Rice Falsely Claims That Iraqis Don’t Believe They Are In A Civil War
Rice Falsely Claims That Iraqis Don’t Believe They Are In A Civil War
Last night on CBS, Katie Couric asked Condoleezza Rice if she believes “the civil war in Iraq is likely to deteriorate significantly over the next few months.” Rice responded that Iraq is not a civil war because “the Iraqis don’t see it that way.” Rice added, “it really doesn’t help to speak about their circumstance as a civil war, in terms that they don’t speak about their circumstances.” Watch the interview:
Actually, top Iraqi military officials believe Iraq is in a civil war. From McClatchy, 8/04/06:
“This is a civil war,” said a senior adviser to the commander of the Iraqi Army’s 6th Division, which oversees much of Baghdad.
“The problem between Sunnis and Shiites is a religious one, and it gets worse every time they attack each other’s mosques,” said the adviser, who gave only his rank and first name, Col. Ahmed, because of security concerns. “Iraq is now caught in hell.”
Former Iraqi Prime Minister Allawi says Iraq is in a civil war. From the BBC, 3/19/06:
It is unfortunate that we are in civil war. We are losing each day as an average 50 to 60 people throughout the country, if not more.
If this is not civil war, then God knows what civil war is.
Average Iraqis appear to share this view:
The top U.S. military commander for the Middle East, Gen. John Abizaid, told Congress on Thursday that the violence in Baghdad “is probably as bad as I have ever seen it,” and went on to say that the country could be headed toward civil war.
Nearly all of the dozen Iraqis who work for McClatchy Newspapers’ Baghdad bureau — evenly split between Shiite and Sunni Muslims — reached that conclusion long ago.
Their observations have trickled out day by day in the scores of conversations colleagues have with one another about their lives and difficulties. Their experiences of the last month reveal a capital city that’s disintegrating into chaos.
Prime Minister Maliki, of course, agrees with the administration that Iraq is not in a civil war. But his beliefs should not be conflated with the entire Iraqi people.
Transcript:
COURIC: According to a study released by the Center for Strategic and International Studies, the civil war in Iraq is likely to deteriorate significantly over the next few months regardless of the actions the Bush Administration may pursue.
RICE: Well, with all due respect to the CSIS, which is a great institution, the Iraqis don’t see it that way and we don’t see it that way. This — the Iraqis see that they have extraordinarily difficult problems. They see that they have sectarian violence. They see that they have to deal with those who are operating outside the law and killing innocent people. But it really doesn’t help to speak about their circumstance as a civil war, in terms that they don’t speak about their circumstances.
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Rice wants a big smooch Daryll, would you give her one?
December 1st, 2006 at 10:16 amThat’s right. And Neocons don’t make mistakes and don’t have any regrets and FOX is real news.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:17 amPrime Minister Maliki, of course, agrees with the administration that Iraq is not in a civil war.
Of course he does…when you’re nothing more than a puppet, it’s difficult to disagree with the one pulling the strings.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:17 amshorter Rice: The American people can sleep soundly at night knowing that we will continue to act as if we have no idea what’s going on. Happy Holidays!
December 1st, 2006 at 10:19 amOne can’t help but wonder…did Ms. Rice actually bother to ask any Iraqis (as in, civillians) their opinion before she came to this rather dubious conclusion?? We know that the Iraqi government doesn’t want to accept the idea that they’re in a state of civil war (for the primary reason that their control of the country would potentially be at stake)…but the Iraqi government and the Iraqi people are not necessarily one and the same, any more than the American goverment and the American people are.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:20 amAs she sits in the Red Sea “resort” she tends to pontificate as usual. It astounds me that people think she is “smart” and knows the ways of the world….scary. She is not the only “puppet” on the world stage that speaks on cue… Send this moron back to Crawford from wince she was spawned (or hatched)..She can sit in the “W” library with the rest of her kind and lie to others from their straight jackets!!!
December 1st, 2006 at 10:22 amI hope she got some nice shoes while she was gone, since she didn’t have time for the makeover.
Maybe Keith will do a Special Comment for Ms Rice, too.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:22 amRice is nothing more than a stooge for the Bushies.
