‘Bomb Iran’ Podhoretz: War Would ‘Unleash A Wave’ Of Global Anti-Americanism
‘Bomb Iran’ Podhoretz: War Would ‘Unleash A Wave’ Of Global Anti-Americanism
The current issue of Commentary magazine — “widely regarded as the leading outlet for neoconservative writing” — features a controversial cover story by Norman Podhoretz titled “The Case For Bombing Iran.”
Podhoretz’s article appeals to President Bush, “a man who knows evil when he sees it” and who has been “battered more mercilessly and with less justification than any other in living memory,” to carry out military strikes on Iran’s nuclear facilities. U.S. diplomats are now pointing to the essay to pressure foreign diplomats to increase pressure on Iran.
In a new interview, Podhoretz was asked to comment on the possible fallout of the military strikes he advocates. “Well, if we were to bomb the Iranians as I hope and pray we will,” Podhoretz says, “we’ll unleash a wave of anti-Americanism all over the world that will make the anti-Americanism we’ve experienced so far look like a lovefest.”
Watch it (6:20):
Podhoretz qualified his statement about anti-Americanism, saying it was only a “worst case scenario.” It’s “entirely possible,” he claimed, that “many countries, particularly in the Middle East” would “at least secretly applaud us.”
But even global anti-Americanism is worth it, he argues, to slow Iran’s nuclear program “for five or 10 years or more.” In fact, American Progress senior fellow Joseph Cirincione has argued that such a strike “would not, as is often said, delay the Iranian program. It would almost certainly speed it up. That is what happened when the Israelis struck at the Iraq program in 1981.”
Transcript:
Q: What kind of international fallout can we expect from such a campaign?
PODHORETZ: Well, if we were to bomb the Iranians as I hope and pray we will, we’ll unleash a wave of anti-Americanism all over the world that will make the anti-Americanism we’ve experienced so far look like a lovefest. On the other hand — that’s a worst case scenario, and worst case scenarios don’t always materialize. It’s entirely possible that many countries, particularly in the Middle East — the Sunni countries like Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Jordan, who are very worried about Iranian influence and power — would at least secretly applaud us. And I think it’s possible that other countries in Europe, for example, and elsewhere, would be relieved to see the Iranians entirely deprived of the capability to build nuclear weapons, or at least have that ability retarded for five or 10 years or more.
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Secretly applaud us? Does that go along with the secret flowers and candy now being showered upon our troops in Iraq?
June 20th, 2007 at 12:48 pmThat wheezing sound Podhoretz and his neocon allies should have heard this week amid the chaos in Gaza, the carnage in Baghdad and the conflict in Lebanon was the final gasps of the Bush Doctrine in its death throes. Just two years after the President and his neo-conservative allies basked in the glow of their self-proclaimed moment of triumph, the Bush Doctrine of no safe havens for terrorists, American preventive war and democracy promotion is discredited, discarded – and dead.
For the details, see:
June 20th, 2007 at 12:50 pm“The Death of the Bush Doctrine.”
Applaud us??? Not this again.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:51 pmBush ought to know evil when he sees it – he has to look in the mirror each day.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:51 pmHe hopes and prays that we will. Does this man claim to belong to any religion? What religion condones war? Does his “god” want people to be killed?
June 20th, 2007 at 12:51 pmSo what do the deep thinkers here at TP think we should do about Iran’s nuclears ambitions?
Would Israel be justified in bombing Iran’s nuclear facilities?
June 20th, 2007 at 12:52 pmDont worry. All Empires fall. Just wait.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:52 pmWOW!!! Another NeoCon warmonger heard from! Why doesn’t any of this surprise me?
And of course, making sure ALL the world would now hate us is a small price to pay to protect our 51st state, Isreal.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:53 pmPodhoretz’s article appeals to President Bush, “a man who knows evil when he sees it…
He ought to… his Admin is just rife w/ it. BigDickâ„¢ could be the poster child for Evil, Inc.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:53 pmWhat religion condones war?
Comment by cynicalgirl
——————————————————-
ISLAM.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:53 pmWhat a surprise a neocon advocating a policy which empowers and emboldens global terrorism…WELL not really a surprise since alCIAduh is a neocon invention – and essentially a consortium of old CIA assets dating from the Afghan-Russian war, gov’t funded mercenaries, and black ops teams ran by the CIA and other intelligence agencies.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:53 pmCan we afford to fight three wars at the same time?
http://OsiSpeaks.com or http://OsiSpeaks.org
June 20th, 2007 at 12:53 pmthe best one can do is survive the tumble
June 20th, 2007 at 12:54 pmHa ha,
A Pro-Iran post!
Thanks Nico from TP.
You just keep exposing this site as an Iranian front group!
TP the gifyt that keeps giving.
The whole Bomb Iran thing is contrived.
John Podhoretz is a Saudi agent.
He wants America to atatck Iran so Iran is weaken and will have no competitors to take over America.
People daon’t fall for this.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:55 pmThe site is all part of the Muslim domination plan!
Wake up!
Dear God: Say it ain’t so… Please no more preemptive strikes… sepecially in your name. God save me from your people! I know I’m a conservative Christian and I’m out of my element on this website, but the killing has to stop somewhere… I beg you progressives, yell at your newly elected congress to not let Bush drag us inot a fight with yet another country.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:55 pmWhere do these NeoKonReichWingTards come up with such crazy ideas?
If someone told me that they pulled these ideas out of their a**, I’d be inclined to believe them.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:55 pmThis guy is obviously senile.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:55 pmBush KNOWS evil when he SEES it??
Yup…
It takes one to KNOW one, and Bush and his DADDY know them ALL!!
On a serious note, intel told Bush previously that if we bomb Iran, the troops we have in Iraq are subject to being annihilated, as the Iraqis have been relatively MILD up to this time.
Good. I hope so…
June 20th, 2007 at 12:55 pm#10 ringer -
Don’t forget the Catholics and their little experiment, called the Crusades!!!
June 20th, 2007 at 12:56 pmWhat religion condones war?
ISLAM.
Comment by Ringo
Christianity, Judaeism…
June 20th, 2007 at 12:56 pmPresident Bush, “a man who knows evil when he sees it†and who has been “battered more mercilessly and with less justification than any other in living memory,â€
So very, very true.
But at least we elected a President who could keep making decisions in the best interest of the US, despite the cruel and unfounded criticism.
God Bless You, Mr. Bush.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:56 pmCoachjason, for a conservative Christian, you sound pretty reasonable. I hope god listens to you (if he exists).
June 20th, 2007 at 12:56 pmI hope all republican candidates run on this platform! Let the American people know, in every campaign speech, vote republican if you want to bomb Iran! Imagine if Reagan had felt the same way towards the USSR.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:56 pmI think it’s possible that other countries in Europe, for example, and elsewhere, would be relieved to see the Iranians entirely deprived of the capability to build nuclear weapons, or at least have that ability retarded for five or 10 years or more.
Ummm, who’s retarded here? Ringo? Israel? Podhoretz? All of the above?
Anyone else tired of old rich white men deciding our future?
Anyone?
