Congress can check Bush on escalation.
By on Jan 8th, 2007 at 8:10 pm
Congress can check Bush on escalation.
So says legal experts Marty Lederman (Georgetown University professor) and Neil Kinkopf (President Clinton’s former constitutional advisor), as well as House Defense Appropriations Chairman Jack Murtha (D-PA). Watch it:
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I'm really curious........this is directed at the core group here....RUcurious......Zooey......Wayne.......etc. Do any of you feel that today we are sort of at a real....as never before....tipping point regarding the madness of our government? I kind of have this sense......strong sense....that this is "it." By this I mean, either the American people really wake up now and push back hard in the next weeks....or I don't know what.
January 8th, 2007 at 8:27 pmAnyone know the answer to this?
If Congress can authorize a president to go to war, can't it -- equally --revoke authorization?
January 8th, 2007 at 8:32 pmCongress can check Bush on escalation.
well, then, DO IT!
s - if only a portion of the american people knew of only a portion of what people like up know, then i would think that, yes, there would be a "push back"... but, as it is, the information that would illuminate the justification for such a reaction is just not out there...
it is disheartening to see the ignorance and even apathy...
January 8th, 2007 at 8:38 pmmost people are just too comfortable and unaffected...
...
Do you mean Joe Biden didn't know what he was talking about?
Go figure...
January 8th, 2007 at 8:42 pmdamn - people like u s know ... of course...
January 8th, 2007 at 8:44 pmThanks Katy. But really, I'm not so sure. The next weeks will tell, but I have a funny feeling the popcorn is going to start popping in the American populace in the next weeks. We'll see if I'm nuts or on to something. I think something is in the air and it's not the smell in NY..thought that is involved. It's that the people are tired, angry, and I think we're going to see a very haggard and crazed looking Bush Wed. eve. Also, this is interesting ( see below) . I believe that even if Bush can over ride Congress cutting off funds, they need to do it to make it crystal clear to everyone what this madman is about. I think Congress knows this...so the political angle is very important....Here's the link:
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003529196
January 8th, 2007 at 8:45 pmMurtha was clear, precise, and just plain right in his convictions and arguments with clear subtext that the The Idiot-In-Chief does not know what the word 'consultation' means.
Thank goodness we have people like Jack Murtha !
January 8th, 2007 at 8:53 pmIn the meantime, it seems like Pres Bush is on his own in this escalation:
Tony Blair will make clear this week that Britain is not going to send more troops to Iraq even if the US pushes ahead with a "surge" of 20,000 extra soldiers.
Blair refuses to match US troop 'surge' in Iraq
And the likely new PM in Britain is not giving very good signs as far as following Pres Bush's lead is concerned:
Brown acknowledged that mistakes were made in the aftermath of the invasion and promised to be "very frank" with U.S. President George W. Bush. He also said that Britain is likely to scale down its commitment of troops to Iraq over the next year — even as the White House is considering dispatching thousands more, at least temporarily.
Britain's Brown says as PM he wouldn't shy away from criticizing the White House
Britain was the only real close ally the US had left in Iraq, and British troops are the second largest contingent -after the Americans. Without them, the US will be really hard-pressed to control Iraq. Maybe that's why Pres Bush is pushing for a "surge"?
January 8th, 2007 at 9:07 pmSURGE======ESCALATION
Escalation is the phenomenon of something getting more intense step by step, for example a quarrel, or, notably, military presence and nuclear armament during the Cold War. (Compare to escalator, a device that lifts something to a higher level.) The term is said to be originally coined by Herman Kahn.
In psychology it is a change in behaviour, usually from stable or acceptable towards unstable or unacceptable.
January 8th, 2007 at 9:11 pmIsn't there like some sort of legal stuff lawyers can read, and see if Congress can check the Prez? Oh yeah, The Constitution.
January 8th, 2007 at 9:12 pmSo what's the new Congress doing about it all today? We'd love to help you out on that, but we can't, because after a fairly busy week, the U.S. House of Representatives decided to take the day off, apparently because so many members wanted to go to tonight's college football championship game in Arizona.
Good thing there is new leadership in there and the do nothing take all the time off group is out.
