Murtha: Bush Administration Is Using Petraeus As A Political Prop
Murtha: Bush Administration Is Using Petraeus As A Political Prop
Ever since Gen. David Petraeus was placed in command of U.S. forces in Iraq in February, President Bush and administration officials have repeatedly used him to deflect criticism of their escalation policy. During his Iraq speech yesterday, Bush mentioned Petraeus by name no less than 12 times; at one point he even acknowledged, “the best messenger, by the way, for us is David Petraeus.”
During an appearance on Hardball, Rep. John Murtha (D-PA) slammed the White House for using Petraeus as a political prop. He said the decision to bring Petraeus back to the U.S. for a rare visit last week, days before Congress voted on its Iraq timeline legislation, was “purely a political move,” pointing out that Petraeus made numerous media appearances but did not testify before Congress’ armed services committees.
“I’m saying he came back here at the White House’s request to purely make political statements,” Murtha said. “That’s what I’m saying. There’s no question in my mind about it.” Watch it:
Murtha said he was particularly angered by Petraeus’ claim that al Qaeda, not sectarian civil war, is the greatest threat in Iraq, and that he complained to Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Gen. Peter Pace. “I said, General, these comments that General Petraeus made are absolutely inaccurate, according to the intelligence we have.”
Transcript:
MATTHEWS: Do you think he’d actually sign that bill, or he would consider that hobbling him?
MURTHA: Well, I am not sure. He made up his mind so early, I’m not sure he even read the bill. I mean, this is the problem with this spinning that goes on. They bring Petraeus back, purely a political move. Petraeus comes back here, doesn’t talk to any of us. He only talks to the news media, and so forth, trying to sell this program. Bush was 64 percent when his mission — mission possible, and today he’s 34 percent, so he’s just turned the opposite. And this bill’s not going to make any difference, just like what we say here makes little difference. What’s going to count is what happens on the ground. The Iraqis are going to have to decide it themselves.
MATTHEWS: You know, when you read Petraeus statements to the press corps — and I know you said he didn’t talk to Congress, but they put out this statement. I read it in “The Weekly Standard” this week, which does have Petraeus’s remarks in there. He does say that we`re fighting the central front against al Qaeda in Iraq. Is that true?
MURTHA: That’s absolutely not true. That’s an exaggeration…
MATTHEWS: That`s Petraeus saying that.
MURTHA: That`s Petraeus saying it. I just gave those comments to General Pace. I said, General — just 5, 10 minutes ago I gave them to General Pace. I said, General, these comments that General Petraeus made are absolutely inaccurate, according to the intelligence we have. Now, that’s the kind of stuff he’s saying, and that’s why I say it was purely political.
Now, when I say he didn`t talk to Congress, he talked to a group of members. He didn`t talk to the committees that have jurisdiction over this legislation.
MATTHEWS: Well, why wouldn`t he tell the truth? If his troops are over there getting killed — as you point out, we lost 100 guys this month, one of the worst months — worst month of the year — getting killed by Sunni insurgents and by militia people on the Shia side — why is he blaming it on al Qaeda?
MURTHA: Chris…
MATTHEWS: The people who blew up the World Trade Center. Why`s he doing that?
MURTHA: This whole — whole war, ever since it diverted the attention away from where al Qaeda started, the Taliban in Afghanistan, the war in Afghanistan, where we should have stayed, ever since that time, they`ve been trying to tie this into terrorism. All of us know there`s terrorism all over the world…
MATTHEWS: But he`s not — but Congressman, he`s not a PR man. He`s not a flack for the White House. He`s a general in the field. Why would he be…
MURTHA: Hey, wait a minute.
MATTHEWS: You`re saying he`s singing the song of the ideologues.
MURTHA: I`m saying — I’m saying he came back here at the White House`s request to purely make political statements. That`s what I`m saying. There`s no question in my mind about it.
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General Betrayus is just another lying, crooked, stupid Chimpy crony.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:59 am“I said, General, these comments that General Petraeus made are absolutely inaccurate, according to the intelligence we have.†– - Ya know, at some point, we should consider the real possibilty that our intelligence is perpetually piss-poor.
May 3rd, 2007 at 11:59 amand???
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:01 pmYeah, let’s believe Murtha, the liar who said to Chris Matthews on Hardball, that Gen. Patreus hadn’t met with any member of Congress.
who is lying, Murtha, or Pelosi who claimed to have “met” over the phone for 30 minutes with General Patreus?
or the 250 members of Congress who met with Gen. Patreus for 90 minutes, or the 86 members of the Senate who met with Gen. Patreus.
Murtha is a windbag and anyone that takes this deplorable man seriously is an poorly educated fool.
I wonder if thinkprogress.org would show video of Iraqi Veterans who have confronted Murtha and his lies.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:01 pmWell Patrious is the other USA. There are 2, you know. He’s the one who thinks they can end terrorism by force. He also thinks we can force Shia and Sunni to be pals, even though USA is bitterly, if not permanently, split.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:02 pmJack “Tuck Tail” Murtha and Harry “Tokyo” Reid – the best political props Dems have to offer. Naturally, they don’t want to give the surge a chance – it might succeed and ….whooosh!!……….a purely political opportunity down the drain!
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:02 pmMurtha’s right and the right is wrong. 7 months from now the good General will be another excuse on why there isn’t sufficient progress in Iraq.
TP needs to follow the meetings in Egypt. They have the appearance of putting a Middle Eastern commitment to assist in Iraq. That will be good for the region but may not turn out the way Bush wanted.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:03 pmI see Matthews was trying to make it seem as if Murtha was going after Petreaus when in reality, Murtha was going after the administration for, once again, using the military as a prop for justifying its unholy mission.
Although ‘just following orders’ is a dangerous road for anyone serving in the military to start following, in this case, that’s exactly what Petreaus is doing. His commander-in-chief needs him to be a political prop rather than a commander in the field and Petreaus is just following his orders.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:03 pmThe real intelligence we have is good. That’s not the problem.
Its the phony intel, ginned up by traitors like Dough Feith, that is the problem.
Phony intel got us into this mess in Iraq, and it will get us into Iran too.
General Betrayus is part of this phony intel problem.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:03 pmThank you, Representative Murtha, for stating what was glaringly obvious.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:03 pmi think these people use just about anything and everything as a political prop. this has been the way of politicians since the beginning of….well, politics!
why some people still trust politicians, i don’t know. but the fact is, they constantly lie, distort, hide, and the like.
A good read on this:
Politicians Lie? Say it Ain’t So!
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:03 pmhttp://www.populistamerica.com/politicians_lie___say_it_ain_t_so
Paetraeus may be a great general but he is a politican first and foremost. You don’t get to four stars unless you are. And unfortunately to many of our general and flag officers place careerism and party loyalty over what is right.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:04 pmPetraeus is accurate in his assessment, just as long as you keep in mind that “Al Qaeda” is a generic term for anyone who ever wore a turban or a kaffiyeh. Or a beard. He doesn’t mean literally “Al Qaeda”; he’s being literary.
And, anyway, the Republican memory erase will go into effect in another week or so and good Republicans can honestly say “Petraeus never said anything of the kind! The media is distorting the record again!”
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:04 pmmurtha, you are a despicable boob. of course this so called general, what the 12th to have the job, is a tool. Much like yourself, a worn out tool that likes war and won’t do anything real to stop it.
we need real representation in this country, not more hot air to affect warming
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:04 pmYeah, let’s believe a partisan windbag like Murtha over the Supreme Commander of the Iraq War. Please!
and Murtha saying that Petraus is lying because the intelligence they have is something different, wait, so now Murtha wants to rely on intelligence, but when it comes to WMDs he claims that intelligence services are horrific.
so which one is it Murtha? I know, go for the one that pushes your anti-American agenda.
Yes, Liberals, I thought Bush wasn’t listening to the Generals on the ground. Wow! it looks like the ones not listening to the generals on the ground are the Democrats.
when’s the last time Murtha bothered to take a trip to Iraq? When’s the last time he bothered to meet with our troops in Iraq? Oh that is right, he doesn’t do that because he would be booed. the troops hate Murtha.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:06 pmthe bush administration doing something for POLITICAL reasons…? no-o-o-o-o-oooooo… ya, right… what’s more shocking is a four-star general allowing himself to be manipulated like that, but, hey… that’s why he was given the assignment, i’m sure… he was also probably vetted and forced to take the “loyal bushie” oath by monica before he took the job… what a government we have…!
And, yes, I DO take it personally
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:07 pmI ask you Liberals,
If you party is so great, if the Democratic Leaders are so great, why won’t they keep the promise to end this war. Why won’t they immediatly defund this war? I mean, if we follow the Liberal logic, it is obvious they don’t care about the troops, Democrats are more worried about the political fall out of defunding this war than they are about standing on the promises they were elected on.
Liberals, your leaders lied to you.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:07 pmHey why no comments on the McCrazy “don’t ask don’t tell” thread?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:07 pmLooks like the trolls woke up and crawled out from under their bridge.
Murtha is telling the truth. General Betrayus is lying to Congress.
All you trolls need to shut the hell up and enlist in the Army or Marines.
There are plenty of bridges in Iraq you can live under.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:09 pmValiantthehater – Of course TP won’t show “Tuck Tail” Murtha being confronted……..remember the Progressive mission statement, “the ends justify the means”and if they have to omit, twist and obfuscate EVERY word, every photo, every poll and every graph to steer the political landscape, they will do so – gladly!
Keep up your “valiant” effort!!
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:09 pmFirst they told us the surge would work in 90 days.
That time passed and things are worse than ever. More bombings.
Now they’re saying they need until the end of the summer.
The Iraqi parliament is taking the summer off, so no political solutions will occur.
And military solutions have not worked in 4 years and will not work now.
Chimpy and Betrayus are just running out the clock. They have no intention of getting out of Iraq…ever.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:11 pmWow, the puppet of the puppet, and a four star Generale to boot!
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:11 pmwait a second
the troll is talking to itself
that’s kind of funny, in an incestuous sort of way
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:11 pmBush will be stabbing at the heart of John Murtha’s district when he speaks at Saint Vincent College in Latrobe, PA on May 11. I’ve been covering it for awhile on my site, but now the professors of the school have officially written a protest letter regarding his visit. See more here; http://www.liberalrevolt.com/article/saint-vincent-professors-speak-out
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:14 pm#18… klyde…
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:15 pmthe McCain thread disappeared…
just when I posted….
Sorry valientthehater, but for only being in office for all of 4 months, most of us are quite happy with the progress so far. The Democrats could move a little faster, but there is an awful lot of corruption your great party is involved in for us to wade through. And yes, most of it is tied to Iraq and getting the illegal war started and corruption in contracting and back hand deals.
