Bush Dismisses Generals’ Concerns: ‘I Hear People Say, Well, Civil War This, Civil War That’
Bush Dismisses Generals’ Concerns: ‘I Hear People Say, Well, Civil War This, Civil War That’
Last week, Gen. John Abizaid, the Commander of the U.S. Central Command, raised the prospect that Iraq could be sliding toward civil war. Abizaid said, “I believe that the sectarian violence is probably is as bad as I’ve seen it in Baghdad in particular, and that if not stopped, it is possible that Iraq could move toward civil war.” Gen. Peter Pace, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said, “I believe we do have the possibility of that devolving to a civil war.”
Today at a press conference, President Bush dismissed these concerns out of hand. Bush said, “You know, I hear people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that. The Iraqi people decided against civil war when they went to the ballot box.”
More than one hundred Iraqi civilians are dying per day, mostly in sectarian violence, according to a recent U.N. report.
Extended transcript:
BUSH: My attitude is that a young democracy has been born quite quickly. And I think the Iraqi government has shown remarkable progress on the political front. And that is is that they developed a modern constitution that was ratified by the people and then 12 million people voted for a government.
Which gives me confidence about the future in Iraq, by the way. You know, I hear people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that. The Iraqi people decided against civil war when they went to the ballot box. And a unity government is working to respond to the will of the people. And, frankly, it’s quite a remarkable achievement on the political front.
And the security front is where there has been troubles. And it’s going to be up to the Maliki government, with U.S. help, to use the trained forces and eventually a trained police force to take care of those who are trying to foment sectarian violence.
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Well he’s “the Decider” and has apparently decided that civil war is not happening.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:44 amDid the American people vote against civil war when they went to the ballot box in 1860?
Can someone please get W to open a history book?
August 7th, 2006 at 11:45 am“You know, I hear people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that. The Iraqi people decided against civil war when they went to the ballot box.â€
August 7th, 2006 at 11:47 amThis jerk is so deluded! When the Iraqis went to the ballot box they voted for whoever their tribal/clan leader told them to vote for. Hundreds of people are being killed each week with most of the carnage not due to AlQaeda “terrists” but Sunnis and Shiia capturing, torturing and killing the other.
The political front has no ability to stop this, as the security forces are comprised of Shiite militia whose controllers have little ability to intervene. Remember, in this government, the Sunni have only three “ministeries” and none of them involve security.
What a damn farce! Blow it out your ass Mr President!
Incompetent,dangerous POTUS this,incompetent,dangerous POTUS that.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:47 amGood God Almighty, he’s going to be at “Well, my Mom still likes me” levels of popularity. No wonder this idiot is toxic to 2006 GOP Congressional prospects.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:48 aminteresting definition.
now could we have such a distinct and salient definition for what victory is in regards to afganistan and iraq?
August 7th, 2006 at 11:49 amWow, maybe we’d believe the President ChickenHawk himself if he actually gave a speech in the Iraq Parliament, and then wandered about outside the Green Zone, lightly armed with no security or bodyguards otherwise, just the way the Iraqis themselves have to live
Of course, the fact that W doesn’t give advance notice that he’s traveling to Iraq kind of always undercuts his Pollyannaish naivete and flat-out lies regarding how wonderful Iraq is going
There’s not a level of Hell miserable enough for W and his whole Administration to suffer through for all eternity, even though he’ll be keeping company with the likes of Saddam’s sons, al-Zarqawi and his multimillionaire brother in arms & ideology, Usama bin Laden
August 7th, 2006 at 11:49 amSo much for “listening to the generals” Bush has been touting (as if this was believable). More cherry-picking of intelligence.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:51 amTo quote the great Wolcott “if Bush’s brain were any clearer it’d be a patch of blue sky.”
August 7th, 2006 at 11:53 amWhat do generals on the ground know about war? Dubya the drunken AWOL coward and his five deferment chickenhawk side kick and ultra-chickenshit chickenhawk brain Karl Rove say stay the course….
August 7th, 2006 at 11:54 amAll this time hasn’t he been saying, the generals on the ground will be making the decisions about troop strengths, etc?
August 7th, 2006 at 11:54 amWhat happened? Did they all just become as STOOPID as the prezidunce?
Well, civil war this, civil war that.
How old is our President? 5th grade? Thats probably the most juvenile response I’ve ever seen from him.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:55 amHe’s really echoing Condi here. The “democracy has been born” line sounds very similar to her “birth pangs” comment from last week. And the whole “remarkable political achievement” sounds like it’s straight from Condi’s mouth.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:57 amYou know, it was sort of fun bashing bush these last years, but this is NO FUN anymore.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:57 amStupid is as stupid does and Bush is stupid. He’s a puppet and his bosses tell him just sit and drink we’ll decide what to do. Our only hope is that Nov. brings a change of power and Bush steppes down before his impeachment. We should all pray that Americans join together to remove the corrupt officials quickly and get our troops out of this mess Bush has put them in. All the lies and stealing have caught up with this Administration. We have no Secretary of State just a girlfriend of the President holding the title. Cheney is working hard to steal as much money as he can before he leaves for medical problems and joins Ken Lay on the island.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:57 amI agree with KingCranky. Bush is the personification of denial and his credibility regarding Iraq is completely shot. Perhaps he is trying to appeal to those Americans who still believe that Iraq somehow possesses those elusive WMD. Seeing him make these erroneous assertions gives hope that someone will write a play for the 21st century entitled: “The Madness of King George.”
August 7th, 2006 at 11:57 amTime for our troop transports to load em up and head them out of bull shit bush’s hell…..My wish would be for all the troops to come home and surround the white house..Arrest and jail all the reich wingers and supporters of this terrible madness……Blessings, the world needs them …Peace, demand it now…..
August 7th, 2006 at 11:58 amI find myself anticipating tomorrow’s primary in Connecticut. THIS TO ME IS THE LITMUS TEST to what I WANT SO BADLY to happen in November…
August 7th, 2006 at 11:59 amGolly gee, what an intelligent, insightful and realistic appraisal of what is happening in George’s war. It must be a wonderful world in which gwb lives, because it certainly not the same one the rest of the world occupies. We have too much time left with this unfettered crazy man. If November doesn’t bring change to the power structure in Congress, then we may see civil war in the USA.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:59 am“You know, I hear people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that.”
