Kondracke Dubs Nancy Pelosi The ‘Wicked Witch Of The West’
Kondracke Dubs Nancy Pelosi The ‘Wicked Witch Of The West’
Fox News host Mort Kondracke, the “left-leaning” counterpart to Weekly Standard editor Fred Barnes on Fox News’ The Beltway Boys, said last night that incoming House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) should be nicknamed the “Wicked Witch of the West.”
According to Kondracke, Pelosi has already been pressuring fellow Democrats, “twisting arms and making — you know, having her aides making threats, and stuff like that.” Asked by Brit Hume if that was really happening, Kondracke said, “Supposedly.” Watch it:
(HT: NewsHounds)
Full transcript:
KONDRACKE: So the history on House leadership is, we had “The Hammer, Tom DeLay, and now we have the “Wicked Witch of the West,” you know, Nancy Pelosi, who is twisting arms and making — you know, having her aides making threats, and stuff like that.
HUME: But was that really happening?
KONDRACKE: Supposedly. That’s, that’s — it got heavily reported, and I have heard no contradictions of that.
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Hi!
November 17th, 2006 at 4:23 pmIS FOX A HOAX?
November 17th, 2006 at 4:23 pmsupposedly someone might even be listening to his flapping mouth. Most likely not.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:24 pmKondracke apparently is not the only liberal who sees that Pelosi is a potential disaster in the making…The New York Times Editorial today read:
Editorial
Speaker Pelosi Tempts Disaster
Published: November 17, 2006
Nancy Pelosi has managed to severely scar her leadership even before taking up the gavel as the new speaker of the House. First, she played politics with the leadership of the House Intelligence Committee to settle an old score and a new debt. And then she put herself in a lose-lose position by trying to force a badly tarnished ally, Representative John Murtha, on the incoming Democratic Congress as majority leader. The party caucus put a decisive end to that gambit yesterday, giving the No. 2 job to Steny Hoyer, a longtime Pelosi rival.
But Ms. Pelosi’s damage to herself was already done. The well-known shortcomings of Mr. Murtha were broadcast for all to see — from his quid-pro-quo addiction to moneyed lobbyists to the grainy government tape of his involvement in the Abscam scandal a generation ago. The resurrected tape — feasted upon by Pelosi enemies — shows how Mr. Murtha narrowly survived as an unindicted co-conspirator, admittedly tempted but finally rebuffing a bribe offer: “I’m not interested — at this point.â€
Mr. Murtha would have been a farcical presence in a leadership promising the cleanest Congress in history. Ms. Pelosi should have been first to realize this, having made such a fiery campaign sword of her vows to end Capitol corruption. Instead, she acted like some old-time precinct boss and lost the first test before her peers.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/17/opinion/17fri2.html
November 17th, 2006 at 4:24 pmWas that in this morning’s daily memo or are these actors ad libbing?
KONDRACKE: Supposedly. That’s, that’s — it got heavily reported, and I have heard no contradictions of that
No one refuted my assertion earlier the world is flat so it is a CONfligrated FACT.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:25 pmNo, sorry. FOX is not a hoax, FOX is a bad joke. But they learned their lesson from the “Wochenschau”, the German NAZI News show from 1939 – 1945.
http://www.shoa.de/wochenschau.html
November 17th, 2006 at 4:27 pmThis excrement along with Kristol will be the last ones dragged off kicking and screaming “I am not obsolete” in which the world will chorus
OBSOLETE!!!!
November 17th, 2006 at 4:29 pmLOL! The Christanic buttf*cks are running scared.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:29 pmSupposedly you’re making things up out of your ass. I also heard something about the Democrat’s “civil war” today.
Not that you’d expect anything less on Fox News as they don’t employ real journalists.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:30 pmSo…she’s acting like Tom DeLay did? Fine by me. DeLay was hugely successful in keeping the House in line behind a solid conservative agenda for a decade.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:30 pmFact is, Kondracke and Barns are gay lover. Until they contridict my assertion, it’s “hump back conservative at Fake News”.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:30 pmBoner passing out cash on the House floor shows class.
DeLay holding a vote open long past the agreed on 15 minutes is fine.
Foley IM’ng Pages is OK until caught.
Hasturd covering Foley’s sick Ass is acceptable.
Frist doing a video diagnosis of a comatose person was worth all the Neosluts flying to Washington during the Holidays, no problem.
Fox News making shit up & calling it news!
Get ready to rrrrrumble, folks! We’ll just have to get used to the name calling, because WE WON THE ELECTIONS!
November 17th, 2006 at 4:30 pmExley,
November 17th, 2006 at 4:31 pmOkay. So how does that article make her into some demon? Explain that please. She said she backed Murtha….he wasn’t voted in. What arm twisitng thug-like actions did she take. Sounds to me she is acting like someone that states what she thinks. Oh yeah. your article is an editorial….always using opinions as facts. Typical.
Exley is dumbfounded, perplexed , and morally puzzled as to why anyone does not goose step in line when a leader makes a position. It is called democracy. An abhorrent and treasonous action to Bush apologists and brownshirts like Exley & Daryll.
You have been banished to your room and to keep your trap shut while we clean up your mess. No computer for 2 years child.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:33 pmWay to get off to a great start, Mort. I’m glad you’ve decided to rise above the petty name-calling and engage in serious civil discourse.
You think you got whupped this time? You’re gonna get your asses kicked from here to kingdom come in ‘08.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:35 pmyou know, Nancy Pelosi, who is twisting arms and making — you know, having her aides making threats, and stuff like that.
That is EXACTLY what I want her to do…
Be the iron fist necessary to rule Congress.
If she isn’t doing this, then I’ll think it’s bad news…
November 17th, 2006 at 4:36 pmPelosi has already been pressuring fellow Democrats, “twisting arms and making — you know, having her aides making threats, and stuff like that.†– - GASP!!!! Pelosi is acting like a politician?!?!
November 17th, 2006 at 4:36 pma little off subject but why do you folks hate Christians
November 17th, 2006 at 4:37 pmExley you sexist asshole…..:) No cigar.
She is a strong woman who will succeed in the jungle of an environment that is the House. Sorry to disappoint. Your macho crap and double standards ( and that goes for your outed “friends” as well ) will not prevail. Nothing she has done can even begin to compare with the corruption, arm twisting, and incompetence of your crew…………Bite it.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:39 pmSorry guys, the link goes to shoa.de a German page about the Third Reich. Unfortunately it is not yet available in English.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:40 pmFrom Wikipedia:
Die Deutsche Wochenschau – (The German Weekly Newsreel) A reel is housed in the Motion Picture Collection of the Harry S. Truman Library, (MP85-1), and includes historic footage of the Allied landings and combat at Normandy France, July 1944, from the Nazi perspective. The reel was captured by US troops. It is a 16 mm, sound, black and white reel that lasts 16 minutes and 49 seconds.
You mean, she’s playing strong Politics? Oh the horror. Suck it Kondracke, you helmet head fruitball.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:40 pmNo big deal. I’m sure that if you checked, you’d find that Kondracke has called previous Speakers – on the rare occasion they might ever have pressured people – Wicked Warlocks. Surely, right?
November 17th, 2006 at 4:41 pmyeah……exley has to quote opinion pieces cause he has no facts to back his last gasp NeoCon bullshit up. The magical thinking era is coming to an end……or didn’t you know Ex?
November 17th, 2006 at 4:41 pmWow, Dlet, you picked up that it was an editorial…That’s pretty impressive. What was your first clue? When I wrote “New York Times Editorial” or when the word “editorial” appeared above the headline? Either way, good job!
Moreover, the editorial does not make her out to be a demon. It makes her out to be politically tone-deaf and having acted l”ike some old-time precinct boss” who “lost the first test before her peers.”
Read it again. Same goes for you, Heterodoxy.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:42 pmGood golly, this politics thing is a rough business. Not the gentleman’s sport that the Grand Old Party plays with its nice white gloves.
Before you scoff, Fox has it on good authority that Democratic leaders — get this — sometimes *pressure* their members to vote a certain way. Egads! The grand democratic experiment truly was dealt a death blow on November 7.
But don’t worry, lectures from proper etiquette Tom Delay and Newt Gingrich are sure to follow. Watch and learn.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:42 pm#19 “She is a strong woman who will succeed in the jungle of an environment that is the House.”
And yet she lost her very first battle in the House….And that was among Democrats. Heh!
November 17th, 2006 at 4:43 pmWRONG…MOR-TAWN….your full of s*** as usual…
November 17th, 2006 at 4:45 pm’supposedly’…the moon is made of green cheese…
I would have to agree, as the speaker of the house, twisting arms, and pressuring the rest of congress is in the job description. It’s what both Delay, and Hastert, and every speaker since the inception of the house of representatives has done.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:45 pmHUME: But was that really happening?
KONDRACKE: Supposedly. That’s, that’s — it got heavily reported, and I have heard no contradictions of that.
So Hume & Kondrake were just sitting there gossiping? WTF?
I have heard no contradictions of the speculation that Hume was fondling Kondrake under the desk during the interview….
November 17th, 2006 at 4:45 pmI guess when Rep. Jim Moran of Virginia noted “they know who told both (Hoyer and Murtha) camps they’d vote for them – and only the freshmen would get a pass’ is not a threat….so is Jim Moran one of the fLYING monkeys???
November 17th, 2006 at 4:46 pmbut why do you folks hate Christians
Comment by Kevin
Some of us because some of you, like you, like to spread cluster bombs over innocent civilians…next.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:49 pmWe need to look into Boehner’s “boners” of passing out checks from lobbyists on the floor of the Senate. Isn’t that considered payola? Blackmail? Definitely corrupt and overtly corrupt.
Let them say what they wish about Pelosi. She’s got more cajones than all of these men worring about their little schemes being outed combined. They know all about “witches” with Coultergeist as their mouthpiece – hah!
I say Pelosi can’t be “witchey” enough – no more nice guy pattacake with these thugs. It’s time the american people get to see these liars, crooks and predator enablers for what they really are. Speaking of which, no doubt Hastert, Alexander, and Boehner will have some answering to do in Foley’s criminal investigation. They’ll be gone so fast due to their enabling behavior and complicity that it won’t be funny.
To coin one of W’s more brilliant statements: Bring ‘em on Pelosi! The american people are waiting to watch the parade of filth being drawn out of their dens.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:49 pmFrankly, I don’t understand all the brouhaha about the Dems having to choose between Murtha and Hoyer and, even if it does mean a difference of opinion among the Dems, why is that so bad? Isn’t the intolerance of the Bush Republicans and their refusal to allow dissent within their party ranks part of the reason our nation is in such a sad state today? I think the Dems are mature and responsible enough to handle a little dissent. After all, if dissent is healthy for democracy, surely it can be permitted within a political party.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:49 pmNo cigar.
LOL! And some times a cigar is just a cigar, rightards.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:49 pmWhat’s the payoff to the media hit-job on Pelosi? Does all this BS actually manifest some advantage for the republicans, or is it just the predictable, pavlovian, angry-white-male response to the first woman speaker?
November 17th, 2006 at 4:50 pmAnd yet she lost her very first battle in the House….And that was among Democrats. Heh!
Comment by Exley
What battle? You really gotta lay off the testosterone pills. She said she backed Murtha. The majority of the Dems wanted a different leader. What battle? It was a civilized vote on leadership. Oh and I wouldn’t throw stones. The Repubs voted in a racist and a man that helped lead them into the dumps for their leadership. Nice choices.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:50 pmAnd that was among Democrats. Heh!
Comment by Exley
I thought you liked democracy so much that you were so eager to spread it even as far as Iraq…with tons of White Phosphorous, just in case…
November 17th, 2006 at 4:51 pm#19, Oh, and by the way the editorial page editor of The New York Times is Gail Collins…So, to call The Times’ editorial “sexist” is inane.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:52 pm:) rolling eyes…..Concentrating on one battle doesn’t get cha there Exley.
Good try. Pubs like Exley will fixate on one aspect of something, blowing it out of proportion, for their own purposes. And they repeat it till they are blue in the face and won’t let go. ……… Hasn’t gotten them or the country very far has it. Our Nation is in shambles, the Pubs are all going to jail, and the Exley’s are still screaming and red in the face.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:53 pmExley, I sense your bitter. Several very telling points were posted in #12 about the previous occupiers of the majority. Rather nasty, petty and unethical acts but not a peep out of you. But let the Democrats hold a vote and your’e all over it like stink on shit.
You know your’e arguments would hold more water if you weren’t so partisans.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:53 pmPoor Kondrack, it a few months he’ll realize that Pelosi has bigger ovaries than he has balls.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:53 pmThis is so ridiculous. The first day of the new congress is not until January.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:54 pm#37, Juan, please don’t get me wrong…I love the way the Majority Leader race turned out. It was most gratifying. Murtha was trounced and Pelosi was made to look weak and ineffective. As The Times pointed out, “Nancy Pelosi has managed to severely scar her leadership even before taking up the gavel as the new speaker of the House.”
November 17th, 2006 at 4:54 pmOf course, Bush horribly lost his first battle too . . . it’s called the Iraq War.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:54 pmIt makes her out to be politically tone-deaf and having acted lâ€ike some old-time precinct boss†who “lost the first test before her peers.â€
Comment by Exley
Okay I read it again and its still someones opinion with no facts like quotes from Dems complaining that she is bullying them for votes or the like. So why would you say that she IS strong arming people with no facts and just opinions from A NYT Editorial and Fox News…both unreliable.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:54 pmI dub Kondracke “The Feckless Felcher of Fox.”
November 17th, 2006 at 4:58 pmI don’t know about you, exley – I was hoping for a Murtha victory. The Progs will bring him out of the box when they need him agian….in much the same way they treat certain constituencies.
November 17th, 2006 at 4:59 pm“Nancy Pelosi has managed to severely scar her leadership even before taking up the gavel as the new speaker of the House.â€
Comment by Exley
I couldnt give a f*ck if thats true. I just want, as 94.5% of world population, to STOP KILLING INNOCENT PEOPLE.
