Snow Dismisses Gordon Smith’s Criticisms Of Iraq Policy, Says Senator Is Just Being ‘Emotional’
Snow Dismisses Gordon Smith’s Criticisms Of Iraq Policy, Says Senator Is Just Being ‘Emotional’
Last week, Sen. Gordon Smith (R-OR) — who originally supported the war in Iraq — delivered a scathing indictment of President Bush’s policy in Iraq, stating it “may even be criminal.” Yesterday on ABC This Week he called it a “dereliction” and “deeply immoral.”
The administration isn’t taking him very seriously. Today, White House Press Secretary Tony Snow dismissed the comments, stating that “politics are emotional.” When the reporter questioned whether Snow was “saying Republican Senator Smith is not in favor of democracy,” Snow replied, “I don’t know.” Watch it:
Transcript:
QUESTION: You’re just going to blow it off. A Republican senator is saying that president’s policy may be criminal and it’s immoral and you’re just saying…
SNOW: What would you like me to say? Should I…
QUESTION: Don’t you think you should answer for that? You’re saying — you said from this podium over and over that the strategy is victory, right?
SNOW: And it continues to be.
QUESTION: And you have a Republican senator saying there is no clear strategy, that you don’t have a strategy.
SNOW: Well, let’s let Senator Smith hear what the president has to say. We understand that this is a time where politics are emotional in the wake of an election. And you know what? Senator Smith is entitled to his opinion.
But I’m not sure exactly what you would like…
QUESTION: How about answering the central thrust about the strategy, not about…
SNOW: OK, the strategy’s pretty simple. If you take a look, for instance — if you take a look at the Baker-Hamilton commission report, what do they talk about? They talk about building greater capability on the part of the Iraqis, so that you can have an Iraqi government that governs itself, sustains itself, defends itself, is an ally in the war on terror, is a democracy.
I don’t think it’s immoral to be a democracy. I don’t think it’s immoral to have state that is able to stand up and defend itself against acts of terror. I don’t think it’s immoral to defend the Iraqi people against acts of terrorism aimed at Muslims.
QUESTION: And the senator’s not saying that’s immoral. He’s saying that the U.S. — he’s saying, of course…
SNOW: That’s the U.S. policy. You know what? I’ll tell you what. You’re engaging in an argument, and you’re trying to fill in the gaps…
QUESTION: It’s a Republican senator saying it, not me. And he’s not — of course he’s in favor of democracy.
SNOW: I understand that. Then tell me exactly…
QUESTION: Are you saying Republican Senator Smith is not in favor of democracy?
SNOW: Well, I don’t know.
Sort Comments By: Top Rated | Date
59 Responses to “Snow Dismisses Gordon Smith’s Criticisms Of Iraq Policy, Says Senator Is Just Being ‘Emotional’”
Topic Cloud
ArchivesBlog Roll
Why even bother anymore? Snow doesn’t even try anymore. It is just Spin, Spin, Spin.
December 11th, 2006 at 3:31 pmAnd I suppose that means that George Bush, by invading a country that was no threat to the U.S. in the name of spreading democracy in the Mid East (Tracy, where are you?) and sending almost 3000 service members to their deaths is being….what…practical?
Let me guess…David Gregory?
December 11th, 2006 at 3:31 pmScotty’s head would have exploded by now if he had stayed on.
December 11th, 2006 at 3:31 pmLet’s just edit out the irrelevant responses of Mr. Snowball, shall we? The whole interchange can be understood by including the very beginning and the very end. To wit:
QUESTION: You’re just going to blow it off. A Republican senator is saying that president’s policy may be criminal and it’s immoral and you’re just saying…
SNOW: Well, I don’t know.
Very eSNOWtional.
December 11th, 2006 at 3:32 pmRE: The administration now refuses to listen to critiques from lawmakers within its own party.
Of course not. What was it we were told the other day? Something about the President, by definition, being smarter than anyone outside of his administration?
December 11th, 2006 at 3:33 pmSNOW: Well, let’s let Senator Smith hear what the president has to say. We understand that this is a time where politics are emotional in the wake of an election. And you know what? Senator Smith is entitled to his opinion.
Ahhhh…the epitome of arrogance.
