Lieberman: Bush’s ‘Ratings Among Historians Will Be Greater Than His Ratings In The Polls Today’
Lieberman: Bush’s ‘Ratings Among Historians Will Be Greater Than His Ratings In The Polls Today’
Yesterday in an interview with right-wing radio host Hugh Hewitt, Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) praised President Bush’s policies in Iraq and predicted that Bush will be remembered by historians as a great President:
HEWITT: Oh, that’s fascinating. Last question, how do you think history’s going to evaluate George W. Bush?
LIEBERMAN: Well, I personally believe look, mistakes were made, and I know the polls are down, but I think on the largest issue of our time, which is the rise of Islamist extremism, that he will be judged as a president who saw the threat, and in the midst of an unpopular war, he stuck with it. And so I think overall, over time, his ratings among the historians will be greater than his ratings in the polls today.
Lieberman’s comments echo those by Rush Limbaugh, who in May said, “Long after we’re all dead and gone, when historians who are not yet born begin to write about this era, they’re going to place George Bush in the upper echelon of presidents who had a great vision for America, who looked beyond our shores, who didn’t just restrict himself to domestic policy niceties.”
It’s interesting that now, with the war more unpopular than ever and violence skyrocketing, Lieberman decides Bush is a great president. In contrast, in May 2003, when Lieberman was competing for the Democratic nomination for president, he said the Bush administration “seems to have been unprepared for the quick victory it predicted.” Similarly, in Sept. 2003, Lieberman stated:
I am shocked at how unprepared the Bush administration was for what to do afterward. They’ve left a vacuum which the terrorists, the Saddam loyalists, our enemies, have jumped into.
Rush and Lieberman may not be aware, but historians are already debating Bush’s legacy. In fact, Rolling Stone recently wrote, “Many historians are now wondering whether Bush, in fact, will be remembered as the very worst president in all of American history.”
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404 Responses to “Lieberman: Bush’s ‘Ratings Among Historians Will Be Greater Than His Ratings In The Polls Today’”
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No, they won't. Historians will pull the covers off this corrupt administration and show just how close we are/have come to the dismantling of our form of government.
Joe is still very, very bitter.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:18 pmBush's ratings among anybody will be greater than his ratings in the polls today.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:19 pmawww, aren't they cute together??
July 13th, 2007 at 2:21 pmI love this argument.
How do you refute it? Let's go pluck some historians out of the future and see if Joe's right.
It's stupidity.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:22 pmWhen we have secured Iraq for American exploitation, then Bush and Cheney will be seen as heroes!
July 13th, 2007 at 2:22 pmIs Lieberman the new whore in the white house???????
July 13th, 2007 at 2:24 pmAnother thing Loserman is wrong about.
Hehehe. Bush is incompetent.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:24 pmThe only historians who are going to be writing anything positive about this failure are the ones who will be paid to research and write at the presidential library.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:25 pmJoe Lieberman shows that it is still possible to put country over party.
God Bless You Joe!
July 13th, 2007 at 2:26 pmand
God Bless America!
Caption contest:
"Here Mr. President, let me adjust the receiver under your jacket."
July 13th, 2007 at 2:26 pmJoe has got to be the stupidest person in the world. Sinful pride is all this is about
July 13th, 2007 at 2:26 pmWhat drugs is Joe doing and where can I get some? How is it possible that the Senator, who once was sensible and sound of judgement, has gone so completely around the bend? It is the destiniy of this adminstration to serve as an amazing warning to future administrations. Examine all their decisions, do the opposite and you can't go wrong.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:26 pmLIEberman filibustered the WEBB / HAGEL amendment
to support the troops...
.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:26 pmHe must mean in the Jewish history books.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:27 pmThere it is again: people seem to think that Bush's term started September 12, 2001. The fact is that he didn't see the threat until after the worst attack in US history. Give credit where credit is due.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:27 pmNow that was funny. You know, you could get a lot more attention if you focused on this kind of humor more. Sarcasm doesn't come across all that well in blogs, but straight up humor like this works very well to make others laugh.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:27 pmWOW. This guy is like a cartoon character...Why does he still hold such powerful positions in the Senate?
July 13th, 2007 at 2:27 pmThat must have been some kiss Lieberman got from Bush it's made him act like a love struck girl. As for history well yes most will be dead but as Americans have believe all these lies for 6 years they most likely will believe this to. Lieberman is sucking up for his retirement money that the White House has been stealing from the US Treasury. People will say anything for money look at some of the TV shows like O'Reilly, Tucker and Tweety. These idiots even sound like they don't have brains but their paid by the White House to do it. Tony Snow needs the medical insurance so that's his reason for lying. Tony would have to use HMO and that would kill him.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:28 pmand to think this guy was almost the VP???
It's official. We are now down to the stems and seeds.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:28 pmI love this argument.
How do you refute it? Let’s go pluck some historians out of the future and see if Joe’s right.
It’s stupidity.
Comment by Egreggious — July 13, 2007 @ 2:22 pm
Didn't stop #1 and #8 from going into the future to find their own historians.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:30 pmhis ratings among the historians will be greater than his ratings in the polls today.
Really? Let's go poll us some historians.
Rolling Stone recently wrote, “Many historians are now wondering whether Bush, in fact, will be remembered as the very worst president in all of American history.†----- My guess? he'll be right up at the top.
Ok, many isn't necessarily a majority, but you gotta wonder....
July 13th, 2007 at 2:30 pmMaureen Dowd:
"W. thinks history will be his alibi. When presidents have screwed up and want to console themselves, they think history will give them a second chance. It's the historical equivalent of a presidential pardon.
But there are other things — morality, strategy and security — that are more pressing than history. History is just the fanciest way possible of wanting to deny or distract attention from what's happening now."
July 13th, 2007 at 2:30 pmLoserman is the new waterboy for the conservative right. This is his yoke for the support during the last election to keep his senatorial seat. He and Zell Miller should hit the road together, the turncoat democrats could have a vaudeville act. Of course Joe supports the war in Iraq, now his precious Isreal will have a partner in the middle east to watch their backside for the next 50 years.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:30 pmThis is the same reason Reagan needs a paid foundation, "The Reagan Legacy Foundation" to try to make him look good.
Hahahaha!!
July 13th, 2007 at 2:31 pmLieberman has Bush Derangement Syndrome.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:32 pmheadline sequel:
July 13th, 2007 at 2:33 pm"Bush's Ratings Among Apologists Will Be Even Greater Than Among Historians"
More accurately, Lieberman too will be acknowledged by future historians as a base villain and a traitor, a disgrace to this nation and an pathetic, cruel joke on the world.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:33 pmLIEberman was re-elected in Connecticut based on lies he told. He was not this rabid Bush poodle when he was running for re-election. He questioned the war and Bush's execution of the war. But he was lying. It's too bad that the people in Connecticut didn't believe their lying eyes when they saw LIEberman kiss Bush. That should have told them something!
July 13th, 2007 at 2:33 pmYou know what, Joe's right. There's chance that GWB's approval among historians could skyrocket up to 30% when all is said and done.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:33 pmLieberman for Defense Secretary!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What were you thinking, Mr. President?
July 13th, 2007 at 2:36 pmWhy would you choose some flunky college president to head the freakin Pentagon?
WORST PRESIDENT EVER!!
July 13th, 2007 at 2:39 pm"...he will be judged as a president who saw the threat..."
When exactly did he see this threat? When the previous administration told him all about it? Oh no. He didn't see it until 9/11. He must've read about it in My Pet Goat.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:39 pmAnd Lieberman will be remembered by historians as an Israeli stooge.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:40 pm#32: Funny! He saw the threat when the planes hit the World Trade Center.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:41 pmas for Lieberman, he is so insignificant himself that historians will not even bother to comment about him.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:42 pm"And so I think overall, over time, his ratings among the historians will be greater than his ratings in the polls today."
Yeah, right, LIEbermann -- a greater failure than you can imagine.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:43 pmLieberman is right about Bush.
Brave guy Lieberman....The last sane Democrat.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:43 pmHilarious. Makes you wonder what these two get up to behind closed doors.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:44 pmI love this argument, since it's the same one I heard over and over and over growing up in a red state in the 70s. It almost became a mantra as the whole ugly mess of Watergate was slowly exposed:
"History will look back at Richard Nixon as one of America's greatest presidents"
Hey, I thought, they're the adults- maybe they see something I'm missing. Now I recognize it as the last refuge of delusion to avoid the uncomfortable mental dissonance of knowing you voted for the guy who turned everything to shit.
I dunno- maybe the next 35 years will be kinder to Tricky than the first 35 of post-Nixon "history", but I'm not holding my breath. And you know, I wouldn't hold my breath for Dubya's vindication either.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:44 pmLook - it is much speculated that the GOP has a lot of dirt on JOE. Meaning a lot of dirt on his wife and her (their)work with BIG PHARMA. So MUCH So that it is speculated they in effect the GOP "controls" him from behind the scenes. So it is little wonder why he acts like he does and this is a likely explination. He is and will be a lapdog for this administration and future GOP efforts. This also explains the strange way they all helped (rescued) him last year to snatch a win from the DEMS last year in CT. Joe knows they got him by the balls and he is more than willing to be a Puppet and BushCO his Master.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:44 pmAnd Lieberman will be remembered by historians as an Israeli stooge.
Comment by anna
-------------------------------------------------------------
Why don't you just call him an evil hook-nosed Jew?....It's what you're thinking afterall.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:45 pmLIEberman will be in the news very soon after dying from an acute koolaide overdose.
Where in the heck are these necons getting these drugs that are this strong?
July 13th, 2007 at 2:45 pmWhy don’t you just call him an evil hook-nosed Jew?….It’s what you’re thinking afterall.
Comment by Ringo the Gringo
we leave racist comments to you neocon clowns
July 13th, 2007 at 2:46 pmWhen's Joe going to get back to his moral high ground and call for Vitter's resignation?
July 13th, 2007 at 2:46 pmhttp://hnn.us/articles/5019.html
These historians don't agree with Joey.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:47 pmCaption Contest:
July 13th, 2007 at 2:48 pm"It was good for me, was it good for you?"
Lieberman is irrelevent by this point in time. I'm sure he makes these idiotic remarks just to get some press.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:48 pmDumbya's "legacy" was CRAP when he left Texas, and it's only gotten worse since arriving in DC.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:49 pmAs we're fond of saying here in the Lone Star state : "Try as you might, you can't polish a turd."
I love how the few Bush supporters left look to the unborn for vindication. First off, historians aren't going to vindicate you. Secondly, even if they did (which again, they won't), why would that matter? People who haven't been born yet are probably going to have a less informed opinion of you than we do right now. Well, until the presidential records becoem public about how you politicized (ie messed up) every department and regulatory aspect of the government (which is yet another reason why you won't be vindicated by historians, and instead, probably will look worse than you do now).
Also (and I know you really really want to believe that historians will vindicate you because otherwise, you have to admit, you're one gigantic failure), your abilities to predict things aren't that great. WMD in Iraq, greeted as liberators, last throghs of the insurgency. Hell, you can't even predict things that have already happened (Lugar breaking with you, no Iraq - 9/11 link, weapons inspectors being allowed into Iraq before you invaded, etc). So, trust me, a guy who didn't think WMD existed in any significant quantity in Iraq, when I say historians will not vindicate you.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:50 pmGood point - someone should dig up some of Lieberman's comments about Clinton's consensual sex and ask him what he plans to say about Vitter.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:50 pmMy lord. What has happened to this man?
Methinks somewhere in the past couple years, the real Joe Lieberman was disappeared, and some GOP programmed robot, or impersonator, or lizard alien, or I- don't- know- what has taken his place.
The man has completely lost it! By "it", of course I mean integrity, intelligence, honor, conscience, etc...
July 13th, 2007 at 2:50 pmNotice how Ringo the Gringo's copy and paste style is exactly like Mr. President.
I'm just reporting, you decide.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:50 pm#48 - We all know you can't polish a turd, but GW doesn't. It explains why everything he touches smells like sh*t.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:51 pmLieberman/Vitter 2008!
July 13th, 2007 at 2:51 pm> Brave guy Lieberman….The last sane Democrat.
You are now entering ... The Twilight Zone!
July 13th, 2007 at 2:52 pmThat would be The TwiRight Zone.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:53 pmLieberman has to make statements like this, because the alternative is to admit that everything Joe has said about Iraq has been a big steaming pile of lies. In order to concede that the current residents of the White House are incompetent ideologues, incapable of accomplishing the simplest tasks (beyond subverting democracy), he'd have to admit the same flaws himself.
This is Lieberman's way of saying, "I'm right and Bush is right because he agrees with me." In other words, he's modestly telling us that history will judge him to be the greatest senator ever. And, who knows, maybe the baboon still thinks he can end up in the White House himself.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:54 pmNotice how Ringo the Gringo’s copy and paste style is exactly like Mr. President.
I’m just reporting, you decide.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 13, 2007 @ 2:50 pm
It's in the RNC Stylebook. Doesn't necessarily mea they're one and the same.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:54 pmYou gonna slipstream your way to glory behind the worst president this republic will ever have, Joe?
July 13th, 2007 at 2:55 pmRingo the Gringo (aka Ringo)/Flaco/Mr. President/PIP are all the same person posting under different names. With no registration, the screen name is banned and the troll just changes it's name.
Rinse, repeat.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:55 pmMe thinks Droopy Dog is vyeing for Head Librarian of King George II's library.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:56 pm"I am shocked at how unprepared the Bush administration was for what to do afterward. "
July 13th, 2007 at 2:56 pmBush was accustomed to Harriet Myers and daddy fixing DUI's and mooning State Troopers.
Why not a War?
I would'nt say he is the worst in history(he did not own a slave) I will
July 13th, 2007 at 2:56 pmsay after the first 15 he is the worst.
It’s in the RNC Stylebook. Doesn’t necessarily mea they’re one and the same.
Comment by Egreggious — July 13, 2007 @ 2:54 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
True. So is this:
July 13th, 2007 at 2:58 pmhEyOOOOOOOOOooooooOOOOOOOOoooooOOOOOOoooOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Why are Joe and Rush just trying to please people in the future? They didn't have to LIVE through Bush's presidency. Shouldn't they be focused on pleasing the people here now?
Is it more important that historians (who are usually wealthy, or at least middle class) be happy, rather than:
The Iraqis today
Katrina victims
Our children, and even grand children
The victims of 9/1
The 3,000+ dead US soldiers
The African Americans across the country who were turned away from voting
The mentally handicapped who were executed and their families under Gov. Bush
German Chancellor Angela Merkel
... the list can go on, but I'm too busy today to keep typing. You fill out the rest!
July 13th, 2007 at 2:59 pm".....and I don't care how many young men and women have to die...as long as my beloved Israel is secure. It's the honorable thing to do."
July 13th, 2007 at 2:59 pmI would’nt say he is the worst in history(he did not own a slave) I will say after the first 15 he is the worst.
