Ward Connerly: Affirmative Action Is ‘Boloney,’ People Should Just ‘Frequent The Racetrack’
Ward Connerly: Affirmative Action Is ‘Boloney,’ People Should Just ‘Frequent The Racetrack’
Ward Connerly has led the right wing’s fight against diversity in schools, pushing ballot initiatives to ban affirmative action around the nation. Earlier in the week on PRI’s To The Point radio show, Connerly said that schools don’t need to be integrated because people can find other places to “get along with others.” He then offered the racetrack as an alternate venue, noting, “I love horseracing, and I– whenever I can find the time I will frequent the racetrack, and I find myself thrown in with people from all around the globe.” Listen here:
But Connerly is missing the point. The effects of diversity in schools can’t be replicated in casual settings such as the racetrack. A recent study by the Center for American Progress concluded:
– African Americans and Hispanics learn more in integrated schools. Minorities attending integrated schools also perform better in college attendance and employment.
– Minority students who are desegregated at a younger age, in elementary school, also seem to benefit more than those desegregated later in their school careers. Three-fourths of the studies where desegregation occurred in kindergarten showed achievement gains and the effect sizes were larger than in desegregation efforts aimed at older students.
– Racial integration is a rare case where an educational policy appears to improve educational equity at little financial cost.
Read full report HERE.
(HT: Julia)
Transcript:
WARREN OLNEY: Ward Connerly, what about that? If there isn’t some mechanism for getting people to know each other early on, how are we going to have a society that is truly integrated and where there is equality for all when people grow up?
WARD CONNERLY: I love horseracing, and I– whenever I can find the time I will frequent the racetrack, and I find myself thrown in with people from all around the globe — low income people, people who own large chains of restaurants, all sitting next to each other.
People are very adaptive. We find a way to get along with others. Even when there are barriers of language, and whatever, we somehow find a way to get along and I just think it’s really nonsense. I’ve been a part of that nonsense as well as anyone, as well as others, coming out of the sixties and being an integrationist and believing that because the government had imposed segregation that somehow there were all these benefits for the government to go the other way. I now really sort of recant that view.
People are adaptive. They will find ways to get along, and this goofiness that somehow the government has to use race to pull us around here and there in order for us to learn to get along in this global society — I think it’s boloney.
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Talk about TRAITORS!
…this man HATES being “mixed” race…
…if he could kill his children to become a white man…
…they’d be dead…
January 18th, 2007 at 3:34 pmMr. Connerly’s own little puddle of consciousness equates race track to race relations………
January 18th, 2007 at 3:41 pm(he goes to the race track to have race relations…………)
Sounds like forced bus-ing is coming back, which caused “white-flight” and the collapse of inner-city economies to begin with ….
Forcing ethnic groups together without giving them choice caused a renaissance in private schooling, so I can only hope it happens again.
January 18th, 2007 at 3:43 pmJMH is a perfect example of why TP is being boycotted. He is an egotistical, self centered, racist bastard.
January 18th, 2007 at 3:50 pm“Sounds like forced bus-ing is coming back, which caused “white-flight†and the collapse of inner-city economies to begin with …. Comment by Jason M. Hendler — January 18, 2007 @ 3:43 pm”
****Dear Mr. Aspergers, thank you so much for sharing your *insight* on this matter! What exactly cause the collapse of the inner cities again? Who’s *research* are you using to come to this *brilliant* conclusion? Wasn’t the inner city collapse related to rise of the freeway systems, and the suburbs? In particular the *selling* of the american dream – that only whites seemed to typically *qualify* for economically and financially?
“Forcing ethnic groups together without giving them choice caused a renaissance in private schooling, so I can only hope it happens again. Comment by Jason M. Hendler — January 18, 2007 @ 3:43 pm”
****Thank you so much for your *brilliant* insight! It flies in the face of *conventional* wisdom, and decades of research that point to the underfunding of public schools brought on by suburban capital flight and school funding mechanisms. But I’m so glad to see you’re once again in the business of *predicting-the-future*! I was so afraid that your *embarrassing* predictions for the last election might have caused you to believe that these abilities of yours were *flawed*! But I’m *thrilled* to see that *history*, *facts* or miserable *personal-failures* haven’t stopped you from visiting your *god* powers on us all! Keep up the good work Mr. Sunshine! And thanks for all of your hatred and bigotry against the black man! Without natural born *haters* like yourself, we wouldn’t have a *con* voter base!
January 18th, 2007 at 3:51 pmHis suggestion is patently ridiculous, but I think it’s unfair to tar everyone who doesn’t support affirmative action as being anti-diversity.
January 18th, 2007 at 3:52 pmInterestingly, President Bush also used the race track as metaphor when addressing an African-American audience. Discussing private Social Security accounts at an African-American audience in January 2005, Bush said:
“Another interesting idea…is a personal savings account…which can’t be used to bet on the lottery, or a dice game, or the track.”
Details here…
January 18th, 2007 at 3:53 pmThat’s a ripoff comment from one of the British Royals or leaders. I forget who.
January 18th, 2007 at 3:55 pmChamberlain? Churchill? Something about we’re all the same when it comes to sinister behavior.
Anyone know what I’m talking about?
“His suggestion is patently ridiculous, but I think it’s unfair to tar everyone who doesn’t support affirmative action as being anti-diversity. Comment by EvilCornbread — January 18, 2007 @ 3:52 pm”
****Dear tasty treat, that’s *so-true*! Some of us just hate poor people, particularly *minority* poor people, others of we *cons* just don’t like black people specifically. Which one are you mister/miss tasty?
January 18th, 2007 at 3:56 pm“sub-urburan capital flight” was the result of “white flight”, which was driven by, among many things – forced bus-ing of white students to predominantly black schools (as well as high crime committed by predominantly black criminals).