Don’t worry, we will get to the bottom of the corruption and end the war.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:15 pmI ask you Liberals,
If you party is so great, if the Democratic Leaders are so great, why won’t they keep the promise to end this war. Why won’t they immediatly defund this war? I mean, if we follow the Liberal logic, it is obvious they don’t care about the troops, Democrats are more worried about the political fall out of defunding this war than they are about standing on the promises they were elected on.
Liberals, your leaders lied to you.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:16 pmProfMarcus – What is more shocking than a four star general wanting to complete his assignment and win the battle is a progressive “professor”!! Such an anomoly!!
Most shocking of all is the Congress trying to micro-manage the battle before the full number of troops is in theatre. God bless General Petraeus and those who serve!
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:16 pmNow the troll is pretending to be two trolls with the same nick.
Valiant Venus has her tongue up Uranus.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:16 pm“Yeah, let’s believe a partisan windbag like Murtha over the Supreme Commander of the Iraq War. Please!”
LOL… Okay, since you ask so nicely; we’ll believe Murtha. It’s interesting that you cannot bring yourself to discuss the substance of Murtha’s comments. Why is that, dear?
Of course Murtha is correct that the real threat we’re facing is an Iraqi insurgency and civil war, rather than al Qaeda. That’s evident to anyone with functioning brain cells. If Petraeus is pretending otherwise, Murth’s criticisms are right on.
“so which one is it Murtha? I know, go for the one that pushes your anti-American agenda. ”
I just love it when mindless partisan drones talk about “an anti-American agenda.”
“Yes, Liberals, I thought Bush wasn’t listening to the Generals on the ground.”
Dear heart, Bush is simply kicking out the generals he doesn’t want to listen to and picking the generals that will tell him exactly what he wants to hear. This is not a sign of good leadership.
“the troops hate Murtha.”
ROFL…. No comment necessary. Just more mindless partisan drivel from our resident idiot.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:17 pm#21 – “First they told us the surge would work in 90 days.” TomTHREE
Tom, No ONE said anything of the kind. YOU are a pathological LIAR….you poor thing.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:18 pmAh a concern troll.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:18 pmI for one don’t care about many of the troops. Most interviews I see with them they are excited about their jobs of meddling in mideast affairs. I don’t think they are particularly intelligent, either.
It does not bother me the Democrats are treading lightly. But they will win.
must be lunch hour the daily troll infestation has erupted see you later bye…
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:18 pmThat’s it Vapid, go after the messanger and forget the message. The original message from liars themselves but it’s ok, I know you can’t come to look at this conflict for the failures prior and current. That goes against your sense of honor. Too bad your sense of honor is missplaced and being used to further the messopotamia that Bush got us into.
You mad at liars then blow up at Bush for lying about his service. He has yet to prove he was where he said he was. $10,000 is still on the table for anyone that can place Bush at the unit during the time period in question.
You are following a liar and are mad because it’s now being shown to you.
Murha is right and the right is wrong.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:19 pm“If you party is so great, if the Democratic Leaders are so great, why won’t they keep the promise to end this war.”
ROFL…. Because, dear heart, we don’t live in a dictatorship and the Bush administration, aided by the Republican Congresscritters, is blocking them. Is this too difficult for you, dear?
“I mean, if we follow the Liberal logic, it is obvious they don’t care about the troops”
ROFL…. No comment necessary. Dear little VT isn’t even trying anymore, is she? Just mindlessly regurgitating the usual talking points.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:19 pmIn 1999, Chimpy the candidate demanded a timetable and an exit strategy. He wanted to micro-manage the Kosovo mission.
Other Repukes also demanded the same things. Micromanagemnet.
Valiant Venus has her HEAD stuck up Uranus.
You can’t smear the Dems for micromanaging when the Repukes were trying to do the exact same thing only 7 years ago, dumbass.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:20 pmIt is sad that Liberals consider anyone that wants to win this war and fight Al Qaeda a liar.
What Liberals want to hear is……”we can’t win this war, we lost this war, this war is bad, etc, etc. etc.”
sad to see that so called Americans hate their country so much. Party over country, typical of Liberals.
How dare the Supreme Commander of the Iraq War say the truth, that we are fighting Al Qaeda in Iraq. How dare he say this things?
let’s believe Murtha who has never been to Iraq, a partisan hack who cares more about getting into power than winning this war. Murtha, who has been confronted by Iraq War veterans who have put him in his place and told him to his face what a liar he is.
Murtha who the FBI caught in a huge corruption scandal. yes, let us believe this idiot over the generals on the ground.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:20 pmValiant Venus still has her head up Uranus.
BONER said “I think it will be rather clear in the next 60 to 90 days as to whether this plan is going to work.”
Go back under your bridge, you inbred idiot troll.
And take your tongue out of the other Valiant’s ass.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:23 pmSponge – IF the Dems have their collective finger on the pulse of America, why soooo timid in a showdown with the White House? You keep citing poll after poll in support of the Dems. For politics sake, Dems, PULL the FUNDING. The American people, whose support you claim, will back you!! The tidal wave of American voters should even force moderate and politically nervous Repubs to leap to your side of the fence.
Despicable Dem leaders have spaghetti spines.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:24 pmROFL…. No comment necessary. Just more mindless partisan drivel from our resident idiot.
Comment by PaulB — May 3, 2007 @ 12:17 pm
why the obssesion kid? desperate for attetion?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:24 pmComment #27…This is not about our party being so great. This is about being lied to from day one by the Bush Administration, and the fact that the lies continue.
valiantthehater, I’ve read many of your posts and as of yet, you’ve never made one single comment about the lies and continued deceit being perpetuated by this administration.
Is there anyone in your family who is in Iraq right now? Have you ever been in the military?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:24 pmAnybody who says we can win this war is a liar.
Anybody who says Iraq is a fight against Al Quaeda is a liar.
The National Intelligence Estimate says that Al Quaeda is only 8% of the attacks in Iraq. And that’s good intel. Not fake intel from Chimpy.
The problem is you Repukes have been lying full-time for 6 years and have absolutely no credibility left whatsoever.
Time for Repukes to step aside.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:25 pmFrom the letter written by the professors at Saint Vincent College in Latrobe, PA regarding Bush’s speech on May 11:
You know when Bush has lost the hearts and minds of the chuchies, he is really up sh!t creek.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:25 pm“If you party is so great, if the Democratic Leaders are so great, why won’t they keep the promise to end this war.â€
ROFL…. Because, dear heart, we don’t live in a dictatorship and the Bush administration, aided by the Republican Congresscritters, is blocking them. Is this too difficult for you, dear?
“I mean, if we follow the Liberal logic, it is obvious they don’t care about the troopsâ€
ROFL…. No comment necessary. Dear little VT isn’t even trying anymore, is she? Just mindlessly regurgitating the usual talking points.
Comment by PaulB — May 3, 2007 @ 12:19 pm
Obviously you are as stupid as what you type. Little one, Congress has the power to end this war by defunding the war. The President wouldn’t be able to do a thing about it. Vietnam was ended this way.
Do yourself a favor, open up a book and get an education. While you are it, also get a clue.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:27 pm“It is sad that Liberals consider anyone that wants to win this war and fight Al Qaeda a liar.”
ROFLMAO…. I wonder if dear little VT knows just how many and which logical fallacies she committed with this sentence? Free clue, dear heart: we only consider actual liars to be liars. And considering that this war has diddly-squat to do with al Qaeda and that they have instead been aided and supported by this ill-advised fiasco, I’m afraid that, as usual, you do not have a point.
“What Liberals want to hear is……â€we can’t win this war, we lost this war, this war is bad, etc, etc. etc.—
LOL… Project much, dear? No, dear, we just want to hear the truth. People like you, on the other hand, continue to want to hear the rosy scenarios that Bush keeps spoon-feeding you. That’s fine, of course, but I like it out here in the real world a lot better. You should try it someday.
“sad to see that so called Americans hate their country so much.”
LOL…. I just love mindless partisan drivel like this, particularly when dear little VT cannot find a single example of a “so called American hat[ing] their country.”
“Party over country, typical of the Bush administration.”
Fixed it for you, dear.
“How dare the Supreme Commander of the Iraq War say the truth, that we are fighting Al Qaeda in Iraq.”
Dear heart, you really should work on your reading comprehension, since that isn’t what Petraeus actually said.
“How dare he say this things?”
Good question, dear, since what Petraeus said wasn’t true.
[Mindless partisan ad hominem attacks deleted.] Interesting that people like VT hate Murtha so much.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:27 pmThe National Intelligence Estimate says that Al Quaeda is only 8% of the attacks in Iraq. And that’s good intel. Not fake intel from Chimpy.
The problem is you Repukes have been lying full-time for 6 years and have absolutely no credibility left whatsoever.
Time for Repukes to step aside.
Comment by Tom3 — May 3, 2007 @ 12:25 pm
so now you believe intelligence services, eh? so do you believe them when they say that Iraq did have WMDs? or are they lying about wMDs and being honest about the number of Al Qaeda attacks? which one is it?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:28 pmTomTRE – Would you please give a citation for your assertion, ““First they told us the surge would work in 90 days.â€
Sources??? …. Anyone?? ……….. Anyone????
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:28 pmYet another LIE from the Repuke trolls.
Murtha HAS visited Iraq. Several times.
Repuke trolls LIE just like their beloved Chimp.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:28 pm“why the obssesion kid? desperate for attetion?”
ROFL…. Oh, the irony….
Dear heart, I’m here because I absolutely love your posts. I think you’re funny as hell and I’m just egging you on.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:29 pmIs there anyone in your family who is in Iraq right now? Have you ever been in the military?
Comment by maddison66 — May 3, 2007 @ 12:24 pm
never been to Iraq, but I have family and friends who have fought and who are currently fighting there.
they all disagree with the Democratic Party and they all say that the media is also lying about Iraq.
sorry, tend to believe family and friends over party and media.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:29 pmSponge Cake – I guess you missed John Paul and Benedict comments on Iraq…..But when have you EVER concerned yourself with Catholic anything?
Toooodles……………..
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:30 pmI believe the REAL intel which said NO WMDs and NO link to Osama.
But that wasn’t the intel that Chimpy used to go to war in 2003.
Chimpy used FAKE intel, ginned up by traitor Dougy Feith.
But you Repukes can’t tell the difference between lies and facts anymore.
Go back under your bridge, you lying troll.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:31 pm“so now you believe intelligence services, eh?”
Poor VT. Can’t handle reality so she has to attack any source that disagrees with those rosy little fantasies she’s painted for herself. Dear heart, when the intelligence service data is backed up by numerous sources, of course we believe it.
“so do you believe them when they say that Iraq did have WMDs?”
