POLL: Active Duty U.S. Soldiers Disapprove Of Bush Handling Of War, Do Not Support Escalation
POLL: Active Duty U.S. Soldiers Disapprove Of Bush Handling Of War, Do Not Support Escalation
The Military Times released a new poll yesterday of 6,000 active duty U.S. military personnel. The results were revealing. Some highlights:
– Only 35 percent said they approve of the way President Bush is handling the war, while 42 percent said they disapproved.
– 50 percent believe success in Iraq is likely, down from 83 percent in 2004.
– 38 percent believe the United States should send more troops to Iraq. 39 percent believe we should maintain current levels or reduce the number of troops, including 13 percent who support complete withdrawal.
– 72 percent believe the military is “stretched too thin to be effective.”
– 47 percent disagree with President Bush’s mantra that the war in Iraq is part of the war against terrorism, while the same percentage agree.
– Only 41 percent of the military said the U.S. should have gone to war in Iraq in the first place, down from 65 percent in 2003. That closely reflects the beliefs of the general population today — 45 percent agreed in a recent USA Today/Gallup poll.
– 52 percent approve of the overall job President Bush is doing, down from 71 percent in 2004.
– 63 percent say the senior military leadership has the best interests of the troops at heart. That number is lower from President Bush (48 percent) and lower still for civilian military leadership (32 percent) and Congress (23 percent).
Greg Sargent and Steve Benen have more.
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I wouldn’t be surprised if this activity gets suppressed or shut down at some point. Some troll probably believes this is unAmerican to do anyway.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:15 pmTreasonous! sarcasm/off
December 30th, 2006 at 12:15 pmThanks for the heads up on the new thread Zooey.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:15 pmI wonder what percent of our informed populous think that taking Saddam’s life makes us any less f*cked in Iraq………
December 30th, 2006 at 12:15 pmAm I being too cynnical?
December 30th, 2006 at 12:16 pmThanks for the heads up on the new thread Zooey.
Comment by ForTruth
I sensed an impending feeding frenzy… :)
December 30th, 2006 at 12:18 pmI wonder what percent of our informed populous think that taking Saddam’s life makes us any less f*cked in Iraq………
Comment by Abby — December 30, 2006 @ 12:15 pm
uh, let me guess…..30 percent?
December 30th, 2006 at 12:18 pmHow utterly dismal and pathetic to have had every advantage in life that the American Dream covets - an influential family with money, degrees from Yale and Harvard, legacy, power, fame - and yet have been unable to do one single positive or selfless thing in your entire life.
George W. Bush is the consumate poster boy for failure…
December 30th, 2006 at 12:23 pmdont’ worry about the military, we’ll be fine. just worry about sitting there at home criticizing everything the government does. that’s your job.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:23 pm“There is a strong strain in military culture not to criticize the commander in chief,†he said.
Well Now 66% think so and the other 34% still feel that way, I can bet you at least 50% of the 34% in military culture WANT to criticize the commander in chief
December 30th, 2006 at 12:23 pmit’s about time the military personnel uses it’s right to criticize and stand up to the enemies that is illegally occupying the white house. folks, this is a courageous thing to do. soldiers have been killed for this, literrally.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:29 pmComment by wingnutt
December 30th, 2006 at 12:31 pm*yawn*
Wanted for Murder:
December 30th, 2006 at 12:36 pmGeorge W. Bush,
Alias, The Decider,
Alias, The Smirker.
For 7,000 Americans murdered: 3,000 in 9-11 Treason,
3,000 in Iraq and 1,000 in New Orleans (negligent homicide).
I wouldn’t be surprised if this activity gets suppressed or shut down at some point. Some troll probably believes this is unAmerican to do anyway.
Comment by ForTruth
I expect it any time. I just got an email from my wingnutty sister saying it was unpatriotic to speak out against the government in a time of war. This from a woman who could never stop ranting about and disrespecting a sitting president who was caught in a lie about a consensual affair.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:36 pmbush couldn’t set up a battle field with his wwll plastic army men in his sandbox and beat an invisible enemy. so why do folks still think this ‘ain’t good for nothing nazi’ is going to save the day.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:38 pm#14
looks good doesn’t it, and sounds good.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:39 pmthe sad part it will never happen.
zooey
i know a few of those folks. all i do is just laugh and look at them as if they just came in on the short bus. that usually gets it. than i wonder who is actually giving these folks passing grades.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:42 pmWhy do our troops hate our troops?
December 30th, 2006 at 12:44 pmI just got an email from my wingnutty sister saying it was unpatriotic to speak out against the government in a time of war.
Comment by Zooey
I have one just like that. But I dont care too much about her opinions. I love her, of course, she is my little sis, but she gets her news from mainstream media so she probably thinks poor people are just lazy people.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:45 pmbs,
That’s funny. It’s a little harder when it’s family. I’m glad she lives in Texas (of course), because I wouldn’t be able to stand the “patient” look she would be giving me right now. Her husband is worse, but luckily I don’t give a shit about him. :)
December 30th, 2006 at 12:47 pmComment by unbelievable — December 30, 2006 @ 12:23 pm
You’re not the only one who feels that way. Go to Google. Type in “failure” and hit “I’m feeling lucky.”
December 30th, 2006 at 12:47 pmI love her, of course, she is my little sis, but she gets her news from mainstream media so she probably thinks poor people are just lazy people.
Comment by Juan C
Juan, I think we’re related!!
December 30th, 2006 at 12:50 pmYou’re not the only one who feels that way. Go to Google. Type in “failure†and hit “I’m feeling lucky.â€
Comment by Briseadh na Faire
wow. the liberals at TP have finally discovered google-bombing.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:51 pmBriseadh,
Apparently there is some way webmasters can get a certain thing to pop up on the top of a Google search. In all fairness, but I still agree with the overall theme.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:52 pmI remember now, it’s called “Google Bombing”. Apparently the other side’s webmasters can’t keep up though…
December 30th, 2006 at 12:54 pmJuan, I think we’re related!!
December 30th, 2006 at 12:54 pmComment by Zooey
Then where the hell did you get your 5´10″? :)
wow. the liberals at TP have finally discovered google-bombing.
Comment by wingnutt
Discovered it? I think we invented it!
Do the same with the word “Santorum,” you’ll like it. You might even learn something, wingnutty.
December 30th, 2006 at 12:56 pmthe troops have spoke. Good for this poll.
No keep in mind that there are SOME here that call these same troops “murdering thugs” and such.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:00 pmThen where the hell did you get your 5´10″? :)
Comment by Juan C
The FedEx guy — Cousin Juan. :-)
December 30th, 2006 at 1:03 pm5′10″ is nice and tall for a girl.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:07 pmHer husband is worse, but luckily I don’t give a shit about him. :)
Comment by Zooey — December 30, 2006 @ 12:47 pm
That sounds like one of my brothers. If you don’t share his emotional opinions he gets from FAUX he tries to intimidate you with patronizing laughter and wide-eyed yelling.
