Comments on: Audience Applauds As Giuliani, Tancredo Endorse Waterboarding Torture http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/ Thu, 26 Nov 2009 05:55:31 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Old Uncle Rupert http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-5/#comment-3812603 Old Uncle Rupert Sun, 20 May 2007 16:11:26 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3812603 It is not outside the realm of possibility, based on past FOX events, that the audience wasn't thoroughly screened to pass <strong>neo-con muster</strong>. I have more faith in general population of South Carolina than that. They also lapped up the <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IrE6FMpai8" rel="nofollow">Julie-Annie</a> knee-jerk to Ron Paul comment on foreign policy. It's no question that Ron Paul's message is central to any real discussion on terrorism. Unfortunately, interested parties can not afford to let the debate stray from "good versus evil", because that would of course result in less of your resources being forcefully redistributed via tax dollars to such parties. It is not outside the realm of possibility, based on past FOX events, that the audience wasn’t thoroughly screened to pass neo-con muster. I have more faith in general population of South Carolina than that. They also lapped up the Julie-Annie knee-jerk to Ron Paul comment on foreign policy. It’s no question that Ron Paul’s message is central to any real discussion on terrorism. Unfortunately, interested parties can not afford to let the debate stray from “good versus evil”, because that would of course result in less of your resources being forcefully redistributed via tax dollars to such parties.

]]> By: smchris http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-5/#comment-3810325 smchris Fri, 18 May 2007 12:21:42 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3810325 Some months ago an essayist dug up a book by an American POW of the Japanese in WWII Asia. Beat him over every inch of his body until he was furred in pus. Starved him to skin and bones. He wrote that there was nothing worse than water suffocation torture. So congratulations all you tough, manly Neo-Fascists who defend waterboarding. You are demonstrating to the world that the U.S. has descended to the mentality of the Japanese Axis in WWII. You must feel so viral and proud. Some months ago an essayist dug up a book by an American POW of the Japanese in WWII Asia. Beat him over every inch of his body until he was furred in pus. Starved him to skin and bones. He wrote that there was nothing worse than water suffocation torture.

So congratulations all you tough, manly Neo-Fascists who defend waterboarding. You are demonstrating to the world that the U.S. has descended to the mentality of the Japanese Axis in WWII. You must feel so viral and proud.

]]> By: Julius Scissor http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-5/#comment-3810253 Julius Scissor Fri, 18 May 2007 05:26:39 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3810253 Hey genius, waterboarding is not a punishment. It is a means of extracting information, false I might also add. You run-away associative hysteria. Doubleplusungood is not a word buddy. Harsh does not equal punishment. Harsh simply equals harsh. Punishment is at best a form of payment. Get help. You've got a couple screws loose. So are you willing to undergo it to demonstrate your claim, m12? Not especially. It’s certainly unpleasant, but punishment is supposed to be. Hey genius, waterboarding is not a punishment. It is a means of extracting information, false I might also add.

You run-away associative hysteria. Doubleplusungood is not a word buddy. Harsh does not equal punishment. Harsh simply equals harsh. Punishment is at best a form of payment. Get help. You’ve got a couple screws loose.

So are you willing to undergo it to demonstrate your claim, m12?

Not especially. It’s certainly unpleasant, but punishment is supposed to be.

]]> By: Hammer http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-5/#comment-3808387 Hammer Thu, 17 May 2007 14:06:59 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3808387 I guess what most of you are saying is that if you knew there was a nuclear bomb set to go off in your hometown that would kill you and your family and law enforcement had a terrorist in custody that knew where that bomb was, you would only endorse their asking him politely where it was and if he said, fuck you, you'd be okay with them giving up. Thank God you people aren't in charge. I guess what most of you are saying is that if you knew there was a nuclear bomb set to go off in your hometown that would kill you and your family and law enforcement had a terrorist in custody that knew where that bomb was, you would only endorse their asking him politely where it was and if he said, fuck you, you’d be okay with them giving up. Thank God you people aren’t in charge.

