Rep. King Designs Electrified Fence For Southern Border: ‘We Do This With Livestock All The Time’
Rep. King Designs Electrified Fence For Southern Border: ‘We Do This With Livestock All The Time’
Rep. Steve King (R-IA) went on the House floor on Tuesday to discuss a fence that he “designed” for the southern boarder. (King constructed a model of the fence as he was speaking.) King’s design features a wire electrified “with the kind of current that would not kill somebody.” King noted that “we do this with livestock all the time.” Watch it:
Transcript:
KING: So when I get down there and sit on that border, what I do is I come to this conclusion, we can’t shut that off unless we build a fence and a wall. I want to put the fence in, but I want to put a wall in, and I designed one. And this just simply is the desert floor – put a trench in that desert floor. We have the ability to put together a machine that would be a slip form machine that would lay a footing about like this, Mr. Speaker.
And if I give you a look at the end of that, that’s so you’d have that about five feet deep underneath the ground. It’d keep the wall from tipping over. We’d pour a notch in it that’ll allow us to put pre-cast panels in. And it would sit, it would look like this, and this would be flush with the desert floor. And then you’d bring in pre-cast concrete walls – ten fee wide, thirteen and a half feet tall. It’d construct itself to be a twelve foot finished wall, just like that, Mr. Speaker. Drop these panels in together, in this fashion. Just take a crane and drop them in. Our little construction company could build a mile a day of this pretty easily, once you’ve got your system going. The whole two thousand miles are not going to work that way, but a lot of it will work this way, Mr. Speaker.
And so to just wrap up this construction, this’d be an example, then, of how that wall would look. Now you could also deconstruct it the same way. You could take it back down. If somehow they got their economy working and got their laws working in Mexico we could pull this back out just as easy as we could put it in. We could open it up again or we could open it up and let livestock run through there, whatever we choose.
I also say we need to do a few other things on top of that wall, and one of them being to put a little bit of wire on top here to provide a disincentive for people to climb over the top or put a ladder there. We could also electrify this wire with the kind of current that would not kill somebody, but it would simply be a discouragement for them to be fooling around with it. We do that with livestock all the time.
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Are we going to have landmines and machine gun bunkers as well ?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:04 pmAbsolutely Bill. It wouldn’t be a Wall without them.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:09 pmWe do that with livestock all the time.
WTF? These are PEOPLE you are talking about here a**wipe. Talk about compassionate conservatism!!!
July 13th, 2006 at 1:09 pmThis sad demonstration in on par with the Rep. from Oklahoma(?) who showed the proud family tree free of gays, and criminals, and different-colored people, and divorced people, and people who think differently. It serves as another reminder that Republicans are out of touch with America. We are going to pay for a fence when we are spending $10 billion a month in Iraq?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:10 pmfor some reason..i approve of this.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:11 pmKing noted that “we do this with livestock all the time.â€
Well done, Steve. I can’t wait to see what John Stewart, Stephen Colbert, and Keith Olbermann make of that one.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:11 pmWe do that with livestock all the time.
Considering what else he does with livestock all the time, I would imagine his romantic advances toward illegals would be far more of a deterent than his fence…
July 13th, 2006 at 1:12 pmComment by unbelievable — July 13, 2006 @ 1:12 pm
Bad, bad visual!!!
July 13th, 2006 at 1:13 pmLet’s build a wall to keep people out – no wait, let’s build a wall to keep Americans in! When Conservatism idealogy is done destroying America who’s gonna want to stay?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:13 pm#3 Jules, that is Compassionate, normally when the neo-cons don’t like you they bomb you, or invade your country.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:14 pmYou’re kidding aren’t you? Equating people to livestock?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:14 pmThe trouble with ‘non-lethal’ voltage is that it’s not going to be much of a deterrent to people truly desperate to get into this country (or get others in for profit).
It’s not going to stop truly determined people, so the Border Patrol will keep ramping up the voltage until a ‘non-lethal’ voltage becomes a voltage that is still non-lethal…to adults, but manages to kill the infant son or daughter of a poor Mexican couple or single mother that are looking to escape the horrors of a Mexico under the rule of the BushCo-installed Calderón.
That’ll make for some great P.R., won’t it?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:16 pmBad, bad visual!!!
Comment by jules — July 13, 2006 @ 1:13 pm
Sorry, I couldn’t resist. I mean he can’t be a handsome fellow since TP left his entire head out of the photo :).
July 13th, 2006 at 1:16 pm(…) discuss a fence that he “designed†for the southern boarder.
Not to nitpick, but it should read “border”.
“We Do This With Livestock All The Time”
What a poor choice of words. Or maybe that’s what he actually thinks of people South of the border.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:17 pmI dunno. I looked at that fence and thought, “WTF. how’s that supposed to stop anybody? Why they’ll barely need to lift their feet to step over it.”
July 13th, 2006 at 1:17 pmWTF does some redneck moron from IA know about the southern boarder
July 13th, 2006 at 1:18 pmYou’re kidding aren’t you? Equating people to livestock?
Comment by Christ was a liberal — July 13, 2006 @ 1:14 pm
Well, in a humane world, we wouldn’t treat any life form with that level of callous disregard…
July 13th, 2006 at 1:19 pmmoron “boarder” == border hahaha
July 13th, 2006 at 1:19 pmLike Pink Floyd Said…. All in all it’ss just another brick in the wall.
John Stewart is gonna have a field day with this one!
July 13th, 2006 at 1:19 pmHe sounds like he’s presenting a personal business proposal. Another no-bid Republican fiasco?
What’s with the “our company” could build a mile-a-day shpiel???
Suggestion for a political ad:
1) Camera pans into King’s demo on C-SPAN.
2) Announcer: “Steve King: Would you buy a fence from this man?”
3) Graphic comes up on screen: The GOP, where good fences make…….
What a wanker.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:20 pmWhat types of fences would liberals support? Here are some suggestions:
1. Invisible (current model)
2. One with a robotic hand that would gently place the “guest” worker back on the Mexican side.
3. One with a voting registration booth every 100 yards so they could increase their dwindling base.
4. One with brochures on how to get free health care, avoid border patrols and live off the United States government.
Border security is an issue that 80% of Americans support. You’d think everyone here would know that since you always appear to know what the pulse of the country is at any given point in time.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:20 pmI have a proposal. Since the people who want this wall built are often the same people who complain about wasting taxpayer dollars on worthless projects, I suggest that they go down to the border with shovels and wheelbarrows and build it themselves.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:20 pmHe also said they could put up the concrete walls at a pace of about “a mile a day.”
That’s about a 5 1/2-year plan for those of you who are mathematically challenged. The Republican plan: start building a wall that will be done only when we’re all out of office.
Let’s make sure to kick out the ones we can folks.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:20 pmApparently Rep. King is unaware of the fact that the Mexican “animals” have evolved to such an extent that they can now actually operate even highly complex tools such as wire-cutters.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:21 pmBorder security is an issue that 80% of Americans support.-Randy
Do 80% of them also support building a fence like this. I don’t think so.
I suppose you think we should also secure our other borders, no? We going to build a fence around the whole country? I think that’s Pat Buchanan’s wet dream.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:23 pm#20: I suspect most liberals know where they stand on the issue. But thank you so much for your attempt to define their position for them. It was very helpful.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:23 pmRandy,
I hate to rain on your parade (not really), but a ‘fence’ isn’t the only option for dealing with border security.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:24 pmwhat a waste of taxpayer dollars. this is just another do-nothing idea that people will find a way to undermine.
this guys should be talking about ENFORCING the LAWS on the books and fining employers who hire illegal workers.
every time there is republican leaderhship in this country illegal immigration goes UP, and enforcement goes DOWN.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:25 pmThe Pentagon Global Climate Change Report – which everyone can google and find suggests: —- Build a WALL BETWEEN USA & MEXICO to keep people out due to drastic climatic changes due to Global Warming.WHAT HAPPENED TO TRUTH? With truth – we can anticipate and fix problems. Guess the only interest the thugs in power today have is to — take care of themselves – the rest of the world be damned.
Try reading John Dean’s book “Conservatives Without Conscience” - we are in trouble folks. WE THE PEOPLE must learn to fight back – educate ourselves and others about our FASCIST leanings… now while we can.
“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man’s oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.”
July 13th, 2006 at 1:26 pmJohn Kenneth Galbraith.
Although some may disagree, I do consciously refrain from using inflammatory or derogatory language. However, are you Americans all batsh*t crazy?
Now, I have never claimed to be of superior intelligence and would never be so arrogant to harbor such a belief internally. With that said, you all do realize that “fences” and “walls”, regardless of design or construction, provide two services equally: 1) Keeping things out, and 2) KEEPING THINGS IN!
You should not be joking about this subject in the least. If you are not running out into the street and screaming at the top of your lungs in opposition to the insane proposition of building a border wall, then you will be as complicit in the process of your own incarceration as if you put hammer to nail yourself.
I am aghast at your complacency and deeply disturbed by your indifference.
Meanwhile, Israel, your bestest friend in the whole gosh darn world, just killed dozens more innocent CHILDREN, WOMEN, and MEN in “retaliation” for the alleged kidnapping of TWO (that’s one more than ONE) of its soldiers who were most likely in the act of killing innocent civilians. And for those who would have the audacity to label me “anti-Semite”, let me address that proactively by pointing out that this action is in contradiction to the Mosaic law of an “eye for an eye”.
What the hell is going on with you Americans?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:26 pmAt an historic meeting between the War-Time President and Osama bin Laden in the Arabian Desert, a bedouin presented the two with a gift of a magic lamp.
The Genie hoping to aspire peace between the two allowed but one wish each.
“I want an impenatrable wall 1,000 feet high completely surrounding the United States of America to protect all Americans from terrorists.” said the War-Time President is his adopted Texas accent.
“Done.” the Genie said and turned to bin Laden. “And your wish?”
Osama paused a moment, then looked at the Genie with a twinkle in his eye and said, “Fill it with water.”
July 13th, 2006 at 1:26 pmI’m sure most Republicans would’t understand why this is outrageous – for one simple reason: we’re talking about “those people”. They literally have to view this as happening to white people for them to be outraged. It’s the same reason they view Iraq as “staying the course” instead of the wanton slaughter of men, women, children, and babies.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:27 pmliberals havve been trying to increase border security ever since Bush/Cheney took office, and conservatives have voted their proposals down every single time… any conservatives want to tell us why?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:27 pmAmazing…it just snaps together like that, eh? What a grand idea. Couldn’t spend any of that money on public schools or hospitals or bombs we need to fight whoever we’re gonna invade next. And on WHO’S SIDE OF THE RIO GRANDE will this be placed?…we gonna take even more of Mexico for this project or put it on our side of the river? I’m thinking that the nice sight of a 13.5 foot wall is probably not nearly as pretty as a river..but hey, what do I know…I’m a stinkin liberal who obviously has no clue as to what is good for the country. God bless King Bush and Repugs…(I sure have a tough time thinking this is the way Jesus would solve the problem, though – and isn’t that what the neo cons are supposed to be asking themselves – WWJD?)
July 13th, 2006 at 1:28 pm…
Is this a “Compassionate” conservative??
I’m glad for displays like this: It shows people what they really are…
July 13th, 2006 at 1:29 pmAs a liberal I desperiately want to be able to keep our social programs others have worked so hard to get. The massive new additions can damage this.
I suppose those who do not want an orderly process for entering this country are the same ones who never lock their homes or take the keys out of their car. It is an open country isn’t it?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:30 pmIt’s like Jurassic Park! Only… Illegal Immigrant Park! Then again… if the fence is on the border… than what is contained behind the fence (from our stand point) would just be Mexico. In which case they would not be illegal immigrants. So…. call it Mexico Park? Ooh.. we could take gas guzzling SUVs along a track to visit. I wonder how many Mexicans would take the goat for good and then spit up a leg on our sunroof? Or for that matter how many of them will try to flip out car over, or run down the outhouse.
Does this sound a little far fetched? Well… so does the electrical fence.
California already has enough power outages. This big-ass fence won’t help matters.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:30 pmWhy do I get the feeling that John Stewart and TDS are going to have a field day with this clip.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:30 pmCompassionate Conservative – an oxymoron if I ever heard one.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:31 pmApparently, Ronald “America’s Greatest Hero” Reagan called for East Germany to tear down its wall so that America could build its own.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:31 pmWhat’s next?
Branding the immigrants we want to keep?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:37 pmI like the idea. Seriously.
King’s a Hellbound Christian, though.
Which reminds me-should Homeland Security be publishing lists of national assets?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:37 pm#29: In response to your question, no, we Americans are not all crazy. Some of us are, but not all. Please refrain from painting us all with the same brush. We are not all xenophobic sociopaths. Many of us want sane immigration policies, many of us like our Mexican neighbors and do not fear them, and many of us want the government simply to enfoce laws that are already on the books (such as those that outlaw hiring illegal workers). And many of us are actively trying to do something about it. Remember, though, that we are not the ones who hold power.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:40 pmGreat plan for ‘cows’ who don’t know how to dig a tunnel…
July 13th, 2006 at 1:41 pmDid the fine fence builder from IA discuss the cost of this? Where will the electricity come from? And who will he get to work long hours in the hot sun to install this? hmmmmmm.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:44 pm- newnameacquired:
Scene from the critically acclaimed “Illegal Immigrant Park”:
———————————
RUMSFELD
Whoa, whoa, whoa, what the hell, what the hell?
BUSH
What now?
RUMSFELD
Fences are failing, all over the nation! A few minor systems, he said!
BUSH
(to Condi, pissed)
Find Rove! Check the vending machines!
RUMSFELD
The monitors are failing.
Condi heads for the door just as all the video monitors in the
control room go out with a faint electronic ZIP.
The three of them freeze for a moment, looking at each other.
The tension in the room goes up a notch.
BUSH
(to Rumsfeld)
Use Rove’s terminal. Get it all back on. He can de-bug later.
RUMSFELD
God, look at this workstation.
CONDI
The Mexican fences aren’t out, are they?
RUMSFELD
(checks)
No, they’re still on.
BUSH
Why the hell would he turn the others off?!
————————————-
(coming soon to a fascist dictatorship near you!)
July 13th, 2006 at 1:44 pmI agree with ironchef.
As long as th Neocons believe this:
“We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality,”
We absolutely have to close the borders.
It is actually quite terrifying that the Neocons have left it open for so long.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:45 pmConservative science fair: in this booth, the border fence. In the next, the watermelon which was shot by a congressman to “prove” that Vince Foster was murdered.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:48 pmLet me ask you pro-cattle-fence people a question…
Why don’t we have problems with Canadian illegals? Why aren’t Canadans crossing the borders in droves to “steal” our jobs and “milk” our social programs?
Answer that correctly and you’ll see that the solution to our problem is not a fence.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:49 pmi love how these republicans from NON-border states have all the crazy ideas for what to do about immigration.
it’s the same people who have NOTHING to fear when it comes to terrorism in their states -dictating what homleand security should be for the states with REAL threats.
all us people in TARGET states voted against Bush & Chenye because we know they have no clue how to stop terrorism.
same with these middle-america politicians who think they know how to deal with the border. You have to listen to the people in those border states if you want to get it right… they have been dealing with the problem for generations and they know what works and what doesn’t.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:50 pmThis guy would have been a hit in Stalinist Russia; unfortunately, he’s HERE!! He, and people like him, would also absolutely have no problem locking up U.S. citizens in those detention facilities Haliburton has received contracts to build (for immigration control purposes and other (unnamed) programs. When Bush looked into Putin’s eyes and “saw his soul,” he recognized a fellow traveler. WE Americans need to recognize the path these people are travelling on, if we intend to maintain our democracy and our liberty.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:50 pmUnzueta described the shaft as technically advanced, with electricity, a ventilation system, pumps to remove groundwater, cement flooring for traction in steep areas, and wood roofing to bolster the walls and ceiling. It had a clearance, he said, of nearly six feet and was about five feet wide.