January 8th, 2007 at 9:13 pmBoyda (D-KS) sez Congress can't check the prez. Heh.
January 8th, 2007 at 9:15 pmBy this I mean, either the American people really wake up now and push back hard in the next weeks….or I don’t know what.
Comment by s
It's my feeling that if we don't check this "president" on this issue NOW, we might as well roll over and let him continuing f*cking us.
January 8th, 2007 at 9:27 pmI sent this to MediaMatters: mm-tips@mediamatters.org
CNN political ticker blog is claiming false division between Democrat leadership:
I think that CNN is trying to create disagreement between Pelosi and
Reid where there is none regarding talk of blocking funds for
escalation in Iraq. She said, originally, that she would not block
funds for troops already in Iraq. Reid is saying the same thing. CNN
is twisting things. Guess that's what the new CNN blog is for.
link:
January 8th, 2007 at 9:36 pmhttp://www.cnn.com/POLITICS/blogs/politicalticker/2007/01/pelosi-dems-will-not-cut-off-iraq.html
It’s my feeling that if we don’t check this “president†on this issue NOW, we might as well roll over and let him continuing f*cking us.
Just like they "Checked" some Florida republican who wanted to go watch a football game during their first 100 hours? Instead of saying "go, we will all be voting here", they said "Heck yeah that sounds like a great idea, can I go too"
January 8th, 2007 at 9:42 pmTundra,
Nice to see you, it's been a while.
I don't know anything about this football game, and frankly I don't give a flying flip about it. I guess you're just thrilled with the performance of the 109th?
I'm talking about this "president" and the issue of escalation.
We can play "Yeah, But" all night, but that's the only issue I'm addressing in that comment. M'Kay?
January 8th, 2007 at 9:49 pmCheck this president? Oh Mommy, make it stop. W. can do pretty much whatever he wants.
January 8th, 2007 at 9:50 pmContrary to an Internet report, (Drudge) Republicans in the House of Representatives asked for a day off less than one week into the 110th Congress, RAW STORY has learned. The Democratic leadership consented, and no action is scheduled on the House floor today.
Where is Sappy, urr, Happy Guy when you need him?
January 8th, 2007 at 9:55 pmThe only thing that will stop Bush is impeachment. It can't come soon enough. Bush is a sociopath, and lately has gone completely off the rails. This country and the world have entered a time of grave danger.
January 8th, 2007 at 9:56 pmCheck this president? Oh Mommy, make it stop. W. can do pretty much whatever he wants.
Comment by Badmoodman
Well by all means, let's do nothing.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:00 pmBesides denying the go-ahead for the escalation, Congress should also familiarize itself with Article I Section 8, which states that, among other things, that Congress has the power "To raise and support Armies..." Instead of allowing Bush to do what he wants in Iraq, which is resulting in the needless casualties of thousands of American troops, Congress should do its job by cutting off the funding for this very unnecessary occupation in Iraq.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:00 pmThe US Congress must cut off the funding for the Iraq occupation, and bring the troops home ASAP, or the American people must demand that the entire Congress resigns with Bush and Cheney! If our elected leaders refuse to heed the will of the American citizenry, then the DC government is no longer legitimate!
January 8th, 2007 at 10:01 pmHopefully, the Democrats will step up to the plate and put a stop to this madness.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:01 pmWhere is Sappy, urr, Happy Guy when you need him?
Comment by Tau
So that's the story about the 4 day week this week? Typical wingnut shit flinging.
Happy Dude won't return for anything as silly as facts.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:02 pmWith Bush's big escalation speech imminent, perhaps the Republicans asked for a day off to meet in secret to discuss what to do about the "Bush problem".
January 8th, 2007 at 10:02 pmDear Laura Bush, please do one for the team, the truck's ready and full of gas, I'll leave the key in the ignition tonight....You're country need's you're help, hell, bet they will even give you a medal..We will call it a mercy thingie..
January 8th, 2007 at 10:06 pmHappy Dude won’t return for anything as silly as facts.
