ThinkFast: January 5, 2007
ThinkFast: January 5, 2007
Senate Foreign Relations Chairman Joe Biden (D-DE) said yesterday that he believes top officials in the Bush administration — “maybe even including the vice president” — have “privately concluded they have lost Iraq and are simply trying to postpone disaster so the next president will ‘be the guy landing helicopters inside the Green Zone, taking people off the roof,’ in a chaotic withdrawal reminiscent of Vietnam.”
The expected replacement of Gen. John Abizaid with Navy Admiral William Fallon to oversee the Iraq war “reflects a greater emphasis on countering Iranian power, a mission that relies heavily on naval forces and combat airpower to project American influence in the Persian Gulf,” the New York Times report.
In its first legislative act, the 110th Congress voted 430-1 yesterday to approve “the broadest ethics and lobbying revision since the Watergate era.” Today, the House will vote on a package to end anonymous sponsorship of earmarks.
Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman “fired the head of the department’s nuclear weapons program on Thursday, citing a series of security failures at national laboratories, including the discovery of a computer device containing thousands of classified documents in the home of a former worker during a drug raid by the police.”
Yesterday, Rep. Keith Ellison (D-MN) not only introduced himself to Rep. Virgil Goode (R-VA), but also asked him out for coffee. “By reaching out to Congressman Goode I’m not trying to be accepted, I’m trying to build bridges. In this world there are too many misunderstandings. I want to put a human face on things,” explained Ellison.
With Zalmay Khalilzad headed to the United Nations, President Bush plans to appoint career diplomat Ryan Crocker to be U.S. Ambassador to Iraq. Crocker is currently U.S. Ambassador to Pakistan, and is “among the State Department’s most respected voices in the Middle East,” the New York Times reports.
“New Orleans repeats mistakes as it rebuilds. … [W]hile new federal guidelines call for raising houses to reduce the damage of future floods, most returning homeowners do not have to comply or are finding ways around the costly requirement, according to city officials.”
And finally: Yesterday, Sen. Harry Reid’s (D-NV) ascension to Majority Leader was almost overshadowed by former President Bill Clinton’s quest for a bathroom. Minutes before Reid was to be sworn in, Clinton “sauntered into the Senate press gallery in search of a urinal. Reporters swarmed, some abandoning their seats in the chamber. … ‘They told me the closest restroom was in the press gallery,’ Clinton explained.”
What did we miss? Let us know in the comments section.
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In its first legislative act, the 110th Congress voted 430-1 yesterday to approve “the broadest ethics and lobbying revision since the Watergate era.†Today, the House will vote on a package to end anonymous sponsorship of earmarks.
Nice start, guys, but I'm still reserving judgment until I see what you plan to do about Iraq spending.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:09 amEllison is just a stand up guy. end of story... Virgil just comes off as a racist pompus ass... not suprising considering the district he represents. You couldnt PAY me to drive through South VA
January 5th, 2007 at 9:10 am"Yesterday, Rep. Keith Ellison (D-MN) not only introduced himself to Rep. Virgil Goode (R-VA), but also asked him out for coffee."
How will he sit down with the spade-shaped tail? How will he drink coffee with those terrible fangs? Aren't muslims horrible demons?
Thank you Rep. Ellison for reminding people that most of our divisions are a matter of choice, and that people who persist in seeing barriers and differences are isolating themselves, not others.
Coffee chat ftw!
January 5th, 2007 at 9:13 am"In its first legislative act, the 110th Congress voted 430-1 yesterday to approve “the broadest ethics and lobbying revision since the Watergate era.†Today, the House will vote on a package to end anonymous sponsorship of earmarks."
I just thought it would be interesting to hear more from the Washington Post about yesterday's first day of the House:
"But (speaker) Pelosi herself acknowledged that her carefully constructed consensus agenda will not satisfy the angry electorate that swept the Democrats to power. Democrats will have to confront President Bush on the larger, more controversial issues of the day: the war in Iraq, military tribunals that suspend the legal rights of terrorism suspects, and warrantless wiretapping by the National Security Agency.
Her call yesterday for a new direction in Iraq "that allows us to responsibly redeploy American forces" elicited strong applause in her party while clearly splitting Republicans, many of whom joined the ovation."
Now, THAT'S what everyone wants to know about! (Especially some posters here at TP!) Will we bring all ourt troops home, or should we start to look at the mess we've made of Afghanistan? We were against the taliban, but we don't seem to give a second thought to them as they regain power from our distraction in Iraq.
Personally, I think that if we screw up in Afghanistan (Again!) then we've abdicated our responsibility to tell any nation how to conduct a Democratic society. If we don't put-up, we should just shut up.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:14 amSorry Trip, Iraq was not important enough for the first 100 hours.
Hil,
January 5th, 2007 at 9:15 amI agree that Ellison is a class act. But if we are to give him a pass for things he has supported in the past, then we need to give it to everyone else.
