hard to believe you actually have children and don't think about their futures. You should be ashamed of yourself.
February 20th, 2006 at 12:56 pmATTENTION: BUSH SELLING THE PORTS TO THE UAE IS AGAINST THE LAW.
Yeah, you're probably saying "he selling it to a corporation", but WHO owns the corporation?
The UAE!
selling it to a government makes it against the law, and this transaction is illegal.
it is based in some law made in the 70's (that's all the hint I'll give ya).
impeachable? Write your congressman and find out.
February 23rd, 2006 at 8:35 pmEr. I meant " he's selling it to a corporationâ€...
My bad. :)
February 23rd, 2006 at 8:37 pmAMERICAN BATTLE PLANS FOR IRAN
http://www.craigmurray.co.uk/archives/2006/02/battle_plans_fo_1.html
February 24th, 2006 at 6:11 pm[...] Once upon a time, Mike DeWine, Congress critter-whore from Ohio, would have been called out as a traitor, and then tarred, feathered, and delivered to the edge of town on a rail in much the same way Bostonians did to excise men and other British agents. Now we can’t be bothered. As Congress passes the Patriot Act, I remember DeWine, who said the following about Bush’s Constitution-crunching NSA snooping program last month: [...]
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