Matthews: Neocons ‘May Be Right’ When They Say Bush ‘Has To Hit’ Iran
Matthews: Neocons ‘May Be Right’ When They Say Bush ‘Has To Hit’ Iran
Today on MSNBC, Chris Matthews hosted a segment entitled “Is Iran Next?” Matthews said that Bill Kristol and other neoconservatives “may be right” when they argue that Bush “has to hit” Iran militarily. Watch it:
Matthews didn’t mention that a bi-partisan group of national security experts believe there are no good military options in Iran.
Transcript:
MATTHEWS: Maybe this is moot. But you know I keep hearing from people on the right — Robert Kagen and Bill Kristol, the guys who are the most hawkish and the most articulate in making their case and they may be right — that at the end of this administration, this hawkish administration — that was willing to go into Iraq and Afghanistan — if this president is not willing to knock out those facilities no future president is likely to do it. We’ll be stuck with a nuclear armed Iran which can rant and rave around that region, threatening Israel, Saudi and everybody else. And we’ll be stuck with it. So their argument is try the diplomatic route, try everything but in the end we have to hit ‘em.
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Ho boy.
Set aside reality.
Build a straw man.
Hit straw man.
Mission Accomplished.
What’s with these Hate Mongers? Do these Compassionate Christians know only one thing? Is that one thing War?
If this were any other country in the world, NeoCons and their supporters would be Fair Game. Only here in the Good ‘Ol USA is such greedy self serving incompetence tolerated by the masses.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:03 pmDon’t worry, no sane person would ever bother asking a liberal to defend their country, so you can stay safe in your flip-flops and bermuda shorts.
Comment by Jason M. Hendler
Psst Jason….Here’s your chance. Enlist now, and protect our country from Iran!
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:05 pmyou can’t defend this guy and the way he talks, but he may be saying that “bush” has to hit iran. meaning it is the only thing he has that he can do to fight his little war on terra. he thinks that will make everyone like him again. that is but a guess by this humble maroon
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:08 pmSomeone has to hit Chris Matthews with a big dope slap.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:12 pmIf the U.S. attacks Iran we will be in military confilcts through the rest of this decade.
Ask the questions: If Bush is right in saying that terrorists back down if the U.S. acts “strong” why is it that the Bush administration has not created and released a legally required report on the terrorist activities? Is it because the number of terrorist attacks has more than tripled since he has been in office?
Bush and his administration has made U.S. citizens and the world a much less safe place to live.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:13 pmThanks for your insight, Tweety.
America’s Least Wanted
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:14 pmWhat happens if we Hit Iran, and that gives them 21?
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:17 pmHey Jason why don’t you get a gun and fight your dirty wars, you coward.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:18 pmListening to Chris Matthews opine on foreign affairs is sort of like listening to Tim Russert opine on Social Security – and almost as much of a waste of air time as having Lawrence Kudlow opine on economics.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:19 pmIraq – a colossal failure by Bushco and NeoCons
Afghanistan – a colossal failure by Bushco and NeoCons
Lebanon – a colossal failure by Bushco, NeoCons, and Israel Zionists
Iran – would be a even bigger oolossal failure by Bushco, NeoCons, and Israel Zionists.
Yesh right Chris Matthewes these completely deluded lunatics have been 100% consistent.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:21 pmNeeded to calm down and repost
Iraq - a colossal failure by Bushco and NeoCons
Afghanistan - a colossal failure by Bushco and NeoCons
Lebanon - a colossal failure by Bushco, NeoCons, and Israel Zionists
Iran - would be a even bigger colossal failure by Bushco, NeoCons, and Israel Zionists.
Yeah right Chris Matthews these completely deluded lunatics have been 100% consistently WRONG !
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:24 pmHELL NO, I WON’T GO!!!! That’s what I’ll say if the neo-nazis try to put me back in uniform. See how fast I give the Pentagon a 1-finger salute.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:24 pmTweety is a self-absorbed loudmouth. He sets up an argument and then defends it.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:25 pmHe says he was/is opposed to the war in Iraq (coulda fooled me) but when it comes to Iran, well, the “neocons may be right.”
So he’s creating a similar stage for the next two years of Hardball.
Bush must be stopped – not encouraged – and only a change in Congress has a hope of accomplishing that.
if anyone can get to mathews, raw story has inteligence officers saying the case against Iraq is being ginned up just like Iraq.
the president is relying on a member of the pnac for info…things like that
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:26 pmI read that too, #14.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:29 pmBut then again I read many similar reports before we invaded Iraq.
The media loves a war because it means viewers and that means $$.
It’s pretty simple.
Remember “Countdown to War” and other similar themes?
It was a foregone conclusion then and they are making a foregone conclusion now.
“Either”
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:30 pmOn a quiet night, when the moon is full, if you listen very hard, you just might hear it, the chirping of the rare and very ugly yellow-striped wingnut: “freep-freep!” “freep-freep!”
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:44 pmSo much for antiwar tweety.
August 23rd, 2006 at 6:57 pmI saw this whole segement, and Matthews was hard on the Neocons, at one point saying something along the lines of ‘if you buy the bill of goods the right sold us, the cheap gas, the roses, the war will pay for itself, all that stuff that was dead wrong…’ To pull out this comment is really an unworthy niggle.
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:09 pmCue Tom Petty’s “Freefalling”.
Economist says US recession will be a doozy.
Link
-GSD
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:11 pmYep.
The neo-cons may be right.
And the moon may be made out of cheeze.
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:12 pm…make that”cheese”.
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:14 pmAnd what would Bush “hit” Iran with? Nukes? We just learned that the Marines are calling up the IRR. According to the LAT, “The ready reserve was designed to be a pool of manpower that the Pentagon could draw on in a time of national emergency. But the Iraq war has forced the Army, and now the Marines, to rely on the ready reserve to fill holes in the combat force.” Note the words, “national emergency.”
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:21 pmThe real question that should be asked is how do we silence these freakin nuts. Honest to goodness, in the real world it only takes one major mistake to lose all credibility and these neocons and this administration has a large volume book full of mistakes of biblical proportions.
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:25 pmBush’s reign of TERROR continues….
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:31 pmsandy – free media is an oxymoron.
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:34 pmDo the board of NBC where little round black hats to cover their bald spots?
Comment by Bluedog49 — August 23, 2006 @ 6:59 pm
I have to agree at some extent with David. Just look at Hollywood (dominated by jewish directors and producers) and their stupid movies where you have two sides: good and bad. Thats all. Jewish people have a tremendous influence over the media…and I wont go further…
August 23rd, 2006 at 7:58 pmAlready trying to paint me as a hate monger which im not, facts are facts
Comment by David — August 23, 2006 @ 7:39 pm
You might claim not to be a racist and a hatemonger, but your linking to a The National Alliance says otherwise:
Membership is not based upon citizenship in one particular country. Instead, membership is contingent upon the person being of purely White or of non-Jewish European ancestry. The National Alliance is often included in lists of neo-Nazi groups, in part due to its glorification of Adolf Hitler.
Wikipedia: The National Alliance
You have provided a link to an organisation that is anti-semitic and against “racial miscegenation”. And this is the source you expect us to find credible? Please.
Take your white supremacist anti-semitic propaganda somewhere else.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:03 pmJuan C,
David is the kind of person for whom Hispanics are not too far removed from the Jewish, when it comes to the racial “scale”.
You see, white/Aryan people are at the top, Jewish, blacks, Hispanics, etc. are at the bottom. They are also against mixing their race with the “lower races” because it debases them and makes them “inferior”.
Be careful with whom you agree.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:11 pmWhy?
What has Iran done to justify another unilateral unprovoked attack by the Bushco on a sovereign Nation? Mr. President your answer please.
1. They have oil. Daddy wants the oil!
2. The Ayatollah “dissed” my Daddy. Daddy don’t like to be dissed!
3. Halliburton’s profits are down. Uncle Dick doesn’t like for profits to be down.
4. They are building a big firecracker. Daddy and Uncle Dick won’t let me use our firecrackers.
5. Tehran is in Iran. Uncle Rummy don’t like Baghdad any more, he wants to go to Tehran.
6. That God-damned piece of paper says I have to move. I got to stay last time because I started a war. Maybe it will work this time.
Thanks, DUHbya. Go back to your pet goat. But please don’t wet your pants again.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:13 pmNot for the first time, I wonder if these idiots talking about “hitting” Iran know how such a catastrophically idiotic move will shred their own comfortable lives. With any major disruptions to the oil supply, this country is toast – literally. I know Matthews, et al are stupid, but are they really THIS stupid?