At 2,400 feet, the tunnel is the longest and most sophisticated of the 21 underground passageways linking the United States and Mexico that have been discovered since the Sept. 11, 2001
July 13th, 2006 at 1:51 pmIt is time to get this guy out of office. Between “Iraq is safer than DC,” his Helen Thomas bashing comments, and the many, many other bizarre comments…this guy needs to go. He isn’t based in reality and sees no problem with wasting time with useless solutions that will take years to implement.
Give some love to his Democratic challenger this fall–Joyce Schulte.
Iowa deserves better and so do the rest of us.
http://www.schulteforcongress.com
also check out blogging all things Schulte at: http://schulteforchange.blogspot.com
July 13th, 2006 at 1:52 pm#42-Jim,
Did you sleep through your civics classes. Have you ever read your Constitution? Here are the cliff notes for the educationally impaired:
US Government is OF, FOR, and BY the people. Elected REPRESENTATIVES (please, look up “representative” in the dictionary) act on BEHALF of their constituents (also, look up “constituents”). Therefore, the ultimate responsibility for the actions of their government, and where the Constitution ensures where the POWER lay, is with the CITIZENS OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
So, do not tell me you don’t have the power. In doing so all that you are saying is that you CHOOSE not to exercise it. What the hell is wrong with you?
July 13th, 2006 at 1:54 pm#45
from my office window, I can see a bunch of guys who would work in the sun to build a fence. It’s why they stand in the parking lot of a 7-11 all day, so they can maybe make some money.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:54 pmunbelievable,
King acurately associates mammals when he talks of cattle.
Both borders need to be closed.
What should really be bothering you is Israel is dragging Iran into the war that is about to break out in the Middle East.
The war that TP will not discuss.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:54 pmSee, I don’t see how anyone can take these types of people seriously. A giant wall, spanning the entire us-mexico border, or at least a greater portion of it. Rather than try to legalize the people and get money from them, you’re going to waste more money to keep them out. Frankly, all these ideas are knee jerk reactions to the problem and offer no real solution.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:55 pmThis guy is no rancher . The electric fence can be shorted an cut . He thinks the electorate can be treated like cows . He is full of Bull . New york repubs better look elsewhere for common sense . The reading of Thomas Paine would be a good beginning.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:56 pmConstitution ensures where the POWER lay, is with the CITIZENS OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
Humanist
On a national level it is simply called GREED AND MONEY, and on the global level it is the WORLD BANK.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:56 pmSlave were treated worse then livestock. I guess the old forms of hatred are back. The United States speaks democracy but acts live the KKK. At lease all the evil people are now stepping forward and speaking out. Soon Americans will turn on Americans as the Bush hate policy continues. Just watch out for the Saudi’s because they are people of color so when Tony Snow, Chris Matthews and Bill O’Reilly use their racist talk the Saudi’s will know what the Branches of government and Bush Administration really think of them too. One bad apple to destroying so many others that bad apple is Bush. Look at the world today hatred and government stealing. If Sen. King wants to kill the immigrants who will do their work or is he bringing back Slavery to full those jobs.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:57 pmWhat a monumental waste of money a border fence would be.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:57 pm#47-ironchef,
To ignore me is to ignore the truth. Which, as it is, probably explains your monumental ignorance.
Oh, and if you have a question for me, feel free to ask and I will (and always) respond. Your insinuation that I do not respond to questions is disingenuous and maliciously false.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:58 pm60. And what I meant by that is those who have the most have the control. Period.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:58 pmThat fence is a great idea..
but it should also be tank proof, with a nice no-man’s land (don’t forget the raked gravel, and land mines) between 2 electrified fences, oh.. and a lot of gun towers. I know it will be expensive but don’t worry, it can be built in phases depending on how totalitarian our leaders become over the next couple of decades.
Ahh, the east German’s would be so proud of us!!
July 13th, 2006 at 1:59 pm#46
building a wall, lol, please. some more pork spending. iwonder if it is under the bill flag burning, gay rights and all that other must have bills. i look at it this way. i do not believe in the theory of ‘the work the americans won’t do’. major cop out folks. i’ll pick beats all day long if they want to pay me descent labor wages. i would NOT except a job anywhere for 5.15/hr. it is called slave labor at it’s finest. and this folks is not just happening around the farming/ranching industry. why hire an american worker for 8/hr when in fact you can get a non-english speaking, illegal immigrant 5.15? no reason. my biggest problem with the illegals is the fact that i have to pay for there room, food, english classes, medical and taxes. if they want to become a member of our society they do it the right way. all the government needs to do is ENFORCE the laws. we are enablers.
July 13th, 2006 at 1:59 pmHow does this stop them from tunneling under it. It looks like the tunnel only has to be about 10 ft. deep.
I am all for a wall… as long as it is waterproof, and surrounds New Orleans.
Art in N.O.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:00 pmwhy didnt we just import the one they knocked down in Berlin a few years back
July 13th, 2006 at 2:00 pmOkay, we’ve been experiencing a collective nightmare for six years now, when will it end?
July 13th, 2006 at 2:00 pmGoes to show how dense the bubble congressmen live in is. It wouldn’t be such a problem if conservatives weren’t so blindly loyal. Take a deep breath and a step back; a massive electrified wall 2000 miles long to keep your “melting pot” safe. And ya know walls have been so historically successful, (Berlin and China, those are just exceptions to the rule). Oh, and stop inventing statistics to make the idea sound maintream. If “80%” is a cross-section from your family of 5, keep it to yourself.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:01 pmA well made fence would weed out the riff raff. But I personally think automated heat seeking weapons are the answer.
Yes, I’m serious.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:01 pm#67
is not pertaining to anyone, sorry #46
July 13th, 2006 at 2:02 pmIf we don’t do something at the border things are going to get ugly. What should we do. Shoot people? Let them die of thirst in the desert? Let them rape each other in the desert. Break every American law in the book regarding legal immigration?
A wall is a hell of an idea. It’s cheaper in the long run to maintain and less people get hurt. The people against a wall must support Haitain and Cuban illegal immigration to. Heck, come on in Central America.
If your not for a wall, what kind of border security are you for?
July 13th, 2006 at 2:02 pmbs,
You’re wrong. Border security is essential to national security. To think otherwise is treasonous.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:04 pmI think we should build a moat, yeh and then fill it with salt water and sharks with lasers on their heads, or maybe just electrify the water in the moat, yeh thats the plan…dats the ticket yeh.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:05 pmLush Limppud,
You’re wrong, too.
Everyday, a dirty bomb comes into America.
Everyday, terrorists come into America with the intent of killing Americans.
You make America weak. All Democrats do. They neglect border security while they wage war. It’s fundamentally flawed and fatal.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:08 pmInstead of the Berlin Wall, The Wall Seperating East and West Germany, The Great Wall of China, there will be the southern wall of the U.S.. Tourists can come and visit the greatest folly ever built in the United States. I was going to say the world, but lets not be hubristic. There can be free style wall climbing contests and wall decorating contests.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:08 pmElectrified fence on the border to shock them like cattle if they try to climb over it? Rep. Steve King needs to resign TODAY!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:08 pmI can’t believe you asked that question… but I’ll answer it for you…
You will. HAng on. Don’t be so impatient.
The canadians are educated far more than us, they are employed probably as much as us, if not moreso, and their economy is much more stable, robust, and they report national surplus budgets every year. It is us who flee north, not them fleeing south.
Canada is presently the most educated country in the world. So, yes, they are more educated than we are. But the Canadian dollar doesn’t have the same value as the U.S. dollar. They could make more money if they came here. That’s a motive. Just like in Mexico.
I actually met an archeologist in Utah last year. He was from Canada, doing a bit of hiking. He told me that Canada is currently experiencing what they call a “brain drain” to teh United States. Meaning, the most educated people are leaving Canada for better paying jobs in the U.S. I did a bit of research myself and it seems he’s correct.
So, your supposition about us fleeing north is actually not the case. They are coming here more than we are going there.
Having answered that correctly, the answer is, as the noted representative said “until the mexican governemnt improves…etc, etc†then the WALL CAN COME DOWN!
Actually, you did not answer that correctly. So, you can play again if you’d like…
Or did you stop paying attention because the idea of the wall made you psycho crazy with liberal rage! lol
Comment by ironchef — July 13, 2006 @ 1:53 pm
I didn’t realize I was having a conversation with a fifth grader until you said this. No wonder you got the answer wrong.
My issue is that a fence will not solve the problem, and the millions that will be wasted could have gone to address the real issue. I avoid hate. It’s not good for a long and healthy life. Look what it’s done to Rush Limp-baugh’s weenie…
By the way, the Canadian border with the US is more than twice as long as that of the Mexican-US border.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:08 pmJay Randal,
You’re wrong, too.
You make America weak. All Democrats do. They neglect border security while they wage war. It’s fundamentally flawed and fatal.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:09 pm#77 and it will only cost 1 Milllliiioon dollars ………..ummm no 1 Billiiiiiion dollars and i know just who can build it Halliburton
July 13th, 2006 at 2:09 pmYou’re wrong. Border security is essential to national security. To think otherwise is treasonous.
Border security had nothing to do with 911, they were on student visas remember?
But now that Bush has the whole mideast up in arms we do need to secure our borders, but a fence, unlesss dug deeply, will have no effect, many illegals cross the borders for work, not to terrorize.
many Illegals across the border in trains, cars and trucks,
If you put a fence on the border you will then have to line the entire coastline….duh.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:09 pmKing acurately associates mammals when he talks of cattle.
How terrible enlightened of you.
Both borders need to be closed.
You mean with a fence? Won’t work.
What should really be bothering you is Israel is dragging Iran into the war that is about to break out in the Middle East.
The war that TP will not discuss.
Comment by Destroy the DLC — July 13, 2006 @ 1:54 pm
You mean the war in teh Middle East that George Bush started? That one has plagued me for years now actually.
Perhaps they are doing their research before they comment. Unlike FAUX gnus, TP isn’t interested in Nielsen ratings.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:12 pmI think there are three very easy solutions to solving the Illegal immigration problem.
1. as several people before me have mentioned, fine the corporations and businesses that hire illegals heavily enough to be a deterrant
2. require at least one parent to be a US citizen before granting citizenship to children who are just born here
3. suspend all non-life saving social programs from people who aren’t paying taxes to support them
Easy. Simple. And it will actually help save the social programs without incurring the costs of building an unnecessary wall. If these simple programs were followed and enforced, it would effectively mean that…
a. corporations would be paying such huge fines for hiring illegal workers that they could afford to pay a legal resident of the US a livable wage and provide them with health-care.
b. you’ve passed a law that is deterring people from crossing the boarder just to have children here and therefore qualify them for social programs that are being bankrupted
c. which then leads into saving the money poured into the social programs for the people who have actually paid or helped pay for them. This may sound cruel, but with the deficit at a record high and tax cuts on top of it, these programs will be bankrupt. There’s no question about it really. And some of you may label me as hateful or a cynic, but I believe in helping people here first, before I try saving the rest of the world.
Thanks
July 13th, 2006 at 2:12 pmLush Limppud,
Our borders are neglected. The world knows this.
Border security has been replaced by widespread, illegal spying of all Americans.
When your liberal heart bleeds you make us less safe. Fundamentally flawed.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:13 pm#74 I agree that a wall is a more cost effective way of dealing with Border security and #76 it is essential to national security. My question is then why has over $300 billion been liberally thrown half way around the world and only now the party in power is pushing for this wall. If we would use the same logic that is getting thrown at us for the Star Wars defense system (if we would have put more money into it way back when we wouldn’t have to worry about Ol’ Kim jun il) as our own border security the fingers point squarely at the party in power.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:13 pmbs
You just hit a homerun. Enforce the current laws. But I love the wall to. I would help law enforcement do its job. And your also right on wages to. People would show up to pick anything for a proper wage. Your more conservative than you think!!!!!!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:14 pmThey neglect border security while they wage war. It’s fundamentally flawed and fatal. -DLC
Border security is essential to national security. To think otherwise is treasonous. -DLC
So your calling the bush people treasonous?
Kewl!!!!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:15 pmDestroy the DLC
“Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it†– Adolph Hitler
July 13th, 2006 at 2:17 pmAmerica.
The Bigot Nation.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:17 pmSometimes, the left exaggerates something the right says.
“You’re kidding aren’t you? Equating people to livestock?”
Just because he said that such a fence is already used with livestock is *not* equating people to livestock.
Had he talked about some method of finding and treating illegal immigrants who are in danger crossing the desert from heat with a program that had been used to find and treat lost livestock, it wouldn’t be equating livestock to people, now would it? It was simply a statement supporting the existence of the fence and its ’safe use’.
Don’t exagerrate what the right says – they say enough terrible wrong things that we don’t want to give them the easy rebuttals that we get it wrong in examples like this one.
The left needs to think through its strategy on the illegal immigration issue. What is the right policy? What is politically feasible? It should recognize how the right is ‘having it both ways’, the economic benefits of the cheap labor, including its undermining effect on wages, while doing nothing to help Mexico improve its own economy, and getting political credit with the public for being the party for restricting immigration. They should have to choose one of those benefits, not get all of them at once despite the contradictions.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:17 pmWell, I certainly hate to agree with right winger nuts, but this sounds quite possibly a wall which would work. Israel has used a similar design, without the electricity, to separate themselves and it has been very effective.
I am a moderate, and have been all my life, but I am absolutely disgusted with illegal immigration. The US must be able to sort through who wants to immigrate to this country and have control over it.
NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO COME HERE, JUST BECAUSE THEY WANT TO.
For the cynics, I DON’T CARE IF THEY PUT A CHARGE ON THE TOP OF THAT 13 FOOT FENCE WHICH WOULD KNOCK THE PANTS OFF ANYONE TRYING TO CLIMB OVER, OR KNOCK THEM COMPLETELY BACK OFF IT.
Knowing that it is there and what will happen will be a huge deterrent and few would approach it.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:18 pmThey neglect border security while they wage war. It’s fundamentally flawed and fatal.
Comment by Destroy the DLC — July 13, 2006 @ 2:09 pm
I hate to point out the obvious to you while you’re in the middle of another one of your fearfilled panic attacks about boogeymen, but the Republicans have been in charge for the last 5.5 years and, therefore, it is your side who has done nothing to address border securiity. Dems are not responsible here.
This leads me to believe that border security is NOT a physical problem….
July 13th, 2006 at 2:19 pm#75-ironchef,
Thank you for actually asking questions, to which I respond as follows:
1. I am from Earth, the third planet from the sun, which maintains a breathable atmosphere (at least for the moment). I recognize no border, and I am in servitude to no government, group, or individual.
2. I am a moral being whose beliefs are based upon the respect for life and the free will of all humankind (my beliefs stretch into all life forms but I do not want to exceed your cognitive model). My theological beliefs an matters of faith are my own and are irrelevant to this conversation and to you.
3. What is a “real†American? How many fake ones are you aware of? And, most importantly, what relevance is there? Who is powerless, you? Have you read your Constitution?
4. In regard to me protesting “my†government or affecting change in my own “countryâ€, I refer you back to my answer #1.
Now, your cowardly approach of asking me questions and then telling me not to answer them because you don’t think that you’ll like the answers is asinine. Why do you fear the truth, because it only reveals your moral ineptitude and cowardice? If you are that pathetic then get out of the way so that “real†humans can fix the mess that you are so quick to accept.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:21 pmCraig,
The Democratic “strategy” is to make Mexicans hate Republicans without solving immigration or security.
