REPORT: The Iraq War Architects Revisited
More than four years after the initial invasion, the decision to go to war in Iraq has come to be widely viewed as the “worst foreign policy mistake” in our nation’s history. But the architects of the Iraq war have largely avoided taking accountability for their respective roles in that terrible decision.
In April 2006, ThinkProgress produced a report reviewing the key architects of the Iraq war. ThinkProgress has updated the report with the latest information on where the key architects are now, expanding it to include a few more integral planners of the conflict.
The original thesis remains the same: President Bush still has not fired any of the architects of the Iraq war; instead, they continue to reap rewards for their disastrous incompetence. Just this week, we witnessed two glaring examples of this fact:
Paul Wolfowitz: As deputy secretary of defense, he aggressively pushed for war, repeatedly making false assurances about the ease of victory in Iraq. Bush later rewarded him with a post at the World Bank, which he was forced to resign in disgrace after becoming embroiled in a corruption scandal. But last week, Wolfowitz announced he was landing at the American Enterprise Institute, a right-wing think tank that “has the President’s ear” on national security issues.
Scooter Libby: Even though the administration had failed to hold him accountable, a jury of his peers did. But, like many of his Iraq war architects, Libby was given safe refuge by President Bush and spared from serving any prison time, despite lying and obstructing justice in a federal investigation that had its roots in the decision to go to war.
Check out the updated report HERE.
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Libby is Bush’s Saturday Night Massacre.
July 4th, 2007 at 4:47 pmClinton Did It!â„¢
July 4th, 2007 at 4:50 pmLet’s make damn sure the Hague gets these asshowls and they take responsibility in that venue.
July 4th, 2007 at 4:51 pmToday we are asked whether to give the President of the United States authority to use force in Iraq should diplomatic efforts fail to dismantle Saddam Hussein’s chemical and biological weapons and his nuclear program. Now, I believe the facts that have brought us to this fateful vote are not in doubt. Saddam Hussein is a tyrant who has tortured and killed his own people, even his own family members, to maintain his iron grip on power. He used chemical weapons on Iraqi Kurds and on Iranians, killing over 20 thousand people. Unfortunately, during the 1980’s, while he engaged in such horrific activity, he enjoyed the support of the American government, because he had oil and was seen as a counterweight to the Ayatollah Khomeini in Iran. - Hillary 2002.
After Saddam capture CLINTON: I was one who supported giving President Bush the authority, if necessary, to use force against Saddam Hussein. I believe that that was the right vote.
Is she an architect or war as well?
July 4th, 2007 at 4:58 pmYeah, well Chelsea did it, which led to Clinton doing it.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:01 pmcrock:
I though we were all idiots, and you hated us, and you were leaving?
July 4th, 2007 at 5:01 pmCan you understand why no one trusts the right wing wacktoids anymore?
After Saddam capture CLINTON: I was one who supported giving President Bush the authority, if necessary, to use force against Saddam Hussein. I believe that that was the right vote.
Is she an architect or war as well?
Comment by drock — July 4, 2007 @ 4:58 pm
I guess it depends on your definition of the term “architect”.
Personally, I take it to mean one who designs, one who is intimately involved in the planning of the campaign and implementation of the plan.
If, on the other hand, YOU take it to mean one who stands on the sideline and simply consents to fund the construction (or in this case, DEstruction) as per the request of the person in charge, then I guess you could have a point.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:06 pmWhere is the ThinkProgress Headline that reads:
BREAKING: Al Gore’s Son. Bust With Drugs.
???????????????????????????????????????????
July 4th, 2007 at 5:06 pmIs she an architect or war as well?
Comment by drock — July 4, 2007 @ 4:58 pm
Yes, indeed she is, or at least she claimed to be one.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:08 pmMr Presidunce
Why can’t you stay on topic?
July 4th, 2007 at 5:08 pmRe drock,
Yup, Hillary should be held to account for her actions, just like everyone else. But if you’re going to implicate her, you have to also hold bush and co responsible for their crimes as well. Do you have the intellectual integrity, and the balls to do that? I doubt it…
July 4th, 2007 at 5:09 pmComment by spit take — July 4, 2007 @ 5:06 pm
I guess that depends on what your definition of “is” is?!?!?
July 4th, 2007 at 5:09 pmHEYOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks for that insightful contribution, Mr. Pee.
At least we should be grateful it’s just nonsense this time, and not your usual inanity and occasional abuse.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:12 pmWhy have not the democratic controled congress stopped the funding?
July 4th, 2007 at 5:13 pmWhy have not the democratic controled congress stopped the funding?
Comment by Troll — July 4, 2007 @ 5:13 pm
Bush will veto. Not enough of a Democratic majority to override. That’s why.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:17 pmYou know, I keep hearing in news reports that Scooter Libby and Richard Armitage had no connections.
Well, they were both members of PNAC and signatories to a number of letters, projects and reports. They were working with the same people towards the same ends.These people all had the same goals for where they wanted this country to go - with the military, with empire-building and going to war. Dick Cheney, Paul Wolfowitz, Richard Perle, Dov Zakheim, Elliot Abrams, John Bolton, Zalmay Khalizad, Robert Zoellick, Donald Rumsfeld, along with many others in this Administration and the Pentagon are/were all part of this same group.
http://en.wikipedia.org/ wiki/ Project_for_the_New_American_Century
It is just one big shell game to keep saying ‘Armitage was the one who leaked’. It was a whole lot bigger and more complicated than that. And, it was planned out, and I am sure it came from the very top (Bush and Cheney, though I am sure it was Cheney because he is the planner, Bush is the talking empty head).
July 4th, 2007 at 5:17 pmBut I wonder why they went to such elaborate lengths and took such stupid risks to hurt someone who was trying to expose the false basis for the war in Iraq? I want to know what is really going on. I don’t believe this was ever about a ‘war on terror’ (though a great scary soundbite and selling point). This wasn’t about protecting our country (becuase they haven’t done that, only made things worse). This war was never about bringing freedom and democracy to Iraq. That is just another feel-good soundbite that would get everybody behind the war. What IS it really about? Is this a power-grab on a global scale? Is this a get rich scheme of epical proportions? Is this a march across the globe to build an empire as to be the only way to keep the US interests protected?
I really want to know what they are thinking and who they REALLY represent. It’s not us..
The run up to the Iraq war, the false case this administration made in linking Saddam Hussein to bin Laden, the fact that no weapons of mass destruction were ever found in Iraq and the fact that our brave men and women are refereeing a brutal civil war between the Shiias and the Sunnis on this 4th of July all indicate that this was indeed the worst foreign policy blunder in our history. Intelligence was wrongly cherry picked by key administration officials like Cheney, Libby, Wolfowitz, Perle, Feith, Rumsfeld, Rice and the president himself. Their inability to stand up and apologize to the American people, shows that they are incapable of admitting mistakes or acknowledging gross lack of planning for the Iraq war.
