AFA blames school shootings on lack of prayer, spankings.
By on Apr 23rd, 2007 at 12:14 pm
AFA blames school shootings on lack of prayer, spankings.
In a new video, the the right-wing American Family Association attributes the tragedy at Virginia Tech to: a lack of prayer in school, a lack of the Bible in school, a lack of spanking kids, a lack of physical punishment in school, abortion, condoms, Bill Clinton, internet pornography, free speech, the entertainment industry, “satanic” music, and liberal culture in general. Watch it:
Additionally, AFA is cashing in on the tragedy and selling the videos for $5 each.
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Satan should spank the AFA..
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:16 pmOf course they think that! And Intelligent Design is real, we’re winning in Iraq and the earth is flat.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:20 pmHuh, no mention of handgun control in the video?
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:21 pm( [CLICK] Just shut up and buy the video, or I’ll plug ‘ya…)
The American Family Association are SICK F*CKS.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:21 pmWitness the downside of freedom. Freedom of speech means freedom for hate-filled ideologues like the parasites over at the ironically-named “American Family Association” spouting their bilious nonsense and twisting a horrible tragedy to serve their own nefarious political ends.
Even though I violently oppose what these monsters are saying, though, I still defend their right to say it…just as I defend my right to debunk their horrid and harmful lies.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:22 pmEven though I violently oppose what these monsters are saying, though, I still defend their right to say it…just as I defend my right to debunk their horrid and harmful lies.
Comment by TripMaster Monkey
Of course, TMM.
They’re still SICK F*CKS.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:23 pmthey are s-o-o-ooo unbelievable… cho and his family were regular churchgoers as are most korean immigrant families… cho’s problem was not a lack of a caring, christian upbringing, he was profoundly mentally disturbed and allowed to arm himself in spite of laws prohibiting the sale of weapons to a diagnosed threat… afa is so brazenly political and devastatingly manipulative of devout christians… they should be ashamed of themselves… (ya, right…)
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:23 pmAnd, yes, I DO take it personally
“Where can I cum to get spanked?”
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:23 pmThis organization is absolutely disgusting.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:24 pmYeah, had NOTHING to do with the assailant being RIGHT OUT OF HIS MIND coupled with pathetic gun laws. No no, it’s because he wasn’t spanked enough as a child. RIGHT.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:27 pmClearly a wacky assessment.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:27 pmDear God, why didn’t you save the schoolchildren? Oh that’s easy folks, I don’t exist. Har de Har Har!
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:28 pmThis Republic666an curse on our country is God’s vengence for our country crushing under foot the poor, disadvantaged, and marginalized peoples of the Earth. The Republic666ans have it backwards.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:28 pmA rebuttal:
I don’t want prayer in school.
I don’t want the Bible in school.
I don’t want to spank kids.
I don’t want physical punishment in school
I want abortion to be safe and legal.
I want condoms.
I love Bill Clinton
I want internet pornography
I love free speech
I patronize the entertainment industry.
“Satanic†music Rocks.
Liberal culture, in general, is a good thing.
So, there ya’ go.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:28 pmsomething i’ve been curious about for a long time:
when, if ever, was there “prayer in school” or the “Bible in school”?
i went to a parochial school, so that’s a given…
but i don’t remember my non-catholic friends saying,
“yay (or darn), we don’t have to pray any more”…
is this a southern thing? i’m in illinois… h.s. class of 71… fyi…
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:28 pmConservatism: Where death and killing is absolutely hillarious when used in jokes (bomb bomb bomb) and also at the same time extremely profitable when used to scare people!
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:29 pmDid they forget to blame gays and lesbians?
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:29 pmHilarious. I also love how they located Taber, Alberta somewhere in Manitoba, which is about a 14 hour drive away from Taber. Instead of worrying about God in the classroom, maybe they should get someone who knows something about geography?
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:29 pmDaryll…
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:30 pmWhen you get this message, call me…
(it’s about the condoms…)
The AFA should be asked to explain how criminals and killers such as Jesse James, Bonnie and Clyde, Al Capone, etc were produced by our society when most of their “factors” were in the direction they advocate.
Again, they have a right to believe and act in whatever way they want, BUT the members of this organization do not have a right to distort facts and, thereby, try to force particular public policy to be enacted.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:32 pmAnd this comes as a surprise to….who?
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:32 pmIn my experience, the loudest screaming, church-affiliated idiots like these are ALWAYS molesting someone or picking their pocket, or worse….
Sorry, I know that sounds prejudiced, but I’ve never met a person in my life who proclaimed their attachment to a church or religion who failed to show me the two sides of their face.
(I’ve never met a practicing Buddhist, so I will exempt that particular religion based on my own ignorance.)
What’s the difference between the Westboro Baptist Church and AFA?
One smiles.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:32 pmSomething I just realized about their movie. They are admitting that their god isn’t powerful enough to overcome government legislation in order to save innocent lives.
That’s a pretty wimpy god for being all powerful and all.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:33 pmCute, they left out the amish school shooting!
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:34 pmThis is just about as sick as that blowhard on Fox telling us that the students & faulty were wimps for not attacking a guy with semi-automatic guns in each hand.
Truth is, anyone from Fox that happened to be in that area during the shootings would have first pissed their pants and then acted like George Costanza at a kid’s birthday party…‘out of the way, let me at the exit door!’ as they trample kids to save their own ass.
