REPORT: 98 Detainees Have Died While In U.S. Custody
REPORT: 98 Detainees Have Died While In U.S. Custody
Human Rights First just released a report concluding that since Aug. 2002, 98 detainees have died while in U.S. custody in the global war on terror. “According to the U.S. military’s own classifications, 34 of these cases are suspected or confirmed homicides; Human Rights First has identified another 11 in which the facts suggest death as a result of physical abuse or harsh conditions of detention.” The report also found that officials often failed to report the deaths and “effective punishment has been too little and too late.”
Yesterday on BBC Newsnight, Bush administration apologist David Rivkin defended the administration’s practice of torture. He argued that even if the report is true, torturing people to death is no big deal. Watch the exchange here.
BBC: If that [HRF report] is true, then this is a big scandal.
RIVKIN: No, with all due respect, it is not. … Let’s assume that 10 individuals were tortured to death. And again, I’m not conceding it to be the case. Let’s assume for the sake of a discussion that this is the case. The biggest problem of criticis like Deborah and most other criticis, is that terrible historical amnesia and a failure of perspective. Ten people were tortured to death out of over 100,000 detainees in Iraq and Afghanistan. That, according to my math, is 1,000th of 1 percent, which is a better rate than the situation in either Vietnam, WWI, or WWII, or most civilian penal systems. So from a standpoint of sheer numbers, it’s not a scandal. Unfortunately, bad things happen in detention. Bad things happen in confinement.
When the President insists, “We do not torture,” reserves the right to bypass a ban on torture, and then fails to punish officials who do torture, there’s something like a scandal going on.
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We didn’t kill them.
They just stopped living during interrogation.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:19 pmFor the latest news, documents, legal memos and other background on Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo Bay, visit:
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:19 pm“The Abu Ghraib Scandal Resource Center.”
I am sickened by this. That’s an extremely high death rate for a country that doesn’t torture. Bad things happen in confinement? Mr. Rivkin puts a very low value on human life.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:24 pmKindness, we didn’t torture them we just killed them. We don’t torture we just kill. They are telling the truth aren’t they. (SARCASM ALERT)
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:27 pmWhoa. Did you also see this from the report?
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:31 pm
According to my math: 10/100,000*100 = 0.01%, for those that know math.
I don’t understand the problem with the terrorist attack of 9/11?
3000/295734134*100 = 0.001% of the population killed. A better rate than many other countries.
(Please be able to identify sarcism when you read it.)
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:33 pmMr. Rivkin and anyone else can bicker about numbers, but when it is a policy to treat prisoners this way, when it is a policy to block international inspectors to see what is going on, when the people who dictate this abuse(higher than privates) aren’t held accountable for their orders then it is a scandal. I just have this picture in my head of a prisoner being beaten to death by someone screaming “Why do you hate America!”…insane.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:39 pmHow many are not reported? How many just disappeared before entering the “system”? Beside the torture, what really sickens me is how the administration got our low ranking kids to commit these atrocities then cut them loose. Fucking pigs.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:41 pmI think its important to remember that this is just what they were allowed to have access to. (HRF).
I doubt this is the extent of the crimes.
If they let HRF find out this much, how much more do you think they are still hiding?
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:48 pmCitz80203, Exactly. Apparently when the Red Cross shows up to ask questions or to see a prisoner they have a list to go by. If they aren’t on the list they can’t inquire diddly. That’s why the Pentagon liked the Ghost detainees. It’s all not very pretty.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:50 pmIf only America had stayed at home . the world would be a safer place …IDIOTS, MURDERERS, SHAMEFULL, HATED, THIEFS, TORTURERS,CHRISTAINSAnd to think they justified going to Iraq cause Saddam was abusing people in Custody..IRONIC
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:51 pmWhat would it take to make this a scandal? 100 deaths? 1000 deaths? 10,000 deaths?
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:52 pmWe have the exact same thoughts on that citizen.
You have to ask yourself just how likely is it that HRF was able to uncover everything?
With all the secret prisons, the clandestine nature of the entire program, and the fact that they are classified makes it clear that we are seeing the tip of the iceberg.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:52 pmFor the record…
…many of these U.S. soldiers working in NG units responsible for detainees…
…work as America’s “corrections” personnel…
…they’re sick, demented, psychotic, red state, racist sombiches…
…and now the world knows…
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:54 pmWhat makes us think the world is just going to sit by and let this continue?
We are making enemies every day. And a lot of those enemies used to be friends.
We are the shame of the planet.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:54 pmfirst red cross, then un, now this report. admin needs to address all of these and what’s going on there.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:57 pmAs the bumper sticker says, “We are making enemies faster than we can kill them.”
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:58 pmWe are all at risk for being subjected to the same treatment.
