Rice Was Against Iraq Group Before She Was For It
Rice Was Against Iraq Group Before She Was For It
Last week, Salon ran a glowing piece about Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice’s role in creating the Iraq Study Group, an independent panel meant to advise the administration on Iraq policy. The article credited Rice with taking Rep. Frank Wolf’s (R-VA) idea to create the panel and personally pitching it to President Bush:
“It was remarkable that Condi Rice took the lead,” said David Abshire, president of the Center for the Study of the Presidency in Washington, and one of four people in the November meeting, including Rice. The Iraq Study Group, he said, “happened with her going to the president.” [...]
Asked to comment on this article, a State Department spokesman would say only that Rice supported the idea of the Iraq Study Group from early on. “The department and the administration have embraced this effort from the beginning as a way to show and maintain public support for advancing our goals in Iraq,” said spokesman Gonzalo Gallegos.
But when a similar panel was suggested in 2002 — when a postwar plan would have been most helpful — Rice played a key role in blocking it. From New Yorker reporter George Packer’s book Assassins’ Gate (pp. 110-112):
In October 2002, Leslie Gelb, the president of the Council on Foreign Relations, had approached Rice and Hadley with an offer of help. The council and two other think tanks, the Heritage Foundation and the Center for Strategic and International Studies, would form a consortium that would gather a panel of experts to provide facts and options for the postwar… “This is just what we need,” Rice said… But she didn’t want the involvement of Heritage, which had been critical of the idea of an Irag war. “Do AEI.”
Chris DeMuth, president of the American Enterprise Institute, where the administration’s neoconservatives drew their support and many of their personnel, neither consented nor refused when Gelb broached the possibility. On November 15, the representatives of the think tanks met with Rice and Hadley in Rice’s office at the White House. John Hamre of CSIS went in expecting to pitch the idea to Rice, but the meeting was odd from the start: Rice seemed attentive only to DeMuth, and it was as if the White House was trying to sell something to the American Enterprise Institute rather than the other way around. When Gelb, on the speakerphone from New York, began to describe his concept, DeMuth cut him off. “Wait a minute. What’s all this planning and thnking about postwar Iraq?” He turned to Rice. “This is nation building, and you said you were against that. In the campaign you said it, the president has said it. Does he know you’re doing this? Does Karl Rove know?”
Two weeks later, Hadley called Gelb to tell him what Gelb already knew: “We’re not going to go ahead with it.”
It’s too bad Rice wasn’t interested in outside help four years ago.
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Always reacting to messes they have created themselves. This administration has never taken good advice when it would count for som egood. That is why Bush Co. will go down as the worst presidency in the last…say…60 years.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:13 pmWill the hypocrisy ever end with these neocons?
November 20th, 2006 at 5:15 pmThis is all part of the Rice for POTUS in 2008.
Dr Rice is the most heinous of flipfloppers.
It is no secret at all that Dr Rice basically spit in the face of her *anti-Neocon* mentor Scrowcroft who is known as a Realist which is often juxtaposed against Neocon.
Having stuck and twisted the dagger in his back and rejected most of what he had imparted to her, she morphed into a Neoneocon nation-builder with jack-boots who vociferously cheered that war in Iraq would help make democracy blossom throughout the Middle East.
The world would actually be a different place had she not flip-flopped.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:19 pmShe should rot in prison like the other lying war architects. Ihe iraq study group is nothing more than Georgie senior sending in his boys to clean up yet another of W’s failed ventures. Don’t cry though, Halliburton and Carlyle group already got their money out of the Iraq debacle.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:20 pmThe White House Iraq Group, which had Condi, Cheney and Fat Karl Rove in it, was the bunch of crooks who was behind outing Valerie Plame and her cover company Brewster Jennings.
With Plame and her company gone, the White House could proceed with cherry-picking intel to support the Iraq war, because Plame and her company were doing intel on Iraq WMDS.
They were also in charge of intel on IRAN WMDs, so Chimpy’s WHIG thugs got a twofer – they now can fudge the intel on Iran because the CIA’s Iran WMD experts are all gone now.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:21 pmSo now we’re all supposed to believe that Rice is the nation’s greatest terrorist traitor? Now that Rumsfeld and Rove have pretended to “step down,” the fascists are telling us that Rice is the world’s worst terrorist?
Good frocking grief.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:23 pmAnother “Master Flipflopper” amonst us! Good Grief…does it ever end? I guess when you’re lying and/or otherwise compromised by political ends that’s the result. Eventually, you find yourself with your back up against the wall. Condi has lost all of her political capital and, like Rummy, is a lameduck excuse for the position she holds. She’s “background” right now…a non entity in the national or global sense.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:24 pmI don’t think they’ll get away with “fudging on Iran” – happy to say. The people know they fixed the intel to suit their purposes (aka outright lies) and will not allow themselves to be taken by these “cons” ever again.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:25 pmWhat a silly ninny. Trust but verify. Butin Condi’s case, leave off the ‘trust’ part.
Why do they always have to use a picture!? Why?
November 20th, 2006 at 5:26 pm(Center for the Study of the Presidency)
When do I get my membership card?
Any bennies to go with having been a practicing member for the last 6 years?
Health Insurance? Dental?
401-K?
When’s the next meeting?
Everyone go out and buy a pair of flip flops, and send them to Condi for Christmas…..
November 20th, 2006 at 5:27 pmPayson, I would think Progs and Progettes would welcome a changed mind or attitude over the course of 2002 to 2006 – - And I thought Progs were supposed to be ….progressive…..
November 20th, 2006 at 5:27 pmThey really don’t need to make anything up against Iran. Iran is openly stating that they are building nukes. What more ammo do we need? Honestly, does anyone in the free world think a country sitting on the 2nd or 3rd largest oil reserve in the world would waste money on nuke power? Everyone knows they are building nuke weapons. How we will stop them is really the only major talking point. Is it possible without military action? I hope so but I don’t see how.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:29 pmMA, why to you think they have changed their mind? Could it be the whipping the repukes got in the elections? Seems that was the only way to change their minds.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:35 pmAnd I thought Progs were supposed to be ….progressive…..
Comment by mighty aphrodite — November 20, 2006 @ 5:27 pm
We are – but conservatives are not. You all believe you should pick a viewpoint at birth and follow it for the rest of your lives. That’s the crux of conservativism. View changing is not allowed because it would mean you were initially wrong, and we know all too well that you think you are never wrong.
When have you ever once apologized or retracted anything you’ve ever said? Hmmmm?
November 20th, 2006 at 5:38 pmAmerican $$$Enterprise$$$ Institiute
Need anyone say more??
Think-Tanks are so altered states
November 20th, 2006 at 5:39 pmIran is openly stating that they are building nukes.
To protect themselves from Christian terrorists that invade innocent countries, ya f*cking pile of Republican. We know.
Every nation with oil needs nukes so that they can defend themselves from these god damned Christian monsters.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:40 pmIran is openly stating that they are building nukes. What more ammo do we need?
Comment by Roger_Roger — November 20, 2006 @ 5:29 pm
Not true. Iran has never stated they are building nukes, simply because they do not have the capacity to do so.
What they have anounced is that they are enriching uranium.
Honestly, does anyone in the free world think a country sitting on the 2nd or 3rd largest oil reserve in the world would waste money on nuke power?
If oil + nuclear technology = US military action, then get ready to invade Mexico too. They have have oil as well as a functional nuclear plant. As a matter of fact, their government is planning on building a second one.
Nuclear technology in the hands of those illegal immigrants!? Oh, the humanity!
Everyone knows they are building nuke weapons.
Who is “everyone”? The Bush administration is accusing Iran of pursuing technology that will allow them to build nuclear bombs, not of building them right now.
Do you even try to read the news before you post?
November 20th, 2006 at 5:41 pmHow we will stop them is really the only major talking point
Good f*ucking grief!
Look at this god damned f*cking terrorist mother f*ucker!
Hey, ya f*cking pile of Christian shit, why don’t you get off your f*cking ass and go kill some brown babies personally yourself? You want to stop innocent people from developing defensive capabilities against you god damned Christian mother f*ckers, you go do it yourself.
Or are you all f*cking coward and mouth?
Jesus!
November 20th, 2006 at 5:42 pmEveryone knows they are building nuke weapons. How we will stop them is really the only major talking point. Is it possible without military action? I hope so but I don’t see how.
Comment by Roger_Roger — November 20, 2006 @ 5:29 pm
How about a policy called Mind Your Own Business?