Comment by Lano — July 13, 2007 @ 2:56 pm
Of course, this criteria doesn't disqualify Cheney from being the worst VP in history.
July 13th, 2007 at 2:59 pmThis is like reverse reincarnation - your past life can't be remembered, and won't help you in this one. In this case, the future can't be predicted, and it won't help you now.
Maybe Lieberman can run for VP in 2060.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:00 pmThere was an excellent article in this months vanity fair, on why bush is not Truman. It also lays out the history aspect, that the white house is pushing, and how silly it is.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:02 pmnot saying much when his approval ratings are at 26% -- you only need three right wing loonies to give him a pass and technically the liebermeister is right. though i don't think that's what he meant.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:02 pmBushes ratings will be higher..
See now he's only rated for killing about 700,000 from Iraq, he's really going for about 22 million.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:02 pmSpudge,
I am both Ringo and Ringo the Gringo (moonbat photographer)....I take no credit for the others.
Here's some of my pictures:
http://flickr.com/photos/83951787@N00/sets/72157600008146856/show/
http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/pictures/LAProtest092405/?imgIndex=36&autoShow=6
http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/pictures/20060318HollywoodProtest/
July 13th, 2007 at 3:03 pmIt is mutiny time!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:03 pmThe Joker,
Did you say you were an isolationist?
If so, why don't you think that the US should take an aggressive military position to wipe out Islamo-Stalinism?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:03 pmComment by Spudge_Boy — July 13, 2007 @ 2:55 pm
suspected as much. Whatever happened to the trolls that had substance.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:04 pmBush = Great Failure architect of a failed war no matter what poodle-head Lieberman says America will hold him accountable for this colossal blunder "war on terror" 9/11 it all points to Bush the real terrorist to our civil rights and our Constitution
July 13th, 2007 at 3:06 pmwhen Nutmeggers turn LIEberman out in 2012 for constantly waxing his nose in bush's arse, it ought to be just in time for him to accept a position in the Chimperor's library as custodian.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:07 pm.
Not so much. Read David Hallberstrom's last article before his death in Vanity Fair.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:08 pmI thing it should be renamed Think Islamic!
Comment by The Joker —
--------------------------------------------
Aloha,
I prefer ThinkDefeat.org is even better.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:08 pmGod bless Joseph Lieberman for his long term vision and putting country over party.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:09 pmOh, he would own slaves if he could and he is trying to bring about modern servitude right this very minute.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:09 pmHello TP Friends! This is long but well worth the read if you have the time.
Peace to everyone!
http://smirkingchimp.com/thread/8686
July 13th, 2007 at 3:09 pm"It would involve a Military Coup and the forming of Death Squads.
You would have to liquidate Leftist orgainzations and then you can after the Muslims in America."
Where do all the crazies come from?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:09 pmBig deal, the Christians boycotted The Last Temptation of Christ and would have rather had it banned.
Project much?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:10 pmYeah, you guys don't march in lock step and you're original thinkers too.
/sarcasm = off
July 13th, 2007 at 3:12 pmWhy do you Leftists support Muslims!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:08 pm
What an inane thing to say. Islam is a religion. Not all Muslims are terrorists. The huge majority of them are not, in fact.
You, Joker, are no better than those RADICAL muslims that advocate the destruction of the United States. From the perspective of someone in the Middle East, you are a terrorist - advocating the destruction of their entire culture.
Funny thing is, you will never understand that.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:12 pmEvery president should be viewed in a big picture/little picture context. Bush is a disaster anyway you look at it.
Big picture-wise, one overwhelming, major, major, major, major Bush mistake is the environment. Iraq is really a SHORT-TERM, small picture, problem. Even if it's a 50-year problem, that's a short-term problem, when compared to the ultimate destiny of this environmentally-fragile planet.
Sadly, I give the planet 500-years and that's it. That may be overly-generous. Every Bush enviromental oversight and every Bush environmental mistake just tips the scale incrementally.
There's no going back. You can't undo what you should have done. Ozone holes can't be repaired.
Eventually, there will be a mass exodus of people to the polar regions of this planet. There's going to be chaos. When many cities, in the mid lattitudes, have average daily summer highs of 150 to 175 degrees, by say 2300, life cannot sustain itself. Maybe Fairbanks, Alaska will have more moderate temperature of say 100 degrees, but that's still hot.
How historians rate Bush is a non-issue. Life on this planet will cease to exist in a relatively short period of time.
Thanks, George. Thanks a lot. GOOD JOB BROWNIE? Not one living BUSH on this planet will be green. Think BROWN, BROWN, BROWN, BROWN.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:13 pmBush, Rush and Joe COMBINED will be known as the some of the STUPID HUMANS ALIVE!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:13 pmJoe Lieberman will go down in history as the Washington politician that looked the most like Alfred E. Neuman.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:13 pmGreat argument. Had Hitler been successful, historians in the New Germany would have said he too was great.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:13 pmHaving a 'debate' with The Joker is like me explaining the theory of relativity to a chipmunk: I present my argument backed by facts and all I get back is senseless chittering.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:17 pmWRONG!
I think Muslims are just as fu*king nuts as you whackos.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:17 pmI just looked at Ringo the Gringo's pictures, and it's remarkable to see the simularities between liberals here and the communists on our streets. A critically thinking person would be alarmed to see that their values are so closely aligned with the likes of such anti-Americanism. But I'm sure that you'll completely miss that point.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:18 pmForgive me if someone has already said this (I jumped on this thread after 99 comments were already posted) but...
Lieberman: Bush’s ‘Ratings Among Historians Will Be Greater Than His Ratings In The Polls Today’
LIEberman's not going very far out on a limb here, is he? I mean, Bush's rating among historians of the future could hardly be worse than his ratings among the public today.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:18 pmThe other part of course is, that the historical parallels that they try to draw don't stack up. Bush is no Truman, and Iraq is not WWII. Add to that, that Bush and company speak all the time about making us safer, but Al Qaida is now as strong as ever. Those who believe in the extremists Islam are more then happy with Iraq, since they use it as a tool to recruit. Funny bit is they say Islam is under attack from the west. and the rabid right wing says Christians are under attack by Islam. I guess it is too difficult to think it through.
No History will not exonerate Bush except in the right wing blogosphere.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:18 pmI attack Muslims and then you attack Christians!
Hey I didn’t see riots when the a croos was covered in piss!
There were riots when Mohamad the Pedophiler was depicted in a Danish Newspaper!
The Left was silent and didn’t condemn the rioters.
In fact many Leftists supported the Islamic riots!
Hypocrisy!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:13 pm
Ooooh tough guy attacking the muslims from the safety of your keyboard. What a moron!
I shat on Jesus and Mohamad, buddah & Chuck Norris.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:19 pmDo you want to discuss the Islamic Jihad of the 7th Century of other wars of Islamic agression?
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:20 pm
Do you want to discuss the Crusades?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:22 pmwillyloman,
Look what your friend Mohammed is up to!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:22 pmhttp://zombietime.com/mohammed_image_archive/extreme_mohammed/mohammad1.jpeg
Senator Joe liberman, obligating us to share the brunt of the World's hatred for Israel, one NeoConservative principle at a time........
July 13th, 2007 at 3:22 pmJohn Gilpins - you are a bit of an alarmist. Too bad the facts arent on your side. Good job on that concert that bombed all weekend trying to gin up more propoganda support for your chicken-little-the-sky-is-falling-BS. I guess if this was 20 years ago you'd be talking about extreme cold like the rest of the tree huggers out there.
Global Warming is nothing more than a POLITICAL movement designed to empower the left, that's it. Sure, everyone wants a clean environment, but the impact that US citizens are making on this pales in comparison to the earth's natural cycles.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:23 pmBush will be remembered as a war criminal, a hatemonger and an idiot. His name will go down as the worst president in American history, and the tactics his party used in both of his electroral "victories" will be remembered with the same scorn that we today recall with Nixon and Watergate.
The next president, whoever that may be, will probably be remembered most for cleaning up Dubya's mess.
Lieberman will be remembered as the bootlicking Senator for Israel that he has always been, and future Americans will wonder why in the hell the Democrats put him on the 2000 ticket with Al Gore.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:24 pmSenator Joe liberman, obligating us to share the brunt of the World’s hatred for Israel, one NeoConservative principle at a time……..
Comment by the fly-man/W is 4 Weak — July 13, 2007 @ 3:22 pm
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why do you hate one of America's friends?
It is stupid to say "The enemy of my enemy is my friend," but you are saying "A friend of mine is my enemy"?
How do you rationalize that?!?!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:25 pmThe Joker -
If you are hispanic, don't you find it a horrible character flaw to attack an entire group of people based upon religion or race? I'm sure you've had to put up with racism and stereotypes your entire life that you hate do deal with. Yet you turn around and use slurs, advocate violence, and belittle and entire group of people based upon their heritage and religion.
Real Christian of you.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:25 pmBush’s Ratings Among Historians Will Be Greater Than His Ratings In The Polls Today, unless historians read stuff like this:
"A secret military operation in early 2005 to capture senior members of Al Qaeda in Pakistan’s tribal areas was aborted at the last minute after top Bush administration officials decided it was too risky and could jeopardize relations with Pakistan, according to intelligence and military officials.
The target was a meeting of Qaeda leaders that intelligence officials thought included Ayman al-Zawahri, Osama bin Laden’s top deputy and the man believed to run the terrorist group’s operations."
July 13th, 2007 at 3:25 pmComment by hellinabucket — July 13, 2007 @ 2:50 pm
It’s in the RNC Stylebook. Doesn’t necessarily mea they’re one and the same.
Comment by Egreggious
They all share one tiny little brain any way.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:26 pmOoooh tough guy attacking the muslims from the safety of your keyboard. What a moron!
Comment by JP — July 13, 2007 @ 3:19 pm
100% TRUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Oh -- sorry; must be some kinda virus I picked up by playing in the wrong sandbox and drinking the wrong koolaid and wearing a tinfoil hat...
I'm better now...
July 13th, 2007 at 3:26 pmWell . . . this confirms it. Lieberman has gone completely soft in the head.
Time to take off the Republican-colored glasses, Mr. Joe-mentum. They've really messed up your vision.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:26 pmYou ignoring the crusades again?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:26 pmThe Crusades were at the end of the 11th Century and was a Christian counter attack after centuries of Islamic attacks!
Do you want to get into specifics?
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:24 pm
Sure. What did Jesus say? Turn the other cheek, right? So the true Christian thing to do in response to being attacked would be to turn the other cheek, not punch them in the nose.
Practice what you preach.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:27 pmWith a gun.
Pu$$y.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:27 pmJP,
I’ve beaten up many of Muslim in my life!
I have desecrated the Koran in front of the Saudi Embassy in Washington!
I left pork in front of a Mosque while the people were right there!
They couldn’t do nothing as I have a Carry permit and had my gun visible!
I can back my shit up!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:23 pm
Almost makes Pee look normal.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:27 pmI love this argument, since it’s the same one I heard over and over and over growing up in a red state in the 70s. It almost became a mantra as the whole ugly mess of Watergate was slowly exposed:
“History will look back at Richard Nixon as one of America’s greatest presidentsâ€
Why not? Liberal historians look at Lyndon Johnson as one of America's greatest presidents despite his adventure in Vietnam.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:27 pmJokewad: Dog hating Muslims? Many muslims I know actually LIKE dogs -- it's CATS they don't like (except in a casserole...mmmmm....).
And who in the world is Hitkler?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:28 pmNo they don't you fu*king lying sack of crap.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:28 pmNo History will not exonerate Bush except in the right wing blogosphere.
Comment by Krazny — July 13, 2007 @ 3:18 pm
I disagree - I think Bush will be wildly popular among historians. For decades, perhaps centuries, historians will make a fortune writing detailed accounts of everything that's gone wrong with this administration and its devastating effects on the world. I predict that by 2109 there will be more books and History Channel documentaries written about the lasting effects of this administration than World War II, Vietnam, and the Kennedy Assassination combined!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:28 pmI left pork in front of a Mosque while the people were right there!
They couldn’t do nothing as I have a Carry permit and had my gun visible!
I can back my shit up!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:23 pm
This is one tough hombre, people!
He left pork in front of a mosque! While the people were right there!
And he backed up his "statement" with a gun! What a man!
Joker, I think your sh!t is already backed up -- right up into your brain cavity.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pmJoker,
July 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pmTake the Prez-troll advice, and go back to you're 3rd world country. Don't you know he hates immigrants? He's only trying to gain your trust to make it easier to control you!
i have this great idea to remodel my house. but f the experts, im going to do it my way. 6 years later my house is barely standing up, it is barely fit to live in and ive wasted lots and lots of money. 100 years from now though people will say i was a great architect and someone ahead of his time.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pmYou ignoring the crusades again?
Comment by Spudge_Boy — July 13, 2007 @ 3:26 pm
----------------------------------------------
What about the Crusades?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pmEuropeans kicked MuslimSh*teaters off of land that they had stolen.
Comment by Spudge_Boy — July 13, 2007 @ 3:28 pm
Yes they do! Perhaps it is not despite, but rather because of his escalation in Vietnam.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:30 pmI’ve beaten up many of Muslim in my life!------- Make you feel like more of a 'man'?
I have desecrated the Koran in front of the Saudi Embassy in Washington! ---- So you're a disrespectful punk biznatch.....what was you point? Didja think they'd come a-runnin to beat your punk-ass? Maybe next time, I'll keep my fingers crossed.
I left pork in front of a Mosque while the people were right there! ----- Looking at you like you were a maniac, no doubt.
"Ma, what's that guy doing?"
"Honey, the crazy man has a gun and a pork-chop, go back inside and dial 911."
They couldn’t do nothing as I have a Carry permit and had my gun visible! ----- That REALLY makes you a scared punk. Why do you need a gun? Why don't you just stop doing the things that make people wanna beat your a$$?
I can back my shit up! ---- With a gun? That's hiding behind a bullet, not backing your sh!t up.
Comment by The Joker
July 13th, 2007 at 3:30 pmHistory will record GDumbya as a mere coma -- the worst president in the country's history.
Lieberman will be remembered as %@#*$#.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:30 pmHey, Mr. President. Do you think I should come clean and admit to all my alleged wrongdoings on this site? You know, give away all the names I've used in the past and the trolls I've been conspiring with to silence the liberal agenda?
You're the Decider. You tell me.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:30 pmLiberal historians look at Lyndon Johnson as one of America’s greatest presidents despite his adventure in Vietnam.
Comment by m12 — July 13, 2007 @ 3:27 pm
Can you name a few "liberal historians" who claim Lyndon Johnson is "one of America's greatest presidents", You're12?
Thanks.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:30 pmMaybe Israeli historians...
July 13th, 2007 at 3:30 pmHey!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:32 pmWhere is Joe (I-Israel)'s right hand?
