Gonzales: We’re 50.1 Percent Sure We Don’t Let People Be Tortured
By on Mar 7th, 2006 at 5:46 pm
Gonzales: We’re 50.1 Percent Sure We Don’t Let People Be Tortured
Alberto Gonzales, 12/8/05:
[W]ith respect to torture, the question is easy: We do not torture. The U.S. policy — not only is it policy, it is the law. We have a domestic law, domestic legal prohibition. We have an international prohibition against torture. … For this president, his position has been consistent all the way through with respect to torture. United States policy and our legal obligations are no torture.
Gonzales, today:
We do not render individuals where we believe it’s more likely than not that they will be tortured.
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And this surprises anyone because…..?
March 7th, 2006 at 5:49 pmWhile Abu Gonzales should be locked up with the rest of the Bush war-criminals, the two quotes don’t really go together. In the first he’s talking about the U.S. doing the torturing, in the second he’s talking about the U.S. handing over people to other countries for torture. Doesn’t make a difference to the victim, but I don’t think the juxtaposition does what you think it does. Gonzales must have made some more definitive statement about rendition than “more likely than not” at some point that would be more useful.
March 7th, 2006 at 5:51 pmI’m 110% sure you do. He should have watched ‘60 minutes last sunday. Pictures and EYE WITNESSES.
March 7th, 2006 at 5:52 pmDumb Sh*theads.
March 7th, 2006 at 5:53 pmMaybe by next year this administration will finally admit that they’ve been pulling Jack Bauer’s all along.
http://www.lcoliberal.blogspot.com
More on torture and Gitmo
http://www.sunstateactivist.org
March 7th, 2006 at 5:53 pmThe source for Progressive views and events in the Southeast
50.1 %? Aint that a kick in the head?
March 7th, 2006 at 5:54 pmIt’s also “more likely than not” that you won’t get killed in a car accident on the way to work. Does that mean it will never happen?
The “more likely than not” excuse is no guarantee of any kind that the renditioned people will escape any kind of torture.
March 7th, 2006 at 5:55 pmWe do not render individuals where we believe it’s more likely than not that they will be tortured.
Setting aside questions over the legality of the ongoing “renditions”, even this caveated & convoluted statement by Gonzalez is hard to believe.
Specially since we know prisoners are “rendered” to destination such as Syria, Uzbekistan, Egypt, and other countries with less-than-stellar human rights records.
Sad thing is, I am sure there is a 35% out there who will buy this claptrap.
March 7th, 2006 at 5:59 pm“More likely than not” is that some legal technical term? Mr. Gonzales, is it more likely than not that you’re spying on us?
March 7th, 2006 at 6:01 pm“More likely than not” — weasel words
March 7th, 2006 at 6:03 pmWe do not render individuals where we believe it’s more likely than not that they will be tortured.
Setting aside questions over the legality of the ongoing “renditions”, even this caveated and convoluted statement is hard to believe.
Specially since we know prisoners are “rendered” to destination such as Syria, Uzbekistan, Egypt, and other countries with less-than-stellar human rights records.
Sad thing is, I am sure there is a 35% out there who will buy this claptrap.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:04 pmRumsfeld thinks there is no Civil War in Iraq
Is he blind
March 7th, 2006 at 6:05 pmIs he blind
Comment by lj — March 7, 2006 @ 6:05 pm
Well, he does wear glasses so, to a certain extent, yes, he is blind. But he’s also a liar, so he has no problem denying what he’s seeing in front of him.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:08 pmhe said we don’t torture, which is a different issue than us sending prisoners places where they do… it’s still wrong, but it’s a technicality Gonzo will apparently stake his credibility on…
March 7th, 2006 at 6:09 pmOperation Restore Dignity to the Whitehouse.
-Hoods and electrodes=check
-Feces and glowsticks=check
-Weasel words=check
-Gas,matches and Taliban corpses=check
-Character assassination dossiers for Richard Clarke, Paul O’Neill, Joe and Valerie Wilson, John Kerry, Scott Ritter, Mohammed El Baradei, Kofi Annan=check
US bill of rights and a toilet bowl=check
International standing and dumpster=check
Human rights record and blowtorch=check
March 7th, 2006 at 6:09 pmI can see that we are not going to be able to stop these criminals untill we get rid of the Repugnican majority in both houses.
The Repugs are shielding this criminal administration all the way.
Disgusting
March 7th, 2006 at 6:10 pmIt’s funny how you can’t actually SEE the asterisks flying all over the place when he talks.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:12 pmwhat? it should 100.1%. i tell ya.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:12 pmPretty much sums up the Administration’s actions; a toss of the coin.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:13 pmYeah and there is a law against illegal wiretaps, but they do that anyway. So, why would a law stop them from torturing?