We aren’t the world’s police… And when we have 3,000 nukes, it’s hypocritical to tell someone else that they cannot have one. Especially when we have placed them in an “Axis of Evil” with a country whom we’ve since attacked.
Sheesh Roger. You should be more afraid of being murdered by a fellow American. After all, last year over 16,000 of us shot each other. Osama and his crew got zero (excluding the soliders Bush set up for him as target practice in Iraq).
November 20th, 2006 at 5:42 pmI hope so but I don’t see how.
Comment by Roger_Roger
Keep your pants on, boy. Contrary to what US does, Europe, Russia, China and some ME countries are trying negotiations. We all know you like flashing lights over Baghdad nights, but if that happens over Teheran, expect more of 3,000 of your soldiers coming back in coffins, cause thats how your government values young american lives.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:44 pmOf course they would Roger. If their only real export is Oil then it would be wise to build a nuke power so you could sell more oil.
Canada is a huge supplier of oil to the united states and you will also find CANDU [Heavy water] reacotors. Do you want to go to war with Canada Roger? As long as Iran is using reactors that use non weapons grade or natural uranium then they could also sell more oil reducing the cost of oil to US.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:45 pmWhere does AEI get their money from? Who’s been backing the neocon wing? What do they share with the Hoover Institute at Stanford University (where Rice came from)? The site http://www.sourcewatch.org has a lot of the details on these creepy protofascist neocon organizations.
Roger_Roger, Iran is claiming they want nuclear power for peaceful purposes – a plan that the US was all for before the Iranian religious clerics staged their revolution and threw out the Shah. Regardless of your opinion, get your facts straight.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:47 pmCondi-ment does not relish the thought of playing ketchup to Rumpsfelts lack of mustard.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:47 pmShe’s in a Pickle (heh heh) now.
CIA and the IAEA says differently Roger, do you KNOW something they dont from sitting in front of a CRT?
November 20th, 2006 at 5:47 pmHow about a policy called Mind Your Own Business?
Unbelievable. The worst terrorist State on Earth maintains a weapons stockpile large enough to wipe out every human on Earth, and currently there’s a profoundly insane Christian kook in the White House who is currently leaning on the button, a madman who has been described by the rest of the world as constituing the single worst threat to world peace bar none.
And this god damned kook wants to proclaim Iran’s need to defend themselves as if it were evil.
Man, Christianity is evil even by its own low standards.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:47 pmWORST ADMINISTRATION EVER.
We must launch investigations this Spring to uncover what twisted motivations were truly behind all this.
Either there’s a hidden agenda, or these a**holes are just plain HORRIBLE at running the country.
Or both.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:48 pmPlease don’t confuse us rational Christians with the fundamentalist reactionary sky is falling armageddonist ones of the McVeigh mentality.
Besides the Bible, in Genesis, says it will be a small star [wormwood] that crashes into earth bringing us darkness and not a man made cataclysm.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:51 pmSo basically this crowd is cool with Iran having nuke weapons. That is suprising even from the far left.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:52 pmI don’t believe, and never have believed, that the current occupant of the white house is a Christian, in the definition of the term applying to someone who even attempts to follow the teachings of Jesus the Nazarene.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:54 pmG.Dubious has demonstrated over and over his complete lack of spirituality.
The worst terrorist State on Earth maintains a weapons stockpile large enough to wipe out every human on Earth, and currently there’s a profoundly insane Christian kook in the White House who is currently leaning on the button, a madman who has been described by the rest of the world as constituing the single worst threat to world peace bar none.
I don’t disagree with a single thing you’ve said. In fact, I think it takes a close realitionship with reality to see that the monster in the mirror is your own President.
And this god damned kook wants to proclaim Iran’s need to defend themselves as if it were evil.
He’s probably the same guy who goes to deer farms to shoot tame animals…
Man, Christianity is evil even by its own low standards.
Comment by Fredric L. Rice — November 20, 2006 @ 5:47 pm
Again, no argument from me. The Christian Taliban in this country have done more to harm the planet in the past six years than all the previous Administrations combined.
I don’t believe in revenge, but I will applaud justice the day these people are found guilty of crimes against humanity.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:54 pmBush Allowed Kim Jong to go nuclear Roger — the far nutty right that is.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:56 pmBesides the Bible, in Genesis, says it will be a small star [wormwood] that crashes into earth bringing us darkness and not a man made cataclysm.
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave — November 20, 2006 @ 5:51 pm
The world will end either by the sun running out of fuel (hydrogen) and eventually super novaing in about 5.5 billion years, or by human means.
Lately I think humans will blow up the planet long before the sun depletes its energy source.
November 20th, 2006 at 5:57 pmSo basically this crowd is cool with Iran having nuke weapons. That is suprising even from the far left.
Comment by Roger_Roger — November 20, 2006 @ 5:52 pm
No. We are not cool with ANYONE having nuclear weapons Roger. Including us. Capisce?
November 20th, 2006 at 5:58 pmI fixed your propaganda Roger X Square
November 20th, 2006 at 5:59 pmNovember 20th, 2006 at 6:04 pm
So basically this crowd is cool with Iran having nuke weapons. That is suprising even from the far left.
Yeah. When people are able to defend themselves from terrorist bullies, we have peace. When nations don’t have the means to defend themselves, we get terrorists ike Bush and his Republinazi Party invading them.
There’s a reason why the United States and the Soviet Union maintained a balance of terror. Now that the Christofascist terrorist regime is the world’s sole superpower, we see the consequences.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:05 pm#35 should have said —
or the earth takes a tumble [flips]
November 20th, 2006 at 6:08 pmRoger_Roger = North Eastern Delimma (aka. ned)
November 20th, 2006 at 6:08 pmSo basically this crowd is cool with Iran having nuke weapons. That is suprising even from the far left.
Comment by Roger_Roger — November 20, 2006 @ 5:52 pm
Roger_roger comes back for more, without bothering to read the replies to his first nonsensical garbage.
Roger*2, you obviously have reading comprehension issues. Iran is not building nuclear weapons. They do not have the capacity to do so.
And since you seem like such an authority on the subject; which country has your approval to possess nuclear weapons?
November 20th, 2006 at 6:11 pm[...] I believe that her self-image is that she’s a tough, no-nonsense woman who takes and defends strong stands. Instead, what I see is a weak person, in way over her head, who frequently reverses direction when she encounters resistance and lies frequently. Here’s the latest: [...]
November 20th, 2006 at 6:14 pmI don’t have a problem with her supporting the group when she used to be against it. There’s nothing wrong with that. What I object to is the co-opting of the record by saying that she’s always been for the idea. They can’t get it into their skulls that it’s OKAY to change your mind, but you have to own up to the fact that you changed your mind. You can’t just say something you’ve been against for months as though that’s always been your opinion. It’s insulting my intelligence and I’m even less likely to like them even if what they’re saying is the most right thing in the universe.
The problem with politicians is that they’ll say anything to get votes, even the truth.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:18 pmLately I think humans will blow up the planet long before the sun depletes its energy source.
Comment by unbelievable
I hardly believe humans posed a threat to life on Earth. Life finds it way.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:19 pmwhich country has your approval to possess nuclear weapons?
I’d expect that would be Israel. They’ve got white skin and worship the “right” gods, after all, huh Roger_Roger?
November 20th, 2006 at 6:24 pmAnd since you seem like such an authority on the subject; which country has your approval to possess nuclear weapons?
Comment by Gregor Samsa — November 20, 2006 @ 6:11 pm
You’ll have to wait your turn Gregor. Roger still owes me an explanation of how eliminating social security will pay for Iraq and his proposed deployment of 500,000 troops to the Korean peninsula.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:25 pmI hardly believe humans posed a threat to life on Earth. Life finds it way.
Comment by Juan C — November 20, 2006 @ 6:19 pm
The Bush “Scientists” are planning to launch a school bus sized bomb at the Moon to break off a large portion of it, in an attempt to find water.
I think 5.5 billion years is a long time without humans screwing it up somehow. A large enough nuclear war could do it… So could Global Warming. Some days we’re really just a crazy lunatic episode away from being either Mars-like or Venus-like…
November 20th, 2006 at 6:30 pmQuadrajet,
So many questions, so little time. Where do I take my number? ;-)
November 20th, 2006 at 6:34 pmI think Gregor nailed it. R2 isn’t reading any comments – just blindly posting random nonsense.
