Comments on: 18 Families Bankroll Estate Tax Repeal Campaign http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/ Thu, 26 Nov 2009 16:57:16 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: 700,000 « JeffSay… http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-2415262 700,000 « JeffSay… Thu, 22 Mar 2007 00:20:53 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-2415262 [...] are. They’re paying millions to “lawmakers” so they’ll vote to repeal the Paris Hilton Tax. No Comments Leave a Commenttrackback addressThere was an error with your comment, please try [...] [...] are. They’re paying millions to “lawmakers” so they’ll vote to repeal the Paris Hilton Tax. No Comments Leave a Commenttrackback addressThere was an error with your comment, please try [...]

]]> By: JeffMo http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-1438612 JeffMo Fri, 12 Jan 2007 21:57:45 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-1438612 #112 Your story is sad, but you haven't logically connected the actions of "a 4th wife" and "a crooked attorney" to the blame that you want to place on the estate tax. #100 Gregor, you are right on. So many posters here totally missed the point by whining about a particular use to which the government will or will not put tax revenues. I'm about as libertarian as they come, and I think the federal government's size should be drastically reduced along with the tax burden they place on us all. Unfortunately, that will not occur simply by repealing or reducing a tax that is almost exclusively paid by the wealthy. Unless such a repeal were coupled with a persistent net decrease in federal spending (and I think we all know how likely that is), the overall outcome will be to "increase revenues" to make up for the loss of this particular source of funding. Even estate tax detractors understand that it is one of the most progressive forms of taxation. Elminate it, and the compensation for the "lost revenue" will come in the form of effective rate increases (or effective exemption decreases) on taxes that are less progressive. In summary, any argument that boils down to "taxes are unfair" doesn't support repeal of the estate tax any more than it would support repeal of income taxes or sales taxes or any other kind of tax. If we want to pay less tax overall, we have to find a way to request or demand less goverment than we currently "enjoy." #112

Your story is sad, but you haven’t logically connected the actions of “a 4th wife” and “a crooked attorney” to the blame that you want to place on the estate tax.

#100

Gregor, you are right on. So many posters here totally missed the point by whining about a particular use to which the government will or will not put tax revenues.

I’m about as libertarian as they come, and I think the federal government’s size should be drastically reduced along with the tax burden they place on us all.

Unfortunately, that will not occur simply by repealing or reducing a tax that is almost exclusively paid by the wealthy. Unless such a repeal were coupled with a persistent net decrease in federal spending (and I think we all know how likely that is), the overall outcome will be to “increase revenues” to make up for the loss of this particular source of funding.

Even estate tax detractors understand that it is one of the most progressive forms of taxation. Elminate it, and the compensation for the “lost revenue” will come in the form of effective rate increases (or effective exemption decreases) on taxes that are less progressive.

In summary, any argument that boils down to “taxes are unfair” doesn’t support repeal of the estate tax any more than it would support repeal of income taxes or sales taxes or any other kind of tax. If we want to pay less tax overall, we have to find a way to request or demand less goverment than we currently “enjoy.”

]]> By: Diana http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-1301185 Diana Thu, 21 Dec 2006 04:20:48 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-1301185 The estate tax screwed me out of everything my father worked for and a 4th wife of a year and 3 months with a prenump that gave her nothing upon his death, got a crooked attorney to come in and make a will 7 days befor he died and he was in the hospital for confusion 3 days prior. The wife and attorney said he was giving everything to her to avoid the tax and that is a lie. We were never even told about the 10 to 15 years time you have to pay it. Now I am in a battle over all this and I am an only child with four kids who stands to loose everything to some evil people who used this tax and took advantage of a dying man. I don't even have a right to my baby pictures. It is sick... Even if your no paris, you don't know the feeling till your in the shoes of the tax that hurt's who is a rightful heir. If a re-marriage accur's.. Who protect's the children? When the tax goes to a non parent with no ties.. The estate tax screwed me out of everything my father worked for and a 4th wife of a year and 3 months with a prenump that gave her nothing upon his death, got a crooked attorney to come in and make a will 7 days befor he died and he was in the hospital for confusion 3 days prior. The wife and attorney said he was giving everything to her to avoid the tax and that is a lie. We were never even told about the 10 to 15 years time you have to pay it. Now I am in a battle over all this and I am an only child with four kids who stands to loose everything to some evil people who used this tax and took advantage of a dying man. I don’t even have a right to my baby pictures. It is sick… Even if your no paris, you don’t know the feeling till your in the shoes of the tax that hurt’s who is a rightful heir. If a re-marriage accur’s.. Who protect’s the children? When the tax goes to a non parent with no ties..