We need a Prog channel to counter Fox’s supid shit. I mean, when Com Central’s Daily Show produces the highest level of intelligence in viewers, it’s obvious we have a market for truth.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:34 pmSee where god gets us? Blaming this tragedy on a lack of faith, sounds earily like blaming another american tragedy on too much faith. (9-11)
Which go id the right god? The AFA and their ilk are as dangerous as any fanatical Muslim. They are just little more subtle. But there end is the same. An American Theocracy based on their god.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:34 pmkaty
You and I graduated h.s. the same year. I only vaguely recall school prayer in my public school and being led in the Pledge of Allegiance in elementary school. School prayer led by school personnel was eliminated by Supreme Court ruling in 1962, so we were just beginning our school careers then.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:35 pmHow do they explain the Amish School Shooting? Plenty of god in that classroom.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:36 pmIt looks like there are more school shootings in red states. How do they explain that?
Notice how Republican gloss over the first and worst school shooting until VT. Charles Whitman at the University of Texas in Austin in 1966, 16 killed and 31 wounded. And it isn’t on the AFA map.
Neocon pundits have been stating that if students had been allowed to have guns lives could have been saved at VT.
Hasn’t Texas always allowed guns everywhere. Then why, after 90 minutes of shooting, did the police end up shooting Mr. Whitman. Why didn’t one of those gunslingers shoot him first.
I don’t believe Texas or Florida, where he was raised were liberal then. However the man killed his wife and mother before he started shooting so perhaps he had some mental health issues.
But if only his mother had made him pray more…
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:36 pm#23 – he’s omlimpotent
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:36 pmObviously it wasnt’ too much prayer.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:36 pmA few annoying evangelic teachers used to, I’m sure, preach religion and lead class prayers occasionally in school, but it was NEVER part of the cirriculum in modern times.
And now it is NOT ILLEGAL to pray or read the bible. You just are not allowed, as an authoritive figure (such as a teacher) to lead the class in prayer and so on and so forth.
Besides there’s (1) nothing of historical merit worth teaching in the bible (it’s a pretty bad math book too, just read the story of Job… Man + old family = man – old family + new family… that’s pretty messed up where that would be equally emotionally rewarding and happy) and (2) NOT EVERYBODY IS %$!#@%$! Christian!! AGH!
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:36 pmGod has abandoned this country. The ruling elite have evil in their hearts.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:37 pm#19 Tiffany, LMAO and sprayed coffee all over the moniter….Good one….Blessings
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:37 pmis this a southern thing? i’m in illinois… h.s. class of 71… fyi…
Comment by katy — April 23, 2007 @ 12:28 pm
I went to public school in Illinois and the only thing I remember is the “Pledge of Allegiance” with “one nation under god.”
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:38 pmThe right-wing MO:
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:39 pm1) screw things up
2) blame the libs
The kids were killed by a guy who watched NBC News, an Olbermann fan, religion had nothing to do with it. The fool was lost early on.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:39 pmJonesboro, Arkansas is in Northeast Arkansas, not Northwest. The bubble for Jonesboro is located at Fayetteville, AR. Fairly nice production values otherwise, for religious fruits that is.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:39 pmPatrick1,
Burn in hell.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:41 pmSo, I guess their point is, if everyone spanked their children on a regular basis, they’d all be antisocial misfits who would be packing heat, so when one of them snaps, they all start firing on each other.
Heckuva job, AFA!
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:44 pmJust a continuation of “This is how you to live your life and be happy or else!” Bushco has empowered these clowns to the point that they actually feel entitled to control Americans based on their repressive and harmful beliefs.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:44 pmNow, were those godless hippies at the end of that video, or were they members of the AFA showing how whacked out on “God” they are?
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:44 pmthanks for the feedback, PLC and shane…
i gotta go mowe… back later…
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:45 pmDevoutly religious people are the most dangerous people on earth. They should be confined to the underworld because they are really making a mess of things here on the surface.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:46 pmhow cute, the american version on the taliban….
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:46 pmIf you replace AFA with Al Qaeda, you find the exact same talking points/agenda.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:48 pm“Hey, everybody, pay attention to me! It’s all about me and what I think! Anyone???? Please????”
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:49 pmIs it just me or is the right wing getting more and more riduiculous as their hold on power (not to mention their grip on reality) gets more an more tenuous?
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:50 pmThis isn’t a gun control issue as much as a mental health issue, or better yet, a lack of mental health resources to families who are in desperate need. I know this first hand. My youngest son (adopted) is and has been severely mentally disturbed from the time he arrived due to what he went through his first two years of life. We have struggled with him for 16 years now.
Thank God we have insurance, but insurance doesn’t cover the intensive services we needed for him. I spent an entire YEAR on the phone calling every resource, doctor, residential treatment facility, congressmen, etc. that I could think of and nobody had any help or solutions. Treatment facilities for severely disturbed adolescents cost around (at least) $150,000 per year and insurance doesn’t pay. We paid for years of intensive therapy outpatient out of pocket. Thank God our insurance pays for his meds which are almost $1,000 a month, that is until he turns 18 and is out of our house and can’t afford his meds any more. Then I have no idea what will happen to him.
He doesn’t think or feel like other people. There are a lot of things that are missing or wires that are crossed in his psyche. My story is not unique. I know of MANY families who are in the same boat or who don’t have the resources that we even had. When I read the story about this young man who did the shooting, I understood as soon as I saw his face and heard his words. People in the press keep trying to find a deeper meaning or a rational explanation, but there isn’t one. He was severly emotionally disturbed. He was a bomb that went off.
