Kristol: ‘Bush Should Pardon Libby. He Should Do it Now’
Kristol: ‘Bush Should Pardon Libby. He Should Do it Now’
Today on Fox News Sunday, Weekly Standard editor Bill Kristol said, “Bush should pardon [former Cheney Chief of Staff Scooter] Libby. He should do it now. It would be fantastic.”
Libby has been charged with obstructing justice, making false statements to a grand jury and perjury. Kristol, however, asserted that Libby was only indicted because special prosecutor was “totally out of control” and “had to indict someone.” He added that Libby “didn’t lie in any serious meaning of lying before a grand jury.” Watch it:
Transcript:
KRISTOL: Ashcroft appointed an independent counsel who got totally out of control — he had to indict someone, I suppose — in December 2003 which never should have happened. Bush should pardon Libby. He should do it now. It would be fantastic. The democrats would go crazy. We could have a debate for two months about whether one should criminalize what was a totally innocent attempt to respond to, as Juan said, a mendacious critic of the administration. It’s really an outrage. The one guy indicted here is Libby. And that outrage is that criminalizing works.
BUMIELLER: But we are still talking about disclosing someone’s identity that — it’s still in the gray area possibly being a crime. So i think it’s not..
KRISTOL: Has libby been charged with that crime? No. No underlying crime.
HUME: No one has. No one has been charged.
WALLACE: But he has been charged with lying to a grand jury. If he lied to a grand jury…
KRISTOL: The things he allegedly forgot about them are much less consequential than what Richard Armitage forgot. Richard Armitage forgot for three months that he talked to Novak. He forgot for two years that he talked to Bob Woodward, three weeks before he talked to Novak. Richard Armitage has not been indicted, and he shouldn’t be. The idea that Libby is indicted for less
WILLIAMS: But he lied. Did he lie or didn’t he lie?
KRISTOL: He didn’t lie in any serious meaning of lying before a grand jury.
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armitage
nytimes.com
Roves authority diminshed
September 3rd, 2006 at 10:56 am(Armitage&Rove today? Some rifts in NWO?)
I guess lying under oath is not a crime - as long as you are a neo-con and a Bushie.
I see we have captured our 25th, or is it 26th #1 Al Qaeda operative. Is the bullshit ever going to stop? I dont think so, not with people like Kristol around.
September 3rd, 2006 at 10:57 am“he didnt lie in any serious meaning of the lying”?
What the hell is this bum-faced asshole talking about?
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:02 amAh Yes! This moon faced toad want’s his 15 minutes of fame so he suggest’s the decider, devider, war monger in charge should absolve Libby of guilt….By all mean’s, let Libby get off, then can we have a cheney or rove in exchange for a libby……Game of go fish, kid’s card’s come to mind these day’s…
Who the hell do these people work for any way.? Not us or our country…When are we going to ride these guy’s on a rail out of town and off our air way’s….Are we going to submit to the reich winged propaganda and allow them to silence us or are we going to demand fair time and truth instead of all reich winged crap……..Blessings to us all, we need them….Peace for all the children of the world.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:03 amThat’s right. And when Democrats go on FOX they advocate these ideas.
Today’s FOX Democrats?
Charles Schumer, Senator, New York
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:04 amNo one will be conviced….after the November elections, the cheney/rove and bush puppet mis-administration will pardon anyone and everyone even slightly connected to this investigation. Then the repubs have two years to gloss over it and claim the zelous dems are out of detroy our freedoms.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:07 amGo right ahead and do that. Just wait until November 1st.
I want the voters going to the polls even more livid than they already are.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:07 amThe spin starts. The concept will be floated by other pundants. When it happens (on a Friday afternoon) it won’t be nearly as extream sounding to 50% of America. When the MSM ignores it, it will be just those of us in “the fever swamp” that find it truely outragous. Bill should marry Ann Coulter. Can you imagine the pillow talk?
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:08 amI quit visiting/commenting here as often because I’ll do ANYTHING to avoid hearing FAUX NEWS. Really, it’s like punching the frail asthmatic kid in elementary school: pointless, mean and downright depressing. I couldn’t care less what they have to say. The “News” isn’t any different than other TV show. They only care about ratings.
Greed. Live by it, die by it.
Go find and read the book FOUR ARGUMENTS FOR THE ELIMINATION OF TELEVISION by Jerry Mander.
(cue sound of lone, self-inflicted gunshot, followed by silence…)
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:09 amKRISTOL: He didn’t lie in any serious meaning of lying before a grand jury.
Give me a frickin’ break. Now we have degrees of lying before a grand jury?
My kids didn’t get away with that crap, and they never told lies nearly as serious as these asshats do.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:10 amBill Kristol is a patheic, cretinous mass of neocon garbage who should be locked away for the traitor to America that he is. He lies with every breath. He has been wrong at every step of the past disastrous six years of this disastrous and destructive, and dare I say, neo-Nazi administration.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:10 amInteresting to see Kristol push that Libby should be pardon’d “Right Now!” — so we can “see the Democrats go crazy”.
1) interesting to see Kristol when he’s cornered and doesn’t act all cutsie but rather desperate like he is now to get this thing done before ….
2) …. there can be any discussion about the difference between Armitage case and Cheney/ Libby/ Rove/ gonzales/ WHIG side of the case. If the public gets the chance to hear the details yet again — the latter group only moves into more dangerous position.
and then:
KRISTOL: He didn’t lie in any serious meaning of lying before a grand jury.
Wow. and right then, KRISTOL isn’t lying in any serious meaning of lying [and misleading] before the TV watching public? Ssssheeesh.
On it goes…
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:11 amI agree with NFL guy and DNFP.
Lest we forget:
Today’s FOX Democrat:
Charles “Chuck” Schumer, Senator, Democrat, New York
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:12 amWhatever > lol. Kristol gives bad advice, but go ahead Bush dumbass and pardon Libby! This would be another nail in Bush’s impeachment coffin!
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:15 am“didn’t lie in any serious meaning of lying before a grand jury.†is the new “depends on what your definition of ‘is’ is.”
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:18 amGo find and read the book FOUR ARGUMENTS FOR THE ELIMINATION OF TELEVISION by Jerry Mander.
Comment by DieNowForPeace — September 3, 2006 @ 11:09 am
Last summer (2005), I did just that. I can’t recommend it enough. Of course, I watch the Daily Show still, but otherwise, I have so much more time for so many more important things - like reading.