Comment by Zooey — January 8, 2007 @ 10:02 pm
Happy Guy exhibits one of the classic attributes of the professional liar: when caught he moves on to the next subject without looking back.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:07 pm#27 - VerbalKint,
And apparently without the blink of an eye.
He needs his mouth washed out with Lava soap.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:12 pmIn 1964, Congress passed the Tonkin Gulf resolution, repealed in 1968 if memory serves. In 1973 Congress cut off funding for combat operations in SE Asia. Fast forward to today. It can be done again, if people raise hell with Congress.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:14 pm
Rep. Nancy Boyda ( D - Kansas ) says Bush is Commander - In Chief and Congress is powerless to do anything about ending it .. Ms Boyda is one of those Kansas GOP'ers who recently have switched to the Democrats. She is still, at heart, a Republican. A wolf in sheep's clothing !
January 8th, 2007 at 10:16 pmYa know what? Give it up! There is nothing that can be done within the system. You want freedom and honesty in Government? You better be ready to die for it. It's too late to change anything. We have NO "representatives" within our government. It's time to break out the original Declaration of Independence. No sense in writing a new one. This one fits.
Peace!
January 8th, 2007 at 10:24 pmPJ
Bush does not need congress anymore for anything .
Comment by rachel b — January 8, 2007 @ 10:24 pm
Another utterly ridiculous statement from the right-wing lunatic fringe.
The US is a representative democracy, not an absolute monarchy. The president cannot do away with Congress.
Be careful what you wish for .
You are the one wishing for an absolute monarchy, so I'd say you need to heed your own advice.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:39 pmPres Bush can never go to far for the followers of his personality cult.
"All hail the Leader!"
January 8th, 2007 at 10:41 pmImpeacheness is such a nice word, first cheney and immediately after bull shit bush.....Blessings
January 8th, 2007 at 10:48 pmJust like they “Checked†some Florida republican who wanted to go watch a football game during their first 100 hours? Instead of saying “go, we will all be voting hereâ€, they said “Heck yeah that sounds like a great idea, can I go tooâ€
Comment by Tundra
Umm that has been debunked.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:51 pmYeh, the GrOPers wanted the day off and the Democrats consented. Really, we have the lamest lemmings here.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:54 pmYeh, the GrOPers wanted the day off and the Democrats consented. Really, we have the lamest lemmings here.
Comment by Tau
Imagine the wingnut outcry if it had been the Dems asking the Repubs for a day off.
January 8th, 2007 at 10:57 pmThis whole thread is just preaching to the choir. The ignorant bastard in the White House can't do a damn thing is he is removed to a cell in Leavenworth. Why worry about whether or not the Congress can stop his "escalation?" The House can stop ANYTHING he does by a simple "YEA" vote on a simple question: Should we shitcan this useless SOB? The Senate can seal the deal with a simple "YEA" vote on a simple question: Should we put his dumb ass in Leavenworth for 20 years? You and I have the answer and we are guilty as charged: Preaching to the choir! A New Years Resolution: For every comment I post on TP I will make at least one other effort (petition, E-mail, telephone call, back-fence gossip, etc)
January 8th, 2007 at 11:01 pmin another circle to bring about the impeachment of bushco. Bragging a bit, I have two comments and three petition signings, three E-mails, and no back fence gossip 'cause the wind is blowing here in Arizona. And I am not biased, if Florida keeps it up Boise State will be NUMBER ONE! You can't get more grass roots democrat than that! This is America, not Greater Bushville.
Bush does not need congress anymore for anything .
Comment by rachel b
And yet the next President, probably a Democrat, will have that same authority. Let the whining begin.
January 8th, 2007 at 11:02 pmAnd I am not biased, if Florida keeps it up Boise State will be NUMBER ONE! You can’t get more grass roots democrat than that! This is America, not Greater Bushville.
Comment by Clyde the Ripper
No, not Boise State! There will no living with them....frickin' smurf turfers.
Good ideas, Clyde!
January 8th, 2007 at 11:05 pmPelosi has already stated that she won't pull funding of the troops, moreover, Hill'reh would never allow the Dems to do anything of the sort, out of fear that she wouldn't be elected President.