No, dear, because that data was contradicted by numerous sources. see the difference?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:31 pm#37 valliumtheneeder
Man, you are an annoying yappy little thing!
That’s some Murtha obsession you have there. Did he dump you in high school or something?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:31 pm#37. It’s so funny that the finger always points outward but can’t admit the mistakes this administration has committed. Vapid and the like will follow GWB to the ends of the earth with blinders on.
Original estimate of the cost to invade Iraq was under 60 billion. Now, over 500 billion. But the Vapid’s still follow.
Original reasons were WMD’s, Saddam and Al Qiada getting WMD’s. Along with aluding to Nuke’s. Now, a free and democratic Iraq. The first were either met (Saddam dead) or never there (operational ties with Al Qiada and WMD’s) and nobody can begin to tell how to guage for a “free and democratic Iraq. But the Vapid’s still follow.
It shows how angry you are that the emporer is being shown that he has no clothes but you still follow.
You are being left behind.
Murtha is right and the right is wrong.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:32 pmClueless Bush cultist: “The troops hate Murtha.”
Iraq and Afganistan Veterans of America gives Murtha a “B” for his voting record supporting the troops.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:32 pm“Obviously you are as stupid as what you type.”
Why, thank you, dear heart. That’s so thoughtful of you.
“Little one, Congress has the power to end this war by defunding the war.”
Actually, dear, they cannot, not without placing our troops in harm’s way.
“Vietnam was ended this way.”
No, dear, it wasn’t; it was far more complicated than that, just as this is.
“Do yourself a favor, open up a book and get an education. While you are it, also get a clue”
Oh, the irony….
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:33 pmI have already caught the trolls in two lies.
This is a catch-and-release website, we are humane to stupid trolls.
I will just throw them back under the bridge and hope they stay there.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:33 pmPetreaus will have a different story when he is retired – like all the other generals, unless he is hired by CNN or Fox News as a “consultant” or joins the board of some “defense” contractor.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:33 pm“That’s some Murtha obsession you have there. Did he dump you in high school or something?”
They really hate Murtha, don’t they? Probably because their usual talking points just fall flat when you actually look at Murtha’s record. He’s done far more in service to this country than any of them ever have.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:34 pmMurtha directly lied.
An injection of reality from CNS News:
Now, will Nico issue a correction, and ask Murtha to do the same?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:37 pm“Yet another LIE from the Repuke trolls. Murtha HAS visited Iraq. Several times.”
LOL… I know; isn’t it hilarious? I loved her comment on another thread that the fact that Gore won the popular vote in the 2000 election was a “myth.” She’s so hilarious idiotic in what she writes, so completely out of touch with reality, that she’s an endless source of amusement.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:37 pmPaulB,
if your party is so great, why won’t they defund this war? who has lied to who? Your party promised to end this war, they can do it with one bill, a bill that defunds this war. The President wouldn’t be able to do squat about it.
why did your party leaders make a promise that they had no intention of keeping? was it all about getting into power?
c’mon Pauly wants a cracker……what’s the matter, not mature enough to face the fact that all your party wants is to be in power? can’t face the fact that your party lied to get into power?
I told you yesterday, my psychologist friend will make a fortune out of Dumbcrats like you. He made a fortune when the weak minded Dumbcrats became clinically depressed when Kerry lost. He can definitely make a fortune out of you.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:39 pm“You know when Bush has lost the hearts and minds of the chuchies, he is really up sh!t creek.”
SpudgeBoy: to be fair, the professors at SVC are not necessarily “churchies”. I’m a graduate from Saint Vincent College, and I never attended church there, nor am I a Catholic. The professors are from all denominations including atheist I’m sure. But, he has lost the hearts and minds of many Order of Saint Benedict (OSB) nuns who plan to protest his visit. View the signatures of this petition: http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/svc/
The link I posted above is an exclusive — it has not been released to the press yet. I wish we could generate more press on this event. Bush was invited to SVC by H. James Towey, the former head of Faith Based Initiatives for Bush, who is now the school’s president. He is busy trying to change the school into a haven for conservatives, but the school has never been that. It’s a small Liberal Arts College that was invaded by a right-wing Christian nut. Search for “Towey” on my site for more.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:39 pmI’d been wondering what bush boytoy Jeff Gannon was up to these days — now I know — he/she/it is full-time trolling TP comment forums making a flaming arse of him/her/itself regurgitating dimwit GOP narratives and pretending he/she/it has anything of value or relevancy to add to the discourse. However, it’s good to know my tax dollars are going to a needy cause — paying red-state uneducated rubes a Burger King salary, providing them with a playskool computer with a modem, an RNC e-mail account, and a daily communique with the latest Bush lies and neo-con talking points with which they can go forth and spew ad nauseum on to progressive blog forums. What a pathetic existence.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:39 pmValiant,
Great job this morning trying to hijack this thread. However, it didn’t work too well and you need some additional guidance.
First, posting over and over is good to disrupt the flow and make the thread all about yourself, but you need to do more than just cut and paste.
Secondly, you need to say more inflammatory and outrageous things to get more responses. They’ve heard the standard partisan arguments. You need to follow the great O’Reilly and name call as much as you can. Remember liberal = Stalinist = Hitler = Nazi = Gay = Islamofascist = Marxist = Al Qaeda = terrorist. Use all of these repeatedly for effect.
Finally, you did a great job attacking the messenger and ignoring the message. We kind of don’t want to talk about what’s going on in Iraq right now. For example, mention that Murtha has a gay lover or that he’s a draft dodger. That should get the conversation going elsewhere. You just need to be inflamatory. Truth is not important.
Keep up the good work. We’re getting rich off of our corrupt ways and you’re doing a great job helping us. Sorry that there’s no money in it for you. Just remember God is on our side and you’ll get eternal happiness for all of your efforts.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:39 pmOne of the Democratic candidates was talking about the Military Industrial Complex running the country. He was right.
After the Cold War ended, there was lots of talk about a defense dividend and turning swords into plowshares. Our defense budget would be pared down and contractors would switch to peaceful pursuits.
But that never happened. Soon we had a new war on terror, where we attacked the wrong country so we could spend more money on the military industrial complex.
We need to pull the plug on these guys, they’re wrecking our nation.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:40 pmIf I’d been proven wrong on every disputed question on what’s supposed to be my area of expertise for the past five years, I’d probably go around the bend, too.
Haven’t you trolls noticed that you’ve been wrong on every single Iraq-related question that’s been debated since before this war began?
You were wrong about WMDs. Wrong about Al Qaeda working with Saddam. Wrong about Chalabi taking over. Wrong about whether the Iraqis would quickly restore order. Wrong about whether there was an insurgency. Wrong about whether the war would increase terrorism. Wrong about a democratic government coming to power. Wrong about the capture of Saddam ending the insurgency. Wrong about the capture of Zarqawi ending the insurgency. Wrong about whether there is a civil war. Wrong about whether the war would pay for itself. Wrong about how long our forces would be there. Wrong about whether the war would sap resources from Afghanistan. Wrong about democracy breaking out all over the Middle East. Wrong about there being a sufficient number of troops to restore order. Wrong about whether there would be sectarian animosity between Sunnis and Shiites. Wrong about the war paying for itself. Wrong about whether we were winning in 2003, and in 2004, and in 2005, and in the first half of 2006.
But this time, you’re just certain that the surge is working. Has it ever occured to you that you don’t know what the hell you’re talking about?
Do you really – really, in your heart of hearts – think that this time you will be proven right, and your opponents wrong?
If so, why? Where do you get this certainty that you can’t possibly be on the wrong side of a question, when you’ve been on the wrong side of every question that’s come up since this whole episode began?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:41 pmLittle one, Congress has the power to end this war by defunding the war.â€
Actually, dear, they cannot, not without placing our troops in harm’s way.
by PaulB,
Pauly wants a cracker….so why did your party promise that they were going to end this war?
you just can’t come to admit that your party lied to you, can you? it is ok, don’t worry.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:41 pmStupid troll can’t find Boner’s quote about 90 days. What a dumbass.
I quoted it above, too. Apparently the troll is illiterate.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:41 pm“Little one, Congress has the power to end this war by defunding the war.â€
Actually, dear, they cannot, not without placing our troops in harm’s way.
by PaulB
so will you admit you lied or you aren’t educated enough to know that Congress can defund this war without the President being able to do anything about it? wait, I am expecting a wacked out liberal to be honest. Sorry, my bad expecting way too much from a Liberal.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:44 pm“The Generals on the ground” have been replaced in turn as each provided his honest assessment of the war. “The Generals on the ground” have never been listened to by this administration. Not once. The real Generals are gone. What’s left is the military equivalent of the US Attorney corps – political functionaries occupying positions of critical importance.
As for “intelligence” I doubt we’ve got an accurate handle on any geopolitical area or political faction anywhere in the world – other than what’s available to the general public (Putin has reformed a dictatorship in Russia, the ME is stuck in perpetual, but politically expedient crisis, Afghanistan is showing its well-established roots, Africa is loosing political and environmental ground, unless oil is present, China is poised to take over the world economically, etc…).
Murtha is “old school”, and he is correct. Patraeus is a political tool.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:44 pmOf course Petraeus is a political prop. He volunteered for the job, agreeing to prolong the war and suffering in order to advance his career. Every minute he stays in charge, he has more to atone for.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:45 pm#
Bush will be stabbing at the heart of John Murtha’s district when he speaks at Saint Vincent College in Latrobe, PA on May 11. I’ve been covering it for awhile on my site, but now the professors of the school have officially written a protest letter regarding his visit. See more here; http://www.liberalrevolt.com/ article/ saint-vincent-professors-speak-out
Comment by Vaughn D. Taylor — May 3, 2007 @ 12:14 pm
Thanks for posting this. I emailed the letter out to my entire contact list, which is currently comprised of not only my like-minded friends…but, thanks to an email sent to me by a right-wing individual who mistakenly believed I would be of like-mind with her, her entire contact list as well. This could get interesting!
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:46 pm“if your party is so great, why won’t they defund this war?”
Already answered, dear. Having trouble reading?
“who has lied to who?”
Well, we could start with Petraeus, since he’s the topic of this thread. Care to actually stay on topic for once?
[Mindless partisan drivel deleted.]
Hilarious shit, VT, but you’re going to have to give me more to work with than this. Nice try, though.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:46 pmvalianthehater;
First off, we need a lot less hate in the world, your nickname shines a light on your personality, and if hate is your driving motivation, you are to be dismissed.
Second, those that say that al qaeda is in Iraq are lying to you. Those responsible for 9/11 are in Pakistan. Why isn’t your president doing everything possible to bring those responsible for 9/11 to justice?
