VIDEO: Cheney Still Lying About Iraq-Al Qaeda Link
VIDEO: Cheney Still Lying About Iraq-Al Qaeda Link
Just last month, the Senate Intelligence Committee — chaired by Bush-ally Sen. Pat Roberts (R-KS) — concluded that there was absolutely no relationship between Saddam Hussein and the late al-Qaeda operative Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. Nevertheless, in an interview with a South Bend, Indiana television station yesterday, Vice President Cheney falsely asserted that Zarqawi was proof of a connection between Iraq and al Qaeda. Watch it:
Cheney’s statement is a lie. Here’s precisely what the Senate Intelligence Committee found:
Saddam Hussein attempted, unsuccessfully, to locate and capture al-Zarqawi and…the regime did not have a relationship with, harbor, or turn a blind eye toward Zarqawi. [p. 109]
Watch the entire interview HERE.
Transcript:
Q: Are you saying that you believe fighting in Iraq has prevented terrorist attacks on American soil? And if so, why, since there has not been a direct connection between al Qaeda and Iraq established?
CHENEY: Well, the fact of the matter is there are connections. Mr. Zarqawi, who was the lead terrorist in Iraq for three years, fled there after we went into Afghanistan. He was there before we ever went into Iraq. The sectarian violence that we see now, in part, has been stimulated by the fact of al Qaeda attacks intended to try to create conflict between Shia and Sunni.
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How is catching Cheyney lying news? Catching him telling the truth about something would be news…
October 20th, 2006 at 1:58 pmAll they do is lie …again …and again…..and again. It’s time to stop them. The following letter says it all. It’s by Pat Tillman’s brother Kevin, out today.
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/200601019_after_pats_birthday/
October 20th, 2006 at 2:00 pmCheney? Lying? And this surprises who? Oh, both people who trust this purveyor of the Dark Side of the Force.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:01 pmKeep on lying big guy. We’ll just add it to the list when you are impeached.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:01 pmGood to see TP using the word lying. It is to the point, because he is lying
October 20th, 2006 at 2:06 pmRepublicans = the party that thinks lying to the American Public is in the party’s best interest..
Has any VP deserved jail time more than this a-hole?
October 20th, 2006 at 2:09 pmLook if you were making as much money as from profiteering as Cheney you’d want the invasion to continue. The Public trust the White House and believes that the GOP would never lie. As the US Treasury is going broke and Iraq/Afghan get 2 Billion a day would you want it to stop. Bush/Cheney/Rummy/Connie and the rest of the White House/GOP have been proved liars but let’s see if Americans are ok with that. Now the voters also have to decide if it’s ok to abuse children as is done in the Branches of government. The Christians will chose God or Satan this election. This time they know Bush is following Satan’s rule so it’s easier for them. If the GOP wins then look for the United States to go back to the beginning. The Saudi’s are waiting to step in and take control.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:10 pm#4 I sure hope Both Cheney and Bush will be impeach after the Dems take over in November. We can not take two more years of these two in office.
I just don’t know what the answer is. Something big has to happen soon.
If the Republican stay in power we the people will have to do something about this. We need to take our America back.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:12 pmThe guy has lost it. He’s a raving lunatic with a maniacal lack of respect for the truth.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:12 pmCheney would explode if he ever told the truth.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:14 pmHe was the driving force in Bush I’s Desert Storm invasion,
and felt compelled to finish the job, even if he was quoted as
saying going into Baghdad would result in a quagmire.
As Sec/Def at that time, he willingly sold us out to the Arab
nations. He’s doing it again, with Rummy as the front man.
VOTE NOV. 8th!
If we can get a majority in one of the houses, we can begin
impeaching this lying sack of dung.
Technically, he’s correct– zarqawi DID flee to Iraq and he WAS there before we invaded. Now, whether he was a welcome guest is a completely different issue and the one that he very cleverly sidesteps.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:15 pmMr.Cheney: “The sky is blue” Cheney: “No…it’s red like all the good states who vote Republican…no matter what. It is a Democrat trick that makes it look blue. I’ll talk to GOD and have him fix it,so the CLINTONS will be exposed as the devils the really are.”
October 20th, 2006 at 2:26 pmI always knew Darth Cheney’s helmet was screwed on a little too tight. It has squeezed his penut size brain so much that he is only capable of one thought
October 20th, 2006 at 2:27 pmI don’t think he cleverly sidesteps anything — he cites Zarqawi as evidence of a connection
October 20th, 2006 at 2:27 pmeditor,
Zarqawi may have been in Iraq before we invaded, but there was not an Al Qaida in Iraq until December 5, 2004 when Zarqawi pledge allegience to Osama bin Laden.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:27 pmDick Cheney, who once downed “a beer” at lunch, shot a 78-year-old man in the face, and then sent his friend out to lie about it to everyone, must think the good people of Indiana are stupid.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:29 pm#11. Think you meant Vote TUES. NOV. 7th!
October 20th, 2006 at 2:31 pmSince Atta was in US in 2001, then by Cheney’s logic Bush/Cheney supported them since he was in US and that alone is enough to make the connection.
Why cant people ask a normal follow up question? Interviewer should have also asked about the senate report contradicting Cheney’s assertion.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:31 pmTechnically this is not a lie… he was careful not to say there was a “direct” connection or an “operational” connection.
One can easily link any two objects in the universe by virtue of their shared existence in the universe… yet that doesn’t mean they should be taken seriously!
911 terrorists took flight training in Arizona… that doesn’t mean that Arizona was harboring terrorists or that John McCain should be hunted down and arrested… or does it?
October 20th, 2006 at 2:37 pmmust think the good people of Indiana are stupid.
Comment by Wayne A. Schneider
60% of the “good people” of indiana voted for his criminal regime in 2004. I would say that makes darth cheney a pretty good judge of some things.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:37 pmOf course, Cheney’s past employer, and current payer of his severance checks and the company in which he holds stock, Halliburton, has done quite well for it$elf in Iraq.
Not everyone has.
While we still have troops ducking bullets and trying to avoid IED’s in the midst of a civil war in which the 3 sides shoot at each other AND at least 2 of them will shoot at us, the families of our troops are begging for food!
Bush’s Baghdad Blunder has gone from tragic mistake to a horrific maelstrom of violence, with nobody hurt more than the innocent.
May God forgive the Bushies and the Repugnants who are their accomplices, because I, and most well read Americans, never will.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:37 pmNothing against Zimzone as I’m sure it was an honest mistake but doesn’t that sound like a GOP ploy? “No, we vote on November 8 not November 7, don’t be silly. See you at the polls! Don’t forget, November 8!”
And as a reminder, in most states you can request a paper ballot to vote early. Here in Tallahassee I went online on Tuesday to request one and it was delivered to my home on Wednesday. You may also request a paper ballot at the polls, even if they primarily use electronic voting machines. It may also be helpful to have the number of your local news organization on hand if you encounter any problems.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:41 pmWhy cant people ask a normal follow up question? Interviewer should have also asked about the senate report contradicting Cheney’s assertion.
Comment by Ajay+Kalra
That is why they do interviews with local stations. The locals are so happy to get big time that they don’t want to rock the boat. Not that the major corporate media is any better but the Army has a large office working out of Atlanta designed to bypass the filter of major media and get the troops on the air with the much freindlier local stations.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:41 pmLook hard people; there WAS a link between Saddam and Zarqwari…something along the lines of a link between Zarqwari and Kevin Bacon (Seven Degrees removed). PATHETIC.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:42 pmCheney does this every few weeks to test the waters to determine if the majority of Americans are still accepting the adminstration’s lies.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:42 pmVP lying again? That doesn’t even phase me.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:47 pmWhat… Kevin Bacon was harboring terrorists… that Bastard!!!
October 20th, 2006 at 2:47 pmCheney is like (a) Fox, he is always just giving his opinion and it has nothing to do with reality and the facts of the matter. I am quite sure he has convinced himself he has the greatest military mind in history and developed it during his five deferments. As he stated his reason for not going to Vietnam was that he had other priorities.
If he wasn’t the President, we likely would give him a padded cell so he wouldn’t hurt himself or 600,000 (and counting) others.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:49 pmSorry, all for my quick fingers…
October 20th, 2006 at 2:51 pmVOTE NOV. 7TH!
And yes, it sure does sound like something to redirect voters.
It wasn’t me sending out those threatening letters to
Latino voters in CA!
It wasn’t me firing 60 investigators investigating me!
It wasn’t me voting for these Neanderthalcons!
You get the picture…
So, by this logic, since al-Quada operatives were in the U.S. at the time of 9/11, that means that the Bush Administration was “linked” to the terrorists as well. I recommend regime change!
October 20th, 2006 at 2:51 pmIt is, matter of factly, a lie. There were no direct connections . To suggest otherwise is helping to spread the lie. Cheneys says “connections” but only states one weak example with Mr. Zarqawi that has been disproven.
Move over Spiro Agnew, the new worst VP is coming thru.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:51 pm#16, You are correct. But Cheney didn’t say that. And as much as I think he’s the world’s best obfuscator, in this case (what is written above) he’s not lying. He’s very ingeniously distorting the timeline.