March 7th, 2006 at 6:23 pm” domestic law, domestic legal prohibition”
That must be very comforting to all the prisoners who are intentionally jailed outside of US domestic jurisdiction.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:27 pmThey are able to parse their words to make lies seem less like lies. Cooperative senators who don’t demand they testify under oath are co-conspirators in this con game played on Americans.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:29 pmWe must demand trials for all of those in Bush&Co – they are criminals, and it must be proven in court.
To further expose the incompetence of Bush&Co: someone forgot to get his absentee ballot in order for the Texas primary today, so Bushie has to travel to Crawford to vote – at taxpayers’ expense, I might add.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:33 pmIs every job at the White House a crony appointment — even down to the office clerks?
Marie,
Whilst it it some times tempting to stoop to their level and simply lock them up without due process, it would be far more satisfying to have them convicted in a fair trial.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:34 pm#20 it will NEVER be proven in court. that is why they stacked the supreme court and that is why silverstien pulled wtc #7. they trying to get rid of the paper trail that shows the corruption.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:35 pmMarie,
I guess it is that old lament “good help is hard to find these days”. Cheney’s staff couldn’t organise the proper shooting licence. These people are running the free world? Gosh, I feel safe.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:37 pmappalled ally, yes, I do believe a trial is in order for these guys — it must be proven without question that they are criminals and deserve punishment.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:45 pmGonzales at 90% today: “We do not render individuals where we believe it’s more likely than not that they will be tortured.”
Gonzales at 180% tomorrow: “Of course we torture. So what?”
Say, would that mean we would have to at least give him credit for finally telling the truth?
This is why georgie didn’t want to join the world court you know. He didn’t want to be docket-bound for torture. I guess he’s ok with living with body guards for the rest of his life. But prosecution as a war criminal probably seemed more than he wanted to risk.
Torture, of course, will be his ultimate undoing. I just hope it will not also be ours.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:48 pmEisenhower was asked a tough question once,which he didn’t want to commit to, so he answered it this way: “I wouldn’t want to say I would, and I wouldn’t want to say I wouldn’t.” and walked away. Would have,could have, might have,maybe,could be, might be…etc. Gonzo is doing the dance of the cat on the hot tin roof.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:49 pmBreaking News: Senate Republicans cave on NSA.
Hagel and Snowe sold out your rights today.
March 7th, 2006 at 6:53 pm#28 What do you mean? No investigation?
March 7th, 2006 at 7:10 pmG.W.
No
March 7th, 2006 at 7:13 pmpretty funny when an attorney is this dull. he isn’t quite sure that he is talking or listening either, 50/50 chance either way though, eh?
March 7th, 2006 at 7:14 pmcan’t wait to see this one in the orange jumpsuite too, he will be taken down by fitz as he is complicit, so fear not. maybe we can rid ourselves of some of these idiots. natural selection isn’t doing a very good job
Watch this clip from Democracy Now:
http://prisonplanet.com/articles/march2006/070306Torture.htm
“Bush Successful at Permanent Legalization of Torture”
March 7th, 2006 at 7:27 pm#30 – How can this possibly be? Why aren’t the Dems shutting down the both houses of congress. We can not possibly let this issue die.
March 7th, 2006 at 7:29 pmKeep your powder dry G.W.
Shutting down Congress is for the DP World port deal. That will get the soft middle third’s attention, port security.
That said, the NSA scandal is still going to be there. Gonzales will be called back, it will burn like an ebola fever.
March 7th, 2006 at 7:54 pmYou are right Citizen80203. Thanks for talking me down. I will hold off on pulling the revolutionary troops together for another couple of weeks.
March 7th, 2006 at 8:05 pmJust wondering, did anybody here say anything when Clinton sent the “albanian returnees” to Egypt where they were executed?
March 7th, 2006 at 8:14 pmNo, we just said “squat lower eunuch”.
March 7th, 2006 at 8:16 pmWar Crimes…
War Crimes The recent revelations about ranting teachers and high school mock war tribunals has once again brought the left back into the spotlight with allegations about President Bush being a war criminal. You know the allegations, soldiers tortured …
March 7th, 2006 at 8:18 pmEunuch Ray
We know your pus inked scripture. Now go squat in your saddam hole.
March 7th, 2006 at 8:21 pm#36- Ray, if you’re going to be a “turd”, go lay in the yard. Gawd, get some help.
March 7th, 2006 at 8:37 pmGeorge Bush is a war criminal. This is news?