All the information you need to see on this matter is now recorded history, so you don’t need me to research it for you.
January 18th, 2007 at 3:57 pmAlrighty then…I’m all for integration in principle, but you have to weigh it against the benifits of neiborhood schools. Forced choice (an oximorin if I ever heard one) has resulted in long bus trips, wacky school hours (my teenager leaves the house to wait for the bus before 6AM), and extreemly high transportation costs. There needs to be a better system. To call integrated schools low cost is not at all true.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:01 pm#11, Chris H.,
Liberals don’t care about costs of any kind – financial, opportunity, moral …
They want equality, even if that means we all have to suffer equally. If liberals truly wanted to raise their constituents up, they would provide vouchers to their children, so that they could choose the schools that serve them best. Instead, they are forced into poorly performing public schools (redundant, I know), which keep them dependent on welfare and the Democratic party.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:05 pmPeople who know the FACTS about AA usually support it
January 18th, 2007 at 4:05 pmLooks like we know who the next head of the Corporation for Public Broadcasting will be …
January 18th, 2007 at 4:06 pmJMH…I am a liberal…and vouchers pull money away from public schools. The schools need to be fixed (and not with all this pointless testing). Moving one student with a voucher does not fix the problem with the school. Of course, neither does taking money away from poor performing schools (another con con).
January 18th, 2007 at 4:07 pmHow well do English speakers do when placed in classes with English learners, as is the case in many public schools in CA and other states? Perhaps TP’s arguments might carry more weight if they didn’t continuously cherry-pick.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:10 pmComment by Jason M. Hendler — January 18, 2007 @ 4:05 pm
Jason, why would you want families to be able to choose their schools? You might end up with “high crime committed by predominantly black criminals” everywhere instead of just urban america.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:11 pmFamilies here are able to choose their own schools and noone likes the system. Not minorities, not whites, not rich, not poor, not the school system, and not anyone else. The choise system sux…
January 18th, 2007 at 4:15 pmCareful Jason, I can see your eyes poking through that pointy white sheet!
January 18th, 2007 at 4:15 pmTalk about TRAITORS!
…this man HATES being “mixed†race…
…if he could kill his children to become a white man…
…they’d be dead…
DO YOU REALIZE HOW STUPID THAT COMMENT MAKES YOU LOOK?
January 18th, 2007 at 4:16 pmAll governments require unified sacrifice for common goals. Taxes are a unified sacrifice and we get, in return, roads, schools, water, sanitary systems, etc, etc. JMH, this is not a Liberal or Conservative issue. The extent to which we want to provide for, and to regulate are the issues. Public Schools should be a shining jewel for every community and we should all work towards that goal.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:18 pmIf arab children and american children could somehow go to school together they wouldnt believe some religious crazy when he says that the other side are all a bunch of devils.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:25 pmI knew it. Black people, once again, are the cause of everything wrong in this country. At least we got a little break when it was the terrorist and the Mexicans.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:27 pmYes, let’s lower the age for gambling. Exposing our children to addictions as soon as possible will prepare them for a better future than wasting time learning to get along in school.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:32 pmForcing ethnic groups together without giving them choice caused a renaissance in private schooling, so I can only hope it happens again.
Comment by Jason M. Hendler — January 18, 2007 @ 3:43 pm
I agree about the forcing leads to resistance part.
I disagree that the matter has to be forced.
This story is simply a valid example of what is wrong with our country… That in the 21st century there are still many ignorant enough to actually believe that a person can be valued in terms of his or her skin color.
Therefore mixing students at an early age, when they don’t need to be forced (prejudice is a learned trait), will ensure that the sterotypes long propagated by people such as yourself are rejected by the experience that the color of one’s skin does not define a person.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:53 pmJMH is a perfect example of why TP is being boycotted. He is an egotistical, self centered, racist bastard.
Comment by Me — January 18, 2007 @ 3:50 pm
People are actually boycotting TP because they allow conservatives to post?
Good riddance.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:54 pmWithout natural born *haters* like yourself, we wouldn’t have a *con* voter base!
Comment by _am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 3:51 pm
I love your posts.
January 18th, 2007 at 4:55 pmAll the information you need to see on this matter is now recorded history, so you don’t need me to research it for you.
Comment by Jason M. Hendler — January 18, 2007 @ 3:57 pm
Considering we don’t know how to google these sorts of misinformation you claim, you’ll have to share your evidence with us…
January 18th, 2007 at 4:57 pm-my modem fried….
-no electricity, the snow storms covered up my solar panels…..
-I have a slow leak in the right rear tire……
it’s fun to be back….AAAAAAwque!
January 18th, 2007 at 5:02 pmOf course, neither does taking money away from poor performing schools (another con con).
Comment by Chris H. — January 18, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
I left Corporate America to become a high school teacher. I agree with your post. I’ll tell you why I think this partly is…
The people who run the school system have not one clue about reality. Not one. My boss routinely dumps impossible amounts of work on us all without the first clue of how much work it actually is, how long it will take, and that we have this problem that we are really there to teach and not fuel her ego and political career.
There should be greater qualifiers for who runs the system. Because right now it’s a lot of control freaks who get off on forcing students to do things they want them to do.
January 18th, 2007 at 5:03 pmIf arab children and american children could somehow go to school together they wouldnt believe some religious crazy when he says that the other side are all a bunch of devils.
Comment by Gerald Gibson Jr — January 18, 2007 @ 4:25 pm
Well said! And true.
One of my students made some homophobic comment today and when I asked him how many gay people he knew, he said none. Then what qualifies him to pass judgment on them? His preacher… Of course.