This isn’t about “arming” the schools, or teaching the bible at school, or using spanking at school, this is about getting the mental health resources to the families who need the help BEFORE their children get to be adults and wreak devastation of society in some form or other. Until our society recognizes that this is a very desperate need for intensive affordable mental health services and resources, and residential facilities that are affordable, you are going to see more and more situations like this. Our prisons are filled with adults who didn’t get the help they needed when they were younger and their families were in crisis (this is according to the professionals who are helping us who also work within the prison system).
The kids can sometimes be helped if they get the help they need early enough. Our son is doing okay now (just okay). I couldn’t say that 5 years ago. He is stabilized on meds and has a lot of support in the school and with lots of therapy. He has cognitive and processing difficulties and won’t be going to college. Now our biggest hurdle is what happens when he turns 18 in two more months.. There are no answers for him once he leaves school.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:51 pmPatrick1:
Why did Cho claim he was like Jesus?
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:51 pmAFA is legal in America? How’s tha possible…
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:54 pmAs a typical Conservative, I support teh fetus over the woman, spanking, corporal punishment, preemptive war, and the death penalty.
Therefore, I am pro-life…
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:57 pmThe AFA is right, all we need is more narrow-minded religious fundamentalism and the world will be wonderful in god’s eye. After all, consider how many of the world’s wars were caused by fanatic atheists trying to force their “religion” on others.
April 23rd, 2007 at 12:57 pmOne of Cho’s nicknames for himself was “spanky.” Go figure.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:00 pm“when, if ever, was there “prayer in school†or the “Bible in schoolâ€?”
You got me. I grew up in NC, went to a private, non-parochial school and there was no praying and no physical punishment. No mass murderers, either. Class of ‘82.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:02 pmi love the part about child porn. as if society as a whole just said “hey, that’s not so bad” and made it legal. that cracked me up.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:04 pmHey, everybody, pay attention to me! It’s all about me and what I think! Anyone???? Please????â€
Comment by Patrick doesn’t have 1 — April 23, 2007 @ 12:49 pm
See P1 how much more people will respect you when you ask for attention nicely. Way to go.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:05 pmThere is a great deal of truth in that video. Group-think is both a blessing and a curse. Humans are a GROUP so individuality flies in the face of humanity. At the moment humans are broken down as individuals or small groups. Our survival mechanism is to attach ourselves to a given group and the result is the crèche, “There is safety in numbers!” Once the only remaining predator is a member of another group of humans (group to subgroup) like the Chinese as an example it is then instinctual to war with them from your group since in this example the Chinese are in direct competition for the same resources.
Politics, religion, race, sex, sexual orientation, nationality and age will and are the current points of division for humanity and have always been so. Once resources (food, water, energy, land, shelter, etc) become a factor our individual chances of survival decrease since any group or groups we depend on may fail since it falls into the minority (example: 75 YO, gay, Muslims would be a small group).
The USA’s population is extremely divided along most of the above examples. Individuality and GOD do not mesh well in an industrialized world. Keep in mind that immigrants from nations like India tend to remain as a strong group since most Indians have strong religious beliefs.
When the final RACE WARS come the Indians and Chinese have the sheer numbers to wipe out the rest. They also have weapons and military to accomplish this.
It might be a GOOD IDEA to PRAY for GUIDANCE based on the FACTS @ HAND!
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:06 pmjust how crazy are you? like the guy on the train mmuttering to himself crazy or sitting in your own feces surrounded by canned tomatoes and back issues of gun n ammo crazy?
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:10 pmThe AFA is dead wrong. The blame goes to those that decided to not allow our children to protect themselves. Those folks decided that our children should be easy targets for maniacs wishing them harm. I hope that this event will finally wake the average American up to the extreme danger these people put our children in when they decide self defense is not an option. Hopefully this will expediate new rules that allow our Children the chance at self defense of themselves and their classmates. I would think that all those folks that decided to take away our children’s self defense option feel pretty bad right now.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:11 pmI hereby state that we need not MORE physical punishment in school, but LESS physical punishment in school, from other students! We have a peer abuse epidemic in American public schools and have for decades. I’m still trying my best to recover from the emotional scars of my childhood academics.
We learned only half of the lesson of Columbine, one half was that kids can kill when pushed too far. The other half, the ignored half was the reasons why. Which was discovered fairly early on but seems to fallen out of the public consciousness. Now we focus our attention on profiling “troubled” students alone without giving consideration to, or most importantly, protection FROM what or WHO is troubling them in the first place.
6th through 9th grades for me (I home schooled after that) were like the goddamned wild west, and the victims of school bullying often get as much scorn as the perpetrators.
And I keep hearing people saying “don’t try to make people feel sorry for him because he got teased as a kid, he was a sick demented person”. I agree with the idea that he was a sick and demented person, but we learn NOTHING if we don’t try to examine the reasons WHY.
There are ALWAYS reasons why! Being mentally ill alone doesn’t make you into a killer. I’ve been diagnosed bipolar, have suffered numerous breakdowns and have a history of almost a decade of emotional abuse and half a decade of physical abuse but that doesn’t make me a killer. I had violent impulses when I was younger because of it, but I had good parenting too.
