Fineman: ‘A Lot Of Voters’ Find ‘Hierarchical’ ‘Male’ Qualities In Politicians ‘Reassuring’
Fineman: ‘A Lot Of Voters’ Find ‘Hierarchical’ ‘Male’ Qualities In Politicians ‘Reassuring’
Tonight, prior to the first Republican presidential debate, MSNBC showed footage of all 10 participating candidates holding a “regal,” coronation-esque walk-through of the Reagan Library, where the debate is being held.
Commenting on the candidates, MSNBC analyst and Newsweek editor Howard Fineman said, “There is a hierarchical, there is, dare I say it, male, there’s an old-line quality to them that some voters, indeed a lot of voters, find reassuring.” Watch it:
Maybe Fineman is projecting. A CBS News/New York Times poll last year found that 92 percent of Americans would vote for a qualified woman for president.
Transcript:
OLBERMANN: Let’s just sit here a moment more as we watch this. And this touches on the idea of regal qualities that were not seen in South Carolina. This is the prosession, this is the parade, these are tonight’s debaters. The ten candidates, filing out, just in fact to our right. We can see them from where we are seated. There is a coronation quality that just was not present in South Carolina.
FINEMAN: Keith, if you look at that picture and took away all of the writing and all of the words, and just had the image, could the American people tell that those were Republicans? I think the answer is yes. There is a hierarchical, there is, dare I say it, male, there is an old-line quality to them that some voters, indeed a lot of voters, find reassuring. And this is something that the Democrats need to understand. The Democrats are the “we are family” party, which is great, but this is the other side of the conversation and this is their home here. We really are in Reagan country.
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Howard Fineman. Buttboy for republicans. A perfect example of current mainstream media thinking.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:47 pmWell, voting in a poll is one thing. Voting in the election is something else. There is good data to show that Americans would like for you to think that they are open minded when in fact we are not.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:50 pmyou could call it “projecting”…
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:51 pmi say it’s more like “planting”, planting that little thought seed…
the power of suggestion…
“Maybe Fineman is projecting”. LOL. Perfect. What a gasbag.
Yet another drawback to the Bipolar Cable News Format. People will say ANYTHING just to keep talking.
ANYTHING. What an idiot.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:52 pmDo you think he means the kind of “male” qualities that Mark Foley exhibited?
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:52 pmWe all know that the misogynistic Fundamentalists are afraid of women, and they will do anything to keep us oppressed.
The fact that they are crying even louder about the “failures” of Feminism (cue Jason M. Hitler) than ever before, and making nonsensical statements such as this proves that they are losing this war as well…
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:52 pmsounds like a perfectly healthy expression of masculine awesomeness. anyone notice if both fineman’s hands were above the desk?
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:52 pmInsert your own homoerotic joke about Republicans needing a big strong Daddy to comfort them.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:52 pmunfortunately, it’s true -
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:52 pmNot every republican is a pedophile but every pedophile IS a republican. Kinda throws a wrench in your drivel eh Fineman?
http://www.armchairsubversive.com/
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:53 pmWhat a stupid remark by Fineman.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:53 pmIndeed, perhaps Mr. Fineman prefers his leaders to be “manly, Daddy” types, all the better to teach necessary discipline to naughty little boys…
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:53 pmOh Howie, I love that you work for Newsweek…a place of authority..please hold me and make me feel warm and safe…Howie, you complete me….
What a daddy worshipping assclown.
-GSD
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:54 pmThe average man doesn’t want to be free, he wants to be safe
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:55 pmFindman. Huh.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:55 pmThe dying Rape-Public-Can idealogy will go to their grave, with dementia, like Ronnie never acknowledging their entire platform is fluff. Style trumps results and accountability. All that matters to these intellectually devoid brownshirt fake Americans is ‘how do I look, issues be damned’.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:56 pmAlmost makes me want to grab a 12 pack, pull up the couch and watch the buffoonery of Reaganesque male models stutting around the cat walk out there in Reagan country.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:57 pmBut, as I’m not titillated by the oozing of macho male bluster, threats and gibberish, I’m going to go cook dinner, and do the laundry.
“We really are in Reagan country.”
Considering they don’t have a single coherent or conscious candidate in the race - most definitely! LOL
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:57 pmCenter voters WILL seceretly vote for hardliners, for sure. Maybe that’s what Fineman meant.
May 3rd, 2007 at 7:59 pmWhat about Rudy’s male hierarchical qualities?
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:00 pmYes, there are a lot of Americans who would be happy to see a totalitarian dictatorship, a new King George, if you will.
Roughly 30% of any given population is genetically predisposed to follow an authoritarian leader, even to their doom. And they will happily take the rest of us down with them, if only to keep from having to admit they were duped.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:00 pmwhat about “who pretends to be a soldier” or “gleans foreign policy cues from playing ‘risk’” or “takes cues from consultants who have been wrong about pretty much everything”? did he mention those qualities too?
