Hadley Ignores NIE, Says White House Will Still Not Call Iraq A ‘Civil War’
Hadley Ignores NIE, Says White House Will Still Not Call Iraq A ‘Civil War’
At a press briefing this morning, National Security Adviser Stephen Hadley said the White House will continue to avoid using the term “civil war” to describe events in Iraq, despite the findings of the new National Intelligence Estimate.
Hadley was pressed on the issue by ABC News’ Martha Raddatz: “Why do you go out of your way not to use that word? The president goes out of his way as well. You say labels are difficult, but is it not important — certainly any military strategist will tell you it’s important to know what kind of fight you’re in.”
Hadley justified his position by pointing to the new NIE. He said the White House will not use the term “because it’s not an adequate description of the situation we find ourselves, as the intelligence community says.” He added, “We know what kind of fight we’re in. We know the facts.”
Watch it:
In fact, the NIE says that Iraq is worse than a civil war. Specifically, it says the term “civil war” “accurately describes key elements of the Iraqi conflict,” but does not “capture the complexity of the conflict,” which also includes “extensive Shia-on-Shia violence, al-Qa’ida and Sunni insurgent attacks on Coalition forces, and widespread criminally motivated violence.”
Transcript:
QUESTION: I want to go back to the term civil war. The administration has really gone out of its way not to use that term, civil war, in the same way that Don Rumsfeld wouldn’t call it a guerrilla war when it was or an insurgency when it was. So why do you go out of your way not to use that word? The president goes out of his way as well. You say labels are difficult, but is it not important — certainly any military strategist will tell you it’s important to know what kind of fight you’re in. Can you call it a civil war? And why haven’t you?
HADLEY: We know what kind of fight we’re in. We know the facts. That is described well in this NIE. And we have a strategy to deal with those facts and to try to succeed. I go back to you…
QUESTION: Is this a civil war?
HADLEY: I will tell you what this NIE says.
QUESTION: I want to know why you avoid…
HADLEY: The intelligence — because it’s not an adequate description of the situation we find ourselves, as the intelligence community says. The intelligence community judges the term civil war does not adequately capture the complexities of the conflict in Iraq. And what we’re doing is saying, if you’re going to run policy and if you’re going to explain it to the American people, we need to get across the complexities of the situation we face in Iraq and what is our strategy to deal with that. And simple labels don’t do that. We’re going to try and force everybody to get into the facts.
Topic Cloud
ArchivesBlog Roll
U.S. training made Shiite militia stronger
BAGHDAD — The U.S. military’s efforts to train and equip Iraq’s security forces have unwittingly strengthened the al-Mahdi Army militia, which has been battling to take over much of the capital as U.S. forces try to secure it.
U.S. Army commanders and enlisted men who are patrolling east Baghdad said the militia, which is loyal to anti-American Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, had heavily infiltrated the Iraqi police and army units that the Americans have trained and armed.
http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/news/world/16605799.htm
Bush administration seeks $245B for wars
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070202/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_war_funding;_ylt=AtwmMEnVorP4XwMDjPD6NfOyFz4D;_ylu=X3oDMTA2Z2szazkxBHNlYwN0bQ–
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:11 pmHell, let’s just call it a “ball game” and go do some tailgating.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:13 pm3090 YEEE HAAA soon be 3100 yee haa
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:14 pmIf you call it a “civil war”, you’re just “emboldening the enemy.” The latter is #1 and the former appears not at all, on the list of Top 10 GOP Sound Bites.”
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:14 pm“A rose by any other name…”
–Billy Shakespear
“If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it ain’t a pig.”
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:16 pm–Grand Pa
The American people should be screaming: If you don’t KNOW what in the hell you’re fighting, you have no business being there. Get the hell out of there, now! Those stupid, pig-headed bastards in the White House making decisions that directly affect my future make my head spin. I want to see them up on charges! For me, polite conversation is over and out. Incidentally, Hadley needs to have his diapers changed. What an ugly baby.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:17 pmAnd the 20,000 Monkey Boy wants to send is now trying to be increased to 50,000 “support” troops.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:18 pmIf it looks like a duck and walks like a duck and talks like a duck…well, it’s gotta be a chicken! Not a duck. Cuz if you call it a DUCK, people will begin to think there’s something wrong. But if you call it a CHICKEN, see, no one will be any the wiser. Cuz after all, it’s just the dumbass, unwashed masses we’re talking about. We don’t think they’re too sharp, but we definitely don’t want to piss ‘em off – they would HURT us!
