Working Americans ‘Still Can’t Afford To Eat’
Working Americans ‘Still Can’t Afford To Eat’
In his State of the Union Address, President promised to pursue “an agenda that will raise standards of living.”
But a study released today by the America’s Second Harvest shows that Bush has fallen short. Nine million Americans sought aid from food pantries and soup kitchens last year, even though they were members of households where at least one person had a job.
A look at why working Americans are struggling to put food on the table:
– After adjusting for inflation, wages have not risen during the last three years. In fact, real hourly wages fell for most middle and low-income workers in 2005.
– An individual who works full-time at the current minimum wage earns about $10,700 a year —$5,390 below the 2005 poverty line for a family of three, and $8,650 below the poverty line for a family of four.
– The inflation-adjusted value of the minimum wage is 29 percent lower today than it was in 1979.
So far, Bush has succeeded only at creating low-wage jobs and long lines at the nation’s soup-kitchens.
– Mike Darner
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As Republican deftly learned during the '92 election, Americans vote with their pocketbooks. If the economy is really as weak as most of you think here, well you should retake alot of seats this fall. Personally, I don't see it that way as do many Americans, but we shall see in November.
February 23rd, 2006 at 3:52 pmThe real problem is that Bush comes from very old money. Very old. He was born with a silver spoon in his mouth and doesn't have a clue what it is to be an avergae American.
We shall see Randy, we shall see.
February 23rd, 2006 at 3:55 pmOh, what a buncha whiners are those working Americans. I mean, people like Randy are fat & happy so it's got to be their own fault.
In all seriousness, I think Randy is probably right--I doubt the Democrats will retake many seats this fall. Except for some of the "fighting Dems" that are Desert Storm & Iraq War vets, most of the democrats are just like the republicans, only less so. And even if there is a decently close race, Diebold and the rest of the republican shenanigans will see to it that every vote that's worthy of being counted will be counted--the "right" way.
February 23rd, 2006 at 3:56 pmI'm waiting for Seth to come on over and tell us all again that we're reading these numbers wrong and everything is actually just great.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:01 pm#3, Fatty bin Laden - keep up the fight, never give up, remember as the middle east turmoil increases (Rice/Iran) there will be a proportional decrease in the stability of oil supply and a corresponding increase in petrol prices. Should come to a head nicely by November don't you think?
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:04 pmI actually think the mid-term turnouts will be larger than in the past.
People turn out to vote when their angry or upset. And within my personal world (family, friends, co-workers), there are a lot more people that previously were not politically aware that are really upset with Bush and the Republican Congress.
Items like this only reinforce the point.
Let's guess how the right will spin this? Perhaps because they will say with the decrease in wages will provide Americans the opportunity to work more than one job.
How uniquely American. Working 2-3 jobs to make ends meet.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:06 pmThey should all do like Rick Santorum and start a PAC. They'll never go hungry again.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:08 pmThe Bush is blueblood -- very wealthy -- very out of touch with the average American. Sometimes, a wealthy family will recognize that their social-economic status comes, in part, from living in America, and they realize that luck plays a role in their good fortune. People like the Bushes et al believe they earned their wealth on their own initiative, and everyone determines his own fortune. They don't mind rounding a few corners, stepping on a few necks, and making a few "deals" on their way up the their golden ladder. They are, will and always have been selfish, thoughtless, careless and able to sleep well at night.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:13 pmThose who have the misfortune to be born of ordinary lineage, can just make it on their own, and endure sleepless nights of worry.
#6, bobcat_grad I wonder if that's what Bush really wants, after all, there's less of a problem with pensions if Americans are dropping like flies from stress in their 40's. While you're all working 2/3 jobs you're not demonstrating or contributing to blogs too.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:15 pmDo you all recall Bush's comment pre-2004 election before a "friendly" crowd? He heard a woman say she works three jobs to keep the wolf from the door and care for her disabled child -- Bush thought that was "great" -- opportunities in America.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:16 pmRandy may be partly correct in that too many people are such dutiful consumers, buying, buying, buying.... things from "designer" coffee and couches to cars and footwear...pragmatism is dead...
On the other hand, you have people being squeezed by powerful interests aqnd God help them if they succumb to illness or some other malady.....USA has become a fascist state.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:17 pmMOre left-wing whining over the economy? Sheesh. Wake me when you have a new, not so recycled talking point.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:17 pmIt is really sad to see America in decline.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:20 pmPart of it was inevitable, but Bush policy
tries to accelerate it as much as possible
to the benefit of cronies.
The unfortunate outcome when there are millions
of deperately poor people with no hope?
Not generally a pleasant time for Marie Antoinettes.
This just makes me ill. We are the wealthiest nation in the world and we are allowing children to starve.
Sure, in a perfect world we wouldn't have poverty or children born into it, but this is far from a perfect world. Far, far from it.
Every single member of Congress, The Senate and entire the Bush Administration should be forced to fast for 3 days in a row in order to have some tiny idea of what it is like to be hungry.
This is appalling.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:20 pmThanks for your concern #12.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:24 pmBTW, a winger complaining about "recycled
talking point(s)"? That's pretty funny.
#13:
Hey Sam, it's not whining if there's some legitimate reasons to be concerned:
– After adjusting for inflation, wages have not risen during the last three years. In fact, real hourly wages fell for most middle and low-income workers in 2005.
– An individual who works full-time at the current minimum wage earns about $10,700 a year —$5,390 below the 2005 poverty line for a family of three, and $8,650 below the poverty line for a family of four.
– The inflation-adjusted value of the minimum wage is 29 percent lower today than it was in 1979.
But then again, America was built on the backs of hard working people like these, right? While the ruling elite whips them.
Go back and read your law reviews and case reviews to get ready to make sure you don't mess up the impending abortion case that will surely be in the court now that South Dakota has gone Medieval.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:26 pmMarie - but, Kerry, who managed to marry to heiresses (one worth nearly a billion), was real in touch with the "average" American.
The problem with liberals is they are too out of touch to realize most middle class Americans don't the economy is in shambles. They think the left wing propoganda machine should KNOCK IT OFF.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:27 pmFamilies not being able to eat healthily is a real shame.
But its part of the goverments game.
I think even since Roman times people have had food, water and a roof over their heads and the same old families running the Goverments are having a whale of a time,
If I remember correctly Bushes blood lines are far beyond ( the nazi era) and go back to count dracula so does prince charles and lady diana...anyway
Things are not really much better than Roman times or even Neanthertal times .. ok maybe we got tele now and a car possibly
for centuries goverments play of each other in a cool and calculated way one minute Labour next minute conservative
meanwhile your LIFETIMES finished and the game goes on and your children have to go though all this bullshit again
Cunning and not good for the poor whom support the rich and priveleged
Really things must be fairer I think some sort of fair communism sounds good to me
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:27 pmI dont see why Polititions get paid more than a nurse apart from them being selected though nepetism though the ages
Hee,
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:31 pmleft wing propoganda machine.
Is this "machine" hidden somewhere behind the
massive BushCo propaganda machine like
a Mini Cooper behind a Hummer?
You are right, why should we keep complaining about a horendous economy? We should just suck it up and live with the fact that Bush is bankrupting the country.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:38 pmIf we have a left wing propoganda machine, it's a small 1 speed blender compared to the right-wing's Ferrari of a propaganda machine.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:42 pmAnd really, "Justice" Alito, what would you prefer to talk about?
War, poverty, foreign policy, the economy, living wage, and national security?
Or the recylced talking point of the rightlike homosexuality and abortion. I suppose your talking points are much more important, right?
