ThinkFast: November 29, 2006
ThinkFast: November 29, 2006
At a recent private reception, President Bush asked Sen.-elect Jim Webb (D-VA), “How’s your boy?” referring to Webb’s son Jimmy, who is serving in Iraq. Webb answered, “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President,” to which Bush responded, “That’s not what I asked you.” Webb “coldly” shot back, “That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President.” Webb later confessed that he was “tempted to slug” Bush.
“A December 7 summit at Riyadh may be the first venue for the Bush administration to negotiate directly with Iran and Syria in an effort to reduce the bloodshed in Iraq,” the New York Sun speculates.
A new classified memo authored by National Security Adviser Stephen Hadley expresses “serious doubts” about whether Iraqi Prime Minister al-Maliki has “the capacity to control the sectarian violence in Iraq.” Among the criticisms of al-Maliki is one often leveled at Bush: that he is surrounded by a “narrow circle” of advisers who “may skew the information he receives.”
New York Times executive editor Bill Keller announced in a statement yesterday that “Times correspondents may describe the conflict in Iraq as a civil war when they and their editors believe it is appropriate.” Keller added, “We expect to use the phrase sparingly and carefully, not to the exclusion of other formulations, not for dramatic effect.”
Former House speaker Newt Gingrich (R-GA) said yesterday “that unless the Bush administration admits that the war in Iraq is a ‘failure,’ it will never develop a strategy to leave the country successfully.”
“About $2 billion worth of Army and Marine Corps equipment – from rifles to tanks – is wearing out or being destroyed every month in Iraq and Afghanistan,” USA Today reports. “The wear and tear may lead to future equipment shortages and cutbacks in more advanced weapons.”
Iraq’s parliament yesterday voted to keep the country under a state of emergency for 30 more days. A U.S. military spokesman told reporters that he expects to see “‘elevated levels of violence‘ as a result of the car bombings that killed more than 200 people in Sadr City, a Shiite district in northeast Baghdad.”
The world will “fall 5 million short” of their goal to provide universal access to AIDS medicines for 9.8 million AIDS/HIV patients by 2010, according to a report by the International Treatment Preparedness Coalition. “The rhetoric from public health officials is good, but the follow-through is abysmal,” said one official.
Incoming Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) promised to do away with the Do-Nothing Congress by putting in “some hours here that haven’t been put in in a long time.” That means “being here more days in the week and we start off this year with seven weeks without a break. That hasn’t been done in many, many years here.”
And finally: iPod diplomacy. “The U.S. government’s first-ever effort to use trade sanctions to personally aggravate a foreign president expressly targets items believed to be favored by” North Korean dictator Kim Jong Il, including “iPods, plasma televisions and Segway electric scooters.“
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Wait…
Bush is against people not answering the questions they’re asked? When did this change happen?
November 29th, 2006 at 9:13 amGeorgie doesn’t understand that when a family member is stuck in the middle of a bloody war nothing else matters or exists other than them returning home safely.
Too bad Webb didn’t level him.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:17 amNew York Times executive editor Bill Keller announced in a statement yesterday that “Times correspondents may describe the conflict in Iraq as a civil war when they and their editors believe it is appropriate.â€
These idiots are so concerned about correctly labeling a war??? LOL???
Then why haven’t they been calling our involvement in Iraq what it is…an OCCUPATION!!!
The war was over when we overthrew Hussein and the president stated mission accomplished.
Are you listening CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, FOX, WaPO, Times, Tribune…
OCCUPATION! OCCUPATION! OCCUPATION! OCCUPATION!
Now why do you think they avoid calling it an occupation? Could it be because to admit that the war (our war, not the civil war) is over would make it very easy to LEAVE. And they don’t ever want our troops to leave.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:19 amI feel that Sen. Webb acted disrespectfully toward our President. The President has a conscience. He’s just wants to ensure that Sen. Webb’s son is still alive and safe. I know George Allen wouldn’t have responded in that type of manner. Shame on you Sen. Webb, Shame on you!
November 29th, 2006 at 9:20 am#1
Remember, for this administration it is ‘do what I say and not as I do’.
#4
November 29th, 2006 at 9:28 amHow Mr. Bush treated Senator-elect Webb is not only a slap in the face to Webb and his son but a slap in the face to every American with a family member fighting Bush’s unjust, mismanaged war in Iraq. If anyone should be ashamed it is Bush, though I doubt he has the capability to feel it. He is only concerned with covering his own rear and worrying about how history will judge him.
4, Anyone can see by the way you structured your post that even you don’t believe what you just wrote.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:29 amMy questions is: Does karl pay you even for your very weak posts?
#4 LMAO! your ~OMGOUTRAGE!!~ is quite amusing… goes quite well with my mornign coffee.
And you know, you’re right Allen wouldnt have responded in such a manner… cuz ya know… he DOESN’T HAVE KIDS FIGHTING IN IRAQ! jackass
November 29th, 2006 at 9:29 amDaryll, Allen wouldn’t have responded in any kind of way because he wouldn’t have been asked the question given that he doesn’t have any family in the war that he so strongly supports.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:32 amDaryll sez:
Please substantiate this claim. Every piece of evidence available speaks against this statement.
Very well…the easiest way to ensure that is to bring our troops home.
Precisely why I respect Webb and not Allen.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:34 am“The wear and tear may lead to future equipment shortages and cutbacks in more advanced weapons.â€
November 29th, 2006 at 9:34 amWell, you prepare for your country’s defense and international crises with the military left to you by the your incompetent, arrogant, pig-headed defense secretary, not with the military you wish to have.
#4 …Daryll [ I know George Allen wouldn't have responded in that type of manner. Shame on Sen. Webb, Shame on you ! ]. How did you come to such conclusion when Allen does not have a son or a daughter in Iraq?. Also how did you come to conclusion that Allen was willing to send any of his kids to Iraq? You don’t think that Senator’s Webb son in Iraq played a big factor? How can you compare feelings of a parent with son in parent with a parent who doesn’t?!!!
November 29th, 2006 at 9:36 amDaryll: What has Bush done to “ensure that Sen. Webb’s son is still alive and safe”?
November 29th, 2006 at 9:36 amFrom the article:
This is the same “Gingrich who stole Christmas” a few years ago: “The incoming Speaker of the House sets off a race to cut programs for the poor. But most Americans don’t agree with harsh cutbacks.”
And the same Gingrich who, as speaker of the House, led the charge for impeaching Clinton because he said he didn’t have sex with Lewinsky. Yet “Gingrich is widely known for adultery, and claims that “oral sex is not sex.” His idea of “family values” was to present his first wife (his high school math teacher) with divorce papers while she recovered from cancer. The Irish Times reports that the real reason Gingrich resigned was that Hustler Magazine had credit card receipts showing that Gingrich paid for prostitutes.”
And Gingrich “divorced [his second wife] in 1999, after revealing that he had been having an affair with a House aide.”
This is the man who wishes to lead the “Party of Moral Values.”
(sorry about the lack of links, but that seems to be a guaranteed way to have a post never make it onto the thread.)
November 29th, 2006 at 9:37 amEmpathy is an issue for dry-drunks; or so I’ve read.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:43 amI feel that Sen. Webb acted disrespectfully toward our President. The President has a conscience. He’s just wants to ensure that Sen. Webb’s son is still alive and safe. I know George Allen wouldn’t have responded in that type of manner. Shame on you Sen. Webb, Shame on you!
Comment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 9:20 am
You have got to be kidding. I wish I was near you right now just so I could knock some sense into you. But, who am I kidding, you right-wing nuts are permanently damaged!!!
November 29th, 2006 at 9:43 amIncoming Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) promised to do away with the Do-Nothing Congress by putting in “some hours here that haven’t been put in in a long time.†That means “being here more days in the week and we start off this year with seven weeks without a break. That hasn’t been done in many, many years here.â€
Cool, maybe my Fantasy Congress team can catch back up
November 29th, 2006 at 9:45 amDaryll, why aren’t you asking, “President Bush, how are your daughters? Have they enlisted in the Marines yet? After all, you are the staunchest supporter of this War. Certainly you can convince your daughters of the “noble cause” worth the sacrifice of their lives. When your daughters are serving in the front lines, you will no longer need to ask anybody else how their kid who is serving in Iraq is doing: you will know first hand.”
November 29th, 2006 at 9:46 am“Times correspondents may describe the conflict in Iraq as a civil war “
No no no!
The correct scientific term is “very low interrelational security“.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:48 amFOLLOW UP: matt lauer wasn’t being punished, as i wondered yesterday… he was with his wife who had a new baby boy! whew!
November 29th, 2006 at 9:52 amBNF, Thanks for the reminders about the Newt. He is a particularly nasty type of slime.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:54 am#4 Daryll
I feel that Sen. Webb acted disrespectfully toward our President. The President has a conscience. He’s just wants to ensure that Sen. Webb’s son is still alive and safe. I know George Allen wouldn’t have responded in that type of manner. Shame on you Sen. Webb, Shame on you!
No, the president does not have a conscience. If he did, it would have eaten him alive by now. He’s a sociopath. He doesn’t know the difference between right and wrong. All he understands is that he’s perpetually in trouble and he’s perpetually having to lie to try to get out of trouble. And he doesn’t care any more about whether or not Webb’s son is safe than he does about anyone else he’s sent to die for his lies and schemes.
Bush is an arrogant little putz. He doesn’t deserve a shred of respect. For me, it’s heartwarming to hear that a U.S. Senator has the same impulse as I would when faced with an evil little jerk who suddenly starts getting pushy. I might not have held back, though.
And, by the way, who gives a rat’s ass what Allen would have done? We already know what kind of a person Allen is. The voters responded appropriately.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:56 amDaryll, why aren’t you asking, “President Bush, how are your daughters? Have they enlisted in the Marines yet? After all, you are the staunchest supporter of this War. Certainly you can convince your daughters of the “noble cause†worth the sacrifice of their lives. When your daughters are serving in the front lines, you will no longer need to ask anybody else how their kid who is serving in Iraq is doing: you will know first hand.â€
Comment by Briseadh na Faire —
Your point is well taken. However, let me point out that it’s not only the Geroge Bush twins who are not serving in this supposedly “noble cause,” but none of his nieces or nephews–children of his various brothers, either.
November 29th, 2006 at 9:57 amBush responded, “That’s not what I asked you.” As if he is an emporer and entitled to subsurvience and cloying, nicey-nice butt-kissing. Senator Webb is probably the only person who has responded to Bush in this forthright way for six years. PLEASE keep it up, Senator Webb. The consultants and fawning people who surround you will try to curb your honesty. Hang out with Feingold and Tester, not Jane Harmon and Ben Nelson, please!
November 29th, 2006 at 10:03 amIt seems that Daryll made what we might call a strategic error in post #4.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:04 amFormer House speaker Newt Gingrich (R-GA) said yesterday “that unless the Bush administration admits that the war in Iraq is a ‘failure,’ it will never develop a strategy to leave the country successfully.â€
Wow. Even Newt Gringrich is capable of saying something smart. Our president can. and if I was Jim Webb, I would have punched him.
I should be honored to meet presidents… and I would have been honored for every previous president. Not this one. No way.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:06 amHey, Newt – good luck trying to get Bush to ever admit fault. He’d just as soon call the situation in Iraq a civil war.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:07 amAmerica’s Least Wanted
It is not the fault of the Bush administration.
That is the conclusion drawn by an internal memo prepared for President Bush.
http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/11/29/bush.trip.ap/index.html
Excuse me, but the government in Iraq is one of our making. The policy that put him in power also established the limit on that power. To the extent that there is a problem with the current government in Iraq (and there is a “problem”) is the extent to which there is a problem with the American policy.
Baker-Hamilton needs to focus on the strategy; past , present and future and draw a clear roadmap for measures that must be forthcoming and integrated into a future strategy. To the extent they get bogged down in tactics will be the extent to which Baker-Hamilton will be measured as to success of failure. My fear is that this report will only address tactical shortcomings with recommendations on the fringes on how to more effectively employ tactics that have a greater chance of success. That, of course, would be nothing more than another receipe for failure.
