On Friday, London was “gripped by a terrorist threat” when “police found two Mercedes sedans packed with gasoline, nails and gas canisters.” The New York Times notes that the “idea of a multiple attack using car bombs — a departure from the backpack suicide attacks of the London bombings of July 2005 — raised concerns among security experts that jihadist groups linked to Al Qaeda may have imported tactics more familiar in Iraq.”
Any connection to Iraq and Al Qaeda is pure speculation.
They have “concerns,” for f*ck’s sake — no evidence.
Scare tactics.
June 30th, 2007 at 11:52 amThere is ZERO evidence of any link to Al-Qaeda.
June 30th, 2007 at 11:53 am“may have imported tactics more familiar in Iraq”…with one big exception. The folks in Iraq sadly know what they are doing, while in London
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/06/29/more_fear_biscuits_please/
June 30th, 2007 at 11:54 amheres what wrong with this news
1/ why was the camping gas cannister outside of the car on the street
2/ why have there been no factual reports on the contents of the car
3/ the second car no reports of anything except petrol so far
4/ why did the driver crash the car and not simply park the car
5/ why has the news for the last 36 hours been blaming Baghdad type car bombing WHEN they could tell us the contents of the car
6/ why say on the BBC that “according to American sources they have a clear image from CCTV of the driver”
were being fed shit so far
June 30th, 2007 at 11:55 amThe attempted car bombings in the UK are very sloppy operation and the gasoline would have burned the cars up, but not blown up any buildings. The UK police would be wise to investigate this as more of a sick prank than a actual Islamic terrorist attack.
June 30th, 2007 at 11:57 amPlease see Glenn Greenwald’s post this morning on the verbatim use of military press releases planted in mainstream news reports, especially on al Queda-Iraq links. I suspect this is another example, and I’m surprised that you post it without question.
Click on the link to read the whole thing.
June 30th, 2007 at 11:59 amalso why did the guy run off and leave the back door open ????
thats no way to have a build up of gas ???
I think they will catch laa laa and tinky winky eventually,/B>
June 30th, 2007 at 12:00 pmHow many times have we been down this road? Literally 1000s of times. Every 55 gallon drum of fertilizer, or perfume that was found in Iraq was WMD, for 3 days… Every time bush needs a diversion, some terrorist plan is discovered and reported breathlessly, for three days, remember the “plan” in NJ a few months ago? What became of that? Remember the plan to blow up the Sears Tower? Remember Padilla?
June 30th, 2007 at 12:01 pmThis reminds me of the bogus terror plot in which some guys were going to use metal cutting torches to take down a bridge in the US. Problem was that it would have taken days to do it, so basically impossible. This kind of stuff are pranks and not terrorism.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:03 pmJust another false flag attack.
Don’t believe it?
Please check out this video – it will completely change how you perceive all of this bogus news:
Watch Zeitgeist Final Cut – Part 3 here:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=497251819335380093
Then watch Zeigeist Final Cut – Part 2 here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7160790539111319889
Then watch Part 3 AGAIN so it really sinks in.
Do you finally get it now?
GOOD – Now do something about it and make sure every single person you know sees this and shares it.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:03 pmPresidential Directive 51 signed last month.
The fuse has been lit – get ready for the sucker punch – America is going down.
Wondering why Bush is moving to Paraguay and why Halliburton is moving to Dubai?
Don’t be the last one to find out – watch this video.
Think your “money” is going to insulate you from what’s ahead?
Sorry to burst your bubble – please watch this video and find out why you are going to be in for a very sad awakening.
Thank you and please share this information before it’s too late.
What amazes me is that the people posting here know more about the car bomb attacks then the British police do, based entirely on what they’ve pieced together from press reports. How do you all do that? It’s like a super power.
The Brits have been dealing with bombs in London for decades, thanks to the IRA. I’m inclined to trust their judgment on these car bombs over the “experts” posting here.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:05 pmThis can’t be, we’ve exported Democracy to Iraq, everything is supposed to be A.O.K., must be wrong.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:05 pmYes the goverment has cried wolf far too many times to believe anything they say – thats why people of the world believe Putin to Bush by 2 to 1
spin spin spin until were all dizzy and apathy sets in us
June 30th, 2007 at 12:06 pmThe UK is always terrorizing itself – this is nothing new.
Did you know they were running “drills” on the day of the London 7-7 bombings that were identical to what actually happened that day?
Yeah – that’s right – just like the same coincidental “drills” that were being run on 911 in the US.
Unbelievable?! Yes – it sure is – but here – check it out for yourself:
http://www.youtube.com:80/watch?v=E1HPNpxbfX8
(1:30 minutes)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Flypeg17ZsM
(4:18 minutes)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1-YA0gbSZk
(4:47 minutes)
Here are some articles on the subject:
http://www.onlinejournal.org/Special_Reports/071105Watson/071105watson.html
http://wagnews.blogspot.com/2005/08/pied-piper-of-london-bombing.html
http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/uk/coincidence+of+bomb+exercises/109010
Okay – Have I got your attention yet?
Because it gets even worse – read these:
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/september2005/200905stagedterror.htm
http://www.cryingwolf.deconstructingiraq.org.uk/
http://www.rense.com/general74/ssno.htm
Okay – starting to get the picture yet?
Then please take the time to watch these Zeitgeist videos linked above and share all this information.
How much longer do you want to be a chump waiting for the sucker punch?
And then check out these too:
“Oil Smoke and Mirrorsâ€
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8677389869548020370
“The Third Stageâ€
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5224963246223576086
“Empire of Oil: Hidden History of 911â€
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6702050570069604257
“Hijacking Catastrophe: 911, Fear, and the Selling of the American Empireâ€
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3320922145165829917
“America: Freedom to Fascismâ€
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1656880303867390173
“Terrorstormâ€
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=786048453686176230
Sorry for the long post – but for any readers who are not on board yet – please make your weekend count and check out this information – Thank You.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:10 pmgummitch – I am British ( Scottish ) and witnessed the biggest ever IRA bomb in London that blew the city of london to smithereens from a towerblock in South london
And im telling you, this bomb was Not Al Queda But was the doing of a ruthless gang of children properganderists called Tinky Winky, Dipsy , Laa Laa and Po
June 30th, 2007 at 12:13 pmIf these claims are actually true, I wonder if the Brits still believe that they are “fighting them there so we don’t have to fight them here.”