That’s the only way he can win an argument… In his own mind anyway.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:34 pmSo could Global Warming. Some days we’re really just a crazy lunatic episode away from being either Mars-like or Venus-like…
Comment by unbelievable
I misunderstood then. Humans will dissapear if that happens, sure. But Earth, destroyed?? Only if a meteor crashes on her. See, we have this human above-all-mentality. Earth will orbit some millions of years more after humans are gone.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:40 pmI hardly believe humans posed a threat to life on Earth. Life finds it way.
Comment by Juan C — November 20, 2006 @ 6:19 pm
In my opinion, humans do pose a threat to life on Earth. Life finds its way, sure, but in the meantime we will be shooting ourselves in the foot.
Earth can carry on without us, and without all the species that we will drag down into extinction along with us. After all, mass exinctions are a fact of life on our planet: The Permian extinction wiped something like 90% of life on Earth.
however, the outcome of every one of these mass extinctions is that a new dominant species emerges. We just need to figure out if that is what we want. Do we want to gamble with the survival of our species?
November 20th, 2006 at 6:40 pmThe Bush “Scientists†are planning to launch a school bus sized bomb at the Moon to break off a large portion of it, in an attempt to find water.
That would be the most expensive stupidity since Iraq war. There are some things called solar stills.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:41 pmDo we want to gamble with the survival of our species?
Comment by Gregor Samsa
I know I will sound like a lunatic. But humans should extinct. We do not deserve this wonderful, so far, unique place.
November 20th, 2006 at 6:43 pmNo they haven’t you lying sack of feces.
Iran has stated openly that it is researching nuclear power. Nothing more nothing less.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:08 pmHumans pose a threat to their own biosphere as it exists today. Things can live without oxygen, how do you spell it, anaerobically? We may ruin it for us, but the earth will continue with other forms of life.
I don’t know about you Juan, but I love this place, and someone else can become extinct.
Are there really people who want to look for water on the moon?
Pathetic if so.
Oh yeah, Condi Rice, ewwww, major turn off.
Iran has never said they are making nukular weapons, but c’mon, wouldn’t you? Problem is, they are nowhere near the full development of a nuclear weapon. Also, would they test one before they ever used one? Go in and f*ck them up if they ever test one, I say.
Spare me the thinktanks, they are no longer vogue.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:19 pm#11, MA
I know I’m late here on the thread, but this has come up a few times, and it perplexes me.
I was wondering why you consider the term “progressive” to be a gender- specific word (Progs and Progettes?). We consider ourselves a movement and a state of mind of being and actions. Not wait staff at Chili’s (no offense to Chili’s). We stand for something. What do you stand for?
Sorry if this posts twice….issues…..
November 20th, 2006 at 7:24 pmHi I’m a Prog, no not a frog, a Prog. We also have Progettes, they are sweet…
November 20th, 2006 at 7:28 pmYou know it was Bush 41 that first identified Rice as ‘not up for the job’ back in 2001-2.
When I think that ppl consider her a presidential candidate I think of her repeated failings not least 911…and then I think of that line from that old movie Moonstruck where Nicolas Cage is lamenting the loss of his hand due to his brother johnny…
“My brother johnny made me look away and I lost my whole hand, he could make you look away and you could loose your whole head!”
I think giving Rice any further role in anything anytime anywhere would make us loose our whole head…
She’s incompetant…
November 20th, 2006 at 7:30 pmWere you a sprogette first?
November 20th, 2006 at 7:31 pmand incompetent
November 20th, 2006 at 7:33 pmFor Truth~
I guess I’m just weird on distinction in that sense. (But then again I’m one of the chicks who’s cool with the C word, so maybe I’m a bad representation of a girl.). No offense, please don’t take me wrong. I just don’t appreciate neocon dudes who proclaim to be intelligent, thinking it’s okay for THEM to make the distinction between male and female within a concept, when they can’t distinguish between right and wrong, good and evil in any concept.
Again I hope I don’t offend you.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:36 pmSouthPaw,
I was not offended at all in the least bit. I like to be a major smart ass, that’s all. It was just my usual banter.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:38 pmBecause mighty assh*ledite is a complete blithering idiot. She thinks that she sounds funny or is putting us down, but in reality she just sounds stupid.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:39 pmHarry Lauder, are you referring to me? Wan’t trying to kick the nest here.
Anyway. As far as movies, I was thinking that folks such as MA and Exley and the like, I think of David Spade and the principal in PCU.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:39 pmAre you going to start the extinction process, Juan??
November 20th, 2006 at 7:42 pmI like to be a major smart ass, that’s all. It was just my usual banter.
Comment by ForTruth
I will vouch for that…
November 20th, 2006 at 7:42 pmFor truth~
Stick to it!!! Always love it!!
Spudgeboy~
2nd that!
November 20th, 2006 at 7:44 pmNevermind, Harry. Sorry….
Anyway, for those of you who are on Eastern time, Charlie Brown Thanksgiving special is on at 8. I don’t care if I’m 100, I’ll watch it.
Good ol Schultz was a progressive…..no?
November 20th, 2006 at 7:47 pmYes, MA. You first.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:48 pmIt’s always a good thing to have a voucher.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:49 pmIt’s always a good thing to have a voucher.
Comment by ForTruth
We validate parking…
November 20th, 2006 at 7:53 pmTry telling a kid to watch Charlie Brown Thanksgiving nowadays, forget it. With all that whacky stuff on several channels 24 hours a day. They look at you like you’re crazy.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:58 pmMost artists/musicians/creative types are liberals you know.
November 20th, 2006 at 7:59 pmMichael Rubin of the AEI reviews the book and calls out the inaccuracies and prevarifications in this book. Libs don’t care about the truth, they just want to use whatever haf-truths and lies to advance their “incompetence” meme.
http://www.meforum.org/article/877
“What undercuts “The Assassins’ Gate” more is Packer’s tendency – like that of many instant experts and political writers – to treat Iraq as a template upon which to act out agendas that have more to do with Washington than Iraq. Packer covers only one side of the complex debates surrounding Iraq policy. His stories belie his contacts: While he delves into long passages about the thoughts and even the dreams of State Department officials like Barbara Bodine, Meghan O’Sullivan, and Andrew Erdmann, he gets Pentagon offices and staffs confused. Harold Rhode, for example, was never in the Office of Special Plans, something which could have been confirmed with a single telephone call to Pentagon directory assistance. He gets other facts wrong: He lists me as a participant in several meetings, none of which I attended.
“Many errors derive from Packer’s failure to evaluate his sources, and his lack of footnotes obfuscates his sourcing. To describe the planning before the war, he appears to rely on descriptions provided by Karen Kwiatkowski, a former Pentagon official who did not actually participate in Iraq planning. Long before Packer completed his research, the bipartisan U.S. Senate Select Committee on Intelligence concluded she was a fabricator.
“Packer mimics investigative reporter Bob Woodward’s style. Those who talked to Packer become complex individuals; those who did not – chief among them Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz – become two-dimensional foils. There are also glaring omissions. Packer ignores the Iraq Reconstruction and Development Council, a group of more than 100 Iraqi-American and Iraqi-European technicians who, against the efforts of Bodine and Thomas Warrick of the Future of Iraq project, returned to their homeland to help guide American diplomats who did not know the language nor understand Iraqi culture. While Packer interviewed senior diplomats in their Baghdad headquarters, these returnees spent their days traveling around Iraq without security or even their own vehicles. A few paid with their lives. Packer’s failure to mention this important component of reconstruction planning and implementation is inexcusable, and reflects the polite but condescending attitude about the Iraqis’ own contribution too common among diplomats and Western journalists both.
“Good reporters are entitled to trust their sources, but they should also verify their accounts. Packer has not. He allows his sources to revise their actions and lie to him about their roles. He allows Warrick, for example, to repeat the old canard that politics were behind an interagency decision to not deploy him immediately to Baghdad after the end of the first phase of the war. Warrick was well qualified. He had helped organize and moderate the Future of Iraq project which brought together scores of Iraqis to discuss everything from democratic governance to rehabilitation of the electricity grid. The problem was what Warrick omitted: his behavior. He liked to brag that his rolodex was “the future Iraqi government” and to threaten Iraqis to either change their positions or he would “remove them from his rolodex.” Many Iraqis complained. Ultimately, the State Department held him back in response to professional misconduct. He compounded this with subsequent leaks.”
November 20th, 2006 at 8:31 pmVince Guaraldi is the man.