If you must hate, at least direct it at a valid target; this corrupt administration that doesn’t give two sh*ts about you and those like you (me either for that matter), or those REAL al qaeda who are responsible for 9/11.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:47 pm“so will you admit you lied”
If I ever lie, dear heart, I’ll be happy to admit it. Alas, I fear that the question is moot, since I have no need to lie.
“or you aren’t educated enough to know that Congress can defund this war”
ROFL… My goodness, but she is persistent, isn’t she? What’s hilarious is that she cannot bring herself to acknowledge the obvious point I made above. Do try again, won’t you, dear? I’ll be right here.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:47 pmIt is humorous to watch the troll argue that the Dems are a failure because they haven’t pulled the financial plug on the war yet.
Talk about spin. LOL!!
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:48 pmJust like Kerry, Murtha loves receiving fake military medals…..how disgusting…
Rep. John Murtha, an outspoken Democratic critic of the Iraq war, said in remarks to be aired on Sunday that voter pressure in the November congressional election could force President George W. Bush to pull U.S. forces from Iraq.
“I think the vast majority will be out by the end of the year and I’m hopeful it will be sooner than that,” Murtha, a decorated Vietnam combat veteran who retired as a colonel after 37 years in the U.S. Marine Corps, told the CBS “60 Minutes” show.
The Pennsylvania Democrat said mounting pressure from voters tired of the war could affect this year’s midterm election and force Bush to devise a plan to pull U.S. troops from Iraq.
These people are dumber then I thought.
Then you have the recent news the Murtha’s may have pulled a Kerry when it came to his service:
Having ascended to the national stage as one of the most vocal critics of President Bush’s handling of the war in Iraq, Pennsylvania Democratic Congressman John Murtha has long downplayed the controversy and the bitterness surrounding the two Purple Hearts he was awarded for military service in Vietnam.
Murtha is a retired marine and was the first Vietnam combat veteran elected to Congress. Since 1967, there have been at least three different accounts of the injuries that purportedly earned Murtha his Purple Hearts. Those accounts also appear to conflict with the limited military records that are available, and Murtha has thus far refused to release his own military records.
A Cybercast News Service investigation also reveals that one of Murtha’s former Democratic congressional colleagues and a fellow decorated Vietnam veteran, Don Bailey of Pennsylvania, alleges that Murtha admitted during an emotional conversation on the floor of the U.S. House in the early 1980s that he did not deserve his Purple Hearts.
“[Murtha] is putting himself forward as some combat veteran with serious wounds and he’s using that and it’s dishonest and it’s wrong,” Bailey told Cybercast News Service on Jan. 9. Murtha served in the Marines on active duty and in the reserves from 1952 until his retirement as a colonel in 1990. He volunteered for service in Vietnam and was a First Marine Regiment intelligence officer in 1966 and 1967.
[...]However, another source, World War II Navy veteran Harry M. Fox, previously indicated that Murtha in 1968 personally asked Fox’s boss, then-U.S. Rep. John Saylor (R-Pa.), for assistance in obtaining the Purple Hearts, but was turned down because Saylor’s office determined that Murtha lacked sufficient evidence of wounds. Murtha later challenged Saylor for his House seat in 1968 and lost. Fox said he personally viewed Murtha’s military records in 1968 as Saylor’s aide.
When Saylor died in 1973, Fox attempted to succeed his boss in Congress, but was narrowly defeated by Murtha in a 1974 special election.
“Pretending to be a big war hero and boasting about having medals is a slap in the face to our veterans who were seriously wounded or killed in action,” Fox was quoted as telling the Uniontown Herald-Standard in the newspaper’s Nov. 1, 1996 edition. “He campaigned as a war hero and I’ve never seen any documentation that he earned any of these honors,” Fox reportedly stated.
On Friday, Jan. 13, Murtha’s congressional communications director provided Cybercast News Service with a copy of a letter from the commandant of the U.S. Marine Corps, citing Murtha’s request of Sept. 26, 1967, seeking Purple Hearts. Cybercast News Service did not authenticate the letter.
“The records of this Headquarters show that you are entitled to the Purple Heart and a Gold Star in lieu of a second Purple Heart for wounds received in action against insurgent Communist Guerrilla forces on 22 March and 7 May 1967 in the Republic of Vietnam,” according to the letter signed by an individual identified only as A. Gardoni. Gardoni’s title is not listed on the letter.
Cybercast News Service attempted to contact Fox for this article, but learned that the health of the 81-year-old was too poor to allow him to communicate. But in a 1996 newspaper article, Fox questioned whether Murtha deserved his Purple Hearts, alleging that there was insufficient evidence of injuries and that Murtha was never confined to a hospital.
“Of course Congressman Saylor wanted to help if he could, but there was nothing in the service record to indicate the wounds were of any severity and the documents specifically indicated that next of kin was not notified in either instance,” Fox told the Herald-Standard in 1996. “We were amazed that Mr. Murtha was asking for Purple Hearts for superficial lacerations,” he added.
Murtha’s accounts of his Vietnam War wounds may also conflict with the available U.S. Marine medical records obtained by the media.
The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette on May 12, 2002, reported that “Marine Corps casualty records show that Murtha was injured in ‘hostile’ actions near Danang, Vietnam, on March 22, 1967, and May 7, 1967.
“In the first incident, his right cheek was lacerated, and in the second, he was lacerated above his left eye. Neither injury required evacuation,” the Post-Gazette reported.
But an Oct. 26, 1994, article in the Herald-Standard quoted Murtha as describing two different injuries.
“I was wounded in the arm with shrapnel from a bullet that hit the motor mount of a helicopter. In the other, my knee was banged up and my arm was banged up when a helicopter was shot down from a very few feet,” Murtha told the Herald-Standard.
A June 1, 1967 report in the Johnstown Tribune-Democrat quoted a letter that the newspaper indicated was sent by Murtha to his wife that same year. The letter apparently detailed yet another version of how Murtha qualified for one of his Purple Hearts. According to the Johnstown Tribune-Democrat, Murtha’s injuries involved his being “struck in the ankle” by a “shot that ricocheted off the helicopter.”
[...]Bailey said during the time Murtha was being investigated for his role in the Abscam FBI sting in 1980, Murtha made a confession on the House floor.
… you admitted, back in our corner, that you didn’t earn your purple hearts (sic) (you indicated you had small scratch on your cheek that wasn’t even directly related to an APC [Armored Personnel Carrier] that ran over a small antipersonnel mine that was behind you). The other purple heart [sic] you even declined to explain,” wrote Bailey in an open letter dated May 5, 2002.
Bailey is also a decorated Vietnam combat veteran. He served in the U.S. Army’s 82nd and 101st Airborne Divisions and was awarded a Silver Star and three Bronze Stars.
“At the time (of Murtha’s alleged admission), you were feeling particularly vulnerable because it wasn’t too long after you had called me crying and sobbing, thanking me for ’saving your life’ before the ethics committee (on Abscam-related charges). There was no doubt in my mind that you were expressing to me that you did not believe you did anything sufficient to earn the purple heart [sic] and that you didn’t want to be active in my efforts to laud Vietnam veterans that served with us,” Bailey wrote in his May 2002 letter.
“You may deny that all you wish — but you and I know that that conversation took place,” he added.
In the Jan. 9 interview with Cybercast News Service Bailey affirmed the contents of his 2002 letter.
“The issue here is this idea or pretense that [Murtha] knows combat and he’s got two Purple Hearts. He’s a phony and a liar,” Bailey said.
Bailey also questioned why Murtha has thus far declined to release his full military records in order to clear up the controversy.
“The Marine Corps ought to be able to produce all the orders, the medical stuff, the citations and the orders granting [the Purple Hearts] and everything else. Where is that stuff?” he asked.
According to a May 16, 2002, edition of the Washington, Pa., Observer-Reporter, Murtha “produced military paperwork indicating he was entitled to the awards,” and a Murtha spokesperson was quoted as saying that “the media for years has investigated ‘and found nothing.’”
But Murtha’s paperwork did nothing to sway Bailey’s opinion.
“You may fool a few reporters into believing that merely because you got some perfunctory paperwork made out by a friend, that that means you earned the purple hearts [sic]. But even if you were awarded the medals later, there should be affidavits from witnesses. These things should be easy to get,” Bailey wrote in his letter while demanding an apology from Murtha for questioning his credibility.
Murtha could end the controversy at any time, Bailey added, simply by calling a press conference and producing the evidence of his wounds.
“Explain where you were and what you were doing when you got the purple hearts.[sic] Explain who was with you and treated your wounds, but most important, Jack, describe your wounds or the lack thereof, as you did for me, years ago,” Bailey wrote.
“Unless the Marine Corps gives out medals for unsubstantiated noncombat-related telltale scratches, procured for use in political campaign — then show me the money, Jack,” Bailey added.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:48 pmFrom the glass-lined tanks of Old Latrobe…
Too bad Rolling Rock is gone. Budweiser bought them last year.
Anything Anheuser-Busch buys turns into piss…er…Budweiser.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:49 pm“Haven’t you trolls noticed that you’ve been wrong on every single Iraq-related question that’s been debated since before this war began?”
They really haven’t noticed this, as far as I can see. Most of them, for example, are firmly convinced that we found WMDs, that Iraq was working hand-in-glove with Hussein, and that things are going great in Iraq but we just aren’t hearing it because the liberal news media is hiding the truth. I know this is bizarre and wholly disconnected from reality, but that really is what they believe.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:49 pmLooks like the troll is now spamming us with crap from the Swift Boaters.
Lies and spin.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:50 pm“if your party is so great, why won’t they defund this war?â€
Already answered, dear. Having trouble reading?
Comment by PaulB — May 3, 2007 @ 12:46 pm
Pauly wants a craker….you call your partisan crap an answer? no wonder you are a Liberal. I hope you at least know your right hand from your left hand. Man, it must suck to be you son. It must suck for you to wake up each morning, Pauly, and find out that you are still you.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:50 pmLike I said, these morons really do hate Murtha with a passion. It’s hilarious to watch them in action trying to slime him.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:51 pmValiant Penis: “IF the Dems have their collective finger on the pulse of America, why soooo timid in a showdown with the White House?”
You call it timid. I call it politics. Dems are looking at picking up another 15 seats in the House and another 10 seats in the Senate, as well as taking the Whitehouse. Without the ability to override a veto or a filibuster, they simply need more seats. Face it. Bush is going to end up as a disaster for the republican party. You’re going to be looking at another 3 or 4 decade run for Democrats. We’re going to get universal healthcare, renewable energy, windfall profits taxes, stem cell funding, balanced budgets, workers rights, etc. etc….. And you’ll be whining like a little baby while most of us are getting happier and healthier.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:51 pmNice post Joe.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:51 pmComment by joe — May 3, 2007 @ 12:41 pm:
perfect.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:52 pm“you call your partisan crap an answer?”
