BREAKING: New Terrorism National Intelligence Estimate Released
BREAKING: New Terrorism National Intelligence Estimate Released
The key judgments of the National Intelligence Estimate have been released. Read them HERE. Below, some important findings:
Al Qaeda has “regenerated key elements of its Homeland attack capability”:
Al-Qa’ida is and will remain the most serious terrorist threat to the Homeland, as its central leadership continues to plan high-impact plots, while pushing others in extremist Sunni communities to mimic its efforts and to supplement its capabilities. We assess the group has protected or regenerated key elements of its Homeland attack capability, including: a safehaven in the Pakistan Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA), operational lieutenants, and its top leadership.
Iraq has strengthened al Qaeda, which will seek to “leverage the contacts and capabilities” gained in the war:
Of note, we assess that al-Qa’ida will probably seek to leverage the contacts and capabilities of al-Qa’ida in Iraq (AQI), its most visible and capable affiliate and the only one known to have expressed a desire to attack the Homeland.
Al Qaeda’s association with “al Qaeda in Iraq” (AQI) helps to “energize the broader Sunni extremist community” and “recruit and indoctrinate operatives”:
In addition, we assess that its association with AQI helps al-Qa’ida to energize the broader Sunni extremist community, raise resources, and to recruit and indoctrinate operatives, including for Homeland attacks.
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Uh oh.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:20 amDamn, and I thought the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were supposed to make us safer from Al Qaeda. It seems Dick Cheney’s black-ops are doing their jobs!
July 17th, 2007 at 11:21 amDon’t forget to mention just how “glossy” it is.
It’s like 90% glossy and shiny…and 10% telling us things we already know.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:22 amWhat Iraq needs is a strongman to keep the country together and hates religous fanantics with a vengance. Ya know, like that Saddam guy we used to be buddies with.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:25 amHere come the trolls to tell us that this is why we must stay and fight. Of course they will be ignoring the fact that we made it this bad through Bush’s foreign policy.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:25 amShorter version aof the report:
All Muslims and Arabs now hate us.
Things aren’t going according to plan (as if we had a plan).
Our new port, border, and immigration controls will keep anything bad from happening.
Al Queda now includes anyone not in the Republican party.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:25 amAlso please be extremely observant and critical of people who can’t seem to close their HTML tags….ugh. ^_^
July 17th, 2007 at 11:26 amLet me get this straight, the war in Iraq isn’t making us safer from terrorists? SO that means that Fox News/BushCO is lying to us… This is an interesting development…
LOL
July 17th, 2007 at 11:27 amSo….basically, we fought them over there so they could regroup, recruit, regain strength, so so that we would have to fight them over here.
I cannot wait to see how the neocons will spin this.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:29 amSomebody tell Brooks and Kristol. Looks like their boy really screwed up.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:30 amNice…just one more thing to worry about.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:30 amInteresting that all these reports coming now,before September’s Petraeous report,and majority in the US are calling for ending Iraq war.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:31 amPlease note: alQaeda = Sunni
Iran = Shia
If Cheney really wants to strike Iran, it’ll mean war with all of Islam. BTW, Iran considers the Taliban one of its enemies.
This White House reminds me of those Losers in high school who could never master the complexities of chess.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:33 amSo all that “if we leave now they’ll follow us home” is nonsense? shocker.
seems they want to “follow us home” no matter if we never leave.
soon as we leave the Iraqis will kill albert kayduh because they don’t represent Iraqi views.
Iraqis are not muslim extremists. they are one of the most westernized muslim countrys in all the middle east.
Wonder where they’ll strike this time? My guess is Califnornia cuz its so easy to sneak in with all the millions of mexicans coming in and out everyday
July 17th, 2007 at 11:33 amSunni not so much Shia? Isn’t Iran – Shia??????? Isn’t Saudi Arabia Sunni?????
July 17th, 2007 at 11:33 amIf starting wars is profitable for the Plutocrats, just imagine how profitable destroying the entire world will be!
We’re about to find out.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:35 amAre the members of Congress actually gonna read it this time?
July 17th, 2007 at 11:37 amYou should probably fix the title to this item… it seems you have mistakenly referred to a new “IRAQ N.I.E.”, when in fact the National Intelligence Estimate is about “The Terrorist Threat To The U.S. Homeland” (as you know).
As far as Iraq goes, it is not mentioned in the N.I.E. until page 6 (of it’s 7 pages), and only just once, in reference to “al-Qa’ida in Iraq (AQI)”, where they (AQI) are referred to as “a visible and capable affiliate” of al-Qa’ida, followed then by a brief and vague reference to AQI’s “association” with al-Qa’ida.
Anyway, the N.I.E is neither titled “Iraq N.I.E.”, nor is it even about Iraq.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:37 amSo, now they can say that Al Qaeda is a threat and it will actually be true?
IMPEACH!
July 17th, 2007 at 11:37 amInasmuchas alQaeda is a Sunni based political entity
July 17th, 2007 at 11:41 amInasmuchas the 9/11 attackers were primarily Sunni from Saudi Arabia
Inasmuchas the Saudi government has not put a stop to alQaeda
It is hereby ordered that we NUKE Saudi Arabia immediately.
That’ll show em.
Heckuva job, Dubya.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:43 amGot Osama? ITMFAs now!
July 17th, 2007 at 11:46 amLittle Frannie Townsend is tap-dancing in the White House press room right now on this topic.
She is about as unconvincing as SnowJob; however, she is more polished. I think she used to work in timeshare sales.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:46 amWhat I’m taking away from this is that there will be an false flag attack in America, to be blamed on Hezbollah and their “sponsor” Iran.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:52 amWar time; let’s all gather ’round the Commander In Chief.
Are Republicans going to Read the NIE? If Larry Flint publishes it…
July 17th, 2007 at 11:57 amWhy was my post yanked?
July 17th, 2007 at 11:58 amAnyone have the dollar amount spent so far in Iraq to make us less safe than before?
July 17th, 2007 at 11:58 amLandSurveyor sez:
Why indeed, LS.
July 17th, 2007 at 11:59 amBush the Uniter – Redux
((at cognitorex))
.
(President Bush softly sings.)
I miss Arafat in the Springtime,
I miss Saddam in the fall,
Lebanon‘s a mess, it‘s in splinters,
I had no idea at all.
Our one time pal, Saudi’s being squeezed cause of Palestine,
And Iran shows no respect, what gall,
Oh boy, thank God, they fight less in the winter,
I had no idea at all.
Condi says this mess is a great opportunity,
July 17th, 2007 at 12:00 pmSome laugh, but what constitutes reality, is my call,
Every planetary wide entity hates us, look Mom, I am a ‘Uniter’,
Bombs Away, bombs away, you’all.