Um…hello…those “people” are your generals.
August 7th, 2006 at 11:59 amWell, civil war this, civil war that.
I wonder just how unconcerned Dubya will be when it’s his country that’s in the throes of a civil war…
August 7th, 2006 at 12:00 pmHmmm…I thought i heard him say many times that he doesnt follow politics but only follows advice of the general on the ground……I guess that wasnt true either.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:00 pmDrop Bush outside the Green Zone in Baghdad to let him see for himself what a mess he has caused there!
August 7th, 2006 at 12:01 pm“a young democracy has been born quite quickly”
it wasn’t “born”… it wasn’t even conceived…
August 7th, 2006 at 12:02 pm#18
August 7th, 2006 at 12:04 pmI predict after Holy Joe is rebuffed and Lamont is taken in, ‘Ole Joe will become a Fox Contributor or Analyst within a month. He will be painting the horrible picture of what the Democratic Party is becoming and oogie boogieing the right with what will happen if the Dems take control.
#16 - Great idea Erroll - working on Act I, Scene I - The energy conference summit at the beginning of this Administration’s tenure…
August 7th, 2006 at 12:04 pm#22 - Make sure he wears his ‘flight suit’, you know, the one with the formidable cod piece!
August 7th, 2006 at 12:06 pmMy attitude is that a young democracy has been born quite quickly.
After a quick rape from the US that is. But this blastocyst of a democracy must be allowed to grow and become a “Sandflake”. We can not murder this blastocyst of freedom.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:06 pmWould someone please give this moron a drool bib, put him in a dark corner and duct tape his feeble genitals to his zipper?
August 7th, 2006 at 12:07 pmBush is truly insane. We have an insane person sitting in the oval office. No, I do not feel safe.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:07 pmFiddle dee-dee…war, war, war! I’m tired of all this war talk!
August 7th, 2006 at 12:08 pm-Scarlett
Lieberman will become another Zell Miller after tomorrow > ranting about Democrats being slime, but his GOP pals are pure corrupt filth, so who cares what Joe does after Tuesday!
August 7th, 2006 at 12:08 pmTo Bushco the Iraqis are just in the way of plundered Oil
August 7th, 2006 at 12:10 pmTry this.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:10 pmThey do not care about our country or the people of Iraq or anywhere else.
Quit assuming that they do, or that they care about what kind of job they are doing.
They have their agenda, and it’s not protecting the USA from WMD’s transported by camel in Iraq.
The fact that the reason for invading Iraq is a moving target that they change at will and are never held responsible for should tell us all something.
They do whatever they want, and get away with it.
This SOB couldn’t care less about the crap that he spits, or the damage that they do.
He knows they will never pay for it.
And I’m not thinking in cash.
The biggest irony of the last 6 years is that gwb was a history major at Yale.
I wonder if this guy even actually attended a class?
“Gentlemen’s C” my ass…when was the last time this guy cracked a book that had more pages of text than pictures?
August 7th, 2006 at 12:11 pm#24 - You are so right. Just like Newt’s fall from grace to become a Faux commentator, holy Joe will find his niche and continue trashing the Dems while getting paid the big bucks.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:12 pmMore mind boggling than the inane comment, is that people will shortly arrive to defend this lunatic. I hope to God you people can sort this out in November.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:13 pm#34 mongo,
August 7th, 2006 at 12:13 pmFrat boys don’t study, they cheat, then they get hired by other frat boys who didn’t learn anything either, it’s called “cronyism”, and it leaves a nation inept.
You know, I hear people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that.
Those “people” are his own generals. The Bush administration is now -yet again- refusing to listen to their own experts in the same way they rejected the 2004 NIE report because it was “too pesimistic”, and mere “guesses”. They are, once more, fixing the facts around the policy.
It is truly frightening to see the people in control of the largest economy, and military in the globe react to world events: If reality is not a reflection of their beliefs, they reject it and create their own, alternate reality.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:14 pmBush did well in that press conference on both Iraq and Hezbollah. He should do another national address to discuss this issue.
Oh, Lieberman has pulled back within 6% in polls, and since polls ALWAYS heavily favor the liberal over reality, Joe Lieberman is going to win his primary, then Jane Harmon and Hill’reh will be able to slam cut and runners.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:16 pmUmmm, we elected Lincoln twice and had a civil war. What’s your freakin’ point, George?
August 7th, 2006 at 12:17 pm2 parties(sides) now, pro-corporate vs. pro-citizen. I don’t even pay atttenetion to the (R) or (D)
August 7th, 2006 at 12:18 pmJason go marry old Joe and move to Israel > bye and have a nice life > lol.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:20 pmBush: ‘I Hear People Say, Well, Civil War This, Civil War That’ - - Bush’s speech is as corroded as that BP pipeline. He’s channeling Rummy now.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:21 pmWhat’s this crazy basterds IQ score any way. Any one know.? I am pretty much self educated since I droped out of high school a long time ago and know my score of 128 has got to be better than his….Give me the job for a day and I’ll fix it all. I’ll even donate my time and not take more than the usual lunch and 2 break’s…Hell all here but the troll’s can do even better than I could….Let’s do it….Commander in chief for a day and stop the madness……Blessings
August 7th, 2006 at 12:22 pmNed Lamont needs to immediately make an ad with Bush’s dream talk along with a picture of Liebermann.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:22 pm#39 - quinnipac poll shows Lamont 54, Lieberman 41. Which poll are you referring to?
August 7th, 2006 at 12:22 pmGeorge cannot admit a civil war in Iraq. It would be the clearest indication of failure of the policy he chose for the middle east. He will continue to ignore the reality of the situation, unless he has zero choice.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:24 pmA Quinnipiac University poll released Monday showed Lamont with a slight lead over Lieberman, 51 percent to 45 percent, among likely Democratic voters.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:25 pmJason, damn, boy your were right!
Tomorrow will tell…
#39 - quinnipac poll shows Lamont 54, Lieberman 41. Which poll are you referring to? - - The one he dreamed up.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:25 pmThe American government is a fraud. What should one expect from a military plutocracy that has fixed the last two Presidential elections and without a doubt, the last 3 and soon 4 general elections?
August 7th, 2006 at 12:28 pmA CT college poll is nonsense, since that probably reflects college Republican groups who love old Joe, but cannot vote for him in the primary election!