I’ve dared my students to try it for a week. One said “No way… The power went out for an hour one night last week and I about died!” So, I just try to remind them of the amazing things that people did before the invention of television… Things we don’t do anymore.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:22 amIt’s only a lie if Clinton does it.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:23 amI saw the episode of FNS this morning. Bill and Brit totally dominated Juan and the woman who were on the panel. As they signed off Bill was just grinning ear to ear about the schlacking he gave the libs.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:24 amLaws don’t apply to Republicans, they are God’s chosen people. But let’t put some American soldiers to death.
This administration and their supporters are sick to the core.
-GSD
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:27 amJason Hendler,
Alan Colmes says he won’t question the honesty of Hannity’s remarks on air. Juan Williams, big name Democrats.
What would FOX be without Democrats? Nothing. Today’s FOX Democrat:
Chuck Schumer, Senator, New York.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:28 amLying to a Grand Jury about blow jobs - bad lie for which an individual should be severly punished.
Lying to a Grand Jury regarding the outing of a CIA Operativie - good lie for which an individual should be set free and given a 6 figure salary.
Dang, they live in a very strange world.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:29 am#21, DLC,
Yes, Schumer is a Clinton Democrat, and to that end, they will partner with the mainstream media, Lieberman and other Republicans to defeat the insurgency of netrooters.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:30 amThen why the hell wasn’t Kristol speaking out loudly and often against the special prosecutor and the impeachment of Clinton?!?
Instead, it’s ‘pardon Libby now, before a trial, before all the facts become public.’
Remember, that at this point, one must assume these Sunday Morning pundits are all following Rove’s marching orders, and that there is a carefully managed script to mete out issues leading up to the November elections.
Kristol points out the goal in this discourse:
Thus the goal here is to deflect criticism away from the Plame affair and its consequences of leaving us with less intelligence capabilities vis-a-vis Iran, and into a debate about the ethics of the special prosecutor.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:32 amI saw the episode of FNS this morning.
Comment by Jason M. Hendler
Episode? Is FNS a sit-com? A soap opera?
I can’t wait for the “very special episode” when they’re all sitting there with their chins hanging, while watching BushCo doing the perp walk…
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:34 amAlan Colmes should be attacked by Al Pieda with a nice banana creamer right in his homely puss.
-GSD
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:37 amI think Kristol-nacht is the one that mixes the Kool-aid.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:37 amI see all the great minds are here to bury Jason et al.
I’ll be back later when everyone is in need of a little snark. :)
The time for playing nicely is over…
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:40 amMr. Kristol thinks it would be “fantastic” if GWB pardoned Libby RIGHT NOW. I bet he does. But Libby says he’s innocent. If the jury agrees, he would be vindicated, but if GWB was to pardon him now, everyone would believe he was guilty. Give him his day(s) in Court!
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:50 amWhen you lose your own self-respect as Kristol has there is nothing left. So you spend your life lying at every turn and the only fool in the room is yourself. What a pathetic specimen this guy is. All you can do is hope somebody from the home comes and rescues him before he wets himself in public.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:51 amSure, pardon him, which of course guarantees a label of guilt for both Libby and Cheney. The now pardoned Libbey will be soooo grateful to have been sailed down the river by Cheney, he can then testify against his old boss with impunity, when Cheney’s trial for outing Plame comes up next year. Please Bush, please pardon Libby now!
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:52 amHow can one person be so stupid, to think everyone or anyone would believe that crap. Was this a lie or just a little white lie and that should pardoned him. Kristol should be bared from ever saying one more word on national radio or Tv.
September 3rd, 2006 at 11:52 amthey are not willing to hold scooter libby to the “clinton test”.
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:16 pmdid he lie under oath? libby did as well as clinton. libby should be held to the same standard as the republicans held clinton too. he needs to have his day in court.
Well, if we are judging the seriousness of lies, then Bill Clinton’s lie was certainly not serious enough to warrant impeachment. I mean it wasn’t like his lie got us involved in an illegal war or anything.
I guess republican lies just aren’t as serious as democrats lies.
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:16 pmoh, so the lie wasn’t “serious” so he should be pardoned. and he hasn’t even gone on trial yet, so he should be pre-emptively pardoned.
gawd, these guys all go on the media circuit at the same time…
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:18 pmThis idiot reminds me of howard the duck. Not just because he looks like him, but because of the idiocies he says; almost comical how moronic.
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:21 pmcan somebody pleeeasssse frag this motherf*cker?
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:23 pmWell, THIS is as blatant a statement as I have ever seen them make in effort to justify criminal activity. He can’t see the outrageously preposterous suggestion in the words “didn’t lie in any serious meaning of lying before a grand jury.†? Pardon him? HELL NO. Try and convict the whole MESS of them, from Chimpy on down. This makes me wonder what Kristol has in his past, as well as up his sleeve that may serve HIM well if pardons start getting passed around. IMPEACH THEM ALL!
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:23 pmOff Topic, but worth noting:
As I noted earlier, McCain’s trade-off for supporting Bush is the Presidency in ‘08.
Bush is going to start an invasion in Iran, then Rove will get the American people will vote for his hand-picked successor, McCain, a war-hero with combat experience.
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:34 pmExcuse me, Mr. Kristol, but you know as well as I do that Cheney, Libby, and Rove would have done exactly the same things that they did to out Valerie Plame, regardless of Armitage’s leak to Novak. We know this to be true because that is exactly what they did. They didn’t know about his leak and Armitage didn’t know that she was a covert CIA operative because that item of information wasn’t in Undersecretary of State Marc Grossman’s memo to Colin Powell. On the other hand, Cheney, Libby, and Rove did know that she was covert operative in mid-June 2003, because Cheney and Libby obtained that information from someone at the CIA and shared it with Rove. That no underlying charge has been lodged against Libby is irrelevant and you know it. He’s charged with lying to the FBI and committing perjury before the grand jury. Fitzgerald has all of the evidence that he needs to convict and he will convict Libby. You’re just afraid that Libby will buckle under and spill his guts before the fall election because that’s really his only option, unless he wants to spend a lot of time in prison.
Frankly, I’m sick of your spinning and spinning. The truth is what it is and no amount of spinning will change it. You only succeed in demonstrating that you will say anything, including lie after lie in an obvious attempt to obfuscate matters and provide cover for this criminal administration and its atrocious deeds.
I would like to know why you are so willing to disgrace yourself on national television to protect a sociopath like Scooter Libby. Have you no sense of decency, sir?
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:35 pmSaddam Hussein should be pardoned too. he seems like the only one in Iraq who can keep the peace ……….
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:37 pmLying under oath is not a serious crime, unless it is a Democrat lying about a blowjob…
Even though Armitage had told Novak, the White House, Cheney et al, tried to smear Joe Wilson for disagreeing with their ficticious intelligence…they want to stop any investigation that will uncover all the lies told about intelligence before the invasion. They are not as cool as they think they are…
Ever notice that Republicans and Reighwingnuts never tell the straight truth about anything? They lie and spin on ever statement they make….I guess it is okay as long as it is not about a blowjob.