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:16 pmI just caught this, and don’t think this post is fair to Matthews. I didn’t get the impression he thought the neocons were right on this, more just saying this is their take.
Besides, his guest Cohen didn’t agree, and Matthews didn’t push the point.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:22 pmPeople like Chris Matthews and Bill Kristol and whoever else can say what they want, I don’t believe it will happen. Noone is going to back us up on this and we can’t do it alone.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:22 pmNo, no, no Mr. Matthews; The truth matters. Who can trust the neocons to get it right after they’ve gotten it wrong so many times?
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:25 pmho boy, is right…
i’ve been taking care of family busines and spending much needed time in the garden … mostly unable to pay much attention to the outside world… after my shower and dinner, i think i’ll check in on the TP blog, “wonder how the world got along without me these past few days?…”
and the first thing i read is that tweety has given his blessing, even encouragement, to further this sinful craziness…
NO, WE DON’T “have to hit ‘em”!!!!!!!
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:25 pmaw jeez… i can’t handle much more of this…
George Bush is without a doubt the greatest threat to peace in the world. He’s a man with no conscience and he’s insane. Way to go right wingnuts in voting for this sociopath.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:28 pmBe careful with whom you agree.
Comment by Gregor Samsa — August 23, 2006 @ 8:11 pm
I read David the first time in the past thread of Buchanan and it wasnt difficult to figure out his opinion about the immigrants issue. Yeah, I think he speaks out of emotion (hate and false patriotism) while I was agreeing with him on the facts. He is somewhat right with the facts, he is completely wrong in the reasons he had to present those facts.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:32 pmI would be surprised to see this really happen. I know, what yer thinking, maybe, “these are dangerous sociopaths here”, yes thats true, but a sociopath is always out for himself, so Gearge will see the majority will not go for it, he will be hated, and his buddys will be voted out, IF HE goes into Iran. So he won’t do it.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:33 pmDon’t worry, no sane person would ever bother asking a liberal to defend their country, so you can stay safe in your flip-flops and bermuda shorts.
Comment by Jason M. Hendler
Since Herr Hindler and almost all rethugs have all enlisted and defended our country (not Hindlers I guess) we are safe. We have Chaney, Bush 43, and Gunner Rudy , not to mention Kristol , Feith, Pearl and a host of chicken $hit cowards that will defend us. NOT. When Herr Hindler and Insanity suit up let me know. Hindler is I think a Boy scout leader looking for another merit badage, or a “Back door draft”. Jason, Here is a thought for you–And I don’t want to seem crude, but- you are one sick Mother $ucker. BTW you should have added “pop tops”. Do you know what they are?.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:35 pmOh, just wanted to present you this:
Corporations (public) with highest profits
rank corporation profits
1. ExxonMobil (USA)
2. Royal Dutch/Shell Group (Neth./UK)
3. Citigroup (USA)
4. BP (UK)
5. Bank of America (USA)
6. General Electric (USA)
7. Total S.A. (France)
8. Chevron (USA)
9. ConocoPhillips (USA)
10. Microsoft (USA)
Source
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:36 pmWell, it appear’s Wed/ along with the other six day’s a week is plant fear day….Bit’s of make up new’s articals some times are truth’s……..Maybe if we all speak of truth, Peace and bring the troop’s home now it will resonate…..How about marchng……Called or emailed all the representatives yet…….Just like the lottery, can’t win if you don’t buy at least one ticket…..Blessings…..Peace , demand it……
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:43 pmComment by Juan C — August 23, 2006 @ 8:36 pm
Juan, I think I see a trend here–Has it have anything oil? Always like your views. Let’s beat up on Jason Herr Hindler a complete rectal prevert.
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:47 pmLisa Dear, were you talking to me.? May I say if my spelling is you’re problem you’re priorities are screwed…..War’s and this administrations total distruction and killing is the issue…..The best our country has 2,612 and hundred’s of thousands of other countries people have perished because of these stupid fool’s….Go fight somewhere else……..
August 23rd, 2006 at 8:56 pm-Off topic-
Shocking election-theft testimony
Posted by Evan Derkacz on August 23, 2006 at 3:16 PM.
*There’s a video on AlterNet–Steve53*
Computer programmer Clinton Eugene Curtis testifies under oath before the U.S. House Judiciary Members in Ohio — video to the right (partial transcript below). Stephen Pizzo writes:
If you can watch this entire video, and still use an electronic voting machine, you deserve the government you get. If your state or district has decided to use electronic voting machines this November demand an absentee ballot today. Watch this video. Then join those of us who have decided that since paper was good enough for our constitution, it’s good enough for our vote too.
Oh, and when you’re done watching the whole video… pass it along. November is only a a few weeks off and the last thing Republicans want to see is either house returned to Democrat control. Because if that happens, hearings happen. And if hearings happen… well, who knows – someone(s) could go to jail. So, demand a paper ballot or an absentee ballot in Nov. and leave the cheaters with a pocket full of worthless Diebold electrons.
A partial transcript:
Are there computer programs that can be used to secretly fix elections?
Yes.
How do you know that to be the case?
Because in October of 2000, I wrote a prototype for Congressman Tom Feeney [R-FL]…
It would rig an election?
It would flip the vote, 51-49. Whoever you wanted it to go to and whichever race you wanted to win.
And would that program that you designed, be something that elections officials… could detect?
They’d never see it.
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:08 pm“djangone so is the speculative bubble ready to burst? Only the realstate? What about the rest? What happened to the “Domino†effect? One sector at the time? You wish!
Comment by Snoop doggy dog — August 23, 2006 ”
I’m sorry, is there a question in this incomprehensible garble? My comment was that Matthews’ day wasn’t that bad, and that this post is kinda dumb. If you think I’m anything but a proud flag-burnin’ liberal because I defend Chris Matthews you’re an utter fruitcake.
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:10 pmHaven’t they learnt anything from their little misadventure into Iraq? I remember that not too long ago, Tweety Matthews was one of the loudest cheerleaders for the Iraq war, now he wants more? Stirring up Iran would complete the circle of stupidiy by these neocons. Iran is not Iraq, and for those kool-aid drinkers who would still be dumb enough to think that we would be safer, they would have a rude awakening in dealing with Iranian terror, literally in America’s living room. If any attack is afoot, then let it be led by the Bush twins, senators kids and kin and those of the punditocracy, aristocracy and thocracy. Too many poor people’s kids have died at the whim and fancy of these war-mongering jackals. It’s time to turn the tables. The more desparate and jumpy these neocons get before November, the louder the drumbeat for war -any war will do, anywhere, with anybody. When poll numbers fall, just start a war.
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:20 pmWhy worry about terrorists when we have the Bushneocons and idiots like Matthews. Hey Chris are you going to send your kids to Iran? You haven’t got the guts to go yourself. The wackos are running the farm.
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:22 pmDon’t worry, no sane person would ever bother asking a liberal to defend their country, so you can stay safe in your flip-flops and bermuda shorts.
Comment by Jason M. Hendler
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:27 pm===================================================================
Hey dickweed a good many of the people posting on this site have served their country. Have you? I didn’t think so. If you look at democrats versus repugnacans I think you’ll see that there are a crapload more democrats in congress that are veterans than there are weasels like Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, and all the other chicken shits in the whitehouse. That goes for Limbaugh, Hannity, Savage, O’Reily, Prager and all the other propaganda mongers you listen to. Before you shoot off your ignorant mouth again why not go enlist they’re waiting for you.
Let’s beat up on Jason Herr Hindler a complete rectal prevert.
Comment by Joefriday — August 23, 2006 @ 8:47 pm
Thank you for your words. I would say likewise. :)
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:29 pmAbout Jason, he does that beating by himself every time he posts. He doesnt need us.
What is with Matthews, lately? One day, he’s a hard-hitting TV journalist who asks sweaty and uncomfortable questions and not allowing guys like Schlesinger and Mehlman any wiggle room whatsoever then he says something stupid like this. We’ve got to stop letting people like this shape the national discourse and framing the terms of debate. To wit:
“The problem is that we liberals allow the conservatives to frame not only the terms of debate (such as when George Bush tells us that we need to civilly express our differing opinions, as long as the end result is the same, which is that he gets his way) but also to debate whether or not something is debated in certain contexts.†Read the rest. I think you’ll be glad you did.
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:30 pmHow do you like me now people?
Comment by Sandy — August 23, 2006 @ 8:53 pm
Sandy, Please go away. What do you think or have to say? Have you ever read on this blog someone say ” you ignorant slut” Just asking.