In its first legislative act, the 110th Congress voted 430-1 yesterday to approve “the broadest ethics and lobbying revision since the Watergate era.â€
How many times do they have to pass legislation that "reforms" ethics rules before they actually get to a point where a lying scumbag has no choice but to act in an ethical manner? It's a shame that elected officials just can't act ethically on their own. But I guess when the cookie jar is the US tax revenue it seems awfully tempting.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:18 am#5 - 'But if we are to give him a pass for things he has supported in the past, then we need to give it to everyone else." Comment by robert — January 5, 2007 @ 9:15 am
I agree. If we can forgive Ex-Rep. Tom DeLay actively supporting the senile Ex-Rep. Strom Thurmond's racist agenda (that he never apologized for in any manner whatsoever) then we can forgive more of the Republican racist, misogynistic, homophopic, xenophobic rantings and ravings.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:21 amThe people of Minnesota are lucky indeed. Man--that Ellison has class don't he? I think you in Minnesota made a GREAT CHOICE.
Representative Ellison has my respect and admiration. It takes a BIG MAN to do what he is doing. Many of us would like to deck Goode instead. I know I would.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:23 amYesterday, Sen. Harry Reid’s (D-NV) ascension to Majority Leader was almost overshadowed by former President Bill Clinton’s quest for a bathroom.
Oh the power of Clinton. That man could sneeze while aliens landed in DC and reporters would be huddled around him. Thats what you get from a good (not even great) president....a legacy. Bush can only dream.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:26 amBut if we are to give him a pass for things he has supported in the past, then we need to give it to everyone else. --Comment by robert
What are the "things" Ellison has supported in the past?
January 5th, 2007 at 9:28 amUmmm...Nation of Islam. You know, the group that refers to whites as "the blue eyed devil". The group that championed a seperate nation for blacks. Those guys.
I am glad that Ellison appears to have moved past that.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:31 am#5
Forgiveness is not on the menue at the coffee shop, Robert. The things Virgil said about Ellison are unforgivable IMO. maybe Ellison has a larger capacity for compasion than I do... or perhaps its not about forgiveness... but about teaching, relating as people, NOT as issues or religions.
maybe its about moving the hell on with it already.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:34 am#10,
I think Robert was talking about the 'things' Goode did. ie What he said to Ellison
January 5th, 2007 at 9:36 am#11 - "I am glad that Ellison appears to have moved past that."
Comment by robert — January 5, 2007 @ 9:31 am
Yeah, I sure wish that Ex-Rep. Strom Thurmond could have brought himself to apologize for his racist past, but he never did. I guess that was asking too much of him to do while he was alive.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:36 am#11. Interesting. I'm guessing you're a Republican and, as such, would not want to spend a whole lot of time pointing fingers at groups with arguably racist views. Pot, meet kettle. Cites: Strom Thurmond, Trent Lott, David Duke, etc., etc.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:37 am#11 Ok Robert apparently I read your first statement incorrectly... because what you are ACTUALLY saying is just so f*cking ridiculous.
Ummm…Nation of Islam. You know, the group that refers to whites as “the blue eyed devilâ€.
What decade are you living in dude?
January 5th, 2007 at 9:38 amIf forgiveness is not on the menu, then you would agree if someone did not forgive Ellison for his past mistakes.
Personally, I would like to see Goode apologize for his bonehead comments, like Ellison has apologized in the past for his affiliations.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:40 amVirgil Goode's gotta be loving this week... first, he learns Jefferson owned a Koran, next he shakes hands with Ellison, and finally, he learns that Bush just appointed a Muslim as ambassador to the UN.
Trifecta, much?
January 5th, 2007 at 9:40 amrobert,
So everyone in the Nation of Islam believes that rhetoric? That's like saying that everyone at the Christian Coalition believes and follows everything that nutjob Pat Robertson says. Praying fo rthe deaths of Supreme Court Justices, nuking the State Department and this stroke of genius....
To see Americans become followers of Islam is nothing short of insanity.... The Islamic people, the Arabs, were the ones who captured Africans, put them in slavery, and sent them to America as slaves. Why would the people in America want to embrace the religion of slavers.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:45 am-- Pat Robertson, quoted from the American Muslim Council press release
#17
Dude,what mistakes... Specifically... are you talking about?!
What did Ellison personally do to Goode that warrents an apology?
January 5th, 2007 at 9:45 amYeah, I sure wish that Ex-Rep. Strom Thurmond could have brought himself to apologize for his racist past, but he never did. I guess that was asking too much of him to do while he was alive
So do I.
And You Thought REAGAN Was Stupid,
You kow what, I do not support those individuals that support racism
What decade are you living in dude?
Comment by hil
Again, I say that Ellison had the good taste and sense to apologize for mistakes he had in the past.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:47 am#17 - Robert, I can agree with you that apologizing for mistakes is a sign of good leadership.
I guess the difference is that some political figures look at apologies for their mistakes as being less then resolute or "flip flopping".
When one enters politics, their past becomes an open target and everything they've ever done becomes a possible liability. If they are unable to look at their past actions and apologize for mistakes, what makes them think they can apologize for mistakes they make now or in the future?
Something I've noticed is that the longer one posts on TP the more likely they are willing to consider anothers point of view. Even if it's one they originally disagreed with! I guess that familiarity with people makes it easier to understand their opinion.
I hope you had a good holdiay (Christmas and New Year), and I wish you luck this year!
January 5th, 2007 at 9:48 am#19
IAWTC!
Ones religious affiliation doesn't override one's personal behavior. to suggest that shows just what a sheep Robert is.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:49 amdlet, #19, Did Ellison not DIRECTLY back and DEFEND Farrakhan?