Fourth of July I called him on his fear-mongering misinformation his was spouting about North Korea’s missle ability. He just makes up stuff partly based in fact so that ignorant people like his wife and my mother will think he knows what he is talking about. So, I stood up to him until he painted his way into a corner and had to shut up. That was the last time he brought up politics at family functions… Though he still calls CNN ‘Communist News Network’…
December 30th, 2006 at 1:07 pmNo keep in mind that there are SOME here that call these same troops “murdering thugs†and such.
Comment by robert — December 30, 2006 @ 1:00 pm
Who? Don’t generalize like that and not expect to hear about it…
December 30th, 2006 at 1:09 pmI was happy to hear my Goper inlaws prefer CNN to Fox News. It was like a Christmas gift. They are done with the President too, they just won’t talk shit about him. Heh.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:12 pmagain, SOME, not all, not even many.
INSANE would be one of them…
December 30th, 2006 at 1:13 pmThough he still calls CNN ‘Communist News Network’…
Comment by unbelievable
ROTFL!!
there are SOME here that call these same troops “murdering thugs†and such.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:16 pmComment by robert
Sorry to say this, robert, but we didnt invent it. There ARE some “murdering, raping and sick-joker thugs” in the US forces.
Juan C,
I agree that there are SOME, but VERY FEW. But people like INSANE and Frederic L. Rice refer to ALL of us that way. Or FLR’s favorite “Christo-facist murdering babykillers.”
December 30th, 2006 at 1:21 pmMorning all, a little late to the party today……It appear’s our fighting forces are waking up, would bet they were awake all along but just not vocal untill now….The day this administration is held accountable will be a great one indeed…..
Blessings..James Brown and all
December 30th, 2006 at 1:30 pmOr FLR’s favorite “Christo-facist murdering babykillers.â€
Comment by robert
I really found that offensive for all those poor, clueless kids in the US forces that are being forced by their despotic government to fight a war for rich people´s motives. Those poor kids in your forces wont see a penny of what they are ripping off out of Iraq. Thats sad. I agree with you in that one. I dont share INSANE OR Frederic´s POV.
Now, make a mental exercise. Imagine you are an iraqi father, whose kid just got killed by a cluster bomb, or burned by White Phosphorous or a bullet from an american soldier…Put yourself in that situation, cuz THERE ARE NO IRAQI soldiers in US soil killing US civilians.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:31 pmagain, SOME, not all, not even many.
INSANE would be one of them…
Comment by robert — December 30, 2006 @ 1:13 pm
Again - that is ONE and not SOME. SOME looks like several or a notable portion of us - and not just one person.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:32 pmJuan C,
I know you, unbelievable, zooey, and even Spudge_Boy ( who you just illustrated my point to, regardless of him calling me a liar) have never said things like that. It is the drive-by artests that do those things.
unbelievable, some means more than one. and as Juan has helped me to point out, there has been more than one.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:39 pmThe Brussells Tribuneral
The execution of President Saddam Hussein is a grave war crime imputable under international law
The US-orchestrated tribunal that sentenced President Saddam Hussein has no legal standing
The execution of Iraq’s lawful president is testimony to the gutting of international law by the Bush regime and its criminal partners
“The colonial invasion of Iraq and the ugliest of lies of the lie machine that propagated and justified these barbarous acts will forever remain among the greatest and unpardonable crimes against humanity.” —Jose Luis Zapatero, Prime Minister of Spain, 20 May 2005
December 30th, 2006 at 1:40 pmunbelievable, some means more than one. and as Juan has helped me to point out, there has been more than one.
Comment by robert
Good, why dont we just turn the whole discussion towards semantics: some, a part of, few, exclusively one…etc? It could be really interesting if there wasnt a war where thousands of people have already died.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:43 pmI agree Spudge Boy.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:44 pmunbelievable, some means more than one. and as Juan has helped me to point out, there has been more than one.
Comment by robert — December 30, 2006 @ 1:39 pm
Some means several… and several is more than two or three as well.
And, Frederic talks about the troops who actually have killed innocent people intentionally - in which case he would be right. I mean, if you are going to keep lowering your standards to get people to fight in an immoral war - what excatly do youthink will happen? You think there aren’t some corrupt soldiers? Then explain Abu Graib and those arrested for rape and murder of women and children…
December 30th, 2006 at 1:45 pmMohammed Hassan, a Khan al-Khalili storeowner who introduced himself as a Robert de Niro fan, disagreed with the execution:
“A prison sentence is better - for Bush. In prison he’s going to suffer, so Bush will feel happy.â€
While admitting Hussein’s crimes, Hassan immediately wanted to shift the focus onto the violence in Iraq. “It is Iraqis fighting Iraqis now, not Saddam or the Americans, and Bush did that, he instigated that,” Hassan said.
“They knew everything that was going on. He and his father, before in Kuwait, had everything planned,†concluding that the situation now is the product of American foreign policy plans.
Hassan said Bush was a “terrorist” and asked “what about what he has done?â€
But he maintained that he did not like Hussein.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:50 pmAs the world reflects on the execution of Saddam the dicator, it also worth recalling the words of President Bush on dictatorship:
“A dictatorship would be a heck of a lot easier, there’s no question about it.”
- President George W. Bush, July 26, 2001.
“If this were a dictatorship, it’d be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I’m the dictator.”
- President-elect George W. Bush, December 18, 2000.
“You don’t get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot easier.”
December 30th, 2006 at 1:50 pm- Texas Governor George W. Bush, July 1998.
Wingnutt voted for Bush. Twice.
That’s gotta hurt.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:51 pmThe ‘Special’ Iraqi Kangaroo Court that ‘Sentenced’ Saddam to Death, was ‘Created’ by Paul Bremer, the US Administrator of Occupied Iraq in 2003 and the ‘Death Sentence’ was Carried out in December 2006 by the US Created ‘Special’ Court. The Execution of Saddam by the US Occupiers was insensitively conducted during the Muslim Feast of Eid al-Adha and it is an affront to all Arabs and Muslims. This Execution by the US ‘Iraqi’ Government ‘Stinks’ of US Interference through the US ‘Puppet’ Iraqi Government. Bush and Blair Must be Convicted in the International Court For War Crimes in the Haque. Bush, Blair and British Politicians are Mass Murderers.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:52 pm“Saddam destroyed his country and his people,” said a grocer downtown who asked that his name not be printed, “but he was a tool of American foreign policy – [like] Kuwait in 1991.â€
Al-Said reiterated those sentiments: “It’s American foreign policy – everything he did – Iran, Kuwait – they gave him permission to do. He is not any better than the people who came before him.â€
All this comments come from people in the working class. Robert, look how well informed these guys are…
December 30th, 2006 at 1:54 pm“Now, make a mental exercise. Imagine you are an iraqi father, whose kid just got killed by a cluster bomb,…” - Juan C.
********Dear Juan - Here is an additional mental exercise for you. Imagine you’re an Iraqi, Pakistani, Afghani, Kurdish, Jordanian, Saudi, Indonesian, Balinese, Spanish, Filipino, Bristish, German, Israeli, American, or Australian parent of an innocent Muslim or non-Muslim killed by the barbarous atrocities of Islamic radicals. And all this mental exercise in just the last 10 years!! When you admit more Muslims have been killed by Islamofascists than the West has killed, you might demonstrate you are teachable.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:55 pmWhen you admit more Muslims have been killed by Islamofascists than the West has killed, you might demonstrate you are teachable.