June 20th, 2007 at 12:57 pmWell, if we were to bomb the Iranians as I hope and pray we will, we’ll unleash a wave of anti-Americanism
Not if we make it look like they deserve it and we had no other choice.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:58 pmHe exists, and he’s helped me in the past. This kind of help is beyind just me and I’m sure I’m not the only one praying this prayer.
June 20th, 2007 at 12:58 pmISLAM.
Comment by Ringo
And don’t forget Christianity, while you’re at it, and Judaism…
June 20th, 2007 at 12:58 pmThis man should be shot. kidding
June 20th, 2007 at 12:58 pmThis should be repeated:
What religion condones war?
Comment by cynicalgirl
——————————————————-
ISLAM.
Comment by Ringo — June 20, 2007 @ 12:53 pm
June 20th, 2007 at 12:59 pm
And don’t forget Christianity, while you’re at it, and Judaism…
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — June 20, 2007 @ 12:58 pm
Not any more they don’t, m’boy. Not any more they don’t.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:00 pm“…..The whole Bomb Iran thing is contrived.”
Comment by The Joker
Senator InVain?
June 20th, 2007 at 1:00 pmIs that you?
Haven’t heard much from you on the campaign trail, and you’re never on Capitol Hill when it’s time for a vote.
The Republican party give you a promotion, and a paid position as a troll?
Attack Iran and get us bogged own in a 3rd war and you can bet American civil war is on the horizon.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:00 pmComment by Ringo
Same thing we did to India and Pakistan’s nuclear programs…
June 20th, 2007 at 1:01 pmVance,
“Attack Iran and get us bogged own in a 3rd war and you can bet American civil war is on the horizon.”
That’s the Muslim plan!
June 20th, 2007 at 1:02 pmYou got it!
Coach Jason – thanks – we will keep writing our congress critters – and you need to do the same – especially the Republicans who will pay more attention to you; they know we won’t support the war – but if you tell them that you’re fed up it will have more clout.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:03 pmGod Bless You, Mr. Bush.
Comment by PRIMVS INTER PARES
Thanks, my Nazi azzhole-licker.
Actually, my interests are that of the MULTINATIONAL CORPORATIONS, and no matter HOW MANY of you MORONS have to DIE for MY LIES, I
REALLY DON’T CARE.
And the criticism of me is ABSOLUTELY JUSTIFIED, as I am a TRAITOR!!
See YOU in hell “first among azzholes” (cause I’LL be THERE),
June 20th, 2007 at 1:03 pmMr. Bush
MURDEROUS WAR CRIMINAL
COWARDLY AWOL COXUCKER PUNK TRAITOR TO THE USA
TM-BushCrimeCo, Inc.
Forget a non-nuclear Iran
Pakistan has an existing nuclear arsenal
Pakistan also has highly placed Govt sympathizers for al-Qaeda, the Taliban & Usama bin Laden
Iran’s not the problem in terms of possessing or spreading WsMD
June 20th, 2007 at 1:03 pm#14 - People daon’t fall for this.
The site is all part of the Muslim domination plan!
Wake up! Comment by The Joker
Ahhhh, Joker, does paranoia run in your family or are you just that way from too much exposure to the Rusher and Faux NoNooz?
June 20th, 2007 at 1:04 pmthere is nothing more repulsive to me than the start of yet another war.
But, these people sure seem dead set on having their way. Maybe this country truly needs to hit rock bottom before it can turn this mess around.
some follow up reading:
“Is Imperial Liquidation Possible for America?”
June 20th, 2007 at 1:04 pmhttp://www.populistamerica.com/is_imperial_liquidation_possible_for_america
The Joker,
Do you find it difficult to live a life being afraid of an unseen boogeyman?
Can you please stop with your anti-muslim rantings. Be substantive or move along.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:08 pm#30 – And don’t forget Christianity, while you’re at it, and Judaism…
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — June 20, 2007 @ 12:58 pm
Not any more they don’t, m’boy. Not any more they don’t.
Comment by PRIMVS INTER PARES
Then what religion is BushCo and his buddies hiding behined while they are practicing this illegal war and occupation? AHUH, I thought so.
Why don’t you go back and practice your high school Latin some more.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:09 pmThe why are you a “conservative” Christian? You ae absolutely right – you are out of your element here. Most Progressive posters here knew what Bushco was before Bush was president. We were right, the conservatives were wrong. This is not our mess – it is yours. Why don’t you call your conservative congresspersons and tell them to stop your war?
Get this: if you’re one of them, you can’t be one of us.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:09 pmWell, if we were to bomb the Iranians as I hope and pray we will, we’ll unleash a wave of anti-Americanism all over the world that will make the anti-Americanism we’ve experienced so far look like a lovefest.
That may be what is needed to wake up the American people.
Imagine the consequences of economic sanctions against America. Walmart would close, being unable to import goods from China. American assets overseas would be frozen. China would stop funding our debt. Our government would have to go from deficit spending to a balanced budget overnight.
America would be plunged into a depression instantly. And the American people will finally start to ask, “Why does everybody hate us so much?”
June 20th, 2007 at 1:10 pmThis would be hilarious if it wasn’t so scary.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:11 pmThey run out one of these neocon shills to promote more war, then cite him as evidence that it’s the only feasible policy choice.
False and False and False.
and
none of the above.
Lets’ hope this fetid last gasp is the death rattle of neoconservatism-
June 20th, 2007 at 1:11 pmPssst- hey Jethro- it doesn’t work- you silly think-tank excrement isn’t BASED ON REALITY, or for that matter, history.
What coachJason(Mask) forgets is that the Republicans in the Senate are responsible for not overriding Bush’s veto of the plan that would have stopped the war…Keep the mask on Jason, you’re not scary anyhow.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:13 pmComment by Briseadh na Faire — June 20, 2007 @ 1:10 pm
Wow.
Do you expect anyone to actually take that crap seriously.
Anyway, that last point:
And the American people will finally start to ask, “Why does everybody hate us so much?â€
Is already a reality, and we know the answer:
They hate us, because they are jealous!!!
June 20th, 2007 at 1:14 pmWasn’t Saddam a Sunni?
June 20th, 2007 at 1:16 pmThen what religion is BushCo and his buddies hiding behined while they are practicing this illegal war and occupation?
Comment by upside00 — June 20, 2007 @ 1:09 pm
They are not “hiding” at all. Bush acts in the interests of the American people.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:16 pmone of the fellows that justifies all killing of arabs with a wave of his hand.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:17 pmwhy don’t they stop putting senile xenophobes on websites?
Is already a reality, and we know the answer:
They hate us, because they are jealous!!!
Comment by PRIMVS INTER PARES
I know that if one studies Philosophy cant get to that kind of moronic responses.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:18 pmAmerica would be plunged into a depression instantly. And the American people will finally start to ask, “Why does everybody hate us so much?â€
Comment by Briseadh na Faire
Sadly, you are probably right, my friend.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:18 pmPerpetual warfare is what the neocons want. War Presidents, in their estimation, have virtually unlimited power, as we’ve seen the Bush regime demonstrate.
Here’s what I don’t understand: They must be pretty confident that a Dem won’t be elected anytime soon, or they must think they can “take back” all this executive power if a Dem is elected.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:19 pmSee YOU in hell “first among azzholes†(cause I’LL be THERE),
Mr. Bush
MURDEROUS WAR CRIMINAL
COWARDLY AWOL COXUCKER PUNK TRAITOR TO THE USA
TM-BushCrimeCo, Inc.
