63%.
By on May 12th, 2006 at 10:04 am
63%.
Percentage of Americans who think its acceptable that the “National Security Agency has been collecting the phone call records of tens of millions of Americans,” according to a new Washington Post/ABC News poll.
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That will change. People haven’t digested the import of it yet.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:09 amAre we becoming a nation of sheep?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:10 am[cough] Bulls**t!!!
May 12th, 2006 at 10:10 amSubmission accomplished. Welcome to the Bush Decidership.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:10 amI wonder when all of those people are going to take the curtains, blinds or other window coverings off their homes and residences.
After all, what could they possibly be doing in there that they would need to shield from anyone walking by?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:10 amThe link leads to a poll dated April 10, 2006.
How is that possible when we just found out about this program yesterday?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:11 amThe question is not posed well if it is put in isolation. That is, that question should be followed by the same question with additional ‘information’ like ‘…and correlating it with your personal information’ or ‘….by paying your phone company millions of dollars’ or ‘…this likely violates the law’.
The better one would be ‘…knowing that you are eligible ofr $1000 for this violation?”
:)
People like money.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:11 amA total of 502 people??? That sure is small.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:11 amDoes this 63% live in Crawford, TX??
May 12th, 2006 at 10:12 amYou mean 63% of 502 people.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:13 amThis is another example of Republicans crafting the right message regardless of the facts. They continue to connect most of their actions to the war on terror and keeping the American people safe. The problem is that in their message, they paint Democrats as being opposed to keeping America safe…when in fact Democrats are for surveillance…BUT under the laws in place.
The D’s continue to lose the message wars and the MSM continues to assist in painting the D’s as being weak on security. I think the D’s should consider a bill to “fix” the FISA system in order to bring ALL surveillance under the oversight of the court. The likely can’t pass such a bill but they can make Republicans oppose it and then use that as a part of the Democratic message. I think Americans would understand and apppreciate that message.
more observations here:
http://www.thoughttheater.com
May 12th, 2006 at 10:13 amThat can’t be right. Then again, you can’t be too sure of these MSM polls. How can Bush’s approval rating be down to 29% while nearly a third of us have no problem with this?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:13 amA lot of people are all for this kind of thing until it burns them personally. Joe Republican cannot imagine the government — for all he hates government — wasting their time on his calls to his mistress when there are important terrorists to catch.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:19 amI forgot the part of the U.S. Constitution that allows for popular opinion to allow Americans to be subject to unreasonable search and seizure without a showing of probable cause.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:19 am1 poll of less than a 1000 people. Call me in a month, the outrage will be palpable. Bush is going to put Nixon’s disapproval rating to shame.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:20 amI agree with the gist of the earlier posts.
Careful that we don’t fall into the trap of the ad populum logical reasoning fallacy. Can we be sure people know enough about the issue to make an informed judgment? The capitalist corporate media can’t be relied on to accurately explain the program or the issue.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:24 amBoth CNN and MSNBC online polls are quite the opposite. Not sure how the question was framed or if people know that it’s against the law. Why not ask “Is the Bush adminstration above the law?” and see what you get.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:25 am#6 is right. An old poll matched with a current news story. On April 10th Americans still thought the collection of records were in the thousands.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:26 amRead the actual questions in the poll. Highly dubious. The poll was obviously politically motivated–just as they refuse to poll on impeachment because of political bias. Rushing a poll out like this is pretty blatantly an attempt to support the right wing extremists.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:27 amHow is it that the CNN online poll had like 76% of people find this creepy and yet other polls show people could care less? Makes me sick to see how willing some people are to give away thier freedoms to an administration that has lied about almost everything.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:28 amThe incredible gullibility, if not stupidity, of the public.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:28 amWhen studies show they do not read papers, they watch only sensational tv news, their automobile radios blast ultra-conservative hate, they are well informed on only sports, Hollywood and American Idol, when their lives are too scheduled, too busy, too stressful to take time to even see, much less comprehend, what is going on under their very noses, it should be no surprise.
When they finally awaken that their rights and liberties have been stolen, it will be too late to get them back. I am in despair, we are looking at the demise of the American I once knew.
The American People are in Denial that we have a Dicatorship happening right here in our own back yards! Total Denial what a Shame!
Do we need a 12 Step Program For Americans on being Enablers of Dicatorbush/cheney?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:28 amReally, 63%? That’s a load of bullshit. It’s just as valid a poll as if you asked everyone here what they think & ended up with 3% think it’s OK for the NSA to Datamine without a court order (C’mon, IRI, MA, seixon…that’s 3%. That is if we could keep them from voting multiple times…Hey, no Diebold polling machines too!)