Comment by mighty aphrodite
Ssshhh, go and make a joke about your dead kid.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:57 pmI wonder if we will finally see a military coup in the United States? I’d sure as hell approve of one and keep it in place until January 20,2009, when a real human being can be signed in as President for a change.
December 30th, 2006 at 1:58 pmMitey Coprolite makes jokes about her own dead child:
But a funny thing happened on her last birthday - I was outside gardening and two of my children came up. I had been crying and they could see my eyes were a mess. One of my sons said, †You know Mom, I know you’re sad because it’s our sister’s birthday…but maybe it’s better she died early - I mean what if she grew up and became a bank robber and was not allowed to go to heaven??†His sister just ahead of him, chimed in, “Or worse, Mom,…what if she grew up to be a DemoRAT???†I went on to tell them I was a recovering DemoRAT….Aren’t some kids just too precious????
December 30th, 2006 at 2:00 pmWishing you and yours a wonderful Easter!!
Comment by mighty aphrodite — April 15, 2006 @ 2:38 pm
not to make light of this story - and i consider it to be “good news” that most of the troops are able to form an educated opinion considering their official sources are so propagandized -
December 30th, 2006 at 2:00 pmbut
there are many interesting stories on crooksandliars that need attention…
.
When you admit more Muslims have been killed by Islamofascists than the West has killed, you might demonstrate you are teachable.
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 1:55 pm
You truly are a sociopath.
People here dislike you immensly and you still feel the need to show up and act like you’re one of the gang.
Why are you here? You don’t contribute anything on any level - ever. You just put people down and act all smug with yourself because you actually theink we believe you are either an attorney or a woman with children. We don’t.
Only a sick person would come here daily. Stop wasting your time here whenyou should be seeking professional help.
December 30th, 2006 at 2:03 pmMighty - we all know how much you care:
You’ve taught your kids that the worst thing their dead sister - your dead daughter - could have done was to become…and they used a derogatory term for Democrats…which you chose to accentuate in your post.
December 30th, 2006 at 2:07 pmBush: execution is a milestone
Jamie Doward Saturday December 30, 2006
The Observer
The US president, George Bush, today described Saddam Hussein’s execution as a milestone on Iraq’s road to democracy, but warned it would not halt the bloodshed and political discord splitting the country.
His comments came amid predictions that Saddam’s death would prompt a surge in violence across Iraq as details of the dictator’s last minutes alive were made public.
“Bringing Saddam Hussein to justice will not end the violence in Iraq, but it is an important milestone on Iraq’s course to becoming a democracy that can govern, sustain, and defend itself, and be an ally in the war on terror,” Mr Bush said.
Mr Bush, who was asleep when Saddam was executed in the early hours of this morning for the killings of 148 Shia Muslims, rejected claims Saddam had not had a fair trial, saying he had received “the kind of justice he denied the victims of his brutal regime”.
…
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,1980398,00.html
an “important milestone on Iraq’s course to becoming a democracy”…
December 30th, 2006 at 2:10 pmfor shame…
Time to bring the troops home!!!
December 30th, 2006 at 2:13 pmMA
December 30th, 2006 at 2:16 pmThat’s the most disturbing thing I’ve ever heard.
Nice job raising “wholesome, paranoid, religious wackos.”
Next time, tell them that God took her because he wanted to protect her from YOU.
You’re a pathetic, sick person, who should get some serious counseling, SOON. You’re obviously still dealing with the pain of loss.
56/ Ex-British 3 Para
The ‘Special’ Iraqi Kangaroo Court that ‘Sentenced’ Saddam to Death, was ‘Created’ by Paul Bremer, the US Administrator of Occupied Iraq in 2003 and the ‘Death Sentence’ was Carried out in December 2006 by the US Created ‘Special’ Court. The Execution of Saddam by the US Occupiers
THEN AGAINST INTERNATIONAL LAW HE WAS A SHEEP TO THE SLAUGHTER HOW CAN THIS BE FAIR MR BUSH
December 30th, 2006 at 2:19 pmComment by oogah,boogah
I think MA just snapped.
December 30th, 2006 at 2:29 pmI think MA just snapped.
Comment by Juan C
Whatever….
December 30th, 2006 at 2:39 pmMight Hemaphrodite squirted:
When you admit more Muslims have been killed by Islamofascists than the West has killed, you might demonstrate you are teachable.
Except of course that is not true. Global Terrorism is estimated to have killed around 30,000 people since the 1950s. The war in Iraq alone has killed anywhere from 150,000 to 650,000 civilians. Your kind of vile, despicable warmonger is far greater a menace then all Islamic, Christian, fascist, communist, nationalist, Palestinian, Bask, Irish, ethnic, religious terrorists combined.
December 30th, 2006 at 2:41 pmSaddam is dead. Next on Death Row: George W Bush
December 30th, 2006 at 3:00 pmthe world can’t wait!!!!!!!!!!!!
“But that statement would be a lie, why would anybody say something so stupid. Oh that’s right, it came from Mighty Aphrodite.”
Comment by Spudge_Boy
******Sponge, As there have been more than 7000 Islamowack attacks worldwide since 9/11 (#’s apparently missing from your favourite sources), your foolish comment will be generously overlooked - which isn’t difficult…
Reference: http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks
You’re welcome….
Happy New Year!
December 30th, 2006 at 3:09 pm“Killing Saddam during the Hajj means they’re willing to provoke Sunnis to the highest degree,” one pilgrim said.
So lets see
Pissed the Sunnis off BIG TIME which make up most of the Arab world
Pissed most Europeans of with the death penalty and not being tried at the Hague and against International Law
Pissed The Kurds off as now they will never find why Saddam gasses them with American weapons
And now 65% of American forces can see though you Bush
what are you trying to do Mr Bush create WW111
December 30th, 2006 at 3:10 pmDear “Facts” Only - You might expand your “fact” base with the site I provided Sponge…http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks
You’re welcome, too!
December 30th, 2006 at 3:12 pmNow that Saddam’s dead, it’s “Mission Accomplished” and time to bring the troops home.
With Saddam’s execution it means we’ve turned another corner in Iraq. (Ever notice how every time we turn a corner in Iraq it get’s worse?)
December 30th, 2006 at 3:12 pmComment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 3:09 pm
Mighty Moron, I do not expect you to get it but your using that website as a source of anti-Islam “information” is a bit like an anti-Semite using a Hitler quote to “prove” how evil Jews are.
Edd Mubarak to you too.
December 30th, 2006 at 3:23 pm“Killing Saddam during the Hajj means they’re willing to provoke Sunnis to the highest degree,†one pilgrim said.
Bush knows how to start wars
December 30th, 2006 at 3:23 pmWhat a contrasting news, “Tornado scare sends Bush running for cover, while Saddam walking to the gallows to embrace death”.
Fallujah was invaded in Ramadan also
“Killing Saddam during the Hajj means they’re willing to provoke Sunnis to the highest degree,†one pilgrim said.