Joker, i like to be told what our intentions are in straight forward TRUTHFUL manner and have serious debates about our national intentions, not have the government run by a small handful of blood thirsty warmongers. I said nothing about my personal support for Israel or lack there of.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:33 pmI detest Muslims and I believe all Americans whether White, Black, Latin and Asian should unite and drive them from our land!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:31 pm
Funny coincidence - I detest racists and bigots and I believe all Americans of all races and religions should unite and drive you assholes from our land.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:33 pm“Honey, the crazy man has a gun and a pork-chop, go back inside and dial 911.â€
Comment by SGT Higgins — July 13, 2007 @ 3:30 pm
Hilarious!
PS. Wasn't your wife ill? Hope she's doing better.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pmThe Crusades were at the end of the 11th Century and was a Christian counter attack after centuries of Islamic attacks!
Do you want to get into specifics?
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:24 pm
Actually, Jokewad, the first Crusades happened in the 1st Century AD; by the time Islam came along several centuries later, Christians were already well-experienced at killing in the name of "God"; they just turned their attention to a new group, Muslims, as the next target.
You need to read the book "Holy War" to understand a little history, before you start trying to play with the adults again. And especially if you're a Christian, like I am, you need to understand the complete history of your religion and why radical Christian fundamentalists like those in charge of the White House right now are no better than radical Muslim fundamentalists like those who attacked us on 9/11.
Now crawl back to your little sandbox before we pat you on the head and send you to play in traffic.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pmIndependent? BAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pmJoker,
Ice Age???? Good! I need a new air-conditioner so I can spare the expense. I should get a good deal right now on a furnace. Make that two furnaces. Make that three furnaces. Make that four furnaces.
I'm not a scientist but I don't follow your logic. Are you familiar with the Greenhouse Effect. When is the last time you've been in a frigid greenhouse? I'm not speaking about the country, Greenland, but greenhouse.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pmDon’t you know he hates immigrants? He’s only trying to gain your trust to make it easier to control you!
Comment by wake-n-bake — July 13, 2007 @ 3:29 pm
----------------------------------------------------------
I never said I hated immigrants! I might have said I hate ILLEGAL immigrants, or immigrants that hate America.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pmLieberman may have stated he would caucus with the Democrats, but his foreign policy preferences match up with the hawkish of the Republicans. Remember in his last election for Senate in Connecticut, he got quite a bit of support and money from the Republican party, even though they ran their own candidate in the race. Democrats who voted for him believing his claims that even as an Independent, he would still represent them got burned.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pmDogs are banned in many Islamic countries!
Comment by The Joker
Your stupidity is matched only by your cowardice.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pmI’m Imperiasl Roman Christian that believes in defending your self and wiping your enemies out!
Comment by The Joker
i.e. the crazy fanatical christian hate monger.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:37 pmIn the Koran Dogs are forbiden as Mohamad was attacked by them.
Dogs are banned in many Islamic countries!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:33 pm
Again with the spin, Jokewad. I never said dogs weren't banned in many Islamic countries -- I was responding to your earlier post that said muslims are dog-hating. That's akin to saying that all hispanics are muslim-hating just because YOU are. Since there are far more muslims in non-Islamic countries than there are in Islamic countries in the world, your broad brush approach to painting all muslims as dog-haters has, like you, absolutely no credibility.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:37 pmActually, Jokewad, the first Crusades happened in the 1st Century AD;
....
Comment by Zippy the Other Pinhead — July 13, 2007 @ 3:34 pm
-----------------------------------------------------------------
What are an idiot?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:37 pmYou know nothing of history!!!
The Christians were the ones being martyred in the 1st century!!!
their love fest should be consummated by pounding each other in the butt.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:38 pmComment by spit take — July 13, 2007 @ 3:30 pm
Sure.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_United_States_Presidents
9th
http://www.americanpresidents.org/survey/historians/35.asp
10th
http://falcon.arts.cornell.edu/Govt/courses/F04/PresidentialRankings.pdf
July 13th, 2007 at 3:39 pm17th
Dogs are banned in many Islamic countries!
Comment by The Joker
And the last carnitas you had was made of what?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pmJoe LIEberman: the suckass senator from Connecticut. Yeah, you can trust his assessment of how future generations will view George Bush. Thanks again, CT voters.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pmYou’re the Decider. You tell me.
Comment by No-one in particular — July 13, 2007 @ 3:30 pm
-------------------------------------------------------
Sure why not?!?!
I've done it!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pm“Honey, the crazy man has a gun and a pork-chop, go back inside and dial 911.â€
Comment by SGT Higgins — July 13, 2007 @ 3:30 pm
Sarge, your reply to The Joker kicked my reply's ass.
Well done.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pmHey Ringo or whatever your name is, to critize Israel is not anti-semetic. Nice try at a put down.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pmI think Joe and Chimpy are on to something with this one. Look how long it took for historians to get it right on Stalin. Heck, they're still finding bodies.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:41 pmtheir love fest should be consummated by pounding each other in the butt.
Oh you make the beautiful act of love between two men sound so dirty. Keep on creamin' dude.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:41 pmthe 1st century? Mr. President I rarely address you directly because you generally don't deserve a response. But your continual running off the deep end is just sad to watch. You are like the lemmings that just follow each other off the cliff.
Honestly, get back on the subject matter.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:41 pm"...but I think on the largest issue of our time, which is the rise of Islamist extremism, that he will be judged as a president who saw the threat, and in the midst of an unpopular war, he stuck with it."
So what gave Bush a clue to the threat? Extremist flying 3 planes into our buildings and killing 3000 of our citizens? This guy is just psychic or is it psychotic.
Anyway, as Rush said, when we are all dead and gone, and historians will write about this time in history and realize that they still have Islamist radicals to deal with in their time, how will Bush be remembered again?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:41 pmWhat are an idiot?
You know nothing of history!!!
The Christians were the ones being martyred in the 1st century!!!
Comment by Mr. President — July 13, 2007 @ 3:37 pm
I shudder to reply to someone who knows so little of the English language that he can't complete a sentence without leaving out a word here or there, but yawn...here goes...
Again, Jokewad, try reading a few books. I mean, other than Dr. Seuss or My Pet Goat. There's lots of great OBJECTIVE books exploring the history of holy wars that aren't written from the purely Christian perspective like the ones you've apparently had read to you. The Christians being martyred in the 1st century were being PROTECTED by Christian-affiliated knights who, as a side job to amuse themselves, were wearing the cross on their armor all while killing and maiming and pillaging in the name of their God.
Sorta like what you're doing now -- spinning and lying and distorting, all in the name of your hatred and bigotry.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:42 pmLIEberman’s not going very far out on a limb here, is he? I mean, Bush’s rating among historians of the future could hardly be worse than his ratings among the public today.
Comment by spit take
Sure, when whatever papers are left are eventually released and show how close his policies have taken us towards being a tyrannical regime and how the constitution was systematically ignored there won't be a historian who will not rate him as the worst president ever.
The saddest thing is that we, the citizens who allowed this all to happen, with our apathy and selfishness, will be judged as the least patriotic of all Americans.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:43 pm...what a moron. Everyone saw the threat--the difference is, the way that BushCo has dealt with the threat has been both clumsy and criminal.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:43 pmI miss Ned Lamont!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:43 pmComment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:13 pm
Ooooh tough guy attacking the muslims from the safety of your keyboard. What a moron!
I shat on Jesus and Mohamad, buddah & Chuck Norris.
Comment by JP
Right, nothing is stopping The Joker from signing up and going to fight muslims up close and personal. The US military is desparate enough to take anybody and if they won't take him because he's too crazy I'm sure Blackwater would love to have him.
But he'd rather sit here and talk tough while wetting himself.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:45 pmpeople critisize the policies the Israel's ultra right wing party push. Not the Jewish people.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:46 pmTo hide behind claims of anti semitism is disgusting. Anyone who does that is desicrating the memory of the real suffering of the Jewish people.
It is like Gulianni spouting "911" whenever he can't answer a question.
Poor Joker, can't take a joke without calling in the sympathy and racist card.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:46 pmYou are a joke, fool.
They couldn’t do nothing as I have a Carry permit and had my gun visible!
I can back my shit up!
Comment by The Joker
Then why don't you back your shit up to Iraq, sissy?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:47 pmBush has been talking up this historian bit for a while.
Most likely, his work will have destroyed the world by then and there will be no historians or history.
Since he started it though, I would like to say that history will look back and say that Jack Jett was one of the most handsome and talented folks of our generation.
Jack Jett
July 13th, 2007 at 3:48 pmhttp://www.jackejett.com
Comment by hellinabucket — July 13, 2007 @ 3:41 pm
Did you read the post I was responding too?
Because if you did not, you should have!
Zippy the Other Pinhead says this:
In the 1st Century Christians were being murdered by pagans!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:48 pmWait -- isn't Lieberman kissing the wrong part of Bush in that photo?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:48 pmComment by m12 — July 13, 2007 @ 3:39 pm
Thanks for that research, You're12, but it doesn't really seem to prove your point at all. Seems like, in the Wikipedia link at least, all of the historians had LBJ ranked in the teens. Pretty consistent.
Of course, to you, that means they're all "liberals", right? Except that only ONE of them had Johnson ranked higher than Eisenhower. Seems if they were all "liberals" they wouldn't have ranked Ike that high.
But as far as your "one of the greatest" remark goes, none of the links you offered place LBJ any higher than 10th. Maybe, being a right-winger, you have a lower standard of "greatness" than I do, but I think that being in the 50-75th percentile is not all that "great". It's good, sure, but hardly "one of the greatest".
So were you exaggerating for effect, or were you just pulling sh!t out of your a$$ as usual?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:49 pmComment by Zippy the Other Pinhead — July 13, 2007 @ 3:42 pm
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now I see that you were joking the whole time!!!
Good one!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:50 pmI don’t brag about myself here.
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:48 pm
"I brag about my gun."
July 13th, 2007 at 3:51 pmJoker, I think your sh!t is already backed up — right up into your brain cavity.
Comment by spit take
He pulled out his pecker, like he always does in public, and thinks he left pork in front of the mosque.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:52 pmThe Joker,
These Leftists will make up history to spread muslim lies!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 3:53 pmIt is funny, but it seems that they are an enemy to Americans like you and me!!!
I have to go now but I will talk to you later.
If I saw you to your face, trust me you wouldn’t be running your mouth!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:48 pm
Why is the fallback position of so many wingnuts the threat of violence?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:53 pmJoker, if you're such a tough ass SOB, why not just kill a few Muslims, right there in front of the mosque?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:55 pmHuh? That'd show em how tough you are.
Maybe a couple of four year old boys or girls. Yeah, that'll show em not to mess with "I've got a gun" Hoker.
What a pathetic pile of shit you are. I don't give a fu(k whether you're hispanic, black, orange or green, you are one fu(ked up moron.
shane ,
Your just an Internet Geek.
A straight pussy that used to get beat up in school!
Typical White Suburban Herb!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:53 pm
well, now that The Joke has proven what a tough guy he is by threatening a girl, can we all move on now?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:55 pmSo Joker is threatening people here now? Some Christian...
July 13th, 2007 at 3:56 pmWhy is the fallback position of so many wingnuts the threat of violence?
Comment by spit take — July 13, 2007 @ 3:53 pm
Apparently, that's what Jesus would do.
July 13th, 2007 at 3:56 pmWhy was Dick Cheney put in charge of investigations of WMDs and security risks inMay 2001, by Presidential order?
"Remember, on 9/11 the Bush administration claimed it had "no idea" aircraft would be used as weapons. Then why were they drilling such scenarios before and during 9/11?
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/011805_simplify_case.shtml
July 13th, 2007 at 3:57 pm"[2.11] And when it is said to them, Do not make mischief in the land, they say: We are but peace-makers."
peace
July 13th, 2007 at 3:59 pmSure Joker, because Jesus was a p*ssy, right?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:59 pmNot every Christian is a turn the other cheek fool!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:58 pm
Why do you hate Jesus?
July 13th, 2007 at 3:59 pmok. I will
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/
interesting film for those who have yet to see it.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:01 pmNot every Christian is a turn the other cheek fool!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:58 pm
Oh, so you're not a "strict constructionist" type of Christian, who believes in everything Jesus said in the Bible. Good to know.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:02 pmThe Joker,
Don't mind 'shane.' The puke has yet to "back her sh*t up" in the education debate on the "Bush Makes Little Girls Cry" thread. Ms. Grape nuts takes comfort in knowing she won't be called out by her former leftinites if she runs.
Anyhow, I agree with you that Muslim immigration is essentially the poison to America's security. Lefties LOVE it. (And SHH! If you tell the lefties of your hispanic descent, you'll be led to think that you need remedial help and inclusion into more of their bogus pet projects.)
STILL WAITING FOR SUBSTANTIATION, SHANE.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:03 pmIt's difficult to write in past-future-present tense, but here goes.
Why would what people who haven't been born yet think (How you would know that is another issue.) change my (or anyone else's) mind?
Bush has too often tried to say that historians will vindicate his actions.
How?
Yes, there are Holocaust deniers, but does that vindicate Hitler?
No, I'm not comparing Bush to Hitler. I'm comparing the delusion of the denier with Bush's (Delusion of Grandure).
July 13th, 2007 at 4:04 pmThen why don’t you back your shit up to Iraq, sissy?
Why don’t you go to Afghanistan?
I have 2 relatives in Iraq and you know nothing about me.
I don’t brag about myself here.
If I saw you to your face, trust me you wouldn’t be running your mouth!
Comment by The Joker
Oh I'd be running my mouth, trust me. And I'm not the commando who hates muslims. Put your money where your mouth is and go fight your most hated enemy. Unless of course you're just a paid troll and make easy money by spewing the same crappola day after day. I bet Blackwater pays better than Rove. Go for it little girl.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:04 pm"the Cheney Energy Task Force. The documents contain a map of Iraqi oilfields, pipelines, refineries and terminals, as well as 2 charts detailing Iraqi oil and gas projects, and “Foreign Suitors for Iraqi Oilfield Contracts.†The documents are dated March 2001.
Interesting maps from right before Bush put Ceney in charge of drilling Norad for potential terrorist attacks.
http://www.judicialwatch.org/iraqi-oil-maps.shtml
July 13th, 2007 at 4:05 pmI believe in Christianity, but only use the bible as a general guide.
I believe in Science and Facts to guide my secualr thoughts!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 4:04 pm
You know, there are a lot of people who share youor political philosophy who would say you're not a Christian at all. Or they'd dismiss you as a "Cafeteria Christian".
July 13th, 2007 at 4:07 pmOf course, to you, that means they’re all “liberalsâ€, right? Except that only ONE of them had Johnson ranked higher than Eisenhower. Seems if they were all “liberals†they wouldn’t have ranked Ike that high.
There certainly is no such thing as conservatives at Cornell, so yeah, they're liberals!
You do realize it was Eisenhower who set up the beloved liberal Warren Court, which endured for 50 years until George W. Bush (hopefully) put an end to it?