Comment by Mr. Bush Goes To Hell — June 20, 2007 @ 1:03 pm
Oh, I get it. Kinda like Dante’s Divine Comedy
Mr. Bush goes to the Inferno, then Purgatory, and then
Mr. Bush Goes to Paradise!!!
June 20th, 2007 at 1:19 pmSo he wants to draw the line and have the “war of civilizations”. That’s fine, but Iraq really is the model for American military incompetence. At least the way the Republicans are doing it. So a good part of the backlash would be MORE AMERICANS hating their own government.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:19 pmI know that if one studies Philosophy cant get to that kind of moronic responses.
Comment by Juan C
Mr P has completed his summer “brain drain.”
June 20th, 2007 at 1:19 pmGet this: if you’re one of them, you can’t be one of us.
Comment by smafdy — June 20, 2007 @ 1:09 pm
So this is progressive thinking nowadays? It’s still Bush’s war even though Libs control the congress. Since it’s his war they are under no obligation to the people to do something about it? That’s the most pathetic excuse I’ve heard in a while. I have petitioned my “republican” congressmen to get us out of Iraq, and I will beg them to keep Bush from starting another war. What are you going to do, post on a lib website and play splinter cell all afternoon?
June 20th, 2007 at 1:23 pmMr P has completed his summer “brain drain.â€
Comment by Zooey — June 20, 2007 @ 1:19 pm
You have to check your brain fluids every 3000 miles, sometimes you need to flush the system.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:23 pmThis is the message the Bush Administrationhas sent to the world:
June 20th, 2007 at 1:23 pmIf you don’t have nuclear weapons and are not developing any, we will pretend that you do and invade you and turn your country into smoking ruins.
Cf. Iraq.
If you actually are developing nuclear weapons, we will call an earnest series of diplomatic conferences and offer you all manner of aid.
Cf. North Korea
If you already have nuclear weapons, even if you are a fiercely Isslamic state, you will become our staunch ally and we will pour money into your country. all the while ignoring just about any sins you may commit.
Cf. Pakistan
#53- Yes, neoscum want perpetual war- but its’ odd- NONE of them have served, none have worn a uniform- they are all to quick to send OPK’s to die (other people’s kids)
June 20th, 2007 at 1:24 pmThey’re educated idiots, the neocon scum.
I know that if one studies Philosophy cant get to that kind of moronic responses.
Comment by Juan C — June 20, 2007 @ 1:18 pm
Look, I only have 5min to spit out as many moronic responses as I can, then I have to go to RNC summer camp.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:25 pmYou have to check your brain fluids every 3000 miles, sometimes you need to flush the system.
Comment by PRIMVS INTER PARES
You don’t need to flush the system daily.
Just sayin’
June 20th, 2007 at 1:25 pmMr. Bush Goes to Paradise!!!
Yup, only TRAITOR Bush the MURDERER coxucker PUNK and YOU would think hell is “paradise”.
Bush has NEVER acted in the interests of America. Only his OIL buddies.
He is a TRAITOR coxucker PUNK.
Who should SWING FROM THE GALLOWS for his WAR CRIMES.
And then go to hell from there.
And it was “Mr. Smith Goes To Washington” which inspired
June 20th, 2007 at 1:25 pm“Mr. Bush Goes To Hell”.
LIFE IMITATES OR ART IMITATES LIFE? It’s kind of creepy to see the parallels between our wars and the destabilization we’re causing in the world and the some of the events in the movie V for Vendetta. We are unleashing a chain of events that will inevitably drag the world into perpetual war and the U.S possibly into a civil war. If immediate and drastic action is not taken to restore sanity to our government and to the world, we will fall into a new dark age under corporate authoritarian rule. It may sound alarmist, but it’s already happening.
Healthcare, the environment, jobs have taken a back seat to the bottom line. Industry is asked to regulate itself and even allowed to write the laws. The undermining of the constitution shows that the conservatives do not respect the rule of law and will not be bound by it. The unjustified invasion of Iraq shows that they do not value human life in their quest for wealth and power. The willingness or desire to attack Iran shows that these men are criminally insane. They will stop at nothing to serve their corporate masters and line their own pockets.
If we don’t take matters into our own hands, our fates will be decided for us with or without our consent.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:26 pmCoach Jason – thanks – we will keep writing our congress critters – and you need to do the same – especially the Republicans who will pay more attention to you; they know we won’t support the war – but if you tell them that you’re fed up it will have more clout.
Comment by powkat — June 20, 2007 @ 1:03 pm
Thanks POWKAT, you’re only the second person on this site who has had the ability to respond to me civilly. Most have seen the word “Christian” or “conservative” and decided that they needed to call me names.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:28 pmDon’t forget though that the Repub’s are now the minority and I’ve heard about too many Dems not fulfilling their pre-election promises of ending the war in Iraq. This is no longer a right versus left debate, it’s an America versus her representatives struggle.
Joe Conason’s book, It Can Happen Here, should be mandatory reading for every American.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:29 pmAnd it was “Mr. Smith Goes To Washington†which inspired
“Mr. Bush Goes To Hellâ€.
Comment by Mr. Bush Goes To Hell — June 20, 2007 @ 1:25 pm
Oh, I get it.
So Bush is the righteous and truly good man (Mr. Smith) who goes in to the corrupt city (D.C.) and does all he can do for his noble, noble cause.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:29 pmHow many times do these people have to be wrong before they are called what they are? Neocon = facist. It really is JUST THAT SIMPLE.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:30 pmYou have to check your brain fluids every 3000 miles, sometimes you need to flush the system.
Comment by PRIMVS INTER PARES
You seem to have forgotten to refill after draining and flushing.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:31 pmYour brain seems to be overheating and freezing up now
=D
Follow up to #19. It sounds like Norman P. is HOPING for another Crusades. Bomb Iran, unleash Muslim angry at us, and then Dick Cheney gets to declare on the whole region. But Dick will not be leading his “Christian Soldiers” – will he? These chicken hawks are destroying our future.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:31 pmYou don’t need to flush the system daily.
Just sayin’
Comment by Zooey — June 20, 2007 @ 1:25 pm
But it keeps my engine strong for RNC summer camp…
I’m off!!!!
June 20th, 2007 at 1:31 pmJoe Conason’s book, It Can Happen Here, should be mandatory reading for every American.
Comment by Vet
Absolutely. I’d loan my copy out but my son currently has it.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:32 pmActually, Bush is the ANTITHESIS of a “righteous and good man”.
He is an IMMORAL LIAR, MURDER and COXUCKER PUNK TRAITOR to the
United States of America.
A real SLEAZEBAG.
Who deserves to HANG for his WAR CRIMES.
And go to hell, where he BELONGS.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:32 pm“Don’t forget though that the Repub’s are now the minority and I’ve heard about too many Dems not fulfilling their pre-election promises of ending the war in Iraq. This is no longer a right versus left debate, it’s an America versus her representatives struggle.
Comment by coachjason — June 20, 2007 @ 1:28 pm”
Keep in mind that the Democrats only have a ONE vote majority in the Senate….