She was in over her head as National Security Advisor and she’s clueless as Secretary of State. It’s the blind leading the blind down there in Washington.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:23 am[…] Watch Rice […]
December 1st, 2006 at 10:24 amA lie told often enough becomes more than a lie, in today’s 24 hour spin machine it becomes the truth — or one version of the acceptable truth. that is the premise of all of the W machine. they, by their words, but not apparently by their deeds, create their own reality. sure, it’s virtual, but how the hell else can they look in the mirror every day. if americans began to honestly examine what is being done in their name, they would be horrified. in my lifetime, however, americans haven’t examined any role they play in creating the backlash against our government’s actions. i don’t see it happening in this instance either
December 1st, 2006 at 10:25 amCondi : a lying sack of —-
December 1st, 2006 at 10:30 amGood post’s, good morning Zooey….Guess it was dead eyed rice’s turn sat bat, like the rest of this administration, another foul ball….Blessings
December 1st, 2006 at 10:30 amWar criminals tend to lie often, I think. Rice is no exception.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:36 amKindaSleazy Rice’s shoes are too tight and it’s cut off the circulation to her brain. How does anyone think that she’s “smart”???
December 1st, 2006 at 10:38 am“as a civil war, in terms that they don’t speak about their circumstances.”
Of course the Iraqis don’t refer to their situation as a “civil war”. That is English and they speak Arabic. Anyone know the Arabic for “civil war”?
December 1st, 2006 at 10:39 amCondi is the kind of person who thinks water ain’t wet, fire isn’t hot and that Abe Lincoln was named after a car. That’s how pathetic she is.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:40 amOT, sorry….200,000 marching in Beirut, damanding the P.M resign….Duh!…Blessings
December 1st, 2006 at 10:46 amIm wondering what you guys all use to define Civil War … 50-60 people dying…it sucks, but if you think about it, really not all that much. How many people died per day there before the war started? How many people die in the united states every day because of violence perpetrated upon one another? i can only assume that it is at least equal to, or greater than that number.
What is going on in Iraq is just “aftershock” of the end of full scale war, and most of the deaths are the “bad guys” anyway. It is just the rest of the iraqi garbage being cleaned up if you ask me.
I am not a fan of Condi Rice, i think she is boarderline retarded. And i am not some pro war freak, but i do think that W’s actions and decisions have been the right ones.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:46 amNow, leave poor Condi alone. She’s not trying to mislead anybody. She just doesn’t know any better. Remember this is the woman whose specialty was the Iron Curtain and the fall of communism when she went into her role as National Security Advisor. Just because she knows nothing about the Middle East and the sectarian violence endemic of the region, you just can’t assume she’s trying to mislead us.
She assumed that the fall of Saddam in Iraq would be like the fall of Communism in Poland. I wish she had studied the fall of Communism in Yugoslavia just a bit closer; it was a better example.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:48 amRice: Hold on to it. Tightly. Poor woman.
December 1st, 2006 at 10:48 amAnd how long did she live in Iraq to know the feelings of the Iraqis?!
December 1st, 2006 at 10:50 amGood morning Sharon and all,
Poor Condi, bless her heart.
December is a new month, and I’m thinking the whack-jobs are going to get wackier. Democrats are sooooo scary…!
December 1st, 2006 at 10:53 amThere is no civil war in Iraq (and I have a 2 foot cock).
December 1st, 2006 at 11:00 amWhat is going on in Iraq is just “aftershock†of the end of full scale war.
Comment by axles of evil
What was that full scale war? Iraq had no air force, it was bombed relentlessly during 10 years, it was subjected to an economical embargo and its army force were a bunch of guys loyal to Hussein. US walked easily into Baghdad…there was no full scale war.
and most of the deaths are the “bad guys†anyway. It is just the rest of the iraqi garbage being cleaned up if you ask me.
Who are the bad guys, axle? Who are the enemies now according to your media and government, axle? Cuz I dont know, if no iraqi killed a US citizen before 2003, and you go over there and invade that country…I dont know who the bad guys are.
And i am not some pro war freak
December 1st, 2006 at 11:01 amYes, you are and also a racist.