]]> By: Lee http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3808312 Lee Thu, 17 May 2007 13:20:30 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3808312 The U.S. is full of armchair generals & armchair torturers. As long as someone else is doing the dirty work, they can sit back fat, dumb, and happy, praising Bush, cutting checks to the 700 Club, watching nascar, and flag waving like a lame, slow motion scene from just about any Michael Bay film. <strong><em>"...an am proud to be an umerican....!"</em></strong> The U.S. is full of armchair generals & armchair torturers. As long as someone else is doing the dirty work, they can sit back fat, dumb, and happy, praising Bush, cutting checks to the 700 Club, watching nascar, and flag waving like a lame, slow motion scene from just about any Michael Bay film.

“…an am proud to be an umerican….!”

]]> By: Victor http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807585 Victor Wed, 16 May 2007 23:25:51 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807585 Alton, you see those as the only two options? Treat them like royalty or torture them? Is your imagination really that stunted? Alton, you see those as the only two options? Treat them like royalty or torture them? Is your imagination really that stunted?

]]> By: Alton http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807492 Alton Wed, 16 May 2007 22:46:44 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807492 I know...we should take all of these 'alleged' terrorists and bath them in flower petals and feed them filet and lobster. Maybe then they will assist us in STOPPING large scale attacks on our country. Waterboarding might be a mild form of torture but its not as bad as watching our OWN people get beheaded on webcasts! Eye for an eye!! I know…we should take all of these ‘alleged’ terrorists and bath them in flower petals and feed them filet and lobster. Maybe then they will assist us in STOPPING large scale attacks on our country. Waterboarding might be a mild form of torture but its not as bad as watching our OWN people get beheaded on webcasts! Eye for an eye!!

]]> By: sean http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807434 sean Wed, 16 May 2007 22:23:28 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807434 hey Canuk Canadian thts just not right! !!!!!!! hey Canuk Canadian thts just not right! !!!!!!!

]]> By: Canuk Canadian http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807396 Canuk Canadian Wed, 16 May 2007 22:07:29 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807396 Nuke the USA bastards. Nuke the USA bastards.

]]> By: sean http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807343 sean Wed, 16 May 2007 21:54:04 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807343 sorry fellas the reason you don't torture is simple it is less than 10% effective and once you make it a practice you have to worry about your own soldiers and what happens to them.At least if you don't torture and they do when the war is over you can have those men stand war crimes trials it would look amazingly hippocritical to bring someone before a war crimes trial and prosicute them when you do the same thing.Do we need to have the moral high ground in our global wars on terror?Ibelieve yes or all that we are fighting for,like the american way of life and christain values are all just bunk!!!!And don't you think the fence sitting possible bad guy could be pushed off the fence and into the arms of radical groups by our own hippocracy.the top 10 global intel agencies incl. the cia says torture for the most part does not yield any good intel,and most intel is bad within 20 hours of the capture of the guy you are going to torture the terrorist group are light and nimble and can change plans and make any intel you get quickly useless.And lastly to the a-hole who said how quickly we would thro out the geneva convention if 300,000 americans died .Well you might as well thro out the constitution too because any document that the us signs is as binding as the declaration of indepenence,bill of rights,and the constitution.because acording to the constitution any treaty or agreement we sign is as binding as the constitution and i don't care if I die in an attack I would rather than give up the principals that this country was founded on then live in your world pal!!!!! sorry fellas the reason you don’t torture is simple it is less than 10% effective and once you make it a practice you have to worry about your own soldiers and what happens to them.At least if you don’t torture and they do when the war is over you can have those men stand war crimes trials it would look amazingly hippocritical to bring someone before a war crimes trial and prosicute them when you do the same thing.Do we need to have the moral high ground in our global wars on terror?Ibelieve yes or all that we are fighting for,like the american way of life and christain values are all just bunk!!!!And don’t you think the fence sitting possible bad guy could be pushed off the fence and into the arms of radical groups by our own hippocracy.the top 10 global intel agencies incl. the cia says torture for the most part does not yield any good intel,and most intel is bad within 20 hours of the capture of the guy you are going to torture the terrorist group are light and nimble and can change plans and make any intel you get quickly useless.And lastly to the a-hole who said how quickly we would thro out the geneva convention if 300,000 americans died .Well you might as well thro out the constitution too because any document that the us signs is as binding as the declaration of indepenence,bill of rights,and the constitution.because acording to the constitution any treaty or agreement we sign is as binding as the constitution and i don’t care if I die in an attack I would rather than give up the principals that this country was founded on then live in your world pal!!!!!

