“The Democrats cannot override his veto,

And this is why a NO vote was the best thing to do! The supposed cost you advocate below is simply quitting when the going gets rough. Throwing in the towel, as they say. Your “pragmatism” lacks courage!

and will never be able to, given how the GOP votes party over country. If they keep pushing along this path, they will also lose control of the Senate (due to the traitor LIEberman’s switching caucuses threat), and that would be a huge blow to their hopes of ultimately stopping this war.”

This is just fearful capitulation. Read the DLC ideology and see the basic idea that formed it was a dramatic shift to the right, based, IMO, on the fear of becoming irrelavent.

We’ve been patient for far too long and we’ve had enough. We’re tired of politician after politician selling us the same old crap. If we seems angry, it’s because we are no longer interested in compromises or consensus with George Bush.

Cut the funding. All of it. It’s our freaking money and we’re tired of our elected ‘representatives’ spending it on killing and maiming people who aside from the accident of their birth country, wouldn’t have any reason to be killing one another.

Enough. We’ve had enough. Especially of excuses.

The Democrats cannot override his veto, and will never be able to, given how the GOP votes party over country. If they keep pushing along this path, they will also lose control of the Senate (due to the traitor LIEberman’s switching caucuses threat), and that would be a huge blow to their hopes of ultimately stopping this war.

It is quite unfortunate that the Democrats have to let Bush win this battle in the war over the war… It is far more important for the Democrats to be ultimately victorious in this fight, though.

I’ve heard a lot of people parallel the Democrats’ behavior at the end of Vietnam to this, in the attempt to say, fighting the White House works. However, Bush is not Nixon; Nixon at least had half a brain inside his head. Bush doesn’t care about the troops, he doesn’t care about what the American people want, and he certainly could care less about what the Democrats in Congress want.

Ideally, I’d like to see the Democrats take a firm stand on ending the war, and I’d like to see it done NOW. The reality of the situation, though, is that Bush doesn’t have to do anything he doesn’t want to do, as his veto cannot be overridden, given the current configuration of Congress.

I have faith in the Democrats that this is by no means the end of their opposition to the war, nor the end of their attempts to bring the troops home as soon as possible. Fighting this battle, however, doesn’t seem to be the way it’s going to happen. I don’t like that things are that way, but that is the way it seems to be.

We’re all passionate about ending this illegal occupation to defend an attempted corporate takeover of a nation’s natural resources. We cannot, however, let our passion blind us to reality.

Stop the war. Impeach. Do it. This isn’t a decision for you. The American people have already decided.

~Sean

A couple things.

One, there is an internal inconsistency in the position of letting the veto stand. Generally we all mistrust the President and fear he will not do the right thing, but to let the veto stand would be to transfer the power of the purse to the President as he would have the flexibility to do what he chooses until Congress does act. The most pertinent precedent in this regard is the fight in 1970 over the Eagleton amendment to stop all funds being used in Laos. Nixon vetoed it and continued the bombing campaign for months, coming back to Congress for new funding only after the campaign was over.

Two, why is this a change of course? The President has to now, for the first time since this started, report to Congress on progress in Iraq and on whether Iraqis are meeting the benchmarks they agreed to. DO I wish it were more? Of course. But is the fact that the president has to come back to Congress and outline where his policy is failing — and do so before the next supplemental is considered — is an important change from his record to date of receiving blank checks for which he had to do nothing to be held accountable.

This fight is in the early rounds. This supplemental is not a knock out by any means, but we are moving toward ending this in a way that protects our interests.

Thanks again for hearing me out.

No more $$$$$$$ for Iraqs civil war.

Bring our troops home NOW!!!!

Denis has dissented from the TP/CAP position, and we believed he deserved an opportunity to make his case through a guest blog post in order to generate some true reflection and discussion on this issue. We also wanted to provide an opportunity for the TP community to weigh in with respect to his views.

Please be civil in your comments regarding Denis’s posting. Thanks

If they fail, we’ll punish them by not leaving.

That being said, it is completely inappropriate for Congressional Democrats to give Bush a carte blanche for more war. They are betraying their core constituents, and hopefully they will be challenged by independent, antiwar candidates in marginal districts in 2008.

This is a dangerous President who must be stopped. And this war must end now before it expands further. No to Denis. No to Bush. And no to the DLC.

Let me say I am still enraged, sent out a short scathing email to Larsen ( no foul language that I am most famous for)…

This is bull shit spread with jelly to appease the voter’s….It ain’t gonna work for me not in a million..I am letting them know they are not going to get away scott free with this crap…..Either they stop funding and impeach these basterd’s, atleast put it back verbaly on the table, stop this war and tell bush to take a hike or I’m against every last one of them..Period…They didn’t put up a fight, hell I can do better and I know how to win..No more money, end it now…..Bull shit..I’m pissed and looking at other parties to join..Yah I know that would mean we would be just as screwed for 4 more year’s but about this, lives and my country I am one way….Lead. follow or get the hell outta my way….Blessings