January 18th, 2007 at 5:05 pmwhy is it that we have an integrated military but not schools? The military teaches teamwork in the most difficult situations. Wouldn’t that be a good base to start from? The ability to work together?
January 18th, 2007 at 5:06 pmRepublicans love gambling, and prostitution, but they hate anything that helps minorities or the poor.
January 18th, 2007 at 5:10 pmYou know as well as Me that JMH is not a conservative. He is a neoconservative.
January 18th, 2007 at 5:57 pm“People are actually boycotting TP because they allow conservatives to post? Good riddance. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 4:54 pm”
****Dear unbeliever, people are *boycotting* TP, because they let warriors of *zion* like myself post without abatement, but my favorite Zionist Judd boycotts *libruls* that post. If they dare say anything *nasty* to me, or any other warriors of Zion, like that angel Lieberman, they get canned. Even worse, if they dare mention that september thingie, they’re toast!
I agree with you, who needs those *libruls* with an opinion of their own here? Why don’t you join me dear unbeliever, in becoming a warrior for Zion like myself and Judd are?
January 18th, 2007 at 6:10 pmYou know, Jason, “diversity” isn’t just for African Americans. As a white parent of white kids, I have a right to send my kids to a racially and culturally diverse school, too. All kids benefit from diversity, not just “minority” students. I want my kids to have African American, Latino, Asian, Jewish, and Muslim friends and classmates because it’s good for my kids to be exposed to other cultures, experiences, ideas and so forth. It helps my kids as much as it helps non-white, non-Christian, non-European kids. Everybody wins.
I live in a community that was way out in front in the open housing and school desegregation movements in the 1970’s. We are situated right on the West Side of Chicago, right next to one of the most densely populated, racially segregated, and poorest urban areas in the United States. When people like my parents started pushing open housing and desegregation, everyone said white folks would flee, the housing market would crash, the village would be taken over by … “those people”; you know the drill.
And exactly the opposite happened. The schools flourished, property values went through the roof, and now I can raise my kids in an environment that is positive, diverse, accepting and (gasp!!) tolerant of others.
So, you see, the good guys won.
Get over it.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:13 pmThose conclusions are certainly striking.
Nevertheless, I wonder what effect forced (or whatever modifier you favor) integration has on the performance of Anglo children?
Or is that a question that can’t be asked? A factor that cannot be considered?
One must assume the study did not suggest greater integration in public schools would result in Anglo children performing better, or the Center would have sung that finding from the rafters.
Wouldn’t a discussion of the neteffect of integration be a more equitable and appropriate discussion? Instead, the utility of further coerced – or court enforced – integration can be rightfully questioned. No education policy that fails to account and consider the benefit to all children, without regard to race should be seriously discussed.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:16 pmYou know as well as Me that JMH is not a conservative. He is a neoconservative.
Comment by Me — January 18, 2007 @ 5:57 pm
So? Every time he posts and we shred his argument, we strengthen our cause. He’s why we were about to win in november. Because people who were undecided were able to see us tear his arguments (talking points) apart, and instead make valid arguments based on facts and reality.
I’m against censorship of those who have a differing opinion, so as long as they don’t cross certain lines. Jason may be many things, but he has the right to his ignorant opinions, just as we have to rip them apart and strengthen our own country in the process.
So, if you’re boycotting, then why are you here posting? Isn’t that antithetical to your cause?
Personally, I’m enjoying the lack of whining about the minutia today, so thanks.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:16 pmAnd we as has already been stated are not against censorship either. We are against being called traitors, terrorist sympathizers, anti-American, etc.
JMH crosses that line everyday he posts here.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:28 pmThey want equality, even if that means we all have to suffer equally.
- JMH
OH HOHO, JMH is back i see, and in full Grand Wizard Regalia!!
if you couldn’t see his pointy white hat striving to shine through in his postings pre-november elections, gather ’round and see it now folks!!!
he comes complete with over inflated pomposity, faux intellectual certitude backed by years of internalized propaganda, masturbatory if not masochistic enjoyment in argument for the sake of argument (if only to offend even one human being who disagrees with him ie. actually has a brain not deeply interconnected with their anus), seething hatred, disdain, disrespect, and inhumanity towards people with melanin and/or the ability to communicate with other human beings in another language, and yes folks, new and improved kung fu grip!!! designed especially for fighting off all the humiliation and mental torture he no doubt suffers for having the very core of his belief system and and each and every one of his principles REJECTED in no uncertain terms by greater and GREATER and GREATER numbers of people here on this forum and across this great country every day.
I know it must eat at JMH having to beg and grovel for attention here with at TP like the spineless loathsome trolling a-hole that he is, but alas, he is only as special as the emotion he can evoke and the attention you pay him, and he obviously can’t get his hard-on without pining for the attention our outrage at his way of thinking gives him, so it’s best to just call him out for exactly what he is every time he tries to inject his cowardly, pathetic, infantile, petty, bigotry into grown folks conversation… (and by the way, JMH, you could be 9 years old or 99 years old, it still wouldn’t make you grown folk, just a whining, self-serving, scared of everything from skin color to change for the benefit of ALL society (not just your society), little titty baby)… that JMH is a who feel free to to have some fun with the aforementioned descriptions, i’m sure most, if not all are applicable. and now that this is recorded history too, JMH doesn’t need me to follow up to any response he may have either.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:30 pmWho said I am boycotting? I started reading about the boycott in the Think Fast thread from this morning. Interesting to hear what you think of your fellow posters though.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:32 pmI agree with you, who needs those *libruls* with an opinion of their own here? Why don’t you join me dear unbeliever, in becoming a warrior for Zion like myself and Judd are?