August 7th, 2006 at 12:29 pmLet this crackpot political and religious, speak more , more and more again .It will surely naill kiss ass joe liberman’s coffin shut tight.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:30 pmYou know, I hear people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that.
This reminds me of a scene from Mel Brooks’ “To be or Not to Be” where Mel stages a play called “Spring Time for Hitler”.
The monologue goes something like this
Mel as Hitler addressing the crowed
“All I want is piece. A piece of Poland, a piece of Czechoslovakia, a piece of France etc.”
Somebody call Barbara Bush (GWB’s mother, not drunk slut daughter) and ask her if she squeezed too hard when she was giving birth to this idiot , which caused his brain damage.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:32 pmThere are really morons who believe this hack? Dubya is the dumbest sob to ever be in the White House and the idiots who defend him hate America and everything that it stands for. Vote Democrat, take back the country and then we go after the crooks who stole it with the help of the deliverance wing of the GOP.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:32 pm#39: Bush did well in that press conference on both Iraq and Hezbollah.
What do you mean by “doing well”? Does “doing well” mean successfully getting through a whole press conference without drooling or vomiting?
August 7th, 2006 at 12:32 pmLook, as an initial supporter of the liberation of Iraq — and who is now extremely pessimistic that democratization of that nation, or indeed that region, is possible, one has to admit the president has a point — There have been three successful and relatively peaceful elections in Iraq since Saddam’s regime was toppled, with each successive election showing ever greater levels of Sunni participation. Moreover, he is Commander-in-Chief of the armed forces. I don’t think we can expect any President of the United States to say, while troops are engaged in operations, that the mission is a failure.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:34 pmPresident George W. Bush, America’s greatest embarassment since… ah, hell, EVER.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:34 pmThat is pretty much what I said earlier Exley.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:38 pmBadmoodman, Bluedog49 — I think you owe Jason M. Hendler an apology…
August 7, 2006 - Lamont Leads Lieberman 51 - 45 In Dem Primary, Quinnipiac University Connecticut Poll Finds
Connecticut likely Democratic primary voters back challenger Ned Lamont 51 - 45 percent over incumbent Sen. Joseph Lieberman in the U.S. Senate race, according to a Quinnipiac University poll released today.
This compares to a 54 - 41 percent Lamont lead among likely Democratic primary voters in an August 3 poll by the independent Quinnipiac (KWIN-uh-pe-ack) University.
http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x11362.xml?ReleaseID=945
August 7th, 2006 at 12:38 pm#57
Look, as an initial supporter of the liberation of Iraq
Exley
We didn’t “liberate” Iraq. We liberated France from the Nazis, we liberated Kuwait from the Iraqis. We invaded and occupied Iraq. If you don’t get the first step in the thought process right everything after is flawed. If you stick with the “liberation” thing, didn’t we go there to get the WMDs?
August 7th, 2006 at 12:41 pm#61, I believe you can “liberate” a nation from an indigenous dictator. But really, I suppose we are just splitting rhetorical hairs.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:43 pmI don’t think we can expect any President of the United States to say, while troops are engaged in operations, that the mission is a failure.
Comment by exley — August 7, 2006 @ 12:34 pm
As much as I despise Bush and consider him an utter moron, I’m also in favour of elections and think they are a very positive thing. However, as you note yourself the outlook is pretty pessimistic, so what will have been the good of the elections if a full blown civil war over several years trashes the country, and drags in others from the region?
Plus, I expect the president to do what makes the most sense, and explain himself, especially given his the primary catalyst of this mess. Is that too much to expect?
August 7th, 2006 at 12:47 pmWhile I don’t really believe in the power of prayer, I am covering all bases and praying almost constantly that Leiberman goes down in flames tomorrow. That would put thr Democrats back on the road to saving this country in a way that nothing else would except a direct hit on the White House and I don’t want any harm to come to that beautiful, old, venerable and history-filled house so I’m not praying for that. Lieberman will do. Please, God.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:47 pm#62
August 7th, 2006 at 12:47 pmAgreed it can be a point of view. Such as “the New Orlean resident entered the local stores after the hurricane and “liberated” some food and alcohol.”
Ricky Bobby is not a thinker …..
( oops, sorry, I meant to say … )
G. W. Bush is not a thinker … he’s just a very bad “decider” ….
August 7th, 2006 at 12:48 pmThe man is nothing if not sure of himself. Exactly the kind of person who, in a tough situation, you would never, ever want to follow. The reason being that he’s always have an opinion on what to do that is usually based on the voices in his head more than any evidence or advice. He’s like an old dog who has lost his sense of smell, sure that he is on the scent, and proceeding in exactly the wrong direction.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:49 pmVery immature, BlueDog49. Just admit you were wrong and move on. So, Jason Hendler happens to keep track of political developments more closely than you. Big deal! You needn’t be so embarassed. Now, don’t you have something to say to Jason????
August 7th, 2006 at 12:50 pm# 54-Pissed Off:
No,I didn’t squeeze too hard when spawning my Georgie.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:53 pmAnd so what if he shoved fire crackers into frogs asses and blew them to kingdom come?
He has greater plans for Amurka.
I can’t believe W actually used “foment” correctly.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:54 pmOK Jason, you dirt bag, your survey results are old news…
August 3, 2006 - Lamont Leads Lieberman 54 - 41 In Dem Primary, Quinnipiac University Connecticut Poll Finds; Malloy Gains Some Ground In Governor’s Primary
Momentum for Ned Lamont, the anti-war Connecticut U.S. Senate candidate, increases as he rolls to a 54 - 41 percent lead over incumbent Sen. Joseph Lieberman among likely Democratic primary voters, according to a Quinnipiac University poll released today.
This compares to a 51 - 47 percent Lamont lead among likely Democratic primary voters in a July 20 poll by the independent Quinnipiac (KWIN-uh-pe-ack) University.
Bite Me.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:58 pm#61
Considering Saddam was NEVER elected….it was liberation. Saddam and his Baath party “occupied” Iraq for 30 years.
“If you stick with the “liberation†thing, didn’t we go there to get the WMDs?”