June 30th, 2007 at 12:14 pmHow long will it take before additional information surfaces casting doubt on the official story, which will be either underreported or not reported at all?
I just turned my TV OFF.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:16 pm99% of British think that going into Iraq has made us less safe
only 1 % have no brains at all
June 30th, 2007 at 12:16 pmAnd im telling you, this bomb was Not Al Queda But was the doing of a ruthless gang of children properganderists called Tinky Winky, Dipsy , Laa Laa and Po
Comment by Tobey Tall
We’re reading very different press, Tobey. I don’t see anyone disputing the fact that this was amateur hour, although the report I read this morning indicated that the guy caught on CCTV was someone that had been questioned in connection with a previous bombing.
I agree, absolutely, this is not Al Qaeda, but I see no reason to doubt that the intent was to blow up Londoners and no reason to doubt that the motivation was in sympathy with Middle East terrorism. Just because they were inept doesn’t mean they weren’t sincere.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:18 pminstead of an actual bomb,
could this have been the INGREDIENTS for a bomb?…
on the way to the bomb making lab or whatever…
just curious…
June 30th, 2007 at 12:19 pmIt is obvious that these alleged bombers must be graduates from the Al Qaeda equivalent of Regents College.
Bin Laden is just like Bush, he’s been hiring incompetent stooges who merely mouth his beliefs.
Ayaman al-Zawahiri is Arabic for Alberto Gonzales.
-GSD
June 30th, 2007 at 12:22 pmThis bomb tactic may be linked to the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center, which was an attack Bill Clinton did almost nothing about.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:24 pminstead of an actual bomb,
could this have been the INGREDIENTS for a bomb?…
on the way to the bomb making lab or whatever…
just curious…
————————-
This was the work of a Drunk Plumber on his way back from work
June 30th, 2007 at 12:26 pmA far more valid question, will be how long before fighters from Iraq, show up in the UK, and across Europe? This attack, and the one just reported on the Glasgow airport may have been amateur hour, but an experienced operative, who spent a year in Iraq making IED’s will quickly change that. The war in Iraq has made us less safe, has built a breeding ground for want-a-be’s and is providing a fertile training ground that weeds out the weak.
Already in Europe many countries have are worried about the rise in attacks, from returning Jihadists. Bush has not only made us less safe, but has increased recruiting, and has promoted cause of muslim extremists.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:26 pmcar slams into glasgow airport
June 30th, 2007 at 12:38 pm“This bomb tactic may be linked to the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center, which was an attack Bill Clinton did almost nothing about.
Comment by Mr. Big — June 30, 2007′
More evidence of the Coulterfication of the modern day Bush/Coulter Republicans.
When the facts are not on their side, they lie.
All of the people involved in the 1993 WTC bombing have been convicted and jailed for life.
Let’s not forget that after Bin Laden declared war on American Republicans chose to launch a partisan attack on the US president in a time of declared terrorist war and the Bush/Coulter Republicans screamed “wag the dog” when largest and most direct attack to ever have been launched at Bin Laden was executed by Bill Clinton.
-GSD
June 30th, 2007 at 12:38 pmCensorship By NPR
This link goes to a blog referencing a Frontline documentary on the alleged Toronto bomb plot, in which I participated.
http://blog.throwawayyourtv.com/2007/06/cracking-toronto-terror-cell.html
it is not a great documentary, giving too much implicit credence to an extremely dodgy informant, and ignoring the crucial agent provocateur aspects of the case. This series is produced out of Canada, and shown first there, and then in the US by NPR. The original documentary did have the saving grace of looking at what drives young Muslims to extremism, particularly in US and UK foreign policy. That is where I came in.
However, when NPR came to reshow this in the US, they insisted on a complete recut, taking out all the balance (including all of me) and turning it purely into an exercise in fear – those Muslims are planning to blow you up because they are plain evil.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:38 pmYeah, because before Al-CIAdah in Iraq, NOBODY had ever used car-bombs.
Yes, it was laden with explosives. A whole tank full.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:38 pmGlasgow Airport? Jeebus, I was just there a couple of months ago. WTF? They’re attacking Scotland?!! Now I’m getting mad.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:38 pmThis is just fear-mongering at it’s very worst to keep people feeling : “please protect me even if it means taking away more of my civil liberties”
Funny, how Brown takes office and *bang* a terror alert.
Fasten your seatbelts, it’s going to be a bumpy night”
June 30th, 2007 at 12:43 pm-Bette Davis, “All About Eve”
Based on the theme of the posts here today I think I just got a sneak preview of how the Democrats will be handling terrorism should the gain control next year. By down playing any attempted attacks and saying the terrorist were just amatuers. Wonder how that will work out?
June 30th, 2007 at 12:45 pm“All of the people involved in the 1993 WTC bombing have been convicted and jailed for life.”
Not Bin Laden. Not any leader of al qaeda. Bill Clinton did nothing to mitigate the threat of al qaeda through his 8 years in office.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:47 pmKrazny – A far far far more valid question is:
“Who are the REAL terrorists?”
Watch Zeitgeist Final Cut – Part 3 here:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=497251819335380093
Then watch Zeigeist Final Cut – Part 2 here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7160790539111319889
Google “USS Liberty”
Google “Douglas Feith + A Clean Break”
Google “Douglas Feith + Iraq Intel”
Do your own research – and come to your own conclusions.
Who is beating the war drums against Iran and why and on what basis?
Why all the lies?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mScWWtRfGQ
(2:10 minutes)
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article12790.htm
http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=5866
http://www.juancole.com:80/2006/05/hitchens-hacker-and-hitchens.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/06/11/AR2006061100652.html
What can we do?