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:00 pmI like Richardson and Edwards a lot, but these kinds of statements make me want to rush to the polls and pull the lever for Hillary. That we have never had a woman running things is a disgrace to our society.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:01 pmThe average man doesn’t want to be free, he wants to be safe
Comment by klyde — May 3, 2007 @ 7:55 pm
If true, then the average man would be content to live out his days in solitary confinement. In fact, that environment would be ideal, according to your premise.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:02 pmyep
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:02 pmOLD WHITE MEN
so what’s new?
jeff: “Center voters WILL seceretly vote for hardliners, for sure.”
I’m guessing that there are more than a few republican women who will secretly vote for Hillary if she’s on the ballot.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:03 pm“Americans would like for you to think that they are open minded when in fact we are not.
Comment by ecthompson — May 3, 2007 @ 7:50 pm”
By proof, do you mean those who openly renounce homosexuality and abortion both in polls, in the elections, and for personal pleasure?
92%, even if a bit higher than reality, is still really high. In reality, it would depend on the woman. As it should…
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:03 pmAll I can say is that his comments are so incredibly offensive, I need a moment to get over my shock before ripping him to shreds.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:03 pm#14 klyde……….
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:04 pmYou’ve nailed the exact reason which has allowed the neo-con corporate complex to gain control of this country.
It’s so much easier to trust someone or something else to protect, than to be courageous and vigilant and fight for the freedom to be vigilant.
“92 percent of Americans would vote for a qualified woman for president”
They would say that. But 100% would vote for a qualified man, and I think there would be a lot more resistance to voting for a woman than these types of polls would show.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:04 pmThese candidates trying to wash what is happening today,by hanging on history…bringing Reagn’s stories as solutions to today’s problems.
People now want this war ends,want a reasonable affordable health,good education…and to live in peace in this world…and Reagan’s story today will not end it.
Reagan died and we need to look for now and the future.
Is any of these people qualify to be a president?!!
All attempting to wear Ronald Reagan suit tonight.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:08 pm“That we have never had a woman running things is a disgrace to our society.
Comment by Bluedog49 — May 3, 2007 @ 8:01 pm”
Considering we can’t inact an Equal Rights Law in the 21st century, it shouldn’t surprise us. Appall us though? Yes, most definitely it is disgraceful.
Most Industrialized Nations have equal rights laws for women and minorities. They also have national health care, follow the Geneva Convention and don’t put bullets over books…
Of course the traditionalists don’t want that to change. It gives them less competition, and let’s them hang our with more men (wink wink nudge nudge)…
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:12 pmReposting an earlier post of mine
Sorry off topic, but another story TP seems to be ignoring:
http://rawstory.com/ news/ 2007/ DFA_head_Impeachment_more_on_table_0502.html
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:12 pmFineman: ‘A Lot Of Voters’ Find ‘Hierarchical’ ‘Male’ Qualities In Politicians ‘Reassuring’
LOL MAF54 would agree with Fineman
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:13 pmBipolar Cable News format. Just stop watching it. Yeah, even Keith Olbermann. Just stop it. You’ll make it.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:15 pmAnd I’m imagining Daryll is horribly confused right about now….
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:16 pm“But 100% would vote for a qualified man,”
First of all - it’s an anonymous poll. The same people have no problems bashing gay rights or abortion in these polls, so there’s no reason for them to be politically correct about voting for women.
Secondly - 100%? You’ve lost all credibility with your absolutistic delusion. I would vote for Nancy Pelosi over ANY Repug you would nominate. And it’s because she’s one of the most conpetitant leaders we’ve had in the political realm in a ahwile.
“and I think there would be a lot more resistance to voting for a woman than these types of polls would show.
Comment by Markk — May 3, 2007 @ 8:04 pm”
Markkk… The problem is that you DON’T think in the first place…
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:17 pmSome debate side-reading:
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:19 pm- “Rudy’s Primary Problem.”
- “Romney Runs - Away.”
- “Sam Brownback, American Taliban.”
- “Tommy Thompson and the Bush Kiss of Death.”
- “The Prostitution of John McCain.”
“Men, men-men-men-men-men-men-men
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:21 pmso throw your rubbers overboard,
there’s no one here but
men-men-men-men-men-men-men-men…”
Looks like more of a chain gang line up to me.
Hating the Repukian Mafia daily
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:21 pm#37: “I would vote for Nancy Pelosi over ANY Repug you would nominate.”
A *qualified* man, I believe I said.
What people say they will do in a poll and what they actually do are two different things.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:22 pmHow does one go about blocking MSNBC from their cable service?
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:24 pmIt’s a moot point, seeing as the Republicans have yet to produce a “qualified” man.
Of course, that didn’t stop them 6 years ago either………..
Pelosi/Richardson 2008
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:28 pmCongressman Hunter looks ready to start a war…..and he claims he is also ‘Compassionate Conservative’…just like Bush.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:29 pmThe poll was taken out of context. If you read the whole question, it says: 92% would vote for a qualified woman, if no men were on the ballot.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:30 pmpre dem debate spin: watch them lower your expectations!
pre repub debate spin: who gets to be THE NEW REAGAN???
up.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:31 pmchuck.