]]> By: Fresh Politics » Blog Archive » Warren Buffett donates his fortune http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-654027 Fresh Politics » Blog Archive » Warren Buffett donates his fortune Mon, 03 Jul 2006 18:13:21 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-654027 [...] Related is the fact that Buffett believes that the estate tax should not go away. Republicans have been trying to repeal the estate tax for years. When you consider that Bush’s estate will be taxed over $20Billion after his passing, and Cheyney’s estate will be hit with a $40Billion+ tax, it is no wonder they try to paint it as the “Death Tax” that will hurt american farm owners (even though they’ve never been able to find a family farm that’s been affected by the tax). I think it was Feingold who said, fine, lets just make the cut-off $100Million. That bill was shot down in a heart-beat by Republicans. ThinkProgress.org (the Paris Hilton tax) and Public Citizen said it best (these articles concerning how these 18 families have been paying billions to convince us, through commercials, that the estate tax is bad): [The Report] reveals how 18 families worth a total of $185.5 billion have financed and coordinated a 10-year effort to repeal the estate tax, a move that would collectively net them a windfall of $71.6 billion. [...] [...] Related is the fact that Buffett believes that the estate tax should not go away. Republicans have been trying to repeal the estate tax for years. When you consider that Bush’s estate will be taxed over $20Billion after his passing, and Cheyney’s estate will be hit with a $40Billion+ tax, it is no wonder they try to paint it as the “Death Tax” that will hurt american farm owners (even though they’ve never been able to find a family farm that’s been affected by the tax). I think it was Feingold who said, fine, lets just make the cut-off $100Million. That bill was shot down in a heart-beat by Republicans. ThinkProgress.org (the Paris Hilton tax) and Public Citizen said it best (these articles concerning how these 18 families have been paying billions to convince us, through commercials, that the estate tax is bad): [The Report] reveals how 18 families worth a total of $185.5 billion have financed and coordinated a 10-year effort to repeal the estate tax, a move that would collectively net them a windfall of $71.6 billion. [...]

]]> By: Think Progress » ThinkFast AM: June 23, 2006 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-636079 Think Progress » ThinkFast AM: June 23, 2006 Fri, 23 Jun 2006 13:06:22 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-636079 [...] Congratulations Paris Hilton. Yesterday the House voted to cut the estate tax, exempting from taxation “individual estates up to $5 million and couple’s estates up to $10 million.” [...] [...] Congratulations Paris Hilton. Yesterday the House voted to cut the estate tax, exempting from taxation “individual estates up to $5 million and couple’s estates up to $10 million.” [...]