These guys are really good at this kind of BS.
Mr. Zarqawi, who was the lead terrorist in Iraq for three years, fled there after we went into Afghanistan. He was there before we ever went into Iraq
Zarqawi WAS the “lead terrrorist” for three years – after we invaded the country! And he WAS there before we went in.
And because NOW there is a connection between Iraq and alQaeda – one that developed AFTER WE INVADED- Cheney can say what he said and be telling the truth while saying it means something completely different than what it does. He speaks facts, but his interpretation is, um, skewed.
I look forward to the day these guys are out of office!
October 20th, 2006 at 2:54 pm#12: Exactly. Timothy McVeigh was in the United States before the Murrah Building explosion. That doesn’t mean he had a relationship with the president.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:54 pm#31 –
That’s been the problem with their rhetoric since 2001 – with Bush threatening to go after any country that ‘harbors’ terrorists.
Well, we were ‘harboring’ terrorists for years prior to 9/11. And to listen to some of the government’s sound bites when discussion surveillance, it sounds like we still ARE harboring terrorists– although ostensibly only to discover even more terrorists.
October 20th, 2006 at 2:58 pmcheney shot jfk !!
October 20th, 2006 at 3:00 pmVP Dick Cheney is a criminal liar, so he must resign from his position, or be impeached by the Congress for corruption!
October 20th, 2006 at 3:02 pmi keep saying this and i have a strong feeling my suspicions are going to be right.
supreme court:
was stacked by bushwhack for the sole purpose so he and his criminal regime WILL NOT face any impeachment or criminal action by their opponents. if you all take notice the chief sides with anything and everything this admin does along with 4 others. the abortion ruckus was a SMOKE SCREEN to sidetrack what they knew was going to happen with this reichwing. now the dems can impeach but are to pu**ified to do so. even if we do get an impeachment we have the nicely stacked supreme court to throw all of it out. hate to say it but for right now….it will be a cold day in hell before the nazi/zionist are held responsible for their dictatorship and ripping us of our most basic freedoms
did anyone watch keith olbermann the other night? he ripped and spit all over this admin. good speech!
October 20th, 2006 at 3:05 pmCheney crossed the Rubicon long ago. There is no coming back for this psychopath.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:11 pmI guess the point I want to make is this:
Cheney is really skirting the truth, but technically not lying.
For us to jump on this as a blatant lie is what makes us look like whining pansies.
There are so so so many things this administration has done to destroy the safety, the military, the culture, the image, the economy… of this country! Let’s not lose focus.
To explain the deception is what we need to do, but simply crying “liar, liar” does nothing for our cause.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:16 pmSince Atta was in US in 2001, then by Cheney’s logic Bush/Cheney supported them since he was in US and that alone is enough to make the connection.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:17 pmComment by Ajay+Kalra — October 20, 2006 @ 2:31 pm
Now that is Priceless, Great Point!!!!!!!
zarqawi made it into iraq because of the invasion of iraq by the criminals(usa) and knew saddam was going to be running for his life and could not direct any attention to him(zarq). remember his loyalist and army were running for their life also.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:18 pmYo, On the Kevin Tillman Piece… Why does Truthdig show the last comment on the piece is 8:00 or so thursday the 19th? I am sure there are hundreds if not thousands of responces…. I for one responded with thanks for his service and it still hasn’t been posted and it’ been over an hour… Does anyone know what might be going on?
October 20th, 2006 at 3:24 pmIT’s like, they get to a location where they think the people are too STUPID to recognize the lie, and out it comes! OSAMA, IRAQ, HUSSEIN, AL QAEDA…OSAMA, IRAQ, HUSSEIN, AL QAEDA!
October 20th, 2006 at 3:27 pmAre there any places left in the US where that really works? Sure! Because there ARE places where deliberate ignorance is fertile soil for lies like that.
Someday, when the old man is lying in a hospital bed somewhere, a nurse who lost her son to his lies will lie to him. “Take these, hon, they’ll make you feel better”.
none of us should forget that we created the taliban(al-quaeda).
October 20th, 2006 at 3:27 pmfolks we got played, and played hard. and the bad part of it all of them knew it was going to come back and bite em in the asses. these criminals have been working for the better part of 30 yrs to get their ‘misson accomplished’ and that is i believe bushwhack was referring to(policies/plolitics) and not military. nice try to deviate from the truth though. all of this crap with the arab nation is about the u.s. getting THEIR interests met and meeting the zionists(israel) interests. these folks don’t give a rats ass about anyone but their goal to rule the world.
Ren, You’re gonna kick yourself when i tell you this so maybe you should sit down! The comments are ordered from latest at the top to older on the bottom. LOL Don’t worry, I read some from the top down only to see responses first before it clicked.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:31 pmOh Ren, my bad. The latest comments are at the top but they seem to stop at 8:22 am this morning. Perhaps they got overloaded.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:34 pmguess the point I want to make is this:
Cheney is really skirting the truth, but technically not lying.
For us to jump on this as a blatant lie is what makes us look like whining pansies.
There are so so so many things this administration has done to destroy the safety, the military, the culture, the image, the economy… of this country! Let’s not lose focus.
To explain the deception is what we need to do, but simply crying “liar, liar†does nothing for our cause.
Comment by editor
Who did any of the things in your accusation?
October 20th, 2006 at 3:37 pmHere is the connection: Saddam Hussein was once the ruler of Iraq, Sean Penn has been to Iraq, Sean Penn and Kevin Bacon were both in “Mystic River,” Kevin Bacon and Walter Matthau were both in “JFK,” Walter Matthau and Walter Koenig have the same first name, Walter Koenig played Pavel Chekov (a Russian) on “Star Trek,” Russia invaded Afghanistan in 1979, Afghanistan harbors members of Al Qaeda. See the connection?
October 20th, 2006 at 3:37 pm#46 in that case the last post was 8:40 something this morning,,,,,?
October 20th, 2006 at 3:40 pmOsama bin Laden fled to Pakistan. Musharraf is the president of Pakistan. Therefore we must spend half a trillion dollars knocking over Musharraf and leveling Pakistan.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:44 pmThanks Yikes, and then I read your second comment… hopefully they will post them all, I would like to read them.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:48 pmOne thing though, already people are commenting more on the politics of him writing the piece than of the loss of his brother. I guess you can go either way, but to be a good person I think we should thank him and his brother for their service and Thanks Yikes, and then I read your second comment… hopefully they will post them all, I would like to read them.
One thing though, already people are commenting more on the politics of him writing the piece than of the loss of his brother. I guess you can go either way, but to be a good person I think we should thank him and his brother for their service and sacrifice that for anything else….but I do understand everyone’s support for him either way…. as long as everybody goes to Truthdig and Posts a comment… that for anything else….but I do understand everyone’s support for him either way…. as long as everybody goes to Truthdig and Posts a comment…
Mr. Zarqawi had connections with Iraq as much as I have connections to the Wal mart in my town. Proximity does not equate to relationship.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:50 pmSo where is the outrage at the newscaster for not following up and questioning the VP about his lie?
It isn’t as if anyone who keeps up on issues doesn’t know what has been published.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:55 pmSo where is the outrage at the newscaster for not following up on the question?
It isn’t as if anyone who is following the issues doesn’t know the truth.
October 20th, 2006 at 3:57 pm[...] See the article and video at: http://thinkprogre…6/10/20/cheney-lies/ [...]
October 20th, 2006 at 4:05 pmHere’s the real connection:
October 20th, 2006 at 4:10 pmAlQaeda shoots people in the face.
WedSeptember132005
Tillman’s Family Still Searching For Answers
The family of slain soldier Pat Tillman — whose jersey we have owned for six years — are simultanously making more headway on getting answers about the death of their son and getting farther away. They reviewed the military papers and found “countless” names and information blacked out.
A San Francisco Chronicle review of more than 2,000 pages of testimony, as well as interviews with Pat Tillman s family members and soldiers who served with him, found contradictions, inaccuracies and what appears to be the military s attempt at self-protection.
Another surprising element of the report: Tillman himself, notoriously highlighted as a gung-ho, let’s-roll warrior by the government, was actually critical of President Bush’s handling of the Iraq war and was a devoted fan of left-wing author Noam Chomsky. But the real tale of the tragedy of Tillman is one of devotion, sacrifice and, yeah, heroism … and the deeply sad mystery that has followed. The Chronicle story is in-depth and fascinating. Take a look.
Tillman Family Demands The Truth [San Francisco Chronicle]
October 20th, 2006 at 4:21 pmPat Tillman
Anti-war stance
The September 25, 2005 edition of the San Francisco Chronicle newspaper reported that Tillman held views which were critical of the Iraq war and did not support President Bush’s re-election. According to Tillman’s mother, a friend of Tillman had arranged a meeting with Noam Chomsky, to take place after his return from Afghanistan. Chomsky confirmed this ([17]). The article also reported that Tillman urged a soldier in his platoon to vote for John Kerry in the 2004 U.S. Presidential election (see [18]).