Yet another lie from Olive Oyl.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:08 amYes Condi….it’s not a lie if you believe it.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:09 amRice and Bush are not stupid. They can pick up an encyclopedia, look up the definition of civil war and understand that Iraq’s in one. They just won’t say it. Now that’s true evil to me.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:10 am.
Yeah! Go tell that to the families of those shot in their cars, those abducted because they have the “wrong” name on their ID cards, those dragged out of their houses in the middle of the night never to be seen alive again, the average Iraqi blown up to pieces on their way to work or the market…
You are a crassly ignorant and abysmally stupid moron.
Run along, now. It’s time for your daily dose of Kool-Aid, and for your prayers at the altar of your Dear Leader.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:10 amCondi: yet another failed Neocon still pushing failed Neocon policies.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:18 amShe described the war between Israel and Lebanon on July21st. of this year as the ‘birth pangs of a new Middle East’,while France and many other countries desperately tried to extinguish the flames of this war before it consumes the whole area. Not many in the Middle Eastern countries and beyond shared this view with her. She seems to see things differently about the Middle East . Her political successes in the area hard to find,when you look at Iraq,Lebanon,Palestinians and Iran. Few days ago,the king of Jordan said that he has worries in the coming months about civil wars in Lebanon,the Palestinian territories,and Iraq. Of course Condi Rice will dismiss this as ‘no news’..since “Iraqis don’t feel this way”….
December 1st, 2006 at 11:18 amWow, New Yorker, the trolls today really ARE psychotic.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:28 amIt’s like the old joke: How can you tell when (Condi) is lying? Her lips move.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:29 amI have to wonder if they checked out the sources at all. Or did they ask any Iraq that has something that looked like a badge.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:39 amThe Iraqi people don’t think their having a civil war? Obviously a lie because Rice and the rest of the neoconscum could care less what the Iraqi people think.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:43 amIts funny that you guys cant defend your arguments so you decide to make personal attacks on me instead because i believe something different from you. Whats that called when someone attacks you because you have different beliefs then them again?? Maybe in your infinite wisdom you can tell me.
Im just wondering, if you are all so intelligent, what would you have proposed we did about Iraq in 2003?
Yeah! Go tell that to the families of those shot in their cars, those abducted because they have the “wrong†name on their ID cards, those dragged out of their houses in the middle of the night never to be seen alive again, the average Iraqi blown up to pieces on their way to work or the market…
you think this never happened before the war ?
What was that full scale war? Iraq had no air force, it was bombed relentlessly during 10 years, it was subjected to an economical embargo and its army force were a bunch of guys loyal to Hussein. US walked easily into Baghdad…there was no full scale war.
So because our military is far supperior to theirs (and almost any other country) we shouldnt use it because its not “fair” ? Its a war, its not supposed to be fair. And if their army is just “a bunch of guys loyal to Hussein” then why would anyone care if we took them, and him, out ? I know first hand most Iraqis dont.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:43 amCondomsleeza Rice. Sounds good.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:04 pmOh yeah forgot to respond to the last question: what would we have done about Iraq in 2003? I don’t know, maybe continue with sanctions that were working fine just the way they were (as there had not been weapons of mass destruction there since our first attack in Persian Gulf 1). Maybe not cook the books to show false-procurement of nuclear weapons there to justify invasion. Maybe actually look at all intelligence, not just the intell that favors invasion. I don’t know, maybe listen to my generals who actually had combat experience rather than firing them. And more importantly, I think I would have went after (or maintained pressure) on the real terrorists and take a psychological approach to the reasons these terrorists hate us so much. And most of all, follow daddy’s example and surgically strike (if need be, which it wasn’t really necessary) instead of trying a botched occupation.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:06 pmSomeone deleting posts?
December 1st, 2006 at 12:08 pmCondomsleeza Rice. Sounds good.
