ThinkFast: August 11, 2006
ThinkFast: August 11, 2006
President Bush’s approval rating has “dropped to 33, matching his low in May,” according to an AP-Ipsos poll. The majority of people who voted for Bush in 2004 (57 percent) disapprove of the job he is doing.
Greenland’s icecap “is melting faster than ever before on record, and the pace is speeding year by year,” new data shows. “The consequence is already evident in a small but ominous rise in sea levels around the world, a pace that is also accelerating.”
Sen. Joe Lieberman (D-CT) once called using national security issues for political purposes “just unacceptable and in my opinion un-American.” Yesterday he said that a timeline for Iraq redeployment (backed by 57 percent of Americans) “will be taken as a tremendous victory by the same people who wanted to blow up these planes in this plot hatched in England. It will strengthen them and they will strike again.”
Reps. Henry Waxman (D-CA) and Charlie Melancon (D-LA) have written to FEMA about a report that 94 percent of emergency housing trailers for Katrina victims “contain hazardous levels of formaldehyde, a known carcinogen.”
The GAO found almost 30 percent of State Department diplomats abroad are “failing to speak and write the local language well enough to meet required levels.â€
“Iraq needs one to two years to rebuild its security forces,” Vice President Tariq al-Hashemi said Thursday, contradicting a recent claim by Iraq’s President Jalal Talabani that they would be fully operational by the end of 2006.
“The Bush administration has illegally denied the public a chance to comment before approving the logging of woodlands damaged by fires or infestations,” a federal appeals court ruled yesterday.
Violence in genocidal Darfur is increasing. “The number of armed clashes during that period was twice as high as the number last year,†says Jan Pronk, Special Representative of the UN Secretary-General to Sudan.
“Most states have shirked the law by failing to ensure that poor and minority students get their fair share of qualified teachers, a new analysis contends.”
And finally: Is Rummy getting ready for his close-up? Premier Magazine reports Donald Rumsfeld “hangs around movie sets — as in a recent visit to the Clint Eastwood-directed war epic ‘Flags of Our Fathers.’†“What was funny is that he stuck around for a while,†cast member Jesse Bradford said. “It’s like, ‘Don’t you have anything better to do? You’re supposed to be running the country.’â€
What did we miss? Let us know in the comments section.
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Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of unknown and possibly explosive (and reactive) liquids, including alcohol, peroxide, acids, and more in an airport receptacle? Well, that’s too long! …
August 11th, 2006 at 9:11 amPresident Bush’s approval rating has “dropped to 33, matching his low in May,†according to an AP-Ipsos poll. The majority of people who voted for Bush in 2004 (57 percent) disapprove of the job he is doing.
Dont worry, Georgie. One or 2 more threats and americans will be side by side with his Commander-in-Chief (what a load of patriotic crap)
August 11th, 2006 at 9:16 am[...] RELATED: From Thinkprogress Sen. Joe Lieberman (D-CT) once called using national security issues for political purposes “just unacceptable and in my opinion un-American.†Yesterday he said that a timeline for Iraq redeployment (backed by 57 percent of Americans) “will be taken as a tremendous victory by the same people who wanted to blow up these planes in this plot hatched in England. It will strengthen them and they will strike again.†[...]
August 11th, 2006 at 9:18 amViolence in genocidal Darfur is increasing.
Those africans are barbarian and beasts. We (the West and very civilized) should be keep selling them weapons so they can solve their problems pacifically.
August 11th, 2006 at 9:20 amWow, looks like Rove gave Lieberman some handy talking points during his phone call to him.
August 11th, 2006 at 9:29 amBut Bush’s approval rating remains at 110% among the trolls. Loyalty is everything. Truth, logic, justice, freedom, security, ethics, morality, and just plain common sense mean nothing.
August 11th, 2006 at 9:30 amThe aggressive neo-con agenda may be too much for even the Zionists in Israel. http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/ 08…ailyUpdate.html
I have yet to hear a peep from the “anti-war” party about finding any form of solution for a ceasefire. The democrats and faux progressives are more militaristic than the Likud at this point. I can get less biased reporting out of Israel than from the US at this point. The entire leadership in the US is a total failure as are the main stream media.
August 11th, 2006 at 9:31 am‘Don’t you have anything better to do? You’re supposed to be running the country.’
WTF?
August 11th, 2006 at 9:38 amBush’s low approval will change as the exploitation of the terrorist plot is played from every angle.
August 11th, 2006 at 9:45 amSomeone PLEASE shut Lieberman up and make him go home! He is a traitorous representative for Bush&Co spouting off Rove’s talking points.
August 11th, 2006 at 9:49 amWhining, back-stabbing, disloyal former Democrat. Take your retirement and get out, Joe.
“Never has so much military and economic and diplomatic power been used so ineffectively, and if after all of this time, and all of this sacrifice, and all of this support, there is still no end in sight, then I say the time has come for the American people to turn to new leadership not tied to the mistakes and policies of the past.”
Our new mantra from none other than RICHARD M. NIXON!