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:41 pmDayum, just when I thought Matthews had some common sense…
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:45 pmChris has just been whupped upside the head by the stupid stick one too many times. Quoting Bill “The Mummy” Kristol is like asking the waiter to come over and set your table on fire. What a doofus.
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:53 pmThank you for your words. I would say likewise. :)
About Jason, he does that beating by himself every time he posts. He doesnt need us.
Comment by Juan C — August 23, 2006 @ 9:29 pm
So true! Like most persons who can not or will not think for them selfs–However, He is one screwed up pervert. Notice, that once you call him out for his true self–He is gone. Jason is just a $hit as$ coward like all his friends-would never ever risk his life or limb for anyone. Hides behind tough talk but is a little coward. I repeat, Jason you are a complete fraud, you would refuse to risk your life for anything or anyone. You and your ilk are the worst of mankind. I have tried many times to get this $hit a$s to debate this but, it won’t.
August 23rd, 2006 at 9:56 pmI agree with DrSinker (#49) – Tweety wasn’t agreeing with the neocons about invading Iran when he said “and they might be right” – he was saying that the neocons want to invade Iran and if Bush doesn’t do it, no president after him will. And that may well be true.
I’m just sayin’….
August 23rd, 2006 at 10:11 pmAnd meantime, the only middle eastern country left that:
1. Invades its neighbours on a regular basis
2. Possesses WMD (and that includes nukes)
3. Regularly ignores UN resolutions it does not like (i.e. 242)
4. Denies other peoples the right to exist
is put under what pressure regarding its nuclear programs…?….nah don’t look over there, the Iranians are far more dangerous /sarcasm
August 23rd, 2006 at 10:19 pmDon’t worry, no sane person would ever bother asking a liberal to defend their country, so you can stay safe in your flip-flops and bermuda shorts.
Comment by Jason M. Hendler
This warrants a little name calling. Jason, you are a complete asshole.
August 23rd, 2006 at 10:50 pmmaybe Chris ought to mention that the evil Iranians have had their gov’t overthrown twice successfully ,once unsuccessfully (by the CIA )and that after the 3rd unsuccessful attempt the US armed Saddam to the teeth for a war that took 1 million lives .
August 23rd, 2006 at 10:56 pmAs to the Iranians threatening Israel and Saudi Arabia and destabilizing the region ,Israeli behavior has without a doubt been the primary destabilizing force in the Mid East and Saudi Arabia is an oligarchy that is a major supporter of terrorism and the majority of the 911 hijackers were Saudi!!!!!
If you were Iranian would you want the bomb that Israel doesn’t officially possess ???
Chris “Well Scrubbed Baby Whore” Matthews doesn’t give a shit what comes out of his mouth, as long as he gets the ratings.
He has no integrity.
He is a waste of skin.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:04 pmJason, go “defend” our country you snivelling cowardly chickenhawk.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:10 pmI’ve got an idea .Lets arrest the neo cons convict them of war crimes and offer serious aid and an olive branch to all the countries in the ME that our policies have wronged in the last 60 years .I suspect it would save us a pile of money and re establish our reputation in the world community !
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:12 pmoh and boycott Exxon fanatically before the election !
#100 what Freeman, you mean the Iranians might just have a reason to be pissed at the US? Say it ain’t so! You mena they are behaving rationally, who would have thought? I thought they were all crazy – says so on US TV
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:16 pmMatthews, of late, has been critical of Bush and the disaster in IRAQ. Peculiar, I thought.
Now, you know why he had such a change of heart?
Spanking Bush on Iraq leaves open the Downy Softness of validating a new war.
It downplays Bushs’ IRAQ failures while he attempts to fornicate another mega disaster with Iran.
Matthews takes it in the ass by Iraq architect mega loser KRISTOL and his neo con suppicants. To even mention these red meat pricks whose NEW CENTURY NEO CON BULLSHIT failed, shows that Matthews has always bent over for them.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:20 pmI’m a Democrat who supports the United States striking Iran and for good reason. We as Democrats have to realize that Iran would give nuclear weapons to terrorists if they had them. The leader of Iran is a mad dog who believes all Americans are the enemy and that we must be destroyed. If you recall he was on of the hostage takers during the takeover of our embasy in Tehran in the 1980s.
It’s time Democrats woke up and smelled the coffee, we can’t play games with these Muslims extremists, because they are bound and determined to destroy America. I don’t not and would not ever ever ever support the President or his policies, but this is one time he should attack a country. Yes attacking Iran will come at a cost, but that cost would be far less than the thousands that could be killed by a nuclear explosion in one of our cities.
I don’t know about any of you, but I don’t intend to be glowing at night because of being contaminated by radiation. If you think about the fallout that would result to our economy, not to mention the panic that would result from such an attack. Katrina was high wind and water, but a nuclear bomb affects not only kill immediate, but for years later and the soil would be contaminated for thousands of years. Those who forget about our nuclear attack during WWII do so foolishly, believe me we don’t want to suffer the fate the people of those two cities did. Believe me my Democratic brothen, I wish there was some other way, but there isn’t. We have to attack Iran and not just once, but for months, and maybe years to avoid a certain nuclear attack by terrorist.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:26 pmI’m a Democrat who supports the United States striking Iran and for good reason. We as Democrats have to realize that Iran would give nuclear weapons to terrorists if they had them. The leader of Iran is a mad dog who believes all Americans are the enemy and that we must be destroyed. If you recall he was on of the hostage takers during the takeover of our embasy in Tehran in the 1980s.
It’s time Democrats woke up and smelled the coffee, we can’t play games with these Muslims extremists, because they are bound and determined to destroy America. I don’t not and would not ever ever ever support the President or his policies, but this is one time he should attack a country. Yes attacking Iran will come at a cost, but that cost would be far less than the thousands that could be killed by a nuclear explosion in one of our cities.
I don’t know about any of you, but I don’t intend to be glowing at night because of being contaminated by radiation. If you think about the fallout that would result to our economy, not to mention the panic that would result from such an attack. Katrina was high wind and water, but a nuclear bomb affects not only kill immediate, but for years later and the soil would be contaminated for thousands of years. Those who forget about our nuclear attack during WWII do so foolishly, believe me we don’t want to suffer the fate the people of those two cities did. Believe me my Democratic brothen, I wish there was some other way, but there isn’t. We have to attack Iran and not just once, but for months, and maybe years to avoid a certain nuclear attack by terrorist.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:26 pmSince the terrorists have started kidnapping FOX journalists, isn’t there any way that they could start on some of these idiot talking heads?
I don’t necessarily want any harm to come to them (although a little torture would be OK) , but it would sure be good to have a break from the Matthews, Cokie Roberts, O Reillys, Cal Thomas, Malkins, Hannitys, Limbaughs, and Coulters for a while wouldn’t it? PLEASE, enlist or imbed these jerks in an unprotected alley of Baghdad!
Seriously, the propaganda machine is in full swing this election year (as predicted). Best not to watch or read any of the main media.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:31 pmLuke, go nuke the boogey-man under your bed, and see what happens.
Moron!
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:37 pmBelieve me my Democratic brothen, I wish there was some other way, but there isn’t. We have to attack Iran and not just once, but for months, and maybe years to avoid a certain nuclear attack by terrorist.
Comment by Koolhandluke — August 23, 2006 @ 11:26 pm
Please tell me you think you are from the left too and then I will start laughing as I should.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:44 pmSorry Koolhand, if you substitute Saddam and Iraq for your Iranian bogeyman, you have the exact same story from 2002. And look how accurate that was. After 9-11, thr Iranians expressed outrage at the attack & supported the US in Afghanistan. Unfortunately, the US used the same blunt instrument to treat Iran as they have done everywhere else – result they pushed Iran back into the hands of the hard-liners. And so here we are. I don’t have the answer, but I would say unleashing nuclear hell on Iran (because that’s what it will take) will mark the beginning of the end for the US.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:45 pmI am a Democrat, and I would expect a Democratic President to stop Iran from obtaining Nuclear Technology.
Not for nothing, we as a nation should be told the truth behind the Iranian Nuclear Technology without the sugar coating…
Russia, China and Pakistan are all responsible for the current Nuke Technology that Iran has… we should be demanding that all 3 nations STOP immediatly all nuke technology transfers to Iran NOW.
And if they don’t, then they are no ‘Ally’ of the United States, they are an ENEMY.. plain and F*cking Simple.
Kennedy Stood up to the USSR in ‘62 .. causing the USSR to back down… the same can be done today… but unfortunatly WALL STREET and certain TRAITORS of the United States (many including owners of media outlets that are expanding operations in Communist China) have a lot to lose if Bush or the Next President takes this on at the source.