May 12th, 2006 at 10:29 amWell yeah, of course they think its acceptable if confronted with the alternative that terrorist activities go undetected if phone calls were not tracked. You can get any result you want to if you’re asking the right questions the right way. I am regularly reading the WP, even if I don’t agree with all of their positions. I like the paper and thought they were very respectable. Not in this case, this is badly manipulative and it seems obvious who is behind it all.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:30 amThese numbers would probably be way lower if the survey wasn’t conducted on the phone.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:30 amYou notice that it doesn’t say anything about how the poll was conducted (the number of people and it was done in ONE NIGHT) until the end of the article.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:32 amThe link leads to a poll dated April 10, 2006.
How is that possible when we just found out about this program yesterday?
Comment by Quest — May 12, 2006 @ 10:11 am
Good catch Quest!
How is it that this is a breaking story today if the Washington Post seems to have reported it over a month ago?
#18 John — the poll question states 10s of millions and not thousands.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:33 amIf you would poll Americans about anything, 63 percent would say it’s ok.
Is it acceptable to sh*t your pants?
63 percent would say it’s ok.
Is it acceptable to breathe?
Don’t hold your breath.
I’m going to start drinking Sufferin’ Bastards in honor of the Bush Cabal and the neowhatevertheyares.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:34 amRegarding polls, here are the results of one that finally makes sense. Take note of who’d written it.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:34 amI don’t have nothing to worry about with the governement listening to my calls. I’m not hiding nothing! I live a good decent, Christian life. I have a trailer home, plasma TV and food and beer in my belly. Ya’ll can go F yourselves. We are in a post 9/11 world where oceans no longer protect us. If you don’t love this country, then leave it, you commie, hollywood loving liberals!
Go protect your owls, bugs and flys and leave security to the GOP. Don’t worry, daddy’s in charge, you bunch of momma-boys.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:37 amFrom the poll: “The practical difficulties of doing a survey in a single evening represent other potential sources of error in this or any other overnight poll.”
so why bother? Does the Post have some sort of vested interest in muddying the waters?
Part of those practical difficulties must be even getting the date on the poll correct. Is it April 10th or May 11th that the poll was done. I get the feeling this sample of 502 people is meaningless.
Unless the meaning you what is to start the majority of people thinking this NSA crap is just fine. So the next time someone is polled, they think ‘well, the last poll said it is ok, so I will say it is ok.’
May 12th, 2006 at 10:39 amHeres another poll we havent heard about today from the MSM, Bush’s approval rating is now 29%. This was the Harris poll.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:40 amMaybe someone can come up with a Mad-lib type form letter for everyone to use for every story the MSM refuses to cover, we could just fill in the blanks and send enmasse to each organisation. What do you think?
And soojn there will be numbers on their arms or a patch sewn to their shirts.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:40 amWrapped in a flag and holding a bible will be their leader.
PIGS!
#25 Perfect!!!
May 12th, 2006 at 10:40 amAnd soon there will be numbers on their arms or a patch sewn to their shirts.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:41 amWrapped in a flag and holding a bible will be their leader.
PIGS!
JP-that was scary reading. The GOP lying and the media not calling them on it sure does not help.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:41 amThis just in from Captain Obvious:
RayfromGA is a parody…..
May 12th, 2006 at 10:46 ami really despair for this country when this many people are this f*cking stupid.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:46 amBaaa—baaa—which way to the slaughter house?
Well, Republicans have argued for years that public schools churn out the idiots. I guess they have their proof now.
-GSD
May 12th, 2006 at 10:48 am“It’s been reported that the National Security Agency has been collecting the phone call records of tens of millions of Americans. It then analyzes calling patterns in an effort to identify possible terrorism suspects, without listening to or recording the conversations. Would you consider this an acceptable or unacceptable way for the federal government to investigate terrorism?”
April 10, 2006 – April 10, 2006 – April 10, 2006… this is significant and deserves consideration.
How is it that when Newsweek “breaks” this story yesterday its news – while the Washington Post releases same exact info over a month ago and nobody cares?
Did the people who responded in this poll even have a sense of what they were answering?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:48 amWhy didn’t they ask if it is ok for Bush to break the law (no warrant) to get your phone records?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:50 amThis is an exampe of the power of the mighty wingnut wurlitzer. This poll is obviously a rush to judgement. They wanted a poll fast and they rigged it to suit their purpose. They know how to do, got to give them credit. Now all the Valid polls will just be compareable and down played. These repigs know the importance of First impressions.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:51 amWhy do people think that the government keeping a database of every phone call made in the country protects them from terrorism?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:51 amThis poll is a joke.