]]> By: appletree » Blog Archive » Estate Tax Stays http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-604383 appletree » Blog Archive » Estate Tax Stays Fri, 09 Jun 2006 15:39:29 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-604383 [...] If the tax had been repealed, it would have cost the treasury hundreds of billions over the next decade. Since most Americans will never inherit estates large enough to be covered by the tax, it’s not very surprising that the effort to repeal it is bankrolled mostly by 18 of America’s wealthiest families, none of whom are farmers or small businessmen. Given the fact that a repeal of the tax would benefit only the wealthiest Americans, it will shock no-one to learn that Republicans voted overwhelmingly in favor of repeal, and Democrats voted overwhelmingly to preserve the tax. Here’s a list of the crossover votes (Democrats voting for repeal, and Republicans voting against): [...] [...] If the tax had been repealed, it would have cost the treasury hundreds of billions over the next decade. Since most Americans will never inherit estates large enough to be covered by the tax, it’s not very surprising that the effort to repeal it is bankrolled mostly by 18 of America’s wealthiest families, none of whom are farmers or small businessmen. Given the fact that a repeal of the tax would benefit only the wealthiest Americans, it will shock no-one to learn that Republicans voted overwhelmingly in favor of repeal, and Democrats voted overwhelmingly to preserve the tax. Here’s a list of the crossover votes (Democrats voting for repeal, and Republicans voting against): [...]

]]> By: Lynda Swanson http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-603441 Lynda Swanson Fri, 09 Jun 2006 02:29:52 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-603441 Thank you! AMazing you were able to answer my question. Thank you! AMazing you were able to answer my question.

]]> By: Infinitive Splitter » A very interesting theory http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-602894 Infinitive Splitter » A very interesting theory Thu, 08 Jun 2006 21:57:13 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-602894 [...] Funny you should mention Wal-Mart. The Walton family is the wealthiest in America, and among those — including the Hiltons and Marses — lobbying hardest for estate-tax repeal. Paris Hilton pays the estate tax, not the owners of "corner lunch counters." [...] [...] Funny you should mention Wal-Mart. The Walton family is the wealthiest in America, and among those — including the Hiltons and Marses — lobbying hardest for estate-tax repeal. Paris Hilton pays the estate tax, not the owners of "corner lunch counters." [...]

]]> By: pmerg http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-596408 pmerg Mon, 05 Jun 2006 21:26:44 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-596408 Its easy for the Buffets and Gates of the world to say "take my money - please!" - 1/2 of Billions is still billions! And this type of program doesn't stop "american royalty" - for references see Family: Bush or Family: Kennedy. There are still a hell of a lot of rich Rockefellers and Morgans out there today. For the rest of us, with considerably less (although still plenty), 1/2 of our wealth, split between multiple heirs and charitable donations, leave a just a little bit. By the time my kids get theirs, they will (hopefully) already be contributing to society, and they won't be able to live off their inheritance. That is the case for most people. My wealth has been taxed multiple times - income tax, capital gains tax, property tax (that's right, your house value factors into your wealth for the estate tax). Why should the government get it a 4th time? And why is the government better at setting social policy? For everyone who believes in this, do you believe is government-mandated morality programs? School vouchers? Religious-based schools funded by the government? Its a slippery slope, isn't it? The 60's and 70's showed us that government programs really don't work to set social policy. Why is this okay? Its easy for the Buffets and Gates of the world to say “take my money – please!” – 1/2 of Billions is still billions! And this type of program doesn’t stop “american royalty” – for references see Family: Bush or Family: Kennedy. There are still a hell of a lot of rich Rockefellers and Morgans out there today.

For the rest of us, with considerably less (although still plenty), 1/2 of our wealth, split between multiple heirs and charitable donations, leave a just a little bit. By the time my kids get theirs, they will (hopefully) already be contributing to society, and they won’t be able to live off their inheritance. That is the case for most people.

My wealth has been taxed multiple times – income tax, capital gains tax, property tax (that’s right, your house value factors into your wealth for the estate tax). Why should the government get it a 4th time?

And why is the government better at setting social policy? For everyone who believes in this, do you believe is government-mandated morality programs? School vouchers? Religious-based schools funded by the government? Its a slippery slope, isn’t it? The 60’s and 70’s showed us that government programs really don’t work to set social policy. Why is this okay?