Take the beheaders, try them and be happy…but Im warning you, somehow I know, this wont be the last war…more enemies will come…so you can be much less safe with shadowy, evil, grinning, souless, bad men invented by your government.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:00 pmaww. I hate it when that happens. :) but sure as shootin…. Exley is full of Bull :)
He hangs out here because he wants attention. Another tiringly single minded and repetitive poster. The article in the Times “couldn’t be sexist” because a woman wrote it………..give me a break. ha ha ha
November 17th, 2006 at 5:00 pmLife is so simple for the Exleys.
(Accept that anyone who can hold more than two thoughts in their mind at the same time can see right through truthiness folk like him) .
First off, I’m not a Christian. I don’t think people should be demonized based on there faith. I don’t care if they are Christian, Jew, Muslim, Scientologist, or some other faith. People have a right to worship however and whoever they chose.
I don’t like cluster bombing anyone. But we didn’t start the war.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:02 pmWhy are you folks so quick to assume everyone in a group have the same values? It’s not black and white over here like it is in your dear leader’s world. Then again, I know you know better. Like your dear leader’s brain, you try and seize on any little thing to make a bucket you can dip you big tar brush into. Nice try, troll.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:03 pma little off subject but why do you folks hate Christians
Comment by Kevin — November 17, 2006 @ 4:37 pm
We don’t, we “hate” hypocrites. Unfortunately most hypocrites call themselves Christians.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:04 pmExley, you wingnuts are a trip; you gladly tongue-wash the feet of an administration and congress whose SOP is f**king up everything it touches, yet you seize on this insanely overblown Pelosi story, like it has deep implications. Where have you been during the cavalcade of cabinet appointees who have quit in disgust over the past 6 years?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:04 pm#47, Mighty Aphrodite, The Majority Leader fight among the Democrats was a win-win for the Republicans. If Murtha had won, the Dems’ number two spokesperson would have been an ethically-challenged, less-than-eloquent Congressman (To Murtha’s credit, he is anti-abortion, so that shows some decency and morality on his part)….A Murtha defeat, however, severely weakens Pelosi and makes her look ineffective in her very first test of leadership and earns her even more enmity from her Majority Leader. Like I said, a win-win for the Republicans.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:05 pmComment by Kevin
Really? When did Iraq declare war on the US? What physical act did they do that justified a response of arms?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:06 pmI have heard no contradictions of the speculation that Hume was fondling Kondrake under the desk during the interview….
Comment by Zooey — November 17, 2006 @ 4:45 pm
I just feel so strongly that you’re right that it must be a fact (isn’t that how the right conducts research?)
November 17th, 2006 at 5:07 pmI don’t like cluster bombing anyone. But we didn’t start the war.
Comment by Kevin
Which war? Iraq? If that’s what you meant, I think you should read up on the subject a little more.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:10 pmLOL! And some times a cigar is just a cigar, rightards.
Comment by Fredric L. Rice — November 17, 2006 @ 4:49 pm
No, it must be a sign from god… I mean the Flying Spaghetti Monster… ur, Zeus… hmmm…
November 17th, 2006 at 5:11 pm#49, Don’t be embarassed that you didn’t know the editorial page editor at The New York Times is a woman and that 8 of the 19 editorial board members are women….So, you wrote something without knowing the facts and thus you now look a little ridiculous. No big deal…Just resolve to do better next time. Okay?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:11 pmI have heard no contradictions of the speculation that Hume was fondling Kondrake under the desk during the interview….
Comment by Zooey
See Exley. It’s a fact right? Hume was fondling Kondrake. Wow thanks Zooey for the Editorial. I think its a Fox News Flash…or whatever stupid thing they call it…Zap, Bing, Kaboom….
November 17th, 2006 at 5:13 pm#48, “STOP KILLING INNOCENT PEOPLE.”
Juan, I suggest you direct that plea at your buddies at Al Qaeda.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:13 pmExley is not interested in the subject matter. It’s all about causing a stir and not doing the honest intellectual work it takes to really figure things out. He has an agenda….and that is, a need to defend the killer toons that have run this country into the ground!!!!! End of story….words are just his toys to try to defend these criminals with. He fails of course. He wants to make it easy on himself. He doesn’t look past a certain level of things. Pelosi didn’t get the person she backed…….HEAVEN SAVE US!!! But Bush has broken our country……HO HUM. It’s his team after all….that’s all that matters to the Cons. I have a very real and deep contempt and disgust for people like him because, as they get off on playing their little word games, people are dying, our country is losing it’s soul, we are losing our freedoms, and the Exleys do not care to see it. It’s too hard and too much work for them. That…makes me angry. And they won’t wake up and will not see the true enemies until it is too late…if ever. Meanwhile, they will try to taunt other groups of people with their twisted logic and juvenile world view. It makes me ILL.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:13 pm“Nancy Pelosi has managed to severely scar her leadership even before taking up the gavel as the new speaker of the House.â€
Comment by Exley — November 17, 2006 @ 4:54 pm
Scar? Compared to the pedophilia and corruption of your party, she could do a whole lot worse before anyone even batted an eyelash…
That was just a desperate and pathetic attempt to spin the situation into drama. I figured you would have had enough by now…
November 17th, 2006 at 5:14 pmKevin thinks Scientology is a religion?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:15 pmAs is usually the case, the hacks at Fox simply cannot let little things like facts get in the way of a good smear job.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:16 pmAmerica’s Least Wanted
no. 65 If I look “a little ridiculous”, which of course I don’t, you look like hell…..:)
November 17th, 2006 at 5:16 pmExley: Would you like an example of a win-win for Democrats? Look back at Tuesday, November 7, 2006. The day the American people slapped the Republican party and rejected the conservative movement. SWEET!
November 17th, 2006 at 5:17 pmAsk Spudge_boy
So you hate all Christians for what some do? Spudge_boy is a raciest.
did we start bombing them? I did’t see that on NBC/ABC/CBS or CNN. or FoxNews for that matter.
They did kill a bunch of americans.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:17 pmI don’t like cluster bombing anyone. But we didn’t start the war.
Comment by Kevin
We started it. Let me put into a context you may understand. The US body splashed Iraq from the top rope while Iraq was laying on the mat after being hit in the head by a chair a couple of times. All the while the blood thirsty crowd (the war mongers in this country) were screaming at the top of their lungs hoping the defenseless body would be crushed…..because it was an easy target. Got it?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:19 pmJuan, I suggest you direct that plea at your buddies at Al Qaeda.
Comment by Exley — November 17, 2006 @ 5:13 pm
Al Qaeda killed 3,000 innocent Americans, Canadians and Europeans.
Bush then went and killed 600,000 (and counting) innocent Iraqs that had nothing to do with 9/11.
Clearly, Al Qaeda isn’t the biggest problem.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:20 pm#68 “Exley is not interested in the subject matter.”
Actually, I am quite ineterested in the subject-matter. And that subject is how Pelosi has already damaged her standing as Speaker and Democratic Party leader even before she has spent her first day on the job.
The damage is so great that even the liberal New York Times editorial page took her to task today….You seem to have missed that. Read it again…slowly.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:20 pmJuan, I suggest you direct that plea at your buddies at Al Qaeda.
Comment by Exley
First. My buddies…stupid thing number one. If you wanted to offend me, you failed. I still like you.
Second. I will direct that plea at Al Qaeda anytime. The thing is that it is really hard to talk to them when youre killing so many people. I dont see any progress in raping girls or killing point-blank kids. In fact, I guess Al Qaeda is pretty much happy and strong due to your f*ing mess. Lets see:
Al-Qaeda: 3,000 innocents (if in fact were they, which according to your FBI, it is not the case…but anyway)
US: 600,000 dead civilians.
So who do you think I should target my plea?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:22 pmThey did kill a bunch of americans.
Comment by Kevin
And how many Muslims have died by americans?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:23 pmSo you hate all Christians for what some do? Spudge_boy is a raciest.
Comment by Kevin — November 17, 2006 @ 5:17 pm
Why do you folks hate Muslims?
Comment by Spudge_Boy — November 17, 2006 @ 5:06 pm
They did kill a bunch of americans.
Comment by Kevin — November 17, 2006 @ 5:17 pm
See…
Christian and hypocrite.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:23 pmThey did kill a bunch of americans.
Comment by Kevin
So you hate Native Americans, Japanese, Germans, Spanish, Mexicans, French, Filipinos, Italians, etc. Wow that’s a lot of hate.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:23 pmkevin,
Interesting logic. So the fact that you americans (Christians?) have murdered far more Muslims than Muslims have murdered americans (Christians?) then purports to justify the Muslims killing more americans. An eye for an eye, right?
Peace.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:24 pmUnbelievable, You really should stop citing that discredited and patently absurd 600,000 figure. It undermines any arguments you may have to repeat that myth as fact.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:25 pm#43 Exley
I love the way the Majority Leader race turned out. It was most gratifying. Murtha was trounced and Pelosi was made to look weak and ineffective. As The Times pointed out, “Nancy Pelosi has managed to severely scar her leadership even before taking up the gavel as the new speaker of the House.â€
I guess if we’re going to engage in this over-the-top imagery, it would only be fair to say that the election last week was nothing less than a castration of every Republican in Washington and everyone who voted for them. And I guess when the Senate Republicans split 25-24 to vote for Lott as minority whip, it forced the party into two warring camps. A near deadlock! Oh, how WILL they ever mend the rift between them? There’s simply no hope for the GOP when Senate Republicans are at each other’s throats like that. Won’t Senate Minority Leader McConnell do something?! He’s so limp-wristed and ineffectual. How can he just stand by and watch the ensuing mayhem?! Oh the humanity!!!
Get real, Exley. Nobody’s buying it.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:26 pmAnd that subject is how Pelosi has already damaged her standing as Speaker and Democratic Party leader even before she has spent her first day on the job.
Comment by Exley — November 17, 2006 @ 5:20 pm
I bet Exley calls 911 for an ambulance to take him to the emergency room every time he gets stung by a bee.
Stop creating Mt. Everest out of moles hills when your party was just fired for diddling little boys, accepting bribes, and a host of other unethical behaviors.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:26 pmThe Speaker of the House ought to drop one on Mort.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:26 pmJust know this: Pelosi is very savvy and can handle the media. She knows that what matters is what she delivers to the American people when she becomes Speaker of the House. In the last elections the Repugs tried to hold the Congress by making Nancy the bogeyman; it didn’t work. The ranting from Repugs and their supporters won’t work either.
I don’t know her reasons, but Nancy would not have supported Murtha publicly unless she had to. I trust her completely. She’s my Representative in the House and I’ve seen her deliver every time.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:27 pmSo you hate all Christians for what some do? Spudge_boy is a raciest.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:28 pmRaciest? Does that mean he is the most racist out of all? or did you mean “racey” like in saucy or sexy?
did we start bombing them? I did’t see that on NBC/ABC/CBS or CNN. or FoxNews for that matter.
Really? Where were you March of 2003?
Why do you folks hate Muslims?
Comment by Spudge_Boy — November 17, 2006 @ 5:06 pm
They did kill a bunch of americans.
Umm, no, a fanatical few have killed Americans. But by your logic, you must hate Christians and Gulf War Veterans, because McVeigh plotted and succeeded in the Oklahoma City bombing.
NEXT
..If he only had a brain…
November 17th, 2006 at 5:29 pmOh, dear, dear, dear!
November 17th, 2006 at 5:29 pmJust wait until January when the real power gets going – Pelosi can hold with the best of them. Action not words. GWB/GOP have proven that babble, blather and bluster mean nothing because action isn’t required.
The dems will demonstrate that actions do speak louder than words.
Boy, that sounds like News to me… Seriously, how did this channel get put on the air? AHHHHHHHHHHHHH !!!!
November 17th, 2006 at 5:29 pmyou folks love to hate.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:30 pmJuan…I, of course, still like you too. Our discussions are always (well, almost) always entertaining and educational. Of course, I was being hyperbolic. However, you employ the same tactic when you state that I support “war criminals” and “baby-killers” or the killing of innocent people. So I simply fight fire with fire.
As with “unbelievable,” I would suggest you stop citing the now-discredited 600,000 figure. Talk about hyperbole. No one believes that figure and it has been utterly undermined and exposed as a myth. Citing it undermines whatever credible arguments you may have.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:30 pmWe have to face the fact that ANY female who represents the Democratic party will be labed b*tch or witch or some other shrew-like moniker by the rethugs. Every one of their policies has failed during the last six years, name calling is all they have left.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:33 pmmr. kondrake is flailing about in his freshly ordained irrelevance. He is going to throw out whatever inflammatory comments he can think of in an attempt to get recognition (like this thread) so as to restore himself (at least in his mind) to a position of influence. I don’t buy it. No one here should buy it.
Regarding all of these attempts to attack Ms. Pelosi and discredit her before she has even taken up her position as Speaker of the House, it only goes to show how fearful the attackers are. Interesting how much Ms. Pelosi is stirring things up considering she hasn’t even gotten started yet. This should be interesting.
Peace.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:35 pmYou really should stop citing that discredited and patently absurd 600,000 figure. It undermines any arguments you may have to repeat that myth as fact.
Comment by Exley — November 17, 2006 @ 5:25 pm
It’s not a myth Exley, Queen of Denial…
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6040054.stm
But I could stand to laugh some more, so pray-tell us what you think the death toll of Innocent Iraqis is. If you say 30,000, we’ll know you haven’t updated your statistics since Bush ignorantly offered that number last year.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:36 pmSpudge_boy is a raciest. – - I think he means you’re the most racy.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:37 pm#92
you folks love to hate.
Not me. I hate to love. And I’m not happy unless I’m miserable.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:37 pmI think this thread is about the despicable reaction our media has had to Pelosi becoming Speaker. Again, Nancy Pelosi is the first female Speaker of the House and our media has acted like that’s not important. Exley even rushed to his computer to post a NYT article diminishing her accomplishment. Right, Exley, this supposedly liberal publication is not that excited about the first female Speaker of the House in history. Thanks to Exley for adding weight to the liberal argument that there is no real “liberal media.”