One person wrote:
She is being investigated for “sedition.”
Those who speak out against this administration now put their lives and their livelihood on the line.
And to think, Republicans came into power promising a kinder, gentler America and preaching compassionate conservatism.
But then, maybe they are saying they have delivered on that promise:
Kinder, gentler torture, killing fewer detainees is compassionate conservatism.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:58 pmNo Greg.
The administration is beyond addressing it.
Now its time for Federal prosecutors to address it.
February 22nd, 2006 at 12:59 pmfirst red cross, then un, now this report. admin needs to address all of these and what’s going on there.
Comment by Greg T. #18
Greg T.
ACCOUNTABILITY…
…is not a word…
…we use in this administration…
…it is “counterproductive”…
…to point fingers and place blame…
…we prefer to look forward…
…think positive…
…and you’ll forget in due time…
Thank you for your suggestion though…
Sincerely,
-Bushiva and L’il Dick-
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:07 pmWhat makes us think the world is just going to sit by and let this continue?
Comment by worfeus — February 22, 2006 @ 12:54 pm
This is the part that worries me the most. (The part that appalls me the most is the torture part).
That more innocent people will come to pay for this administrations disregard for humanity.
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:08 pmMan, the “Culture of Life” crowd sure kill a lot of people, don’t they?
What’s really so appalling about this is that torture is an unreliable method of interrogation.
We know that.
So the only conclusion is that these people are being tortured just for the fun of torturing them.
How does this make us different from the SSD, the Gestapo, the NKVD?
How on earth can we claim the moral high ground any more?
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:09 pmNow its time for Federal prosecutors to address it.
Comment by worfeus — February 22, 2006 @ 12:59 pm
Absolutely.
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:09 pmFederal prosecutors can’t address it. Congress gave away federal jurisdiction in return for language prohibiting the use of torture.
See:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060221/pl_afp/usattacksguantanamo;_ylt=AlvV7rnLeXhyRGmeXuta_NdMEP0E;_ylu=X3oDMTBjMHVqMTQ4BHNlYwN5bnN1YmNhdA–
If the Supreme Court rules in favor of the government on this issue look for a broadening application of this law.
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:16 pmI knew there were some deaths, but 98!!! And has been stated, this is what they were able to find out information on. How many are covered up? Just like the soldiers who are greavely injured in Iraq and shipped out of the country before they die, so as to not raise the number of soldiers “killed in Iraq”
This is disgusting and goes against everything the United States stands for.
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:17 pmThis is everything America stands for, now.
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:19 pmWhatreallyhappened.com has an article(Feb20) where Dr.Pace of the UN claims this number is in the thousands.
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:22 pmso who might I ask is going to do this in The Federal Government? bush has locked the courts up and the Federal Government .What Supreme Court? It disappeared when bush took over. Not the A.G. he is bush’s old taco pal that wrote his( briefs(for the Sheek) on killing people in the late great State Of Texas (been renamed as Bandarbush Country)
So where does this leave AmerDubai ? In the dust rotting along with these P.O.W.’s that was murdered by prolly Caci or Titan employees…..Armed killers is the correct term..
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:27 pmAmerica is sick
The world knows it now
hec of a job
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:27 pmSounds to me like Rivkin admitted it.
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:40 pmAfter all the charges by humanitarian watchdog groups, followed by photographs of certain abuses, followed by testimony of same, followed by lame denials by Rummy and his team — the whole world knows this happened. The US looks like lying, arrogant lawbreakers and we deserve the reputation.
This is not the America I know, it has been subverted by a rotten, immoral, unethical cabal.
http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/060227fa_fact
Taht is a supurb article about the torture policy of the US and how people were making noise about it way back in 2002.
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:43 pmall from natural causes, right?
February 22nd, 2006 at 1:47 pmHow hard is it for someone to say that even one death is too many? This ‘administration’ will never learn…
February 22nd, 2006 at 2:02 pm31# I agree America is sick. I also think Bush has the Biggest team of Phycologists ever assembled in one place to manipulate the American Public . very Sick Human Bush is
February 22nd, 2006 at 2:28 pmWhat a sleight of hand. First, pull a very low number out of a hat. Then, claim torturing prisoners has been an acceptable practice in previous conflicts. Casually hint that your own penal system engages in the practice, as if torturing inmates was part of a warden’s job description. Finally, wrap up your argument by saying that bad things happen.
In a nutshell: Everyone does it. We are not bad because we torture less than Hussein did.
The moral bankrupcy of this administration’s apologists is breathtaking.