The “strategy” is to not have or express an opinion on immigration or national security that would drive Mexicans to the Republican voting machine.
It is very simple.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:21 pmWe either need to stop doing things like supporting murderers around the world and spending the same type of money on helping people as we do killing them OR … we need a fence that is manned by robots, electricity fences, flying drones, fire proof aligators in firey moats, etc… Either we get people on our side again or else we will need to be able to stop them from getting their revenge on us…
July 13th, 2006 at 2:21 pmMr. Bush, build up this wall.
-The Ghost of Stalin
July 13th, 2006 at 2:22 pmB. Thornton,
Of course a wall works.
That’s why Republicans and Democrats dismiss it.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:23 pmPost 82 > I am NOT against security on the Mexican border, or even fencing, but NOT an electrified cattle wall to keep out Mexican illegals! The GOP guy equated the poor of Mexico as livestock > means he is racist! I find it odd that Bush helps the pal of the Mexican elite, Calderon, to get into the presidency by fraud, who wants the border wide open so another 10 million desperate poor are forced to cross it, but if Bush had supported Obrador, then he would create jobs in Mexico so the border issue would be resolved?!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:23 pmEither we get people on our side again or else we will need to be able to stop them from getting their revenge on us…
Comment by Gerald Gibson — July 13, 2006 @ 2:21 pm
Pay attention trolls – this is a HUGE part of the problem we have… not people from Mexico looking for a job…
July 13th, 2006 at 2:25 pmDLC
You’re an idiot.
1> Despite many many requests for more security in our ports, they are still the most viable method for sneaking a bomb into this country. Millions of cargo containers pour into our ports daily.
2> A wall would need be built around the entire USA. Why couldnt a terrorist just take a short boat trip from canada/mexio around the fence?
3> A fake ID/Passport will get you in to this country via plane, boat, train, donkey. I guess you think terrorists will show their true ID’s?
The best way we can secure our borders from terrorists is to get rid of this administration who supports terrorism. They’re in 2 countries now creating more terrorists.
Stop supporting Isreal.
Help Mexico create jobs.
Now DLC I hear your mom calling you for lunch, better get out of the basement, stop playing counterstrike.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:25 pmOf course a wall works.
That’s why Republicans and Democrats dismiss it.
Comment by Destroy the DLC
Actually no it does not. I watched on Fox propoganda hour the other day where they were talking about putting up a wall and was showing a wall that has been built… and there were people climbing right over it. But how are they going to get past an electric fence? Watch TV probably… there has been many shows depicting people getting past them. I think the land mine thing might work though … and laser armed robots.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:26 pmYeah, that wall in Isreal is doing a really great job of defending them…. It works especially well on things that fly…
July 13th, 2006 at 2:26 pmDLC,
Republicans are the party of hate, you love to spread it, so don’t worry about a few mexicans hating you, the world hates you.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:28 pmStop supporting Isreal.
Help Mexico create jobs.
Comment by DenverDem — July 13, 2006 @ 2:25 pm
Well said!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:29 pmthen there’s the matter of asian people being smuggled in containers in ocean bound freighters…I live near a major port city, and some of these containers have landed right there at the Port of Seattle….the same containers that the Republicant congress rejected to be checked before reaching our home ports.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:30 pm#76
i know border security is needed. and where, just where in my statement did i say otherwise. folks here love to twist and insert words that simply are not there. so enforce the laws!!!! why has bush cut homeland security fund? do lyou really think tunnel diggers are going to be stopped by a wall? ok, then build a wall and get rid of INS, cuz obviously they can’t, won’t, don’t do their job. why is the gov. hiring illegal workers? i’ll tell ya, slave labor. and why not, it’s hell of alot cheaper. the gov is hiring and putting these illegal workers, knowing they are illegal, on our bases to build CO (commisioned officer) housing and other facilities ON OUR MILITARY BASES DURING THE TIME OF WAR. come on folks. this is obsurd. this gov. knows what it is doing. look at katrina. all those lousiana natives were waiting for a job and thinking the rebuilding would put them back on their feet. these jobs without a question should have gone to them, but NOOOOO. who did bushy bring in, the illegal mexicans and alot of them were already here but still illegal. the gov. does not give a shit because it is making him and his cronies richer. what makes it so bad they get on t.v and admit to it. why outsource out of country or out of state? bushy boy doesn’t want security. this is such bs. what will it take for this to end, don’t know. ask jeb, he married a mexican so bushy needs to save them all.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:30 pmthat word – outsource. I recall battling a conservative who believed outsourcing is GOOD?!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:32 pmB.Thorton,
The only standing upon which you would be able to make your claim of -
“NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO COME HERE, JUST BECAUSE THEY WANT TO.â€
- would be if you were a “Native Americanâ€. You know, those folks who lived in relative peace on that continent before all of the “civilized” Europeans came and killed them off and herded them into “reservationsâ€?
However, I know you not to be a Native American because they did not believe in land ownership or borders. Your false sanctimony and blatant racism are deplorable to see in practice. You should be ashamed of yourself, but that would require a conscience. Please obtain one as soon as possible.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:32 pmBorder security is one piece of the puzzle. And you foks do a tremendous disservice when you minimize it just because there are other security flaws.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:33 pmThe fence will look great as it runs through Big Bend National Park. What an idiot!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:33 pm“NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO COME HERE, JUST BECAUSE THEY WANT TO.â€
how about if an iraqi said that….
July 13th, 2006 at 2:34 pmAs usual, the right wing wants to pin the blame on the people coming here for the jobs (since they make zero contrbutions to the GOP), not the people in this country who are supplying the jobs that give the people coming here the incentive to leave their homeland (they do give to the GOP).
When I was a kid in southern New Jersey in the late’60s-early’70s I lived in a town that saw a wave of Hispanic people move to the area because farmers were hiring them for cheap labor. So of course, local residents (fueled partly by racism) blamed the underpaid Hispanics for a general decline in the town’s quality of life, not the farmers who lured them here or the half-assed town leadership.
Want to cut down on illegal immigration? Crack down on the employers, not the potential employees. Make them pay a living wage that would be more incentive for Americans to take the jobs (especially now that this country manufactures hardly anything).
July 13th, 2006 at 2:35 pmComment by ironchef — July 13, 2006 @ 2:34 pm
was that last sentence really called for????
July 13th, 2006 at 2:36 pmStop supporting Isreal.
Help Mexico create jobs.
Comment by DenverDem — July 13, 2006 @ 2:25 pm
Well said!
Comment by unbelievable
Well said indeed…. there are two ways to stop forwards movement of a force … a wall … and change the center of gravity so that the force flows the other way…. if America used it capitalistic abilities and maybe even put a little money into it we could make Mexico a much more viable place to live for all these people and so they will be less likely to come here… think about all the things the mexicans say they come here for and then make those same things in Mexico… now no more reason to come … nor bitch when we take drastic actions to protect the borders.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:37 pmThis is what Republicans think of people(could be you or us if so determined by Republicans).
How will they fence off the opposition political party when they deem it time to.
Better stay on their good side.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:39 pmThe canadians are educated far more than us, they are employed probably as much as us, if not moreso, and their economy is much more stable, (…)
Comment by ironchef — July 13, 2006 @ 1:53 pm
As true as this might be, you are ignoring the fact that the wall is part of a “border security” strategy touted by some politicians. “Border security” being code words for “keeping terrorists out”.
If that is really the issue, if security is indeed the goal, it is obvious that neglecting the northern border is a huge, gaping hole in said “border security”. Unless that is, terrorists do not have access to maps to find out the US has more than one border.
On the other hand, if the goal is to keep illegal immigrants out of the US, it seems to me the best way to do it is trough enforcing existing laws as other commenters have already mentioned before me: Law enforcement agencies should impose fines and other penalties to employers who hire illegal immigrants.
Without legal deterrents on those employers, people will find a way to cross the border by other means, e.g., trains, trucks, cars, tunnels, because the lure of higher wages is too tempting to ignore.
In short, ironchef, the fence is a costly, ineffectual means for dealing with illegal immigration or border security. It is one of those “wedge issues” fueled by a healthy dose of xenophobia.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:39 pmFirst:
Then:
Troll alert!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:40 pmHumanist,
The problem is that you still believe this to be true.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:40 pm#115-ironchef,
Which question did I not answer? Which truth do you dispute?
Now, in regard to your devoid of intelligence statement requesting that I speak no further truths and perish, you betray only your own cowardice and ignorance for all the world to see. I am sorry for you that the truth frightens you so, but I will not engage in childish banter with you.
May peace be with you.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:41 pm#89
i’m conservative in some areas and i’m liberal in others. i’m a realist. and don’t need to be in a ‘group’ or part of a ‘party’ to make me feel i’m somebody. i often wonder why alot of folks in here consider this admin. conservative. i don’t get it. these folks are everything but conservative/republican, liberal/democrat. these folks are self-riteous, fascists, and criminals. i don’t give a shit if what ticket they run under. it is wrong, it is wrong no matter how you twist it or flip it.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:43 pmHumanist – May peace be with you too. Blessings.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:44 pmThe mouth that roars has growled again. Ann Coulter now calls for the execution of the NYT’s editor.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:46 pmHumanist,
July 13th, 2006 at 2:46 pmYou make my ass hurt. Take it somewhere else, please. Isn’t there a Unicorn/crystal/medieval theme park you need to be at?
#124-Spudge,
July 13th, 2006 at 2:47 pmWith respect, I disagree. The problem is not that I believe in the ideals and structures so beautifully crafted and displayed in your Constitution. The problem is that too many of the citizens of the United States of America do not believe in their Constitution. What’s worse, I fear, is that there are far too many Americans who do not even understand what it says. Or, for that matter, what it means.
If ironchef is so intuned with the third planet from the sun, which species of plants and animals does he decide to kill on a daily basis to sustain himself?
And if Canada is so bliss, why did they just elect a conservative?
July 13th, 2006 at 2:47 pmSeems like if we simply remove any chance of an illegal getting a job in the US, the problem would solve itself (mostly). So after getting laws against companies that severely fine them for even hiring 1 illegal, we then need to enforce the law. At that point, simply beefing up border patrol to 40,000-50,000 strong should eliminate those pushing drugs over the border.
Seems like a very simple problem to solve. Sadly, neither side wants to make this simple for some reason.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:48 pm#129-Destroy,
July 13th, 2006 at 2:49 pmI suggest then that you try thinking with your head.
It would be easier to just build a stainless steel fence
around the White House. More cost effective, too.
I’d certainly support electrifying that one, as well.
It would keep the boy king at home where he can do
less damage globally, and they could do to livestock
whatever it is they do in Texas & Wyoming.
Poor goats & cows…what did they ever do to the Right?
July 13th, 2006 at 2:50 pmThe fence is not to keep them out. It is to keep us in after this becomes a total police state.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:50 pmJust wondering since Rep. King’s head is cut off in the pic, does that mean he has horns sticking out of the top of his head or something? Just curious > lol.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:50 pm- ironchef:
Yes, it’s easy to say “Just fix Mexico and we won’t need a wall!†Yippee! Yes, that is the best plan..but guess what? They’re a sovereign nation who we have no right to barge into and do a regime change
Well, you might want to tell Dubya that, then, because ‘barging in an ddoing a regime change’ is exactly what he’s doing right now by attempting to fix the election for his mini-me Obrador.
(By the way, are you gonna answer that question of mine? Funny how you demand a laundry list of answers from Humanist, and when he gives them to you you complain that they’re ‘evasions’, but I ask one little question and you avoid me like the plague….odd, that…)
July 13th, 2006 at 2:50 pmHow many have read the Declaration of Independence? OMG – all too familiar – history repeating itself, and I fear it will take some AMAZING feat to get these criminals out of washington. HEED THE WORDS.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:51 pmPost 136 > if you see the machine gun nest nests pointed toward the US, then the wall is to keep us Bush slaves from fleeing into Mexico?!
July 13th, 2006 at 2:52 pmwe spend more money in waste and destruction than we give to mankind. so why not put the money in the infrastructure of mexico instead of a wall. enforce laws=make employers accountable for hiring illegals. make the federal gov. accountable for hiring illegals. if we owe anything to anyone it would be the indians and black folks.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:52 pmHumanist,
July 13th, 2006 at 2:53 pmI knew you had it in you.
Wow. Just wow. The American Iron Curtain. “Land of the free” my ass…
July 13th, 2006 at 2:54 pmthe national guard, can see that for border protection. but right now they are caught up in iraq. SOMETHING NEEDS TO BE DONE-THAT IS WHAT I KNOW RIGHT NOW.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:55 pmit’s really embarrassing to be an american sometimes. I try and try to hold onto some kind of hope, but as the days go on and on, no relief that I can see, I would, if I could afford to, expatriot myself to the country of my mom’s ancestry, which has a grown up society.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:55 pmHow come these same jerkoffs don’t complain about all the illegal armenians and Russians in Los Angeles?
Anybody ever see an Armenian gang member? They are brutal little f**ks. If we are serious about deporting illegals, we need to look at Armenians as well.
July 13th, 2006 at 2:56 pmHumanist is no better than the neo cons he hates. It only shows how elitist folks like him are when they label me with the neo con liars and their liberal enablers (Hilary).
July 13th, 2006 at 2:57 pm“We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality,”
Does that make you feel any better, madashell?
July 13th, 2006 at 2:57 pmHumanist is in a constant siezure state brought on by the black light posters and glow in the dark model unicorns.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:00 pm-
Ok people, sorry for stirring this thread up so much. I’ll exit now acknowledging two things.
You gutless little worm.
Address my question or be subscribed as a coward.
Humanist is a poo-poo face
God, you really are reprehensible, aren’t you?
July 13th, 2006 at 3:01 pmComment by ironchef
No one said anything about barging into peoples countries. If we took the $150 billion bush wants to send into Iraq later this year and said Mexico look what we got … and you can have alot of it if you help us help you …. You are embarressingly emotional. This is not an emotional issue. HOW do you change the actions of humans? How do you encourage them to act differently? Republicans usually say shoot them. The non crazy people usually look for ways to encourage the people to make the choice on their own… and that means being cold and calculating. It means looking at all the inputs and engineering an output that is in your favor. All this hooting and howlering might work in a dixie confederate flag flying hoe down, but that is not how you intelligently solve problems.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:01 pmi often wonder why alot of folks in here consider this admin. conservative. i don’t get it. these folks are everything but conservative/republican, liberal/democrat. these folks are self-riteous, fascists, and criminals.
Comment by bs
There you go, that’s not a statement a “realist” would make, but a NUT……. How much money should WE give to mankind? Why are WE the ones who have to build Mexico? Build the damn wall because Mexico refuses to control its own side of the border. Increase enforcement of current laws, but still build the wall.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:04 pmAnd then we could send ‘em back to Mexico stuffed in cattle cars…
July 13th, 2006 at 3:04 pmi think that cattle prods, fire hoses, and attack dogs would be a good thing to add…. hey, it worked in birmingham, didn’t it? well, it may not have worked all the time, but, it sure was FUN….
yours, from the grave, i remain
gov. george wallace
July 13th, 2006 at 3:04 pmThe U.S. Senate was asked to increase funding for rail security in this country. The majority said no.†(from a new TP thread)
Clearly, the Republicans are not worried about our security..