And Kevin is deeply troubled by any animosity he might find here for christians and then posts this nugget: “I don’t like cluster bombing anyone. But we didn’t start the war.”
Get it people? We didn’t start the war. Kevin, wtf are you talking about???!!
November 17th, 2006 at 5:38 pmThese assclowns better watch out or some flying monkeys will be buttf**king them real soon!
November 17th, 2006 at 5:39 pmCiting it undermines whatever credible arguments you may have.
Comment by Exley
So, how many dead civilians have died since the beginning of the war, Ex?
Besides, lets say its not true…it is still abominable.
I dont understand, you are so worried about numbers, right? Why shouldnt I look at your 3000 dead citizens as almost nothing in comparison with the a hell lot more than that!
November 17th, 2006 at 5:39 pmunbelievable: Exley doesn’t trust any media outlet that isn’t owned by a large American corporation.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:39 pmyou folks love to hate.
Comment by Kevin — November 17, 2006 @ 5:30 pm
Keep showing us what a Christian hypocrite you are Kevin…
Jesus said that you should turn the other cheek.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:39 pmKevin – Waaaahhh – you folks love to hate!
November 17th, 2006 at 5:40 pmNo Kevin, now wash up, or you’ll not get a bite to eat!
No one believes that figure and it has been utterly undermined and exposed as a myth. Citing it undermines whatever credible arguments you may have.
Comment by Exley — November 17, 2006 @ 5:30 pm
Says the person who, almost religiously, believes Kerry was demoralizing the troops, when in fact, he was slammin’ George W (been proven again and again)
November 17th, 2006 at 5:43 pmBe careful about throwing that first stone, there, Exley (or, as Pink Floyd said “Careful with that axe, Eugene!)
But we didn’t start the war.
Didn’t Bush say that once? “I didn’t start the war.” YES YOU DID!
November 17th, 2006 at 5:43 pmCiting it undermines whatever credible arguments you may have.
Comment by Exley — November 17, 2006 @ 5:30 pm
I heard you the first time. And I posted the results of a John Hopkins study that validates 655,000 deaths actually…
But keep denying the reality of the occupation of Iraq. It’s the only way you can justify supporting a dictator more barbarian than the one you claimed to have removed in the name of your “morals”. The hypocrisy is staggering…
November 17th, 2006 at 5:44 pmKevin: “you folks love to hate…”
Hey Kevin, how many liberals hold up signs saying, “God hates fags”?
How many liberals have you seen holding up a sign saying “I hate the Dixie Chicks”?
When conservative Glen Beck declared, “I hate Michael Moore so much I’d like to kill him,” was he channelling liberals?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:44 pmunbelievable: Exley doesn’t trust any media outlet that isn’t owned by a large American corporation.
Comment by Bluedog49 — November 17, 2006 @ 5:39 pm
Yes of course.
Though, it does cite a very reputable American University (Johns Hopkins) in the article…
November 17th, 2006 at 5:47 pmcan someone please get Kevin a prostitute named “Gary” and some crystal Meth to release some of that anger?
November 17th, 2006 at 5:48 pm#108, DRxJ, I see that you have bought into Kerry’s desperate damage-control spin on his insulting of our troops, but alas you are one of the few. No one believed that he was really trying to insult Dubya. Everyone knew that in mocking our troops he was speaking what was in his heart. Even Kerry recognized that and eventually apologized for his insult. And for that I give him credit.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:51 pm[...] So Mort Kondracke has called Nancy Pelosi, and she is not even in power, yet. Witches are scary creatures, and women in power are very much like witches. How nice that there is no need to remind any of us what witch rhymes with. [...]
November 17th, 2006 at 5:52 pmFor the Bushbots because Bush said it means it isn’t true. Bush doesn’t cite anyone to discredit the study, he just alleges it has been discredited.
That is just what the Bush worshippers do, repeat his inane falsehoods as though they are truths.
When there was talk of “privatizing social security” that scared many senior citizens, so Frank Luntz did a focus group and voila’, Bush starts talking about “personal accounts”.
When there was talk of “domestic spying” Bush changed the words to “terrorist surveillance program” and his mindless minions began to use that term.
When there was talk that the religious folks didn’t beleive in evolution the Bush-rightwing propaganda mind machine started using the term “intelligent design” and the lambs followed.
Pretty sad.
-GSD
November 17th, 2006 at 5:54 pmExley: “No one believed that he was really trying to insult Dubya.”
That statement is so divorced from reality that it makes me wonder about your sanity, Exley.
November 17th, 2006 at 5:58 pmUnbelievable….It is myth and it has been discredited:
‘Robert Blendon, director of the Harvard Program on Public Opinion and Health and Social Policy said the number of deaths in the families interviewed — 547 in the post-invasion period versus 82 in a similar period before the invasion — was too few to extrapolate up to more than 600,000 deaths across the country.
Donald Berry, chairman of biostatistics at M. D. Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, was even more troubled by the study, which he said had “a tone of accuracy that’s just inappropriate.â€â€™
“They’re almost certainly way too high,†said Anthony Cordesman of the Center for Strategic & International Studies in Washington.
NEW YORK TIMES / ASSOCIATED PRESS
November 17th, 2006 at 5:58 pmNo one believed that he was really trying to insult Dubya.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:00 pmLet me correct you,
No one on the right after hearing the purposely edited version of the speech, really knew that, in fact, he really was trying to insult Dubya
You’re welcome.
Anyone that is willing not to be blindly led by the Right’s “fact making machine”, clearly heard Kerry slamming Dubya.
Anyone that is thirsty for more kool-aid, did not
GSD, it’s called the “authoritarian personality.” A person of this type has a pathological need to believe and follow his leader. I would pity them if they weren’t screwing things up so much.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:00 pm#114 Exley
, I see that you have bought into Kerry’s desperate damage-control spin on his insulting of our troops, but alas you are one of the few. No one believed that he was really trying to insult Dubya. Everyone knew that in mocking our troops he was speaking what was in his heart. Even Kerry recognized that and eventually apologized for his insult. And for that I give him credit.
Either you’ve got amazing recall or you’re starting to cut and paste your old posts. You don’t believe that about Kerry anymore than we do. You can keep reciting it all you want, but it’s bogus and everyone knows it.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:01 pmExley, this is an debate/argument for another day, another time. I’m off to spend time with the family.
Good night all!!!
November 17th, 2006 at 6:01 pmGood night, DRxJ…I too am outta here. It’s 6:00….Mr. Rove says I can leave now. evening, folks.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:08 pmSeems like Mr. Rove would be having you work some unpaid OT about now Exley. Anyway have a good weekend all, and go UofM
November 17th, 2006 at 6:16 pmThe Bottom Line The whole world is watching, and they really want to know the answers to these questions: (A) Do the American people approve of the criminal acts that are being perpetrated in their name; (B) If so, why have Americans become so morally-blind as to silently capitulate to these heinous war crimes [4]; (C) If not, where is the hue-and-cry for accountability from our country, especially when the Abu Ghraib investigation has become another farcical whitewash; and (D) Why has Mr. Bush refused to demand the resignations of any higher-level officials despite overwhelming evidence that the interrogation policies which resulted in these outrageous human-rights violations were, in fact, approved from the top down? [5, 6]
November 17th, 2006 at 6:16 pmnd John Boehner threatened to strip Joe Barton of his committee assignments if he didn’t drop out of the minority leader’s race.
And then there’s this from Hotline
Double, sexist, standards yet again.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:16 pmI have solved it; it was Dorothy, in the castle, with the bucket.
means, motive, opportunity, chance for personal gain at kingdom’s expense, escape and exile with a fat offshore bankroll
ignore the fellow behind the curtain, please. look at me. I’m mort.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:20 pm(which in french (sorry general) means “dead”)
He’s just afraid that Pelosi is a little too close to the top of the presidential succession.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:24 pmKondrake is nearing apoplexy at the thought of a woman Speaker of the House standing behind his beloved chimp-in-chief. A woman, third in line to the presidency.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:44 pmI expect to see Fox’s ratings continue to slide, as they will have to come up with ever more outrageious comments and lies as the White House continues to lose its total control.
#59 – “Why do you folks hate Muslims?” – Comment by Spudge_Boy
*******Dear Sponge Cake – We don’t hate all Muslims. We only hate the ones who want to kill us.
Have a good weekend, Spongy…..
November 17th, 2006 at 6:48 pmMORON CONTROL: Exley loses again…big time.
Today, C-SPAN ran an e-survey on the Pelosi-Murtha alignment:
“Do you think it harms the Democrats that Nancy Pelosi backed John Murtha for majority leader?”
20% YES
80% NO
Contrary to what the trolls at the NYT staff want us to think, this will ultimately play to Pelosi’s advantage. “Read it” and weep…lmao.
As for Kondracke and Hume, so what if they did fondle each other? And why should they deny it? After all is said and done, isn’t that what being a Beltway Big Boy is all about?
Money for nothin’…get your cheeks for free.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:48 pmMarie,
I don’t think this is that unusual for the republican party, they love to demonize the enemy, makes for a great us vs. them mindset. It is mostly a way to divide and conquer, and maintain power. However after the election, it is apparent that it isn’t working anymore.
November 17th, 2006 at 6:51 pmKondracke Dubs Nancy Pelosi The ‘Wicked Witch Of The West’
More name-calling from the right? I’m shocked!!!
November 17th, 2006 at 7:00 pmFrankly, I see no problem with Pelosi’s backing of Murtha. He did a lot for this election and she was right to acknowledge that publicly.
I have a feeling Pelosi’s smarter than you give her credit for, and a better leader. I don’t doubt she knew where the votes were. She knew Hoyer was going to win easily, and rightly so, because he was more in line with the party’s values.
But she supported him anyway, as a political payback for past support from Murtha, and also to publicly acknowledge his contribution to the election and to Iraq. She even said so.
And then we all move on. Murtha gets control over the finances for the war, Hoyer gets the position he campaigned for, Pelosi has supported Murtha like she promised and we can move on to governing.
Whats the big???
November 17th, 2006 at 7:00 pmKrazny, I, for one, am going to enjoy watching the self-anointed desperately and futilely cling to some semblance of authority.
November 17th, 2006 at 7:03 pmYeah, well, as we found out recently, Mighty A thinks elected representatives asking military personnel to be honest about the state of our Iraq war to be “grandstanding.” Yikes!
November 17th, 2006 at 7:13 pmPelosi’s backing of Murtha, a long-time friend, is actually an example of NOT doing the politically prudent thing but instead, doing the honorable thing. It’s not surprising that conservatives don’t get that.
November 17th, 2006 at 7:16 pmI am with you bluedog – I failed to see a big deal in the issue.
November 17th, 2006 at 7:35 pmPelosi is a long time friend of Murtha and out of respect for that and for his stand in exposing the truth about Iraq, she owed him her support. She is fully aware that he is not a “liberal” Democrat, voting conservatively on nearly all social matters, but in this way, she shows she is willing to take a hit for her friend, knowing full well that the House Dems would prefer the more liberal Democrat, Hoyer. Hoyer seemed to be very aware of what was happening, as was Murtha. In fact all three of them were quite reasonable and gracious in the end. I think that is what fried the so-called “liberal media” who were itching for a battle and tried to engineer one.
Now they are trying to create another battle between Harmon and Pelosi; Pelosi is not happy with the soft-touch Harmon has for Bush&Co and the war while serving in her committee. Pelosi is going to keep her base of Democrats satisfied.
This is just too reasonable and mature for the media to accept, having reported on the us vs. them of the Bush&Co years.
That’s right. And when Democrats guest on FOX they help sustain FOX and propagate FOX’s illegal, treasonous behavior.
November 17th, 2006 at 7:39 pmMarie, to me it’s astonishing just how much the corporate media has revealed itself. Dems took both houses, no Dem lost his or her job, Pelosi is the first female Speaker in history…. and to our media, it’s been a very bad week for Dems. Amazing, isn’t it?
November 17th, 2006 at 7:48 pmWhy do you guys still talk to mighty? Mighty’s not even a real person.
November 17th, 2006 at 7:53 pmSupposedly…..
……supposedly…..
supposedly we have a new president. I mean, I heard Bush left the country and isn’t coming back. Yeah..I heard some other stuff, but those could be just rumors….supposedly, though.
November 17th, 2006 at 8:02 pmHow is Pelosi a wicked witch?
November 17th, 2006 at 8:35 pmEveryone knew that in mocking our troops he was speaking what was in his heart.
Comment by Exley — November 17, 2006 @ 5:51 pm
Wha!? Are you a psychic now?
Give up already, Exley. This feigned outrage of yours is getting very old.
Even Kerry recognized that and eventually apologized for his insult.
Kerry apologised for the misunderstanding, and clearly said his statement was not in reference to any troop.
I don’t even care for Kerry, but you repeating this nonsense is very annoying and makes you sound flat-out stupid.
November 17th, 2006 at 8:40 pmAfter reading all the trolls in this thread, I havecome to the conclusion that republicanism is a genetic defect.
I really believe that someday the medical science will identify and erraticate the gene that causes Republicanism, then the world will be a better place for all. =)
November 17th, 2006 at 9:09 pmHow is Pelosi a wicked witch?
Comment by ForTruth
Standard issue uppity woman.
November 17th, 2006 at 9:14 pmStandard issue uppity woman.
— Zooey
may I expand?
Uppity woman = woman who has strong opinions and defends her viewpoint
Man who calls a woman uppity = jackass
November 17th, 2006 at 9:19 pmWayne,
That was perfect. Thank you for expanding. :)
November 17th, 2006 at 9:23 pmThat was perfect. Thank you for expanding. :)
— Zooey
You’re very welcome =)
November 17th, 2006 at 9:28 pmIf the citizens of WMD (World of Mass Denial) label Pelosi the “Wicked Witch” from anywhere, it clearly means that she is, in fact, the “Saintly Speaker” that they are AFRAID OF and have to try to DEMONIZE.