President Bush has shown with his actions, unlike President Clinton (a great president) he is willing to go far to protect former staff members, his vice president, and himself when it comes to key issues of outing a covert CIA agent (another great American) to silence her husband, who rightfully criticized the false arguments made in taking this country to war. If Ambassador Wilson was wrong why were 16 words stricken from the president’s State of the Union speech? Scooter Libby is a convicted felon who broke the law. He deserves to go to jail for his crimes. His sentence was not excessive, the president should respect the rule of law, the decision of Judge Walton, a republican appointee he himself put on the federal bench.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:19 pmHate to say it but:
Hillary Clinton should be on that list too. She was one of the chief voices arguing in favour of the invasion, and much like Lieberman (Who should also be on the list) was instrumental in shutting down opposition to the war.
She isn’t a chickenhawk (Having tried to enlist herself in her twenties) but she was an Iraq war architect.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:29 pmAnd all this time, trolls and other war supporters have been WRONG.
Keep the really insightful comments, trolls, you have zero credibility as always. .
July 4th, 2007 at 5:30 pmSpit take,
The congress either passes war funding or it does not. If it does not then the President has a limited time to withdraw. There would be no spending bill to veto if none since none would be sent.
In May the democrat controlled Congress funded the war through Sept.. Why did they ignore the will of the people and fund this war which so few support?
What kind of cowards are they? The responsibility for the shed blood of our brave men and women certainly lay with this democrat congress.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:31 pmThe responsibility for going to war in Iraq which was the wrong war, in the wrong place and at the wrong time only rests with one man - President George W. Bush. This failed policy is his legacy and his choice.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:35 pmBy funding it the democrats in congress have made it their war also.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:36 pmThose who knowingly fund terrorist operations are held criminally responsible. So too should the democrats who funded this war.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:41 pmTroll, your free with words calling Dems cowards, what’s with you and all of the other that’s behind Dead Beat Bush, just load up and go over to Iraq. Bring all of the people you know that’s willing to fight in a no win war, and more so for a War for Oil, made posssible by Dead Beat George Bush. Yes, I did serve my country in the US Army, an very proud of it.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:41 pmI think they were cowards to not represent their constituents. Not because they did not fight in Iraq.
But it serves to highlight that politicians on either side can not be trusted to represent the people.
Government is the enemy.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:48 pmBTW
July 4th, 2007 at 5:48 pmThank you for your service to our country.
Government is the enemy.
Comment by Troll
Never thought Id agree with a troll :)
July 4th, 2007 at 5:51 pmAnd this entire crowd forgot about Henry Alfred Kissinger.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:52 pmI just want to thank President Bush for taking more days of vacation while in his first term than any other president and for playing gold while the terrorist were planning their attack. i really do appreciate him doing all he could to ensure our 3,000 plus americans didn’t die.
i want to thank bush for getting over 3,400 more killed in his war created by lies…a war that was not needed, and is not needed, yet he continues to allow our americans to die. we don’t see him make a single sacrifice but happy to let other americans die for his greed.
i want to thank president bush for taking a surplus of money and turning it into a record high debt that requires us to borrow from china.
i want to thank bush for making it more likely that we will be attacked and other countries will be attacked by religious nuts. all this while god told him to attack iraq…WOW….what people will claim in the name of a god and so many die and suffer. praise umm…one of the gods.
obviously not the christian or muslim god as they seem to ALWAYS support killing, as do their followers. jesus would be proud.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:54 pmi intended to say golf and not gold. i must like money..hehe
July 4th, 2007 at 5:56 pmClinton did it tu-tu.
July 4th, 2007 at 5:58 pmThank you Juan :)
July 4th, 2007 at 6:02 pmReuters: U.S. helicopter forced down in Iraq, one killed
One person on board a U.S. military helicopter was killed when the aircraft was forced down in northern Iraq on Wednesday, a military spokesman said.
3588
10 this month so far
July 4th, 2007 at 6:09 pmPS and a helicopter yesterday shot down but two crew recued
2 helicopters in 2 days OUCH
July 4th, 2007 at 6:10 pmVenezuela to sell gasoline to Iran
TEHRAN, Iran –Venezuela has agreed to sell gasoline to Iran, the South American county’s energy minister said in comments published Tuesday, a week after the Islamic country imposed a fuel rationing program that has sparked violence.
“Yes, Iranians have asked to buy gasoline from us and we have accepted this demand,” Rafael Ramirez told the Iranian daily newspaper Shargh. The reformist daily said Ramirez declined to elaborate on the deal.
OUCH Mr Bushco
July 4th, 2007 at 6:13 pmWhat role did Henry Kissinger play?
What role did Alan Greenspan play?
What role did DAVID ROCKEFELLER play?
Dig deeper.
July 4th, 2007 at 6:14 pmI can not recall another time when I have been so repulsed at looking at a pic… a pic of this stupid moron next to the headline of this article.
July 4th, 2007 at 6:15 pmWhat role did Ronald Reagan play? He played no role, he was sleeping.
July 4th, 2007 at 6:15 pmIraq’s crucial oil bill today faced further delay amid opposition from Kurdish politicians and parliamentary supporters of the radical Shia cleric Moqtada al-Sadr.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,2118378,00.html
July 4th, 2007 at 6:18 pmComment by Mr. President — July 4, 2007 @ 5:06 pm
If his son is busted how does that impact Al Gore the politician. In the late ’90s the son of our (then) Home Secretary was caught in a newspaper sting punting weed. Jack Straw wasn’t fired because teenagers do shit. It’s the way it works.
July 4th, 2007 at 6:19 pmIraq’s crucial oil bill today faced further delay amid opposition from Kurdish politicians and parliamentary supporters of the radical Shia cleric Moqtada al-Sadr.
Passage of the bill is seen by the US as vital to healing Iraq’s sectarian divisions. The prime minister, Nuri al-Maliki, had hoped for parliament to start debating the draft law today.
As Mr Sadr’s supporters voiced their displeasure with the bill, the Kurdistan regional government (KRG), which administers Iraq’s Kurdish north, said it had not seen and did not support the draft approved by the Iraqi cabinet yesterday. Sunni politicians were also opposed.