Comment by ForTruth
Or like Dave Chappell says: Cunnilingus Rice
December 1st, 2006 at 12:11 pmOh yeah forgot to respond to the last question: what would we have done about Iraq in 2003? I don’t know, maybe continue with sanctions that were working fine just the way they were (as there had not been weapons of mass destruction there since our first attack in Persian Gulf 1). Maybe not cook the books to show false-procurement of nuclear weapons there to justify invasion. Maybe actually look at all intelligence, not just the intell that favors invasion. I don’t know, maybe listen to my generals who actually had combat experience rather than firing them. And more importantly, I think I would have went after (or maintained pressure) on the real terrorists and take a psychological approach to the reasons these terrorists hate us so much. And most of all, follow daddy’s example and surgically strike (if need be, which it wasn’t really necessary) instead of trying a botched occupation.
all excellent points, but what about the idea that while we were looking to find out why these terrorists hate “US” so much, they attacked again while we were stitting around thinking?
you also have to realize, that the terrorists dont just hate the united states.
but terrorism is a different issue.
what do you think about Hussein making threats toward the united states for so long? do you think that those should just be taken out of the equation because we hadnt found any weapons of mass destruction in Iraq? I assume that people would know, that just because they posses WMD’s doesnt mean they are in their country, there are plenty of other countries that im sure would have been willing and able (and closer to the target) to hold weapons of mass destruction for Hussein if the proposition of an attack on America came up.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:15 pmPre-emptive
who deleted what posts?
December 1st, 2006 at 12:17 pmThanks for posting this - I can’t bear to listen to Condi-liar anymore. Her modulation is designed to hypnotize, and she lies, she lies, she lies!
Hmm, that last line sounds like a lyric.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:18 pmIs there anything rice says that isn’t a lie?
Inquiring minds would like to know.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:30 pm.
axles,
You mention that other nearby nations who have WMD’s would be willing to strike the US or perhaps Israel on Saddam’s behalf. What’s stopping them now? Wouldn’t they be even more inclined to attack now that we have pre-emptively struck one of their allies? The whole problem with the Iraq war is the instability and anger in the Muslim word that the war has created.
As to the argument that what is occuring now in Iraq, i.e. people being murdered on their way to market, etc. was also occuring prior to the war; this is completely untrue. Yes, Saddam was eliminating political opponents. Yes, he once massacred thousands of Kurds (with weapons provided to him by the US and our allies). But by no means did the chaos that we have now exist.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:33 pmCondi’s only doign what’s been so effective lo these past 6 years. Tell whoppers that clearly fly in the face of logic, and tell them so convincingly that most people give up on following the debate. Franken touched upon it in one of his books. The GOP doesn’t care whether or not you believe their shite. They just want you to question the truth to the point where you give up trying to follow the debate. Because if you acquiesce, you’re not putting up a fight, and that’s just as good as being in complete lock-step, as far as the GOP is concerned. They have about 1/3rd of the public following them blindly, and another third who know they’re full of crap. All they gotta do is keep that final 3rd totally confused, and it’s business as usual (and for the GOP and their richest strongest proponents, business as usual is lucrative, indeed).
December 1st, 2006 at 12:39 pmI am not a fan of Condi Rice, i think she is boarderline retarded. And i am not some pro war freak, but i do think that W’s actions and decisions have been the right ones.
Comment by axles of evil — December 1, 2006 @ 10:46 am
Well at least Condi is borderline. You’re COMPLETELY retarded!!
What a moron.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:43 pmI just noticed Condi is wearing her brown shirt today..
December 1st, 2006 at 12:50 pmRice responded that Iraq is not a civil war because “the Iraqis don’t see it that way.â€
Did she even realize how stupid she sounded? I think not.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:51 pmMiss Shoe Shopper needs a good dose of reality.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:52 pmWell Axles …I’m not sure how but often times my posts on here just simply vanish - twice I have posted responses to you (and they weren’t ad homs I promise) and they are gone. I’m not even sure this will go through. I’m tired of trying.
But I’ll try this one point - I don’t recall Saddam threatening us nor could I believe anyone could take that joker seriously when we have bigger boogies right in our backyard doing horrible things to their own people. We had bigger fish to fry in the middle east and Saddam was just an easy scapegoat, or so they thought. Funny, he was hated by these religious fuxtix terrorists as much as we were. The main reason, but by all means, not the only reason we are hated by these people is because of our arrogant bullying attitude, which doesn’t help matters much when we continue or increase those behaviors, effectively creating more terrorists.