“What people say they will do in a poll and what they actually do are two different things.
Comment by Markk — May 3, 2007 @ 8:22 pm”
Yes, but not by a lot when it comes to anonymous formats. Even 88% is still a lot…
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:31 pmI would vote for Nancy Pelosi over ANY Repug you would nominate. And it’s because she’s one of the most conpetitant leaders we’ve had in the political realm in a ahwile. — unbelievable
Except for the “impeachment off the table” issue, which I vigorously disagree with, yeah she is pretty good. I would vote for her before voting for Hillary, for sure.
Maybe the Delegates from her own state woke her up a bit. ( see my previous post )
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:33 pmBnF @ 24 I’m pretty sure it was HL Menken who wrote that first. Your premise doesn’t even begin to address the idea of relative safety. The Patriot Act, three strike laws, the Rockerfella drug laws and on and on. All sold to the public as keeping them safe while eroding our freedoms.
Believe what you like but Menken wrote that line because, well because it’s true. Do you really believe the boy king would not have gotten away with his power grab had he not botched his plan with the Iraq invasion and occupation? There was no significant objection to his spying his data mining his arbitrary detentions from the MSM or the general public. It wasn’t until the body count and the monetary cost in Iraq became to high that people began to abandon the junta.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:34 pm#42 trueblue
..[ How does one go about blocking MSNBC from their cable service?
Put your ‘mother in-law’ picture on television screen…
It has been tested
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:34 pmI can’t believe these comments.
Fineman.
Markkk.
paul.
You are so freaking delusional.
Let me ask you - are you married?
Please, just answer me yes or no.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:35 pmAnd I’m imagining Daryll is horribly confused right about now….
Comment by Raven
Confusion is a constant state of being for that troll.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:36 pmPaul - from the article:
“Ninety-two percent of adults now say they would vote for a woman for president from their political party if she were qualified for the job. This support has increased steadily over the past 50 years.
In a Gallup poll conducted in 1955, 52 percent said they would support a woman for president. That number rose to 73 percent in 1975 and to 82 percent in 1987. “
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:40 pm::sigh::
Fineman finds father figures reassuring, drools over the scene of Republican candidates walking into a room, and thinks everyone feels the way he does.
On the other hand, the irony of a man drooling over the male candidates of the homophobic party was probably lost on Fineman.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:40 pmRemember…this is not Edward R. Murrow(God rest his soul)…this is howard fiiiinemannnn….
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:41 pmDaryll can always lick his diploma from Oral Roberts when he gets confused. That seems to get him calmed down and incoherent.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:43 pmMarkkk.
paul.
Are you married?
Simple question. Please answer.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:43 pmFineman said, “There is a hierarchical, there is, dare I say it, male, there’s an old-line quality to them that some voters, indeed a lot of voters, find reassuring.â€
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:44 pmNone of the voters I know find anything reassuring about this pathetic group of wrinkled old white fools parading as candidates.
“Except for the “impeachment off the table†issue, which I vigorously disagree with, yeah she is pretty good.”
Mee too, but I know why she did it though… She knew she didn’t have the votes, and decided a different approach of standing up to the bully. She actually thought about it, and I respect that over what the Chimps does…
“I would vote for her before voting for Hillary, for sure.”
Most definitely. But since she isn’t running, I hope Al Gore will…
“Maybe the Delegates from her own state woke her up a bit. ( see my previous post )
Comment by Wayne — May 3, 2007 @ 8:33 pm”
Unfortunately, she still doesn’t have the votes - yet. But I’m still optimistic too :)
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:46 pmpa·tri·arch·y /ˈpeɪtriˌɑrki/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[pey-tree-ahr-kee] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:48 pm–noun, plural -ies. 1. a form of social organization in which the father is the supreme authority in the family, clan, or tribe and descent is reckoned in the male line, with the children belonging to the father’s clan or tribe.
2. a society, community, or country based on this social organization.
How coincidental that the three Monotheistic Religions..Judism, Christianity, and Islam… all subscribe to Patriarchy.
Like Helen Caldicot says… this works for Cave Bears,,but not for Nuclear Weapons!
“Daryll can always lick his diploma from Oral Roberts when he gets confused. That seems to get him calmed down and incoherent.
Comment by RUCerious — May 3, 2007 @ 8:43 pm”
Welcome back… I see nothing has slowed you down LOL :D
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:48 pmHey un!
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:50 pmFeeling a lil spryer each and every day now…
And for all of you knuckle draggers out there who think a woman could never get elected to the highest office in the US because Americans are not “ready” for a woman president, even Pakistan and India -no beacons of liberalism by any stretch of the imagination- have had female Prime Ministers.
The Philippines, Chile, Nicaragua are among the countries that have also elected female heads of state.
Think about it, you twits, you drag your knuckles even lower than the knuckle draggers in any of those countries.
And you still think the US can “export” democracy? Puh-lee-ze.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:53 pm“Feeling a lil spryer each and every day now…
Comment by RUCerious — May 3, 2007 @ 8:50 pm”
So glad to hear that! Definitely not the same without you. Good to see you back.