A smart fellow… sez:
Poll: Most Americans Support NSA’s Efforts
By Richard Morin
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, May 12, 2006; 7:00 AM
A majority of Americans initially support a controversial National Security Agency program to collect information on telephone calls made in the United States in an effort to identify and investigate potential terrorist threats, according to a Washington Post-ABC News poll.
…
The article said:
A total of 502 randomly selected adults were interviewed Thursday night for this survey.
Did anyone ask them if they’d “read the news today [i.e., that day]“?
And the poll itself says:
The practical difficulties of doing a survey in a single evening represent other potential sources of error in this or any other overnight poll.
+/- 4%, rather than the more common 3%. The procedural difficulties in finding a random sample on a single night might add more error than just sample size.
29%! Mars, bitches!
May 12th, 2006 at 10:52 amThanks for the laugh RayinGA – a trailer AND a plasma screen TV? I’ll alert John Waters, you’re perfect for a Pink Flamingos remake. Any chance you’re driving a ‘57 Caddy?
May 12th, 2006 at 10:55 amNSA Point/Counter Point (RT = Republican Tool, TI = Thinking Individual)
RT – I don’t care if the government s monitoring my calls – If you are not doing any thing wrong you have nothing to worry about.
TI – It is not you who decides if you are doing anything wrong. According to the patriot act our government can arrest you, spirit you off to a foreign prison, never charge you, never give you a day in court, and never release you. Would you care if Clinton had these unchecked powers?
RT – They are not listening to the calls of Americans.
TI – How do you know? If there is no judicial oversight – who is to say that they are not? And if not your calls – who is to say that they are not listening in on political opponents. Again, would you feel comfortable if it were Clinton who had these unchecked powers?
RT – Talking about secret surveillance programs aids the terrorists.
TI – How? How does the terrorists knowing that there calls are now being monitored without warrants – as opposed to the old way with warrants – give the them any advantage or aid what so ever? In fact – if the government ever prosecutes a would be terrorist – the information that they collected without a warrant may be thrown out in court… this would truly aid the terrorists.
RT – Talking about secret surveillance programs hurts America.
TI – Not talking about these programs hurts America. When we allow the president to break the law and erode our civil liberties under the guise of protecting America – this hurts America.
May 12th, 2006 at 10:58 amA total of 502 randomly selected adults were interviewed Thursday night for this survey. Margin of sampling error is five percentage points for the overall results. The practical difficulties of doing a survey in a single night represents another potential source of error.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:04 amWait a minute. Recent polls consistently show the majority believe that the nation is on the wrong track, and Bush is doing a poor job handling terrorism. His job approval rating and personal approval rating is in the dumps. The word most people associate with Bush is ‘incompetent’.
Yet, the majority of our population is okay with Bush listening in on our phone calls? There definitely is a disconnect here.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:04 amBUSTED!
I’ve been busted. I’m really from NYC, playing devil’s advocate. Go to video.google.com and look up “Loose Change” 2nd Ed.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:05 amThe SIGINT programs are valuable, its the politicians, who have become nothing but Elitist Kapitalists, will USE and ABUSE this data for Poltical and Capital Gains.
And they Have. And its the STICKY fingered corrupt polticians that WE must keep out of the Data Streams. Let the Trained Techs do their Job and keep the Assclowns OUT of the Data.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:06 amThey voted that way because they think that it’s the other guy that was affected, not themselves. Now if Bush can get his rubberstamp Congress to enact a law saying that it’s completely legal and that the courts have no authority over it, then he can have the name of the country changed to the Christian Empire of America!
May 12th, 2006 at 11:07 amUmm We call that Trolling RayfromGa
May 12th, 2006 at 11:08 amthis is as close to fiction as anything I have ever seen. We don’t have to put up with lies if we don’t read the ridiculous pus they write.
anyone that believes this is as stupid as the idiot shrub
May 12th, 2006 at 11:08 amJust tell them Clinton tapped their Phones as well.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:09 amThey will think Differently, very Quickly.
#50 – Ray, we already knew that, the NSA alerted us as to your whereabouts days ago…..
May 12th, 2006 at 11:11 amhttp://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/echelon/echelon_eur_parliament.pdf
Its a little dated as, but contains some Factual Data, Please read this folks, its 194 pages, and requires Adobe acrobat, but you will have a MUCH more informed view.
Not MY View of course, but your own. =)
May 12th, 2006 at 11:13 amABC……your attempt to put out these false numbers….WRONG.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:13 amJust to be clear I don’t belong in that 63%.