But as far as your “one of the greatest†remark goes, none of the links you offered place LBJ any higher than 10th. Maybe, being a right-winger, you have a lower standard of “greatness†than I do, but I think that being in the 50-75th percentile is not all that “greatâ€. It’s good, sure, but hardly “one of the greatestâ€.
Ok, I'll use your terminology. Clearly, if liberals put him at 10, Vietnam (6x the financial and human cost of Iraq) can't be all that bad!
How did Mr. War on Poverty do, anyway?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:07 pmMaybe I already served?
Do you know me, no!
I just don’t discuss certain things here.
It’s none of yiur business.
Your just a suburban white ppunk!
Comment by The Joker
Maybe you served, and maybe I'm the f*cking Queen of England. Doesn't matter anyway, they'd take you back, candyass. Soldiers are doing their 5th tours and all you do is talk, talk, talk. You will never have the ability to legally kill muslims again like you can right now. Anybody whose hate is as virulent as yours would be dying to go kill some muslims. If you weren't such a pu$$y.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:08 pmI believe in Christianity, but only use the bible as a general guide.
I believe in Science and Facts to guide my secualr thoughts!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 4:04 pm
Ohhh... so you pick an choose what you want then? Kind of like the radical muslims that do the same with the Koran, then? Huh... makes you just like them, then. Go figure.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:08 pm"I believe in Christianity, but only use the bible as a general guide.
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007"
same with timothy mcveigh.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:09 pmPS. Wasn’t your wife ill? Hope she’s doing better. --- Yeah, she's fine now, thank you. =)
Comment by Egreggious
Well done. --- it was my pleasure, although I'd have liked to see the Joker's response...guess he was at a loss. Go figure.
Comment by spit take
July 13th, 2007 at 4:09 pm#113,
I disagree and the facts are not on your side.
Are you a petroleum engineer? One official petroleum organization refutes global warming, but that's about the only scientific organization that does.
Maybe you're trying to sell a house on a beach. Good luck! As the oceans and seas rise, you'll be living on the second story.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:09 pmI’m an Isolationist!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
Excellent. You better turn off your internet connection, then, and isolate yourself.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:09 pmComment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:23 pm
Jesus, late into this but you can back your shit up by being one of the biggest tools to have ever walked the earth.
Well done son, very clever.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:10 pmHe will go down as the worst, most corrupt non-elected criminal President, that was also was convicted of so many war crimes as to be only second to Hitler.
Butt Slush - the splurpy drink of choice of CT_V1
July 13th, 2007 at 4:10 pmwell, now that The Joke has proven what a tough guy he is by threatening a girl, can we all move on now?
Comment by spit take — July 13, 2007 @ 3:55 pm
Where do you get that 'shane' is a woman? I think 'mutant' better reflects Ms. Grape-nuts. The specimen is a canker sore with a mouth of its own.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:11 pm"For we are opposed, around the world, by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy that relies primarly on covert means for expanding it's sphere of influence on infiltration instead of invasion, on subversion instead of elections, on intimidation instead of free choice, on guerillas by night instead of armies by day."
JFK 1961
July 13th, 2007 at 4:11 pmI’m not that religious.
Not every Christian is a turn the other cheek fool!
Comment by The Joker
Thre are 'degrees' of Christianity now. I missed that part....what verse is that Joker?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:11 pmSure thing, Croaky-Joe.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:13 pm"It is a system which has conscripted vast human and material resources into the building of a tightly-nit, highly-efficient machine that combines military, diplomatic, intelligence, economic, scientific and political operations. It's preperations are concealed, not published. It's mistakes are buried, not headlined. It's descent is silenced, not praised. No expenditure is questioned, no rumor is printed, no secret is revealed."
JFK 1961
July 13th, 2007 at 4:13 pmThre are ‘degrees’ of Christianity now. I missed that part….what verse is that Joker?
Comment by SGT Higgins — July 13, 2007 @ 4:11 pm
Hyprocrites 9:11
July 13th, 2007 at 4:13 pmI’d invite you to come to my house for some whup ass but hispanics are only allowed in my neighborhood if they’er cutting the grass.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:10 pm
RACIST HYPOCRISY ALERT!
RACIST!
RACIST!
RACIST!
Alert to: The Joker, Mr. President
July 13th, 2007 at 4:13 pmI believe in Christianity, but only use the bible as a general guide.
I believe in Science and Facts to guide my secualr thoughts!
Comment by The Joker
A general guide? Either do it or don't....quit half-a$$ing it.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:13 pmThat’s why Us Muslims consider you Progressives our allies!
Thank you and Peace be upon you!
Comment by Umar Lee
Oh look, now Mr. President is a Muslim. You're a piece of shit no matter what religion Pissadent.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:13 pm"the very word 'secrecy' is repugnant in a free and open society. And we are, as a people, inherently and historicly opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths and to secret proceedings. We decided long ago, that the dangers of excessive and unwarranted concealment of pertinant facts, far outweighted the dangers which are cited to justify it."
JFK 1961
July 13th, 2007 at 4:15 pmButt Slush - the splurpy drink of choice of CT_V1
Comment by Buch Fush — July 13, 2007 @ 4:10 pm
So original. A cheap spin of my own insult.
You didn't make up 'Buck Fush,' either. Not fooled, fruitpie.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:15 pmAlert to: The Joker, Mr. President
Comment by CT_V1
Gotta send 'em a heads-up, huh?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:15 pmGuess you read these posts out loud for 'em too?
Tell me you're not pre-digesting their food too, just their facts, right?
Lieberman: Bush’s ‘Ratings Among Historians Will Be Greater Than His Ratings In The Polls Today’
:|
Hmm
That wouldn't take much.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:16 pmIt's kinda obvious how few Historians Lieberman has spoken to on this matter.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:16 pmComment by willyloman — July 13, 2007 @ 4:11 pm
"It is a paradoxical truth that tax rates are too high and tax revenues are too low and the soundest way to raise the revenues in the long run is to cut the rates now ... Cutting taxes now is not to incur a budget deficit, but to achieve the more prosperous, expanding economy which can bring a budget surplus."
– John F. Kennedy, Nov. 20, 1962, president's news conference
"It is no contradiction – the most important single thing we can do to stimulate investment in today's economy is to raise consumption by major reduction of individual income tax rates."
– John F. Kennedy, Jan. 21, 1963, annual message to the Congress: "The Economic Report Of The President"
"In today's economy, fiscal prudence and responsibility call for tax reduction even if it temporarily enlarges the federal deficit – why reducing taxes is the best way open to us to increase revenues."
– John F. Kennedy, Jan. 21, 1963, annual message to the Congress: "The Economic Report Of The President"
"A tax cut means higher family income and higher business profits and a balanced federal budget. Every taxpayer and his family will have more money left over after taxes for a new car, a new home, new conveniences, education and investment. Every businessman can keep a higher percentage of his profits in his cash register or put it to work expanding or improving his business, and as the national income grows, the federal government will ultimately end up with more revenues."
– John F. Kennedy, Sept. 18, 1963, radio and television address to the nation on tax-reduction bill
July 13th, 2007 at 4:17 pmSTILL WAITING FOR SUBSTANTIATION, SHANE.
Comment by CT_V1
What do you want substantiated dickwad? I already answered that I left to take my child to music and gymnastics. You think I'm scared of you? Beside, you weren't part of this discussion until right now. You still have a chance to back out otherwise I'm coming to get you.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:17 pmSince he started it though, I would like to say that history will look back and say that Jack Jett was one of the most handsome and talented folks of our generation.
Jack Jett
http://www.jackejett.com
Comment by jack jett — July 13, 2007 @ 3:48 pm
I peeked at your site and I would have to agree!
Bush, though, will go down as the worst prez ever. Any of us here with any perspective know that. In fact, I think his standing will actually go down with time.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:17 pmDown here in my Miami neighborhood, You Whites can’t afford to live here!
Comment by The Joker
Oh really? Your part of suburban Dade Co. slum is that affluent, huh?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:18 pmIf you're living in an area where there are no 'whites'...it's by choice. They're living in MORE AFFLUENT suburbs. That's why they aren't in YOUR neighborhood. That or they're all in Coral Springs.
There certainly is no such thing as conservatives at Cornell, so yeah, they’re liberals!
You do realize it was Eisenhower who set up the beloved liberal Warren Court, which endured for 50 years until George W. Bush (hopefully) put an end to it?
But as far as your “one of the greatest†remark goes, none of the links you offered place LBJ any higher than 10th. Maybe, being a right-winger, you have a lower standard of “greatness†than I do, but I think that being in the 50-75th percentile is not all that “greatâ€. It’s good, sure, but hardly “one of the greatestâ€.
Ok, I’ll use your terminology. Clearly, if liberals put him at 10, Vietnam (6x the financial and human cost of Iraq) can’t be all that bad!
How did Mr. War on Poverty do, anyway?
Comment by m12 — July 13, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
Do you have any cogent argument at all??
There are no conservatives at Cornell?
Eisenhower is now a liberal?
Do you agree that none of the "liberals" you cited claim that Johnson was "one of the greatest" presidents in history?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:20 pmshane,
If you haven’t read my posts I’m against the war in Iraq and Afganistan.
I beliebve in getteing rid of Muslims from America!
I’m an Isolationist!
Comment by The Joker
Frankly I don't read most of your posts. And I don't recall you ever stating you were against any war in the Middle East. Funny but most Americans are more interested in getting Hispanics out of the US than Muslims. Watch your back.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:20 pm"A bill will be presented to the Congress for action next year. It will include an across-the-board, top-to-bottom cut in both corporate and personal income taxes. It will include long-needed tax reform that logic and equity demand ... The billions of dollars this bill will place in the hands of the consumer and our businessmen will have both immediate and permanent benefits to our economy. Every dollar released from taxation that is spent or invested will help create a new job and a new salary. And these new jobs and new salaries can create other jobs and other salaries and more customers and more growth for an expanding American economy."
– John F. Kennedy, Aug. 13, 1962, radio and television report on the state of the national economy
"The present tax codes ... inhibit the mobility and formation of capital, add complexities and inequities which undermine the morale of the taxpayer, and make tax avoidance rather than market factors a prime consideration in too many economic decisions."
– John F. Kennedy, Jan. 23, 1963, special message to Congress on tax reduction and reform
"Our present tax system ... exerts too heavy a drag on growth ... It reduces the financial incentives for personal effort, investment, and risk-taking ... The present tax load ... distorts economic judgments and channels an undue amount of energy into efforts to avoid tax liabilities."
– John F. Kennedy, Nov. 20, 1962, press conference
"In those countries where income taxes are lower than in the United States, the ability to defer the payment of U.S. tax by retaining income in the subsidiary companies provides a tax advantage for companies operating through overseas subsidiaries that is not available to companies operating solely in the United States. Many American investors properly made use of this deferral in the conduct of their foreign investment."
– John F. Kennedy, April 20, 1961, message to Congress on taxation
July 13th, 2007 at 4:20 pmI can think what I want. ---- Did I put thoughts in your head?
I’m a Christian with my own ideas. --- about Christianity? That's not how it works.
Sorry you can’t stereotype me! ----- I don't need to, you got that one covered all by your lonesome.
Comment by The Joker
July 13th, 2007 at 4:22 pmChristians don't carry guns fu*k wad. They have God's word as their sword and the Bible as their shield. Guess you weren't paying attention in church like I was.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:23 pmComment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
Not an excuse because of the abrupt timing.
I've provided an irrefutable argument with supporting credible links, yet you continue to push baseless stereotypes.
You have 0% credibility.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:24 pmI like how he calls you a racist after spewing racial hatred, then attempts to be racist by calling you Anglo.
Hypocrite.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:24 pm– John F. Kennedy, Sept. 18, 1963, radio and television address to the nation on tax-reduction bill
Comment by m12 — July 13, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
Maybe you didn't realize, You're12, but the top tax rate at the time Kennedy spoke was 91% -- instituted as a measure to pay for the costs of WWII and left in place by Eisenhower (oh, that's right -- he was a liberal, wasn't he?) throughout the 1950s.
Kennedy cut the top tax rate to around 70%.
STILL wanna claim him as your champion of tax policy?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:25 pmComment by spit take — July 13, 2007 @ 4:20 pm
Nope, Cornell is full of lefties.
http://www.academia.org/campus_reports/2002/october_2002_5.html
Liberals outnumber conservatives 18 to one at Brown University. At Cornell University, the number is even higher, with liberals outnumbering conservatives more than 26 times.
Of course, you will continue to result to off topic diversions.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:25 pmI beliebve in getteing rid of Muslims from America!
I’m an Isolationist!
Comment by The Joker
Why do you 'beliebve' in gett'e'ing rid of Muslims from America? If you're 3rd gen American, as you claim, you of all people (and I use that term loosely) should be able to appreciate the foundations of our country.
Don't you have an MS13 meeting to get to?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:25 pmWhere do you get that ’shane’ is a woman? I think ‘mutant’ better reflects Ms. Grape-nuts. The specimen is a canker sore with a mouth of its own.
Comment by CT_V1
Oh you're a funny little turd. Not like you make anybody laugh, but like here comes the straight jacket. Just cause you're mother's a crack whore doesn't mean you should bash all women. And lot's of gay men, like yourself, have really good relationships with women. I suspect this is more a daddy issue, where's he serving time?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:26 pmKennedy cut the top tax rate to around 70%.
STILL wanna claim him as your champion of tax policy?
The man was shot before he could do it again, but he set the clear, logical, and successful policy in for Ronald Reagan to continue!
July 13th, 2007 at 4:26 pmButt Slush - the splurpy drink of choice of CT_V1
Comment by Buch Fush
Mr. President's his favorite flavor.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:27 pmYou still have a chance to back out otherwise I’m coming to get you.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
OooOOoooOOOoooOOOoooOOOoooOOOoooOOOoooOOOoooOOOoooOOO
I look forward to continued baseless stereotyping from this specimen despite overwhelming and flattening evidence.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:27 pmDon't know if my dictionary's he last word on this, but it says a Christian is "One who professes belief in Jesus as Christ or follows the religion based on his teachings."
I hate to defend the Cracker-hater, but there it is.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:27 pmLet's ask Daryll if the Joker is a real Christian, according to Daryll.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:29 pmJust cause you’re mother’s a crack whore doesn’t mean you should bash all women. And lot’s of gay men, like yourself, have really good relationships with women. I suspect this is more a daddy issue, where’s he serving time?
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:26 pm
I'm not talking to a woman, I'm talking to 'shane.' Keep that in mind. This is not a women that I'm speaking to. Please stop calling yourself a woman.
Good substantiation with credible links, after all. Nice work.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:30 pmRACIST!
Alert to: The Joker, Mr. President
Comment by CT_V1
Wow you picked right up on that. You're not as dumb as you look. But then, who is? Do you not think bashing all mulims in this country is racist? Maybe you are as dumb as you look.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:30 pmfar too many self promoting flagelaters in this thread.
Remember the topic? care to discuss it? didn't think so.