Haven’t seen Daryll in a while… He’s probably busy “saving” all those poor homosexuals… LOL
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:54 pmThe only candidate that has a clue is RON PAUL.
He understands the need to audit the Federal Reserve and stop defending Israel.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:56 pmSenator Sam Brownback sounds like Pat Robertson…
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:00 pmFineman said, “There is a hierarchical, there is, dare I say it, male, there’s an old-line quality to them that some voters, indeed a lot of voters, find reassuring.â€
None of the voters I know find anything reassuring about this pathetic group of wrinkled old white fools parading as candidates.
Comment by RUCerious — May 3, 2007 @ 8:44 pm
Exactly. Many of us think they looked more like goose stepping, doddering old fools. Very scary in their incompetence, just like more Bushwad.
What are the trolls so worried about? Do they think the election is tomorrow?
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:05 pmAre you married?
Simple question. Please answer.
Comment by trueblue — May 3, 2007 @ 8:43 pm
Don’t bother asking anymore, you’ll just feel sorry for their wives if they are. But I’m quite sure they are all terminally single.
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:06 pmGregor… your comment reminded me of this John Pilger article:
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article17637.htm
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:09 pmHow can these candidates keep talking about reducing and eliminating taxes but they want to continue to spend money on wars and military adventures….
That is a dangerous formula that has been tried and that is why we have the worst deficit in US history that we have to raise the National Debt Ceiling so we can print more money…that is coming from selling Treasury Papers to foreign countries like China and others.
Ron Paul is right , he understands this more than all of them.
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:09 pmtrueblue. I thought that everyone would understand I was joking. I am married. My wife is a talented professional and definitely smarter, and in many ways, more capable than I am. (Although, I am better looking and more modest). I would definitely vote for a qualified woman and, although it is difficult to know for sure, I am probably more of a feminist than most here. Next time I try to be funny, I’ll put one of these ;) on the end.
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:15 pmTerryTheTurtle,
Thanks for the link. Interesting interview.
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:33 pmSomeone has to be kidding. These apologists need to be sent to the showers or at least a bath - rubber ducky anyone?
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:44 pmThat comment was really stupid. These are people like you and me, nothing more beneath the expensive suit. They can walk around and do all the stupid things the media told them to do, so they think they are powerful, but most of them are crooks and all of them are politicians, so…there is no hope. Even Miss Universe drops turds that would make me faint.
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:48 pmSorry I offended you Juan!
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:58 pmthese guys are completely delusional. They actually believe that they did well tonight.
May 3rd, 2007 at 10:38 pmReagan Reagan Reagan….. he sucked it large, and yet, they hold him up as a GOD. They certainly can’t hold up the boy king idiot as the beacon of the republican party, so they revert to the, thankfully dead, puppet #1.
Evolution- 0
Abortion- 0
Gay rights- 0
War- 100
These assholes need to crawl under a large rock and wither away.
Same with all their apologists and “political advisors”
Haha…. just saw Jon Stewarts “english” correspondent lurking in the background at the aftershow with Keith Olberman. That should be a good indication of a slam dunk for the show tomorrow night.
Sorry I offended you Juan!
Comment by WaltTheMan
Ha. I bet you have never said anything stupid in your life, Walt.
I meant the comment that is the reason for the thread.
May 3rd, 2007 at 10:39 pmI am thinking Fineman doesn’t know the word patriarchal.
May 3rd, 2007 at 10:45 pm#76 Take an apology at face value, Juan.
May 3rd, 2007 at 10:46 pmTake an apology at face value, Juan.
Comment by JPark — May 3, 2007 @ 10:46 pm
My guess is that Walt was being sarcastic. I would never refer any comment from him as stupid. He knows that.
May 3rd, 2007 at 10:58 pmNothing like 10 white guys standing there telling women what to do with their own medical health.
May 3rd, 2007 at 10:59 pm#79 Then you have my apology :)
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:01 pmpretty weird stuff
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:08 pmThis has been a great example of killing the messenger. I would vote for pelosi in a heartbeat however, some people-ya many people ” might ” feel better with a male president. Next, Fineman is not Friedman.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:09 pmThen you have my apology :)
Comment by JPark
Ha ha ha. Nope. That will happen when you offend me.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:17 pmAnd I bet you could not beat me in a soccer match, so I guess thats not possible. ;)
Another Republican lapdog in the corporate media.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:18 pmAfter the Office I watched the debate. I didn’t think something could be so funny. Half of them looked and acted like Micheal and half like Dwight. I don’t count John McCain in that mix, he’s not funny.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:20 pm#84 I could never beat you in soccer!! Don’t come across the middle on a pass from your quarterback though.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:20 pmAs long as as its not a shrill, opportunistic, calculating and cold bitch trading on her husband’s popularity. Jennifer Granholm, Dianne Feinstein, Nancy Pelosi, hell yes. Hillary? Hell no! She would do nothing to bring this country together and does not deserve it.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:23 pmTarzan - I know you have heard this before, but reasonable tax reductions produce more income for the Treasury due to increased economic productivity. But I know if you discovered such data on your own and agreed with me, the powers that be would revoke your Prog Card for spouting progressive “economic heresy”. Smart politicians from JFK and Ronald Reagan to Bill Richardson know this to be true. Why do Progressives hate the truth?