As you might correctly conclude, I view Baker-Hamilton as all hat and no cattle, as the saying goes. And that is even before the report is released. But that is also how sure I am that Baker-Hamilton is the wrong policy at the wrong time in the wrong theatre of operations. Listening to the King of Jordan would be a good starting point.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:09 amTP, you forgot this one.Annan Seeks Summit Outside Iraq to Reconcile Factions
November 29th, 2006 at 10:10 amI’m glad Webb didn’t slug Bush. Webb needs to be able to show up to work without a scandal right off the bat.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:15 amWebb’s a winner.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:17 amBush is a whiner.
Daryll, go back to Sunday school, where fantasy rules & objectivity is frowned upon.
As far as the ‘Little Lizard’ goes, why does anyone care what he spouts?
He’s not in office.
He’s not in the mainstream.
He’s not truthful about anything.
He’s an adulterer, veiling himself in projecting what’s good for all of us.
Newt, just STFU. Please.
There, got my opinion in before the thread becomes family hour again.
#4 Daryll
I feel that Sen. Webb acted disrespectfully toward our President. The President has a conscience. He’s just wants to ensure that Sen. Webb’s son is still alive and safe. I know George Allen wouldn’t have responded in that type of manner. Shame on you Sen. Webb, Shame on you!
No, the president does not have a conscience. If he did, it would have eaten him alive by now. He’s a sociopath. He doesn’t know the difference between right and wrong. All he understands is that he’s perpetually in trouble and he’s perpetually having to lie to try to get out of trouble. And he doesn’t care any more about whether or not Webb’s son is safe than he does about anyone else he’s sent to die for his lies and schemes.
Bush is an arrogant little putz. He doesn’t deserve a shred of respect. For me, it’s heartwarming to hear that a U.S. Senator has the same impulse as I would when faced with an evil little jerk who suddenly starts getting pushy. I might not have held back, though.
And, by the way, who gives a rat’s ass what Allen would have done? We already know what kind of a person Allen is. The voters responded appropriately.
Comment by chimpeach — November 29, 2006 @ 9:56 am
We’re at war, there’s a high risk of death during war time efforts. Who are you to judge the President? I believe that President Bush dearly cares for our troops. If so, why ask for more funding to aid them and the war effort? If Allen had a child over there and was put in that identical situation with the President, I know he wouldn’t have responded negatively to the President. Think about it, as Sen. Webb requested, if we leave, there will be even more turmoil, and our nation and other western countries would be at high risk for more terrorist attacks. We want to defeat these wretched groups, not empower them dems. Think about this situation logically.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:20 am“Empathy is an issue for dry-drunks; or so I’ve read.”
Indeed. It’s missing in sociopaths.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:20 amSen. Webb vs. The Scarecrow/Cowardly Lion from the Wizard of Oz? I would pay cash money to sit ringside at that bout.
I can hear Wimpy McFlightsuit now after pert near one punch, “No mas! No mas!”
November 29th, 2006 at 10:20 am“That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President.â€
I would have loved a nice smack in the face right after that.
The world will “fall 5 million short†of their goal to provide universal access to AIDS medicines for 9.8 million AIDS/HIV patients by 2010,
But its OK. When all those AIDS people are dead, they wont have to spend a penny. /sarcasm off
Among the criticisms of al-Maliki is one often leveled at Bush: that he is surrounded by a “narrow circle†of advisers who “may skew the information he receives.â€
How narrow is a circle?
“We expect to use the phrase sparingly and carefully, not to the exclusion of other formulations, not for dramatic effect.â€
November 29th, 2006 at 10:24 amFurthermore, we will begin to name hurricanes sweet breeze of love from God in order to make less dramatic effects about that phenomenon.
Shame on you Sen. Webb, Shame on you!
Comment by Daryll
My guess is Daryll fell a lot as a kid.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:26 am#33, Daryll
How dare you. This is not a dictatorship (yet), it is a ‘democracy’ … any one of us has the right to question, to judge Bush. He works for we the people, we the people do not work for him. As the employer of this President it is not only our right, but our duty.
“there’s a high risk of death during war time efforts” … well no shit sherlock. The point is not of high risk of death but is that death worth it? We are fighting an unworthy cause, an illegitimate war in Iraq. Bush has the blood of American soldiers and Iraqi civilians on his hands.
And if to the lead of the war the Bush administration had thought logically, we would not be in the war. If people like you had thought logically you would have protested this war rather than supporting it. If you had thought logically people like you would not have re-elected this idiot.
And the dems don’t empower these groups, the Republicans and this administration do by continuing this unjust war in Iraq.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:30 amThere, got my opinion in before the thread becomes family hour again.
Comment by Zimzone
LMAO!!!!
November 29th, 2006 at 10:32 amDaryll, you’re obviously insane as evidenced by your postings, but I don’t think that would exclude you from being able to serve in Iraq under current guidelines. It certainly hasn’t excluded anyone from service in this administration. Can you tell us again why you aren’t serving in Iraq Daryll?
November 29th, 2006 at 10:33 amHey junior . . . ‘How’s your boy?’ is what they’re gonna be asking your cell-mate.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:36 am#1 – “Wait…Bush is against people not answering the questions they’re asked? When did this change happen?” Comment by nitpicker
*******Dear Nit – Re-read the copy:
November 29th, 2006 at 10:36 am“How’s your boy?†referring to Webb’s son Jimmy, who is serving in Iraq. Webb answered, “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President,†to which Bush responded, “That’s not what I asked you.â€
The President DID NOT ask Senator-elect Webb, “What are YOUR views on the war and “re-deploying” our troops.” He asked how Webb’s son was doing – PERIOD. (Progs keep telling the rest of us how bright they are – but the inability to for the Senator-elect answer even the most simple and thoughtful question has me wondering…..)
[...] …and you have Jim Webb, the Senator-elect from Virginia, in this ballsy exchange with the Commander-in-Chief: At a recent private reception, President Bush asked Sen.-elect Jim Webb (D-VA), “How’s your boy?” referring to Webb’s son Jimmy, who is serving in Iraq. Webb answered, “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President,” to which Bush responded, “That’s not what I asked you.” Webb “coldly” shot back, “That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President.” Webb later confessed that he was “tempted to slug” Bush. [...]
November 29th, 2006 at 10:40 amI only voted for Webb as a vote against Allen but I’m liking him more and more.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:41 amDarryl, no, I believe Allen would have responded in the same manner if he had been addressing President Clinton. Or perhaps Cheney would have responded in a similar fashion if he were addressing Senator Leahy on the Senate floor. But the greater thing to consider is that Bush could not ask that question of Allen because Allen’s has no who are serving. How do you know Bush has a conscience? What has he done, other than tell you that he has deep faith. That indicates that he has any sort of conscience at all? Was it his mocking of death row inmates as they were executed in Texas? (Can’t think of her name, but I remember clearly the president mocking the woman who ax murdered that couple and then said she found faith in Jesus) Or is it his ability to completely express his personal sense of responsibility for his own actions (Not really). He has, in my opinion, never given any sign that he has a conscience, and, other that his word, he has performed no actions that indicate that he truly is a man of faith. So you say Webb was being disrespectful? Is Bush being disrespectful every time a reporter asks a question and Bush gives a totally unrelated answer? Would reporters be disrespectful if they looked at Bush and said, that’s not what I asked you?
I am currently reading a book on Stalingrad and am getting to the end. During most of this book, I find it chillingly familiar how the people surrounding Hitler tell him what he wants to hear and how Hitler insists that his way is the only way that will work, even when disaster is looming. Goering and Richtoffen promised Hitler that 6th army could be supplied by air once surrounded so they gave him data that showed him they were doing their job. When captain Behr reported to Hitler on the wretched condition of sixth army shortly before the final battle Hitler still would not believe what he was hearing or seeing (Behr brought out 6th Army’s war diary from the encirclement). The Luftwaffe told Hitler that they were sending the supplies (300 tons per day were the minimum needed to survive), and they showed him records indicating that the supplies had been sent. Behr showed records indicating that the supplies were not arriving and that only one day in the past two months had anything close to the minimum been received. Heck in their first assessment the Luftwaffe said they needed more airfields inside the surrounded pocket and that they needed trained crews and repair facilities on the ground to make the resupply happen. Neither of these conditions were met. Hitler clung to the notion that 6th army was still a viable mobile fighting force and he would not allow them to break out to safety because leaving Stalingrad at that time would be an admission of defeat and that they could stay forever simply by force of will, even as the entire Don front was being driven back hundreds of miles away from the encircled army. No who does that sound like? Hmmm, only takes the word of sycophants, only hears what he wants to hear, fully believes that by force of will he can achieve his goals, even as he is being proven wrong by facts etc…It is scary to read this stuff and see the same personality traits in our current leader.
Note to right wing fanatics…I am not equating Bush with Hitler. I am simply pointing out that they appear to think in the same manner and surround them selves with sycophants who tell them what they want to hear even in the face of mounting evidence to the contrary.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:42 amIn #34, Daryll stumbles again. How often has W attended a military funeral for any of the Americans who have died in his war? Why does he have them returned to Wilmington in the dead of night and shipped FedEx to their families accompanied with a bill for the equipment they left behind when they died? If that is ‘dearly caring’, I could do with a little less of it.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:42 am“Empathy is an issue for dry-drunks; or so I’ve read.â€
Indeed. It’s missing in sociopaths.
Comment by Verse
Combine the two, add the most powerful office in the world, stir with a supplicant congress and present with a compliant media. Viola! Half a million dead people and billions of wasted dollars sans the guilt.
The only thing missing is a $500 million dollar library to scrub the recod.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:45 amDaryll, you’re obviously insane as evidenced by your postings, but I don’t think that would exclude you from being able to serve in Iraq under current guidelines. It certainly hasn’t excluded anyone from service in this administration. Can you tell us again why you aren’t serving in Iraq Daryll?
Comment by Quadrajet — November 29, 2006 @ 10:33 am
As explained previously, I was a Marine Corps officer 2 years ago. I resigned my position because I didn’t enjoy being in a tactical group, but I do love Marine Corps morals and values. Sure I only served during peace time and resigned as a 1st Lt, but I did serve my country. Currently, I test government web programs and software. I’m helping government officials operate online securely, which will help protect our government soil and prevent future terrorists attacks. I may not be working directly in the government sector, but my job is protecting everyone residing in the United States. Take that!
November 29th, 2006 at 10:47 amPoor wing-nuts, still HURTING from their DEFEAT.
Recent reductions in trolling here have left us with the 33% -ers who blindly follow der Shrub, like helpless, blind mice.
You’re PATHETIC, cowards. You’re no better than Lewinsky-type, oval office blow-job wannabee’s, who for lack of intelligence, would do ANYTHING for our bumbling, idiotic President.
GET A CLUE OR TWO, YOU SORRY LOSERS.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:49 amAt a recent private reception, President Bush asked Sen.-elect Jim Webb (D-VA), “How’s your boy?†referring to Webb’s son Jimmy, who is serving in Iraq. Webb answered, “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President,†to which Bush responded, “That’s not what I asked you.†Webb “coldly†shot back, “That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President.†Webb later confessed that he was “tempted to slug†Bush.
Oy. I’m glad he didn’t, because he doesn’t need to start that way, but I’m glad he admitted the feeling. Heh.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:50 ammaybe, aphro, webb was answering in the first person because he did not want to tell his son’s like views to the commander-in-chief… we all understand that webb meant, ‘he wants out of iraq, sir, they all do’ …
November 29th, 2006 at 10:51 aman empathetic bush would have then said, ‘yea, i know, we’re doin’ what we can to help that along’, or some such bullshite… not acted like a bully wannabe dictator…
.
A new classified memo authored by National Security Adviser Stephen Hadley expresses “serious doubts†about whether Iraqi Prime Minister al-Maliki has “the capacity to control the sectarian violence in Iraq.†Among the criticisms of al-Maliki is one often leveled at Bush: that he is surrounded by a “narrow circle†of advisers who “may skew the information he receives.â€
This seems quite important, TP, while also quite ironic. It looks like this admin might be trying to find a way to shake up Iraq even more — we’ll never get out of there — just like Georgie wants.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:53 amBush response to Senator Webb:”..That is not what I asked you….” simply meaning “I am in charge here” . But Bush unease with the senator comes from the fact that first: Senator Webb was in the minus column based on GOP calculations to win Virginia state.Secondly: Bush campaigned for senator Allen also…and thirdly: Webb’s win which gave the Democrats the Senate majority…So, Allen was the symbol of GOP defeat in the eyes of Bush..that is why Bush response was unfriendly one….