LOL… Yes, dear, I do. And obviously, it’s an answer you cannot deal with, since you’ve been flailing around ever since. Gotta love it, though, since the evasion is obvious.
“no wonder you are a Liberal. I hope you at least know your right hand from your left hand. Man, it must suck to be you son. It must suck for you to wake up each morning, Pauly, and find out that you are still you.”
ROFL…. No comment necessary. I absolutely love this shit. Keep it up, VT!
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:55 pmVapid, please refute Joe’s post at #68. Show us all. Don’t jump to another rant, just disprove all of what is shown there. If you can’t then all your blowhard bullcrap is just that.
Murtha is right and the right is wrong.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:55 pmLike I said, these morons really do hate Murtha with a passion. It’s hilarious to watch them in action trying to slime him.
Comment by PaulB — May 3, 2007 @ 12:51 pm
we don’t hate him like you poor imbeciles hate Bush. We just know that Murtha is a liar. Anyone with an IQ over 100 can figure this out. I just feel sorry for partisan hacks like you that are too stupid and too poorly informed otr realize when their party has lied to them and when their Dumbcrat leaders have lied to them.
but I do have to laugh at the irony of a Liberal making fun of Conservatives for supposedly hating Murtha. I guess you have been sleeping all this time and not reading or hearing the hate that hte left spews against President Bush, eh?
I am laughing at your immense stupidity. keep it coming son. You are quite the entertainer.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:55 pmOoooh, swiftboating!
Ohnoes! We’re doomed now, because swiftboating war critics is so totally going to work. That, and stating that the 2/3 of Americans who oppose the war are radical leftists who hate America.
I certainly hope the Republicans don’t make swiftboating and attacks on patriotism the centerpiece of their 2008 campaign.
Also, I do not wish to be thrown into a briar patch.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:57 pmLet’s stop the spin and put the reality onto the words and actions. The Democrats passing any kind of “emergency supplemental”, with or without timelines, benchmarks, etc. is NOT “supporting the troops” but is supporting the continuation of the occupation of Iraq. Bush, by signing his veto with the pen of a fallen Marine, was demonstrating exactly the truth…he signed it in blood. Call it for what it is! There is only one way to stop this occupation (please…call it what it IS) and that is to cut off ALL funding NOW for it. There are enough funds in the pipeline to bring our people home. NOW. As for Al Queda. They might have been stopped in Afghanistan. But instead, we created another failed state for them. Do you honestly think that was an accident? It simply justifes our staying there, with permanent basis, forever…perhaps. Just as 911 justified the increasing loss of our own civil liberties and democracy. Do you also think that was a “failure of intelligence” and a “lack of imagination” by those who are supposed to protect the American people?
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:58 pmvalianthehater;
First off, we need a lot less hate in the world, your nickname shines a light on your personality, and if hate is your driving motivation, you are to be dismissed.
Second, those that say that al qaeda is in Iraq are lying to you. Those responsible for 9/11 are in Pakistan. Why isn’t your president doing everything possible to bring those responsible for 9/11 to justice?
If you must hate, at least direct it at a valid target; this corrupt administration that doesn’t give two sh*ts about you and those like you (me either for that matter), or those REAL al qaeda who are responsible for 9/11.
Comment by Namtillaku — May 3, 2007 @ 12:47 pm
Namtillaku, this name was given to me by your “love” and “peace” Liberal brothers. If you are going to talk about hate, look within the Dumbcrat party and Liberals first.
May 3rd, 2007 at 12:58 pm“From the glass-lined tanks of Old Latrobe…Too bad Rolling Rock is gone. Budweiser bought them last year.”
Sadly there are many who lost their jobs because of this. Latrobe is a very small town, and when a company like Rolling Rock pulls out, it’s a huge deal. However, I have just heard that Sam Adams is going to start brewing in the factory, and they plan to hire back all of the employees who were let go. So, drink Sam instead.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:01 pmDear heart, Bush is simply kicking out the generals he doesn’t want to listen to and picking the generals that will tell him exactly what he wants to hear. This is not a sign of good leadership.
And when they leave, they let their REAL opinions be known:
The President vetoed our troops and the American people. His stubborn commitment to a failed strategy in Iraq is incomprehensible. He committed our great military to a failed strategy in violation of basic principles of war. His failure to mobilize the nation to defeat world wide Islamic extremism is tragic. We deserve more from our commander-in-chief and his administration.
–Maj. Gen. John Batiste, USA , Ret.
By vetoing this bill and failing to initiate an immediate and phased withdrawal, the President has effectively gone AWOL, deserting his duty post, leaving American forces with an impossible mission, suffering wholly unnecessary casualties.”
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:01 pm–Lt. Gen. William E. Odom ( USA , Ret.)
Namtillaku, this name was given to me by your “love†and “peace†Liberal brothers. If you are going to talk about hate, look within the Dumbcrat party and Liberals first.
Comment by valiantthehater — May 3, 2007 @ 12:58 pm
Answer my question, why don’t we have 150,000 troops in Afganistan & Pakistan rooting out those responsible for 9/11?
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:02 pmClueless Bush cultist: “The troops hate Murtha.â€
Iraq and Afganistan Veterans of America gives Murtha a “B†for his voting record supporting the troops.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:05 pm“Little one, Congress has the power to end this war by defunding the war.â€
“…Actually, dear, they cannot, not without placing our troops in harm’s way.”
Comment by PaulB — May 3, 2007 @ 12:33 pm
there you go: A Republican admitting that the troops are being used by Bush as a political pawn. Read it twice: Congress cannot perform its Constitutionally mandated role “without placing our troops in harm’s way.”
the Rethugs are holding our troops hostage.
As a side note, someone answer me this:
If the Constitution gives Congress the right to declare war, wouldn’t that indicate that Congress – and only Congress – can undeclare war? The Commander in Chief is in command of the troops regardless of their involvement in a war or not. Congress can bring the tropps home without stepping on Chimpy’s toes – because he’ll still be Commander in Chief (albeit without a legal war to prosecute).
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:06 pmAnswer my question, why don’t we have 150,000 troops in Afganistan & Pakistan rooting out those responsible for 9/11?
Comment by Namtillaku — May 3, 2007 @ 1:02 pm
Answer my question, you claim that we need less hate in the world. Read the hateful comments against Bush on this site? will you condemn these? will you condemn the lies the left constantly spews out in order to get back into power?
as for your questions…..Afghanistan is not in the same disaray that Iraq is. and NATO has troops there. My question to you, why don’t you Liberals demand that the Europeans keep up their promises made to NATO and to send their troops to Afghanistan?
as for Pakistan, how the hell should I know. I am not the president of Afghanistan and neither you nor I know what they are doing, right?
the fact is that something has been done right since no terrorist attack has occured on mainland USA since 9/11, right?
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:08 pmI’m targeting the generals at this point…Pace, Patraeus and all in between. Pace can say what he said about gays serving in the military, but the enlisted cannot post to blogs, message boards and send email anymore? I belted this piece out late last night and early this morning, and feel it deserves to be read by anyone who is fed up with the way our government is treating these soldiers and marines. Enjoy, and feel free to forward it to whomever you so choose:
Decapitated Slave Army
Topics covered: Leadership void at the top of the military, Appeal for Redress, how FM 3-24 (which Patraeus wrote) cannot be applied to Iraq, the removal of our soldiers’ right to free speech, and others
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:12 pmValiant, please refute the below provided by Joe.
You were wrong about WMDs. Wrong about Al Qaeda working with Saddam. Wrong about Chalabi taking over. Wrong about whether the Iraqis would quickly restore order. Wrong about whether there was an insurgency. Wrong about whether the war would increase terrorism. Wrong about a democratic government coming to power. Wrong about the capture of Saddam ending the insurgency. Wrong about the capture of
Zarqawi ending the insurgency. Wrong about whether there is a civil war. Wrong about whether the war would pay for itself. Wrong about how long our forces would be there. Wrong about whether the war would sap resources from Afghanistan. Wrong about democracy breaking out all over the Middle East. Wrong about there being a sufficient number of troops to restore order. Wrong about whether there would be sectarian animosity between Sunnis and Shiites. Wrong about the war paying for itself. Wrong about whether we were winning in 2003, and in 2004, and in 2005, and in the first half of 2006.
Here’s your chance to stand up and show the world.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:13 pmahhh, the eternal conundrum: is hating the hater, because of his hatred, a good thing, or a bad thing?
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:13 pmre# Namtillaku
Those responsible for 9-11 are those who planted the explosives in the WTC that created the 50 micron 45% silicon fine powder dust shown in the following link. (please paste link and remove spaces).
h t t p : / / 9 1 1 r e s e a r c h . w t c 7 . n e t / w t c / e v i d e n c e / p h o t o s / s t r e e t s 1 . h t m l
The 50 micron 45% silicon fine powder in the above link DISPROVES that the WTC was demolished by gravity energy, because there is no other way than explosive energy to created such a fine silicon powder from intact concrete and glass in the less than 15 seconds that the WTC towers went from whole to pieces, therefore no spin doctor nor lying expert can convince CRITICAL THINKING people that the WTC was demolished by gravity energy.
If you go to an engineering school or concrete manufacturer and watch them fail concrete an INTACT piece of concrete, you will notice that it breaks into sand sized particles, and in order to turn it into a 50 micron fine powder you would have to MILL those particles.
Even if you drop concrete from 30,000 jet crusing altitude, it will still fail into sand size particles, just like you cannot make flour from wheat kernels by dropping them off a tall building!
Even if you put more tha X pounds of weight on a cubic inch of concrete that has a compression strength X pounds per inch, it will still fail into sand size particles, just like you cannot make flour from wheat kernels by setting them under a heavy rock!
The reason you cannot make fine powders simply by dropping material, is that the material’s collision with the ground results in the small particles recoiling upward instead of them being breaking into smaller and smaller pieces, no matter how much FORCE they hit the ground with.
The reason you cannot make fine powders simply by setting weight on material, is that the surfaces are not perfectly even, so small particles lay in the hills and the valleys between the surfaces, therefore they CANNOT be broken into smaller particles because NO FORCE is being applied to them, no matter how much FORCE is being applied to surfaces.
MILLING can be done by the scraping of abrasives which chew off one fine powder particle at a time, or done by the crushing of surfaces that are SMOOTHER than the desired fine powder particle size.
Since the environment in the demolished WTC towers was not like a MILL, and MILLING always takes more than 15 seconds to generate an appreciable amount of fine powder, WE KNOW FOR A FACT THAT THE 50 MICRON 45% SILICON FINE POWDER THAT IS GIVING THE FIRST RESPONDERS SILICOSIS LUNG DISEASE HAD TO BE CREATED BY EXPLOSIVES, BECAUSE THERE IS NO OTHER WAY FOR THAT POWDER TO BE CREATED IN THE TIME AND ENVIRONMENT OF A DEMOLISHING WTC TOWER.