December 11th, 2006 at 3:37 pmHere we have Tony Snow, one again, refusing to give a clear answer to the question: “What is the Bush administration’s response to the charge made by Sen Smith that there is no clear strategy?”
What we get instead is a long-winded babble about the Baker commission and the morality of democracy and helping others.
It’s not as if it’s the first time they hear that accusation. You’d think they would have an answer by now.
More muddling the issues from the party of personal responsibility.
December 11th, 2006 at 3:43 pmI don’t think it’s immoral to be a democracy. I don’t think it’s immoral to have state that is able to stand up and defend itself against acts of terror. I don’t think it’s immoral to defend the Iraqi people against acts of terrorism aimed at Muslims.
Well it sure as hell is immoral to send in over 100,000 troops (nearly 3000 of which have died) simply for the reason of effecting regime change by deposing a leader for which you no longer have any use for.
Frequent contributor Tracy has suggested this was the real reason we invaded Iraq…to plant the seeds of democracy in the Middle East. The WMD story was just window dressing for an America that wouldn’t have had the stomach for regime change being the #1 reason. I have to say I agree.
December 11th, 2006 at 3:46 pm[…] Tony Snow on Bush’s “strategy”: QUESTION: Don’t you think you should answer for that? You’re saying — you said from this podium over and over that the strategy is victory, right? […]
December 11th, 2006 at 3:51 pmAnd may I add something I’ve been harping on recently.
Bush is on record as saying that had he known in 2003, pre-invasion, what he knows today…that there were no WMDs in Iraq…he’d still have gone through with the invasion.
Which means it was never about WMDs to begin with. This is why I agree with Tracy’s assessment.
December 11th, 2006 at 3:51 pmto plant the seeds of democracy in the Middle East.
We don’t always reap what we sow - seeds of democracy spread on a bedrock of sectarian tribalism will have difficulty taking root.
December 11th, 2006 at 3:53 pmIs it just me or does it look like Snow-Job’s nose has been getting longer lately?
December 11th, 2006 at 4:00 pmSounds like the reporters are finally losing patience with BushCo. I wonder how much longer they’re going to accept the same answers.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:03 pmsmith is a pathetic man, snow is the kind of rat that would clearly eat another. one runs from sinking ship, one stays on to convince other rats to stay and be food
December 11th, 2006 at 4:05 pmto plant the seeds of democracy in the Middle East.
I have to disagree. The invasion as a nation-building exercise is every bit a failure as the invasion as protecting everyone from WMDs that don’t exist.
In short, it’s just the latest shade of lipstick they’ve smeared on the pig. The real reason for the invasion of Iraq is control…establishment of a permanent Imperial American presence in the Middle East.
When looked at from this angle, it almost makes sense to have an embassy compound that’s visible from space.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:13 pmSnow should just give it up and go back to Faux where he belongs–the gaggle has become an idiotic exercise.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:27 pm#1 JAD
Why even bother anymore? Snow doesn’t even try anymore. It is just Spin, Spin, Spin.
He knows that nobody believes him. A decent person might care whether or not he still has any credibility. Not Snow. He has that little half-grin on his face most of the time and when he gets cornered he accuses the reporter of being partisan.
When it all comes falling in on Bush, Cheney, and Rove, I sure hope it buries Snow, too.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:40 pmLots of Americans being blown up and dying for nothing. I don’t see anything to get emotional about…
There’s no room for human feeling in making policy. This is war.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:50 pmSomeone ought to send this idiot a memo telling him hise “Snow-job” no longer works with us the People.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:51 pmIn short, it’s just the latest shade of lipstick they’ve smeared on the pig. The real reason for the invasion of Iraq is control…establishment of a permanent Imperial American presence in the Middle East.
Yes, for the control of the oil in the region. That is ALL it’s ever been about. And control of the oil is control of the world economy.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:54 pmComment by TripMaster Monkey — December 11, 2006 @ 4:13 pm
Allow me to clarify…my point is that the WMD story was bogus…always have said this. I am agreeing with Tracy (a rare occurance, a assure you) on this point.
I concur with your point that spreading democracy was not what Bush had in mind. Getting us bogged down in another country with no plan for winning was, IMO.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:54 pmWhen Snow repeats that the strategy is “victory” the next question from the press should be, define victory and how Bush plans on achieving it. These cliches are getting really tired. Snow is a putz.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:54 pmDoes anyone know who is asking the questions?