November 29th, 2006 at 10:54 am#48,
November 29th, 2006 at 10:54 amWell said, Walt, well said.
#50, Darryl, you do not sound like any Marine Officer I have ever met in my life. They usually are very smart and very articulate. I served in the 3rd ACR when they awere stationed at Bliss and the Marines had their duck hunters trained there. I had a lot of respect for those guys, none of who were anything close to resembling you.
Not one of the guys i met would have resigned their comission in the face of action. Thhey all have tremendous loyalty to the Corps and their men and would never have abanndoned them. What has changed that they now allow yout ype in?
November 29th, 2006 at 10:58 amI was a Marine Corps officer 2 years ago.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:58 amComment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 10:47 am
Sure I only served during peace time
There was peace 2 years ago? Wow, and to think I thought this invastion started March 2003. Daryll, may I be the first to state:BULL
I’m helping government officials operate online securely, which will help protect our government soil and prevent future terrorists attacks. I may not be working directly in the government sector, but my job is protecting everyone residing in the United States.
May I again state: BULL
#45 – “Might Aphrodite, Were you there? Did you catch the tone of Bush`s question? The tone would clearly be the story.TP got it right.”
Comment by Bill C`s alter ego
*******Dear Bill – You could be right – but that doesn’t change the fact Senator-elect Webb used a question ABOUT his son to make a political dig. Unable to answer the question or bent on making a political point? Either stupid OR tacky……
November 29th, 2006 at 10:59 amEveryone say “hi” to little out little modern day chickenhawk, Daryll!!!
Oh yes, YOU ARE. Enlisted, but too big a wuss to fight (boo hoo, tactical group SCAREY!)
No wonder you worship little Shrub, YOU’RE JUST LIKE HIM!!!
I seriously doubt anything you do for the Government involving “securely”(?) hasn’t done one thing to protect me. As IF.
BWAAK, BWAAK, BWAAK!!!
November 29th, 2006 at 10:59 amFormer House speaker Newt Gingrich (R-GA) said yesterday “that unless the Bush administration admits that the war in Iraq is a ‘failure,’ it will never develop a strategy to leave the country successfully.â€
**yawn**
November 29th, 2006 at 10:59 amIncoming Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) promised to do away with the Do-Nothing Congress by putting in “some hours here that haven’t been put in in a long time.†That means “being here more days in the week and we start off this year with seven weeks without a break. That hasn’t been done in many, many years here.â€
Good job, Harry.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:01 amIt’s a circus there. Before, I have refused to travel for training to San Francisco because of its lack of morality.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:05 amComment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 8:12 am
Now wait just a second here. Our brave 1st Lt St.Daryll afraid to visit San Francisco because of them there homo-sexuals? A Marine afraid to visit a city?
BULL I say
#53 – “maybe, aphro, webb was answering in the first person because he did not want to tell his son’s like views to the commander-in-chief…”
Comment by katy
********Dear katy – Where in the question, “H-O-W-’S Y-O-U-R B-O-Y?”
November 29th, 2006 at 11:06 amis the implied OR direct question that the President is inquiring about Webb juniors opinion of the military operation in Iraq? Had the President asked, “Jim what do you hear from your boy about the situation on the ground?” you might have a leg to stand on. As it is, you may want to cut and run before you dig yourself any deeper.
#50 – Daryll, I didn’t ask you if you had ever served in the military – I asked you why you weren’t serving in Iraq. Now I’ll have to question your credibility since you popped off with this:
“I was a Marine Corps officer 2 years ago. I resigned my position because I didn’t enjoy being in a tactical group, but I do love Marine Corps morals and values. Sure I only served during peace time”
The Iraq war began in 2003. That would be 3 going on 4 years ago, yet you claim that you served in ‘peace time’ 2 years ago. Were you serving in the US Marine Corps?
November 29th, 2006 at 11:07 amIf asked, I’m sure that Jim Webb’s son would respond that he’d rather be in Buenos Aires doing a three-way with the twins.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:08 amDaryll you just don’t get it….
The war in Iraq can not considered as simplistic as Bush presents it to be. Their are many other factors contributing to this Middle Eastern Conflict. Bush has made the region LESS stabile due to our invasion. Now a civil war has broken out in the area and it only looks like it is getting worse. How many young men and women will have to die before you admit you were wrong about this whole thing. My older brother is in Iraq right now (he is stationed only 15 miles away from Baghdad) and I do not want to hear about his death because people like you will not give up this charade. I am sick of it… all of these kids are dieing for a cause we still do not know. Bush has no conscience at all. We should have continued what we were doing in the past (catching Osama Bin Laden) instead of taking this wild goose chase. America is sick of this war and are working hard to restore order in this country…
November 29th, 2006 at 11:09 amDaryll,
How long were you in before you resigned your position? And why would you join the Marine Corps and NOT expect to be in a tactical group? Just questions?
November 29th, 2006 at 11:09 amWho are you to judge the President?
Comment by Daryll
All of us who judge GWB are The People, as in “We The People….”
You know that document you swore to uphold when you took your oath as a Marine….
Sorry, I can’t go on…..I’m too busy laughing my ass off…
November 29th, 2006 at 11:11 amIt’s a circus there. Before, I have refused to travel for training to San Francisco because of its lack of morality.
Comment by Daryll
Daryll, you’ve never been out of your home town, bless your heart.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:14 am“Not one of the guys i met would have resigned their comission in the face of action.”
Comment by Mark — November 29, 2006 @ 10:58 am
Hmmmm, sounds like Daryll is one of those ‘cut and runners’? Tell us it ain’t so Daryll.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:14 amAnd why would you join the Marine Corps and NOT expect to be in a tactical group?
Comment by robert
You know that document you swore to uphold when you took your oath as a Marine….
Comment by Zooey
The Iraq war began in 2003. That would be 3 going on 4 years ago, yet you claim that you served in ‘peace time’ 2 years ago.
Comment by Quadrajet
Well, this certainly sucks for St.Daryll! But pretending to have served in our armed forces really does piss me off. At least have the ballz to admit you were too chicken sh!t to serve an invasion you claim to approve of. I’d at least respect your honesty. Thousands of thousands of our brave men and women are serving over in this hell known as Iraq, and you “pretend” to be among them?
Geez, did you not get the memo from the Bible about lying? pseudo-christian!
St.Daryll, you, my friend, are an idiot of the hypocritical kind. Begone before you embarrass yourself even more
November 29th, 2006 at 11:23 amI was a Marine Corps officer 2 years ago.
Comment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 10:47 am
Sure I only served during peace time
There was peace 2 years ago? Wow, and to think I thought this invastion started March 2003. Daryll, may I be the first to state:BULL
I’m helping government officials operate online securely, which will help protect our government soil and prevent future terrorists attacks. I may not be working directly in the government sector, but my job is protecting everyone residing in the United States.
May I again state: BULL
Comment by DRxJ — November 29, 2006 @ 10:58 am
I served between 10/2000-2/2004. Second, all units in Quantico were considered non-deployable during that timeframe, and I am employed by a defense consulting company.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:23 amWebb “coldly†shot back, “That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President.†Webb later confessed that he was “tempted to slug†Bush.
Reason 127 for how I know I voted for the right guy.
Senator-elect Webb used a question ABOUT his son to make a political dig.
Now just wait a second… Its simply common sense to end the War in Iraq (and to not have gone in the first place). It is your “side” and people who have made this a political issue by dividing the country and initally labelling anti-war dissenters as “traitors”.
Please regain some honest perspective here. All of you people who are so concerned about the President’s “feelings”, while he still has all of that blood on his hands, have COMPLETELY lost it.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:26 amIt’s a circus there. Before, I have refused to travel for training to San Francisco because of its lack of morality.
Comment by Daryll
Daryll, you’ve never been out of your home town, bless your heart.
Comment by Zooey — November 29, 2006 @ 11:14 am
Zooey, I went to a IA training course in Georgia vs. San Francisco. San Francisco is full of immorality.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:27 amComment by DRxJ — November 29, 2006 @ 10:58 am
Comment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 11:23 am
It took you that long to “google” Marine Corps?
November 29th, 2006 at 11:28 amGenius, I tell ya
Off topic, sorry….Love the new format and posting box TP…Please keep this one…Much better than in the past……Blessings all….Off in the winter blast to stock up..
November 29th, 2006 at 11:29 amDaryll, Let me help you a little buddy. In 2003 I was sitting in a tent in the middle of Kuwait near Breach Point West. A place called Camp Fox. That was 3 1/2 years ago.
If you served 2000-2004 that is not concidered peace time. Basically anything after Nov 2001 is not concidered peace time.
Officers do not resign their Position. They resign their Commission.
If you were at Quantico, and they were non-deployers, then you were not with a tactical unit. Also, how could you join the Marine Corps and not expect that you were going to a tactical unit? THAT IS WHAT WE DO.
So you resigned your Position because you did not like being in a tactical unit that you were not in.
I am not going to call you a liar, but I will say that your story does not add up.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:35 am#73 – Daryll, that response doesn’t answer anything that’s been asked, and only further calls your credibility into question since you claim again that you were in the military during a time period that includes both the Afghanistan and Iraq conflicts yet you served during peace time.
By the way, since you say that you work for a defense consulting company that would be paid with tax dollars, should I assume that you’re off work today and we’re not being billed for the time you’re spending here at TP?
November 29th, 2006 at 11:36 amZooey, I went to a IA training course in Georgia vs. San Francisco. San Francisco is full of immorality.
Comment by Daryll
So is the whole frickin’ world, Daryll! Ya’ll got Newt Gingrich in Georgia, so give me a break.
When are you scheduled to leave the planet?
November 29th, 2006 at 11:41 amI went to a IA training course in Georgia vs. San Francisco. San Francisco is full of immorality.
Sounds like you’ve never really been to Georgia either…
November 29th, 2006 at 11:41 amAt a recent private reception, President Bush asked Sen.-elect Jim Webb (D-VA), “How’s your boy?†referring to Webb’s son Jimmy, who is serving in Iraq. Webb answered, “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President,†to which Bush responded, “That’s not what I asked you.†Webb “coldly†shot back, “That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President.†Webb later confessed that he was “tempted to slug†Bush.
Once again, Bush’s ignorance on display. You don’t ask that question of an anti-war individual, much less one who happens to be a Democrat and who is newly elected to the Senate and can grab you by the nuts and throw you out of office should impeachment hearings be held.
At least he didn’t call Webb “Dad.” I’m sure that, along with his question, would have been too much to prevent Webb from swinging.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:41 amDaryll, Let me help you a little buddy.
I am not going to call you a liar, but I will say that your story does not add up.
Comment by robert
Not much help for the Daryllmeister, Robert. :)
November 29th, 2006 at 11:42 amHe’s just wants to ensure that Sen. Webb’s son is still alive and safe.
Comment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 9:20 am
Oh, BS! If Webb’s son was dead, Bush would know about it. On the other hand, maybe not, as the administration only views the death toll as “just a number.”
Bush can take his show of sympathy and shove it up his comma.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:45 amI went to a IA training course in Georgia vs. San Francisco. San Francisco is full of immorality.
Sounds like you’ve never really been to Georgia either…
Comment by June
Classic. Truly classic! Ya know, that city of Georgia is not cracked up to what it used to be…..
November 29th, 2006 at 11:46 amWhen are you scheduled to leave the planet?
Comment by Zooey — November 29, 2006 @ 11:41 am
Actually Zooey, when reading Daryll’s posts I often find myself wondering if he’s ever been here.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:47 amDear Darryll – When sharks smell blood, they zero in on their prey. The playground sharks here at TP are no different. And you are right about SF – the city WAS fabulous ONCE upon a time……no more. Obviously, you have a different point of view than the majority of posters – remember – they HATE “diverse” ideas…..
Enjoy this playground for what it is – a place for many employEES to steal time from their oppressive employERS.
’til later……
November 29th, 2006 at 11:52 amActually Zooey, when reading Daryll’s posts I often find myself wondering if he’s ever been here.
Comment by Quadrajet
Unfortunately, he’s just one of millions of small minded, backwater, redneck idiots who probably is 35 years old and still lives with his mommy.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:52 amRobert,
Thank you for your service bro.
For real.
Comment by Bill C`s alter ego
Ok, now, somebody explain this to me, why do US citizens hold in such a high regard US troops or former troops?