I will give my house, car, money, clothes, and every worldly possession to the first person lying expert or otherwise who can turn an intact piece of concrete or glass into a 50 micron fine powder in less than 15 seconds without explosives, even though they would not need my money, because they will have won a Nobel prize and would have a zillion dollar patent for making milling obsolete!
So if you choose to believe the official LIE, and ignore the TRUTH that the WTC towers were brought down with explosives, by IGNORING the IRRFUTABLE evidence that the critical thinker has given you, it simply means your emotions overrule your logic, and your psyche cannot handle the ramifications of this IRRFUTABLE evidence, so you close your eyes and keep believing that it was not an inside job when the evidence OBVIOUSLY says otherwise to CRITICAL THINKING people like Columbo.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:13 pmWhen I walk down the street, ValiumtheNeeder crosses to the other sidewalk and hopes I don’t see him.
If I walk towards him, he starts shrieking “Help! Help!” in a little girl voice.
Hi, I’m joe, and I make trolls wet their pants.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:16 pm#
Sponge Cake – I guess you missed John Paul and Benedict comments on Iraq…..But when have you EVER concerned yourself with Catholic anything?
Toooodles……………..
Comment by valiant venus — May 3, 2007 @ 12:30 pm
#
Find ONE comment that ever supported the Iraq “war.” Post the link. Or shut up. (And it’s not “Benedict.”) Idiot.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:17 pmBluePUP – Apparently SpongeBob had to take out the trash, so I will ask you the same question.
IF the American people (translation “voters”) are solidly behind the Dems effort to “bring the troops home” why does the Dem leadership refuse to CUT THE FUNDING FOR THE WAR? Surely, savvy politicos on the Left can convince Repubs in precarious districts that THEIR interest to get re-elected will be rewarded by a grateful American electorate. Such a swell of populism would be enough to overide this unpopular President. Surely, “Tuck tail” Murtha, “Tokyo” Reid and our esteemed Speakette Nancy have plenty of arm-twisting practice.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:18 pm“Criticalthinker” – The “tin-foil” hat maker will be arriving in a few minutes for your fitting. (A reminder….the 9/11 conspiracy crowd will be meeting behind the grassy knoll – don’t forget your secret decoder ring.)
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:22 pmThe problem valiant is that you have be duped by Bush and his administration. They used 9/11 to attack Iraq, claiming non-existant connections between al qaeda and Saddam. That doesn’t make you angry? We’re doing practically nothing to bring OBJ to justice.
I don’t know where you’ve been, but terrorism has increased by 40% since we attacked Iraq. No, they haven’t attacked us – that’s good, I’m happy about that. But they will, by attacking Iraq we just created a new Afganistan where those terrorist will be able to launch those attacks against us.
You are a fool valiant – I’ll say it again, this administration doesn’t give two sh*ts for anyone other than corporations and the richest people in America. They don’t care about you, me, the soldiers serving America (Walter Reed), Christians, and especially not the middle class.
But trying to convince a fool of anything is a waste of time. There was a story a week or two ago in the news, it was one showing that in some respects monkeys have out evolved humans. I don’t need any study to see that, I can see that right in front of my eyes – here – reading your posts.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:23 pmIF the American people (translation “votersâ€) are solidly behind the Dems effort to “bring the troops home†why does the Dem leadership refuse to CUT THE FUNDING FOR THE WAR?
Because the American people, and the Democrats, want the troops brought home in a responsible and orderly manner, not abandoned in the desert without equipment and fuel.
Gee, vv, if you are opposed to public housing, why don’t you support planting explosives around the support colums at HUD-owned residential towers and destroying them with everyone inside?
Then again, who says you don’t?
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:24 pmImPEAR- Thanks for playing – - I do not contend official Catholic dogma condones this war….and if you would read what is writtien rather than what you do NOT see between th lines, you might not apPEAR so poorly informed. Thanks again – they’re serving jello in the day room….run along.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:25 pmComment by criticalthinker — May 3, 2007 @ 1:13 pm
Please – conspiracies, true or not, are unnecessary.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:26 pm“we don’t hate him like you poor imbeciles hate Bush.”
ROFL…. Yes, dear, whatever you say. I’ll just point you to your own posts in this thread, dear heart. Q.E.D.
“We just know that Murtha is a liar.”
And again, Q.E.D. You really should try harder, dear. This is just too easy.
“Anyone with an IQ over 100 can figure this out.”
LOL…. No comment necessary. Care to address the actual substance of Murtha’s remarks, dear? And discuss just what the greater threat we face in Iraq is? Free clue: Murtha’s right.
“I just feel sorry for partisan hacks like you that are too stupid and too poorly informed otr realize when their party has lied to them and when their Dumbcrat leaders have lied to them.”
LOL… Couldn’t have said it better myself, dear. So tell me, dear, have you actually looked at what the Bush administration said about Iraq over the years?
“but I do have to laugh at the irony”
So do I, dear, constantly.
“of a Liberal making fun of Conservatives for supposedly hating Murtha.”
“Supposedly,” dear? Have you read your own posts on this thread? Q.E.D.
“I am laughing at your immense stupidity. keep it coming son. You are quite the entertainer.”
Nice try, dear.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:27 pm“IF the American people (translation “votersâ€) are solidly behind the Dems effort to “bring the troops home†why does the Dem leadership refuse to CUT THE FUNDING FOR THE WAR?”
Because to do so, dear, would put the troops in danger. This isn’t rocket science, dear heart. Do try to keep up.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:28 pm“the fact is that something has been done right since no terrorist attack has occured on mainland USA since 9/11, right?”
Will they ever learn? Correlation does not equal causation.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:29 pmIf y’all were wondering what this swift-boating news source VTH is quoting:
Cybercast News Service (CNS) is a subsidiary of the conservative news monitoring group, the Media Research Center (MRC). Originally calling itself the “Conservative News Service,” CNS changed its name to Cybercast in 2000.
Just one of the big CNS headlines:
CNS claims proof Hussein had WMD and ties to Al Qaeda
’nuff said…
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:32 pmThe Repugnicunts have a rolling 6 month target, “just give it a chance, in 6 month’s we will see progress, why do you want to quit???” If we had known 4 year’s ago that we would be mired in the middle of a civil war that doesn’t involve us, would we have been so eager to give these pukes their rolling 6 months.
Sick, twisted little trolls like Vapidtheshiteater don’t care how many arms and legs, eyes and lives we squander, as long as Boy George doesn’t have to admit he is a loser.
Hate you? Why yes I do as a matter of fact. If there were a God, she would arrange to have all of you Bush lovers gang-raped, bust your asses wide open, a good case of gangrene and a lifetime of carrying a colostomy bag to church.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:35 pm“of a Liberal making fun of Conservatives for supposedly hating Murtha.â€
“Supposedly,†dear? Have you read your own posts on this thread? Q.E.D.
“I am laughing at your immense stupidity. keep it coming son. You are quite the entertainer.â€
Nice try, dear.
Comment by PaulB — May 3, 2007 @ 1:27 pm
so now, little Pauly wants a cracker, is a mind reader. Shit kid, called the NSA, military intelligence, they would love to have you in their staff.
keep it coming pauly the entertainer.
peace and love brother.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:36 pmWhat’s hilarious about our two valiant trolls is that they think we’re supposed to be impressed that the Democratic Party leadership LIED to us! Ooh! Ooh! Look at the boogeyman! They LIED! They’re not defunding the war! Impeach them! Throw the bums out! This is their idea of a rational and compelling argument? This is the best they’ve got? The mind boggles….
And note how neither of them can bring themselves to actually address the substance of Murtha’s comment about who we are fighting in Iraq and what the greatest threat there is. Instead, it’s just one mindless ad hominem attack after another. Talk about a meltdown….
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:37 pm“so now, little Pauly wants a cracker, is a mind reader.”
LOL…. No, dear; just a reader. Your own posts condemn you, dear heart.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:38 pmValiantthehater, why don’t you answer my post at 101? Is it easier to throw insults than to prove your points. Refute what is written.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:40 pmDear Nam – I suppose you missed the memo that Saddam rewarded terrorists and allowed terror meetings to take place in Iraq. FYI – in the Saddam regime, you didn’t just drop in Iraq.
That terrorism is up 40% is not a surprise to me – it’s called a WAR. Thank GOD we have been spared further attacks here. Thank GOD the UK tried and convicted the latest Koranimals for their horrendous plots. Thank GOD we have not yet become the country of “roll over and play dead”.
Topic switch (brought about by YOU) – That the administration is business friendly does not bother me – alot of people on both sides of the political aisle work for large corporations and small incorporated businesses. There are plenty of laws and regulation to reward ethical business and punish illegal practices.
That the President is concerned about the poor education being provided by the NEA controlled schools and has spent a boatload of money helping poor kids doesn’t seem to merit much praise from you. (That tidbit wasn’t in your “talking points” was it?) That you ignorantly believe liberals care anything about the disadvantaged is laughable – THEY COULD CARE LESS ABOUT THE POOR AND DISADVANTAGED – they care about translating entitlement programs into voting constituents – PERIOD. (Don’t believe me? Ask yourself this unsettling question – “Where would Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton be if without the remnants of racism? Why don’t they critique the apparent disregard and embarrassment many African-American students suffer for being GOOD students? You see…..THEY need to perpetuate a permanent under-class or wave goodbye to the fame, fortune and pulpits….OK, they don’t have pulpits – - just fame and fortune.)
Thanks for playing…..you can stop by the exit and pick up your parting gift.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:41 pmVH,
From now on, when I spank you, I want you to stop saying “Thank you, Daddy.”
Your new orders are to say, “Thank you, Sir, I am your dog.”
Let’s try it:
“You were wrong about WMDs. Wrong about Al Qaeda working with Saddam. Wrong about Chalabi taking over. Wrong about whether the Iraqis would quickly restore order. Wrong about whether there was an insurgency. Wrong about whether the war would increase terrorism. Wrong about a democratic government coming to power. Wrong about the capture of Saddam ending the insurgency. Wrong about the capture of
Zarqawi ending the insurgency. Wrong about whether there is a civil war. Wrong about whether the war would pay for itself. Wrong about how long our forces would be there. Wrong about whether the war would sap resources from Afghanistan. Wrong about democracy breaking out all over the Middle East. Wrong about there being a sufficient number of troops to restore order. Wrong about whether there would be sectarian animosity between Sunnis and Shiites. Wrong about the war paying for itself. Wrong about whether we were winning in 2003, and in 2004, and in 2005, and in the first half of 2006.”