June 30th, 2007 at 12:48 pmWhat if when they call for the next war – nobody came?
katy,
There were a lot of nails strewn about the car = frag bomb
June 30th, 2007 at 12:48 pmnew attack at Glasgow Airport, SUV rams into terminal and explodes….seeing this on MSNBC at 12:30 Eastern Time
June 30th, 2007 at 12:49 pmBush didn’t do anything to mitigate the threat of Al Qaeda for 9 months, then when the largest terrorist attack on US soil (9/11) happened, he abandoned the hunt for Bin Laden, to attack Saddam Hussein, who had nothing to do with the attack.
Please take you red herring elsewhere.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:51 pmBy down playing any attempted attacks and saying the terrorist were just amatuers. Wonder how that will work out?
Comment by Chris
When America is attacked again, it will be apparent republicans shot down any attempts at controlling the borders, so they won’t have any ammunition to use against the dems. That’s how it will “work out” – unless there are no attacks.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:52 pmMr. Big,
How’s Dubya doing in his sixth year of getting Bin laden “dead or alive” last I heard Dubya said he really doesn’t matter all that much, aint that some flip flopping spin. Ya know several years have passed since president Clinton held office, what has the all hat cowboy done about terrorist numero uno?
June 30th, 2007 at 12:54 pm“Bush didn’t do anything to mitigate the threat of Al Qaeda for 9 months”
This is largely true. But compare 9 months with Clinton’s 8 years of inaction and it’s no comparison. Clinton was offered Bin Laden by the Sudan 3 times, and he turned them down, probably for poltical reasons.
To Bush’s credit, he has put us on offense against the terrorists. Bill Clinton treated terrorism as a crime.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:54 pm“How’s Dubya doing in his sixth year of getting Bin laden “dead or alive†”
Bin Laden is in hiding now after 9/11. He was not during Clinton’s 8 years in office. The Sudan offered to turn him over. Clinton refused the offer.
There is a CIA video during the Clinton years showing Bin Laden walking around, and Clinton wouldn’t authorize the CIA to take a shot at him with a drone.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:56 pmMr. Big,
Go away with your RNC talking points, sell crazy somewhere else.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:57 pmThe man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either.
Benjamin Franklin
June 30th, 2007 at 12:57 pm“Not Bin Laden. Not any leader of al qaeda. Bill Clinton did nothing to mitigate the threat of al qaeda through his 8 years in office.”
Comment by Mr. Big
I guess Reagan’s arming terrorists has paid dividends, eh? They saw how cowardly “the leader of the free world” actually was, and they thought all Americans were like him. If only he had had the political will to not to negotiate with terrorists, we wouldn’t be paying the price for his perfidy decades later.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:58 pmI am not getting involved in your red herring mr. Big, this whole issue has been discussed over and over again. Perhaps you should acquaint yourself with the facts, instead of the Rush/RNC/Fox/Coulter talking points.
More on topic, if Bush is on the offense as you put it, why is Bin Ladens still free? Why is radical extremism on the rise, and why are we in Iraq, when the the 9/11 Hijackers were largely Saudi?
June 30th, 2007 at 12:58 pmMr. Big,
As is usual for a Conserv666ative you don’t answer questions. Bin laden was trapped in the Tora Bora mountains while we were IN COUNTRY not a globe away and Dubyas incompetence let him get away. To hell with your skewed version of history.
Pick up a gun and get in the fight tough guy.
June 30th, 2007 at 12:59 pmSo is it true a bomb exploded at Glasgow airport today?
June 30th, 2007 at 12:59 pm“I guess Reagan’s arming terrorists has paid dividends, eh?”
I agree with arming the contras in my heart. But I disagree with Reagan pulling out of Beirut.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:01 pmI waited all day yesterday before writing on this. My first instinct yesterday when I heard this story was that it was yet another staged occurence. Too convenient on the heels of VERY bad press for the WH and the first day of a new Prime Minister in England who doesn’t necessarily support the policies of GW Bush.
I didn’t write anything because I thought perhaps I was getting too cynical. The bombs in London were discovered but hadn’t gone off. Perhaps it was a genuine find. But, it wasn’t even clear if they were actually bombs.. Yet it took over ALL the news of the day and won’t stop now for some time.
My first thought was “How convenient..â€. Mind you, I would NEVER want any bombs to go off anywhere and I would never wish anyone harm – ever. But, bombs that DIDN’T go off are now going to direct ALL conversation and news cycles for days. How convenient.
The newscaster went nuts. These were the messages:
1. The terrorists are still out there and you still need to be very, very afraid..
2. They want to kill us for our freedoms
3. That is why we must fight them there so they WON’T come here
4. (and I really heard this said) what happens if the Dems win the WH? Are they strong enough on terror??
The other thing I heard was Keira Phillips on CNN talking about how fortunate there were surveillance cameras posted all over in London so they could study the tapes (or whatever). Then I heard her say something about the need for surveillance in personal residences so that people could feel safer. I almost fell out of my chair. Maybe I heard it wrong (I was in the next room and was only halfways listening), but I don’t think so. It was straight out of “1984″. Big Brother in every home. Man, was Orwell a creator of a work of fiction? Or, was he a psychic or a prophet? Or, was he giving us a very real warning of what was coming?
People CANNOT sellout their brains and their very souls in order for their government to make them feel safe again. Especially when it is the government, and the newscasters, that are working overtime to make and keep people feeling AFRAID!
It is like all of this is scripted! I mean, maybe it really did happen the way they are reporting, but why is it ALWAYS so convenient and incredibly TIMELY!?
Again, this wonderful reminder by Olbermann on
“The Nexus of Terrorâ€:
http://www.crooksandliars.com/ 2007/ 06/ 04/ olbermann-the-nexus-of-politics-and-terror-2/
Is this possibly set up in order to bring people back into line so they can continue on with this plan? I know this was in London, but GB and the US sure seem connected on all of this stuff..
Oh, and Giuliani wasted NO TIME in jumping on the ‘TERROR’ bandwagon and spinning it to his advantage… Sick..