Anyway, For Truth, I don’t think that’s the case in all matters. My niece and nephew are very well-rounded for 5-year-olds. They can speak some Spanish, and aren’t babysat by t.v. Just because t.v. is there doesn’t mean that it hasto be the educational tool or the only tool.
There are a lot of tools on t.v.
November 20th, 2006 at 8:34 pm54 – “I know I’m late here on the thread, but this has come up a few times, and it perplexes me.
I was wondering why you consider the term “progressive†to be a gender- specific word (Progs and Progettes?). We consider ourselves a movement and a state of mind ” Comment by SouthPaw
*******Dear Ms. Paw – Progressives love to congratulate themselves on their inclusiveness, racial, ethnic and gender blindness. But who notes gender/victim/volunteers more than Progs or Progettes? We have several kinds of women Progs tend to discuss:
1.) “Roaring” women – these include career moms or educated women who are unsure of how to fend off a sexual harasser but know how to call an attorney
2.) “victims” and/or “volunteers” – these are women who have suffered terrible catastrophe and grown from the experience. The latter are women who continually make stupid choices when it comes to men, sex, drugs, drinking, education, etc. and expect others to pick up the pieces….
3.) idiot conservative, religious women or mothers who have not employed abortion as a birth control device.
WOW!!! Congrats (??) on your verbal liberalization using the “C” word. YOU do a HUGE disservice to women when you talk like a truck driver or drunken sailor – actually I apologize to ALL truck drivers and drunken sailors – my last comment was exceedingly insulting to these honourable professions…..I prescribe a good bar of Zest…..
November 20th, 2006 at 8:39 pm#61 – “Because mighty assh*ledite is a complete blithering idiot. She thinks that she sounds funny or is putting us down, but in reality she just sounds stupid.” Comment by SpudgeBoy
*****Dear SpongeCake – Progs correctly take great pride in Nancy Pelosi becoming the first Speaker of the House. Personally, I took greater pride when Margaret Thatcher was Prime Ministerette, but I’m certain this is due to politics….
November 20th, 2006 at 8:44 pmI took greater pride when Margaret Thatcher was Prime Ministerette, but I’m certain this is due to politics….
Comment by mighty aphrodite — November 20, 2006 @ 8:44 pm
That would be Prime Minister for you.
If you actually took any pride, Mitey Coprolite, you would address Mrs. Thatcher by the appropriate title: Prime Minister. There is no such thing as a “ministerette” -or maybe there is in the red-light district where carry your business. That is certainly not the case in Downing Street.
Never did I heard even the dimmest of the dimwits address a Prime Minister by a nickname they thought “cutsey”. She was anything but cute. Perhaps is why you do it: You think it’s “cute”. It isn’t. It’s openly disrespectful to the dignity of the Prime Minister’s office.
November 20th, 2006 at 8:54 pmSay isn’t Anne Coulter a failed lawyer, kinda like MA here?
November 20th, 2006 at 8:57 pmIt’s openly disrespectful to the dignity of the Prime Minister’s office.
Comment by Gregor Samsa
Can we still call GWB Chimpy? :)
November 20th, 2006 at 8:59 pmFirst, you’re “we” now on Progs? Alrighty.
And, this is your current understanding of women? Excellent. Thus, the wrinkling of your genetalia.
1) Educated women and career moms are mutually exclusive?
2) Pardon? Makes no sense. Victims are victims. I don’t understand these volunteers you speak of. I don’t know of anyone who volunteers for abuse. BTW, why haven’t you enlisted, speaking of volunteering?
3) It’s idiotic for someone not to abort due to their beliefs? What planet? What egg? Where did you come from? I believe in a woman’s rights. You believe it to be a no-brainer.
Pardon me ladies, but MA, you are a C@nt, and likely are the reason most ladies find the word offensive. I am not offended my words, or made up terms to offend, so that is why cuss words don’t do anything for me.
You are something else.
November 20th, 2006 at 8:59 pmSuch is why I don’t watch movies or buy any Hollywood gossip media.
But lets take a look at a say Paris Hilton. Sure she might be in the limelight now, but I can guaranteee you that when she gets older, and not famous, she will be a Pshychiatrists Golden Egg.
Of course they are insecure it’s why they try so hard to be liked.
In fact MA I bet you have a bigger movie collection than I do. Which is zero.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:03 pmHappy Thanksgiving to you too MA.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:04 pmCan we still call GWB Chimpy? :)
Comment by Zooey — November 20, 2006 @ 8:59 pm
;-)
Yes, Zooey. One thing is the person, another thing is the title/office.
Is like calling MA “hogwash”, but abstaining from calling any female lawyer a “lawyerette”.
On second thought, perhaps is what we should call MA: “lawyerette”.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:05 pmI hear [Rumor] that Lawyers are required to take an oath to bankrupt America..
Is that true MA?
November 20th, 2006 at 9:05 pmOh its been a joyful last year or so with MA and IRI. =)
November 20th, 2006 at 9:08 pmYou should be for the nasty case of the clap you gave them!!
November 20th, 2006 at 9:10 pmHey is it just me or does Condi got a reptilian eye?
November 20th, 2006 at 9:14 pm“You should be for the nasty case of the clap you gave them!! Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Waveâ€
Beautiful!!
November 20th, 2006 at 9:14 pmYOU do a HUGE disservice to women when you talk like a truck driver or drunken sailor
Comment by mighty aphrodite — November 20, 2006 @ 8:39 pm
Says the woman who calls a Prime Minister a “ministerette”, and a Speaker of the House a “speakerette”. Talk about disservice.
Further disservice is done by denying that women face harassment at work and that they have a hard time fending off those bloody harassers.
Even more disservice is done by suggesting that an abusive relationship is the woman’s fault (”stupid choices when it comes to men”). It takes some gall to even think that is true.
Mitey Coprolite, no more evidence is needed: You are not a lawyer, a woman, or a parent.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:17 pmOn second thought, perhaps is what we should call MA: “lawyeretteâ€.
Comment by Gregor Samsa
Or janitorette.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:22 pmComment by SouthPaw
I sense a fellow labrum frequenite. =)
November 20th, 2006 at 9:25 pmOr janitorette.
Comment by Zooey
Bwaa!
Life of the Potty!
November 20th, 2006 at 9:26 pmBTW BT do you teach or is that Zooey? And what course [math etc] If I might enquire
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
I may teach, but in a purely unintentional way. Heh.
I am a recently unemployed court clerk. Happily so, I might add.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:26 pmLife of the Potty!
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
Oy. What have you heard…?
November 20th, 2006 at 9:27 pm#100~
I am working on English. Have my Bachelors in it, and all of the certification courses, but NCLB is a thorn. No experience, no cert./ no cert, no exerience. May have to do Bmore city, which is fine. That’s where it’s needed. But support is minimal. I was lied to by the Education beaurocracy., a.k.a Bush.
I substituted at a bad school, but I loved the kids. They did what they could with what they had, I want to run with that.
I could go on forever, but no one is interested. I feel very strongly that I can help the children of Baltimore, who need help. I won’t give up.
The more I can educate students, just as far as questioning (which is the aquisition of knowledge) the more I feel I can contribute.
You can always ask.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:31 pmI have heard nothing, just curious…your quite well informed and was wondering what you did. Me I am just a Boo Dog mechanic. =(
November 20th, 2006 at 9:32 pmMighty A, I am starting to question your authenticity, it was pointed out on another thread I might add.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:33 pmCool, SouthPaw. We need teachers like you. Good luck!
November 20th, 2006 at 9:33 pmOy. What have you heard…?
Comment by Zooey
Want me to tell him?
November 20th, 2006 at 9:34 pmGlad to know that Zoo and South!
Me I hated school when young and only now find interest in such subjects other than technical things…
November 20th, 2006 at 9:34 pmMe I am just a Boo Dog mechanic. =(
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
Don’t run yourself down Zep, who’s the smartest and most desirable man on earth when the car breaks down?
Love your name, Zep. ‘Z’ names are the best.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:36 pmZoo, I learn with every post!! My head’s about to bust with your knowledge.
No lie.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:36 pmWant me to tell him?
Comment by ForTruth
Go ahead, I dare you.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:37 pmYou don’t have too it’s okay. I was Dog named Boo [screen] and missed the comraderie here more than anything, even the blog software is kinda messed up, after a week I wandered back. Such are creatures of habit.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:39 pmZoo, I learn with every post!! My head’s about to bust with your knowledge.
No lie.