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:19 pmIt’s like telling your oncologist you know better about how to treat your cancer than he does.
“With all due respect, Dr., I’ve decided to continue treating the “aberrant fibrous growth” in my brain by hitting my head against the garage door and paying a psychic $10k/day. I will continue to refuse to call it “cancer”. I know what it is, and I know that if I stop hitting my head on the garage door, or stop paying the psychic it will embolden the growth.”
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:20 pmThe Bush Administration wouldn’t admit there is a civil war going on in Iraq if the Sunnis and Shia took to fighting each other in company sized units. The fighting could result in having half of Baghdad in flames and the US forces evacuating in a fighting retreat and Toadie Snowjob would still stand up at the podium with a straight face and call it something else.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:20 pmWhen it comes time to hold folks accountable for this horrible mess in Iraq, Hadley should be in the A group with aWol, Chaney, Rice, Perle, Adelman, Rumsfeld et al.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:21 pmI think this is a bit past “plausible deniability”.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:21 pmComment by Tobey Tall
F*ck you, Toby
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:22 pmIf only Denial was a currency we would have no National debt.
Spin away Losers, spin away
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:23 pmHadley can LIE all he wants, but Iraq is now a sectarian civil war!
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:23 pm“genocide abroad, not at home…yet”
http://www.micropoll.com/akira/MicroPoll?mode=html&id=23186
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:24 pmthis is the guy who was telling his friends that he was going to be indicted. hadley has zero credibility.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:28 pmThe Bush Administration will not call it a “Civil War” unless Iraq divides up North and South and once they line up their colonial-era cannons in their blue and gray uniforms!
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:29 pm(This phrase is key)….because it’s not an adequate description of the situation we find ourselves, as the intelligence community says.
( To break it down even further, this is the money shot)….as the intelligence community says.
Yet your title for this article reads:
“Hadley Ignores NIE, Says White House Will Still Not Call Iraq A ‘Civil War’”
Hadley isn`t ignoring anyone. He is quoting what the intelligence community says.
You are busted once again TP. This time you didn`t even try to hide the discrepancies. I didn`t even have to read or open up the entire article to see the attempt at obfuscation on your part. All I had to do was read the title and then read the frontpage paragraph to spot this one.
You are either getting sloppy TYP or you just don`t care anymore. Kind of like a shameless beginner whore you are. After awhile yoiu don`t even clean up between sessions. All in a days`s work for you.
I swear some of the TP staff either work for or have worked for FoxNews at one point in their lives.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:29 pmHadley Lamarr?
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:32 pm“if we refuse to call it a civil war…
…maybe it’ll go away”…
-Bushites-
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:35 pmwormburner, the only reason a liar like Hadley won’t call this a civil war is that Bush and Cheney don’t want him to. WTF are you talking about? Hadley is all about obfuscation. When you can’t win an argument on merits, one strategy is to obfuscate. This guy has been lying through his teeth for years now. Where the hell have you been?
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:35 pmBack, Bush… Back to the primordial ooze and slime from whence thou come. Your presence doth insult me and your face is… an unholy sight! Back… Back, I say!
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:42 pmI can’t wait until the day someone in the Bush administration tries to tell us that they couldn’t call it a civil war in February of 2007 because the NIE said it was worse than a civil war.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:44 pmcaption-
I am a giant CIA bred top secret attack beetle. These are my pincers and they are coming closer and closer to victory.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:45 pmThey will when they are good and ready.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:45 pmWhy don’t we just call it what it is, a mess. Who cares what it’s called. We just need to get out of there. The American people want our country out of that war. If anyone in D.C. ignores what the majority of American people have clearly said we want, then those politicians, each and every one of them, need to be removed from office. The politicians are in office to serve at the pleasure of the people, not the president and his gang. We are in charge. If the politicians are insubordinate and do not follow the orders of the American people, then those politicians need to be fired. It’s that simple.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:46 pmwormburner, the only reason a liar like Hadley won’t call this a civil war is that Bush and Cheney don’t want him to.
Comment by Bluedog49 — February 2, 2007 @ 1:35 pm
Proof to back up this loose claim? Or it didn`t happen.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:47 pmBecause it’s more than a civil war they can’t use that terminology……right.