This is like hereditary diseases, we’re too narrow when we focus on just one gene to be faulty when looking for a cause, when often times it is entire networks of genes working in unpredictable ways that cause such diseases. In a similar vein, there is no one cause that drives someone into being a psychopathic killer, but a network of many interacting events that occur over ones lifespan.
We really do ignore the underlying causes and therefore refuse to learn any lessons from these incidents when we dismiss a person’s traumas and just shrug them off as “sick people” without examining the underlying contributing factors simply because our asses are too lazy to accept the idea that we may have to do some actual scientific investigative work to actually comprehend what makes these things happen.
Better just to paint with a broad stroke quickly so we can move on to the next news cycle.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:13 pmMaybe we do need more God in our lives. The Washington Post has an interesting take on this: http://blog.washingtonpost.com/offbeat/2007/04/mental_health_gun_control_the.html
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:14 pmYeah, I can’t really defend the AFA. I understand what they mean about the moral decline, but the biggest problem with the VT massacre is that Cho was psycho.
Assuming that the video is delivered by snail mail (as opposed to on-line) though, I don’t agree that they’re trying to ‘profit’ from VT; 5 dollars would just about cover CD creation and shipment.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:15 pmComment by Saywho — April 23, 2007 @ 1:06 pm
just how crazy are you? like the guy on the train mmuttering to himself crazy or sitting in your own feces surrounded by canned tomatoes and back issues of gun n ammo crazy?
Comment by wags — April 23, 2007 @ 1:10 pm
ALL OF THE ABOVE – yikes.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:15 pmHow about I pray that the “real” God shows himself and dictates his wishes for us so that we don’t have blow each other up in an attempt to find out which god is the “real” god.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:16 pmI would think that all those folks that decided to take away our children’s self defense option feel pretty bad right now.
Comment by Roger_Roger — April 23, 2007 @ 1:11 pm
Gee R2 why didn’t you respond to my post #29 about the first school shooting in Texas. Had Texas outlawed guns at the time? Then why didnn’t somebody take him out?
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:17 pmWhoah, Roger! I can see it now, kindergartners packing heat! That’ll make us safer. Sure!
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:19 pm“Hopefully this will expediate new rules that allow our Children the chance at self defense of themselves and their classmates.”
Ah, yes, if only we let children have guns….think of the things they could do! Why, they might see someone reach in a backpack and because we’ve scared them shitless with fear*fear*fear they might decide that person is reaching for a gun and shoot him first. They might have a bad day and get a poor grade from a teacher and shoot him.
More college students die from alcohol than shootings so should we just give them all a lifetime supply of vodka to save them from themselves?
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:19 pmI think everyone should do morning – noon- and evening bong hits and we would all be much more peaceful.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:20 pmWhy can’t they get OVER Bill Clinton???
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:20 pmA lot of people claim to be like Jesus. But from his actions he clearly wasn’t. More a fan of Olbermann than Jesus it seems. Where did he send his videos?
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:21 pmNo AFA, they happened because of Jesus. Didn’t you watch Cho’s video? He compared himself to frickin’ Jesus, so it’s all his fault!
Here’s a thought..How about blaming the shooting on a wacko twisting off and acting like a murderous wacko?
If the AFA had existed in the 60’s would they have blamed Whitman’s UT sniper rampage on queers, Clinton, and condoms?
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:23 pmDid the AFA even bother watching the videos?
A lack of prayer, or access to a Bible isn’t exactly what came across as Cho’s problem there.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:26 pmAfter watching that video, I’m having anxiety attacks.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:26 pmGod is going to smite me because Libruls are Satan’s children.
Oh, dear.
Save me someone, please save me!
Don’t let God smite me becasue of the evil Libruls! I’m innocent! I swear!
We are the most religious of all industrial nations, we have more handguns per capita than any other industrial nation and we live in the most violent of industrial nations.
The conservative solution: More religion and more guns. And, this makes perfect sense to them. That’s what we’re dealing with people. Roughly 30% of our population has been driven insane by corporate propaganda.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:27 pmP.S. I’ll send you all the money you want, AFA, just don’t let God smite me.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:28 pmAnything you want! Just ask!
How very neo-con. Start a ‘war on corruption’ to hide your own corruption, when you get caught, yell long and loud that those who caught you are against you because you are against corruption. To be followed, inevitably by ‘Bill Clinton did it first.’
Sorry, boys, nobody but a few tired old DC pundits (this means you, David Broder) is buying any more.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:29 pmThat would definately be the same bible that promotes waging war and killing people. I’m sure that the American anti-family association is not referring to anything that Jesus said.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:36 pmPatrick1:
So here spinning the same crap that Fux news tells you? I think they’ve got just a bit of jealousy going on that they weren’t mailed the videos.
And I think if he was more of a liberal, he would be comparing himself to say Ghandi not Jesus.
But go on keep living in your own stupid “faith based” reality. Truth is if you got rid of every liberal, and non christian, murder rates, incest, and everything else bad would increase. After all what kind of screwed up religion changes “Thou Shalt Not Kill” to “Thou Shalt Not Murder”.. It’s so you can still kill, you know brown people of other religions. Funny they call you infidels, you call them Islamofascist, I call you both FUKCED UP!
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:44 pm@ #70 – Because they are jealous that Bill was getting some, that’s why!! I’d take Lewinsky OR Hillary over a farm animal any day!
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:49 pmAFA blames school shootings on lack of prayer, spankings.