BOTH.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:59 pm“so what will have been the good of the elections if a full blown civil war over several years trashes the country, and drags in others from the region? Plus, I expect the president to do what makes the most sense”
Oh, I agree, Brian. But I just think it is unrealistic to expect this or any president to say a situation is hopeless, especially while U.S. troops are in harm’s way. He can acknowledge problems, mistakes, and difficulties (which he has done), but I don’t we can expect him to say that the situation has collapsed beyond all redemption. I mean, what would that do to the troops’ morale? Nothing good, I’d imagine. They are facing enough difficulties over there without having to hear their commander-in-chief saying they are fighting for a lost cause.
Plus, while I am pessimistic (as pessimistic as I have ever been), a small part of me still hopes that the Iraqi people will seize this historic opportunity, put aside their petty religious and ethnic feuds, and create a sustainable, peaceful, civilized democratic society….That admittedly seems less and less likely with each passing day, but a glimmer of hope remains.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:59 pmwhat a dumbass.
August 7th, 2006 at 12:59 pmCommander Clueless gives me a warm fuzzy everytime he decides whats actually happening.
If only the USA had elections during the 1800’s it could have spared itself a civil war.
If only bush was President back then.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:00 pmExley, I would expect the prez to call it like it is, the message to the troops would be, hang tough while we get you the hell out of hell.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:01 pmI’m surprised anyone asks him a question or really cares what pours out of the hole in his face.
It’s no great shock that The Great Leader is a dolt. I’ve personally tried to distance myself so far from his utterances that they no longer have much of an impact. I find this especially important with our growing children. We determined not to stain their developing minds with images or sounds of our national idiot.
What’s continually disturbing is that the mass media prints what this imbisile blathers without much question.
I know little about IRAQ, other than it’s a disaster area, yet I could stand before a microphone and speak something a lot more credible. Any of us could. So why is it that those who know the best, like these Generals, are brushed off the shoulder of The Great Leader like dandruff? And why is this not questioned?
August 7th, 2006 at 1:02 pm#76 - BTW, the ” petty religious and ethnic feuds” go back hundreds of years, like since the 7th century. Read some history, please.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:02 pmBlueDog, you have made yet another error when you wrote, “You’re both wrong about Lieberman …” I have taken no position on Lieberman v. Lamont. I could not care less who wins. In fact, I must say I take a certain amount of enjoyment out of seeing the Democratic Party tear at eachother like this. A divided Democratic Party is good for my side. I simply pointed out that Jason Hendler was correct when he cited his poll figures and you were wrong when you claimed those numbers did not exist. But I accept your apology.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:03 pmpetty religious and ethnic feuds - exley
Perfect example of your cluelessness. I suppose Isreal’s problems are just “petty religious and ethnic feuds” as well? These “petty religious and ethnic feuds” are just the OPPOSITE of what you say. They are THE focal point for ALL conflict in the Mid-East. Conflicts which ebb and flow for centuries are not due to “pettiness”. Idiot.
Now, where do you get your “Conservative” blinders anyway? The GOP store?
August 7th, 2006 at 1:04 pm#78 My pleasure. I have several spreadsheets I keep up to date with polling data. I was remiss in not having the CT race updated…
August 7th, 2006 at 1:04 pmBush is correct. Just like in 1860, when Americans went to the polls? It’s not like there was a civil war after that or anything.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:05 pm#84 - I simply pointed out that Jason Hendler was correct when he cited his poll figures and you were wrong when you claimed those numbers did not exist.
Did you read my post #74?
August 7th, 2006 at 1:05 pm#75
“If you stick with the “liberation†thing, didn’t we go there to get the WMDs?â€
BOTH.
Comment by Tracy
I didn’t know you are a bush administration policy maker. So when was BOTH decided upon? After the WMDs didn’t turn out to work very well for you?
As for the never elected thing. Why haven’t we invaded N. Korea yet? They have BOTH there.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:05 pmI don’t we can expect him to say that the situation has collapsed beyond all redemption.
Comment by exley — August 7, 2006 @ 12:59 pm
Neither do I, but for him to dismissively say “people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that.” is appalling. Those “people” are his own generals.
He could at least acknowledge that the opinion of those anonymous “people” might, just might, be based on facts and that he intends to react according to the new reality facing him.
Is that too much to ask?
August 7th, 2006 at 1:07 pm#86 - Now, where do you get your “Conservative†blinders anyway? The GOP store? DieNowForPeace
August 7th, 2006 at 1:07 pmROFLMAO!
#83…Thank you, RUCerious, but I am quite aware that these religious and ethnic tensions go back centuries, but that is hardly an excuse in the 21st century for Iraqis to throw up their hands and say, “Oh well, I guess we just have to go on killing one another.” It is time for the Iraqi people to stand up and stop the madness, let go of the hatred, and work together to seize this historic opportunity handed them by the United States, Great Britain, and the rest of the Coalition and create a civilized, stable, peaceful democracy. Whatever happened in 800 A.D. should be irrelevant to what happens in Iraq in 2006. I think you would agree with that.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:08 pmSince 2000, about 40,000 troops from all branches of the military have deserted, the Pentagon says. More than half served in the Army. But the Army says numbers have decreased each year since the United States began its war on terror in Afghanistan.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:08 pmBluedog49 -
August 7th, 2006 at 1:09 pmLet’s make a point of rubbing their noses in it Wed AM…
Uh Exley, that is what the entire middle east needs to do. I don’t disagree with your statements, in fact I agree whole heartedly, However the reality on the ground says, that this type of thing will never stop.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:10 pm# 93, Gregor, Yes, I will acknowledge he phrased himself rather inelegantly.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:10 pmOff subject Where is old cheney.? He has not had his big mouth open. Has anyone seen him?
August 7th, 2006 at 1:11 pmYou really don’t have a clue about how their culture operates.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:11 pmThere are some really good cultural antrho books you could read on the tribal mentality and how it affects the world view of this part of the world.
Do you remember the last “opportunity” the British gave them in 1932? Please enlighten us as to how that worked out.
Are you being serious Exley?
You actually don’t think the President has the moral and ethical responsibility to tell the troops the truth about the situation they’re in?
Why would that be? Because you’re really concerned about troop moral during a failure, or you’re concerned about a president having to admit failure?
August 7th, 2006 at 1:12 pmI don’t think we can expect any President of the United States to say, while troops are engaged in operations, that the mission is a failure.— Exley
I guess Exley thinks that Bush is infallible like the Pope.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:14 pmHe can acknowledge problems, mistakes, and difficulties (which he has done), but I don’t we can expect him to say that the situation has collapsed beyond all redemption.