Religious beliefs
October 20th, 2006 at 4:33 pmTillman is known to have been a well-read individual who had read a number of religious texts, including the Bible, Koran, and Book of Mormon. He was also particularly fond of the American transcendentalist philosophers Ralph Waldo Emerson and Henry David Thoreau ([20]).
Wikipedia
#58
i believe they know the truth but want the players to admit it. they want to hear it from the responsible parties mouth. it is not going to happen. to admit guilt or take responsibility for the actions that caused his death would open a can of worms that would probably lead to some catastrophic findings.
October 20th, 2006 at 4:37 pmI look forward to the day after the elections, to come here and discuss what went wrong with the democrats and why they could not gain control.
October 20th, 2006 at 4:42 pmWith all of Cheney’s continual denial and dislocation from reality, isn’t it about time that he be considered mentally unstable. In my experience, anyone who continues to embrass falsehood even after much proof otherwise usually has some sort of mental health issue. Maybe that’s the real issue.
October 20th, 2006 at 4:44 pmTruthless – come on down on Nov 8, we’ll be waiting for you with open arms! We really do love you!
October 20th, 2006 at 4:44 pmI love you folks too, just think you are a bit whacky, but we are all God’s children, whacky or not.
October 20th, 2006 at 4:47 pmhttp://www.truthdig.com/ report/ item/ 200601019_after_pats_birthday/
October 20th, 2006 at 4:48 pmNo spinning. Cheney LIED. He was asked why no DIRECT connection has been found and he answered that there was a connection. He distorted the question to fit his answer, his desire to make it appear that there was a direct operational connection. This is a lie.
TruthTeller: and when the Democrats do regain at least the House, will you post here your new, honest screen name (like “Bushiter”)?
October 20th, 2006 at 4:53 pmCheney just knows, in his gut, there is a link. Its his intuition.
/sarcasm
October 20th, 2006 at 5:00 pmHey, I just simply stated that I am joyful in my anticipation of coming here to help you understand why you lost an election and I’ve already been called Truthless and Bushiter, which were witty and comical, I must admit. Some people would consider that a sign of deep and buried anger coming out in a vindictive fashion.
Well anyway, have a great day and try not to get to worked up over things.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:01 pmMay the Lord take a likin to ya’ll.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:11 pmTruthteller, the folks here are already planning their “THE ELECTION WAS STOLEN” propaganda again.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:27 pmbut we are all God’s children, whacky or not.
Comment by TruthTeller
Ehemm…Im a my mom´s and dad´s children. God had nothing to do with that.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:28 pmmuckdog,
October 20th, 2006 at 5:40 pmWell, they won’t have room to complain in AZ now that the 9th Circus Court of Appeals has set aside the legislation that was voted in by the public that requires ID to place your vote. Now even the “dis-enfranchised” Illegal aliens can regester a vote in AZX if the Supreme’s do not over turn the 9th Circus. That should help their base.
DuckMog – Actually we’re planning a little party. It will involve analyzing the 13% differential between the exit polls and the Diebold machine polling place results.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:41 pmCome on down!
There won’t be enough machinations to prevent the 28 seat loss the GOP is staring at in the House. The Senate is too close to call.
PS. Blackwell isn’t going to get away with his purge of democrat voters in Ohio, as provisional ballots will be on hand, or the press will be called to the polling stations that have insufficient provisional ballots. I’d love to see the interview of those polling place officials…
Comment by muckdog — October 20, 2006 @ 5:27 pm
October 20th, 2006 at 5:43 pmYo, That name is so gay…
TT – We don’t want ineligible voters voting in this election. Why do you?
October 20th, 2006 at 5:43 pmBack on track TT – Which parts of Dick Cheney’s lies do you support?
October 20th, 2006 at 5:44 pmTruth Teller, do you believe Dick Cheney? Was there/are there true ties between Al Qiada and Iraq? If there were, where is the evidence that would suggext such a response would be an invasion of another country. If there is evidence to support this show it. then explain the steps this administration did after they decided to invade another country. Show what you are truly behind because right now all I see is little farts in the wind from you.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:46 pmSee, even CantbeCerious resorts to changing you login, as it really seems to be hard for these liberals to conduct a conversation wit a conservative without getting sarcastic fro the get go. WOW!
For the record, my sarcastic name changing (9th Circus), only came after being called TruthLess and Bushiter. I was provoked. LOL
October 20th, 2006 at 5:46 pmT, It’s OK to have some fun with handles, that’s OK. Name Hijacking is another thing. It’s OK to have some fun. Honest. I thought your 9th Circus was great.. But get back on point and answer hellinabucket!
October 20th, 2006 at 5:49 pmCheney didn’t say that Saddam’s regime had a relationship w/ Zarqawi. He said there are “connections” b/t Zarqawi and Iraq. Not the same thing.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:52 pmWhat a clever way to phrase your question CantbeCerious.
I personally do not believe that a known terrorist can just arrive at an Iraqi hospital run by Sadam’s son, injured from the Afgan battlefield, and not have a connection. It is too much of a stretch for me.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:52 pmHate to be a stickler for accuracy, but…
http://intelligence.senate.gov/phaseiiaccuracy.pdf
The data reveal FEW indications of an established relationship between al-Qa’ida and Saddam Hussein’s regime before September 11, 2001. (155)
“FEW indications” does not equal “absolutely no relationship”
October 20th, 2006 at 5:56 pmTT – OK, thanks!
October 20th, 2006 at 5:58 pmFor the record, my sarcastic name changing (9th Circus), only came after being called TruthLess and Bushiter. I was provoked. LOL
October 20th, 2006 at 5:59 pmComment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 5:46 pm
Yay, FIGHT BACK! you sure are a winner…….
#81 and this is the justification of sending hundreds of thousands of troops into Iraq and billions upon billions of dollars? All the while not thinking thru one simple plan after the world’s most mighty army destroys a third world army? Your ok with this? You have no problem putting our soldiers into situations where they become targets and policeman? That wasn’t the mantra when we were in Kosovo. I believe the republicans were shouting we shouldn’t be the world’s police force.
So a hospital visit is worthy of a conflict lasting longer than WWII. Please show me where I am wrong on this because you haven’t proved squat so far.
October 20th, 2006 at 5:59 pmHe said there are “connections†b/t Zarqawi and Iraq. Not the same thing.
Comment by Careful reader — October 20, 2006 @ 5:52 pm
Don’t be ridiculous. We were told Hussein was a ruthless dictator, who held Iraq under his thumb. Nothing moved in Iraq without his consent.
With that understanding, the words “Hussein” and “Iraq” have been used interchangeably by the Bush administration.
You are not fooling anyone.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:03 pmBush today:”The best way to win is go on the offence, and stay on the offence”….
As if we are on the offence in Iraq…
Tony Snow today,”Sounds like cut and run is becoming walk and talk” in response to democrats wanting to have talks with people in the middle east.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:04 pmTo be perfectly honest, I tend to believe that Iraq was invaded by Bush for reasons other that the war on terror. Unlike most of you I believe Bush actually believed that Iraq was a place that harbored terrorist and would supply them with terrible weapons if than chance availed. I believe Bush acted on this, whether bad intelligence was the source or not, from his pure belief that it was right. At least that is what he believed. While I do believe there were terror camps and terrorists in Iraq before the war, in my view I do not believe that was the actual reason for invasion. I think on a subliminal level he was avenging Dad.
Now, knowing I hold this belief, I still believe we are better off having gone down this road. I believe the mindset off these terrorists would eventuall lead them here to attack us in our homeland. I would much rather they sneak into Iraq and fight us there than swim the Rio Grande, and blow up the mini-mart on the corner.
With that said, I believe the Iraqi people, in majority, are glad we are there to help liberate them from dictatorship. I believe they realize that the process to affect change takes a long time and can stomach the transition and violence during this time. On the other hand, I think Americans have a “whats in it for me, fast food mentality” and will buckle under the violence. This is a mistake to me as I see the violence racheting up jsut before our election and see the correlation between the escalation and our election. It seems to be working for the terrorist as you guys here and the biased media seem to be falling into this trap.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:08 pmTT – Evidence shows that in the northern sector, out of Sadaam’s area of influence, there was a Jihadist camp.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:16 pmOne hospital visit by a jihadist, who at the time was hardly a household name, is pretty thin justification.
I think there is more to the Iraqi invasion and occupation that you sense.
Why do 83% of the Iraqis want us out NOW>?
#88
October 20th, 2006 at 6:17 pmYo, where the hell are you form? There are so many mistakes in this one, I’ll clog the blog….(spelling and grammar wise and others)
TT
You have to believe what you believe, otherwise your entire world would come crashing down around you. Poeple often have nervouse breakdowns and suicide when they are faced with the undeniable reality which is contrary to their belief system.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:18 pmI would much rather they sneak into Iraq and fight us there than swim the Rio Grande, and blow up the mini-mart on the corner.
With that said, I believe the Iraqi people, in majority, are glad we are there to help liberate them from dictatorship.