June 30th, 2007 at 1:02 pmDoesn’t look like a bomb exploded, but a car with maybe full propane tanks was driven into the terminal, and caught on fire. Two men were arrested, possibly of Asian decent. Doesn’t sound like they have a very clear picture. Also they are unsure if it has anything to do with what happened in London yesterday.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:03 pmJay:
“Detectives hunted Saturday for suspects who abandoned two explosives-packed cars in the heart of London’s nightlife district, reviewing closed circuit television footage and scouring the vehicles for clues.
Amid fears of further attacks, a burning sport utility vehicle crashed at full speed into the terminal building at Glasgow airport in Scotland, police and witnesses said.”
June 30th, 2007 at 1:04 pmMore on topic, if Bush is on the offense as you put it, why is Bin Ladens still free?
He’s probably in Pakistan, where for political reasons we just can’t go in with guns blazing.
He’s not leading any parades. He’s in hiding now, which he largely wasn’t during Clinton’s 8 years in office.
To Bush’s credit, he has drasticaly reduced the membership of al qaeda. 2/3’s of the leadership has been captured or killed.
Even Hillary has admitted we are safer now than before 9/11.
“Why is radical extremism on the rise, and why are we in Iraq, when the the 9/11 Hijackers were largely Saudi?”
We are at war with radical islam. They understand it’s a war.
Why did we go into Afghanistan is the 9/11 hijackers were largely Saudi?
June 30th, 2007 at 1:05 pmI just read a press release and Glasgow airport had a SUV that crashed and burned at the airport, so basically an accident of some kind, but the UK government wants to turn it into a terrorist attack.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:06 pmI’ve got to admire how the “special relationship” still applies.
Wonderful propaganda. Wonderful. And I say this as a die-hard GOP operative.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:07 pm“Bin laden was trapped in the Tora Bora mountains while we were IN COUNTRY not a globe away and Dubyas incompetence let him get away.”
He obvioiusly wasn’t trapped, because he slipped away.
But which is easier: Trying to find somebody hidden in the moutains of tora bora, or just recieving him into custody from the Sudan?
June 30th, 2007 at 1:07 pm“I agree with arming the contras in my heart. But I disagree with Reagan pulling out of Beirut.”
Comment by Mr. Big
Reagan armed Iranians, who were holding Americans captive – until Reagan sold them weapons. What’s the matter? Can’t wrap your head around the fact that Reagan did sell weapons to Iranian terrorists, while telling the american people “we never negotiate with terrorists?”
June 30th, 2007 at 1:08 pmUh we went into afghanistan, because Bin laden, tall fellow wears white was based out of there. or did you forget about him.
LOL you have many excuses for you dear deciders failures. Perhaps the reason Bin Laden is still out there, is because Bush was far more interested in Iraqi oil then anything else.
hehe you aren’t a very smart opponent.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:08 pmBurning cars are not a terrorist attack, but claiming it as such seems to scare some people.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:08 pmAt least Bush has made nice with Muammar Khaddaffy after he ordered the bombing of a Pan Am plane over Scotland!
That shows the terrorists that we won’t reward “bad behavior”!
P.S. Nice of Bush to negotiate one on one with North Korea too!
-GSD
June 30th, 2007 at 1:10 pmThis whole thing seems to be an attempt to undermine the new PM in the UK and get the Brits to bemoan Tony Blair being gone.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:12 pm“He said the men in the car got out and started throwing petrol about – that must be how it caught fire,” he said.
Is that what you call an accident. I call it a terrorist attack!
June 30th, 2007 at 1:12 pm“Reagan armed Iranians, who were holding Americans captive – until Reagan sold them weapons.”
Our hostigages were returned because of Reagan. What did Jimmy Carter do to get them returned?
June 30th, 2007 at 1:13 pmThis whole thing seems to be an attempt to undermine the new PM in the UK and get the Brits to bemoan Tony Blair being gone.
Comment by Jay Randal — June 30, 2007 @ 1:12 pm
I was just thinking the same thing.. Poor guy. Rough first couple of days.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:15 pmWhat is his position on fighting this “war on terror”?
“because Bush was far more interested in Iraqi oil then anything else.”
Saudi Arabia has more oil than Iraq. It would have been far easier to invade Saudi Arabia and steal their oil than it was for Iraq, if what you say is true. But it isn’t.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:15 pmMan > LOL throwing gasoline around is strange, because that can cause a fire, but not a bomb blast. Sounds like arsonists gone goofy.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:16 pmlet me explain
two guys smoking while driving a car , one of them farts and catches fire , other guy swerves into building
see nothing to do with terror attacks
June 30th, 2007 at 1:16 pm“Nice of Bush to negotiate one on one with North Korea too!”
Just continuing the work of your hero, Maddy Albright.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:16 pmBig > Bush is a pal of the Saudis, so he would never attack them.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:17 pmTobey, how many times have you seen someone ignite because he farts? You’re just trying to dismiss this incident as something harmless.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:18 pm“Uh we went into afghanistan, because Bin laden, tall fellow wears white was based out of there. or did you forget about him.”
And we went into Iraq because of a killer: Saddam, and his sons. Forget about them?
June 30th, 2007 at 1:19 pmAfter six years of Bush’s war on terror, if it was anywhere close to being successful, there wouldn’t be ANY threats, attempts or near-misses.
Bush was given unlimited resources, the complete elimination of any of those pesky rights of citizens, and a 17-page menu of secret surveillance programs to spy on anybody, anywhere. With everything that he wanted (and got), and in a country that is under 24-hour camera surveillance watching people’s every move, cars were stolen from Scotland, filled with explosives, then driven to the center of London without anyone suspecting anything.
This is not the way to make our lives safe and secure.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:20 pmNot really, if the US had invaded Saudi Arabia, it would have forced the world to turn against us. The SA isn’t run by a despotic madman, at least not one in the same caliber as Hussien. Also the SA is our ally, and “friendly” though I use that term loosely.