Ha Ha Ha Ha back to the drawing board with that one
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,2118378,00.html
July 4th, 2007 at 6:19 pmWe all bought the “Iraq is a threat to our Nation,” hook line and sinker. If anybody is to be blames, it’s all of us. We trusted this administration and even let them get re-elected. I’ve heard so many “Not me!’s” over the last couple of years it’s sickening. We all did! Were we lied to? Yes. Does that matter? Nope. We bought the rhetoric and were right there in front of the TV’s watching the shock and awe phase with pride saying, “That’s our powerful military!” Crap, probably a majority of us even bought the “We’ll be out in a year,” lie. Suck it up. We have to live with what we let happen.
http://beforeyougopostal.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=124
July 4th, 2007 at 6:23 pmTobey, don’tcha just love it when the debate is set to begin, but the key players haven’t even read the first draft>!
July 4th, 2007 at 6:24 pmWhat a farce this so called democratic experiment has turned out to be.
Who could have predicted they’d be unable to agree on pretty much anything?
OK, put your hands down now.
Tess:
Please speak for yourself.
I NEVER BOUGHT A WORD OF IT.
July 4th, 2007 at 6:25 pmSure…. I love Monday morning QB’s.
July 4th, 2007 at 6:26 pmWhy wasn’t Newt Gingrich named as an architect and planner of the invasion of Iraq. Gingrich was appointed by Rumsfeld to the Defense Policy Board headed by Richard Perle. He was a big supporter of Rumsfeld”s transformation strategy. ( the not enough troops policy)
July 4th, 2007 at 6:33 pmNo Dick Cheney?
July 4th, 2007 at 6:33 pmNo David Addington?
What about the GOP Congressional supporters/enablers?
No military planners?
“Tess:
Please speak for yourself.
I NEVER BOUGHT A WORD OF IT.”
Comment by ace — July 4, 2007 @ 6:25 pm
Nor did many of us, I imagine. I know that no one in my family bought it.
Ace, great posts!
July 4th, 2007 at 6:47 pmI was in the middle east during all of it so actually listening to the news wasn’t high on my priority list at that time. We had other priorities. As we liberals are so fond of saying lately, look at the polls to find out what America was thinking.
http://www.nytimes.com/ packages/ html/ politics/ 20030322_poll/ 20030322poll-results.html
Look at question #4.
July 4th, 2007 at 6:53 pmGet caught believing lies once, bad on us. Get caught twice be a Republican.
July 4th, 2007 at 6:59 pmace,
I am waiting for an answer to my question in post #63.
I don’t want to here that you “never bought the “Nazi-like tactics” a few months from now.
Answer the question or you are a fraud, sir.
July 4th, 2007 at 7:03 pmI sense a conspiracy. I smell a conspiracy. Hey, save some of that conspiracy for me!
July 4th, 2007 at 7:03 pmComment by Mr. President
Ace is the place to spend the firth of Jeeeeew-lieeee.
July 4th, 2007 at 7:05 pmace,
Answer the questions:
What is the real story behind the Gore III drug bust cover up?
Why does TP cover Paris Hilton but not Al Goracle’s son being busted with drugs?
What are you hiding a.c.e.???
July 4th, 2007 at 7:10 pmAnd the wolf gets the enterprise institute? Next stop, jail? Lets hope!
July 4th, 2007 at 7:13 pmI hate when entire articles are copied and pasted onto a blog. I would appreciate the link only.
July 4th, 2007 at 7:13 pmI hate when entire articles are copied and pasted onto a blog. I would appreciate the link only.
Comment by CT_V1, Dean of Dissent — July 4, 2007 @ 7:13 pm
Indeed, CT.
But if this is how they do it, maybe we can find something from:
Townhall.com
to post.
July 4th, 2007 at 7:15 pmThat is,
http://www.townhall.com/
July 4th, 2007 at 7:16 pmhttp://killtown.blogspot.com/ 2005/ 11/ dancing-israelis-on-911.html
July 4th, 2007 at 7:18 pmComment by Mr. President
I don’t even know where to begin scanning on Townhall. This ‘ace’ figure is cut-and-paste go-wild.
July 4th, 2007 at 7:26 pmMr. President
I pity you…you are making an absolute ass of yourself… all over the board - and in Bold… and no one is paying any attention to you..
July 4th, 2007 at 7:27 pmI will answer your post again - Al Gore III being busted for drugs is a non issue because:
This is an unfortunate situation found in all walks of life regardless of parenting skills. All folks, unless they have no family or live as a recluse
are affected one way or another by US drug and alcohol problem.
Correction: ‘ace’ is cut-and-paste gone wild.
July 4th, 2007 at 7:28 pmI have chosen no sides. I do not side with Bush’s policies re: the war on terror. I am, however, wanting to hear some specific, concrete policies from the democrats as to how to deal with islamic terrorist groups and their enablers. Comments like, “well don’t invade Iraq,” or “Bush sucks” aren’t policy suggestions.
By: Gordon on August 15, 2006 at 01:26pm
OK, how about this:
Arrest the entire Bush Cabinet for Conspiracy to Commit Treason (manufacturing false evidence to justify the invasion of a sovereign nation), order all US troops withdrawn from Iraq immediately and apologize to the Arab world for allowing Israel to infiltrate the United States Government with spies and operatives bent on the destruction of the Arab world in order to fulfill the promise of “Eretz Israel” at the expense of the US Taxpayer and the lives of hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians.
How would that be for a start?
July 4th, 2007 at 7:38 pmPelosi and Murtha=Islamo-Stalinist TRAITORS to the USA.
July 4th, 2007 at 7:40 pmSpeaker Pelosi is the greatest speaker in our history. God bless Speaker Pelosi who is a role model to so many women all over America and indeed to all Americans.
July 4th, 2007 at 7:47 pmComment by Probus — July 4, 2007 @ 7:47 pm
Typical Islamo-Stalinist.
eh, ace?
July 4th, 2007 at 7:50 pmMs. Pelosi needs to choose sides, because the TRUTH is hot on her trail.
Comment by ace — July 4, 2007 @ 7:52 pm
Wow.
ace, we agree about something!!!
July 4th, 2007 at 7:59 pmThat story about Halliburton acquiring the asbestos liabilities of Dresser Industries raises an interesting point…
Cheney KNEW that Dresser had the most massive liability issue on planet earth (he had to have known) yet decided to pay good money to bring Dresser’s problems under Halliburton’s tent.
The Bush family and Dresser Industries are very connected and go way back. Just google ‘Dresser Industries’ and ‘Bush’.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:08 pmGOOGLE: “Pelosi” and “Muslims”
July 4th, 2007 at 8:10 pmAnd, who in the heck reads The Weekly Standard anyway..? Who would even ADMIT to reading it??
July 4th, 2007 at 8:20 pmComment by MCMetal
Actually, MCMotorMouth, the links used are no less credible than ace’s “www.antiwar.com”. Mr. President’s links provide substantial evidence.