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:43 pmnothing has changed over the last 10,000 years!
Comment by NFL Guy — September 3, 2006 @ 12:39 pm
Yes NFL but “we” and I omit you from that category are more evolved than cockroaches, they haven’t changed in hundreds of thousands of years. “We” and I again remember I am omitting you, hope to do better than the cockroaches and move beyond war, corruption, pestilence, and disease. This is the point of civilization. I know you find it hard to believe the point of civilization is not sniffing used jockstraps and wiping buffalo wing grease on the Italian leather sofas of the neauvou riche, but truthfully the point is progression from caveman, lost to the whims of nature and predators to civilized man free from the destruction baser instincts. Come get on the train with “us”, don’t be left behind in the cold wet disease ridden public restrooms of the Super Dome.
September 3rd, 2006 at 12:49 pmif I ever get into legal trouble I hope Mr. Krystol will likewise come to my rescue with the ” I hope ( she) gets pardoned ” thing. What an absolute outrage….
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:03 pmNovak should be in jail. Novak should be discredited completely and charged with treason for printing the damn article in the first place. It is common knowledge that Americans do not *out* their spies…….
*DUH* spin spin spin
48) So, do you believe Libby commited an honorable crime against America when he disclosed a covert CIA operative’s name?
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:04 pmSo if Kristol beloieves Libby did noting wrong that it is OK to obstruct justice, make false statements to a grand jury and perjury himself, then why was President Clinton impeached?
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:10 pm51) Why exactly would liberals, who do things like make sure there’s a seperation of church and state, want an Islamic Republic?
But I’m glad to see you’re violating the interests of our founding fathers by wanting a state sponsorship of Judeo-Christian philosophy. Folks like you love waving the flag in the faces of everyone that you disagree with, but never undersand what the flag stands for.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:11 pmI can actually spell and type…….excuse the above typos….
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:12 pmWhile we’re on the subject of perjury, just when can we expect Alberto Gonzolez to be charged for his perjury?
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:12 pmKristol will burn in Hell for his sins! -Kevo
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:14 pm55) When did Gonzolez lie under oath?
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:16 pmComment by NFL Guy — September 3, 2006 @ 12:58 pm
Honestly I don’t care for politics…
We’re getting sick of both your theatrical acts and just want to be left alone. -Then why are you posting on a POLITICAL BLOG, are you one of those “special” children? The SPORTS blogs are elsewhere precious.
The way to end the terrorist crap is to nuke Iran. That will teach them a lesson. - See “special” the way to end child misbehaviour amongst a family with five children is to murder , gut, and skin one of the children and that will teach the rest a lesson. Deary, you must really try to use your head for more than a helmet stand.
If China or Russia were the dominant powers would things be any different? I don’t think so. - Yes dearie, and people will still commit murders in US cities, but does that mean we all should? Just because Jimmy jumps off a bridge your arguement is that we all should jump, didn’t you have a mom and dad who taught you all about this impaired way of “thinking”.
There will always be war and destruction and that’s that! - So we souldn’t try to improve the human race? OK then I guess I’ll get a gun , rob the bank, rape the neighbors, get drunk, and constantly fart…I mean since you say we’ll never change and terrible things will always be with us.
Look “special” NFL guy, give up on the whole “thinking and writing” think you’re meant for that sniffing jocks thing.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:16 pmYes please pardon Scooter ASAP! PR fiasco.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:20 pmPathetic, but it seemed that something like this was coming.. hence the disinformation campaign that started with Mikey Isikoff’s “scoop” last week.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:20 pmCan the Prez pardon someone who is presumed innocent?
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:20 pmWilliam Kristol, Paul Wolfowitz and others who follow the philosophy of Leo Strauss have had a disproportionate amount of power in this Bush administration. Their goal is to continue an unending war in the middle east and work toward world domination. Their ends justifies the means ethic
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:28 pmjustifies lies, wars, manipulations, and the killing of innocent civilians in war’s wake. Their problem is that they haven’t factored unplanned “consequences” into their strategies.
And so just where do our resident twit trolls live? Jason, Scarface.? Me hopes when you all choose up sides, those of us on both coast’s can lob shot’s toward’s the middle and hit our mark….Right after we round up all the war mongers in charge and put them in jail….Get real and get off you’re same ol bull shit page hand delivered by this miserable administration….bushco is loosing in all the polls, you’re bunch has created this entire mess….Stop the madness and go play with you’re selves, that’s all you’re good for..
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:31 pm“This idiot reminds me of howard the duck. Not just because he looks like him, but because of the idiocies he says; almost comical how moronic.”
Comment by DEANandGORE2008 — September 3, 2006
*****
HAHAHA, I hadn’t noticed, but it’s true, he does look like Howard the duck! What a piece of shit maggot this Krystol idiot is.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:34 pmDoncha worry they will wait a while to pardon him. Kristal is the admin’s “Kristal ball”.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:39 pmThe President cannot pardon Libby until he’s been tried and found guilty. He must stand trial first.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:44 pmWell I say we should split this country up. Let the Blue staes form an Islamic Republic and the Red states a Judeo-Christian nation. That’s the fairest solution to our problems. It’s time for a division of America!
Comment by Scarface — September 3, 2006 @ 1:05 pm
Excellent idea Scarface, If the Blue States such as New York and California
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:45 pmkept our tax base income to ourselves you Red Staters would soon become what you really are…..a third-fourth world country. For all your flag waving moralists BS you red states are nothing but leaches on the wealth of the more liberal and successful Blue States. You bitch while the red states are sucking at the teat of the Blues. Please leave.
Thre real meanign of that statement is - If Bush wants to pardon Libby he better do it now, cause BUsh is going to be impeached next year - if the grassroots Dems have any say about it - as long as ClintonCo and the Dem elites don’t try to stop it.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:48 pmIt has been alluded to above but not spelled out explicitly. Let me spell it out.
Clinton was being investigated about Whitewater - a personal business deal that took place before he was in office.
Libby was part of the investigation in to the leak of the name of an UNDER COVER CIA agent working on WMDs.
The Clinton investigation was looking for lies by talking to Paula Jones.
The Fitzgerald investigation was arrow-straight in questioning Libby about Plame.
Fitzgerald was asking Libby questions about the Plame issue.
Starr’s team was diposing Clinton ON VIDEO about Paula Jones when they asked “Have you had a affair with Monica L”. The information about Monica was obtained by someone ILLEGALLY taping 20 hours of conversation with her.