I seem to remember an NIE being postponed for months when it didn’t confirm this Administrations’ lies a few years ago, but they must be on track now, I guess.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:00 pmGolly, there hadn’t even been _one_ eye-racki international ‘turrisss, but after those doctors in England and Scotland this summer, looks like we finally made a couple.
GREAT work, uncle dick/ Dubyugggh. morons.
Tom, this whoe damned administration is like one of those time share sales pitches, where they promise you lots of good shit, then don’t let you leave until you sign in blood on the dotted line…
July 17th, 2007 at 12:02 pmLook what $600 billion, thousands of American lives, and countless Iraqi lives gets you….
… an even worse situation than when you started.
….sigh….
July 17th, 2007 at 12:09 pmDidn’t they hold up the release of the last NIE? Wasn’t the last one a “good news, we’re winning”?
Now that fear serves their purposes, it’s all doom and gloom?
Is there any reason we should believe them this time?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:17 pmThe result of the ‘Miserable Failure’ administration.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:19 pmLet’s see what Harry Reid says about this. I’m guessing he’ll still push for pulling out even though that would be a disaster for Iraq. Because what’s important is doing what the far left wing of your party wants — not what is right for the country, right Harry?.
Reid is the one who should be impeached.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:21 pmdo you think they hired a wreal righter that could come up with more interesting fiction?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:24 pmhow about this: “Al Qaeda has the full support of the Saudi government and is trying to control Iraq by any means necessary”
“Choose your enemies wisely, for he is who you become.” Chairman Mao
July 17th, 2007 at 12:26 pm… an even worse situation than when you started.
….sigh….
Comment by bobcat_grad
What? then, by all means, continue to dig!
July 17th, 2007 at 12:28 pmCynicon, What’s right for this country? I haven’t seen much evidence of support from you. I haven’t seen any facts being pushed to counter any claims here. You seem content in getting pissy when change is discussed but don’t offer any rationale to “Stay the course”.
And then to end with “Reid is the one who should be impeached” is just dumb. It shows you have the ability to put words together that will form a sentence, but that sentence doesn’t have any substance. A lot like our Mr. President. (pick whichever one suits you).
So make a stand and show your colors. Put forth your ideas on what is right and wrong with all of this. Go for it.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:30 pm“Because what’s important is doing what the far left wing of your party wants”
So 2/3 of the country’s voters are now “far left wing” Democrats? Interesting. Can we get some smarter trolls, please?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:32 pmI can’t believe everyones buying into this bullsh$t.
THINK.
Does anyone find it the least bit convenient that in the middle of a showdown between the White House and Congress over the firing of US Attorneys, not to mention Bush’s all time low approval ratings dropping into the 20’s, and the release of polling data showing half the country is ready for impeachment hearings to begin, that “suddenly”, Classified reports showing Al Quaida and Bin Laden are coming to get us is leaked, and suddenly everyones talking about terrorism again?
No one, other than me, finds this the least bit convenient?
Go figure.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:32 pmWell, Islam is a dangerous ideology. I am sure we will handle this problem appropriately.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:33 pmThe only thing I fear other than Mothra is the GOP, and their idiot “Jebus” worshipping followers who are just as crazy and brain washed as those over there wanting to attack us here.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:36 pmGodzilla,
July 17th, 2007 at 12:38 pmYou fear me!
That’s why you.\, Rodan and Mothra teamed up against me!
Hey since you hate Christians, do you like MUslims and their Pedophile Prophet?
The only thing I fear other than Mothra is the GOP, and their idiot “Jebus†worshipping followers who are just as crazy and brain washed as those over there wanting to attack us here.
Comment by Godzilla — July 17, 2007 @ 12:36 pm
Mothra is scary, but he’s benign to us humans. If you’d stop scaring Japanese people, he might be nice to you too.
As for the Jebus worshipping GOP, you’re right, they are crazy.
But suppose THEY are the ones wanting to attack us here?
Just suppose.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:38 pmI think its a bit convenient that Reid pulls his slumber-party stunt in the midst of ridiculously bad approval numbers for the congress and senate.
You libs need to get together at Cindy Sheehans house and get your attack-lines straight. Half of you claim Iraq is a civil war and AQ has nothing of substance there, the other half claim that Iraq is a training and recruiting ground for AQ.
MorOn.org must be swelling in new memberships.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:38 pmYep, why just last night a Christian car-bomber drove into a local art festival and vaporized fifty people. It was in the news, you saw that right?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:41 pmBARTLBEE,
July 17th, 2007 at 12:41 pmIt’s the Jews who did 9/11 !
Hey since you hate Christians, do you like MUslims and their Pedophile Prophet?
Comment by Ghidorah — July 17, 2007 @ 12:38 pm
You mean as opposed to the pedophile Christian leaders?
Or did you think the Catholic church just gave a few hundred million to the church members of the San Diego parish because they’re nice guys?
Schmuck.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:41 pmBecause what’s important is doing what the far left wing of your party wants — not what is right for the country, right Harry?.
Reid is the one who should be impeached.
Comment by Cynicon Implant — July 17, 2007 @ 12:21 pm
It’s not just the far left wing anymore. Now it’s a solid majority of the country that wants troops withdrawn. BECAUSE it’s right for the country. It’s also what’s right for Iraq, as a majority of the Iraqi people have said repeatedly.
And as I’ve tried to explain many times, pulling out is not “immediate withdrawal.” There’s no such thing as “immediate withdrawal.” In the 12-18 months we will need to get everyone and everything out, there will be plenty of time for the military to train and arm whatever militias we want to befriend and for the GOI to push through sensible legislation that actually benefits the Iraqi people. A withdrawal date is a deadline for the Iraqi government to get its ass in gear.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:41 pmconsidering that 68% of the country, 49% of that block being conservative, wants US to get out now, that’s a big far left wing…
maybe you should tell your boss at advantageconsultants.org to upgrade some of your systems, cause your talking point is played out.
now go be scared…. booga booga.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:42 pmStupid sh*t heard on CNN this morning:
Heidi Collins: Al Qaeda has regrouped and is as strong now as in 2001 – HOW COULD THIS HAVE HAPPENED? (my caps)
Captain Obvious, where are you when we need you?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:42 pmYou libs need to get together at Cindy Sheehans house and get your attack-lines straight. Half of you claim Iraq is a civil war and AQ has nothing of substance there, the other half claim that Iraq is a training and recruiting ground for AQ.
Comment by Crackdaughter — July 17, 2007 @ 12:38 pm
As opposed to you neocons who thought they’d toss flowers and welcome us liberators?
How’s that one working out for you genius?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:43 pmBlackwater,
“Yep, why just last night a Christian car-bomber drove into a local art festival and vaporized fifty people. It was in the news, you saw that right?”