May want to try derailing the debate w/o talking points. Prove yourself, metal mouth.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:20 pm“www.antiwar.comâ€
Thanks for the link! I hadn’t seen that website yet. I will bookmark it and look at it further tomorrow.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:26 pmAce
July 4th, 2007 at 8:29 pmYou have an incredible grasp of this whole situation and I want to thank you for all the background material.
I think many people want to dismiss the whole 9/11 conspiracy movement because if it is true (it does stretch credibility to think so many people could be involved) how scary is that. Rather than put much thought into such a horrifying reality, they turn to American Idol and other diversions to keep the “wolves of the truth” at bay.
I, for one, want to know the truth; no matter how horrid. From these truths will come actions that will hopefully lead to getting our country back. Yes OUR country trolls, your and ours. Instead of trying to score points with juvenile postings, which accomplish nothing more than give you a little “high”, why not just state your position, if you are capable of it. If not, children should stay out of adult discussions, children should be seen and not heard.
That being said a note to the Joker Mr. Preznit: I have become adept at skipping your meaningless drivel, but noticed you started to put longer postings on this thread without paragraphs of crosses or whatever immature devices you employ. They may have said something important or interesting, but many like myself, will never know. We just skip along to something substantive. But it does appear you are making an attempt. I think.
Kudos to Ace for his painstaking research. That’s why I have started reading here. Not for someone to agree with, but to get better informed. I have no agenda besides finding out what is really going on.
As an American.
JG:
I was told directly by a high level source at the outset of the blunders in Iraq that this was ALL BY DESIGN.
Quagmire By Design was and remains the entire plan.
Permanent Bases are just that…as in FOREVER.
Depopulation of the territory is the goal.
They are ON PLAN.
Mossad is active in Iraq - and every Mosque bombing is attributable to them.
Muslims DO NOT blow up Mosques.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:29 pmComment by CT_V1, Dean of Dissent — July 4, 2007 @ 8:20 pm
Now point out to me where I praised ‘ace’ for his stunningly accurate links , Mrs Dean of Retard U , aka Regent University ?
BTW Mrs Dean of Retard U
Someone like Mr PretzelDunce using a completely partisan and discredited site to prove a point based upon right wing opinion , only further reveals that the twerp has no legitimate argument , nor any tangible facts to present.
You may want to comprehend what is fact , and what is made up out of whole-cloth , before you stupidly (as usual) post incredibly ludicrous and trite crap ………..Then again , it being you , probably not.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:30 pmComment by JG
It’s a propaganda trash site, you ought to know that in advance.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:30 pmFunky p:
I appreciate your thoughtful comment.
You and I are on the same page…merely seeking the truth.
Clearly the two party system is not the solution, so being “political” serves no useful purpose.
Just the truth, baby, just the truth:
http://plungerspeaks.blogspot.com
July 4th, 2007 at 8:32 pmantiwar is a great site.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:33 pmComment by JG
It’s a propaganda trash site, you ought to know that in advance.
Comment by CT_V1, Dean of Dissent — July 4, 2007 @ 8:30 pm
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I can see how much regard you hold for your own advice to someone else , you unfunny clown………
July 4th, 2007 at 8:35 pmIt’s a propaganda trash site, you ought to know that in advance.
You mean”The Weekly Standard”? I already knew that, but thanks. :-)
July 4th, 2007 at 8:36 pmDid he say something?
July 4th, 2007 at 8:37 pmIncompetence and chaos is by design. Under cover of all this massive looting can take place. Like a pipeline directly from Iraq to our “friends” in Kuwait. Like $9 billion in CASH…oops, seems to have gone missing. While the factions fight it out, some one is pumping several million barrels (we don’t know exactly…in all the excitement we seemed to have forgotten to put meters on the wells) of oil EVERY DAY. Multiply that by $70 dollars a barrel; that’s a good piece of change.
If they had order in Iraq we would never be able to steal so much. Why do you think we guarded the oil Ministry and infrastructure, but left bomb making materials un-guarded.
Comment by MCMetal
Ahem.
More Talking-points.
More baseless attacks.
More Islamo-Stalinism.
More MCMotorMouth.
If you feel the need to question Mr. President, you should also direct similar Islamo-Stalinist ™ remarks to ‘ace.’
July 4th, 2007 at 8:38 pmThis country’s resources is being used like a personal account by the Bush crime family. From Daddy Bush on, the laws and best interests of this nation have been subverted by their greed for wealth and power.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:48 pmI know, it really started with Prescott and the Nazis, but thinking that much makes my head hurt.
Hey trolls; there’s still some choice land for sale in the war criminal sanctuary Bush is building in Paraguay. After you loyalists return from Iraq (where I am sure you are heading to back up your pro-Bush rhetoric)
you can join him there!
ace,
Do you think the proprietor of that blog would mind if I put a link to it on mine? You can see where it sould go.
And great posts, by the way. Thanks for gathering all the information about what was, for some of us, an incredibly strange set of circumstances, coincidences, and incompetence to have brought about such destruction. Had to be more to it.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:50 pmComment by MCMetal
I know I can I can expect “unbiased or impartial” discourse from a tie-dye metal head.
Hippies are meant to be wrestled and not heard.
Typical Islamo-Stalinist talking-points. Today’s guest, McMetalHead
July 4th, 2007 at 8:55 pmComment by MCMetal — July 4, 2007 @ 8:48 pm
I already told you to either prove the facts in my posts to be wrong or shut up.
You know one of these days you should think about taking your ear-plugs out and your blind-fold off so that you can see and hear the TRUTH about the Islamo-Lovers on the Left.
But no.
You would rather say “LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA!!! I CAN’T HEAR YOU SO I DON’T HAVE TO DEAL WITH REALITY!!!!!”
You are a typical dillusional Lefty.
July 4th, 2007 at 8:56 pmJG, you are right, I forgot about the missing Pentagon money.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:06 pmIt takes a lot of scratch to fund a “catalyzing event, like Pearl Harbor”
Looks like troll hour. The insults are back. Thanks for the info. people.
Mr. President, I am just curious. If you are so offended and outraged by Progressive views, then why is it that you put yourself through the aggrevation of posting on a Progressive blog? What did you think you would find here? Seems like a waste of energy and an early heart attack to me.. ;-)
Do you honestly think the Right wing is the only arbiter of all truth? (Actually far-Right, because I have great conversations all the time with Conservative friends who don’t share all my viewpoints or perceptions).
How unreasonable is that? And why is it that even those with opposing viewpoints cannot find the truth somewhere in between and discuss it rationally?
Just asking.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:06 pmComment by MCMetal
I know I can I can expect “unbiased or impartial†discourse from a tie-dye metal head.