August 11th, 2006 at 9:52 amI can get less biased reporting out of Israel than from the US at this point. The entire leadership in the US is a total failure as are the main stream media.
Comment by Just plain mad
Yep.
The current republican plan has been going on for several decades now… kill people any where in the world that gets in big oils way. They just renamed it from “American(big oil) Interests” to “Democracy on the march” to make themselves sound less evil. But either way it creates people bent on revenge.
The democrats could be talking about big world wide reconciliation among the religious leaders and economic cooperation packages and a “justice for all” plan to settle to Israel/Palastine issue… maybe talk about turning Jerusalem into the world center for peace as an example to all the other trouble areas for how they should act i.e. China and Taiwan… AND/OR they could be talking about special forces hit squads finding and taking out Osama and all the other over the edge people that cannot be talked to… an all out push to eliminate WMDs in all militaries around the world and a redirection of the energies that go into WMDs to instead go into a world wide cooperation to colonize space…. SOMETHING…. but at this point all I see are democrats that are playing small time politics and give the people ZERO hope for the future. Pulling all troops out of Iraq TODAY will not make me feel any better about the world… it will just be one step with many many more to go and no one even talking about those future steps…
August 11th, 2006 at 9:54 am**Greenland’s icecap “is melting faster than ever before on record, and the pace is speeding year by year,†new data shows. “The consequence is already evident in a small but ominous rise in sea levels around the world, a pace that is also accelerating.â€**
Well looks like my property in Texas may be beachfront property sooner than I thought.
August 11th, 2006 at 9:54 ammarie, and any/all – i’m going to see OBAMA at a town hall meeting on tuesday – help me come up with a good question in case i get the chanc/nerve…
August 11th, 2006 at 10:02 amthanks!
Lebanon Daily Star
In a sign of the international exasperation over the wait for a resolution, Russia on Thursday introduced a rival draft resolution demanding a 72-hour humanitarian truce.
“War is raging in Lebanon and the humanitarian situation is getting catastrophic,” Russia’s UN ambassador Vitaly Churkin told reporters after talks with envoys from the United States, France, Britain and China.
Highlighting the deadlocked efforts by the United States and France to press an alternative plan, Churkin said: “We have had repeatedly optimistic statements that any day a solution might be available.” He added that the Russian government had come to the conclusion that “we do not have an immediate process of this resolution being accomplished.” Russia was “extremely concerned and profoundly upset by the fact that we have this humanitarian tragedy unfolding in Lebanon.
“So we think that the time is right to call for a humanitarian ceasefire and try to use this opportunity to accomplish and to bring to a successful end the political and diplomatic efforts.” Churkin said UN Secretary General Kofi Annan supported the measure and that the other four veto-wielding permanent members of the Security Council had raised no objection.
http://www.dailystar.com.lb
But US ambassador John Bolton criticised the Russian proposal.
“I don’t think it is helpful to divert attention. We are seeking to get a permanent, sustainable solution based on the approach that we and the French have been taking.
“We are not playing games here,” Bolton told reporters. “This is very serious.” The Russian envoy insisted that Moscow’s proposal was not meant to undermine the US-French efforts. “It is not our intention to compete with anybody,” he said.
Annan has called on the Security Council to pass a resolution on the “nightmare” Lebanon war by the end of the week.-AFP
August 11th, 2006 at 10:04 amSen. Joe Lieberman (D-CT) once called using national security issues for political purposes “just unacceptable and in my opinion un-American.†Yesterday he said that a timeline for Iraq redeployment (backed by 57 percent of Americans) “will be taken as a tremendous victory by the same people who wanted to blow up these planes in this plot hatched in England. It will strengthen them and they will strike again.â€
Lieberman has a fairly low threshold for whoring himself. One could say he’s easy…but as demonstrated in CT this week, they want higher quality…
August 11th, 2006 at 10:05 amReps. Henry Waxman (D-CA) and Charlie Melancon (D-LA) have written to FEMA about a report that 94 percent of emergency housing trailers for Katrina victims “contain hazardous levels of formaldehyde, a known carcinogen.â€
Wow. Just in time for the one-year anniversay of Katrina. Let me guess guys, are you up for re-election, too?
August 11th, 2006 at 10:06 amOn CNN right now …
Tip from Muslim led to arrests
Information about plot to blow up transatlantic flights came from Britain’s Muslim community, official says
Undercover British agent infiltrated the terror cell, officials say
So what part of TALKING TO THE MUSLIMS do the Bush dick wads not understand?
What part of ISLAM does NOT equal terrorism do they not understand?
IF we would stop slinging our virtual dong around and patting ourselves on the back and promoting redneck cowboy approaches to this problem we WILL get a return on that investment.. EVEN though America is lambasting muslims, arabs, and their religion we STILL see that decent muslims/arabs want PEACE just as much as anyone else and if we work with them they will work with us. If we blow them up and undermine their leaders (see Iran pre-Iranian revolution) then they will want revenge and will blow stuff up themselves… it is common sense human nature. Americans would act just like the terrorists if we were the ones that had to face a huge military might that was bent on selfish killing for oil and Israel at our expense.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:07 amIsrael Haaretz
IDF General Staff fiercely opposed to cease-fire terms
One dispute that delayed the agreement was over Shaba Farms. Prime Minister Ehud Olmert rejected a Lebanese-French demand that Israel withdraw from this area and transfer it to an international force until the UN, which had previously ruled Shaba part of Syria, decides how to handle Lebanon’s claim. The new draft merely states that the dispute over Lebanon’s borders, including around Shaba Farms, must be resolved, and instructs UN Secretary General Kofi Annan to propose a plan for doing to.