Then he supported what Farrakhan said.
January 5th, 2007 at 9:50 amIf we can forgive Ex-Rep. Tom DeLay actively supporting the senile Ex-Rep. Strom Thurmond’s racist agenda (that he never apologized for in any manner whatsoever) then we can forgive more of the Republican racist, misogynistic, homophopic, xenophobic rantings and ravings.
Comment by Democrat Soldier
I'm appalled at you, Democrat Soldier. No wonder Jason and aphrodite get upset here reading the posts of the middle-roaders and anti-right bunch. Inflamitory statements, provocative and anti-Republican rants just to name a few things that piss trolls off. And your post above is a good example of someone whose statement needs to be edited for inflamitory content and corrected. So allow me:
I believe "homophopic" is spelled "homophobic".
January 5th, 2007 at 9:54 amIn its first legislative act, the 110th Congress voted 430-1 yesterday to approve “the broadest ethics and lobbying revision since the Watergate era.†Today, the House will vote on a package to end anonymous sponsorship of earmarks.
Dear Lobbyists,
In two years, when I'm looking for a job, remember who was there for you.
Regards,
January 5th, 2007 at 9:54 amRep. Dan Burton (R-IN)
"the discovery of a computer device containing thousands of classified documents in the home of a former worker during a drug raid by the police."??
...
...
Words fail me.
Rep. Keith Ellison, IMO, is one of the smartest men in congress.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:00 amSenate Foreign Relations Chairman Joe Biden (D-DE) said yesterday that he believes top officials in the Bush administration — “maybe even including the vice president†— have “privately concluded they have lost Iraq and are simply trying to postpone disaster so the next president will ‘be the guy landing helicopters inside the Green Zone, taking people off the roof,’ in a chaotic withdrawal reminiscent of Vietnam.â€
You mean that big-ass citidel will be a waste of my taxpayer money? Jeez.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:01 am#25
January 5th, 2007 at 10:02 amLOL!
And finally: Yesterday, Sen. Harry Reid’s (D-NV) ascension to Majority Leader was almost overshadowed by former President Bill Clinton’s quest for a bathroom. Minutes before Reid was to be sworn in, Clinton “sauntered into the Senate press gallery in search of a urinal. Reporters swarmed, some abandoning their seats in the chamber. … ‘They told me the closest restroom was in the press gallery,’ Clinton explained.â€
I still like Bubba too. Reid got what he deserved for being a wet noodle all this time.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:02 amhil,
READ WHAT IS TYPED
GOODE owes ELLISON (and the country) an apology.
ELLISON has, in the past, apologized for his support of Nation of Islam and Farrakhan. Here, this is from Wiki:
In Ellison's letter, he denounced the Nation of Islam and Farrakhan, writing "I wrongly dismissed concerns that they [Farrakhan's remarks] were anti-Semitic. They were and are anti-Semitic and I should have come to that conclusion earlier than I did."[65] He explained his previous views, saying that he, "did not adequately scrutinize the positions and statements of the Nation of Islam, Lous Farrakhan, and Khalid Muhammed"[60].
It is not about religious affiliation, it is about supporting a philosophy of hatred. ELLISON has learned and apologized and does not appear to be supporting that philosophy any more.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:03 amHere are a couple of letters to the editor from the Danville Register & Bee, 061231: I fiund very little in any of the major newspapers regarding Mr. Goode's comments but this is what I beleive are consistent with Mr. Goode's constituency, after all he was elected.©Danville register&Bee.
To the editor:
Thank you, Virgil Goode! There’s no need to apologize for speaking the truth.
This controversy is not a slap in the face against Muslims, but what Rep.-elect Ellison wants to do is against the United States. If he wants to represent our country, then he should put his hand on the Bible to take his oath of office.
One letter’s writer recently asked, “Don’t you believe in freedom of religion?†Oh yes, we do. This is America, and what you do at your church or home is entirely your business. But what you do representing our country is our business.
If we had more of elected officials with the backbone of Virgil Goode, we would be having fewer immigration problems.
Stand up for what you believe in. Have you already forgotten about God being taken out of our schools? If you don’t take a stand now, you had better learn a few more languages, because we will soon be in the minority.
FAITH HYLER
Danville
To the editor:
Glory to my congressman, Virgil Goode. He is a man of character who has the backbone to stand up for America. He is a true American who has the guts to save American values. I applaud him on his stand on illegal immigration.
America may be a land of immigrants, but legal immigrants came here because they wanted some of what we had - not to change us and our way of life. American tradition has no meaning to the foreigners who are trying to take over and change the United States of America.
Trust Muslims? Never! Change to pacify one Muslim? Never! The meaning of Islam is trouble. And throw in the illegal Mexicans also.
Save America. Stay American. Stand your ground, Mr. Goode.
DANNY YATES
January 5th, 2007 at 10:03 amDanville
Nice one Joe.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:03 amrobert,
Does this satisfy your scruples test?
"If you're going to latch on to a very strong, but racist, movement, you have to be sure to explain why that happened so people in the community know why that happened so they know that you really have changed," Weiss says.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:06 amEllison is trying to do just that.
"My ideas about Minister Farrakhan have changed in a number of important ways," he now says.