Now, what do YOU say?
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:41 pmJoe – The Dems haven’t done anything responsible for the military since JFK.
Your smirky HUD suggestion shows what happens when the ACLU gets involved in mental health holds – - you poor thing!
Tooodles…..and I hope you feel better SOON! (They’ll let you out of the strait-jacket as soon as they are certain you pose no danger to yourself or others.)
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:45 pmre# valiant venus
I notice you resort to the standard trick of name calling “tin foil hat” when faced with IRREFUTABLE proof that cannot be argued against without violating the known laws of SCIENCE.
Unfortunately that trick does not work with me.
Unless you, the head of MIT, or any other paid lying shill can go to an engineering laboratory or concrete manufacturer and compression fail an intact piece of concrete into a 50 micron fine powder in less than 15 seconds, you and the official LIE have been DISPROVED.
Ignoring the “smoking gun” that proves explosives were used, does not change the SCIENTIFIC FACT that MILLING is required to make fine powders without explosives, and MILLING takes more than 15 seconds to perform.
I usually IGNORE the tripe you post here, because in a battle of wits you have no ammunition, as proven by your use of the term “conspiracy theory” (meaning PROVEN FACT) instead of “conspiracy hypthesis” (meaning UNPROVED IDEA), but this time I will simply say to you or anyone else that believes in the “official conspiracy hypothesis” to PUT UP OR SHUT UP.
Post your film on you tube where you drop a piece on intact concrete from a great height and it turns to 50 micron powder, and collect your prize money from me, the Nobel committee, and from all the companies who will offer you billions of dollars for your patent of the technique that makes milling obsolete!
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:45 pm#113 – “Because to do so, dear, would put the troops in danger. This isn’t rocket science, dear heart. Do try to keep up.” Comment by PaulB
PBJ – I think if you had the equipment in place to remove the troops immediately, you’d find they would be out of danger. And no….this isn’t rocket science – you demonstrate that fact ably.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:48 pmFunny how the right wingers forget that Bush FIRED the 2 Generals, Pace & Abazaid, because they were against the surge. The surge was a concept of the neocon Robert Kagan. Petraeus, who wrote the Army manual on counterinsurgency, recommended twice as many soldiers as he was given. So who isn’t listening to the commanders on the ground???
And as for the “next 6 months”, they have been saying that for the last 3 years. It a joke now, called a Friedman Unit, for NY Times columnist Tom Friedman, who echoed the 6 months time frame for so long…
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:48 pmFine, upstanding represenative of the American people.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:50 pmWe hear you “loud and clear”, Sir!
“Joe – The Dems haven’t done anything responsible for the military since JFK.
Your smirky HUD suggestion shows what happens when the ACLU gets involved in mental health holds – - you poor thing!
Tooodles…..and I hope you feel better SOON! (They’ll let you out of the strait-jacket as soon as they are certain you pose no danger to yourself or others.)”
See, first he tried to cross the street and hope I didn’t notice him, but then when I saw I was walking towards him, he commencing with the little-girl shrieking.
Because you clearly have had no opportunity to learn this on your own, let me fill in you in something; if you were a man, you would have at least tried to respond to my question in some manner that indicates that you think your position is defensible. That, or admitted that I’ve got you dead to rights. But we’re in the realm of speculation here.
I’ve just listed a whole series of issues surrounding the Iraq War that opponents answered correctly, and war supporters got wrong. Can you come up with even one example of a question that went the other way?
Even one?
Since you can’t, why do you continue to assume that your political beliefs give you a better understanding of the Iraq War than your opponents?
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:52 pmCritical thinker – I watched an interesting program on the History channel which demonstrated the design of the tower construction, the impact of the planes and the heat from the fuel combustion ALL combined to produce the sorrowful results we saw on 9/11.
Your imagined genius causes other to look at you and wonder “God, I hope he/she doesn’t drive a car or teach kids or work with sharp knives.”
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:53 pmEven a former commander on the ground in Iraq knows the truth. General Paul Eaton wrote a letter to BUsh that was printed in the NY Times, and cross posted at votevets.org
General Eaton’s Letter to President Bush on Veto
May 1, 2007
President George W. Bush
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
Washington, DC 20500
Dear Mr. President,
Today, in your veto message regarding the bipartisan legislation just passed on Operation Iraqi Freedom, you asserted that you so decided because you listen to your commanders on the ground.
Respectfully, as your former commander on the ground, your administration did not listen to our best advice. In fact, a number of my fellow Generals were forced out of their jobs, because they did not tell you what you wanted to hear — most notably General Eric Shinseki, whose foresight regarding troop levels was advice you rejected, at our troops’ peril.
The legislation you vetoed today represented a course of action that is long overdue. This war can no longer be won by the military alone. We must bring to bear the entire array of national power – military, diplomatic and economic. The situation demands a surge in diplomacy, and pressure on the Iraqi government to fix its internal affairs. Further, the Army and Marine Corps are on the verge of breaking – or have been broken already – by the length and intensity of this war. This tempo is not sustainable – and you have failed to grow the ground forces to meet national security needs. We must begin the process of bringing troops home, and repairing and growing our military, if we are ever to have a combat-ready force for the long war on terror ahead of us.
The bill you rejected today sets benchmarks for success that the Iraqis would have to meet, and puts us on a course to redeploy our troops. It stresses the need for sending troops into battle only when they are rested, trained and equipped. In my view, and in the view of many others in the military that I know, that is the best course of action for our security.
As someone who served this nation for decades, I have the utmost respect for the office you hold. However, as a man of conscience, I could not sit idly by as you told the American people today that your veto was based on the recommendations of military men. Your administration ignored the advice of our military’s finest minds before, and I see no evidence that you are listening to them now.
I urge you to reconsider your position, and work with Congress to pass a bill that achieves the goals laid out above.
Respectfully,
Major General Paul D. Eaton, USA, Retired
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:54 pm“PBJ – I think if you had the equipment in place to remove the troops immediately, you’d find they would be out of danger.”
ROFL…. Dear heart, do you know how complicated it would be to remove 170,000 troops, 100,000 contractors, and countless vehicles, equipment, and the like from Iraq? And all of this without funding?
“And no….this isn’t rocket science – you demonstrate that fact ably.”
ROFL…. I’ll just let that comment stand.
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:55 pm“The surge was a concept of the neocon Robert Kagan.”
Yup. Petraeus had nothing to do with it. He’s simply trying to do what he can within the framework of “the surge.”
“Petraeus, who wrote the Army manual on counterinsurgency, recommended twice as many soldiers as he was given”
And again, yup. Not to mention that he has admitted privately that “the surge” has only about a 25% chance of success.
I actually have no real beef with Petraeus, aside from the idiocy of his comment about the real threat in Iraq, assuming that Murtha is quoting him correctly. All generals at his level have to balance political considerations against military considerations and I’m assuming he’s doing the best he can with the resources he has. I just think it’s silly the way his name is invoked as if he’s the second coming.
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:00 pmPope John Paul:
Pope John Paul II calls War a Defeat for Humanity: Neoconservative Iraq Just War Theories Rejected
Pop Benedict:
New Pope Benedict XVI a Strong Critic of War
I am very aware of what the popes have felt about the illegal war in Iraq. It is you mighty aphrodite that needs to bone up on facts.
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:03 pmJoe – “if you were a man, you would have at least tried to respond to my question in some manner that indicates that you think your position is defensible…..”
My huband, Prince Valiant, is delighted I am not a man – he doesn’t swiitch hit.
To address your assertions. The digusting terrorist acts by Sunnis and Shiites SHOULD have been anticipated – if for nothing else than fear AND revenge.
If you were a man, you might think Saddam moved a few tons of WMD’s the same way he was moving CASH. If you were a man, you might admit the Kurds are doing well up north. If you were a man you might admit minority Sunnis are fearful of their loss of power – but the Shiites have agreed to oil-revenue sharing. If you were a man, you might admit that Saddam violated the terms of the 1991 Gulf-War cease fire. If you were a man you might admit it was a good thing General Eisenhower didn’t have to listen to all you back benchers.
What flavour jell-o for you?
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:03 pmPBJ – Dems are NOT willing to fund the retreat/surrender?? I’m shocked!!
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:05 pmHow does admitting something that isn’t true make you a man?
Mighty aphrodite is whacked.
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:10 pmre#129 valiant venus
You have no education in engineering, and know nothing of material science, and therefore do not know what questions to ask.
Not every detective is like Columbo, and knows the right questions to ask to DISPROVE a hypothesis, but I like Columbo know the right questions to ask, because I do have an education in engineering, unlike you and most people who do not understand that the fine concrete poweder is PROOF of explosives!
In that television show you watched, did they explain how intact concrete could be changed into a 50 micron fine powder without explosives or MILLING?
Well duh, of course not!
If they explained in that television show how 50 microm fine powders are created and how they cannot be created in collisions and falls, everybody would see that there is IRREFUTABLE proof that the official explanation is a LIE, and would demand an answer.
Why do you not go to a engineering school or concrete manufacturer and watch what happens when concrete fails, or go the a library and check out a book on material science that explains concrete. or check out a book that explains MILLING, rather than watching a paid lying shill television show?
Of course you will not do it, for the same reason most other Americans will not, you do not like to USE YOUR BRAIN and take the time to make a determinatin for yourself, but would rather be spoon fed your ideas from a talking IDIOT box.
I repeat – if what I am saying is so “outlandish” how come not a single expert backing the official lie will explain the MECHANICS of how the intact concrete can be MILLED into a 50 micron fine powder in less than 15 seconds without explosive?
Well duh, of course they IGNORE and do not explain this because it is IRREFUTABLE evidence that explosives were used!
I repeat – PUT UP OR SHUT UP and show a video of an intact piece of concrete being changed into a 50 micron fine poweder in less than 15 seconds, and claim your prize money from me, the Nobel committe, and from the people who will give you billions of dollars for the patent that makes MILLING obsolete.
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:16 pmCritical thinker – I do not claim to be an engineer, materials scientist, architect, etc. (I appreciate the History channel and the experts they found to de-bunk your BUNK – and in such a clear and concise way, too!) But since I do not have the time or inclination to “PUT UP OR SHUT UP” why don’t you take that intact piece of concrete and demonstrate why it is impossible to convernt that chunk to the 50 micron fine powder. Psst, being the “absent minded professor”, don’t forget your parachute, fuel and fire. Just trying to to help.
Is the new tin-foil hat a tad tight??
Tooodles……..
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:32 pmCome on mighty aphrodite. I provided facts that prove both popes John Paul II and Bendict XVI have been against the illegal war in Iraq. prove to me that they were behind it at any point.