Why I dont hear american people expressing the same admiration for single moms, nurses, black women with 3 jobs, teachers, farmers, underpaid doctors, etc?
November 29th, 2006 at 11:55 amDaryll started ‘life’ here as a “preacher”,
November 29th, 2006 at 11:57 amnow he has dropped that to become an “ex-military techie”…..
I noticed in his radical christian mode many errors in his descriptions of scripture and the Bible, leading me to believe at that time he was playing a role, a bit of web theater, if you will……..
This current incarnation of his only confirms my intuition he is a paid hack.
Paid Hacks reside in the outhouses of trolls, under their bridges………….
Dear Progs – I LOVE how you were adroitly able to shift from the vacuousness of Webb’s self-serving answer to playing jump on Darryl. Let’s see – - yesterday you piled on Humanist and today it’s Darryl. That of course is probably due to the fact that prog postings were less than stellar. In fact, the ducking and feeble punches of most of the posts were pretty pitiful……
November 29th, 2006 at 11:58 amAnd finally: iPod diplomacy. “The U.S. government’s first-ever effort to use trade sanctions to personally aggravate a foreign president expressly targets items believed to be favored by†North Korean dictator Kim Jong Il, including “iPods, plasma televisions and Segway electric scooters.“
And Bushie really believes that Kim would not get one or a lot of these without his permission? And, who really wants an oh-so-expensive-and-useless Segway scooter? It’s a dull gizmo who never had too much popularity. May I remind to Bush that China fabricates a lot of the plasma televisions that we have in the West and that they can clone the iPod without sweating a drop? And that China will not embargo NK in a near future?
November 29th, 2006 at 11:58 amZooey, I went to a IA training course in Georgia vs. San Francisco. San Francisco is full of immorality.
Comment by Daryll
Well, don’t come anywhere near NE TN, Daryll.
Here in our little part of the world we have married men sleeping with married and un-married women.
We have boys bringing home girls and having sex with them in hot tubs at 4am in the morning while the boys’ parents are asleep in the house. The fun couple then goes inside and hops in bed, and 20 minutes later goes at it again.
We have homosexual couples spending time together and living in the same house.
We have male preachers having homesexual affairs while they are still married to their wives. Once the wife divorces the husband, the hubby then breaks into their ex-wives’ homes and rummage through their belongings, and brainwash their children and make them hate their mothers.
We have sisters-in-law who have the hots for their brothers-in-law.
And speaking of preachers, we have ones that get married and then have affairs with women who are part of the churches’ singles group.
So, definitely, stay away from us. We wouldn’t want to hurt your feelings or anything.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:02 pmSorry, I meant to direct post #51 DIRECTLY at the geriatric postings of M.A.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:04 pm#94…..
November 29th, 2006 at 12:08 pmThere’s nothing we need to defend Sen. Webb for, or discuss any further…. he’s off to a great start! Go Jimmy, go!
I agree however, that Daryll is a waste of time, energy, and thought.
He is here with the sole purpose of roiling emotions and drawing attention away from the task of objectively paying attention to problem solving. A Rovian scholar, I believe him to be……
#92 Ok, now, somebody explain this to me, why do US citizens hold in such a high regard US troops or former troops?
Comment by Juan C — November 29, 2006 @ 11:55 am
Because, after the war of Viet Nam, many veterans coming to home were spitted and mistreated in the USA, by the civilians who did view the massacres of Mai Lai, the results of the bombings and the rest of horrors done by the USA troops to the vietnamese people.
After that, veterans organized themselves and fought for a recognizement of his merits and claimed “we only followed orders to protect you” (even when this was not a valid excuse in the Nuremberg Trials for nazis).
Nowadays, reigns a political correction in the USA, and people likes to micromanage the misdemeanors of the troops, “only a few bad apples”, etc.
This tends to be a lame excuse, because the “only few bad apples” were surrounded by many, many other “fresh apples” who did nothing, altough the military manual of the USA and the Geneva Conventions signed by the USA itself characterized these acts as punishable, and the “following orders” is not an excuse because both say crystal clear that they “can (and must) say no” to these behaviors.
So, the USA has so many open fronts and needs so badly the military that they don’t dare critizise their own army.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:11 pmMerciful God….
Comment by mighty aphrodite
If you’re lucky…
November 29th, 2006 at 12:14 pmEither stupid OR tacky……
Comment by mighty aphrodite — November 29, 2006 @ 10:59 am
Mightyasswipe, please don’t be modest, you’re not either/or, you are both stupid and tacky:>D
November 29th, 2006 at 12:17 pmI wish he had slugged him so Shrub would really know what a “Thumpin” feels like
November 29th, 2006 at 12:22 pmit’s easy to understand his self-serving motive…….
Comment by mighty aphrodite
Especially from the closed mind of a self-serving, right wing, corporatist government dolt. Takes one to know one, eh?
Puddles…
November 29th, 2006 at 12:26 pmJim Webb has a son who is a Lance Corporal in the Marines stationed in Iraq. How hard would it have been for Bush to show the slightest bit of empathy and say “I understand,” or “Hang in there.” Bush is a sociopath. He’s still the same disgusting little bully terrorizing his younger siblings and rushing out in the rain to blow up frogs. He has to be the worst excuse for a human being to ever hold the office.
But, what this thread exposes is that Bush’s cult-like followers are also sociopaths, devoid of any shread of human decency. Daryll doesn’t think citizens of a democratic representative republic have the right to question the president. That makes him a fascist. Mighty A-hole, as usual, spits bile and disdain at anyone who dislikes or questions her dear leader. That makes her a fascist. Both of these sorry excuses for people are the worst our society has to offer. They are a symbol of what’s wrong with our society today — people without any sense of justice, devoid of empathy and totally without any of the qualities our Founders described as American.
I, for one, will never respond to any post by either of these a-holes again and I suggest that like-minded people do the same. They’re both like a disease on this board. They stink it up to the point where I don’t want to even engage in any of these discussions because their posts are so inhuman and absurd. They are here to f*ck things up, people. Please ignore them.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:27 pmI feel that Sen. Webb acted disrespectfully toward our President. The President has a conscience.
Comment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 9:20 am
And you don’t think our President acts disrespectfully? He is a pathological liar. He and his lying spokespeople never give a straight answer. Bush’s retort to Webb was just more flaming hypocrisy. But blind idolatrous Bush supporters like Daryll are invariably VERY comfortable with hypocrisy.
And by the way, Daryll, I think the evidence is overwhelming that Bush does not have a conscience to speak of.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:29 pmSo, the USA has so many open fronts and needs so badly the military that they don’t dare critizise their own army.
Comment by Ego Sum
Great post. Thank you very much.
unlike South America which has been home to so many military coups and banana dictators
Comment by mighty aphrodite
There is a latinamerican joke:
Q: Why doesnt US have military coups?
A: Because they dont have US embassies. :)
Most of us actually appreciate the fact that we have people brave enough to protect the ideals of our wonderful country.
Are those the same brave men that had been used to invade, occupied, attacked 180+ times other countries to fulfill american companies economic goal´s? Why do you have to protect the ideals overseas?
And it is a scary thought that some tin-horn dictator has the power to send thug-troops to ones home and permanently shut them up is not something normal Americans fear.
There is no need for that. You have US media.
Many single moms black women, farmers, doctors DID serve in the military and we thank them for their service to the nation.
But do you thank them for trying hard to educate children, to provide you with food, to struggle against a racist society or just for holding a rifle?
November 29th, 2006 at 12:32 pmMerciful God, the US has been blessed with a fine military tradition of service.
Isnt just that a big contradiction? Jesus would have served?
Webb later confessed that he was “tempted to slug†Bush.
This is what we went to the polls for, A CHANGE OF ATTITUDE when dealing with the Dumbya.
IN YOUR FACE REALITY BITCH SLAP.
#107 Very well said, Bluedog49.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:33 pmDear BluePuP – Good thing you’re not “ever going to respond “to trolls again. You’re not very good at it. You couldn’t correctly frame the question to answer if you asked your wife for permission…..As usual…..
Poor Jim Webb – poor BluePup – - unable to answer SIMPLE questions……
’til later…….
November 29th, 2006 at 12:35 pm#99 Many single moms black women, farmers, doctors DID serve in the military and we thank them for their service to the nation. You seem to have a bit of misunderstanding regarding our country. One is not guaranteed happiness – we have the right to freely pursue it…..
Comment by mighty aphrodite — November 29, 2006 @ 12:08 pm
…Thanks to the lack of social services, educational opportunities and exits to their economic situation in the job market in the USA…
November 29th, 2006 at 12:35 pmGoddamn it Webb! You had a chance to cold cock the smarmy bastard, you should have taken it.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:35 pm#33 Daryll
We’re at war, there’s a high risk of death during war time efforts. Who are you to judge the President?
We’re stuck in the middle of a civil war. It was Bush’s choice to invade Iraq and it’s been an incredible disaster from the start. All his reasons for invading Iraq turned out to be lies. That makes him a liar and a murderer. Who am I to judge the president? I’m a citizen of the United States. So far, citizens are still allowed to do that. I would never be so egotistical as to think that I’d make a good president, but this country would be far better off with me in there than him. That’s how bad he is.
I believe that President Bush dearly cares for our troops.
You can believe whatever you want. I’m going to believe my eyes and ears and open mind.
If Allen had a child over there and was put in that identical situation with the President, I know he wouldn’t have responded negatively to the President.
You mean you “believe” he wouldn’t have responded that way. There’s a difference.
…if we leave, there will be even more turmoil, and our nation and other western countries would be at high risk for more terrorist attacks.
And if we stay there will be even more turmoil and our nation and other western countries would be at high risk from more terrorist attacks. What’s to stop the terrorists from attacking now? Do you think they’re all tied down in Iraq right now? Terrorists are all over the world and they can come and go as they please. There’s nothing about our presence in Iraq that’s stopping terrorists from attacking anywhere else in the world. In fact, our presence there is just helping their recruitment efforts and it’s giving them a place to train. They get to test out all kinds of nifty remote controlled explosive devices there, perfecting their craft for use elsewhere.
Think about this situation logically.
Demonstrate that for me.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:36 pmComment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 11:27 am
Who are you to judge?
November 29th, 2006 at 12:36 pm#4 Daryyl! Your back! I’d say welcome back, but you may be getting the message already that your smarmy pap isn’t well received among those who can actually think critically.
November 29th, 2006 at 12:38 pmWhy does anyone put a microphone in front of that discredited, corrupt hack?
November 29th, 2006 at 12:39 pmComment by mighty aphrodite — November 29, 2006 @ 11:52 am
Thus spake the alleged lawyer. How many billable hours have you spent here, MA?
November 29th, 2006 at 12:44 pm#117 – greenjeans,
November 29th, 2006 at 12:46 pmFor humorous relief?
I served between 10/2000-2/2004. Second, all units in Quantico were considered non-deployable during that timeframe, and I am employed by a defense consulting company.
Comment by Daryll — November 29, 2006 @ 11:23 am
Last month Daryll described himself as a 24 year old. And a graduate of Oral Roberts CIS program. Did you do ROTC at OR?
November 29th, 2006 at 12:48 pmBraid Fairy – I don’t get paid for work I don’t do – unlike MANY here…….
November 29th, 2006 at 12:53 pmBraid Fairy – I don’t get paid for work I don’t do – unlike MANY here…….
Comment by mighty aphrodite
Apparently you have problems with comprehension, Haggette. The question was not whether or not you would be paid for those hours, but HOW MANY BILLABLE HOURS?
Attorneys bill by 1/10ths of the hour. For this thread alone, I would estimate at least 1.10 hours. How much do California attorneys make per hour — assuming they’re working?
November 29th, 2006 at 1:00 pmComment by mighty aphrodite — November 29, 2006 @ 12:53 pm
Then you don’t record the hours you put in here? How does the law firm you supposedly work for appreciate your lack of billable hours?
November 29th, 2006 at 1:04 pm#121 The keyword is productivity. MANY here produce far more revenue for their employers (or themselves if they are self-employed) while sleeping than you fully awake… but hey, you have mister Trannie Lover to help you with the family budget…
November 29th, 2006 at 1:05 pm#107 – Bludedog – You’re right of course, but there’s something about Daryll (kinda like Something about Mary) that makes me light up and rattles the shit out of my lyingbastardometer. Just have to call BS..Sorry for asking for dispnsation on this one troll.