July 13th, 2006 at 3:05 pmI can just picture in my head King’s wall being built for like a hundred miles in the middle of the Arizona desert and then abandoned > It would just become a relic of stupidity! Mexicans would spray paint nasty words on both sides of it too > lol.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:05 pmI live in SoCal, so I’m physically close to the issue. This guy is as ignorant as they get. Why don’t we just exhume the folks who built the Great Wall of China…or the Berlin Wall…and see if they can help us with this one?!
July 13th, 2006 at 3:06 pmThe cheaper, more simple solution for now is a wall. it sends not only a direct message to those looking at it as they plan their illegal migration, it also sends a deeper message to those who would like to cross that we mean business..even if it’s just this minimal approach.
Comment by ironchef
Sending messages did a lot of good in Vietnam to didnt it? You want to send a message? Open Outlook Express and start typing away. If you want to solve a problem then you need problem solving skills… heated retoric and emotional outbursts and racist chest thumping dont cut it.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:06 pmTime to build an electrified fence from the banks of the Potomac to around the Mall, the Capitol, all the way down to RFK stadium to keep the Congresscriminals inside the House and Senate Office buildings.
Don’t let them out, they’re dangerous.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:09 pmnote to self: send peter an email and see if we could make the razor wire poisionous… also check if we can use some sort of radioactive material to the wall the immigrants will make for us…
July 13th, 2006 at 3:09 pm#157 – Yep. Almost seems they WANT us to get hit hard so they can get reelected by blaming any attack on the libs.
More proof it’s time to start voting for the best CANDIDATE whether they be party based or independent. So if you are a rightie and you hate the GOP choice, feel free to cross party lines and vote for GOOD people. We need to accept that nobody will ever agree 100% with anybody, so as long as we realize this, we will find a way to get SOLUTIONS to problems vs. talking about it and blaming the other side :(
July 13th, 2006 at 3:11 pm#149-Beadyeyeguy,
It is as irresponsible as it is disrespectful to claim to speak for someone. I can assure you, without reservation, that you do not, and are not qualified to, speak for me.
I do not “hate†anyone and I will not accept anyone making that claim on my behalf. Correct yourself, beadyeyeguy, and provide the apology to myself and this group for which your blatant indiscretion warrants.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:11 pmThis has got to be the stupidest thing I’ve seen in Congress in a long time.
What’s to stop anyone from blowing a hole right in that thing with a single stick of dynamite?
How the hell are migrant animals supposed to migrate?
It won’t happen, but seeing people trying to actually do it is laughable.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:12 pmHumanist,
You will find that just about everybody here (right wingers included) feel the same way about the US Constitution. The problem is our leaders do not. George W. Bush said “it’s just a goddamn piece of paper” He has also stated that he would like to be a dictator three different times.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:12 pmGWB is such a freakin’ dweeb…all he really cares about is being written about in history books…I don’t think he realizes what infamous means.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:14 pm#160
Racist chest thumping? No one on here said anything racist. You spent so much energy on your problem solving skills you forgot your basic english skills.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:14 pmHumanist…NOPE not gonna do it.
I want an apology for you lumping ME in with the neo cons and their liar friends. Why is it you people assume ALL Americans support this crap? YOU generalize me. You pretend to speak for me when you say US AMERICANS. Sorry bud, you don’t LIVE here, you don’t KNOW me and I find it offensive YOU seem to think we all approve of the crap that Bush shovels.
Sorry friend, I don’t apologize for what I said, I have a right to say it and you prove you are no better than the neo-cons when you demand an apology for an OPINION.
Guess what? I wasn’t anymore disrespectful to you than you were by generalizing me as somebody who approves of the crap going on in Washington.
So until you stop generalizing, I will not apologize for calling it like I see it.
Good day.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:16 pm#166-Spudge,
I agree. And just so you know, my heart has bled for you each and every time that despicable man has dishonored the very thing that he is sworn to uphold and defend. “Traitorous”, I would think, is too small a word to describe your president’s actions.
May peace be with us all.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:17 pmThe same people who want this electrified wall on the Mexican border, must be the same ones who like the wall being put up in Israel?! Its bad policy in both nations! If a wall was built then do it more like the wall of China > nice brick or stone walls with a walkway on top, with towers, and big giant wood or iron/steel gates in places > lol.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:20 pmSpudge: The constitution is the only thing that matters to me. Not the Dems, Not the Republicans…ONLY the constitution. I hate when people misrepresent her for their greedy aims (be it when they want to roll back rights, hate on immigrants, hate on gays, et al).
I tire of the idiocy I see sometimes when people just don’t seem to give a damn about what happens to something as important as that special document (but then again, Bushie thinks it’s just a God damned piece of paper – argh!).
July 13th, 2006 at 3:20 pmGary,
That law already exists. It just isn’t being enforced.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:21 pmbut still build the wall.
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
And so after spending all that money on the wall and it dont work are you personally going to reimburse the USA for your dumb idea?
When something needs to be done NEVER listen to the person that comes up with an idea in 2 seconds and wants to implement it right NOW! … Why dont you try putting yourself in the mexicans place and ask yourself how would “I” get around that… if you cant find a way you are either dumber than the mexicans or you are lieing.
Building up Mexico is not for the benefit of Mexico it is to solve an American problem. If you actually DO want to solve the problem then latching to dumb ideas as a viable solution is the wrong way to go about it. If the scientists that made the nuclear bomb acted like that they would all be dead before they ever succeeded. Doing SOMETHING is worse than doing nothing… but taking your time and analyzing the problem domain and comparing each possible solution with all the possible down falls to each solution possibility. THEN picking the one that appears to solve the problem without causing more problems and that has fewer possibilities for failure than the rest.
But hey! your 2 second solution is worth throwing a billion dollars at just to see if it works right?
July 13th, 2006 at 3:21 pmI think we should genetically engineer dogs that shoot bees out of their mouths and have them protect our southern border. That would stop illegal immigrants just as well as a 2,000 mile wall.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:23 pmSpudge:
Colorado and Georgia are enforcing the law now. Let’s hope it works and encourages the states to do what the feds refuse to do.
Problem I see, though, is if Bushie gets one more neo-con onto the supreme court, I could see some mega-corp like Wal Mart suing to argue that the states do not have that kind of authority to require corporations to handle all this paperwork.
I see it coming…it’s sad if it happens and I will be pissed beyond pissed if some company even THINKS of such things.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:23 pm#170
Where was the peace before 9/11/01 Humanist? Why should you care if our President uphold or defends anything. To you he is THE EVIL GREAT SATAN THAT LOVES THE TASTE OF BLOOD IN THE MORNING!!!!! Bush could cure AIDS and you’d bitch “WHY DIDN’T HE DO THIS FIVE YEARS AGO”!!!
July 13th, 2006 at 3:24 pmBeadyeyeguy,
I’m with you 100%. Many people don’t realize that most of the politicians in Washington are neither blue nor red. They are a purple color. They do not have the best interests of the American people in mind, only their wallets.
I am sure that King has stock in a fence building company.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:25 pmWho knew that Pergo was now making anti immigration fences? Great infomercial – Now that I know that it would only take one congressman one weekend and a trip to Home Depot to keep out illegal Mexican immigrant I’m all for it.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:26 pmComment By Jim: I may be mad at Humanist for his comment to me, but you are not very bright.
Why defend Bush? I can agree with Humanist on this: He’s the worst thing this country has ever had to endure (worse than the DEPRESSION for God sakes!) and if you are an apologist for him, shame on you.
If not, then why not accept the fact the man is a major part of the problem?
July 13th, 2006 at 3:26 pmOkay, all this generalizing, and grouping aside, does Rep King have any experience as an engineer?
July 13th, 2006 at 3:27 pm#169-Beadyeyeguy,
I defend my honor, and the rights of all humankind, with vigor and without relent. I will allow neither to be compromised.
You, however, choose not to act honorably. That is your choice, and I respect your free will in that regard. But to expect others to act with the same lack of honor, or to with malice attempt to slander the honor of others, that is not acceptable in civilized and advanced mentalities. I will not participate in a conversation with such low standards.
May you find the peace you seek.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:27 pmSpudge: Uh huh…I bet he does too. I’ll also bet he’d do whatever his corporate masters want and if the states DARE to keep passing employer enforcement laws with regards to immigrant hirings, I bet he’d argue the states DO NOT have that right. Then he’d move it into some b.s. committee and let it die all the while the corporations can keep contributing to this problem by hiring more cheap labor.
Sad and shameful these congresscritters are :(
July 13th, 2006 at 3:29 pmRacist chest thumping? No one on here said anything racist. You spent so much energy on your problem solving skills you forgot your basic english skills.
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
When discussing this issue the word “wet back” gets used quite often. So yes racism does play a big part in why the republicans would suggest such a stupid idea as to spend untold amounts of money on a worthless project with little thought… racism comes from the same ignorance as do these stupid 2 second ideas that get trumped up and get the chest thumping idiots going on about how they are big enough to build a wall… Walls have no longer been a viable form of protection since about the 1500s. And they were not that good long before that also. There is even an entire History Channel show talking about the innovations of “wall defenses” over the ages and how they were completely outdated over time. Even the berlin wall did not work. People went over it all the time. And so the russians had to start shooting people that tried because the wall itself was STUPID and symbolic only…. you want to send symbolic messages? Send an email.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:29 pmSince this is meant to keep Mexicans out, does it mean Americans are the livestock???
July 13th, 2006 at 3:29 pmSome of you are already seeing the “solution” which will eventually protect the United States from “terrorists.”
When the United States is no longer a land of economic opportunity; when people in the United States have no civil rights and live in a totalitarian state; when the people live in constant fear, not of the threat of “terrorist” attacks, but of their own neighbors and their own government; then we will no longer need a wall to keep people out of the United States, but to keep people in.
Rest assured our government is working day and night to bring this “solution” to reality.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:30 pm#174
Last time I checked, concrete didn’t cost billions of dollars. And, I said enforce the current laws AND build some kind of security barrier. A wall is cheaper than troops. Sooner or later the Mexican government and people are going to have to help themselves. We’ve signed NAFTA and moved several jobs south of the border. Now, illegal immigrants are snubbing our own laws by protesting for rights in this country that they don’t have. THEY WANT TO VOTE, IN OUR ELECTIONS. You would’nt mind though. You’ve got to put a dent in that 80% of Americans who support, A WALL…..
July 13th, 2006 at 3:31 pmA previous poster said that we should help Mexico create jobs. How about creating jobs here in the US.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:32 pmHumanist: But you have no problem generalizing all Americans?
Whatever, I have no ill will toward you. I defend mankind as well, I am charitable, I am not selfish and I do not like these freaks running this country.
It’s a shame you can’t find some middle ground here, but whatever, it’s your right.
Just keep in mind, I AM NOT your enemy…let’s make that clear and agree on that, ok?
I am honorable, it’s a shame you feel so slighted by ONE comment I posted. If you see another post I actually defended you when some neo con apologist attacked you.
If you met me, you and I might actually get along very well. Who’s to say we wouldn’t in this chat board, just know I will never agree with stereotyping or generalizations. You posted something that generalized me and I didn’t agree.
I will apologize and say sorry you misunderstood the gist of my post. I won’t apologize for calling you out on generalizing Americans…
See…Middle ground is a good thing, right? Beats the crap that the right seem to want to sell the world.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:32 pmmy dad used to have this corny old joke, he would ask “Do you know why they put fences around cemetaries?”
A; Because people are dying to get in.
somehow i don’t see the humour in it any more.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:34 pmRest assured our government is working day and night to bring this “solution†to reality.
Comment by Briseadh na Faire
That sends chills up the back of my neck.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:35 pm#177-Jim
Do not portend to speak for me. And I do not think in a pre and post 9/11 reference frame. I am for peace in each and every moment. Is that concept foreign to you?
I do not “hate†bush, I hate what you have allowed him to do with your country. And if mr. bush either found himself, or caused to come about a cure for AIDS, I would heap upon him the praise that such a noble accomplishment would deserve.
Open your mind, and seek the truth and not labels. You only serve to limit yourself.
Peace.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:36 pmSteve King is a gross embarrasment to everyone in his district – me included. We have put together a website on King at http://www.kingwatch.org
Visit the site, leave a comment if you have something to add. Tell your friends and ask them to link to the KingWatch site.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:38 pmBeadyeyeguy
You can bash Bush all you want. You can have all the conspiracy theories you want. Bush is worse than the depression? Are you starving to death? Are you working for nothing? When you say crazy stuff like that is actually makes me laugh. I love it when someone like you says that I’m not bright. Really, thanks. I feel so much better now. How dare I defend that bastard Bush. How do we know he is human? Oh, maybe he just doesn’t have a heart. Maybe all this strife is for THE OIL…….
July 13th, 2006 at 3:42 pmYou would’nt mind though. You’ve got to put a dent in that 80% of Americans who support, A WALL…..
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
Strawman
Only Americans should vote in Aamerica and unlike the republicans I think Arnold schwarzenegger should NEVER be allowed to run from president nor anyone else not born here… that is totally besides the point ..
It does not matter how many lazy minded, American idol, yee haw, or intelligent design type people want to build a wall it is still STUPID. Taking NO action is better than taking a STUPID action. Study a little about the history of warfare… stupid generals that have lots of guts but no brains have gotten their men slaughtered because of that type of thinking. If you dont know HOW and WHY that wall will work and can SHOW it then it is STUPID.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:45 pmA few questions: Has Rep. King explained who made that model of the wall for him? It looks like a professional did it, so is Halliburton wanting the contract to construct it? And how much will it cost to build 2,000 miles of it?
July 13th, 2006 at 3:47 pmcan’t. get. spinal. tap. concert. out. of. head.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:47 pm#189-Beadyeyeguy,
Your civility is appreciated. And I agree, that if we met, we would get along. I have yet to meet an open-minded person with which I was not able to converse with respectfully and pleasantly.
In regard to “generalizing†all Americans, I have to agree that such is unfair. However, by the nature of your structure of government, which is a beautiful thing by the way, the PEOPLE are responsible for the actions of their government and country. That, my friend, is the point that I hammer home. I believe it is a concept that has become lost in the partisan foolishness that prevails currently in your political environment.
Thank you, though, for the apology, it means a lot. I believe that our honor, and the results of our actions (or inactions), are all that we truly possess in this life. Understanding that you can see why I allow no compromise in that regard.
May peace be with us all.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:47 pmAny fool that’s lived on or near a farm knows that livestock get through those fences all the time. To think that a thinking human being wouldn’t is idiotic, but then again, do any of these failed Conservatives think?
July 13th, 2006 at 3:47 pmA previous poster said that we should help Mexico create jobs. How about creating jobs here in the US.
Comment by bjb
How about we create jobs in Mexico for the mexicans (and play it off as some kind of American humanitarian christmas present to our neighbor) and give the jobs that get left behind to people that need to make money… oh wait! I see! Those people would be Americans and that means minimum wage which the employers dont want to pay …. now it makes sense…
July 13th, 2006 at 3:47 pmGerald Gibson
I agree with you on Schwarzenegger and only people born here to run for President. Actually I hate polls. We can’t just sit back and do nothing with the border any longer. I can’t believe Bush and congress didn’t do something four or five years ago to secure our border with Mexico and our ports. Stupid is sitting around waiting for the situation to get better while knowing it’s only going to get worse.
July 13th, 2006 at 3:55 pmWhat a dick!!!
July 13th, 2006 at 3:56 pmI can’t believe Bush and congress didn’t do something four or five years ago to secure our border with Mexico and our ports.
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM — July 13, 2006 @ 3:55 pm
As I’ve said before, if the goal is security from terrorists, sealing the border in the south while leaving the other one unguarded defeats that purpose.
If the goal is to keep illegal aliens out what is needed is proper law enforcement and funding. If you build a wall people will find a way around, over, or under it to get to the jobs on the other side.