Ellison says he favored Louis Farrakhan's teachings on certain subjects, like black self sufficiency and personal responsibility. He says his law-school writings and other activities were independent of any outside groups. Ellison says his only interaction with the Nation of Islam was for 18 months during the mid-1990s when he worked with the group to organize Minnesotans to attend the Million Man March. Ellison says he hasn't had any involvement with the group since that time and has never been a member of the organization.
He says he was wrong to dismiss concerns about the group's anti-Ssemitic views and has learned to scrutinize the groups with which he works.
"Human beings are complex, we evolve," he says. "We ought to let each other evolve. We ought to let each other be better than they were today. If someone is the same as they were 16 years ago, that would be the very definition of stuck in a rut, wouldn't it?"
In an attempt to alleviate concerns about his background, Ellison wrote a letter to the Jewish Community Relations Council and has been speaking at synagogues to emphasize his work on civil rights issues.
Joe Biden and pushing off the end of the Iraq War to anyone other than this administration
One simple thing that the Democrats could do is FORCE Bush to give Congress updates on the progress of the war. This was something that has already been passed and Bush, with the approval of the 109th Congress, simply ignored.
Every time the administration would have to go before Congress and admit that there is no progress would simply be a reinforcement of this disaster and hold the administration accountable. I'm fairly certain it would also help drum up further support to ending this war.
Wouldn't take a lot to do and would benefit the Democrats tremendously.
I don't see a down side.
Anyone else?
January 5th, 2007 at 10:08 am#8 freebird9
The people of Minnesota are lucky indeed. Man–that Ellison has class don’t he? I think you in Minnesota made a GREAT CHOICE.
That's the kind of decency that Wellstone brought to Washington, too. I hope it's contagious.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:08 amI can tell the trolls that post here are getting more scared every day.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:08 am430-1
Does anyone happen to know who the "1" was?
January 5th, 2007 at 10:08 amBush has settled on a new policy:
PURGE AND SURGE.
Purge the military of all dissent, surge the number of US troops killed.
Mission accomplished.
-GSD
January 5th, 2007 at 10:09 amSo Bush and Cheney are just biding time until the next President takes over? What great leaders we have!
January 5th, 2007 at 10:14 amdlet,
Read, think, then react. We are all guilty of not doing it at times.
Has Ellison in the past supported Farrakhan and NOI?
Yes.
Did he defend Farrakhan by writing papers stating that Farrakhan was not anti-semitic?
Yes.
Has he since, learned and retracted his support?
Yes.
Should people get past that and show forgivness?
Yes.
Should that only be applied to Ellison/blacks/Muslims/Democrats?
NO! Everyone f*&ks up at somoe point in their life.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:15 amhalbert,
January 5th, 2007 at 10:15 amNice way to connect Ellison to Hitler. Here's some more logic for you...Hitler is dead.
Senate Foreign Relations Chairman Joe Biden (D-DE) said yesterday that he believes top officials in the Bush administration have “privately concluded they have lost Iraq and are simply trying to postpone disaster so the next president will ‘be the guy landing helicopters inside the Green Zone
Commonly known as 'externalizing' and junior's admin. is well practiced.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:16 amAdolf Hitler is dead, not that it stopped the republicans from trotting out the corpse of strom thurmond on close votes.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:17 amhalbert holmert
Don't get confused. I support Ellison in the round.
I fight against the hypocracy of some the think forgivness only goes to those they agree with.
It is easy to forgive friends, hard to forgive and enemy.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:19 ammargaret,
January 5th, 2007 at 10:21 amDan Burton from Indiana
#40, the one dissenting is Burton from Indiana (a Republican, naturally). Here's the roll call: http://clerk.house.gov/cgi-bin/vote.asp?year=2007&rollnumber=7
January 5th, 2007 at 10:22 amIt is easy to forgive friends, hard to forgive and enemy.
Should read
It is easy to forgive friends, hard to forgive an enemy.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:22 am#32 robert
It is not about religious affiliation, it is about supporting a philosophy of hatred. ELLISON has learned and apologized and does not appear to be supporting that philosophy any more.
We have our share of right-wing trolls that post here, but robert isn't one of them. He asks serious questions and he's a reasoning and reasonable individual. There's no need to blast him.
It's not necessary that everyone agree with me or my side of an issue, as long as they're willing to discuss it in a civil way and be open to the possibility that they might be wrong or might have overlooked something, as I would be. Robert doesn't agree with a lot of the things posted here, but he's obviously open-minded and reasonable. I'd like to see him treated accordingly.
halbert holmert, on the other hand...
January 5th, 2007 at 10:23 amSTUPID
Comment by halbert holmert
poopy head
January 5th, 2007 at 10:23 amWhen does college resume Halbert?
January 5th, 2007 at 10:24 amIn its first legislative act, the 110th Congress voted 430-1 yesterday to approve “the broadest ethics and lobbying revision since the Watergate era.†Today, the House will vote on a package to end anonymous sponsorship of earmarks.
So we need to be keeping an eye on the hold-out: Rep. Dan Burton (R-Ind.)
January 5th, 2007 at 10:25 amhalbert:
I have a few suggestions for you:
1. Don't type in all caps. It makes you look like a moron.
2. Write grammatically correct sentences. Failing to do so makes you look like a moron.
3. Try to have a cogent thought before rushing to the keyboard. Failing to do so, again, makes you look like a moron.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:25 amHere's what I stand for:
"halbert holmert" refuses to forgive people for past mistakes.