It sounds like Sen Smith needs to cave in Snowflake’s expensive smile.
December 11th, 2006 at 4:58 pmthe report was CNN’s Ed Henry …. and Snowy’s bull is just the usual coming from this administration — denegrate those who disagree, in this case, by dismissing the offensive opinion as being “emotional.” i think it means they take it very seriously indeed, to start in on the discounting like that.
December 11th, 2006 at 5:00 pm#
Dec. 11: Rep. Dennis Kucinich Briefing on Iraqi Casualties
Live on C-SPAN, 10 AM EST
Announce end: +0000, Thu Dec 14, 2006 8:55 PM
Posted: +0000, Sat Dec 09, 2006 3:54 PM Quote: Schedule date: Monday, December
11, 2006
10:00 AM EST
2:00 (est.) LIVE
C-SPAN
Congressional News Conference
Iraqi Civilian Casualties
U.S. House of Representatives,
Dennis Kucinich , D-OH
Ron Paul , R, Texas
The beginning and end of this live program may be earlier or later than the scheduled times.
http://www.kucinich.us/ phpBB2/ viewtopic.php?p=35039&;sid=1ba98740c7bbe82af1444badd5f5f3bf#35039
http://messageboards.aol.com/ aol/ en_us/ articles.php?boardId=523441&articleId=2353739&func=6&channel=News+AOL+Managed&filterRead=false&filterHidden=true&filterUnhidden=false
Dennis Kucinich had an incredible hearing this morning with the Lacent and JohnsHokins people..and what they said is their 655,000 figure of deaths in Iraq are most likely an undercount..the numbers could actually be closer to 950,000 dead iraqi’s and Dr Juan Cole of the UNiversity of Michigan said
nonsence for those who say ..if we don;t get them there they will come here.. HE SAID THAT IS NONSENCE!
he also said for those who say..we must have victory in Iraq..
he asked what will victory look like ..killing each and every Sunni??
If you can catch the re-run of this hearing ..it is must see!!
Dr Juan Cole said the US media has hidden the truth since 2003 of violent casualties..both the print media and TV media..and said what the American people know of the casulaties is only the tip of the iceberg!
Comment by Share — December 11, 2006 @ 2:13 pm
I wanted to post this again from another string earlier today. If these figures are correct, and if Saddam killed 300,000 people over a period of 30 years, we have far exceeded this! 600,000+ in nearly FOUR years! If Saddam had killed people at this rate, he would have massacred 4.6 million. No, Americans and the coalition forces DID NOT kill each and every one of these people What we did was open the Pandora’s box on the killing fields.
December 11th, 2006 at 5:10 pmWhen Snow repeats that the strategy is “victory†the next question from the press should be, define victory and how Bush plans on achieving it. These cliches are getting really tired. Snow is a putz.
Comment by Vic — December 11, 2006 @ 4:54 pm
I’d be interested in what his answer would be now, if he had one.
Several weeks ago a reporter asked Snow if we were winning in Iraq.
His response: “Are we winning in Iraq? I don’t know…how do you define ‘winning’?”
I believe the exchange is posted somewhere here on TP.
December 11th, 2006 at 5:13 pm“to plant the seeds of democracy in the Middle East.
I have to disagree. The invasion as a nation-building exercise is every bit a failure as the invasion as protecting everyone from WMDs that don’t exist.”
Bush said, back at the very beginning of those whole mess, that he wasn’t interested in nation-building. I believe he was telling the truth in THAT case — this has always been about oil and the rebuilding contracts for his fat-cat buddies and his family. That’s it.
December 11th, 2006 at 5:16 pmWhen looked at from this angle, it almost makes sense to have an embassy compound that’s visible from space.
Comment by TripMaster Monkey — December 11, 2006 @ 4:13 pm
When looked at from this angle, it also makes sense to want to continue the civil war and utter chaos and fighting all around for as long as possible:
The more destruction, the more $$$ for Halliburton to “rebuild”.
The more fighting, the more $$$ for Blackwater and CACI who have almost as many private contractors in Iraq as we do military personnel.
The more fighting, the more equipment and weapons are blown up or “lost” or stolen. The more $$$ to replace them and the more weapons into the hands of the enemy to continue fighting.