February 22nd, 2006 at 2:29 pmIve about had it with america even now iam teaching my children at a young age priciples about buying American products
dont shop in ASDA kids your supporting terrorism
please dont think Im joking either
There only 1,5 and 9 and I have been teaching them this simple value since you stepped into IRAQ
they are already getting the message its amazing
February 22nd, 2006 at 2:38 pmone other thing theres plenty of people accross the world doing exactly the same thing ……….Most probably will take to my great grand children before theres a reversal in this policy
February 22nd, 2006 at 2:39 pm7- There was a documentary on Link TV that featured him, and one other man prominently. Listening to them recount the details of their captivity is, well, disturbing would be an understatement. There is still much of this story that we don’t know, especially the more gruesome aspects.
February 22nd, 2006 at 2:58 pmall from natural causes, right?
Nah, suicide, most likely.
February 22nd, 2006 at 3:06 pmHere you go
February 22nd, 2006 at 3:13 pmOn Monday the outgoing UN human rights chief Dr. John Pace dropped a bombshell when he told an obscure Maltese newspaper that as many as a thousand detainees a month are being tortured to death in Iraq.
“The Baghdad morgue received 1,100 bodies in July alone, about 900 of whom bore evidence of torture or summary execution. That continued throughout the year and last December there were 780 bodies, including 400 having gunshot wounds or wounds as those caused by electric drills,” said Pace.
This makes today’s claim that only 100 prisoners have died in US custody in Iraq and Afghanistan since August 2002 pale into insignificance. True, the majority of the 1000 a month figure are being tortured to death by corrupt Iraqi police, but those police and former Saddam loyalists were trained and put into positions of power by the US government,
February 22nd, 2006 at 3:54 pmRead this
Bush and Blair have brilliantly done Bin Laden’s work for him
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2088-2047134,00.html
February 22nd, 2006 at 4:08 pmTHINK PROGRESS US BRITS WILL SHOW YOU AMERICANS HOW TO DEMOSTRATE AGAINST WAR WITH 2 MILLION PEOPLE NEXT MONTHnote also if we were ever invaded these 2 million would be called insurgents ……
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/4736742.stm
February 22nd, 2006 at 4:20 pmThe moral bankrupcy of this administration’s apologists is breathtaking.
Comment by Gregor Samsa — February 22, 2006 @ 2:29 pm
Now, now, Gregor. They are Evangelical Christians. Those are the most moral people on the face of the Earth – because they said so. Actions don’t supercede declarations of such magnitude, didn’t you know? :)
February 22nd, 2006 at 5:40 pm#48 – *gag*
February 22nd, 2006 at 6:15 pmThere is nothing more FUN to read than IGNORANT, INEXPERIENCED humans posting to this blog.
If you can do it better, get off this blog and show the world!
Blog talk is cheap. Most of the bloggers here are hopelessly undereducated about life in general.
Signed: A senior citizen.
February 22nd, 2006 at 6:27 pmWhoever posted “If only America had stayed at home the world would be a safer place” – I guess you FORGOT about 9/11 … we were at home, they brought the war onto our soil.
In regards to the torture going on overseas – you cried bloody murder and blamed our government for not stopping 9/11 – now that you see what it takes and how you deal with animals who have no remorse for blowing up their own wife and kids to make a point, you want to complain. Get a clue, wake up and smell the coffee – see how they are reacting to stupid cartoons – I guess you can only see if you are willing to open your eyes.
God Bless America & our troops!
February 22nd, 2006 at 6:31 pmWhat has this country become? Torturers?
9/11–3,000 Americans have died
Hurricane Katrina–1,000 dead, 3,000 unaccounted for.
All under Bush’s watch.
Now, selling our ports to a country that breeds, and does business with, terrorists.
What will it take to get this man out of office? What has to happen before we ALL DEMAND he resign now?
February 22nd, 2006 at 6:35 pmHurricane Katrina–1,000 dead, 3,000 unaccounted for.
All under Bush’s watch.
- WOW, I never realized Bush had the ability to summon up hurricanes! I guess it is his fault when it rains to much and floods your basement, it’s his fault that it snowed and made the roads icy … how about the Governor of LA who did NOT declare a state of emergency until the morning of the storm hitting land, I guess that was Bush’s fault to for stepping on state’s rights.
Hopefully you won’t burn your dinner rolls tonight – otherwise you will probably blame Bush for that too.
February 22nd, 2006 at 6:52 pmWhats the real problem Sad but safe, the prune juice not working? you withered old right-wing fossil.
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:09 pmAs for your comment; right-wing Mike posted next and blew that argument to hell.
Mike,
Bush isn’t directly liable for the hurricane itself.
But, he is responsible for eating cake on August 29, while people were dying:
He is responsible for playing guitar August 30 while people died:
He is responsible for not going to ground zero and only flying over on August 31:
He is responsible for not going to New Orleans until Spetember 2.