Not to mention that, according to the government’s own figures, about 40% of illegal aliens in the US are visa overstayers -not border crossers. A wall will not stop those.
July 13th, 2006 at 4:01 pmBeadyeyeguy and Humanist, congrats on your new found peace. I’m really happy for you both. I wish you both great happiness and great wealth in your lives. Let us join hands now and damn global warming to hell!!!!!!!
Come on say it with me….
Peace to the world, to hell with global warming
again
Peace to the world, to hell with global, uhm uh I mean to hell with Bush Bush man.
Just kidding guys. I’ve got to go. I actually enjoy talking to my favorite libs on TP
July 13th, 2006 at 4:02 pmOkay, all this generalizing, and grouping aside, does Rep King have any experience as an engineer?
Comment by Lush Limppud — July 13, 2006 @ 3:27 pm
No…but he started a company called King Construction in 1975, which his oldest son now runs. Guess this is what he meant when he said “our little company could build…”
July 13th, 2006 at 4:02 pm“What types of fences would liberals support?” –Randy
Gee, Randy, let’s look at what YOU support, shall we?
• Bush is allowing EVERY SEMITRUCK IN MEXICO FULL ACCESS TO THE UNITED STATES, while inspecting something under FIVE PERCENT of these 70 ton behemoths.
• Bush is CURRENTLY BUILDING a Mexico-Canda freeway for Mexican semitrucks which will BISECT the United States, cut out all U.S. labor unions, and for which Kansas City has already SOLD land to Mexico for a massive, Mexican truckstop.
Those policies are a bit more worrying than the NONEXISTENT threat posed by Latino farmworkers and lawn cleaners crossing the borders on Christmas to see their family.
THERE HAVE BEEN ZERO TERRORIST THREATS FROM LATINO PEASANTS. ZERO.
Meanwhile, there are SIX major terrorist threats a year from white-supremacist SKINHEAD gangs.
THIS is a terrorist:
“April 10, 2003 The FBI raids the Noonday, Texas, home of William Krar and storage facilities he rented in the area, discovering an arsenal that includes more than 500,000 rounds of ammunition, 65 pipe bombs and remote-control briefcase bombs, and almost two pounds of deadly sodium cyanide. Also found are components to convert the cyanide into a bomb capable of killing thousands, along with white supremacist and antigovernment material. Investigators soon learn Krar was stopped earlier in 2003 by police in Tennessee, who found in his car several weapons and coded documents that seemed to detail a plot. Krar refuses to cooperate, and details of that alleged plan are never learned. Eventually, he pleads guilty to possession of a chemical weapon and is sentenced to more than 11 years in prison.”
Eleven years, minus time off in the current absurd system that Congress refuses to fix, and this TERRORIST BASTARD is out on the streets planning on blowing our asses off, WHILE YOUR PALS IN THE RAPEPUBLICAN CONGRESS fiddle their thumbs and figure out how to hurt the poor.
Wake up — you are YOUR OWN WORST ENEMY.
July 13th, 2006 at 4:05 pmStupid is sitting around waiting for the situation to get better while knowing it’s only going to get worse.
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
I agree.
Stupid is doing nothing forever.
Stupid is doing SOMETHING just so you can say you are doing something.
On the morning of 911 my wife asked me what was going to happen. I said remember all those shows I watch about WWII? She said she didnt want to have that happen. I said well 911 is FAR bigger than Pearl Harbor. The whole country is going to get mobilzed and lots of things are going to change… my career will have to be put on hold….
And what happened? Typical republican conniving manipulations, lies, greed, power grabbing .. and NO JUSTICE FOR THE ATTACK ON AMERICA BY SAUDI ARABIANS.
I expected BushCo would set aside their politcal rightwing BS and pull out all the best of Americas people and go all out on those behind 911… but that is not what happened … is it?
July 13th, 2006 at 4:07 pmOh post 205, so King himself has a Construction company? I guess he figures his son {and himself } can make a fortune building his electrified wall for 2,000 miles of it?!
July 13th, 2006 at 4:07 pmKing’s design features a wire electrified “with the kind of current that would not kill somebody.†King noted that “we do this with livestock all the time.â€
Of course, the 12 foot drop after you get stunned by the wire isn’t going to do you any good.
——
July 13th, 2006 at 4:14 pmhttp://griperblade.blogspot.com – grumblings from the heartland
Gerald Gibson
Did you support Afgansitan? I’ll read your answer later after I get home. Have a good evening…..
July 13th, 2006 at 4:20 pmGerald Gibson
Did you support Afgansitan? I’ll read your answer later after I get home. Have a good evening…..
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
Absolutley. But is was just an outpost. Saudi Arabia provides the man power, the money, and the religious extremism. Pakistan provides the shelter for Osama and the WMD blackmarket that supplied Lybia, Iran, North Koream, and has had talks with Saudi Arabia about going nuclear.
In addition I want to know why all those Israelis were chearing the burning WTC towers and what the FBI found out during their interrigations of those Israeli spys in the days after 911…
AND I want to know why the Saudis were allowed to leave this country after 911 without the FBI using them in its investigations.
AND I want to know if Iran has really been holding some major Al Qeada people since 911.
AND I want to know WTF Iraq has to do with any of this.
July 13th, 2006 at 4:27 pmA statesman would call for an end to farm subsidies that enable U.S. farmers to sell U. S. corn cheaper than Mexican farmers can sell their corn, thereby putting the Mexican farmers out of business and forcing them to look for other jobs–which can only be found north of the border.
But Mr. Fence Builder is from Iowa, which means he probably has a lot of constituents who either grow corn or live in corn-growing counties where the economy is tied to farming. Best guess: he’s no statesman.
July 13th, 2006 at 4:27 pmWhy can’t we build a wall like that to keep Republicans off Capitol Hill? George Romero did it all the time with zombies.
July 13th, 2006 at 4:29 pmWouldn’t it be hysterical if this turned into a “Spinal Tap” kind of thing? Where they passed this plan, and set up the contractors, and the contractors built the wall literally to scale – and built a 2,000 mile long, 18-inch high electrified wall? It’d be like our government dabbling in performance art.
July 13th, 2006 at 4:38 pmI fail to understand why you guys on the left don’t want to stop illegals.
It seems like a very simple problem. It also seems like something the Dems would want more then the Repugs. You claim that your the party of the poor and illegals deflating wages and the amount of jobs available for poor american citizens seems like something the Dems would want to fight against.
This problem is extremely easy to solve. To get rid of illegals coming for jobs or to smuggle drugs, weapons, etc., you simply make huge fines against any business who hires even 1. We need to make sure any illegal that comes here will not find work. You then enforce that fine. Also, you increase the number of true border patrol to 30,000-50,000. At this point we need the border patrols advice. We build fences where they want them, we provide the technology they need. Most importantly, we fund them to the levels they request. We also need to pass laws stopping illegals from being able to use our social programs. Lastly, we need to figure out who to deport from the 11 million + that are already here. Obviously, we need to let those that have been here a long time stay unless they have broken any law (outside of illegally coming here in the first place). I would suggest that they need to be here for at least 6-8 years. All others need to be deported ASAP.
This type of plan would stop almost ALL illegals from coming here. The benefit would be more jobs for the poor and higher wages in many important industries. I can’t see a downside for the Dems on this issue. In reality, it seems like something the Repugs wouldn’t want as illegals are cheap labor for big business and we all know that big business supports the Repugs much more then the Dems.
Either way, I am still baffled as to why sites like this are so against plans to stop illegal immigration. Can someone fill me in?
July 13th, 2006 at 4:39 pm[...] Rep. King Designs Electrified Fence For Southern Border: ‘We Do This With Livestock All The Time’ [...]
July 13th, 2006 at 4:43 pmdoes he plan on installing one of these things on the northern border too, or is it just brown people that we want to keep out?
July 13th, 2006 at 4:50 pm#215 I don’t believe the majority on this site is against stopping illegal immigration. It’s more of the sophmoric response we finally get from this administration. Your plan looks very close to what has already been proposed by Dems.
Question to you is who is going to fill the void when all this low wage work now becomes available? Without an increase in the minimum wage it won’t attrack even the smallest of percentage needed.
Another thorn (at least in my side) is the anemic attempts this admin. has actually put towards Border security. They don’t want to inspect containers (dirty bombs), they don’t increase security for train transport, they slash funding in airline security and still tout how tough they are. Actions, not words are what is needed.
A wall may be a start but is not the end all answer. So easy to send another $100 billion around the world but can’t stand behind real border security.
July 13th, 2006 at 4:52 pm# 214…I about died laughing at the image you created of the scale model fence! Hilarious! Thanks…I really needed that comedy relief!
July 13th, 2006 at 4:59 pm[...] Stimpy, you EEDIOT! Asides Socially Bookmark Don’t pee on the electric fence [...]
July 13th, 2006 at 5:02 pmI fail to understand why you guys on the left don’t want to stop illegals.
Comment by Gary
Strawman
illegals SHOULD be stoped. Doing idiotic things to try stoping it is the problem.
Walls can be SEEN but they dont solve the problem. Do you want to solve the problem or have photo ops of Bush, Inc standing on top of the wall… only to have the problem continue right on….
You want the problem solved? Good so do we … so come up with an idea that isnt DUMB and lets discuss it. Relieving the pressure that drives mexicans here in the first place sounds like a good idea that would work … but NO Gary doesnt like that idea because it he didnt come up with it because it requires thinking.
No Gary wants to build walls and moats like it is the freaking year 150 BC. DUMB.
July 13th, 2006 at 5:07 pmComment by Jim: I am not a lib. I am an independent thinking American. One who is willing to listen to all sides (including your skewed view of the world, LOL).
Anyway, my earlier point is not based in conspiracy theories, it’s based on FACT. Just because I am not starving doesn’t mean it excuses this awful President’s economic policies have made his cronies rich while the middle class WILTS.
Guess you don’t care since you put party thinking above the good of America. Next time you want to debate my point, MAKE ONE YOURSELF. It’s apparent to me you are bankrupt of ideas.
Funniest yet…you call anybody you disagree with a lib. Funny, you stereotype your opponent like that. I would MUCH RATHER debate points of the world with nice people like Humanist ANYDAY OF THE WEEK than walk lockstep and ditto your point of view just so we can “get along.” Your party says that libbies are elitist? I beg to differ. I don’t see the libs calling those they disagree with names. I disagree with libs on many points, but I also like some of what they say as well. They don’t call me names. I go to a right leaning site and debate a point, I am automatically labelled. So to me, the libs seem to be more accepting of ideas than the right.
Prove me wrong or else you lose (hate hearing that, eh?). I used to be a conservative. Still am in principle (old line con, not this gross, selfish, loser version that likes big government, trampling the rights of others and telling me how to live my life!) but the more I read the likes of you, I wonder if I can even say that anymore.
Good day to you. Again, I don’t hate anybody. I dislike Bush, but I don’t hate him. LOL, you make me laugh when you put words in my mouth and label me the way elitists or tyrants do.
July 13th, 2006 at 5:11 pmBTW Comment By Jim: Have you ever looked the word LIBERAL up in the dictionary? I am sure you haven’t judging by the way you dittoheads throw it around like it’s a dirty word.
Did you know the USA is a Republic formed by liberal principles?
Oh well…keep inhaling the b.s. Rush Limbaugh shovels.
Again, good day to you. Talk to me when you are serious about solving the problems of this country instead of selling me stereotypes, platitudes and party talk.
America matters way more to me than a dumb party.
Good day.
July 13th, 2006 at 5:13 pmGerald: If the right would let the states pass tougher rules on employing illegals, then you would solve the problem. Why would anybody come here if they couldn’t find work?
This is NOT a problem of liberals. In fact, the liberal governors of Arizona and New Mexico BOTH have plans in place to deal with this problem and are not ignoring it the way most on the right seem to want to do.
So next time you want to make things up about the libs, get it right at least :( Sheesh.
(Now I wait while the guy calls me a lib and an idiot without debating ONE IOTA of my point).
July 13th, 2006 at 5:15 pmUnder the Bush administration the rate of investigations into illegal employment has dropped like a rock. There are laws on the books that are not being enforced especially after INS was folded into Homeland Security where wonderful guys like Brownie are doing such a great job.
Read this:
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0705-23.htm
July 13th, 2006 at 5:22 pm
Justanobservor: Yep, the right cry when prices rise even the slightest. They cry when taxes are increased, YET, they have no idea what’s in store when the price of the most basic things skyrockets because we deported 11 million workers. They don’t want to raise the minimum wage even though THAT is the right thing to do for AMERICAN workers.
To raise the min. wage is not like raising taxes. If a business needs people they will absorb the costs. As a business owner myself, I pay people above the Min. Wage and always will. I feel it engenders loyalty to my business and I get happy workers. No harm in raising this as it will come back to the Feds and localities in increased payroll taxes which can then be used to pay for employer enforcement of immigration law and border patrols.
Oh well…guess that was easy. Too bad the Ditto heads think that those who make min. wage are lazy :( These people work hard, they hold jobs that serve a purpose and they HAVE TO work hard. Why not help them out and keep the min. wage at inflationary rates? THAT is compassionate and it doesn’t effect one person via taxation.
Oh well…this is why the GOP doesn’t like people like me. We aren’t going to back the party line and therefore we were forced out by the extremists.
July 13th, 2006 at 5:23 pmKing forgot something in his demonstration: a model detention camp with little crematoriums, and lots and lots of little urns for the Mexicanos who get past the wall. Heh, all the republican congressional candidates from my fine state of Oklahoma are using this kind of hate rhetoric in their campaigns—oh, and God and family, too. All them really fine republican partyspeak points, can’t get enough o’ them neocons. Personally, I think they want to keep us in, and those are our urns.
July 13th, 2006 at 5:24 pmSo next time you want to make things up about the libs, get it right at least :( Sheesh.
(Now I wait while the guy calls me a lib and an idiot without debating ONE IOTA of my point).
Comment by Beadyeyeguy
I have been coming here for about a year now arguing against the neo cons, supporting real conservative ideas like the right to bear arms, and defending the good ideas of the left… I just dont know what you are talking about… but I have jumped peoples asses before myself not realizing they were actually agreeing with me … so dont sweat it.
July 13th, 2006 at 5:39 pmGerald, Sorry it was a typo and meant to say TO THOSE who want to make things up about the libs.
I have no problem with a lot of what you say. I defend the right to bear arms, I will DIE to defend the constitution from the idiots who think it’s a “god damned piece of paper” and I will NOT sit by and let a bunch of idiots sell out the ideals put forth in the Declaration Of Independence and Constitution.
I have no problem with you and sorry my typing sometimes gets ahead of my brain :(
July 13th, 2006 at 5:45 pmGerald,
I fully agree that Bush has done nothing about Illegals. I can’t think of a president that actually did much of anything for that matter. Both parties don’t truly want to do something sadly.
Whats my plan to stop illegals? Simple:
1) Pass tough laws that fine any company or person that hires even 1 illegal. That fine should be so huge that no company would even dare hire one.
2) Enforce the law
3) Add many many more border patrol. I would go to 30,000-50,000 border patrol for starters.
4) Ask the heads of the Border patrol what they want to do their job better. If they want walls, build them. If they don’t, then don’t build them. If they want new technology, give it to them.
5) Finance the Border Patrol and all programs that focus on keeping illegals out to the levels they need.
6) Pass new laws that don’t allow illegals to use any of our social programs. This will be one more reason for them not to come. NO MORE HAND OUTS!