The other parts state that there are al Queda, Sunni and Shia factions attacking the coalition forces so it makes it more than a civil war. So if we left it will be just a civil war. Is that the reason they are using to keep troops there? So they don’t have to use the words “civil war”? Now I get it.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:49 pmHadley justified his position by pointing to the new NIE. He said the White House will not use the term “because it’s not an adequate description of the situation we find ourselves, as the intelligence community says.†He added, “We know what kind of fight we’re in. We know the facts.â€
*************************************
This is typical Bush administration rhetoric. Translation: “Yeah, we know what the experts said…but what do they know? Don’t listen to them. Listen to us — we’re the only ones who really know what’s going on, and we’re infallible.”
Yeah, the intelligence community refrained from describing the situation in Iraq as “civil war” — but perhaps it was because that phrase suggests that the battle lines between the various factions are to at least some degree clearly drawn. From the sound of it, this is not the case in Iraq. I don’t know about you…but “extensive Shia-on-Shia violence, al-Qa’ida and Sunni insurgent attacks on Coalition forces, and widespread criminally motivated violence” in addition to “hardening of ethno-sectarian identities, a sea change in the character of the violence, ethno-sectarian mobilization, and population displacements” seems worse than civil war to me. It sounds like something close to utter chaos, but the Bush administration insists on pretending that everything is just hunky-dory.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:52 pmAfter dumbing down all communication for 6 years, Bushbots aren’t going to use the term “civil war” because its not nuanced enough.
Pardon me while I blow big chunks of disbelief in Hadley’s smug little mug.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:53 pmHadley isn`t ignoring anyone. He is quoting what the intelligence community says.
I swear some of the TP staff either work for or have worked for FoxNews at one point in their lives.
Comment by wormburner
Proof to back up this loose claim? Or it didn`t happen.
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:55 pmHe also put the Nigerian Uranium claims ignoring CIA director no to insert that in the State of The Union address
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:59 pmNice try.
It was however a figure of speech.
BlueDog made her staement sound as fact.
I am waiting BlueDog?
Show me where Bush and Cheney didn`t want Hadley to call it a civil war.
Now let`s read the whole of my statement. Entirely different context.
You are either getting sloppy TYP or you just don`t care anymore. Kind of like a shameless beginner whore you are. After awhile yoiu don`t even clean up between sessions. All in a days`s work for you.
I swear some of the TP staff either work for or have worked for FoxNews at one point in their lives.
Comment by wormburner
My case rests.
Bluedog……… Proof?
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:59 pmugh
February 2nd, 2007 at 1:59 pmWormburner: “Proof to back up this loose claim? Or it didn`t happen.”
From NBC: “Speaking at the opening of the Nato summit in Latvia yesterday, George Bush refused to accept the “civil war” label, arguing that the conflict was being artificially stoked.
“There’s a lot of sectarian violence taking place, fomented, in my opinion, because of these attacks by al-Qaida, causing people to seek reprisals,” he said.
His national security adviser, Stephen Hadley, was more explicit in countering the “civil war” terminology. “The Iraqis don’t talk of it as a civil war, the unity government doesn’t talk of it as a civil war,” Mr Hadley said.”
As I said earlier, wormburner, members of a cult tend to filter out any information which portrays their leader in a negative light.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:01 pmHadley isn’t ignoring anyone, he’s just saying that, though the Doctors want to call it cancer, he and some other guys would prefer calling it “aberrant growth”, because, oftentimes, the patient knows more than the Doctor about the disease.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:01 pmMy case rests.
Comment by wormburner
At the bottom of the ocean floor.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:02 pmBush: “You know, I hear people say, Well, civil war this, civil war that. The Iraqi people decided against civil war when they went to the ballot box.â€
Let me walk you though this, wormie: critics of Bush’s invasion of Iraq pointed out early on that the most likely outcome of removing Hussein from office would be a civil war in Iraq. Bush and Cheney have never wanted to call anything in iraq a “civil war” because it would confirm that these critics were correct. Do you get it now? This is all pretty basic unless you are a member of the Cult of Bush.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:05 pmhow’s “QUAGMIRE” sound? kind of rolls off the tougue- and fits the bill.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:06 pmAs I thought BlueDog.
You have no proof.
Know why?
Because you made it up in your loose spouting of hubris!
You got caught up in the moment…the staus quo here at TP.
You have been outted for being a liar.
Right here on your own home field. You have the home field advantage and everything.
Perhaps you should go back to just reading and learning for awhile before just opening your mouth and just letting anmything just fall out and into your writings (scribllings actually)
Politics is a tough business kid. Don`t ever back yourself into a corner like that again.
I hope you learned a lesson from all of this.
Maybe not.
We`ll see.