Well … I don’t think so. He’s paid occasional lip service to the idea, but nothing concrete, like pulling your troops out!!? I mean he’s still in denial about what seems to be widely understood, the British are a useful bell weather in this regard. They have accepted that we have a civil war on our hands, so it won’t be long before you dotoo. Although I agree that he couldn’t possibly say what you are suggesting, but who is actually expecting that.
At some point he is going to have to say something about withdrawal, or is he just hoping to pass the whole bucket of slop to the next poor bastard who ends up in the whitehouse? Thats not very commendable either.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:14 pma small part of me still hopes that the Iraqi people will seize this historic opportunity, put aside their petty religious and ethnic feuds, and create a sustainable, peaceful, civilized democratic society
Of course what half way human person wouldn’t? These infuriating observations of the blindingly self evident are said as if we all are looking forward to Iraq imploding. No offence meant, really. Of course we are all hoping for that. However, what little chance of success there was, was sabotaged from the outset by incompetence and greed. Besides, the entire idea is flawed anyway, and now we can see it, and it’s why we were screaming against it from day one.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:14 pm#104
No shit, I’m sure the troops being pulled out of Vietnam thought they were winning until the last evac helicopter left the pad.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:15 pmI will acknowledge he phrased himself rather inelegantly.
Comment by exley — August 7, 2006 @ 1:10 pm
It is not so much his phraseology I am talking about, it is the dismissal of the opinion of the very same people who are experiencing the fight first hand.
What you are saying is that you’d rather have Pres Bush save face than the troops their lives.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:15 pmIsn’t what this has become all about Gregor?
Saving bushes face?
How would it look if the great decider failed, again?
IF that’s what conservatives think about our troops, then the mistake the USA made in 2000 and 2004 has just become magnified a thoudandfold.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:18 pm#101 - Last seen snarking in a dark room beneath the White House, mumbling heh, heh, all goes exactly according to master plan…
August 7th, 2006 at 1:19 pmBluePuP blurb….”I’ll apologize when people like you admit that Bush is a sociopathic liar and the worst president in American history.” - Comment by Bluedog49
*****Dear BluePuP - I wasn’t a Bill Clinton fan but admired the way he took good ideas from various quarters and implemented those he thought were good for our citizens in addition to being polititcally expedient. of course you are free to think GWB is a “sociopath” & “the worst President” we’ve had but consider the stupidity of your remarks when reviewing: Richard Nixon, Jimmy Carter, and Warren Harding. Frankly, I have been amazed that the US seems to have the “crisis-President” when we need it (Washington, Lincoln, Roosevelt, Reagan, Bush) and the “caretaker President” when immersed i relatively “quiet times”.
I am thankful NOT to have endured a Gore response to 9/11 or the uncertain “convictions” of Kerry. You might have wished for a more diplomatic response to 9/11, the assassination plot against Bush the Elder and an abandonment of our allies, but I think that belies weak character and few, if any principles….But perhaps you were potty-trained too early or lost the 6th grade Spelling Bee….
August 7th, 2006 at 1:20 pmHad Mr. Hendler limited his information transfer to the facts of the matter, (and optionally noted that they had come down from the double digiit spread of late last week) I might be more inclined to agree with you. The pointty stick jabs about polls leaning liberal and the addenda re Ms. Hamsher and Mrs. Clinton, he asked to be engaged.
mj
August 7th, 2006 at 1:24 pmOh man, The Mighty Aphrodite think bush is a ‘crisis-President’.
That’s the most bizarre thing I’ve read today, and that’s including all of I Hate Liberals posts.
Crisis President: Sit stunned while America is under Attack.
Crisis President: Play a guitar while NOLA drowns.
Crisis President: Delays diplomatic intervention in Israel Lebanon War.
Crisis President: Rather lie to the troops about their current situation then tell them the truth and admit he’s a failure.
What a laugh.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:25 pmOh man, The Mighty Aphrodite think bush is a ‘crisis-President’.
Well, MA is basically incoherent, so who knows what it really means when she spouts non-sequitors composed of words she doesn’t quite understand.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:28 pmmighty aphrodite,
> I am thankful NOT to have endured a Gore response to 9/11 or the uncertain
Can any response be worse than what Bush did? Are you a complete moron. All that seems to matter is “US show of force” and nothing else. A targeted response to get Osama would have been far more effective.
And Iraq? Are you out of your mind? Killing innocent people for your own shortcomings is what exactly? If assisnation plot is all that matters, US would have kicked out of this planet long ago.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:30 pmnon-sequitur
August 7th, 2006 at 1:31 pm#119
Are you a complete moron. Yes.
Are you out of your mind? Yes.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:32 pmis he just hoping to pass the whole bucket of slop to the next poor bastard who ends up in the whitehouse? Thats not very commendable either.
Bush has already said that he’s going to leave the whole mess to his successor.
Frank Rich recently summed it up very nicely.
It’s called kicking the can down the road.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:33 pmI point out that the first WTC attack happened 30 days into Clinton’s two terms. He not only captured, tried and jailed all the terrorists involved in this attack, but no other attack happened on our soil for the next 7 years of his administration.
But but but, he lied about a blow job!!!
August 7th, 2006 at 1:35 pmBush The Crisis President :
“All right, you’ve covered your ass now.â€
August 7th, 2006 at 1:38 pmsince the biggest crises facing this country, is one of our own creation, how does bush stack up?
August 7th, 2006 at 1:40 pmYou might have wished for a more diplomatic response to 9/11
Comment by mighty aphrodite — August 7, 2006 @ 1:20 pm
I wished for a more accurate, on target, timely, distraction-free response to 9/11
To establish a historical parallel, attacking Iraq after 9/11 was as ill-conceived as it would have been if the US had launched an all-out assault on China in retaliation for Pearl Harbor.
Picking a country in the “general area” and sending the troops over there does not intelligent foreign policy make.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:42 pmYou mean, Bush: The Crisis Creatin’ President.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:43 pmGILDED Age
August 7th, 2006 at 1:47 pm#91
I has always been both even before November 2002. Have you listened to ANY of Bush’s speeches or the 2003 State of the Union address? Or did you only que in on the WMD part?