Comment by _am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 6:10 pm
If you truly believe that – then why are you still posting?
I think everyone has been having problems with the spam filter – even the trolls. But then it gets turned into some conspiracy theory? Sorry, I don’t do conspiracy theories and I am willing to give Judd the benefit of the doubt that he’s gaining momentum for TP and can’t babysit.
If you don’t like what someone is posting, then don’t read it. If you don’t like that Judd doesn’t want conspiracy theories here, then by all means, go so where else. The whining about it has grown more obnoxious than some of the lesser trolls, frankly.
I don’t care what people call themselves… If you’re going to act like a giant brat, you shouldn’t be surprised by the consequences.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:32 pmcorrection folks….
that JMH is a (please insert preferred noun/adjective/expletive here) who (does n’t have the cajones to say half the bullsh*t he spews from his keyboard within 10 feet of any black man much less person of color, unfortunate enough to have to breathe the same air as this degenerate.) feel free to to have some fun with the aforementioned descriptions, i’m sure most, if not all are applicable. and now that this is recorded history too, JMH doesn’t need me to follow up to any response he may have either.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:33 pmAnd we as has already been stated are not against censorship either. We are against being called traitors, terrorist sympathizers, anti-American, etc.
Because? It’s just words. I’d rather they call us silly names based on their ignorance and fear in here than actually go out into the world and bomb abortion clinics and the sort. Perhaps if the internet were available for everyone, we’d have more wars of words and less actual violence. Sounds like a dream to me….
JMH crosses that line everyday he posts here.
Comment by Me — January 18, 2007 @ 6:28 pm
And he gets spanked for it. Where a whole lot of people can read it… That’s a great thing.
I still don’t get why you’re here if you’re boycotting…
January 18th, 2007 at 6:36 pmInteresting to hear what you think of your fellow posters though.
Comment by Me — January 18, 2007 @ 6:32 pm
Isn’t that a neocon strawman?
I only feel this way about a select few – and they already know it. I don’t automatically like someone just because we have the same political leanings. That would make me a sheep. And I’m not terribly fond of wool….
You brought up the boycott as if you support it. If you support it why are you posting? It’s a valid question.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:40 pmTo all regular commenters:
Please be assured that we are taking aggressive action to ensure that the comment section maintains its integrity. We are aware of the problems and working very hard to fix them.
In the future, we will have a substantial upgrande of the comments section that should eliminate the problem — plans are already underway — but this can’t happen overnight. In the interim, we are exploring all options to make sure disruptions are limited.
We share your frustration. Please be patient with us as we work to solve this problem.
Comment by Judd — January 18, 2007 @ 9:58 am
See, no conspiracy! There are legitimate problems.
What is wrong with people to assume the worst in someone who has worked so hard to give them a voice?
Give the guy a break. He works on all the days we have off from work. Sheesh.
January 18th, 2007 at 6:50 pmDO YOU REALIZE HOW STUPID THAT COMMENT MAKES YOU LOOK?
Comment by michael #20
…sorry michael…
…didn’t know you could see me…
January 18th, 2007 at 6:50 pmAnd we as has already been stated are not against censorship either. We are against being called traitors, terrorist sympathizers, anti-American, etc.
JMH crosses that line everyday he posts here.
Comment by Me #39
SSHHHHH Me…
…you’re gonna get “me” …
(not you)
…banned from TP…
…and I kinda like it here…
…don’t take their ad hominem attacks so seriously…
… just remember…
…you’re trading insults with inbred imbeciles…
January 18th, 2007 at 6:59 pm“See, no conspiracy! There are legitimate problems.
What is wrong with people to assume the worst in someone who has worked so hard to give them a voice?
Give the guy a break. He works on all the days we have off from work. Sheesh. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 6:50 pm”
****Dear unbeliever, it might have something to do with people like me being able to call people names, and post unabated, while some posters have actively been *banned* for responding – specifically to me.
The *uneven* nature of banning, that almost exclusively ends up attacking *progs*, might be why some people are pissed. I’m guessing that because you haven’t been banned – you don’t care about this imbalance – and neither do I! The more *progs* that get banned – the more I can help Judd fight for *zionism*!
January 18th, 2007 at 7:00 pmi’ve been reading through the threads and comments occasionally through the day and wanted to break my “refrain from posting” to commend judd and co. on their admirable efforts to control the obnoxious troll takeover…
this is a direct result of the declaration by and insistance of many of the “regular” commenters that “ThinkProgress takes positive action against the ‘trolls’ who abuse the site in flagrant violation of the Terms of Use”…
the problem of bona fide posts being deleted may not yet have been addressed completely, but i’ve not read of any complaints about such…
i – we (i’ll take the liberty) – truly appreciate judd’s rapid response this morning to that message of frustration and aggravation with what had become an intolerable and embarrassing situation… embarrassing to be associated with the idiocy that was allowed to run rampant on this site…
so, for those who are enjoying the lack of whining today – you’re welcome…
and, judd & co., thank you very much for you extra effort today… please, please, please do not let up with this endeavor to keep TP a top rated blog site…
January 18th, 2007 at 7:00 pmso, for those who are enjoying the lack of whining today – you’re welcome…
Comment by katy — January 18, 2007 @ 7:00 pm
If you’d let me know the days you (specifically) won’t be here, I’ll be happy to note them in my calendar so I can be sure to be here.
Funny how the posts today, after you left, were on topic, relevent and there were no insane trolls. Hmmm…. If I were prone to conspiracy, I’d accuse you of being the trolls. Good thing I’m not.
Can’t even keep to your own boycott. Why am I not surprised. You’re a total hypocrite with everything else anyway.