November 29th, 2006 at 1:06 pmExcellent post Bluedog49.
There is no defense of Bush’s conduct, and face-to-face the trolls don’t try. It’s only because of the anonymity of this venue that they can spew their bile and vile. Ignore them and they will go away.
I hope the upcoming hearings will wipe the smirk and the swagger from the pathetic loser, Webb showed a lot of restraint to not smack the Chimp.
November 29th, 2006 at 1:11 pmBack from lunch, commission-billet whatever, it’s a position. I went to OCS which is located near the old Butler Gymnasium. I was commisioned at the Quantico auditorium/theatre. I supported MarCorSyscom who aided battleground troops, during military operations, with computer software support and testing so it was considered a tactical command. I refused to be under a dictatorial military organization, and I hate instructing troops to complete illogical orders (my perspective), which were given by superior officers. That’s a portion of the reason why I left. I make decisions by using my intuition . Currently, there are officers in this organization that lack common sense. I can think for myself.
November 29th, 2006 at 1:13 pm#125 – “Then you don’t record the hours you put in here? How does the law firm you supposedly work for appreciate your lack of billable hours?”
Comment by Briseadh na Faire
*******Braid Fairy – I own the firm….Now if you’ll excuse me, I have an appointment.
November 29th, 2006 at 1:17 pm*******Braid Fairy – I own the firm….Now if you’ll excuse me, I have an appointment.
Comment by mighty aphrodite
And the Haggette slips up…
November 29th, 2006 at 1:23 pmDaryll – when did you graduate from OR?
November 29th, 2006 at 1:42 pmBill C., Thanks for the recognition. I am honored to serve you, the American People, My real boss.
Juan,
I think people have learned to have a higher regard for the troops/former troops after the way they were treated post-Viet Nam. Everyone in a uniform was being judged by the few the were complete barbarians.
Personally, I have the highest respect for single PARENTS that take care of their kids regardless of race. I think that teachers, cops, and firefighters are the everyday heroes that no one ever talks about.
You may not like the U.S. Military, but then again, you also may not understand it well either. The majority of service members are just “trying to do their best” like everyone else in the world. We take an oath “to uphold and defend the Constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic and to follow the orders of the officers appointed over us and the President of the United States”. We take that oath seriously. We (the military members) are not the ones that are trying to force our beliefs over in Iraq. We are upholding the oath we took.
It is our civilian leadership and the American people that we serve And our leaders in the House, Senate, and the Presidency that have to determine where and how we serve. It is the American people that decide who runs those offices.
November 29th, 2006 at 1:43 pmRobert,
I flip you a lot of shit, but I do appreciate your service to our country. I don’t think I’ve said that before, and I should have done.
All of my formative years were spent as a military dependent, and I wouldn’t change a thing about it, except for maybe more money for my hard-working Chief Warrant Officer dad. The scariest time ever was toward the end of the Viet Nam War, when he was gone to sea for so long, and those black cars carrying the worst news cruised our neighborhood.
Thanks for your recognition of single parents. Having been a single mom for 13 1/2 years, it’s nice to hear. :)
November 29th, 2006 at 2:02 pmDaryll, I know a few people at MarForSysCom too as I am in the Info Mgmt field. Where did you graduate college? Someone said ORU. I did recruiting duty near by so, if you served when you say you did, I also know who your OSO was.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:04 pmrobert. The thing is I dont consider my national forces are protecting me from anything or giving me freedom in any way. What gives me freedom are schools, social services, good national programs focusing on education, hospitals, critical media, social justice, laboral dignity, but NOT guys with guns. Far from it, guys with guns rarely have contributed something to humanity. I dont attack the people, I am against the military institutions, here and everywhere. There is nothing more unsafe than the idea of protection by weapons. You go to Japan and if you are lucky you will spot a police unit, therefore Japan is one of the safest countries in the world, as Canada, Sweden, etc. I hope you get my idea. It is not my intention to say anything against the poor people that is sent to fight against other poor people following the orders of corporations…errr…governments. Thank you for your answer.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:09 pmSaying one “supports the troops” is just talk and, as we all know, talk is cheap. The questions in a representative democracy should relate to how our elected representatives support the troops with their votes. Do they vote to provide services to veterans and their families? Do they vote for services to the families of people who are fighting overseas? Do they vote to provide proper equipment and body armour for our troops under fire? If you want to know who supports the troops with their votes, the Iraq and Afganistan Veterans of America (IAVA) site has a complete rundown on the voting records of our representatives and it grades them based on a standard they completely explain on the site. If an American wants to support the troops with anything other than words, a good start is to go there and see which representatives and senators deserve your vote on this issue.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:10 pmZooey, Nope, thank you for your support AND desent.
Incase no one tells you YOU ARE A HERO, even if only to one child.\
I am not old enough to remember Viet Nam. Dad and Grand Pa were both there. They didn’t like to talk about it. When Dad did mention the protests, he only told me that his boss (the American people) were not happy. I am second generation American and I was tought that my family owed a debt to this nation that welcomed us and gave us the opportunities that we have.
BTW, I am not in the position to openly criticize the President, but I agree that there are so many better things he could have said. As a father, I can definately understand Sen. Webbs feelings.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:10 pmMighty you continually bring up that you feel “Progs†are not open to other ideas. When I see that the other ideas are a repetition of failure or a repetition of the mind numbing talking points, I am simply responding to what has been said and debunked 1000 times before. It is not my fault that the people like you repeat the same crap endlessly. You might say that you have something new, but like the many significant policy statements Bush was supposed to make this last year you are merely repeating the same old crap and only trying to make it appear that you have something new to add.
What I get from the discourse out of republicans is that they want their policies enacted regardless of the validity of them. Enact them with out debate. Enact them and continue with them without debate regardless of the consequences. When proven disastrous, continue with the policy because that’s the way republicans want it! You are the ones who are not at all open to new ideas, or to trying things that work. Republicans simply want to have their way, damn the consequences full steam ahead.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:17 pmRobert, thank you for your thoughtful comments. It’s very encouraging to see military people with your perspective. The Founders of this country made one thing pretty clear: As Americans, we are not required to have or to even show respect for the president or any of our elected representatives. Our duty is to show respect for the constitution. I also understand that active members of the military are not in a position to question the Commander in Chief and that’s fine with me. Thanks again.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:18 pmHaving been a single mom for 13 1/2 years, it’s nice to hear. :)
Comment by Zooey
You are a true hero, Zoo.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:18 pmRobert,
Thanks for that. Actually I have two sons: Zoo Sr, 24; and Zoo Jr, 18.
Since we lived in the SF Bay Area at the end of the war, naturally there were protests. All the service dads said the protesters had a right to be there and speak their minds, so we learned about respecting differing views at an early age.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:23 pmDid we lose 1st Lt Saint Daryll?
November 29th, 2006 at 2:24 pmMust be busy protecting us from an Al-Qaeda assault on the web? or maybe from…oh I dunno…mmmmm…..perhaps SATAN?? (the preceding sentence was done in the best ‘church lady’ impersonation available on the internets!!! with apologies to Dana Carvey)
You are a true hero, Zoo.
Comment by Juan C
Thanks, Juan! You’re a great guy. Things going well with you?
November 29th, 2006 at 2:24 pmI posted this before but regarding the “support the troops”:
The U.S. pioneered the public relations industry. Its committment was to “control the public mind,” as its leaders put it. They learned a lot from the successes of the Creel Commission and the success in creating the Red Scare and its aftermath. The public relations industry underwent a huge expansion at that time. It succeeded for some time in creating almost total subordination of the public to business rule
through the 1920s….
…The corporate executive and the guy who cleans the floor all have the same interests. We can all work
together and work for Americanism in harmony, liking each other. That was essentially the message. A
huge amount of effort was put into presenting it. This is, after all, the business community, so they
control the media and have massive resources…
Mobilizing community opinion in favor of vapid, empty
November 29th, 2006 at 2:25 pmconcepts like Americanism. Who can be against that? Or, to bring it up to date, “Support our troops.”
Who can be against that? Or yellow ribbons. Who can be against that?… The point of public relations
slogans like “Support our troops” is that they don’t mean anything. They mean as much as whether you support the people in Iowa. Of course, there was an issue. The issue was, Do you support our policy?
But you don’t want people to think about the issue. That’s the whole point of good propaganda. You
want to create a slogan that nobody’s going to be against, and everybody’s going to be for, because
nobody knows what it means, because it doesn’t mean anything, but its crucial value is that it diverts your attention….
Things going well with you?
Comment by Zooey
I have a hangover so I decided to stay at home. (Thats progress right there…) The Master´s final project is getting complicated due to some problems I had with some thermoelectric modules placed in the cavity I want to submit to free convection. There were heat leaks and we all know how annoying can that be. :) But, health is well, family is well, friends are OK (including you I hope), so yeah, pretty much, everything´s ok.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:29 pmJuan, I did not intend to offend you with my statement as I was not offended by yours. I was just explaining my view as an American first and then as a military member.
“What gives me freedom are schools, social services, good national programs focusing on education, hospitals, critical media, social justice, laboral dignity, but NOT guys with guns.”
Unfortunately there are people foreign and domestic that would like to take those rights away from Americans. Our job is to ensure no one does. The Constitution and all the litigation in the world can not keep the wolves at bay. Sadly, sometimes other means become necessary. The Media, the schools and social services were not able to keep us safe at Pearl Harbor or on 9/11. Sometimes, it takes the “guys with guns” to do that.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:36 pmDang! I wish Webb would have decked W! That would have been the most combat W had ever seen in his life!
November 29th, 2006 at 2:46 pmJuan, I did not intend to offend you with my statement as I was not offended by yours.
Comment by robert
Are you an abusive (in the broad sense) guy, robert? If the answer is no, then there is no chance that you can possibly offend me. Let me rephrase that, you can speak to me in any way you want, robert. Its ok. :)
It seems you have reached a level of understanding with TP posters (including me) due to your good posts. So Im sorry for insisting in this issue that can be looked as anti-US citizens (americans are inhabitants of the continent called America). Im not trying to offend anyone, but…
Unfortunately there are people foreign and domestic that would like to take those rights away from Americans. Our job is to ensure no one does.
Please name these people. And tell me if these people hadnt been supported by US in the past. From this side of the world, robert, once UK lost dominance over the world, the US has become the country that has taken those rights from A LOT of countries across the world. I dont mean US troops knew/know the truth about it but that doesnt mean they should be justified for messing the world.
Sometimes, it takes the “guys with guns†to do that.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:53 pmBut they didnt, robert. And they are certainly not doing it now.
#155 Unfortunately there are people foreign and domestic that would like to take those rights away from Americans. Our job is to ensure no one does. The Constitution and all the litigation in the world can not keep the wolves at bay. Sadly, sometimes other means become necessary. The Media, the schools and social services were not able to keep us safe at Pearl Harbor or on 9/11. Sometimes, it takes the “guys with guns†to do that.
Comment by robert — November 29, 2006 @ 2:36 pm
Generalizations and propaganda. Iraq didn’t attack the USA, nor had WMD. So, if the military created to protect the USA citizens is used in other ways to attack people who is not attacking the USA, it’s a crime. And it’s a crime perpetrated by the politicians with their own interesets and agenda, the military that don’t asked the though questions and by the enablers, all the cheerleaders for the war, including you, robert. Don’t evade the responsability.
November 29th, 2006 at 2:56 pmJim Webb is the real deal.
November 29th, 2006 at 3:01 pmGive ‘em hell, Jim!
November 29th, 2006 at 3:04 pm#158, So me as the lowly foot soldier that has nothing to do with policy, is responsible for the situation in Iraq? Wow.
I have never said that the military is not misused. Every administration has used the military for their own agendas. I was not even specifically talking about Iraq.
As far as it being a crime, The President, the Congress, and the UN have all issued the mandate that the U.S. military stay in Iraq. I am just here to enforce the mandate.
November 29th, 2006 at 3:28 pmand the UN have all issued the mandate that the U.S. military stay in Iraq.
Comment by robert
The UN has also issued these… and US vetoed them.