Hippies are meant to be wrestled and not heard.
Typical Islamo-Stalinist talking-points. Today’s guest, McMetalHead
Comment by CT_V1, Dean of Dissent — July 4, 2007 @ 8:55 pm
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
How many “metal heads” wear tie-dye , you huge ignoramus ?
Holy shit , how old are you , and in what aboriginal backwater do you live ?
You can’t even correctly identify a music form , and the people involved in it ; you believe you’re capable of judging impartiality or unbiased behavior ?
Zip it , child ; you know absolutely nothing and are just embarrassing yourself with every post …………
July 4th, 2007 at 9:08 pmYou are a typical dillusional Lefty.
Comment by Mr. President — July 4, 2007 @ 8:56 pm
And you’re nothing more than a moronic and ignorant Chimpy leg humping stooge.
Check above , chump …. Your whole argument has gone the way of the dodo (and , no ; not the Shrub “dodo”) ; the bird one.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:09 pmWell, I would like to personally thank the likes of Mr. President, CT Whatever he calls himself, Jessie Saxton, m12, and all the other Good Americans for braving the wilds of ThinkProgress to bring the nourishing truth of the conservative revolution to these godless liberals.
You good folks have swallowed the crap that I and my sycophantic followers spent years concocting in order to further our own “rich guy’s” agenda, and now you’re “takin’ it to the streets” as that old druggie band used to sing. Well done. I’m proud of you. Nancy is proud of you. My protoge, the very Reaganesque George W. Bush is proud of you, too. Proud of you for staying faithful to the Cause even after it’s been shown to be a disaster. I’ll tell ya, i sure wouldn’t stick with a lost cause this long. I’d a been in that lifeboat the second my deck shoes got a little damp.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:14 pmComment by JG — July 4, 2007 @ 9:06 pm
I am not “offended and outraged by Progressive views.” In fact, I am Metaprogressive ™.
I didn’t quite know, to be honest, I followed a link one day and found this place.
No, I don’t “honestly think the Right wing is the only arbiter of all truth.”
It is not unreasonable.
I think that they can.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:15 pmWayne:
Go ahead and put the link on your site. The more truth, the better.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:15 pmWayne:
Yeah, go ahead and put my links on your site too. The more truth, the better.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:17 pmMetaprogressive
Did you make that up?
July 4th, 2007 at 9:18 pmComment by funky p — July 4, 2007 @ 8:29 pm
Very well said sir. Pretty much how we all feel about Ace’s contributions and the distaste we feel for the two disruptive trolls Mr. P and CT.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:22 pmMetaprogressive
Did you make that up?
Comment by JG — July 4, 2007 @ 9:18 pm
Of course he did. That’s one of the tricks of the Conservative Way — make up words and imply a meaning, either good or evil, that suits your purposes. Doesn’t matter if it’s not a real word. The only thing that matters is that it is perceived to be a real word, and one that can score you points against the bad guys.
I shouldn’t be telling you guys all these secrets, but what the hey, I’m dead now and if the very Reaganesque George W. Bush goes down in flames, it can only make my questionable legacy look better, right?
Well, happy trails, all.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:25 pmI am not “offended and outraged by Progressive views.†In fact, I am Metaprogressive ™.
I didn’t quite know, to be honest, I followed a link one day and found this place.
No, I don’t “honestly think the Right wing is the only arbiter of all truth.â€
It is not unreasonable.
I think that they can.
Comment by Mr. President
Spew, spew, spew and then, as usual, you turn into a back pedaling liar. You and your butt buddy CT/Dean of Idiots. Found the site, bullcrap, nobody would be here all day every day if they weren’t getting paid. Unless they are totally mental, that’s the only other option.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:29 pmWayne:
Go ahead and put the link on your site. The more truth, the better.
Comment by ace — July 4, 2007 @ 9:15 pm
Thank you, ace.
Mr. President, don’t be silly. ;)
July 4th, 2007 at 9:29 pmI am not “offended and outraged by Progressive views.†In fact, I am Metaprogressive ™.
Comment by Mr. President
And metaprogressive is a word you made up that means nothing. Google it and the only thing that comes up are your stupid posts.
You are truly pathetic.
July 4th, 2007 at 9:33 pmCrap, shane, give the prez a break. He meant to say MeatProgressive.
July 4th, 2007 at 10:08 pmRepublican hacks who orchestrated this unnecessary war have no credibility left with a majority of the American people. They have no credibility left because they were wrong on so many counts. We never should have gone into Iraq. This policy has been a disaster from the beginning. Libby has no credibility left, as a convicted felon he should have served out his full 30 month sentence. There is plenty of shame to go around. Wolfowitz had to resign from the World Bank in disgrace for his corrupt practices. Bush only commuted Libby’s prison sentence to protect his own interests.
July 4th, 2007 at 10:24 pmCrap, shane, give the prez a break. He meant to say MeatProgressive.
Comment by RUCerious
Maybe MeatlessProgressive. Or NoMeatProgessive. MeatheadProgressive? All of the above?
July 4th, 2007 at 10:29 pmWell, nothing’s changed except their financial status. They with their children/grandchildren are all still chickenhawks who fully expect that the poor peasants will fight their wars for them. It’s a pity we can’t look at how much each of them has made out in speeches/war profiteering/buying stocks in defense industries etc. etc. and then confiscate all those ill-gotten gains.
July 4th, 2007 at 11:36 pmScooter Fibby can be commuted but his crime stands, and Evil Dick Insaney remains on the DarkSide, if you will.
July 5th, 2007 at 8:42 amComment by MCMetal
That’s right, you’re one of those uncommon hippies. Metal head, tie-dye. I take it I’m supposed to take pointers from an Islamo-Stalinist?
Knock it off with the pointers, buddy. You’re not fooling anyone.
You still haven’t proven Mr. President’s information to be false, by the way. I suggest you get to it.
July 5th, 2007 at 9:24 amComment by shane
Ahem.
STFU. Heed that simple advice.
Double shot of Jack, on the rocks.
July 5th, 2007 at 9:27 amNever, under any circumstances, send your kids or grandkids to Georgetown University………………
July 5th, 2007 at 9:40 amThese so called “planners” could NOT plan their way out of a kitty litter box, literally.
This war AND Occupation of both Iraq and the wh is an abortion of many messes.
If you reside in a red state call your congressmen up and demand, a new, progressive future.
ELK
July 5th, 2007 at 11:34 amElliott Abrams.
I remember seeing his name show up in the context of the State Departments “Project for a Future Iraq”, which was supposed to have been putting together, admittedly under uncertainty, the plans needed on the ground.
The people who didn’t suborn that project are derelict.