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:45 pmNothing says "Spin" like Pres. Bush saying anything.
Or the Republican party saying "Trust us!"
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:46 pmMarie - but, Kerry, who managed to marry to heiresses (one worth nearly a billion), was real in touch with the “average†American.
The problem with liberals is they are too out of touch to realize most middle class Americans don’t the economy is in shambles. They think the left wing propoganda machine should KNOCK IT OFF.
Comment by Samuel Alito
Anyone see how this justifies Bush letting our economy disentigrate? Sure he didn't do it himself but he sure was criminally negligient.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:48 pmI would be suprised if the Dem's win back anything in 2006. I would also be suprised if we stop this port deal. Follow the money and look to see who has their hand up who's dress and you have the answers. The corruption in this entire white house, house and senate is like a huge cancer with tenacles going in all directions. Untill the misery index is high enough and the true conservatives see what has happened there will be no changes, just more power grabs sell off's etc:
Lot's of people have 2 and 3 jobs now, most are part time, little or no benefits and short hours. Service job's are where the dictatorship want everyone, untill they can figure out how to lock us all up in their concentration camps or gas us all. Get real people, we are in a dictorship and crash cart Cheney, Bull S*** Bush and all this bunch are doeing as they please and laughing in our face that we can't do anything to stop them..And you know what, so far we haven't. So far we have only been like the preverbial fly that gets shood away.....Rioting here may be next before impeachment.....
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:51 pm#19
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:54 pmWhat are you nuts? You still think the MSM is unbiased? You need look no further than last week's story on the Cheney hunting accident to see clear evidence of this. Believe me, the public saw the press in an ugly light as they exposed themselves for what they really are.
the republicans heartless way
"im alright jack keep your hands ofa my stack"
I think India is managing this problem better than America
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:54 pmonce again Starving the poor is destabalising society and that is the basic priciples of how the Rich and priveled have survived at the top since time began
Snap out of it Sharon, we need you on
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:56 pmthe front lines! Don't be defeatist
now that people are starting to come
around to the incompetence and corruption
of the GOP machine.
That is why we refer to Kerry as Republican Lite. I don't ever see anybody here bring up Kerry, unless they are a troll.
This killed him for me:
This shows how out of touch he is with the average American. If he thinks the average American goes windsurfing in Hawaii all the time, he's got another thing coming.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:57 pm#25 - Something that will really make 2006 a "win" for the Dems is the MediScare legislation that was pushed through by the Republicans. Once people wake up to how screwed they are, they'll vote for anyone other than a Republican.
Then again, I could be wrong. (Something that Republicans will NEVER admit!) I hate to wonder about how the current climate against the Republican corruption-hypocrisy-cronyism can change, but all I have to do is think about another terrorist attack on our soil. If that were to happen, it would be "spun" to the ignore Pres. Bush failing America by letting it happen into "Oh my God! We can't change horses in the middle of the race!"
When the horse you're riding is killing our soldiers for oil, giving tax break after tax break to the top 1% of the top 1%, increasing the national debt to nightmarish porportions, and raising the deficit to the largets one in history, you shoot the horse in the head and move on to something better.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:58 pmNo, the American public wanted to know the truth about what happened, which they still don't know. You go ahead and live in your little bubble while the rest of us live in the real world, next to real people, with real questions.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:59 pm#26,
No I KNOW the MSM is biased to the right.
February 23rd, 2006 at 4:59 pmI expect you get your info from the "fascist faux network"
so you just hear propaganda.
I will never understand why mid-west blue collar, low income workers continue to support Bush. They lose their jobs and are forced to food pantries to eat as well as being spied on. The standard of living keeps going lower and lower.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:00 pmWhat are you nuts? You still think the MSM is unbiased? You need look no further than last week’s story on the Cheney hunting accident to see clear evidence of this. Believe me, the public saw the press in an ugly light as they exposed themselves for what they really are.
I'm curious. Are talking about how the media didn't ask questions about the 14 hour window between the shooting and when the authorities talked to Cheney, the discrepencies in the stories about the involvement in alcohol, or the "interview" by Brit Hume full of softball questions and brown-nosing?
Yup. They exposed themselves for what they are. Lazy journalists who accept what they are told at face value, never do any fact checking, and realize that corporate conglomerates sign their paychecks.
Really, Randy. I bet you think Fox news is fair and balanced, don't you?
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:02 pmI will never understand why mid-west blue collar, low income workers continue to support Bush. They lose their jobs and are forced to food pantries to eat as well as being spied on. The standard of living keeps going lower and lower.
Comment by Shannon — February 23, 2006 @ 5:00 pm
Blind faith. Really.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:02 pmEverything President Bush has done has turn to complete shit.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:03 pmHe is completely worthless.
Democrats in 06!
As for Cheney, I think a lot of
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:04 pmreal hunters just noticed that Darth
is a moron when handling a gun.
The stupid spin about "happens all the time"
won't cut it with real hunters. They know better.
What are you nuts? You still think the MSM is unbiased? You need look no further than last week’s story on the Cheney hunting accident to see clear evidence of this. Believe me, the public saw the press in an ugly light as they exposed themselves for what they really are.
Comment by Randy — February 23, 2006 @ 4:54 pm
If you'd been paying closer attention you might have noticed that they were ticked off for not being notified, it has nothing to do with that mythical "liberal bias".
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:04 pmShannon,
Honey, you have got to stop reading the New York Time and watching CNN! I live in the midwest. Things are not as bad as the media is trying to get you to believe. The unemployment rate is what, 4.7%, the same as it was in '98 during Clinton's second term. How come we didn't hear about the soup lines then?
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:04 pm#26 - Or you can look back to 1998 to see how "liberal" the MSM truly is.
How much did you hear about us trying to assassinate Osama bin Laden? One story.
How much did you hear about the hunting of pres. Clinton and his impeachment? About 100 times a day.
How much do you hear about flip-flop after flip-flop after flip-flop of Pres. Bush? None.
Yeah, REAL liberal media.
You really take major swigs from the kool-aid doncha there, Randy!
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:05 pmSo much for helping the poor…...
But a study released today by the America’s Second Harvest shows that Bush has fallen short. Nine million Americans sought aid from food pantries and soup kitchens last year, even though they were members of households where at least one person had a.....
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:08 pmRandy - That does not include those people who are still out of work because their no longer eligible to collect due to having not found a job.
GEEZE. These numbers are always incorrect. They don't take a lot of factors into the numbers.
Your out of your mind if you think that things are FINE. They are not!
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:09 pmThis just makes me ill. We are the wealthiest nation in the world and we are allowing children to starve.
They are not starving. They get to go get handouts and little bibles from churches.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:09 pm"The unemployment rate is what, 4.7%, the same as it was in ‘98 during Clinton’s second term. How come we didn’t hear about the soup lines then?"
Comment by Randy — February 23, 2006 @ 5:04
Ah, but didn't the Bush administration change the formulation (the way it is computed) shortly after taking office?
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:10 pmYour comparison stinks.
Pretty good attempt to change the subject #39,
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:10 pmbut the post is about declining wages.
Did you have something to offer WRT that?
Middle and lower income wages are down while exxon-mobil profits are sky-high, mission accomplished.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:10 pmYou got that right #46!
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:13 pm$30+ to fill a small car!
Heck-of-a-job BushCo.
Sign away royalties from federal land!
Heck-of-a-job BushCo.
26 Randy)
The same MSM that repeatedly called a shotgun a pellet gun and being shot instead being called "peppered" THAT left wing MSM? They cant even call that hunting accident for what it was. They stumbled all over themselves to try to change the reality by changing the wording. Personally I dont give a rats ass about chenneys little mishap, but the media act like the biggest bush ass kissers around. Next to the bushites that come to this site of coarse.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:15 pmRandy, I live in the Midwest, too.