I am done on this thread.
My work is done here.
BlueDog, just remember…politics is a tough business and you NEVER, and I mean NEVER! open your mouth like that and make loose claims like that without anything to back it up.
You will be pinned to the wall everytime just like I did to you a few moments ago.
Take care.
I am off this thread and going to others now.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:11 pmwormburner: “Proof to back up this loose claim? Or it didn`t happen.”
Proof to back up the claim that Bush fulfilled his duties in the National Guard? Or it didn’t happen.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:13 pmAug. 14, 2006 issue – The Bush administration insists Iraq is a long way from civil war, but the contingency planning has already begun inside the White House and the Pentagon. President Bush will move U.S. troops out of Iraq if the country descends into civil war, according to one senior Bush aide who declined to be named while talking about internal strategy. “If there’s a full-blown civil war, the president isn’t going to allow our forces to be caught in the crossfire,” the aide said. “But institutionally, the government of Iraq isn’t breaking down. It’s still a unity government.” Bush’s position on a pullout of U.S. troops emerged in response to news-week’s questions about Sen. John Warner, chairman of the Armed Services Committee. Warner warned last week that the president might require a new vote from Congress to allow troops to stay in Iraq in what he called “all-out civil war.” But the senior Bush aide said the White House would need no prompting from Congress to get troops out “if the Iraqi government broke down completely along sectarian lines.” ….
Source: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14206642/
So, this is why they refuse to call it a Civil War.
Theresa
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:13 pmYes, wormburner, you have taught me a lesson. The lesson is that cultists never accept reality even when it hits them in the face like a big cream pie. And, the second lesson is that delusional cultmembers like yourselves will conjur up a scenario that they have won when everyone else thinks they lost. Now quickly declare victory and run away like the cowardly cultist you are.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:16 pmwhy would what hadley said differ from the administration’s view? of course he’s saying what bush/cheney want him to say. he’s not speaking independently and just happens to agree with bush/cheney. he’s echoing the voice of his boss, just as rumsfeld and bolton did, and rice still does. who needs proof of that? maybe hadley can send you a pay stub.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:16 pmpgw, you’re using a logical argument. That won’t work with a cultist like wormburner. He’s already declared victory and ran off to a place which will better reflect his world view.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:21 pmProof to back up the claim that Bush fulfilled his duties in the National Guard? Or it didn’t happen.
Comment by Bluedog49
I never said he didn`t fulfill his duties. You did.
I don`t know whether he did or do not.
I never made the claim, YOU DID.
Project much?
I really don`t care much about it whether he did or did not.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:23 pmtheres a saying in France and in Italy too and it says
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:24 pm” NOBODIES FAULT BUT MINE”
Bush should understand this one
Is THAT Stephen Hadley? I thought it was a string puppet and it’s mouth was froze open. Well, of course he’s repeating the same tired, old messages he gets from his master and lord, King Shit on Turd Island, in D.C.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:25 pmnext time someone uses ‘hadley’ and ‘proof’ in the same sentence, consider that this chestnut just fell from his mouth: “The Best Plan Is To Have This Plan Succeed.” now i need proof that hadley is not being ironic.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:29 pmWormburning Bush Cultist: “I never said he didn`t fulfill his duties. You did.
I don`t know whether he did or do not.”
No, cultist, what you said was “Proof to back up this loose claim? Or it didn`t happen.”
I simply applied your logic to another Bush related topic that Bush cultists like to forget. Using your logic, Bush must have gone AWOL since there is no proof that he did his duty.
Hey, I thought you were scurrying off to another hole or something. Why are you still here?
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:32 pmI really don`t care much about it whether he did or did not.
Comment by wormburner
Now why would that be?
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:33 pmThat would be because she is a cult member in the Cult of Bush.
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:36 pmShow me where Bush and Cheney didn`t want Hadley to call it a civil war.
Comment by wormburner — February 2, 2007 @ 1:59 pm
Pres Bush is Hadley’s boss, and Hadley -to keep his job- must toe the line… no?
For example, Hadley says:
And what we’re doing is saying, if you’re going to run policy and if you’re going to explain it to the American people, we need to get across the complexities of the situation we face in Iraq and what is our strategy to deal with that.
Who are these “we” Hadley keeps talking about? Himself? He, his family, and friends?
Or is it taking about the Bush administration -of which he is part, and he is referring to the political strategy they have collectivelly decided on? And who is “The Decider”?