But I will say one other thing - please don’t generalize and lump everyone in the same box based on one or two responses on here or any forum, even mine :)
December 1st, 2006 at 12:54 pm[…] But no faster than she can talk. Now she has stated that the Iraqis do not think it’s a civil war there. A lie. What is with this woman, and why does she so readily lie? […]
December 1st, 2006 at 12:56 pmSince when is this administration giving credibility to what the Iraqi’s say. They have been telling us to leave for about a year now.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:59 pmrice is nothing but a G D liar, fashioned in the bush, rhummy, cheny, rove mould.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:59 pm“No one could have imagined….”
“It was basically historical in nature….”
“I didn’t read it….”
What else is new. Along with her standing as the most incompetent National Security Advisor in history, now she stands as the most mendacious Sec. of State since Kissinger. What a resume!
December 1st, 2006 at 1:12 pmWas she on her monthly cycle, or does her face just frown like that naturally? Oh well, I digress…
Question: Why would ANY respectable journalist BELIEVE anything that she says, when she works for the most well-known IDIOT in the world? Like she is going to have any differentiating opinion from what DUMBYA says?
It took Colin Powell’s resignation for him to wake up, and yet they still interview her thinking that she will tell the truth or stray from the WH talking points…
UNBELIEVABLE!
December 1st, 2006 at 1:19 pm#52 - “They have been telling us to leave for about a year now.”
Comment by ForTruth
******Dear ForTruth - I have read so many different polls on the question posed to Iraqis re: our leaving. But if the vast majority wanted us out, I would have to support that move. I hate the idea of more (if that would be possible) sectarian violence and I dislike the notion of Iran’s influence. But to free people from an awful dictator and watch them revert to 7th Century madness is pathetic.
And while we may have different motives for supporting bio-fuels, I FULLY support getting out from under the thumb of OPEC. My proclamation: “Let them ride camels…”
Busy day…..
December 1st, 2006 at 1:24 pmMA,
We agree on this momentous occaision. I even sense some compassion in your post, or am I just projecting?
December 1st, 2006 at 1:28 pmIraqVet: “Why would ANY respectable journalist BELIEVE anything that she says…”
It’s a good question. Unfortunately, the answer illustrates part of what is wrong with our media today. Gwen Ifill of NPR, for example, is a personal friend of Rice’s. She goes to Rice’s house for dinner and cocktails, has a nice time and then has an interview her the next day. She, of course, asks no embarassing questions and lets Rice ramble without providing anything but administration spin… because she’s a personal friend. This is not journalism. It’s speaking FOR power.
December 1st, 2006 at 1:31 pm#58…
Point taken!
December 1st, 2006 at 1:49 pmCall me naive or stupid but I sense the whole purpose of Baker’s Iraq Study Group is to make Iraq a place to do business again. The group was formed in March, ‘06, right about when Bechtel, Blackwater, etc. started considering pulling out of Iraq. It wasn’t the midterms that brought all this grasping for alternatives about. Rummy’s firing is just so much misdirection. By now, Iraq was supposed to be a contractors’ paradise, that it hasn’t turned out that way is pissing off some major corporate donors (yes, to both parties). As we know with China, Russia, Indonesia, etc., “stability†trumps “democracy” as far as corporations are concerned. That is now the template for Iraq.
December 1st, 2006 at 3:05 pmRemember, Baker represents his own interest (Carlyle Group) and the interest of the Govt of Kuwait for unpaid war reparations, talk about conflicted!
[…] Source: Think Progress » Rice Falsely Claims That Iraqis Don’t Believe They Are In A Civil War […]
December 1st, 2006 at 3:19 pmRice is nothing but a Bush lackey- and a she lies all the time. This is nothing new.