What do you want them to do?????
If they try to pass legislation, the Republicans Filibuster (which was a horrible thing to do when they were in power) and they perform all the possible tactics to prevent bills from being advanced…..
Without a CLEAR veto override, what do you really expect them to do?????
I’m pissed that the Dems have not done more, but I do see their point…… They can’t really do much but make some decissions here or there….. Other than that, the Repubs still hold enough power to prevent anything the Dems try to do for the Country……
So please tell me what do you expect them to do?????
June 20th, 2007 at 1:33 pmThe Greatest Story Ever Sold, by Frank Rich, also needs to be read by every American.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:33 pmI’m off!!!!
Comment by PRIMVS INTER PARES
Folks, this is it. The definitive Mr P comment.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:34 pm“What religion condones war?
Comment by cynicalgirl
——————————————————-
ISLAM.
Comment by Ringo — June 20, 2007 @ 12:53 pm”
Suggest you read this:
June 20th, 2007 at 1:37 pmhttp://slacktivist.typepad.com/slacktivist/2004/12/lb_cursed_are_t.html
Mr P has completed his summer “brain drain.â€
Comment by Zooey
No wonder why it happened in a matter of seconds :D
June 20th, 2007 at 1:37 pmActually, the distinction of being “battered more mercilessly and with less justification” belongs to Bill Clinton.
George W. Bush deserves every “battering” he gets and more. If the media were doing their jobs and the Democrats in Congress theres, he’d be “battered” right into impeachment and prison.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:39 pmAll one has to do is label someone or some country “evil” and then bomb them!
Well, if bombing Iran is not in the interests of the US, then for whom is Mr. Podhoretz shilling?
June 20th, 2007 at 1:40 pm#80 – That’s a VERY good point!!!
June 20th, 2007 at 1:42 pmBut at least we elected a President who could keep making decisions in the best interest of the US, despite the cruel and unfounded criticism.
God Bless You, Mr. Bush.
Comment by PRIMVS INTER PARES — June 20, 2007 @ 12:56 pm
Yeah, about that… do you think it would be too much to ask that he make the RIGHT decision once in a while?
I mean, it’s great that he’s “The Deciderâ„¢” and all, but it doesn’t do us much good if all of his decisions make things worse.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:45 pmCOACH JASON,
I have no beef with you personally. I am a liberal christian, though not one who accepts the literal truth of any work written by man, inspired by God or not. I am glad that you have come here and been respectful and engaging in your dialogue. I wish more “conservative Christians” reached out to engage in a honest and civil and most importantly, rational conversation.
The fact of the matter is though that the most high profile conservative Christians leaders and their followers are largely responsible for many of the travesties that afflict our nation and the world today. Where were you when the right divided this country? Did you speak out against the invasion of Iraq?How have voted during the last several elections? By and large, conservative christians have blindly supported this administration and the republican congress to our nations’ peril.
If however you acknowledge that as a nation we must make decisions based on compassion for all regardless or race or religion, and on sound science, and rationality, then I personally welcome your input. But if you wish to continue to make decisions based on dogma, the bible, or what your preacher tells you is most christian, then we will not find common ground.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:48 pmPodhertz reminds me of the campus conservative who showed up at any peace rally or meeting at my college (in the early ’70s) He would rant at everyone for being commies in the pay of (this is how he said it) Mayo Test Tongue. But he was the same flabby, pasty, pompous, self-rightous idiot that seems to rule the right wing and neo-cons. I can’t remember his name, but I ofter wonder if he’s busy demolishing the Constitution for BushCo.
June 20th, 2007 at 1:51 pmAt this point we need to figure out the best and fastest way to stop the Iranians in their attempt to make nuclear bombs. If that is war, so be it. We need to protect ourselves and our allies. I pray we can talk the Iranians down and talk alone will get them to stop, but if that doesn’t happen, we will need to stop them with force. Is there any other choice outside of sitting back and allowing them to build the weapons they need to hurt us?
June 20th, 2007 at 1:54 pmThese neocons trying to peddle another war, against an enemy vastly superior to our last two (which we haven’t mopped up yet), with a military already stretched to the breaking point, with zero credibility behind us… it’s kind of like if Coca-Cola had persisted in trying to sell New Coke all through the nineties. “No, no, it’s a really good idea. We can recapture all of our lost market share if we just sell it hard enough. I just KNOW that the consuming public will react the way we want them to. Trust me.”
The only difference is this is our country they’re talking about.
How many times and how disastrously does a pundit have to be proven wrong before he loses his credibility? Or is having no credibility a prerequisite for punditry?
June 20th, 2007 at 1:55 pmGlobal Anti-Americanism?
I thought the world hated us already?
June 20th, 2007 at 1:56 pmGood morning campers!
June 20th, 2007 at 1:57 pmWelcome to RNC Summer Camp!
I’m your counselor here in Cabin #9, and my name is Tim, but you can call me Griffy.
OK! first things first, who’s who, and who gets what meds?
Primus? You seem to be a bright kid, what are you taking?
Ridalyn? Yes, well, I could have guessed. There’s also a note here that says I am to observe you physically swallowing each dose… are you something of an entrepeneur, Primus?
Ringo? What’s your deal?
(sorry, Primus, I’ll try to remember your particular sensitivity to that word…)
Zoloft? Huh, these are blue….. oh well…..
Mr. Joker…. my goodness, you have quite a cocktail here! These are all yours?
Well, I’ll see if we can have enough bottled water on hand.
OK! Now listen up! If any of you need more meds, or have any other health problems, You may go see Dr. Holsinger at the infirmary.
OK? Good!, Now, bunk assignments………………….
“Secretly Applaud” == The sound of one hand clapping while the other throws a grenade
More on our friendly Norman Podhoretz here: http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=10973
June 20th, 2007 at 1:58 pmDear Coachjason, you are correct in that we are all in the same boat, something I have tried to point out to the troll’s that lurke here..I don’t consider you a troll btw…
Several thing’s have become painfuly clear to those of us that have worked hard since 2000 to right this sinking ship..
First off we are unable to get our representatives to do as promised, same as the right wing with one exception the right has backed big oil, big business and the war industrial complex, ignored the people with huge debt’s to foreign countries and striped our own country of it’s young and healthy military to satisfy a wealthy few..Everything seem’s to be going as planned for the bush bunch…Since we don’t have a clear majority and our bunch is appearing spinless nothing will get done untill we scare the shit out of them and make them do what is correct.
I spoke to an old time conservative a couple of week’s ago and his comment to me was,” The republican conservatives of the past need to take back their party.” .I didn’t need to ask what he ment, I knew….There are few old time republican’s left…The conservatives of the past are now neo-con’s…There are few Democrat’s left as well..Just my opinion…I mean in the elected official’s ofcourse..The public is now 70-30 against this and any war…Many of our dem’s are merly republican lite…A bunch of centerest rogues that lie to us often..