And things suck. Ohio's economy is in the tank.
Randy - explain to me how the media is liberal. How they could possibly be liberal.
90% of the media outlets in this country are owned by one of five corporations. Watch the commericals on all of the news shows that I'm sure you love (and those you hate, too). As large corporations, these media companies have a vested interest in Republicans staying in power and giving them tax breaks out the ying-yang.
The commercials played on these stations and programs are also targeted to wealthier conservatives. Why the hell do you think BASF advertises so much on cable news? They don't make anything (they just make things better, according to them). But they advertise in order to exert their influence over programming.
If they see some liberal thought on a station they have adverstising on, all they have to do is pick up the phone and say, "Hey, you know, we're not pleased with the direction of your programming. We're thinking about pulling our advertising dollars."
Conservatives rule the airwaves, Randy. Watch any Sunday morning 'news' program and see how many liberal minds you see on their panels.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:17 pm#3, Fatty bin Laden - keep up the fight, never give up, remember as the middle east turmoil increases (Rice/Iran) there will be a proportional decrease in the stability of oil supply and a corresponding increase in petrol prices. Should come to a head nicely by November don’t you think?
Comment by British I AM NOT A TROLL Gary — February 23,
Glad to see you did that 'UK Gary', it was getting kinda confusing with all the Gary Ruppert posts.
~~~~~
The Bush Admin may have made their 'mini-nukes' reclassified as not being form of WMD.
[[conplan 8022 2004 Rumsfeld]]
Personally Fatty Bin Laden I think the Bush Admin and perhaps some of these other people are a little too trigger happy if you get my drift.
I dont want to see any of these NON WMD WMD weapons flying thru the air in any country, especially if it can be stopped.
These military'rules' dont fall within the public domain of discussion. There is much gum flapping from the people about the current political situations yet much goes on without.
Rumsfeld and crew have reclassifed and reserved the use of mini-nukes and recertified them as NOT being a weapon of mass destruction.
This may be war propaganda.
Todays Technology mini-nukes are no new feat. The Nuclear Museum open to the public in New Mexico, has information on these mini-nukes and the Cannons from which they can be fired, not to mention umanned UAVS today. A Jeep mounted mini-nuke has been around for some time.
Now Like I Said I think Bush is Trigger Happy as The Mr. T and the A-team and thats not a Conspiracy Theory.
I mean Cheney was Trigger Happy Wasnt he?
Mr. T. Never hit anyone with a Bullet on that Show, and Guess What? The Bush Admin doesn't have to be a good Aim with these weapons of 'not mass destruction' to mess up a whole lotta lives.
I hope that the People of All countries involved will come to a type of peaceful resolve/sanction/program and do everything they can to stop a huge disaster before it begins.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:17 pm"Honey, you have got to stop reading the New York Time and watching CNN! I live in the midwest. Things are not as bad as the media is trying to get you to believe. The unemployment rate is what, 4.7%, the same as it was in ‘98 during Clinton’s second term. How come we didn’t hear about the soup lines then?
Comment by Randy — February 23, 2006 @ 5:04 pm"
Sweetie, I'm glad to see your manners are improving, perhaps there's hope for you and your partisan brian yet. Haven't you heard by now that unemployment only tracks those who can receive benefits, and not the jobless rate? The sluggish economy has last so long now that many people have lost their benefits. It doesn't mean they have work, although it might mean they have to rely on soup kitchens.
But I forgive you pumpkin for being too busy and pre-occupied with your own life to care about the misery and suffering of others. It's a trait that seems to affect many people in this country. I'm sure you're a swell guy who is insensitive out of ignorance and not out of any immoral tendencies. It's OK pumpkin, just listen to the folks on here and you might learn a little more about the country live in.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:18 pmStarvation (low income) is another way of destabilising society it ctreates thiefs who are justified to steal food in my view...creates fear and thats what goverments want
India with all its population does not have this problem although they do have to hand out bowls of rice..but I would not expect this from America ? its political
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:21 pmDear afterthought, after listening to C-span on the port debacle all morning, hoping to see this mess dropped, all these lieing thieves giving up excuses I am sick. Hillary Clinton was brilliant with questions, altho she and I do not agree on the Iraq war and other things. I don't see us winning, not on anything untill more people see the food bank lines like I do and meet the 75 year olds at work at Safeway because their S.S. and medical benefits are not enough. Knowing old people and disabled living on $568.00 a month and then getting screwed out of $80.00 a month for medicare, medicade what ever. The money going to pharmacuticles hmo's was originaly set at a givaway of $68 billion, last heard it was 3 times that amount. The bill had 1500 pages and many stuffed in the night before the vote.
I do appreciate your concern and thank you for your advice, however; since I have been in the trenches for 44 years for a party who has now abandond me and many others to side with the rich right to feather their own beds I am now an independent and will openly critizise any and all that are like the neo cons. If they support the war and dismanteling our country and constitution I will vote against them. If there is no one suitable to vote for I will mark my ballot unaceptable....Were in deep shit and I have a big shovel. Maybe we should do like another poster said, shoot the horse and get another, my view is we need a very tall Clydesdale to handle this problem.......Blessings
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:22 pmAn individual who works full-time at the current minimum wage earns about $10,700 a year —$5,390 below the 2005 poverty line for a family of three, and $8,650 below the poverty line for a family of four.
Yeh Imagine that work more than 40 hrs a week just to get UP to povety Level.
Heckuva way to treat the Very People that Protect and Built America George.
I wonder what the Soldiers Hourly Rate works out to be?
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:25 pm“Honey, you have got to stop reading the New York Time and watching CNN! I live in the midwest. Things are not as bad as the media is trying to get you to believe. The unemployment rate is what, 4.7%, the same as it was in ‘98 during Clinton’s second term. How come we didn’t hear about the soup lines then?
Comment by Randy — February 23, 2006 @ 5:04 pmâ€
After a period of Time unemployment Runs out Randy. After a further period of Time they are DROPPED off the Lists.
They are then no longer part of the Percentage that the Neo-cons Keep Using that falsely show a lower rate of Unemployment.
Cmon Randy, you can do Better. Think Troll Man Think
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:29 pm#17, Sam,
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:32 pmDo you know how much charity work is done by the Kerrys -- of course, you don't.
Some people who are wealthy and fortunate, don't live like the Bushes.
#17, Sam
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:35 pmOne more thing,
It's so easy for someone who has no defense to say the other guy is no different.
How does throwing crap at someone else a defense of the extraordinary recklessness of GWBush?
I believe Justice Alito left the building. Things got too tough for him.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:35 pm#55 - the big LIE on the economy has been exposed. It's not that the bad. The biggest problem Bush has on the economy is trying to appease liberals. The prescription drug bill is bull shit. We pay social security and medicare - enough is enough. AND gas prices - Bush shoudl be drilling the shit out of the Cali coastline and ANWR, but the whining left would never let him do that.
But even with that, we have 4.7% unemployment with strong job growth. STOP the lies and the self hatred you have for your country.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:36 pmThe President promised to pursue “an agenda that will raise standards of living.â€
Not to mention Randy, the President made a PROMISE he's now breaking that promise by helping corporate interests, SUCH as Delays keeping the MIN WAGE DOWN in the Marianas. People are Suffering so Bush Cronies can grow Fat.