Comment by SouthPaw
Wow. Thanks. *blush*
November 20th, 2006 at 9:40 pmDon’t run yourself down Zep, who’s the smartest and most desirable man on earth when the car breaks down?
Oh I also am certified by the DOT to repair aircraft if you ever get one =)
November 20th, 2006 at 9:41 pmFor Truth and Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave,
You guys have no idea how good it feels to hear that. I hit brick walls day in and day out. I just want to teach. I want to do something. And I will appreciate all views. I just hate that it’s so hard, for someone with the passion, to be there. You know my view, but it doesn’t mean that others aren’t valued. You don’t know what it means to hear support from y’all.
Well, this is way OT, my apologies.
Thanks. :)
November 20th, 2006 at 9:42 pmSuch are creatures of habit.
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
I thought “Boo Dog mechanic” sounded familiar. Welcome back, Boo — Zep is better since it’s a ‘Z’ name, of course. Everyone comes back after a while, because they miss us too much. :)
November 20th, 2006 at 9:43 pmWell, this is way OT, my apologies.
Comment by SouthPaw
Well, the topic is Condi Rice, and who can stay on topic with that?
November 20th, 2006 at 9:45 pmAye!
November 20th, 2006 at 9:48 pmAlright Dog named Boo now a new guy, cool.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:48 pmCondoms have lice?
November 20th, 2006 at 9:49 pmSouthPaw,
You are welcome.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:49 pmRight? I’ve never quite grasped that.
Example: Bar down the road from me. Advertises “Speak english M-Fer” t-shirts…..The band (which was good) consisted of a dreaded Black dude , an American Indian, and an Asian dude.
Hipocrocy is wide-spread.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:50 pmWell, this is way OT, my apologies.
Comment by SouthPaw
Naw the thread is pretty much toast…at least the trolls are =)
November 20th, 2006 at 9:50 pmWell, let’s see. Condi Rice. What can I say about her that doesn’t have something to do with her incompetence? I am trying to be nice. The snaggletooth is attractive. The constant severe look on her face isn’t.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:51 pmKinda like religion.
Anyone read Clstine Prophecy?
November 20th, 2006 at 9:52 pmCondoms have lice?
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
You should buy new ones.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:52 pmWow we could make a great team. We got court clerks, teachers, techs!
November 20th, 2006 at 9:52 pmTruth,
Do you have something to share with everyone? You are under a dare. :)
November 20th, 2006 at 9:53 pmYeah, this thread is toast…. maybe Goodscarrier will tell me to stop using so much bandwidth. I’m sure I have a large effect on that.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:54 pmAnyone read Clstine Prophecy?
Comment by SouthPaw
Not on purpose, but I did read the DaVinci Code recently. Excellent symbolism, but the mystery sucked big-time. I had it figured out fairly quickly. My dog thinks I’m a nut case saying APPLE to a book…
November 20th, 2006 at 9:55 pmOh I’m under a dare?
He said he already knows how witty and smart you are…
November 20th, 2006 at 9:56 pmI will try, even though I joke, Condi was from the Madelaine Albright School of thougt, i just don’t know what happened after that. I think working for the Oil people messed her mind up and she got perhaps greedy or power hungry,,not sure which. Power corrupts the best minds.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:57 pmGoodscarrier will tell me to stop using so much bandwidth. I’m sure I have a large effect on that.
Comment by ForTruth
He told me off big time last night about saying off topic shit. I told him to f*ck off, and he ignored me after that.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:57 pmshe should be ashamed of herself. My African American friends at work think she’s a joke, a farce.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:57 pmHe said he already knows how witty and smart you are…
Comment by ForTruth
Fine then…heh.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:58 pmCondi somehow earned a Ph.D. , somehow… it seems like an insult to acedamia. She is so dishonest.
November 20th, 2006 at 9:59 pmIts a farce of a movie.
Think of a circle with 888 ideograms. Lord is 3 and man is 6
November 20th, 2006 at 9:59 pmSuch is my name Zee Zero!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:00 pmI will try, even though I joke, Condi was from the Madelaine Albright School of thougt, i just don’t know what happened after that.
She stopped after Madelaine Albright School of…
November 20th, 2006 at 10:00 pmI just thought Celstine was kind of a giude, if nothng else. Something to ponder.
Godnight, my friends. God Bless.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:01 pmCondi Rice is bought and paid for, but she never really had to sell herself, that’s where I get confused.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:02 pmGoodscarrier knows how to advance his agenda. Wait, he is a jack-ass isn’t he? I have been away for awhile and he is still shooting himself in the foot?
November 20th, 2006 at 10:02 pmGoodscarrier will tell me to stop using so much bandwidth. I’m sure I have a large effect on that.
Comment by ForTruth
Text on a HTML page [Hexidecimally speaking] takes up little bandwith. Its the images that take alot of TCP packets to send down the tubes.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:02 pmGoodnight SouthPaw.
I hope I didn’t offend you.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:03 pmShe stopped after Madelaine Albright School of…
Comment by JPark
Heh!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:03 pmGN SP
November 20th, 2006 at 10:04 pmI heard Condi sucks a mean Dick!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:05 pmThe goverment iseems to be full of them.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:05 pmZep Tepi Non Scalar Wave,
Tell us about your new name, please.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:05 pmI as well. Which can only mean hidden agendas.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:07 pmPlease, nobody respond to Jigga. Please!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:08 pmG’night Zooey & Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave ,
Nice to talk with you. Thanks, for everything.
We’ll get there. If we keep trying….
November 20th, 2006 at 10:10 pmZep Tepi Non Scalar Wave,
Tell us about your new name, please.
Comment by Zooey
Zep Tepi means Zero Time.
A non scalar wave holds much energy but it’s flat.
Think of a wave, at the surface of the ocean, now put that wave on the sea floor, it staill holds the same energy, but its flat, or a non wave.
Such is where we get into standing waves such as Tesla described. In large particle colliders a Zee Zero Hadron is thought to be the ‘GOD’ particle. Since all numbers are infinite we get into plack scales that is a 1 with 33 zeroes before it. Remember that atomically we are 95% space.
Tuff to imagine. =) We are very small in the realm of things.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:13 pmhttp://www.crystalinks.com/zeptepi.html
November 20th, 2006 at 10:14 pmPlease, nobody respond to Jigga. Please!
Comment by Zooey
Grrrrrr Ok =)
November 20th, 2006 at 10:16 pmIt is SOOOO fun, Zooey!!!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:17 pmExcept for that last comment by him. I will let that one stand on its own.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:17 pmWe are very small in the realm of things.
In fact we basically touch if seen from afar. The Silver cord that connects us all so to speak.
Thus we get into the frequency of the mind which is very close the the frequency of the earth 8hz. [Schumann Resonance]
November 20th, 2006 at 10:18 pmGrrrrrr Ok =)
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
That one is sick.
Interesting website. Now I understand completely. Not. The diagram helped a bit. We are very small in the universe, that’s very true.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:19 pmhmm.How best to explain. Take a mirror and look into a mirror. Hold a mirror behind you and you see the ‘frames’ the bloch line, that what seperates the frames of time/space would be that zero energy.
Like slices of toast my sister says =)
November 20th, 2006 at 10:21 pmZep,
I’ve never met a spiritual mechanic before.
I was married to a helicopter mechanic once, and he didn’t know it, but he was dumb as a bag of hair. Doesn’t say much about me, does it…hmmm. Well, I’m not married to him anymore.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:22 pmInteresting website. Now I understand completely. Not. The diagram helped a bit. We are very small in the universe, that’s very true.
Comment by Zooey
So are our minds, but they even are electrical in nature and require a frequency. =)
November 20th, 2006 at 10:23 pmLOL, Zooey, not all aviation mechanics are dumbasses. My dad was a pretty bright guy. You wouldn’t want me fixing your plane though. I have two left feet for hands.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:24 pmNow you have!! Basically we live in a giant dynamo and their is quite a bit of negative energy that flows thru us all. Like our Auras are created from =) [Kirlian photography]
Need a drink Brb!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:26 pmZep, he wasn’t dumb because he was an aviation mech, he was just dumb, period.
I wouldn’t try dancing on your hands, if I were you.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:27 pmThe Zen of infinite mirror reflections whilst sitting on the can.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:28 pmBasically we live in a giant dynamo and their is quite a bit of negative energy that flows thru us all…
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
Don’t I know it. At the courthouse, my desk was between two complete bitches, who didn’t like me much — probably because I thought they were bitches — and their energy was draining. Sheilding helped for a while, but basically you can’t make a career out of that type of environment.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:30 pmThe Zen of infinite mirror reflections whilst sitting on the can.