7) Deport most of the 11 million+ illegals that are hear right now. Only allow those that have been here for a minimum of 10 years to stay. Those that get to stay have to pay a $10,000 fine per adult and $3,000 fine per child. They also need to pay all back taxes and social secuirty payments. Lastly, we will fund mandatory class’ that teach english. After all that, they can become an American Citizen.
This plan would work. It isn’t even hard. If illegals can’t find work here, they won’t come here. They will stay home.
Simple
July 13th, 2006 at 5:53 pmFor once…just this once…I’m glad I moved from Iowa to Nebraska 12 years ago.
Jason
July 13th, 2006 at 5:57 pmfiled under: another dipshit idea.
July 13th, 2006 at 6:13 pm#234, I think the plan proposed by #88 is acutally a lot better and solves the problem more efficiently without incurring the cost of adding 20,000 more boarder patrol agents….
July 13th, 2006 at 6:15 pm[...] Idiot liberals are having a damm cow over a demonstration by Congressman King on building a wall.  Rep. King Designs Electrified Fence For Southern Border: ‘We Do This With Livestock All The Time’ Rep. Steve King (R-IA) went on the House floor on Tuesday to discuss a fence that he “designed†for the southern boarder. (King constructed a model of the fence as he was speaking.) King’s design features a wire electrified “with the kind of current that would not kill somebody.†King noted that “we do this with livestock all the time.†[...]
July 13th, 2006 at 6:18 pmAccording to the labor calculations of a construction website I used, which specializes in concrete, it would require 82,410,264 cubic feet of concrete to build a 12′ high 3′ thick wall along the 1951 miles of US-Mexican border. It would take approximately 4,079,308 man hours to construct.
The concrete alone (not including rebar, expansion joints, formwork or site preparation) would cost approximately one billion dollars at $7.50 per 80 lbs of concrete mix delivered. The cost for labor would be, according to the US Dept of Labor at $20 an hour for labor (not including management, supervisor pay or profit and o.h. for the General Contractor), around $9.5 million.
We’re close to $2 billion just on concrete and nonsupervisory workers alone. Just the tip of the construction iceberg…
July 13th, 2006 at 6:24 pmGerald Gibson
Man, where to begin. What should we have done to Saudi Arabia? Gone after them militarily or isolate them (I don’t know how we could)? Isreal civilians weren’t jumping up and down in the streets. That was people in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, and that is not subject to debate Gerald. That is one of the images burned in my brain from 9/11. Now, I’m not saying that Isreal wasn’t upset in the sense they knew this would make us respond in the middle east in some kind of military fashion or another and they always like that action.
July 13th, 2006 at 6:26 pm[...] Think Progress [...]
July 13th, 2006 at 6:28 pmBeadyeyeguy
Okay, you don’t like being called a lib. I don’t like being called neo-con, nazi, right wing radical ect ect. Which no one has called me that, but I am pretty conservative. I always have been. I’m talking about since I was ten years old. My dad hates Bush, my wife is a democrat from NY and I have disagreed with Bush on….
Not securing the borders after 9/11
Port deal with the UAB
Harriot Myers nomination to the Supreme Court
I’m not a Rush Limbaugh brainwashed idiot (hey a new name to call someone), I like to discuss issues. When I was stationed in Germany my last two years of the Army, my best friends were a German Buddist who found the Soviet lifestyle to his liking. An Iranian who owned a pizza shop who loved German beer and girls. Most of the name calling on TP is towards “conservatives” who come on here. I can handle the names, hell, I can handle anything, but get some thicker skin. Lib? No more lib stuff for you or Gerald. BUT THAT DOESN’T MEAN I’M GOING TO KEEP QUITE……
July 13th, 2006 at 6:36 pmLOL…Jim. Yes, let’s bomb everybody for the heck of it.
Ronald Reagan never tried to bomb the Soviets and JFK didn’t nuke Cuba did he?
July 13th, 2006 at 6:37 pmJim, you have every right to post your POV, I never said you didn’t. I am not gonna keep quiet either. If you want to discuss my point of view, try not labelling me a lib. I am not a lib nor am I a conservative. I am an American who cares about his country.
Okay, fine, you aren’t a neo-con. At least you DISCUSSED the point with me. See, if you TALK to me, I will TALK back. If you stereotype me, I serve it right back at you.
My point is this…debate my POV, but leave the name calling for those who don’t have a clue how to debate. If you are what you say you are, then you and I can discuss this stuff and see where we stand, agree or disagree on.
Sound good?
July 13th, 2006 at 6:40 pmI for one would appreciate a demonstration by the congressman
July 13th, 2006 at 6:41 pmI would ask that he urinate on the electric fence to prove what it will do to stop aliens
I would not believe it effective until I see him perform this act, but please do disguise the little soldier in question from the prying eye of the media. (re; Michael Jackson, Bill Clinton et all)
I would then consider his statement about electric fences
Simple
Comment by Gary
That sounds a hell of a lot better than a wall… now will ANY of that actually happen? Congress doesnt have a good record from any party … as you said … we will see.
July 13th, 2006 at 6:41 pmAnd King says that without embarrassment.
July 13th, 2006 at 6:41 pmAnd congress lets it stand without a hue and cry.
We can also put gun towers every 500 yards. We can dig a moat and fill it with pirhana.
This is disgusting, and Americans should be ashamed.
The root of the problem is all corporate economy – businesses want cheap labor, slave labor – people are in an untenable position. Born dirt poor in Mexico with no hope of improving life there, so they are attracted to jobs here because our corporations like exploiting the Mexican plight.
I for one would appreciate a demonstration by the congressman
July 13th, 2006 at 6:42 pmI would ask that he urinate on the electric fence to prove what it will do to stop aliens
I would not believe it effective until I see him perform this act, but please do disguise the little soldier in question from the prying eye of the media. (re; Michael Jackson, Bill Clinton et all)
I would then consider his statement about electric fences as one he is ready to get up close to.
BTW Jim: I have a thick skin…I just don’t like being stereotyped. Those who stereotype and claim to be righties tend to have ZERO ideas and tend to be Rushbots.
But then again, if you want to call me a liberal as it is defined in the dictionary, I guess I’ll accept it.
If you want to call me a lib just because you disagree with me, that is not cool and has nothing to do with having a “thick skin” or not.
July 13th, 2006 at 6:43 pm[...] We couldn’t make this up if we tried. From ThinkProgress: [...]
July 13th, 2006 at 6:45 pmWhat the right need to realize is that TALK and diplomacy STILL WORK. We can’t keep overextending the military.
We attacked SADDAM (notice I don’t say we invaded Iraq, because we didn’t, we attacked because Bush hates Saddam) when we should have shown the arabs what we could do in Afghanistan. Nobody disagreed with attacking The Taliban.
Now Kim Jong Il pipes up and the right want to blame Clinton? Uhhhh, we wasted EVERYTHING on Saddam and the N.Koreans act up! Now I hear those who say Iraq is the right thing to do? WHY? So we can look manly?
The America I love would never invade Iraq for such feeble evidence. The America the Bushbots love think it’s perfectly okay for us to act like the world’s bully. Sorry, diplomacy seemed to work when we faced down the Soviet threat. Why can’t we learn from that? Why are all these warmongers allowed to hold office?
July 13th, 2006 at 6:48 pmMan, where to begin. What should we have done to Saudi Arabia? Gone after them militarily or isolate them (I don’t know how we could)? Isreal civilians weren’t jumping up and down in the streets. That was people in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, and that is not subject to debate Gerald. That is one of the images burned in my brain from 9/11. Now, I’m not saying that Isreal wasn’t upset in the sense they knew this would make us respond in the middle east in some kind of military fashion or another and they always like that action.
Comment by comment by jim
How can you say “Israeli civilians werent jumping up and down in the streets? It was on the NEWS and the FBI did capture them and hold them and interigate them for it… a woman saw them doing it and called the FBI…
The investigations of the Israelis working at malls is separate from another case of detained Israelis, in New York. On Sept. 11, five young Israeli army veterans who worked for a moving company were observed at a park on the Hudson River in New Jersey snapping photographs of the burning World Trade Center and seemingly clowning around. To complicate matters, when authorities arrested them they had box-cutters in their moving van, the types of weapons used by the terrorist hijackers. Two other Israelis working for the same firm were arrested later.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A3879-2001Nov22?language=printer
http://www.sundayherald.com/37707
And a Fox news special about it …
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAoe26MaTew&search=fox%20news
Serious … I know where you should begin … try reading and stop having opinions without any facts to back you up? That might help you look a little more credible.
Now then …
Saudi Arabia? Well we could have done lots of things … from military to, CIA hit teams, to arming Saddam and sending him in there as the new gaurdian of Mecca, to giving all the middle east an ultimatum that included their precious Mecca… either peace or war … with America…
July 13th, 2006 at 6:50 pmBeadyeyeguy
Come on man, there you go again. You just called a bunch of people “Rushbots”. Man alive, you crack me up. I know the definition of a liberal man. It’s been awhile since I read it but I believe it means those who “strictly follows the word of the constitution while a conservative is someone that applies the constituion to the current situation” or something like that.
July 13th, 2006 at 6:51 pmGerald
I’m getting a little tired of you taking a “potential”(and I use the word loosely) conspiracy and taking it for fact. Everything you read isn’t true. But to satisfy you, I WILL CHECK OUT YOUR WEBSITE. Your not backing all your stuff up with facts Gerald, some of your stuff your using as fact is questionable. I was talking about people living in Isreal jumping up and down. I had no idea you were talking about people in this country. I do remember a story about people arrested not far from ground zero for celebrating, but if I recall correctly, they were RELEASED…..
July 13th, 2006 at 6:57 pmNo more lib stuff for you or Gerald. BUT THAT DOESN’T MEAN I’M GOING TO KEEP QUITE……
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
You can call me lib all you want. Labels mean nothing to me.
I respect straight shooting honesty and science… I still have a respect for nonChurch religion.. I did grow up a christian right wing nut case… but I grew out of that as I spent more and more time in the public library. I had a very personal and powerful experience when I was “saved” and I fully believe in the ways of Jesus, Buddha, Zen, and Ghandi because of that experience… I thought Reagan was just great … until I grew up and learned of Iran-Contra… but his StarWars and Berlin Wall and reduction of nukes agreements with Russia are still good in my eyes… I believe in many conservative things… I dont agree with flowerpower just say no to war any more than I agree with the invasion of privacy that is the War on Drugs.
Whether you are conservative or progressive or liberal or whatever doesnt matter as long as you have the #1 trait that made the founding fathers great and therefore America itself …. ENLIGHTENED REASONING… real simple …. anyone that uses this can see that the U.S. Constitution is MORE important that the judeochristian bible, that war is sometimes neccessary, that sacrificing freedom for security is not worth it, that sometimes bad things happen to good people so that the system of law can be preserved (and likewise bad people sometimes go free) … and of coarse SCIENCE over DOGMA.
Liberal is NOT a bad word … I used to think so when I listened to Rush on the radio … but when I looked it up for myself … as I did alot of things in my life … I found out that propoganda is a lie … and people like Goebbels and Rush are nothing but lies.
Was a war needed after 911? You bet. But ENLIGHTENED REASON does NOT allow me to accept attacking just ANYONE just so we can say we attacked SOMEONE… that is just as dumb as this wall idea. And it also requires a COMPLETE scientific investigation of 911 no matter HOW PAINFUL the results might be.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:01 pmJim:
Well cool, it’s not exactly that, but close. As for Rushbot…it’s a term and it’s fair. The man is a hazard like all talk radio hosts from both the right and left. They preach dogma vs. critical thought and I find it unacceptable. If a person likes those people, good for them, but if they can’t debate a point with me without automatically labelling me whatever, then they deserve the tag.
Who did I call a Rushbot? I said ANYBODY who sits here stereotyping others is most likely a Rushbot! A Rushbot is somebody who quotes RUSH and calls others idiots vs. debating the finer points of somebody else’s opinion. It’s a lazy way to debate, but whatever, to each their own.
I will do it anytime somebody can’t debate the point and lowers the debate. That’s the problem with the net, too many people calling one another names (libs, moonbat, whatnot on the right and nazi, brownshirt, et al on the left). I find it unacceptable and one more reason why we have problems in this country.
I would hope you agree somewhat with this? If not, at least tell me why.
——————————————————————————————-
lib·er·al Audio pronunciation of “liberal” ( P ) Pronunciation Key (lbr-l, lbrl)
adj.
1.
1. Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
2. Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.
3. Of, relating to, or characteristic of liberalism.
4. Liberal Of, designating, or characteristic of a political party founded on or associated with principles of social and political liberalism, especially in Great Britain, Canada, and the United States.
2.
1. Tending to give freely; generous: a liberal benefactor.
2. Generous in amount; ample: a liberal serving of potatoes.
Conservative:
con·ser·va·tive Audio pronunciation of “conservative” ( P ) Pronunciation Key (kn-s�rv-tv)
adj.
1. Favoring traditional views and values; tending to oppose change.
2. Traditional or restrained in style: a conservative dark suit.
3. Moderate; cautious: a conservative estimate.
4.
1. Of or relating to the political philosophy of conservatism.
2. Belonging to a conservative party, group, or movement.
5. Conservative Of or belonging to the Conservative Party in the United Kingdom or the Progressive Conservative Party in Canada.
6. Conservative Of or adhering to Conservative Judaism.
7. Tending to conserve; preservative: the conservative use of natural resources.
——————————————————————————————-
I am not against conservatives…I just hate that they’ve been co-opted by far right elements that are no different than the far left elements the right complains about in the Dem party.
Anyway, I appreciate your trying to TALK to me instead of labelling me. Let’s try for this from now on now that you understand where I am coming from (I hope).
July 13th, 2006 at 7:02 pmGood post Gerald. You and I aren’t that different.
Thanks for that.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:05 pmi have said that all along. that’s what we need, an electric fence. PERIOD. that will do the trick! at least SOMEONE is on the right track!
yeeeeha!
July 13th, 2006 at 7:08 pmI think smallpox infested dollar bills laid end to end across the border would be much cheaper and more effective. And we already have experience with this with Native Americans.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:12 pmconspiracy
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
Bushes explaination of 911 is a conspiracy theory …
People like me have no theory because we believe in scientific investigations… which was NOT done. What people like me do is look at the facts that are NOT opinion and say well that is science … it is NUMBERS… it is not POSSIBLE according to the laws of physics for the official conspiracy theory to be true because science didnt change just because of 911… I am not going to get into a debate about it here now… if you want them just type 911 scholars into google.
The fact of the matter is that you cannot dismiss the FACT that steel buildings have NEVER and will NEVER crumble. Steel NEVER melts into pools of molten metal because of fires from plane fuel or office fires or the mixture of the two. One building fell exactly like the first 2 WTC towers even though it was NEVER HIT by plane (even though planes dont bring down steel buildings)… and once again … it crumbled… STEEL DOES NOT CRUMBLE. Israeli spies were all over the US leading up to 911 doing all kinds of suspicious things like staying in an apartment right across the street from Mohammed Atta. Saudi royals were giving money to the Al Qeada people while they were here in the USA…. put options WERE placed on the very airlines that were crashed that day in suspiciously high volume right before 911… on and on and on… Is that all a theory? Hell no. It is a list of unacceptable holes in YOUR conspiracy theory… these holes would NEVER be accepted by real forensic detectives on any normal murder case… they would be looked into and explained… these things are not small they are GLARING and people like me feel STUPID accepting the official conspiracy theory when it obviously does not address these GLARING outstanding issues.