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:24 pm#88 I agree. Unfortunately, I have a feeling she will win the primary. I have no option but to vote for her in the general as the Republicans will put up their most vile candidate.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:26 pm#89 Tranny, that can be true. However, you righties take John Maynard Keynes way out of context. He is for both raising and lowering taxes(and running deficits) to offset current dangerous situations. There is no way he would support lowering taxes during wartime and he certainly wouldn’t countenance the huge deficits we are running now.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:31 pm#90 - Gore needs to get in the race and crush her. She will definitely get crushed in the general by McCain, Thompson, Giuliani or Romney. I also have to admit that I (and I suspect many other Dems) might vote for McCain or Giuliani over Hillary.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:33 pm#89 It is pretty simple, with a recession we should raise taxes (for the people) to offset the low prices. With inflation we should lower taxes (for the people) to offset the low supply. With deflation we should have a governmental surplus, with inflation we should have a deficit. But that is just too damn complicated for you righties, isn’t it?
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:34 pmSmart politicians from JFK and Ronald Reagan… ?
Comment by valiant venus — May 3, 2007 @ 11:24 pm
NO wonder why Bush was elected twice.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:35 pm#92 I agree that Gore should run. He would have my vote. I would never vote for McCain. He is just Hillary+neocon. Giulliani might get my vote if he weren’t such an authoritarian.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:35 pm#94 Be fair, the Republicans supported the first female president, Nancy Reagan.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:40 pmIt is time for Gore (with Obama as his running mate).
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:42 pm#97 Not sure I want a DLC shill as a VP. He probably couldn’t get away with Kucinich as a running mate but Edwards, Clark or Richardson wouldn’t be bad.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:45 pmThis is my post in the above thread.
My guess is that the political ruling class protect themselves to some extent. They wont go hard on Bush, cuz it can happen to them sometime. I mean Clinton must still be laughing, cuz he didnt lose anything, his wife is there, he holds the contacts, he is a likeable guy…I mean, he is laughing.
You follow the names of politicians and tell me if they are “new†people: The Bush, The Kennedys, etc… pure nepotism. You rarely see a guy without some Ivy League education in the higher ranks of US politics, a working class guy. No, they just keep passing the power between them so it appears that there is something called DEMOCRACY, but that ruling class stays there no matter what.
Comment by Juan C — May 3, 2007 @ 11:15 pm
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:46 pm#99 Yeah, that is true for the most part. You can’t win an election without a lot of money. It really keeps the corporatocracy in power.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:51 pm#91 - JPark - Thank you for the brief synopsis of Keynesian economics. I prefer the policies of Milton Friedman and Friedrich von Hayek. Both trusted the citizenry more than Keynes ever could.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:58 pmDems should run a true Prog ticket to reward you fine activists in Neverland…I mean Prog-land. I would love to see a real contest of ideas with a Gore/Kucinich ticket!!! My choice for the Repubs: Thompson/Guiliani.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:01 amI prefer the policies of Milton Friedman and Friedrich von Hayek. Both trusted the citizenry more than Keynes ever could.
Comment by valiant venus — May 3, 2007 @ 11:58 pm
Sure, thats so obvious.
Corporations = NON public scrutiny
Democracy = Public scrutiny.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:02 amNice debate. Glad to see the leaders who matter speaking on important issues.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:03 amThanks Juan, for showing us how little you know about the US. Please look up Ronald Reagan’s pre-Hollywood days, Jimmy Carter’s pedigree, and the histories of Gerald Ford, Richard Nixon, LBJ, Dwight Eisenhower, and Harry Truman. Even our last Ivy Leaguer, Bill Clinton, came from modest circumstances.
Then get back with us with the rest of your class-envy talking points…….
May 4th, 2007 at 12:05 amWondering if Fineman is in any way related to Fonebone from Mad magazine??
May 4th, 2007 at 12:07 am#101 Oh, come on Tranny, you don’t buy their theories either. You love you some Adam Smith, just like every righty.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:07 am#102 Um, is that really the dream Repug ticket? I doubt it.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:07 am#105 Modest circumstances? What are you, a Ford?
May 4th, 2007 at 12:08 amThen get back with us with the rest of your class-envy talking points…….
Comment by valiant venus
You keep admiring those that own you.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:09 amthis is from the anti-war planes thread… works here, now that i find it…
i watched the first hour of the debate… made a few notes…
the only one that really scared me was mccave… what a poser…
talk about delusions of grandeur…
but, to be sure, st.ronnie had his name and “honor†invoked
many many times, gratuitously and unabashedly…
if i were nancy, i’d have been embarrassed…
there has to be a clip of mccave’s response to a binladen question…
May 4th, 2007 at 12:10 amhe’s all gruff and tuff and puffed up and scowling…
and he says he would “follow him to the gates of hell”…
and then he grins this huge, fake, ugly, shiteatin’ grin…
really ugly, wacko…
Juan - WHY do you think average citizens are such idiots that they can’t make it without the hand of government propelling or propping them up? I have much more faith in the American citizen - we argue, have multiple news sources and tons of info.