]]> By: haplo http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-555523 haplo Sun, 14 May 2006 01:07:52 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-555523 i find it amusing that u ppl who take paychecks from wealthy business owners seem to find no problems turning right around and saying they r evil and that they owe the country something. how the **** do u think they got all that money? by starting a business and creating jobs for u. they already monetarily support their millions of employees...what the hell else do u want from them? let them keep their damn money. i find it amusing that u ppl who take paychecks from wealthy business owners seem to find no problems turning right around and saying they r evil and that they owe the country something. how the **** do u think they got all that money? by starting a business and creating jobs for u. they already monetarily support their millions of employees…what the hell else do u want from them? let them keep their damn money.

]]> By: the wizard of oil http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-526749 the wizard of oil Fri, 28 Apr 2006 07:11:22 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-526749 <strong>Poor Little Billionaires </strong> http://simbaud.blogspot.com/2006/04/poor-little-billionaires.html Poor Little Billionaires

http://simbaud.blogspot.com/2006/04/poor-little-billionaires.html

]]> By: Edso http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-524165 Edso Wed, 26 Apr 2006 22:59:12 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-524165 It's been good chating with you folks. God bless America. It’s been good chating with you folks. God bless America.

]]> By: Gregor Samsa http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-524034 Gregor Samsa Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:47:00 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-524034 <i>I’m paying it now…every month. Comment by Edso — April 26, 2006 @ 5:36 pm </i> You are still not paying it. Those are savings that will be used towards paying the estate tax <b>after</b> your, well, decease. And may I remind you, your strategy is optional... great foresight, tough... I’m paying it now…every month.
Comment by Edso — April 26, 2006 @ 5:36 pm

You are still not paying it. Those are savings that will be used towards paying the estate tax after your, well, decease.

And may I remind you, your strategy is optional… great foresight, tough…

]]> By: Edso http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-3/#comment-524013 Edso Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:36:53 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-524013 Gregor Samsa I pay $3000.00 a month for a life insurance policy that will pay the taxes on my estate whenI die. What do you mean when you say that the heirs pay the tax. I'm paying it now...every month. Gregor Samsa

I pay $3000.00 a month for a life insurance policy that will pay the taxes on my estate whenI die. What do you mean when you say that the heirs pay the tax. I’m paying it now…every month.

]]> By: Gregor Samsa http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-2/#comment-523999 Gregor Samsa Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:32:18 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-523999 <i>(...)the estate tax is forced wealth redistribution … in that sense, I feel it’s wrong. Comment by Giacomo — April 26, 2006 @ 4:57 pm </i> <b>All</b> taxes are forced wealth redistribution, because they take money from someone(s) and put it towards building infrastructure (physical and legal) that benefits us all... (…)the estate tax is forced wealth redistribution … in that sense, I feel it’s wrong.
Comment by Giacomo — April 26, 2006 @ 4:57 pm

All taxes are forced wealth redistribution, because they take money from someone(s) and put it towards building infrastructure (physical and legal) that benefits us all…

]]> By: Gregor Samsa http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-2/#comment-523994 Gregor Samsa Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:31:02 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-523994 <i>Since when does giving money to the government benefit others? The government doesn’t know what to do with money. I know what to do with money, my heirs know what to do with money. Comment by Edso — April 26, 2006 @ 4:27 pm </i> Tax monies are used to build roads, public schools, pay teachers, build the sewage & potable water systems, lay down the electricity network, build & maintain dams and levees, fund Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, provide the veterans’ benefit system, fund the construction of seaports and airports, insure for home loans & student loans (when not actually providing these loans), fund public universities & subsidise private ones, etc, etc, etc. Sounds like a lot of benefits to a lot of people me... Since when does giving money to the government benefit others? The government doesn’t know what to do with money. I know what to do with money, my heirs know what to do with money.
Comment by Edso — April 26, 2006 @ 4:27 pm

Tax monies are used to build roads, public schools, pay teachers, build the sewage & potable water systems, lay down the electricity network, build & maintain dams and levees, fund Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, provide the veterans’ benefit system, fund the construction of seaports and airports, insure for home loans & student loans (when not actually providing these loans), fund public universities & subsidise private ones, etc, etc, etc.