Really what needs to be done, is to stop or reduce our use of oil, to the point that we don’t need anything externally to maintain our energy needs. Then we can wipe the sand of the middle east from our boots, and let them kill each other, instead of funding the very radicals attempting to kill us.
Reagan selling arms to the Iranians was illegal. I realize as your super deity. Reagan is sancrosant, but he was still a bad president, and an idiot. His only saving grace was, he was a nice guy.
Read the PNAC links sometimes they had this whole thing mapped out.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:20 pmI think the point isn’t about stealing the oil as much as controlling how much oil is put out there so they can control the price thus making bazillions of dollars off the consumers.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:21 pmMr. Big,
Raygun negotiated with terrorists to win the release of our hostages
June 30th, 2007 at 1:22 pm“because Bush was far more interested in Iraqi oil then anything else.â€
Saudi Arabia has more oil than Iraq. It would have been far easier to invade Saudi Arabia and steal their oil than it was for Iraq, if what you say is true. But it isn’t.
Comment by Mr. Big — June 30, 2007
Mr. Big shows his lack of political savvy here. It is highly likely that much of the Muslim world would have responded very unfavorably to a US invasion of the nation that houses the revered Islamic holy sites of Mecca and Medina.
In other words, IT WOULD’T HAVE BEEN EASIER TO ATTACK SAUDI ARABIA, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN MUCH HARDER.
Next lame talking point to be shot down in flames please.
-GSD
June 30th, 2007 at 1:22 pmMan > calm down. The alleged bomb attacks in the UK are the dumbest pranks of nincompoops ever devised.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:22 pmAnd we went into Iraq because of a killer: Saddam, and his sons. Forget about them?
Comment by Mr. Big — June 30, 2007 @ 1:19 pm
Not in the least, but there are many despotic regimes around the world, including our one of our biggest trading partners China, not even counting most of Africa, a fair bit of central and South America. Why Iraq? Why not get bin Laden track down his network and cut off the money? You cannot fight terrorism with full scale military invasions, it doesn’t work. We are bleeding money, our military is overextended, and we are deeply in debt to a communist nation. However we need to stay the course? Just how stupid are you?
June 30th, 2007 at 1:23 pmI suppose every time a car crashes and burns somewhere it can now be called terrorism. That seems to lower the bar to the ground now.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:25 pmI just read a press release and Glasgow airport had a SUV that crashed and burned at the airport, so basically an accident of some kind, but the UK government wants to turn it into a terrorist attack.
Comment by Jay Randal
According to eye witness reports on the BBC site, the jeep was burning before it hit the airport, and there were two men in the vehicle who bailed out on impact. One was on fire and fought the police who arrived. Both men were led off in cuffs. Not the world’s sharpest terrorists, but scarcely “an accident.”
So now I see two responses to these incidents. On one hand, we’ve got the “Holy crap, Al Qaedi is blowing up cars, vote for me!” and on the other hand, we’ve got the “that’s not a real bomb, this is all a ploy to scare us.”
Great discourse. Just great.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:26 pm“Our hostages were returned because of Reagan.”
Comment by Mr. Big
And we have paid the price for his political cowardice for decades. Would we have even been attacked at the World Trade Center, and on 9/11 if Reagan hadn’t shown how cowardly, and two-faced Americans (as exemplified by his cowardice) were? Look in the mirror if you want to see the real culprit: conservative cowardice and perfidy.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:27 pmSo why did Tony Blair leave Gordon Brown a terrorist mess. I mean if we use the Chimp’s 26% base logic, it is the fault of Tony Blair(the previous leader) for the terrorist attacks.
-GSD
June 30th, 2007 at 1:27 pmAnd we went into Iraq because of a killer: Saddam, and his sons. Forget about them?
Comment by Mr. Big — June 30, 2007 @ 1:19 pm
Yes they were bad guys. There are lots of bad guys in lots of places. We don’t go attacking all of them.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:28 pmThey had been planning this for some time. The secret Cheney Energy Task Force (officials from Exxon Mobil Corp., Conoco [before its merger with Phillips], Shell Oil Co. and BP America Inc) met in secret meetings at the White House prior to 9/11. Documents uncovered by Judicial Watch concerning the activities of the Cheney Energy Task Force pre-9/11 contain a map of Iraqi oilfields, pipelines, refineries and terminals, as well as 2 charts detailing Iraqi oil and gas projects, and “Foreign Suitors for Iraqi Oilfield Contracts.†The documents are dated March 2001. Were they already planning on an invasion of Iraq and were they deciding how to divide it up?
http://www.judicialwatch.org/iraqi-oilfield-pr.shtml
Is that what you call an accident. I call it a terrorist attack!
Comment by Man — June 30, 2007 @ 1:12 pm
No this is a terrorist attack:
http://www.dispatch.co.za/2007/06/29/Foreign/abomb.html
You know one done by real terrorists, not fabricated scare tactics.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:28 pmA couple of losers drop their freebase crack pipe onto their bottle of gin and juice and it becomes a terrorist attack.
-GSD
June 30th, 2007 at 1:29 pmThat truck in California that burned under a bridge in California, collapsing the structure, could have been a terrorist attack, but instead was done by a sleepy driver who needed to get a motel room.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:29 pmWelcome to my ignore list.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:30 pm“In other words, IT WOULD’T HAVE BEEN EASIER TO ATTACK SAUDI ARABIA, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN MUCH HARDER.”
lol, writing in all capitals does not make it true.
Saudia Arabia would have folded like a tent, and we could have stolen their oil, if this were really about oil, which is isn’t.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:30 pmWhat th HELL is it with these ignore lists?
June 30th, 2007 at 1:32 pmWelcome to my ignore list.
Comment by Man
And welcome to my ridicule list…
June 30th, 2007 at 1:32 pmSaudia Arabia would have folded like a tent, and we could have stolen their oil, if this were really about oil, which is isn’t.
Comment by Mr. Big
But “Bandar Bush” wouldn’t approve, so no invasion.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:34 pmBush is King Saud’s bitch that’s why we don’t invade them. The Bush crime family and the house of Saud goes back a long way. Remember George kissing the king?