My guess is we all need to take back control of our country, boot all their butt’s out if they are not doing the will of the people…Sadly almost all of the elected official’s are working for them selves instead of We The People who are their employer’s..There are many little dictator’s back in D.C or atleast they seem to want to be…..Blessings
June 20th, 2007 at 2:00 pmRe 74: I can’t believe I’m saying this but if Bush wants another war, let it be with congress (remember Cheney’s Nuclear option?). Don’t give him the funds for another war. Don’t let anything that a republican proposes pass until Bush and co. listen to you. You have tools available to you, you just have to have to balls to use them.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:04 pmBush has zero credibility to act on Iran because of his past failures, mendacity and ineptitude.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:05 pmThat mess is going to have to be cleaned up by our next President.
So this is progressive thinking nowadays? It’s still Bush’s war even though Libs control the congress. Since it’s his war they are under no obligation to the people to do something about it? That’s the most pathetic excuse I’ve heard in a while. I have petitioned my “republican†congressmen to get us out of Iraq, and I will beg them to keep Bush from starting another war. What are you going to do, post on a lib website and play splinter cell all afternoon?
Comment by coachjason — June 20, 2007 @ 1:23 pm
No. progressive thinking is what you’re doing, the only difference is that you support regressive action by claiming membership in a “conservative” group.
Again: Why are you a “conservative†Christian? Why do you appeal to the Progressives to appeal to their Congresspersons? Do you think they don’t know the war is wrong?
I’m always willing to welcome someone to the reality-based, progressive community. The only catch is, it can’t be half-assed.
You cannot be regressive and progressive at the same time. So, I urge you to get on or get off. I don’t care which you choose. that said, I’d rather have an ally than an enemy, but the choice is yours. I am a Liberal, and have chosen to be so for many good and thoughtful reasons. You know where I stand. Where do you stand?
June 20th, 2007 at 2:05 pm…ignored the people with huge debt’s to foreign countries and striped our own country of it’s young and healthy military to satisfy a wealthy few..
Comment by Sharon — June 20, 2007 @ 2:00 pm
There’s your solution, when congress ignores you, ignore them back. Don’t campaign for those not willing to fight for you. don’t make phone calls for someone just because he/she’s a Democrat. Make them earn your allegiance. Flood their mailboxes and email boxes. Make their phones ring off the hook. nd make sure you do it to the ones you voted and campaigned for because they OWE you. They have to listen to you or next time, you work for someone else.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:09 pmYou have tools available to you, you just have to have to balls to use them.
Comment by coachjason
sadly, it is not about balls. It is about money and strategic position in geopolitical scenario. It is about 50 years of ownership of energy resources.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:11 pmYou cannot be regressive and progressive at the same time. So, I urge you to get on or get off. I don’t care which you choose. that said, I’d rather have an ally than an enemy, but the choice is yours.
Comment by smafdy — June 20, 2007 @ 2:05 pm
That’s the problem nowadays… We are not enemies. Our goals are one in the same (to put it simply… A BETTER AMERICA). The fundamental difference is only our methods for achieving that goal. I don’t need to choose a side, the side needs to choose me. I will do my best to see that America gets better by the means that I feel are necessary not by what a political party tells me. I called myself conservative because my belief on achieving that better America coincided with theirs. If starting yet another war is what it takes to be a conservative, then that adjective no longer describes coachjason.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:15 pmCoachjason, all that has been done many time’s, perhap’s hundred’s….We are now at a cross road’s of uprising…Hundred’s of thousand’s of us have been doing these thing’s for year..Join in and work on your side, as if there were realy is a side in the survival of human kind and our planet…..
Isn’t it funny a christian and witch exchanging life and death matter’s at last…Blessings
June 20th, 2007 at 2:21 pmSo, I choose you. Welcome aboard. You do realize that you will now be demonized by your former friends, don’t you? It’s called “swiftboating”, and many honorable people have been stained by it. When it happens, and it will happen, we will recognize the stain as a badge of honor.
Be vigilant. Be steadfast, Above all else, honor the Constitution.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:26 pmWelcome to the light Coachjason, we on the left are against war for oil and the genocide of entire countries by our corrupt polatician’s, no matter what side they claim to be on…There is only one side as far as I can see, honor the constitution, life and our planet..Blessings
June 20th, 2007 at 2:32 pmPodhoretz is a mentally disturbed man. He hopes and prays that we bomb and kill Iranians??
June 20th, 2007 at 2:35 pmHey, old man, how about you finish the two wars you already hoped and prayed for before you go starting another one!
What a blood thirsty sicko.
I guess the “thinking” behind the “applaud us” line is that they forgot to greet us as liberators in Iraqnam, so now this will be a second chance? No wonder this country is so thoroughly detested throughout the world – we allow brain damaged people like Podhoretz to publish articles and seem like they have authority.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:36 pmSo what do the deep thinkers here at TP think we should do about Iran’s nuclears ambitions?
Would Israel be justified in bombing Iran’s nuclear facilities?
Comment by Ringo — June 20, 2007 @ 12:52 pm
So what do the deep thinkers here at FreeRepublic think we should do about Israel’s nuclears ambitions?
Would Iran be justified in bombing Israel’s nuclear facilities?
June 20th, 2007 at 2:37 pmAnother Nut Job foaming at the mouth…
June 20th, 2007 at 2:39 pm“And I think it’s possible that other countries in Europe, for example, and elsewhere, would be relieved to see the Iranians entirely deprived of the capability to build nuclear weapons, or at least have that ability retarded for five or 10 years or more.”
So let me get this straight. Sacrifice what’s left of this country’s reputation, what’s left of its treasury, what’s left of its military….all to POSSIBLY make some other countries relieved?!?! For a measly five years?!
These mental cases are NOT working for the best interests of THIS country!
June 20th, 2007 at 2:42 pmSo, I choose you. Welcome aboard. You do realize that you will now be demonized by your former friends, don’t you? It’s called “swiftboatingâ€, and many honorable people have been stained by it. When it happens, and it will happen, we will recognize the stain as a badge of honor.
Be vigilant. Be steadfast, Above all else, honor the Constitution.
Comment by smafdy — June 20, 2007 @ 2:26 pm
I will still hold my religion as the most precious belief that I have, sorry if that offends anyone. As for being demonized, I’ve been getting lots of practice here on TP over the last few months, so I’m pretty good at handling myself. As for honoring the constitution… ALWAYS!
There is only one side as far as I can see, honor the constitution, life and our planet..Blessings
Comment by Sharon — June 20, 2007 @ 2:32 pm
Sharon… is that side the “inside”? Excuse me if I put life before the other two… I still have some things that will always be more important to me than others…
Isn’t it funny a christian and witch exchanging life and death matter’s at last…Blessings
Comment by Sharon — June 20, 2007 @ 2:21 pm
At least I’m not burning anyone at the stake and not getting crucified (at least not yet) ;-)
And thank you all for proving me right, I knew there was common ground all along, I just didn’t expect to find you already standing on it.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:45 pmSounds like he needs a diaper change. Someone call his nurse and dose him up on more meds. He’s a lunatic ranting about wanting to kill everyone.
June 20th, 2007 at 2:52 pmCoachjason, I ddn’t put the 3 thing’s down in order of importance…From this witch’s stand point all living thing’s are first, the planet next and constitution last..
All road’s lead to the same place (common ground) your heaven my summerland it’s how we navigate those road’s to get there…My thinking..Lest we bruse pebles on the way, for even the stone’s are part of it all…..Blessings .