This is where the premature electionation of the Dems to the House and Senate will prove to be Hill'reh's worst nightmare.
January 8th, 2007 at 11:06 pmAnd yet the next President, probably a Democrat, will have that same authority. Let the whining begin.
Comment by Tau
Heh.
January 8th, 2007 at 11:07 pm"He is a unitary power President"
Why? Because he said so, that's why.
Sorry Rachel, our system just doesn't work that way. Article 1 of the Constitution deals with the legislative branch for a very good reason -- the founders thought it was the most important branch.
January 8th, 2007 at 11:17 pmI'm with Clyde, already signed a couple of patitions tonight and tomorrow will bang out some email's and letter's to representatives and will leave messages of opposition to these war's on their DC phones...Massive work on our part will get this crap stoped....Uncle Ho posted a site I am going to send a little check to tomorrow...Can't go to D.C myself but will help pay some one elses way to march....I can do the local demonstration's...We can and will demand an end to this dictatorship...Blessings
January 8th, 2007 at 11:18 pmLet's be very clear on something for the Bush cultists here. There is no writing on the part of any signer of our constitution which would serve as a basis for this "unitary executive" theory. It's fiction. It's just what they wanted to guard against. It's unamerican.
January 8th, 2007 at 11:19 pmCome on, Zooey,
Lighten up! The kids done good for a bunch "tater tots!"
In any other sport in the world, from the youngest amateur to the oldest professional league the champion is the one that loses the fewest games in the season. Not so the BSC (Bull Shit Conference); the winner is the one with the most money. Ohio State spent $40 million to win 12 and lose 1; Boise State spent $4 million to win 13 games. Which is the better business? Who should be number one?
January 8th, 2007 at 11:23 pmThank God there's some type of checks and balances up there.
January 8th, 2007 at 11:23 pmGod, if there is one, blesses you Sharon. To paraphrase Home Depot (maybe a poor choice considering the ex-CEO's bonus): We can do it. You can help!
January 8th, 2007 at 11:27 pmWho should be number one?
Comment by Clyde the Ripper
University of Idaho Vandals -- except their specialty is snatching defeat from the jaws of victory... :)
BSU :P
January 8th, 2007 at 11:27 pmZooey,
If I wasn't pissed at Dennis Erickson for leaving Seattle and Oregon State I would be on your side.
The Pac Ten should add San Diego State, Fresno State, San Jose State, Idaho, Boise State, and Nevada, Las Vegas then split into two divisions of eight teams each and alternate schedules. As it is the top teams in the nation must play each other while the east Coast Gerrymandered conferences masturbate to the Bowl games and lose their collective asses.
January 8th, 2007 at 11:34 pmIf I wasn’t pissed at Dennis Erickson for leaving Seattle and Oregon State I would be on your side.
Comment by Clyde the Ripper
Didn't you hear? Erickson dumped us, too! After 10 months, he's off to Arizona State. People here were/are sooooo pissed off.
UI is way out of our league in terms of the conference we're in, it's ridiculous.
January 8th, 2007 at 11:38 pmZooey
My apologies to you Easterners for highjacking the thread, however, see my last.
I had not heard that he was leaving. As far as I am concerned the man is a Republican. I also am disturbed to hear that he is going to ASU. The Sun Devils are up there on my list of favorites and I am not sure Erickson will be a postive influence. At one time he could have been an outstanding coach but his reach has outdistanced his grasp. Unlike DUHbya he doesn't have Daddy and the Doughboys to bail him out.
If you Easterners were able too stay sober Saturday noght long enough to watch the West Coast games you would not have been so embarassed as you were Monday and tonight. Tonight's game should have been bteween USC and Boise State and the final would have been Boise State 21. USC 20. QED
January 9th, 2007 at 12:15 amI don't apologize for my typing--it hasn't changed. I do apologize for neglecting to hit the spell check. OH WELL, I am celebrating!
January 9th, 2007 at 12:23 amLegal authority - maybe. However, they lack the cahones (still).
January 9th, 2007 at 12:25 amDo you mean Joe Biden didn’t know what he was talking about?
Go figure…
Chris Matthews mischaracterized and misquoted Biden (as you can see and hear for yourself).