Comment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 6:08 pm
October 20th, 2006 at 6:19 pmTT you aren’t alone in thinking there were other reasons for going into Iraq. My biggest complaint is the way it was done. It was done ont the cheap. No real though on how to get a country on it’s feet. This administration used the worst case scenarios to scare us into believing we had to go into Iraq and used the best case scenarios to fool themselves on how Iraq would be after the invasion.
This is where Bush has failed the united states and this is why I am fighting for the removal of all Republicans and all democrats who either knowingly or unknowingly allowed this to happen. Cafferty is right. They all must go and the next bunch be put on notice.
It’s not a what’s in it for me mentality. It’s a I really don’t want to think about it mentality and this administration loved that. They got to decide.
No more.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:19 pm“I would much rather they sneak into Iraq and fight us there than swim the Rio Grande, and blow up the mini-mart on the corner.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:21 pmWith that said, I believe the Iraqi people, in majority, are glad we are there to help liberate them from dictatorship.”
Comment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 6:08 pm
Now can anyone please tell this dumbass what is wrong with this statement….?
83% is a poll # that could be skewed by many factors when taken from people in a country that fears reprisals from insurgents. I believe based on the word of mouth from family members and personal friends that have volunteered and sent over as reservists, that the majority of Iraqi’s think differently than what your poll says. I have personally talked to 17 people close to me that have been in Iraq and only one has said that they believe what you state.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:21 pmTT – I truly pity your fear based mindset. I agree that we must be vigilant (spend some real money) on keeping our borders safe. But to live in fear that the jihadist boogeyman is coming to get us, and to use that as an excuse to invade and occupy Iraq is absurd.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:21 pmBy the way, can you tell us exactly when the excuse “get them over there before they get us here” was introduced by this administration???
TT – OK, show me your poll that contradicts it?
October 20th, 2006 at 6:23 pmAnother new poll, scheduled to be released today by the Program on International Policy Attitudes at the University of Maryland, found that 71 percent of Iraqis questioned want the Iraqi government to ask foreign forces to depart within a year. By large margins, though, Iraqis believed that the U.S. government would refuse the request, with 77 percent of those polled saying the United States intends to keep permanent military bases in the country.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:29 pmTT – I don’t doubt the veracity of your relatives and friends. I salute their service.
But, they may or may not have been in a position to know the attitudes of the average Iraqi on the street…
Dick is a dick is a dick. Nothing intelligent comes out of his mouth. I honestly believe he thinks if he says it enough times, he will believe it and so will others. Unfortunately, as observed in this thread, there are those who do believe him. BAAAAAHHH! Go drink the kool-aid, go on, it’s good for you!
October 20th, 2006 at 6:29 pmhellbucket, I’ll buy that as what one believes makes up that person and he or she lives with that decision, but for me, I seriously believe Bush acted from his belief and heart, not intending deceit. Wether he was wrong or right in the long run, I do not believe him to be the devil liar as painted by some.
ForTruth, as for you, you show the true face behind your hate by accessing my mental state just because of what I believe. I am quite sane and have my wits about me and have taken long looks at what I choose to believe. Some would say it typical of and extreme liberal to get vitriolic when opposing views are expressed. Suicide would never be for me as I love life, myself and family far too much to even waste more than this time in response to you!
October 20th, 2006 at 6:33 pmRUCerious, I am not in fear, just think it better that the terrorist come out of their holes over ther. Thats not fear! Thats is a realist view I choose to see this by.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:35 pmGreen, again, you portray anger or some seeded hostility when commenting on others beliefs. Your showing your true self when you offer your thoughts in this manner.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:38 pmThank some of you for the comments that form your beliefs, and no thank you to those who choose to hate because of them.
My daughter wants some attention and help on the guitar, so I bid farewell til next time.
Remember, don’t hate for a belief or your no better than the worst of us and may the Lord take a likin’ to ya’ll!
October 20th, 2006 at 6:43 pmNo link. Period. 9/11 Commission. Cheney is brain dead.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:47 pmForTruth, as for you, you show the true face behind your hate by accessing my mental state just because of what I believe. I am quite sane and have my wits about me and have taken long looks at what I choose to believe. Some would say it typical of and extreme liberal to get vitriolic when opposing views are expressed. Suicide would never be for me as I love life, myself and family far too much to even waste more than this time in response to you!
Comment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 6:33 pm
Hey buddy, go take your God Damn Bible thumping, self- richeous, condescending, I am above thou, and don’t have to respond, A$$; and pack it in. Get the hell out of this site with this, “I can’t argue with you” Sh!t… Our anger comes from your ineptitude and piety and minimizing of major problems. And of course you play (pout, pout) victim:( boo hoo:)
October 20th, 2006 at 6:50 pmSkip it,,, get the f#ck outta here…
and may the Lord take a likin’ to ya’ll!
Comment by TruthTeller
Um, after supporting a war of choice, that has killed hundreds of thousands, You’d better be more concerned about the lord likin’ ya’ll.
Have a good weekend.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:51 pmThank some of you for the comments that form your beliefs
October 20th, 2006 at 6:57 pmComment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 6:43 pm
This guy is an ass-hat. Hey slappy, beliefs don’t come from the comments, the comments come from the beliefs…. can you dig it….
and may the Lord take a likin’ to ya’ll!
October 20th, 2006 at 7:00 pmComment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 6:43 pm
and may you take a likin to my teabag…
TruthTeller sounds just like Tom DeLay when he starts boo-hooing…
October 20th, 2006 at 7:03 pmRemember, don’t hate for a belief or your no better than the worst of us and may the Lord take a likin’ to ya’ll!
October 20th, 2006 at 7:10 pmComment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 6:43 pm
I gave my love a cherry….bla bla bla..
It’s all about perspective with regards to comments to beliefs to comments. As far as Ren is concerned, you are nothing but a hater and it is sad that see others in life with such hate. I for one am glad I do not have to live my life in the nature you do with such anger, I do pity you though, even if you dont want it or think it to be “condecending”. As far as thinking I am better than another, when did I say that? YOU put those words to pen, I didn’t. No person is better than another and all I did was state my views on certain subjects, that’s it. You came at me with the a firey tounge, and attacked me simply for what I believe. How does that make you different than those who rage against or kill all, not just believers in God, that have only a belief that differs. I chose not to converse with haters and that was all, my choice, but it does not make be better than others. It just means I do not wish to confront someone who speaks from a posiyion of nothing but this anger as whats the point? Get you riled up enough to call me more names.That’s not for me sir, So mtake your hateful self “outa here”.
In addition, I’m not a “victim” as you put it, just a minority view on this blog that simply tried to voice my thoughts. Apparently you have issue with such things or differences of opinion and have no respect for what others believe. I thought you were supposed to be tolerant when you proffes your liberalism. Hmmm?
October 20th, 2006 at 7:17 pmIt actually suprises me when a conservative comes in here and is rude to you or acts in the “REN” manner you folks appeal to your Savior Judd to block that person. How about Ren asking me to take a likin’ to his BALLS.
Whatever, it’s your site and you ultimately have to live with this person and his “ass-mouth”. Try not to choke on the turds as you try to let them flow profusly from your mouth REN! I’m not so holy as you would believe, to not call you for what you are REN! Hating Prick!
There, you understand it in those terms REN!
October 20th, 2006 at 7:25 pmGeez!
October 20th, 2006 at 7:27 pmTo be perfectly honest, I tend to believe that Iraq was invaded by Bush for reasons other that the war on terror. Unlike most of you I believe Bush actually believed that Iraq was a place that harbored terrorist and would supply them with terrible weapons if than chance availed. I believe Bush acted on this, whether bad intelligence was the source or not, from his pure belief that it was right. At least that is what he believed. While I do believe there were terror camps and terrorists in Iraq before the war, in my view I do not believe that was the actual reason for invasion. I think on a subliminal level he was avenging Dad.
Now, knowing I hold this belief, I still believe we are better off having gone down this road. TT
But Bush ignored the intelligence:
Iraq’s Alleged Al-Qaeda Ties Were Disputed Before War
Links Were Cited to Justify U.S. Invasion, Report Says
By Jonathan Weisman
Washington Post Staff Writer
Saturday, September 9, 2006; Page A01
A declassified report released yesterday by the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence revealed that U.S. intelligence analysts were strongly disputing the alleged links between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaeda while senior Bush administration officials were publicly asserting those links to justify invading Iraq.
Far from aligning himself with al-Qaeda and Jordanian terrorist Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, Hussein repeatedly rebuffed al-Qaeda’s overtures and tried to capture Zarqawi, the report said. Tariq Aziz, the detained former deputy prime minister, has told the FBI that Hussein “only expressed negative sentiments about [Osama] bin Laden.”
The report also said exiles from the Iraqi National Congress (INC) tried to influence U.S. policy by providing, through defectors, false information on Iraq’s nuclear, chemical and biological weapons capabilities. After skeptical analysts warned that the group had been penetrated by hostile intelligence services, including Iran’s, a 2002 White House directive ordered that U.S. funding for the INC be continued.
It’s hard to believe TT would willfully ignore the obvious.
Bush knew it was crap, and using these “Curveball” types enabled him to claim “plausible deniability,” saying he was only going on “the best intelligence available,” when in fact he was ignoring that intelligence.