I think people just don’t get the seriousness of this situation. Again, the main stream media failed miserably or played good blow hards for these fascist criminals.
One other reason for this 63% could be, that they asked the wrong question. May be the question does not reflect the gravity of the situation.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:14 amI bet the question asked didn’t mention that the domestic spying was illegal.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:14 amTime to take the Dawg for a Walk.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:15 amI have patented a sticker that goes on Fire Hydrants, Simply apply to any Hydrant, and the Dogs will pay homage to Bush’s picture!
#25 – Excellent.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:15 amA more meaningful polling question would be: President Bush claims that it helps prevent terrorist attacks if the government analyzes the records of your telephone calls. Do you believe the President?
May 12th, 2006 at 11:16 ama bit off topic – listening on c-span to some of the 29% at the minuteman project gathering in d.c. … the opposition is very loud in the background…
the moms will be gathering there this weekend – hope they get some coverage… think?
May 12th, 2006 at 11:17 amThe NSA doesn’t care about RayfromGA, but come on now, who gives a rats ass about trailer park trash that swill beer first thing in the morning. of course your sister/wife may not like it, but then again your momma/sister probably didn’t teach you any better. Hey is that your cousin/sister playin’ on “Trailer Park Trash Girls Gone Wild” right now on your plasma? Damn, she looks just like Momma! Wonder why?
May 12th, 2006 at 11:25 am502 people. Let me ask you something here, why 502? I mean, that isn’t a number which divides all that easily into 100, it isn’t a large enough sample to show any sort of a national trend (look, how many states are there in America? This is basically 10 people per state talking for the whole nation of America.)
Further, here is the question the poll seems to be referring to.
That is quoted directly from the Washington posts site. That is a prime example of the sort of shit which shows how reputable the Washington post, isn’t.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:29 amI wish they would ask: do you think that spying on Americans is more important to national security than is securing our ports, guarding our borders, and removing nuclear material from the former soviet union?
I think 0% would say yes… yet we accept a republican administration telling us that they have to do everything possible, including breaking the law, to secure America – yet they don’t do anything about these more imortant issues.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:32 am“Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”
“Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you.”
Both quotes came from Benjamin Franklin over 200 years ago! Could they be any more contemporary?
He also said:
“He that won’t be counseled can’t be helped.”
He must have known Bush personally!
May 12th, 2006 at 11:34 amBen Franklin also said:
Half a truth is often a great lie.
Seems appropriate somehow….
May 12th, 2006 at 11:40 amMay I just say this, in the voice of Gilbert Gottfried, about the 63% who think it’s just peachykeen-a-roony to collect this data on us:
WHAT THE F*CK?
May 12th, 2006 at 11:43 am#68 Zeke – Franklin also said that beer is proof that God loves us and he wants us to be happy… my personal favorite.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:43 amIf these inbreds would take a deep breath and ask themselves a couple of pertinet questions like…
1) If this (NSA domestic spying program) is so above board and straight, why not follow the legal process to do it?
…the criminal Bushite junta and their right wing al Crackkker propagandists’ talking point about the need for secrecy trumping the need to follow the law doesn’t fly…
…if Osama bin Laden and the terrorists don’t/didn’t know their phones were tapped and electronic and telephonic communications monitored by Bushiva’s bunch then…
…why haven’t we captured someone so obviously obtuse?
2) If this NSA domestic spying program is so above board then why all the hemming, hawing, equivocating and explicating. In other words why didn’t Bushiva just own up to it up front?
…the story changed from (in the beginning) just tapping in to the conversations of a few overseas call to known terrorist operatives…
…which if that was the case, why aren’t those KNOWN terrorist operatives (and the people here in america who call them) in custody?
…then it (the story) morphed into all overseas calls…
…and now has become The Largest Database ever assembled…
…TRUST these mofos if you want to, I say they’re definitely up to no good…
…where are the safeguards to prevent them (Big criminal TREASONOUS Brother) from using that database for nefarious purposes in the future?
May 12th, 2006 at 11:44 amI haven’t seen anyone mention this yet – but the reason this poll’s results are so off from what would seem possible might also have to do with who did the poll..
May 12th, 2006 at 11:48 amABC credits the poll to TNS Intersearch Corporation in Pennsylvania. A little digging reveals this:
“TNS is one of the world’s leading market information groups. We provide market measurement, analysis and insight through our global network of operating companies in 70 countries. Working with national and multi-national organizations, we help our clients to develop effective business strategies and enhance relationships with their customers. In July 2003, the group merged with NFO WorldGroup, Inc. Further information on TNS can be found on http://www.tns-global.com.”