December 30th, 2006 at 3:28 pmAl-Sadr is responsible for hundreds of americans death in iraq and but US backs his government
December 30th, 2006 at 3:29 pmMighty Misinformationdite brayed:
Dear “Facts†Only - You might expand your “fact†base with the site I provided Sponge…http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks
You’re welcome, too!
That crazy list on that insane site, run clearly by the same sort of mental giants as yourself, combines all attacks within Iraq by insurgents of all stripe, Baathist, nationalist and what not with those by Al-Queda affiliates who are doing it for the Radical Salafi Islam reasons you so “informatively” call “islamofascist”. If you go by your “reasoning”, we should include all Viet Cong and NVA as “terrorists” in your statistics. Don’t forget also all those nasty North Korean “terrorists” in the Koran war.
You and those idiots at that website are simply certifiably nuts.
Luckily those who keep real statistics disagree with your mentality whereby any Muslim engaged in any kind of warfare, anywhere is a “terrorist” and so only include actual terror attacks in countries not being under attack by one super-power or another.
Oh and by the way, your “reasoning” would include all those Taliban “freedom fighters” you were so fond of in the 1980s when they blew up Soviet choppers and tanks as “terrorists” too. I am glad that finally you and Leonid Brezhnev agree on something so dear to both your hearts.
Funny though that you were not spewing spittle while screaming “Death to All Islamonistofascistoliberalmaoistchefeminazis!” back then. Nor are those attacks included on that glorious website of yours.
But, of course, it was the Red Menace at that time which kept you wetting yourself under you bed and the “brave Afghani tribesmen” were the “good guys” worthy of a Rambo movie.
December 30th, 2006 at 3:35 pmHanging Saddam “barbaric” - top EU official
BRUSSELS (Reuters) - Hanging former Iraqi president Saddam Hussein was “barbaric” and may turn him into a martyr, the European Union’s aid and development Commissioner told Reuters on Saturday.
Saddam, who had been convicted of crimes against humanity, was hanged at dawn in the Iraqi capital.
“You don’t fight barbarism with acts that I deem as barbaric. The death penalty is not compatible with democracy,” Louis Michel told Reuters.
“Unfortunately Saddam Hussein risks to appear as a martyr, and he does not deserve that. He is not a martyr, he committed the worse things,” Michel said in a phone interview.
“The death penalty is against the values of the European Union … we are against by principle, whatever the crimes committed by Saddam Hussein - and he committed horrible ones,” Michel said.
SO AMERICA REALLY IS A DICTATORSHIP
December 30th, 2006 at 3:36 pm# 58 When you admit more Muslims have been killed by Islamofascists than the West has killed, you might demonstrate you are teachable. -Comment by mighty aphrodite
Let me congratualate you and your superb lawyering skills on undermining your own argument. Yes, you’ve successfully grasped that muslims are extremely busy fighting with each other, but somehow, this hasn’t been translated by your brilliant jewish/christian/soldier/proctologist/lawyer brain into the logical consequence that they are too dysfunctional and busy with intra-islamic squabbles to form a vast, global conspiracy capeable of “waging war” on a superpower. While there are many militant islamic groups, they all have different idealogies, MANY conflicting with one another, and many having nothing but nationalist agendas with possibly only lip service to anti-western sentiment. Its funny, how you people who constantly mock “conspiracy theorists” are willing to believe in a vast conspiracy of dysfunctiional islamic nuts at the drop of a hat.
Oh, and when you grasp that slipping in your bathtub has killed more americans in the past 6 years than “the terrorists” have in the same amount of time, you will be teachable.
I know you’re going to credit the vigilance of our president for lack of terrorists attacks, but show me the people they’ve rounded up in america since then and i’ll show you nothing but a bunch of posers and wannabees who schemed of cutting down the brooklyn bridge with a blowtorch or jumped through a few tires in afghanistan before fleeing the country and taking no later suspicious action.
THe truth is, there is no vast well organized islamic conspiracy. Its a few disorganized nuts, drawing power from Bush’s melodramatic charactization of them as a “threat to our existence”
everybody be safe on new years eve guys… try to avoid being rammed into….by your fellow americans, on the highway…
December 30th, 2006 at 3:40 pm“…THe truth is, there is no vast well organized islamic conspiracy. Its a few disorganized nuts,….” Comment by Whitey Hermaphrodite
********I don’t disgree with you, Mr./Ms. Hermey. In the VAST majority of cases, “organized islamic conspiracy” is an oxymoron - as is the term “tolerant progressive”.
December 30th, 2006 at 3:57 pmWhile we are at the gallow:
Leave it outside in front of the White House.
We got some work to do there too.
Maybe we can get some Irqaqi executioners to do the job.
Start with Bush and make your way through et al.
Now that would be Justice.
And allow any follower to go the same route.
Where is the difference between any fascist regime and this administration?
“A defiant Saddam Hussein was hanged at dawn today in a secret concrete death chamber..”
LAT
‘Secret concrete death chambers’. That’s Bushes favorite activity.
But be reminded:
When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.
When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.
When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.
When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.”
Martin Niemöller 1892-1984
December 30th, 2006 at 4:02 pmDear CMT - And I should care about the “sensibilities” of the EU, ….because?? The same mindset which tolerated Stalin, Hitler, Franco, etc. for how long?? The brilliant appeasers??? OK…sure….
December 30th, 2006 at 4:06 pm********I don’t disgree with you, Mr./Ms. Hermey. In the VAST majority of cases, “organized islamic conspiracy†is an oxymoron - as is the term “tolerant progressiveâ€.
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 3:57 pm
You have a few nuts that want to create theocracies throughout the Middle East and will kill to achieve. Christian Fundamentalism has been tamed because of progressives in the West. If we all thought like you, there would be Christian madrasas throughout the West pondering ways to create theocracies.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:09 pmI understand that most of the MSM that the troops in Iraq have access to is Fox Network and radio talk shows, with Limbaugh being most frequently “beamed” at them. Amazing that they are moving slowing to recognizing their true position there despite all that. Guess it proves the power of internet access, and the blogs. All things considered, it’s possible/probable that the troops will have to save themselves by walking off the “battlefield,” because it doesn’t appear that the Commander in Chief cares about anything other than his “legacy,” and the Democrats are still in the process of regrowing their spines.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:10 pmThe same mindset which tolerated Stalin, Hitler, Franco, etc. for how long?? The brilliant appeasers??? OK…sure….
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 4:06 pm
Isolationism mainly by republicans tolerated these dictators too.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:12 pmSaddam Wanted To Be Saladin And In Death He Has Become A Martyr
Saturday 30th of December 2006
by Jay Randal
Saddam Hussein the former despot leader of Iraq was hanged at 6:00 AM in Baghdad, and in death he may become more of a problem than he was alive, because in Islamic culture a martyred leader is highly revered.
Saddam was a tyrant, but there have been many such tyrants in worldwide history: including Mobutu in the Congo/Zaire, Marcos in the Philippines, Papa-Doc in Haiti, Suharto in Indonesia, vile Pinochet in Chile, etc.