So, when you’re ready to boycott me, I’ll return the favor. But as long as you continue to speak to or about me – I’ll remind you why your absence is valued.
January 18th, 2007 at 7:10 pmThe *uneven* nature of banning, that almost exclusively ends up attacking *progs*, might be why some people are pissed.
But that is speculative as to who actually gets banned and why. We don’t know the whole story. And I don’t like accusing people of things that I only see a small aspect of.
I’m guessing that because you haven’t been banned – you don’t care about this imbalance – and neither do I!
No, I haven’t been banned. There’s no reason. But to suggest that I support people like TerryTheTurtle being banned for posting as “Jesus” is flat out wrong. And unfair.
As for the 9/11 Conspiracy crowd – they were repeatedly warned. I don’t have sympathy for them.
MA could go and I wouldn’t miss him. But as I’ve said, without the trolls, it gets boring agreeing with one another after the first 30-50 posts…
The more *progs* that get banned – the more I can help Judd fight for *zionism*!
Comment by I_am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 7:00 pm
Now I get why you are still here.
January 18th, 2007 at 7:15 pm“But that is speculative as to who actually gets banned and why. We don’t know the whole story. And I don’t like accusing people of things that I only see a small aspect of. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 7:15 pm”
****Dear unbeliever, if only that were true. I’ve seen many *progs* get banned. They usually *wimper* briefly under another ID, until Judd gets wise and wipes out their posts. He never seems to have to time to clean out the copious quantities of a blog overloader – but as soon as one person complains they were banned – *poof*. Their content gets removed in a matter of minutes.
That’s nice that you haven’t noticed such things – but I do, and I appreciate Judd’s unwavering support! I think he’s my biggest fan!
January 18th, 2007 at 7:19 pm****Dear unbeliever, if only that were true. I’ve seen many *progs* get banned.
Who? And why? I mean, what are the facts as you see them… Because talking in hypotheticals is kinda of problematic.
They usually *wimper* briefly under another ID, until Judd gets wise and wipes out their posts. He never seems to have to time to clean out the copious quantities of a blog overloader – but as soon as one person complains they were banned – *poof*. Their content gets removed in a matter of minutes.
The ones I’ve seen do that were banned for posting 9/11 Inside Job stuff after being told not to.
That’s nice that you haven’t noticed such things – but I do, and I appreciate Judd’s unwavering support! I think he’s my biggest fan!
Comment by _am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 7:19 pm
I have noticed. I just don’t see it the same way as you do, because I agree that the 9/11 conspiracy stuff lowers the quality of this site, clogs the threads and makes people rabid. And what gives people a right to force their views on someone who has said “Don’t do it here”. It’s why we dog the trolls, after all.
I’ve also seen trolls repeatedly change their IPs – which is not Judd’s fault.
Sounds like he’s getting ready to implement site registration. That should fix the majority of the insane troll problems.
January 18th, 2007 at 7:31 pmIf you’d let me know the days you (specifically) won’t be here, I’ll be happy to note them in my calendar so I can be sure to be here.
Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 7:10 pm
I’LL NEVER LEAVE YOU AGAIN, UN !!! … I PROMISE !!!
January 18th, 2007 at 7:50 pmI’D MISS YOUR CUTE LITTLE BROWN NOSE SO MUCH! :-)
!!!!!!!! :-)
“Who? And why? I mean, what are the facts as you see them… Because talking in hypotheticals is kinda of problematic. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 7:31 pm”
****I’m glad to see you’re on my side and Judd’s. There’s no reason to talk about that pesky day in history, or the lack of proper investigation, or the fact that many materials scientists and architects actually disagree with your very valid conclusions on the matter. I agree with you, that Judd has every right to exclude whatever material he wants from the site. Interestingly enough, have you noticed how nothing we *cons* want to talk about is ban-worthy?
As for the specifics of who were banned, I suggest you ask Braid fairy, worfeus the freak, buntruthful, tripmaster primate, etc., etc. Most have either been blocked, banned, censored and not just for discussing that favorite day in history! I bet if you recall, several of your own posts *mysteriously* vanished! How many times do you recall that ever happening to one of mine? Curious isn’t it dear unbeliever!
January 18th, 2007 at 8:07 pmA strawman is something that isn’t real. You actually said it, so no strawman.
And I am not boycotting. I am discussing the boycott and pointing out that JMH is one of the reasons for it. Then you ask me why I am posting if I am boycotting, to which I respond that I am not, to which you repeat the question. Who has the hang up with strawmen?
January 18th, 2007 at 8:09 pmconcerned poster,
IP addresses are not private and you don’t own it either. Your ISP lets you use your IP address on a lease. Every website you visit knows and most likely tracks your IP address. This can be done without putting a cookie on your PC. Good luck with your lawsuit.
January 18th, 2007 at 8:13 pmI’LL NEVER LEAVE YOU AGAIN, UN !!! … I PROMISE !!!
I’D MISS YOUR CUTE LITTLE BROWN NOSE SO MUCH! :-)
!!!!!!!! :-)
Comment by katy — January 18, 2007 @ 7:50 pm
Only crazy trolls type in all acaps (screaming) and multiple exclamation points (insanity).
If you cannot differentiate between brown-nosing and loyalty, I get why you couldn’t even last a single day in your boycott. Pathetic.
January 18th, 2007 at 8:32 pm***Dear unbeliever, did you notice how my post *about* the other bloggers was just deleted (formerly #61)? But the ones from *concerned-poster* are still here? Nice work from Judd – eh?
January 18th, 2007 at 8:36 pmI bet if you recall, several of your own posts *mysteriously* vanished! How many times do you recall that ever happening to one of mine? Curious isn’t it dear unbeliever!