Now I can understand living in the corrupt narco-run state of Mexico that your cynicism is sadly malignant….but I hear Venezuela is turning the socialist corner rapidly….maybe they could use your expertise, praise and propaganda!
Time to change my nail polish! Tooodles……
May 4th, 2007 at 12:11 amI apologize, Tranny. I buy that you are a follower of Milton Friedman, the economist to the stars. He has never been right (the many times the Rethugs have tried trickle down proves that). Friedman died without ever having been right about anything. Pathetic.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:11 am>My choice for the Repubs: Thompson/Guiliani.- by valiant venus
a person who lives his life pretending to be someone else, and a cross dresser…. what an aprorpriate choice for you. howse that hormone therapy going methhead megan? it been able to make your breasts thicker than your armhair yet? hahahahaha.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:13 amkaty, McPain showed off his truly neandertal side tonight.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:13 amScored points with the 28%ers and turned the rest of the nation’s collective stomach.
Waiting on Juan to give us the histories of the Presidents I mentioned through the sadly cynical C*mm#nist lens…….
Good night, little comrade…..such a precious useful idiot!
May 4th, 2007 at 12:13 amWhat are you, a Ford?
Comment by JPark — May 4, 2007 @ 12:08 am
Or a McNamara, Rockefeller, Iacocca, zzzzzz…
May 4th, 2007 at 12:14 am#115 Still waiting for you to prove they were the paupers you claim they were.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:16 am*yawn*
May 4th, 2007 at 12:16 amMore like a Carnegie. Andrew liked shooting at his workers. I am thinking Tranny would relate. But they have done way too much good in the last 50 years so I guess not.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:17 amTranny goosesteps with the best of them. Good little Nazi.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:18 amAndrew liked shooting at his workers. I am thinking Tranny would relate. But they have done way too much good in the last 50 years so I guess not.
Comment by JPark
Must be a Britney wannabe…
May 4th, 2007 at 12:20 am#121 Nope, more like a Tori Spelling wannabe. Ew.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:25 amsome thoughts from my notes:
huckabee gave a decent answer on the global warming question:
the boy scout rule - leave the place in better shape that you found it…
rudy had the balls to remain pro-choice… sort of…
he would also be “ok” if roe was repealed, or stood as presedence…
while romney has studied and thought about cloning and decided
he should change his mind about choice… huh…
when asked, can you be reagan?, mccave’s voice breaks and squeeks…
… so, no…
about corruption - seems many dems have money in their freezers, according to brownback… tancredo reminded all that corruption was
not unique to republicRATs…
besides the innumerable times that st.ronnie was mentioned,
there were several references to “islamo-fascists/fascism”…
and matthews kept thinking he was doing hardball interviews…
May 4th, 2007 at 12:30 am…
Nope, more like a Tori Spelling wannabe. Ew.
Comment by JPark
That must be really sad. But, then again jokes about dead children is not THAT happy, right?
May 4th, 2007 at 12:31 am#124 That is the sickest thing in the world. I have a son and there is no way I would ever joke about his death. I have dreamt about it and woken up in a cold sweat. That is just fricking sick.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:35 amScored points with the 28%ers and turned the rest of the nation’s collective stomach.
Comment by RUCerious — May 4, 2007 @ 12:13 am
ugh… i know i was recoiling… it was such a bad performance…
i no longer “feel bad” for him, that’s for sure…
so, it’s like riding a bike, right? … you seem to have jumped right back into the swing of things here…
i’ll take my turn to say welcome back and so glad to hear your news
May 4th, 2007 at 12:39 amwas good news… keep up the good work… just pace yourself! :-)
…
That is just fricking sick.
Comment by JPark — May 4, 2007 @ 12:35 am
Thats life for some. Do beetles like to eat dog crap? Probably not, but they have to.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:39 am#127 It is still the one thing that gets me riled. To joke about her own childs death proves she is inhuman. She is someone who shouldn’t be allowed to breed.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:43 amIt’s interesting that qualities that people find attractive in male candidates, like assertiveness, are unacceptable in a woman. Susan Faludi had a word for it (and a book): Backlash. The politics of Kucinich or Edwards look better to me than Clinton’s right now, but she’d be a vastly–vastly!–better choice than any of the ten automatons in tonight’s debate.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:46 amShe is someone who shouldn’t be allowed to breed.
Comment by JPark — May 4, 2007 @ 12:43 am
I dont buy any of her stories. Even sociopaths have more grace.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:46 amIt’s strange how qualities that are appealing in men candidates, like assertiveness, are unacceptable in a woman. Susan Faludi had a word (and a book) for it: Backlash. Right now the policies of Edwards or Kucinich look better to me than Clinton’s, but she’d be a vastly better choice than any of the ten automatons in tonight’s debate. And she’s been effective in the Senate, as her enormous majority in the last election demonstrates. No Republicans would admit it openly, but she has even won the grudging respect of some of them. It amazes me that anyone would consider voting for a Republican after six years of their disastrous one-party rule.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:52 am#130 I do. I have met sociopaths and narcissists before. They care about themselves and a good dead child story would get them some attention. Good or bad, attention is attention.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:54 amCould be. She would feel all alone in right wing blogs, I guess.