Clinton lied about a personal issue unrelated to the investigation and it
was considered OBSTRUCTION.
Libby lied enough to actually OBSTRUCT the Plame investigation.
The “liberal media” played the Monica (via Jones via Whitewater) lie
24×7.
The Starr report found nothing on Whitewater but mentioned sex about 100 times.
Republicans were trying to censor the internet at the time but felt that the LURID Starr report MUST be available online.
During the resulting impeachment Newt Gingrich was one of the loudest advocates for the importance of TRUTH (yada yada). Newt, at
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:52 pmthe time, was having an affair with an intern.
Great post’s pipsquek & Jame…We all must have done the same research and self education….Unlike the trolls and roaches that pollute our site and are handed their script’s from bushco…..I wonder often, how much do they get paid, do they get overtime pay for week ends and who are all the sickos that pay them…….Blessings all..
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:53 pmYes and Bill signed Nafta after which Mexico’s economic decline spiraled, and then Bill went and sailed in Bush Srs boat and all was right with the world of crime syndication. THe two crime families joined forces.
September 3rd, 2006 at 1:55 pmI saw Bill on TV last night with some kind of report about poverty - I guess BushClintonCo has decided it’s time to rehabilitate him for signing the welfare reform act - his own little war on poor people dressed up as reform - reform all right - reform poor people managing to survive into poor people without a hope
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:00 pmNothing thrilled me more than to see those two mafia dons - George SR and Bill, sitting together in a love fest over the tsunami
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:02 pmNewt, at the time, was having an affair with an intern.
Comment by Linda Tripp — September 3, 2006 @ 1:52 pm
Excellent post! Well said.
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:03 pmBut then Hilary outdid all of them when she said Israel was standing up for american values by attacking Lebanon - yes and what is it - 100,000 cluster bombs from Israel - now that speaks volumes about hilary’s view of american values
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:04 pmamerican values = american made cluster bombs delivered to Israel in time to be dropped on southern lebanon, and now taxpayer money will be handed over to corporations owned by the crime syndicate to clean up the mess -what a great game they play and we all sit back and pay and pay and pay - pay with our children’s futures
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:06 pmDid you pick the short straw today, Jason? Please cite some facts that show how Libby preserved national security? From what I’ve read, when Plame was outed, our entire intelligence operation regarding Iran’s nuclear program was destroyed. How did that help preserve our national security?
The only way your argument makes any kind of logical sense is if you equate national security with having an authoritarian dictatorship. But then, you’ve argued for that before.
Tell me, how will having a dictatorship make us more secure?
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:15 pmBill Clinton didn’t “lie in any serious meaning of lying before a grand jury” either. Sheesh, the madness of Kristol is simply astounding. My only hope is that Bush DOES pardon the guy, and then the dems can ride their victory in both Houses on a huge tidal wave.
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:27 pmIf he didn”t lie, what is the need for a pardon? They pay that asshole for shitting?
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:34 pmIMPEACH-PROSECUTE-EXECUTE
September 3rd, 2006 at 2:49 pmALL war criminals,traitors,theives,liars,the bribed,etc…Oh no they are all pardoned by Bush illegal leader of free america…..Do I smell revolting?
Was the smug and smirking Kristol so generous with pardons in the past? Was he advocating letting Clinton off the hook because his lying to the grand jury was less consequential than - let’s say - lying about WMD’s and invading a sovereign nation?
September 3rd, 2006 at 3:18 pmLarry Johnson has a theory that the WH is critical of Fitzgerald - and by extension, also eager to pardon the only indicted person, Libby - because Fitz’s case is not yet closed and there may be indictments coming for Cheney and/or Hadley.
September 3rd, 2006 at 3:19 pmWould someone PLEASE do the USA a favor and off this guy!?!
September 3rd, 2006 at 3:27 pmDear Progs - We are gracious “winners”. Just send Karl Rove, Dick Cheney and President Bush a sincere apology and your national temper tantrum will be forgiven. I won’t blame you for putting that “has been”, Joe Wilson, through deliberate and thoughtful scrutiny. (I keep wondering how many books that putz would have sold if he hadn’t lied about who sent him to Niger…..hmmmm..)
September 3rd, 2006 at 3:32 pmKristol is just another murderous AIPAC neo - con slime ball. If Libby goes to trial the Israeli spy network in this country maybe ( partially ) exposed .
September 3rd, 2006 at 3:33 pm#43 - “President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is the man! I’m going to get aposter of him for my house.
He stands up for the oppresed masses in the world against the evil Christians and their Jewish masters!
Revolution bay!” - Comment by Rodan
*******A question for any honest Prog (I know which of you are dishonest so don’t waste YOUR bytes.) WHERE do you find posters like THIS? Ronan, did you write the copy for the American Islamisfascist who is trying to induce US military to desert and fight for Islam???
September 3rd, 2006 at 3:43 pmI seem to recall that Kristol and others, hypocrites all, sang a different tune about Clinton lying. Funny how they sing different tunes at different times.
September 3rd, 2006 at 3:44 pmOn one hand the Republiscum claim Plame was a lowly clerk at the CIA and not under cover at all — on the other hand, she had the AUTHORITY to send her husband on a “junket” to Niger.
Which way do they want it? They argue both sides of their own argument.
1. Anyone who thinks Niger would be a junket is mistaken.
September 3rd, 2006 at 3:48 pm2. Wilson was the last person to meet with Saddam, he was former ambassador in the region, familiar with mining data necessary to obtain yellowcake.
3. He did it pro bono.
4. If she were not under cover why in hell was the CIA so furious over her exposure?
5. Was she exposed because it meant her company (investigating the proliferation of nuclear weaponry in the region) would also be worthless once exposed?
6. The order came from the VP’s office — Plame reminded her superior of her husband’s qualifications.
Nothing like smearing widows, orphans, and the down trodden right mighty assface? Does your soul leave you after you’ve killed and eaten what you 10th, 20th, 50th baby?
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:01 pmWell, well, well, FINALLY ThinkProgress touches upon the revelations this week that the so-called leak of Valerie “Vanity Fair” Plame’s identity has turned out to be a media-hyped non-story. I can understand why TP has been so reluctant to bring it up…I am sure it, like so many other “progressives,” deluded themselves (or tried to mislead others) into thinking that there was any type of “scandal” here. And now it has blown up in your collective faces. How embarassing for you. You folks certainly allowed yourselves to be taken for a ride by the odious Joe Wilson and his publicity-seeking wife.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:07 pmComment by Exley = stupidity
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:09 pmwho but morons and neadarthals listens to this guy anymore? has he been right about anything, especially the iraq conflic?