November 29th, 2006 at 3:37 pmDESERVES REPEATING:
The thing is I dont consider my national forces are protecting me from anything or giving me freedom in any way. What gives me freedom are schools, social services, good national programs focusing on education, hospitals, critical media, social justice, laboral dignity, but NOT guys with guns. Far from it, guys with guns rarely have contributed something to humanity. I dont attack the people, I am against the military institutions, here and everywhere. There is nothing more unsafe than the idea of protection by weapons. You go to Japan and if you are lucky you will spot a police unit, therefore Japan is one of the safest countries in the world, as Canada, Sweden, etc. I hope you get my idea. It is not my intention to say anything against the poor people that is sent to fight against other poor people following the orders of corporations…errr…governments. Thank you for your answer.
Comment by Juan C — November 29, 2006 @ 2:09 pm
juan – your mother has to be so very proud of you – and you must be proud and thankful that she did such a great job raising such a smart, insightful young man… i know i may be speaking out of line, but after reading the above comment, and as a mom, i just had to say that… hope you understand.
November 29th, 2006 at 3:52 pmWebb is a quitter and a jerk, and I am GLAD i didn’t vote for the quitter. As secrettary of the navy, when the going got tough, the Secretary QUIT leaving all the corpsman and sailors who depended on him high and dry.
Now I can add disrespectul idiot to his list of accomplishments. Bush was being polite and asked how his son was, not what Webb thought, nor anything personal between the 2.
I can’t wait to see him fall on his butt, whine and quit again because he’s not going to get his way, and in 6 years, he won’t be re-elected.
November 29th, 2006 at 3:53 pm#163 & Juan C.- The reason Japan doesn’t need police everywhere is the people repect each other, and their penal system is something that is feared. People do not break the law, because to do so bring dishonor upon their families, and penalties that a person does not want to incur.
Very different than here, where people don’t care, have no respect for other people and their property. Rape? Car jacking? Police don’t make that happen, it happens here, not there.. WHY? Because there, a person MAY do it one time, they will never get another chance once caught, and their family will ALSO suffer from it.
November 29th, 2006 at 4:01 pmJuan,
Good link, thanks. Looks like the USSR vetoed a few more votes than the U.S. and we all know that they were the perfect society.
For the record, we were not given our freedom by the work of a pen, we won our freedom at the point of a weapon.
November 29th, 2006 at 4:02 pmBush’s legacy will be like a fat lip and a broken nose, either now or later.
November 29th, 2006 at 4:12 pmThe Chimp’s question was a taunt, not a real question. The Pathetic Loser is pointing out to Webb that his son is in danger because of Bush’s actions, and rubbing his nose in it.
Disrespectful? Shoving dung in Bush’s mouth wouldn’t have been too disrespectful. Jim Webb is the real deal and so is his son. The Chimp should have ended up with a bloody nose after that exchange.
He is a loser, a bully and a spoiled petulant brat. It’s time to hand the USA back to the adults.
November 29th, 2006 at 4:12 pmNewsMax is mischaracterizing the Bush/Webb conversation as “Jim Webb Threatens to ‘Slug’ President Bush.” Screen shot here.
leave it to the wingnuts not understand the difference between ‘did not slug’ and ‘threatens to slug’…
November 29th, 2006 at 4:28 pmI feel the American people acted disrespectfully toward the office of the President by voting GWB in twice.
November 29th, 2006 at 4:35 pmDouglas G, I would like you to consider the possibility that one reason people in Japan are respectful to one another and there is much less violence is that Japan takes care of its citizens’ basic needs. Nobody in Japan worries that they will be facing bankruptcy because of illness. Healthcare is a RIGHT in Japan. Nobody in Japan worries that a qualified child will not have the money to go to college. Certainly you are correct that there are also cultural reasons. A few years ago, when it came to light that CEO’s were making 400 times what workers made on average, Japanese CEO’s felt disgraced and many issued public apologies.
November 29th, 2006 at 4:54 pmSo people in Japan aren’t overrun by selfish greed? What a concept, they value thier citizens.
November 29th, 2006 at 5:18 pmI wish that insolent mf Webb would have hit Bush. That would have been the end of the freshman senator’s term in office.
November 29th, 2006 at 5:29 pmNewsMax is mischaracterizing the Bush/Webb conversation as “Jim Webb Threatens to ‘Slug’ President Bush. 
Comment by Wisco — November 29, 2006 @ 4:28 pm
knew that was coming… heard on randi rhodes that even some dems are having conniptions about it… sometimes ya can’t win for losin’… shame…
November 29th, 2006 at 5:32 pm…
letter campaign to webb – YOU DON’T NEED TO APPOLOGIZE !!!
.
171 actually having lived there for a time, I can tell you that Japan doesn’t take care of citizens, it’s citizen’s do. The families band together,a nd work together to take care of the young and the old. The don’t face bankruptcy because their families take up the slack as they feel it’s incumbent on them to do so. Healthcare is not a right, trust me, if you have ever seen what it’s really like there, you would not have even thought that. If you don’t work, you have no care, you have no schooling, and no college. What they prtray vs what is reality over there, are 2 very different beasts
November 29th, 2006 at 5:36 pmTHanks Douglas G.
The family is not as strong here in the US, just look at how our famous people treat the family.
November 29th, 2006 at 6:05 pmOn “Meet the Press” last week, he (Webb) dispensed with the normal banter with host Tim Russert to talk seriously about Iraq and the need for economic justice in the United States.
Good for him. The “banter” is the most useless element of the thoroughly useless show Russert snores through.
November 29th, 2006 at 6:19 pmDouglas G: “I can tell you that Japan doesn’t take care of citizens, it’s citizen’s do.”
Japan provides universal healthcare for its citizens. True or false?
November 29th, 2006 at 6:23 pmAgain, I would like to remind the fascists here that this is the United States, where citizens actually have the right to be insolent to their leaders. I would think that repubs especially would be aware of this having spent 8 years referring to a President as a murderer and a rapist and even threatening to shoot him if he came to their state.
November 29th, 2006 at 6:33 pm#161 #158, So me as the lowly foot soldier that has nothing to do with policy, is responsible for the situation in Iraq? Wow.
Um, no. You as a soldier, you as a person as you as a voter. “We, the people”, remember?. And, the lowest soldier can, and must denounce a misdemeanor of his superiors. A person can demonstrate and take legal actions against a dishonest government, and a voter can vote out a President. BTW, the idea of not changing a sitting president while at war is very silly.
I have never said that the military is not misused. Every administration has used the military for their own agendas. I was not even specifically talking about Iraq.
So, we aren’t talking about Iraq? What other war are talking you of?
As far as it being a crime, The President, the Congress, and the UN have all issued the mandate that the U.S. military stay in Iraq. I am just here to enforce the mandate.
Comment by robert — November 29, 2006 @ 3:28 pm
Sorry, but it’s false. The Congress hasn’t declared oficially war to Iraq. If you mean the Patriot Act, remember, it allows the President to prosecute the terrorists and their abiders. Sadly, nor Saddam nor Iraqis had anything ado with the terrorists of Al Qaeda. And the UN resolution doesn’t allowed to begin a full blown war. And, the ultimate authority, Koffi Annan, was all the time against any intervention before the inspectors of the IAEA ended their duty, duty that the USA GOP simply refused to continue.
And two years later, and bilions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of innocent lives lost after, the nuclear inspector of the USA, David Kay, frankly not a dove, simply said that the UN had it right.
Are you a “good german”, robert, or in this case a “good american”?
November 29th, 2006 at 6:57 pmRobert, I think a review of this “mandate” as you call it is in order. The congressional resolution contained this:
“The President is authorized to use the Armed Forces of the United States as he determines to be necessary and appropriate in order to–
(a) defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq; and
(b) enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq.”
Since there was no real threat posed to our national security by Iraq and the United Nations strongly objected to the invasion, I’m not sure what “mandate” you’re talking about.
November 29th, 2006 at 7:06 pmFurthermore, Robert, the resolution also required the President to, at least every 60 days, present Congress a report on “matters relevant to this joint resolution.”
Since the administration has not lived up to this part of the resolution, the resolution is not worth the paper it’s written on. Evidently, conservatives expect us all to forget this stuff since the media hasn’t discussed it. Uh oh, some of have good memories.
November 29th, 2006 at 7:12 pmSorry, I lost an “us” there in that sentence. Some of us have good memories.
November 29th, 2006 at 7:17 pm[...] (Hat tip to Think Progress) [...]
November 29th, 2006 at 7:32 pmComment by robert — November 29, 2006 @ 4:02 pm
Must it always be so? Can we not outgrow our need to use force to enslave others? Can we, the people refuse to fight the wars of the ruling class?
When humanity decides it will no longer fight the wars of the wealthy, then, and only then, will there be true peace and true freedom. If the rich and powerful cannot force the rest of us to die for them, they will no longer control us.
November 29th, 2006 at 7:59 pm“Webb later confessed that he was “tempted to slug†Bush.”
Maybe Webb shouldn’t speak for his boy unless he knows what he want’s. Sheehan certainly didn’t reflect her son’s views.
“A December 7 summit at Riyadh may be the first venue for the Bush administration to negotiate directly with Iran and Syria in an effort to reduce the bloodshed in Iraq,†the New York Sun speculates.”
Maybe we should go ahead and have direct negotiations with al Qaeda.
“A new classified memo authored by National Security Adviser Stephen Hadley expresses “serious doubts†about whether Iraqi Prime Minister al-Maliki has “the capacity to control the sectarian violence in Iraq.”
Or the willingness.
“Iraq’s parliament yesterday voted to keep the country under a state of emergency for 30 more days.”
Maybe the Iraqi people will start decreasing their own internal violence themselves…for a change.
“Incoming Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) promised to do away with the Do-Nothing Congress by putting in “some hours here that haven’t been put in in a long time.”
Don’t count on it.
November 29th, 2006 at 8:43 pmI wish Webb would have slugged that worthless scumbag. What a POS! bu$h’s 2 whore daughters are getting run out of Argentina for acting like the two drunken whores they are.
November 29th, 2006 at 10:45 pmwe all know that they were the perfect society.
Comment by robert
Just until Lenin died, pretty much.
November 29th, 2006 at 11:15 pmMaybe Webb shouldn’t speak for his boy unless he knows what he want’s. Sheehan certainly didn’t reflect her son’s views.
Comment by Tracy — November 29, 2006 @ 8:43 pm
Webb wasn’t speaking for his son. He was speaking for himself when he said “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President”.
Notice how he uses *I*? He is speaking for himself.
And a father knows more about what his son wants than you, me, or Pres Bush. You don’t have any children, do you?
November 30th, 2006 at 12:54 amDouglas G: “I can tell you that Japan doesn’t take care of citizens, it’s citizen’s do.â€
Japan provides universal healthcare for its citizens. True or false?
Comment by Bluedog49
I have also lived in Japan and am fluent in the language. Healthcare isn’t quite universal, but anyone, including non-citizens with the proper kind of visa, can sign up for the National Health Insurance. It is not free but covers 70% of medical and some dental bills. Also, many companies and other organizations offer health plans to their workers or members. Thus, one can say almost everyone does have some kind of health insurance.
November 30th, 2006 at 2:02 amTuition for the national and other public universities is still quite low. Private universities are another matter.
The image that families are always helping each other in Japan is outdated.
The family system is breaking down to a certain degree, and the percentage of people aged 29 to 39 who have never been married is one of the highest–perhaps the highest by now–in the industrialized world. Go to any large park or large subway station in Tokyo or other major cities, and you will find homeless people living there, often in tents and sometimes huge cardboard boxes. The big difference with the homeless in the US and Europe is that the Japanese ones don’t panhandle. They may take hand-outs from various charity groups and individuals or search the trash for edibles and recyclables, but they leave passers-by alone.
Also, since the “bubble” economy in Japan tanked, there has been an increase in suicides in Japan–often by throwing oneself at a moving train. The “culture of shame” is still very much alive in Japan, so many prefer to kill themselves rather than go on welfare once they lose their job or business.
Lora, thanks for the background information on Japan. What makes it from Japan into the mainstream press over here is practically non-existent.
November 30th, 2006 at 8:28 amBNF, You’re welcome. By the way, today (Nov. 30) is my birthday as well as that of Japan’s second-in-line Prince Akinoshina.