But what else is new?
January 9th, 2007 at 6:07 amThis whole thread is just preaching to the choir. The ignorant bastard in the White House can’t do a damn thing is he is removed to a cell in Leavenworth.
A bit indelicate, Clyde, but I concur.
While preparing the video of Biden and Graham on MTP for uploading to YouTube (and listening to it at least a dozen times), it's obvious to me that Democrats are trying to manuveur Republicans into taking action against their own leader. Because, barring a populist movement to impeach and remove Bush and Cheney from office (state legislature by state legislature ), Democrats can't do it (stop the war or remove Bush-Cheney from office) without Republicans signing on, too.
Where the ball stands now is for we, the people, to bring extraordinary pressure to bear on Republicans (and Democrats). If the state legislature impeachments got moving again, if people hit the streets and joined their local war protest marchers (in my region, that's been every Friday from 5-7 pm, on street corners at the center of towns, since the war began in 2003), and brought friends, it might motivate Republicans to rethink their 'Bush-loyalty.'
January 9th, 2007 at 6:36 amThis whole thread is just preaching to the choir. The ignorant bastard in the White House can’t do a damn thing is he is removed to a cell in Leavenworth.
A bit indelicate, Clyde, but I concur.
While preparing the video of Biden and Graham on MTP for uploading to YouTube (and listening to it at least a dozen times), it's obvious to me that Democrats are trying to manuveur Republicans into taking action against their own leader. Because, barring a populist movement to impeach and remove Bush and Cheney from office (state legislature by state legislature ), Democrats can't do it (stop the war or remove Bush-Cheney from office) without Republicans signing on, too.
Where the ball stands now is for we, the people, to bring extraordinary pressure to bear on Republicans (and Democrats). If the state legislature impeachments got moving again, if people hit the streets and joined their local war protest marchers (in my region, that's been every Friday from 5-7 pm, on street corners at the center of towns, since the war began in 2003), and brought friends, it might motivate Republicans to rethink their 'Bush-loyalty.'
January 9th, 2007 at 6:38 am[...] Think Progress / January 9, 2007 [...]
January 9th, 2007 at 8:36 amThe Dems will pass legislation capping the number of troops, Bush will veto.
January 9th, 2007 at 9:34 amRepublicans, seeing their political death knell tolling, will override the veto.
Bush will ignore the override, probably with a signing statement.
The Congress will take it to the Supremes.
The Supremes will side with Congress.
The chymp will go ahead and do it anyway, under the Unitary Executive doctrine.
The chymp WILL be impeached.
He needs his mouth washed out with Lava soap.
Comment by Zooey — January 8, 2007 @ 10:12 pm
Are we back on the pumice theme again? ;-)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
s, I don't know about 'tipping point', but last night I realized just how angry I am over the complete politicizing of the question of troop escalation. The fact that W has put the new Democratic majority in such a position where, if they go along with increasing troop numbers, thereby increasing casualties, they're to blame. If they reduce or halt funding, or start redeploying troops elsewhere and Iraq takes that last step into all-out civil war, they're to blame. This president has put our country into a no-win situation, and the troops suffer. He and his gang of thugs are willing to sacrifice our troops for his own ego and face-saving. This should be absolutely unthinkable to any rational human being. Watching W recently, there is certainly evidence that he's getting close to his own personal tipping point, and I hope that the country both sees that, and comes to its own tipping point.
January 9th, 2007 at 9:51 amJane, it does have the RoveScum all over it, doesn't it?
January 9th, 2007 at 9:55 am#1 s -
January 9th, 2007 at 9:56 amYeah, that's my feeling, per my post #65...
#54 Clyde - Daddy and the Doughboys
January 9th, 2007 at 9:59 amThat's a peach!
or, is it an im peach?
#67--get ready, I'm going to get gross: Worse than RoveScum, it's got RoveToeJam on it! Eww!
January 9th, 2007 at 10:26 amChris Matthews is a "Right wing" hack. His question "What Democrat is against what you're saying?" He would NEVER ask a republican on his show a question like this.
January 9th, 2007 at 11:52 am