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:13 pmActually, bones, the stupidity lies with those who believed Joe Wilson’s lies and allowed this pointless “investigation” to drag on for three years when, as now all know, there was never any underlying crime or infraction committed. Richard Armitage should provide financial restitution to the U.S. government, as well as to Vice President Cheney, Karl Rove and all the others who were caught up in this fiasco concocted by Joe Wilson, Vanity Fair Valerie, and David Corn.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:15 pmGreat post’s, well except for the cristo facists reich wingers of course. Realy like you’re “you must of got the short straw, Jason”, BnF that was another priceless quote…May I add, Jason is the short straw on the short list of tinkeling trolls that try to plague us…Right after Jason goes the Mighty mad hatteress and then the skitso scarface…..You all have fun with this crazy bunch today, I’m off and running with the Bear and hugging trees……Blessings, pass them around……Peace is on the way, we are winning and that’s why they are so angry…
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:18 pmComment by Exley = stupidity
Everything you said was stupid, wrong, and propoganda by a stupid clumsy person who believes others are as stupid, clumsy, and unintellectual as he is.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:22 pmAh, I see, Bones…You are still too embarassed to admit you and you ideological soulmates were 100% wrong when it came to the alleged “outing” of Vanity Fair Valerie. Well, that’s understandable. But I suggest you re-direct your anger at the people truly responsible for your humiliations — The publicity-seeking and dishonest Wilson/Plame couple and their press agent David Corn.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:25 pmSorry Dixie,
Libby withheld/lied to a grand jury. His intent was to protect his boss. In this country we have a law that says you CAN NOT LIE to a grand jury, and if you do you will be put on trial and if found guilty, punished. Libby did it to himself. The prosecuter didn’t make him lie,Joe Wilson didn;’t make him lie, Valerie Wilson didn’t make him lie. The lie is the crime here. The rest of the crime will be prosecuted under a Democratic Congress.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:27 pm#97 see #98, these facts are NOT DISPUTABLE, which is why Libby is going to be tried. So any lies you tell don’t excuse the FACTS in #98.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:29 pmCan you really predict a million years into the future?
Our species is evolving. Even now, a new paradigm shift is occuring. There is a reason the Mayan Calendar ends at 2012.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:32 pmActually, bones, those “facts” are very much in dispute. That is why there will likely be a trial (unless the judge dismisses the case against Libby first). Unfortunately for the prosecution, the revelation that Armitage was Novak’s source delivers a near fatal-blow to the prosecution’s case against Libby. If — as we now know — there was no underlying crime and if the Vice President’s office was not the source of the so-called “leak,” there was no motive for Libby to lie to investigators or the grand jury.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:33 pmHey, Mighty Afraudite, you’re back! I’m still waiting:
How much do you want to bet the Judge Taylor’s ruling is overturned on appeal??? For such a long opinion, there wasn’t much meat on the bone….
’til later…..
Comment by mighty aphrodite — August 29, 2006 @ 4:30 pm
OK. It’s later. I’ve finished reading Judge Taylor’s ruling. Time to show us your “legal†skills, Mighty aFraudite. What would be the grounds for overturning the opinion? What will be the judicial standard applied in reviewing the case? What were her errors? Cite her ruling, by page number.
Comment by Briseadh na Faire — August 31, 2006 @ 9:51 pm
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:34 pmLibby is charged with lying to a grand jury. he either did lie or he didn’t. NO OTHER FACTS MATTER in his case. Period. So there is NO DISPUTE of any RELEVANT facts unless you Exley are a complete moron, oh yeah I forgot - you are.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:38 pmEx-lie, unless you were on the grand jury, or working for the prosecutor in the case, YOU KNOW NOTHING of consequence in the matter other than Repugnicant talking points.
Fact: Libby was charged with lying to a Grand Jury. Motive is irrelevant.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:39 pmNo Dixie, my sorry was for your pointing out Exley is an idiot troll and on the list, and I wasn’t ignoring him. Not for anything you wrote about Libby.(Your post 96)
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:40 pmComment by Exley — September 3, 2006 @ 4:25 pm
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:41 pm107…continued…
Perhaps I should direct my anger at people such as yourself who support a dictatorial fascist regime.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:43 pm#108 Dixie
Exley is probably sEiXXon-and-on-and-on-and-on…
He’s on the troll list!!!!
Comment by dixie blood — September 3, 2006 @ 4:22 pm
I was arguing with exlax immediately before you posted this. I felt your post was to remind me he is a troll and so I acknowledged that by saying I was sorry to you for arguing with him and taking up space. Now is this really Dixie?
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:48 pmDixie, ignore the entire paragraph after “Sorry Dixie”, only the first two words were directed at you. The rest was simple statement of fact about the thread topic to piss exlax off.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:50 pmBush can but won’t pardon him now. Certainly not before the election and maybe never.
September 3rd, 2006 at 4:57 pmReason 1: He might win an acquittal. Not likely, but not impossible. Then all they are out is the money GOP donors ‘donated” to his defense fund.
Reason 2: If found guilty, he might get probation. After serving his probation, then he could be pardoned and be able to be employed again as a lawyer or lobbyist without hurting Bushco.
Reason 3: If he is pardoned for any crimes he might have committed during that time, he could have his ass hauled up before the grand jury again, and since he couldn’t be prosecuted for any crimes committed during that time period, he couldn’t claim the 5th. He would have to answer all questions, and if he lied, the pardon wouldn’t cover that.
Capeman you’re right a pardon would be a great political/strategic mistake - Which is exactly why “we” should encourage idiots like Kristol and the republofascists to consider pardon. (1) Americans don’t like political parties that give their members pardons, great right before elections, and (2) we want Libby back in front of a grand jury for Cheney next year after Novemeber - where he can torpedo his ex-boss.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:03 pmBill Kristol: new and improved Joker products. that huge maw of his surely qualifies. for what came out of it today certainly reeked…just reeked. how he can sit there and justify lying, well, that’s really in and of itself not too surprising, as he is a ‘neo-CON’ after all. it’s beyond the pale and is not defensible. but he’d disagree on that.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:13 pmWho is Bill Kristol?
I will bring Dick Cheney to his knees.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:20 pm“unless you were on the grand jury, or working for the prosecutor in the case, YOU KNOW NOTHING of consequence in the matter ”
Actually, Briseadh na Faire, I know as much about this case as you or any other member of the public does….Actually, perhaps moreso, since, as we have learned this week, my take of the so-called “outing” of Vanity Fair Valerie turned out to be correct and the conspiracy theories held by so many people here turned out be embarassingly wrong.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:32 pmI know as much about this case as you or any other member of the public does….Actually, perhaps moreso, since, as we have learned this week, my take of the so-called “outing†of Vanity Fair Valerie turned out to be correct and the conspiracy theories held by so many people here turned out be embarassingly wrong.