]]> By: Victor http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807319 Victor Wed, 16 May 2007 21:48:53 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807319 My favorite part of these arguments is when the bellicose Neocon pulls out the "weak" card to use to deride those of us who do not jump to violence as the answer to the problems of the world. Seriously, what kind of messed up world is it in which resorting to violence is a show of strength, while finding diplomatic solutions is weakness? Indeed, violence is the refuge of the coward, who is too weak to face the underlying challenge. Who is weak? Gandhi or Bush? Without question it is the latter. My favorite part of these arguments is when the bellicose Neocon pulls out the “weak” card to use to deride those of us who do not jump to violence as the answer to the problems of the world. Seriously, what kind of messed up world is it in which resorting to violence is a show of strength, while finding diplomatic solutions is weakness? Indeed, violence is the refuge of the coward, who is too weak to face the underlying challenge. Who is weak? Gandhi or Bush? Without question it is the latter.

]]> By: Josh Jasper http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807158 Josh Jasper Wed, 16 May 2007 21:08:12 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807158 Rep. Tancredo's church <a href="http://reformed-angler.blogspot.com/2007/03/evangelicals-condemn-torture.html" rel="nofollow">condemns torture</a> If anyone with a regular news readership were to, say, call his church leadership and local minister and get an opinion on the idea that one of thier flock might potentially, as President, encourage torture, I think there might somhow be a good story embedded in all of this. A quick googling for "denver" and Evangelical Presbyterian gave <a href="http://www.pepc.org/pepc/welcome_" rel="nofollow">this link</a> 9100 East Parker Road, Parker, Colorado 80138 Office:303-841-2125, Toll Free: 877-629-2621 Have at it. Rep. Tancredo’s church condemns torture

If anyone with a regular news readership were to, say, call his church leadership and local minister and get an opinion on the idea that one of thier flock might potentially, as President, encourage torture, I think there might somhow be a good story embedded in all of this.

A quick googling for “denver” and Evangelical Presbyterian gave this link

9100 East Parker Road, Parker, Colorado 80138
Office:303-841-2125, Toll Free: 877-629-2621

Have at it.

]]> By: jake3988 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807062 jake3988 Wed, 16 May 2007 20:36:58 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807062 # torture is immoral. torture is disgusting. torture is illegal. torture engenders more hatred against us. torture ensures us that people will try to torture americans. the constitution doesn’t permit the government to engage in torture. period. some reading: “Should the US Military be Allowed to use Torture? http://www.populistamerica.com/ should_the_u_s__military_be_allowed_to_use_torture Comment by stopthecons — May 15, 2007 @ 11:21 pm Thank you. You said it spot on. #

torture is immoral. torture is disgusting. torture is illegal. torture engenders more hatred against us. torture ensures us that people will try to torture americans. the constitution doesn’t permit the government to engage in torture.

period.

some reading:

“Should the US Military be Allowed to use Torture?
http://www.populistamerica.com/ should_the_u_s__military_be_allowed_to_use_torture

Comment by stopthecons — May 15, 2007 @ 11:21 pm

Thank you. You said it spot on.