Based on "halbert holmert's" logic, ANYONE who makes ANY mistake should NEVER be forgiven, no matter how many times they apologize and make amends for their mistakes.
Therefore, since "halbert holmert" has questioned the ability for any progressive to have any standard, and has been proven completely wrong, "halbert holmert" should just shut his/her/its face and stop posting lies.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:25 am#54 - Robert, we all make mistakes! ;-)
I've done it myself, fat-fingering the keyboard as I was typing.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:27 amOr forgetting to spell check my posts.
Somewhat embarrassing, but never a show stopper.
"There is nothing a United States Senate can do to stop a president from conducting his war," Biden said. "
Bulls...t. There are TWO things the Senate (and House) can do. Stop funding the war and/or impeachment.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:29 am#33 fly-man
I agree with those readers that we should stick to our American traditions. Let's go back to the tradition of not having any mention of "God" on our currency, and let's go back to that time-honored custom of respecting the separation of Church and State. Ever since this country started breaking down the wall between the two, things have gone to hell, figuratively speaking.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:30 amYesterday, Rep. Keith Ellison (D-MN) not only introduced himself to Rep. Virgil Goode (R-VA), but also asked him out for coffee. “By reaching out to Congressman Goode I’m not trying to be accepted, I’m trying to build bridges. In this world there are too many misunderstandings. I want to put a human face on things,†explained Ellison.
Oh, to be a fly on the wall during that coffee klatch -- if it happens.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:33 amYou know, the group that refers to whites as “the blue eyed devilâ€.
Comment by robert
yeah, cuz its not like white men enslaved millions of african people, killed millions of indians to take their lands, killed 37 millions of russians, 6 millions of jews, etc...just sayin...
January 5th, 2007 at 10:36 amHalbert,
The short bus is here. Strap on your helmut, grab your Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles lunchbox and have a greeeaaaat day.
-GSD
January 5th, 2007 at 10:37 amI always wonder how someone such as Goode gets elected and continues to be elected.
At the same time, I remember Jessie Helms, the good old senator from North Carolina.
After a while you begin to think that it's something in the water down south.
Then we get McCarthy and realize that the north isn't impervious to stupidity.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:43 amDid halbert holmert just called STUPID a poster?
January 5th, 2007 at 10:44 amNow, thats ironic.
robert, would you forgive Stalin, Hitler or Queen Victoria (greatest drug dealer of all times)?
Its not about pardon. Lets get the religious crap out of the way for once. Its about justice.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:47 amchimpeach,
Thanks
January 5th, 2007 at 10:49 amrobert - while I agree with you that we should forgive mistakes made in the past for those who apologize for them, who on the republican side has apologized for their mistakes?
January 5th, 2007 at 10:49 amIn every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Horatio G. Spafford, March 17, 1814
January 5th, 2007 at 10:52 am...who on the republican side has apologized for their mistakes?
Comment by Jules
Jules, please! What mistakes!?
January 5th, 2007 at 10:53 amHalbert Holmert, the most valuable article I found on the link to the World Net Daily that you posted is the one below. The rest is all just rants and fear mongering. Obviously very appealing to one of your doubtful intellect or ethical/moral guidelines.
SPECIAL OFFER
January 5th, 2007 at 10:55 amNo plunger? No problem
Secret to unplugging your toilet
--BottomLineSecrets
Joe Biden is right...It came from the mouth of Bush himself when he stated in a press conference few months ago that "Iraq war will be for presidents after me to worry about" So, all of this Iraqi problem will be left to whoever takes over as president in 2008
January 5th, 2007 at 10:56 amJules, please! What mistakes!?
Comment by Zooey — January 5, 2007 @ 10:53 am
I consider their presence on this earth a mistake!
January 5th, 2007 at 10:56 amyeah, cuz its not like white men enslaved millions of african people, killed millions of indians to take their lands, killed 37 millions of russians, 6 millions of jews, etc…just sayin…
Comment by Juan C
So, all white men are evil? Don't think so.
robert, would you forgive Stalin, Hitler or Queen Victoria (greatest drug dealer of all times)?
Its not about pardon. Lets get the religious crap out of the way for once. Its about justice.
Comment by Juan C
Are all "crimes" equal? First, Goode may have been stupid, irrational, bigoted, and disgustin. But he did not commit a crime. You are talking about people that committed criminal acts.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:57 amNow that Harriet Miers has resigned, I'm curious about something. I hope those trained in legal matters can help. Just how far does the attorney-client privilege go? I understand that an attorney cannot be compelled to tell anyone what the client said (under most circumstances, but not if the information can specifically stop a crime), but can the attorney be compelled to answer questions about the advice given? Put another way, can Harriet Miers be compelled to answer under oath what advice she gave to the president regarding some of these legal matters that will be the subject of Congressional hearings? I mean, what if she told him he could safely ignore Congress? Is that information protected? She doesn't have to say what the president said back to her, just what she said to him was legal and what wasn't. I'm curious to know why he acts like he doesn't have to obey the law. Who's been telling hiim this? Who's been telling him signing statements are a way around the intent of Congress? Miers?