Comment by Exley — September 3, 2006 @ 5:32 pm
Evidently you don’t douche, because as you have been told repeaqtedly but are too stupid to understand, Libby is charged with lying to the grand jury. Not for outing Valerie Wilson. Sibnce he isn’t charged with outing a CIA operative, it has nothing to do with his defense. He is charged with something VERY FRICKING SIMPLE UNDER THE law, and you are TOO FRICKIN STUPID to get it, so NO YOU DON’T KNOW FRICKIN anything about the case, whereas evidently others here do. Sorry you’re too stupid to understand, it’s been explained above over and over, but you’re too STUPID to understand.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:37 pmBones wrote that these “facts” are “not in dispute:”
Libby withheld/lied to a grand jury. His intent was to protect his boss.
Actually, those allegations are very much in dispute. That is why there will likely be a trial (unless, as I said, the judge grants a motion to dismiss based on these new revelations). You seem be under the mistaken beliefe that an indictment is tantamount to a conviction.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:40 pmActually, those allegations are very much in dispute. That is why there will likely be a trial (unless, as I said, the judge grants a motion to dismiss based on these new revelations). You seem be under the mistaken beliefe that an indictment is tantamount to a conviction.
Comment by Exley — September 3, 2006 @ 5:40 pm
No douche those facts are NOT IN DISPUTE, which is EXACTLY WHY HE IS GOING TO TRIAL. You have lied and said I have a mistaken belief indictment = guilt. You may be stupid enough to believe others are as stupid as you are, but we’re not. The facts were presented to a Grand Jury and an indictment was returned. If there was dispute, then the 12 people of the grand jury would not have indicted Mr Libby. So the only thing in dispute is “guilt”, not the “facts” asshat.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:43 pmThat’s right, Dixie, that was my take from the very beginning…I knew this was a hyped-up non-story being pushed by now-proven liars Joe Wilson and Vanity Fair Valeries and their sycophants in the liberal media….
And what have we learned this week? Lo and behold, I was right and you guys were 100% embarassingly wrong. No conspiracy. No violation of IIPA. No illegal disclosure of classified info. We, who have shown to be correct, accept your collective aplogies and retractions.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:45 pmExley, you really need to pull your head out of your butt and read real reporting , not that Faux crap. When you lie to a grand jury, and the prosecutor goes back multiple times and you lie over and over and then the prosecutor goes to the same grand jury and shows them how the witness lied to “them”, they were there for the lies and their opinion matters a lot since they were the ones involved with the witness’ lie. They have first hand knowledge, and they found the guy to be a liar. Like you.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:47 pmNo illegal disclosure of classified info. We, who have shown to be correct, accept your collective aplogies and retractions.
Comment by Exley — September 3, 2006 @ 5:45 pm
You really are living in your own perverted dream world aren’t you. That or an idiot cretin, I’m voting cretin.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:48 pmFirst, O Arrogant One, show me where I have been in error. You, on the other hand, seem to be claiming to be correct based on media disclosures rather than a trial where evidence is presented under oath.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:56 pm*sigh* Bones, I think it is adorable that you are trying to play lawyer. But a grand jury when voting on whether or not to indict does not make factual determinations. Its function is to hear evidence presented by the prosecution (I will assume you do not realize that defendants are not permitted to present their own evidence at a grand jury nor are their attorneys permitted inside the grand jury room nor may they ask any questions) and then decide whether there is sufficient evidence of probable cause to bring the accused to trial.
Here endeth the lesson, junior.
September 3rd, 2006 at 5:58 pmAnd yet, Dixie, YOU were the folks who got suckered by Lyin’ Joe Wilson and Vanity Fair Valerie…Heh! Your faces must be soooooooo red.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:04 pmBut a grand jury when voting on whether or not to indict does not make factual determinations.Here endeth the lesson, junior.
Comment by Exley — September 3, 2006 @ 5:58 pm
You’re right, here endth the lesson, grand juries absolutely make “factual determinations”. I believe that the “finding in fact” is the reason for the indictment. You’re too cute pretending to play attorney, unfortunately you’re too stupid to be a human being much less an attorney. you couldn’t give a “lesson” to a six year old much less an actual educated adult. You can’t identify the charge, you can’t identify the facts in the case, you can’t show knowledge how grand juries or the American legal system works - yeah i’d say the lesson ends here - you can’t teach a rock, especially concrete like you. Moron. Asshat. Arrogant self-important idiot, I could go on about you but I wouldn’t want you to enjoy it.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:11 pmExley thinks only he knows anything about politics, the law, and everything else. His massive stupidity and underestimation that others know everything he knows (for example I will assume you do not realize that defendants are not permitted to present their own evidence at a grand jury nor are their attorneys permitted inside the grand jury room nor may they ask any questions). yes Exley, we’re all well aware of that you FRICKIN MORON. And yet if you only look at the Martha Stewart case, I’m sure you remember that asshat, people get convicted and do serious jail time for what Scooter did, just like Martha learned. But your ignorant arrogance prevents you from seeing that. Again - asshat, idiot, self important pretend intellectual.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:15 pmThere is a reason the Mayan Calendar ends at 2012.
Comment by Briseadh na Faire — September 3, 2006 @ 4:32 pm
They were conquered by the Spanish and couldn’t finish it?
Or maybe it repeats and you start back at the first year in 2013?
In 5.5 billion years the sun will destroy the Earth based on strong scientific evidence. We don’t have to worry. We’ll be long gone. :)
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:15 pm#87 - “On one hand the Republiscum claim Plame was a lowly clerk at the CIA and not under cover at all — on the other hand, she had the AUTHORITY to send her husband on a “junket†to Niger.” Comment by Marie
******Dear Marie - Such an interesting point!!! I don’t recall hearing Val called a “lowly clerk” - I DO recall the notation she was no longer a covert operative. But why let specific truths litter a Defeatocrat blog?? Why would the dastardly “scum” in the White House send Joe “the Foe” Wilson?
Happy Comrades Day!!!!
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:16 pmOh look it’s that child killing civil rights robbing dip mighty asshat. presuming to dictate “facts” to people. Asshat you know slime mold doesn’t dictate anything to human beings, go back under your rock and let the adults talk.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:18 pmMighty Aphrodite,
Don’t be too hard on them. They have had a rough week, learning how they all served as “useful idiots” for the publicity seeking Joe and Valerie Wilson. They dreamed of “Fitzmas” and instead found out they had been played for fools. We should pity them, not mock them (Although, it IS oh-so enjoyable mocking them!)