“Why haven’t we invaded N. Korea yet? They have BOTH there.”
They have nukes that could be fired on and reach the U.S. That is a little different than a chemical artillery shell. No one said the Saddam for sure had a nuke.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:47 pmOh, he’s the worst in so many ways, but let’s not forget his strength:
Best Lapdog President EVER!
August 7th, 2006 at 1:48 pmwhat steps did the republican congress of the ’90s take in helping Clinton fight terrorism?
The GWOF (Global War On Fellatio)!
About as pertinent to fighting terrorism as Bush attacking Iraq.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:48 pmThat is a little different than a chemical artillery shell.
But it was a shell that could have been used against a target only 7,000 miles from the US as late as 15 years ago.
That ol’ 1% option, y’know…
August 7th, 2006 at 1:51 pmThat’s very true Tracy, the problem there was that there will always be some uncertainty about how quickly he could have acquired nuclear weapons. But they didn’t want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:53 pm#143 - Poor AnAmerican - did you not learn to put together a comprehensive “time-line” in school? Let’s examine your “off the cuff” ignorance:
“Crisis President: Sit stunned while America is under Attack.”
*****As opposed to jumping up in front of a classroom full of 7 year old, telling them to hit the deck, running down the hall, screaming and panicing the whole way - I understand the emotional nature of progs, but sometimes a crisis is best responded to by remaining calm, gathering the FACTS, and coordinating a response. (You appear to be an excellent example of why progs make great puppy handlers and poor presidents.)
“Crisis President: Play a guitar while NOLA drowns.”
******Again, a timeline might have saved you from displaying your stupidity. Bush was not hanging out with McCain while the levees broke in NO. The levee breaks caused the most widespread damage but WHY confuse YOU with facts - you have an agenda and FACTS might get in your way…..
“Crisis President: Delays diplomatic intervention in Israel Lebanon War.”
******Spoken like a true FoHHSI - friend of Hezbollah and Hamas, Syria and Iran….I for one, am grateful the Israelis are prepared to take out barbarians - I realize some of you want to “understand and make friends” with them and others would be happy to simply see them domesticated - been fitted for that comfy burka yet?
“Crisis President: Rather lie to the troops about their current situation then tell them the truth and admit he’s a failure.”
******The troops know the situation in Iraq and Afghanistan - hopefully the governments in both countries can but a lid on the Islamo-wacks. But if they cannot and a Civil War demonstrates the barbarism of 7th Century thinking, it is NOT due to the chance never offered them by an American President and her brave military - it is an example of an opportunity squandered. P.S. When are you going to quit giving aid and comfort to our enemies….
Back to play later…..
August 7th, 2006 at 1:54 pmLOL
Did you really just try to say that Bush didn’t want to excuse himself from a classroom full of schoolkids to go attend to his duties??
If that’s the best you have, I’ll just skip those next three.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:55 pm#143??MA, are you pychic? #143 ain’t happened yet?!
August 7th, 2006 at 1:56 pmOUT OF TOUCH
We had a puppet government in Vietnam also … that didnt make all the difference now did it? You can make puppet governments easy…. you can even call them democracies… but that doesnt mean that you are not living a fantasy.
August 7th, 2006 at 1:57 pmDamn, forget my chell specker..
August 7th, 2006 at 1:58 pm#133
August 7th, 2006 at 1:59 pmSo you think its okay to kick little dogs(Iraq) but if they can bite back(Korea) you believe that its better to let them be. Your bravado is false.
#139 - I thought FoHHSI meant Fond of Having his Sobriety Inebriated?
August 7th, 2006 at 2:00 pm#96
Those found out that they might actually get shot at…..oops!
August 7th, 2006 at 2:02 pmSomebody get this Ass a straight jacket! Please!
August 7th, 2006 at 2:03 pmBlue-PupPPy -According to your “logic” Carter could have appointed himself the first Sec’y of Energy and then done us a huge favour and resigned the Presidency. I would LOVE to eliminate ME oil from our energy diet (and perhaps that was Mr. Jimmeh’s strong suit) but his response to domestic problems and international threats was inept at worst and anemic at best.
Clinton viewed terror as a “law enforcement” issue not a foreign policy issue and on that, people can disagree. I believe he did the best he could WITH WHAT HE KNEW. Progs not nearly as generous. I believe in hindsight he would have taken Osama off the market IF he knew what was coming down the road….but he didn’t know. I still don’t understand the lack of response to the embassy bombings and the USS Cole, but not comprehending Dems is not new…
August 7th, 2006 at 2:04 pmAs opposed to jumping up in front of a classroom full of 7 year old, telling them to hit the deck, running down the hall, screaming and panicing the whole way - MA
I forgot you live in a world of extreme absolutes. Here’s a more realistic way of dealing with said situation.
“Sir, terrorists just flew a plane into the WTC” - Secret Service
“Let’s roll” - Bush (politely thanks the class, then abruptly leaves, wondering if the “terrrrists” might try to assassinate him SINCE HIS SCHEDULE WAS PUBLISHED WELL IN ADVANCE.)
“But sir!” - Secret Service
“Men, we are being attacked. Get me on AF1, send some free books to the kids and my apologies. We’ve got serious work to do.” - Bush
Instead, I’ve never seen a more confused, lost human in my life. Poor little “decider”, him was just too confused, never having been confronted with such a burden of a tragedy in his wittle, sheltered life… I felt sorry, only for one second, for that lowest of moments in his life being forever captured on film. PRICELESS.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:04 pma crisis is best responded to by remaining calm, gathering the FACTS, and coordinating a response.
Comment by mighty aphrodite — August 7, 2006 @ 1:54 pm
Remaining calm: Saying “we don’t want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud” is not to remain calm but to engage in fearmongering.
Gathering the FACTS: Blathering about “east, west, south and north somewhat” was not giving the American public factual information.
Coordinating a response: Attacking the people who have not attacked you is a response, to be sure. I just don’t know what you’d expect to accomplish. Osama Bin Laden, AlQaeda, and the Taliban are still stil alive and well.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:06 pmAphrodite, who could read past your first point refuting the proposition that Bush might have actually gotten up and left the building when he was told that America was under attack? You said: “*****As opposed to jumping up in front of a classroom full of 7 year old, telling them to hit the deck, running down the hall, screaming and panicing the whole way ”
August 7th, 2006 at 2:06 pmCome on. Nobody here suggested that. You think Bush had two options? The one above or to continue to play with the little kids? I used to read some of your comments, but that was the end. No more. No credibility left. Bye.