Yeah wasn’t it that Militant Greek Orthodox group called the Party of Justinian?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:43 pmThey’re the ones ranting of getting Constantinople bakc!
Or was it Roman Crusade? That’s the nuts who want to restore the Roman Empire!
BARTLBEE,
It’s the Jews who did 9/11 !
Comment by Ace — July 17, 2007 @ 12:41 pm
Cut that crap out, ace – I assume you are being name jacked here just to be generous.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:46 pmHalf of you claim Iraq is a civil war and AQ has nothing of substance there, the other half claim that Iraq is a training and recruiting ground for AQ.
Comment by Crackdaughter — July 17, 2007 @ 12:38 pm
Not incompatible activities. AQ is not a major player in the civil war, but is using the chaos to train and try stuff out….. thanks Chimpy.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:47 pmIts a scientific fact that Christians are far more dangerous than any other religion. 1000 years ago they put people to death by burning them, proof positive that todays Christians are just as deadly, even if they do run missionaries, homeless shelters, soup kitchens and charitable NGO’s around the world.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:47 pmYep, why just last night a Christian car-bomber drove into a local art festival and vaporized fifty people. It was in the news, you saw that right?
Comment by Blackwater — July 17, 2007 @ 12:41 pm
That didn’t happen. But Christian plane-bombers vaporized thirty-six innocent people last month. That actually was in the news. Did you see it?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:47 pmAs opposed to you neocons who thought they’d toss flowers and welcome us liberators?
How’s that one working out for you genius?
Is that the best you can do, fartandpee? Either AQ is in Iraq or they arent, your choice. 28 million Iraqis hang in the balance, choose wisely and then advise your representatives in the senate.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:50 pmdon’t worry, bush will hold one of his “everything’s great” press conferences shortly and ease all of our concern.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:51 pmIts a scientific fact that Christians are far more dangerous than any other religion. 1000 years ago they put people to death by burning them, proof positive that todays Christians are just as deadly, even if they do run missionaries, homeless shelters, soup kitchens and charitable NGO’s around the world.
Comment by Tony S. — July 17, 2007 @ 12:47 pm
How about they’re ALL dangerous?
I personally am tired of the debate of who’s more dangerous, Christians or Muslims.
History has demonstrated unequivocally that they are BOTH incredibly dangerous, as are most people who believe that God talks to them, and no one else.
Sane people don’t kill because they think God wants them to kill. Period.
That goes for Christians, Muslims and Jews.
We need smart men to lead us. Not religious ones.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:51 pm?
nothing about the policy shift of
face to face talks with IRAN ???
good news for the world’s people…
i hate that i have to wonder what’s up bushco’s sleave…
it should be worthy of a celebration…
fingers crossed…
July 17th, 2007 at 12:52 pmoh, even that has a double meaning…
…
As a supporter of Hamas, Al-Qaeda, Hezzbollah and Iran I do hope for an Islamic victory!
July 17th, 2007 at 12:53 pmI admit it!
I want to get on a rug and pray to Allah everyday!
I’m Muslim. I admit it!
Praise be to Allah!
katy,
July 17th, 2007 at 12:54 pmWhy do you support the Iranian regime?
Are you against Women rights?
Also since when did Iran become the Left’s new cause?
Is Dafur played out?
That actually was in the news. Did you see it?
Yes I did though I failed to see where the article referred to the pilots conducting the airstrike as being Christian, not atheist or jewish or shinto or buddhist or hindu or muslim, but Christian. Could you please confirm that by posting a relevant passage?
Grasp away, sir. Be scared of Christians all you want, they arent conducting worldwide murder campaigns in the name of their religion.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:55 pmhear! hear! bartlebee @ 12:51 pm
extremists, religeous or otherwise, are the problem…
as with EVERYthing: always in moderation…
July 17th, 2007 at 12:55 pmIs that the best you can do, fartandpee? Either AQ is in Iraq or they arent, your choice. 28 million Iraqis hang in the balance, choose wisely and then advise your representatives in the senate.
Comment by Crackdaughter — July 17, 2007 @ 12:50 pm
Thats the best I need to do sally.
See, when you screw up, in a monumental fashion, you lose all credibility.
What you created in Iraq, we call a “clusterf$%k”, which means that you foreited any future claim to speaking authoritatively on the topic.
The losers hour is up. You and the morons with you need to step aside, and let smart men take over. Whatever they can do with the mess you created remains to be seen.
But that doesn’t mean your dumb ass has anything to say about it.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:57 pmnothing about the policy shift of
face to face talks with IRAN ???
good news for the world’s people…
Yes, what great news, the west gets to hold talks with dictators and thugs on an equal basis yet again. What wonderful news! We should send Barney Frank as our negotiator…or may not, I hear that homosexuals arent,…uh..appreciated in Iran.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:57 pmBlackwater,
Which Christian terror group scares you most?
The Greek Orthodox Party of Justinian or the Catholic Roman Crusade?
July 17th, 2007 at 12:57 pmYou mean as opposed to the pedophile Christian leaders?
Schmuck.
Comment by BARTLBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 12:41 pm
BART
The Christians don’t worship those pedophile leaders. (They dont even listen to them most of the time.)
But you knew that so why the misleading comment? Hmmmm.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:58 pm“Al Qaeda has “regenerated key elements of its Homeland attack capabilityâ€
——————————————————————————————–
But…..I thought Dick Cheney and the PNAC blew up the World Trade Center!
July 17th, 2007 at 12:58 pmYep, why just last night a Christian car-bomber drove into a local art festival and vaporized fifty people. It was in the news, you saw that right?
Comment by Blackwater — July 17, 2007 @ 12:41 pm
————————————————————————-
No. I didn’t.
But even if the person did happen to be Christian, it would have been incidental. There are still no grounds for a comparison of Christianity to the idiocy of the Muslim religion.
UNLIKE Christianity, Muslim terrorism is dictated by religious clerics 99.99% of the time.
July 17th, 2007 at 12:59 pmBARTLEBEE,
July 17th, 2007 at 12:59 pmYeah you’re right.
Religions are dangerous.
Did you know that religious nut Stalin killed 25 Million people.
Or how about the devout Mao, he killed 70 Million!
Be scared of Christians all you want, they arent conducting worldwide murder campaigns in the name of their religion.
Comment by Crackdaughter — July 17, 2007 @ 12:55 pm
Sure they are.
What do you think we’re doing in Iraq?
The mighty Christian crusade goes on.
Only now, instead of gold and other spoils, we just want the oil.
And they’re undying submission. (or dying submission, whichever comes first).