And to Mighty Aphidette, Tracy, Daryll, etc. trolls,
November 30th, 2006 at 9:52 amJim Webb knew exactly what Dumbya was asking, and he was very much within his rights, as a father of a soldier currently serving in Iraq and as a decorated Vietnam vet himself, to reply the way he did. As has been pointed out before, if the Iraq war is such a noble cause, then why aren’t Bush’s daughters or any of his able-bodied nieces and nephews over there? The juxtaposition of the Bush brats getting drunk in Argentina could not present a more stark contrast with Jim Webb’s son–not to mention that Webb was in Vietnam, while Dickhead Cheney swung five deferments and Dumbya used Daddy’s connections to jump ahead of hundreds of others on the National Guard waiting list.
Moreover, while Mighy Dingbatette often write sthat we should be grateful to our armed forces and complains that progs don’t allow opinions other than their own (which is why, of course, he/she is allowed to post here, while conservative sites apparently ban all contrary opinions), he/she smears any decorated veteran such as Murtha, Kerry and now Webb who does not share her/his views. A Mighty Hypocrette, indeed!
Goodbye for now; hubby and I want to celebrate!
#180, Um, no. You as a soldier, you as a person as you as a voter. “We, the peopleâ€, remember?. And, the lowest soldier can, and must denounce a misdemeanor of his superiors. A person can demonstrate and take legal actions against a dishonest government, and a voter can vote out a President. BTW, the idea of not changing a sitting president while at war is very silly.
Yes, I vote and yes I must, under regulation, denounce any misconduct of my superiors. I, can not however demonstrate against the administration or make disparaging comments about a sitting President. Again I am bound by an oath and by regulation. I have not been ordered to do anything illegal therefore I have nothing to denounce.
So, we aren’t talking about Iraq? What other war are talking you of?
U.S. troops were also misused in Viet Nam, Korea, some parts of WWII as well. Tell me this, what was the threat to the U.S. citizens in Kosovo?
From #181
“The President is authorized to use the Armed Forces of the United States as he determines to be necessary and appropriate in order to–
(a) defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq; and
(b) enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq.â€
Here is the key phrase: as he determines
For those who missed it (Bluedog) here is the latest mandate from the UN asking us to keep the U.S. led coalition in Iraq for 12 more months.
Annan Seeks Summit Outside Iraq to Reconcile Factions
Ego Sum, thanks for the little Nazi reference. It shows that you paid zero attention to anything I said. My loyalty is to the People of the United States and the Constitution, not what ever administration or party is in power.
November 30th, 2006 at 10:54 amFor the record, we were not given our freedom by the work of a pen, we won our freedom at the point of a weapon.
Comment by robert — November 29, 2006 @ 4:02 pm
Must it always be so? Can we not outgrow our need to use force to enslave others? Can we, the people refuse to fight the wars of the ruling class?
When humanity decides it will no longer fight the wars of the wealthy, then, and only then, will there be true peace and true freedom. If the rich and powerful cannot force the rest of us to die for them, they will no longer control us.
Comment by Briseadh na Faire
Ok, we were talking about how we got our freedom. So tell me how fighting for the freedom of the U.S. enslaved anyone?
But yes, it would be a beautiful thing if no one needed a military force but you have to have one at the ready. You do not build an army after an attack, you train one prior to an attack.
November 30th, 2006 at 11:06 amJuan,
So dictatorships are good things?
In the events of 1905 Lenin distinguished three main features—(1) the temporary seizure by the people of real political freedom, (2) the creation of new if only potential revolutionary power in the shape of soviets of workers’, soldiers’ and peasants’ deputies; (3) the use of force by the people against those who had employed it against them. Those conclusions, from the events of 1905, became the guiding principles of Lenin’s policy in 1917 and led to the dictatorship of the proletariat in the form of the Soviet State.
November 30th, 2006 at 11:09 amDear Lora – Happy Birthday!
Re: Your comments about Jim Webb being “within his rights” to not answer the Presidents’ question and make his political comment – of course he was. It still doesn’t change the fact that he did NOT answer the question posed.
Enjoy your birthday! Don’t eat tooo much cake….
November 30th, 2006 at 11:34 amEnjoy this playground for what it is – a place for many employEES to steal time from their oppressive employERS.
’til later……
Comment by mighty aphrodite — November 29, 2006
Mighty A*shole, I see your stupid a*s is here too. EVERYDAY!!! :>D
November 30th, 2006 at 1:49 pmEnjoy this playground for what it is – a place for many employEES to steal time from their oppressive employERS.
’til later……
Comment by mighty aphrodite — November 29, 2006
Mighty A*shole, I see your stupid a*s is here too. EVERYDAY!!! :>D
November 30th, 2006 at 1:49 pmRe: Your comments about Jim Webb being “within his rights†to not answer the Presidents’ question and make his political comment – of course he was. It still doesn’t change the fact that he did NOT answer the question posed.
Enjoy your birthday! Don’t eat tooo much cake….
Comment by mighty aphrodette
Thanks for the greetings. I don’t have much of a sweet tooth, so eating too much cake isn’t an issue.
November 30th, 2006 at 4:53 pmI’m glad you at least admitted Jim Webb was within his rights to reply that way to Dumbya. Obviously, you neo-cons and neo-conettes aren’t very good at picking up subtle messages and need everything spelled out. Jim Webb clearly answered the question based on what he knows about what his son is facing in Iraq.
I have yet to hear an explanation/reply from any of you neo-cons and neo-conettes about why neither of the Bush brats nor any of their able-bodied cousins are serving in this supposedly noble cause. Any takers?
#189
“Webb wasn’t speaking for his son. He was speaking for himself when he said “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. Presidentâ€. ”
And then he said “That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President.â€, suggesting to me that he know what his boy wants.
“And a father knows more about what his son wants than you, me, or Pres Bush. You don’t have any children, do you?”
Sheehan certainly didn’t. Yes, I have two children, boy 2 and girl 4 yrs. old.
November 30th, 2006 at 5:04 pm#192
“As has been pointed out before, if the Iraq war is such a noble cause, then why aren’t Bush’s daughters or any of his able-bodied nieces and nephews over there?”
For the same reaon(s) that that vast majority of Democrat and Republican representative’s son and daughters aren’t over there, including Charlie Rangel who has two able bodied children that could serve in the military but wants to reinstate the draft.
“Moreover, while Mighy Dingbatette often write sthat we should be grateful to our armed forces and complains that progs don’t allow opinions other than their own (which is why, of course, he/she is allowed to post here, while conservative sites apparently ban all contrary opinions),”
Which web sites?….specifically.
“….while Dickhead Cheney swung five deferments and Dumbya used Daddy’s connections to jump ahead of hundreds of others on the National Guard waiting list.”
Any comment on this wimp?….
http://www.1stcavmedic.com/bill-clinton-draft.htm
November 30th, 2006 at 5:45 pmTracy,
November 30th, 2006 at 6:21 pmI’m about to go out, so I will be brief. Neither Rangel nor Clinton started this war. Nor do they talk about the “noble cause” that it is supposed to be. I believe Rangel suggests reinstating the draft, specifically because it would equalize the social classes in the military–in other words, making the richer class to join in the sacrifice for this supposedly “noble cause.” Of course, if the draft were reinstated, some well-connected rich kids like the young George W. Bush would still have strings pulled to stay out of the military.
I myself haven’t tried to post on rightwing websites, but most of the ones I have looked at in the past, such as Ann Coulter’s, don’t even have spaces soliciting for comments. Also, several posters here have mentioned being banned from certain other neo-con sites. I tend to believe them; but if you can prove this wrong, I will certainly accept it.
Ps. I have no idea how old Rangel’s son and daughter are. But I looked up his own record of military service. According to nndb.com,
November 30th, 2006 at 10:06 pm“War hero during the Korean War, where he rescued forty comrades from behind enemy lines for which he was awarded the Bronze Star. Democrat and liberal, Rangel was elected to the New York State Assembly 1966-70. Since then he has been serving continuously as U.S. Representative from New York’s Harlem district. ”
So how does that compare with the “records” of Dumbya and Dickhead–not to mention all the other chickenhawks so prevalent in this administration?
“At a recent private reception, President Bush asked Sen.-elect Jim Webb (D-VA), “How’s your boy?†referring to Webb’s son Jimmy, who is serving in Iraq. Webb answered, “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President,†to which Bush responded, “That’s not what I asked you.†Webb “coldly†shot back, “That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President.†Webb later confessed that he was “tempted to slug†Bush.”
I can’t wait for the day when Webb asks Bush “How’s your impeachment doing?”
December 1st, 2006 at 7:55 amSheehan certainly didn’t reflect her son’s views.
Comment by Tracy
I probably shouldn’t bother with this. Still, I wonder on what basis Tracy can state this–twice, in fact. Did Tracy ever meet Sheehan’s late son Casey? Was he privy to the final letters or telephone conversations Casey had before he was killed in Iraq? Or has he been able to channel Casey’s spirit through a medium, like Whoppee Goldberg in the “Ghost” movie for which she won a Best Supporting Actress Oscar?
December 1st, 2006 at 9:20 amFinally, whether Cindy Sheehan was accurately representing the late Casey’s feelings or not, she is certainly entitled to express her own. Or, like Newt Gingrich, does Tracy feel the Constitutional right to free speech ought to be reconsidered and perhaps abolished?
Anyone that think imposing a draft will “balance the scales” and cause rich kids to go to war is really mistaken. Just look back at Viet Nam. Rich kids got the deferments and the poor didn’t. A draft will just require the poor/working poor/middle class to carry more of the burden
December 1st, 2006 at 10:26 amThank you, Mightette,
December 1st, 2006 at 4:44 pmI had a very nice birthday, celebrated after work at a very nice and reasonably priced French restaurant, where the proprietress (or in your language, “propriette”) gave my four-person party some Kir on the house, as hubby and I are known to her and her husband.
As for Casey Sheehan, he re-enlisted after a tour of duty in the US, with the awareness that he might get sent to Iraq. It is quite possible that he became disillusioned after going to Iraq; that is something neither you nor I nor Tracy are in a position to make bold assertions about. I think his mother might know more about this than any of us, and in any case she has a Constitutional right to free speech and to speak out against this war.
So in a language I know you disdan, “Au revoir” (I’d rather say “Adieu,” but I know you will be back),
#188
“I believe Rangel suggests reinstating the draft, specifically because it would equalize the social classes in the military–in other words, making the richer class to join in the sacrifice for this supposedly “noble cause.—
That’s not what Rangel himself said. He want’s to reinstate the draft so under the assumption that if everyone, including the children of congressmen and congresswomen, would be less likely to commit troops to any type of military engagement.
“I myself haven’t tried to post on rightwing websites, but most of the ones I have looked at in the past, such as Ann Coulter’s, don’t even have spaces soliciting for comments.”
Well you either are lying or actually haven’t been to her web site to make such a statement LOL!. There is a chat room, but like many blogs you have to register.
http://chat.anncoulter.com/phpBB2/
Eric Alterman on the other hand use to have a blog (LOL! if you wanted to call it one) on MSNBC and I had posted dozens of comments but they obviously went thru a screener first and only the ones the HE wanted to be posted were, i.e. 99.9% of them were those either praising him or they were in line with his left wing politics.
“Also, several posters here have mentioned being banned from certain other neo-con sites. I tend to believe them; but if you can prove this wrong, I will certainly accept it.”
LOL! I think if you were truely objective that you would demand that the prove their claim about being banned on conservative sites is right! BTW this hypocritical blog has a “terms of use” page that says…
“You agree not to:
• Post any messages or provide links to any messages that endorse or oppose a particular political party or candidate for office.
• Post any private information or otherwise harvest, collect or disclose information, about another Blogger without his or her express consent.
• Post any content to the Blog that is unlawful, racist, hateful, libelous, defamatory, obscene, or that intentionally discriminates against or harasses particular individuals or groups.
• Post any content to the Blog that infringes any third-party’s intellectual property or other rights.
• Use the Blog for any unlawful purpose, or transmit or otherwise make available in connection with the Blog any material that would give rise to criminal or civil liability.
• Use the Blog for advertisements, chain letters, “spamming,†survey solicitations, junk mail or solicitations.
• Impersonate any person or entity, including any APAF employees, or falsely state or otherwise misrepresent your affiliation with any person or entity.
• Imply that APAF endorses any of your statements or positions.
• Transmit any harmful, invasive or disruptive code or other materials (such as viruses, worms or web bugs) through or to the Blog, or otherwise “hack†or deface any portion of the Blog.