Ha ha ha. Yeah, torches and iron maidens also.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:49 pmThe discourse in America is so lopsided. Obama is chastised for “trivializing” the Virginia Tech massacre because he meditated on the culture of violence in America and talked about every kind of violence, intolerance and abuse. But the AFA can riff on the shooting, basically blaming the victims for not being more religious, and they’re applauded and they’re actually allowed to profiteer by selling product. For shame.
April 23rd, 2007 at 1:55 pm>Hopefully this will expediate new rules that allow our Children the chance
>at self defense of themselves and their classmates.
Rodger your an idiot. If we let people have guns on campus, for every school shooting like this, there will be a thousand drunk fratboys shooting off firearms at keggers and blowing away someone who was hitting on thier girlfriend. If this guy walked into a bar and did this would you say everyone should be allowed to carry guns in a bar?
I know you idiots don’t realize that for every action there is a consequence, but when putting forward a suggestion, you have to examine ALL potential consequences, not just the ones that fit your view of the world… in this case the cure would be worse than the disease
Seriously, only a complete retard would think that mixing underage alcohol conspumption (pretty ubititous on campus), firearms and hazing is a good idea. The jock douchebags at my school were frightening enough unarmed, I shudder to think what some of these idiots would do with a headful of vokda and a firearm. Run the numbers, whats the probability you will be killed by a mass murderer’s firearm? Theres been what? about 100 people killed in mass shooting in the usa in the past year? Does that probability justify arming people who are at a stage in thier life where many of them are likely to be feeling reckless, carefree, and intoxicated? Come on man, get a grip. Keep in mind that bathtubs kill about 600 people each year in america. Psychopaths aren’t suppsed to have firearms… yet somehow virgina screwed up and didnt follow the federal law. If anything this tradgedy could have been averted by less permissive or more enforced gun laws. This guy was such a loner that if virginia had followed the federal background prodecure, he may not have even been able to get a gun at all without someone figuring out what he was up to.
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:01 pm#15 katy
I was thinking the same thing. When did they have prayer and the bible in public school? The class of 64. I live in WI.
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:07 pmAgain, if you’ve already got the most gun violence AND you have the most guns, I’m guessing increasing the amount of guns is not a viable solution to gun violence. Shouldn’t this make sense to a sane person?
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:08 pmFrom post #7 …afa is so brazenly political and devastatingly manipulative of devout christians… most likely, but take into consideration, it isn’t just the AFA. Christianity itself, and most other religions are “devastatingly manipulative” fear mongering cults. F*ck Religion period!
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:08 pm#60 – “The AFA is dead wrong. The blame goes to those that decided to not allow our children to protect themselves.” Comment by Roger_Roger — April 23, 2007 @ 1:11 pm
Sounds like you would support my call to allow everyone to carry weapons everywhere.
When Pres. Bush appears in public, and they check everyone to remove licensed weapons from people, Pres. Bush is saying: I hate you! I WANT you to die should anyone attack you while at my public appearance!
Pres. Bush hates anyone that wants to carry a licensed gun in his presence when they are required to remove their licensed weapon!
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:19 pmTruth hurts
here
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:21 pm#68 We already allow our children to shoot guns. I understand that elitist folks like yourself living on the coast don’t actually realize that, but we do. My son was already shooting a 9mm glock when he was 12. He was able to start using a .22 rifle when he was eight. Either way, I certainly wasn’t saying we should allow children that young to conceal and carry. Folks that are 18 years of age and older are allowed. These colleges have decided to make their own rules which simply state people are not allowed to use self defense. This is fine and dandy as long as they then provide the defense they took away from our college age children. They of course failed and 30+ children are now dead because of them. When you take away our right to self defense, it is then your obligation to defend us COMPLETELY. This means that every single college classroom should provide an armed officer in each and every single room across the entire campus. Of course this will be an insane cost to the taxpayer and the poor students trying to pay for college, but we have no other choice when they decide they won’t allow us to protect ourselves. If I was a parent of one of these children, I would sue this school for tens of millions of dollars. If someone took away my sons right to protect himself and then didn’t protect him, they are liable.
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:22 pmAFA has taken the lessons from Elmer Gantry, Harold Hill and other con men who prey upon people’s fears for their own advantage.
Hey, it works for Bush&Co too..
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:31 pmSome idiot had the idea of arming the ROTC and sending them into all the classrooms to ride shotgun. What a stupid idea! We’d have a Kent State every other week. The shooter in the Dawson College killing had military training; and that shooting would have been much worse if two cops hadn’t been on site answering another complaint.
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:31 pmThey happen to be talking about the breakdown and moral decay of society and the world we live in. One reason that it happened was that we live in one super messed up world. Many of the people posting here fail to accept the reality and gravity of exactly how difficult life around the BALL HAS BECOME. Naturally, religion is a method of control implemented to govern the masses! Without law we have chaos and anarchy.
People here love to hang blame on anything they want. He was BI-POLAR (big deal), he was CONFUSED (no he wasn’t), he should not have had GUNS (if he was in compliance with all laws and regulations till that moment then it was within his RIGHTS), WE should BAN ALL GUNS (people that are in compliance with all gun laws in their area should not have their RIGHTS INFRINGED).
Many of you seem to want UTOPIA… Har De Har Har. None of you even want to believe that defending yourself is essential to long term survivability. Now, I mentioned that many parts of the video in question are true. I also mentioned Group-Think as a double edged sword. This does not make me crazy but actually it closes your mind in a trap of DENIAL by pretending that those who insist on individuality as a means to an end merely do nothing more than exist with no true purpose of mind or being.