July 17th, 2007 at 1:00 pmCome on fart, letting your emotions get the best of you in the blogosphere is unbecoming. Maybe you should retune your Ritalin prescription and up the dose?
I said make a choice, you failed to do that and instead decided to throw a hissy fit (as libs usually do). Your side has no plan other than to run like hell and hide under your bed, then again you have been doing that for quite awhile now so what else is new. Shat for brains.
Libs: no end to their rights, no beginning to their responsibilities.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:00 pm“The mighty Christian crusade goes on.”
Yeah that Jihad thing doesn’t exists!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:00 pmLOL!!!
FART&PEE, you buy in to that Zi*onist-Crusader propaganda!!!
You’re a damn fool!!!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:01 pmMr. President you are simply wrong. You state there are no grounds for comparison between Christianity and Muslim. They are intertwined at their origins. Look it up and educate yourself. Start with Abraham (Ibrahim) and then come back and show us all how you can learn something.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:02 pmI dont see our soldiers wearing white robes with crosses or marching under a banner with the popes face on it.
In fact our military comprises every religion under the sun, not that I would expect an hysterical twat like yourself to be able to understand that.
The DFL has become the party of the dumbasses, you should campaign for Dean’s job.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:02 pmSane people don’t kill because they think God wants them to kill. Period.
That goes for Christians, Muslims and Jews.
We need smart men to lead us. Not religious ones.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 12:51 pm
I agreed with you up until this point. The fact is that sane people DO kill because they think God wants them to. Terrorists, whether they’re Christian, Jewish, Hindu, or Muslim, are not generally insane. They’re usually quite sane and rational and are doing what they actually believe is right.
The thing they tend to all have in common is the feeling of victimhood. They kill not out of aggression, but in self-defense, and for the defense of their kind. This is the mindset we need to unerstand when we talk about fighting this abstract concept.
Also – I don’t mind having leaders who are religious, as long as they’re also rational.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:02 pmMr Pee,
July 17th, 2007 at 1:03 pmIt is the Jews!
Israel controls America and they’re eveil.
They gace that great Progressive leader Hitler a bad name!
nothing about the policy shift of
face to face talks with IRAN ???
Someone please explain to me why we are so afraid of Iran? They haven’t attacked a neighbor in over 1000 years. Yes they have had wars but they didn’t start them. We on the other hand used Shock and Awe to bomb Iraq’s infrastructure into dust just because we got frightened. So just are we so afraid of we Iran? Maybe if we can figure out why we are so scared of Iran, we can avoid another fiasco like Iraq.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:03 pmComment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 1:02 pm
Shut the fuk up, moron. I’m talking about terrorists and the religious or non-religious motives that drive them to commit the acts of terror.
I probably know more about that retarded religion than you, so piss off, biyatch!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:04 pmWhat about fighten’ ‘em over there, so we don’t have to over here?
Or standin’ down when they stand up?
Or freedom’s on the march!?
Last throes, anyone???
July 17th, 2007 at 1:04 pmThe Christians don’t worship those pedophile leaders. (They dont even listen to them most of the time.)
But you knew that so why the misleading comment? Hmmmm.
Comment by Droll — July 17, 2007 @ 12:58 pm
You must live under a rock, instead of a bridge.
Because the leaders of the Catholic church have been proven to be the most corrupt, foul pedophiles to ever walk the face of the planet.
Not isolated cases, but MASS molestations covered up by the mother church, making the church as a whole an accomplice after the fact.
And these are molestations are not new. The catholic church leaders have been molesting young boys since the days of Lucius Lactantius, (350 CE), and this sick, twisted practice has been continued for almost 2000 years.
Read the “Divne Institutes” some time.
That way you’ll know something before you open your big fat mouth again.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:05 pmHoly Shit!
Is that who I think it is?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:05 pmPagan American,
July 17th, 2007 at 1:06 pmSo we should talk with Bin Laden too?
Do you support their regime?
As a supporter of Hamas, Al-Qaeda, Hezzbollah and Iran I do hope for an Islamic victory!
I admit it!
I want to get on a rug and pray to Allah everyday!
I’m Muslim. I admit it!
Praise be to Allah!
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 12:53 pm]
Awww, how sweet- Mr. P is namejacking me now. :)
For future reference – I always transliterate the names as the more phonetically correct “al-Qa’ida” and “Hizballah,” and I don’t use the word “Allah” to refer to God unless I’m speaking Arabic. Otherwise that’s a really good attempt A+ for effort!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:07 pmLet’s not forget that Bush stood there just a few days ago on national television and said that it wasn’t true that al Qaeda had regained power. He stated clearly that his policies had weakened, not enhanced al Qaeda’s power. Can Bush supporters such as our “Blackwater” explain this? Would they call this a “lie?” It sure sounds like a bald-faced lie. As Commander-in-Chief, he certainly must have seen this intelligence information before we did.
Let’s hear it, Blackwater! How would you explain away the fact that Bush looked the American people in the eye and said something completely counter to intelligence reports which he must have already read?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:07 pmMr Pee,
It is the Jews!
Israel controls America and they’re eveil.
They gace that great Progressive leader Hitler a bad name!
Comment by NOT BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 1:03 pm
Mr President, unable to debate me, has once again resorted to his puss tactics, of impersonating me.
You will be able to tell the difference from the writing style. I usually don’t spell evil “eveil”, nor do I spell gave “gace”.
Mr President can’t hide, because his ignorance follows him everywhere.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:07 pmMakes sense. What religion are you?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:07 pmHey, I’m on a name-calling roll right now! Stop deleting my insults!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:08 pm“History has demonstrated unequivocally that they are BOTH incredibly dangerous, as are most people who believe that God talks to them, and no one else.”
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 12:51 pm
BART
July 17th, 2007 at 1:08 pmHistory has demonstrated unequivocally that Democrat and Republican leaders are both incredibly dangerous that does not stop you from voting Dem does it?
The fact is that sane people DO kill because they think God wants them to.
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 1:02 pm
Wrong.
And if you believe that maybe you should schedule a few sessions on the couch.
The very act of killing because you “think God wants you to”, is in itself a definition of insanity.
Talk to a shrink. They’ll set you straight.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:09 pmSo, give us some examples, nutjob.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:09 pmHistory has demonstrated unequivocally that Democrat and Republican leaders are both incredibly dangerous that does not stop you from voting Dem does it?
Comment by Mole — July 17, 2007 @ 1:08 pm
You don’t know how I vote skippy.
But know this. I vote against the criminally insane lunatics you vote for.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:10 pmLet’s review this religion thing:
Bush began by calling this a “crusade.”
Coulter said we should “invade their countries and either convert them to Christianity or kill them.”
The former military commander in Iraq said, “this is a fight between good and evil and our religion is better than theirs.”