Pelosi is a major player in the hard hitting business of politics. If she isn’t being tough, she’s not doing her job. If Republicans, especially neocons, are NOT criticizing her, then she is not doing her job.
November 17th, 2006 at 9:35 pmOh, I see, Pelosi does her job = witch. I get it.
November 17th, 2006 at 9:37 pmYeah she is a witch then.
November 17th, 2006 at 9:38 pmYeah she is a witch then.
Comment by ForTruth
A truly Wicked Witch. The worst sort.
November 17th, 2006 at 9:42 pmAnd I’m really looking forward to Speaker Pelosi dropping the House on a few neocons in the next year or so. Are you ready for some corruption investigations, my pretties?
November 17th, 2006 at 10:10 pmNovember 17th, 2006 at 10:12 pm
Nice to see so many of you value true political discourse but follow your statements with name calling and profanity.
Juan C, saying the all christins like to spread clusterbombs over innocent civilians is a bad as saying that all Muslims want to kill Americans.
And all of you that would like to erradicate Republicanism, Wayne#149, remember that a Republican President was esential in ending slavery. If the world would be a better place without them, then you would say that the world would be better if we had kept up the slave trade.
For “progressive and enlightened” people, you are all very close-minded to any idea that is different than your own.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:14 pmAnd I’m really looking forward to Speaker Pelosi dropping the House on a few neocons in the next year or so. Are you ready for some corruption investigations, my pretties?
Comment by PatrioticLiberalChristian
Don’t turn over too many stones, you may not like some of what you find…..
November 17th, 2006 at 10:16 pmEveryone knew that in mocking our troops he was speaking what was in his heart.
Comment by Exley
Thank you from one of the mocked
November 17th, 2006 at 10:18 pmRobert,
Who cares what slime will be found under the stones, it all has to go.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:19 pmForTruth,
As long as it is equal. It does not matter if the slime is red or blue. there is plenty on both sides!
November 17th, 2006 at 10:22 pmWho cares what slime will be found under the stones, it all has to go.
Comment by ForTruth
They just don’t get that kind of thinking.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:24 pm#160
There is a historical reason why the Repugs did not hold the house and senate for 40 years. In the last 6 years we have been reminded of that reason and nov 7th the people threw them out again.
You are one of the reasons I think modern republicanism is a mental disorder caused by a genetic defect.
Don’t worry, I am sure we may eventually find a cure for you once the cut medical research funding is set up again.
Support the cure!!!
in the mean time, you are good comedy Robert.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:25 pmThank you from one of the mocked
— Robert
Oh, really…..
Lets hear it. Tell me about military life Robert. Where are you currently stationed?
November 17th, 2006 at 10:33 pmReally? When did Iraq declare war on the US? What physical act did they do that justified a response of arms?
Comment by TheToonGuy
Actually, by failing to abide by UN mandates (17 times) that is the equivilant to a declaration of war on the UN
Why do you folks hate Muslims?
Comment by Spudge_Boy
November 17th, 2006 at 10:35 pmI do not hate all Muslims, only the ones that kill my countrymen, their own countrymen, and that wish for the elimination of all that are non-Muslim
As long as it is equal. It does not matter if the slime is red or blue. there is plenty on both sides!
Comment by Robert
Very good Robert.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:36 pmDon’t turn over too many stones, you may not like some of what you find….. Comment by Robert
Neocon projection
a Republican President was esential in ending slavery. Comment by Robert
You claim Lincoln. I doubt Lincoln would claim the Republican Party of today.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:39 pmWayne,
If you would like that information you can e-mail me at bulls-it1@lycos.com as that is not information I wish to share with the public. It would be the same as asking me to post my home address.
But I will say that I haev served honorably for 13 years, I haev deployed to Iraq twice, and do truly love my job. The most gratification I get from it is knowing that I help to protect every Americans right to take part in forums like this.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:40 pmDon’t turn over too many stones, you may not like some of what you find….. Comment by Robert
Neocon projection
Comment by PatrioticLiberalChristian
Are you saying that there is no corruption on the other side of the isle? If so, you are naive.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:42 pmDon’t turn over too many stones, you may not like some of what you find…..—- Robert
I say turn over all the stones and ANYONE corrupt goes to jail, no matter the party.
Rule of Law needs to be re-established in this Government.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:44 pmin the mean time, you are good comedy Robert.
Comment by Wayne
I like the mocking tone, but why do you insist that I am a Republican? I am Environmentally concerned, I support medical research for cures to things like Parkinsons, I am concerned for the proper treatment of the elderly, inferm, children and animals. I am also a strong supporter for responsibility in government as well as personal responsibility. I am for a strong defence and the betterment of all people in my nation. Is there something wrong with that? I thought this site was for progressive thinkers. Is that not progressive?
November 17th, 2006 at 10:47 pmI say turn over all the stones and ANYONE corrupt goes to jail, no matter the party.
Rule of Law needs to be re-established in this Government.
Comment by Wayne
I agree with this, does that make me progressive or a Democrat or something. Wyane, Buddy, you have me confused. Who says that someone can not be both Progressive AND a Republican?
November 17th, 2006 at 10:50 pmthat is not information I wish to share with the public
——
But I will say that I haev served honorably for 13 years.
— Robert
I respect that.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:52 pmMy family is a military family.
I, my father ( retired last year after many years ), one of my sisters ( one of the wounded ) and her husband ( in Iraq now ), one of my sons (in Iraq now ), have served.
Who says that someone can not be both Progressive AND a Republican?
Comment by Robert
Are you prone to whiplash?
November 17th, 2006 at 10:54 pmAre you prone to whiplash?
Comment by Zooey
No, but my head does swim from too much rhetoric from either side.
November 17th, 2006 at 10:56 pmWayne,
thank you and your family for their service. At the risk of offending many in this blog, God bless you Sister for her wounds and I hope protection for your son and brother-in-law from whatever god you chose to (or not to ) worship.
I will say this, Camp Lejeune
November 17th, 2006 at 10:59 pmActually Robert I believe modern conservatism is unamerican.
Grover Norquist is one of leaders of the modern conservative movement quoted that he wants to shrink government “down to the size where we can drown it in the bathtub.”
When in power,they have actually raided the treasury and have tried to bleed to death this country with a thousand cuts.
This government he and his followers want to “drown it in the bathtub” is the United States. The government described in the constitution as “We the People”
To want to destroy our goverment in my eyes is the highest form of treason.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:02 pmNo, but my head does swim from too much rhetoric from either side.
Comment by Robert
So you really don’t have to commit to anything, do you?
November 17th, 2006 at 11:11 pm#179
Thanks
And welcome to TP, marine.
If my debate gets out of hand just slap me upside the head hehe
November 17th, 2006 at 11:13 pmWayne, myself and the majority for modern coservatives in my age group are not like that. I am a firm believer in what the founding fathers thought about government. The government that governs best is the one that governs the least. I think that if some one is wealthy either through their own work or inheritance, they have a MORAL obligation to help those less fortunate, but the government does not have the right to REQUIRE it. I believe that all people born and unborn, black and white gay and straight have value. I believe that all able bodied people should work to elevate themselves and not rely on the government to do it for them. I believe that no man or woman should stay in any political office for too long as it put them out of touch with reality. I do not believe that any group is entitled to any special standing or benifit. I believe that what happens in my bedroom is my business and what happens in your bedroom is your business. I do not flaunt my Hetrosexuality so I expect the same courtesy for those that have a different life style.
A small government is a good thing, but a functional government is better.
More importantly, I believe that I have to determine my own morality and that the government has no right to dictate what I must like, dislike, support or accept.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:17 pmRobert do you like Nancy Pelosi?
November 17th, 2006 at 11:18 pmZooey, I commit to the ideas that I believe in regardless of the source. Truth is truth, no matter if it is from the Bible, Koran, or an Archie comic book
November 17th, 2006 at 11:19 pmI will say this, Camp Lejeune
Comment by Robert
Is that code for saying you’re a Marine?
I will say this, Twenty-nine Palms.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:21 pmForTruth, No I don’t. But I RESPECT her position. I do not like that she is extremly hostile toward the military and she aligns herself with many on the EXTREME left.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:21 pm#185 – Thanks.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:22 pmNo it is not code, he asked where I was stationed, not what branch I was in. I will always proudly say that I am a Marine if asked.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:23 pmSo you are a Marine, or a retired Marine, which means you’re still a Marine.
I am not a Marine.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:26 pmZooey, if you are at 29 Palms and not a Marine, are you a corpsman or a cactus?
November 17th, 2006 at 11:29 pmIs that code for saying you’re a Marine?
– Zooey
Several major Marine Corps commands are atCamp Lejeune.
Oh, yeah, and one Navy command.
I assumed marine, but he may be Navy
Either way, I salute your service Robert.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:29 pmHeh. I’m not at 29 Palms. I was born there. My dad was a Marine.
I would say I identify more closely with the cactus or Joshua Tree.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:31 pmAnd again, Do not judge all Marines from the same angle. some of us are actually nice guys and can count to 21 with our pants on.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:34 pmWho is judging Marines?
November 17th, 2006 at 11:35 pmAnd again, Do not judge all Marines from the same angle. some of us are actually nice guys and can count to 21 with our pants on.
—- Robert
LOL
November 17th, 2006 at 11:40 pmUnlike some flyboys I know ( my dad always hates my jokes about the AF =-)
Just a bit of humor as many of the “progressive thinkers” thnk that in order to be a Marine you have to have a lebotomy.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:40 pmWayne is either a Sailor or a Soldier
November 17th, 2006 at 11:41 pmJust a bit of humor as many of the “progressive thinkers†thnk that in order to be a Marine you have to have a lebotomy.
Comment by Robert
That’s funny. My dad retired from the Navy, after having been a Marine. He said he had to get out of the Marines when they found out his parents were married.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:43 pmI thought Wayne played rock guitar, but he may have had a previous life.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:44 pmzooey, the email address is bulls-it1@lycos.com, feel free to use it at any time.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:48 pmRobert,
Is that a real email address?
November 17th, 2006 at 11:50 pmyes it is, it is linked to a sight a buddy and I are starting up. test it, you will see.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:54 pmTest it by letting you know my email address? That’s kind of silly, don’t you think?
November 17th, 2006 at 11:56 pmYes it is, but you asked if it was real so I offered you the challenge as a way to prove my point.
November 17th, 2006 at 11:59 pmI would need more information before I tested something like that, Robert. Thanks.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:01 amand the site is http://bulls-it1.tripod.com
male,36,hetro lol
November 18th, 2006 at 12:04 amWayne is either a Sailor or a Soldier
— Robert
Lets just say I did recon, sabotage and harrassment ahead of the line in 90, for Papa Bush. Most military know whose job that was.
I thought Wayne played rock guitar, but he may have had a previous life.
—– Zooey
Yep, in fact another sub job for a band tomorrow, bass instead of lead this time.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:05 amanything else you would need?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:05 amwayne, I salute your service
November 18th, 2006 at 12:06 amanything else you would need?
Comment by Robert
Yep
November 18th, 2006 at 12:09 amwayne, zooey – if you are still lurking at the bottom of this thread, go crack a rib on the new Poor Man:
November 18th, 2006 at 12:10 amThe Wonderful World of Disney, Episode 3
Exley,
November 18th, 2006 at 12:11 amIf you think Kondracke is a real liberal then you must be high on crack.
Robert, based on your your political agenda, you actually belong here.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:15 amstonehinge, define here?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:21 amThe Wonderful World of Disney, Episode 3
—- stonehinge
That was some funny chit.
lmao…….
November 18th, 2006 at 12:23 amthanks for the link
Zooey, Wayne, and any friends hanging around, it’s official: I passed the California State Bar.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:26 amHay Zooey, Think I mentioned I went to school in 29 Palms and lived a few miles out of Joshua Tree..That was a life time before you were born but bet we walked over some of the same land…Was the drive in theater there when you lived there.?….
I find it odd that the troll’s were terribly unhappy and full of drivel and drool when they were ahead and still are now….Kind of like they are all sick with munchousen disease…Anything for attention, especiely the males….They just can’t stand it that a woman may be able to do a better job than their bunch can….Left or progressive males don’t seem to have the same illness, only the soft hand’s, no neck, fat faced, doughboy, radical profesed christian republican types seem to have this problem. There must be another name for their affliction, will have to think on it.. What a wonderful day it will be when I wake up and think, Good Morning President Palosi…Blessings all
November 18th, 2006 at 12:28 amYour ideas is better filled by the Democratic agenda than the Republican agenda. Don’t get caught by the NWO Doublespeak — there is nothing conservative whatsoever about the Republican agenda.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:30 amZooey, Wayne, and any friends hanging around, it’s official: I passed the California State Bar.
Comment by Briseadh na Faire
Congratulations, my dear friend.
Now you can smack “Attorney at Law” behind your name.
Break out the scotch, ya’ll, we’re going to have a really strange party.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:33 amI passed the California State Bar.
——- Briseadh na Faire
Wow, congrats =)
November 18th, 2006 at 12:33 amHay Zooey, Think I mentioned I went to school in 29 Palms and lived a few miles out of Joshua Tree..That was a life time before you were born but bet we walked over some of the same land…Was the drive in theater there when you lived there.?….
Comment by Sharon Cox
It may have been, but I left when I was 6 months old! I know we’ve shadowed each other over the years, it’s very interesting.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:35 amBnaF, Esq — such heroism!!! I just hope you’ll still come visit with the morlocks from time-to-time.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:36 amBravo BnF, great new’s…..Blessings
November 18th, 2006 at 12:37 amOf course, I’m assuming Briseadh na Faire will even speak to us anymore.
:-)
November 18th, 2006 at 12:38 am“soft hand’s, no neck, fat faced, doughboy, radical profesed christian republican types”
Yes, Sharon, it needs a name…something Syndrome, I should think.