I hope he spends his entire post-presidency running from the World Court…just like Kissinger and Pinochet.
May he never sleep, nor know a moment’s peace.
March 7th, 2006 at 8:58 pmRecall your troops G.W.!
According the morning edition of the Post:
White House Effort to Block Challenge to Ports Deal Collapses
“Appropriations Committee Chairman Jerry Lewis (R-Calif.) will attach legislation to block the port deal today to a must-pass emergency spending bill funding the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.â€
This is quid pro quo. Shut down the NSA investigation and we will withdraw on the DP World deal.
All bets are off, shut down the Senate over the NSA coverup.
March 7th, 2006 at 9:07 pm#42 PLUS it’s Rethugs who are putting the wrench in!
GWB has officially become The Toxic Pretender.
March 7th, 2006 at 9:11 pmThey were forewarned by Harry, Dog.
March 7th, 2006 at 9:12 pmI’m down wif dat, homey.
March 7th, 2006 at 9:14 pmI’m 49.9% sure that I’m about to start a populist revolution.
March 7th, 2006 at 9:47 pmThat’s what kills me the most…they act like there aren’t pictures and documentations. I sometimes like to imagine the look on Bush’s face as it’s all presented to him and the rest of the world from the Hague.
March 7th, 2006 at 9:55 pmKiki
It would be a look of confusion, I’m sure.
March 7th, 2006 at 10:09 pmWe all wait for justice, and justice does not come. The bushcons are surely ‘fixing’ the 06 elections as we speak. We must ‘overide’ them, then start the wheels of justice rolling again to throw them out for good in 08. If we cannot do this we might as well kiss this country goodbye. The tide is turning in our favor, but NO LET UP is the word, because as we sleep, they are inching back like a si-fi movie that has a virus that will not die.
March 7th, 2006 at 10:26 pm“If the bush whitehouse does it,it’s not against the law.”
George Nixon Bush.
Anybody see this from the BBC?:
Nine US servicemen have been disciplined for mistreating civilians in Kosovo, according to reports on the American television network ABC.
The men are said to have indecently assaulted women, punched and threatened civilians, and fired at a Red Cross vehicle.
The nine servicemen, from the 82nd Airborne Division, have been reduced in rank and suffered financial penalties, according to ABC, which says it has obtained an official report on the incidents.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/927323.stm
March 7th, 2006 at 10:38 pmSee the AP story that does a fine job of helping Gonzales state his case with barely an opposing voice? The equivalent of a loaded Sunday morning talk show panel.
Mentioned in the third paragraph is the only reference to an opposition: “human rights groups” (would it be so difficult to cite them?) and “other European critics” (as though they were members of some fringe element instead of major heads of state). What’s more, their criticism is merely “alleged,” whereas Gonzales’ words are given no such pejorative framing, even though he offers no proof in his denials of torture and renderings of prisoners. Proof of these crimes, on the other hand, has been well documented for quite some time, from Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo to gulags in Poland and torture chambers in Egypt. Some of these prisoners have already been released after years of being held without charge, years of cruelty and torture – solitary confinement in rat-infested cramped cells, water-boarding, beatings, maiming, prolonged sleep deprivation, electric shock to genitals, bites from attack dogs. Psychological ruination. And some prisoners have been released into the afterlife. While still others remain in these dark chambers, in their own private hell. Nameless. Faceless. Without no recourse or legal representation.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060307/ap_on_re_eu/britain_gonzales
Last line of story, Alberto, Minister of Justice says:
March 7th, 2006 at 10:39 pm“If we went around this room, people would have different definitions of what constitutes torture, depending on the circumstances.”
RR, that is from September 18, 2000.
Imagine what will happen when the trials start for the Iraq war. How many people will be convicted?
None, they are all CIA and won’t ever face any criminal trials for deeds much worse than punching somebody, shooting at the Red Cross or “indicently” assualting women.
March 7th, 2006 at 10:45 pmspluge boy said “Imagine what will happen when the trials start for the Iraq war. How many people will be convicted? None, they are all CIA and won’t ever face any criminal trials”
I am sure the dozen or so soldiers in jail for crimes from the Iraq war are glad to hear they are not in jail after all…
While Pfc. Lynndie England’s case remains in limbo, seven Army reservists have been convicted of abusing detainees at the Abu Ghraib prison.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7709487/
…genius
p.s. shooting at medical evacs is a major war crime. Did you guys talk about impeaching clinton then?
March 7th, 2006 at 11:11 pmEunuch Ray
We smell your rot boychild.
March 7th, 2006 at 11:30 pmThe Bush Regime is corrupt and criminal, so impeach the entire bunch of them, then war crimes trials for all of them!