Comment by ForTruth
You should change your name to ForClass. Seriously…
November 20th, 2006 at 10:31 pmHey! I resemble that remark!
My IQ is above average,and trust me I knew many mechanics that weren’t very bright. I specialized in the rigging and replacement of flight control cables and the operational checks. We also took many courses on different planes and the navigational systems..
Ennyhoo enough about me..What about you?
November 20th, 2006 at 10:35 pmZooey, I was the one defending aviation mechs. I didn’t think you thought all of them were dumb. I was just being an ass :)
November 20th, 2006 at 10:36 pmhe Zen of infinite mirror reflections whilst sitting on the can.
Comment by ForTruth
Is it not a self pumpiing reflection of time/space? =)
November 20th, 2006 at 10:36 pmPeople like that drain me completely and I feel very sleepy and lethargic when I get near them.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:38 pmDon’t worry about it, the flight attendants often called us grease monkeys but depende on us to make the planes right.
Love is a grease monkey!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:40 pmSorry JPark, I am easily confused.
Zep, you dance on your hands all you want…
The ex would fix the damned helicopters, but you wouldn’t see him fly in one. He knows he’s stupid on some level. Heh.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:41 pmit’s your intelligence and higher thoughts they drain =)
November 20th, 2006 at 10:41 pmJPark is back from getting his Jigga fix on another thread, I see.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:42 pmLOL, without good grease monkeys I would not want to fly. I drove semi and my company didn’t have a mechanic…for about a week. No way I was staying there.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:43 pmJPark is back from getting his Jigga fix on another thread, I see.
Comment by Zooe
lMAO!!
More power to ya JP!!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:43 pmI love that Jigga. He is such a smooth touch.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:43 pmEnnyhoo enough about me..What about you?
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
What do you want to know, Boo?
November 20th, 2006 at 10:44 pmOh but playing the part of a dumbass is half the job!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:44 pmI love that Jigga. He is such a smooth touch.
Comment by JPark
And apparently, you’re a soft touch….?
November 20th, 2006 at 10:46 pmWhatever you feel free to discuss and nothing more =]
November 20th, 2006 at 10:47 pmI love that Jigga. He is such a smooth touch.
Comment by JPark
Yah like a dull knife!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:47 pmSmart guy! But honestly I worried more about my work than the passengers did. maybe this is what makes the diff betweena good mech and a bad one.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:50 pm#186 Maybe, I have a soft spot for sweet, dumb animals.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:52 pmWhatever you feel free to discuss and nothing more =]
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
That’s a pretty wide open field there, Boo…..er Zep. I’ll think on it.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:53 pm#189 Tell you the truth I don’t trust anybody I don’t know. Flying is a real chore. I hope more mechs are like you than otherwise.
November 20th, 2006 at 10:53 pm#188 Aww, come on. He is such a soft little guy!!
November 20th, 2006 at 10:53 pmThe had us fly on what we fixed =)
November 20th, 2006 at 10:55 pmMaybe, I have a soft spot for sweet, dumb animals.
Comment by JPark
Is Mighty Hag here?
November 20th, 2006 at 10:58 pmHmm, are there any indiginous British animals? I didn’t think so.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:00 pmI had nightmares about cotter pins and would rush back to work only to find that I did put one in. Their are a second of eyes however, such as my RII ticket, everything we did was looked at twice and three times before the inspector would sign off on the task at hand.
Enough about airplanes already!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:00 pmLOL, I feel the same about balance sheets :)
November 20th, 2006 at 11:01 pmNo pressure here
November 20th, 2006 at 11:02 pmHmm, are there any indiginous British animals? I didn’t think so.
Comment by JPark
That Hag ain’t british, it’s a fake all the way around.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:04 pmHmm, are there any indiginous British animals? I didn’t think so.
Comment by JPark
Fish n Chips?
November 20th, 2006 at 11:04 pmLOL, I feel the same about balance sheets :)
Comment by JPark
I used to feel the same about bonds and warrants. Ah freedom…
November 20th, 2006 at 11:05 pmthat’s a pretty wide open field there, Boo…..er Zep. I’ll think on it.
Comment by Zooey
Were waiting here. :)
November 20th, 2006 at 11:06 pmZooey, it claims to be American but spells labor, “labour”. It is not from San Deigo.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:07 pmNo pressure here
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
I just spent the afternoon with a friend, and that’s pretty much all I can think of. Wouldn’t want to put that up.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:07 pmI think its teeth look like indian corn.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:07 pmHmm, fish, no. Chips, maybe….Chips Aphrodite…I like it.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:08 pmI need to get into cost Zooey!!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:09 pmFrom now on MA is Chips.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:09 pmZooey, it claims to be American but spells labor, “labourâ€. It is not from San Deigo.
Comment by JPark
It’s pretending…it labours at pretending.
See? I’m from frickin’ Idaho.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:10 pmFrom now on MA is Chips.
Comment by JPark
Excellent. I’ll remember that. Let’s not explain it, if it asks….
November 20th, 2006 at 11:13 pmWork wise
November 20th, 2006 at 11:13 pmSee? I’m from frickin’ Idaho.
Comment by Zooey
Hey did you ever see napolean dynamite?
November 20th, 2006 at 11:15 pmSee? I’m from frickin’ Idaho.
Comment by Zooey
Is that that bad?
November 20th, 2006 at 11:15 pmI don’t think so Zooey. It claims it is a lawyer from San Diego. A lawyer from San Diego doesn’t say labour. It is a fake. It is a for’ner.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:15 pm#211 I wouldn’t think of explaining it :)
November 20th, 2006 at 11:16 pmWhat do you think, Zep, is #208 by the real JPark?
November 20th, 2006 at 11:16 pmFrom now on MA is Chips.
Comment by JPark
Excellent. I’ll remember that. Let’s not explain it, if it asks….
or Whores Teeth! I mean Horse Teeth
November 20th, 2006 at 11:16 pmLOL, or indian corn.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:18 pmZooey, that meant cost accounting. It wasn’t anything about getting into some sort of Zooey!!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:18 pmdoesn’t sound like JP
November 20th, 2006 at 11:19 pmHey did you ever see napolean dynamite?
Comment by Zep Tepi Non Scalar Wave
I own that movie. It’s so funny. I love the part where the old guy shoots the cow right in front of the bus full of kids. I’m way up north, so it really has nothing to do with me. *ahem*
November 20th, 2006 at 11:19 pmBut I could be wrong TP has no verification
November 20th, 2006 at 11:21 pmLOL, yes, it was me but it looks like it was not exactly…clear.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:21 pmIs that that bad?
Comment by Juan C
You can keep on waiting, Juan. :)
No, it’s not all bad. Except for our new governor, and my new Rep in Washington DC. I apologize in advance…
November 20th, 2006 at 11:21 pmI saw parts of Napoleon Dynamite. I don’t remember the cow part (I remember the Me, Myself, and Irene cow part).
November 20th, 2006 at 11:23 pmZooey, that meant cost accounting. It wasn’t anything about getting into some sort of Zooey!!
Comment by JPark
You won’t be offended if I say accountants are a bit weird, will you? Because I put myself at the head of the weird list…
November 20th, 2006 at 11:24 pmThings are looking up in Wisconsin. We took the Senate, kept the Governorship and closed a huge gap in the Assembly.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:24 pmHaha my daughter gave me the video, guess what song just came on the radio? My own private Idaho by the b-52’s!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:24 pmHows life over there, Zoo? Is it true that it is kind of boring, farmlands, beer and rednecks?
November 20th, 2006 at 11:25 pmLOL, yes, it was me but it looks like it was not exactly…clear.
Comment by JPark
Im thinking costco?
November 20th, 2006 at 11:26 pmI doubt Condi saw Nepolian Dynamite.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:26 pmI saw parts of Napoleon Dynamite. I don’t remember the cow part (I remember the Me, Myself, and Irene cow part).
Comment by JPark
It’s right at the beginning. No one really says anything about it. All the kids are arriving at the school, and you see the old boy in his field pointing a gun at this cow, but he’s right next to the road. As the school bus goes by, he shoots the damned thing. That’s an Idaho stunt, for sure.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:27 pmJuan, lol, I think you are thinking Wisconsin but you forgot the cheese.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:28 pmYeah, I hear Sali (R-ID) is quite the fine smelling guy.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:28 pmOr the guy who spent 4 hrs on the internet talking too hot chicks lmao!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:28 pmCostco? I wish we had one. We only have Wal-Mart here.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:29 pmHows life over there, Zoo? Is it true that it is kind of boring, farmlands, beer and rednecks?