Yeh thats real Nice of those congressman to help their Fellow Americans do stuff like eat, especially when ol Newt is WHINING that for 25$ he cant get a decent FREE lunch.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:40 pmBut even with that, we have 4.7% unemployment with strong job growth. STOP the lies and the self hatred you have for your country.
Comment by Samuel Alito — February 23, 2006 @ 5:36 pm
Stop repeating those misleading LIES SAM, you should know better as a Stoolie, I mean er Federalist, I mean a 'Judge'
You and your 'Pro-Death' Stance.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:42 pmYour about the most Flip Floppinist Black hearted Wretch I have see on the Posts Sam.
Sam wants to Nuke Innocent Kids, isnt that what you SAID SAM?
Nukes are Good?
Why havent you left for the Middle East SAM?
Go get you a Suntan Nuke Boy.
Be the Hero that Glows in the Dark.
Sam the Pro-Death man
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:45 pmTo the neocon flamers:
Wake up and smell the fast food. As someone who has at one time scraped by on pocket-change I can tell you from experience that the economy is abysmal. The problem is not entitlements, it's refusing to force employers to pay a living wage. I have been both a worker and an employer in my life and I can tell you this, I never found it necessary to screw my employees to make a profit.
It just depends on how big a profit you want. If you are greedy, then there are no limits to how much you will squeeze employees, suppliers and anyone else.
The state of health care in this country is rotten. Ever try to get medical care with out health insurance? I have and it is next to impossible. To have to choose between paying rent and getting the medicine you need to live there are no good choices.
The illusion that we have strong job growth is based in the "Enroning" of the figures. The stats quoted do not include people who have not been able or have given up on job hunting. It also does not list the "under-employed".
There are people with degrees and years of experience doing telemarketing because employers will not hire anyone over 50. If you don't believe it, call around and try it.
I could go on but it wouldn't matter, you have your mind made up and you are blinded by the neocon propaganda.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:52 pmSammy by the way many states have restrictive rules that deny unemployment to many workers so they lose their job but never make it on the unemployment rolls.
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:55 pmThank you Mr. Ho, if the amount paid out in food stamps and welfare were exposed by state and the nation I think the true picture would be made, also think the people not collecting unemployment any more and unable to find work would be eye opening. The neocons and brain dead right like it just the way it is, lies and cover up's. They would prefere to pay the media to spew propaganda then feed our poor or pay our service men and women better wages. Many of our service personal are also on food stamps. Sad state we are in.....Blessings
February 23rd, 2006 at 5:56 pmOff point,,,CNN and Lou Dobbs on the port coverage now..Tune in.
February 23rd, 2006 at 6:00 pmOr the number of the lowest ranking soldiers who qualify for food stamps.
February 23rd, 2006 at 6:11 pmMen walkin' 'long the railroad tracks
Goin' some place, there's no goin' back
Highway Patrol choppers comin' up over the ridge
Hot soup on a campfire under the bridge
Shelter line stretchin' round the corner
Welcome to the new world order
Families sIeepin' in their cars in the southwest
No home, no Job, no peace, no rest
The highway is alive tonight
But nobody's kiddin' nobody about where it goes
I'm sitting down here in the campfire light
Searchin' for the ghost of Tom Joad
He pulls prayer book out of his sleepin' bag
Preacher lights up a butt and takes a drag
Waitin' for when the last shall be first and the first shall be last
In a cardboard box 'neath the underpass
Got a one way ticket to the promised land
You got a hole in your belly and a gun in your hand
sleeping on a pillow of solid rock
Bathing in the city aqueduct
The highway is alive tonight
Where it's headed everybody knows
I'm sittin' down here in the campfire light
Waitin' on the ghost of Tom Joad
Now Tom Said; "Mom, wherever there's a cop beatin' a guy
Wherever a hungry new born baby cries
Where there's a fight 'gainst the blood and hatred in the air
Look for me mom I'll be there
Wherever there's somebody fightin' for a pIace to stand
Or decent job or a helpin' hand
Wherever somebody's strugglin' to be free
Look in their eyes mom you'll see me."
Well the highway is alive tonight
But nobody's kiddin' nobody about where it goes
I'm sitting down here in the campfire light
Searchin' for the ghost of Tom Joad
the ghost of tom joad
February 23rd, 2006 at 6:21 pmby Rage Against The Machine - Zach Delaroche
"Everything is great at our house,the 'underprivlidged' are just never happy."
Barbra Bush
February 23rd, 2006 at 7:02 pmWhen you read this editorial and a lot of the comments, it sounds like, "Bush promised to raise the standard of living in his State of the Union address THREE WEEKS AGO and he still hasn't gotten around to doing it! That nazi!" It's kind of funny. Otherwise, this is a recap of the family income thread, which isn't dead yet.
February 23rd, 2006 at 7:12 pm#69 You just reminded me why bush is such a mealy mouth dull wimp elitist jerk,...... it comes from his mother.
February 23rd, 2006 at 7:17 pmOtherwise, this is a recap of the family income.... which isn’t dead yet.Yea Seth but Bush is working to kill it as fast as he can.
February 23rd, 2006 at 7:20 pmAnother Great Depression is coming soon because the economy is on the brink of total collapse! This must be the reason why Bush is building internment camps, because he knows his economic policies are crap, and people without jobs will flip out causing riots! He plans on rounding up the jobless into the camps, and since we know what happened at GITMO it means being stripped naked and abused! Welcome to the Gestapo America everyone!
February 23rd, 2006 at 7:21 pmGee, Does Anyone Care? NOT!
February 23rd, 2006 at 7:49 pmWayne Madsen
May 15, 2005 -- According to National Security Agency insiders, outgoing NSA Director General Michael Hayden approved special communications intercepts of phone conversations made by past and present U.S. government officials. The intercepts are at the height of the current controversy surrounding the nomination of Undersecretary of State John R. Bolton as ambassador to the United Nations. It was revealed by Connecticut Senator Christopher Dodd during Bolton’s Senate Foreign Relations Committee nomination hearing that Bolton requested transcripts of 10 NSA intercepts of conversations between named U.S. government officials and foreign persons. Later, it was revealed that U.S. companies [also treated as "U.S. persons" by NSA] were also identified in an additional nine intercepts requested by Bolton. However, NSA insiders report that Hayden approved special intercept operations on behalf of Bolton and had them masked as "training missions" in order to get around internal NSA regulations that normally prohibit such eavesdropping on U.S. citizens.
February 23rd, 2006 at 8:57 pmActually, that was kinda funny. I got a chuckle.
February 23rd, 2006 at 9:33 pmSome might find this a useful reference:
http://www.bls.gov/cps/cps_htgm.htm
February 23rd, 2006 at 9:34 pm#55 Under Clinton the unemployment rate was going down every year -- official govt. record:
THE CLINTON-GORE ECONOMIC RECORD:
February 23rd, 2006 at 10:02 pmTHE LOWEST UNEMPLOYMENT RATE IN 30 YEARS
THE LOWEST UNEMPLOYMENT RATE SINCE 1969 AND MORE THAN 20 MILLION NEW JOBS.
Seth the humor was there and all I had to do was lose a word. Nothing personal .... but I get a laugh sometimes.
February 23rd, 2006 at 10:19 pmSo what is the real answer
February 23rd, 2006 at 10:46 pmThis thread has been killing me all day. Hubby & I together make well over $100,000 a year. WE have trouble making ends meet. We DO NOT live beyond our means nor do we have expensive habits. Our mortgage is WAY below what the mortgage company would gladly like to lend us. We had minimal credit card debt. And yet, it deeply, deeply troubles us that there are people who are far less fortunate than we are struggling with the basics of daily living (food, heat, electricity, child care, health care). We struggle to fund these basic essentials on over $100,000 per year! Neither hubby nor I have seen a wage increase since 2000 yet our cost of living has increased by.........(economists out there help me!). We're broke, at $100,000 per year. So tell me El Presidente and your gang of trolls, how exactly has our economy improved since you took office?