TNS Intersearch is a unit of UK-based market research conglomerate Taylor Nelson Sofres.
according to Hoovers “TNS Telecoms, a unit of UK-based market research heavyweight Taylor Nelson Sofres, provides market data and research reports to clients in the telecommunications industry. The company’s primary clients are telecommunications service providers”
So the poll was done by a company whose primary client is telco’s.
not that they would have any interest in scewing a poll about how people feel about telcos …
http://www.hoovers.com/tns-telecoms/–ID__126280–/free-co-factsheet.xhtml
since the questions did not mention anything about required warrants or court orders. the results most definitely would have been different.
“Is collecting phone records acceptable?”
(65% “yes”)
“Would it bother you if there was a record of your phone calls?”
(66% “no”)
always look at the questions they ask before judging the answers.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:50 amPoll seemed somewhat accurate. Sample size a little small. Questions were not as ambiguous as I thought. As with Iraq and Bush we have a nation with lots of sheep. One third is awake, one third is psycho and one third are dumb as shit. Gotta wait for the dumb as shit ones to come around again.
Give me liberty or give me death. Yeah right. Give me Oprah and Brangelina and do what you want.
May 12th, 2006 at 11:52 amHayden, Can you hear me now!?
May 12th, 2006 at 11:52 amComment by AngelofConfusion #73
Thanks Angel,
…A verrry enlightening post indeed…
May 12th, 2006 at 11:57 amThe questions are ALWAYS incomplete! How about asking if the government should be able to tap phones and trace numbers WITH OVERSIGHT, WITHIN the LAW versus should the government be allowed to glean what they want with your information, with no oversight, no limits? Might get a different answer then. IT’s all in how you ask the question.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:03 pmI can’t believe that 36% of the people still complain :)
May 12th, 2006 at 12:04 pmthank you #73
May 12th, 2006 at 12:05 pmWell . . . . if we poll the right amount of the right people, armed robbery is acceptable.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:07 pmAt 29 percent, chuckle-nuts should just resign already.
If these War Pigs hit Iran, it’s time to storm the castle my friends.
Here’s an example.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:07 pmShould you be allowed to take a dump every morning?
I think you would get a 100% positive response.
Should you be allowed to take a dump every morning on your neighbors lawn?
The result should drop to at least 50% with that one.
I do find it strange that when I question polls (as I often do) with some of the same questions asked here, I am called a Neocon, Facist blah blah. I have asked what questions were used, size of sampling data etc and get lambasted about the reliability of polls.
I’d really like to see some of those same people come in here and defend this one.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:10 pmFunny how 502 people represent 64% of all Americans…
Thats how it will be reported now.
My husband checked into the company that conducted the poll – TNS of Horsham, PA. Seems they are affiliated with the Telecom companies – SURPRISE!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/polls/postpoll_nsa_051206.htm
May 12th, 2006 at 12:17 pmTundra –
Here is the poll info:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/polls/postpoll_nsa_051206.htm
May 12th, 2006 at 12:19 pmPeople, 500 respondents to a telephone survey cannot possibly accurately represent what an entire nation of almost 600,000 times that number thinks! I don’t care how you spin the statistics, there is no way in hell that a poll like this could only be off by 4%. Does anyone really think that 500 people called at random who happen to be home for this poll were informed enough about the issues to give intelligent responses? I don’t. Do not believe the results of this poll. If you explain to people what the issues are (and in more depth than the questions did), you would find far less support for this illegal government intrusion into our lives (IMHO). I notice the questions didn’t explain that this program was done without judicial or Congressional oversight, and without warrants being issued by a judge. How many of the 500 people polled understood that? To how many would it have made a difference? No, I do not accept the validity of this poll or its results.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:28 pmIt’s great to know that popular opinion can trump federal law… as if laws can be bypassed if more than half the country don’t mind.
That will come in handy in decriminalizing marijuana use and allowing soldiers to pack up and come home whenever they choose to.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:31 pmNo surprise that this ridiculous poll came from the Washington Post. After all, they gave us Deborah Howell and Bob (traitor) Woodward and Richard Cohen. What more can we say?
May 12th, 2006 at 12:38 pmThere’s a very good possibility that many of the 502 (JUST 502) people they asked didn’t know what the NSA is or what it does. I was trying to talk about this subject at work yesterday and nobody knew what I was talking about.
These are many of the same people who don’t have skills in English sufficient to understand the average daily newspaper op-ed.