January 5th, 2007 at 10:58 amRocket (uh, I mean Halbert), it sounds like you have been spending too much time hanging out at Powerline.
January 5th, 2007 at 10:58 amI consider their presence on this earth a mistake!
Comment by Jules
Pffftt! Clinton!
January 5th, 2007 at 10:59 am62, the Senate can neither stop funding the war nor start impeachment proceedings. That authority lies with the House.
January 5th, 2007 at 11:02 am…who on the republican side has apologized for their mistakes?
Comment by Jules
I have said before and I will say it again, I think those like Goode should apologize.
January 5th, 2007 at 11:02 amPffftt! Clinton!
Comment by Zooey — January 5, 2007 @ 10:59 am
I so wish he could run again. That is what pisses the repugnuts off so much. If he were to run again he would be re-elected in a landslide. Bush would be lucky to fall in third!!
January 5th, 2007 at 11:06 am#78 - Wayne.
I'd be interested in the answer to that also.
There is something else that might come into play in this also.
As I understand it, and I welcome being corrected, the President could also play another game with the attorney general and other lawyers.
There's an issue about a lawyer giving their client advice that somehow can mitigate their legal expsoure. It was explained to me that it was a tactic that some of the mafioso would use in their trials.
January 5th, 2007 at 11:06 am#78 - Wayne
Federal Rules of Evidence
Article V. Privileges
Rule 501. General Rule
Except as otherwise required by the Constitution of the United States or provided by Act of Congress or in rules prescribed by the Supreme Court pursuant to statutory authority, the privilege of a witness, person, government, State, or political subdivision thereof shall be governed by the principles of the common law as they may be interpreted by the courts of the United States in the light of reason and experience. However, in civil actions and proceedings, with respect to an element of a claim or defense as to which State law supplies the rule of decision, the privilege of a witness, person, government, State, or political subdivision thereof shall be determined in accordance with State law.
Also see this:
January 5th, 2007 at 11:07 amhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attorney/client_privilege
I posted this a few days ago on another part of TP, but found it quite prophetic.
Let me see if I have this right?
Dubya wants to send more troops to try to support a leader who doesn’t want the job? Why does this confuse me?
Next thing, we will be seeing helicopters lifting the last US citizens (and the rich Iraqis) from the Green Zone HQ. Sound familiar, anyone????
Comment by upside00 — January 3, 2007 @ 1:09 pm
January 5th, 2007 at 11:14 amWayne - the client holds the privelege not the attorney.
Meirs would only be reqiured to testify about their conversations if she were part of the criminal conspiracy - ie she assisted in furthering it, or if she knew about a future crime to be committed. It is very difficult to prove whether or not the attorney was a part of the conspiracy without knowledge of the conversations, and you will not have knowledge of the conversations without a waiver of privlelge. That is unless there are wire taps used to record the conversations. - This is how the AG in NY got John Gotti's lawyer removed.
January 5th, 2007 at 11:15 amThank goodness for Jules!
I can find 'em, but I don't interpret 'em. Might pop a vein...
January 5th, 2007 at 11:22 amI thought the SCOTUS already ruled that the AG is not an attorney to the President and therefore there is no privelege? Wasn't that back during Watergate?
Even if it has not been decided I can see an arguement for no privelege. It has been ruled that the General Counsel for a corporation is not an attorney for the employees, including management, but the attorney for the corporation. Therefore there is no privelege attached to conversations between employees of the corporation and GC. The AG is the attorney for the US and not the president so privelege should not apply.
January 5th, 2007 at 11:33 amRobert should apologize and will apologiize are two entirely different things. I personally think when there is public pressure to apologize, that it becomes more of a stunt than an apology.
January 5th, 2007 at 11:41 amJules,
Harriet Meirs is White House counsel, isn't that GWB's attorney? So privilege applies?
I agree AG Gonzales, even though he talks like he's GWB's attorney, is the attorney for the people. No privilege between him and GWB.
January 5th, 2007 at 11:48 amI love it when the rules to protect corporations come back and bite these guys in the butt!
January 5th, 2007 at 11:49 amThe privelge SHOULD apply to Meirs. I seriously doubt the SC, especially this current SC, would see it any other way.
January 5th, 2007 at 11:54 amGood Morning all, sorry, off topic....Zooey, where's BnF..? ...Cold wind's here and headed you're way I think.....Global change in full force against our coast this year....Blessings
January 5th, 2007 at 12:06 pmThis applies to yesterday's Think Fast, sorry:
Why Alaska's natives are facing a rapidly changing world alone
January 5th, 2007 at 12:10 pmOut in the cold
Sharon - it is supposed to be 65 here today and 49 tomorrow. This disproves Global Warming right? After all, it will be cold tomorrow!
January 5th, 2007 at 12:10 pmZooey, where’s BnF..? …Cold wind’s here and headed you’re way I think…..Global change in full force against our coast this year….Blessings
Comment by Sharon Cox
Good morning, Sharon. We got enough cold wind and snow yesterday, just snow would be fine.
Briseadh na Faire is gone. He just couldn't stand the way things are being run around here anymore. We've had a lot of legal questions the last couple days, and I wish he was here to weigh in. Maybe TP will get things fixed, and he'll come back.