Comment by I_am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 8:07 pm
Not several, but a few have been eaten by the spam filter. They were usually for length.
As for the 9/11 stuff, if it upsets you so much then why not go somewhere else? It’s the constant forcing it, harrassment of those who don’t ‘believe’, and complaining about it that I really don’t get. I mean, look at this exchange for example… I disgree with you and you’ve turned belittling. I don’t respect that, because it’s not respectful of my right to form my own opinions without siding with the ‘official’ report or the alternative theory. Neither to me work. But am an architect, and I know more architects who disagree with the conspiracy theory than agree with it – as well as engineers and construction folks. Real people who live the building industry. Don’t get mad at me that ya’ll haven’t convinced me. I just don’t think either side of the issue is convincing and that the truth most likely lies in the middle. It’s your refusal to accept that I can disagree with you, like Judd, and not be labeled a host of derogatory names. Which oddly coincides with someone getting upset about a neocon calling them derogatory names. Baffling.
January 18th, 2007 at 8:41 pmBut who is to say if your every keystroke is or is not being watched and monitored by my or someone elses computer?
Comment by NOT unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:08 pm
Not me.
January 18th, 2007 at 8:42 pmA strawman is something that isn’t real. You actually said it, so no strawman.
A strawman is repeating what I said, but twisting it so it is easy to tear down.
That was not what I said.
And I am not boycotting. I am discussing the boycott and pointing out that JMH is one of the reasons for it. Then you ask me why I am posting if I am boycotting, to which I respond that I am not, to which you repeat the question. Who has the hang up with strawmen?
Comment by Me — January 18, 2007 @ 8:09 pm
I was asking you questions. Those aren’t strawmen. Strawmen are statements.
Here’s an example of a question “Why are you posting under an alias?”
January 18th, 2007 at 8:45 pm***Dear unbeliever, did you notice how my post *about* the other bloggers was just deleted (formerly #61)? But the ones from *concerned-poster* are still here? Nice work from Judd – eh?
Comment by I_am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 8:36 pm
Is it now at 56?
There was another one after 56? ‘Cause I didn’t get that far yet.
Was it about 9/11 stuff? Just a thought.
You guys have a right to your thoughts. I just don’t get why you waste the time posting them here knwoing how he feels… Why not go to a site that supports your beliefs and allows you to post there? Wouldn’t it be a win-win for all involved?
January 18th, 2007 at 8:48 pm“Not several, but a few have been eaten by the spam filter. They were usually for length. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
****Yet mine never get *eaten* or *disappear*, wonderful isn’t it? Except for the one where I just mentioned the *handles* of bloggers. It appeared, then was removed – nice huh?
“As for the 9/11 stuff, if it upsets you so much then why not go somewhere else? Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
****Hey, Judd can censor whatever he wants – he’s the *blog-god* here! I’m thrilled that the only *topics* he censors are one that embarrass us *cons*!
“It’s the constant forcing it, harrassment of those who don’t ‘believe’, and complaining about it that I really don’t get. I mean, look at this exchange for example… Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
***The only thing I believe, is that it’s really great to be a *con* like me when posting here! My stuff never goes missing, I can say whatever I want, and wow, I’m greeted like the winner that I am!
“I disgree with you and you’ve turned belittling. I don’t respect that, because it’s not respectful of my right to form my own opinions without siding with the ‘official’ report or the alternative theory. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
****I always belittle you dear, it’s because you have such a habit of thinking for yourself – which I hate, as you know. Dear unbeliever, I agree that it’s very nice to have an executive branch prepared official report that’s thin on content and concrete on conclusions. It’s also helpful to see how little investigations congress did – very useful to us!
I really hate that you can form your own opinions, and I’m happy to see how little facts are available for you to use in that opinion formation. It’s very helpful to ensure that you jump to a conclusion.
“Neither to me work. But am an architect, and I know more architects who disagree with the conspiracy theory than agree with it – as well as engineers and construction folks. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
****Well that’s great, but just because the building fell, doesn’t mean there isn’t a conspiracy. Nor does it mean there is one. Isn’t it nice to know that *I* have a more open mind than you do? But we both know that didn’t we?
“Real people who live the building industry. Don’t get mad at me that ya’ll haven’t convinced me. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
****Mad at you, dear thing, no way. But you seem to have a lot more energy on this than I do. I prefer actual dialog, of which there’s been very little real. I’m so happy that people like you are 100% convinced, because it sure makes people’s jobs much easier to avoid any real and thorough investigation to be sure!
“I just don’t think either side of the issue is convincing and that the truth most likely lies in the middle. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
****Yet dear, your conclusion is to *dismiss* anyone that doesn’t meet your definition of where that middle is. Careful, you’re starting to sound like me!
“It’s your refusal to accept that I can disagree with you, like Judd, and not be labeled a host of derogatory names. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
****You can disagree all you like, but what’s nice is that we *cons* can do it with no retribution. But if you *libruls* don’t watch yourselves, you get *banned*!
“Which oddly coincides with someone getting upset about a neocon calling them derogatory names. Baffling. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:41 pm”
****Not sure what that means dear, but it is fun when the name calling is largely one sided, isn’t it? I get to call you *progs*, commies, traitors, *koranimals*, headchoppers, whatever I like! You start fighting back – and *poof*, you’re gone!
This is *my* kind of system!
And keep closing that mind of yours – I like you *more* by the day!
January 18th, 2007 at 8:57 pm“Is it now at 56? There was another one after 56? ‘Cause I didn’t get that far yet. Was it about 9/11 stuff? Just a thought.Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:48 pm”
****Dear unbeliever, I had to mistype their names, otherwise the system at them. Isn’t that just a victory for me? I got the very mention of them removed!