]]> By: Mertens http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807056 Mertens Wed, 16 May 2007 20:35:45 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807056 Vote for the month Fred Thomson will enter the GOP primary at www.fredthompsonnews.com Vote for the month Fred Thomson will enter the GOP primary at

http://www.fredthompsonnews.com

]]> By: mudlark http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3807009 mudlark Wed, 16 May 2007 20:16:26 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3807009 So far, the icons invoked by the Republicans in their debates have been pretend; namely the gasbag Ronald "sunshiney day" Reagan during the first one, and the totally fictitious character Jack Bauer in this latest. Not only that, but the inventiveness of their disaster scenarios suggest they were culled primarily from '50s comic books. Isn't the reality of what we're experiencing and causing every day bad enough? As far as thousands of men, women, and children being killed,(I assume 9/11 is again being trumpeted, a la Rudy Girliani), I suggest that the tens of thousands of Iraqis murdered by a bull***t, wrongheaded invasion and occupation have more than paid the price for something they didn't do. Also, now that there are more American deaths directly attributable to White House policy than there were killed on 9/11, I don't think Republicans should be using it as a talking point for their side. (I almost wrote 'ideas'. Imagine that!) I think, in fact, that they should be ashamed of themselves. I know I am. So far, the icons invoked by the Republicans in their debates have been pretend; namely the gasbag Ronald “sunshiney day” Reagan during the first one, and the totally fictitious character Jack Bauer in this latest. Not only that, but the inventiveness of their disaster scenarios suggest they were culled primarily from ’50s comic books. Isn’t the reality of what we’re experiencing and causing every day bad enough?
As far as thousands of men, women, and children being killed,(I assume 9/11 is again being trumpeted, a la Rudy Girliani), I suggest that the tens of thousands of Iraqis murdered by a bull***t, wrongheaded invasion and occupation have more than paid the price for something they didn’t do. Also, now that there are more American deaths directly attributable to White House policy than there were killed on 9/11, I don’t think Republicans should be using it as a talking point for their side. (I almost wrote ‘ideas’. Imagine that!) I think, in fact, that they should be ashamed of themselves. I know I am.

]]> By: Nate http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3806954 Nate Wed, 16 May 2007 19:51:47 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3806954 Jake: So since torture is not-according to you-banned in the constitution (I guess torture doesn't count as cruel and unusual punishment) what you're saying is that torture is perfectly ok? Is that right? You want america to torture people? Ok, fair enough, so what exactly makes this america of yours any better than iran, or saudi arabia, or the soviet union, or dark ages europe? Hot dogs? Jake:

So since torture is not-according to you-banned in the constitution (I guess torture doesn’t count as cruel and unusual punishment) what you’re saying is that torture is perfectly ok? Is that right? You want america to torture people? Ok, fair enough, so what exactly makes this america of yours any better than iran, or saudi arabia, or the soviet union, or dark ages europe? Hot dogs?

]]> By: HP http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3806933 HP Wed, 16 May 2007 19:41:42 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3806933 The USA is the most oppressive regime ever. With all the concentration camps, sharia law, trial without jury, how could anyone ever doubt this? Many citizens are put in prison without charges. I hate this country. The USA is the most oppressive regime ever. With all the concentration camps, sharia law, trial without jury, how could anyone ever doubt this? Many citizens are put in prison without charges. I hate this country.

]]> By: HP http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3806927 HP Wed, 16 May 2007 19:39:00 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3806927 Big papa sounds racist to me actually with all the Lily-white adjectives thrown around. Big papa sounds racist to me actually with all the Lily-white adjectives thrown around.

]]> By: Ugly Amiercan http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3806883 Ugly Amiercan Wed, 16 May 2007 19:21:13 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3806883 Ron Paul is the only true American up there. All the others are would be dictators. Ron Paul is the only true American up there.

All the others are would be dictators.

]]> By: zxz http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/comment-page-4/#comment-3806866 zxz Wed, 16 May 2007 19:13:52 +0000 http://thinkprogress.org/2007/05/15/debate-torture/#comment-3806866 I personally am against torture, but for some morbid reason, seeing Giuliani waterboarded might be exciting. Comment by lunacy — May 16, 2007 @ 12:41 pm I bet you also voted for it before you voted against it. I personally am against torture, but for some morbid reason, seeing Giuliani waterboarded might be exciting.
Comment by lunacy — May 16, 2007 @ 12:41 pm

I bet you also voted for it before you voted against it.

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