He is responsible for not cutting through the FEMA red tape he created when he moved FEMA under the Department of Homeland security.
He waited for three days to even acknowldge there was a problem in New Orleans. You maybe one of the only people in the world to not recognize that fact, but it doesn;t mean it didn’t happen.
Stop being an apologist and stop trying to take everything at face value. You might learn something.
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:11 pmI was just going to comment that even the ‘trolls’ couldn’t try and justify the death of 98 detainees while in U.S. Custody.
Then up-pops Mike to restore my faith in troll stupidity.
This is a terrible story Mike, and a damning indictment of Bush’s ‘War On Terror’, or as we must now refer to it as ‘The Long War’. My head hurts so many titles, so many re-brandings, have they finally settled on a name yet for what should now be referred to as an ‘unjust war’?
Maybe Bush’s ‘War Of Human Stupidity And Belligerence’, would suffice.
People have died at the hands of what is tantamount to torturers, yet you are trying to justify the ‘murdering’ of another human being. And pass it off as a prank or a ‘hazing’ by college students.
‘Hearts And Minds’ Mike, ‘Hearts And Minds’. They’ve never had it so good have they Mike. They have their freedom and a thriving democracy, all thanks to the good old US of A. Civil War in Iraq looks like it is about to break out in Iraq, if it hasn’t already after today’s events in Iraq. And the right-wing of America, and Bush and the GOP are acting as if everything is normal in la-la land. Nothing to see here, everything’s fine, move along now, we have got everything under control.
Phew! some people will believe anything we say to them, especially Fox News viewers, there the ones we need to keep away from the light.
“You can fool all the ‘Fox News’ viewers some of the time, and some of ‘Fox News’ viewers and ‘Mike’ all of the time, but you cannot fool all of the ‘news junkies’ all of the time.â€
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:12 pmHe is responsible for not going to ground zero and only flying over on August 31:
He is responsible for not going to New Orleans until Spetember 2.
Oh yeah, nice photo op with the flag behind Bush.
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:15 pm51 # I posted that ” IF america etc etc
Stuff your county and Fvck your muredering troops
Your Patriotic games are brainwashing your peoples into thinking like arogant morons who think they rule the world.become a human from earth and not an american lets say our earth was going to be blown up and two astronauts were sent into space to save the human race you would call them brothers YEH…now lets say one was Black and a woman arabic would you still say that ……..so forget the American Patriotic bullshit thats for wars or declaring your better than say a canadian …and as for the canonfodder troops that list up cause they aint got a real job or a brain to work things out for themselfs..LIVE BY THE SWORD DIE BY THE SWORD …stuff your troops they are the dogs of war IDIOTS
anybody can become a terrorist even a Buddhist monk whom practiced peace all their lifes when the Chinese made them hold guns in their hands and pressed the trigger which killed a family member they soon took to wearing guns and seeking revenge..Im a passafist but you touch my kids and Ill want revenge ….you rape my kids and get off in a court of law and live acccroos the street by god will i terrorise you ..
Thiank about waht your doing in the world arrogant piece of shit
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:16 pm51# and to finish your question …..if you had a different foreign policy 911 would never have happened …blame yourselfs
and as for IRAQ by god you made that mess ..saddam hussein was your dog to start with he just started to not like the Bush family and paid for it …….hell probably be hung 3 months from now …you murdered his children also…as well as gaddafi children whom DID not bomb the lockerbie pan am airlines ..WHY did your CIA run onto the tarmack of that flight and pull his KIDS off the flight at the last minute ….THIS IS YOUR FOREIGN POLICY — STAY AT HOME the world has lived a lot longer than American history
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:25 pmI guess you FORGOT about 9/11 … we were at home, they brought the war onto our soil.
Comment by Mike — February 22, 2006 @ 6:31 pm
The US wasn’t “at home”: The attacks were brought about due to the presence of US troops in Saudi Arabia, the holliest land in Islam. US military bases in saudi Arabia is one of Bin Laden’s main peeves and his best recruiting tool. Imagine what will happen when the US oficially acknowledges the four “enduring” bases built in Iraq.
you cried bloody murder and blamed our government for not stopping 9/11
The Bush administration did fail to stop the attacks, even when they got the memo titled “Osama Bin Laden determined to strike inside the US”.
now that you see what it takes and how you deal with animals who have no remorse for blowing up their own wife and kids to make a point, you want to complain.
Arabs/Muslims are not animals -you’re racism and bigotry are showing. If you are talking about the recent bombing of the Shiite shrine, the insurgents did not blow up their own wifes and kids. They likely were Sunnis targeting as many Shiites as they could. Iraq is in the mist of a civil war; didn’t you know that?