Jpark, Im done, buddy.
Take care, King of the Wicked.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:55 amNight Juan. Sleep well.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:00 amI love you, JPark.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:13 amI love you, too, Juan C.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:14 amNice namejack, homophobe.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:14 amI hosted a progressive radio show during the ‘04 election. Here’s a story for you.
Starting in April ‘04, I started getting bi-weekly calls from Joanie, a 65 year old, who had had it with Bush. “oh Johnnie, your right, he’s ruining the country, we got to get him outâ€. This went on , by May it was, “I’m getting other people to join and we’re all going to the polls together. I’ve got 2 more alreadyâ€. By July it was 4 more. By September the car was full and we were talking about a caravan.
Two days after the election she called. Joan , “Johnnie, I’m sorry, your going to hate meâ€. Me, “Why Joanie, what happenedâ€. Joan, “I voted for Bushâ€. Me “What !!! Why!!!â€. Joan “I just couldn’t stand that Theresa Heines Kerryâ€
My point - women just don’t support women. At least not women who were born 1965 or earlier - I don’t know about women younger then that.
Trust me, I don’t get it, I don’t understand, but it’s true. I saw it a lot in the corporate world.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:16 am#138 I buy that. That was a different generation and it is a generation that votes.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:18 am#139
Yes exactly. As the call went on, I asked her why she just didn’t vote at all instead of casting a vote for Bush. She was almost confused by the question. As if not voting was not an option.
Imagine though - voting for the IncompetentCorruptAmericanPrince because she didn’t like Theresa Kerry’s personality.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:29 am#140 I don’t get it. I like spicy women. Why would you be the least interested in a June Cleaver. I guess it is definitely a generational thing. How boring.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:33 amAll the GOPers in DC make me puke, so cut the crap of them being leaders of anything but corruption. They do not reassure me in any way: PERIOD.
May 4th, 2007 at 1:38 amA CBS News/New York Times poll last year found that 92 percent of Americans would vote for a qualified woman for president.
No, a poll found that 92% of people SAID they would vote for a woman, not that they actually would.
There’s a viable black candidate in the next Presidential election. Wait and see the difference between the % of people who say they have no inherent opposition to voting for a black candidate over a white one, and the % that actually do.
May 4th, 2007 at 5:26 amOr just check the polls of this already available.
TO UNDERSTAND THE IRAQ OIL TAKEOVER WATCH THIS SMALL ANIMATION TO EXPLAIN EVERYTHING
Oil law animation A MUST WATCH TO UNDERSTAND WHAT BUSH IS UP TO
http://www.handsoffiraqioil.org/
its so easy to understand
May 4th, 2007 at 5:48 amI’ve seen more dignified and stately lineups at urinals in the mens bathroom. The only difference is at the urinals they have thier hands on their own piece instead of the guy next to them. what a bunch of tools, this who thing was stagemanaged and airbrushed to a sickening degree.. these people have sold thier souls and thier nothing but pieces in a bloody malfunctioning machine. my worse wishes to all of them but Ron Paul, who actually is more a of real conservative than any of them..
May 4th, 2007 at 6:07 amA bunch of old men competing to show who is the most “religious”, who hates women the most, and who hates gays the most.
They should be competing in the Iranian presidential elections!!!!
It says everything about the US’ current status as a failed state that something close to half of Americans will vote for these bozzos.
May 4th, 2007 at 6:17 am>Waiting on Juan to give us the histories of the Presidents I mentioned
Valiant Penus Megan we’re still waiting for you to give us the histories of the medals received by your republican heroes in office, since you were so insistent about knowing every detail of murthas.
Let me give you a clue.. about the only one who even got combat related medals was Hagel, who has pretty much called out everything bush has done military wise as pure idiocy.
May 4th, 2007 at 6:35 amTO UNDERSTAND THE IRAQ OIL TAKEOVER WATCH THIS SMALL ANIMATION TO EXPLAIN EVERYTHING
Oil law animation A MUST WATCH TO UNDERSTAND WHAT BUSH IS UP TO
http://www.handsoffiraqioil.org/
its so easy to understand……………………………………
May 4th, 2007 at 7:23 am>Why do Progressives hate the truth? -MethyMightyMeganAprodite
we know where the weapons are. we know without a doubt that saddam husssien has weapons of mass destruction. saddam has links to alqueda. alqueda attacked us on 9-11. i never said saddam was involved with 9-11.
yes, republicans, the picture of truth and consistencey….