Dubya’s Decision
People say,
August 7th, 2006 at 2:10 pm‘civil war this,’
and
‘civil war that.’
For them
I give not
the ass
of a gnat.
I am the one
who can decide
what truth is true
and what to hide
And with whom
to take
a
bicycle ride
So feed me no pretzels
tell me no facts
just heed my decision
Or you’ll get the axe.
Folks, here is the big picture:
The BushCo went into Iraq for ONE reason. To build permanent bases and to establish a permanent presence. Has anybody noticed a large scale dicussion about these bases?
Now, about Israel & Hezbolah. The BushCo wants Israel to do a clean sweep through Lebanon, Syria, Iran, all the way to the border with Iraq.
Everything that’s been happening with the US and Israel is all by DESIGN. It’s all part of the script.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:14 pmMy dog has more sense than George W.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:19 pmWhere’s Sonny Bono when the Republicans need him?
August 7th, 2006 at 2:21 pmThe Crisis President. It took me longer than seven minutes of stunned silence to recover from that unbelievable post. And pray tell, just exactly how did the “Crisis President” deal with OBL? Oh, that’s correct, OBL is still cutting rock videos. Thanks, for playing, please collect your year supply of Rice A Roni as your consolation prize. Crisis President indeed.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:21 pm[…] Think Progress for the transcript) Filed Under: War coverage, Bush, Iraq Trackback Permalink postCount(’10019449′); | EMail ThisPost […]
August 7th, 2006 at 2:22 pmHey, Sonny Bono is dead.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:22 pmIt took Iraq as long to get a constitution as it took for George to dismantle our constitution.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:26 pmHey Bluedog,
The President was on vacation on Tuesday! Get off his case.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:27 pmI hope Cindy Sheehan is raising hell down in Crawford.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:28 pmI think the Connecticut Cowboy is milking the horse, correct?
August 7th, 2006 at 2:31 pmHorses? On a Ranch? Rove hasn’t told him about those yet.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:31 pmShhh don’t disillusion the trolls.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:32 pmCome on you Bush lovers… defend him…
August 7th, 2006 at 2:32 pmIf you defend Bush, you’re as unAmerican as they come.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:33 pmA real patriot would stand up to him… but the Bushites are chickenshit, chickenhawks….
August 7th, 2006 at 2:34 pmI think they’ve given up defending him on this story.
The only defense they had was some bullshit about lying to the troops in order to keep up morale.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:35 pmAnd, does Laura believe her husband is gay? Just wondering.
Comment by Bluedog49
That would explain why the Condi tryst seems so believable. George is gay.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:37 pmHow could you support someone who knowingly supports the killing of innocent people? How could you support someone that sent our soldiers to fight on deceitful intelligence?
Are we more secure than we were on Sept. 11? I think not.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:37 pmClinton’s law enforcement approach to the first WTC attack: all perpetrators captured, tried and convicted; currently in jail.
Supplemental to that result, we need to add the “not dead” 50,000 nameless foreigners.
Law enforcement is always the correct approach to terrorism.
You need look no further then the British/Irish conflict, remember the IRA actually killed members of the British government and very nearly killed Margreat Thatcher herself by bombing the hotel the cabinet were staying in. That gentlemen, is restraint, and Maggie was no shrinking violet. It takes time, decades, there are ups there are downs. However in the 30 years of IRA terrorism (Ireland has roughly the population of Lebanon), some 3000 innocent people died violently.
In this “spat†in Lebanon, the current conflict has claimed 1000+ innocent lives. After 2 weeks. Iraq, 30,000 initially and 15,000 a year. Thats the difference.
There is of course no panacea, no easy solution, I’m sorry to have to disappoint you in that regard:-( War, unless it is going to be genocidal all out war to kill millions, will never resolve these kinds of issues, and will invariably make things worse.
The military have never been, and never will be a solution to terrorism.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:38 pmThe only crisis that Bush had was to clean out his shorts when told about the World Trade Center in front of the kids…. and I heard that Bush blamed the smell on one of the kids…
August 7th, 2006 at 2:41 pmBush’s moniker should be “The Dumbinator”.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:46 pmThose generals should be ignored anyway since (using Newt Gingrich’s twisted logic) these generals are “insurgents”.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:48 pmOld Bushies does not know how to ride a horse as when he was down in Mexico Fox want to go horse back riding and Old Bushies said no. He is a chickenliver.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:51 pmEverything you see about Iraq in the newspaper and on tv is made up so we can raise the price of oil to $200 a barrel by the end of GW’s presidency… Saddam is still in charge…
August 7th, 2006 at 2:52 pmIt is a characteristic of an alcoholic family, to create crisis after crisis. They think its the only way to bring the family together.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:52 pmAlso, no horse ridin’ Bush also vacations at a fake ranch, bought just before the 2000 election.
August 7th, 2006 at 2:54 pm[…] Then I saw this Think Progress post: Today at a press conference, President Bush dismissed these concerns out of hand. Bush said, “You know, I hear people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that. The Iraqi people decided against civil war when they went to the ballot box.†[…]
August 7th, 2006 at 2:57 pmThank you for pointing out that in front of small groups of young children, PROGS can rise to a level of mature adult behaviour. (Frankly, such maturity is too often lacking here…) Not to change the subject, but how are NedL.’s poll numbers holding up as the CT race enters the final stretch???
August 7th, 2006 at 3:03 pmI seem to recall the Iraqi peole “went to the ballot box” when Saddam was in power, too.
George Bush is clearly a simpleton with understanding of reality. Or else he thinks the American people are too stupid to question his BS.
August 7th, 2006 at 3:05 pmMake that, with NO understanding of reality. sheesh.
August 7th, 2006 at 3:05 pm#184 - “It is a characteristic of an alcoholic family, to create crisis after crisis. They think its the only way to bring the family together.” - Comment by For Truth
*****Info you garnered from first hand experience….or from principled, unselfish social work???
August 7th, 2006 at 3:06 pm#
Not to change the subject, but how are NedL.’s poll numbers holding up as the CT race enters the final stretch???