June 20th, 2007 at 2:57 pmI just sent an email to Commentary asking them to stop these insane, hateful rantings – in God’s name no less!
Not that I believe in “God” but if there IS a God I doubt very much he would appreciate a nuclear war contaminating his/her planet…
June 20th, 2007 at 2:57 pmJust to put things in perspective, let’s all remember what happened after 9/11/2001. Iran was right there expressing sympathy and solidarity. President Bush responds with the famous “Axis of Evil” speech. What a brilliant strategy. A country expresses sympathy and support and we call them agents of the devil. Its certainly original. Not effective, but certainly original.
June 20th, 2007 at 3:01 pmright on, coachjason
June 20th, 2007 at 3:04 pmMargaret,I can not speak for the god/goddess but for me may I say good work and keep it up..We need all the help we can get now.
Leporello and let us not forget 16 of the bomber’s were from Saudi arabia and supported by the very prince and his wife that heir bush hug’s so well..Blessings
June 20th, 2007 at 3:08 pmdelete my posts again TP its bye
June 20th, 2007 at 3:12 pmbye everyone TP is deleting my posts ……. its the Isreal lobby really
June 20th, 2007 at 3:13 pmSharon, you seem like one super-cool lady. Positive, constructive thoughts and actions sure couldn’t hurt!! And you do more than your share. I hope you have a lovely and love-full day!
June 20th, 2007 at 3:17 pmThis is so stupid it makes Bush seem smart. And that’s hard.
The entire concept is based on preventing Iran from ever acquiring nuclear technology. If history has taught us anything – even those of us who would rather burn books than read them – it is that technology can neither be undone, nor contained indefinitely.
It is an inevitability that every government will eventually possess – at least in part – the technology that all possess today. Prolonging the inevitable serves no purpose if preparations are not also made for the inevitable.
June 20th, 2007 at 3:22 pmBye Tobey! I’ll miss your passion and information. Perhaps you got a little too “I hope the U.S. crashes and burns”? I hope the U.S. doesn’t continue to make you crazed!
June 20th, 2007 at 3:22 pmThank’s Margaret and back at ya..
Sorry to hear of the blocking Toby, been there done that, atleast you can still post…I was blocked from posting and reading the blog for over a week when I was screaming of the Lebanon killing’s by Israel…OOp’s..Here we go again…Blessings
June 20th, 2007 at 3:41 pmSo, it would have devastating consequences for our national reputation and would not even accomplish the stated policy goals of delaying Iran’s nuclear program.
So, why on Earth would we do it? War with Iran would mean (another) financial windfall for “defense” contractors, would likely take Iran’s oil supply offline (further driving up prices), and would make Israel very, very happy.
Is it worth it?
June 20th, 2007 at 3:44 pmIs it worth it?
Comment by War4Sale — June 20, 2007 @ 3:44 pm
In case you’re taking a straw poll – NO!!!!!
Wouldn’t it be nice if Americans were actually allowed to vote on that question? Sigh…
June 20th, 2007 at 3:47 pmHe’s a great Wanker American.
June 20th, 2007 at 3:53 pmIran is arming Hamas, Hezbollah, the Mehdi Army, and the Taliban. The Iranian Republican Guard has the blood of coalition soldiers all over their hands. Now is not the time for Jimmy Carter/ Neville Chamberlain style appeasement. John Murtha is the shame of fellow Democrats. It’s because of loudmouth losers like him that encourages the average American to buy in to the theory the Democrats are weak on foreign policy.
June 20th, 2007 at 3:53 pmFor your reading injoyment may I suggest…On Truthout, William Rivers Pitt has an article “A time to reap”….It bring to mind my recent visions of our summer starting with Litha/Summer solstice tomorrow..Get ready, the time’s are changing, join and do all you can….We the people will take back our country….Blessings
June 20th, 2007 at 4:02 pmPodheretz is a fool. Iran would destroy us.
June 20th, 2007 at 4:24 pmYou need to start paying attention, people.
http://tinyurl.com/2mr3d7
June 20th, 2007 at 4:55 pmForget a non-nuclear Iran
Pakistan has an existing nuclear arsenal
Pakistan also has highly placed Govt sympathizers for al-Qaeda, the Taliban & Usama bin Laden
Iran’s not the problem in terms of possessing or spreading WsMD
Comment by KingCranky — June 20, 2007 @ 1:03 pm
If the US attacks Iran again under false pretenses, then Pakaistan will have a real problem on their hands with Musharraf probably getting “couped”. Now, what will the US do? Fight a 4th war? Then there is China and Russia waiting in the wings. Will Dumbya take them on too? 5…6…7 wars at once. Rome and Nazi Germany…….Here we come!!!!
Crazy Fundamentalists, both Muslim and Christian, have gotten us into another fine mess. Revelations from The Bible become a self-fullfilling prophesy, if you believe that stuff.
June 20th, 2007 at 5:14 pmâ€Pud horetz was so right about Iraq. Why don’t we just listen to him about Iran. ”
That is what his wacko circle of friends must be saying. Do these guys really believe the sh*t they are saying??? Is it possible anyone can be so utterly stupid and naive? Oh, wait Bush is president!
We can’t even control/stabilize Iraq. This fear of end of empire and/or American world dominance/policing through military action is insane and will ultimately seriously damage the US politically and economically.
We should start to worry and get our protesting shoes ready. The talk of bombing Iran (with wolfie’s mini nukes?) just seems to be increasing daily.
June 20th, 2007 at 5:33 pmFrylock, it’s worse than that. Not even a ‘city’ called Baghdad.
June 20th, 2007 at 6:08 pmComment by Clem — June 20, 2007 @ 3:53 pm”
“Iran is arming Hamas, Hezbollah, the Mehdi Army, and the Taliban. The Iranian Republican Guard has the blood of coalition soldiers all over their hands.
Uh, Clem…you have “darn good intelligence” that proves all these accusations, right? I mean, certainly you wouldn’t just irresponsibly parrot baseless gossip you read on a wingnut message board, would you?
“Now is not the time for Jimmy Carter/ Neville Chamberlain style appeasement. John Murtha is the shame of fellow Democrats. It’s because of loudmouth losers like him that encourages the average American to buy in to the theory the Democrats are weak on foreign policy.”
LOL, good one! I guess the reason Americans now say they trust the Democrats more on foreign policy is because they can clearly see the genius of the Bush foreign policy of starting wars based on position papers written by draft dodgers at the American Enterprise Institute and PNAC!
You need some fresh talking points, Clem.
June 20th, 2007 at 6:10 pm“So what do the deep thinkers here at TP think we should do about Iran’s nuclears ambitions?”
Three things. First is who in the hell do we think we are telling Iran they can’t have a nuclear weapon when Pakistan (our supposed friends) not only have a nuclear weapon but they are also harboring Osama Bin Laden and there are Al Quaeda training camps in Pakistan.
Second, most experts say that Iran is at least 10 years away from being able to produce a nuclear weapon. So my question is, what’s the rush?
And last, do you really think it’s a good idea for us to invade another country when we are already going bankrupt from our invading Iraq? Because just dropping bombs on them isn’t going to do it. Dropping bombs on Iran will do much more harm than good.