Government sources expressed satisfaction with the new draft, saying that it includes two key Israeli demands: an international force with teeth, and the disarmament of south Lebanon below the Litani River. “It’s true that the problem of Hezbollah has not been solved,” admitted one, “but we are also not in a position to solve it militarily.”
However, the Defense Ministry and the IDF General Staff are fiercely opposed to the emerging cease-fire, and senior defense officials accused Olmert of blocking the proposed advance to the Litani, thereby denying Israel a significant military achievement.
The officials charged that the emerging resolution is very problematic for Israel, because it makes no provision for the immediate return of the kidnapped soldiers (it urges their return, but this is not one of the resolution’s operative clauses), includes no stringent supervisory mechanism to prevent a renewed flow of arms to Hezbollah, and does not guarantee the organization’s disarmament. “[Hezbollah leader Hassan] Nasrallah will continue to mock us, and in the end there will be another war,” said one.
“We understand that the leadership wants to do everything possible to save soldiers’ lives, but too much is in the balance here,” added another. “We must continue.”
The defense officials argued that the cabinet should have allowed the expanded operation approved on Wednesday to start immediately, thereby creating military pressure for a cease-fire more favorable to Israel. By delaying the operation, they said, this opportunity has apparently been missed.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:07 amThe GAO found almost 30 percent of State Department diplomats abroad are “failing to speak and write the local language well enough to meet required levels.â€
Shameful. That’s what cronyism will get you, GWB. Oh yeah, he doesn’t give a shit…
August 11th, 2006 at 10:07 amThe GAO found almost 30 percent of State Department diplomats abroad are “failing to speak and write the local language well enough to meet required levels.â€
Of course, if your belief is that America(ns) is (are) superior, than it is reasonable to believe that everyone should be speaking American English. Interestingly, 30% is about the same as Bush’s poll rating. Further the GAO could probably state that Bush “fails to speak and write the local language well enough to meet required levels.”
August 11th, 2006 at 10:08 amHey now…
I saw in this AM’s SF Chronicle that one of our posters & threads were quoted from yesterday. They also quoted some reichtwingnutz site to show balance.
Wadda ya expect?
Anyway, I found it curious that some writer thought us interesting enough to quote us on his article titled PSYCHE OF BLOGOSPHERE: Experts call venting opinions a response to vulnerability.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:08 amoff topic I feel sorry for all the people that were flying yesterday that had to get rid of
all their personal things in their carry on bags.
My understanding is you can put your personnal thing in your check on bags like toothpaste, shampoo, etc.
Does anyone know if this is true? We are going to fly in September.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:08 amIsrael wants the Litani river for military reasons. Yeah, right. F**ers.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:08 ammarie, and any/all – i’m going to see OBAMA at a town hall meeting on tuesday – help me come up with a good question in case i get the chanc/nerve…
thanks!
Comment by katy
What EXACTLY can the democrats do to prevent a future 911. Exact concrete steps.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:08 amMorning, Zoo and everybody.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:09 amTaking off! :}
Morning, Juan. Bye!
August 11th, 2006 at 10:13 amhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eDJ3cuXKV4
August 11th, 2006 at 10:14 amThis latest terrist gig, supposedly broken up by the British, leaked to Busco by them, and being used by Bushco to the fullest, is a spinoff of the 1994 BOJINKA in the far east.
There is one major, major difference. Their 1994 plot did not call for martrying of the plotters. All else is right down the line, including using liquid type explosives and cell phones as detonators.
This proves to me that on this earth there are more and more people willing to make martrys of themselves. The hate for George Bush’s Amurka is growing by leaps and bounds. It wont stop until these neo-fascists are out of power.
A suggestion to DHS and the airlines. BAN ALL CARRY-ON LUGGAGE. Period. This would solve a hell of a lot of problems for the traveller. The airlines could stock up on baby bottles, formula and diapers for travellers who need those things. Ban cell phones and lap-tops also.
BTW I cannot think of any gel that when mixed with a sports drink, could become an explosive device. I do know about a bunch of powder products easily available at the super-market that will flash and explode. It is something millions of Amurkans put in their stomachs every day. Not me.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:14 amI for one understand the ONLY, and I mean ONLY reason terrorism exists is from the years and years and years of meddling by both the British government and the USA, and that includes their unending financial support to ISRAEL.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:16 amWhat’s funny is that the quote from TP in the SF Chronicle made the writer appear to be a complete dumbass.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:17 ammadashell, maybe the majority of Muslims are the problem:
Can a devout Muslim be an American patriot and a loyal citizen? Is Muslim American really an oxymoron? Consider this:
August 11th, 2006 at 10:22 amTheologically, no. Because his allegiance is to Allah, the moon god of Arabia.