Kennedy was a Democrat, and he dealt with the ‘62 crisis at the source, he didn’t play F*cking Games, he didn’t go after Cuba, he went to the SOURCE.
But from the looks and sounds of things from so called Democrats today, on this board and other non republican oasis boards … many of these whining complainers today would have been whining and screaming when Kennedy stood up to the USSR over the Cuban Missile Crisis.
I’d give Bush a thumbs up if he stopped Iran’s Nuke Tech program, and heaven help us if Iran does get it’s hands on Nuke Weapons.
FYI – I am not Happy that Pakistan has Nuke Weapons, and I wouldn’t flinch if we moved in and neutralized their Nuke Strike Capabilities.
That’s it for now,
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:45 pmGregNewYork
Koolhandluke,
The President of Iran has about as much power in his country as our Secretary of the Interior has in ours. They put him up front because he puts on a good show, and scares “whitey.”
I don’t know about you, Kool, but I don’t feel comfortable messing around with extremists of any kind, whether they be Muslim, Christian, or vegan.
You speak quite easily of the cost to this country were we to attack Iran. Are you prepared to offer up yourself, your children and grandchildren as cannon fodder? This would be a generational war, and would be the end of the world.
That’s why we have to do the hard thing, and it’s called diplomacy, let’s just shut up and start listening. We don’t know everything, as we’ve proven so well these last few years.
We create what we fear. Try not to be frightened.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:50 pmkoolhandluke a real gunfighter huh.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:54 pmA war in the mid east of the magnitude your describing will affect the flow of oil and the global economy hugely !
Oh and while our untrained DRAFTED army learns how to fight on the front lines I’m sure China and the rest of the world community will just sit and watch .Do you know anything of our history through the cold war in the region ?
Stick to spaghetti westerns ,real war is a travesty and so is your lack of morality !
A third world war will not make you safer ,any more than a civil war in Iraq or the destruction of Lebanese democracy !
Not for nothing, we as a nation should be told the truth behind the Iranian Nuclear Technology without the sugar coating…
Comment by GregNewYork — August 23, 2006 @ 11:45 pm
You sound like the cat being afraid of the mouse. Iran, North Korea, Venezuela, or whatever country you are now being told to hate, will never attacked US. Perhaps if US stops threats against poor countries with fanatics in power you would sleep better.
we should be demanding that all 3 nations STOP immediatly all nuke technology transfers to Iran NOW.
Were US demanded to STOP all nuke technology transfers to Israel? mmmm…I guess we only criticize what the others do.
many of these whining complainers today would have been whining and screaming when Kennedy stood up to the USSR over the Cuban Missile Crisis.
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:58 pmHe was intelligent enough to know that an agression to Cuba or USSR would leave him with the US halved in a blink.
give David a star and a sling shot then turn him loose in the desert to find God .But please take away his computer .
August 23rd, 2006 at 11:59 pm#112 – Nuke the Iranians and the Pakistanis? The US becomes the first. second and third nation to let off nuclear weapons….?
August 24th, 2006 at 12:00 am#104 Terry
August 24th, 2006 at 12:05 amNo , this is just our peculiar way of making friends .I’m at a loss as to why they don’t like us .May be we should just nuke them because we are a good Christian nation .
Love is never having to say your sorry .
whoa there koolhand,
i’m not a democrat, and i think you don’t know what you’re talking about. here’s why:
1) we don’t know how far off iran is from getting nukes. we do know that north korea already has them, though. where are all the people that want to attack kim jong il? oil, anyone? also saudi arabia has done far more to support terror in the last 20 years than iran, and what are we doing about them? oh…nothing, that’s right.
2) the leader of iran is not its president mahmoud ahmadinejad, but supreme leader ali khamenei, a man who condemned the 9/11 attacks and “called for a condemnation of terrorist activities all over the world, whether in the United States, occupied Palestine, the Balkans, or elsewhere.” ok, maybe that doesn’t amount to a hill of beans in your book, but this guy also isn’t the one that’s out there making whacko statements. the iranian president does wield more power than 20 years ago, but he still answers to khamenei.
3) if you study the history of iran-u.s. relations, you’ll find that our cia was in fact the first to inflict terror on iran, helping overthrow their democratically elected prime minister in 1953, installing the shah. in the process, they planned and financed at least one terror attack on a mosque (which they blamed on communists) and undertook a heavy campaign of intimidation and propaganda. why did this happen? because the prime minister of iran wanted to nationalize the oil. tough luck.
4) iran doesn’t currently have any missiles that can reach an american city. you know who might? north korea, a country we already know has nukes. and their missiles can already reach japan, south korea, the phillipines and taiwan. one wonders why we aren’t considering attacking them. oh, that’s right — they don’t have any oil.
5) and i hear what you’re saying now: suitcase nuke or dirty bomb. well, the truth is, it would be massively stupid for iran to give a nuke to a terrorist. why? because we can test the radioactive material to determine its source, that’s why. once we found out iran was the source, we all, including the iranian leaders, know what would happen — no more iran. sure, iran could claim it was stolen, but if you think that would fly, you’re more naive than your comments suggest. as for dirty bombs, they are a ruse. according to our own nuclear regulatory commission, “at the levels created by most probable sources, not enough radiation would be present in a dirty bomb to kill people or cause severe illness.”
6) if islamic fundamentalists are hell-bent to destroy america, what are the christian fundamentalists up to, i wonder? is revelations just a nice story or is it a prophecy? if someone believes the bible is literal, do you think they want it to be true, or false? if that’s the case, what interest at all does a christian fundamentalist (like our president) have in stopping what they think is the rapture?
7) you need to stop buying into the fear and misinformation. and stop spreading it, by the way. you sound like a brain-washed neo-con.
August 24th, 2006 at 12:08 amRex you rule
August 24th, 2006 at 12:12 am#99 Rightly so.
August 24th, 2006 at 12:32 amJason, from one veteran to one who isn’t, Up Yours, chickenweasel!
David,
We are the smartest race, and as such we say to you: Go piss up a rope.
August 24th, 2006 at 12:42 amthanks, freeman. btw i loved what you said to david @117.
err, david? generalize much?
or are you being facetious? if you are, you’re not doing a very good job of it…
incidentally, if the jews are really the “smartest race”, how long is it going to take them to figure out that living smack dab in the middle of a region where everybody else hates you and wants you dead is a very stupid idea?
August 24th, 2006 at 12:42 amDavid,
We are the greatest athletes. Thank you for your applause.
Oh, and we’re sleeping with your girlfriend.
August 24th, 2006 at 12:44 amBush doesn’t have to hit ANYTHING! Bush doesn’t havew the right or power to hit anything! The Constitution restricts the power to declare WAR to CONGRESS. What part of that doesn’t Chris Matthews understand? Maybe we have to keeep reminding him, Bush and CONGRESS of this fact. Maybe if we keep reminding them they will finally get it.
August 24th, 2006 at 12:45 amI’m a Democrat who supports the United States striking Iran and for good reason.
Comment by Koolhandluke — August 23, 2006 @ 11:26 pm
I am a Democrat, and I would expect a Democratic President to stop Iran from obtaining Nuclear Technology.
Comment by GregNewYork — August 23, 2006 @ 11:45 pm
Anyone notice any similarities between these posts? I do. Very formulaic. They both look like they were written by neocon propagandists (or maybe the same propagandist).
“I’m a Democrat” my ass. You guys must work at the Weekly Standard.
August 24th, 2006 at 1:04 amDavid,
I’m not smart because I’m Jewish. I’m smart because my brain is wired that way. Did you know there are really smart people who are not Jews? Look it up, I’ll wait.
August 24th, 2006 at 1:06 amactually that was the first thing i thought also, rs.
not that a good debunking wasn’t worthwhile anyway…
August 24th, 2006 at 1:06 amnot that a good debunking wasn’t worthwhile anyway…
A good debunking is a good thing.
August 24th, 2006 at 1:08 am#130
David,
I hope you don’t consider your self one of “these people.” If you do you should take a remedial course in English Grammar. Spell check is not the answer.
August 24th, 2006 at 1:08 amHi Clyde,
You have arrived just in time for me to say goodnight. Goodnight! Have fun with David, he’s dumber than my dog — and my dog is as dumb as a bag of hammers. :)
August 24th, 2006 at 1:12 amoh hell yes, david — einstein!
jew=mc²
please, name some more smart jewish people for us!
August 24th, 2006 at 1:17 amare you insinuating that all lawyers are smart?
where’s that list of smart jewish people, david?