The more fighting, the less they notice who’s stealing the oil (Halliburton again)
Keep the country in turmoil. More money money money money.
And what’s a few million more dead Middle Easterners?
And what’s a few thousand more dead Americans?
Even sending their own children won’t matter to these people - they would be just as content to have their children killed as long as the $$$ keeps flowing. They can always make more kids to carry on the line, after all.
December 11th, 2006 at 5:17 pmTom DeLay was just on Hardball. He said his blog just started TODAY! LIAR!!! Also, nothing about the negative comments received. Surprise. The host (where is Matthews?) was very sympathetic toward this criminal.
December 11th, 2006 at 5:27 pmThanks WC, I do now remember that exchange with Snow. How do you define winning is another question they need to answer because they keep repeating that line’o bull as well. I remember Bush saying many times “We are winning” or “The generals tell me we are winning”. Oh yeah dubya. how are we winning?
December 11th, 2006 at 5:31 pma person who doesn’t know what winning is , snow, is too stupid to live.
December 11th, 2006 at 5:41 pmThe “emotional” label is a favorite among “conservatives” to lambast a position they don’t like, but can’t defend against. Take the minimum wage. They would say that you must look at it from an economic standpoint, and not just base your opinion on emotions. I guess that means if there is more bread for you, screw the starving man. Or they’ll even contrast “emotional” with “practical” as if it is totally childish to think opposite to them. If you want to save baby seals from being pummeled and they want to make money from baby seal fur, then they are practical, you are emotional.
It’s classic “conservative” crap.
December 11th, 2006 at 5:56 pmHe must like being a pol. Needs to kiss some ass now.
December 11th, 2006 at 7:33 pmTypical Psychopathic behavoir, I hear it over and over again, “Emotional”. Psychopaths do not understand the higher emotions because THEY DO NOT HAVE THEM! Therefore it is a confused reaction to human beings as they act in a way the Psychopath does not understand, and the Psychopath dismisses it as “Emotional”.
Republican = Bigot Psychopath
December 11th, 2006 at 8:10 pm33-35
I beg your pardon?
Tony Snow is an exemplary role model for all students of journalism today.
How could you say such a thing?
December 11th, 2006 at 8:19 pmLet`s agree on one thing #35
Republican=Bigotry
Not all republicans are bigots,just as not all democrats are gay.
Please chastise if you must,but don`t lump all of us Republicans into
one nice neat little picture.
It is the NEOCON faction of the party that really sucks.
Glad we could talk.
Now back to your mac and cheese and your day job.
“Keep America Strong,Eat More Mac and Cheese”
Bwahahahahaaaaa!
Did I mention,I have $77,000,000 and I won`t invest or give back one penny to anyone.I am KEEPING IT ALL FOR ME!
Thanks Dems!!
These tax breaks are absolutely fabulous!@!
Perhaps one day you will have money too…………but I wouldn`t
count on it!
Bwahahahahaa
December 11th, 2006 at 8:25 pmI think it’s time that America (and the rest of the world, for that matter) stopped listening to what this so-called “president” has to say.
Go back to Fox, Tony…and take Cheney with you.
December 11th, 2006 at 8:40 pmDon’t be too hard on Tony. He is an unaccomplished student of journalism. He finished 1 position above the most famous student in his graduating class - Baghdad Bob, who finished last.
December 11th, 2006 at 8:43 pmDemandTruth is so right, but I doubt they would send any kin in line for the throne. Just look at Dubya who was ensured a nice spot in the Air National Guard instead of slogging through the jungles of ‘Nam like the “commoners”.
These people are geo-politicians. To them, you and everyone else is expendable. Oil is the basis of our empire, much as coal was for the British: An important resource that needs to be controlled and protected AT ALL COSTS. And yes, in order to effect that control, lies must be told. British: We’re here to cilvilize you and bring you all of the benefits of western society. US: We’re here to free you from dictatorship.
Hugo Chavez couldn’t be more correct about us.
December 11th, 2006 at 9:03 pmHere’s some additional Tony Snow trivia: He was very good friends with Linda Tripp. He developed her as a source and hit gold because of her connection to Lewinskyl.