Comment by Juan C
We have all of those things, Juan, but since this is a university town, we have a little more diversity, and a little less inbreeding. The Dems actually won in my town.
I do know of a man who is married to his own niece, but they live far away from here. I don’t know how that’s legal.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:29 pmZooey, is it really that good of a movie? I didn’t pay attention the first time.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:30 pmyeh i do remember that now u said it!!
Bwwaaaaa! hilarious movie.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:30 pmI doubt Condi saw Nepolian Dynamite.
Comment by ForTruth
we should send it
November 20th, 2006 at 11:31 pmYeah, I hear Sali (R-ID) is quite the fine smelling guy.
Comment by ForTruth
He’s got that going for him, that’s for sure.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:32 pmI think you are thinking Wisconsin but you forgot the cheese.
Comment by JPark
To me, everything that has an indian name seems like Mississipi on fire (??? Is that the name of the movie in English?) with Gene Hackman and William Dafoe.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:33 pmZooey, is it really that good of a movie? I didn’t pay attention the first time.
Comment by JPark
Let me put it this way, JPark, it’s easy to miss the genius of the movie.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:33 pmZooey, is it really that good of a movie? I didn’t pay attention the first time.
Comment by JPark
one of those kind of movies you should partake of substance before watching..
November 20th, 2006 at 11:33 pmI don’t know how that’s legal.
Comment by Zooey
ha ha ha! Its like Shelbyville from the Simpsons.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:34 pmCostco? I wish we had one. We only have Wal-Mart here.
Comment by JPark
Walmart I refuse to shop their
November 20th, 2006 at 11:36 pm#244 Mississippi Burning…that is mostly the south. I don’t think we have ever had a lynching up here. We are close to Canada.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:36 pmwith Gene Hackman and William Dafoe.
Comment by Juan C
Or Talladega Nights: The Ballad of Ricky Bobby.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:36 pmCostco? I wish we had one. We only have Wal-Mart here.
Comment by JPark
I have to drive 45 minutes to get to Costco. I’m giong there Wednesday for homemade pies.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:36 pmAwww, I don’t partake of substances so it will probably make about as much sense as The Wall.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:37 pmWe have all of those things, Juan, but since this is a university town, we have a little more diversity, and a little less inbreeding. The Dems actually won in my town.
Funny this inbreeding thing, in some countries they call it blue blood royalty but in arkansas its inbred hicks!!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:38 pmI thought Costco was only in the East?
November 20th, 2006 at 11:39 pmAwww, I don’t partake of substances so it will probably make about as much sense as The Wall.
Comment by JPark
Liquor I mean
November 20th, 2006 at 11:39 pmAwww, I don’t partake of substances so it will probably make about as much sense as The Wall.
Comment by JPark
Eat ice cream, it has the same effect. The powerful pot lobby just doesn’t want you to know…
November 20th, 2006 at 11:40 pmNice mess we have made out of this thread, people. :)
November 20th, 2006 at 11:41 pmLOL, I can take Zep’s advice. Ice cream doesn’t do it for guys!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:42 pmI thought Costco was only in the East?
Comment by JPark
Nope. It’s out here, too. For the last 12 years or so.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:42 pmI thought in Arkansas it was a badge of honor :)
November 20th, 2006 at 11:43 pmAwww, I don’t partake of substances so it will probably make about as much sense as The Wall.
Comment by JPark
The wall, while I enjoyed the PF album the movie I didnt care for.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:44 pmI thought in Arkansas it was a badge of honor :)
Comment by JPark
When I lived in Louisiana, I knew lots of people married to their first cousins — it was legal. You could really tell somtimes…
November 20th, 2006 at 11:46 pmHmm, unfortunately Costco jumped right over us. We still have Shopko and KMart so there is still no way I am going to WalMart.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:46 pmWho beat Condi in the face with the ugly stick?
November 20th, 2006 at 11:46 pmNice mess we have made out of this thread, people. :)
Comment by Juan C
It’s all Condi’s fault. If she weren’t such an uninteresting sell-out, we’d be right on topic. :)
November 20th, 2006 at 11:47 pmLOL, I can take Zep’s advice. Ice cream doesn’t do it for guys!
heh!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:47 pmMe too, Zep. I have never enjoyed pot though so I guess I never got the full effect.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:47 pmThe south is really a different place…a place I don’t really want to visit.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:48 pmNice mess we have made out of this thread, people. :)
Comment by Juan C
bow to the drunken mess kings!
too bad TP doesnt have ads to profit from!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:49 pmThe south is really a different place…a place I don’t really want to visit.
Comment by JPark
Visiting is fine, just don’t stay. I stayed 5 years too long. Great food, and great people — just a little different culture — and this former-California girl didn’t quite fit. They thought I had a cute accent, though.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:51 pmNaw, people have come down from the north [new hamsphire friend of mine] was scared to death, they don’t seem to understand it. once they get into it and find out that we like people they love it and have a great time!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:54 pmIt’s been fun, you guys, but I’m outta here. Got to get up early and go get Zoo Jr at college. He misses his mama sooo much.
Yeah, right…
November 20th, 2006 at 11:55 pmEww, Zooey, I don’t want to try chitlins :) I did have a girlfriend from Oklahoma who loved my accent. She thought I sounded Canadian. I don’t say oot but otherwise Canadians sound normal to me.
November 20th, 2006 at 11:57 pmNight Zoo
November 20th, 2006 at 11:57 pmWell, when I think of the south I don’t really think Arkansas…kind of like when I think football I don’t think Razorbacks :) I am just teasing!!
November 20th, 2006 at 11:58 pmGN zoo
November 21st, 2006 at 12:00 amCondi Rice is a liar like Pres. Bush, so nothing more needs to be said about her!
November 21st, 2006 at 12:37 amHappy morning after I missed all the fun post’s…Oh well, needed my beauty sleep..LOL..Great posts all and funny to….I think the name for “it” should be chippie not chip’s but will abide by the majority rule…..Heh!
Like Jay, nothing good to add about dead eyed rice so will leave the on topic to others.
Good link Zep, will study it later…..
Zooey, glad you dumped the job, we are indeed a lot alike. Done the very same thing myself, several times during my working year’s….If it wasen’t men harassing it was women back biting…..Harmony in the work place is diffacult, seldom found and not enough mirrors to send back the negative to the source…Blessings All
November 21st, 2006 at 7:48 amForgot to ask, did you all catch Keith’s show last night.? Another good zinger..The more I hear this guy the better…..It was a wow speech….Blessings
November 21st, 2006 at 7:53 amThis is a bit of a stretch to tag Rice as a flip-flopper–she was against study group “A” in 2002, but now she’s into study group “B” in 2006!” Shouldn’t we get over that? Okay, that’s what they called us back in the day, but the day is over,we have control of the house and senate so let’s let the “He’s a flip-flopper, She’s a flip-flopper” thing go. Of course Rice would have second thoughts about a study group that might undermine the whole Iraq adventure. and of course she’d be behind this totally phoney study group now because it provides “we’re trying to go foward” ink for the MSM to go crazy over while they’re busy escalating the war. Keep your eyes on the prize. Talk up ENDING the war, stop wasting your time pointing out every little hypacritical moment of a hypacritical regime it accomplshes nothing.
November 21st, 2006 at 8:29 am# 137, Zooey: Goodscarrier will tell me to stop using so much bandwidth. I’m sure I have a large effect on that. He told me off big time last night about saying off topic shit. I told him to f*ck off, and he ignored me after that.
Now that Zooey, JPark, et al have destroyed another important thread, one which people have come to read about and participate in what’s one more offtopic thread ?
Zooey: The thread was about Condi Rice, i.e., until it became all about you.
HINT: TP is not Zooey’s blog, a chat room especially for Zooey, a website where people can peer into Zooey’s life.
Why should people be invited to come to TP to read about how Rice Was Against Iraq Group Before She Was For It and then have to scroll through your endless chit-chat?
Why should people have to read about your life in the South instead of Rice?
Why should people have to scroll through your quitting your (one of probably many) job(s) instead of reading about Rice?
There are so many other places you can do your chitchats. Why selfishly hijack TP? You are doing the work of a TROLL. Are you are Troll?
E.g.