March 7th, 2006 at 11:57 pmhe’s such a clean cut, Alberto VO5 kinda All American,
March 8th, 2006 at 12:36 amhow could he possibly be telling naughty little fibs.
While Pfc. Lynndie England’s case remains in limbo, seven Army reservists have been convicted of abusing detainees at the Abu Ghraib prison.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7709487/
…genius
p.s. shooting at medical evacs is a major war crime. Did you guys talk about impeaching clinton then?
Comment by RR — March 7, 2006 @ 11:11 pm
————
DOJ asks court to dismiss detainee torture lawsuit against Rumsfeld
Jeannie Shawl at 8:45 AM ET
Photo source or description
[JURIST] US government lawyers on Monday asked a federal court to dismiss a lawsuit [PDF complaint; JURIST report] filed by two rights groups against US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld [official profile] over detainee abuse in Iraq and Afghanistan. The American Civil Liberties Union and Human Rights First [advocacy websites] filed the suit on behalf of nine former detainees [ACLU profiles], alleging that Rumsfeld and other top military officials bear direct responsibility for torture and abuse committed by US personnel and their actions violate the US Constitution and international law.
The DOJ argues that Rumsfeld is entitled to immunity under the Federal Employees Liability Reform and Tort Compensation Act of 1988, 28 US Code 2679 [text; DOJ backgrounder], barring civil lawsuits against federal officials for conduct performed within the scope of employment.
March 8th, 2006 at 1:31 amp.s. shooting at medical evacs is a major war crime. Did you guys talk about impeaching clinton then?
Comment by RR — March 7, 2006 @ 11:11 pm
————
DOJ asks court to dismiss detainee torture lawsuit against Rumsfeld
Jeannie Shawl at 8:45 AM ET
Photo source or description
[JURIST] US government lawyers on Monday asked a federal court to dismiss a lawsuit [PDF complaint; JURIST report] filed by two rights groups against US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld [official profile] over detainee abuse in Iraq and Afghanistan. The American Civil Liberties Union and Human Rights First [advocacy websites] filed the suit on behalf of nine former detainees [ACLU profiles], alleging that Rumsfeld and other top military officials bear direct responsibility for torture and abuse committed by US personnel and their actions violate the US Constitution and international law.
The DOJ argues that Rumsfeld is entitled to immunity under the Federal Employees Liability Reform and Tort Compensation Act of 1988, 28 US Code 2679 [text; DOJ backgrounder], barring civil lawsuits against federal officials for conduct performed within the scope of employment.
Sorry if Duplicate Spam Filter uggh
March 8th, 2006 at 1:33 amLiars liars liars liars liars
March 8th, 2006 at 5:02 amcHRIST SAKES JUST LOOK AT THE aRAIB gURAB iMAGES AND THERES WORSE TO COME
March 8th, 2006 at 5:03 amBritish government minister says Guantanamo must close to save democracy
http://www.craigmurray.co.uk/archives/2006/03/british_governm.html#more
March 8th, 2006 at 8:35 amwake up smell the coffee idiot you have been caught ….what more proof do you need
March 8th, 2006 at 8:41 amBut torture worked so well rooting out all those witches way back when …!
March 8th, 2006 at 10:27 amTime to rename the “Justice Department”. How about the “Ministry of Truth”?
March 8th, 2006 at 10:45 amNo surprise that people keeps botching everything they touch, they only think in black and white. They don’t see any colour out of that.
March 8th, 2006 at 11:36 amWait till tommoro night 9 pm channel 4 “road to guantanamo”
film by micheal winterbottom view here
Truth gonna be reveiled and America are gonna look like a sick country AGAIN
http://www.channel4.com/news/special-reports/iran.html
watch the clip looks good and you can buy it a dvd as from tommoro..what the film really needs is screened in the pictures across America
March 8th, 2006 at 4:28 pmright on ,fellow bloggers!cheny-bush what a bunch of stooges. i thought st. ronnie was bad but at least he helped my hero Gorbachev!these 2- do they think atlas shrugged?
March 8th, 2006 at 4:36 pmright on ,fellow bloggers!cheny-bush what a bunch of stooges. i thought st. ronnie was bad but at least he helped my hero Gorbachev!these 2- do they think atlas shrugged?
March 8th, 2006 at 4:36 pmright on ,fellow bloggers!cheny-bush what a bunch of stooges. i thought st. ronnie was bad but at least he helped my hero Gorbachev!these 2- do they think atlas shrugged?
March 8th, 2006 at 4:36 pmI’m 100% positive Gonzales is evil and corrupt.
March 8th, 2006 at 6:26 pm