At least Bush learned the most valuable lessons of Iran/Contra.
” I believe Bush acted on this, whether bad intelligence was the source or not, from his pure belief that it was right. ”
The dead of Iraq can no longer be used as political tools for conservatives, whose hands are drenched in their blood. Jesus Wept.
October 20th, 2006 at 7:31 pm#100
Oh my godness, you still believe in killing half of million ppl is right thing? Let’s agree he did it from his belief and heart. Then I want to say it was Lucifer’s job. Lucifer told him did that. And you, you’re listening Lucifer, aren’t you? You love life , yourself and your familly, pls think about many ppl lost their lifes and their famillies for nonsense things. It is a Lucifer’s job.
October 20th, 2006 at 8:02 pmrevealed that U.S. intelligence analysts were strongly disputing the alleged links between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaeda while senior Bush administration officials were publicly asserting those links to justify invading Iraq.
Still, known terrorists “were” in Iraq. Whether known to Sadam (likely), or not, they were there and were fleeing there from the original battlefield “war on terror” in Afghanistan. I do believe that just after 911, Bush did state no country would be safe if harboring terrorists.
Hussein repeatedly rebuffed al-Qaeda’s overtures and tried to capture Zarqawi, the report said. Tariq Aziz, the detained former deputy prime minister, has told the FBI that Hussein “only expressed negative sentiments about [Osama] bin Laden.â€
You would choose to believe a former lackey of Sadam Hussein that hade an oportunity to rebuke the beliefs of the administration that was responsible for the downfall of his previous “more luxurious than most Iraqi’s” lifestyle.
After skeptical analysts warned that the group had been penetrated by hostile intelligence services, including Iran’s, a 2002 White House directive ordered that U.S. funding for the INC be continued.
There will always be an opposing analysis of any position taken by some. In the case of the INC, would it have been better to ignore “all” the information from these defectors and classify it as suspect and biased. Not all information provided from the INC defectors was found erroneous. In the inntellegence community there will always be information that is suspect or planted in the attempt to enable a certain outcome.
I “willfully believe” that the leader of the most powerful country in the world would not purposely reject information that would possibly change his decision making process.
The dead of Iraq can no longer be used as political tools for conservatives, whose hands are drenched in their blood. Jesus Wept.
The dead in Iraq are definately being used as a political tool, by those who differ in opinion from the current adminstration, trying to foster resentment and hate among the populous, in an attempt to divide the country and gain power politically! Jesus wept again.
October 20th, 2006 at 8:07 pmyangho, I believe we are fighting evil, be it whatever devil you wish to evoke, or the evil in man. I have lost one close to me in this battle and miss him dearly, but hold close the fact that my friend only joined the military “after” 911, voluntarily, to go and try to rid the world of this evil that was threatening us all. So do not try to explain to me loss some feel over this.
So is Lucifer fighting himself or in your view did whatever God you do or do not believe in, tell these Islamic Extremist to fight this battle against the free people of the world?
October 20th, 2006 at 8:13 pmI do believe that just after 911, Bush did state no country would be safe if harboring terrorists.
So why didn’t we invade Saudi Arabia, where 18 of the hijackers originated?
You would choose to believe a former lackey of Sadam Hussein that hade an oportunity to rebuke the beliefs of the administration that was responsible for the downfall of his previous “more luxurious than most Iraqi’s†lifestyle.
And you would choose to believe a leader who attacked another country, costing the lives of hundreds of thousands, because “he tried to kill my dad?” None of the other rationalizations hold water.
Still, known terrorists “were†in Iraq. Whether known to Sadam (likely), or not, they were there and were fleeing there from the original battlefield “war on terror†in Afghanistan. I do believe that just after 911, Bush did state no country would be safe if harboring terrorists.
“In” the Kurdish areas, not under Saddam’s control.
Do you tell yourself that to cleanse the dead from your conscience?
Not all information provided from the INC defectors was found erroneous.
Link?
The dead in Iraq are definately being used as a political tool, by those who differ in opinion from the current adminstration, trying to foster resentment and hate among the populous, in an attempt to divide the country and gain power politically! Jesus wept again. Comment by TruthTeller
What do you mean by “Jesus wept again?” Please explain. Or can you?
Your side were the ones who first used the Iraqi dead for political purposes, and if you don’t know it you’re being willfull ignorant again. Don;t you think conservatives come to the terrorism debate with decades of blood on their hands? If not, willful ignorance.
October 20th, 2006 at 8:38 pmJesus Christ you f#cking retard….. yawnnnnnnnnnnn TruthSeller!!!!!!!
October 20th, 2006 at 8:39 pmTruthTeller, your name, and your posts sound like Orwellian doublespeak.
“No country would be safe if harboring terrorists.” Yet members of al Qaeda have been and are on American soil. Does that mean Bush harbors terrorists? By your logic, it does. By Cheney’s logic, it does.
Members of the Mafia have been and are on American soil. Does that mean Bush has connections to organized crime? According to you and Cheney, yes.
Members of various gangs have been and are on American soil. Does that mean Bush harbors gangs, and has gang connections? Again, yes.
Murders, rapists, pedophiles, drug lords….every kind of criminal imaginable have been and are in America. Bush has connections with all of them. So does Cheney, Rumsfeld and Rice. So do you. So do I.
In fact, if Einstein is correct in his theory of relativity, all matter is energy and all energy is matter: all is connected.
You have undertaken the necessary mental gymnastics to find a way to justify the unjustifiable. The consequences of that kind of thought processes has been to justify the MURDER of approximately 655,000 INNOCENT CHILDREN, WOMEN, AND MEN.
I, for one, would like to see the truth come out. Will you join me in calling for an International War Crimes Tribunal to completely investigate this Administrations actions in initiating and prosecuting a war of aggression, mankind’s most heinous crime? Such a tribunal would either convict or exonerate this Administration. I can live with its judgment, can you?
October 20th, 2006 at 8:41 pmI “willfully believe†that the leader of the most powerful country in the world would not purposely reject information that would possibly change his decision making process.
To influence the Mid-terms of ‘02, you bet their lives he would. He had a hard-on for Iraq before coming into office, and he was quick to exploit the feelings Americans felt after 9/11. Why did the war resolution have to be voted on before the mid-terms? Why couldn’t it have waited for a month? Because Bush knew he could capitalize on the memories of the dead of 9/11, and push through his agenda by questioning the patriotism of all who complained. The Dems folded – much to their everlasting shame – with only a few shining examples of real patriotism.
Ask yourself, TT: if a democratic president had done all this, would I be so sanguine?
October 20th, 2006 at 9:00 pmRen, you’re a real psychotic piece of work. Still no coherent comment from your neanderthal “ass-mouth”. I bet your parents are real proud of the foul mouthed and hateful member of society they failed in raising.
Lord, what a complete jerk you are.
I know a guy named Seth in Boulder, Colorado that has no friends that has the same hateful, vitriolic and unpleasant disposition as you. I can refer you to him and you two can foul mouth the world together til the day you die. Oh yeah, he has been diagnosed with a “real” mental disorder, but you sure sound alot like him. I even think he posts here from time to time. He may just be the friend you need to feel complete and validate your pathetic attitude.
Barfly, I would welcome any War Crimes Tribunal to investigate the administration. With that said, I believe it would be very difficult to find impartial individuals to head this tribunal. This whole, your evil and I’m right mentality from both sides, has gone global with everyone taking a side. Just look to Chavez getting cheered by some folks after calling Bush the devil.
Most people, and probably the Bush administration, would consider even allowing yourself to be investigated by such a body gives the impression of some sort of wrong doing, just by being investigated in the first place. I myself, believe the opposite. I relish the opportunity to explain my actions and views to expound on the reasons and causes for my actions.
Who knows, maybe someday you’ll get your wish and the outcome of such an inquisition just may change your opinion of Bush, the man and President.
Woo Hoo, just came over wire, the Supreme Court just reversed the 9th Circus Court of Appeals decision to block the polls in Arizona from asking for ID to place your vote.
October 20th, 2006 at 9:25 pm[...] read more | digg story [link] [...]
October 20th, 2006 at 9:42 pm[...] It really isn’t a stretch for John Doolittle to spin the fantasy insistence that WMD will still be found in Iraq when the Vice President is still shopping around the completely disproven Sadam Hussein / Zarqawi link. [...]
October 20th, 2006 at 9:47 pm#122 finally got some emotion out of you you pathetic wuss… what a flat line you are, surprised I got that out of you and you obviously had to end it with a diatribe on psychotherapy via myself being friends with one of your moron friends. I hear there is a job packing bags and or pushing carts down at wallmart for ya, cause that is the limit for your intellect, ass-clown…
October 20th, 2006 at 10:04 pmI just read the opinion. There is no final judgment on the merits, but the Supreme Court did hand a tactical victory to those who wish to disenfranchise otherwise eligible voters. Merely change the rules and implement the change too close to an election for the courts to have a full hearing on the constitutionality of the law. The law may ultimately be held unconstitutional, but another election will have passed, ostensibly keeping THE PARTY in power.