Get a clue, wake up and smell the coffee – see how they are reacting to stupid cartoons – I guess you can only see if you are willing to open your eyes.
These are more than just “stupid cartoons”. The Quran explicitly prohibits the depiction of the prophet, god, or anything on heaven or earth (By the way, these prohibitions are found in the Old Testament. Muslims happen to take them literally, as do many Christian Protestant denominations). To depict the prophet in any way is a desecration and a blasphemy, akin to portraying Jesus Christ in drag, or to say that the Virgin Mary worked on streeet corners at night -if you know what I mean.
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:30 pm60# I aggree 911 was Bin laden wants US troops out of Suadi Arabia — Basically your 600 troops there surround a royal family of 140 members whom steal saudis oil wealth between them and of corse the Bush family get a big kick bakc …….as i said 911 would never have happened if it were not for America foreign policy ….Im right eh
AS for this
US suspects al-Qaeda
In Washington, a senior US official said the al-Qaeda was suspected of being behind the attack on the Shia shrine.
“We believe this can be traced back to the Zarqawi al-Qaeda movement,” said the State Department’s coordinator for Iraq policy, Ambassador James Jeffrey, on Wednesday adding the United States would do all it could to track down the perpetrators.
90 sunni mosques were attacked today and civil war is happening
I SMELL A RAT HOW CAN THE ABOVE BLAME ALL QUEDA without any proof all within 18 hours
IM TELLING you the 6 police that hijacked the most in the early hours of the morning where probabbly AMERICAN service men …………this is another American foreign policy PROBABLY…I dont know but i smell a rat for sure
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:39 pmMisspell. My post above should read: “your racism and bigotry are showing.”
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:40 pmGregor Samsa,
How many Christians would call for World War III if the Muslims were to release cartoons like the ones you describe. If it isn’t all of them, then they aren’t real Christians.
It is hard for these people to look in the mirror or put the shoe on the other foot. Their hatred of other races/religions is transparent.
February 22nd, 2006 at 7:43 pmSpudge_Boy,
My feeling exactly. People like Mike think the people they offend are stupid, believe in “superstitions”, and should grow a thicker skin. Their inability to empathise is almost morbid.
Also, not all Muslims are taking to the streets to participate in violent protests. Not to mention there is certainly a number of religious leaders who are using this issue to push their own political version of Islam.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:15 pmI should have known better that there would ONLY be ignorant liberals on such a blog … I was over there for 9 months and saw things first hand, I deployed and supported both my unit and country – unfortunately the common man over in Iraq wants to just sit back and let the insurgents control them so that they can again blame the US for anything and everything that goes wrong in the middle east. Maybe if the murderous swords of Islam practiced what THEY supposedly teach the world would be a better place – the world would be a better place if the middle east didn’t exist, that is where ALL problems and terrorism evolves from.
Have a great night the rest you sad pathetic Gore admirers, don’t forget that the lack of action on Clinton’s part actually led to 9/11 happening, the bombings of our emabssys in Africa and the bombing of the USS Cole.
I is really to sad to see how many of you liberals hate the country that allows them to speak freely like you do – if you lived in the middle east, you would have been tortured, killed and your family killed many years ago … when was the last time someone died in the US as a result of freedom of speach?
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:17 pmI agree that Mike is somewhat close minded, but the Muslims killing Christians, burning down churches and clerics offering millions of dollars to anyone who murders the Dutch cartoonist is sad – there is NO excuse for such in humane actions.
This type of behavior further fuels EVERYONE of ANY religion that Islam is not a tolerant or loving religion. It is 2006, not 1206 – this type of behavior by any group hiding behind a religion is unnacceptable.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:22 pmGoint points Julie,
Yes those crtoons may be offensive or against their religion, but where does it say in the Koran that people should be killed for drawing a cartoon?
Which is morally worse – a cartoon or people killing and burning down churches in the name of Islam? The answer is obvious unless you are blinded by faith. People should be able to think for themselves regardless what the bible or koran states and love their fellow man, not harm them.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:27 pmWell, yeah, Iraqs unemployment rate is 40%, so 60% of them have to go to work.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:32 pmTomithy McVeigh wasn’t Middle Eastern. He was a right winger.
The guy who sent the anthrax in the mail to the Democratic leaders in 2001 wasn’t Middle Eastern. He was a right winger.
The right wingers who are burning black churches in Alabama aren’t Middle Eastern.
The right wingers that blow up abortion clinics aren’t Middle Eastern.
What was that abou the Middle East again, racist.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:35 pmI believe it was either Martin Luther King Jr. or John F. Kennedy. Both killed by right wingers.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:37 pmSpudge as well as their ignorance of what the bible actually says and the meaning if Christ’s message to us from the sermon on the mount.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:37 pmLOL Spudge_Boy – I seriously hope no one is funding or paying these individuals riot and burn down churches, that would be despictable.