Here is one source for what happened, but I haven’t read too many others (they report Tom Warrick as having been in charge, with Abrams as just a leader of one of the working groups):
Cooperative Research dot org (I”m not associated with them).
quote, outlining Rumsfeld & Co’s (?) power grab form the State Department:
And here is a rich exchange on Abrams:
Ari Fleischer responds to a question about Elliott Abrams (December 5, 2002)
Q Ari, in yesterday’s briefing, you called Elliott Abrams a warrior for democracy. Shouldn’t a warrior for democracy show more respect for the elected representatives of the people, namely the American Congress?
MR. FLEISCHER: I said everything that the President believes on that topic, and I don’t have anything additional or different to add to it today.
Q He pleaded guilty, as you know, to two misdemeanor counts for essentially lying to Congress in the ’80s about Iran-Contra. Is that consummate with being a warrior for democracy in your view and the President’s view?
MR. FLEISCHER: I think there is no question that, as a result of Elliott Abrams’ efforts and the efforts of others as well, democracy has spread throughout Central and Latin America and he enjoys the tremendous faith and confidence of the President.
http://home.earthlink.net/ ~platter/ neo-conservatism/ elliot-abrams.html
July 5th, 2007 at 2:46 pmace,
Answer the questions:
What is the real story behind the Gore III drug bust cover up?
Why does TP cover Paris Hilton but not Al Goracle’s son being busted with drugs?
What are you hiding a.c.e.???
Comment by Mr. President — July 4, 2007 @ 7:10 pm
Because they got an overwhelmingly negative response from covering Paris Hilton and Gore III is basically Paris in drag?
July 5th, 2007 at 2:59 pmDamn….I just got done with breakfast…’scuse me whilst I go puke!!!
July 6th, 2007 at 8:09 amgreat page I will link to often
if you guys could do one favor?
please address which of these “architechs” were members of the pnac at any time
that would be the cherry on top
July 6th, 2007 at 8:13 amhey guys, I just went to revisit your page on what happened to the “architechs” of this war
great page I will link to often
if you guys could do one favor?
please address which of these “architechs” were members of the pnac at any time
that would be the cherry on top
July 6th, 2007 at 8:14 amWhat if we look at this mess from a different perspective? What if these people aren’t really as stupid and incompetent as they appear? What if the Bush administration held the stay the course position in the face of all evidence that it was failing because it was actually succeeding, at least from the perspective of what they were actually trying to accomplish? If we look at what’s actually happening, and what the administration is actually doing ignoring all the sound bites and rhetoric, we might get a very different picture.
Behavior would seem to indicate that the Bush administration actually wanted to destabilize the middle east. Everything they have done seems to have intentionally lead to increased violence, civil war, more instability between Israel and Palestine, etc. What could they have been trying to accomplish with this? Who would benefit from such instability and escalation of hostilities? If we are intellectually honest, we’d have to say its us. Our way of life depends on cheap oil, and least we forget, there’s a lot of oil under Iraq. What if the plan was to make things so bad in the middle east that Israel would step in and clean up the mess for us in order to protect themselves. Then we step in and take the spoils?
We have to stop letting these guys dictate the discussion. They have us arguing about meaningless soundbites they sling out like feed to the wolves. This is likely designed to distract us from what they are really doing. The best way to deal with people who play loose with the truth is to ignore what they say and focus on the truth apparent in what they do.
July 6th, 2007 at 8:59 amThanks - TP - for providing this update on “where have they all gone?”. It’s clear that the majority of them have already been flushed down the toilet….with Dumb and Dumber on their way down with them!
July 6th, 2007 at 9:03 amChanging the discussion? When it comes to criminal behavior, there IS NO discussion - end of discussion! When this Congress began discussing introducing new immigration laws, they allowed the change in discussion. When we negotiate with traitors and terrorists, we allow them to change OUR discussion.
Our discussion IS, HAS BEEN, and ALWAYS WILL BE the dictates of our Constitution and Bill of Rights….along with the other federal laws we enact.
Do not allow these shapeshifters to change OUR discussion. We have laws in place, despite any illegal “signing statements” to the contrary.
Soon Bush’s signing statements will be declared illegal and a clear “obstruction of justice” by their mere use.
This is precisely what James Madison was imagining (nightmare) when he made it clear that when a president attempts to absolve his own crimes, he is even more culpable than the actual crimes themselves…..it’s the crime and then the attempt of obstruction of justice.
After all, this is what Nixon was impeached for….let’s get on with the business at hand. It’s all distilling down to one demand of this congress:
IMPEACH
July 6th, 2007 at 9:07 amIMPEACH
IMPEACH
IMPEACH
As an aside and covered by most other blogs this morning: Palfrey (*DC Madam) has released her records and contrary to what ABC news reported about the list (Brian Ross had only a “partial list” and of course, he failed to mention that one material fact). Now the entire list is out and soon will be up for everyone to see. There’s rumor that DeadEye Dick is on the list. Wonder what his little Swiss Miss (Pamela Williford) will think of that??
July 6th, 2007 at 9:08 amAlso, since we’re on the Cheney end of things (butt end??) my research has shown a little-known material fact in all of this. Of course, now the members of PNAC have been outed along with their Federalist Society buddies….as being responsible from 911 to where we are right now (cesspool)….but Lynne Cheney has somehow managed to run under the radar and IS a card-carrying brainwashed “Straussian” as well. (Google Leo Strauss to see how un-imaginative Karl Rove actually is….Rove is just a plagiarist - Leo Strauss was the “real deal”….just ask William Kristol whose grandpappy brought Strauss, Fascist Godfather of the Neocons, and his philosophy into the mainstream. Allan Bloom who was Strauss’s personal protege was responsible for 150 PhD’s during his tenure at University of Chicago. It’s safe to say that these individuals have infiltrated our democracy now and may be hiding in places heretofore unknown. One of our illustrious judges is a Straussian and Paul Wolfowitz is the Jefe of the Straussian group.
July 6th, 2007 at 9:13 amRemember the newscaster on CNN named Darryn Kagan? Well, she mysteriously vanished from the radar once her husband was outed as a member of PNAC. Interesting!
July 6th, 2007 at 9:13 amIrving Kristol is noted as the initiator of the Straussian Guide to Fascism (William Kristol’s grandfather). I shudder to think what these twisted minds actually believe, don’t you?
July 6th, 2007 at 9:15 amStrauss’s approach:
The hallmark of Strauss’ approach to philosophy was his hatred of the modern world, his belief in a totalitarian system, run by “philosophers”, who rejected all universal principles of natural law, but saw their mission as ‘absolute rulers’, who lied and deceived a foolish “populist” mass, and used both religion and politics as a means of disseminating myths that kept the general population in clueless servitude.