June 30th, 2007 at 1:34 pmbarfly > Bush lovers seem to go nuts at the mere mention of terrorism. Seems to scare the crap out of them. They have more chance of dying in a car crash, than from a real terrorist attack.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:36 pmThat truck in California that burned under a bridge in California, collapsing the structure, could have been a terrorist attack, but instead was done by a sleepy driver who needed to get a motel room.
Comment by Jay Randal
The vehicle was reportedly burning before it hit the airport. More to the point, there is no place outside of Glasgow airport to “accidentally” drive at the speed necessary to cause a car to burst into flames. There’s a fairly narrow road (one-way traffic, IIRC) that has made several turns prior to the short straight stretch in front of the airport.
I was just there, Jay. I picked up my hire car just across the road from where the Jeep crashed into the building.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:37 pm“They have more chance of dying in a car crash, than from a real terrorist attack.”
Comment by Jay Randal
And as we near the next election, every car crash, stink-bomb prank and bank heist will be “evidence” of terrorism.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:40 pmI got my Aneros yesterday. I had been waiting for it with great anticipation. I started about 5:30p I put towels on the bad as read about and had everything ready. I used 10cc of KY jelly in a syrnge to inject into my rectom. I waited about 5 minutes walking around to distrubate it well. I lubed uo my new FRIEND and inserted. Not at all what I expected. It was not uncomfortable at all. I lay on my right side with my legs drawn up. After about 4 minutes of squeezing my spencter muscle something started happening. The automatic muscle contractions started. My body started shaking and it lasted maybe 45 sec. I thought “this can’t be all.” i DECIDED NOT TO STOP FOR AT LEAST 1 HOUR TO SEE WHAT HAPENED. i HAD 4 MORE SUCH EPISODES WITH EACH ONE GROWING STRONGER. I figured 5 was enough but i was gonna lay there and rest for a bit. After about 3 minutes after the last wave I noticed I started breathing harder. I could feel my lower abdomes start to quiver and then it started. HOLY COW!!! It must have lasted 3 minutes. I had to make myself breath. I thought i was going to pass out. After I was able to function again I got cleaned up in the shower. I FEEL GREAT!!! I woke this morning thinking I would be to sore to walk, but no such thing. Infact, I,m thinking of sneaking home early befor the wife gets home and have another session.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:42 pmfake fake fake fake fake
June 30th, 2007 at 1:43 pmgummitch > the incident is very odd, but not a viable terrorist attack. Police would be wise to treat it as some kind of weird accident, before jumping to conclusion of being a terrorist act. Could be drunk Scotts doing a road rage thing.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:44 pmconsidering Gordon brown nose has never ever stated his true beliefs on Iraq, apart from saying He aggrees with Blair on two occasions , These pathetic attempts at Terror give him justification to have a hardline stance with Iraq
And now within 2 days of being in Office he can continue as Tony Blair
a coincidence or is it New Goverment synchronization for ongoing conflicts
June 30th, 2007 at 1:44 pmI feel SO fortunate…
…that there are so many…
…”stupid” terrorists…
June 30th, 2007 at 1:45 pm“Fightin’ em o’er thay-er, so weez don’t hav-ta here…”
For the great manipulators of fear (those in power), there’s no difference between a “real terrorist” threat, or a wannabe, copy-cat act. The results are the same, and ALWAYS in their favor.
Never forget:
June 30th, 2007 at 1:48 pmhttp://youtube.com/watch?v=qxhIkzTg14M
Jay,
reports are, the men driving the vehicle were Asian, I won’t rule out the drunk part, but they probably weren’t Scots
June 30th, 2007 at 1:48 pmAneros > there are porn blogs for you to post on guy.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:48 pmWhite House apparently is doctoring old videos…removed mission accomplished banner on their old videos of bush’s speech on the carrier:
June 30th, 2007 at 1:52 pm#98: Got links?
June 30th, 2007 at 1:52 pmUh. Ignore that.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:52 pmhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-u2ITs4yIAE
(here’s the link where they removed the mission accomplished banner..didn’t work before)
June 30th, 2007 at 1:53 pm#98: Got links?
Comment by Jake — June 30, 2007 @ 1:52 pm
Uh. Ignore that.
Comment by Jake — June 30, 2007 @ 1:52 pm
ROFL just use google, I am sure you can find a few =P
June 30th, 2007 at 1:54 pmThis bomb tactic may be linked to the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center, which was an attack Bill Clinton did almost nothing about.
Comment by Mr. Big
Except capture the guilty parties, put them on trial, convict them, and put them in prison. Not a damned thing!!!
June 30th, 2007 at 1:55 pmMaybe Aneros has this event solved. The crazy Asians were busy putting bananas up their butts > lol. Just needed to tell that joke.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:55 pmeports are, the men driving the vehicle were Asian, I won’t rule out the drunk part, but they probably weren’t Scots
Comment by Krazny
Scots??? Was anyone head-butted???
June 30th, 2007 at 1:55 pmAneros = Jake.
What a pervert.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:56 pmI woke this morning thinking I would be to sore to walk, but no such thing. Infact, I,m thinking of sneaking home early befor the wife gets home and have another session.
Comment by Aneros
Another republican.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:57 pmGot links?
Comment by Jake
I thought it was Jake …
Those nurses must be drugging him to shut him up, again…
Hey, nurses! Double the dosage!
June 30th, 2007 at 1:57 pmDon’t think you can get a gas can to explode by headbutting it.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:59 pmThis Al Qaeda attack in Glasgow gives further proof to the world that we must band together to defeat terrorism.
Now is not the time to retreat as the leading Democrat candidates would tell you.
This is the time to join together and unite against this terrorist threat that affects all of us.
We are not at war with the terrorists, they are at war with us. We must fight to protect our right to exist.
We are with you, people of Glasgow. Thoughts and prayers to those out there who are facing the terrorist menace today.