We (the USA) are a nation of INDUSTRIALIZED CONSUMERS. This method of life we exist in offers us little or no personal satisfaction. We add up the dollars, count the stock, blame “them” when things go wrong, covet the predators, hold ourselves as sacrifices to the greater good of the predators and we never seem to get any place.
We live in a Dog eat Dog country full of lust for more and more of anything that will help us to FEEL BETTER about the truth that we do nothing, make nothing, offer nothing and are void of anything since the only thing the majority of us believe in GLUTTONEY and INDIVIDUALITY.
I pray that the Constitution will survive and that those of you that are armed will shoot straighter than our enemies and that we will have enough ammo to provide for our common defense from those that would kill us!
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:33 pmRodger you idiot you would lose your imaginary lawsuit. And yes you did say “arm the kiddies”… ie.. “allow the children to defend themsevles”.
Are you saying that the government has an obligation to put an armed guard in every bar and every classroom in america? Come on… dude.. 30 people is NOTHING.. sorry… honestly…this thing is being grossy hyped out of proportion. The only real lesson there is learn from this is : DONT LET CRAZY PEOPLE HAVE GUNS!!
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:42 pmRogerX2 and still twice as dumb.
Sorry while I am not against banning guns, letting ANYONE carry them that shouldn’t is just stupid, especially in a school.
See we can regulate the sale of guns, we can regulate idiots (thus you would have been aborted before birth).
Who’s to say that even an armed guard in that class room was a better shot than Cho? And Cho had the element of surprise. Maybe the reason Cho stopped killing was he ran out of bullets? Maybe he coulda killed a few armed students then used their guns to kill others, ohhh the irony of that eh?
Okay so let’s say we allow any student to carry a pistol to school, any nutjob that wants to “Go Cho” will then just bring an Ak-47, then we have an arms race. Good for the gun dealers, bad for the humans.
When does it end Roger? Again I am not against guns, but really look around you, letting every idiot pack a weapon and we’re back to the wild wild west. And with todays youth on every mind altering legal and illegal substance, AND alcohol we have a recipe for disaster.
April 23rd, 2007 at 2:48 pmDaryll, daryll, o’ where art thou, Saint Daryll of 2 Second Land???
If ever there was a thread for our hypocritical pseudo-christian poster, this is it!
Hello?
(maybe he’s at the reprogram yourself not to be a homo retreat this week?)
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:04 pmAccording to the map at the beginning of the 11 of the 19 shootings were in the south, the BIBLE BELT.
In fact a majority of the southern, bible belt states have had school shootings.
HuH…just a coincidence I guess.
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:06 pmRodger you idiot you would lose your imaginary lawsuit. And yes you did say “arm the kiddiesâ€â€¦ ie.. “allow the children to defend themsevlesâ€.
Are you saying that the government has an obligation to put an armed guard in every bar and every classroom in america? Come on… dude.. 30 people is NOTHING.. sorry… honestly…this thing is being grossy hyped out of proportion. The only real lesson there is learn from this is : DONT LET CRAZY PEOPLE HAVE GUNS!!
Comment by Knappy Headed Ho — April 23, 2007 @ 2:42 pm
He suggesting that, my Second Amendment Right is as valid, real and more important than your First Amendment Right to post nonsense on the internet. He is also stating the truth that most people respect the law and if they cannot meet armed force with equal force then the government must provide an armed guard at each and every location that people attend at all times.
Think about this each and every day a local cop is found guilty of dealing drugs or assault or cheating on his/her taxes. Police do receive training and have sworn an oath to protect US. However we are relying on some other guys and gals with guns to do something that we need to do. We are them and they are us and we show up for a gunfight with empty hands each and every day.
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:08 pmDaryll is on assignment with the crew shooting a new documentary,
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:11 pm“Below The Bible Belt”
“People here love to hang blame on anything they want. He was BI-POLAR (big deal), he was CONFUSED (no he wasn’t),”
Saywho – you clearly have never lived with someone or known someone with severe mental disturbance. If you had, you would never be able to say anything like that.
I never knew what was wrong with my son until he was diagnosed at age 11 (from age 2). We just knew there was something really, really wrong with him. What we lived with is too long to write here. I never felt he was just ‘a little boy’ , and on occasion, thought he could be the spawn of the devil (if I believed in that sort of thing). He was charming (and manipulative) as heck to people outside our home. Nobody had a clue what was going on. He was destroying our family with his behaviors and total lack of remorse and his dark rages. We had no control or impact on the situation. The rages and dark moods got worse as time went on and he got closer to adolescence. Once we got the diagnosis, the psychologist told us to go home and look it up. He told us that we would need to make arrangements for when he would no longer be able to live in our home and that these were “the kids that kill”. He told us to take steps to protect ourselves. The psychologist also could not give us any advice on what to do next or who to call.
I was afraid for myself, for my other children, and for all the people he came in contact with. I slept with an alarm on my son’s door so that I would hear when he got up in the middle of the night. Basically, I didn’t sleep much. Everything sharp in the house was in a locked cabinet. That didn’t stop him from taking a piece of broken glass he found in the garage and carving up the inside of his mouth and then coming in with blood pouring out his mouth with a story made up about falling out of a tree. He wanted stitches because he thought they looked cool. He went into a rage when he didn’t get them. He smiled at me as he told me of how he did it, of how hard he had to hit his mouth to get it to swell. He said he wished he had a wasp so he could swallow it and it could sting his throat.