I got it…how about…
…close?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:46 amMaybe Hastert-Limbaugh Syndrome?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:48 amVery good Stonehinge, that work’s…..By the way, what are morelocks.?…..Blessings
November 18th, 2006 at 12:51 amthere is nothing conservative whatsoever about the Republican agenda.
—- stonehinge
I agree with that. And the veteran cuts are not meeting the “support the troops” rhetoric.
That pisses me off the most about boy-Bush.
I have an old bud with the “syndrome” from GW-I and is having hell with the V.A. as we speak.
I think I mentioned before that family had pitch in to help with my sister’s bills.
Bush saying others don’t support the troops is pure BS.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:51 amZooey, it mo’ bettah…
I think we need to circulate that one far and wide.
Anybody care to nominate candidates for the HLS Poster Child of 2007?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:54 amAnybody care to nominate candidates for the HLS Poster Child of 2007?
Comment by stonehinge
I don’t want to offer any ideas, because I’m going to bed and don’t need any horrible visuals to deal with. But I think whatever you decide should involve a speedo. :P
Goodnight!
November 18th, 2006 at 12:59 amstrong>BnF
November 18th, 2006 at 1:02 amCongratulations!
But I think whatever you decide should involve a speedo. :P
Goodnight!
Comment by Zooey
Ewwwwww……
Night Zooey. =)
November 18th, 2006 at 1:04 amWayne & Robert, I just happened to have this quite remarkable historical background on the GI Bill open, as we speak:
November 18th, 2006 at 1:05 amSupporting the Troops
Yikes! do they make speedos big enough for Hastert types?…..Think Seattle tent and awning would have to take on that job…Night all…Blessings
November 18th, 2006 at 1:15 amWell, around 2000, weren’t they referring to the GOP as the Big Tent? I’m ashamed that it took me this long to realize they only meant a mode of dress…LMAO.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:32 amThe only person Mort could be “left leaning” compared to is Atilla the Hun.In the aftermath of this election, I broke my vow never to watch Fox News, just so I could watch these idiots squirm. I realize now that my vow was a good one.
November 18th, 2006 at 8:31 amBug eyed Poodle Pelosi will not last and be replaced by her own party. She is an embarassment to Democrats everwhere. I wish our party would put someone with a more balanced viewpoint in charge.
She is a mistake!
November 18th, 2006 at 8:55 amstonehinge, Sorry fif you misunderstood my stance, but I definately do not belong with the Democratic party. Their gereral belief system is far too liberal for me. As I said, I do not think any group is entitled to special rights or benifits. This means tht we should not change the constitution for gay marriage and that by people elevating them selves, I ment they should gain employment and educational opportunities from their own efforts, not the quota system of affirmitive action. Things like that say you must hire, minorityies, wonem an dgays, but if you are a business that is run by a minority, woman or gay, you do not have to hire white hetero males.
I am pro choice, but only in the forst trimesterunless there is an imminant threat to the mothers life. But I also believe that there should be limits on the number of abortions a woman should be able to have. See, I believe that when the first cell multiplies, it is a life.
The Democratic party has had plenty of time since the “New Deal” to create an entitlement society. I think it is time that we moved away from that. Are any of those ideas in line with the Dems?
November 18th, 2006 at 9:10 amBobbo, #239. You are right. Pelosi will become a very devicive person in your party.
November 18th, 2006 at 9:11 amGood morning everybody, and thank you. Sorry I couldn’t stick around last night, but I learned long ago it is not wise to drink and type!!!
Peace and Blessings,
Briseadh na Faire
November 18th, 2006 at 9:38 amstonehinge-That GI Bill stuff was interesting to read. one thing that a lot of people do not realize is that the GI Bill is not free. Service members pay into it ($100/mo for 12 months, unless there has been a recent change). This has been the way since at least the Carter Administration. Therefore it is not an entitlement, but an envestment in ones education. And there are limits on claiming it. If you are discharged from the military for reasons of misconduct, you do not recieve the benifit.
November 18th, 2006 at 9:45 ami’ve been away a couple days, catching up, found this on google news -
apropos to this thread, a good read, love the headline:
O.J. sewer leads right to Murdoch
November 18, 2006
AMERICA’S popular culture lost its sense of shame so long ago that it’s a little hard to recall precisely what that emotion felt like.
[...]
…the Fox television network announced that it would air a two-part interview with O.J. Simpson as part of the publicity campaign promoting a new book, “If I Did It,” in which he offers a hypothetical account of how he might have killed his ex-wife
[...]
“If I Did It” is the product of the former football star’s collaboration with an unnamed ghost writer and will be published at the end of this month by ReganBooks, the euphonious shock-and-schlock imprint Judith Regan runs for the HarperCollins publishing house. Fox, ReganBooks and HarperCollins all have something important in common: They’re owned by the predatory Australian-born media tycoon Rupert Murdoch, who has devoted his life to making money by making sure that news and entertainment are as coarse and vulgar as can be imagined in as many places as possible.
In fact, if there is a single compelling argument for restrictive immigration policies, Murdoch is it. It is one of history’s inexplicable perversities that this avaricious antipodean has been welcomed into this country while honest Mexican workingmen are walled out.
…
what is wrong with the country and world – fox…
November 18th, 2006 at 10:27 amprobably would like that link:
November 18th, 2006 at 10:27 amO.J. sewer leads right to Murdoch
http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-et-rutten18nov18,1,1029374.column?coll=la-news-columns
CONGRATULATIONS!
November 18th, 2006 at 10:56 amBriseadh na Faire!!!
!!!
Sorry I couldn’t stick around last night, but I learned long ago it is not wise to drink and type!!!
Peace and Blessings,
Briseadh na Faire
Heh.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:07 amTwo things, Robert:
1. I do not think any group is entitled to special rights or benifits. This means tht we should not change the constitution for gay marriage…
So allowing the gay community the SAME rights all the rest of us have is a “special right.” I see…
2. I am pro choice, but only in the forst trimesterunless there is an imminant threat to the mothers life. But I also believe that there should be limits on the number of abortions a woman should be able to have. See, I believe that when the first cell multiplies, it is a life.
Have you ever been raped, Robert?
November 18th, 2006 at 11:35 amIt is myth and it has been discredited:
Only with opinions:
“was too few to extrapolate up to more than 600,000 deaths across the country.”
Really, why?
“a tone of accuracy that’s just inappropriate.â€â€™
Again – how, why, facts?
“They’re almost certainly way too high,â€
Once again… doesn’t sound like any valid explanation as to why the study was wrong – just, as usual, beliefs and opinions.
Comment by Exley — November 17, 2006 @ 5:58 pm
You just want to believe its wrong. For your righties that is enough. For us lefties, it’s not.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:52 amMORON CONTROL: Exley loses again…big time.
Today, C-SPAN ran an e-survey on the Pelosi-Murtha alignment: “Do you think it harms the Democrats that Nancy Pelosi backed John Murtha for majority leader?â€
20% YES 80% NO
Comment by stonehinge — November 17, 2006 @ 6:48 pm
Since that poll didn’t ask every single person in the world, Exley thinks it’s not valid.
For Exley, you can’t just poll a percent and extrapolate, even though Scientific studies have shown that extrapolation of a small percentage is actually much more accurate than extrapolation of large percentages – which is why polls tend to use less than 1000 people to gain a high degree of accuracy.
But nevermind reality, Exley doesn’t feel that it’s correct.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:56 amAs long as it is equal. It does not matter if the slime is red or blue. there is plenty on both sides!
Comment by Robert — November 17, 2006 @ 10:22 pm
Not really…
There is a very, very long list of Republican pedophiles. The list of Democratic pedophiles isn’t even long enough for anyone to have compiled…
You just need to believe that we are as corrupt as you to justify your being one of them…
November 18th, 2006 at 12:02 pm1. I do not think any group is entitled to special rights or benifits. This means tht we should not change the constitution for gay marriage…
So allowing the gay community the SAME rights all the rest of us have is a “special right.†I see…
so we should also allow Poligamist, and child marriage as well?
2. I am pro choice, but only in the forst trimesterunless there is an imminant threat to the mothers life. But I also believe that there should be limits on the number of abortions a woman should be able to have. See, I believe that when the first cell multiplies, it is a life.
Have you ever been raped, Robert?
Comment by Zooey
and a woman that is raped can not make up her mind in 3 months whether or not to keep the baby?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:05 pmI do not hate all Muslims, only the ones that kill my countrymen, their own countrymen, and that wish for the elimination of all that are non-Muslim
Comment by Robert — November 17, 2006 @ 10:35 pm
So then you are understanding and supportive of those who hate all of the radical Christians who are killing, raping and torturing tehir own countrymen, and that wish for the elimination of all that are non-Christian?
You support those people?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:05 pmAs long as it is equal. It does not matter if the slime is red or blue. there is plenty on both sides!
Comment by Robert — November 17, 2006 @ 10:22 pm
Not really…
There is a very, very long list of Republican pedophiles. The list of Democratic pedophiles isn’t even long enough for anyone to have compiled…
You just need to believe that we are as corrupt as you to justify your being one of them…
Comment by unbelievable
Slime is not just limited to pedophiles.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:07 pmWhat Morons!
November 18th, 2006 at 12:09 pmIt was OK for Tom Delay and Dennis Hastert to employ strong arm tactics, but NOT OK for Nancy Pelosi.
This just goes to show how misogynistic they are over at FOX.
It’s OK for MEN to employ strong arm tactics, but not OK for a Woman.
Who says that someone can not be both Progressive AND a Republican?
Comment by Robert — November 17, 2006 @ 10:50 pm
Republicans
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Party_(United_States)
November 18th, 2006 at 12:12 pmBobbo: Stop lying you piece of crap, YOU are NOT a Democrat!
You are just trying to create a problem where none exists.
ALL of us TRUE Democrats are PROUD to have Speaker Pelosi as our voice.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:16 pmThe only people who don’t like her are Republicans and POSERS like you.
Go back to Free Republic you POSER!
one of my sons (in Iraq now ), have served.
Comment by Wayne — November 17, 2006 @ 10:52 pm
Didn’t know that. Hope he is well and comes home soon.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:16 pmShow me a sorce that says that Progressive means you have to be liberal?liberal. Do not use wiki and that is edited and defined by users.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:16 pmso we should also allow Poligamist, and child marriage as well?
Robert, was I wrong to give you more credit than that? Marriage between an adult and a child is illegal. A marriage between two gay adults would be perfectly legal.
and a woman that is raped can not make up her mind in 3 months whether or not to keep the baby?
Ok, I’ll give you that one, with one correction — until the pregnancy is deliverd, it’s a fetus, not a baby.
If the cells are a “life” when the multiply, why so generous with the 3 months, Robert? How many abortions would you dole out to women? What do you consider an imminent threat to a woman’s life?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:21 pmso we should also allow Poligamist, and child marriage as well?
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 12:05 pm
What’s wrong with polygamy? If it’s consenting adults?
You’re trying to compare gays to child marriage? That’s ridiculous. We’re talking about consenting adults. Who the hell cares who someone loves? What gives you the right to tell people of age what they can and cannot do? And spare me the Jesus crap. I want reality-based reasoning behind our laws, not religious delusion and ‘feelings’.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:27 pmand a woman that is raped can not make up her mind in 3 months whether or not to keep the baby?
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 12:05 pm
Your sympathy is staggering…
November 18th, 2006 at 12:29 pmSlime is not just limited to pedophiles.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 12:07 pm
No but it’s a pretty large compass…
We can discuss the Abrahamoff Scandal. No Democrats there.
What other qualifiers you want? Be specific.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:31 pmso we should also allow Poligamist, and child marriage as well?
Robert, was I wrong to give you more credit than that? Marriage between an adult and a child is illegal. A marriage between two gay adults would be perfectly legal.
But then you are interfering with their “constitutional” rights. How do you decide what group does and does not have the right to marry? In short, where does it end.
and a woman that is raped can not make up her mind in 3 months whether or not to keep the baby?
Ok, I’ll give you that one, with one correction — until the pregnancy is deliverd, it’s a fetus, not a baby.
If the cells are a “life†when the multiply, why so generous with the 3 months, Robert? How many abortions would you dole out to women?
Comment by Zooey
that is not to be decided by me. If I had my PERSONAL way, zero, unless it is a result of rape, or imminant risk to the life of the mother. But again, that is MY belief and it is not my job to FORCE my belief.
What do you consider an imminent threat to a woman’s life?
If there is a reasonable certainty that a womans life would be ended or her medical condition would be such that it would place her in grave medical danger.
When would you say the cut of is. Late term, Partial Birth when the “fetus” is actually viable and able to sustain life outside the womb?
November 18th, 2006 at 12:35 pmShow me a sorce that says that Progressive means you have to be liberal?liberal. Do not use wiki and that is edited and defined by users.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 12:16 pm
So?
Well, Think Progress would be one of those sources. But I have more.
http://thesaurus.reference.com/browse/progressive
Main Entry: progressive
Part of Speech: adjective
Definition: liberal
Synonyms: accelerating, advanced, advancing, avant-garde*, bleeding heart, broad, broad-minded, continuing, continuous, developing, dynamic, enlightened, enterprising, escalating, forward-looking, go-ahead*, gradual, graduated, growing, increasing, intensifying, left*, lenient, modern, ongoing, onward, open-minded, pink, radical, reformist, revolutionary, tolerant, up-and-coming*, up-to-date, wide
Antonyms: conservative
Source: Roget’s New Millenniumâ„¢ Thesaurus, First Edition (v 1.3.1)
November 18th, 2006 at 12:35 pmCopyright © 2006 by Lexico Publishing Group, LLC. All rights reserved.
unbelievable #261, if you actually read things I have posted you will first see that I do not use religion as a crutch. Not once have I envoked Jesus as a foundation for my arguement.
Also, I have stated that MY Morality is MY resposibility and yours is yours. It is not my job to force my morality on you.