June 30th, 2007 at 1:59 pmwhat better way is there for giving Gordon Brown a legitimate reason to continue Tony Blairs Iraq Oil Aid program
only on two occasions in the past 4 years has Gordon Brown said publicly
that he agreed with Tony Blair on Invading Iraq
Now Gordon Brown has the perfect answer within 2 days of Goverment to continue foreign policy without lookingbad for himself
coincidence or synchronization
June 30th, 2007 at 2:00 pmDon’t think you can get a gas can to explode by headbutting it.
Comment by Krazny
Clearly, you don’t know the Scots!
June 30th, 2007 at 2:00 pmmuckdog > lol are you smoking crack or something else?
June 30th, 2007 at 2:01 pmbut instead was done by a sleepy driver who needed to get a motel room.
Comment by Jay Randal
But that’s only the “official version”, Jay…
June 30th, 2007 at 2:02 pmmuckdog – I am Scottish and live in Scotland
please take your forces out of Iraq and Afghanistan and stop creating reasons for terrorism
Thank you so kindly
June 30th, 2007 at 2:02 pmThis bomb tactic may be linked to the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center, which was an attack Bill Clinton did almost nothing about.
Comment by Mr. Big —
June 30th, 2007 at 2:03 pmIs mr big short for mister bigmouth? You’re a braindead idiot. And your parents obviously experimented with inbreeding.
Maybe they hoped all the HOT AIR from the Neocons would “oxidize” the gas canisters… since they were incapable of erupting WITHOUT ONE!!!
“The sky is falling! We’re being attacked”
Does this sound familiar, my ‘chicken-littles’:
Tattoo it on your foreheads so it’ll be easier to remember, brainwashed Repukes…
June 30th, 2007 at 2:03 pmLook in the mirror if you want to see the real culprit: conservative cowardice and perfidy.
Comment by barfly
Sorry, barfly, but you’re going to have to find simpler words than perfidy if you expect to be understood here. Try something in the one-syllable catagory, or perhaps some grunts and gesticulations…
June 30th, 2007 at 2:05 pmWell Republic that crash did result in a highway bridge collapsing, so could be called a successful terror attack, but Bush officials quickly claimed it was just a sleepy truck driver.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:05 pmTattoo it on your foreheads so it’ll be easier to remember, brainwashed Repukes…
Hmm. Maybe we’re following his suggestions. Ever thought about that?
God you people are stupid.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:05 pmYes, I advise Repukes to heed the advice of a Nazi War criminal.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:08 pmMakes PERFECT sense…
but Bush officials quickly claimed it was just a sleepy truck driver.
Comment by Jay Randal
They had to look at the possibility, that’s for sure.
An ex-acquaintance of mine was involved w/ the film “The Wild Wild West”. Bad movie. I had heard my friend was claiming the studio hijacked his idea for that film, and decided he was probably telling the truth because only this guy would be desperate enough to take credit for a flop.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:11 pmmuckdog,
That brought a tear to my eye.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:11 pm“… the advice of a Nazi War criminal…”
Makes PERFECT sense…
Comment by Not Canadian
How did Prescott Bush get into this conversation?
June 30th, 2007 at 2:12 pm#121: Ever heard of the “Operation PaperClip”? We brought a lot of important information back from the 3rd Reich. Stuff that allowed us to win the Cold War.
In fact, if we had done the right thing and joined forces with the remnants of Wehrmacht in 1944-45 after Hitler’s death and driven the Soviets out of Berlin, there would not have been a Cold War to begin with. Imagine that.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:13 pmIf we need to band together, why did Bush alienate almost all of our allies, and turn world opinion against the US?
June 30th, 2007 at 2:15 pmBB,
Yes we know of the Bush’s funding of the 3rd Reich through the World Bank, and their profit from said, and their ties/fascination with the Nazi Regime.
Shrub and his pappy have been using the Nazi ‘playbook’ for decades.
And thanks for the showing your allegience to the Fuhrer.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:16 pm“This Al Qaeda attack in Glasgow gives further proof to the world that we must band together to defeat terrorism.
Now is not the time to retreat as the leading Democrat candidates would tell you.
Muckdog”
More noecon lies and distortions. the democrats want to focus of actualy fighting the terrorists. We aren’t doing that in Iraq, moron. We’re fighting for oil. If you believe otherwise you are a fool.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:16 pmNow is not the time to retreat as the leading Democrat candidates would tell you.
Comment by muckdog
muckdog (appropriate name, by the way…), if you want to be taken seriously, STOP LYING!!!
June 30th, 2007 at 2:17 pmAs I said, the alliance could have been made only after Hitler’s death. I’ve got no allegiance to the Führer. I’m just thinking realpolitik. Drive out the Soviets and you would have had Free Europe instead of the stand-off that cost us billions of dollars.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:18 pmNot to digress too much from the main topic, but the only way we could have avoided the cold war, would have been to invade the Soviet Union in 1918, shortly after the Bolshevik revolution. Hitler’s invasion of eastern europe, is what opened the door for soviet dominance. Whether we had driven them from Berlin, something that tactically I doubt the allies were capable of is irrelevant.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:18 pmI believe that we will see a major up-tick in terrorism as we approach the U.S. election cycle. Repbulican voters view their party as the one of security. The form of security under that party is one of war as well as decreasing of liberty within the U.S.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:20 pmTerrorism breeds off the vary actions of the current tact of the republican party. They want the U.S. to stay with the war party.
The constant bellowing that we have not been attacked since 9/11 should make you feel safer? It is not just because of our security forces. It is just the marking of time before the next election.
…and joined forces with the remnants of Wehrmacht in 1944-45 after Hitler’s death …
Comment by BottomBoy
Your compassion for the Jews is visceral.
It makes my skin crawl.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:20 pm#133: I’m sure Wehrmacht would have been more interested in driving out the Soviets with our help than maintaining any camps.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:21 pm#134
And you think anybody with half a brain stem could/would trust them?
HELL NO.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:22 pmNo Bottom boy has a great idea, lets arm the enemy we just defeated.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:23 pm#134: Germans were always a logical race. If we helped them rid their country of the Soviet scourge, what makes you think they would have any interest in killing Jews? Besides, Wehrmacht was never into that stuff. It was the nazi high command and SS.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:24 pm#136: Well, what the hell do you think happened in the 1950s and 60s?