August 24th, 2006 at 1:29 amoh! i’ve got one: noam chomsky.
Half of all lawyers in the USA are jewish but they are only 2.5% of the population.
Comment by David — August 24, 2006 @ 1:43 am
You seem to think very highly of lawyers. Even if it were true that Jewish people choose to go into the legal field, it doesn’t mean they are smarter than the overall population. If you have statistics, let’s see them.
With that fact and many others like it how can u possibly dispute my claim.
Silly, silly David. If Jewish are smart, you clearly are no Jew. First you have to show the evidence that supports your claim so others can dispute it. Otherwise it’s no fact, but a statement of opinion.
August 24th, 2006 at 1:52 amAh, now I am supposed to do your homework and find evidence to your claim?
Tsk, tsk… if it’s so easy, being this your claim, and since you’re on the web too -how about you do the research and present some evidence?
August 24th, 2006 at 2:19 amZooey,I’m not so dumb not to know that you posted as “Black Athletes”and “The Jews”.
August 24th, 2006 at 3:00 amAre you either ?
According to Seymore Hersh, the same people who brought us the Iraq war are pushing a bombing campaign on Iran, believing that the Irani’s will rise up and over throw the government once we’ve done to them what the Israeli’s did to Lebanon.
And just as four years ago, the media drums starting beating for war with Iraq, so now, the word is going out to push for one with Iran. In the last few weeks, Bill Kristol has been on various talk shows started pushing a military solution to the “problem” with Iran, which isn’t that surprising, but the fact that Chris Matthews has taken up Karl Rove’s talking points on this is frightnening to the point of nausea.
Even after the terrible debacle in Iraq and the travesty of Lebanon, nothing seems to deter these mindless war mongers from spreading as much pain and misery as they can throughout the world.
The following is an excerpt and link to an article from the New Yorker, written by Seymore Hersh about the palns for bombing Iran, and the disaster that many in the pentagon predict will be the result.
The Bush Administration, while publicl advocating diplomacy in order to stop Iran fro pursuing a nuclear weapon, has increase clandestine activities inside Iran and intensifie planning for a possible major air attack. Curren and former American military and intelligenc officials said that Air Force planning groups ar drawing up lists of targets, and teams o American combat troops have been ordere into Iran, under cover, to collect targeting dat and to establish contact with anti-governmen ethnic-minority groups. The officials say tha President Bush is determined to deny th Iranian regime the opportunity to begin a pilo program, planned for this spring, to enric uranium.
A government consultant with close ties to the civilian leadership in the Pentagon said that Bush was “absolutely convinced that Iran is going to get the bomb†if it is not stopped. He said that the President believes that he must do “what no Democrat or Republican, if elected in the future, would have the courage to do,†and “that saving Iran is going to be his legacy.â€
One former defense official, who still deals with sensitive issues for the Bush Administration, told me that the military planning was premised on a belief that “a sustained bombing campaign in Iran will humiliate the religious leadership and lead the public to rise up and overthrow the government.†He added, “I was shocked when I heard it, and asked myself, ‘What are they smoking?’ â€
http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/060417fa_fact
August 24th, 2006 at 3:06 amONLY CONGRESS CAN DECLARE WAR! Matthews is a Nazi Goebbels wannabe. The president has no authority to start wars on his own. The military would be violating their constitutional oaths by attacking Iran.
Not to mention we would lose tens of thousands of troops if Iran rallied the Iraqi Shia along with their own Army and counterattacked our forces in Iraq. Complete and utter disaster. There would be no way around a draft. And we would not have a single ally in the world excluding tiny Israel.
August 24th, 2006 at 3:13 amThe need for an immediate strike against Iran does not exist. No evidence that Iran has developed the technology to enrich weapons-grade uranium exists. Even after the Iranians develop the technology, if they ever do, they will need time to create a stockpile of U235 for their weapon. Under the lash of WW2 the United States needed two years to create enough U235 for something like 1.5 uranium bombs. That was using the facilities at Oak Ridge in TN running full bore during all that time. Iran will not be able to beat that record.
We have time to negotiate with the Iranians. We should use it wisely rather than beating the war drums and attacking. No immediate threat exists, except in Dubya’s mind. He may think he’s indispensible but he’s just disposable.
August 24th, 2006 at 5:49 amThe real point he’s trying to make-equally incorrect- is that future Presidents won’t protect America. What a Henny Penny.
August 24th, 2006 at 5:57 ammaybe the generals will launch a coup in America before the neo-cons destroy the once proud U.S. armed services.
August 24th, 2006 at 6:11 amA Nuclear free world would be the best solution
August 24th, 2006 at 6:54 amBob Herbert rightly asks how did Harriet Tubman, Thurgood Marshall and Martin Luther King ever get replaced with thugs on the covers of magazines like Felon?
August 24th, 2006 at 7:02 amIran has done nothing to us. They are using the nuclear reactor that the U.S. taxpayers bought and paid for to enrich uranium – what the hell did we think they’d do with a nuclear reactor? We’re invountarily recalling marines who are 60 years old and idiots like Kristol are hoping we’ll strike Iran. This is one screwed up country.
August 24th, 2006 at 8:10 amHooray for election year rhetoric.
August 24th, 2006 at 8:17 amIf someone says “trust me”, my suspicion meter hits the red zone. If a person on a progressive blog site writes “I’m a Democrat”, that meter pegs also. Trolls trying to make it appear that “Democrats” are split in their positions, in all likelihood.
August 24th, 2006 at 8:20 amWho really listens to what blather-mouth Chris Matthews says? GWB and Co are totally inept, but if you want to make a point, use a more credible “source”.
August 24th, 2006 at 8:24 amHit’m—–with WHAT?
August 24th, 2006 at 8:29 amSure, America can have nuclear weapons and even renew all of them, totally ignoring the non-proliferation-treaty but Iran? Nooooo. We Good, They Bad! Get a grip on reality fast please.
August 24th, 2006 at 8:31 amZooey,I’m not so dumb not to know that you posted as “Black Athletesâ€and “The Jewsâ€.
Are you either ?
Comment by David II
No, David, I thought I had made it pretty obvious. I also posted as “Einstein,” which was also obvious, so I won’t ask you if you’re Jewish, since you don’t meet your own standards for Jewy-ness.
August 24th, 2006 at 9:46 am[...] Original post here! Radical Right Wing Agenda» Radical Right Wing Agenda [...]
August 24th, 2006 at 9:47 amHey, here’s something to really be concerned about. Who cares what these globalist whores say. Focus on this. Now! The “North American Union”. Canada, USA and Mexico will become one borderless nation by 2009!!! Go to http://www.ssp.gov and educate youselves and others about: The death of the dollar – The death of our sovereignty – The death of our freedom. The NAFTA Superhighways are starting to be built in Texas as we type. This could start a revolution in Texas and spread through the nation. “They” are now going to confiscate massive amounts of land for construction and build toll roads in Texas and this will spread all across America.
August 24th, 2006 at 11:18 amWhat we are seeing is a total police-state coming. Don’t look to your Democratic leaders to help because, they are just as corrupt as the neo-con traitors!
In the words of one republican caller I heard when told he should enlist and fight, I don’t have because Republicans do not fight wars, the less fortunate do. Amazing as that statement is it does show you the mindset of some who support the war, so I would not expect Jason to be enlisting anytime soon or ever for that matter.
However, this kind of talk is not limited to one party, as I have found by talking to those who support the war, (left, right or middle) to them its a necessary war, but they won’t join to fight. This makes me wonder why they don’t, because if they did, we may a have large enough military where we would not have to keep redeploying troops 2 to 4 times.
Conclusion: Jason would run if he were called to duty or call Rash Limbaugh for advice on how to get a deferment!
August 24th, 2006 at 11:34 amRe: 112’s comment – The president has no authority to start wars on his own.
That was true, until after 9/11, when Congress passed a law which gave Bush the authority to wage war against terrorism as he saw fit. At the very least, it’s arguable that Congress could put a stop to the bombing of Iran, if if they wanted to.
Obviously, it was a huge mistake for Congress to give Bush such broad powers.
August 24th, 2006 at 12:16 pmTo Juan C – Post #83’s response to my original post #79
You apparently do not know history.
The week of October 25th 1962, President Kennedy made a Public TV address to the nation and the world…..
He made it clear, any threat against the United States from Cuba would result in a direct Nuclear Attack directed at the Soviet Union.
Now, I know the ‘Democrat Party’ accepts all kinds, including some on this board who would say ‘why can’t Cuba have Nukes’.