Sounds like a lot of benefits to a lot of people me…

]]> By: Gregor Samsa http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-2/#comment-523991 Gregor Samsa Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:30:11 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-523991 <i>On the same token most people can afford an extra $5 a week to a charity of my choice with no big problems. Why not require it of them? Comment by Tundra — April 26, 2006 @ 4:20 pm </i> The estate tax is not paid by the person who paid the money but by their heirs... it is not the same thing. It's kind of like winning the lottery: They didn't have to work towards accumulating all that capital. <i>We won’t agree, but this thread is dead so I can have the last word muwahahahahaha</i> I don't think so.... HA! On the same token most people can afford an extra $5 a week to a charity of my choice with no big problems. Why not require it of them?
Comment by Tundra — April 26, 2006 @ 4:20 pm

The estate tax is not paid by the person who paid the money but by their heirs… it is not the same thing. It’s kind of like winning the lottery: They didn’t have to work towards accumulating all that capital.

We won’t agree, but this thread is dead so I can have the last word muwahahahahaha

I don’t think so…. HA!

]]> By: Gregor Samsa http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-2/#comment-523986 Gregor Samsa Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:29:21 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-523986 <i>On the same token most people can afford an extra $5 a week to a charity of my choice with no big problems. Why not require it of them? Comment by Tundra — April 26, 2006 @ 4:20 pm </i> The estate tax is not paid by the person who paid the money but by their heirs... it is not the same thing. It's kind of like the heirs winning the lottery: They didn't have to work towards accumulating all that capital. <i> I don't think so.... HA!</i> On the same token most people can afford an extra $5 a week to a charity of my choice with no big problems. Why not require it of them?
Comment by Tundra — April 26, 2006 @ 4:20 pm

The estate tax is not paid by the person who paid the money but by their heirs… it is not the same thing. It’s kind of like the heirs winning the lottery: They didn’t have to work towards accumulating all that capital.

I don’t think so…. HA!

]]> By: Edso http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-2/#comment-523970 Edso Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:22:42 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-523970 A quote from the above article: " The estate tax repeal would “collectively net them a windfall of $71.6 billion.”" It wouldn't net them a dime. It's their money to begin with. They will only break even. A quote from the above article:
” The estate tax repeal would “collectively net them a windfall of $71.6 billion.””
It wouldn’t net them a dime. It’s their money to begin with. They will only break even.

]]> By: Edso http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/comment-page-2/#comment-523955 Edso Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:15:29 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2006/04/25/estate-18/#comment-523955 Giacomo If I had 100 million and you needed 100k for cancer treatment I would write you a check. I don't have 100 million but I do have about 3. I didn't inherit a nickle, I come from a humble background and worked my whole life much to the exclusion of everything else. I never got married, never had children. I got my jollies from making money. Now the Democrats want to punish me for being fiscally responsible. If you truly believe that the govt knows what to do with those billions that they confiscate every year from dead peoples estates, ask them for 100k for cancer treatment,,,I think we know what they will say. btw If I were required to give 47% of my estate to causes that "I" think are worthwhile( afterall it is my money), I may look at the death tax a little differently. Giacomo
If I had 100 million and you needed 100k for cancer treatment I would write you a check.
I don’t have 100 million but I do have about 3. I didn’t inherit a nickle, I come from a humble background and worked my whole life much to the exclusion of everything else. I never got married, never had children. I got my jollies from making money. Now the Democrats want to punish me for being fiscally responsible. If you truly believe that the govt knows what to do with those billions that they confiscate every year from dead peoples estates, ask them for 100k for cancer treatment,,,I think we know what they will say.

btw If I were required to give 47% of my estate to causes that “I” think are worthwhile( afterall it is my money), I may look at the death tax a little differently.

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