Go back to your grand delusions
July 13th, 2007 at 4:30 pmNope, Cornell is full of lefties.
http://www.academia.org/ campus_reports/ 2002/ october_2002_5.html
Liberals outnumber conservatives 18 to one at Brown University. At Cornell University, the number is even higher, with liberals outnumbering conservatives more than 26 times.
Of course, you will continue to result to off topic diversions.
Comment by m12 — July 13, 2007 @ 4:25 pm
"Accuracy in Academia"??? Please, You're12, you can do better than that. Besides, you didn't say "Cornell is full of lefties". You said "There certainly is no such thing as conservatives at Cornell, so yeah, they’re liberals!". Not the same thing at all. You could have been sarcastic, but then you wouldn't be able to use it to justify your statement,as you are continuing to do.
And no response to the other points I made? Eisenhower is a lefty now?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:30 pmSGT Higgins, --- what, Joker? This is getting old. Like your mom. great now i'm an age-ist, too.
You racist ignorant fool! ---- Nice, Joker, way to stay level-headed....then again, that' always been a real strugle for you, hasn't it?
Ever heard of Doral? ---- Aren't those the generic cigarrettes?
It’s an upperclass Hispanic suburb. --- Ok, if you say so.
Unlike the rest iof the country There are plent of Upperclass Hispanic neigborhood and suburbs doen here in Miami! ---and your point is what? exactly?
But your to much of an ignorant White Racist Leftist to know this! ---- whatever.
It’s funny you hate Hispanics but like Muslims. --- I don't 'hate' anyone based on their race or religion....it's more of a case-by-case basis.....so far, you lose.
Nice logic you racist Anglo clown! ---- How can you tell I'm Anglo under all this makeup, these big floppy shoes, and this red rubber nose?
Comment by The Joker
July 13th, 2007 at 4:31 pmCT_V1 - Just turning your uncreative, immature little half-assed insult on you. What are you, like 12 yrs old or something?
Here just for you, creep.
BUTT SLUSH - THE FAVORITE SLURPY OF CT_V1
July 13th, 2007 at 4:31 pmshane,
See you just proved that you Leftists are racists.
Down here in my Miami neighborhood, You Whites can’t afford to live here!
Comment by The Joker
So effing stupid that you don't realize bashing muslims nonstop is racist.
Whites don't live in your neighborhood because they can't afford it, keep telling yourself that.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:32 pmDear Mr. Limbaugh: I seem to recall that Bush was (S)elected on the premise of NO nation building...and you were ALL for that at the time.
History will NOT be kind to this President, just like it is not kind to Harding.
Bush likes to say that if they are still writing about George Washington, then he has a shot. At least George Washington was a literate man.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:32 pmComment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:27 pm
No, the flavor of Muslim sucking suits you best.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:33 pmThe man was shot before he could do it again, but he set the clear, logical, and successful policy in for Ronald Reagan to continue!
Comment by m12 — July 13, 2007 @ 4:26 pm
So, in your view, there's no difference between cutting taxes from 91% to 70%, and from say, 15% to 10%?
The effect will be the same no matter what?
How about if you cut taxes from 15% to 1%? Will revenues still go up, in your opinion?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:33 pmWhy do you ‘beliebve’ in gett’e'ing rid of Muslims from America?
Comment by SGT Higgins — July 13, 2007 @ 4:25 pm
LOL, ... thats funny the way you quoted him. Worthy of myself even.
I'm actually starting to like you sarge. Better cut it out.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:33 pmi pray to God myself and have my own interpetations of scriptures.
Yeah, that' always proven to work out in the past...just ask King James.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:33 pmshane,
See you just proved that you Leftists are racists.
Comment by The Joker
What a coincidence -- you just proved that you tighty-righties are stupid!
Congrats!
July 13th, 2007 at 4:34 pmLieberman has no credibility. No one should listen to this miserable and stupid sycophant. If Lieberman loves war so much, why does he not send his own kids to Iraq? Why does he not go himself?
But no, of course, he is as cowardly as the rest of this pitiful administration: all talk, no action .
July 13th, 2007 at 4:34 pmnot that bigot Mr. President.
In fact I have my own blog!
please post there so we can discuss how Progressives and Muslims can work together.
http://www.umarlee.com
Comment by Umar Lee
Cute, idiot.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:35 pmThe part you allowing to be fuzzy is in bold. The his don't refer to dummy in these threads. It refers to Christ and the religion based on how Jesus said people should behave. It doesn't mean pick and choose what you want and throw the rest away. Dummy is NOT a Christian.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:36 pmSo, he's forgotten WE THE PEOPLE. He's playing to historians who will allegedly buy his bloody, stupid war and occupation of Iraq.
I wonder how well the war is playing with widows and orphans?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:36 pmHa ha ha funny! --- Yeah, ain't I a hoot?
Don’t you have a Klan meeting to attaend. ---- Nope, 1st & 3rd Fridays, put it on your calendar, we'll be expecting you.
How about taking care of that ugly kid of yours! ---- He's good, thanks for askin'........loser.
Are you sure it’s your’s? ----- Yeah. You dad sure you're his? Does he claim you anyway?
Comment by The Joker
July 13th, 2007 at 4:37 pmComment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:30 pm
You're more senile than your age would regularly suggest. Congratulations for being uncommon for all of the wrong reasons.
Muslims in the U.S. don't do a good job in denouncing terrorism, they shouldn't reside here until they take a convincing, compelling stand to the contrary. They will be held to a high standard, as they should.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:37 pmNot an excuse because of the abrupt timing.
I’ve provided an irrefutable argument with supporting credible links, yet you continue to push baseless stereotypes.
You have 0% credibility.
Comment by CT_V1
What thread was it, I'll go look, because I don't have a clue what you're referring too. Trust me, Wednesday, music and gymnastics.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:38 pmI’m actually starting to like you sarge. Better cut it out.
Comment by BARTLEBEE
Sorry BART, It's my uncanny ability to be endearing.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:38 pmComment by Buch Fush — July 13, 2007 @ 4:31 pm
Whatever, young man. Continue talking to the wall.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:39 pmComment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 4:34 pm
Nothing new....you'll have to try harder.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:40 pmAnd no response to the other points I made? Eisenhower is a lefty now?
I certainly don't know of any solidly conservative policies he enacted. He was mostly nonpartisan, other than his disastrous Supreme Court.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:40 pmHow about taking care of that ugly kid of yours!
Are you sure it’s your’s?
Comment by The Joker
You should have never pissed the Sgt. off. Or the rest of us for that matter. Shit for brains.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:41 pmComment by The Joker
Wow, Joker... You carry a GUN!? I am really impressed ese, you must be REALLY TOUGH... why don't you come down to the barrio and help us fight the woods, e los chinos e los negros. After we take them out, then we'll get all the Christians who aren't Católicos and the Muslims after that. Are you with us homeboy?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:41 pmI’m not talking to a woman, I’m talking to ’shane.’ Keep that in mind. This is not a women that I’m speaking to. Please stop calling yourself a woman.
Good substantiation with credible links, after all. Nice work.
Comment by CT_V1
Oh you've used antiwoman epithets against me. Saying you haven't won't change that.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:43 pmI onlu dislike Mulsims.
I detest the fact they want special treatment.
That’s why I want to remove them now!
Comment by The Joker
Wow, sounds like they want the same things you want....
Isolation= special treatment.
Guess you're special, well 'special'.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:44 pmGreat, you can keep your hot, humid swampland with mosquitoes the size of Apache helicopters. Not to mention the palmetto bugs. Dang, you can step on them and they keep coming back.
Maybe they are Muslim bugs out to get you.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:44 pmThe defend Muslims but hate Latins!
Comment by The Joker
We don't defend muslims and we don't hate latins. We hate you reich wing nuts. That isn't racist, its philosophical.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:46 pmSGT Higgins,
I detest the Klan!
I detest then as much as I detest Muslim lovers like you!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 4:40 pm
Why is it with you far right wingnuts, someone being unwilling to condemn a person or particular group just because you demand that they do, constitutes "loving them"?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:46 pmI detest the Klan! --- So what?
You’re just a fake fraud. --*yawn*
You played a few video games and think your military. ---- *Yawn*
You’re a fake! --- *yawn*
Go attend your Klan meeting now! --- # 289
Take your stupid looking retarted kid with you to! ---- It's spelled 'retarded'.....re-tarted is what your mom is.
Comment by The Joker
July 13th, 2007 at 4:47 pmHey how
’s your White and sheet isi it ready yet! ---- I don't know, you tell me, It's YOUR dry-cleaning business.
It’s tough having a retarded child! -- Your parents oughta know.
Comment by The Joker
July 13th, 2007 at 4:50 pmDown here we are the masters and you the serfs!
Comment by The Joker
Good for you, you have white trash under your thumb. By the way, there's nothing lower than American white trash, that's why CT_V1 is so pathetic.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:50 pmWell, one thing the Bush presidency will improve is Nixon's reputation. Finally, there's someone worse than him.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:50 pmI love this argument, since it’s the same one I heard over and over and over growing up in a red state in the 70s. It almost became a mantra as the whole ugly mess of Watergate was slowly exposed:
“History will look back at Richard Nixon as one of America’s greatest presidentsâ€
Hey, I thought, they’re the adults- maybe they see something I’m missing. Now I recognize it as the last refuge of delusion to avoid the uncomfortable mental dissonance of knowing you voted for the guy who turned everything to shit.
I dunno- maybe the next 35 years will be kinder to Tricky than the first 35 of post-Nixon “historyâ€, but I’m not holding my breath. And you know, I wouldn’t hold my breath for Dubya’s vindication either.
Comment by pdq — July 13, 2007 @ 2:44 pm
Bush makes Nixon look like Lincoln.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:51 pmAre you that ugly or did you drop him on his head while you were attending the Klan gathering?
Comment by The Joker
Personal attacks on a small child, huh?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:52 pmAnd you think you're BETTER than radical Muslims who attack women and children?
You played a few video games and think your military.
You’re a fake!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 4:40 pm
Better check his website again mr Joke. You'll find he has a .mil email address.
Only military personnel get those.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:52 pmMaybe they are Muslim bugs out to get you.
Comment by Spudge_Boy
Joker you better listen to SB here, I think those bugs are after you.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:54 pm#317
Comment by The Joker
You're as dumb as they come, and then some.
Thanks BART, he's not the brightest bulb on the string. Even spelling it out for him, he's not likely to notice it.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:56 pmPersonal attacks on a small child, huh?
And you think you’re BETTER than radical Muslims who attack women and children?
Comment by SGT Higgins
CT_V1 was attacking my daughter the other day. These trolls are predictable. They make themselves look despicable and think they've won.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:57 pmJoker don't bring the kids into this - they have nothing to do with the plan conservative plan to free the Muslims from an oppressive dictator. You should apologize for making such rude and hateful remarks about someones child for chrissakes.
July 13th, 2007 at 4:58 pm#
SGT Higgins ,
You should gio attend to your family now!
Oops I forgot your Wife is running tricks out on the street now!
Just like your mom did in the trailerparks you grew up!
How’s your daddy do you know!
Maybe your Uncle is your daddy!
That would explin your Kid’s deformed face!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 4:53 pm
What's next; your momma so fat jokes?
July 13th, 2007 at 4:59 pmKids should not be allowed to interrupt adult conversations.
That isn't really that unreasonable a thing to say. Most presidents are viewed more favorably several years after their presidency has ended. Considering that Bush's current ratingd may very well be at the low-point of his presidency (he can't get much lower), there's a good chance he will be viewed more favorably after things have cooled down a bit.
The only odd thing about the quote is that it could have come from a senior member of Bush's administration. Instead, it came from an independent, a guy who not too long ago ran for the Vice Presidency as a Democrat. There are enough people carrying W' water for him. We don't need the Dems doing the same. I think Joe just needs to register as a Republican already and stop jerking everyone around.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:00 pmComment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:57 pm
It's absolutely shameful...you gotta wonder just how IS he 'interpreting' his Bible?
I mean, I have to believe that stupidity and arrogance can be found on both sides of the aisle, but damn, if I gotta choose.....
July 13th, 2007 at 5:01 pmWhat is with The Joker's disturbing obsession with Muslims?
July 13th, 2007 at 5:01 pmBARTLEBEE,
Any more Pro-Muslim postings today you Dork?
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 4:54 pm
I haven't posted any pro muslim postings mr Joke.
But if you want one, well.. ok.
Hmmmm pro muslim ..... hmmmm
ok, try this.
Muslims should be happy, because they're not inbred, like you.
:D
Hows that?
July 13th, 2007 at 5:02 pmBoy, I'd rather hear Joke argue about the Crusades! And I don't want that at all!
July 13th, 2007 at 5:03 pmI certainly don’t know of any solidly conservative policies he enacted. He was mostly nonpartisan, other than his disastrous Supreme Court.
Comment by m12 — July 13, 2007 @ 4:40 pm
Do you know of ANY policies he enacted?
Answer the question -- is Eisenhower a lefty in your view?
July 13th, 2007 at 5:04 pmThat isn’t really that unreasonable a thing to say.
Comment by Nick — July 13, 2007 @ 5:00 pm
You're right.
Its a positively ridiculous thing to say.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:04 pmMost presidents are viewed more favorably several years after their presidency has ended.
Comment by Nick — July 13, 2007 @ 5:00 pm
Yea, "most" presidents.
But we're talking about Dubya here.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:05 pmComment by BARTLEBEE — July 13, 2007 @ 5:02 pm
lmao...begs the question:
If a muslim becomes a highly paid WWE wrestler (god forbid) and I think he's the best wrestler in the ring....would that make me Pro-Pro Muslim?
July 13th, 2007 at 5:05 pmIt’s absolutely shameful…you gotta wonder just how IS he ‘interpreting’ his Bible?
I mean, I have to believe that stupidity and arrogance can be found on both sides of the aisle, but damn, if I gotta choose…..
Comment by SGT Higgins
Who knows with these guys? They have no boundaries. Although Joker looks like he scared himself off now.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:06 pmLoonie, I can only surmise that his sister married one.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:09 pmAlthough Joker looks like he scared himself off now.
Comment by shane
That..or his Mom called him downstairs for dinner.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:09 pmLike I said sarge. Refusing to jump on the hate-wagon for a neocon wingnut, (not normal conservatives, wingnuts) and damning all muslims to hell, constitutes being a "muslim lover".
In the 1960's, if you were willing to set next to a black person on a bus, guys like Joker would call you a "n#$$#er lover".
In the old west, if you gave an Indian a drink of water, guys like Joker would call you an "injun lover".
July 13th, 2007 at 5:10 pmComment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:50 pm
Please, your continous projection provides me with non-stop laughter, my senile citizen.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:12 pm"I left pork in front of a Mosque while the people were right there!"
I will remember this for the rest of my life.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:12 pmI think Joe just needs to register as a Republican already and stop jerking everyone around.