February 23rd, 2006 at 10:50 pmNo seriously, that was a funny twist. There are a lot of cheap shots around here, but that one was clever.
February 23rd, 2006 at 10:57 pmSo Seth, I've been watching your posts all day. Tell me how, HOW, have me and my husband and children's lives improved under Bush's policies? I really, really want to know. You're a budding economist, so please tell me when those of us who used to be considered "upper middle class" are going to see a light at the end of our tunnel and be able to reach the same level of financial freedom our parents were. Oh, and as an aside, for those of us who wish to reach this financial freedom, what should we babyboomers be doing to increase our financial stake in this new economy? P.S. Bonus question for you.........my parents were able to purchase their first home thanks to the GI Bill and my father's college education was paid for thanks to the GI Bill. Hmmmmmmmmm P.S.S. My hubby is an honorably discharged GI who has had minimal benefits (compared to prior generations).
February 23rd, 2006 at 11:11 pmOh, and Seth, since no one has yet begged the question.......in your undergraduate years, how much of your education was funded with pell grands and federally subsidised student loans? If you say none, I want to know who paid for your education, otherwise you're nothing but a "government welfare cheat". (I have a MA already so don't lie about how you paid for your BA or BS).
February 23rd, 2006 at 11:26 pmDamn, Lisa, you think I have all the answers! I'm just here to point out what doesn't make sense. There a ton of flaming rhetoric around here that, upon some investigation, isn't supported by the cited references. If you've been following me today you've seen where I've pointed it out.
How have your lives improved under Bush? How about telling me what you've done to improve them? My political preference is for a federal government that DOESN'T have much impact on the daily lives of most people. I can only speak for myself, but I've done okay the last few years: got married, bought a house, started a small business. I don't credit Bush for that; my wife and I have done most of it. Beyond the anecdotes, people have been posting their interpretations of national trends that don't hold up under scrutiny.
I have friends who were recently honorably discharged from the military. They're in school on the GI Bill and one is getting a VA loan to buy a house. He's thrilled! The program is still in place!
And if you're a baby boomer, you better have been taking care of your financial situation for the last couple of decades. It's getting too late for boomers to catch up now. I don't want to throw an age insult, but seriously, if you didn't plan your own retirement you've been expecting WAY too much from ANY government administration. My parents (born 1940) planned their retirement. I'm planning mine. What made the generation or two in between ignore the inevitable?
And while it's none of your business, I went to a cheap state school on an academic scholarship. My parents helped with the little amount that the scholarship didn't cover. After a couple of years, I got a DOD scholarship that covered everything and my parents were off the hook. My grad school now (at a different cheap state school) is partially covered by federal loans, but mostly by my wife's and my jobs. I applied for a loan after the dreaded deadline last year (when all federal loans were supposed to become Bush usury), and was accepted quickly and got terms that are just fine. What the heck is your point?
February 23rd, 2006 at 11:45 pmLisa how about his parents financial situation....some people don't qualify for government asistance because they have so much income they can't qualify, usually the same ones that want to end the same programs sincer they see no reason for them.
February 23rd, 2006 at 11:45 pmClif, you've got some kind of fixation with my parents. I've already revealed far more about my personal situation than I've asked of anybody else. Want to know why I haven't asked? IT DOESN'T MATTER WHERE YOU COME FROM!!! You're a human being with a certain vison of society. I'm also one, but with a different vision. I want to discuss and debate our visions. You want to nitpick my background in order to avoid that debate. Others want to pretend I'm paid by Rove. Approximately 5% of you have actually engaged in any valuable discussion.
From what I can tell of your parental fixation, your vision of society involves parents not being able to do well enough to help their children. You see a negative if someone's parents were able to help them out. Your chief question of someone who challenges your vision is, "what about his parents?" Is my opinion more or less valuable if my parents have inherited wealth? Earned wealth? No wealth? Died when I was a teenager? A lot of liberals make fun of southern red states being so poor. So why don't you respect their opinions more?
February 24th, 2006 at 12:07 amLisa,
You can't make ends meet at $100,000/year? That's weird, my family makes ends meet at a lot less than that, and has money left over for vacations, a new deck, a new kitchen, upkeep on 3 cars, not to mention the great equity on their home due to the value increasing more than $100,000 in about 10 years.
Looks like you suck at life, or you're not telling us the truth.
As far as the increase in people at the soup kitchens: with the undeniable fact that millions and millions of illegal immigrants have flooded the USA over the years, how many of those you want to bet are going to these soup kitchens? "Americans" my ass. You think these soup kitchens ask for ID before serving? I don't think so!
All I know is that everyone I know in the USA has their standard of living higher or the same as 5 years ago. That includes people from all walks of life, with my family being middle-class, less wealthy than "we can't make ends meet with $100,000" Lisa.
February 24th, 2006 at 12:28 amI read this blog quite often, but very rarely post. I find it laughable that someone is complaining about not being able to make ends meet on $100,000 a year. I made $16,000 last year, going to school full time, and working 27 hours a week. My wife and I have no health insurance, and my wife has an $80,000 hospital bill. My wife can't get the medicine she needs.
February 24th, 2006 at 12:35 amSeixon,
February 24th, 2006 at 12:39 amYou are living in an faux news induced fog. I too, used to have a decent job, with decent pay; until my employer decided they could get my job done a lot cheaper in India. And as for your home equity, if the housing bubble bursts, your equity will be gone, along with the rest of the US economy.
Seth,
I have to say I’m impressed you’ve kept your cool the entire night and while I don’t completely agree with you…you do have some points. I do believe we “control our own destiny†to a certain extent…however, there are factors that make it easier to get there for certain people. If Bush wasn’t born into the family he was…where would he really be today left with his own drive and abilities?
In today’s society the message is buy, buy, buy, spend, spend, spend. It’s cool to show your friends your new Lexus or plasma TV. It is up to us to not buy those things if we can’t afford them!! However, there are enablers all around…0% financing, 100% mortgages, credit cards for everyone!
What I have a problem with and what seems more prevalent in the last five years is the lack of security in our lives. I watch my dad, who goes to work every day at HP wondering if he’ll be the next job cut. Sixty years old, has been very responsible with saving for retirement…but not real comfortable losing his job at this time. Loyalty to a company doesn’t matter any more…politics rather than productivity trumps in the corporate world.
Myself, I’m self employed and have decent health insurance…yet I’m terrified to go to a doctor who might discover some medical problem I may have. Having a dreaded “pre-existing condition†would doom me in our health care system. My mother in law, living paycheck to paycheck, can’t afford her recent electric/gas bills.
If you don’t believe in the entitlement programs the government provides…what about the entitlements and give aways to the oil companies and pharmaceutical companies?
Perseverance and hard work should get you somewhere in life…with or without the connections or silver spoons.
February 24th, 2006 at 1:44 amAs they have demonstrated, time and time again, Republicans are all mathematically challenged, downright %100 disabled. A recent example; the number of people that Republicans have been claiming signed up for the new "prescription drug disaster". A whopping 25,000,000 ! WOW ! That is impressive. It is also a big fat lie. The actual number is 5,000,000. This particular issue is chock full of mathematical "errors". And that is just ONE example!!! And the fact that Congress is able to vote themselves "pay-increases", at will, yet refuse to raise the minimum wage, out of concern for "businesses being affected" are incredible hypocrites, both parties included. And one other point, Mrs. Kerry inherited her fortune from her late husband. Who just happened to be a REPUBLICAN!!!!!!!