So Juan C, all I can say is, too bad for you, because even with a Democratic Senate Majority and Democratic President, the United States will eventually elimate any Nuke Threat from Iran.
August 24th, 2006 at 12:43 pmTo Real Scientist, post #97,
I am not part of some neocon group, nor am I affiliated with that other poster.
Please do a quick review of the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962. President Kennedy wound up Threatening the USSR with a Nuclear Strike over the deployment of the Russian Medium Range Ballistic Missiles being set up in Cuba.
Let me ask you something Mr Real Scientist, and everyone else on this board, do you think President Kennedy was WRONG to confront the USSR over the Deployment of Nuclear Missiles in Cuba in 1962?
Was President Kennedy a NeoCon?
Or here is another question for the knee jerkers…..
Was Cuba in it’s right to have Nuclear Ballistic Missiles in 1962, supplied by the USSR?
I’d love to hear the answers from some of you influential bloggers too!
Thanks
August 24th, 2006 at 12:50 pmGregNewYork
hey greg let me ask YOU a question .Did you get that the supremes ruled that the prez doesn’t have the powers he has claimed to have under the constitution and has violated the geneva conventions in his treatment of prisoners of war .That means simply he has committed war crimes and violated his oath of office .
August 24th, 2006 at 1:06 pmDid you ever realize that the PNAC had plans to invade the mid east BEFORE 911 and that that is a crime according to the law of the land and international conventions of which we are signatories
Perhaps you noticed that the American Bar Assoc. stated that this presidents use of signing statements represents a serious threat to democracy in America and must be dealt with immediately .
Perhaps you missed that 84 % of security experts say that there are no good military options in Iran and that the Iranians(a country whose gov’t we have overthrown twice and failing to overthrow a third time armed Saddam for a war which took 1 million lives on both sides) ,is still some time away from producing a bomb and has no good way to deliver it ?
August 24th, 2006 at 1:13 pmPerhaps you missed the fact that India is not a signatory to the Non proliferation treaty and that bush has handed them nuclear technology and given them a pass !
That Israel is also in the nuclear club and the most obviously destabilizing force in the region !
That North Korea has WMD’s and a missile allegedly capable of reaching the West coast of the US but not worth talking too or worrying about .
No,we must worry about the country neighboring Iraq ,who was attacked for no real reason ,having nothing to do with Sept. 11 th and possessing NO WMD’s but a very large oil field .
Perhaps you missed that Condi Rice was on the board of Chevron Texaco or that that a large number of W’s cabinet were oil and energy CEO’s that they actually put their names to papers that stated the US ,in order to establish global hegemony must invade the mid east in order to control the flow of oil to the developuing world and China ,and that these stated goals were all Pre 911 !
I quote from the PNAC “but barring a national catastrophe it will be hard to galvanize the American public behind such a scheme “.
Perhaps you missed that we have killed 10’s of 1000’s of Iraqi civilians over false or fabricated reasons and handed Iran to the hard liners when by all accounts the movement in Iran had been toward a more free and open society .
August 24th, 2006 at 1:33 pmHAVEN’T YOU SEEN ENOUGH KILLING !!!!!
August 24th, 2006 at 1:36 pmMatthews (and millions of others} “may be dead” when the lid blows off after we “hit em”. When are these MSM types going to stop treating foreign policy like half time at an NFL game?
August 24th, 2006 at 2:39 pm[...] A hill staffer has released a report claiming CIA failures in intel for Iran. The big nuclear boogey man is coming. Hardball says Bush “may be right” we should “hit” them first. They’re stepping up the rhetoric for a war we can’t win. [...]
August 24th, 2006 at 2:44 pm#74 – Are you Joe Lieberman, or just a cowardly bastard who got a sip of the Kool Aid?
August 24th, 2006 at 3:33 pmWhere is the American Claus von Stauffenberg?
Our “administration” lurches from one “crisis” to the next, while their Pentagon media franchises dutifully spew more b.s. at the public. Isn’t eveyone tired of being pissed on by this bunch of hacks?
Wake up and smell the jackboot.
August 24th, 2006 at 3:42 pmSee you in the gulag.
David-
Why are you refering to Jews as a race?
Forum-
Why hasn’t he been slated for this already?!
August 24th, 2006 at 7:37 pmAdditional clues point at coming US attack on Iran:
http://www.warwithoutend.co.uk/zone0/viewtopic.php?p=286462&sid=19dec39c9ceac8605be07168c82b1588#286462
Read via his ‘Life of an American Jew in Racist/Marxist Israel’ how American Jew Jack Bernstein warned that Zionists would trick US into fighting wars in the Middle East for Israel with many Americans to die and get horribly wounded/maimed in the process (like we have already experienced in the Iraq quagmire with Iran and Syria next to come for Israel as well):
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/israel.htm
August 24th, 2006 at 7:38 pmgregny:
your point is irrelevant. you’re trying to compare things that are incomparable.
iran, which currently has zero nukes, is not the soviet union (over 3500 nukes in 1962), nor will it ever be. george bush is not john f kennedy, nor will he ever be.
2006 is not 1962, nor will it ever be. we have a totally different geopolitical situation.
just remember, they want you to be afraid. it makes you so easy to manipulate. it keeps you voting them back into power.
get over it. it does wonders for your life.
August 24th, 2006 at 8:13 pmTo Freeman, Post #131
To be upfront, I am totally disgusted with President Bush, TOTALLY… he blew it in the worst way with his handling and lying leading up and then dealing with the Iraq War.
Bush is an outright liar and you can’t trust him or his team.
But, that still doesn’t discard the fact of Iran’s Nuke Ambitions.
Iran’s Nuclear Project is a fact, the Russians are Building it, along with help from China and Pakistan.
PS: I do not trust China, they are going to wind up being an enemy of the United States, or, what is left of the United States… for I see a dismal future ahead of the current 50 State membership in the next decade.
August 24th, 2006 at 9:09 pmTo progressaurus rex , post # 142.
No progressasurus, I do not believe it is in the best interest of the United States to let Iran Develop Nuclear Weapons, and don’t be niave that Iran will not develop them once they have their Nuclear Reactors and Tech Team up and running.
Here is the Scenerio that I see happening down the road….
1) Iran eventually strikes Israel with a Nuke Strike
2) Israel responds with greater force, knowing their country would wind up being totally wiped out from a Nuke strike by Iran, their response goes further….
*Israel launches a nuke strike against Saudi Arabia
*Israel launches a nuke strike against Syria
*Israel launches a nuke strike against Egypt
3) In the midst of all of this, Pakistan suffers a coup against Musharraf, and launches a Nuke strike against Israel and it’s allied positions (the US Military Bases Scattered around the middle east)
4) India responds to Pakistan’s aggression
5) Russia has a nuke strike war going on below its borders and sends down a raining strike of Nuke attacks against all participants.
6) The United States responds to Russia’s aggression.
7) Russia knows the United States would respond to Russia’s hit, that is why they pre-empt the United States by also launching a strike against Targets throughout the United States
8) At this point, who’d give a f*ck, we are all toast at this level.
So, now you see why I’d expect the United States, whoever the President is, to stop Iran from gaining Nukes.
The End
August 24th, 2006 at 9:19 pmGreg
But, that still doesn’t discard the fact of Iran’s Nuke Ambitions.
or north korea’s.
or india’s.
or pakistan’s.
or israel’s.
you do recall that we are currently in a war with a country we were told, in the form of an elaborate presentation at the u.n. by colin powell, also had a nuclear program, mobile biological weapons labs, and chemical weapons?
and do you happen to recall how that’s turned out?
just one more question: why, if your opinion of bush is as you say, would you ever trust the guy again if he said, “we need to go to war”?
the guy will be out of office in just under two years. iran certainly will still not have a nuke by then.
how about we just wait to move on this one until someone a bit more competent is in charge?
August 24th, 2006 at 9:25 pmwell greg, sorry that apparently fear rules your life. i hate to tell you this, but your post @144 reads like a hysterical neo-con death fantasy. and the escalations you describe aren’t related or causal in any fashion.
maybe it would be healthy for you to take a while to step back and extract yourself from the propaganda and fear. i’m sure if i bought into it i could come up with half a dozen doomsday scenarios myself. but one thing i know is that the only way we descend into anarchy is if we give in to irrational suppositions such as these and let the tide take us out into that sea of chaos and despair. looks like you’re already drowning in it.
i’d throw you a life jacket but it doesn’t appear that it will do you any good.
simple fact: threats and fear-mongering, whether from iranian or american leaders, will never make the world safer. never.