January 5th, 2007 at 12:21 pmThe first Muslim member of Congress is linked to a radical Islamic school of thought that requires loyalty to the Quran over the U.S. Constitution, WND has learned.
World Nut Daily is nothing but propaganda Halbert, much like that Rag site Wizbang. Ellis swore to uphold the Constitution.
Now Halbert tell me who called the constitution a GD piece of paper?
January 5th, 2007 at 12:23 pm2. Write grammatically correct sentences. Failing to do so makes you look like a moron.
But I worked so hard to purfect my intertubes moronity and to goad the pasty aspergers!!
January 5th, 2007 at 12:36 pmhalbert - repeating your bull sh*t does not make you any less an idiot!!
January 5th, 2007 at 12:42 pmHalbert is such a typical fear-mongering troll. He repeats his crap garnered from the right-wing racists at every turn. He makes Virg Goode ol' Boy and Tommy "Miami-is-a-third-world" Tancredo look almost normal.
And is always changing his/her handle.
January 5th, 2007 at 12:47 pmActually Halbert Isa (Jesus) is mentioned in the Koran many times and is viewed as a Messiah. Again all these religions are Abrahamic.(Ibrahamic)
Of course, the word “God†does not actually appear in the original Hebrew or Greek manuscripts of the Bible, accepted as Holy by both Christians and Muslims. “God†is an old English word which developed from an Indo-European word, meaning “that which is invoked,†which is also the ancestor of the German word Gott (meaning: God).
Book: Building Bridges.
The Navigators, a well-known evangelical Christian organization, published the following:
“…It’s interesting to observe that, in rejecting the Athenian’s erroneous concept of God, Paul did not reject the word they used for God, Theos, which was the common Greek word for God.
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/quran-jesus.html
Halbert, it's confused people like you who are making an issue out of nothing.
January 5th, 2007 at 12:55 pmBack at ya Zooey, What happened this time.?..Many of us have been having continued problem's with this site...Altho I do like the poster's and appreciate the link's sometimes the problem's with the TP site out weigh the gain's and I also bail..And then there is alway's the deleted post's and no response when question's are asked as to why when one is blocked......
Thank's for the link Die for Peace.
Jules, where do you live.?....I'll give you a soggy 45 degree for you're 65, wanna trade...How about a 32 this a.m. and wind's to gust to 45 mph....LOL...Time for this old woman to move back to Montana......Blessings all and sorry for being off topic..
January 5th, 2007 at 12:57 pmIsouV ChristoV and Theos all mighty Halbert, let the man do his job before you start your reactionary and uninformed rants.
January 5th, 2007 at 12:59 pmYour talking to a Christian who believes in God Halbert. One of the few here.
January 5th, 2007 at 1:00 pmSharon - I currently live in Dallas Texas. My husband and I would like to move to Oregon as soon as we can. My daughter graduates from HS in May and we are fixing up the house to sell.
The weather may be gloomy up in the Northwest, but the politics warms my heart!!!
January 5th, 2007 at 1:02 pmSharon,
I think he was just completely frustrated with the deletions and no explanations. It seems like no troll EVER has a problem getting deleted unless we email Judd complaining. Look at the crap hal holmert is putting up. See it disappearing? I'm going to keep him posted on improvements, if TP even lets us know about them, and I have hope he'll come back.
January 5th, 2007 at 1:06 pm104.
nalichinowrunforthehillslikeyourcowardlydemocraticprogressivecurdogbuddiesdowhenconfrontedwithbasisinfactsyouhurlinsultsandiwilljuststoptypingnowicanseeiamwastingmytimeonyou
Comment by halbert holmert — January 5, 2007 @ 12:56 pm
105.
Back at ya Zooey, What happened this time.?..Many of us have been having continued problem’s with this site…Altho I do like the poster’s and appreciate the link’s sometimes the problem’s with the TP site out weigh the gain’s and I also bail..And then there is alway’s the deleted post’s and no response when question’s are asked as to why when one is blocked……
Thank’s for the link Die for Peace.
Jules, where do you live.?….I’ll give you a soggy 45 degree for you’re 65, wanna trade…How about a 32 this a.m. and wind’s to gust to 45 mph….LOL…Time for this old woman to move back to Montana……Blessings all and sorry for being off topic..
Comment by Sharon Cox — January 5, 2007 @ 12:57 pm
106.
zepitepi
no use trying to cover your lying ass now go joiny ourfriends nalichi and the other atheists and get outta my sight you went right along with the sinners blasphemeing jesus so now you can sleepin your own bed now that you have made it.
Actually I have been Baptised Halbert, and my father was a Catholic. Not to mention that I am a blue eyed white male And trust me on this one Pal, I have been brought before GOD already =)
Comment by halbert holmert — January 5, 2007 @ 12:58 pm
January 5th, 2007 at 1:07 pmHal just learned a new HTML trick.
January 5th, 2007 at 1:07 pmIt is not about religious affiliation, it is about supporting a philosophy of hatred.
It seems to me you have much Hatred Halbert, even towards a fellow Christian?
My My, What a blasphemer you are. May God smile upon your hate.
January 5th, 2007 at 1:08 pmnalichi now run for the hills like your cowardly democratic progressive curdog buddies do when confronted with basis in facts you hurl insults and i will just stop typing now i can see i am wasting my time on you.