Is the march to a Fascist State really something to cheer about?
October 20th, 2006 at 10:06 pm#126 Briseadh na Faire, nice one….glad to see someone on the job checking out the facts….
October 20th, 2006 at 10:09 pmFor your information I live in AZ and voted for the proposition that required ID to register to vote two years ago. So get your facts straight. The requiremnet to show ID was not voted in just before the election. Just the opposite is true. The Democrats filed the appeal recently with the 9th Circus, just before this years election to affect the vote for their benefit by allowing no ID check to vote.
ostensibly keeping THE PARTY in power.
Another fact not checked so well. Arizona has a Democrat Governor and she was pushing this appeal to the 9th Circus in the past few months. Why wait til now? Interesting. She is our former Attorney General and knows howto work the system by appealing the voter passed legislation to the San Fransisco High Court at just the right time.
Is the march to a Fascist State really something to cheer about?
No, but having a system that makes sure one is actually an “AMERICAN CITIZEN” before allowing them to be involved in the decision making process of this country is actually a sane thing. This privelidge is for those who earned the right by paying taxes, obeying this countries sovereignty and laws, becoming citizens the proper way and having the “RIGHT” to do so. Calling THAT disenfranchising the illegal aliens and I’ll agree!
#126 Briseadh na Faire, nice one….glad to see someone on the job checking out the facts….
Comment by ren — October 20, 2006 @ 10:09 pm
Your still an IDIOT Ren, for not verifying what Briseadh posted before commenting.
LOL!
October 20th, 2006 at 10:36 pmRen, every party needs an ASS-PUPPET like yourself to mouth the party line and hurl insults, all the while secretly enjoying you love the hand of your master thoroughly up your “puppet hole”.
October 20th, 2006 at 10:39 pmren, thanks. Just doing what I can to help.
In other news:
Bush said voters need to ask: “Which political party has a strategy for victory in this war on terror?’ ”
Well, it certainly isn’t the Republicans. Thus far, all Bush has demonstrated is a strategy for creating more terrorists.
And how can anyone have a strategy for defeating a tactic?
Terror is a tactic. It is using random acts of violence and destruction to create fear and motivate people to want to change their government.
A “terrorist” may be an individual, or belong to a group of individuals, or even be a government.
The ONLY way to defeat terror is through enlightenment. Thus far, the only political party to promote this strategy for victory has been the Natural Law Party:
Before you ridicule such thinking, reflect on this: this is the same path to peace as has been suggested by Buddah and Christ.
October 20th, 2006 at 10:44 pmHey Judd, is it OK to rachet it up for Ren when defending myself against his pathetic attempts to get me “emotional”? Just wondering as I want to be able to stick around and visit from time to time, at the same time I would like to defend myself in a manner close to Ren’s black heart. Just wondering. I do not want him to be able to get me booted just by responding in kind seein as I am the odd man out on this site.
October 20th, 2006 at 10:49 pmMost people, and probably the Bush administration, would consider even allowing yourself to be investigated by such a body gives the impression of some sort of wrong doing, just by being investigated in the first place. I myself, believe the opposite. I relish the opportunity to explain my actions and views to expound on the reasons and causes for my actions.
Who knows, maybe someday you’ll get your wish and the outcome of such an inquisition just may change your opinion of Bush, the man and President.
The evidence by this time is overwhelming; anyone who thinks differently is being willfully ignorant. Impeachment is what awaits Mr. Bush, so that we can show the world that we haven’t totally relinquished our belief in the rule of law. War crimes trials would be a distraction from putting our own house in order.
It’s clear by your rhetoric that you are only interested in conservatives’ ducking responsibility. Don’t you agree that conservatives have to answer for the blood on their hands? For arming both terrorists and brutal dictators?
You haven’t answered the question I posed about Jesus; you obviously don’t know what “Jesus wept” actually means, do you?
Look it up.
October 20th, 2006 at 10:55 pmWhat about those Arizona facts Ren, feeling pretty f-in pathetic now aren’t ya!
SQWAAAAAK – SQWAAAAAK, Renny want a cracker?
Ren is now this sites mascot puppet, in parrot form, with Noam Chomsky’s hand planted firmly in his puppet hole, cursing and repeating every lie ever told to him.
I’ve got a mental pcture of that and it is quite frightening and at the same time, HILARIOUS!!!!!
October 20th, 2006 at 10:58 pmTT, learn how to read. I didn’t claim that Arizona used a particular tactic, I stated a tactic that would work to disenfranchise otherwise eligible voters, based upon a reading of the Supreme Court decision you refered to.
Ren has seen my posts before. There are those who have come to trust what I write. Who are you to criticize someone for trusting what I post? Such trust takes time to build, and can only be maintained by being continually trustworthy. Can you aspire to such standards? If you are not so trusted, will you look to yourself for the reason why?
The Supreme Court in the above case merely decided to not bar the law from being enforced pending a full hearing on the facts. The problem is two-fold: how do you prevent people from voting who are not eligible to vote, and how do you allow people to vote who are eligible to vote, but lack the ability or resources to provide the required identification. Case in point: many U.S. Citizens lost every bit of identification, and their birth records were likewise destroyed as the result of hurricane Katrina. Should they also lose their right to vote?
October 20th, 2006 at 11:00 pmOh my godness, fight with evil doesn’t mean we allow to put million ppl in misery lifes or deaths. I sorry about your loss, but I don’t think your love one understand what’s happening. Why we fight at Iraq? It is not for 9/11 for your love one. Even GOD start to worry that his children’re too furious to lose their humanity and mind. I feel bad that you’re thinking those ppl should die for your pleasure.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:01 pmHey Judd, is it OK to rachet it up for Ren when defending myself against his pathetic attempts to get me “emotional�
October 20th, 2006 at 11:07 pmHey, Tooth Smeller, Looks like you are pretty emotional to me…ahhhhh, success again….
I’ve got a mental pcture of that and it is quite frightening and at the same time, HILARIOUS!!!!!
Comment by TruthTeller
2,700 Americans dead for a war of choice.
I’m laughing my ass off.
Do you feel no shame at the dead you are responsible for? For the crippled, who will curse America’s name, and spit on our legacy? For the Americans who have yet to die? You cannot escape final retribution.
“I relish the opportunity to explain my actions and views to expound on the reasons and causes for my actions. ”
Tell it to St. Peter. Convince him of the rightness of your cause, and methods. Perhaps Karl Rove can give you some really effective talking points!
Do you come here for absolution? We have none to offer you.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:11 pmMerely change the rules and implement the change too close to an election for the courts to have a full hearing on the constitutionality of the law
Your own statement proves otherwise. Spin in however you wish. Still reads the same to me. Leave yourself wiggle romm by not being too specific is how I see it. Any good debater will do that.
Case in point: many U.S. Citizens lost every bit of identification, and their birth records were likewise destroyed as the result of hurricane Katrina. Should they also lose their right to vote?
By all means no. Every US citizen should be allowed to vote. Diligence of those affected like the stated Katrina victims would allow those who wish to take part in the voting procces can acquire the necessary ID to do so. For those who sit on their rears and do nothing to help themselves through such a disasterous time, and then cry disenfranchisment, get what their lack of helping themselves deserve, lose the ability to show your voice and vote. It’s been a year. Any one of those folks could get the necessary paperwork to fix that situation in that time, if they had decided that voting was a prority for them.
In Arzona, there is a built in net for those who are too old, too lazy or have many of the disenfranchise arguments. You definately have to prove you are an American Citizen when you register. But a the polls, you only need to show two forms of ID if you have no drivers licsense, social security card an American passport. Utility bills, rent statements or similar documents that show you actually live in the voting district and are who you say suffice. Hell, you need an ID to get a library card, buy cigarettes, and enter bars. Why is it always called unconstitutional or disenfranchising to ask for ID to vote? Geez.
There are those who have come to trust what I write. Who are you to criticize someone for trusting what I post? Such trust takes time to build, and can only be maintained by being continually trustworthy.
I apologize to you if you were offended by the fact that I questioned your integrity when stating facts to bolster your argument. That was not my intent. I read them as they were stated and interpreted them as I did. I still think either you intentionally were vague in the statement to give yourself an argument out as I previously stated a good debator will do, or you literally jumped the gun in your assessment of the ruling with regards to Arizona. It happens. I’ve done it.
As far as Ren goes, that person is just an uncouth individual trying to get a rise from me and it worked. In respond in kind with no apologies!
October 20th, 2006 at 11:23 pmTooth Smeller, hey buddy..I’m sorry…. I am so sorry that you suck….Haaaa!
No really, sorry I don’t follow Arizona politics…yaaaawn…
I’ll just go back to this……
October 20th, 2006 at 11:25 pm“I would much rather they sneak into Iraq and fight us there than swim the Rio Grande, and blow up the mini-mart on the corner.
With that said, I believe the Iraqi people, in majority, are glad we are there to help liberate them from dictatorship.â€
What are you talking about?
yangho, I feel bad that you’re thinking those ppl should die for your pleasure.