February 24th, 2006 at 1:50 amWhat I want to know is where people who earn $16,000 a year live? ‘Cause let me tell you, earning that a year would get you a nice cardboard box underneath the freeway where I live.
February 24th, 2006 at 1:58 am“However, there are enablers all around…0% financing, 100% mortgages, credit cards for everyone! Seixonâ€
"Sweetie, these things used to be regulated, and to a reasonable person would be considered loan sharking and exploitation. I’m sure you’re one of those free market jockeys that don’t believe con games and ‘enablers’ that exploit should be regulated, but that’s what most reasonable people would consider to be good policies and a good solution. Not everyone can be as lucky or as smart as you and avoid these sharks, and I’m really saddened that you simply attack those who are less fortunate than yourself instead of sharing concern for their plight,"
Did you read my entire post...your point is my point exactly!!! Those con games and 'enablers' are out of control and preying on the fiscally undisciplined. I directly attach these exploits on the Bush administration! Seth keeps asking for specifics...I gave one.
February 24th, 2006 at 2:13 amRightPunch...you've made me feel a lot better! 'Exploitation' is a much better word...and something Bush needs to desperately see continue or we will witness the collapse of the economy on his watch. We already know wages are stagnate, energy and healthcare costs have skyrocketed, yet we're still buying...therefore showing a "strong" economy. That economy is being financed on home equity loans and credit cards...guess we learned from the government. The breaking point is coming...
February 24th, 2006 at 2:37 am97,
You sound kinda cute. What do you say we open a hot dog stand. Are you good with your fingers? You're going to need to be, cause I got one of those big ones. What to you say, sweet tits?
I see a glaring flaws here. The thread doesn't mention that average incomes are up, that minimum wage workers don't stay at minimum wage pay for the length of their career, that many minimum wage earners are also making tips, (when I was young a waitress girlfriend made more money than me), that both spouses/partners work (remember incomes are up) that low inflation and interest rates - due in part to incomes increasing steadily, not too rapidly - have kept purchasing strong making for a healthy GDP. Name another country that has a better economy. That's why everyone invests here.
Cost of doing business, especially small business which have been a big part of this economy, is very expensive. Most of the expense can be for paying wages and benefits. There's a balance to be measured with the required wage. A wage too high will restrict hiring. Less people working. It's better to have more people working at a lower wage than to have less people working.
#97, What kind of increase to you propose, sweet tits?
February 24th, 2006 at 3:42 am#99- a person working for minimum wage does not have a "career". They have a j-o-b. Too many families live below the poverty level in this country. This would seem to indicate that alot of people are working for minimum wage, or maybe a little bit more. But you are mistaken when you claim that higher wages restrict hiring. That has been proven false. In cities, and states that have acted to increase the minimum wage beyond the federal minimum, no significant harm can be shown. Norway has a better economy than we do. And many large companies have figured out how to avoid those annoying wage/benefit issues by simply outsourcing their jobs to other countries, where it's ok to pay people a pittance. But does the price of their product go down, reflecting their reduced business expenses? OH HELL NO !!! If anything, the price goes up, and keeps on going. We already have less people working. Remember the recent layoffs by FORD ? 30,000 jobs-poof-gone. But FORD was really happy about their record earnings for the year. How long will those people be counted in the unemployment stats.? And when they are no longer being counted, they are still unemployed, or "lucky enough to have that minimum wage job, bussing tables, ( but hey- they get tips!!) Yes, you are a "scrotum". Complete with the intellect that "scrotums" are known to possess.
February 24th, 2006 at 4:45 amNeocon Economic Theory 101:
1)Outsourcing is good for the economy.
2)Unemployment is good for the economy.
3)Debt is good for the economy.
#1 causes #2 which then cause more #3.
February 24th, 2006 at 6:35 amPost 94 A > You ask where people live who make $16,000 a year? Everywhere in America, because that is about the amount earned by working, for a year, for 40 hrs a week at about $7.50 an hour > minimum wage is lower than that in many States of about $5.50 an hour, so many make around $12,000 a year! Also just so you know about 40% of American workers are at this level of income > so are they living in cardboard boxes? No, but very low income apartments or trailers! About half the population of Georgia, where I live at present are the working poor! Everytime you shop at a WalMart store and gripe about the employees > remember that they are making about $6.00 an hour and barely able to survive and eat! America under the Bush Regime is getting poorer, but the wealthy elite do not care, so may God have mercy on their greedy souls! Shame on Bush and his father!
February 24th, 2006 at 6:55 amOne more fact: a married couple each making minimum wage and each working a full time job would mean about $24,000 a year pooled together > reason why being single on min wage is almost impossible to exist > reason why the working poor will share a house with several people or an apartment!
(Note: I am rounding numbers here, so do the math for exact figures of income and remember to deduct for income taxes or to add tax credits. Do the math and discover how poor a lot of working Americans are for REAL.)
February 24th, 2006 at 7:48 am#1 - Randy
February 24th, 2006 at 7:52 amYou don't think that Americans are suffering from job loss, low pay - I spoke with a woman who was laid off 4 times this past year. I don't think she sees it your way.
Trolls, seriously, why do you keep saying "the trouble with the left is..."?
Really, why? If you will stop worrying and spending endless amounts of time on why you hate the left and what their problem is, you might actually be able to say something meaningful.
Why wouldn't you want some honest debate? What are you afraid of? Like Rush, he never has an actual answer. Like the other day, he says "if the left were consistent, they would love this Dubai deal." Now, he never said if he thought it was okay or not. He never stated anything with any real content and never addressed the fact that his own party is against it.
He made some funny noises, like the air leaks when someone behind you in line is getting tired of waiting, but never proposed an idea, never had (or ever has) anyone on the show with any knowledge, just some lay hicks with fanciful ideas of new kinds of hate for the "other" party.
All he is is a drug addict (the signs are all there) that likes to talk. This is what narcotics addicts do - they rant tirelessly. It is kind of funny to listen to him call others names and act so juvenile. BUT, I am scared about the people who listen to him. I am worried that some will not understand that this is what drug addicts do and actually think he is coming from a place of clarity.
This frightens me greatly.
February 24th, 2006 at 10:41 amCO:
Lending terms are related to risk; lower-risk borrowers get better terms. It has always been that way. The people who apply for "predatory" loans are the high-risk borrowers who were previously unable to borrow money under any terms at all. The terms suck, but do they suck more than not being ALLOWED to borrow money? If the government outlaws these loans, these people are back to being unable to borrow under any terms. If the government outlaws the risk/term relationship the entire lending industry will suffer, as will pretty much everybody else.
You asked about corporate entitlements; I also dislike with those, in general. I'm probably closer to libertarian than republican, in all honesty. I don't like farm subsidies, steel subsidies, energy subsidies (for fossil, nuclear, OR renewable), probably most subsidies you could name. My general philosophy about it is that we cannot appreciate the value of a commodity, such as energy, if we don't pay the REAL cost for the amount we use.
RightPunch lamb-chop:
What would you have the president do about home prices? That $700,000 median RightPunch mentioned is in the wealthiest (and often liberal) markets. Those markets were expensive even before Bush came along. The U.S. average is $190,000; I don't see the value of citing outliers as proof that the whole system sucks.