Comment by halbert holmert — January 5, 2007 @ 12:56 pm
Actually I am sovereign, as the Lord is, and I am not a Democrat. And speaking of Hurling insults I have hurled none. You on thr other hand have judged me without knowing anything of my beliefs. You have judged wrongly Halbert. Now please start acting like a real Christian.
January 5th, 2007 at 1:15 pmBut if we are to give him a pass for things he has supported in the past, then we need to give it to everyone else.
Comment by robert — January 5, 2007 @ 9:15 am
You yourself have posted information relevant to Ellison's acknowledgement of his mistakes, and his disavowal of the Nation of Islam and Farrakhan. I think he has explained his former position and retracted his previous statements rather gracefully. How is accepting his expressions of regret giving Ellison "a pass"?
I would gladly accept anyone's retraction if I thought they were sincere; although conservatives/neocons/Republicans and assorted Christian "moral leaders" still have many things to apologise for -like calling for the assassination of foreign heads of state, and making many a bigoted, racist statement.
Accepting a heart-felt apology is not giving anyone a "pass".
January 5th, 2007 at 1:21 pmHobart:
The same condemnations could be made about those who adhere to the Torah and the Pat Robertson take on Christianity-- straight down the line. But, it gets even worse if you look into the Talmud, much worse. If this nation had followed the teachings of Islam, instead of the Pharisees of the Right, we wouldn't have 47 million people without access to health care and we most certainly wouldn't be subjugated to this abominable corporate welfare state such as we are. I'll take Ellison over Goode without any apologies over past alliances. If you had better than a quarter-wit of your own, you'd do the same thing.
January 5th, 2007 at 1:31 pmNow Halbert if I have insulted you, I apologize.
Are you a able to do the same for what you have said?
January 5th, 2007 at 1:32 pmSurely, I thought, Hal had offed himself after seeing Ellison with the Ko-ran!!!
See silly person, it's not the end of the World, but hopefully, the end of the World as YOU KNOW IT.
January 5th, 2007 at 1:57 pmSH*T! Now he's posting "in Tongues". (#104 HAL -not related to HAL9000).
Freakin' hilarious. Dude, you're a RIOT!
January 5th, 2007 at 2:00 pmThank's for the response Zooey and Jules.....
Oregon, Wash. and Idaho are beautiful states but I prefer Montana....Altho it is predominately Republican (old style) not neo-con I love the open spaces and being able to see forever, without the population the people there for the most part are not just kind but also very caring toward's their neighbor's...Polatics take a back seat to family, state, neighbor's and relegion and more war's are started and ended over water right's than anything else...National problem's are considered but in a situation of -30 degrees, wind at 40 MPH and wind chill to -70 during some winters, survival and caring about one's self and neighbor's becomes a bigger issue...This old transplant's heart will alway's be there and hopefuly the rest of me will be as well.....
It appear's we have some new named troll's, sure wish they would change their racest, hatred speel....Guess they didn't get the memo from their reich winged bosses that they lost the last election....Oh Well! I can scroll real well.......Blessings
January 5th, 2007 at 2:05 pmSharon,
Montana tugs at my heart, too. So beautiful and more sheep than people. Always a plus. Like you say, the winters are harsh, but the benefits would probably outweigh that factor. *sigh*
January 5th, 2007 at 2:13 pmMy Big Sky mud flap's await a diffren't truck to put them on.....One more year is all I am going to wait....The coming spring, summer and fall is dedicated to my give away time here, light travel is my goal.....
Zooey, on another thread there was mention of a tour to DC, what's with that.? For real or just for fun....Blessings
January 5th, 2007 at 2:26 pmSharon,
Isn't it great just pulling up stakes and heading to somewhere new? I've done it several times in my adult life, and even though it can be hard, it's a great thing to do.
Yeah, the roadtrip to DC. It started out that I was taking Rogerx2 to DC so Nancy Pelosi could kick the crap out of him with her brand-new ass-kicking boots. Then RUCerious, ForTruth, and katy volunteered to help out, so it has become quite the trip. Heh. My car is getting so crowded Rogerx2 is gonna end up in the trunk. Whatever...
January 5th, 2007 at 2:32 pm...and i will just stop typing now i can see i am wasting my time on you.
Comment by halbert holmert — January 5, 2007 @ 12:56 pm
An early birthday present? You shouldn't have!
January 5th, 2007 at 2:38 pmI feel that Keith Ellison has the right to his religion and he should be left alone about it.
As far as Virgil Goode is concerned, he should apologize to the country for what he said.
January 8th, 2007 at 1:02 amThe United States has caused more problems in the world than any other country has.
All the problems in the world are caused directly or indirectly by the United States.
The U.S. launched an imperialist war against Afghanistan and Iraq. The U.S. is also funding Israel's wars against Lebanon and the Palestinians.
It was the U.S. that turned Vietnam into a bloodbath.
It was the U.S. that nuked Nagasaki and Hiroshima in August, 1945.
It was the U.S. that illegally invaded Panama in 1989.
The U.S. bombed Libya for no reason in 1986 and murdered President Qadhafi's 2-year old daughter.
There are so many crimes against humanity that the U.S. has caused that it would take days to list.
The U.S. is the enemy of all humanity.
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