• Frame or mirror any part of the Blog without our prior written authorization.”
http://thinkprogress.org/terms
…well we all know how useless and hypocritical this part of TP’s web site is! LOL!
December 1st, 2006 at 6:45 pm#191
“Still, I wonder on what basis Tracy can state this–twice, in fact. Did Tracy ever meet Sheehan’s late son Casey?”
Casey Sheehan was sent to Iraq initally in March 2003 and then he RE-ENLISTED in August 2003. That pretty much means that he believed in the job he was doing over there was “noble”.
“Finally, whether Cindy Sheehan was accurately representing the late Casey’s feelings or not, she is certainly entitled to express her own.”
ABSOLUTELY and I had no problem with it or have one currently.
“Or, like Newt Gingrich, does Tracy feel the Constitutional right to free speech ought to be reconsidered and perhaps abolished?”
Just because I disagree with her trying to pass off her feelings as her son’s own doesn’t mean that I think she should be silenced. That’s reserved for our tolerant liberal universities where “free thinking” is supposed to fostered, but as we all know that isn’t the case.
http://www.academia.org/campus_reports/1999/march_1999_2.html
http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/news.aspx?id=11426
And if you are wondering how I came the conclusion that most universities are liberal….
http://www.leadershipinstitute.org/resources/resourcesmain.cfm?section=bluecampus
December 1st, 2006 at 7:09 pm#189
“Ps. I have no idea how old Rangel’s son and daughter are.”
They would both eligible for the draft if were to come back. I think they are both in their early 30s.
“So how does that compare with the “records†of Dumbya and Dickhead–not to mention all the other chickenhawks so prevalent in this administration?”
It’s much better, but Bush has a much better military service record that BJ Clinton. Oh, I forgot he doesn’t have one! And not to mention Al Gore’s five month Vietnam service record as a war opposition journalist, in which he was never in a live combat zone.
http://www.rightgrrl.com/carolyn/goreserve.html
December 1st, 2006 at 7:28 pmPs. Tracy,
I have just checked the jewishworldreview website, a conservative site with both Jewish and several non-Jewish columnist and where I sometimes read Ann Coulter’s blog in the past. I could still not find a space for Comments.
Below is wikipedia on Al Gore’s stint as an army–not an “opposition”–journalist:
“Late October 1969 to December 1970: writer for the Army Flier newspaper at Fort Rucker, Alabama.
January 2, 1971 to May 22, 1971: field reporter in Vietnam, part of the 20th Engineer Brigade, stationed primarily at Bien Hoa Air Base near Saigon.”
If you want to insist that George W. Bush put himself more in harm’s way by protecting Houston from the Vietcong than Al Gore who was actually sometimes within shooting range, I won’t even try to convince you otherwise. Enjoy the Kool-Aid.
December 1st, 2006 at 9:48 pmre: 192 Anyone that think imposing a draft will “balance the scales†and cause rich kids to go to war is really mistaken. Just look back at Viet Nam. Rich kids got the deferments and the poor didn’t. A draft will just require the poor/working poor/middle class to carry more of the burden
Comment by robert — December 1, 2006 @ 10:26 am
True but it was the draft that raised the alarm bells of the middle class and forced Americans to wake up and stand up for eachother. Right now the Soldiers in Iraq are out of sight and out of mind and most Americans are distracted by trival crap like whether or not Madonna is adopting another baby or who won Dancing with the Stars. A draft might not drag in all the rich kids but it will prevent Amerians from being lulled into complacency which is precisely why the corporate war machine doesn’t display images of war on network tv or the coffins coming back draped with flags and why Republicans don’t want a draft. They want to keep us barefoot and pregnant while they siphon tax dollars and wage corporate wars abroad.
December 2nd, 2006 at 3:26 am#189
“I have just checked the jewishworldreview website, a conservative site with both Jewish and several non-Jewish columnist and where I sometimes read Ann Coulter’s blog in the past. I could still not find a space for Comments.”
Then check out HER web site. Again here it is, if you didn’t bother the first time.
http://chat.anncoulter.com/phpBB2/
“Bien Hoa Air Base near Saigon”
“With its close proximity to the international airport at Saigon, Bien Hoa Air Base was the easiest tactical air base to be reached by visiting news reporters, and therefore it received the greatest amount of news and photographic coverage during the war.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bien_Hoa_Air_Base
Like I said not near any danger. My uncle was fighter pilot in Vietnam i the 3rd TFW and flew many missions from this well protected airfield.
“who was actually sometimes within shooting range,…”
From this airbase he was NEVER in shooting range. Bush and Al Gore did as much to defend against the “enemy” as you or I have.
December 2nd, 2006 at 6:21 pmBush and Al Gore did as much to defend against the “enemy†as you or I have.
Comment by Tracy — December 2, 2006 @ 6:21 pm
I don’t need to check out Ann Coulter’s website; I actually believe you on this point. However, there are some websites on which her columns appear that do not have spaces for Comments. Check them out if you want to call me “liar.”
December 2nd, 2006 at 7:33 pmThe Wikipedia article also mentions that Gore was sometimes a field reporter. That may have put him close to danger, but I will not insist on that point now you have at least admitted that Bush’s military service is no more impressive than Gore’s. In any case, it was neither Gore nor Clinton (whom you just can’t get over) nor Rangel who started a pre-emptive war in a country that did not attack us. Moreover, you haven’t answered my question if anyone in the current administration or GOP Congressional leadership has family members fighting for the “noble cause” in Iraq.
#201
“n any case, it was neither Gore nor Clinton (whom you just can’t get over) nor Rangel who started a pre-emptive war in a country that did not attack us.”
Clinton and NATO bombed the Serbians who didn’t “attack” the U.S. or any other NATO county led to the removal of Milosivic from power. NATO did not have the backing of the UN Security Council nor was their ANY resolution authorizing the bombing. Now I agreed with NATO’s actions to put a stop to the genocide, but even Bush had a UN Resolution that authorized far more in the way of military action against Iraq than Clinton or NATO did against the Serbians.
“Moreover, you haven’t answered my question if anyone in the current administration or GOP Congressional leadership has family members fighting for the “noble cause†in Iraq. ”
I did a while back (#187) by saying it was the same reason the 99.9% of the members of congress Democrat or Republican don’t have sons or daughter serving, i.e. like everyone in this country they CHOOSE not to.
December 3rd, 2006 at 5:46 pmI did a while back (#187) by saying it was the same reason the 99.9% of the members of congress Democrat or Republican don’t have sons or daughter serving, i.e. like everyone in this country they CHOOSE not to.
Comment by Tracy
And you see no hypocrisy in calling the Iraq War a “noble cause,” while choosing not to have any family members fight in it? There were, after all, Democrats who voted invading Iraq; Lincoln Chafee was the only Republican Senator who did.
December 3rd, 2006 at 8:18 pmPs. Tracy,
December 3rd, 2006 at 8:29 pmSince you agree that Clinton’s and NATO’s bombing of Serbia was a good idea to stop the genocide there and remove Milosevic (correct spelling), I don’t know why you even bother bringing it up. You are well aware that it wasn’t a full-scale occupation going on for more years than World War II. Besides, bringing up Clinton every chance you have does not excuse Bush’s actions today. (Have you heard the adage, “Two wrongs don’t make a right?” Not that I actually think Clinton did the wrong thing by helping to remove Milosevic, either.)
Finally, though the Vietnam War came to be widely opposed by the American public, Lyndon Johnson at least had his two sons-in-law over there, in complete contrast to the hypocritical warmongers of today.
Pps. Tracy,
I re-checked information about the late Casey Sheehan on a couple of sites. In contrast to your quote in #196: “Casey Sheehan was sent to Iraq initally in March 2003 and then he RE-ENLISTED in August 2003. That pretty much means that he believed in the job he was doing over there was “noble,” I found the following in wikipedia (as well as elsewhere):
“In May 2000, Sheehan enlisted in the United States Army as a light-wheeled vehicle mechanic, MOS 63B. It has been reported that he had originally considered enlisting as a Chaplain’s assistant MOS 56M. (Sheehan had acted as an altar server during the Palm Sunday mass on the morning of his death).[3]
Near the end of his tour of duty, the US invasion of Iraq began. Sheehan re-enlisted, knowing that his unit would be sent to Iraq[citation needed]. Sheehan’s division, the First Cavalry Division, was sent to Iraq. On March 19, 2004, Sheehan’s unit, Charlie Battery, 1st Battalion , 82nd Field Artillery Regiment arrived at FOB War Eagle in Sadr City. Just a few weeks later, on April 4, 2004, Sheehan was killed in action after volunteering as part of a Quick Reaction Force to rescue American troops.”
In other words, your dates appear to be all wrong. Moreover, as I pointed out in #194, Sheehan re-enlisted after serving in the US–not in Iraq. It is quite possible that he got disillusioned after going over there, but that is something neither you nor I can boldly assert either way. To borrow your own words, ” if you were truel(SIC) objective,” you would stop trying to put words and attribute ideas to people you don’t know nor have ever met, ranging from telling all of us who don’t agree with Bush things like we “want Al Qaeda to win” to trying to speak for the late Casey Sheehan.
December 3rd, 2006 at 9:15 pm#203
“And you see no hypocrisy in calling the Iraq War a “noble cause,†while choosing not to have any family members fight in it?”
Those kid are not joining the military not to serve because the Iraqi war isn’t noble. They are choosing not to serve because they don’t want to be in the military. Again in any of the conflicts in the 1990s where troops were sent there wasn’t any more or less congressional leaders children serving than there currently are now.
December 4th, 2006 at 11:23 am#205
“In May 2000, Sheehan enlisted in the United States Army as a light-wheeled vehicle mechanic, MOS 63B.”
Which means he was serving in his first commitment in the Army from May 2000 untill untill he decided to re-enlist in August 2003. Enlisted serve a minimum of 2 years to max 6 years with four years being the most common. before choosing to re-enlist.
“Near the end of his tour of duty, the US invasion of Iraq began. Sheehan re-enlisted, knowing that his unit would be sent to Iraq[citation needed].”
My dates are not wrong and as your quote says, AFTER the invasion began Casey Sheehan’s tour of duty ended after the invasion began and then he re-enlisted in August 2003.
“Moreover, as I pointed out in #194, Sheehan re-enlisted after serving in the US–not in Iraq. It is quite possible that he got disillusioned after going over there, but that is something neither you nor I can boldly assert either way.”
Right, but give the man some credit in choosing to engage in something that he definately was on board with at the time he re-enlisted. BTW only her mother was the only one that we know who became “disillusioned” with the war.
December 4th, 2006 at 12:01 pmBTW only her(SIC) mother was the only one that we know who became “disillusioned†with the war.
Comment by Tracy —
Hey, please show some respect for the late Casey Sheehan–a “he” (ie. “his mother”)–not “her mother,” okay?
December 4th, 2006 at 4:53 pm#200
Sorry about that. I will do that from now on as long as you do the same and respect his choices and not infer what you “feel” his he might have been thinking after he re-enlisted.
December 4th, 2006 at 5:26 pmI will do that from now on as long as you do the same and respect his choices and not infer what you “feel†his he might have been thinking after he re-enlisted.
Comment by Tracy —
My whole point was that you are in no more position to infer about Casey Sheehan’s feelings during his last weeks of life than I am. Get it? I think his mother may (and mind you, I write “may”–not “definitely”) have known more than you and I. However, if you don’t agree, that’s your business, just as it is my right to tend to believe his mother more than you. Okay? Can we move on?
December 4th, 2006 at 7:25 pm#210
I agree, although I don’t know, in this thread at least, what we could move on to. I can only make assumptions about Casey based on the facts. Here are some letters from Casey Sheehan, but I don’t really think you can read into them very much. The letters are at the end of the article.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/03/20/INGIGBNC46129.DTL
December 5th, 2006 at 10:13 am#210
“Casey Sheehan’s Sergeant asked for volunteers. Sheehan had just returned from Mass. After Sheehan volunteered once, the Sergeant asked Sheehan again if he wanted to go on the mission. According to many reports (and according to his own mother), Casey responded, “Where my Chief goes, I go.”
http://www.blackfive.net/main/2005/08/army_specialist.html
Dedicated or disillusioned?
December 5th, 2006 at 10:19 am