Snow more then anyone else leaned on Tripp hard to wear the wire that led to the perjury trap they set for President Clinton. He climbs down into the political gutter as good as Lee Attwell did. He pretends to be a journalist but in reality he produces nothing but Bush propoganda that Dr. Joeseph Goebbels would be envious of.
He dismisses the Senator from Oregon as being “emotional”. What an insult for a man that carried Bush’s water for a few years. That pie in the Sky democratic Domino effect for the Middle East has turned around on you and the Domino’s that are falling are in your own party.
I’m very dissapointed that the young people of this country aren’t organizing a huge protest march in DC. Step up here and get involved so that we can get our troops out of Iraq. It’s very important that you do this as soon as possible.
I’d like to see at least 2 million protesters in DC camping out in a vigil as close to the White House as possible. This Lawbreaker , our President, needs the full court press from the citizens, because I see no way that the Democratic Party will do what is requried to end the war and end it SOON.
December 11th, 2006 at 9:18 pmTony Snow is dumber than a friggin bag of hair.
And worth less than that.
December 11th, 2006 at 9:32 pmThis poor smuck has only the ignorance and arrogance of his boss going for him anymore. How low some people can go. It is what happens when you not only sell your soul to the devil, but work for him as well.
December 11th, 2006 at 9:56 pmGod forbid someone in the Government experience an emotion…
December 11th, 2006 at 10:41 pmHint to Toadie Snowjob: “Dude, you wasted that cheap ass dodge. You should have saved that for when a Congresswoman bad mouthed the Administration. You could have been a sexist asshole instead of just an asshole.
December 11th, 2006 at 11:53 pmBoy oh boy, that Angie is some smart investor. She went from $7 million less than a week ago, to $70 million the next day, to $77 million now. She’ll probably hit $777 million by the end of the week.
December 11th, 2006 at 11:54 pmWe understand that this is a time where politics are emotional in the wake of an election.
…said the man who started crying at his first White House press briefing when someone asked him about his yellow wristband. Yes, that’s right Tony. It’s stupid for someone to get emotional about something if it’s not all about you.
December 11th, 2006 at 11:59 pmI like Snow. He reminds me of the good-for-nothing male ape who was friend of the female ape doctor that helps Charlton Heston in the Planet of the Apes.
December 12th, 2006 at 12:27 amSnow’s head is full of straw. Best not to even post anything this birdbrain says.
December 12th, 2006 at 12:47 amI would NOT buy a new car from Tony Snow.
December 12th, 2006 at 1:11 amBaghdad Bob and Washington Willie. War is fun!
December 12th, 2006 at 4:25 amWhy Oregonians will be voting Gordon Smith out in 08
Gordon Smith supported Racist Trent Lott as Republican Minority Whip.
Trent Lott stepped down as minority leader in 2002 after stating the country would be better of if Presidential candidate Strom Thurmond would have won on the segregation platform.
“I wanna tell you, ladies and gentlemen, that there’s not enough troops in the army to force the Southern people to break down segregation and admit the nigger [1]] race into our theaters, into our swimming pools, into our homes, and into our churches.” — Presidential Candidate Strom Thurmond 1948 Segregation Camptaign Speech
Gordon Smith took money from convicted lobbyist Jack Abramoff.
“The senator has held fundraisers at a D.C. restaurant that Abramoff owned until recently, and he has taken thousands of dollars in campaign donations from Abramoff and his tribal clients. …
Between May 2001 and May 2002, Abramoff wrote three $1,000 checks to Smith, followed by a $2,000 check in June 2002 from one of his main clients, the Mississippi Band of Choctaws. In late October 2002, right before Smith’s reelection, while he enjoyed a large lead in the polls over Democrat Bill Bradbury, the senator accepted three more checks totaling $4,000, two from the Mississippi tribe and one from another Abramoff client, the Agua Caliente Band of Cahuilla Indians in California. Since the election, Smith has received two additional checks from Abramoff’s Indian clients, totaling $6,000.”
December 12th, 2006 at 10:11 amWhy Oregonians will be voting Gordon Smith out in 08 (continued)
Gordon Smith supports Outsourcing companies that move their operations to offshore locations.
“In 2005, after accepting $47,000 from Virgin Islands corporate interests, including a fundraiser thrown on his behalf by supporters of the tax loophole, Smith last year opposed a budget amendment that would have repealed tax incentives for domestic companies that move their manufacturing plants to offshore locations. The measure’s resulting revenue projected to reduce the federal deficit by $3.2 billion from 2006 to 2010.”