June 20th, 2007 at 6:18 pmHear this.
No matter what happens, Bush must not be allowed to attack Iran.
June 20th, 2007 at 6:19 pmSecond, most experts say that Iran is at least 10 years away from being able to produce a nuclear weapon. So my question is, what’s the rush?
Comment by Katie — June 20, 2007 @ 6:18 pm
The only rush Katie, is Bush trying to escape his quickly impending grand jury indictment, and the inevitable jail cell waiting him and his cohorts.
Bush knows the best way to avoid being prosecuted for his crimes, and to keep any more of them from coming to light anytime soon, is to start another war. A real war, against a country with somewhat of a real army.
Then, martial law, arrest and “detainment” of US citizens who seem to sympathize with the enemy (anyone not on the Bush bandwagon), and the freezing of the electoral process, extending Bush’s presidency into the next decade.
Make no mistake about it people.
Bush must NOT be allowed to attack Iran.
June 20th, 2007 at 6:24 pmSadly, far too many people are still stupid enough to believe all the fearmongering, propaganda so regularly rolled out– and Bush & Co know this.
June 20th, 2007 at 7:38 pmThe old white f@$k has nothing left to lose. His fantasy it to sit on the highest mountain and watch civilization nuke the shit out each other. The only thing he forgets is that when it’s over, there will be nothing left except a bunch of old white men climbing out of their bunkers to die of radiation poisoning.
June 20th, 2007 at 8:48 pmI hope to god he never gets his wish…
When the nighmare of the King George reign has ended I hope they round up all these mindless fu#ks that lead our country to the edge of the abyss and hold them responsible for war crimes. I’ll start the list add to it if you’d like: Kristol, Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, Cheney, Ohlmert, Podhoertz, Kagin, Pearle,….
June 20th, 2007 at 9:16 pmHow many of you so-called “thinking individuals” here are interested in a nuclear Iran?
*crickets chirping*
Who here would like to see Ahmadinejad’s finger on the button?
*more crickets chirping*
June 20th, 2007 at 10:29 pmHow many of you so-called “thinking individuals†here are interested in a nuclear Iran?
*crickets chirping*
Who here would like to see Ahmadinejad’s finger on the button?
*more crickets chirping*
Comment by Cosco — June 20, 2007 @ 10:29 pm
Well considering even if he did get a working nuke sometime in the next 5 to 10 years, it would take another 15 to 20 years for him to come up with a delivery vehicle that could transport one to US soil, (you don’t just need the rocket Einstein, you need a targeting system, meaning satellites, etc) and considering even if he did get to this point he would know a launch of his puny projectiles would mean instant obliteration of his entire country, I feel fine with it.
How about you?
June 20th, 2007 at 10:44 pmHow are you feeling about it?
:|
Scared as usual?
June 20th, 2007 at 10:45 pmYou guys said the same thing about India, and now you’re trading them to them for mangos.
:|
Go figure.
June 20th, 2007 at 10:48 pmHow many of you so-called “thinking individuals†here are interested in a nuclear Iran?
*crickets chirping*
Who here would like to see Ahmadinejad’s finger on the button?
*more crickets chirping*
Comment by Cosmo — June 20, 2007 @ 10:29 pm
but you are ok with a nuclear pakistan,israel,india,russia,china,uk,france and north korea,right?
June 20th, 2007 at 11:41 pmThis man is an abomination, that any American take these neoconservative traitors seriously is amazing with the wealth of information on the internet on how unbelievably un-American these elitists that have our president brainwashed are. Do yourselves a favor if you lack knowledge of who these rich elitists are and find out their methods and style of speaking out in public. This is not about right versus left, liberal versus conservative this about a cabal of jackals in our government who use intellectual means to get politicians, and folks at home through media to buy into more war for middle east bullshit interests.
June 21st, 2007 at 12:31 amFurther to comment #139, I’d add “But you are okay with a nuclear United States?” The U.S. is by far the greatest menace. Its no surprise that they are also the only country as yet to have used nuclear weapons in war.
June 21st, 2007 at 2:40 am1971 opec decrees that all oil is bought and sold in US$. Even if it’s sold to Poland trading with Morrroco or whoever.
2000 Iraq switches to Euros (axis of evil #1)
2001 Iran switches to Euros (axis of evil #2)
2002 North Korea switches. (axis of evil #3)
2003 US Attacks Iraq (axis of evil #1)
2006 US talks tough with Iran (axis of evil #2)
What happens next? You tell me…
June 21st, 2007 at 4:31 am142#
2002 North Korea switches. (axis of evil #3)
Nothing happens here North Korea is far to powerfull and no oil
America will only attack countries that are weak
June 21st, 2007 at 6:22 am““Well, if we were to bomb the Iranians as I hope and pray we will,†Podhoretz says, “we’ll unleash a wave of anti-Americanism all over the world that will make the anti-Americanism we’ve experienced so far look like a lovefest.—
Podhoretz is having imaginations and hallucinations. There will be no “wave of antiamericanism”, since
1) every even tiny criticism of the US is strictly forbidden and suppressed in the media, the “wave” exists only in Podhoretz’ wishful imagination. The reality is the “cold masses” acting as a black hole in front of their TV-sets etc. They’re deeply asleep and have been for at least 50 years now
and 2) the last world war will be on by then, more than ever lead by hyper-rich functional illitterates and other complete madmen with absolute power.
No “wave” whatsoever. Rich people in general are so busy “surviving”, even and precisely when they are very very rich, that they stand no chance of getting even in the slightest touch with reality.
June 21st, 2007 at 12:01 pmTypical Neo-Con Jew if you ask me. Most of the Neo-Con movement is run by Jews, so of coursel they would like to see iraq and iran attacked.
June 21st, 2007 at 12:31 pmStupid Americans….
June 21st, 2007 at 12:33 pmLet’s just wait till there’s a nuclear cloud over 7 of our city before we act. No wait, let’s wait till Bin-Laden is in the White house before we act. Better yet, let’s not do anything and hand over the country to who or whom ever wants it.
June 21st, 2007 at 12:35 pmIslam is not the only religion that condones killing and war. So does Christianity and Judaism. It’s called “eye for an eye.” Except, in the case of this debate, it’s an eye for an eye that MIGHT be poked out.
Personally, I think we should embark on a war against technology in 3rd world countries. After all, who’s next after Iran? Could be Guatemala or Indonesia that gets “weapon of mass destruction” technology next! If we just bomb them all, reduce them all to piles of rubble & corpses, THEN they won’t be at threat to us, right?
June 21st, 2007 at 12:53 pmI dont get why your country, land of the free, doesnt impeach Bush and get rid of all the warmongering politicians.
Heh, the UK humiliated themselves by not starting a war with Iran?
Yep, nice logic, America.
June 21st, 2007 at 1:33 pm@Dave: There are two reason why we haven’t impeached Bush first off we don’t have the votes to do so and the only thing scarier than Bush would be president Cheney.
—-
Attacking Iran would be a huge mistake. It is one of the few countries in the middle east that is moving toward democracy on its own and a war would be a huge set back to that movement.
June 21st, 2007 at 1:42 pmHumiliated?? The UK did what we do best. We got our people back without the need to kill a thousand innocents.