August 24th, 2006 at 9:42 pmEveryone knew that there were no WMD’s in Iraq, everyone. People went along with it because well common sense is not so common. Everyone knows that Iraq will get nukes, mainly because its the worst kept secret since Dann Coulter’s sex change. Also GregNY, I think that you may be right, or plausible at least up to about your point 2, but just because clowns are throwing round nukes doesnt neam everyone suddenly has a deathwish to join in. Whatever happens it’s generally flowing on from the instability caused by the Iraq invasion which was basically to secure oil and protect satellites, ask Dickie Pearl..
August 25th, 2006 at 12:53 amHave you ever heard of Gulf of Tonkin, an incident that never occurred? Or USS Maine that was blown up from inside? Or Saddams WMD that never existed? Your government lie to you all the time and you keep on believing them – incredible!
How many countries have Iran or any other Muslim country attacked? How many countries have US attacked? How many countries have NOT been bombed by US through history?
I don’t think Iran or any other Muslim country will nuke you but I do believe that the Eskimos from Greenland will attack you with kayaks filled with nukes – duck and hide!
August 25th, 2006 at 1:54 amBOOGA BOOGA!
To progressaurus rex , regarding your post #146
If you are not aware of the fact that the Iranian President has called for the elimination of Israel, let me point out that he has called for the elimination of Israel.
You label me induced with fear… I label you induced with ignorance to current facts.
The scenerio I posted in #144 will most likely incur in the event Iran did use a Nuke weapon against Israel.
Like it or not, Israel is an Ally of the United States, both Democratic and Republican parties recognize Israel, and Iran has daringly called for Israel’s end.
Now, I don’t know about you, but when someone says they are going to elimate you, or an Ally of yours, one with courage would act to prevent that threat, one with a pacifist mindset, would watch it’s Ally be taken out and then cry foul.
Just to reiterate my beliefs, we as the United States, should be imposing tough talk to those who are building Iran’s nuke tech programs to cease and dismiss, and once that objective is achieved, then there would be no reason to go to war with Iran.
So, Hawk I am not, the current administration, and some in the current high ranks of the Democratic Party seam to be keeping quiet and building up the case to go to war, I on the other hand believe we should make it so that there would be no reason to go to war.
August 25th, 2006 at 2:11 amHow totally blind and rediculous people have become. Just because Iraq was neutralized for 12 years, with sanctions and no fly zones and was a complete sitting duck, the morons in this country think they can just waltz right in and take out Iran, HOW STUPID.
The reality of the matter is that Iran can fight back, which is something the whimpy little neocons aren’t used to. Yeah, we’ve got great weapons and we can beat the crap out of countries like Afghanistan and Iraq, but Iran is a whole nother ball game, THEY CAN FIGHT BACK.
Even if they can’t win, the amount of casualties to the US, Israel and who knows, old war horse retired 4 star generals are even nervous about going in there.
But the pride and the ignorance of all too many Americans has budded so far out of whack, that some people are suggesting we can take out Russia without suffering any serious consequences. In reality most of these American are nothing but cowardly little whimps that like to go around slaughtering helpless people who can’t fight back, like the victims on 9/11, they didn’t have a chance when our government rigged up all those explosives many weeks before the decoy planes hit.
August 25th, 2006 at 2:13 amThe neocon zionists have designed a war between radical (zionist ) Christianity and radical Islam, with the zionists standing to be the last man standing. Solution: A jihad of true anti zionist Christians against their apostate zionist counterparts and a jihad of regular Muslims against their radical brothern and lastly a dissolution of the zionist state. Viola, world peace.
August 25th, 2006 at 2:17 amhey neo-con troll,
although i mostly agree with you, the gulf of tonkin incident was not an “incident that never occurred”. it was in actuality a pair of incidents, the second of which did not occur, and the first of which was most likely provoked by the u.s. navy anyway (and only resulted in damage from one bullet). but the uss maddox was indeed attacked by 5 north vietnamese patrol boats on august 2, 1964.
and lbj, although otherwise a total bastard, is probably wrongfully accused in this case. what evidence we have available today suggests “only information that supported the claim that the communists had attacked the two destroyers [on August 4] was given to Johnson administration officials.”
hmmm. fixing the facts around the policy. where have i heard that before?
so your wider point still stands. i just think it doesn’t help to use misinformation to attempt to bolster claims. especially when there is so much good information out there that corroborates your premise. like the cia-planned and financed terror attacks of operation gladio in europe in the 70s and 80s, for instance.
August 25th, 2006 at 2:19 amI have a good option for dealing with Iran. Leave them the hell alone.
August 25th, 2006 at 2:21 amOne more thing about the ignorance of so many uneducated Americans, who never think for themselves but only parrot the talking heads on Fox news, is their total misunderstanding of what the president of Iran said about Israel, regarding their right to exist.
In reality, they are correct, the country of Israel has no right to exist, because in 1948 a bunch of neocons got together and stole that land, slaughtering Arabs, Muslims, Christians and real Jews, not the phony zionists, but real Jews who actually believe in God. Yeah, these sicko’s who don’t even believe in God or in the bible or in the teachings of Moses stole the land of Israel and called it by a name that would surely trick and decieve all the idiot Christians, (who don’t really believe in Jesus or His teachings) but rather enjoy murdering Muslims and telling people they will go to hell unless they bow down and worship their twisted, satanic mockery of the bible.
But hardly anybody knows how to read, so they don’t listen to what the president or other pee’d off Arabs are really saying about Israel. It’s nothing against real Jewish people, it’s simply about the illegal state that has nothing to do with what the bible says, it’s rather an old satanic trick. And this trick has people shouting from the top of their lungs in chuches and synagouges “Crucify them” Crucify them Arabs” as they feel that this stolen land belongs to them and they have a right to kill anyone who tries to take it back.
How would you feel if someone broke into your home, killed half your family and then claimed the residence as their own, even though you had the deed? And when you went to court and/or called the cops, you discovered they were bribed by the BAD GUYS, so that the property you owned was illegally granted to the killers. What would you say? Do those killers have a right to your house?
If you want to hear what some REAL JEWS SAY ABOUT ISRAEL CLICK HERE!
August 25th, 2006 at 2:27 amhttp://iwilltryit.com/zion1.htm
By the way, if there are any INTELLIGENT Christians that haven’t yet taken the mark of the beast, and still believe we should listen to Jesus, and understand His words are about today, contrary to the wolves in sheeps clothing that try to tell you we must bow down and worship little bush as the god of the earth.
Well, if there are any REAL PEOPLE out there, I wanted to share something with you regarding Alex Jones. Yes, old Alex is famous, Jesus even talks about him in the bible, actually it’s in the book of Revelations, but you need eyes to see and ears to hear to grasp it. I’m sure that Alex knows exactly what it means… Nicolations is kind of like a metaphor, you know like Neocons.
Revelations 2:2-6 “I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:
:3 And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name’s sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.
:4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.
:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.
:6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.
August 25th, 2006 at 2:45 amsorry greg, but “wiped off the map,” the phrase supposedly used by ahmadinejad, is not in the iranian lexicon. that’s not what he said.
furthermore, as i have noted here previously (@87, point 2), the president of iran isn’t the leader of iran. he answers to khamenei.
now, he may want israel gone, but that’s much easier said than done, and you know it. and the continual foreign policy blunders by the bush administration haven’t been helping at all, so when it comes to them taking any action, i’m against it. they’re just simply incompetent and can’t be trusted to make sound decisions.
and as far as the facts are concerned, let me repeat it once again: IRAN DOES NOT HAVE NUKES, and they probably won’t for quite some time. your outrage is, quite frankly, laughable. where were you when american c-41s, given to pakistan as part of the “war on terror®”, were spotted by our satellites on runways in north korea, dropping off uranium refining equipment in 2002? why are pakistan still our allies if they’re giving equipment and nuke knowledge to north korea? why haven’t we already done something about kim jong il?
and once again, your doomsday scenario is a joke. that’s as likely to happen as bush admitting he’s a gay coke addict with “i love karl” tattooed on his scrotum.
but it’s this statement that gives you away:
one with courage would act to prevent that threat, one with a pacifist mindset, would watch it’s Ally be taken out and then cry foul.
it’s so easy, much like bush does, to boil it down to all black and white, isn’t it? i just wonder why you suppose i’m for doing nothing and just sitting idly by and allowing a threat to increase. there is plenty of room for diplomatic pressure, sanctions, and other solutions. but another war from this administration? i don’t think so!
as i said before, i’m not a democrat, but i have a hard time understanding why any democrat would be for another war from these morons.