Comment by Nick — July 13, 2007 @ 5:00 pm
July 13th, 2007 at 5:13 pmHe seems to have joined the neocon party!
His words have no relevance for me.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 13, 2007 @ 5:10 pm
It's about as sad as it gets.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:15 pmI left pork in front of a Mosque while the people were right there!
Comment by The Joker — July 13, 2007 @ 3:23 pm
Just curious, but wouldn't your own presence there constitute that?
July 13th, 2007 at 5:16 pmWell, I hope that Joker doesn't get drunk at happy hour, make a fool of himself in front of hot women and then get a DWI while driving home alone.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:16 pmIt is friday the 13th after all.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:18 pmI will remember this for the rest of my life.
Comment by Egreggious
I'm sure there are some very nice Muslim's in Miami who have that image burnd into their heads, as well.
"Remember that time we saw the crazy guy?"
And no one will have to ask, "which crazy guy?" they'll know exactly who's being referenced. "Right, the one with the pork chop."
July 13th, 2007 at 5:18 pm#
Like I said sarge. Refusing to jump on the hate-wagon for a neocon wingnut, (not normal conservatives, wingnuts) and damning all muslims to hell, constitutes being a “muslim loverâ€.
In the 1960’s, if you were willing to set next to a black person on a bus, guys like Joker would call you a “n#$$#er loverâ€.
In the old west, if you gave an Indian a drink of water, guys like Joker would call you an “injun loverâ€.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 13, 2007 @ 5:10 pm
Isn't that joker joker latino.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:18 pmIn Brooklyn N.Y. in the 50s and 60s, Puerto Ricans were looked upon the same way, just a step under the blacks. I'm not saying I agree.
I'm just saying. One man's muslim is another man's negro!
I think Joe just needs to register as a Republican already and stop jerking everyone around.
Comment by Nick — July 13, 2007 @ 5:00 pm
Well, while you're right, that he is clearly a neocon, hopefully he's to enthralled with the lure of being one of 2 independents in the Senate.
Because if he does switch, we will immediately lose the majority, and the republican party will be back in power in the Senate.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:20 pm#341 I think Joe just needs to register as a Republican already and stop jerking everyone around.
Joe, as an Israeli stooge, needs to to register as a foreign agent under Congressional law. Although born in America, this traitor's loyalty is not to his country of birth.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:21 pmTakin' off.
Have a good night all.
BART, if you get a chance #98 on the "we're makin' progress" thread was mine......I had a blast and you might get a chuckle out of it.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:22 pmSee ya Sarge. I'll check it out.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:23 pmBecause if he does switch, we will immediately lose the majority, and the republican party will be back in power in the Senate.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 13, 2007 @ 5:20 pm
I don't think so...at least in terms of heading the committees. Voting wise, it really changes nothing, he already is voting hawkish. Demorcrats will still head committees until the next election.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:25 pm,
Thankd for defending the honor of Muslims.
We love this site and it’s good to know we have friends here in America.
I also like the fact posters like you hope for a Jihadi victory in Iraq!
We’re winnning and victory will be ours!
Ish’Allah!
Comment by Umar Lee — July 13, 2007 @ 5:23 pm
Sure sure, anytime Umar,... hey look, do you think we could convince you to Jihad the Jokers ass?
July 13th, 2007 at 5:25 pmIsh’Allah!
Comment by Umar Lee
It's i'N'sh'Allah, you dummy.
Thought you were going out, Joker.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:26 pmSee ya Sarge. I’ll check it out.
Comment by BARTLEBEE
Thanks, enjoy your weekend.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:28 pmI don’t think so…at least in terms of heading the committees. Voting wise, it really changes nothing, he already is voting hawkish. Demorcrats will still head committees until the next election.
Comment by funky p — July 13, 2007 @ 5:25 pm
I'm not sure, but I think you're wrong. Whoever has balance of power gets to chair the committes, and I don't think an election has to occur for that to happen. I think if Lieberman switched, the Senate would have to select a new President Pro Tempore (currently Robert Byrd) and a new Majority Leader, (currently Harry Reid), as well as a new whip, a new caucus secretary, etc.
I am not sure but I think they would just sort of "switch" titles.
Harry Reid would automatically become the "Minority leader", and Mitch McConnell would become the Majority leader.
I mean, you can't be the Majority leader if you're in the minority.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:31 pmI’d invite you to come to my house for some whup ass but hispanics are only allowed in my neighborhood if they’er cutting the grass.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:10 pm
---------------------------------------------
SHAMEFUL!!!
and
DISGUSTING!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 5:31 pmComment by Umar Lee — July 13, 2007 @ 5:23 pm
Fuk You MuslimSh*teater!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 5:33 pm357.
Visiti my site if you want to discuss events with Muslim Americans.
We are on the same team against the Neo-Cons.
Here’s my link:
Umarlee.com
Please post, you are welcome my friend.
Comment by Umar Lee — July 13, 2007 @ 5:30 pm
I thought you hated the infidel, I'm gonna tell Mohammed what you said.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:33 pmUmar Lee,
Look at your lover!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 5:35 pmHow does it feel to know that he is cheating on you!!!!!
http://zombietime.com/mohammed_image_archive/extreme_mohammed/mohammad1.jpeg
Revoltin' Joe must think his name is on the DC Madame's list; he's put on new knee pads and lubricated himself up. We have eighteen more months to go to see how much more pathetic this man can become.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:38 pmBush has a lock on WORST PRESIDENT IN US HISTORY.
There's isn't even a close second.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:38 pmPlease, your continous projection provides me with non-stop laughter, my senile citizen.
Comment by CT_V1
Projection? Next to white trash in the dictionary they have your picture.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:38 pmAnd no one will have to ask, “which crazy guy?†they’ll know exactly who’s being referenced. “Right, the one with the pork chop.â€
Comment by SGT Higgins
Good one Sarge.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:40 pmComment by BARTLEBEE — July 13, 2007 @ 5:31 pm
You may be right on that Bart...I'm looking for that information; got a link?
July 13th, 2007 at 5:41 pmIt’s i’N’sh’Allah, you dummy.
Thought you were going out, Joker.
Comment by SGT Higgins
This ones Mr. President. Evening sarge.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:44 pmSure sure, anytime Umar,… hey look, do you think we could convince you to Jihad the Jokers ass?
Comment by BARTLEBEE
You slay me Bartlebee.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:44 pmComment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 5:38 pm
Again, please continue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BTW, leading dictionaries are considering the addition of the words, "Chatty Kathies," "Overrated, pushy whining mothers," and "hag projector," and they're seriously considering your picture, name, and even listing your address right next to the terms. Good luck.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:45 pmSHAMEFUL!!!
and
DISGUSTING!!!
Comment by Mr. President — July 13, 2007 @ 5:31 pm
Comment by Umar Lee — July 13, 2007 @ 5:23 pm
Fuk You MuslimSh*teater!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Comment by Mr. President
Hypocrite.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:46 pmBTW, leading dictionaries are considering the addition of the words, “Chatty Kathies,†“Overrated, pushy whining mothers,†and “hag projector,†and they’re seriously considering your picture, name, and even listing your address right next to the terms. Good luck.
Comment by CT_V1 — July 13, 2007 @ 5:45 pm
This thread is about Joe Lieberman. Why do you say these horrid things about kissyface joe
July 13th, 2007 at 5:47 pmGood luck.
Comment by CT_V1
Loser.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:49 pmComment by BARTLEBEE — July 13, 2007 @ 5:31 pm
This was brought up about two weeks ago here on TP. (I'm getting too old to remember details). However, there was a deal put into effect that should this happen, no change in the leadership positions would take place. As I recall it lasts until 2008.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:49 pmPerhaps someone with a better memmory than I can point out the thread or the official docs that lay it out.
Mr. President,
Your time is running out!
Islam is victorious everywhere, you shallow Christians are losing.
Even in your own countries we are winning with the help of the Left!
Christianity’s time is running out!
Comment by Umar Lee — July 13, 2007 @ 5:41 pm
July 13th, 2007 at 5:50 pmYou clearly are confused. Lieberman, your chief recruiter, is on the Right!
And he's a Jew.
You may be right on that Bart…I’m looking for that information; got a link?
Comment by funky p — July 13, 2007 @ 5:41 pm
Why does everyone think anything anyone says involves a link?
You know, when I was growing up, we didn't have the internet. We didn't even have personal computers. People had to like, "know sh$t" and stuff.
Anyway not taking it out on you, just venting.
No, I don't have a link. Sorry.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:50 pmHowever, there was a deal put into effect that should this happen, no change in the leadership positions would take place. As I recall it lasts until 2008.
Perhaps someone with a better memmory than I can point out the thread or the official docs that lay it out.
Comment by Merlin — July 13, 2007 @ 5:49 pm
July 13th, 2007 at 5:53 pmI suffer too from overly gray gray cells, but that is my recollection as well.
And no response to the other points I made? Eisenhower is a lefty now?
I certainly don’t know of any solidly conservative policies he enacted. He was mostly nonpartisan, other than his disastrous Supreme Court.
Comment by m12 — July 13, 2007 @ 4:40 pm
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yup. Ike is Lefty now.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:55 pmAnyway not taking it out on you, just venting.
July 13th, 2007 at 5:56 pmComment by BARTLEBEE — July 13, 2007 @ 5:50 pm
No offense taken, and my thoughts that Democrats would retain committee control is what you termed "knowing shit" and you thought the shit I knowed was shit!
Comment by Umar Lee — July 13, 2007 @ 5:41 pm
We will never surrender to your barbarian religion!
You know of nothing but sand and camels!!!
Did you see your lover in the link!!!!
How do you now!!!
HAHAHA!!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 5:57 pmWe don’t defend muslims and we don’t hate latins. We hate you reich wing nuts. That isn’t racist, its philosophical.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:46 pm
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First, let me say:
BwAHhAHHAHAHAHAHaHhahHAhahHAHhaHAHhAHhaHHAhahHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We don’t defend muslims and we don’t hate latins. We hate you reich wing nuts. That isn’t racist, its philosophical.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:46 pm
I’d invite you to come to my house for some whup ass but hispanics are only allowed in my neighborhood if they’er cutting the grass.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:10 pm
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, let me say:
July 13th, 2007 at 6:01 pmHYPOCRITE!
We don’t defend muslims and we don’t hate latins. We hate you reich wing nuts. That isn’t racist, its philosophical.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:46 pm
——————————————————————————–
First, let me say:
BwAHhAHHAHAHAHAHaHhahHAhahHAHhaHAHhAHhaHHAhahHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
——————————————————————————–
We don’t defend muslims and we don’t hate latins. We hate you reich wing nuts. That isn’t racist, its philosophical.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:46 pm
I’d invite you to come to my house for some whup ass but hispanics are only allowed in my neighborhood if they’er cutting the grass.
Comment by shane — July 13, 2007 @ 4:10 pm
———————————————————————————-
Now, let me say:
July 13th, 2007 at 6:03 pmHYPOCRITE!
That's better.
OK Bart and funky p here is somethingb on that issue of leadership loss. The article is:
Could the Democrats Lose the Senate before the Next Election?
By Richard K. Neumann, Jr.
Listed on "The Object of History" website. Sorry no URL.
The November 2006 elections produced a Senate with a thin Democratic majority, 51 to 49. After Tim Johnson was hospitalized in December, there was much speculation in the media that the Republicans would insist that the new Senate’s organizing resolution contain language like the one adopted in 2001, and that they would filibuster a resolution that lacked it. But the resolution adopted on January 12 contained no such provision, and the Republicans quietly acquiesced. Why?
July 13th, 2007 at 6:07 pmThe Republicans aren’t saying. But their position was weak for two reasons.
First, the 2001 resolution was unique because the situation was unique: an exactly tied Senate from the first day. Some other Senates have started with thin majorities, but the majority party would get an organizing resolution without an escape clause, which is the precedent on which the Democrats could rely.
Second, the Democrats now have an advantage that the Republicans did not have in 2000 — a popular mandate. In the last two elections, many more Americans have voted for Democratic senatorial candidates than for Republicans. In 2004, the Democrats got over four million more senate votes than the Republicans did. In this year’s elections, the Democrats and the two independents who caucus with them got six and a half million more senate votes than the Republicans. In all the elections that produced the 100 senators in the current Senate, 96 million votes were cast for Democratic senatorial candidates and 87 million for Republicans. When the public has so clearly expressed its preference for a Democratic Senate, the Republicans would have looked awful to the public if they had used a filibuster to obstruct it from functioning.
So if the Republicans were to pick up a seat or two and gain a majority, they would get no help from the organizing resolution now in effect. They would instead be in the position that Lyndon Johnson’s Democrats were in the 83d Congress.
No offense taken, and my thoughts that Democrats would retain committee control is what you termed “knowing shit†and you thought the shit I knowed was shit!
Comment by funky p — July 13, 2007 @ 5:56 pm
Lol. No, I didn't think it was sh$t, I'm really not sure. Someone just said above that the senate struck a deal that if Traitor Joe decides to make it official, that they'd retain control until the 08 elections.
Thats possible I guess, as the Congress does get to make its own rules, but I can't figure out what the democrats could have possibly offered the republicans to make them consent to that.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:10 pmEvery year a consortium of American College History professors and professional historians rates all the presidents on a set of criteria. Bush supporters, historical perspective on GW Bush is not looking good. 75% of this consortium already believes that he will be rated in the bottom five of all presidents if not the worst in history. Even thought close to 40% of the professors in this forum call themselves "conservatives" nobody has Bush rated better than mediocre.
But, on this thread, my favorite idiot is again Mr. M12 with his incessant quoting of JFK's call for cutting taxes. Yes, M12, by all means, let's go back to where taxes were when JFK lowered them. Can anyone guess where JFK's "lowered" rates were for the wealthiest Americans? Oh, oh, they were about 55%. Great idea, m12!
July 13th, 2007 at 6:12 pmI hope that everyones figured out that Mr President and Umar Lee are the same person.
:|
Assuming you can call it a person.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:14 pmI wonder how difficult it would be for TP to compare IP addresses and monikers to eliminate the Umar/MrPee syndrome.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:17 pmI imagine its a time thing RuC. Besides, then who would we laugh at?
July 13th, 2007 at 6:19 pmPoint well made Bartles, Daryll doesn't come out except on gay threads...well, and Hindu prayer items.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:23 pmComment by Merlin — July 13, 2007 @ 6:07 pm
Thanks for clearing that up.
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — July 13, 2007 @ 6:12 pm
Nice one! Nothing like the truth to scare the trolls back under the bridge.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:26 pmSome day Robert Novak will write a book praising Bush.
Or maybe William Kristol.
But a historian? Not if he can read!
the correct exchange was:
HEWITT: Oh, that’s fascinating. Last question, how do you think history’s going to evaluate George W. Bush?