All of the above listed dictators were friends of the US before their deaths, but only one Saddam was hanged for his crimes, so the hypocrisy stands out blatantly in his execution and leaves a stain of double-standards.
As long as dictators do the bidding of US government, then they are allowed to brutalize their own citizens, but if like Saddam they give the US the middle finger, then they become mortal enemies such as old Castro.
Saddam is now dead, but like Saladin the infamous tyrant who opposed the Crusades, he lives in infamy.
( Jay Randal, political activist and writer in Georgia, USA.)
December 30th, 2006 at 4:16 pm#
Dear CMT - And I should care about the “sensibilities†of the EU, ….because?? The same mindset which tolerated Stalin, Hitler, Franco, etc. for how long?? The brilliant appeasers??? OK…sure….
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 4:06 pm
Let’s not forget Prescott Bush, shall we? Or how about the many industrialists in the U.S. who opposed our entry in WWII and supported Hiltler? Let’s also not forget that the U.S. “tolerated” Saddam, among a whole slew of dictators for YEARS, as long as they could serve the interests of the U.S. (corporations). No one could be as uneducated and uninformed as you are, and be an attorney.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:16 pmVIDEO: Saddam Hussein Executed by Hanging
U.S. War Crimes Accomplice Executed
Saddam Hussein Executed by Hanging
US diplomat James Akins served in the Baghdad Embassy at the time. Mr. Akins said, “I knew all the Ba’ath Party leaders and I liked them”.
“The CIA were definitely involved in that coup. We saw the rise of the Ba’athists as a way of replacing a pro-Soviet government with a pro-American one and you don’t get that chance very often.
“Sure, some people were rounded up and shot but these were mostly communists so that didn’t bother us”.
check out the video, it is a music video.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:18 pmNo one could be as uneducated and uninformed as you are, and be an attorney.
Comment by Impeachcheneythenbus
Sure she/it could. I know lots of phony-baloney types who passed the bar - it ain’t that hard. And most/all of them became lawyers only because they thought they could make a lot of money, not for any moral reason. Shallow-types, most of them.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:22 pm#94 - “You have a few nuts that want to create theocracies throughout the Middle East and will kill to achieve.” Comment by nat
*****Come back and contribute your wealth of intellectualism after you watch a documentary by film maker Wayne Kopping, “Obsession: the Threat of Radical Islam”.
P.S. Since my dear, Jewish mother got out of occupied Austria as a small child in the nick of time, w/o any help from her complicit neighbours I don’t think I will be looking to establish Christian madrasas anytime soon……
December 30th, 2006 at 4:28 pmSave the mind reading for Dionne Warwick or the astology column in your local newspaper or tween magazine…..
“I know lots of phony-baloney types who passed the bar - it ain’t that hard. And most/all of them became lawyers only because they thought they could make a lot of money, not for any moral reason. Shallow-types, most of them. ” Die Now for Peace
******DNfP - You sound like you could be discussing our resident rune thrower, Braid Fairy.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:31 pmbush could care less about what the soldiers think, they are merely being killed for his illegal war.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:32 pmthe wrong person was put to death yesterday.
LOL MA > you are one of those phony-baloney types who claims to have passed the bar! We all know you cut hair in a Washington, DC, salon!
December 30th, 2006 at 4:34 pm“Let’s not forget Prescott Bush, shall we? Or how about the many industrialists in the U.S. who opposed our entry in WWII and supported Hiltler?….No one could be as uneducated and uninformed as you are, and be an attorney. ” Comment by Impeachcheneythenbush
*******Your naming individuals doesn’t QUITE meet the same institutional, or national level of appeasement I noted…..It would be painful to watch you twist in the wind, but this may be a learning experience for you….
Nonetheless, t doesn’t change the fact that the EU is entitled to it’s collectivist view - and I could care less what those losers think. (A friend I were debating that very topic the other day - - she noted so much of American culture has Euro-roots. I had to agree with her. I added, “the good ones were fortunate to leave that decaying mindset behind…”)
December 30th, 2006 at 4:39 pmJay, Apparently a hair cut job sounds good to you - we all know you’re still sucking on a gov’t handout teat for the chronically unemployable….
December 30th, 2006 at 4:41 pmArab Anger Over Execution
Updated: 21:00, Saturday December 30, 2006
Anger simmered in the Arab world over the decision to execute Saddam on the holiest day of the Muslim year.
While his victims, their relatives and the US rejoiced at Saddam’s demise, many Muslims questioned the wisdom of killing the former dictator at the beginning of Eid al-Adha.
Leading Sunni Muslim Arab power Saudi Arabia criticised Iraq’s Shi’ite leaders for executing Saddam, saying his trial had been politicised.
“There is a feeling of surprise and disapproval that the verdict has been applied during the holy months and the first days of Eid al-Adha,” a statement read by the presenter of the official al-Ikhbariya TV said.
“Leaders of Islamic countries should show respect for this blessed occasion … not demean it.”
Many Arabs said his hanging for crimes against humanity was provocatively timed to coincide with Eid al-Adha and would worsen violence in Iraq.
BUSH KNEW THIS HE’S AN ASSHOLE .
December 30th, 2006 at 4:46 pmEid al-Adha - a Muslim holy event meant to celebrate FORGIVENESS.
What a slap in the face, but I seriously doubt Dumbya even knew it was taking place from within the Ivory Tower of Dumbness that he inhabits.
But surely others in the Administration knew.
Bush is a T-O-O-L of the highest order and some assh*le “God” he worships is the manipulator, according to him.
December 30th, 2006 at 4:53 pmThe reason why it got that far in the first place
December 30th, 2006 at 5:02 pmis the widespread believe that America is the greatest.
Because America is the greatest, it is superior.
Because it is superior it is above the common law
of common people in a common world.
Because it is above the common law
there is nobody to stop its descend into
destruction from the inside out.
America is militarist and at least 21 percent love it and
think they have the right to do whatever they please in
this world to satisfy their greed.
But they are only 21 percent. Probably less because 61 Million
voted republican in 2004. So there are less than 30 Million
hardcore followers. 270 Million against 30 Million. 9 versus 1.
There have been worse situations in history.
If the French revolution is to drastic then maybe the Indian
way of Mahatma Ghandi will work.
Come back and contribute your wealth of intellectualism after you watch a documentary by film maker Wayne Kopping, “Obsession: the Threat of Radical Islamâ€.
What is this paranoiac obsession with the boogeyman of “Radical Islam” of yours? How are these particular religious nuts any more dangerous then the religious nutcases of “Fundamentalist Christianity” (who blow up whole Federal Government buildings in addition to medical centers and research facilities while attempting to pervert the US into a theocracy), “Radical Sikhs” (who blow up planes full of people out of the sky), “Militant Hindus” (who burn down whole trains full of people in India), or “Orthodox Judaism” (who have been waging war of terror and ethnic clensing on the Palestinian Arabs for 50 years now)?