Religiously, no. Because no other religion is accepted by his Allah except Islam (Quran, 2:256)
Scripturally, no. Because his allegiance is to the five pillars of Islam and the Quran (Koran).
Geographically, no. Because his allegiance is to Mecca, to which he turns in prayer five times a day.
Socially, no. Because his allegiance to Islam forbids him to make friends with Christians or Jews.
Politically, no. Because he must submit to the mullah (spiritual leaders), who teach annihilation of Israel and destruction of America, the great Satan.
Domestically, no, because he is instructed to marry four women and beat and scourge his wife when she disobeys him (Quran 4:34).
Intellectually, no, because he cannot accept the American Constitution since it is based on Biblical principles and he believes the Bible to be corrupt.
Philosophically, no, because Islam, Muhammad, and the Quran do not allow freedom of religion and expression. Democracy and Islam cannot co-exist. Every Muslim government is either dictatorial or Autocratic.
Spiritually, no, because when we declare “one nation under God,” the Christian’s God is loving and kind, while Allah is NEVER referred to as heavenly father, nor is he ever called love in the Quran’s 99 excellent names.
Ben, I don’t think you get the gist of my post. They believe in an eye for an eye – right or wrong, this is what they believe. Never have they STARTED anything – anything they have done has been in direct response to our MEDDLING.
If OIL did not exist in the middle east, and they grew, say, broccoli, WOULD THESE COUNTRIES GIVE A DAMN?
August 11th, 2006 at 10:27 amBen,
Maybe we ought to start rounding up Muslims, making them wear red crescents on their clothing, and put them in camps? Would that make America a better place? They used to say the same thing about Catholics, you know.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:28 amIt scares me to think that there are people who REALLY BELIEVE that peace will now EVER exist in Iraq. You CANNOT BOMB PEOPLE INTO SUBMISSION.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:29 amand because of these countries follies in the middle east – WE ARE NOW ALL TREATED LIKE WE ARE ALL TERRORISTS when we fly.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:32 am#29 RWAC You are totally wrong. The people in America should not be inconvenience because the HLS can not get there act together. This was all political to put fear in Americans so the Republican can win in November. We will not be fooled this time.
The Dems will win in November.
We have the Sercuity people that check our bags and steal stuff. I don’t like the idea that I have to put my personal things in my check in bag.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:35 amalso Ben – you are describing FUNDAMENTAL Islam – I for have known many of middle eastern descent, and NONE OF THEM ascribed to what you just described.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:35 amI woke up to my clock radio this morning to the Stones’ Sympathy for the Devil….and the first thing that popped into my head was DICK CHENEY. One thing though, forget the sympathy part.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:41 am#36 madashell I agree with you now all Americans are treated as terrorist when we fly. This is totally disgusting.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:41 amCan a devout fundamentalist Christian be an American patriot and a loyal citizen? Is Fundamentalist Christian American really an oxymoron? Consider this:
August 11th, 2006 at 10:54 amTheologically, no. Because his allegiance is to God, not to a nation.
Religiously, no. Because no other religion is accepted by his God except Yahweh
Scripturally, no. Because his allegiance is to the sixty-six books of the Bible and the Great Commission.
Geographically, no. Because his allegiance is to Heaven, which he hopes will come to claim him and all other devotees as soon as possible
Socially, no. Because his allegiance to the Old Testament of the Bible forbids him to make friends (”yoke” himself) with non-Christians or non-Jews.
Politically, no. Because he must attempt to unite church and state in order to bring about the Kingdom of God.
Domestically, no, because he is instructed to have slaves, sell his daughters into slavery, dominate his wife and not let her have a religious or political voice.
Intellectually, no, because he cannot accept that the American Constitution is not based on Biblical principles, that the United States is not a Christian nation, and that the Bible can be interpreted in various ways.
Philosophically, no, because Jerry Fallwell, Pat Robertson, and other fundamentalist leaders do not allow freedom of religion and expression. Democracy, as the free will of people without constraint unless there is a threat to someone else’s expression of free will, cannot co-exist with fundamentalist Christianity, which demands submission to the will of God by everybody. Every fundamentalist Christian organization is either dictatorial or Autocratic.
Spiritually, no, because when they declare “one nation under God,†they suggest that the Christianity must be advanced by a government, as if the faith cannot stand on its own. The Christian God is loving and kind, while its followers are often cruel and judgmental.
A NY Times article (Liquid Threat is Hard to Detect) gives yet another example of how throwing a trillion dollars into Iraq has compromised safety:
$110 million is approximately what the U.S. spends in 14 hours in Iraq (assuming $70 billion per year).
And for Mary Poplins and others curious about the new airline rules, here is the TSA’s explanation.
August 11th, 2006 at 10:55 amI don’t think Farwell or Robertson is sending suicide bombers into non believers like we are seeing these extremists doing.