Gordon Smith. Flip. Flop. Flippity-Flop.
“The US Senate passed a $70 billion tax cut - most of it going to the wealthiest Americans. Republican Gordon Smith of Oregon originally registered a “nay” vote but changed to “aye” just before the tally was announced.”
Gordon Smith’s Ethics Problem
“If the records are accurate, the trip by Smith and four other Republican lawmakers would violate ethics rules that bar lobbying firms from paying for trips taken by members of Congress.”
December 12th, 2006 at 10:20 amWhy Oregonians will be voting Gordon Smith out in 08 (continued)
Gordon Smith caves to Big Oil
“Gordon Smith has again shown the dishonesty of his slick campaign ads and so-called independence in the U.S. Senate,” said Kelly Steele, the party’s communications director. “When the chips were down, Gordon Smith bowed to the will of the Bush White House, and broke another promise to Oregonians.”
Karl Rove & Gordon Smith
” John McCain and Gordon Smith caved. And the oil-drilling measure passed.”
“At the time, Rove noted that Oregon’s incumbent Sen. Gordon H. Smith, a Republican, faced a difficult reelection. The Interior Department was then questioning whether to allow drought-stricken farmers to pull more water from Oregon’s Klamath River, endangering the state’s salmon population. Farmers are a critical part of the Oregon GOP base.
An inspector general’s report subsequently concluded there was no inappropriate pressure on the decision makers in the Klamath case. But the controversial decision to release water to farmers resulted in the largest fish kill in the West and still angers Indian fishermen and environmentalists. Smith won reelection”
Gordon Smith’s $1.9-Billion-a-Week Problem
“What’s a trillion dollar price tag mean? That means Gordon Smith is willing to spend $1.9 billion a week to improve the lives of the Paris Hiltons of the country.”
Gordon Smith: Making Oregon Less Competitive
“A proposal to raise the national minimum wage to $6.25 per hour from the current $5.15 was defeated 51-47 today. Gordon Smith voted with the majority of Republicans to defeat the proposal. No Democrats voted with Smith.”
Sensing his impending defeat in 2008, Oregon Republican Senator Gordon H. Smith, who in 2002 voted to authorize the war in Iraq, flip flopped on Thursday and became the first GOP senator to raise the possibility of a quick withdrawal of American troops. Senator Gordon Smith is an opportunist. Too little too late, opportunist Senator Gordon Smith won’t be reelected in Oregon in 08.
December 12th, 2006 at 10:27 amDEMOCRACY TO GLOBALISTS IS A WAY TO SLASH AND BURN A CULTURE.OPTMIZING THE POTENTIAL FOR PROFIT,SO IT PAYS TO SPIN YOUR AGENDA [TONY SNOWJOB]
December 12th, 2006 at 10:52 amDK
Since Snow took on the position as Presidental spokesman,
WE ALL HAVE BEEN TREATED TO A (SNOW JOB) FIVE DAY’S A WEEK
A happy Democrat
December 12th, 2006 at 12:48 pmJust read American Dynasty and The State of Denial. You may arrive at some undersatnding. Boy am I glad not voting for the Father or the Son, and will not vote for Jeb either!!!
December 12th, 2006 at 3:27 pmWhen Ceasear took control of his Army he promised the troops riches. All our troops get is a paycheck that doesn’t come close to want Blackwater troops are getting paid.
December 12th, 2006 at 3:53 pmWhatever happened to Snow being “Fair and Balanced”? What a crock. This guy is proof positive that all Fox News people are just Bush mouthpieces….
December 12th, 2006 at 10:25 pmThese people are no longer filled with reasons, but excuses. If the excuses break down as they have in the past, then they turn to lies. Remember “We’re Winning!?” It’s time the whole bunch of liars are thrown out and tried in a court of law for the deaths they caused. The incompetency/stubborness of this WHOLE administration has to be dealt with. With Rummy gone, who is steering the military ship? As a matter of fact, who is steering our ship from the top on down?. Certainly not our cheerleading president. Save us Nancy, you have a bag of snakes to reckon with.
December 13th, 2006 at 8:07 am