December 1st, 2006 at 3:29 pmmark
ill admit that your claims are all good ones, but you have to admit that you are all (most) very biased on the situation. maybe for good reason, maybe not, but you have to look at it from both sides, what about the good things we’ve done for these people ?
the information we’re ALL getting is all being subject to framing so it suits whatever network produces its purpose. just like all news.
certainly there are facts that are being overlooked from both sides and people are using this to slant the issue. whether it be officials, or bloggers, or commenters on blogs like ourselves.
and to the earlier comments i got, you have no reason or support for you claims that i am ignorant on the issue. whether i am or not, that does not change the issue that im bringing up relevant questions on the subject, and for you, this could be your chance to educate someone that doesnt really know all there is.
ill admit, i am arguing for the sake of argument here, i have no real official oppinion either way, maybe i should, but i dont, i have my own issues right now that im dealing with first.
December 1st, 2006 at 3:53 pmWho cares what you call it… civil war.. insurgents… al quaeda…etc.
The truth is probably all are involved in a growing stew of violence and hatred.
Iraq is totally screwed up with a dysfunctional government running a disfunctional military.
Maybe Rice could agree to that! Then again, the light isn’t too bright upstairs.
December 1st, 2006 at 3:53 pmI am not a fan of Condi Rice, i think she is boarderline retarded.
Comment by axles of evil — December 1, 2006 @ 10:46 am
Read your comments and I asked, did pot meet kettle here?
December 1st, 2006 at 4:52 pmRead your comments and I asked, did pot meet kettle here?
wow you are just oh so clever. its good to see you can add this and not add anything constructive to the “conversation” at all… do you have an oppinion of your own? or do you just mindlessly follow liberal Dbags all over the place
I figure ill tell you now, i have no interest in any of this, whatever is happening is happening, and since NONE of you are taking any ACTIONS to remedy the situation , you may as well not be informed either, what are you going to do with your information, sit around and thumb your asses in your parents basements?
Im of the mindset that you should either use the information you have to take action, or shut up and sit down, because you arent contributing anything by whining on the internet.
If this is how you all feel, get off your asses and do something about it, i would applaud and support you for it, but untill then , you are just a bunch of all talk, no action complainers.
i was just using this/and all of you, for a project im doing at school, a top 20 university.
well i think i got what i need and i wont be checking back here again, thanks for the help.
December 1st, 2006 at 5:50 pmWhile they were at it…they should have asked CONDI if Iraqis see themselves as OCCUPIED. Or maybe OPPRESSED. Or if they think Americans should leave. Or if GAY people should be married. Or maybe if PRESIDENT BUSH should be tried for WAR CRIMES.
I guess that would seem only fair since we are using their opinions to determine semantics on our end.
December 1st, 2006 at 6:18 pmCondi=BushCo Shill. No more-no less.
December 1st, 2006 at 7:21 pmBack in August of 2003 Rice while pandering to Veterans of Foreign Wars in San Antonio told them that situation in German following World War II was every bit as dangerous as what we were witnessing in Iraq at that time. That statement came from someone considered to be a scholar on the German issue. What it boils down to is that Condi would do or say anything and the truth be damned.
December 2nd, 2006 at 12:22 am[…] Well lets see. So far we’ve been told this is not a civil war because not all parts of the country were at war. Ok! On that basis we did not have a civil war either, Maine did not have any battles during the Civil War. And we were told by our military leaders that because there is still a functioning central government in Iraq we do not have a civil war. Well Ok! Then once again we did not have a Civil War because Lincoln and his government were in power the whole time. And now lastly, we are told this is not a civil war because some outsiders are taking part in this war. Ok I can buy into that too. But on that count ours then also was not a Civil War because among others who fought in our war were a number of Canadians who were opposed to slavery. So, all you text book writers out there scratch that from the books, NO CIVIL WAR happened in the US. We failed that mark by several different tests. Kids, remember on the SAT, NO CIVIL WAR IN THE US. And if you are marked incorrect on that we have the proof and the experts to back you up. Condi will help you too. […]
December 2nd, 2006 at 12:47 amWith all respects due to Dr Rice, is the world so stupid not to see what a situation is like when political factions are trapped into violence and warfare inside the same border line?
December 4th, 2006 at 6:09 pmWhatever you may define it, or whatever Iraqis deem fit to call their internal fighting as a war or a conflict of some kind… we shall always remember the words of this very wise man about people who call themselves Doctors… with PHD: a Permanent Head Damage!