“You guys have a right to your thoughts. I just don’t get why you waste the time posting them here knwoing how he feels… Why not go to a site that supports your beliefs and allows you to post there? Wouldn’t it be a win-win for all involved? Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 8:48 pm”
****I post here to help Judd with his zionism. Why those crazy *libruls* post here is a great question – why do you post here knowning Judd is a Zionist? I would imagine it’s because you believe in the ideals of progressivism, more than you believe in Judd? Or maybe it’s because you know that CAP is more than just Judd? Or maybe you hope that he’ll become reasonable someday and realize that he’s being just a wee bit of a hypocrite himself – and that he can do better? Or maybe it’s because much of what this site does do, you agree with – but like any relationship you don’t agree on everything?
Me, I’m here to make the life of you *progs*, especially you athiests an *examined* life! That’s so I can make sure my own life never gets examined!
January 18th, 2007 at 9:02 pmHey JMH, why don’t you get a clue? This is America, where everyone is supposed to be equal. Remember what the Pledge of Allegiance, “one nation…indivisible”. By having segregation, you produce inequality. Ward Connerly is a snake of the first class.
January 18th, 2007 at 9:19 pm****Yet mine never get *eaten* or *disappear*, wonderful isn’t it? Except for the one where I just mentioned the *handles* of bloggers. It appeared, then was removed – nice huh?
Actually, MA was complaining about his posts disappearing also.
I think it’s speculative to say none of his ever get deleted. You really can’t know….
****Hey, Judd can censor whatever he wants – he’s the *blog-god* here! I’m thrilled that the only *topics* he censors are one that embarrass us *cons*!
Besides 9/11 what are you accusing him of censoring? Because the folks you mentioned were all posting 9/11 stuff.
***The only thing I believe, is that it’s really great to be a *con* like me when posting here! My stuff never goes missing, I can say whatever I want, and wow, I’m greeted like the winner that I am!
You have to prove this.
****I always belittle you dear, it’s because you have such a habit of thinking for yourself – which I hate, as you know. Dear unbeliever, I agree that it’s very nice to have an executive branch prepared official report that’s thin on content and concrete on conclusions. It’s also helpful to see how little investigations congress did – very useful to us!
I don’t support that either. I think Osama attacked us and Bush looked the other way to get his occupation of Iraq.
I really hate that you can form your own opinions, and I’m happy to see how little facts are available for you to use in that opinion formation. It’s very helpful to ensure that you jump to a conclusion.
That’s the thing… I don’t jump to conclusions, and that’s what’s upsetting the 9/11 crowd. Most of the ‘building’ suppositions are not valid.
****Well that’s great, but just because the building fell, doesn’t mean there isn’t a conspiracy. Nor does it mean there is one. Isn’t it nice to know that *I* have a more open mind than you do? But we both know that didn’t we?
It’s because I have an open mind that I require proof, not just a well crafted story I really want to be true. Less dramatic, I know, but I’ve never seen desperate housewives either.
****Mad at you, dear thing, no way. But you seem to have a lot more energy on this than I do. I prefer actual dialog, of which there’s been very little real. I’m so happy that people like you are 100% convinced, because it sure makes people’s jobs much easier to avoid any real and thorough investigation to be sure!
You said I’m 100% certain. I never said that. I just said that the conspiracy theory has too many holes. It’s those of you who support it who get upset when I debunk an aspect of it.
And it’s also a strawman to say I oppose investigation. I think wild theories are less likely to get further investigation because they get automatically dismissed as craziness…
****Yet dear, your conclusion is to *dismiss* anyone that doesn’t meet your definition of where that middle is. Careful, you’re starting to sound like me!
Not at all. You’re trying to put words in my mouth. This makes you guys religious with this stuff… And we all know, there is no debate or discussion with believers.
****You can disagree all you like, but what’s nice is that we *cons* can do it with no retribution. But if you *libruls* don’t watch yourselves, you get *banned*!
The neocons don’t bring up 9/11 theory, so it’s not logical to suggest there is some bias because they don’t get cut for it.
However, they do get cut for other things.
****Not sure what that means dear, but it is fun when the name calling is largely one sided, isn’t it? I get to call you *progs*, commies, traitors, *koranimals*, headchoppers, whatever I like! You start fighting back – and *poof*, you’re gone!
I think you’ve taken this personally to the point of exaggeration. Besides, what’s in a name? Doesn’t it prove someone has reached the limit of their intellect when they name call?
This is *my* kind of system!
And keep closing that mind of yours – I like you *more* by the day!
Comment by I_am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 8:57 pm
It’s the fact that I have an open mind that I don’t jump on the trendy bandwagon and make claims about things that are egregious… But, like I say, I’m not here to make friends or be elected Homecoming Queen.
Partisanship is partisanship regardless of some one’s affliation. When you automatically agree with the popular liberal theory just because it is liberal, it makes you about as closed-minded as it gets.
I’ve said that if someone can convince me, I’ll listen. That just hasn’t happened. And in the process, I and the other liberals here who do not support the theory get insulted. It makes me question the credibility of those who do this. Rightfully so.
As long as people believe buildings are unrealistically safe, you people are risking lives. And that’s why I am so passionate about this. Because I care more about people than I do about being right (or in this case extreme left).
Though you still haven’t said why you are here if you have a problem with how the site is run. I mean, if you’re dating someone and find out they don’t like your religion, do you stay and try to convert them, or maybe accept there’s someone else better for you and move on?
January 18th, 2007 at 9:22 pmSo, it’s open minded to call Judd names?
See why I’m having a hard time wondering why you bother to stick around? Is it some control thing? I don’t get it.
Won’t HuffPo let you talk about this stuff? Or Kos? Why not befriend them?