I know there will NEVER be world peace or at least until after nuclear war or th next ice age. Maybe that’s what we really need here, a fresh clean start without ANY religions to brainwash the people – just basic common sense, morals and ethics and treat one another in a respectful way, we would have a wonderful planet.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:39 pmActually the Koran says that you can’t have ANY pictures of Muhammed. Cartoon or not. And it does call this Idolitry and it is an offence punishable by death. The fact that it is a cartoon is only icing on the cake.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:39 pmunfortunately the common man over in Iraq wants to just sit back and let the insurgents control them so that they can again blame the US for anything and everything that goes wrong in the middle east.
Comment by Mike — February 22, 2006 @ 8:17 pm
Aahh, the white man’s burden is so heavy to bear sometimes, isn’t it?
So sad “those people” don’t appreciate your sincere attempts at civilising them… Did you manage to Christianise anyone while over there? Because you know, Christians have never, ever killed anyone.
Maybe if the murderous swords of Islam practiced what THEY supposedly teach the world would be a better place – the world would be a better place if the middle east didn’t exist, that is where ALL problems and terrorism evolves from.
More racism and bigotry from our new troll Mike.
If the US hadn’t invaded Iraq in a war of choice, US servicemen & women wouldn’t be dying over there.
The world would be a better place if the US decided to stop meddling in other countries’ internal affairs, and left other people to rule themselves instead of engaging in “regime change” and invasions over natural resources.
don’t forget that the lack of action on Clinton’s part actually led to 9/11 happening, the bombings of our emabssys in Africa and the bombing of the USS Cole.
I guess the irony of decrying murder while participating in the illegal invasion of a country that posed no threat (and subsequent carnage) is lost on you.
I is really to sad to see how many of you liberals hate the country that allows them to speak freely like you do – if you lived in the middle east, you would have been tortured, killed and your family killed many years ago
If I lived in Iraq right now, chances are I would have been dragged out of my house at night by US troops, throwned in jail with no recourse, and tortured. Possibly even killed.
when was the last time someone died in the US as a result of freedom of speach?
What does this have to do that people have died at the hands of their US captors? Why are you trying to avoid the subject?
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:39 pmMy Name is Earl,
Love that show.
Everybody needs to be hit one time with that memory erasing thingy from Men In Black. That would mellow everybody out.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:41 pmOh yeah, Mike, what unit and division were you in?
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:42 pmwhen was the last time someone died in the US as a result of freedom of speach?
I believe it was either Martin Luther King Jr. or John F. Kennedy. Both killed by right wingers.
- well, not to defend the person in any way who posted this original question, 1963 for JFK and 1968 for MLK is 43 and 38 years ago, unfortunately innocent people are murdered daily in Iran and North Korea for speaking ill of their country or it’s policies.
We are VERY fortuate here with all of the rights and freedoms we have, yet some people think we have limited rights – they really need to read up on rights on other countries, they would be shocked!
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:45 pmI agree that Mike is somewhat close minded, but the Muslims killing Christians, burning down churches and clerics offering millions of dollars to anyone who murders the Dutch cartoonist is sad – there is NO excuse for such in humane actions.
Comment by Julie — February 22, 2006 @ 8:22 pm
“Somewhat”? He is close-minded and backward. Drop the “somewhat”, please.
There is no excuse, to be sure. But to say that only Muslims are violence-prone, and that they are making a big deal over a “stupid cartoon” is both racist and ignorant.
This type of behavior further fuels EVERYONE of ANY religion that Islam is not a tolerant or loving religion. It is 2006, not 1206 – this type of behavior by any group hiding behind a religion is unnacceptable.
How about the self-appointed Christians who were blowing up abortion clinics? Or killing the doctors who worked there? Does that mean Christianity is bad? Are these aberrations a poor reflection on Christianity as a whole?
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:48 pm“Oh yeah, Mike, what unit and division were you in?”
I would tell you, but then I would have to torture and kill you, the way you think every soldier/marine is stationed overseas – that is just as ignorant as saying all Muslims are terrorists.
Not that it matters nor do I care what any of YOU and think I am a racist, I am an African-American – I know what racism is and have experienced it first hand for many years growing up in Georgia. Thankfully in the Armed Forces there is very little racism and anyone caught doing so is punished, unlike in the civilian world.
Have a good one everyone and thanks for playing the blog game! I love to play the devil’s advocate on these things, people get so worked up over words, mere words.
God Bless everyone, Christians, Muslims, Jews, Buddists and those who worship the earth, we all make up this bizzare world we live on and attempt to share.