I ask where do we stop and why does a persons sexuality have to be a public issue.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:41 pmBut then you are interfering with their “constitutional†rights. How do you decide what group does and does not have the right to marry? In short, where does it end.
Consenting ADULTS, Robert. Those over age 18. Hello?
that is not to be decided by me. If I had my PERSONAL way, zero, unless it is a result of rape, or imminant risk to the life of the mother. But again, that is MY belief and it is not my job to FORCE my belief.
So then why an arbitary 3 month window? That is forcing the other 6 months to fit your variable “ideals…
When would you say the cut of is. Late term, Partial Birth when the “fetus†is actually viable and able to sustain life outside the womb?
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 12:35 pm
A better question is to ask you how many babies you’ve adopted and how many more you plan to adopt. And spare me the ‘I didn’t get them pregnant’ crap. If you want to force them to have the kids, then you share in the responsibility, as do all tax payers, to care for those unwanted children.
And what kind of life do you think those children have Robert? ‘Cause as a high school teacher in the public school system, I can tell you. It isn’t one of quality.
Yet people like you have no problems supporting the mass slaughter of innocent humans, of animals, of things you believe to be beneath you or lesser than you.
Nothing even remotely progressive about that.
And this is further proof that a Republican can not be progressive.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:44 pmBut then you are interfering with their “constitutional†rights. How do you decide what group does and does not have the right to marry? In short, where does it end.
You persist with the idea of the adult/child marriage — which is already illegal. I see I did give you too much credit.
If there is a reasonable certainty that a womans life would be ended or her medical condition would be such that it would place her in grave medical danger.
So your cut off is the imminent death of the woman. Apparently the ruination of a woman’s health is acceptable, even if that means she might be unable to care for any existing children, or if her health is affected for the remainder of her lifetime.
Wow.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:48 pmunbelievable #261, if you actually read things I have posted you will first see that I do not use religion as a crutch. Not once have I envoked Jesus as a foundation for my arguement.
I did read your posts. You don’t have to have yet evoked Jesus as a crutch for your actions to give you away…
You see, being a progressive means that you understand that actions speak louder than words.
And your actions of being anti-abortion are very revelaing of your Jesus beliefs.
Are you saying you are not a Christian?
Also, I have stated that MY Morality is MY resposibility and yours is yours. It is not my job to force my morality on you.
But that is what the Christian religion and the Republican party stand for. They stand for converting others to their way of thinking, which they believe is the only “right” way.
Yes, you’ve said some progressive things, but you aren’t ACTING in agreement with those words. Therefore, I choose your actions over your words to see your true character.
I ask where do we stop and why does a persons sexuality have to be a public issue.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 12:41 pm
I’ve answered – Age of Consent.
And it’s a public issue because Republicans and Christians have made it public.
Those of us on the left would prefer it to be a private matter. But those of you on the right refuse to be progressive about it.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:50 pmunbelievable-Wow, I guess you missed the post when I said I was FOR protection of animals. No, I have not adopted any children, instead I take responsability for the three I created.
You also missed when I said that I feel ALL people have value. when haev I ever stated that anyone is beneath me.
The three month window is because a reasonable person should be able to decide in a reasonable timeperiod. As pregnancy is devided into trimesters that is a good place to start. Also at three months, the “fetus” has zero chanch of servival out side of the womb.
As for who has the responsibility to care for the children, that is the PARENTS job, not the government na dnot the tax payers.
If two consenting adults have sex and they create a life then it is their responibility to care for that life. ergo if you so not want to risk creating a life then either A) take preventitive measures or B) don’t have sex.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:53 pmWow.
Comment by Zooey — November 18, 2006 @ 12:48 pm
He has better manners than Jason, but he’s basically the same brain in the same pea…
What is it with these men who think they have a right to control our uteruses? Patriarchal cultures do not work. Until we have an Equalitarian culture, our society will suffer the consequences. Mind boggling, really…
November 18th, 2006 at 12:55 pm#268 I think that grave medical danger would include ruination of the womans physical health.
November 18th, 2006 at 12:57 pm#269, I never said I was anti-abortion, I have said I am pro-choice. Again, it goes back to personal morality. But I am against using it a a form of birth control.
And about the sexuality issue. It is not the Republicans that forced the Gay pride parades. That is an attempt to flaunt ones sexuality in the face of society.
And yes, I am a Christian and believe in Jesus. Is there something wrong with that? I thought that I was allowed to believe that way.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:02 pmunbelievable-Wow, I guess you missed the post when I said I was FOR protection of animals.
So, like me, you are a vegan?
No, I have not adopted any children, instead I take responsability for the three I created.
Then you can’t criticize those who have abortions.
You also missed when I said that I feel ALL people have value. when haev I ever stated that anyone is beneath me.
It’s not about saying it Robert, it is about SHOWING it. Which you have done by verbalizing your wish to deny equal rights to woman and gays.
The three month window is because a reasonable person should be able to decide in a reasonable timeperiod.
Says who? You? That’s putting yor beliefs over someone else’s, therefore showing that you feel that those people are beneath you. see how this works yet?
As pregnancy is devided into trimesters that is a good place to start. Also at three months, the “fetus†has zero chanch of servival out side of the womb.
So? Again, this is YOUR opinion, you are trying to force on others…
As for who has the responsibility to care for the children, that is the PARENTS job, not the government na dnot the tax payers.
Funny. Really. Join reality. If you think we the tax payers do notsupport unwanted children for the rest of their lives, you are far deeperin denial than I originally though.
Women who have unwanted pregnancies generally tend to be people who don’t have a whole lot of self-worth to begin with. You think people like that can raise healthy and happy chidlren that they didn’t really want in the first place? Please tell me that you, a parent influencing teh development of three chidlren, aren’t that naive…
If two consenting adults have sex and they create a life then it is their responibility to care for that life. ergo if you so not want to risk creating a life then either A) take preventitive measures or B) don’t have sex.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 12:53 pm
Not only naive, but ignorant to reality. You have not one ounce of understanding that sex is not optional. It’s a human need. Which, I’d be happy to explain if you embraced the reality of evolution…
You are not a progressive Robert, by your own definition and example.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:03 pmI think that grave medical danger would include ruination of the womans physical health.
Comment by Robert
Thank you for that clarification, Robert.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:04 pmI think that grave medical danger would include ruination of the womans physical health.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 12:57 pm
Gee, how generous of you…
November 18th, 2006 at 1:06 pm#271 – Actually, unbelievable, I wouldn’t put him in with the likes of Jason. Robert seems to have at least thought about his positions, even if we don’t agree.
Jason spouts the ultra-rightwing position, with none of the required thought given, and heaps on a dose of sexual harassment as something special for the ladies. Creep.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:08 pmI never said I was anti-abortion, I have said I am pro-choice. Again, it goes back to personal morality. But I am against using it a a form of birth control.
Again, as you seem to be missing this – ot’s not what you SAY but what you DO.
Against using it a a form of birth control? Then don’t. But you can’t tell anyone else that they cannot. It’s not your life, your womb, or your embryo/fetus…
And about the sexuality issue. It is not the Republicans that forced the Gay pride parades. That is an attempt to flaunt ones sexuality in the face of society.
Oh please. There would be no Gay Pride Parades if the Republicans didn’t expect gays to be straight or celebate.
Only those who protest are those who are oppressed. Think about it. Women’s suffrage, Civil Rights, Workers Rights, and Gay Rights (Atheists will be next) – those who are denied by conservatives to be themselves, and therefore must stand up to their oppressors.
And yes, I am a Christian and believe in Jesus. Is there something wrong with that? I thought that I was allowed to believe that way.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 1:02 pm
You are not the victim Robert. Don’t try to pull that third grade ‘why are you picking on me’ nonsense when you are called out for your hypocrisy.
And, see, I was right about Jesus being your crutch. Even if you won’t admit it, it’s very obvious to real progressives…
November 18th, 2006 at 1:12 pmActually, unbelievable, I wouldn’t put him in with the likes of Jason. Robert seems to have at least thought about his positions, even if we don’t agree.
Then you are more trusting of him than I am. After having debated many people who start off like Robert, in the long run, they haven’t actually thought of anything at all. They are just lighter versions. But they still use the Republican foundation and Jesus to defend their “opinions”.
Robert is no different from Jason on women’s issues. Watch… I believe that if he sticks around, time will tell. Jason didn’t start off much different than this. But it didn’t last…
Jason spouts the ultra-rightwing position, with none of the required thought given, and heaps on a dose of sexual harassment as something special for the ladies. Creep.
Comment by Zooey — November 18, 2006 @ 1:08 pm
He didn’t start out like that though.
Interesting how he has disappeared…
November 18th, 2006 at 1:18 pm#280, All I was stateing was do not demonize me for my beliefs just as I do not demonize you for yours.
The last thing I am is a victim of anyone.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:21 pmExley,
You are still giving me opinions. Give me proof that there are only the “43,850 and 48,693″ civilian deaths… (just because that is all that is reported means nothing. Look at our unemployment rate that excludes everyone not receiving benefits).
My article explained their process for determination. So far, you’ve just given me numbers. Tell me how and why they are valid.
Thank you.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:22 pm#278, Against using it a a form of birth control? Then don’t. But you can’t tell anyone else that they cannot. It’s not your life, your womb, or your embryo/fetus…
did I not say it is not my place to force my views on others. It is not my place to force you to think is is wrong and it is not your place to force me to think it is right.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:24 pmInteresting how he has disappeared…
Comment by unbelievable
Maybe Jason is re-gathering the christian faith he “put aside” in order to destroy us. The fact that he is able to put aside his faith to accomplish any stated goal is pretty disturbing to me.
I’ve seen Jason here and there, so I don’t think we’ve seen the last of that one.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:24 pmAll I was stateing was do not demonize me for my beliefs just as I do not demonize you for yours.
Excep tthat your beliefs kill innocent women and children in Iraq, force unwanted children into this world, and put burdens upon an already burdened world. Therefore, I will demonize you for them. It’s my right to do so.
And really, I don’t care if you demonize me for mine. Your beliefs of me do not hurt me or anyone else. It’s your actions that trouble me…
The last thing I am is a victim of anyone.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 1:21 pm
Then stop acting like it.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:25 pm#277, Zooey, thank you for at least a little credit. Yes we may not agree, but ain’t that what this counrty is all about . The right to express a differing opinion.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:26 pmdid I not say it is not my place to force my views on others. It is not my place to force you to think is is wrong and it is not your place to force me to think it is right.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 1:24 pm
Robert, I’ll speak s.l.o.w.l.y…
It’s ACTIONS not WORDS that matter.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:26 pmMaybe Jason is re-gathering the christian faith he “put aside†in order to destroy us. The fact that he is able to put aside his faith to accomplish any stated goal is pretty disturbing to me.
You have more faith in him than I do. I would bet he’s somewhere trying to rationalize his actions and planning his next campaign against progressives…
I’ve seen Jason here and there, so I don’t think we’ve seen the last of that one.
Comment by Zooey — November 18, 2006 @ 1:24 pm
I have no doubt that you’re right. And he’ll be louder and more obnoxious than ever when some minor thing happens that makes his crazy notions look valid.
He should become a preacherman of some weird snake cult. That would probably fit him best.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:30 pmSo, in order to show that I am pro-choice, should I get my wife pregnant and then have her abort it?
I determine my own belief system THAT IS ACTION. I determine what is appropriot in MY HOUSEHOLD, that is action.
YOUR actions state that if my opinion is different than yours that I am wrong, a sexist and a biggot.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:32 pmShould have said”
Except that actions from your beliefs kill innocent women and children in Iraq
November 18th, 2006 at 1:32 pmYou have more faith in him than I do.
Comment by unbelievable
I guess I should have said he was re-gathering his perception of his christian faith. I have no doubt his “faith” is corrupted beyond any redemption.
unbelievable, you are an atheist, and I am not a christian, but both of us are more “christian” in our everyday lives and attitudes than Jason could ever imagine being.
If he checks this thread, you do realize Jason will be thrilled about us talking about him, don’t you? :P
November 18th, 2006 at 1:37 pmAll I was stateing was do not demonize me for my beliefs just as I do not demonize you for yours.
Excep tthat your beliefs kill innocent women and children in Iraq, force unwanted children into this world, and put burdens upon an already burdened world. Therefore, I will demonize you for them. It’s my right to do so.
and the beliefs of the Muslim EXTREME save lives? If you didn’t want the children you shouldn’t have made them.
And really, I don’t care if you demonize me for mine. Your beliefs of me do not hurt me or anyone else. It’s your actions that trouble me…
I would not do that to you because it is your right to think and feel the way you do and I recognize that right.
I do not feel I have acted as a victim of anyone. I love the fact that you can think what you want of me. It means that I am doing my job correctly.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:38 pmI guess I should have said he was re-gathering his perception of his christian faith. I have no doubt his “faith†is corrupted beyond any redemption.
We agree.
unbelievable, you are an atheist, and I am not a christian, but both of us are more “christian†in our everyday lives and attitudes than Jason could ever imagine being.
Back before paranoia got the best of IRI and he was still posting here, we were having a debate about some Christian aspect that he was, as usual, being hypocritical about. I quoted something that got some random liberal to tell me that she thought I was a true Christian and IRI was not. I still laugh about that one.
I agree with you. And if everyone who claimed to be a Christian actually acted like one, there would be no need to point out how their hypocrisy is destroying our society. They are happier to blame it on those of us non-believers who are trying to stop them from succeeding.
If he checks this thread, you do realize Jason will be thrilled about us talking about him, don’t you? :P
Comment by Zooey — November 18, 2006 @ 1:37 pm
You always have to be right, don’t you ; )
November 18th, 2006 at 1:45 pmIt means that I am doing my job correctly.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 1:38 pm
Huh? By killing innocent people in a country who never attacked us?