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:33 pmSpongeBob – I was confused, too – by reading the post I was commenting on – I think Joe was trying to “pump up” his masculinity……
Toooodles……………
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:34 pm“Murtha is telling the truth. General Betrayus is lying to Congress”
Comment by Tom3
Murtha’s statement is inaccurate. He did speak with Petraeus and Patraeus did meet with a number of Congressmen.
http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewPolitics.asp?Page=/Politics/archive/200705/POL20070503c.html
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:36 pm#
ImPEAR- Thanks for playing – - I do not contend official Catholic dogma condones this war….and if you would read what is writtien rather than what you do NOT see between th lines, you might not apPEAR so poorly informed. Thanks again – they’re serving jello in the day room….run along.
Comment by valiant venus — May 3, 2007 @ 1:25 pm
I assume you actually are referring to my post under “Impeach..” Again, post a link to prove your implied allegation that the Catholic Church supported the Iraq war. Surprise! You won’t find one because it doesn’t exist.
P.S. We know you are really M.A. One can attempt to disguise oneself by adopting a different “persona,” but the person doesn’t change. “Toodles” to you.
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:39 pmThat’s great, now show me proof that Pope John Paul II or Pope Benedict support the illegal war in Iraq.
May 3rd, 2007 at 2:48 pmValiant Venus,
I apologize. I should have written, “If HE were a man…” in reference to your husband. My bad.
“If you were a man, you might think Saddam moved a few tons of WMD’s the same way he was moving CASH.”
You mean, “If I were a man who had been proven wrong…” because it has now been definitively proven that there no WMDs in Iraq prior to the invasion.
“If you were a man, you might admit the Kurds are doing well up north.” Admit it? That fact was one of the primary reasons I opposed the war, since you people are almost certainly going to sell them out. Clinton protected our Kurdish allies for years, and now you’re working to shove them back under some Arab dictator’s boot.
“If you were a man you might admit minority Sunnis are fearful of their loss of power” Done.
“- but the Shiites have agreed to oil-revenue sharing.” Not yet they haven’t.
“If you were a man, you might admit that Saddam violated the terms of the 1991 Gulf-War cease fire.” Done.
“If you were a man you might admit it was a good thing General Eisenhower didn’t have to listen to all you back benchers.” Back in the real world, Eisenhower’s boss went to great lengths to bring the Republicans on board with his military efforts, both before and during the war. FDR and Marshall – whom you backbenchers spent a decade slandering as a traitor after he won World War II – even went so far as to delay rearmament out of deference to the sensibilities of your party. You see, that’s what a real leader does in times of war and crisis – he seeks to bring the country together, out of concern for the broad national interest, rather than working to rip it apart, out of a narrow partisan interest.
May 3rd, 2007 at 3:05 pmSpongeBob – Get up to speed – I answered in #51. To clarify for Your Slowness, the Catholic Church does not endorse the Iraq War. So what. Neither do the Amish, or the Buddhists……Your point is?…..You have no point.
May 3rd, 2007 at 3:15 pm“You mean, “If I were a man who had been proven wrong…†because it has now been definitively proven that there no WMDs in Iraq prior to the invasion.” – Jokes on Joe
No it hasn’t – - but you continue to repeat more LIES from the Left. The weapons inspectors admitted they checked 125 sites out of 1000. That doesn’t sound very definitive to me. Do you think they had any notice which sites the inspectors were heading to?
You make this game tooo easy…..but thanks for playing!
May 3rd, 2007 at 3:19 pm#
SpongeBob – Get up to speed – I answered in #51. To clarify for Your Slowness, the Catholic Church does not endorse the Iraq War. So what. Neither do the Amish, or the Buddhists……Your point is?…..You have no point.
Comment by valiant venus — May 3, 2007 @ 3:15 pm
You answered nothing. You asked a question in your original post about what John Paul and the “Benedicts” had said in #51. You also ignored my request that you post some kind of link explaining what the hell you meant. And now you tell Spongebob you answered the same question you posed in #51 IN #51. And you perfectly represent the logic of the far-right, which is no logic at all. Simply a meaningless circle.
May 3rd, 2007 at 3:25 pmYou said:
So, what you are saying is that you took MY position to use against me?
Way to go genius.
If not, then what the fu*k was the point of your dumb a$$ comment.
You either agree with me that the Catholics (aka The Church) are against Bush or you are full of sh!t. But, either way I am the one that is right.
May 3rd, 2007 at 3:26 pm“No it hasn’t”
Actually, dear, yes it has. Quite conclusively.
“but you continue to repeat more LIES from the Left.”
Dear heart, I’m afraid that the only liar here is you. You really should do your homework before continuing to spout nonsense.
“The weapons inspectors admitted they checked 125 sites out of 1000.”
LOL…. That’s what you’re basing your opinion on? Oh, my…. Dear heart, they had access to Iraqi scientists, government officials, records, and sites, both before and after the war. There was nothing there, dear. There’s nothing to find because there was nothing to find. You were duped.
“You make this game tooo easy…..but thanks for playing!”
LOL… Couldn’t have said it better myself, dear.
Man, can we get some smarter monkeys? This is no challenge at all.
May 3rd, 2007 at 3:58 pm“PBJ – Dems are NOT willing to fund the retreat/surrender?? I’m shocked!!”
ROFL…. Loved the moving goalposts, dear, not to mention the fact that you were wholly unable to deal with the stumbling block I placed in the way of your little fantasy about Congressional Democrats.
Of course they will fund the withdrawal, dear, but Bush will veto it. Do try to keep up, won’t you?
May 3rd, 2007 at 3:59 pmYou know, I just consulted the Rules of Internet Debating, and in Section IV Paragraph 8, it states the following:
“Any debator who, on or after November 1, 2003, states that there WERE SO weapons of mass destruction in Iraq shall be declared the loser of said debate by technical knock out.”
Sorry, vv. You put up a pretty good fight, but you’re going to have work on that right cross.
May 3rd, 2007 at 4:00 pm“If you were a man, you might think Saddam moved a few tons of WMD’s the same way he was moving CASH.”
ROFL…. Oh my…. Free clue, dear heart — moving thousands of tons of weapons and materiel is a hell of a lot harder than moving cash. Hell, in moving cash, you don’t even have to physically transport dollars — it’s just bits in a computer. And even if you don’t count the insurmountable obstacle of moving hundreds of trucks worth of material, you still have the problem that chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons materials leave traces, both in the move and in the laboratories and warehouses where they were originally stored. In short, and as usual, you got nothing.
“If you were a man, you might admit the Kurds are doing well up north.”
Committing ethnic cleansing? Supporting terrorist acts in Turkey? Raising the spectacle of a contact with both Iran and Turkey? Just what is your definition of “doing well?”
“If you were a man you might admit minority Sunnis are fearful of their loss of power”
And the minor inconvenience of their loss of lives….
Loved the disconnection from reality. Nice job!
May 3rd, 2007 at 4:04 pmTom, No ONE said anything of the kind. YOU are a pathological LIAR….you poor thing.
Comment by valiant venus
Boehner said exactly that, over three months ago. You really should get out more, Toodles.
May 3rd, 2007 at 5:10 pmPBJ – The millions of dollars leaving Baghdad when it was confiscated was IN CASH – not computer chips, not laundry tickets. I appreciate this opportunity to clarify your falsehoods.
May 3rd, 2007 at 6:14 pmSpngey – I agree with you on “The Church”. I just found it amusing that you would find them a reliable reference…..will wonders never cease?
May 3rd, 2007 at 6:15 pmHey Venus,
How is my 54 year old overweight “stud” with the comb over doing today? From the looks of what you have been arguing so far, it doesn’t look good. I’m hearing that beautiful music again!
Great to be entertained while working out at the gym, my bald headed punching bag…Music’s gettin loud, baby! Hear it?
Blappity, blappity, blippity blap. The sweet sound of your head being used as a punching bag.
You know, every day the boxers change, but you are always there waiting to be used.
May 3rd, 2007 at 6:59 pmIt has nothing to do with that. It has to do with Bush claiming that God told him to attack Iraq and The Church told him that he is full of sh!t. According to every one of you whackos, you claim that Catholics are Christians and that you all get to be lumped together when counting the number of Christians. Well, the Pope is the mouth piece of God according to the Catholics.
Now I am sure that you won’t group them in with you lunatics in this case. Just a matter of you moving the goal posts again.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:10 pm#150 Comment by valiant venus — May 3, 2007 @ 6:15 pm
Spngey – I agree with you on “The Churchâ€. I just found it amusing that you would find them a reliable reference…..will wonders never cease?
Comment by Spudge_Boy — May 3, 2007 @ 8:10 pm
It has nothing to do with that. It has to do with Bush claiming that God told him to attack Iraq and The Church told him that he is full of sh!t.
Look, fat boy VV, I’m trying to do you a favor! Ever since you acted like Dorian Gray and lost your 24 year old girly persona I’ve been tryin to get ya to listen.
May 3rd, 2007 at 8:28 pmSee, now here is a case in point. Know what I mean? No? OK I’ll tell ya. You think what Spudge_Boy says is funny, right? But, see, its not funny at all. Ya get it now? I’m just tryin to help ya, OK? Now fix your comb over, clean your coke bottles and try hard to understand why your head hurts so much.
Merlin – I know that comb over thing might fly for a buff-boy from West Hollywood looking for a Sugar-Daddy(sorry to disappoint)…..
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:17 pm“The millions of dollars leaving Baghdad when it was confiscated was IN CASH – not computer chips, not laundry tickets.”
Dear heart, since you didn’t specify precisely which money you were referring to, I assumed you were referring to the quite ordinary electronic transfers of money that Saddam was doing in his role as chief embezzler. It’s hardly my fault that you cannot get your story straight.
In any case, dear, my point above still stands, a point that you noticeably ducked out of answering since it made you look so monumentally stupid. Here: let’s provide it again:
And even if you don’t count the insurmountable obstacle of moving hundreds of trucks worth of material [unobserved], you still have the problem that chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons materials leave traces, both in the move and in the laboratories and warehouses where they were originally stored. In short, and as usual, you got nothing.
May 3rd, 2007 at 9:49 pmPowerful assessment of the general’s testimony. Murtha has always been close to the senior levels in the military. Wonder who’s talking to him. As a marine vet, Murtha’s probably got an “issue” with Army officers and the Army way, but he’s always been sympathetic to any military personnel issue. What’s in it for Murtha to baselessly diss Petraeus? Not much; So it’s very likely true.
May 4th, 2007 at 6:26 pmhey valantthehater…examples please
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March 27th, 2008 at 6:52 am[...] Murtha (D-PA) charged that the White House had been using Gen. David Petraeus as a prop to “purely make political statements.” Comments 0 Share [...]
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