This isn’t rational. This isn’t making excuses. This isn’t about him not taking personal responsibility for his actions. He was incapable. This is just the reason for the behaviors and his disfunctional thinking. This is severe mental disturbance. He can appear perfectly delightful and age appropriate in public. Most people only recognize that something is a little off. Just a few years ago I feared he would need to be locked up somewhere the rest of his life. With intensive help and meds, and therapy, a heavily structured school and home environment, he is doing better now. I don’t know what that will mean for him as an adult.
I am not making excuses for the shooter. I am recognizing the reasons and the tragedy of our system.
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:15 pmDaryll is on assignment with the crew shooting a new documentary,
“Below The Bible Beltâ€
Comment by Raven
Raven, do you happen to know if Daryll is under “deep cover” on that story? :D
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:17 pmI am not making excuses for the shooter. I am recognizing the reasons and the tragedy of our system.
Comment by JG
My best to you and your family, JG.
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:20 pmYour son is lucky to have such a caring parent.
My daughter is a 4.0 student (Smith College), she is an aethist, like my wife and myself. She has never been spanked, punished yes, but never spanked and she turned out just fine…..
These people are sick-00000s.
Plus I have never met a so called christian that was a better individual than myself, I’ll let you know when I do.
Hating the Conservative Christian Hate Machine daily
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:33 pmComment by JG — April 23, 2007 @ 3:15 pm
What???
No Clinton, internet porn, or homosexual references?
How could that be????
Seriously, though, JG, God bless you! Being in a profession that deals with the mentally challenged, I somewhat understand your plight. Having 4 children of my own, I have no idea how you were able to handle that situation so well.
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:33 pmBut your son is lucky to have a compassionate, caring parent!
In what I wrote I was speaking of my own son. In speaking of the shooter, it is clear from interviews that they (the family) recognized there was something really wrong with him early on. They didn’t know what to do. He may have been pick on in school, but I will be willing to bet that he was disturbed before he got there. Bullies seem to zero in on kids who are different. It may have just increased his rage. It was clear he felt victimized in his life real or imagined. There seemed to be a number of times that people (teachers) recognized troubling problems and tried to help. The system is not geared toward helping people who are emotionally disturbed, especially the severely disturbed.
I feel like he was a trainwreck waiting to happen. It is so incredibly tragic that he took so many people with him. I think the solution has to start with fixing the system and identifying these kids early on and making help or even residential treatment available to families if there is any hope of preventing more victims in the future.
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:36 pmI don’t believe the solution is to give more guns to more people. People are not all one size fits all.. Who are the ones more stable and responsible, who are the ones with a hot temper, who are the ones with impulse control problems, who are the ones with hormonally instability, who are the ones who are depressed, who are the ones who are on drugs or who have been drinking, etc.. With more guns you just have more shootings and more tragedies. I know for myself, I have older children in college. If they allow guns on campus I would want them out of that campus.
I think a lot of kids are identified early on in their schools. I get calls from people (teachers and physicians) because they know my situation and they call for advice. I have been dealing with this for 16 years now. They don’t know what to do with these kids. Doctors don’t know what to tell the parents. The system needs to be fixed.
Comment by JG — April 23, 2007 @ 3:15 pm
You ASSUME TOO MUCH….
I’ll bet he has been on many drugs too!! Any way I appreciate your issue however obtaining a handgun is conditional in most locales. In my state a firearms ID card is needed as well as a permit for each gun. Obtaining a card is time consuming. You are required to include a great deal of info for a background check. You must submit to fingerprinting and get a doctor’s note. Beyond that there is a mandatory waiting period for all guns and like I said hand guns require individual permits. There is also a pergery cause that has been a nice touch.
Your mess of a kid will miss out on his 2nd Amendment Rights since he is mentally disturbed. My point is that if you obey the law and pass the requirements and can afford the guns then by all means do so. Did you know that each and every day men are forced to turn in their guns (all of them) should their soon to be X wifes decide to obtain a divorce and utter the words, “He verbally assaulted me!” His 2nd Amendment Right is removed along with 4th Amendment protected possessions based on a verbal.
I can assure you that there are mountains of laws, issues and hurdles that a legal gun owner must endure that an illegal or stolen gun owner does not face.
April 23rd, 2007 at 3:44 pmThese people are sickkkkkk, and we criticize the Muslim religious wackjobs because Allah also condones wanting to do us infidels in. Religion fundamentalist, the biggest haters on the planet. These AFA idiots sound like they were trained by Goebels.
April 23rd, 2007 at 4:03 pmTheir salvation, when they pass, they do so with a smile on their face…..
Your mess of a kid will miss out on his 2nd Amendment Rights since he is mentally disturbed.
Comment by Saywho
What the hell is wrong with you? Why are you attacking JG? Are you so narrowly focused on your favorite rant that you can’t appreciate what JG is saying?
Yeah, we’ve heard it all before. Lock yourself in your armed compound and hope fo rthe best.
April 23rd, 2007 at 4:10 pmI don’t know which is worse: the shooting itself or the people that come out of the woodwork and take advantage of this tragedy to push their own agenda.
April 23rd, 2007 at 4:27 pmYour mess of a kid will miss out on his 2nd Amendment Rights since he is mentally disturbed.