August 25th, 2006 at 2:52 amprogressaurus rex,
You might have a couple of minor points slightly grasped, but you missed some of the most important, regarding who the president of Iran answers to. He answers direct to God. Even though they call Him Allah and God, he has made it very crystol clear exactly who it is that he gives his allegance to.
You might want to get a little bit of knowledge before commenting on where the president of Iran is coming from. Here’s the famous 8 page letter he wrote to bush.
http://iwilltryit.com/letter18.htm
August 25th, 2006 at 3:02 amOne thing I’m curious about is why people focus so much attention on thermite and other evidence that shows the government did 9/11, when the fact of the matter is that because the buildings fell at FREE FALL SPEED is 100% PROOF BEYOND ANY AND ALL DOUBT that explosives were used.
There is no debate whatsoever on the FREE FALL SPEED ASPECT, which is why the entire government democrat and republican, along with the media KNOWS it was control demolition.
SO WHO IN THE HECK ARE THEY KIDDING ANY WAY?
August 25th, 2006 at 3:08 amTo progressaurus rex (who doesn’t know how to use capital letters appropriatly)
Well the Anti Israel feelings many have are thier opinons, and the facts many use to have such Anti Israel feelings cannot be disputed.
I am anti war.. plain and simple.
If a war can be averted, I am all for it.
Bush giving those planes to Pakistan was a mistake in my opinion.
Bush’s complete handling of the Iraq Debacle has tarnished the United States level of credibility across the globe.
But Progressive Rex, you have a reading comprehension problem as well as the ‘cry-baby-knee jerk reaction’ symptons I have stated that many on this board and other anti Bush, anti Republican oasis boards seem to have.
You state ‘it will be some time before Iran has Nuke Weapons’,,, ok, I agree, and then when they do have it, my scenerio that many so quickly labeled a neocon fantasy
will take place.
So I believe the US should do everything in its power now to prevent Iran from getting Nuke Bomb Tools. If that means getting tough with their suppliers, I am all for it.
But at this point, your total lack of in depth thinking and condesending viewpoints to anything you don’t agree with has led me to the conclusion that you are not worth my time from this point on.
Have fun defending Iran.
August 25th, 2006 at 11:16 amprogressaurus rex
Yeah, it looks like ignorance must be bliss, and I’m sure it must be nice living in your fantasy world where the US can impose it’s will on anyone they want and will prevail, but in this place called the REAL WORLD countries like Iran, North Korea and even Iraq don’t always submit to the will of the little bush administration. In the real world some of those people have chosen to lay down their lives and try to defend their country and why of life, rather than bend over, grab their ankels, squeel like that guy in “Deliverance” and say “Yes sir Mr. Bush, we will do whatever you want”
You see, even though I was raised in the United States and am somewhat spoiled by all our modern conveniences and to a larger or lesser degree, “freedoms” and I wouldn’t want to live in that part of the world, with all their strange cultures and traditions, many of them feel the same way about us.
Yeah, in your little pee brain you think the US is always the good guys and all the Muslims are bad, but maybe it’s time to wake up and smell the coffee and realize that they just might possibly disagree. I’m sure it’s hard for you to accept the fact that they would have the gaul to disagree with everything you were taught as a child, but in the real world, not all countries agree with the US and it’s partners in crime.
And so, let’s just say they have nukes or ar in the process of putting some together. Now what? Yeah, we don’t like, but guess what? too bad. There’s nothing we can do about it because guess what? We are not God, and we don’t own the world contrary to the things your religion has taught you.
It’s sad, but it’s true, NUKES ARE OUT OF THE BAG, and there’s nothing, and I mean nothing we can do to stop it. Can you blame Iran for wanting to defend itself against a country that repeatedly calls them the axis of evil? All they’ve heard for the past 5 years or longer is how the US and Israel are planing on wiping them out, and then we wonder why they would want to have nukes.
We just sold 50 or 60 nukes to India. Why do you suppose that is, seeings how nukes are so bad? Maybe, just maybe Iran realizes that nukes just might be a detourant. Now try to take out Iran if they do have nukes and see what happens.
I got a better idea, I know this is a new revolutionary concept, but why don’t try to get along with our neighbors instead of going around the world destroying everything.
August 25th, 2006 at 5:16 pmNUKES FOR PEACE?
My sense is that mankind is approaching a collective epiphany, such as: is there no one in the cockpit of the good ship America that ever, ever, ever contemplates setting a course for peace. Do we bomb Iran? Do we use nukes? Should we take out Syria? Are there no course maps, no policies available that don’t engender hate, fear and the ‘rule of brutality.’
August 26th, 2006 at 12:43 amWe need to bear arms and defend ourselves but if the radar has no reading for a someday world of peace we will not get there.
Consider that the US will not hold discussions at any level with Iran or Syria. In a world where a cell phone and a cup of liquid can cause untold horror who in their right mind thinks destroying sovereign nations who already detest us is best for making the world safer? It seems plain nuts.
Somebody needs to tell Kristol and Cheney to shut their yaps for at least a few minutes each day to see if there is not some alternative to incinerating a goodly chunk of humanity in the name of self defense.
Not to be all Buddhist like, but there simply has to be some middle road short of ‘War-mageddon.’
It’s coming up on 5 years of this, and I’m really sick of it. “Fight the terrorists there or we fight them in our backyard”, well, how did we do in Vietnam “in their backyard”? How are we doing in Iraq “in their backyard”? How do you think we’ll do in Iran and Syria “in their backyard”? Do you see a pattern forming? I’ve had it, I say, yeah, let them do it in “our backyard”!
I’ll take my chances on that rather than deal with this USSR-lite that neocons have pursued successfully based on fear, real or constructed. We’re all frogs in a pan of water gradually being heated to boil, it’s not too late to get out. Or you can trade your civil rights slowly but surely to keep out the terrorists.
I’d seriously rather deal with shrapenal at home than “your papers please”.
August 26th, 2006 at 1:27 amSome people say the founders of this great nation used the Roman empire to model our government by, and in many respects we’re just like our fathers. It seemed that no country on earth could defeat the great military strength of Rome, just as the United States is viewed by some as being invincible and unstoppable. Any one who dared to pose a threat to Rome was invaded and practically destroyed, just as the US is looking to wipe out Iran, North Korea, etc.
But as mighty of an empire as Rome happened to be they just couldn’t conquer the heart of the people and so eventually they collapsed from within.
As powerful as the US may be, with it’s great riches and military capabilities the fact of the matter is we are suffering from an incurrable illness on the inside. Our morals and principlas and rules of law have all but collapsed. Our educatinal system is so corrupt that 50% of high school students can’t even read or do the most basic mathematics.
Prescription drugs are injested like their going out of style, so that instead of addressing the real problems are children are having, they simply give them Ritilan or Prozak or whatever is the fastest, easiest way to make them settle down.
Our churches have sold themselves outa long time ago, so that instead of promoting truth, morals and good will towards mankind, you’ll hear them beg for money and tell people they’ll go to hell unless they dig deep in their pockets and give, give, give until it hurts. Of course you’ll also hear our great Christian leaders tell their flocks that murdering our neighbors in other countries is a good thing, a Godly thing, since God hates any non-amercian anyway, we might as well save God the trouble and wipe them out ourselves.
Things like love for human beings, good will, peace, kindness humanitarian aid may exist in the minds of some people, but it’s considered treasoness, liberal left wing, pinko communist and panty waste.
I believe a balance is a good thing, because sometimes you’ve gotta defend yourself, but especially for the past 6 years or so the general feeling in this country is fear, terror, hatred, greed, selfishness and inflated pride, but these are all things on the inside, and may not be visible to people who aren’t thinking along those lines. And so out of site, out of mind, most people don’t even really believe in things that are spiritual in nature anyway.
Abraham Lincoln said, As great of a nation the United States happens to be, if the people depart from the principals of our Lord, we will be destroyed. And it’s pretty obvious that the churches have departed from those principals more than anyone.
August 26th, 2006 at 3:10 pmThis is getting nuts, when Chris Mathews starts agreeing with the neo-con fascists/shvindlers.
August 29th, 2006 at 4:29 pmHe’s was the only major media figure one to question their motives and stand up to them. They must have gotten to him some how. threatening to pull the plug on his program and his
career. No More “Hard Ball”, but he’s getting very “Soft Ball” and I hope he isn’t getting to sound like those other neo-con puppet, Jeff Beck and Tucker Carlson, the other
shabbes goy in the pay of Israel Lobby, oy vey…di ganz velt ist Meshugass
Shabbes goy,
You’d be suprised what kinds of rules TV news reporters have to follow
August 30th, 2006 at 2:38 pm