But, since our troops are not wearing white robes and carrying crosses above their head, Blackwater thinks religion has nothing to do with it. OOOOKaaaay!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:11 pmThey’re usually quite sane and rational and are doing what they actually believe is right.
The thing they tend to all have in common is the feeling of victimhood. They kill not out of aggression, but in self-defense, and for the defense of their kind. This is the mindset we need to unerstand when we talk about fighting this abstract concept.
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 1:02 pm
———————————————————————-
No, you idiot!
They tend to have a false sense of reality. They commit acts of terror out of “self-defense,” only because they do not see things reasonably, but rather, they see things through the ideology of their given religion.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:13 pmThis is not rational at all, and no, it is not right either!
Let’s review this religion thing:
Bush began by calling this a “crusade.â€
Coulter said we should “invade their countries and either convert them to Christianity or kill them.â€
The former military commander in Iraq said, “this is a fight between good and evil and our religion is better than theirs.â€
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — July 17, 2007 @ 1:11 pm
See folks.
There are sane and intelligent people out there, who understand whats going on.
You’d do well to listen to him.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:13 pmWrong.
And if you believe that maybe you should schedule a few sessions on the couch.
The very act of killing because you “think God wants you toâ€, is in itself a definition of insanity.
Talk to a shrink. They’ll set you straight.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 1:09 pm
It depends if you’re talking about individuals or groups. Yes, a single person who believes he’s talking to God and that God is telling him to kill is likely suffering from some mental illness. But when a large group of people get it in their heads that they’re under attack and that God is on their side and wants them to defend themselves, that’s a sociological phenomenon, not a psychological one.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:14 pmSo, give us some examples, nutjob.
Comment by Marcus Aurelius — July 17, 2007 @ 1:09 pm
How about the Civil war and Vietnam, idiot.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:15 pmFrankly, Bin Laden has always wanted to attack the US. However, Bin Laden does not care whether it is on US soil or overseas. Bush and the neo-cons simply cannot understand the concept of what Bin Laden and the radical Islamists want to accomplish. It has led to a series of tactical and strategic errors that have seriously undermined US interests.
Bin Laden attacked the United States with two goals in mind. First, Bin Laden wanted to create a maximum of damage to the United States. However, the damage he sough was not the mere loss of life and property. He wanted to inflict economic damage on the United States. Second, he wanted the United States to over react and attack him. Bin Laden believed that an attack against Al Qaeda would create thousands of converts.
Bin Laden succeeded beyond his wildest dreams with regards to his first objective. The invasion of Iraq and the subsequent costs to the US have created significant economic impact. More than half a trillion dollars has been committed to this misadventure with an estimated trillion to go to finish the venture and replace lost equipment. This does not include the costs of homeland security on the local, state and federal level. It is amazing that the United States attacked Iraq and vastly increased the economic impact.
Bin Laden initially failed in his second goal. The attack on the United States horrified the Muslim world. The US was seen as a victim and Muslims rallied against extremist elements. Then the US attacked Iraq. The US denied the applicability of the Geneva Conventions and actively committed war crimes. This became the catalyst for recruiting and turning the conflict into a war of civilizations. Bush had to lock the US into a no win situation by declaring Iraq to be the center of the war on terror when it was clearly a civil war with little Al Qaeda or foreign intervention. That has changed. Bush has placed US prestige on the line in a country that never should have been attacked. The US will not successfully quell what has become a sectarian civil war. Even if the US drove out every single Al Qaeda operative, violence between sectarian groups and the US presence will make it look like we lost.
The NIE is correct in most of its findings.
1. Al Qaeda has been able to reconstitute itself. The Bush misadventure failed to kill off Bin Laden and his group when he diverted resources to Iraq. Al Qaeda adapted and decentralized. Al Qaeda increased membership through out the world because of US tactics and occupation of Iraq.
2. Iraq has become an Al Qaeda training ground for radicalized extremists. It was a wonderful place to develop tactics against the US military. It brought newly radicalized muslims together which could not have happened in Afghanistan or Pakistan.
3. The Iraq war has become a world wide recruiting tool that did not need to exist.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:15 pmCan anybody tell me why the word “Homeland” is capitalized in this sentence?
Or this one?
Or this one?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:16 pmNice job, Joker. You’re making the point yourself. Christianity is a dangerous, sick philosophy. It is a cult of death. Your most important icon is a man being tortured to death. You eat his flesh and drink his blood. You lust for war and dream of the day you can watch millions of people cry. Enough said. Great job!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:16 pmAnd keep in mind, that the religious leader who was counseling Bush when he decided to blow Iraq back to the stone ages, was none other than the meth addicted homosexual hating homosexual, the “notsohonorable” Rev Ted Haggard.
Like I said. We need “smart” men ….
July 17th, 2007 at 1:16 pmWe’ve got all of the other kind that we need.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:16 pmComment by BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 1:10 pm
You don’t know how I vote, Bart.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:17 pmBut when a large group of people get it in their heads that they’re under attack and that God is on their side and wants them to defend themselves, that’s a sociological phenomenon, not a psychological one.
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 1:14 pm
Its called “mass insanity”.
Like I said. Talk to a shrink. They’ll set you straight.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:17 pmYou don’t know how I vote, Bart.
Comment by Hole — July 17, 2007 @ 1:17 pm
Nor do I care.
In fact, I’m not even sure if they allow you to vote.
That whole, “convicted felon” thing I assume precludes it.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:19 pmIn answer to SpudgeBoy’s “Can anybody tell me why the word “Homeland†is capitalized in this sentence?”
It’s from the German.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:19 pmho ho ho You’re soooo funny Barty.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:21 pmEvidently, “Blackwater” and his Bush-worshipping friends missed my post above, because no Bush supporter responded. Let’s ask again: just a few days ago, Bush looked the American people in the eye and said al Qaeda had not regained power. He said his policies had reduced al Qaeda’s power. At the time, he must have been aware of this intelligence report – it’s been available to him for weeks now. How is this not lying to the American people about the most important matters facing our society?
Bush supporters: can you explain why this wasn’t simply a bald-faced lie to the American people?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:21 pmNo, you idiot!
They tend to have a false sense of reality. They commit acts of terror out of “self-defense,†only because they do not see things reasonably, but rather, they see things through the ideology of their given religion.
This is not rational at all, and no, it is not right either!
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 1:13 pm
Whether it’s a false sense of reality or reasonable or not is immaterial. The ideology that spawns the use of terrorism doesn’t have to be religious – it could involve land rights, animal rights, natural resource ownership, economic oppression, political oppression, etc. I believe that the roots of most “Islamic terror” are far from religious. They have much more to do with political and economic issues, and use religion as a convenient smokescreen.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:22 pmRet. Col. Jack Ripper ,
July 17th, 2007 at 1:23 pmIf Islam is a peaceful religion then why do they attack Budddhists in Thailand and Hindus in India?