Your words, not mine. Your sick to assume someone takes pleasure in such things! My pleasure was picturing the ASS PUPPET Ren doing a little dance for the folks here at my expense.
barfly, Tell it to St. Peter. Convince him of the rightness of your cause, and methods.
Iwill as I have always planned to do!
barfly, Do you come here for absolution? We have none to offer you.
Never from you or anyone else except the aforementioned!
October 20th, 2006 at 11:29 pmMaf54:My pleasure was picturing the ASS PUPPET Ren doing a little dance for the folks here at my expense.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:33 pmSaddam killed 182,000 Kurds in one year. I guess that is not consider a WMD by the Stink Progress crowd here. HE WAS THE WMD. We do not consider Kurds human.
Bill Clinton let 800,000 Rwadan be slaughtered.
I think he said he felt their pain and apologized for not doing anything.
NO WMDS found guess in Rwanda.
Of course the USA has killed 40 million unborn children by not accepting them as human. Just like Hitler dehumanized the Jews.
This Stink Progress crowd has one hell of a moral compass.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:35 pmNever from you or anyone else except the aforementioned!
Comment by TruthTeller
Good luck.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:38 pmIf you not pleasure about what happen in Iraq, you should feel bad, or feel wrong about the Bush war. His mistake is not tolerable with me. If it is not his intending deceit , I only say its Lucifer.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:41 pmOK, for the mentally ill, AKA, Ren. I would rather have the worms of the world come out from under their rocks to fight us as they seem to be flocking into Iraq to do, than banging on your rock to ask you to convert just before they blow up your humble abode on our own soil.
With me so far Ass-Mouth?
Now, even with that battle taking place on Iraqi soil, and having the war on terror at their door, I believe that the Iraqi’s are in the most part grateful for the liberation from Sadam Hussein’s dictatorship.
How hard is that to understand?
October 20th, 2006 at 11:42 pmWe more than WMD, we cause 600,000 deaths, and deaths list still stay of the couse.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:44 pmHey SpoofTeller, what is your agenda? You have a decent vocabulary and so do the rest of us…so quit fooling yourself on how “intelligent” you are… our creativity will flush you like a turd. “Why don’t you Come on in for the big Win?”
October 20th, 2006 at 11:45 pmOK, for the mentally ill, AKA, Ren. I would rather have the worms of the world come out from under their rocks to fight us as they seem to be flocking into Iraq to do, than banging on your rock to ask you to convert just before they blow up your humble abode on our own soil.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:47 pmComment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 11:42 pm
Ok, now we’re getting somewhere….now all you have to do is say it in plain F#CKING ENIGLISH!!!!
english obviously…
October 20th, 2006 at 11:48 pm70% Iraqis want we’re out. Let’s see, a guy who have family, job and take coffee, kiss his wife and children and go to work every morning. One day, he lost everything for a mistake WMD or 9/11 thing. You think he dont take a gun and fire at our troop? How hard is that to understand.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:48 pmI believe that the Iraqi’s are in the most part grateful for the liberation from Sadam Hussein’s dictatorship.
How hard is that to understand?
Comment by TruthTeller
Yeah, the sectarian violence is so much better. And the ethnic cleansing does wonders for the whole unity bit. They are talking of partitioning the country – with religious extremists setting up autonomous enclaves, and if that occurs, the Sunnis will do every thing in their power to sabotage the oil facilities, and torch well heads.
Yeah, so much better.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:53 pmI would rather have the worms of the world come out from under their rocks to fight us as they seem to be flocking into Iraq to do, than banging on your rock to ask you to convert just before they blow up your humble abode on our own soil.
October 20th, 2006 at 11:54 pmComment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 11:42 pm
I understand this but I want to do a grapevine and have people explain this to me…. so “take the challenge”…..if you dare…
yangho, If you not pleasure about what happen in Iraq, you should feel bad, or feel wrong about the Bush war. His mistake is not tolerable with me.
Who are you to impose you on others what they should or should not feel bad about. Tolerance levels are affected by perception.
I’m really not sure what you were even stating there in bold as it sounded a little mixed uop there. Wish to restate.
Ren, now you want to try and debate any issue after acting as the ASS PUPPET you have shown yourself to be, Thats all you get from me sicko! Call me now ignoring your twisted, antagonist nature what you want in your next post. I could care less. I will tell you this though. If you were on fire, I would not waste a good piss to put you out, but I would fight and die for your right or any others, to spew the BS that comes from you and act like the ASS PUPPET you doas that is one of the benefits that makes this Republic we live in great.
That is probably the biggest difference between myself and you!
October 20th, 2006 at 11:54 pm#153 Its up to you man. If it dont make you feel wrong, I only say it is Lucifer’s job.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:00 amso quit fooling yourself on how “intelligent†you are… our creativity will flush you like a turd.
I’ve never professed to being more or less intelligent than you or any others. Your words, and the are very telling with regards to you. Figure it out. I would go toe to toe, in person with you any day ASS PUPPET, as I am only confident in my opinions, not professing my intelligence as you suggest!
October 21st, 2006 at 12:01 amOK, for the mentally ill, AKA, Ren. I would rather have the worms of the world come out from under their rocks to fight us as they seem to be flocking into Iraq to do, than banging on your rock to ask you to convert just before they blow up your humble abode on our own soil.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:05 amNow, even with that battle taking place on Iraqi soil, and having the war on terror at their door, I believe that the Iraqi’s are in the most part grateful for the liberation from Sadam Hussein’s dictatorship.
Again….I know what this is…
But I want someone to explain it to me just to verify….
With that said, thanks to all, except the vile Ren, for offering insight to how those on the other side of things, see. While you may not believe it, I have respect for those who offer these opinions without malice. For those who only wish to antagonize, the want to offer a fake dabate, PFFFT!
Talk to ya soon, and may the lord take a likin’ to ya’ll.
Good night.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:06 amYo! Yangho, nice to have you here… I mean no offence to you when I hang sh!t on Spoof Teller’s english.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:08 amand may the Lord take a likin’ to ya’ll!
Comment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 6:43 pm
and may you take a likin to my teabag…
Comment by ren — October 20, 2006 @ 7:00 pm
Man I love that zinger…haaaa
October 21st, 2006 at 12:14 amIwill as I have always planned to do!
Comment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 11:29 pm
This implies you are Christian. Yet you do not follow the teachings of Christ. Instead of turning the other cheek, you have asked Judd if you could respond “in kind” to ren.
Never from you or anyone else except the aforementioned!
Comment by TruthTeller — October 20, 2006 @ 11:29 pm
And so you would seek absolution from St. Peter, and not Christ?
Well, then, perhaps you are Pagan. That would explain why you don’t follow the teachings of Christ. In fact, judging from your posts, you seem to follow much of the tenets expressed in The Satanic Bible. Before you dig youself further into a karmic hell-hole, you might want to check out the 105 Universal Laws.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:16 am#158 Dont worry man. I like your posts.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:18 amTalk to ya soon, and may the lord take a likin’ to ya’ll.Good night.(“Likin”A Chinese provincial tax levied at many inland stations upon imports or articles in transit.”Likin,” which used to be regarded as illegal, as one of the many, “squeezes” imposed by the mandarins, is, in Jamieson’s opinion, just as legal as any other form of taxation- A. R. Colquhoun.)
October 21st, 2006 at 12:21 amComment by TruthTeller — October 21, 2006 @ 12:06 amLi´kin`1.A Chinese provincial tax levied at many inland stations upon imports or articles in transit.
the lord take a likin’ to ya’ll.
Good night.
Comment by TruthTeller
I’m still waiting for the Truth part . . .
As I said before, perhaps you should be giving more thought to your own salvation, Mr. War of Choice supporter.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:23 amthe lord take a likin’ to ya’ll.
Good night.
Comment by TruthTeller
I’m still waiting for the Truth part . . .
As I said before, perhaps you should be giving more thought to your own salvation, Mr. War of Choice supporter.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:25 amBarfly and Yangho, good to do the do and fight the GiantHead.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:30 amI didn’t mean to get vulgar, but it seemed to be the tact that would push this thing to a head with SpoofTeller, so I used it. Good to serve with you…
Jay,
I tend to agree with your assessment. I believe Rove is confident in the outcome of this election with good reason. Diebold machines being just one factor. Republicans counting the vote being another. States passing laws to eliminate exit polls being another. Republican “suppress the vote” activites being yet another.
This election may well be the last chance Americans have to make a non-violent statement for regime change. If they are unsuccessful and their voice is silenced at the ballot box….well…in one of my shamanic journeys I have already seen the entire eastern seaboard of the United States in flames…
As Thomas Jefferson said some 220 years ago, a little rebellion now and then is good for the country. The 1860’s saw the civil war. The 1960’s saw the civil rights movement and associated rioting. I don’t think people will tolerate 60 years of living under a dictatorship to take to the streets again.
And there will be a bit of irony. Many “liberals” who supported gun control legislation may well be arming themselves with assault rifles, thanks to the actions of the “conservative” NRA.