Christian, Muslim, etc. whatever. The point is that Muslim extremists are killing people all over the world and you say they are not “starting” anything. Give me a break. You have the leader of Iran calling for the removal of Israel from the Middle East. Where should they live?
Thanks for revealing your true colors. There are plenty of Muslims who are only interested in living a peaceful life. Unfortunately many of their leaders have a different agenda.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:14 amBEN, your DOWNRIGHT IGNORANCE is astounding. READ SOME HISTORY YOU KNOW NOTHING.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:15 amWhere should they live?
Comment by Ben
Are you asking this about the displaced Palestinians?
I don’t think Farwell or Robertson is sending suicide bombers into non believers like we are seeing these extremists doing.
Yes like the extremists that are dropping bombs from 5,000 feet onto civilians. And those extremists that invade other countries and kill 10s of thousands of their civilians. Those extremists?
August 11th, 2006 at 11:21 am39. radio alarm.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:24 amDick has sympathy for the devil.
It’s his Uncle Satan !
Ben,
You attempted to paint ALL Muslims with one brush, offering that being Muslim and American are incompatible. My post was mostly a satirical take-off on yours to show the inherent illogic of your post. On the other hand, if you were to have said “radical”, “fundamentalist”, or “extremist” Muslim you would have a more valid point. Then you post “There are plenty of Muslims who are only interested in living a peaceful life. Unfortunately many of their leaders have a different agenda.” Why didn’t you state this in your original post?
BTW, Falwell has called for killing people. Don’t you think his and others’ rhetoric has fueled domestic terrorism (like bombing abortion clinics)?
August 11th, 2006 at 11:25 amYou are mistaken Ben,
to begin with, Allah is based upon the Jewish/Christian God, with parts taken from local customs to blend in better, and be more acceptable to the locals. Something Christianity did as well in the early days. Christmas trees easter eggs, etc. Jesus Chris is revered in Islamic teachings as the 4th or 5th prophet of God, but not as the savior. Christian and Judiasm were allowed to exist under the calips, however a tax was imposed upon non-muslims. If you look at the makeup of middle east countries, there are small pockets of Christians and Jews in most of them. I believe our good friend and ally Saudi Arabia, has laws about practicing any religion except for Islam these days. Iraq under Sadaam was pretty secular, thus the groups of Christians, Jews, Shia, and Sunni Arabs.
I don’t view the entire religion as being wacko. I do think there are some clear problems. However the right wing obsession is to paint all muslims as religious zealots. Much like Christianity or Judiasm, there are always those who will twist the beliefs to fit an agenda. The larger issue we are having, is those who preach the fiery message, are the ones listened to the most. When you have a large population of young men, who feel they or their brothers are being oppressed, and disenfranchised, it inevitably leads to violence. Look at the IRA in the UK, or read the history of the punk movement.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:26 amI can’t seem to find the AP-Ipsos poll, even on their website, but the last two FoxNews polls have seen approvals of 36, with the disapproval going from 53 to 56 %. The AP-Ipsos also does not have a not sure/don’t know option, so all polled have to go approve or disapprove. Looks like the undecided are making up their minds.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:32 amYou can argue you history until you are blue. There is plenty of wrong to go around for everyone of every religion. The question is what about today? Where should Israel live? Where should Palenstine live? Will Muslim extremists stop sending suicide bombers into Israel? Is Israel just supposed to accept the fact that they will be victims of terrorists acts as long as they reside in the Middle East?
Just try to address the current state of affairs. This is where the world is standing. What is the peaceful solution? What should be done about those who insist on unreasonable plans?
August 11th, 2006 at 11:35 am49. I saw that poll in passing yesterday, and noticed it was a Fox poll. Of course they took it down.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:36 am#50 – Who gets to define what is reasonable and what is un…?
August 11th, 2006 at 11:36 am50. No one here said Israel doesn’t have a right to exist. With that said, they also cannot ISOLATE themselves and treat every bordering neighbor as they have. And the US can STOP sending them arms. You do realize they have treated palestinians as animals – and even animals don’t DESERVE THAT KIND OF TREATMENT.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:37 ammadashell – here’s a good link –
August 11th, 2006 at 11:39 am54, let me try Again]]
August 11th, 2006 at 11:39 amhttp://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm
#53, would you agree that Israel should withdraw from the occupied territories and go back to the 1948 borders?
August 11th, 2006 at 11:41 am56. Absolutely!
August 11th, 2006 at 11:44 am#56. But since that will never happen, they can withdraw from the areas that they promised they would – instead they have been occupying and building MORE AND MORE!
August 11th, 2006 at 11:47 amLater gaters, got meetings & stuff.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:47 am#52 I would hope that we could agree that suicide bombers are not reasonable. Let’s agree that many in the region do not like Israel. Many references of occupation is nothing more than saying that Israel resides in the Middle East. So does Israel have to leave the Middle East? Where should they go? This is the primary problem.
madashell, Israel has tried to put up a wall. Israel responds aggressively against Palenstine AFTER they get hit not before. What commerce does Palenstine engage in? They are very poor and unemployed. The assistance they have received has not gone towards investment. Israel does not have a reason to “start” anything. Financially they are secure.