To follow the American doctrine we would have punished Iran by killing thousands or tens of thousands of INNOCENT people. Thats not hitting Iran, thats killing INNOCENTS.
I am Very proud of the UK Government. Maybe thats the difference between us.
The reason the female soldier was clothed as she was, is simple. Its not about dressing like a Muslim, its about covering the hair, which is seen as important in Iran. Tourists do it all the time when entering temples etc. Again, there was no humiliation.
America needs to wake up. If you go to Iran, your on your own. There is no way the UK will stand with you. The Australians won’t come. The poles have said no. It will be America and Israel ALONE.
You had the world with you after the 11th of September. You lost us all
June 21st, 2007 at 1:48 pm…And I think it’s possible that other countries in Europe, for example…
Right, as if most of the EU wasnt already close to the boiling point? To top it off, some SICKO French President is actively trying to “nominate” T. Blair (of the BushCo. family) as the “Presiden of the EU”.
Blair, you hung out with the wrong crowd, go dig a hole and stay there. As for BushCo et al – Evil begets Evil – You cant stop the Evil you started by doing more Evil, EOD. When are you Americans going to hold the US Congress etc. accountable for NOT impeaching BushCo for OBVIOUS warcrimes, blatent disregard for the safety of your own nation, and extreme corruption?
BushCo supports the death penalty (I consider almost *any* crime petty combared to what BushCo is, and have been, doing.) – put it to good use.
June 21st, 2007 at 2:19 pmsee http://hotshadow.com/Bomb_Iran_Podhoretz.aspx
June 21st, 2007 at 2:45 pm#10 cynicalgirl
“what religion condones war”?
The answer isn’t just “Islam”
Tthe ANSWER IS: All the ones based upon the hebrew old testament.
June 21st, 2007 at 3:05 pmie, the Judaeo Christian & Islamic monotheistic “religion of Abraham” religions certainly have all condoned war for national and political ends… and CONTINUE to do so.
they are certainly not the only ones through out history that have been used to motivate and unify people under a cause (real or projected)
Don’t fool yourself into believing the hype and swallowing what you’re told via commentary in the western (FOXâ„¢?) media.
Please do a bit of thinking on this one.
For those upset regarding the comments posted by the “”conservative†Christian” by coachjason.
I say that you’re WRONG and kneejerk reaction isn’t helping things
we should all embrace those conservative christians that see the light and just how “they” were duped by the K Rove/Bush tag team.
During the Vietnam war the most effective protester and draft card burners were not the long hair radicals but the well trimmed and “christian soldiers” that jumped sides after seeing what Jesus was really about.
Make no mistake, learn from history the progressive and traditional conservative “values” are the same. The real conservatives are actually very liberal. Jefferson/Constitution liberal.
June 21st, 2007 at 3:30 pm-they’re just approaching the same goal points from a different direction as the long haired liberal ( again we’re constitution liberal) .
WE NEED THEM STANDING WITH US ON IRAQ!
fighting for the same things.
Vomiting the Bush line about “standing with us or being against “us”" back at people is not only wrong -but divisive.
it hurts the cause (correct the damage the bushies have done)
drop the us vs them mindset about us winning “over them”
and starting thinking more about how the goal can be achieved. sans ego.
being goal Oriented is the only way we’re all going to combat what’s happening.
Um…
stop me for stating the obvious here….
the USA unilaterally (all alone) bombs Iran.
to stop it from building the same atomic bombs that Pakistan India N. Korea and Israel all have.
1. We “may” destroy their atomic production (buried deep underground)
2. Irradiate the land. sea and neighboring nations
3. Cause the death of all of our current troops in Iraq
4. Start a 3rd front and player in the war against the USA.
5. Turn the entire world against us and perhaps join in the battle against our military imperialism over the globe. (Defacto World War III)
again with the USA and Israel standing all alone
6. A more than likely complete cutoff from all middle eastern oil (you think prices are bad now???- Try ration cards)
7. Only gain a TEMPORARY set Iran back 10 years time max from their project with the caveat of their being REALLY REALLY MAD AT THE USA.
Hummm…. how can these bozo’s think that they is worth it?
Unless, that is… they somehow magically think that none of it matters
since too many believe that they’re all going to heaven and that none of this matters at all since it’s only a temporary planet we all live on “that was given to them by their god for their (mis)use”.
Huummmmmmmm
June 21st, 2007 at 4:32 pmIsn’t this the SAME god that they worship by eating at a canniballistic alter with? How very Skull and Bones of them…
I think we’re all in D33P S41t*
‘Unleash A Wave’ Of Global Anti-Americanism
It seems to me that Anti-Americanism has long been unleashed and is currently making a mess on the carpet.
June 21st, 2007 at 6:36 pmI do not support dropping bombs on Iran. However, I do support dropping Podheretz on Tehran, from about 30,000 feet.
June 21st, 2007 at 9:04 pmLet the warmongering Zionist/Marxist Likudniks fight their own battles. In fact, let’s parachute “Battling Norm” into Iran with an AR-15 and a target on his back.
“It’s high time that the central premise of American policy in the Middle East is challenged and the specialness of the “special relationship” is held up to scrutiny. This latest demand – that the U.S. expend its resources, including the lives of its young people, in yet ANOTHER war on Israel’s behalf – has nothing to do with defending the Jewish state against nuclear incineration at Iranian hands, and everything to do with keeping the Israeli boot firmly on Arab and Muslim necks. And that is not worth one American life.”
June 22nd, 2007 at 12:50 pmCan’t figure out why Americans have not stormed the White House and the Congress and taken back their government from these warmongers.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:22 pmWho is running our foreign policy, four and five star Generals are standing up and saying we have to stop these wars, meanwhile some reactionary American Jew writes an article and all the diplomatic corp are nodding in agreement. The defence industry, the oil industry and AIPAC do not run this country.
I feel sick. This is sick. How can a man advocate bombing another country into smithereens? How can he advocate that after the arrest/kidnapping, depending on how you see it, of 12 service people? How can he do this? How can he compare the Iranian President with Hitler? Why do Neocons like to compare everything with the Second World War? If there is to be a comparison why not compare the Holocaust with any possible bombing of Iran into “smithereens”. What he is advocating and what the Nazis did are both examples of senseless calculated hateful killing of innocents in part because of their nationality and religious faith. This is so disgusting.
June 23rd, 2007 at 2:58 pmhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Rs9sinZJ_4
July 7th, 2007 at 9:24 pmJason,
The Dems do not control congress. They have a bare majority in the Senate that is not sufficient to over-ride a Butch veto. They’d need at least 60 votes to do anything meaningful, and two-thirds to override the veto. Although it is easy to deride the Dems for inaction, it looks like meaningful change will only come about through the election of a Democratic presidential candidate who will have to stake their political life on ending with the war and repairing the horrible mess that Butch has made. The latter is probably a Sysiphean (sp?) task. And Republicans will use the inevitible blow-back as a cudgel to beat the Dems with, rather than acknowledge the depth of the Butch disaster.
Orestes
July 16th, 2007 at 2:40 pmGoodbye America. It was nice having you as a neighbor. Soon you will be bankrupt.
July 17th, 2007 at 5:27 pm