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:21 pmDixe, if you were the one “progressive” who kept their head about them and never believed or espoused the now-discredited theory that White House officials conspired to knowingly “out” a covert CIA operative as political retribution than my comments don’t apply to you. They are directed at your ideological soulmates who breathlessly tried to advance this absurd non-story for three years, only to have it blow it their face. So, again, Dixie, if indeed you had been defending the administration against these absurd charges for the past several years, you are exempt from our side’s joyful gloating.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:26 pmMighty Aphrodite,Don’t be too hard on them. Yeah, we’ve got to put up with crap for brains like Exley, who is almost as stupid, childish, and evil as you. I think he beats you on the stupid scale. But that last “no one said Plame was a lowly clerk” is pretty stupid.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:27 pmExley = stupid.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:28 pm138…Heh! Says Bones, the person who thinks that grand juries make factual determinations of guilt or innocence. Nice try, rookie.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:29 pmWait a second. Didn’t Clinton get impeached because he lied under oath? Now, we have a high-ranking republican doing the same thing (minus the BJ) and the neo-cons want him pardoned - surprise, surprise!
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:36 pm#140 exlax you are a liar and stupid, I never said grand juries make determinations of guilt or innocence, you did. i said you had shit for brains, and that’s absolutely true you moron.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:40 pmEDxalx when you lose an arguement changing the words of your opponent, especially when they are written immediately above is called stupid and disingenious, but you knew you were those things already. Moron.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:42 pmthe next time a mouth breather says Clinton lied and should have been impeached, remind them of Kristol’s “meaningful sense” doctrine.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:45 pmEXnay, If your premise is correct, then I expect we will shortly be hearing that the Fitzgarald investigation is concluded. Until that happens I’d say you are maybe celebrating a bit prematurely. which is not the only thing you do prematurely, no doubt.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:54 pmWISHING DON”T MAKE IT SO !!!
Poor Bones. He makes an ignorant comment that grand juries make factual determinations…He confuses an indictment with a conviction…He mistakenly characterizes his statements that “Libby withheld/lied to a grand jury. His intent was to protect his boss” as “indisputable facts” before a trial has even been held…That’s a pretty bad run on this thread, Bones. You are wrong on every count. Maybe you should start over and try again on another topic. You seem hopelessly lost here.
September 3rd, 2006 at 6:54 pmExley when you lie about posts people only have to go back and read them. Evidently besides being stupid you’re also ignorant. you lost the arguement. and evidently a Federal grand Jury and a federal Prosecutor and the Dept of Justice agree with me, while you’re an asshat all by yourself. It doesn’t phase you that the JUSTICE DEPT is carrying the Libby prosecution forward and you dismiss the whole thing. Are you that much of a moron, or just being contrary. yes exlax you know better than Fitzgerald, of course he’s got an excellent track record as a federal Prosecutor and your only track record is gumming your own knob. Moron. Ass.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:01 pmExlax, what’s it like to be wrong on EVERY post you make? How much of a frickin loser do you have to be to be as ignorant as you are?
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:02 pmDear Exley - Of course we myst not be TOOOO hard on progs. But I am ashamed to admit I’ve ENJOYED watching them twist in the wind - just a tad…I’m now waiting for them to explain to us how a pullout from Iraq is a “victory”. Can’t you just hear Osama calling London:
“Abdul, GOOD news!!! The mighty American infidels are tucking their tails in victory and “re-deploying”, Allah Akbar…..”
The REALLY great news for neo-progs - our brave military defend ALL of us - not just those of us who understand their difficult mission….
Happy Labor Day, Exley!
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:03 pmExlax has been wrong about EVERYTHING he has stated on this thread and he’s too stupid to know every poster here is laughing at his ass.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:04 pmEXnay,
Remind me again who Armitage works for ?
Explain to me how blaming it on just a different incompetent White House insider changes anything ?
It seems your whole arguement is that because Armitage was the White House leaker then Libby’s lie doesn’t count.
Did I get it RIGHT ?
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:04 pmExcept mighty asshat, who condones child killing, so giving a happy ending to lying morons is actually a step down on the scum scale for her.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:05 pmFrom what I understand, before the Novak story, two Administration officials were pushing her name to Tim Russert, Chris Matthews, and Andrea Mitchell, amongst others. None of them took the bait. So, slow down Kristol, the story is not over. Libby was thought to be obstructing justice.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:05 pmMighty Mouth,
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:07 pmHave you read either Cobra II or Fiasco ?
What are your sources regarding the military prosecution of the war ?
Maybe if Mighty Asshat had a brain, she would have seen going into Iraq in the first place was a bad move and if the Republofascists hadn’t been so stupid we wouldn’t be in this mess in the first place. But asshat is used to gumming GW so everything he does is OK by her, Asshat do you have a GW stained dress? GW has FAILED at EVERY occupation he has ever had, what the hell amde you think this would be any different. I enjoy seeing asshats like you twist in the wind knowing you supported a guy who is a drunk, drug using, womanizing, loser and then find out years later he’s made a shambles of everything.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:08 pmThe answer is “yes” to a couple of commentators above: a person can be pardoned before a trial takes place, pre-emptively so-to-speak. You guys are probably too young to remember Gerald Ford doing this exactly when Nixon made his exit. I agree with Mike G. above that this Libby pardon thing is a carefully orchestrated campaign, and they say that Rove does not have the clout he once had? Give me a break.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:09 pmJame, If you note, no where in any of my postings do I say that Libby should be pardoned or that if it is proven at trial that he did indeed commit perjury or knowingly mislead investigators, that he should avoid punishment.
What I have said is that the revelation that Iraq War skeptic and former State Department official Richard Armitage was the original “leaker” undermines the theory that Libby lied to protect so-called “neocons” in the White House for some alleged illegal plot to discredit the now-shown-to-be-a-lair Joe Wilson.
If there was no underlying crime or unsavory political plot, then the prosecutors are going to have a hard time proving that Libby had any reason to commit the ancillary crimem of perjury or misleading prosecutors.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:14 pmP.S. Exley, I say the pitifully immature and insufferably raunchy “Bonez” is between 12 and 18 years old. Have you ever read a factual argument from this poor dear? Mr. Aphrodite is convinced Dixie Anemia is Bonez’ big sister ….