Again, what would you like for Israel to do?
August 11th, 2006 at 11:48 amBen – NOT what they’re doing right now.
August 11th, 2006 at 11:54 amthe whole thing is a vicious cycle. The Isrealis are attacked by Palestinians who feel oppressed and downtrodden. The Isrealis respond by attacking into Palestine, destroying homes, seizing land etc. thus creating more oppressed and downtrodden feeling among angry young men, who then strap bombs onto themselves and attack the Isrealis, who then respond to the attacks……
The true change needs to come from the Palestine and Lebenon. They need to control the fringe elements, who are frankly not concerned with who lives and who dies.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:01 pmGreenland’s icecap “is melting faster than ever before on record, and the pace is speeding year by year,†new data shows. “The consequence is already evident in a small but ominous rise in sea levels around the world, a pace that is also accelerating
Can’t we just send some troops over there and threaten the icecap, and if it doesn’t stop melting, we blow it up. That’ll clearly send a message to all other rogue icecaps.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:07 pm“But even if Lebanon survives intact, the hatred of its battered and bloodied population for those on the other side of the border will have intensified, and a whole new generation of Lebanese will have grown up knowing nothing of Israel but its pitiless aerial bombardment and indiscriminate destruction. Far from being a war for its survival, Israel has by its actions over the past month only increased the long-term threat to its own security.”
August 11th, 2006 at 12:12 pmThe true change needs to come from the Palestine and Lebenon
Krazny – we do agree on most things – but if you knew the true history of the region, you definitely would not be saying that.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:13 pmI agree that the Isreali’s need to change as well. It is difficult to change, when you are under constant attack. I don’t think that killing innocent civilians for either side is how you solve these issues. What I meant about change coming from Lebenon and Palestine, was the governments there need to have enough control to disarm the fringe militias. Frankly if the UK was sending truck mounted rockets to fringe groups in the US, who planned to launch them into Canada, the US government would put a stop to it.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:16 pmBut Krazny – the US is sending missiles to Israel – how can that EVER be justified?
August 11th, 2006 at 12:20 pmone more thought – by Israel’s actions over the last 50 years, they have CREATED both Hamas and Hezbollah.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:23 pmMadashell,
I think the situation is far more complex then most people realize. I don’t have sympathy for Isreal, since they have created their own monster. I don’t have sympathy for Hezbollah, or for hamas, because idealogically they are corrupt. I have sympathy for the Isreali’s who must endure terrorism from Hamas, and Hezbollah, I have sympathy for the Palestinians who want a peaceful life, only to see everything destroyed by the IDF, with US explosives. I have sympathy for the lebonese who wanted no part of the conflict Hezbollah has created, and who are know under threat of death if they try to move about their own country.
Ben touched on it above, there is plenty of blame and anger to go around.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:29 pmJoe Lieberman needs to shut up his yapper and crawl back under the rock he slithered out from under at birth > go away Joe you smell badly!
August 11th, 2006 at 12:29 pmKrazny – I know more than a lot of people about the history of the Middle East, and have for more than 25 years. There is an excellent book called the “Arab Awakening”, written in the 1930’s, by a Greek author. None of it is sugar coated, all the information is backed up in an excellent bibliography – he says the information was all out there – for anyone interested in learning the truth.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:33 pmKrazny – do you suppose you could link to some of the articles I posted above?
August 11th, 2006 at 12:33 pmmadashell, I watch a lot of international tv including Mosaic on WorldLink. You get different perspectives not just those of the West. I have seen on many occasions that this will never stop until Israel leaves Jerusalem. Israel is not going to leave Jerusalem. So what is the solution?
Look around the globe. Muslim extremists killing in EVERY part of the world. Africa, Asia, Europe, etc…I don’t think Israel is there.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:34 pmWhich post did you link the articles?
August 11th, 2006 at 12:35 pmI’m done. I will debate anyone who has a grasp of cause and effect of Israel, the US, Britian, France, etc., has had in the middle east.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:36 pm#62, 64, 65, and 66.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:37 pmBTW – JERUSALEM IS EVERY FAITH’S CITY. CHRISTIANS – JEWS – MUSLIMS
Why is it they all lived peacefully together for centuries until that last one?
August 11th, 2006 at 12:38 pmI have a grasp of the cause of middle east colonialism after WWII. I understand the longstanding effects of the crusades, 500 years ago on the middleo-eastern psyche. I just think you have decided to blame Isreal for everything. Violence is a two say street. Noone is blameless.
August 11th, 2006 at 12:43 pmLook I am NOT blaming Israel, per se – it is the ACTION OF THEIR GOVERNMENT – JUST LIKE OURS!
August 11th, 2006 at 12:44 pm79. Look I am NOT blaming Israel, per se – it is the ACTION OF THEIR GOVERNMENT – JUST LIKE OURS!