October 21st, 2006 at 4:12 am[...] Just last month, the Senate Intelligence Committee — chaired by Bush-ally Sen. Pat Roberts (R-KS) — concluded that there was absolutely no relationship between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaeda operative Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. Nevertheless, in an interview with a South Bend, Indiana television station yesterday, Vice President Cheney falsely asserted ..read more | digg story Links [...]
October 21st, 2006 at 5:58 am[...] Just last month, the Senate Intelligence Committee — chaired by Bush-ally Sen. Pat Roberts (R-KS) — concluded that there was absolutely no relationship between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaeda operative Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. Nevertheless, in an interview with a South Bend, Indiana television station yesterday, Vice President Cheney falsely asserted ..read more | digg story Links [...]
October 21st, 2006 at 5:58 am[...] VIDEO: Cheney Still Lying About Iraq-Al Qaeda Link Think Progress, DC – 16 hours ago Pat Roberts (R-KS) concluded that there was absolutely no relationship between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaeda operative Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. [...]
October 21st, 2006 at 6:27 amMCCAIN TRASH VIDEO !!
October 21st, 2006 at 7:31 amhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXwPec2stfw
MCCAIN TRASH VIDEO !!
October 21st, 2006 at 7:32 amCLICK MY HOMEPAGE FOR YOUTUBE LINK!
Yeah, sorry to piss all over your party, but this isn’t actually a lie, if you look at it logically.
Cheney said Zarqawi was in Iraq. He never said anything about Zarqawi working with Saddam. Any source you care to look at will tell you that Al Qaeda existed in Iraq. Were they funded, supported, or sheltered by Saddam? No, he hated and feared them. Does that mean they weren’t there? No.
Don’t get me wrong, I think Cheney’s the most evil man on the planet, but he’s not stupid.
October 21st, 2006 at 7:44 amHaha, yeah, you lost me here:
“If the left had a plan (which they say they’re holding on to until after the election) they would have won last time!”
If you think the Democrat party is anywhere near left wing… we’re not living in the same world. ;)
Also…
“dems are emotional and repubs are rational”
I wholeheartedly concur. Republicans generally act now and think later, which is why they presently appeal so much to our current society, which is based on instant gratification. It’s the rationality of the Democrats that’s been losing them popularity, and as a logical extension, it’s the rationality of guys like Chomsky which keeps him from the mainstream media. It’s the irrational hostility of guys like O’Reilly that keep them popular, because we’re currently being moulded to want to please ourselves, the notion of wanting to please everyone, we’re told, is soft, ‘hippy’, and will give the alleged terrorists that all important advantage over us.
October 21st, 2006 at 10:03 amJudd,
someone is censoring out posts which comply with the terms of use. Jay Randall had made some valid comments. My post 166 is in reply to one of his posts which no longer exists. In fact, an earlier post of his asked why bother to vote. I responded to that by stating that voting against this administration was an act of non-violent protest. Both of those posts have been deleted, yet both of those posts complied with your terms of use.
Is somehow impermissible to be critical of a state which uses Diebold Machines?
There is a justified concern over the election process, and that concern will only intensify if a site such as this bans all criticism of that process. If it is possible, please restore Jay’s posts, as they complied with the terms of use.
I’ll be checking back to see if they reappear, but I won’t be posting again until I either see his posts or an explanation of why they were deleted and can’t be replaced.
October 21st, 2006 at 10:41 am172, 173 – for logic, please see my post #120.
October 21st, 2006 at 10:44 amJay,
My reference to “emotional vs. rational” is in itself fact.
The myth that dems are rational is substantiated by one Slick Willy gettin noggin in da oval orfice. If that wasn’t instant gratification, I don’t know what is. Although Monica is one butt ugly excuse for a woman!!!
October 21st, 2006 at 11:00 amJay,
My reference to “emotional vs. rational” is in itself fact.
The myth that dems are rational is substantiated by one Slick Willy gettin noggin in da oval orfice. If that wasn’t instant gratification, I don’t know what is. Although Monica is one butt ugly excuse for a woman!!!
October 21st, 2006 at 11:00 amJay,
My reference to “emotional vs. rational” is in itself fact.
Take a look at John Kerry, “I voted for before I voted against”, or Howard Dean with “the scream”, or Hilary saying it was the Bush adm. that allowed NK to build nukes…gimme a break.
How bout those tax cuts? Were they irrational or emotional? If you own your own biz like I do, my taxes are so low, my CPA can’t even find them, and I’m getting richer by the year and so are my employees. When we were under dem rule, my taxes were so high I had to find shelters just to protect my future. Now I can clearly and openly make a profit…like millions of Americans now can.
The myth that dems are rational is substantiated by one Slick Willy gettin noggin in da oval orfice. If that wasn’t instant gratification, I don’t know what is. Although I’ll admit, Monica is one butt ugly excuse for a woman!!!
And yes, after 911, we do aim first, as we should have done during the last 30 years. We need to be on the offense rather than waiting to be hit again.
We need more clandestine anti-terrorism teams defending us around the World.
Do you disagree with the notion that we may be hit again or do you believe that we should “wait-n-see”?
The simplistic touchy feely side would rather try to negotiate with the terrorists, just like they did with us on 911, or like Madam Dullbright did with the fat little midget in NK, and in the very second they flew those planes into the WTC, the freaking gloves came off, and thank God we had a real man in the White House rather than a John Kerry or Clinton.
Both of which are pissed that they weren’t in office for legacy reasons.
Bush doesn’t give a rat’s ass about legacies.
I keep wondering what it would be like to have to keep my 12 gauge next to my bed at nite to thwart a terrorist attack….I’m being a bit sarcastic, but think about it. What would America look like if we had to look over our shoulder every second. This is exactly what the Europeans are doing after the terrorist attacks there. It’s indisputable that they hit Europe because it is closer to the rats nest and if it were us, you’d be saying, holy Sh#@, where’s my gun.
October 21st, 2006 at 11:24 amFaire post 175 > I am not aware of any of my posts being deleted on this thread? Someone has been hijacking our screennames at times, so perhaps one of those posts was deleted on here? My post about “Georgia Elections Are Fraudulent” is still shown on the ThinkFast thread, and your response to it as well, and then my response to you, then back to me! TP is having some kind of technical problem with posting today > white screens and other stuff too, so a glitch or another cyber attack perhaps?
October 21st, 2006 at 11:26 amThanks, Jay.
I did send a note to Judd on the contact us link as well.
And, first thing in the a.m. …I think I got the threads confused because I see my reply to your thinkfast post here on this thread.
If it’s a cyber attack, it wouldn’t be the first time. But we need to contact Judd whenever something strange goes on so he can keep on top of things to the best of his ability.
Keep up the good work, Jay!
October 21st, 2006 at 11:39 am#179 hey Tim, you’re a typical Republican. It is not wrong with your opinions. But something more …
Tax cut is good for you, and even for me. But if tax cut is cause for suspend social programs, it will be a disaster. You see if some ppl go to poor , they will became criminals. And sooner and later, you sould pay more tax for more polices and prisons. You run a biz , you should know win-win game.
Sure, we should hunt down those bastards. But we also think about why those ppl hate us so much? It is root cause. If we don’t prevent ppl becoming extremists, we’re still under a threat of another 9/11. Terrorism is a thought not human. You kill terrorists, it doesn’t mean you eliminate terrorism.
October 21st, 2006 at 12:52 pmWhat we doing in Iraq? We’re producting more and more anti-American ppl. They’re all good candidate for future terrorists.
Hey Jay
I like your tone! good honest debate without name calling…even though you’re wrong..LOL.
It’s been great. maybe I’ll post later. Lots to do oin a weekend.
Thanks
Tim
PS. being a good Republican or Democrat is better than the alternative.
October 21st, 2006 at 1:02 pmit’s only in this country that the media is so listless that such bluster like cheney can still sway a few people… int’l press is so much more demanding
http://www.miserywatch.com/2006/10/latest_on_rices.html
October 21st, 2006 at 1:15 pmeditor – I agree with your point in #40. The response should be along the lines of “So what?” Ridicule him for bringing up irrelevant matters. “Our soldiers are being dismembered and you’re still talking about Zarqawi being in Iraq in 2000?”
We need to start portraying this guy as bumbling. Calling him evil doesn’t work. Look at his career. He’s screwed up everything he’s ever done.
October 21st, 2006 at 3:11 pmCHENEY is a war criminal profiteer,who the hell would even listen to this totally corrupt regime ever and not know it’s all lies or propaganda ? Half of america is so ignorant they believe anything coming out of all these real life murderers that should be publicly EXECUTED.
October 21st, 2006 at 3:42 pm[...] read more | digg story [...]
October 22nd, 2006 at 1:05 am[...] VIDEO: Cheney Still Lying About Iraq-Al Qaeda Link Think Progress, DC – Oct 20, 2006 Pat Roberts (R-KS) concluded that there was absolutely no relationship between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaeda operative Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. [...]
October 22nd, 2006 at 10:05 amDistance Learning Teachers Having Sex With Students Very Hot School Girls
I can not agree with you in 100% regarding some thoughts, but you got good point of view
March 23rd, 2008 at 2:53 pm