P.S. Since my dear, Jewish mother got out of occupied Austria as a small child in the nick of time, w/o any help from her complicit neighbours I don’t think I will be looking to establish Christian madrasas anytime soon……
Which makes your obsession even more puzzling since those who she was “getting out in the nick of time” away from, were wearing belt-buckles with “Gott mit Uns” on them. Those dudes (and some followers of the Shinto religion) were responsible for more death and destruction then all the followers of Islam combined to date, more then 50 times over. Now let’s see, what do you suppose that “Gott” referred to? Allah? Buddha? Jahve? Help me out here…
So I think you are simply an irrational bigot, who hates, hates, hates, without any particular distinctions or variation all those who, in your deranged mind, dare to “oppose” your ideologies by not pliantly following the self-serving, hypocrtical, insane creeds of the members of your “in” group of your social circle. It just so happens that “islamofascists” are at the top of the list, probably because they are active in Israel, which I suspect figures front and centre in your chief zealot delusions.
Thus terrorism, warfare, mayhem, pillaging, torture and other merriments commited by Christian Fundamentalists or Zionists are wholly “justified” and “excusable”, but any violence by those swarthy, uppity Arabic, Islamic types is automatically paramount to high treason, heresy, bestiality and barbarism, to mention only a few.
I suspect that you won’t listen, but it has to be said: You do need professional psychiatric help.
December 30th, 2006 at 5:03 pmI wonder………
Shouldn’t someone have stopped the videotaping once it was obvious that Saddam was not going to have to be dragged to the gallows kicking, screaming and begging for mercy?
The criminality of the murder aside, what a pitiful and embarrassing PR disaster. Even in death, Saddam kicks Bush’s ass.
December 30th, 2006 at 5:04 pmWhy is it that the tough tornado-hider couldn’t have switched places with Saddam about 10:00 pm Eastern time last night? He had already shit his pants with the tornado bearing down on him. All he needed then was a noose. Oh well, we can all fantasize I guess.
December 30th, 2006 at 5:12 pmMA a real lawyer LOL that makes me laugh hysterically! MA is an extremely nasty person who would have loved to have put the noose around Saddam’s neck. By the way MA I am not on Welfare, nor have I ever received any handout from the government. Go join the military today and die for Bush’s oil in Iraq!
December 30th, 2006 at 5:14 pmlast I checked…’the military’ WORKS for the Republic….’we the people’…
it’s unfortunate that their commander does not.
the opinions of ‘the military’ are formed in similar fashion to those of the congress which voted for the aumf….”catapulted propaganda”
they DON’T have the same intelligence. take that however you want to take that…
December 30th, 2006 at 5:24 pm#110 - “What is this paranoiac obsession with the boogeyman of “Radical Islam†of yours?” — FO
******It’s called the power of observation….you need to keep up a little better.
“How are these particular religious nuts any more dangerous then the religious nutcases of “Fundamentalist Christianity†(who blow up whole Federal Government buildings in addition to medical centers and research facilities while attempting to pervert the US into a theocracy),” - FO
******Your idiocy looms large. Timothy McVeigh was held in contempt, disgust and anger by 98.9% of Christians, unlike the percentages of sympathetic Muslims who danced in the streets after 9/11. (This is not to say ALL Muslims despise the West. Most of those who don’t despise us moved here.)
A question about Palestine -
Before Palestine was “occupied” by the Jews, please name the last “Palestinian” President, Sheik, or King.
Please explain the abandonment and slaughter of Palestinains by Arabs?
Hint: King Hussein.
In short, the Jews who survived the betrayal and brutality of WWII Europe do not need to apologize to anyone for returning to Israel. (P.S. You might want to give the Palestinians a few tips on what the words “cease fire” mean…)
December 30th, 2006 at 5:39 pmDear Traitors - (those who wish GWB were in Saddam’s noose) - I hear the noble Iraqi “freedom fighters” have openings for “human shields”….tools.
December 30th, 2006 at 5:43 pmIn short, the Jews who survived the betrayal and brutality of WWII Europe do not need to apologize to anyone for returning to Israel
Spoken like a true supporter of the Civil Rights Movement.
Good on ya!
December 30th, 2006 at 5:46 pmTimothy McVeigh was held in contempt, disgust and anger by 98.9% of Christians, unlike the percentages of sympathetic Muslims who danced in the streets after 9/11. (This is not to say ALL Muslims despise the West. Most of those who don’t despise us moved here.)
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 5:39 pm
How did you come up with the Christian percentage for McViegh and what percentage of Muslims danced in the streets after 9/11?
December 30th, 2006 at 5:50 pmDear Traitors - (those who wish GWB were in Saddam’s noose) - I hear the noble Iraqi “freedom fighters†have openings for “human shieldsâ€â€¦.tools.
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 5:43 pm
There are openings for human targets in Iraq. Why don’t you sign up for the position instead of letting all those Iraqis die for freedom?
December 30th, 2006 at 5:58 pmhas anybody noticed Mighty A’s style/voice has changed? It’s as if someone else has hijacked the name….
December 30th, 2006 at 5:59 pmDear Nat - Take it upon yourself to do a little research. Watch the film, “Obsession: …” This compilation of info is a miniscule portion of the information the film makers gathered regarding the various attitudes of Islamists. Now….go back to news archives and find the expose’s of the throngs of McVeigh/Nichols sympathizers…..I hope this helps….
You’re welcome.
December 30th, 2006 at 6:04 pmlets just say, “alot of active duty members of the armed forces is at least upset with the administration’s handling of this crisis”. They really know that Iraq is out of hand.
December 30th, 2006 at 6:11 pmsaddam’s dead, so lets go home! Now!
No more death!
Only oil for the “fortune”ETTE.
Dear Nat - Take it upon yourself to do a little research. Watch the film, “Obsession: …†This compilation of info is a miniscule portion of the information the film makers gathered regarding the various attitudes of Islamists. Now….go back to news archives and find the expose’s of the throngs of McVeigh/Nichols sympathizers…..I hope this helps….
You’re welcome.
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 6:04 pm
The percentage of Christians who approved of McVeigh’s actions is the same as the percentage of Muslims who approved of the 9/11 attacks. One percent or less of the 1.3 billions Muslims worldwide ascribe to something similar to the Zawahiri or bin Laden’s ideology.
You’re Welcome.
December 30th, 2006 at 6:15 pmIt’s called the power of observation….you need to keep up a little better.
No rationale then. Your personal, subjective, bigotted, “observation” is the only reason. As I suspected.
Timothy McVeigh was held in contempt, disgust and anger by 98.9% of Christians, unlike the percentages of sympathetic Muslims who danced in the streets after 9/11. (This is not to say ALL Muslims despise the West. Most of those who don’t despise us moved here.)
What? You mean you claim that more then 16.5 million people (100%-98.9%=1.1% of 1.5 billion followers of Islam) danced in the streets on 9/11? Where was that gigantic Carnival happening?! Do you have any factual corroboration of this? And if not so, the same logic you just presented to “excuse” fundie Christianity, applies to Islam. A handle of “Pretzel Logic” is far more apt for you then your current one.
Before Palestine was “occupied†by the Jews, please name the last “Palestinian†President, Sheik, or King.
It was occupied by Jews since most of those who reside there now, used to reside somewhere else, mostly Europe and USA. That is the very definition of “occupation”.