February 22nd, 2006 at 8:55 pmThere is no excuse, to be sure. But to say that only Muslims are violence-prone, and that they are making a big deal over a “stupid cartoon†is both racist and ignorant.
Gregor Samsa, I don’t appreciate your personal attacks on me and calling me racist. I don’t recall saying ONLY Muslims are violence prone – I merely pointed out a current event. I dont recall the Jews or Christians killing Muslims and burning down Mosques over cartoons over Christ, not did Americans go out and burn down every Mosque on Sep. 11th – they easily could, thanksfully they didn’t!
Try to focus on the discussion at hand and not attack people for expressing opinions, attack the arguement instead – otherwise you lose your case instantly.
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:03 pmNot that it matters nor do I care what any of YOU and think I am a racist, I am an African-American – I know what racism is and have experienced it first hand for many years growing up in Georgia.
Comment by Mike — February 22, 2006 @ 8:55 pm
Are you seriously saying black people cannot be racist? Are African-Americans somehow incapable of racism? Is it genetic?
If you have experienced racism and bigotry, you ought to be able to see the same attitude in yourself; like when you call Iraqis “animals”.
I love to play the devil’s advocate on these things, people get so worked up over words, mere words.
I will remember that next time I run into a white supremacist web site. Those morons probably don’t mean anything they post, and theirs are mere words, right?
God Bless everyone, Christians, Muslims, Jews, Buddists and those who worship the earth, we all make up this bizzare world we live on and attempt to share.
Please keep your blessings to yourself, you make my skin crawl -creep.
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:04 pmGregor Samsa, I don’t appreciate your personal attacks on me and calling me racist. I don’t recall saying ONLY Muslims are violence prone – I merely pointed out a current event.
Comment by Julie — February 22, 2006 @ 9:03 pm
Relax, I wasn’t talking about you. I was talking about Mike.
Try to focus on the discussion at hand and not attack people for expressing opinions, attack the arguement instead – otherwise you lose your case instantly.
I thought I was focusing -I was trying to explain my replies to Mike. But I will attack people who express racist and bigoted opinions -like Mike and other trolls.
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:07 pmGregor,
As I can see by your attacks on me and the posting prior to yours, you are such a compassionate and caring individual yourself.
You may want to consider some anger management courses. They also offer medication to people like yourself.
Again, God Bless you! … hoping that makes your skin crawl even more since you are a self proclaimed saint!
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:09 pmThanks Gregor, I have never been nor do I tolerate racism or prejudice against anyone regardless of their race, sex, religion or sexuality.
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:12 pmJulie
As I can see by your attacks on me and the posting prior to yours, you are such a compassionate and caring individual yourself.
Comment by Mike — February 22, 2006 @ 9:09 pm
I actually am caring. I just don’t care for passive-agressive people like you: “I am black, so I cannot be racist” -nice try.
And I didn’t attack you, you are not that important. I offered rebuttals to your asinine, racist & bigoted posts.
You may want to consider some anger management courses. They also offer medication to people like yourself.
Funny -I wasn’t angry. Not a bit. Now I am even amused.
Again, God Bless you! … hoping that makes your skin crawl even more since you are a self proclaimed saint!
Where did I say I am a saint? Geess, you are weird.
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:18 pmJulie,
Peace to you too ;-)
Cheers and g’night…
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:19 pmunfortunately the common man over in Iraq wants to just sit back and let the insurgents control them so that they can again blame the US for anything and everything that goes wrong in the middle east.
Comment by Mike — February 22, 2006 @ 8:17 pm
Is that like the christofacists who let the neo-cons shrill fear mongering machine stir them into such a frenzy that killing the wrong muslims is OK so long as we are killing muslims.
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:35 pmWhat the fvck are you talking about dumbass. I was stationed overseas during Deseert STorm and I didn’t torture anybody. The fact that you think that anybody in the world thinks that ALL soldiers torture and kill people shows just how stupid and brain dead you are.
I ask again, what unit and division were you in?
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:53 pmHa, you wish you could get me worked up dumabss. You would have to be the president and completely screw up this country to get me worked up, other than that, you are a twerp.
You are not playing devil’s advocate, you are just another dumbass.
February 22nd, 2006 at 9:57 pmFirst of all, Jews don’t believe in Christ. They think Jesus was a swell guy, but he wasn’t Christ to them.
Second, we haven’t seen any anti Christian or Jewish cartoons, yet. There were probably bad Jewish cartoons during the Nazi era in Germany, but they were killin ghte Jews anyway, while America sat by until we were attacked by Japan.