“I believe that the roots of most “Islamic terror†are far from religious. They have much more to do with political and economic issues, and use religion as a convenient smokescreen.
If that’s the case explain the Jihad of the 7th Century?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:23 pmFART&PEE and Ret. Col.
1) Bush was misspoke… What are you suprised?!?!?
2) Ann Coulter was giving her own opinion, that doesn’t mean it is the opinion of the American people.
3) Well, did he say “Christianity” or “Judaism” or did he just say “a fight between Good and Evil”?
Personally, I am not Christian or Jewish, but if I was to be part of any religion, it would be the religion of Good.
Last but not least:
THE CRUSADES WERE ABOUT THE HOLY LAND!!!
WE ALREADY HAVE IT!!!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:24 pmI believe that the roots of most “Islamic terror†are far from religious. They have much more to do with political and economic issues, and use religion as a convenient smokescreen.
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 1:22 pm
———————————————————–
Exactly! So let’s get ride of the smokescreen!
Down with Islam!!!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:25 pmMr. President,
July 17th, 2007 at 1:28 pmYou notice how the tolerant, Multi-cultural Progressives become anti-Christian bihgots when they defend Islam.
They’re hypocrites and I expose them evertime!
Bush on July 12: “There is a perception in the coverage that al Qaeda may be as strong today as they were prior to September 11. That’s just simply not the case.”
Bush supporters, this was just five days ago. Do you really think Bush hadn’t been told about or hadn’t read intelligence reports which are being made public today, five days later? Can any of you explain why Bush would lie to the American public about the most important issue of our time?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:28 pmIts called “mass insanityâ€.
Like I said. Talk to a shrink. They’ll set you straight.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 1:17 pm
There is no such condition in the DSM as “mass insanity.” Mass hysteria, on the other hand, is a social and psychological phenomenon that happens to people without mental illness. If you really want to “understand the enemy,” it’s really important to grasp this point. You can’t fix terrorism with Prozac.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:29 pmComment by JMOHR — July 17, 2007 @ 1:15 pm
Excellent post.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:31 pmMr. President, you lack credibility. Here and the Whitehouse. So easily set off and so easily confused.
Look up the IRA and get back to me about the calm christians.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:34 pmBush: “There is a perception in the coverage that al Qaeda may be as strong today as they were prior to September 11. That’s just simply not the case.”
Clinton: “I did not have sex with that woman…”
To our mainstream media, Clinton’s lie was evidence of a deep lack of character. It was even sited as a reason to remove him from office. It was repeated over and over for months on end. People were insulted by his troubling behavior. There was lots of discussion in the media.
Will there be any discussion or outrage over Bush’s lie? Will there be any discussion at all? Until we as a people deal with this aspect of our culture, our system will continue to be broken.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:34 pmThe Spainish inquisition is filled with peace loving christians.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:35 pmBush: “There is a perception in the coverage that al Qaeda may be as strong today as they were prior to September 11. That’s just simply not the case.”
Will any Whitehouse reporter ask Bush at the next press conference why he said this? Will anyone bring it up? We need to demand that our media ask Bush this question.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:37 pmhellinabucket,
“The Spainish inquisition is filled with peace loving christians.”
Stalin’s purges were done by Progressive Atheists!
The Armenian genocide was done by peaceful Muslims!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:38 pmSo now Bush is concerned with AQ. After he was, then wasn’t, then was, then wasn’t. He’s a f#@King cork screw.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:38 pmIs there no Bush supporter who can defend this lie? Where is the mighty Blackwater? Has he crawled back into his hole of denial?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:39 pmEvery time I see “Homeland” capitalized and used by our government to mean the United States, it sends a shiver through me.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:42 pmLook up the IRA and get back to me about the calm christians.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 1:34 pm
—————————————–
You fool!
We are not threatened by Irish Catholics!
and remember, I said 99.99% of the time.
(By the way, in the future I would appreciate if you reference the comment of mine that you are referring to, that way I do not have to go searching the thread to see exactly what I said.)
July 17th, 2007 at 1:45 pmHomeland sounds too close to the Motherland.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:46 pmThe Spainish inquisition is filled with peace loving christians.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 1:35 pm
——————————————————
Well, if you mean that it was then you would be wrong. However, that was a long time ago and I don’t think it is too much of a problem any more!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:46 pmMr. President,
Notice they stay silent on the 2 great Progressives STalin and Mao.
Those 2 great atheists killed 25 Million and 70 Million repectively!
Their silence speaks volumes!
It’s a shame anti-Leftists don’t expose the bigotry of the Left like we do Mr. P!
July 17th, 2007 at 1:49 pmBush just five days ago: “There is a perception in the coverage that al Qaeda may be as strong today as they were prior to September 11. That’s just simply not the case.”
“Mr. President,” I would prefer that a troll with a little more “juice” in the intelligence quotient answer this question, but you seem to be the only troll left around here. Can you possibly explain why or how this wasn’t a bald-faced lie told to the American people about our most important issue?
July 17th, 2007 at 1:50 pmMr. President, you throw out an unfounded claim and I show you there has been terrorist attacks by christians and then you change the goal posts again.
Did you read JMOHR’s post at #96. It’s an accurate account and not a panic, knee jerk reaction to the middle east.
Drop the missplaced anger and start really looking at the direction this administration has taken this country.
Quit allowing yourself to be led without questioning.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:53 pmWhat’s with the “Homeland” shyte?????
July 17th, 2007 at 1:53 pmRet. Col. Jack Ripper ,
I’ll answer as I am the 2 nd “troll” around here.
Mr. Bush has no credibility. People don’t care what he has to say anymore.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:54 pmOnly you Leftists with your Bush obssession care about him.
The rest of the country doesn’t care about that clown anymore.
hellinabucket,
July 17th, 2007 at 1:55 pmThere ghas been less terror attacks by Christians than Muslims.
Also the IRA called ahead of time for their bombs.
I’d like to hear any troll tackle that question Col.
July 17th, 2007 at 1:59 pmMr. President, you throw out an unfounded claim and I show you there has been terrorist attacks by christians and then you change the goal posts again.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 1:53 pm
How did I change the posts, and to what?
This was my initial statement that you obviously didn’t understand:
This is true, sure there are strong connections between the two, both ripped off Judaism, and Islam ripped off Christianity. But I am talking about the idiocy of the Muslim religion, in which, one is justified by the idiot ideology to commit acts of terror for the Muslim community.
Some Christians and maybe Jews have done the same, but the overwhelming majority (and this is an understatement) of Muslim terrorism is condoned by powerful religious officials.