LIEBERMAN: Well, I personally believe look, mistakes were made, and I know the polls are down, but I think on the largest issue of our time, which is the rise of Islamist extremism, that he will be judged as a president who saw the threat, and in doing the most insane think possible, initiated an unpopular war, he then stupidly stuck with it and escalated it. And so I think overall, over time, his ratings among the historians will be even less than his ratings in the polls today.
i think the transcribers got it wrong, joe can't be that stupid, can he ??
July 13th, 2007 at 6:27 pmMost of these far right wingnuts are pretty funny all in all. They're not conservatives. They're like "Uber-Conservatives". I know, I was a republican for most of my life. Why? Because like most "casual" republicans, I didn't understand what it meant to be one. Nor did I care. I was interested in one thing. Making money. Which made me fit right in.
But George W Bush helped me figure out that I didn't fit in. So now, I vote for democrats.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:27 pmI wonder how difficult it would be for TP to compare IP addresses and monikers to eliminate the Umar/MrPee syndrome.
Comment by RUCerious — July 13, 2007 @ 6:17 pm
---------------------------------------------------
I'm not Umar.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:28 pmThen you wouldn't have any problem with a system like that, would you?
July 13th, 2007 at 6:32 pmThen you wouldn’t have any problem with a system like that, would you?
Comment by RUCerious — July 13, 2007 @ 6:32 pm
----------------------------------------------------------------
A registration system?
Not at all.
In fact, I've requested one in one of my emails to TP after someone had stolen my name.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:35 pmHe is Umar, as well as about a half dozen other handles.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:40 pmIn fact, that little argument he just had with Umar?
He was arguing with himself.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:41 pmJust like when he's having sex with his partner, he's really just playing with himself.
July 13th, 2007 at 6:45 pmYou are too Umar. I thought that earlier when made the "that's why we are aligned with you Progressives" comment.
You are also a liar.
And you need a bath
July 13th, 2007 at 6:46 pmAnd I think Joe Lieberman is also Elmer Fudd.
At least I've heard things.
July 13th, 2007 at 7:12 pmFour plus years and over 3600 troops and who knows how many innocent Iraqi citizens and counting, shit for brains. How can you believe lying assholes who have proven to be wrong for so long? You can't. Go to hell Joe, you suck.
July 13th, 2007 at 7:19 pmLike his voice. Thats a dead giveaway.
July 13th, 2007 at 7:34 pm@393 Comment by RUCerious — July 13, 2007 @ 6:17 pm
I wonder how difficult it would be for TP to compare IP addresses and monikers to eliminate the Umar/MrPee syndrome.
I wonder as well. I believe that there should be one user name for each email address which is automatically checked at posting time. That would make it more difficult to namejack, though is not a complete solution. Are there any of you who know what can be done and how expensive/difficult it is to do?
Then there is the need for desire on TPs side. I would like to hear their view on namejacking and abusive trolling as it pertains to the value of their blog. Will they answer? I doubt it. The time I asked TP directly about a problem I never received an answer.
July 13th, 2007 at 7:58 pmHISTORY GOES TO THOSE WHO WRITE IT.
July 13th, 2007 at 8:01 pmAnd who own and control the publishing houses and textbook manufacturers, the History channels and documentary consortiums?
The same bastards who back Bush today. Just as they've ressurrected Nixon's putrid soul from oblivion, they will burnish W's legacy. They're working on it at this very moment. They're actually seeding the media with comparisons to Truman.
"The rich will do anything to hold on to America."
Gore Vidal
And look what they've done to the Kennedy's...
July 13th, 2007 at 8:04 pmI agree that GW Botch is the worst federal employee ever!
Here's a cool idea...Let's raise money for and build "The Worst President Ever Library."
Why not? His Ghoul-Aid guzzling a$$lickers will be busy building the Library of Lies for GW Botch!!!
July 13th, 2007 at 8:49 pmLieberman tripped out on too much LSD as a kid.
July 13th, 2007 at 9:07 pmWhat do you expect from the Mossad?
July 13th, 2007 at 10:01 pmOn the subject of history, Historian David Halberstam wrote a piece this past April that may have some bearing on the matter; he is an historian after all, so maybe he knows at least as much as LIEberman on the matter
Here's a couple of quotes for you history buffs. You'll get a sense for how bush measures up:
But rather than students of history, Halberstam writes, "They are people groping for rationales for their failed policy, and as the criticism becomes ever harsher, they cling to the idea that a true judgment will come only in the future, and history will save them."
Halberstam asserts that Bush's description of the lessons of history, much like his rationale for war, is based on political necessity, blind arrogance, cherrypicking evidence, and a disdain for the facts.
He says this about Bush's delusional state:
His is a world where other nations admire America or damned well ought to, and America is always right, always on the side of good, in a world of evil, and it's just a matter of getting the rest of the world to understand this.
The president tends to drop off in his history lessons after World War II, especially when we get to Vietnam and things get a bit murkier. Had he made any serious study of our involvement there, he might have learned that the sheer ferocity of our firepower created enemies of people who were until then on the sidelines, thereby doing our enemies' recruiting for them. And still, today, our inability to concentrate such "shock and awe" on precisely whom we would like—causing what is now called collateral killing—creates a growing resentment among civilians, who may decide that whatever values we bring are not in the end worth it, because we have also brought too much killing and destruction to their country....
Even today George and his worshippers don't get it. If you attack someone, and kill their children, and their fathers, and their lovers; they kind of resent that. And people who share their faith or their circumstance, also feel that resentment. They may see you for the actual threat you are to their way of life and their customs and culture.
July 13th, 2007 at 10:34 pmIn American history, American media and politicians have always made the enemy, whoever they were, out to be sub-human scum. Those pesky 'redskins' that had the temerity to be born on White Christians' land started it, and it continues today. Two hundred years from now we will apologize to Iraq for stealing their oil, and grant them permission to open gambling casinos outside the green zone.
Bush and his minions today are as deluded as Nixon's minions were before (and some still are):
Venturing into that room, visitors learned that Watergate, which provoked a constitutional crisis and became an enduring byword for abuses of executive power, was really a "coup" engineered by Nixon enemies. The exhibit accused Washington Post reporters Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein — without evidence — of "offering bribes" to further their famous coverage.
[...]
This was history as Nixon wanted it remembered, a monument to his decades-long campaign to refurbish his name. Nixon himself approved the exhibit before the library's 1990 opening.
"Everybody who visited it, who knew the first thing about history, thought it was a joke," one Nixon scholar, David Greenberg, said of the Watergate gallery. "You didn't know whether to laugh or cry."
Nixon library's changes start with Watergate
It doesn't matter how much Pres Bush and his deluded cultists lie to others and themselves (like Nixon and his loyalists did), Iraq is still a disaster, his domestic initiatives have come to naught, he has politicised every branch of the government (much like Nixon did), and he has broken more laws than I care to count. Historians already agree: his legacy will be one of abject failure. He is one of the worst presidents ever.
July 13th, 2007 at 10:54 pmYes, the troll now has a troll. Let’s see how much he likes it.
Comment by Mr. Pee is the lamest troll ever — July 13, 2007 @ 8:29 pm
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Whatever. If you think that Umar was me, report it.
July 14th, 2007 at 12:54 amWhile you are at it, ask for a registration system, I'm all for that!!!
Last time I checked twice nothing was still nothing
July 14th, 2007 at 12:55 amI'm with you guys!!! It is hard to imagine, right?
I mean, with so many of us already of the opinion that President George W. Bush has been the greatest leader of the USA thus far... how could those in the future love him more than we do today!?!
George W. Bush, Great Man, Great Politician, Great President!!!
God Bless the US of A!!!
July 14th, 2007 at 1:02 amA tell all guide to troll-spoting
http://www.benfrank.net/disinfo/#top
pass it on.
July 14th, 2007 at 1:49 am#403
July 14th, 2007 at 1:58 amYep that's right Dems trying to rewrite history.
rewrite history?
History is only interpretation unless you where present and even then our memories change through time for a multitude of reasons
July 14th, 2007 at 2:12 am"LIEBERMAN: Well, I personally believe look, mistakes were made, and I know the polls are down, but I think on the largest issue of our time, which is the rise of Islamist extremism, that he will be judged as a president who saw the threat, and in the midst of an unpopular war, he stuck with it. And so I think overall, over time, his ratings among the historians will be greater than his ratings in the polls today."
The only way that it would be possible for George W. Bush to somehow elevate in the future his current abyssmal ranking among U.S. presidents would be if the threat from Islamist extremism kept escalating and widening far beyond Bush's last day in office, making Bush and his rogue vice-president, Dick Cheney, appear to be almost prophetic, and lend some sort of post-mortem justification for all the laws they had to bend and break to address the Islamist extremism threat.
Oh, wait, everything Bush and Cheney have done since entering the White House has been counter-productive to containing and lessening the threat from the Islamist extremists. In fact, everything they've done has escalated and expanded this threat, appearing almost intentional in nature. Bush and Cheney have been poking a stick at the Islamic fundamentalist hornet's nest, while claiming that their actions will somehow lessen and negate the threat of America being stung. Which indicates that their true intent is not related at all to promoting and sustaining any type of peace, but instead involves establishing perpetual, self-perpetuating war.
Besides the Bush/Cheney distaste for diplomacy, the biggest escalation and expansion of the Islamist extremism threat was in Bush and Cheney ordering the invasion of Iraq and deposing of Saddam Hussein. Neither Iraq, nor Saddam Hussein, had anything to do with the 9/11 attacks. The real Islamist culprits had had their headquarters and terrorist training facilities in Afghanistan, with the ultra-orthodox, ultra-conservative shariah-spouting Islamist Taliban providing refuge to the al Qaeda and their gangs of trained assassins.
So, of course, and based on the radical and twisted neo-con Republican way of thinking, after the al Qaeda and Taliban in Afghanistan were dealt with following 9/11, then Iraq was next on their menu, even though in Iraq any Islamist extremists were kept under tight watch and control by Saddam Hussein's government. In fact, instead of Bush and Cheney flooding our troops and humanitarian funds into Afghanistan after the routing of the Taliban and al Qaeda there, they actually drew down our troop strength in Afghanistan and diverted these terrorist fighting assets of our nation from the epicenter of Islamist extremism in Afghanistan to prepare for an ill-conceived, ill-planned and ill-executed war in Iraq, wasting valuable and irreplaceable resources that our nation needs to address the Islamist extremism threat.
In other words, everything Bush and Cheney have done has literally weakened us while strenghtening the al Qaeda and Islamist extremists. They continue to poke a stick at this Islamist extremist hornet's nest, with the next stick probably being their ordering of the bombing of suspected nuclear sites in Iran, which will only inflame Islamist extremism even more, which will probably even turn some of our erstwhile Arab allies against us and lead them to side with the Islamist extremists instead.
Once again, are Bush and Cheney stirring up these hornet's nest on purpose, intentionally doing one insane thing after another to expand and escalate this threat, while doing almost nothing to lessen and contain it? Or, are both of them just so dumb that they didn't have a clue beforehand that moving the battlefield from Afghanistan to Iraq would have these tragic, costly and dangerous effects?
July 14th, 2007 at 2:27 amTo the joker on 82
July 14th, 2007 at 2:44 amjoker you should learn how to read! Being pissed off at Bush because of his lies how he crept up to power and forced this criminal war on all of us does not equate to supporting Muslims.
What a dumb ass freak you are Joker
people are mad at the freak Bush so that makes the Islamo-Stalinist this is personal ok we're pissed off at the freak!
"Once again, are Bush and Cheney stirring up these hornet’s nest on purpose, intentionally doing one insane thing after another to expand and escalate this threat, while doing almost nothing to lessen and contain it? Or, are both of them just so dumb that they didn’t have a clue beforehand that moving the battlefield from Afghanistan to Iraq would have these tragic, costly and dangerous effects?"
Comment by The Oracle — July 14, 2007 @ 2:27 am
Thank you for your excellent post. Unfortunately, I'm afraid (literally) that it's the former. Although, as regards the latter choice, it could be that the whopping 2-1/2 hours that Colin Powell spent trying to convince Bush not to invade just bored Bush, what with all foreign country names that he can't keep straight, and all that history stuff. He probably just sat nodding at Powell and thought about what he wanted for his next meal.
July 14th, 2007 at 3:43 amLiebermann is such a sorry excuse for a human being, let alone a representative of any country. Old Vinegar Joe would gladly start a war with anyone (as long as he doesn't have to do any fighting, just shooting his idiot mouth off), in order to gain a headline. The guy is so desperate for a news bite he gladly declare a war on Israel it it would get him re-elected. I think American Heritage Dictionary terms such moral fabric as a whore.
American Heritate Dictionary
July 14th, 2007 at 6:51 amwhore (hôr, hÅr) Pronunciation Key
n.
1. A prostitute.
2. A person considered sexually promiscuous.
3. A person considered as having compromised principles for personal gain.
Google 'Hitler'
July 14th, 2007 at 7:55 amHistory will judge Joe Lieberman as an even bigger putz than he is regarded now, especially if the history books include photos of him in his "Tooter Turtle" helmet and body armor in Baghdad.
July 14th, 2007 at 9:48 amBARF!
July 14th, 2007 at 12:06 pmAll of this dialogue is just that. Nothing is being done except giving these dilusional people a voice. Let's not diaolgue any more with people like the joker or anyone else who is illiterate and foolish. It is all coming home now...our shores ARE threatened now due to these people and their "wannabe" dictators...cheney, bush and co. This war has NOTHING to do with terrorists but rather oil and money. Actions are better than words. I am not a christian but somewhere in the Bible it says "Do not cast your pearls of wisdom among swine." Bush, Cheney and supporters of this war supporters are swine. Their god will have to forgive them and they will have to live with this. Unfortunately, good people are dying. It's a shame that war supporters who stay home and spin lies aren't going to Iraq to die if they really believe their lies.
July 14th, 2007 at 1:48 pmFor once i think joe got this one right. Bush will be remember as a president with a vision, a vision that he went for despite massive opposition. I think my kids and thier kids will learn about Bush as a hero and as an iconic president.
July 14th, 2007 at 2:16 pmI submit that these people are not only mentally retarded, but quite possibly criminally insane*. They are also running the US.
Quaint. Do anybody know why their presence is still tolerated in the American administration, never mind on Planet Earth?
* A rare, but incredibly unfortunate combination.
July 14th, 2007 at 2:16 pmJoe Lieberman is right. In an era when most politicians in both parties test the wind and go along with popular sentiment, George Bush refuses to play that game.
Rather than do the popular thing so he can have high popularity ratings, he is doing what is necessary to protect the country...and he is paying the price.
Winston Churchill was a very unpopular guy in the days before World War II, when the likes of Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain were rolling over and giving Hitler Czechloslovakia and anything else he demanded, in the vain hope that Hitler would be satisfied and war avoided.
Churchill correctly predicted that Britain would have to fight Germany...and the nation finally threw out the appeasers and defeatists, and turned to Churchill for leadership, when Hitler refused to be satisfied and started the war in 1939.
I'm proud to say that I voted for George Bush in both elections. I'm proud to say that I voted for a man whom I believe history will judge as a great president, on a par with Washington, Lincoln, and FDR.