See why I don’t care for your ideology Robert? It’s laden with hypocrisy. patronization and conservativism…
November 18th, 2006 at 1:47 pmIf you were doing your job Robert, Osama would be in custody…
November 18th, 2006 at 1:50 pmYou always have to be right, don’t you ; )
Comment by unbelievable
We are the same. :)
namaste
November 18th, 2006 at 1:53 pmIt means that I am doing my job correctly.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 1:38 pm
Huh? By killing innocent people in a country who never attacked us?
See why I don’t care for your ideology Robert? It’s laden with hypocrisy. patronization and conservativism…
Comment by unbelievable
Funny, I have never killed anyone.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:58 pmunbelievable, You forget that there is a long history of peopel tha tmissed the opportunity to get Osamma.
November 18th, 2006 at 1:59 pmnamaste
Comment by Zooey — November 18, 2006 @ 1:53 pm
Namaste
November 18th, 2006 at 2:01 pmFunny, I have never killed anyone.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 1:58 pm
Stop spinning and back pedalling – it makes you look desperate and cornered.
Oh, John Basilone was a relative of mine.
unbelievable, You forget that there is a long history of peopel tha tmissed the opportunity to get Osamma.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 1:59 pm
No I don’t. I am only pointing out that you’ve not helped capture him, because blaming those no longer in the position to do so doesn’t motivate those in power to do anything about it now.
You can only control you. Focus on what you are not doing.
November 18th, 2006 at 2:04 pmIa m am controlling me, that is the point. And despite what you may think, I feel my efforts in my current job have aided in leading to his capture. Personally, I think the guy died of old age.
You state that my beliefs lead me to kill innocent women and children in Iraq. You made the issue personal. All I did was clarify to you that I have not killed anyone. Where is the spin?
November 18th, 2006 at 2:37 pmAnd despite what you may think, I feel my efforts in my current job have aided in leading to his capture. Where is the spin?
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 2:37 pm
Iraq had NOTHING to do with anything but King George’s misguided ego (he couldn’t find oil in Texas)… They didn’t attack us or were planning to attack us. And 3 years of thousands of lives and billions of dollars have shown why Saddam ruled with an iron fist. Because Democracy does not work with their culture.
So, what you’re doing there is not the job we want you to be doing. Capisce?
Where is the spin?
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 2:37 pm
You’re ignoring it.
Oh, and thanks for showing that you are not who you claim. Every time I go to Arlington National Cemetary to visit my cousin’s grave (John Basilone), I practically get saluted. The fact that you ignored my relation to a man that every Marine I have ever met was taught to revere shows that you are not a Marine.
I was suspicious. Thanks for validating it with your ignorance.
November 18th, 2006 at 2:54 pmunbelievable,
Actually, the fact that you claim to be related to “Manila John” was not lost on me. the story of how he was awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor for holding of waves of Japanese attacks is the thing that legends are made of. But you can not transfer his glory and heroics onto yourself. That would be equal to you taking credit for his deeds.
Again, if you would like to question my itegrety or honesty, I challenge you to e-mail me at bulls-it1@lycos.com and I will send all the proof you would like.
November 18th, 2006 at 4:06 pmCome on, big mouth, remember actions speak louder than words.
November 18th, 2006 at 4:26 pmActually, the fact that you claim to be related to “Manila John†was not lost on me. the story of how he was awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor for holding of waves of Japanese attacks is the thing that legends are made of. But you can not transfer his glory and heroics onto yourself. That would be equal to you taking credit for his deeds.
Took you that long to Google him to get the facts, eh?
I wasn’t claiming taking credit for his deeds, just testing you. You failed. I am not surprised.
Again, if you would like to question my itegrety or honesty, I challenge you to e-mail me at bulls-it1@lycos.com and I will send all the proof you would like.
Comment by Robert — November 18, 2006 @ 4:06 pm
I am not that naive or gullable. And I really don’t care. I just am good at smelling out a rat and then validating it.
Seems I am better at my “work” than you at yours…
Later.
November 18th, 2006 at 4:27 pmCome on, big mouth, remember actions speak louder than words.
Comment by robert — November 18, 2006 @ 4:26 pm
Keep proving that you have nothing but WORDS and THREATS Bobby. Now, it’s nothing more than amusing.
Besides, I have other things to do now. I am done playing with you.
November 18th, 2006 at 4:29 pmUnbelievable,
google SSgt Robert M. Perkovich, unless you do want to burden yourself with checking facts before opening your mouth
November 18th, 2006 at 4:45 pmNancy is cool, calm, and collected. She paid her due respects to Murtha, gave the impression she might be ill-rational and/or ignorant, but then managed to get a 100% vote for her chosen position. Don’t you think she knew ahead of time Stoney would win? How do you keep unity in the ranks and the circle unbroken? Murtha will continue do what he does best. Being almost prehistoric with a type reptilian scaling, Murtha is our bigga boy to get in your face or china cabinet. He’s a mean mother scooter and will work best where he landed. Pesoli finally has evened up her justice with him and will sail onward on any type sea with a party united. Criticism from any pundit will be pissing in the wind. I detect a level of petty envy and jealousy. Jesus, we are also witnessing democracy in action. Did we forget so quick? Pelosi is one slick maverick who doubles as a tough cookie. Shudder you Republican swine and the looming instant karmic wrath of past deeds done.
November 18th, 2006 at 7:42 pmhe’s soooo full of shit, you can see him just lieing his ass off,what a jag off…………..
November 18th, 2006 at 7:53 pmSsgt Robert M. Perkovich #240
You should fell the sting of REAL discrimination…
…you should be discriminated against because you’re a dumb CONNED’servative al cracker male who thinks his sh*t doesn’t stink…
…you believe that you have all the answers and that your life is worth more than anybody else’s…
…you talk sh*t like you believe everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion…
…but you’re a lying, racist, TREASONOUS, anti-American, right wing, inbred Busite corksucker…
…by very virtue of your admittedly CONNED’servative ideological bent…
…you’re irrelevant and idiotic…
November 18th, 2006 at 8:33 pm#309,
I never said that I was discriminated against., I never said my sh*t don’t stink.
I never claim to have all the answers, but many others here claim to.
I do not think my life is more valuable than anyone elses. But it is not less valuable.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion and no one has the right to stiffle anothers opinion
Show me one time I have lied, displayed any sign of racisim, acted in a treasonous manner, displayed and anti-Americam view.
My parents were not related prior to their marriage and I have never sucked a cork in my life.
I am glad that the “enlightened progressive” people here like to launch personal attacks against people they know nothing about. Beats trying to argue with facts, don’t it. Facts take time and research, emotion is so much easier.
I am white, for what ever that is worth, and I do alighn myself more to the right than the left. So, big papa, out of 11 attempts to attack me, you have discovered that I am a white republican. Wow, like there is any surprize in that.
November 18th, 2006 at 8:53 pmRobert,
Tell me about your website.
Basically, I don’t click on anything with just someone’s word that it’s interesting, because that can really be some bad news if you believe the wrong person.
November 18th, 2006 at 9:16 pmIt is basically a “fun” site for Bulls-it, as the name implies. Mainly an expression of our view of all the bull in the world. Politics, Coffee, OJ Simpson, what ever we feel at teh moment. We are always looking for contributors. On that site all views are equal and little is sacred.
November 18th, 2006 at 9:23 pmThank you, Robert.
Two more things:
1. Why give out the email address first?
2. Am I going to have to wade through all that shit all over again to find the link?
November 18th, 2006 at 9:29 pmRobert. If you were ordered by to drop WP on a civilain population what would you do?
November 18th, 2006 at 9:33 pmZooey, when someone claims to be military, always watch a while. If they are not they will trip up eventually.
Lies are harder to keep up with than truth. People forget the lie.
and Robert, why did you offer an email link when you were talking about a web site.
November 18th, 2006 at 9:47 pmNo one is gonna give you their email address forwhatever stunt you have in mind.
#313, for further offline debate as I find your ideas and approach interesting. the link is bulls-it1.tripod.com
November 18th, 2006 at 9:47 pmRobert. If you were ordered by to drop WP on a civilain population what would you do?
Comment by Wayne
Wayne, If I were asked to drop White Phosphorous (WP) on a civilian population I would deny the order. That would be an illegal order under the UCMJ. I am not sure which article.
And I have no scheme in mind. I do like to have an honest exchange of ideas with those that will listen to an opposing view with an open mind.
November 18th, 2006 at 9:53 pm#316
Giving TP more free advertisement with a link from your silly nonsense of a rant, I see. Good. hahaha
Those that can actually read can decide for themselves what is bulldooky.
November 18th, 2006 at 9:55 pmThose that can actually read can decide for themselves what is bulldooky.
Comment by Wayne
Wayne,
I am interested to know what soured you on Robert. I think I missed something.
(Link doesn’t work anyway.)
November 18th, 2006 at 10:00 pm#312 right answer. It is against “law of land warfare” in the marine code and you should know it is. It is required reading before you are deployed to a combat situation, last I knew. Maybe they are getting lax these day?
Next question, if law of land warfare was violated and WP was dropped on a civilian population killing women, children, and elderly, would you consider that a war crime?
November 18th, 2006 at 10:06 pmWayne, did I not say it was just for fun?
November 18th, 2006 at 10:06 pmYay ren!
November 18th, 2006 at 10:17 pm#321, If it is a deliberate act, then yes. If it is a matter that an Artillary round fell shout due to no fault of the gun team, no. But following an illegal order makes you as responable as the person issueing the order. it is a war crime.
I would love to answer more, but my wife has the night off. You can call my little site bulldooky, but it is just a couple guys having fun. Sorry it did not meet your standard.
November 18th, 2006 at 10:19 pmI am interested to know what soured you on Robert. I think I missed something.
—- Zooey
His response to Unbelievable’s reference to her cousin John Basilone was unbelievable for a Marine. If he is a marine, he should be ashamed.
Was playing todays gig earlier, had a chance to catch up reading the thread after I got back home, to see what I missed.
November 18th, 2006 at 10:24 pmWas playing todays gig earlier, had a chance to catch up reading the thread after I got back home, to see what I missed.
Comment by Wayne
Glad you’re back!
I didn’t get the John Basilone reference. I’ll run the name by a former boss — the retired Marine Colonel, now attorney. I’m sure to regret it, because he’ll have a million stories. :)
November 18th, 2006 at 10:36 pmI’m sure to regret it, because he’ll have a million stories. :)
— Zooey
hehehe, that line reminds me of my Dad and my Grandad.
November 18th, 2006 at 10:40 pmhehehe, that line reminds me of my Dad and my Grandad.
Comment by Wayne
I’ll give you his address and you can listen to the stories. Heh.
November 18th, 2006 at 10:42 pmI didn’t get the John Basilone reference
– Zooey
He was the only enlisted marine to ever get the Purple Heart, the Navy Cross and the Medal of Honor all in WWII.
He was killed at Iwo Jima taking out an enemy installation after he had volenteered for combat again.
Hell, any WWII history buff can tell you that, much less a marine. And the arogant response to Unbelievable, “But you can not transfer his glory and heroics onto yourself. That would be equal to you taking credit for his deeds.”, is something no true marine would ever say to a relative of John Basilone.
I was astounded.
November 18th, 2006 at 10:51 pmI was astounded.
Comment by Wayne
So Basilone is a hero in the Marine Corps, and his disrespect to unbelievable was out of bounds in that context.
November 18th, 2006 at 10:55 pmSo Basilone is a hero in the Marine Corps, and his disrespect to unbelievable was out of bounds in that context.
– Zooey
Exactly.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:02 pmCool.
So Wayne, what do you do when you’re not playing gigs and collecting the ladies?
November 18th, 2006 at 11:04 pmHe also said he could not tell me the section or article where incendiary on a civillian population is prohibited, did not mention “law of land warfare” ( exact wording from the code), which gives me more suspision, since he claimed he has deployed to Iraq at some time.
Then he bows out after I start questioning him further.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:08 pmThat’s something any Marine of any rank would be required to know?
November 18th, 2006 at 11:12 pmSo Wayne, what do you do when you’re not playing gigs and collecting the ladies?
— Zooey
My day job, I work for one of the major computer manufacturers finding and fixing software and hardware “bugs”.
Collecting ladies? I don’t have to try hard for a date, but I stick to dating one at a time
November 18th, 2006 at 11:14 pmI’m not real into onenight stands
Old fashioned of me, I know. =P
My day job, I work for one of the major computer manufacturers finding and fixing software and hardware “bugsâ€.
So anytime these companies put out software that drives us batshit crazy, it’s job security for you? :)
Old fashioned of me, I know. =P
Comment by Wayne
I would think a rock guitar player would have to shake the ladies off at the exit. :-D
November 18th, 2006 at 11:20 pmHey…I was looking for some hijacking…but in the first threads!!! not in this one…good thing Ive already found you. ;)
November 18th, 2006 at 11:27 pmHey, Juan. Pretty quiet evening again. How are you?
November 18th, 2006 at 11:30 pmAnd it doesn’t count as thread hijacking after 300 comments — or in this case — 30 comments. Mort Kondracke? Please…
November 18th, 2006 at 11:32 pmThat’s something any Marine of any rank would be required to know?
—- Zooey
FM 27-10, The Law of Land Warfare is the name of the handbook.
Why I mentioned he did not name “law of land warfare“.
Yes he should know the name of the book and chaper 2, section 3, Forbidden means of waging warfare. He should have had a “class” covering it before ever deploying to a combat zone.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:40 pmFine, Zoo…:) And you? Long thread this one.
Wayne: I saw your discussion with Robert about the troops.
Public relations is a huge industry. They’re spending by now something on the order of a billion dollars a
November 18th, 2006 at 11:44 pmyear. All along its committment was to controlling the public mind….
…The corporate executive and the guy who cleans the floor all have the same interests. We can all work
together and work for Americanism in harmony, liking each other. That was essentially the message. A
huge amount of effort was put into presenting it. This is, after all, the business community, so they
control the media and have massive resources… Mobilizing community opinion in favor of vapid, empty
concepts like Americanism. Who can be against that? Or, to bring it up to date, “Support our troops.”