Also the fact that the Palestinian Arabs were under one time or another “assigned” by the British colonial authorities to some artificially shaped kingdom of Transjordan or Egypt, changes not the fact that they resided in Palestine for many generations, alongside a small (proportionally) Jewish population. Following which they were brutally expelled, driven or indtimidated out of their ancestral homes by the incoming Zionists from Europe and wherever. That is the very definition of “ethnic clensing” which was applied to the Balkans.
Please explain the abandonment and slaughter of Palestinains by Arabs?
Again, this has no bearing on the point, which is the activities of the Zionists. The fact that the “king” of Transjordan was also busy trying to keep the tide of Palestinians being driven out by Zionists from upsetting his rule in no way lessens the responsiblity of Zionists for their actions, which were the original cause of the whole upheaval. The fact that someone else murdered a person in some city, does not absolve another criminal in the same city of the same crime. They are simply both guilty. So is with King Hussain and the Zionists. They are both guilty of persecuting the Palestinian Arabs, in different ways. Note however that the Palestinians settled (mostlty) their grievances with Jordan as that kingdom ceased their warfare with them. Not so with the Zionists who continue to expand their holdings and treat the Arabs as prisoners of a concentration camp.
In short, the Jews who survived the betrayal and brutality of WWII Europe do not need to apologize to anyone for returning to Israel.
Yes they do. To those on whom they sprung their betrayal and brutality of Zionist warfare. The fact that at one time you were a victim of one gang of thugs does not give you carte blanche license to perpetrate the same kind of crime on others. Otherwise the Jews have simply sunk to near the depths of the Nazis.
(P.S. You might want to give the Palestinians a few tips on what the words “cease fire†mean…)
Sure, that means that one side stops shooting as promised while the other also stops “targetted assasinations”, ceases building settlements, stops engaging in land grabs and allows some freedom to the inmates of the Gaza and West Bank concentration camps as they promised. Oops.
December 30th, 2006 at 6:18 pmYou GOT to see this if You have not already!
http://www.bushflash.com/swf/thanks.swf
Digging deeper even though I know You guys are way
ahead of me but:
The 15 slave states at the time of the Civil War were Alabama, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, and Virginia (including West Virginia). (The District of Columbia also had slavery prior to the Civil War.) The last northern state to abolish slavery was New Jersey in 1804, although the laws of that state retained slaves over a certain age as “apprentices for life” until the 13th Amendment.
Wikipedia
Those are basically the people we have to be grateful to, for the desastrous past six years with the known consequences.
December 30th, 2006 at 6:20 pmWith Saddam Hussein we hanged a guy that always tried to
please the United States. He was a faithful and loyal buddy
and we ‘allowed’ him to go to Kuwait. When he did that I
knew it was his biggest mistake. The biggest mistake is to
trust the United States Of America. It’s nothing new, it goes
on ever since The United States declared its Independence.
Democrats in the House and in the Senate warrant common sense and protect the good values America stands for. As for a Democratic President with a republican Congress and Senate, well we all know how that worked out. The Slave States will always cheat. They are the cheaters in this world.
They always cheat because cheating is neccessary to get them what they want. Everything. Everything.
Nat, DieNowforPeace, FactsOnly…
I know we all like to bash MA from time to time, in fact its pretty funny that she never ever answers to important issues and only comes up with the Islamo-whacko 5 y/o words to prove his/her point; therefore she is not here to argue.
I would encourage you to ignore him/her no matter how easy is to expose her ignorance.
December 30th, 2006 at 6:21 pmDear FO - Thank you for dancing around the FACT there has never been a nation of Palestine… And to think you wasted all that “productive-time’ typing…..Toooo precious!
December 30th, 2006 at 6:23 pmDear FO - What is your opinion of the demanded Palestinian prisoner release?
December 30th, 2006 at 6:25 pmItsjustKarma…great link!
December 30th, 2006 at 6:34 pmDear FO - Thank you for dancing around the FACT there has never been a nation of Palestine… And to think you wasted all that “productive-time’ typing…..Toooo precious!
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 6:23 pm
Israel was artificially created; we’ve applied that standard to the Palestinian territories.
December 30th, 2006 at 6:35 pmoh! i forgot nat’s posts also…
December 30th, 2006 at 6:41 pmso sorry…
“I hope for New Years that you get run over by a truck and taste your own blood before you die.” Comment by Spudge_Boy
*****Dear Sponge Cake - you should visit the http://www.religionofpeace.org website homepage to see the worldwide instances of Islamo-wackery on display. You seem to have adopted the bloodthirstiness of the most radical Islamo-wack….such a shame…..
The only truck likely to run me over on New Years is one of my kids Tonka trucks….and I’m not TOOOOO worried about that.
December 30th, 2006 at 6:52 pmI would encourage you to ignore him/her no matter how easy is to expose her ignorance.
Comment by Juan C — December 30, 2006 @ 6:21 pm
well, my comment at #132 made no sense - because the first part of it did not post… i’ll try again:
normally i would agree juan (oh - now i know why - i asked, where did bt****ful go?)…
but the rebuttals by factsonly and nat have been most insightful and educational for me….
that’s the kind of replies that i appreciate…
hope i didn’t just open a can of worms…
December 30th, 2006 at 6:53 pmThank you for dancing around the FACT there has never been a nation of Palestine… And to think you wasted all that “productive-time’ typing…..Toooo precious!
No there was not, at least not by that name. Neither there was a state of Israel till not so long ago. Or Jordan for that matter. Or Iraq. Your point?
You mean that the Arabs living in the area of what used to be the “mandate of Palestine” are therefore not entitled to their own self-determination because of …? Their “islamofascist” status? They are “not quite human”? What is the excuse?
December 30th, 2006 at 7:02 pmDear FO - What is your opinion of the demanded Palestinian prisoner release?
Which prisoner release? Demanded by whom? When?
There are tens of thousands of Palestinians in Israeli jails and there were so many demands for release of some of them by one group or another that I have no idea which one you are referring to.
December 30th, 2006 at 7:05 pmWhat mean, FO, is there are plenty of Arab/Muslim countries for “Palestinians” to live. (It is interesting to note that the only thing other Arabs appreciate about Palestinains is their usefulness as anti-Jew tools.) There are not scads of other Jewish oriented countries…..
December 30th, 2006 at 7:08 pmOOooops …in #138 “What I mean…”
December 30th, 2006 at 7:10 pm“Which prisoner release? Demanded by whom? When?” - FO
**** The thousands of prisoners the “Palestinians” are demanding Israeli’s release. Of course your loving friends from Hezbollah and Hamas haven’t brought up the topic of the three kidnapped Israeli soldiers…
December 30th, 2006 at 7:13 pmIraq veterans against the war, the Vietnam Veterans Against the War supports you.
December 30th, 2006 at 7:14 pmWhat mean, FO, is there are plenty of Arab/Muslim countries for “Palestinians†to live.
This pretzel logic can be applied to Israeli Jews, who are for the most part Europeans, Americans or Russians. They are as welcomed in those respective locations as are the Palestinians in other Arab countries. Ponder that.