Hate him all you like...it will not change history's judgment. Years from now many of you...if you have any shred of human decency at all...will be ashamed of the way you abuse and mock him now.
July 14th, 2007 at 2:18 pmBush will be remembered as the Un-American Activity that he is and was.
No more or less. Reagan was a good president?? Bullfeathers, he was
a B actor, and a shill.
Bush is a dangerous brain dead douchebag that used the phrase "Commander-in-Chief" no less than 15 times during his inauguration speech. We knew where this National Guard pussy was headed from the get-go.
Bush is a lame, Texan wannabe. A failed oilman, and were it not for the family money and influence, he would be washing windows at stoplights today.
July 14th, 2007 at 2:22 pmI think thats wishful thinking since no ones giving him a thumbs up now maybe when were all dead and gone he will get a thumbs up... Yea right
July 14th, 2007 at 2:36 pmHistorically, Bush has THE WORST RECORD FIGHTING DOMESTIC TERRORISM, bar none. No attack since 9/11, you say? Bush still has THE WORST RECORD FIGHTING DOMESTIC TERRORISM.
Do not speak of 9/11 as if it was a muligan that doesn't count. Historians won't overlook the facts which include Bush & Co being wrong about everything. They'll even get a kick out of the little sidebar Historical Fact: The Bushlicans even thought we would think they were right, after all. Hardy har har har har!
July 14th, 2007 at 3:12 pmHistory will rate Joe Lieberman as the biggest mistake made by Connecticut voters since Thomas Hooker arrived in Hartford in 1635.
July 14th, 2007 at 3:31 pmGOOD OL' HEBERMAN,
July 14th, 2007 at 3:55 pmISRAEL FIRST, ALWAYS!!
ARENT YOU SUPPOSED TO
REPRESENT AMERICANS?????
Wonder if the nutmeggers have finally figured out that they were duped big time by Holy Joe and his Repuke friends? If I was selling snake oil, Connecticut would be my first stop and would undoubtedly be my ticket to unimaginable riches and early retirement. Unfortunately for this country, his constituents voted based upon wishful thinking rather than assessing Kissyface's actions, which clearly predicted the course he has taken since the 2006 election.
Surely, Lie-berman is on the short list to join Chimpy, Rover and Jeff Gannon for fun and frivolity at the faux ranch in Crawford whenever Laura is out of town. And be sure that everyone is given a take-home videotape of the proceedings for insurance purposes--no one could point the finger at anyone else without risking an end to their political career.
July 14th, 2007 at 3:57 pmHe will be viewed as greater than his polls are today. ROTFLMFAO. His polls are in the toilet but still too high.
July 14th, 2007 at 4:26 pmConnecticut, for shame for electing this clown!
July 14th, 2007 at 4:29 pmFirst, it's obvious that Joe Lieberman is at least as delusional as George W. Bush. We have never been faced with as serious a constitutional crisis, or border so closely on a dictatorship as we do today, which was stated by Barbara Boxer - one of the first politicians to publicly attempt to warn America that we hover dangerously close to the point of no return.
There is a way to impeach Bush and Cheney in one-fell-swoop, but to do so, we have to remember Joe Biden's request for people to call the White House and Congress to express their outrage; A Blogger caried it one step further, published the White House phone directory - and the phone system for both branches of government eventually crashed under the weight of the calls.
But, Congress listened, and were shocked at the out-pouring of outrage by the American people, something that has been absent since we were abandoned by the Mainstream News Media! It may have been by accident, but it was proven that even when the MSM decides to stifle honest debate and present spin and misinformation rather than facts - "The People" can still be heard!
Let's throw these bums out of office, and now - while free speech is still a right that Bush/Cheney haven't yet dissolved or watered-down to the point that we as a people become totally ineffectual. There's still time, and there's no time like the present to support those in Congress that actually have a backbone and are attempting to save our country!
Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid – Refusing to Stand-Up for the People!
July 14th, 2007 at 4:59 pmI would guess that future historians will be wondering how in the hell morons like bush and lieberman ever managed to getelected in the first place .
July 14th, 2007 at 5:26 pmAhhh Joe....I sat home and did not vote for Gore in 2000 because of Joe, I may have been wrong about not voting for Gore but certainly not Liberman.
July 14th, 2007 at 6:15 pmWhat an ass. Joe has truly "jumped the couch" and I can't wait until 2012 when Connecticut voters send him packing.
July 14th, 2007 at 7:00 pmRight. Bush's ratings with historians may, at some future date, rival those of Attila the Hun and Adolph Hitler. Though only a footnote, Lieberman will be right there with him.
July 14th, 2007 at 7:11 pmLeiberman is delusional chicken hawk coward.
All I can think of is that Joe should be on the front lines in Iraq with the soldiers he so easily dismisses.
Not backed up and supported by hundreds of security forces but in a uniform riding in an unarmed hummer day after day.
July 14th, 2007 at 7:20 pmJoe is such an a**hole. Who would listen to anyone who would have his campaign say "Connecticut for Lieberman" - the ego, the balls of this jerk. Sorry Joe, we don't need historians to let us know how screwed we've been by "the commander guy" (i.e. commander bunny pants!)
And don't forget this Pope is accused of conspiracy to cover up sexual abuse of children in the U.S., and at the Vatican's request, BUSH GRANTED THE POPE IMMUNITY FROM PROSECUTION. SO I CAN ONLY DEDUCE THAT BUSH HATES CHILDREN AND LOVES PEDOPHILES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
July 14th, 2007 at 7:24 pmDon't take my word for it, rent the film DELIVER US FROM EVIL. Shocking and disgusting, no wonder Bush's name is in it!!
Yes Joe, we know how history treated the last guy who started a War of Aggression.
Let's start writing the history now then:
George W. Bush, one of the most odious and misguided scoundrels ever to poison the halls of government was buried in Arlington National Cemetary today. Nobody showed up.
July 14th, 2007 at 7:50 pmWhen pigs fly. . . who is Joe Leiberman to make any predictions about history. Why is anyone interviewing Leiberman anyway?
July 14th, 2007 at 8:03 pmCrazy much, are we, Joe? What in the hell has George Bush done in the last seven years that turned out well? How is our country better because of what he and his administration has done? Any small progress or positive change that has occurred on his watch is totally undone and overwhelmed by the monumental fiasco of Iraq. All Americans alive and unborn will be paying for the stupidity and evil of the Bush/Cheney years. We will be less safe, less prosperous and less free because we stupidly allowed these people to rule our country without oversight or limits.
July 14th, 2007 at 8:23 pmJoe you just continue to disappoint ......
July 14th, 2007 at 8:26 pmLiebalman is a shill for Israel. An Israeli firster. He cares not about our country, only that our tax dollars go to Israel and our soldiers die for Israel.
July 14th, 2007 at 9:04 pmyou have to admit it--where else can two half baked morons get so far?
July 14th, 2007 at 10:23 pmHistorians and the American people who Bush lied to into this war, will remember him as the worst president just like Nixon who disgraced the presidency over his conduct of the Vietnam war and Watergate. No wonder Nixon resigned. Bush, like Nixon has disgraced this office. The American people no longer respect Bush or like him.
The most important issue of our time has been Bush's poor response to warnings about the 9-11 attacks before they took place. It happened on his watch not Clinton's. Since the attacks he used the good will of the American people and misused it. He lied us into a war using 9-11 as an excuse. It is clear that Bush doesn't have the respect of the American people because he started a war of choice that most Americans think is a mistake. The surge has failed and it failed due to his failed policy in Iraq.
July 14th, 2007 at 11:17 pmWho cares what a political hermaphrodite thinks history will say?
July 14th, 2007 at 11:41 pmIf Iraq is so critical to our security why aren't the Bush double scotch twins, Jenna and whats her name, in the military and over in Iraq?
July 15th, 2007 at 2:25 amI don't expect them to fight but they could be comfort women for the Iraqi troops.
Why would ANYONE believe ANYTHING that comes out of LIEbermann's mouth? Bush and Cheney will be reviled for many reasons, the least of which is dragging us into a war of their own making. If Congress did the right thing, they'd both be impeached for their crimes. Their names will go down in infamy.
July 15th, 2007 at 3:01 am#381 -- To answer your question, "Why is anyone interviewing Leiberman anyway?" -- Probably for the same reason than Ann (The Man) Coulter is still being interviewed. They can both be counted on to say something that is outrageous to any reasonable person while at the same time tossing red meat to the neocon knuckledragger crowd.
July 15th, 2007 at 3:26 amIt’s interesting that now, with the war more unpopular than ever and violence skyrocketing, Lieberman decides Bush is a great president. In contrast, in May 2003, when Lieberman was competing for the Democratic nomination...
Well no, that's not interesting.
July 15th, 2007 at 6:37 amIn fact it's gotten pretty fkn boring over the past 9 months having you repeatedly point to such a shift in policy as though you haven't yet figured out this most simple of examples in cause and effect.
Here is the real reason we went into Iraq and eliminated Saddam Hussein and why we are not being told about it.\:
After 9/11 our greatest enemy was recognized as being radical Sunni Islam. Most of the 9/11 terrorists came from Saudi Arabia and were adherents to the violent and intolerant Wahhabiism teachings. Saudi Arabia has been actively involved in exporting this ideology around the world using oil money generated within that state.
This created a serious problem. We could not turn on our Saudi “friends†and there was not an easy way to attack the widely disbursed Sunni radicals. A creative response was needed.
Much of foreign policy is built on the time-tested principles of “divide and conquer†and “the enemy of my enemy is my friend.†To turn these principles into strategies, it was necessary to find a group, which was a natural enemy of the Sunni radicals. The obvious choice for this is the moderate Shiites who have their spiritual center in Iraq. An added reason for supporting these moderates is that they are not in line with the radical Shiites who now control the government of Iran. The installation of a moderate Shiite regime in Iraq would have the double benefit of becoming a thorn in the sides of both Iran and Saudi Arabia,
Of course, the best way to help the moderate Shiites was to take out their nemesis, Saddam Hussein, who had for many years stood as the bulwark against the hated forces of Shia. He had ruthlessly persecuted the Shiites in Iraq and mounted a lengthy and bloody war against Iran. The Sunni Muslims could ignore the Shiites, many of whom lived in their midst, because Saddam was holding them at bay.
Saddam had at one time been a close ally of the US, which was instrumental in bringing him to power and supplied him with armaments. Why did he turn against us? Remember “Iran-Contra?†Saddam was incensed when he found out that we were secretly funding and arming Iran in their fight with us. It became clear to him that all along, it has been our policy to contain his power. Research this strange episode and you will find commentators mystified as to the reasons behind it. No one states the obvious. We wanted to help Iran but needed to keep it a secret. VP Bush was the mastermind and even then we were playing the Sunni/Shia division.
I am convinced that the real reason we invaded Iraq, eliminated the Baath regime and abandoned our bases in Saudi Arabia is that we wanted to strengthen the power of the moderate Shiites in the region. At this time both sides hate us but also need us as they fight each other. The Bush administration constantly boasts that the proof for the success of our policies is that there have not been any attacks on our soil. Al Quaeda and the radical Sunnis are now concentrating their fury on the newly invigorated Shiite regime taking shape in Iraq. If it all turns out as we hope, the Shiites will be a major counterforce against radical Sunnis and the radical Shiites in Iran.
The nice thing about this theory is that it challenges the accepted wisdom that Bush and his cohorts were naïve in trying to set up a democracy in Iraq. This could never have been our goal. We are leaving the country a mess, but the radical Sunnis now have their traditional enemies to occupy them instead of us.
Even if the civil war in Iraq drags on with more violence or we are asked to leave, we will still have accomplished our primary goal of striking a blow against our most bitter enemy, radical Sunni Islam, and turned their attention to those whom they hate more than us. Having Saudi Sunnis in a dominant position as they coddle and export the virulent versions of their faith has not been healthy for the world or the Mideast region.
July 15th, 2007 at 7:56 amTime will tell if this has been a wise policy. Involving ourselves in the Mideast can have unforeseen consequences. Consider the bitter harvest we have reaped as a result of our support for the Mujadeen in Afghanistan. The ones we built up for that struggle are the same ones who turned on us later. On the other hand, if we accept this theory as the true rationale for our involvement in Iraq, it provides a much more reasonable explanation as to why we went in. It is certainly more credible than the official line that we embarked on this mission with the quixotic rationale of installing democracy in Iraq. That idea never did make sense and in my view was a mere pretense for the true, Machiavellian purposes laid out above. Unfortunately, if this is what we did, our government can never openly express it. Instead, we are left to merely observe and appreciate or dread the outcomes.
Depends on who writes the history. If the mexicans and jews write the history, then, yes, he will be seen as a great president.
July 15th, 2007 at 10:59 amI love it. History will judge him as a great president. What a pile of dung. The truth is often as not historians are right about a person's place in history. Do you think history will judge Adolph Hitler as a great man? Listen. Here's the truth about Joe Lieberman. He is a citizen of Israel first. He would sell the USA down the river if it would advance the cause of Zionism. History will judge Lieberman and Bush as deceitful liars who lacked courage to do the right thing.
July 15th, 2007 at 4:25 pmLiebermann needs to stop smoking CRACk!
July 15th, 2007 at 7:08 pmRolling Stone recently wrote, “Many historians are now wondering whether Bush, in fact, will be remembered as the very worst president in all of American history.â€
I think it's hilarious that you use Rolling Stone as your authority on what "historians" think. It speaks volumes about your credibility.
July 15th, 2007 at 7:42 pmBob said:
"The fact is that he didn’t see the threat until after the worst attack in US history."
Bob, can you read? He saw the threat IN THE MIDDLE OF AN UNPOPULAR WAR.
Are you TRYING
July 15th, 2007 at 7:45 pmSince when did an "educated" society give two shits about what the POP magazine Rolling Stone dug up as a source?
July 15th, 2007 at 10:21 pmOOOHHHH! Rolling Stone said that? Well then go tell Addison Wesley that when they write the next history book, that THE Rolling Stone said Bush is the worst president. Also, maybe they'll publish the story of Batboy, since it came from the equally reputable source, the Weekly World News.
July 15th, 2007 at 10:59 pmThe only thing that has allowed me to tolerate the fact that Gore had the election stolen from him is fact that Lieberman did not become VP. The thought of him being a heartbeat from the Presidency is terrifying.
Bu I do agree with liberman that Bush is going to be revered by hsitorians in the future. He will be regarded as the best president Israel ever had.
July 16th, 2007 at 6:48 pmThe comment inside the article is misleading - Lieberman never said Bush would be remembered as a great president. Instead, he just said that Bush's ratings will increase over time. This could simply mean that one day he'll be slightly less unpopular, or even average, but most certainly does not state he'll be remembered as a great president.
I can't say I actually agree with that sentiment, but it's a very poorly written statement and it thinkprogress needs to do better.
July 16th, 2007 at 9:03 pm