This is why polling sometimes doesn’t work.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:39 pmtoo much, I tell you, too much. Why is no one talking about the fact that the repukes shot down my senators attempts (I’m from Washington State), to have EVERY SINGLE CONTAINER COMING BY FREIGHTER CHECKED BEFORE THEY REACH OUR US PORTS?
this is just absolute crap – everything about the repukes – EVERYTHING!
May 12th, 2006 at 12:41 pmI can’t believe that 36% of the people still complain :)
Maybe Halliburton is behind schedule building the internment camps, which may be larger than previously estimated?
May 12th, 2006 at 12:43 pmThat is the question the poll was referring to. It was a leading question, the answer is therefore meaningless.
What it should have asked is this:
44: Do you think that the government should have the right to tap the phones of US citizens, without a warrant?
May 12th, 2006 at 12:45 pmwell, here’s the poll from the Seattle PI, and how they framed the question….
Was Qwest, the regional phone company serving much of Western Washington, right to refuse to turn over customer phone records rountinely to the National Security Agency?
85.5%
Yes
14.5%
No
Total Votes: 1838
May 12th, 2006 at 12:45 pm#89 That’s true. After all, the mainstream media are very manipulative that way.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:46 pmBesides 502 people hardly represents the opinions of nearly 300 million people living here. Why must the media try very hard to think that being stupid about politics is okay? They have should be ashamed of themselves.
My comment #90 – is for all the trolls who seem to think they have our best interest at heart.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:48 pm#93 Now that’s a real poll. And with real opinions.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:49 pmSomething stinks here…..CNN site poll reveals only 23% favor Government spying.
77% are against collection of phone information.
.
May 12th, 2006 at 12:51 pmAnother thought – even if we assume the 502 were randomly selected from a nationwide pool and ignore the fact that the pollers work for telco’s, there’s another problem with this.
Someone on another board just had this to say:
“There is no such thing as a random telephone poll.
Here’s a statistic for you, 100% of people polled by telephone said they were ‘willing to participate in telephone polls’!
This is especially relevant here, since those that value their privacy are less likely to participate in telephone polls.”
On top of that, the only people who have the time and desire to sit there and talk to unsolicited phone callers are insane.
How many people can you easily imagine telling unsolicited phone callers to piss off, or saying they just don’t have time to talk to this unscheduled caller? A lot, I’m guessing. People who have nothing better to do or even weirder yet enjoy taking polls are not an accurate representation of the general population.
May 12th, 2006 at 1:01 pmThe poll from the Washington Post suggests that the President Bush may be winning a double victory with his illegal NSA domestic surveillance programs. Americans seem willing to buy the White House’s “tough on terrorism” hype at the expense of the law and their own civil liberties. And as an added ironic bonus, the President gets another opportunity to decry leaks that supposedly jeopardize national security.
For the dismal details, see:
May 12th, 2006 at 1:08 pm“Poll: Double Win for Bush on NSA Phone Records”
So the Phone Companies have been at it for a While, at least since 1976.
May 12th, 2006 at 1:28 pmWell Well, thats a fine ‘How do you do’
Nothing to do with Terrorism at all.
No guys you got it all wrong!
According to the Pole not the Poll.
May 12th, 2006 at 1:48 pm63%: Percentage of the Republican who agree to slip a single in a thong!
haha now everyone is a polling expert.
“this cant be right”
“the wording was loaded”
“the sample is too small”
take a second to listen to yourselves! lord knows that any time a poll comes out showing ever-lower bush approval ratings, there is no mention of small samples, or flawed methodology, etc.
yall are just as bad as the fox news viewers who only accept what is in line with their preconceptions.
i hope everyone here keep banking on generic ballot polling. the day after the election in november you can all sit around sucking each others thumbs, asking “what happened? but the polls said…? the polls….?”
May 12th, 2006 at 2:09 pm#98 AngelofConfusion,
Thank you. Well put. You have to be suspicious of a poll where the respondents had nothing else to do and were “available” to take the poll. They didn’t take into account the nature and personality of people willing to answer questions like this versus those of us who reject the accuracy of telephone polling in the first place. So what their results should say is, “X-percent of people willing to believe in polls say…”
May 12th, 2006 at 2:12 pmAt least 68% of the country who disapprove of Bush should care about the NSA tapping your phones.
“…They took various high quality recordings of generals and experimented with creating fake statements. One of the most memorable is Colin Powell stating “I am being treated well by my captors.â€
By taking just a 10-minute digital recording of [anyone’s] voice, scientist George Papcun is able, in near real time, to clone speech patterns and develop an accurate facsimile. A [US General] was so impressed, he asked for a copy of the tape.