For Strauss and all of his proteges (His 100-150 PhD students (Straussians) now dominate most university political science and philosophy departments), the greatest object of hatred was the United States itself, which they view as nothing better than a weak, pathetic replay of “liberal democratic” Weimar Germany.
Among the current lot of neo-cons, Michael Ledeen stands out as THE ONE person who openly flaunts his “universal fascism”. For Wolfowitz, Kristol, and the rest, their association with Strauss could be a contributing factor in their looming downfall - and none too soon.
July 6th, 2007 at 9:19 amHmmmmmm. One of these things is not like the other, one of these things just doesn’t belong…….! The photos that accompany this report look like a rouges gallery of rich white guys that all only stood to get richer off the blood of the masses …….except one : Condi ! .. Condi, Condi Condi i cant let you go ..all my life a worship you i love you soo oh oh ho Condi Condi Condi life is crazy-eeeeeeeee…
July 6th, 2007 at 9:28 amsad! your looking at the architects of the downfall…..and its a long way down
Key Nuremberg Tribunal Indictments and Verdicts
Remember that the first two counts of the indictments and ultimate guilty verdicts against the defendants at the Nuremberg trials in 1946-47 were:
(1) Conspiracy to Wage Aggressive War
(2) Crimes Against Peace, including the launching of an aggressive war
July 6th, 2007 at 11:40 amIf we are able to empty out GITMO, we need to preserve it to hold this growing group of war criminals.
July 6th, 2007 at 12:03 pmBeautiful job! Will forward it far and wide.
Considering that the true objective of the invasion was never anything OTHER than the desire to dominate oil DISTRIBUTION (not PRODUCTION) — before China and Russia could get in there ahead of them — I think this rogues gallery did an excellent job of obfuscating their true aim.
July 7th, 2007 at 1:59 amOther then geting my sick to my stomach it was enlightening and comprhensive
July 7th, 2007 at 3:28 pmit’s to bad stupid isn’t a crime
July 7th, 2007 at 5:01 pmWatch for Mr. Bush to issue blanket pardons to all these key players in his very last days in office, including Mr. Libby, of course. He’ll provide every one of his major supporters a Get out of Jail Free card to immunize them from culpability in anything that the next administration would consider actionable.
The President’s party will have a very long time to recover from the excesses of Mr. Bush’s administration.
We can mention the thousands of injured military service men and women who will bear the scars of Mr. Bush’s War until they die. We can add the huge cost of their life-long medical treatment to the overall cost of this war, and the long term effects of those costs will dwarf the war-time costs.
July 8th, 2007 at 11:03 amGood list ans summary of details, but let’s not stop at the top dogs, lets keep the list going. I’ll start..
1. John Yoo. Wrote justification for torture. Now teaching law at Berkeley.
July 8th, 2007 at 9:13 pmDr. Strangelove is running the country.
July 12th, 2007 at 10:57 pmwhen these people are run out of town,jailed or disgraced–that will be MISSION ACCOMPISHED
July 13th, 2007 at 12:41 pmMaybe someone out there can help me out with this - maybe I am just a little dense and don’t understand the obvious. I am a conservative, I thought maybe if perhaps one of you liberals folks (not the abusive type, thank you) could give me a serious answer, I could give it some serious thought. (If all you are going to do is answer with the intelligence of a fourth grader and say that I’m a ____, I’m not much interested in listening, so please - serious responses only).
Some preliminaries:
1) - I support our President. I don’t think he is dumb. It was necessary to fight in Iraq, and necessary to our national security to kill Saddam and his cronies. I voted for him twice, I do not regret my choice.
2) - I think that cut-and-run is stupid, and an obvious method of bringing the war to American soil.
3) - I think that the current Democratic leaders have not provided a consistent or well-reasoned strategy for an American withdrawal, and are appealing to emotion and “Bush-bashing” rather than to leadership.
4) - I think that we should certainly “win” in Iraq. I think that the comments by Nevada Senator Reid about us having already lost have all the essential ingredients of treason. Treason in time of war is punishable by death. He should be tried, and if convicted, he should be executed. I defend his right to free speech, but not to treason.
Now you know my current stance, you should also know that I am not a blind follower of the President, either. My question: When the President says we need to “win” the war, what exactly does “win” mean?
“Win” - when you are talking about a war - has to be a military objective, and the only thing that I have heard from the current administration with reference to “winning” is somehow creating a stable democratic form of government in Iraq. That is a political objective - or possibly a moral objective. Since it cannot be accomplished by military force, it cannot be the military objective. What is the military objective that we could accomplish with our fighting men and women that would define “win”?
Here is what I think. I would like to see us “win”, and then come home. Let’s cut the head off the serpent, and go home. Granted, we will eventually have to cut it off again, but there is no sense in trying to make Iraq, Iran, or any of the insane Muslim crusader governments anything but a serpent. (Christians had their insane period too. It resulted in America - land of religious freedom.) We know that the deeper and more deadly the cut, the longer it will be before we have to cut it again. If we cut deeply and fiercely enough, we will not have to cut again for a long time, perhaps for another generation.
We cannot occupy a nation to give it time to become free, freedom is a tree that begins growing in bloody, violent soil, and cannot germinate in peaceful soil. It did not do so here, it will not do so there. It only germinates when the people of a nation want freedom more than they want life, and are not afraid to loose their lives to gain their freedom.
This nonsense about “winning” being tied to the development of an Iraqi government friendly to the US is just that - nonsense. All it does is give greedy men the opportunity to plunder us while they tell us lies about how they want a “peaceful government”. We win when the bad guys are dead, not when the good guys are in power. Kill the bad guys, kill them without mercy, without reserve, and without any doubt in anyone’s mind as to what we are doing, then come home. When you bloody the bully’s nose bad enough, he will leave you alone.
In remaining there this long attempting to accomplish something that cannot be accomplished with guns and missiles, we have given the “nice” people too much time to kiss the bully’s boo-boos, and encouraged our enemies to begin bullying again. Being nice is fatal when dealing with an extremist. I say hit them again - hard, fast, and continuously, and when they are unconscious, let’s go home. The United States should not be “nice” like a doormat. We should be kind, and generous (and we are) - and as dangerous as a bullet fired from the end of a machine gun (and we can be).
We can be kind - distributing humanitarian aid to civilians that are the victims of brutal regime - but only at the point of a gun, so that any military force that comes within miles of the civilian populace is immediately and mercilessly decapitated. If you just mail sacks of flour, the regime will starve the populace and sell your flour for more bullets to shoot at you.