Sure… Waco, Jonestown, a few others, but in this day and age it is Islam that is the problem.
Hopefully, we will pacify it soon!!!
July 17th, 2007 at 2:09 pmMr. President,
Notice they stay silent on the 2 great Progressives STalin and Mao.
Those 2 great atheists killed 25 Million and 70 Million repectively!
Their silence speaks volumes!
It’s a shame anti-Leftists don’t expose the bigotry of the Left like we do Mr. P!
Comment by The Joker — July 17, 2007 @ 1:49 pm
————————————————————————–
The Joker,
Your posts keep disappearing, I think you are banned from the site.
But I agree, the Leftists have been trained to hate Christianity and to love Islam and other nonsense!
July 17th, 2007 at 2:12 pmDid you read JMOHR’s post at #96. It’s an accurate account and not a panic, knee jerk reaction to the middle east.
Drop the missplaced anger and start really looking at the direction this administration has taken this country.
Quit allowing yourself to be led without questioning.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 1:53 pm
—————————————————————–
First of all, no, I have not.
Second of all, who cares about this administration? Stick to the topic.
Thirdly, I don’t, why do you think I am questioning and refuting everything you say!!?!
July 17th, 2007 at 2:15 pmMr. Pres & The Joker: “Notice they stay silent on the 2 great Progressives STalin and Mao.
Those 2 great atheists killed 25 Million and 70 Million repectively!
Their silence speaks volumes!”
I don’t know of any current American liberal of note who admires either of these two. I do know that Grover Norquist and a number of prominent neocons admire Stalin. Grover Norquist had a portrait of Stalin above his desk for years until it became a public relations problem.
How about famous lefty John Lennon, who was feared and loathed by the FBI for his leftist leanings? Here are his words immortalized in song:
“And if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao,
July 17th, 2007 at 2:17 pmYou aint gonna make it with anyone anyhow…”
I am not defending Islam in any way. I won’t make a blanket statement about the religion like you do either.
There has always been extremists. There has always been groups wanting to overthrow other groups.
What do you really know about the real threat that is AQ?
Joker is just that. No rational person on TP is going to defend Stalin or Mao and it’s a sad, strawman argument to begin with.
My beef is with this current administration throwing our soldiers into a quagmire without having a clue on what they should do. It’s a clusterfu@k and I will continue to voice my disgust in this.
We have over 100,000 hired guns in Iraq now. That means our total forces in theater are over 225,000 but this administration didn’t want to have that many soldiers thrown into it in the begining. Now there is discussion of throwing more soldiers in. They don’t have a clue and our soldiers die.
I will not sit by and quietly watch this. Your missguided fear against anything not GW is laughable.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:21 pmJoker: “Mr. Bush has no credibility. People don’t care what he has to say anymore.
Only you Leftists with your Bush obssession care about him.
The rest of the country doesn’t care about that clown anymore.”
First, that’s not really an answer to the question. Was it or wasn’t it a bald-faced lie about the most important issue facing our nation.
Secondly, he is the President of the United States. We care about what he says and does because he is the executive. People like you voted him in with the help of election fraud and the Supreme court. It is the height of intellectual dishonesty to dismiss his lies by now saying he’s irrelevant, especially if you’ve been a supporter.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:21 pmNo rational person on TP is going to defend Stalin or Mao and it’s a sad, strawman argument to begin with.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 2:21 pm
Agreed. But not everyone on TP is a rational person, and think you would find that some do defend Maoism (maybe not Mao himself, though).
July 17th, 2007 at 2:23 pmPhony Mr. President: “Second of all, who cares about this administration? Stick to the topic.”
Ahem. The topic is not your cult of death called Christianity or the cult of death called Islam. The topic is supposed to be the NIE.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:23 pmYour missguided fear against anything not GW is laughable.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 2:21 pm
July 17th, 2007 at 2:26 pm————————————————
I think Bush could be doing a better job, actually. The War on Terror will improve with the next administration!!!
The topic is supposed to be the NIE.
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — July 17, 2007 @ 2:23 pm
——————————————————-
Retarded Col. Jack,
I was speaking to hellina about a specific comment that s/he made in response to one of my posts.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:28 pmI can only speak for myself as for the posters here on TP.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:30 pmPhony Mr. President: “The War on Terror will improve with the next administration!!!”
That’s the most intelligent thing I’ve ever seen you post. Yes, whether it’s Clinton, Obama, Edwards, Gore or anyone else the Democrats nominate, the “War on Terror” will be prosecuted in a much more competent manner. No doubt about that!
July 17th, 2007 at 2:30 pm“AQI”. It took five years of lies for the administration to assert that 911 was associated with Iraq and apparently get away with it through this report. I still consider it a lie. And I wonder if the report is a lie as well. Odds are it is. The administration has cooked the books just too many times.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:43 pmAnd if it is, the next step is the “inside job”. A violent watergate.
Phony Mr. President: “…and think you would find that some do defend Maoism (maybe not Mao himself, though).
And, he calls me “retarded.”
July 17th, 2007 at 2:44 pmSwan, the most probable “next step” is Democrats taking supermajorities in both houses of congress as well as the Whitehouse. After that, the next step is indictments, trials and remanding Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld to the World Court to stand trial for war crimes.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:47 pmCol. A major shift in the public’s perception will have to happen before the Bush Administration is sent for war crimes. We Americans don’t like to be told we are wrong and find it very hard to admit we were. Besides, we’ve been fed a steady diet of missinformation and there will be debate at every turn on what is crime worthy or not.
I would still like to see it.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:52 pmI’m voting with you Col. Jack. I may be old by then but I will have that broad cheerful smile again.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:54 pmIt’s not al Qaeda in Iraq that we need to worry about… it’s al Qaeda controlling Pakistan that would present a nuclear problem.
July 17th, 2007 at 2:57 pmThank you, swan!
Hellenabucket, I agree, but the American people haven’t been told the story or had it explained. In addition, we have no control over the findings of the World Court and I think we are still treaty-bound to accept its judgements. Remember that Nixon was reelected with a huge mandate. Only a couple of years later, after Americans had been told the story, his approval ratings were where Bush’s are today. How strong will be Bush’s disapproval ratings after Americans are told his true story? I think he’ll be seen as a national disgrace.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:02 pmThe ‘Just-Released’ NIE = Failed Report Card on Bush’s Policies
Normal, mentally fit, decent leaders would be mortified by this report and realize it’s an indictment of their administration’s failed policies.
After six years, BushCo hasn’t lost its ability or will to try to spin negatives into positives. To release this NIE as an exhibit in BushCo’s latest campaign to thwart efforts to change course and bring the troops out of Iraq, when it’s the best evidence of how the U.S. occupation of Iraq is making worldwide terrorism worse, is no question about it, brass without equal.