And who said 40% earn minimum wage? That doesn't even pass the smell test for me to go look it up. Are you including high school students and college students who work? I recently read that the bottom quintile of income is "transitional"; something like 97% of people in the bottom quintile will have moved to the next quintile within ten years. So a large amount of the poverty cited includes those people who just entered the workforce and will move up in time. Three percent may need some help, but 97% will improve their lot in life through their own perserverence.
Unfortunately, as much as I enjoy talking to a few of you, I've got to log off for most of the day. I'm just catching up on the night's events.
February 24th, 2006 at 10:57 amthis is a sad subject. especially for americans. don't you think it all starts with minimum wage. 5.35/hr. now when i last checked that is called slavery. that is why the mexicans pick beats and we don't. you must be out of your rabbit ass mind if anyone thinks that i'm going on a rich mans farm, ranch and pick their fricken beats for 5.35/hr. you have insulted the american for suggesting it and he would only be stupid for taking up such and offer. so why not cut the congress, senators, and passed presidents finances in half and tell the lazy peckerwoods to go pick his fricken beets.
February 24th, 2006 at 10:59 amProud: As I've hung out at this site for a couple of days, I've seen FAR more, "Republicans are brain-dead" comments than "the problem with the left is..." Maybe you can address those as well.
February 24th, 2006 at 10:59 amYou gotta love Robin Williams......
Even if he's nuts! Leave it to Robin
Williams to come up with the perfect
plan. What we need now is for our
UN Ambassador to stand up and
repeat this message.
Robin Williams' plan...(Hard to
argue with this logic!)
"I see a lot of people yelling for peace
but I have not heard of a plan for
peace. So, here's one plan."
1) "The US will apologize to the world for our "interference" in their affairs, past &present. You know, Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, Tojo, Noriega, Milosevic, Hussein, and the rest of those "good ole boys", we will never "interfere" again.
2) We will withdraw our troops from all over the world, starting with Germany, South Korea, the Middle East, and the Philippines. They don't want us there. We would station troops at our borders. No one allowed sneaking through holes in the fence.
3) All illegal aliens have 90 days to get their affairs together and leave.We'll give them a free trip home. After 90 days the remainder will be gathered up and deported immediately, regardless of whom or where they are. They're illegal!!! France will welcome them.
4) All future visitors will be thoroughly checked and limited to 90 days unless given a special permit!!!! No one from a terrorist nation will be allowed in. If you don't like it there, change it yourself and don't hide here. Asylum would never be available
to anyone. We don't need any more cab drivers or 7-11 cashiers.
5) No foreign "students" over age 21. The older ones are the bombers. If they don't attend classes, they get a "D" and it's back home baby.
6) The US will make a strong effort
to become self-sufficient energy wise. This will include developing nonpolluting sources of energy but will require a temporary drilling of oil in the Alaskan wilderness. The caribou will have to cope for a while.
7) Offer Saudi Arabia and other oil producing countries $10 a barrel for their oil. If they don't like it, we go someplace else. They can go somewhere else to sell their production. (About a week of the wells filling up the storage sites would be enough.)
8) If there is a famine or other natural catastrophe in the world, we will not "interfere." They can pray to Allah or whomever, for seeds, rain, cement or whatever they need. Besides most of what we give them is stolen or given
to the army. The people who need
it most get very little, if anything.
9) Ship the UN Headquarters to an isolated island someplace. We don't need the spies and fair weather friends here. Besides, the building would make a good homeless shelter or lockup for illegal aliens.
10) All Americans must go to charm and beauty school. That way, no one can call us "Ugly Americans" any longer. The Language we speak is ENGLISH...learn it...or LEAVE...Now, isn't that a winner of a plan?
"The Statue of Liberty is no longer
saying "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses." She's got a baseball bat and she's yelling, 'you want a piece of me?' "
If you agree with the above forward
February 24th, 2006 at 11:05 amit to friends...If not, and I would be amazed, DELETE it!!
copy and paste this and pass it around to everyone, the congress, senators. tell them to do something and fight for the americans or else you won't see them in office.
February 24th, 2006 at 11:08 amSETH stop posting your crap in here because you have no idea about average Americans, so go spew your love for GOP and Bush elsewhere! Many Americans work at minimum wage whether you realize it or not! I bet you treat the cashier at your supermarket like trash! SHAME ON YOU!
February 24th, 2006 at 11:10 amgood morning iraq war.........!!!!robin william has an excellent point folks. must read and pass it around.
February 24th, 2006 at 11:14 am"Still can't afford to eat..."; you should finish the sentence, the way Americans are taught and marketed what and how much to eat.
But there are options that'll last at least a week, if not months:
beans and rice $2.00
oatmeal $1.50
frozen bread $.69
powder milk $2.00
Always be on the lookout for a sale. Transportation, along with housing, is probably a bigger issue. Automobiles are expensive, mass transportation is sporadic, and other options are discouraged.
But does it matter, according to Oprah, the poor people, people that make $75k-$110k, don't know how to budget and are in debt by 10's of thousands. They spend thousands on arts and crafts, renting a piano, eating out because they don't want to cook in their huge kitchen, in their huge house (they really couldn't afford); 5 new cars, don't teach their kids to manage money and buy everything their kids want, luxury vacations, etc., etc.,
http://www2.oprah.com/tows/pastshows/200602/tows_past_20060224.jhtml
Saw an interview on immigrants that started with nothings and now are citizens and doing well but they don't eat out, don't take vacations, and save 35% of what they make; their kids are now going to college. They also, until feasible, live with relatives so generations help one another in baby sitting and sharing expenses. Here, we kick the kids out of the house when they are 18.
But on the other hand, no one can make it alone on minimum wage, whether it is family or society. But I think the problem should be attacked not on the low end but the high end. The outrageous wages and compensation of upper management and unethical management. We've gone from a owners capitalism to managers capitalism. Our current administration is a great example of "guys gone wild on money"; spending like there is no tomorrow, no bid contracts, cronyism, wasteful, hire incompetent managers, no accountability, secrecy. Those that use to be stewards and exercised fiduciary responsibility over our resources are now salespeople and marketers. Read John Bogles book, "The Battle for the Soul of Capitalism" or "Bull".
February 24th, 2006 at 12:09 pmJack...best post yet!
February 24th, 2006 at 12:23 pmJack,
I believe that we need moderation, but not to the point that people's lives are dull and meaningless. No one working should HAVE to eat peanut butter and jelly everyday because they can't afford a decent meal. They also should have to sit in teh dark at night because they cannot afford electricity. That's too extreme.
We have a problem called Capitalism. It not only distributes wealth disproportionately - as I believe no one's job is so valuable that they should be awared millions of dollars in salary or bonuses. And no one's job is so meaningless that $5.25 an hour is acceptable.
We teach people to become Consumers to their own detriment. We advertize on anything and everything these days telling people that if they don't have the latest and greatest they are worthless. We need to re-examine our priorities in this country, and understand that the billions of dollars spent on product advertizing is more powerful than the will power of a single human being. No wonder so many people are in such enormous debt.
February 24th, 2006 at 1:02 pmyou know what is say to oprah. kiss my azz. tell oprah to dish over millions of her dollars for everyone and stop asking us. the fricken nerve these rich folks have.
February 24th, 2006 at 1:28 pm#116 Hmmmm... I don't see Oprah in the Fortune 500...
February 24th, 2006 at 2:12 pmQuick lunch stop:
Jay Randal, you have demonstrated several times that when you don't know jack about someone who disagrees with you, you make horrible assumptions about them and then lash out. That's not the tolerant, compassionate, patient liberal that I hear about. That's the judgemental, self-absorbed, hot-tempered liberal that I observe more of here. Calm down; you'll live longer.