If the Iraqi people want a free society, let them create it. We are a blueprint, so they don’t have to reinvent the wheel. Let’s stop pretending we can deliver the world’s cowards from themselves. We cannot. We can only keep the land of the brave free, not the world. Freedom takes courage with honor, and it is in short supply in the natives over there. Let them prove me wrong.
July 20th, 2007 at 7:46 pmwhen will the madness stop? this president has violated so many laws, ignored the constitution; invoked executive privilege at a whim and still he’s allowed to carry on unimpeded. when he claimed executive privilege on the Pat Tillman case, that should have been the final straw. when one considered how much of our rights and liberties that have been taken away, they should have mobs storming 1600 Pennsylvania. wake up, once you allow one of your rights to be taken away, it could easily become a slippery slope to enslavement–remember Jose Padilla
July 24th, 2007 at 6:20 pmIt sounds like if you screw up you’ll be rewarded with a higher position in the Bush administration. Unfortunately the American people are fast asleep and aren’t paying any attention to their inept leader’s corruption and incompetence. George Bush is a disgrace and he should be brought up on criminal charges for starting the IRAQ war but of course that won’t happen because all the rest of the Washington politcos have skeletons in their closets, too. How did this happen? When will it end?
July 25th, 2007 at 1:13 amWhat about Netanyahu and all of his croonies from Israel who had ’secret confirmed reports of WMD’s, and Links to Osama and Iraq’ ?
Israel’s pro war fanatics are just as guilty… along with Tony Blair’s circle jerk of liars also.
July 29th, 2007 at 12:10 amI’m pretty open minded on most things, but I must ask why are most of the architects of the Iraq War pro-Israel Jewish neocons? This isn’t just my opinion, this is fact. Look at the list.
It now looks like a second string squad of similar neocons are pushing us to invade Iran? Sen Leibermann doesn’t go a day without mentioning the need for the hard line against Iran. CNN and Fox bring it up constantly. Americans need to take control of our country for America.
August 1st, 2007 at 10:58 pmI think they are desined to dominate.
August 9th, 2007 at 10:19 pmBush was not reelected. He was first appointed president and next time was elected after allowing his opponent to be slandered re his service in Vietnam. Bush didn’t serve in Vietnam and was even missing from the National Guard
August 13th, 2007 at 4:36 pmYou shits erased all my hard work, so do not expect me to re-do it!
August 18th, 2007 at 11:01 pmArgh! I’m sick of the anti-Semitic posts here.
August 23rd, 2007 at 7:59 pmThe drug addiction of Al Gore III is about as relevant to this topic as Jenna and Babs’ scoring of illegal drugs and alcohol (pre-21) in the first years of Dubya’s reign.
I’m interested to note that of all the people mentioned in this article, only one (Colin Powell) has ever been under fire in a war. The rest should be rounded up, issued an M-16, and sent out on night patrol in Baghdad in an under-armored Humvee.
August 27th, 2007 at 1:48 am#133:
1) - I support our President. I don’t think he is dumb. It was necessary to fight in Iraq, and necessary to our national security to kill Saddam and his cronies. I voted for him twice, I do not regret my choice.
2) - I think that cut-and-run is stupid, and an obvious method of bringing the war to American soil.
Comment by Mark — July 20, 2007 @ 7:46 pm
Mark if you feel that way, your local recuiter can’t wait to meet you.
August 27th, 2007 at 1:50 am#133:
Here is what I think. I would like to see us “winâ€, and then come home. Let’s cut the head off the serpent, and go home.
Okay, Mark, what is your suggestion for “cut[ting] off the head of the serpent”? Kill them all and let God sort them out? Ask Hitler–that policy didn’t work out too well for him.
Good luck with your mission. Dubya and Dick, neither of whom had enough courage to be under fire themselves, will be happy to send a letter of condolence to your family. So long as your mother does not speak out against the war, in which case they will employ all their gutless chicken hawk water carriers to brand her a “kook” a la Cindy Sheehan.
Mark, the real reason we are in this war is not to free the Iraqis, or to eliminate non-existent WMDs. It’s to secure Iraq’s oil for the Major Multinationals. That’s why they are sooooo intent on keeping the US Army there. If we withdraw, 12% of the world’s reserves are up for grabs. At least with American GIs dying every day, there’s still a chance that the tide might be turned and Exxon might get control of their share of Iraq’s wealth. Same for Chevron, Conoco, BP, and Shell.
If this president meant what he said about Saddam’s bad acts, then we would have invaded Sudan years ago to stop the carnage in Dharfur. But since there is no oil there, we have no interest in that conflict.
This entire war has been a sham of lies. They tell you that they want to spread democracy through the middle east. Yet they had no plans for Day 1 after Baghdad fell. Why? They expected Chalabi to step in and be the new strongman, and to give the Multinationals their desired ends. In other words, they had no intention of giving Iraq a democracy; they merely wanted to change one dictator (who was opposed to the Multinationals) with another who was in favor of them.
Mark, wake up and smell the coffee. This president is in the pocket of the oil industry, and has been all along. Why do you think Shooter will not allow us to know who was in those Energy Task Force meetings, or what they discussed?
August 27th, 2007 at 2:03 amIt sounds like if you screw up you’ll be rewarded with a higher position in the Bush administration. Unfortunately the American people are fast asleep and aren’t paying any attention to their inept leader’s corruption and incompetence.
Comment by M. Thau — July 25, 2007 @ 1:13 am
No, the American people are too interested in Lindsay Lohan’s trevails and Paris Hilton’s boobs to care much about people dying in the streets of Iraq.
August 27th, 2007 at 2:07 amWhat causes an entire nation of people to become such unknowing morons as to blindly follow a government of morons, lead by the king of all morons, in to an abyss of irreconcilable human destruction and suffering…All in the name of Peace and Freedom????
August 29th, 2007 at 8:55 pmIt’s fascinating to see how the word, win, is thrown about as if it truly can be empirically defined. In truth, the war in Iraq, against Saddam and his army was won by the U.S. and U.K., at least as a strategic event. The society, which was never stable since Iraq was artifically set up as a country by imperialist forces, is chaotic. That was an inevitability once the strongman fell, particularly because he fostered so much enmity among the Shiites and the Kurds.
For the sake of unifying the country under the Baathists, enmity was invariable, which, after the Baathists lost power became a revengeful civil war. None of this has anaything to do with the U.S. or U.K. It has to do with Iarqis “losing” the war as they lose their country. Simply because Iraq isn’t performing as the U.S. would like doesn’t mean the war is lost, but rather that the naturally occurring chaos is unfolding so that unity is impossible.
With this in mind how could Humpty Dumpty be put together again (winning the war) without Iraqi society figuring out internally how to do it? And it’s not America’s role to figure that out.
August 31st, 2007 at 5:37 am