How about Bush targeting and labeling you as an “enemy combatant� Hauled off to Gitmo, no lawyer, no trial. How? with this technology, anyone could “morph†your voice and record a phone call of you saying you want to assassinate the president or were plotting a terrorist attack.
May 12th, 2006 at 2:40 pmA popularity poll regarding legality is worth about the same as a steaming sack of horse muffins. At the end of the day, the law is the law.
The reason simplists (neo-conservative populists) are displeased the constitution is because it guarantees rights to people even when recognizing those rights is politically unpopular.
For example, Native Americans make up about 1% of all Americans. You could probably craft a poll to ask whether all reservations should be abolished and get a majority of people to approve it – because only 1% of the country would be affected, and the other 99% could be sold on the idea if the price was high enough.
More to the point, if we moved based on popularity polls Bush would already be out of the White House (29% approval).
So don’t be a simplist – be a realist. No matter how popular an idea is, it might still be a bad idea. Facts, logistics, resources and consequences are all things that should be considered before an idea is posed, not after we already screwed up the logistics, ran out of resources, got our facts wrong, and now face the consequences.
May 12th, 2006 at 2:42 pmChase, the questions about (dis)approval of the President and Congress are pretty standard stuff. There is very little question of what they mean. But this question? Totally unfair. Totally manipulative, and paid for by the telecom companies! If fact the very company that performed the “poll” is owned by a telecom company.
May 12th, 2006 at 2:58 pm‘Scuse us for wondering WTF ? The news broke yesterday and there they were, ready with the “poll” results immediately, a poll based on a question that ignores the illegality of the matter. Doesn’t that set alarms off for you?
What part of the US did they survey? Dumfuc*istan? What’s strange is that with such a large database, it will take an enormous amount of time to find terrorists. Even with sophisticated filtering programs, that’s still a lot of data to peruse. The terrorists most likely speak in code so using key words won’t make a significant difference. By the time the NSA figures out that there is a terrorist message, the terrorist will have ditched the prepaid cell phone and the terrorist act will be in place. These 63% are fools if the believe that they are safer with Bush’s spy program.
May 12th, 2006 at 3:49 pmA poll of 502 people out of the total population is not statistically significant. If you polled 502 people who live in central PA, Rick Sanitorium would win the election, hands down. Poll 502 people that live in either the Pittsburgh or Phila area, and it will be Kick out Rick in 06.
May 12th, 2006 at 3:53 pm63% of the 29% who still like this buffoon?
May 12th, 2006 at 4:36 pmOK folks…help me out here. Read on dailykos yesterday that Sprint was involved in turning over phone records to the NSA. Sent a note to Sprint with this question, and got a reply, posted below.
Can anybody here give me a link to any proof that Sprint is involved?
Here is Sprint’s reply in all its outsourced glory (check the grammar):
Thank you for contacting Sprint together with Nextel. I will be happy to assist you regarding the sharing the call records.
We do not have such type of sharing the call records. Sprint Nextel has a strong history of protecting our customers’ privacy. For details on Sprint Nextel’s Privacy Policy, please visit our website at http://www.sprint.com/legal/privacy.html.
I was in customer service for over 13 years and as such I question companies’ knowledge vs. that of the public. Remember about 13 years ago when Sears shut down their catalog business? I was one of your helpful representatives taking orders on the phone. We found out about the company’s decision from customers about a day before the company bothered to officially inform us.
Thanks…
May 12th, 2006 at 5:59 pmVerizon, AT&T, and Sprint stocks all down today.
Obviously those who trade disagree with this poll.
Hit em where it hurts, boycot all nazi companies!
May 12th, 2006 at 7:19 pmThere are countless problems with this poll, not to mention it was taken before this scandal broke.
Wait for another poll to contradict this one in a matter of days, especially when this is all over every newspaper and every TV news program, and after everyone becomes aware that this is a scandal even the Bush Republicans can get behind and criticize.
May 12th, 2006 at 7:22 pmThis is it. I think I know who these 29% that support George W Bullshit are. I stumbled across this thread by fluke. Take a look.
http://forums.espn.go.com/espn/thread?forumID=736&threadID=3664772&lastPostID=23378560
May 13th, 2006 at 2:42 amAmeriKans are retards. They deserve to live in this fascist AmeriKa. Mindless idiots.
May 13th, 2006 at 6:45 amA few questions…
1. Should the government be trying to find terrorists in the United States and abroad who are working to destroy our country?