Comment by madashell — August 11, 2006 @ 12:44 pm
But you are laying the blame for all of the violence at the feet of Isreal. It is a sympton of a much larger problem. There is massive amounts of intolerance, and deep rooted anger in the muslim world towards not only Isreal, but also the western world. The crusades, the defeat and colonialism after WWII. The support of corrupt dictators by western powers, the need to control the oil supply. It all adds up to alot of hate and anger. I agree, that by supporting Isreal, and by say invading Iraq, that we have fanned the those flames. There is no good solution. Peace can only be had if both sides can actually live in peace. you may not like Isreal, but they are surrounded by unfriendly countries. They have in the past and will continue to react aggressively to any attacks on their people or their land. Yes it creates more of the same problem. yes it is US made arms being dropped on those caught in the middle. We are in a self perpetuating war. Unless a real agreement can be met and maintained. It will not change. I blame Iran and Syria for sending weapons to Hezbollah. I blame the UN and the lebonese government for failing to enforce a disarmament of Hezbollah. I blame Isreal for creating a sitution where a group like Hezbollah is able to thrive. I blame the UK and France, for not thinking through the problems of creating Isreal. Damn dude just about everyone shares a peice of this pie.
August 11th, 2006 at 1:00 pmI saw the thing posted by Ben (#32) a few days ago. Somehow I doubt that any of these points have been confirmed with an Islamic scholar. This is written by somebody who thinks it’s profound and doesn’t have a problem with the bearing false witness thing. (yes, there are outright lies in that text).
In 1960, when Kennedy was running for President, people were asking themselves “Can a Catholic be President?!! Those people are practically polytheists! We’re all going to have to learn Latin? The Pope is going to be telling America what to do from now on. I’m voting for Nixon because he’s not a heathen pagan fathersonwhaterver worshipper.”
Of the crimes perpetrated by Muslim extremists, how many of them were home grown in the US of A? OK, that guy who shot people last week, whatisname Lind and who else? American Muslims in on 9/11? American Muslims doing terrorism in Iraq? American Muslims planting bombs in Madrid, London and Bali? Nope. Pity, but Muslim Americans are disappointingly well behaved.
There are 7 million Muslims in the U.S. Seven times a thousand times a thousand, and there’s no indication that the bulk of them are any wackier than the Christians. They’re not disporportionately on welfare or in jail and they pay taxes, but that’s not good enough for the people who wrote the tripe that was included by Ben. They’re the “wrong type” of Americans. Timothy McVeigh killed more Americans out of his “all-American” ideology than American Muslims have out of their beliefs. McVeigh was a right-wing Catholic – maybe we should round all of them up? But how can the author of that idiotic and unresearched screed trust any conservative Catholic after what McVeigh did?
Go ahead- be suspicious. Find a group to dislike and then find reasons to dislike them. Sure beats having to educate yourself. Preserve America! Law abiding citizens with different weekend plans than yours got no place in the Land of the Free.
Better living through bigotry! Aaagh! Muhammad “the Greatest” Ali wants me dead!
August 11th, 2006 at 1:08 pmBut you are laying the blame for all of the violence at the feet of Isreal.
No I’m not – although I am blaming the governments of both Israel and the US!
August 11th, 2006 at 1:15 pmTake all the people you’ve heard of who were killed by Muslims for ostensibly religious reasons in the last 20 years. Multiply it by 100 (for no reason). Then subtract that number from a billion. Now compare the number of “killed by Muslims” to the number of Muslims in the world.
Remember: there’s a computer programmer in Jakarta with a wife and two kids who doesn’t have anything against you. Neither do his wife and kids.
August 11th, 2006 at 1:24 pmmadashell, you seem to represent the problem. You only blame the governments of the US and Israel. What about the other countries in the Middle East? Iran’s leader says that Israel should be wiped out. You preach fairness but behave with prejudice.
August 11th, 2006 at 1:45 pmTwo faces has Joe.
August 11th, 2006 at 2:00 pmJoe Lieberman needs to shut up his yapper and crawl back under the rock he slithered out from under at birth > go away Joe you smell badly!
Comment by Jay Randal — August 11, 2006 @ 12:29 pm
Apparently Gov. Richardson asked the same thing today.
August 11th, 2006 at 2:16 pmmadashell, you seem to represent the problem. You only blame the governments of the US and Israel. What about the other countries in the Middle East? Iran’s leader says that Israel should be wiped out. You preach fairness but behave with prejudice.
Comment by Ben — August 11, 2006 @ 1:45 pm
That may be. However, his country is not invading Iraq and killing thousands of innocent Iraqis. Neither is his country invading Lebanon and killing civilians in job lots.
He may have a big mouth, but he isn’t an actual war criminal unlike the people you are defending.
August 11th, 2006 at 2:36 pmKaty,
August 11th, 2006 at 2:52 pmI just saw your message – it’s hard to come up with a single question now. We all should give it some thought and reply to Katy.
My immediate questions are more rhetorical, negative, or otherwise not helpful – I’d like to think of a good question that will elicit a good reply.
Dems have a lot of issues worthy of discussion, but we also need at least one short and sweet, positive and memorable, appropriate and concise slogan to be used by everyone on camera, on radio, in print, on cars, placards and buttons.