June 30th, 2007 at 2:25 pmAl Qaeda may have imported tactics more familiar in Iraq.
The insurgents in Iraq do not use propane and gasoline in their car bombs. They use real explosives and artillery shells that the Lethally Incompetent Bush war planners failed to secure during the invasion of Iraq. Our troops drove PAST warehouses full of these munitions in their single-minded quest to find Weapons of Mass Destruction.
June 30th, 2007 at 2:37 pmAnd why didn’t our troops simply blow these munition storage facilities up??? Because they didn’t have the TIME or Resources to search them, and were afraid chemical weapons possibly stored in there would be released.
Just on Juan Cole website
Larry Johnson points out that Friday’s similar incident in London was similarly a SNAFU.
http://www.juancole.com/
this should really please some trolls
June 30th, 2007 at 2:43 pm“this is actually brilliant nobody was hurt and now it forces Brown to play his hands as for 4 years he has whitewashed the subject of Iraq or should I say foreign policy”
June 30th, 2007 at 3:26 pmRandom thoughts:
-1/3 of you cats are conspiracy kooks.
-Two bomb attacks have been going on in more places than Iraq for yeats [Israel for one].
-Who’s side are some of you on?
June 30th, 2007 at 3:31 pmNot Al Qaeda. Iraqi style insurgency imported and created by America’s War on Terror.
June 30th, 2007 at 3:32 pmI think it’s time to invade London.
That way, we can fight the evildoers there, instead of over here.
June 30th, 2007 at 3:50 pmAlQaeda’s number two, Aiman al-Zawahiri Cancelled plans for a poison gas attack in America, because he thought it would not be SPECTACULAR enough. No… these car bombs in England were the work of amateur Al-Qaeda wannabe’s. If Bin Laden attacks us again, god forbid, we won’t have any doubt who did it.
June 30th, 2007 at 3:53 pmI think every sedan has gasoline in it.
Well, maybe not the ones that run on diesel.
June 30th, 2007 at 3:54 pmCNN has been showing the burning vehicle at Glasgow, and fire seems to have damaged the building above it somewhat, but the windows are still intact so could not have been any explosive in the car. Might have been filled with jugs of gasoline to make a bigger fire. Appears to be a very poorly planned attack on the airport, so more for show than to kill a bunch of people. Capturing two Asian guys is odd and hard to tie them to Islamic Arabic terrorists.
June 30th, 2007 at 4:22 pmJust like the immediate speculation following 911, eh? Is this a last-ditch attempt to exonerate their own criminal, Bush’s poodle? Amazing how they can decide almost immediately who is responsible yet cannot seem to find OBL after 5 years of hunting for him? Hmmm…..doesn’t make a bit of sense, does it?
June 30th, 2007 at 5:46 pmAs far as this bomb situation, all I can say is: NEXT! The sycophantic media whores love this – monopolizing the air time with repeating this ad nauseum….when no one cares at all. I don’t think the MSM will get it until it’s too late for them….have to say that I wouldn’t notice it one iota if they were all gone because I don’t listen to or watch any of them.
June 30th, 2007 at 5:48 pm“according to American sources”
June 30th, 2007 at 7:14 pmThat’s all you have to hear to know it’s bullshit.
A couple of car bombs do not always mean Al Qaeda and Iraq. The mainstream media is ridiculous. People have been making car bombs for decades, long before Al Qaeda existed.
June 30th, 2007 at 10:07 pm“according to American sourcesâ€
That’s all you have to hear to know it’s bullshit.
Comment by SKdeA — June 30, 2007 @ 7:14 pm
June 30th, 2007 at 10:39 pmTypical Lefty UnAmerican Sentiment
These clowns are worthy of the three stooges. If only the insurgents in Iraq were this incompetent, instead of “the most diabolical enemy I’ve ever seen,” as David Petraeus said just yesterday. A lot less of our boys would die today, and tomorrow.
July 1st, 2007 at 1:00 amNo doubt that these attacks are related to Iraq.
And you aint’ seen nuthin’ yet. Before it’s over George Bush will have even more American blood on his hands than the people he executed in Texas with a chuckle, those that died on 9/11, those that died on the battlefield, and those that die every day in this country because of lack of health care. And the filthy heartless sonofabitch doesn’t care one bit. His two fetal-alcohol-syndrome addled daughters will live in luxurious isolation from real society as planned — and the widening gap between the haves and the have-nots will better assure their sensitivities are never confronted with reality.
Bush and his neocon cabal is one hundred percent responsible for the worldwide surge in terrorist activity.
July 1st, 2007 at 9:01 amTheir ‘intelligence’ is based in the theory of, six degrees of separation.
July 1st, 2007 at 11:52 amSix degrees of separation is the theory that anyone on the planet can be connected to any other person on the planet through a chain of acquaintances that has no more than five intermediaries.
Any connection to Iraq and Al Qaeda is pure speculation.
They have “concerns,†for f*ck’s sake — no evidence.
Scare tactics.
Comment by Zooey — June 30, 2007 @ 11:52 am
As opposed to, say, the hard evidence offered by Al Gore’s “documentary” on global warming?
July 2nd, 2007 at 12:34 pmThe biggest news story over the weekend and this site has one mention of it at the bottom. Sad and scary. You people who believe that there is no war on terrorism(Fanatic Islamists) better get your head out of the sand. To say that the attempted bombings were carried out by”the three stooges” is cowardly. You won’t open your eyes and understand that the world we live in is different post 9/11. You are like spoiled children who don’t get what you want. Close your eyes and ears and scream”no,no,no!!” The terrorist still want to kill you and your children. They hate us not because of G.W. Bush. They hate us because of freedom. Just go ask one of them. It’s all about control to them,no freedom of religon,no freedom of speech, and no rights for women. It’s not scare tactics you idiots! Ignore the past and you will be destined to repeat it.
July 2nd, 2007 at 2:29 pm