and of course, its currently the dems who are fighting desparately against having to put thier hands on a bible and swear to tell the truth…goodling trying to take the 5th before shes even questioned, gonzo constructively pleading the 5th via selective inability to remember what he recalled and piggy boy karl desparately invoking every phantom non existent constitutional concept he can to avoid him or his emails being subject to public scrutiny. im sure your going to dazzle us with all your brilliant knowledge about how clinton officials made even greater attempts to avoid being put under a oath than dumbbya did.
honestly, ive figured you out megan. you feed off this negativity. you desparately desire attention, but both your physical apperance and personality is so mindnumbingly putrid, this negative attention is the only type you can get, so you crave it like a drug. and after seeing boy after boy ignore you and pay attention to the bubbly curly haired liberal chicks on campus instead, you’ve developed a pathlogical hatred of anything liberal and a desire to get some sort of attention, however poisonous, to fill the empty meaningless hole that is your soul. Sending cupcakes and a polaroid of your emaciated a3s to some soldiers in iraq who are so horny they’d f#ck a camel is about the only thing that gives your life more meaning than the repeatedly lashings reality and its liberal bias give you here on a daily basis.
please, post here all you want, but for christ sakes try to do something in your life more than pretending to worry about how the only thing that separates us from a reality where our tax dollars go to fund gay islamic weddings for al-queda is people like you and the people you send cupcakes too. once again, i wonder if you will, for a moment, give us a rough idea of of exactly how much more likely it is that if any of us are murdered, chances are it will be one of our fellow countrymen that did it. so far this decade, the terrorist are about a million deaths behind ourselves when it comes to killing americans. i’d quote stats, but i have before, and frankly, i’ve yet to see a single right winger be swayed by this reality.
May 4th, 2007 at 7:52 amOil law animation
A MUST WATCH TO UNDERSTAND WHAT BUSH IS UP TO only last 1 minutes and leaves you so informed
http://www.handsoffiraqioil.org/
May 4th, 2007 at 8:09 amexactly why we need people like Obama and Clinton running…
May 4th, 2007 at 8:46 amFineman: What an ass.
May 4th, 2007 at 8:46 amGORE/OBAMA! TO WIN.
HILLARY: ANOTHER KERRY ONLY SHRILLER AND MORE ANNOYING AND WITHOUT ANY LEADERSHIP SKILLS WHATSOEVER.
May 4th, 2007 at 9:59 amFineman’s an ass. Yeah we ALL want big daddy, big chief, the frickin’ “commander” to keep us safe, stupid and overfed. Right…. But what about Olbermann? This guy is tea-bagging these Re-thugs here. The so-called “regal qualities” of these men could be translated as they are all rich, white and corporate looking too.
This begs the question, since when has the presidency judged in terms royalty? Its enough to make Ben Franklin wretch.
For as Olbermann giddily portrayed the “coronation quality that just was not present in South Carolina,” what this intimates is the most base form of elitism on his part. Its just gross. This guy’s just as much a military-industrial-complex cheerleader as his waspy cohort Matthews. Be he’s much worse for wearing “liberal” clothing over his sycophantic, apologist stance that he confers to the Righty candidates in this example.
And just check out his glib, school-boy sniggering when it comes to Mike Gravel. He compares him to Zell Miller. This in itself is very telling. And dead wrong, Sir Olbermann.
May 4th, 2007 at 10:21 am“First of all - it’s an anonymous poll. The same people have no problems bashing gay rights or abortion in these polls, so there’s no reason for them to be politically correct about voting for women.”
What I’m saying is–they believe they aren’t sexist. But when it comes down to it, they will find some reason, any reason, not to vote for a woman, a reason that wouldn’t stop them from voting for a man. It’s practically unconscious.
I don’t think these numbers are huge, but they are there.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:08 pmNice to see that white old men are still held to the highest regard in the halls of republican elitism just because they are, well, male, white and old! Fineman sounds like a groupie.
May 4th, 2007 at 12:33 pm“Almost makes me want to grab a 12 pack, pull up the couch and watch the buffoonery of Reaganesque male models stutting around the cat walk out there in Reagan country.”
Comment by Raven — May 3, 2007 @ 7:57 pm
Come on, someone needs to do a You Tube of these males on the cat walk - too sexy for Fineman’s shirt. Or even “My Heart Belongs to Daddy” - Eartha Kitt’s version.
It’s too perfect - that is if you could get the MSNBC footage. They seem to want to lock it up in copyright protection.
DT
May 4th, 2007 at 12:53 pmI was thinking the same thing!
May 4th, 2007 at 3:40 pmFineman, like so many other ‘journalists’, assumes that he and the world are the same.
May 4th, 2007 at 6:13 pmtonight 10 white men danced around each question very similar to”dancing with the lame and desperate”as if they could dance. So, that is what we as a naton call a debate?It’s a “Fox trot”……………… Rupert send in the band and leave reality to those of us who can follow our own muse b peace-our mike
May 5th, 2007 at 12:26 amWhat about Olbermann’s comment about the coronation quality of the procession? Is that a cut at the authoritarian tendencies of the GOP. or what? I have a hard time believing that a certain kingly quality in the chief executive is a good thing. I think he just took a broad slap at the GOP and totally got away with it - again.
May 7th, 2007 at 6:18 am