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:14 pmExlax and mighty asshat, lovers in the churh of evil. Asshat arguing based on facts makes no difference to either of you morons. when presented with facts you lie, ignore the facts, change the question or what’s your forte, yeah diddles on yourself. So arguing facts with republofascist apoligists is useless, you do’t have the capacity to actually weigh the facts and come to a logical conclusion without reverting to the fascist party line.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:18 pmAnd as for judging people Asshat, again I remind you slime mold like you, with your child killing, fascist, anti-civil rights stands are not allowed to dictate to “real” human beings. Ass.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:19 pmMust be tough when the last remaining republofascists are evil horrible child killers and the ignorant named after constipation products.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:21 pmExley & Mighty Aphrodite = My Kind of People.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:22 pmSo, Mighty A-Fraudite, you ever going to fess up to lying when you claimed to be a lawyer?
I keep giving you ample opportunities to prove yourself. You keep taking a pass. Yet you keep posting here as if you have something worthwhile to say. Are you that starved for attention?
Yes, I’d say after looking at your Runes, you are that starved for attention. Do yourself and us a favor and go out and buy something battery-operated. Go on, have a ball! You can come back to TP when the batteries need recharging. I’ll be checking every so often to see if you are able to dazzle us with your legal expertise or if you admit to lying about being a lawyer.
Peace.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:25 pmDo yourself and us a favor and go out and buy something battery-operated.
Comment by Briseadh na Faire
I always knew you could be as crude as me!
Thanks for that one! :-D
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:30 pmSay, Afraudite, how did you miss this bond-head legal argument from your friend?
Ex-lie, just what makes you think the prosecutors have to prove anything other than the fact that Libby lied?
Oh, and you keep asserting, “the now-shown-to-be-a-lair [sic] Joe Wilson.” Yet you provide no evidence. When did Mr. Wilson lie under oath? When was he convicted of perjury?
Are you content to rest all arguments on media disclosures? If so, why are you not up in arms over the now-shown-to-be-liars Bush, Cheney, Powell, and Rumsfeld? They are just as much liars, if not more so, as Mr. Wilson, yourself, and Ms. Afraudite.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:33 pmI don’t see the connection, the prosecutors don’t “need to prove an underlying crime”, to prove perjury.
People lie all the time when they don’t need to, thus the moniker “liar”.
The complaint was brought by the CIA to the Attorney Generals Office to investigate whether the White House had “outed” one of this country’s
valuable agents. Period. The rest is spin.
The politics of that particular agent, who she was married to, or which
incompetent in the White House did it is irrelevant to the original
complaint.
The spin has been set up for MONTHS !!!!!
It’s called “Watch the Birdie “, while I pick your pocket .
A valuable asset in which millions of dollars and years of investment have been placed has been lost either due to intentional malice or incompetence by this White House.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:36 pmAgain, How is this turned around to be an embarrassment for the Progressives ?
Are you that starved for attention?
Comment by Briseadh na Faire — September 3, 2006 @ 7:25 pm
Yes. MA is so starved, in fact, that (s)he had to come up imaginary family and friends to fill his/her empty life, on top of having to lie about his/her professional, personal accomplishments. So sad.
the prosecutors are going to have a hard time proving that Libby had any reason to commit the ancillary crimem of perjury
Comment by Exley — September 3, 2006 @ 7:14 , 2006 @ 7:14
The prosecution doesn’t have to prove motive to prove a crime was committed. If you shoot someone, prosecutors only have to show the evidence that you did it. Why you did it is not central.
September 3rd, 2006 at 7:49 pmThese liars want to confuse the issue with all sorts of “side” arguments. The only charge against Libby is he lied to the gand jury. Exley’s spurious argument that a grand jury would indict a “ham sandwich” doesn’t play here, the gand jury he lied to found evidence he lied and indicted him. Those are the only “facts” in evidence and necessary to prosecute. This is different than the grand jury who has never seen or heard testimony from a defendant and indicted that person. These jurors saw and heard testimony form Libby not once but repeatedly and found he lied to them. Again, ask Martha Stewart if her jail time was any less “real” because she was convicted of perjury. All the other “excuses” Exley gives are completely superflous to the prosecution. And as stated by Fitzgerald, when Libby’s lawyers requested “classified” records from the vice president’s office for his defense - fitzgerald warns that the charge is perjury, he was well aware a conspiricy to cover up the lies existed coming from the vice president’s office and if the defense pursued those papers perhaps the prosecution needed to add conspiracy to the charges Libby faced.
September 3rd, 2006 at 8:07 pmLibby was indicted in October on five counts of lying to investigators, perjury, and obstruction of justice related to his role in the Plame Wilson leak. Legal scholars said that Fitzgerald can ask a grand jury to add conspiracy charges against Libby if he uncovers evidence that Libby and other administration officials worked together to leak Plame Wilson’s identity to reporters in an effort to silence her husband. “Libby is not charged with conspiracy or any other offense involving acting in concert with others, and the indictment lists no un-indicted co-conspirators,” states Fitzgerald’s motion, which asks a judge to deny the defense motion seeking evidence Fitzgerald said is unrelated to Libby’s criminal indictment.
That could change, however, the sources said, if there is enough evidence to support conspiracy charges.
Although that remains to be seen, former State Department and CIA officials who have testified about their role in the leak said they believe officials at the National Security Council and in the vice president’s office worked together to unmask Plame Wilson to reporters, specifically to undercut her husband’s credibility. They said that Joseph was one NSC staffer who worked with Cheney officials to do so.
September 3rd, 2006 at 8:12 pmformer State Department and CIA officials who have testified about their role in the leak said they believe officials at the National Security Council and in the vice president’s office worked together to unmask Plame Wilson to reporters, specifically to undercut her husband’s credibility. They said that Joseph was one NSC staffer who worked with Cheney officials to do so.
Comment by bones — September 3, 2006 @ 8:12 pm
Gee sounds like “witnesses” to me, and that testimony has been obtained and is waiting till afer Scooter’s conviction to turn him against Dickie Vader next year. So rant on republofascists - obviously you lie.
September 3rd, 2006 at 8:15 pmWhat I have said is that the revelation that Iraq War skeptic and former State Department official Richard Armitage was the original “leaker†undermines the theory that Libby lied to protect so-called “neocons†in the White House for some alleged illegal plot to discredit the now-shown-to-be-a-lair Joe Wilson.
Comment by Exley — September 3, 2006 @ 7:14 pm
You characterize Richard Armitage as “Iraq War skeptic†when in fact he signed “The Project for the New American Century’ letter to then Pres. Bill Clinton in 1998, which urged the removal of Suddam Hussein from power due in part to the “threat from WMDâ€. He was also a core member of the “Vulcans†White House Foreign policy advisors. Not exactly a dove.
The 1998 letter concerning Iraq was co-signed by:
William Kristol
John Bolton
Paul Wolfowitz
Donald Rumsfeld
Richard Perle
Robert Kagan
Elliot Abrams
William Bennett
The White House, most likely with Mr. Armitage’s blessing has characterized him as a “war criticâ€