Who can be against that? Or yellow ribbons. Who can be against that?… The point of public relations
slogans like “Support our troops” is that they don’t mean anything. They mean as much as whether you
support the people in Iowa. Of course, there was an issue. The issue was, Do you support our policy?
But you don’t want people to think about the issue. That’s the whole point of good propaganda. You
want to create a slogan that nobody’s going to be against, and everybody’s going to be for, because
nobody knows what it means, because it doesn’t mean anything, but its crucial value is that it diverts
your attention….
I would think a rock guitar player would have to shake the ladies off at the exit. :-D
—- Zooey
Well not always =D
I really like it when the ladies dance right in front of the stage.
Gee,may posting is slowing, must be size of the thread.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:48 pmHe should have had a “class†covering it before ever deploying to a combat zone.
Comment by Wayne
Very enlightening, Wayne. Thanks.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:49 pmI really like it when the ladies dance right in front of the stage.
Imagine that. :)
Gee,may posting is slowing, must be size of the thread.
Comment by Wayne
We should have hijacked the Ashcroft thread. At least it has a funny picture.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:52 pmFine, Zoo…:) And you? Long thread this one.
Comment by Juan C
I’m doing well. I’m recently unemployed, and quite happy about it. I’m glad Briseadh na Faire passed his bar exams — as if there was any doubt of that — because I’m done with the law. I’ll pass all my knowledge off to him. Ugh.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:55 pmI’m recently unemployed, and quite happy about it.
Comment by Zooey
What happened? Too boring?
November 18th, 2006 at 11:57 pmWayne: I saw your discussion with Robert about the troops.
– Juan
Yeah the “support the troops” hype by the repugs is a base lie.
If they supported the troops, the troops would be treated better.
From not getting the needed body armor, to the cuts for veterans and BS the VA is pulling on Vets.
Plus the civilian deaths, like in Faluja by internationally outlawed use of incendiary on civillians to torture of prisoners.
This whole administration is wacked and they are war criminals.
November 18th, 2006 at 11:58 pmWhat happened? Too boring?
Comment by Juan C
Never boring, Juan. Just too full of bitches. At this point in my life, I’m not putting up with bitchy office politics. Life is too short for that — or too long, however you might look at it. :P
November 19th, 2006 at 12:01 amThis whole administration is wacked and they are war criminals.
Comment by Wayne
This is going to get so much worse before it gets better.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:03 amThis whole administration is wacked and they are war criminals.
Comment by Wayne
I completely agree. Now, dont get mad, do you think there is a great belic culture that becomes almost a fascination about wars in US citizens? I mean…jets flying over a baseball game (what for?), the cowboy legacy, the “kill em all”, the “army wants you”, etc. How does an intelligent person survives that way of living? I am asking sincerely.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:05 amAt this point in my life, I’m not putting up with bitchy office politics.
Comment by Zooey
You know, I dont have too much experience working in the usual sense of the word: 8 a.m. to 6 p.m., wearing a tie, having a lot of coffee, talking about the legs of the new secretary, getting drunk with the clients so they can sign contracts…etc. I found that that kind of life, wasnt for me. It made me sick, literally, when I worked in an office. It was a company which provided big boilers to pharmaceutics, food companies, etc. The pay was ok, but I rather live poor and happy than wealthy and with a face like Ashcroft (years without sex…)
November 19th, 2006 at 12:11 amdo you think there is a great belic culture that becomes almost a fascination about wars in US citizens?
— Juan C
Not really.
I do think curturally we are bass-ackwards, personally.
On television you can see blood spattered corpses on shows and thats supposed to be good entertainment, death good entertainment?
Yet the act of creating life or human anatomy is an “obsenity”.
Really backwards in my world view.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:20 amPersonally I cannot stand war movies, I have to go outside if one is on or make them turn it off.
War is NOT entertainment.
The pay was ok, but I rather live poor and happy than wealthy and with a face like Ashcroft (years without sex…)
Comment by Juan C
Oy god, a face like Ashcroft’s. We all need to double up on the sex, I think…
I agree, Juan. I’d rather be poor and happy, than wealthy and miserable. I wish it wasn’t getting toward winter, I’d go on a road trip. That would be fun.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:22 amWar is NOT entertainment.
Comment by Wayne
That can only be known from people who have been there. I am grateful that you are here, spreading knowledge and progress.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:26 amI do think curturally we are bass-ackwards, personally.
On television you can see blood spattered corpses on shows and thats supposed to be good entertainment, death good entertainment?
Yet the act of creating life or human anatomy is an “obsenityâ€.
Comment by Wayne
Absolutely. I knew women who would buy horribly violent movies and videogames for their children, but who almost died when Janet Jackson’s boob appeared for a split second. That disgusts me.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:26 amWe all need to double up on the sex, I think…
—- Zooey
That sounds fun. =D
November 19th, 2006 at 12:28 amI wish it wasn’t getting toward winter, I’d go on a road trip. That would be fun.
Comment by Zooey
Go south, then. Mexican beaches. I recommend Nexpa in Michoacán…and for your entertainment dozens of brazilian, german and american surfers.
Did you quit in an outburst or you gave it a thought?
November 19th, 2006 at 12:29 amThat disgusts me.
Comment by Zooey
I disagree, Zoo. I like boobies. :)
November 19th, 2006 at 12:31 amThat can only be known from people who have been there. I am grateful that you are here, spreading knowledge and progress.
— Juan C
There was a troll a couple days ago that used the name VeteranPatriot, who said he “enjoyed” combat.
I knew he was fake when he said that.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:37 amAnyone that says they enjoyed combat either has never really been there or is a candidate for a section 8 (crazy).
Go south, then. Mexican beaches. I recommend Nexpa in Michoacán…and for your entertainment dozens of brazilian, german and american surfers.
Could be interesting. :)
Did you quit in an outburst or you gave it a thought?
Comment by Juan C
Let me put it this way, Juan. While I was thinking about getting the hell out of there, they were thinking the same thing. Heh. They offered to let me resign, and would pay me until the end of November. Sounded like a good deal to me!
I’ve got enough good references, and a good enough reputation that this won’t be a big deal.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:37 amI disagree, Zoo. I like boobies. :)
Comment by Juan C
I guess that didn’t come across well! It was the violent games and movies, and the other mothers’ attitude, that disgusted me — not the boob.
I carry two boobs around with me all the time. We have made our peace. :)
November 19th, 2006 at 12:40 amI carry two boobs around with me all the time. We have made our peace. :)
—- Zooey
lmao
I should hope so.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:42 amthis won’t be a big deal.
Comment by Zooey
I dont have a doubt. :)
I carry two boobs around with me all the time. We have made our peace. :)
November 19th, 2006 at 12:47 amDo you have any link to back that up? ;)
There was a troll a couple days ago that used the name VeteranPatriot, who said he “enjoyed†combat.
Comment by Wayne
That one was nuts. Most people I know who have been combat never talk about that aspect of their service, even if they truly enjoyed their military experience.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:47 amDo you have any link to back that up? ;)
Comment by Juan C
Briseadh na Faire has corrupted you terribly. As usual, the spam filter keeps deleting my links…..Heh.
Goodnight Juan & Wayne. It’s been fun. My boobs and I are off to bed. No links…
:)
November 19th, 2006 at 12:51 amComment by Zooey
Take care both of you!!!
Im off, too. Wayne, thanks for the posts.
November 19th, 2006 at 12:53 amWayne,
Again, I am sorry if I do not meet your standard of what a Marine is. I do not have my stack of TMs, FMs and a copy of the UCMJ sitting here in my house.
As for my post to unbeleavable. She makes a claim to be related to Bastilone which was out of the context of the issue we were discussing. Her supposed relationship does not give her any impunity or special privilage or make her immune from criticism.
I have nothing to prove to anyone here. If you can not handle a differing view that your are not as “progressive” as you claim.
Wayne, buddy, you know so much. Use the mlitary locator and look me up.
November 19th, 2006 at 8:58 amIf you would like a list of the classes we take before we deplow, they incliude: Law of War, Rules of Engagement, Convoy Operations, Code of Conduct, Combat Life Saving, to start. Any of these look Familiar, Wayne?
Oh, Don’t forget the option for SLAC (Survival Level Arabic Course), as well as the number of “Smart Cards” and “Pointy-talky” cards we carry in our pocket.
All disbelievers in me. I know that no matter what information I present to you, you will instantly call it manufactured. If that helps you sleep better then so be it.
November 19th, 2006 at 9:33 amBy launching into personal attacks instead of sticking to the issue at hand you weaken your arguements. I have not asked any of you to prove who you are. I you at your word. Wayne, I believe you served, and honorably at that (that is a given), and I do not doubt anything about your family serving. I do not even doubt unbelievables claim to be related to Basilone. But what ever happened to sticking to the issue at hand and not personalizing things.
This has shown to be a site dedicated to only those that want to follow the party line and are afraid to give equal time to the opposing view.
Zooey, you seem to be the exception that proves the rule. Thank you for sticking to the issues at hand.
November 19th, 2006 at 9:44 amIf Kondracke had used “the Emperor without clothes” or some such phrase in relation to Bush, he would have been excoriated. But it’s OK to attack a Democratic woman by calling her names. The men just can’t stand that a woman, Nancy Pelosi, has a position of authority. They will never admit that she will do anything right.
November 19th, 2006 at 1:08 pmSince Peeeloshi crapped out on her first roll it is fun watching the lefties squirm. Voted down by her own dummie’s. Appointing an impeached judge, who has proven he will take a bribe, to protect the country will be the next big mistake. Talk about leaked National Security Secrets? Not a good start.
The icing on the cake will be when old Rangel intoduces his new “Draft” bill. I’ve recommended the republicans abstain on every vote and the only comment from them should be ‘no comment’. Let the dimmi’s introduce the bill and pass it. You know it only goes from age 18 to 42 now. All of the lefties will be voting republican in 08 or their children, brothers, and sisters will be fighting in North Korea and Iran in 09.
Dang, this election has made life fun for the republicans. Let the Wicked Witch of the West and her herd of idiots get slaughtered in 08.
November 19th, 2006 at 3:20 pmHey Juan
You mean like the almost 3000 innocent people killed on 911?
Wake up and realize that the world has changed and the only way to bring it back to some sort of normalcy is to go after ALL terrorists where they hide and KILL them before they kill us. Even if it takes 30 years, I’m willing to wait. The next ime we have a terrorist attack here in the US, you’ll be singing a different tune.
This liberal head-in-the-sand mentallity makes me want to puke.
I’ll state again. You try to negotiate with the terrorists and report back how you were received….LOL.
Good luck!
November 20th, 2006 at 4:32 pmIf Kerry was insulting the troops, like the rightards say, why did he specify Iraq and not Afganistan? Why didn’t he say, “you might find yourself in Japan” or “patrolling the border between North and South Korea”? No, if your daddy’s paying for your C grades while you’re a cheerleader who doesn’t study, you might bungle things like Iraq.
Fact is, and no politician will admit this, if you don’t study hard (and in some cases, even if you do), due to the damage done by the Rethuglican party to our economy, your only choice of a halfway decent job is to join the miliarty anymore.
November 30th, 2006 at 12:28 pmI don’t know about any liberal-with-head-in-sand approach you’re talking about. Nice strawman. Going after terrorists is fine. Making new ones is not. No one bitched about going after the Taliban. Labeling all brown people as terrorists and throwing armies in a general direction trying to occupy countries is not the way to go – very stupid in fact, since it bleeds our armies, bogs them down, and still leaves us just as vulnerable to terrorist attacks at home. Terrorism should be treated as a police action – invest at home, educate our police on what to look for i.e. detective skills. The Iraq revenge fantasy was a bust. Revenge is a vicious cycle. Now we’ve created Iraqi terrorists for generations to come instead.
Rather than stop the arrogant and incensitive behavior that got these terrorists so pissed to begin with, the current administration has played right into their hands, doing exactly what they want, acting arrogant, attacking the wrong people, and bogging down and bleeding the armies. Now our armies are spread thin, demoralized, and are not stopping terrorists. “rather fight them there than here” – what a crock of $h!t – none of this Iraq war stopped some kids from bombings in London, Madrid, or Bali now did it? None of the action against these Arab terrorists stopped the Anthrax attacks here in the US.
Not everything can be solved with a military action, and if it can, it helps to, oh I don’t know, maybe go after the people who were actually responsible. If memory serves me right, there wasn’t a single Iraqi on any of those planes – most were from Saudi Arabia, where they still teach children to hate America, but that doesn’t seem to phase Bush or his worshppers.
Fact is, Bush and his followers wanted revenge and they wanted it quick (not very Christian)…and they thought Iraq would be an easy victory. Had they actually followed his Daddy’s example and stuck with surgical strikes rather than attempts at occupation, we wouldn’t be in this mess and we could have used the umpteen billions of dollars to invest in our own country.
November 30th, 2006 at 12:38 pm[...] Update (12/4/06): See this post in Think Progress. Someone else had the same idea. [...]
December 4th, 2006 at 7:36 amThe terrorists are emboldened by the mid-term elections and an outcome in which they believe was a victory for them. Watching Pelosi being sworn in serves to create more hatred for America and it’s collective way of life. I’m sure hearing her cackle surrounded by a bunch of children really instilled fear in the hearts of the terrorists. This blog is a shining example of how the terrorists, their methods and their goals of divide and conquer will prevail over the USA and it’s collective way of life. Your children are going to die at the hands of these terrorists; you just fanned the flame. While all of you waste your time pounding meaningless words which will NEVER EVER CHANGE ONE THING, the terrorists are plotting a way to kill you and your children. Your collective ignorance is very scary and I’m glad I did not bring children into this world…..Here is a riddle: Was there more violence and death in IRAQ or California in 2005. The answer is CALIFORNIA!
Blog on dolts while the world is burning around you!!!!!!
January 7th, 2007 at 11:38 amThe wicked witch is the perfect complement to the senior senator from Gomorrah running the other house. Where is that little girl from Kansas with the pigtails and the bucket of water?
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