Having said this, if the process of creation of Israel was governed by some sanity, an extensive effort could have been made to entice the local Arab population to relocate via combination of hefty financial incentives, cunning international dipliomacy, economic aid, co-operation between religious and political leaders and what not. But the Arabs were not even deemed worthy to be consulted as to their fate by the partitioning powers, never you mind concentrated effort to affect the partitioning in a manner which does not disenfranchise them. They were simply assumed to be like cattle which will obidiently move when prodded sufficiently.
And so the whole world has been paying for this bit of astronomical arrogance and stupidity ever since.
December 30th, 2006 at 7:21 pmFO - Would you have any information on the progress Palestinians have made in Gaza since the israeli pull-out? Whatever happened to the billions of $$$ Mr. and Mrs. Arafat looted from the aid given to “Palestine”?
When it gets right down to it - Golda Meir had it right, “There will only be peace when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us.”
December 30th, 2006 at 7:26 pmThe thousands of prisoners the “Palestinians†are demanding Israeli’s release.
Israel will have to eventually let go those and all the other Palestinians it presently imprisons, be it in high-security compounds on in the open-air concentration camps of West Bank and Gaza. Either that, or finally make a full circle of destiny and setup fake showers fed with Cyclone gas to solve its “Palestinian problem”.
Of course your loving friends from Hezbollah and Hamas haven’t brought up the topic of the three kidnapped Israeli soldiers…
Listen to yourself: on one hand there is three Israeli soldiers and on the other tens of thousands of militants, politicians, activists, civilians, family members and who not Israel deemed fit to imprison. And you are trying to equivocate?
I am sure that the release of the Israeli soldiers can be negotiated. On what terms, that for Hizbullah and Israel to settle, not me.
Also I have no friends in Hizbullah. I don’t even personally know any members of that group, nor any other Arab organisation. You are making assumptions again.
December 30th, 2006 at 7:31 pmhope i didn’t just open a can of worms…
Comment by katy
I agree. Nat´s response was very informative, katy.
December 30th, 2006 at 7:38 pmWhatever happened to the billions of $$$ Mr. and Mrs. Arafat looted from the aid given to “Palestine�
Most of what remains is in Israeli banks, where all “aid” to Palestine is deposited first. Some was stolen, some embezzled, much likely funds Mossad activities. Arafat’s hopelessly corrupt regime is a topic completely independent of all of your other meandering attempts at “justifications” for your hate of “Islamonistofascistofeminazis” which you espouse so vehemently.
When it gets right down to it - Golda Meir had it right, “There will only be peace when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us.â€
Well, since Israel continues to be chiefly responsibe for abysmal fate of Palestinian children, the love of Palestinian parents is likely to result in hate of Israel. The greater the love, the greater the hate for the fate of the children. Ergo Golda Meir’s “prediction”, like those very similiar ones of his South African White Afrikaner soulmates, is likely to do its racist damage as intended.
December 30th, 2006 at 7:42 pmWhen it gets right down to it - Golda Meir had it right, “There will only be peace when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us.â€
Comment by mighty aphrodite — December 30, 2006 @ 7:26 pm
There will never have peace because both groups believe they have a divine right to the land. You cannot argue with people who think their position is backed by God.
December 30th, 2006 at 7:47 pmExplain the difference between Yaser Arafat taking money from his people and George W Bush and Dick Cheney taking money form their people?
Not to forget the numerous corruption and embezzlement (plus bonus: sex) scandals in the Israeli government over the years.
December 30th, 2006 at 7:54 pmThere will never have peace because both groups believe they have a divine right to the land. You cannot argue with people who think their position is backed by God.
I am sure there are sizeable groups with this lunatic attitude on both sides, but most of the inhabitants still retains a more pragmatic approach. They simply want justice, freedom, peace and prospetrity.
However longer this situation persists, specially if it involves deepening economic hardship and hopelessness for the Palestinians, easier it is for fringe religious wackos to get to the younger generations of the futureless disenfranchised. That’s how Hamas came to be. And it is only going to get worse.
Frankly, I think Israel as a Jewish state is doomed. It will either have to engage in some really despicable activities (such as official enslavement or even outright mass gassing of Arabs - actions resulting in world-wide embargoes and intense global hostility) or the Jews will lose control, since the nominally “citizen” Arab population within its borders grows at a rate which will result in the demographics of Israel changing irretrievably in just a few decates.
December 30th, 2006 at 8:04 pmHowever longer this situation persists, specially if it involves deepening economic hardship and hopelessness for the Palestinians, easier it is for fringe religious wackos to get to the younger generations of the futureless disenfranchised. That’s how Hamas came to be. And it is only going to get worse.
Comment by FactsOnly — December 30, 2006 @ 8:04 pm
After Israel destroyed major infrastructure in Lebanon a few months ago, Hezbollah was the first group to offer assistance to the Lebanese people and start rebuilding. Because of the inaction of Israel and America more people have turned to Hezbollah. Will we ever learn?
December 30th, 2006 at 8:20 pm[…] For the rest of the story see: http://thinkprogres…12/30/military-poll/ […]
December 30th, 2006 at 8:48 pm“Now, he is in the garbage of history,†said Jawad Abdul-Aziz, who lost his father, three brothers and 22 cousins in the reprisal killings that followed a botched 1982 assassination attempt against Saddam in the Shiite town of Dujail.
“Ali Hamza, a 30-year-old university professor, said he went outside to shoot his gun into the air after he learned of Saddam’s death.
“Now all the victims’ families will be happy because Saddam got his just sentence,†said Hamza, who lives in Diwaniyah, a Shiite town 80 miles south of Baghdad.”
Yes, Juan, they are well informed.
December 30th, 2006 at 10:26 pmIsn’t it strange that those backward Iraqis smack each other with shoes and celebrate by firing guns into the air. A pretty primitive species of humanity, in the least.
December 30th, 2006 at 11:17 pmI don’t think anyone reads this, but oh well, I’ll try:
You really need to see that there is a problem in this country when half of the people believe one thing and the other half believe the opposite. This reflexes a huge confusion we have. How can it be possible that there is a 50/50, right down the middle, on important, life threating issues? If your society is so fouled up, that you can’t figure right from wrong at any given time, about any given subject, then what makes you think your world isn’t completely fouled up? Nothing is the answer. The most likely situation is you have 50% of people who are educated and can see and cognise very basic things, and the other half are crooked and sick and very very stupid. Yet if your making choices as a group, and function as a group, you can’t go 50% South and 50% North–think of America as a single individual, you can’t go 50% South and 50% North as a single individual. So what you will have in a democracy, if you make a decision, it will be 50% this way and 50% that way, and it balances out and you go no where. Your in limbo. You don’t go anywhere. And this is my point about America or any other nation. And if this kind of directionless idiocy goes on for hundreds or thousands of year, what the hell do you think you’ve been doing all this time?
When will the time come when the smart overtake the stupid, or to put it another way, when will the wise overtake the fools? I suspect that a illness runs through humankind where the idiots will always reassert itself. Something’s got to give. There is something extremely extremely wrong with this.
December 30th, 2006 at 11:19 pmYour a Psychopath mighty aphrodite. I will make sure everyone knows it to.
December 30th, 2006 at 11:22 pm