If a REAL investigation is done and most of these things can be explained then so be it… but I am no sheep … and neither should you nor ANY Americans be…
July 13th, 2006 at 7:17 pmMy question is why they are so worried about our southern border when it is the northern border that has actually been crossed by those who have dreamed of doing harm? Oh, I can answer my own question…bigotry.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:19 pmGerald, we didn’t just attack anyone for no reason. Your self degree from your ENLIGHTENED REASONING… is fine, but your “looking down” on people just because they don’t have your degree. That’s fine with me. Reagan will go down in history for speeding up the end of the Soviet Empire. Your views on God and Zen is up to you. I will never question someone’s beliefs. I have my beliefs to, I believe in Jesus. But I still enjoyed DOGMA. It cracked me up. Your “ENLIGTENED REASONING” is a little freaky though.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:21 pmBeadyeyeguy
I’ll agree with you dictionary versions of liberal and conservative. I’m going to label you one more time though, please don’t get offended. YOU ARE AN AMERICAN!!! Now, that may seem funny to some, but there are people out there, maybe but I doubt it Gerald, who find that label offensive. If you keep calling people Rushbots, your opening yourself up for someone to call a Deanbot. Ha Ha Ha
July 13th, 2006 at 7:28 pmComment by COMMENT BY JIM
It is not my enlightenment or reasoning .. it is the founding fathers… they talked about it themselves to explain the difference between themselves (believers in god) and the “religiousness” type people that were ignorant rubes that would sale their freedoms to a king if their preacher told them god told him to tell them to do so…
It is from them that I learned how one can believe in something irrational and still be as rational as a scienctist. It is irrational for me to love America… it is just a hunk of land… America was even born on the holocaust of the American Indians and the slavery of the blacks, but I still love America… it is irrational… and so is my faith that it will eventually rise up out of the past of human ignorance and truelly set the example for the rest of the world to follow … AND NEVER GO BACK…. but like the founding fathers I and YOU must be rational… reasoned… and enlightened … to make that happen… faith isnt enough… sometimes even armed revolution is neccessary … I fully believe that it was the original ideas of Jesus that eventually lead to the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights and the freeing of the slaves… NOT the DOGMA… the cult like sheepish followers of the right is a weakness that slows America down from reaching that eventual goal that the Statue of Liberty is lighting the path to…. and it is the conservatives (the real conservatives) that moderate us all and keep us from going too fast too soon…
freaky? There is nothing freaky about enlightment and reasoning .. it is the best thing humanity as going for it.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:34 pmGerald, we didn’t just attack anyone for no reason.
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
You are right the neo cons PNAC had it planed out long before 911.
http://www.newamericancentury.org/
July 13th, 2006 at 7:36 pmGerald Gibson
Okay Gerald, now you’ve done it. A lady I worked with sent me the e-mail address for the proffessor from Utah? I’ve watched the videos of the towers going down and seen the pictures of the red hot steel being brought out of the ashes after burning for two weeks. Physics. Your telling me that the towers should have fallen to the right or left? Yeah, if they had Godzilla chest bump them. Those buildings fell from within Gerald. I also read where the government had the buildings set with explosives so they would self implode. Yeah, keep bringing the FACTS…….
July 13th, 2006 at 7:36 pmSome of you are simply braindead.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:42 pmHe’s NOT comparing livstock with people. He’s saying that the electric fence is no more dangerous to people then it is to livestock. Christ people, some of you must enjoy spending your lives doing nothing but drawing rediculous conclusions.
You don’t want a fence? Great.
If AND when this country is attacked again and this time it’s YOU who looses a family member, and it’s determined that the “terrorists” gained illegal entry from Mexico, tell me, who are you going to whine to? Who are you going blame?
My suggestion would be yourselves.
Jim: Fair enough. I am an American and you aren’t a Rushbot, LOL. But then again, we are both Americans, even if we don’t always agree on policy or party platforms :)
If somebody called me a Deanbot, I’d laugh…but tell them not to label me that either :)
July 13th, 2006 at 7:47 pmGerald, I enjoy reading your quotes. Your a little broad with the ” ignorant rubes” comment, but that’s your right. I think you’ve just insulted 3/4 of the worlds population, but that’s up to you. Just a question, and I’m sure you have an answer..\
What is your definition of a great society?
July 13th, 2006 at 7:47 pmThose buildings fell from within Gerald. I also read where the government had the buildings set with explosives so they would self implode. Yeah, keep bringing the FACTS…….
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
Yes they did fall from within … that is the whole point .. I am glad you can see the truth right in front of you … that is called an implosion. That is what happens when a controlled demolition occurs… think about Oklahoma city … when that steel federal building got hit by a blast far larger than a plane crash the structure did not crumble parts of it broke off as you would expect from steel…. THAT is the difference… and the force of gravity is what would have caused those buildings to fall to one side or the other… that is physics .. that is why professional demolitions companies do not let gravity bring down buildings … steel will twist and bend causing it to fall over .. THAT is why they use explosives to cause them to IMPLODE straight down onto their own foot prints… as far as what you said about the government putting them in there … I find that highly unlikely.. I once heard someone try to say the government did it incase they got attacked again like in 1993 so that they would not fall over on the rest of New York … well that makes sense at first, but I find it highly unlikely … it would be too risky because you never know if something might accidently set those explosives off …
damn now you got me debating it when I wasnt intending to here … just go to http://www.st911.org/
lots of good stuff there… some of it goes into left field, but most is scientific.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:48 pmIf AND when this country is attacked again and this time it’s YOU who looses a family member, and it’s determined that the “terrorists†gained illegal entry from Mexico, tell me, who are you going to whine to? Who are you going blame?
My suggestion would be yourselves.
Comment by CED
Are you saying that a terrorist can not get through a god damn fence when cows do it?
IF we are attacked again it will most likely be a revenge attack from an Iraqi….
July 13th, 2006 at 7:50 pmCED: If this country is attacked again, not only will that be a shame, but it will be blamed on Bush, not the average citizen.
You fix the immigrant problem by enforcing employer verification. If they have to keep all records on file and cannot produce them, they risk hurting their businesses.
As for terrorism, guess what? With the patriot act and all this domestic and international spying the feds do, if they can’t stop another attack that’s on them and they should be held responsible for their malfeance. The buck stops at the President’s desk PERIOD.
And one more thing, we will only win this war on terror by sticking to our principles as well as making sure the terrorists NEVER have one second of calm to plan. War will not solve this NOR will passing more Patriot Acts. If Osama can tie us up in perpetual war and force us to spy on our own citizens while throwing all of our rules of law out the window, he wins. Do you want Osama to win? I sure don’t.
He wants to break us by making us violate our constitutional principles, our values as a country AND bankrupt our economy with wars. Funny thing is, Bush seems to be falling into this trap time and time again. Sad…
July 13th, 2006 at 7:53 pmGerald, I enjoy reading your quotes. Your a little broad with the †ignorant rubes†comment, but that’s your right. I think you’ve just insulted 3/4 of the worlds population, but that’s up to you. Just a question, and I’m sure you have an answer..\
What is your definition of a great society?
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
Yes I did insult that many people … but hell 300 years ago that was 99.999% of the people … today it is only 75% … we are on our way… some day we will have religion with no dogma and all will be well …
Great society? Star Trek’s Earth? Didnt the story go they got over killing each other and decided to work together to explore the universe? Then again having a common space alien enemy (Klingons or whatever) probably helped >-) …
Great society? I would guess that if you took America today… toned down the capitalism (aka share the wealth/generate wealth specifically for sharing it)… toned down the religiousness nuts … and educated everyone on the U.S. Constitution, Bill of Rights, Jesus, Ghandi, Zen, Buddha THEN we would have a great society .. and eventually a Great world as we set the example…. A perfect society? No. Sadely there will always be child predators, murderers, theifs etc….
July 13th, 2006 at 7:55 pmBeadyeyeguy
Sooner or later we Americans must stick together. Just like the Brits, the Russians, the Itailians, Japanese ect. ect. There are big fish in the sea. And these fish have teeth and bad breath. China, Iran, North Korea, Syria and the girls from “The View”… :)
July 13th, 2006 at 7:56 pmGerald: Remember the kids who got busted plotting attacks in Canada a month ago? They aren’t Al Qaeda affiliated but were inspired. Timothy McVeigh wasn’t Al Qaeda but he hated America for whatever sick reason. That’s what makes me laugh when these people say things like a fence will stop terrorists. Our next attack may be homegrown and not from the Arab AQ advocates :(
Sad that some can’t see this.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:56 pmJim:
If an enemy marched up our shores, I fight. I just don’t think we need to attack toothless nations such as Iraq when we knew Iran and No.Korea were bigger problems.
As for China, I am not so worried about them militarily. Economically is another matter all together. If China ever decides to dump the U.S. debt it’s purchased, we could be in for a very rude awakening.
July 13th, 2006 at 7:58 pmP.S. – I believe in the idea of sovereignty. Conservatives of old did. Too bad this generation of propagandists disguised as conservative politicians thinks that attacking anybody without proof is perfectly okay :(
July 13th, 2006 at 8:00 pmGerald
Now if your going to use physics use it correctly. An object the size of the Fed Building in Oklahoma was how many stories tall? And how tall were the Trade Towers? The taller a structure the more frail it becomes. A truck bomb against a jet flying oh, 200-300 miles an hour. Your short changing yourself here Gerald. I didn’t intend to get into this either, but it’s time we all get to the bottom of some stuff. Use physics Gerald, I hated the course in college, but I did get the basics.
July 13th, 2006 at 8:03 pmBeadyeyeguy and Gerald Gibson
Its been fun guys. I love a good debate. I just want a good place for my son to grow up in. He’s 19 months old. My wife and I don’t agree on politics at all, but we agree on the future we want for our son and our family. The same thing with my fellow Americans, whether it be Rushbots or Deanbots or in Geralds case, Incrediblebots. :)
July 13th, 2006 at 8:16 pmThe taller a structure the more frail it becomes.
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
False. Steel does not lose strength because it is stacked.
An hollow aluminum tube going a couple hundred miles an hour is NOTHING compared to the specially hardened steel that is used in these buildings.
A Bomber in the 1950s loaded with bombs ran straight into the upper floors of the empire state building … it was a big bomber to… yet no magic crumbling steel .. and that was old steel … not like modern steel.
There is a video out there were a guy uses a physics caluclator lab to show exactly how a building would fall and parts of it would fall if it was falling through air instead of crashing down on itself… it is physically impossible for those buildings to fall straight down at full speed when they had to crush their way through hardened steel.
The guy that made this video is very bright and shows in detail several SCIENTIFIC holes in the offical story…
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3498980438587461603&q=911
July 13th, 2006 at 8:22 pmIncrediblebots. :)
Comment by COMMENT BY JIM
Well you dont seem like a troll … so am I supposed to be offended? >-)
July 13th, 2006 at 8:23 pmThanks Jim: Take care. I too want what’s best for all Americans. The sooner we look for common ground as a people, the better off we hopefully should be. That is, unless the politicos haven’t sold us all out for a couple pieces of gold ;)
Gerald: I think he’s kidding. If he were a troll, he’d stick to his guns on calling me a libbie and not engage us whatsoever.
July 13th, 2006 at 8:29 pm[...] Steve King, a House representative from New York, has compared illegal immigrants to livestock in saying that we should build an electric fence to corral them like we would cows. Isn’t that darling? [...]
July 13th, 2006 at 8:35 pmI’m not trying to offend anybody. I’ve got better things to do. Like insult my wife? Hell no she’s Italian and its not a pretty picture when she’s mad. Look at the video of the towers themself Gerald. You are taking every conspiracy theory to heart.
July 13th, 2006 at 8:44 pmBeadyeyeguy and Gerald
You guys have a good evening, I’m sure we’ll talk again soon. TP is cool. This story got over 200 hits. Go figure?
July 13th, 2006 at 8:55 pmKing equates immigrants with livestock…
Here’s Republican Rep. Steve King on the House floor:KING: So when I get down there and sit on that border, what I do is I come to this conclusion, we can’t shut that off unless we build a fence and…
July 13th, 2006 at 8:58 pmInstead of building a great wall of America, we should annex Mexico, El Salvador, Guatemala, Yucatan, Belize, Nicaragua, Honduras, Costa Rica, and Panama the whole way to the Panama Canal. I say build the wall there at the narrowest part of the isthmus. A Little Wall of America wouldn’t be so expensive to build or staff–and not such a national embarrassment. The new Central American countries can become full-fledged States among the United States and all the citizens can then become taxpayers and move about the U.S. as legally as we Floridians can drive to Georgia. We could make an interstate or two and drive to Acapulco, if our gas holds out. English is the superior language and will naturally win out against the competition when everyone has a cell phone and satellite TV. And the U.S. would have real live volcanoes as part of our heritage.
Then we should go for Canada. Not too many of them speak French. Then the stars section of our flag could have a nice round number of 60, and we’d have 120 Senators. The new Americans could be easily courted to become compassionate conservative Republicans.
Panama canal length: 51 miles (89,760 yards).
Mexican-American border: 1,900 miles.
Great China Wall length: 3948 miles.
Canadian-American border: 5525 miles.
“GOOD NEIGHBOR,” Senator Sessions, wasn’t smart enough to look up Frost’s _Mending Wall_ before quoting a line from it either:
I see him there,
Bringing a stone grasped firmly by the top
In each hand, like an old-stone savage armed.
HE MOVES IN DARKNESS AS IT SEEMS TO ME,
Not of woods only and the shade of trees.
He will not go behind his father’s saying,
And he likes having thought of it so well
He says again, “Good fences make good neighbors.”
But I suppose most Americans are just as dumb. I wonder if Mr. Bush will spend more on talking up The Fence than he has on New Orleans? He’s got the whole Mr. Murdoch-owned press ready to deceive everyone into believing that a 19% fence will protect our fearful selves. Will I dream of National Guardsmen shooting Central Americans as they attempt the triple-fence? Will it be electrified like Huxley’s fence around the Savage Reservation in _Brave New World_? Will anyone ever question whether it’s we or they who are the savages?
July 13th, 2006 at 9:00 pm[…] Steve King, a House representative from New York, has compared illegal immigrants to livestock in saying that we should build an electric fence to corral them like we would cows. Isn’t that darling? […]
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What an absolutely rediculous statement. If we use your logic of “corraling them” (Mexicans), then aren’t we also corraling Americans from illegally crossing the boarder into Mexico? A fence would work both ways.
All he is saying is “American citizens are OVERWHELMINGLY fed up with Mexicans crossing the boarder ILLEGALLY to come into our country”.
Every recent poll has concluded beyond the shadow of a doubt, that American citizens are just plain fuc**ng tired of illegal aliens sucking up resources.
And that included illegal aliens of ANY nationality. NOT just Mexicans.
Period. End of story.
July 13th, 2006 at 9:49 pmWhile I commend Rep. King for his attempt to find a ’solution’ to this issue he feels so strongly about, I question his ability to prioritize. Why is a border fence considered to be more urgent than making sure our chemical weapons storage facilities, here at home, are as secure as possible? Or working with Russia to secure those ‘loose nukes’, that GWB parroted John Kerry saying, that they are ‘the greatest threat facing us.’ Haven’t heard a word about either one of those projects. This is just another one of those ‘look busy’ schemes, that the Righties are so fond of. It does not need to work, they just want something to show the folks back home, at election time. But hey, if he can make a few bucks off of it at the same time… It is about 4 months till election day, this ‘plan’ is going nowhere after that.
July 13th, 2006 at 9:55 pm[...] As interpreted by Republican Congressman Steve King of Iowa. (Download for Windows Media coming soon) [...]
July 13th, 2006 at 9:58 pmComment by Cyra Brown
While I commend Rep. King for his attempt to find a ’solution’ to this issue he feels so strongly about, I question his ability to prioritize. Why is a border fence considered to be more urgent than making sure our chemical weapons storage facilities, here at home, are as secure as possible?