February 24th, 2006 at 3:01 pm[...] Check out this report from the Economic Policy Institute on jobs and wages in 2004-05. (Hat tip to ThinkProgress.) I know economic stuff is boring, but the sharts presented offer a rather telling picture of just how much of a failure Bush economic policies are. Sluggish private job growth indicates failure of tax cuts Changes in tax law since 2001 reduced federal government revenue by $870 billion through September 2005. Supporters of these tax cuts have touted them as great contributors to growth in jobs and pay. But, in reality, private-sector job growth since 2001 has been disappointing, and a closer look at the new jobs created shows that federal spending—not tax cuts—are responsible for the jobs created in the past five years. [...]
February 24th, 2006 at 4:22 pmAPRIL FIRST IS IMPEACH THE FOOL DAY ...
get out and get heard, plan a rally or a march, put signs in your yard and on your car...
IMPEACH THE FOOL ON APRIL FOOL'S DAY!
a day of protest and civil disobedience
pass it on!
February 24th, 2006 at 5:27 pm#108 I would ask you how long you have been on this site, first of all. This is progressive site and, as such, we are invaded by a small amount of trolls who post under several different handles. They are on a mission and, if you have been here a while, have witnessed the admissions. They post Limbaugh-style hatred meant to deter and deflect from the actual post/topic at hand. Surely you see this.
Do you see the same thing on redstate? Of course not, you will see left bashing. Didn't context come to mind when you asked me that question? It seems rather obvious doesn't it?
February 24th, 2006 at 5:33 pm#121
No, I'm really a new visitor here. I haven't had any other handles. I'm not here to troll, I'm pointing out legitimate disagreements that usually boil down to ideological differences. If this is an intellectually honest progressive site, regulars could handle legitimate disagreement. That most of them cannot indicates that they spend too much time isolated with their own people. However I have been impressed by a few people here who didn't bare the fangs first-off and actually carried on a civil debate.
I didn't come from redstate, but I do hang out on moorewatch. I've avoided redstate, freep, and DU because of the blind partisanship that, unfortunately, a lot of people have here too. Moorewatch posters are about 75% conservative and 25% liberal, with most conservatives being closer to libertarians. Even when a new liberal shows up and actually makes a point, they gain respect pretty quickly. Trolls are the people who don't add anything whatsoever, and moorewatch has both con and lib trolls.
Of course I knew this was a progressive site when I came here, but I still didn't expect as much blind partisanship as I found. Guess I was spoiled by the atmosphere at moorewatch.
February 24th, 2006 at 6:50 pmSeth-
So I go to check out Moorewatch and the first words I see are "What a Fat Bastard"...I was ready for respectful conversation :) LOL
February 24th, 2006 at 9:56 pmSeth-
PLEASE enlighten me or show me where to go at Moorewatch...all I read was Michael Moore bashing...and the same blind partisanship. I saw no meaningful discussions about the issues we're facing today...just a lot of "poor Bush" and that "mean liberal media." I tried!
February 24th, 2006 at 10:07 pmSETH go back to Moorewatch > that is where you belong! TP is for progressives, not Bush loving conservatives! As for living a long life, I doubt that applies to you because Bush lovers burn-up in anger and turn into Cheney > lol.
February 24th, 2006 at 10:25 pmCO: The front page is the blog, and I don't hang out there so much anymore. There's a link on every blog entry on the front page labeled "Discuss in the forums". The forums are open topics for registered users. There's still more conservatives than liberals, and there's still some partisanship, but it's much less hostile.
Jay: You're the last person here I have any interest in pleasing. If I extend my stay here, it's probably to taunt you.
February 24th, 2006 at 11:57 pmCO P.S., if you click "discuss in the forums" while reading the comments on a blog entry, you will probably go to the old forums. You have to click from the front page.
February 24th, 2006 at 11:58 pmIf you stay on here it is because Rove tells you to or else > lol. Stay as long as you like in here, because everyone will clobber you daily for being a dumb Bush apologist!
February 25th, 2006 at 12:25 amThere relative and abosolute proverty, in realty were not really getting poorer, at the same time, most people in the lower income rungs are making the same purchasing power year to year. However, compared to the top 1% of wages earners they are taking home the bacon. The reality, American culture is called boom were flush with cash or "oh shit Im broke" when we bust. The comment, "making 100k is a lot of money in dominations", However, affordable housing is a joke no matter what make. People making 100k are getting ripped off, as are the rungs making 1/5th at $20,000 wage. Here 1000, sq ft condo for $300,000. Across the street, the house is only $15,000 more with 2,500 sq ft, in the end, the average person getting less house for the dollar. Unfortunately, lifestyles today are excessive becuase people want brand new cars each year, new eletronic junk every year, paying six-dollars for cup of designer coffee, going on expensive vacations, the list can go on. In the end, a lot of factors played into where the person stands in terms of ecomonic standing than how much people earn year. I say, 90% of the working population over 25 me included, could live fine on what we made, if were willing to cut out designed soda, desinger clothes, sports cars, internet porn. "Life too Short Enjoy it".
February 26th, 2006 at 3:48 am[...] And on housing, one final thought: The inflation-adjusted value of the minimum wage is 29 percent lower today than it was in 1979. Meanwhile, “…average U.S. home prices increased 12.50 percent from the first quarter of 2004 through the first quarter of 2005 …House prices rose 12.5 percent, while prices of other goods and services rose only 3.1 percent. …[This] represent[s] the largest four quarter increase since the third quarter of 2004, when appreciation surpassed any increase in over 25 years.” [...]
May 17th, 2006 at 3:31 pmThe minimum wage should be increased nationwide to at least 9.50, the wage of Santa Fe. Working at minimum wage cannot provide for even the most basic necessities. How are we supposed to survive without governmental intervention. Either they give more social aid to those who are to lazy to work, or the will finally give my taxes back to me through a higher wage.
June 2nd, 2006 at 10:27 amGive me my "effing" cash money.
I don't wish to insult anyone here, or any Americans. I came to USA 4 years ago to marry my husband. I came from the UK, where I owned my own house, car had a great career and took frequent vacations around the world. Both my husband and I work full time, we have a baby. This week we are living on 13cent noodles in order that the baby may eat and drink milk. We had a car but couldn't afford it so it was repossed. We don't drink, smoke or socialize. My entire life savings was eaten up in four years with government fees and regulations. We live in New York city where you get a massive fine for stepping foot on a blade of grass. As I write this on my lunch break from work, I am starving. I was never hungry in my life until I came to USA. I am only half way through adjustment of status with immigration, we can't afford to finish it. I don't want citizenship, just be able to go home and come back to visit now and then with my husband and daughter, who were both born in New York.
August 28th, 2006 at 1:11 pmI speak 5 languages. I have a degree in Marketing and Hotel Management. I went to a private school. I can't make it here. Can't make ends meet. Bush has no idea how ordinary people live in this country. And don't even get me started on health costs. Such a wonderful people, it's a shame we live like this here.
Sandra Reay
Can the american people sue congress for not doing their job? Or can we sue for them not acting as a seperate but equal branch of government? Is there rules in place stating that the Executive office can NOT lobby or influence congress?
As long as the Excutive branch is allowed to twist arms and and turn our democracy into a bribery fest I’m afraid that the laws wont matter anymore.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:49 amCan the american people sue congress for not doing their job? Or can we sue for them not acting as a seperate but equal branch of government? Is there rules in place stating that the Executive office can NOT lobby or influence congress?
As long as the Excutive branch is allowed to twist arms and and turn our democracy into a bribery fest I’m afraid that the laws wont matter anymore.
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