February 22nd, 2006 at 10:00 pmI would tell you, but then I would have to torture and kill you, the way you think every soldier/marine is stationed overseas comment by mike,
Well mike either you can not back up what you posted and reply with a cheap reply to deflect attention, or you are ashamed of your service, and do not want to acknowledge it, I served in desert storm and very little of what anyone does in combat is classifed as you hint at AFTER the fact. I should know because I held a top secret cinwit clearance and was pal(nuc-chem) cleared. Smart replys may sound good to you but they shrivel the message you proclaim to have,
I was over there for 9 months and saw things first hand, I deployed and supported both my unit and country -
commemt by mike,
“Oh yeah, Mike, what unit and division were you in?â€
Comment by Spudge_Boy — February 22, 2006 @ 8:42 pm
you could show some common decency in your answer even if you do not want to tell him.
February 22nd, 2006 at 10:04 pm#48 – *gag*
Comment by Zookeeper — February 22, 2006 @ 6:15 pm
Yeah, it was a bit nauseating to type… :)
February 22nd, 2006 at 10:05 pm“you don’t need to understand italian to see the bestiality of humans in wartime……”
italian speaking people understand having sex with animals in wartime?
am i missing something here?!
(heh, i think i know what you meant… just found it kinda funny is all)
February 23rd, 2006 at 1:27 amsanto- what is the video clip you have? I never click on that stuff… Is it one of the ones where they are cutting a guys head of slowly with a knife and he is screaming the most horrific screams you could ever imagine for what seams like eternity? or is it one where the detanie is grunting like a pig while ….
February 23rd, 2006 at 3:30 amI know someone was complaining that these guys used to be our friends and now their not. Personally they were never my friend and if they are your friend you are not my friend either.
heres some friendly advice
AMERICAS FOREIGN POLICY
to stay on top of the world we must put other countries down
we sell weapons to them
we start wars for them
we torture them
we jail them
we install dictators
we install puppet goverments
we commit assainations
we invade countries illegally
we spend money speading lies
we steal
we sell heroin
in fact our foreign policy is to disrupt societies of foreign countries as to keep them from progress
GROW UP THE WORLD KNOWS YOUR GAME
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:34 ambeing a liberal is a modern day neccessity
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:35 amJust to put this in perspective. the iraqi health service reported just over a thousand dead bodies in their morgues last month. Doctors said they estimated 900 had died via summary execution, and.or showed evidence of torture before death. And that is just the figures for one month, iraqi against iraqi. Still does exonerate US abuses which are unnacceptable too.
February 23rd, 2006 at 7:32 amAnyone suprised?
Prescott shrub helped it happen in WWII Germany, now his great fabulous son
DUMBYA
is seeing that it will be done now.
800, Yes people 800 EIGHT HUNDRED concentration camps HERE IN THE U.S. and a cozy deal worth $385MILLION to Halliburton’s KBR to build more.
Just who the hell do you think they will be killing and keeping in these camps?
ANYONE THAT DOES NOT SHARE THEIR TWISTED IDEAS!
They have drafted laws to use those in the U.S. CONCENTRATION CAMPS as SLAVE LABOR.
Sound familiar YET?
Wake up people, IT’S HAPPENING AGAIN.
Will you be INSIDE OR OUTSIDE listening to FAUX news?
February 23rd, 2006 at 11:37 amGRAND SON DUMBYA,
sorry for the mis-type
February 23rd, 2006 at 11:38 amAt least one good thing came out of this shrine being blown up by a Bush covert operation …….YEE HAA seven american troops killed today YEE HAA
February 23rd, 2006 at 12:58 pmSmedley I hope your not residing in the USA. Scary thought.
February 23rd, 2006 at 9:43 pmFor those of you who are still yelling 9/11 to excuse everything. Watch ‘Loose Change” or check out Scholars for 9/11 Truth. This nightmarish administration was behind 9/11 and then used it to excuse all their subsequent crimes against the world at large.
February 24th, 2006 at 2:33 pmBasically Most Americans are waiting for the wealth to come from stealing Iraqs oil wealth and possibly Irans too (( as in American Battle plans for Iran here http://www.craigmurray.co.uk/ archives/ 2006/ 02/ battle_plans_fo_1.html
The democrats I think dont speak out against the war because monkey boy Bush might just manage to steal all the worlds oil reserves …therefore most say morgage paying americans , workers, fear for their future …and have hidden ajendas …If Bush pulls this steal off …and America becomes rich again the democatrats will look very foolish …I think and thats why they do not speak out
February 24th, 2006 at 5:54 pm[...] When the President insists, “We do not torture,†reserves the right to bypass a ban on torture, and then fails to punish officials who do torture, there’s something like a scandal going on. http://thinkprogress.org/2006/02/22/98-detainees-died/ [...]
February 26th, 2006 at 3:24 pmsocial security ssd facts and information…
Intriguing idea, but I don’t know if I believe you one hundred percent….
March 26th, 2009 at 6:57 am