Comment by Saywho
What the hell is wrong with you? Why are you attacking JG? Are you so narrowly focused on your favorite rant that you can’t appreciate what JG is saying?
Yeah, we’ve heard it all before. Lock yourself in your armed compound and hope fo rthe best.
Comment by Zooey — April 23, 2007 @ 4:10 pm
Zooey,
You seem intelligent but then many of us are not what we seem. Your ability to post here centers on the 1st Amendment however the 1st Amendment means nothing without the 2nd Amendment that protects by force if necessary the 1st, 3rd, 4th, etc Amendments.
Now you attempt to infringe on my 1st Amendment Right to dialogue someone that directly spoke to me here. I can only conclude that you are a Fascist posing as a Socialist!
Now in response to your query:
1) Nothing is wrong with me but since there is no Hell your question is pointless!
2) I didn’t attack him/her you just love creating mountains of bumps on the ground. This persons kid is a mess but keep in mind that JG brought that up to comment on my statement, “People here love to hang blame on anything they want. He was BI-POLAR (big deal), he was CONFUSED (no he wasn’t)â€
3) I in fact stated, “I’ll bet he has been on many drugs too!! Any way I appreciate your issue however obtaining a handgun is conditional in most locales.” I went on to describe what getting a legal gun is like in my state!
This thread is about a video and the problem of truly faithless beings running counter to the core of OUR purpose. My need to protect myself and family is more dire then your need to strip citizens of our Constitutional Rights! You live in an imaginary world spinning your homespun or homegrown.
If your intent is to limit my ability to protect myself then the blood is on your hands if you fail to provide the protection given to me by the 2nd Amendment by your limiting action. You may just be a Fascist!
April 23rd, 2007 at 4:35 pmI pray that the Constitution will survive and that those of you that are armed will shoot straighter than our enemies and that we will have enough ammo to provide for our common defense from those that would kill us!
Comment by Saywho — April 23, 2007 @ 2:33 pm
Looney. Too many Jerry Springer for you.
April 23rd, 2007 at 4:38 pmShameless…you would think that the AFA would have a little more respect for the dead.
April 23rd, 2007 at 4:47 pmLooney. Too many Jerry Springer for you.
Comment by Juan C — April 23, 2007 @ 4:38 pm
Since when is it Looney to want to see the US Constitution remain intact?
Since when is it Looney to promote the common defense?
Since when is it Looney to hope that you can shoot better than the other guy in armed conflict?
Since when is it Looney to store supplies in case the SHTF like ammo?
Jerry Springer is on TV and since the kids have taken over the TV (and they watch Sponge Bob) I have never watched that show.
By the way next time try wording that like this…
At least drop the ‘many’ and use ‘much’ instead like this…
April 23rd, 2007 at 5:01 pm
Your comments dont surprise me at all. You are the one that posts apocalyptic scenarios regarding oil shortage and began a discussion about Thermodynamics when you probably dont know too much about it. You are the one that advocates for people having guns to defend themselves from well, whatever menace you want to add. I dont think thats a problem in Sweden or Japan. But hey, keep your guns, be happy.
At least drop the ‘many’ and use ‘much’ instead like this…
Looney. Too MUCH Jerry Springer for you.
Comment by Saywho
Forgot to add shows. We can speak in Spanish if you like…
April 23rd, 2007 at 5:26 pm#99 JG
April 23rd, 2007 at 6:38 pmI am sorry for your family troubles. As a parent, I can imagine your anguish. Best wishes to you and your family.
Even Benny Goodman’s music was considered satanic. I suppose if the AFA had been around in Beethoven’s time, his music would be considered satanic.
April 23rd, 2007 at 6:38 pm“a lack of prayer in school, a lack of the Bible in school, a lack of spanking kids, a lack of physical punishment in school, abortion, condoms, Bill Clinton, internet pornography, free speech, the entertainment industry, “satanic†music, and liberal culture in general.”
Thus spoke the American Taliban.
April 23rd, 2007 at 6:57 pmSounds like the AFA would be happier in Iran.
April 23rd, 2007 at 11:46 pmOnce again, God was too busy being a voyeur and watching teens having pre-marital deviant sex, and couldn’t be bothered to use his omnipotence to save 30 plus humans from a madman. Thanks alot, we humans appreciate your grace.
April 24th, 2007 at 12:10 pmyour so full of bullshit its comeing out of your ears, im glad they took the bible out of schools it has no place in schools or any where eles except for churches do you really think a bible wouldve stopped all these kids from shooting each other if you think that way then your more of a retard then i thought you were and as for spanking students id hurt any teacher or princeable if they wouldve laid a finger on anyone of my kids they did the right thing when they abolished spankings from the schools to me thats an assult if they(teachers) touch any kids any ways i just wanted to tell you your site really sucks…
April 24th, 2007 at 12:51 pmArming the kids in college is a ridiculous notion. To all who think this would be a good idea, have you ever seen these kids on spring break or at a frat party? Sure you might be able to prevent a large massacre like at VT, but you would be replacing that with one or two shooting deaths per day. Idiots!
April 24th, 2007 at 2:17 pm“I pray that the Constitution will survive”
Survive what Saywho…the Bush administration?
April 24th, 2007 at 2:25 pmAs a Christian, please accept my apologies for such an offence by the AFA for using this opportunity to grind an ax instead of offering comfort to families. I’m sorry.
April 25th, 2007 at 12:17 am[...] [...]
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