Just how many surveys and polls would YOU need to read to be convinced that securing our boarders is EXACTLY what American citizens feel IS the Nunber 1
July 13th, 2006 at 10:16 pmpriority?
Another way for oil companies to reap profits on the misery of others. Who will make the electricity?
July 13th, 2006 at 10:31 pmAnother way for oil companies to reap profits on the misery of others. Who will make the electricity?
Comment by catherine — July 13, 2006 @ 10:31 pm
My suggestion would be for you to buy some stock in these nasty, greedy oil companies, and reap some of the profits yourself.
July 13th, 2006 at 10:41 pmIllegal immigration is not the problem; stop using the term. The real problem is illegal employers. Stop using illegal immigration; start using illegal employers and demand that they be punished under the law.
Every time “illegal immigration” is used it reinforces the “right” framework. Change the framework to “illegal employers”. Let’s go after them!!!!
July 13th, 2006 at 10:56 pmComment by Siskiyou Sam
Illegal immigration is not the problem; stop using the term. The real problem is illegal employers. Stop using illegal immigration; start using illegal employers and demand that they be punished under the law.
Sorry pal. They ARE ILLEGAL ALIENS.
July 13th, 2006 at 11:13 pmPeople are not going to dumb down their vocabulary to appease people like you who do everything in their power to redefine the english language.
Of course they are illegal aliens; but they wouldn’t stay if there were no illegal employers, and surely a wall or fence will not stop them. I said nothing about redefining anything. I repeat: Illegal immigration is not the problem; stop using the term. The real problem is illegal employers. Stop using illegal immigration (it’s not the problem); start using illegal employers (it is the problem) and demand that they be punished under the law.
July 13th, 2006 at 11:30 pm[...] He’s on again about immigration according to this article in the Des Moines Register. This time he wants to stop multilingual ballots and electrify the Mexican border fence. There’s picture and video goodness here at thinkprogress.org. [...]
July 14th, 2006 at 12:40 amNO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO COME HERE, JUST BECAUSE THEY WANT TO.
“Give me your tired, your poor — your huddled masses yearning to breathe free. The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. I lift my lamp beside the golden door.”*
(*Unless they’re brown Catholics, or course.)
Pax
July 14th, 2006 at 12:45 amrats – “OF course”, not “or course.” (Happens ev’ry time.)
July 14th, 2006 at 12:46 amMexican border should have been secured over 50 years ago > just after WWII! But having said that, the most influx of illegals has occured under Bush Junior’s watch > about 8 to 10 million flooded in since he got into the presidency! I think he cut a deal with President Fox, of Mexico, to leave the border wide open, so the Mexican poor could be exploited for cheap labor, plus it has kept the minimum wage from being raised > GOP loves that unfortunately!
July 14th, 2006 at 1:21 amI think the politicians are playing dumb on this one. Controling illegal immigration doesn’t seem to be THAT great of a challenge. The catch is, you have to actually WANT to do it. I don’t think that either party really wants to. The republicans see a huge labor supply for their Masters in business to exploit. The democrats see a huge new voting block for themselves.
July 14th, 2006 at 1:28 amIn the mid-ninties I thought that we want to globalize…so what is this return to the “closed-economy” model? Didn’t we say that it is obsolete…all economies MUST open?
We want the world to consume our goods and services, work for peanuts but we will not let them step into the “paradise”. So cage them…or cage us?
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One building fell exactly like the first 2 WTC towers even though it was NEVER HIT by plane
Seismic forces could explain this. The impact of the planes into the towers and the towers collapsing are equivalent to an earthquake.
There’s only one way for a building to fall – straight down. It’s basic statics. There’s not enough “push” that exists to be able to topple anything that large. It’s why you won’t see a building fall over like a tree. They are too large.
July 14th, 2006 at 11:10 amThere’s a logical explanation for how the towers fell.
It doesn’t excuse Bush for not having investigated the report he inherited from Clinton’s Administration aptly titled “Osams determined to attack within the US”, and having done something to stop it. At best he is guilty of being an accomplice by neglect, at worst, he turned a blind eye to events that he knew were unfolding in order to reep the ‘benefits’.
I just think the Inside Job Theory makes liberal look bad when a large portion of it is based on strawmen (steel melting, buildings falling within themselves, etc.) It’s why I show you all the holes. So, you’ll understand that the structural part of this theory is not reality based. Sorry.
July 14th, 2006 at 11:18 am[...] As interpreted by Republican Congressman Steve King of Iowa. Download for Windows Media,Quicktime coming soon. And for all the peoples now on YouTube. [...]
July 14th, 2006 at 11:19 am[...] A GOP representative has the solution to illegal immigrants: electric fences. Apparently this is a good solution to him, because “We do this with livestock all the time.” [...]
July 14th, 2006 at 11:41 amWhat would happen if the US built a wall by 2007?
Mexicans win the Olympic pole-vaulting event, taking gold, silver, bronze, copper, aluminum, and zinc medals.
4 years later, they take the [new sport] Olympic freestyle Tunnelling event…
4 years later, all the swimming events, and some new events involving hang-gliders and minisubs.
hee hee.
July 14th, 2006 at 11:44 amAre we putting a wall to keep others out, or to imprison us?
July 14th, 2006 at 1:26 pmyea
July 14th, 2006 at 2:17 pmWe have become everything we said we stood against. Mr. Bush, tear down this wall. You might want to dynamite the Statue of Liberty while you’re at it so the rest of the world knows that we’re closed for business. And for the record Human Beings are not livestock, jackhole.
July 14th, 2006 at 4:46 pm[...] go to source/story>> Think Progress » Rep. King Designs Electrified Fence For Southern Border: ‘We Do This With Livestock All The Time’ [...]
July 14th, 2006 at 5:15 pmCompare them to livestock?
My Husband prefers to refer to them as Cockroaches.
July 15th, 2006 at 11:26 amMy Husband prefers to refer to them as Cockroaches.
Comment by Jesi — July 15, 2006 @ 11:26 am
As we prefer to refer to your type as Human Garbage.
July 15th, 2006 at 11:40 amI have aleays maintained that the main problem with Washington is that it is too full of Democrats and Republicans. This is just one more example.
July 16th, 2006 at 1:10 amBuild the Wall! Keep out Mexi-Nazi Supremacists!
July 16th, 2006 at 3:07 pmThat model was actually taken from his GI Joe set at home in Kiron where he enjoys playing “Fallujah” on the weekends.
We must remember this is the same man who when commenting on Abu Ghraib said the torture “amounts to hazing.”
If I lived one county to the West, I would be in his district. I wake up everymorning thankful that I don’t.
July 20th, 2006 at 9:34 am[...] Rep. King Designs Electrified Fence For Southern Border: ‘We Do This With Livestock All The Time’ Rep. Steve King (R-IA) went on the House floor on Tuesday to discuss a fence that he “designed†for the southern boarder. (King constructed a model of the fence as he was speaking.) King’s design features a wire electrified “with the kind of current that would not kill somebody.†King noted that “we do this with livestock all the time.†[...]
August 2nd, 2006 at 6:35 pmWhat is to stop these mexican economic terrorists from digging 7 feet down and 10 feet under the base of the fence and popping up on the American side like a disgusting flea infested Gofer “AKA” (Rodent) on a private golf course leaving pot holes and a trail of turds in it’s wake before crapping out an anchor baby a year your tax dollars pay for while the rest of us can’t afford to get a basic checkup because the middle class can’t find a job because corporations can’t make massive profits by paying anyone over the minimum wage or offering health coverage to the millions of americans who can no longer pay there mortgage and face losing everything so illegals can have a better life then in the country they have little interest in improving when they can get it all free in america with your stolen SSN and enjoy great financing using your good Credit rating before them destroy it and move on to another victim. After all, it’s only legal american tax paying citizens that suffer, so who cares?
September 20th, 2006 at 4:27 pm[...] 76. Rep. Steve King (R-IA) went on the House floor to unveil a fence that he “designed” for the southern border. King constructed a model of the fence as he said, “We do this with livestock all the time.” [Link] [...]
November 6th, 2006 at 6:10 pmthis is a good idea, it works in Israel it will work here.
November 26th, 2006 at 8:09 pmI live in Austin, Texas and know very many illegals.
They would rather be living in Mexico and stay with their families and friends.
I say send them back. Then they could vote the crooks out (the crooks are 150+ families) that run Mexico.
Mexico’s culture is about three thousand years old. Mexico has an incredible amount of natural resources. The Mexican worker is dedicated and highly motivated. So; why aren’t we playing “catch up” to Mexico’s economy? It is because their own elites have robbed and cheated the common citizens of Mexico for centuries.
We, the US, have sent billions of dollars to Mexico for the devopment of infrastructure. Building of schools, water and sewage treatment plants, roads, & etc. Where has the money gone? Into the hands of the ruling elit of Mexico.
Does Vicente Fox want Mexico’s most dedicated workers back in Mexico? No. Why? Because if they were there they would vote him and his corrupt government and his buddies out of office. Why does my president, George Bush, not seem to care for Mexican citizens? I don’t know. If he did he would force the Mexican illegals back into their own country where they would overthrow the current and corrupt Mexican government. Viva la Revolution !!!
If Mexicans could stay in their own country and earn an honest wage and support their own families then they wouldn’t want to come to the US.
There are some business people here in the US that care more about their own businesses and wallets, so much so that they do not mind “enslaving” Mexican nationals in a system that makes the Mexican workers “indentured servants.” They also don’t care what is happening to our country and our culture and our language and our values and our traditions. All to put a buck in their own pockets. Shame on them.
Stopping the illegals from entering our country is not only easy it is truly compassionate. Build a barricade. No amnesty. No birthright to citizenship. Employer sanctions. Actually, all of these restrictions already pertain to non-citizens of Mexico. The Mexican government has all of these laws in place and strictly enforces them – so why don’t we? The answer is that we, the citizens of the US, appear to want a “slave” society where we can use and abuse citizens of another country and culture to do our bidding and to force them to survive in a secondary “shadow” culture.
There would be nothing better for our country than to have an economically strong and viable neighbor to the south, Mexico. As it is we have a “crippled” neighbor that must rely upon the handouts of our country to survive. “Crippled” by our inaction and our complacency. “Crippled” because we do not care enough about them to help their downtrodden citizenry overthrow their corrupt government. “Crippled” because we do not send their most motivated and dedicated citzens back to their own country where they would demand and effectuate the basic changes that need to be instituted to create a country where its own people could live and earn a decent living that would allow them to stay within their own borders and enjoy their own families.
If anyone cares about Mexico and the Mexican people then they cannot argue that Mexicans would rather be living in Mexico with their own families; on their own land; and in their own culture.
Only someone that wants a “slave” to support their business income and rob an American of work in America would disagree and want to continue the “slavery” of Mexican workers in our country.
Build the barricade. Enforce our borders. No amnesty. No birthright to citizenship. Employer sanctions. What is good for Mexico (and these are their laws) is good for the US.
John Corbin
November 29th, 2006 at 12:45 am[...] Mexican immigrants plan to masively use the Koran By La bloguera And you thought Steve King (R-IA) was out there? [...]
December 20th, 2006 at 12:20 pmWow…
February 11th, 2007 at 1:21 pmThese are people who we’re talking about. Building this wall will do nothing and is somewhat not humane. The Mexicans will find other means of getting, and will persist until they do. Not only is this walling a bad idea, but it definitely isn’t helping our world relationships. Besides, this wall would cost billions of dollars each year to maintain. I strongly believe that our efforts could be better used. If the United States helps Mexico in making it a better place and more desirable, Mexicans would stay there. I do believe that they would want to stay in there home country if possible. They are sick of being in poverty and poor. They are coming to the United States for a better life. We could give them that life, and help our fellow neighbors without going to too much trouble. America could help them raise their economy by creating laws, such as minimum wage and other labor laws. The last thing that we need to do is to make more enemies and spend billions on a pointless wall while we haven’t finished our business in Iraq (As for that matter, George Bush needs to get over himself, end the war, and send our troops home.) Our culture can’t digress any more to that lowly state. We can stop it now. Nip it in the bud before it blooms. Along with helping Mexico’s economy, I think that the United States should grant citizenship to some (not all) of the illegal immigrants coming into this country. People have been complaining about them entering this country illegally and not paying taxes. This would solve that issue. Finally, pertaining to the hard labor that we have Mexicans doing, who would build the wall? Most convenient stores, McDonald’s, fast food joints, and hard labor is being accomplished by the illegal Mexicans.
February 11th, 2007 at 2:01 pmThese are people who we’re talking about, not livestock. Building this wall will do nothing and, I believe, it is not humane. The Mexicans will find other means of getting in, and will persist until they do. Not only is this walling a bad idea, but it definitely isn’t helping our world relationships. Besides, this wall would cost billions of dollars each year to maintain. I strongly believe that our efforts could be better used. If the United States helps Mexico in making it a better place and more desirable, Mexicans would stay there. I do believe that they would want to stay in there home country if possible. They are sick of being in poverty. They are coming to the United States for a better life just as early Americans did.
February 11th, 2007 at 4:16 pmIn representative Steve King’s proposal, he says “If somehow they got their laws working and their economy working…†they wouldn’t need to come here. The Bush administration has identified the issue, but isn’t doing anything about it. We could give them that better life, and help our fellow neighbors without going to too much trouble. America could help them raise their economy by creating laws, such as minimum wage and other labor laws. The last thing that we need to do is to make more enemies and spend billions on a pointless wall while we haven’t finished our business in Iraq. Our culture can’t regress any more to this lowly state of not allowing certain people in our country for unclear reasons. We can stop it now. Nip it in the bud before it blooms. Along with helping Mexico’s economy, I think that the United States should grant citizenship to some (not all) of the illegal immigrants coming into this country. People have been complaining about them entering this country illegally and not paying taxes. How is it harming us if they become citizens? This would solve that issue. Finally, pertaining to the hard labor that we have Mexicans doing, most convenience stores, fast food joints, and other hard labor is being accomplished by the illegal Mexican.
I’m 13. I made a few mistake in the previous. Here is the new one. Oh, and sorry if it shows up twice.
These are people who we’re talking about, not livestock. Building this wall will do nothing and, I believe, it is not humane. The Mexicans will find other means of getting in, and will persist until they do. Not only is this walling a bad idea, but it definitely isn’t helping our world relationships. Besides, this wall would cost billions of dollars each year to maintain. I strongly believe that our efforts could be better used. If the United States helps Mexico in making it a better place and more desirable, Mexicans would stay there. I do believe that they would want to stay in there home country if possible. They are sick of being in poverty. They are coming to the United States for a better life just as early Americans did.
February 11th, 2007 at 4:18 pmIn representative Steve King’s proposal, he says “If somehow they got their laws working and their economy working…†they wouldn’t need to come here. The Bush administration has identified the issue, but isn’t doing anything about it. We could give them that better life, and help our fellow neighbors without going to too much trouble. America could help them raise their economy by creating laws, such as minimum wage and other labor laws. The last thing that we need to do is to make more enemies and spend billions on a pointless wall while we haven’t finished our business in Iraq. Our culture can’t regress any more to this lowly state of not allowing certain people in our country for unclear reasons. We can stop it now. Nip it in the bud before it blooms. Along with helping Mexico’s economy, I think that the United States should grant citizenship to some (not all) of the illegal immigrants coming into this country. People have been complaining about them entering this country illegally and not paying taxes. How is it harming us if they become citizens? This would solve that issue. Finally, pertaining to the hard labor that we have Mexicans doing, most convenience stores, fast food joints, and other hard labor is being accomplished by the illegal Mexican.
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