Something the repugs can’t get away from no matter where they go.
You can argue you history until you are blue. There is plenty of wrong to go around for everyone of every religion. The question is what about today? Where should Israel live? Where should Palenstine live? Will Muslim extremists stop sending suicide bombers into Israel? Is Israel just supposed to accept the fact that they will be victims of terrorists acts as long as they reside in the Middle East?
Just try to address the current state of affairs. This is where the world is standing. What is the peaceful solution? What should be done about those who insist on unreasonable plans?
Comment by Ben
These exact questions and a few more should be asked and then answered through open meetings at the UN or some other middle ground area. But that is not what the dim whitted Bush nor the cruel Chenney are doing now are they? They are not asking these questions because they do not want the answers… answers mean solutions.. solutions mean no more problems… no more problems means much less money being made from oil/weapons/wars which is where most of the Bush/Chenney types and their friends get all their money.
August 11th, 2006 at 4:00 pmThe true change needs to come from the Palestine and Lebenon
Krazny – we do agree on most things – but if you knew the true history of the region, you definitely would not be saying that.
Comment by madashell
The fact of the matter is if the Zionists never went to the ME this would not be happening.
But we are way past that point… the arabs dont have the power to wipe out Israel and even if they did they would pay too much for it. There are people that live in Israel now that know their homeland/birthplace as Israel not europe where their fathers and grandfathers came from.
The arabs need to accept this.
The Israelis need to stop rubbing it in the arabs faces.
Both sides need to arrest and not cheer on the violent settlers and terrorists.
Only a few leaders on all sides can pull off peace and the leaders from both sides need to decide to do it at the same time. And this requires a third party to pull both sides together to do this at the same time. And that third party SHOULD be America … but Americas leaders are not and will not do this… but this is the first REAL step to stoping ME terrorism. THE ROOT.
Republicans are too egotistical to do it. The democrats are too concerned with getting power back to risk doing it…. the religious leaders are all egging on the killers or are keeping quite out of peer pressure from the ones that are egging on the killers…. the rest of us either dont have any power or know the people that do but are not telling them what they need to do because of the peer pressure affect again.
Year after year… around and around… death death death….
We need a new president of the USA. Someone that is alot like Teddy Roosevelt… that will put on his rubber pants and walk waist deep into the sewer and get this mess cleaned up not matter how much the others howl about it.
August 11th, 2006 at 4:11 pmmarie – keep thinking!
gerald gibson – thanks for that – good question…
i’m surprised so few had any suggestions…
while reading the “headline news anchor” thread, i thought of this one, still needs work – will accept revisions!
August 11th, 2006 at 6:54 pm“what can we do – you, the congress, do – about the prevalence of lies and misinformation delivered constantly by the media, and even directly from the administration?”
Re: “Reps. Henry Waxman (D-CA) and Charlie Melancon (D-LA) have written to FEMA about a report that 94 percent of emergency housing trailers for Katrina victims “contain hazardous levels of formaldehyde, a known carcinogen.â€
It reminds me of the government giving the Indians small pox infected blankets.
August 12th, 2006 at 3:40 pm“failing to speak and write the local language well enough to meet required levels.â€
Isn’t that a fragment? The GAO shouldn’t throw stones.
I respectfully disagree. Americans need honesty more than we need softball questions tossed to unaccountable politicians. Our Senators and Representatives need to represent the electorate or get the hell out of office. Too many politicians sacrifice the needs of the people for the desires of big business. Both sides of the aisle must be held accountable by “We the People.”
Ask Obama why he voted for the bankruptcy bill that allows lending institutions to stuff obscene amounts of money into their coffers at the peril of the American People who have been preyed upon. His “yes” vote was one of his first official acts and I would like to hear his explanation.
August 13th, 2006 at 2:19 pmReps. Henry Waxman (D-CA) and Charlie Melancon (D-LA) have written to FEMA about a report that 94 percent of emergency housing trailers for Katrina victims “contain hazardous levels of formaldehyde, a known carcinogen.â€
Wow. Just in time for the one-year anniversay of Katrina. Let me guess guys, are you up for re-election, too?
Comment by Zooey
Zooey,
August 13th, 2006 at 10:05 pmIf you are implying here that Waxman and Melancon have done this as an election year ploy, I think you are wrong–at least in the former case. I am not very familiar with Melancon, but Waxman has been after the administration and various government bureaus for corruption and waste throughout his career in Congress. Besides, he lives in a safely Democrat district and doesn’t need to put on some kind of show close to election time. (Until a bit of redistricting following the 2000 census, I voted in his district. I now vote in a neighboring, also overwhelmingly Democrat, district). I don’t want to take up a lot of space here going over all the good things Waxman has done or tried to do, so I recommend that you look up his record if you have any doubts. I think he is a Congressman you would like or at least approve of.
Thanks for the info, Lora. I’ll look into it. You can tell I’m a bit jaded these days.
August 14th, 2006 at 12:07 amNovember Predictions:
Another Al Qaeda Attack
Another Bin Laden Video
Another Rigged Election
Another Republican Sponsored Supreme Court Decision
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