2. If yes, how should our government best go about that?
3. Why do liberals not help provide solutions to any big problem ever?
Here’s what I read when I visit liberal web sites. Our President is a loser, our government is corrupt, big businesses are ruining the fabric of our society. But the funny thing is, in dealing with government, liberals are quick to criticize, but seldom provide solutions to the actual problems government is attempting to solve. So you think the phone records thing is illegal. What should the government do legally to track terrorist activity in a timely and effective manner?
Answering that question is too difficult, so we just call the President names and focus on ficticious “huge” problems in our society like global warming. I hear about Think Progress quite a bit on the radio, so I come here and this is what I get. Come on!
May 13th, 2006 at 6:47 amAbsolutely. Lets start with the people who already attacked us first. Talk Osama, Ayaman Al-Jawahiri, Mullah Muhummad Omar to begin with. Liberals say, let get these MoFos first. When you break the leadership you break the back of al-quaeda.
If you find the above mentioned names, terms vage and don’t seem to strike you beautiful mind, try to remember 9-11.
On 9-12 the whole world was behind us. If and only if dumbya used that potential to get together with some top nations and formed some kind of an anti-terror alliance, that would have been a good first step at being proactive. Instead, he invaded iraq with a series of lies. All these other major world powers knew that Colin was BSing in the National Security Council. So, they backed off and did not go with us on iraq. Iraq’s mess, and this administration’s attitude is irked the entire muslim middle east. When you piss a lot of people, a 5 yr old will tell you, they are bound to hate you and might do something to harm you. Liberals say make friends not enemies.
There are countries that deal with terrorism on a daily basis, like Isreal, India etc they don’t spy on their own people. But, nazis did.
Foxnews don’t ever cover anything that is considered news. So you don’t see any liberal solutions. Try reading a news paper or if you have a TV watch C-Span(Not ESPN).
I am sure a plenty of people have already told you all these, but I know that you are a slave to your master. I gave it a shot anyway.
May 13th, 2006 at 7:43 am1. Should the government be trying to find terrorists in the United States and abroad who are working to destroy our country?
Absolutely. Lets start with the people who already attacked us first. Talk Osama, Ayaman Al-Jawahiri, Mullah Muhummad Omar to begin with. Liberals say, let get these MoFos first. When you break the leadership you break the back of al-quaeda.
If you find the above mentioned names, terms vague and don’t seem to strike your beautiful mind, try to remember 9-11.
On 9-12 the whole world was behind us. If and only if dumbya used that potential to get together with some top nations and formed some kind of an anti-terror alliance, that would have been a good first step at being proactive. Instead, he invaded iraq with a series of lies. All these other major world powers knew that Colin was BSing in the National Security Council. So, they backed off and did not go with us on iraq. Iraq’s mess, and this administration’s attitude is irked the entire muslim middle east. When you piss a lot of people, a 5 yr old will tell you, they are bound to hate you and might do something to harm you. Liberals say make friends not enemies.
There are countries that deal with terrorism on a daily basis, like Isreal, India etc they don’t spy on their own people. But, nazis did.
Why do liberals not help provide solutions to any big problem ever?
Foxnews don’t ever cover anything that is considered news. So you don’t see any liberal solutions. Try reading a news paper or if you have a TV watch C-Span(Not ESPN).
I am sure a plenty of people have already told you all these, and I know that you are a slave to your master. I gave it a shot anyway.
May 13th, 2006 at 7:46 amThis whole domestic spying thing is nothing but a crock of shit. Consider for a moment the logistic impossibilty of the medias wild claims—If you got 200 million people talking 30 minutes a day, what you have is six billion talk minutes or 100 million talk hours. Let’s say businesses use the phone two hours a day. A hundred thousand businesses, another 12 million talk minutes or 200,000 talk hours, now we’re at 100,200,000 talk hours per day. Per day. It would take 4,175,000 people at 24 hours a day to listen in on all of that, and that’s probably a low number. I’m suprised the mainstream media isn’t running stories about how Bush lowered the unemployment rate by hiring 4 million people to listen in on their own phone calls.
May 13th, 2006 at 9:40 amRight on.
This whole charade of listening to Al-Quaeda is such a BS. Such a waste of time. If this is really for listening to terrorists, it means that the Al-Quaeda have won hands down on war on terror. Bush and America is so scared that people had to be spied upon. They have so terrorized us. IF Bush is bringing the fight to them by fighting over them in IRAQ. Why the hell is he worried about. Why is is fighting us here. It is clear that by his own admission Bush is a miserable failure. Well. he’s been a loser all his life. Nothing new for him. But, we have been Winners damn it. He is taking us to new lows. We are losing our freedom to the terrorists (I am being nice to Bush here). They are winning.
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