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:42 pmIt’s Groundhog Day on Iraq, Iran and the NIE, all right. Administration figures cherry-pick words and findings from an ambiguous report. Weak intelligence and tenuous conclusions fail to make the administration’s case.
For more on why it’s deja vu all all over again, see:
February 2nd, 2007 at 2:53 pm“Groundhog Day: Iraq, Iran and the NIE.”
Insanity. Pure Insanity.
February 2nd, 2007 at 3:11 pmUnreal.
February 2nd, 2007 at 3:15 pmHadley with a fomer criminal past as he changed the spelling of his first name and then was welcomed in the criminal circle of the White House. He can’t even lie right he has the look of lying. The Bush Administration is on life support and dying fast. Cheney/Rove are packing up the money and shipping it to over shore accounts and the bottom falls out and the criminals go down. Now that Americans can’t believe a word Bush or Cheney said they are sending out their flunkies to spread the lies. Watch Chris Matthews do as he’s ordered by Bush spread the lies and blame others, Chris does lying well.
February 2nd, 2007 at 3:31 pmMy case rests.
Comment by wormburner #35
…Please do…
February 2nd, 2007 at 3:40 pmI do believe I called this on the initial NIE thread:
Is Chimpy working on a way to ignore this report as well?
February 2nd, 2007 at 3:42 pmComment by Zooey — February 2, 2007 @ 11:26 am
Stephen Hadley is what little Ralphie Parker would have become if he hadn’t gotten that Red Ryder BB gun for Christmas….
February 2nd, 2007 at 3:43 pmNobody but a few straggling wingnuts believe anything the White House says at this point. Let ‘em say what they want.
Is anybody listening? Wolf! Wolf!
February 2nd, 2007 at 4:28 pmJust watched a Pentagon briefing. Hadley’s comments are being echoed by Gates and Pace as well. These are their “talking points,” that’s all.
February 2nd, 2007 at 4:30 pm#19 wormburner
(This phrase is key)….because it’s not an adequate description of the situation we find ourselves, as the intelligence community says.
( To break it down even further, this is the money shot)….as the intelligence community says.
Yet your title for this article reads:
“Hadley Ignores NIE, Says White House Will Still Not Call Iraq A ‘Civil War’â€
Hadley isn`t ignoring anyone. He is quoting what the intelligence community says.
I guess this is the part of the NIE you’re having a hard time understanding:
“Nonetheless, the term ‘civil war’ accurately describes key elements of the Iraqi conflict, including the hardening of ethno-sectarian identities, a sea change in the character of the violence, ethno-sectarian mobilization, and population displacements.”
Let me know if you’d like me to break that down for you.
February 2nd, 2007 at 5:29 pmChimpeach, I think wormie is already doing his touchdown dance thinking that he/she kicked some ass around here. Funny, isn’t it? The guy/gal is the classic delusional cultist.
February 2nd, 2007 at 5:32 pm#66 Bluedog49
I think wormie is already doing his touchdown dance thinking that he/she kicked some ass around here.
Yeah, but does he/she actually think we believe that? I guess we should just keep humoring him/her.
February 2nd, 2007 at 5:55 pmDoes Bush purposefully hire idiots because he doesn’t want anyone working in the White House that’s smarter than he is? The NIE clearly said that not only are key elements of the Iraqi conflict indicative of it being a civil war, but that part that doesn’t fit the civil war moniker, doesn’t fit because it’s WORSE than a simple North/South division. In other words, in a best case scenario, it IS a civil war. In a worst case scenario, things would have to improve before it qualified as one!!!
February 2nd, 2007 at 7:56 pmMy friends do you remember Baghdad Bob being dillusional? Same goes for these nut jobs that think George Bush is The Messiah. Believing anything he says. Any Republicans that stand with HIM are gonna go down big time. Who do these Republican thugs think we are?
February 2nd, 2007 at 11:13 pmFollowers like them, haha. Ya’ll will never lead this nation again. Get some dignity back into your Republican Party. SAD SAD
It’s not a Civil War:
IT’S MUCH WORSE THAN A CIVIL WAR!
February 2nd, 2007 at 11:15 pmThese republicun neocons wouldn’t know the facts if they were run over by a truckload of them.
February 3rd, 2007 at 11:57 amYeah, everyone knows, when you’re trying to get a message across to the American people, you don’t use simple labels. The intelligence community has about the thinking capacity of Bush’s brain. But you don’t have to be very smart to be intelligent, if only the rest of the world is as stupid as your average American public….
February 3rd, 2007 at 1:45 pm