January 18th, 2007 at 9:24 pm“Partisanship is partisanship regardless of some one’s affliation. When you automatically agree with the popular liberal theory just because it is liberal, it makes you about as closed-minded as it gets. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 9:22 pm”
****Dear unbeliever, how do you *know* what I believe about this topic. My point was that it isn’t allowed to be *discussed*, whereas every other topic is. But you pulled a nice *strawman* out of it – I like that in you! Reminds me of myself!
What’s *closed-minded* is when someone says we can’t talk about a subject because people will think we’re *crazy*. That’s closed minded dearie!
January 18th, 2007 at 9:30 pm“So, it’s open minded to call Judd names?Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 9:24 pm”
****Oh unbeliever, how many times do you recall this blog ever discussing Israel or the DLC?
“See why I’m having a hard time wondering why you bother to stick around? Is it some control thing? I don’t get it. Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 9:24 pm”
****You know for a *teacher*, you sometimes are slow in the uptake. Why do you stick around as a democrat, if they haven’t done everything you want? Why not go be an independent? Oh wait, you probably did do that. See many people stick around *in* the environment they intend to choose to improve or participate in, even when it isn’t *perfect*. They don’t just run off to canudu like a hippie.
“Won’t HuffPo let you talk about this stuff? Or Kos? Why not befriend them? Comment by unbelievable — January 18, 2007 @ 9:24 pm”
****Dear unbeliever, you assume a lot without knowing anything about me. Why do you *presume* I am restricted to only one blog posting? How naive of you child.
January 18th, 2007 at 9:33 pm***Dear unbeliever, is there a site of *debunking* you prefer to put out there? Please do tell, I assure you I have no axe to grind, and know I do not have enough information to be *sure*, unlike yourself, on this matter. Any place you prefer, or should I just use *the-google*?
January 18th, 2007 at 9:35 pm****Dear unbeliever, how do you *know* what I believe about this topic.
It is hard to know who you are due to the alias change, so at this point I don’t. But we were talking about those who have been banned for it. “You” was figurative.
My point was that it isn’t allowed to be *discussed*, whereas every other topic is. But you pulled a nice *strawman* out of it – I like that in you! Reminds me of myself!
And my point was that if you don’t like it, why are you here complaining about it instead of going somewhere else that is is allowed? Seems futile to me.
No strawman. We were talking about those who support that theory – which are those who are banned.
What’s *closed-minded* is when someone says we can’t talk about a subject because people will think we’re *crazy*. That’s closed minded dearie!
Comment by I_am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 9:30 pm
By your definiition. Truth is subjective after all.
Fine you think he’s close-minded. People think we round-earthers are close-minded too. So why not move on? The only thing you can control is yourself. And frankly, those of you who insist the matter be discussed against his wishes care more about getting your way rather than finding a different outlet.
Alright, I’ve made my point, and you’ve made yours. We don’t agree, obviously, and probably won’t. I see no reason to keep repeating ourselves.
I’m gonna go. I have stuff to do before bed.
Have a good night
January 18th, 2007 at 9:40 pm***Dear unbeliever, is there a site of *debunking* you prefer to put out there?
Comment by I_am_mighty_aphrodite_and_a_zionist_fool — January 18, 2007 @ 9:35 pm
I just erased what I typed (and it was long), because I feel that I have to respect what Judd has asked of us. I shouldn’t discuss the issue either. Sorry….
I do need to run.
Have a good evening.
January 18th, 2007 at 9:49 pmThe problem with the school system is that it’s a big government monopoly. And like all big government monopolies, the results are mediocre at best. There needs to be a way to introduce some free market competition in schools. Bust up the government monopoly.
That’ll never fly, of course. So we’re stuck with mediocre schools. And I feel for the kids; because they’re the ones getting ripped off here.
The option for folks is to either pay for a private school or to move to an area where school results are above average.
January 19th, 2007 at 1:10 amThat headline should probably read “Bologne”
ya know…instead of “bolone”…which isn’t a real word…
January 19th, 2007 at 11:17 amWard Connerly is nothing more than a self hating black fool who uses race to further is goal of getting rich by selling out his people. The is worst that Judas. At least Judas was born to do what he did and basically had no choice. Connerly is a hater who knows that ignorant whites will pay him to attack his own people. It’s the oldest trick in the book. I could do the same and probably become rich too. There are blacks like Coonerly and I mean coon-erly, who sell out for 20 pieces of silver.
If only this moron knew that the fires of hell await him, maybe, maybe, he’d wake up and stop representing the KKK. I’m sure the Coonerly would be welcomed at a Klan rally as the guest speaker and then hanged to prove that they (Klansmen) hate all blacks. He’s such a sick little, and I mean little man that I can’t stand to look at his face. I’ve personally be run of the road by Klansmen in North Carolina and I hate Coonerly worst than the Klansmen who tried to kill me. At least they were whites who hated me legitimately and not some black fool who helps them to do what they did to me by speak the bull-hit he speaks.
The true but sad part about the Klansmen trying to kill me, was that I was driving home from a Military base, Fort Bragg, North Carolina, when it happened. There I was a soldier protecting their right to hate me and they tried to kill me.
January 19th, 2007 at 3:00 pmReply to #3: Jason M. Hendler you are a RACIST ahole! There is no other way to say it. I know that is a compliment to you and you deserve it too. Why don’t you move to the middle east with the other people to hate Americans? Are you sure your last name isn’t Himler, like the racist who killed 6 million jews during WWII. Apparently you are a decendant of Himler because you sure think like him.
And as far as you thinking the way you do, keep it up fool. In twenty years the majority in this country will be other than white. Then what are you going to do? So if I were you, I’d move now before the line gets too long.
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