Comment by mighty aphrodite — August 7, 2006 @ 3:03 pm
#
Umm not to point out what an idiot you are, but you are trying to change the subject, after getting spanked over your poor and rather illogical arguments. I believer that Mr. Lamont was discussed either in this thread, or in another one. Perhaps if you tried reading you would find the appropriate spot.
August 7th, 2006 at 3:07 pm“Clinton’s law enforcement approach to the first WTC attack: all perpetrators captured, tried and convicted; currently in jail.”
Brian, in all of our various discussions you have not yet explained how a “law enforcement” approach to 9/11 would work. Would the FBI just gone over to Afghanistan with an arrest warrant and placed Osama Bin Laden and other Al Qaeda figures under arrest? And the Taliban would have allowed this because…?
No, Brian, while law-enforcement certainly has a very large role to play in combatting terrorism, so does military action.
And you simply cannot compare the IRA with Al Qaeda. While the IRA was certainly a terrorist group, they did not compare to the reach and nihilsim of Al Qaeda. The IRA was a homegrown terrorist group with limited goals. In that sense they were much more similar to 1960s and 1970s U.S. terrorist groups like the Weathermen, the FALN, and the Symbionese Liberation Army, and therefore susceptible to law-enforcement methods. Al Qaeda is an entirely different creature. It is an international organization that seeks WMDs and whose stated goal is to kill Americans and Westerners. To use a cliche. you are comparing apples and oranges.
August 7th, 2006 at 3:10 pmDear Idio-LITZ - Yes, as I recall, Saddam was overwhelmingly re-elected time and time and time and time again!! (Am modern political “miracle”!!) I have a difficult time finding any voters who voted FOR the “opposition” candidate - can you put me in touch? (pointing me to a headstone does NOT count!)
August 7th, 2006 at 3:12 pmP.S. I heard they have elections in Cuba, too!! Democracy is a wonderful thing - but communism sucks….
It’s all Bill Clinton’s fault.
August 7th, 2006 at 3:13 pm[…] not mine Last week, Gen. John Abizaid, the Commander of the U.S. Central Command, raised the prospect that Iraq could be sliding toward civil war. Abizaid said, “I believe that the sectarian violence is probably is as bad as I’ve seen it in Baghdad in particular, and that if not stopped, it is possible that Iraq could move toward civil war.†Gen. Peter Pace, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said, “I believe we do have the possibility of that devolving to a civil war.†[…]
August 7th, 2006 at 3:14 pmDick Cheney put Saddam in power, so he may remove Saddam if he so desires.
August 7th, 2006 at 3:15 pmMy dear Krazy - “Spanked”??? Hardly…..The problem with progs - lacking anything substantive to say, they process their opinions as FACTS. “If they “FEEEEEL” something, it “MUST” be the truth”…
And Neddy’s numbers are…..where? Conservatives are hoping the Ned Lamont Show hits all 50 states as the “Roving Prog Road Show”….maybe we could team up the Connecticaut Cable King with the Queen of Mourning Glories (and Crawfords NEWEST resident) for a ‘We HATE GWB tour”. (John Kerry and Al Gore could be the warm-up acts…)
August 7th, 2006 at 3:19 pmExley — if I am not mistaken, the Clinton approach was to invoke military action when necessary, or were the missiles fired into Afghanistan my imagination. I seem to recall that and a missile strike in the Sudan which were derided as some kind of wag the dog campaign by the GOP Congress, which was too busy worrying over a blow job than national security. The GOP talking points in this context should hold no water here (except I suppose for failed policy apologists like yourself) precisely because the administration’s response to 9/11 has been less than a success. They apparently have managed to screw up any early successes in Afghanistan by diverting to Iraq. Thanks, but I would take Clinton’d foreign policy over the current wreck now. Can we really point to one single foreign policy success? I am sure you will eventually stop apologizing for the failures once oil hit $100 a barrel.
August 7th, 2006 at 3:22 pmBrian,
And, with regard to Israel’s current battle against Hezbollah in Lebanon; Hezbollah is not simply a terrorist organization. It is an army, with sophisticated, modern militart equipment supplied by terrorist states Iran and Syria. As today’s New York Times reports:
“Hezbollah is a militia trained like an army and equipped like a state, and its fighters “are nothing like Hamas or the Palestinians,†said a soldier who just returned from Lebanon. “They are trained and highly qualified,†he said, equipped with flak jackets, night-vision goggles, good communications and sometimes Israeli uniforms and ammunition. “All of us were kind of surprised.â€
Much attention has been focused on Hezbollah’s astonishing stockpile of Syrian- and Iranian-made missiles, some 3,000 of which have already fallen on Israel … But Iran and Syria also used those six years to provide satellite communications and some of the world’s best infantry weapons, including modern, Russian-made antitank weapons and Semtex plastic explosives, as well as the training required to use them effectively against Israeli armor. It is Hezbollah’s skillful use of those weapons — in particular, wire-guided and laser-guided antitank missiles, with double, phased explosive warheads and a range of about two miles — that has caused most of the casualties to Israeli forces. Hezbollah’s Russian-made antitank missiles, designed to penetrate armor, have damaged or destroyed Israeli vehicles, including its most modern tank, the Merkava, on about 20 percent of their hits, Israeli tank commanders at the front said. Hezbollah has also used antitank missiles, including the less modern Sagger, to fire from a distance into houses in which Israeli troops are sheltered, with a first explosion cracking the typical concrete block wall and the second going off inside.”
http://www.nytimes.com/ 2006/ 08/ 07/ world/ middleeast/ 07hezbollah.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
Israel cannot address the threat posed by Hezbollah through “law enforcement methods.” Hezbollah is a miliary organization that needed to be confronted militarily.
August 7th, 2006 at 3:22 pmAnd Neddy’s numbers are…..where? Conservatives are hoping the Ned Lamont Show hits all 50 states as the “Roving Prog Road Showâ€â€¦.maybe we could team up the Connecticaut Cable King with the Queen of Mourning Glories (and Crawfords NEWEST resident) for a ‘We HATE GWB tourâ€. (John Kerry and Al Gore could be the warm-up acts…)
Comment by mighty aphrodite
Something you ‘felt’, huh?
August 7th, 2006 at 3:23 pm#187 - please see #74
August 7th, 2006 at 3:25 pmAny comments?