#261, Zooey: I thought in Arkansas it was a badge of honor :)
Comment by JPark When I lived in Louisiana, I knew lots of people married to their first cousins — it was legal. You could really tell somtimes… Comment by Zooey
#269, Zooey: The south is really a different place…a place I don’t really want to visit. Comment by JPark Visiting is fine, just don’t stay. I stayed 5 years too long. Great food, and great people — just a little different culture — and this former-California girl didn’t quite fit. They thought I had a cute accent, though.Comment by Zooey
November 21st, 2006 at 8:44 amZooey, please consider moving your personal conversations to a private area where you are not selfishly forcing people to scroll through your life as opposed to the topic posted by TP.
e.g.
#258, Zooey: Nope. [Costco is] out here, too. For the last 12 years or so.
What does that have to do with how Rice Was Against Iraq Group Before She Was For It?
#261, Zooey: When I lived in Louisiana, I knew lots of people married to their first cousins — it was legal. You could really tell somtimes…
What does that have to do with how Rice Was Against Iraq Group Before She Was For It?
#269, Zooey: And this former-California girl didn’t quite fit. They thought I had a cute accent, though.
What does that have to do with how Rice Was Against Iraq Group Before She Was For It?
#271, Zooey: It’s been fun, you guys, but I’m outta here. Got to get up early and go get Zoo Jr at college. He misses his mama sooo much. Yeah, right…
What does that have to do with how Rice Was Against Iraq Group Before She Was For It?
November 21st, 2006 at 8:52 am“What does that have to do with how Rice Was Against Iraq Group Before She Was For It?”…..This is aperfect example of linking the words “Iraq” and “Group” together to prove Rice is a flip-flopper. It’s apples and oranges: a phase IV study group has nothing to do with a “re-evaluate Iraq” study group in any other way than they are both study groups and both about Iraq. this doesn’t make Rice a “flip-flopper”. Attack Rice for being a war monger like her Boss. let go of the whole “see they’re flip-floppers too” thing. It’s a pointless, childish exercise.
November 21st, 2006 at 9:03 amgoodscarrier, instead of complaining try skipping over what you don’t like…Didn’t see anything on topic on you’re post…..Many of us skip the troll post’s all the time…There’s hijacking of the diffrent thread’s on both sides……..Slamming us is not a solution or being a contributor either….Lead, follow or get the hell out of the way…To my knoledge, no one died and made you boss…Lighten up for crap’s sake…..
November 21st, 2006 at 9:03 am#281 – No shit!
Hey guys, have you ever heard of email? Or do you enjoy holding up your skirts for the whole world to see?
Get a room, and/or quite derailing threads with tales of your sheltered, small minded lives… yawn.
November 21st, 2006 at 9:11 amSharon,
If you want to turn this board into a place to meet friends, I guess I’d understand since most of the people hear only know how to piss and moan while not really doing or offering anything to affect change.
When a thread has over 250 posts, most of us believe it’s because there’s great discourse of the subject, not girly talk of epic, LAME proportions…
And no one needs to be dubbed “Boss” in order to point out the derailing of threads is not permitted under the “Terms of Use”.
November 21st, 2006 at 9:19 amWell, Die now and others, It does not seem terribly important to any of you young male’s when all you’re troll posters turn the thread into a bragging or pissing contest accompanied by filthy language does it..I can’t see anything wrong with a little light banter between poster’s on a slow night, especiely when it isn’t using filthy language….Running down regular posters aposed to dreadful trolls seem’s to be you’re topic of choice today…
On topic..Rice is nothing more than a well educated baught and paid for lier and whore for bush and company…..
November 21st, 2006 at 9:47 amGood morning, Sharon. Anything interesting going on?
November 21st, 2006 at 10:01 amBack at ya Zooey,…..LOL…. not much, just some of the boy’s complaining about this thread being hijacked…LOL..Didn’t see them complaining on the other thread (war in Iran) about that miserable child jeeba and his made up bragging right’s… I love men, it’s narrow minded boy’s wanting to claim their suporiority I have problem’s with….LOL…People with no tolerance for other’s are a continued pain in the ass, like a roid..LOL…Lot’s of wind and rain here..Blessings to day and every day..
November 21st, 2006 at 10:09 amOh thanks, Sharon, I hadn’t noticed. :)
I seems I have received the credit for a hijacking already in place when I arrived. Hmmm, I am very powerful, it seems.
#280 & #281 – If you’re so concerned about thread hijacking, please try to remain on topic. Thank you.
November 21st, 2006 at 10:23 amThis thread was toast last night.
November 21st, 2006 at 10:51 am#283, Sharon Cox: goodscarrier, instead of complaining try skipping over what you don’t like…
Try skipping over?
Try getting your own blog.
There’s no reason for you to destroy this forum with your personal and extensive chitchats especially when there are countless other avenues in which you may express yourself in private.
You guys posting personal stuff that is not in keeping with the purpose of TP which is to provide a forum that advances progressive ideas and policies.
November 21st, 2006 at 12:32 pm#289, Zooey: If you’re so concerned about thread hijacking, please try to remain on topic. Thank you.
Clearly, you do not respect the purpose of this forum; you have no sense of privacy due to the exorbitant amount of time you are spending on the web instead interacting in the workaday world; you actually must think TP is like a sort of bar like Cheers, where you are like the character Norm who is liked by all due to his unyielding witiness and endless stream of zingers.
With all due respect, Zooey, please do you self a favor: Unplug for awhile.
November 21st, 2006 at 12:41 pmgoodscarrier,
Why don’t you send Judd an email asking him to ban me? Clearly that would be the solution here. Why are you so focused on me? Was I talking to myself last night?
I don’t answer to you, and I will do what I damn well please, so get used to it. Kindly mind your own f*cking business.
You’re still off topic, and using way more bandwidth than I am.
November 21st, 2006 at 6:27 pmWhy is this bitch still talking? She needs to get down on her knees and do the work she was hired for.
November 21st, 2006 at 7:25 pmBeen gone all day so no chance till now to respond…As I said before, clearly you boy’s don’t mind if a miserable male troll spout’s garbage and hijacks a thread and also clearly you are upset with women…Well get over it and move on, like the republican’s you are not a god, live and let live or atleast be f***ing equal with you’re bashing.
November 21st, 2006 at 7:49 pm#294 is directed at C. Rice, in case there was some confusion.
November 21st, 2006 at 8:05 pmZooey: Why don’t you send Judd an email asking him to ban me?
Norm!
This thread is threadbare……
Why don’t you bring my actions up to Judd?
I am sure everyone from TP would love to read about your life in the South, your accent, Zooey jr. … ad naseum.
I am sure everyone from TP is busting their ass so you can waste everyone’s bandwidth going on about your life.
A lot of people’s time and energy is going into this site to provide a forum that advances progressive ideas and policies and not to provide a forum especially for you where you can go on about your personal life. There other areas. Please, start your own blog, stop gorging on the work of others, and do something other than talk about yourself.
Zooey: Why are you so focused on me?
Time, energy, and bandwidth. Please note Zooey: I do not wish to bicker with you at all. I am past tired of having to scroll past all the chit chat which is EXTREMELY RUDE.
Zooey: I don’t answer to you, and I will do what I damn well please, so get used to it. Kindly mind your own f*cking business.
I also do not answer to you. Keep wasting bandwidth and I will respond. And if you continue to use profane language, which your chat buddy Sharon Cox abhores when it suits her (e.g. 286 vs 295 ), I will report you to the moderators.
Good luck Zooey.
I wish you well.
I really hope to read of more substantive non-personal posts from you, i.e. those which are in line with the purpose of TP.
November 21st, 2006 at 8:14 pmgoodscarrier,
Please stop wasting bandwidth on your stupid pursuit of being right, and restrict your posts to those which are in line with the purpose of TP.
Keep wasting bandwidth and I will respond. — goodscarrier
Do not threaten me.
You go ahead and do whatever you feel is necessary. Just stop following me around.
November 21st, 2006 at 8:39 pmpreparing the feast:
http://www.knoph.com/louzyleeza/namingthebird.jpg
toast
November 23rd, 2006 at 3:39 pmRE: Election stat’s …. Has anyone checked the %ages of radio listeners to particular stations? I thought Air America Radio did a wonderful job and I wondered how many people listened to AAR rather than other radio speakers/stations. I think AAR helped the Democrats win this election and it’s truly sad AAR is struggling to survive while right-wing Republican outlets seem to have deep pockets of support/money. Peace
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