BushCo has been given a blank check to do anything and everything it wanted to do to wage a “war on terror” (and what Bush-Cheney weren’t given, they just took). We’re back to 9/10/01. Trillions of dollars spent and committed long into the future, money which was supposed to go towards making us safer, but actually went into BushCo’s pockets (their friends’ and patrons’ corporations) through privatization schemes. Our Constitutional rights, protections and guarantees are in shreds, and we’re bigger targets, more exposed and vulnerable, and hated by many more throughout the world.
But is that what Bush-Cheney-Rove and the Republicans who are still firmly behind them see when they read this NIE? Is their response, “My bad, we blew it, let’s change direction”? No. Their plan is “More of the same,” more war (Iran), more legislation (they’re now trying to tie their immigration reform legislation as “necessary to fight the war on terror”), “…and put a little hustle in it.”
July 17th, 2007 at 3:07 pmThis is true, sure there are strong connections between the two, both ripped off Judaism, and Islam ripped off Christianity. But I am talking about the idiocy of the Muslim religion, in which, one is justified by the idiot ideology to commit acts of terror for the Muslim community.
Some Christians and maybe Jews have done the same, but the overwhelming majority (and this is an understatement) of Muslim terrorism is condoned by powerful religious officials.
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 2:09 pm
These statements are patently untrue. Acts of terror against civilians are forbidden under Islam, and acts of terror are regularly condemned by powerful Muslim religious officials. They are condoned by a small Klan-like fringe group that is becoming more powerful thanks to genocidal rhetoric such as yours.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:08 pmComment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 3:08 pm
You and I both know the the Koran says to use whatever means you can to support and protect the Ummah.
Don’t make me start to post explicit passages!
July 17th, 2007 at 3:10 pmYou and I both know the the Koran says to use whatever means you can to support and protect the Ummah.
Don’t make me start to post explicit passages!
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 3:10 pm
Please do. And post them in Arabic, please, so there’s no translation bias.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:14 pmComment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 3:08 pm
Anyway, my statement is not untrue, because I said that it is do to the influence of the religion that the terrorist acts are committed.
Just as in Waco, and Jonestown, this type of crazy religious garbage should not be tolerated.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:15 pmAnd post them in Arabic, please, so there’s no translation bias.
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 3:14 pm
———————————————
Yeah right!!!
July 17th, 2007 at 3:15 pmJust as in Waco, and Jonestown, this type of crazy religious garbage should not be tolerated.
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 3:15 pm
I agree. Fringe groups that exploit a religion should not be tolerated. This includes hate groups that think the genocide of 1.6 billion people is justified.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:18 pmI would like to see that happen Col. I would like the nation to see what a disgrace Bush is.
Mr. President, there are many types of crazy religious garbage. Maybe that’s why the founding fathers wanted to keep the Church and State separate.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:20 pmtoaster,
I did a quick google search, apparently there are 111 passages that refer to jihad!
I will have to read through them to see which one’s to post, as I do not want to them all.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:21 pmI did a quick google search, apparently there are 111 passages that refer to jihad!
I will have to read through them to see which one’s to post, as I do not want to them all.
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 3:21 pm
Oh good – so there are 111 passages talking about a struggle. Now see how many say “holy war.”
July 17th, 2007 at 3:26 pmOh good – so there are 111 passages talking about a struggle. Now see how many say “holy war.â€
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 3:26 pm
————————————————————-
I never said “holy war,” I said “idiot Muslim ideology”
Remember:
But I am talking about the idiocy of the Muslim religion, in which, one is justified by the idiot ideology to commit acts of terror for the Muslim community.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:34 pmjihad can mean struggle in Islam.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:34 pmThen why did you bring up 111 passages with Jihad (that means struggle). Goal posts are changing again Mr. President.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:35 pmI never said “holy war,†I said “idiot Muslim ideologyâ€
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 3:34 pm
Ahh, my bad. And how many references to that phrase did you find in the Quraan? You might try searching ” إلهيات اØمق المسلم “
July 17th, 2007 at 3:39 pmGoal posts are changing again Mr. President.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 3:35 pm
————————————————–
Not at all, toaster knows what the word refers to, and how it is used to incite violence…
… in fact, everyone knows that!!!
July 17th, 2007 at 3:41 pmNot at all, toaster knows what the word refers to, and how it is used to incite violence…
… in fact, everyone knows that!!!
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 3:41 pm
Any word can be used to incite violence by people who want to incite violence. What you are failing to prove is how Islam itself, in the Quraan, condones violence against innocent people.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:48 pmjihad can mean struggle in Islam.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 3:34 pm
Or ‘Crusade’ : you know, sword-wielding maniacs appear out of nowhere, slashing, burning and putting babies on pikes anyone left gets a free ‘Holy Book’ for their coffee table?
July 17th, 2007 at 3:48 pmThere is no such condition in the DSM as “mass insanity.â€
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 1:29 pm
Sure there is. Mass insanity is another term for mass hysteria. The fact that the condition may be temporary (ever heard of temporary insanity?) does not preclude the fact that for the moment, a crowd may be judged legally insane.
For example, when a group of townsfolk in a southern Alabama town lynches a black man because a white woman got raped by a black man, that is absolutely criminal insanity, albeit temporary or not. In fact, I purport that the underlying mindset is a form of insanity, that would permit a person to join in with such a criminally insane act as murdering a man because his skin color matches that of someone else who did someone harm.
If you believe that God wants us to kill somone, or attack another country, (especially if you’ve actually “read” the new Testament), then sorry, but you’re as batty as a belfry.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:51 pmIf you really want to “understand the enemy,†it’s really important to grasp this point. You can’t fix terrorism with Prozac.
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 1:29 pm
Hmmm. Agreed.
I was thinking more along the lines of Thorazine.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:51 pmWe could pump it into the water, or maybe conceal it in toothpaste.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:53 pmAnd in densely populated conservative areas, particularly those with large numbers of trailer parks, we could add it to the Thunderbird.
Or any of the finer canned wines.
July 17th, 2007 at 3:55 pmAny word can be used to incite violence by people who want to incite violence. What you are failing to prove is how Islam itself, in the Quraan, condones violence against innocent people.
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 3:48 pm
Gimme a minute, this book is boring. Anyway, here is this:
July 17th, 2007 at 4:00 pm
- Medina
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 4:00 pm
————————————————————–
Oops. This is where it was written the passage is actually:
Immunity, line 5
July 17th, 2007 at 4:08 pmThe Spoils 12:
July 17th, 2007 at 4:13 pm
And when the sacred months are passed, kill those who join other gods with God wherever ye shall find them; and seize them, besiege them, and lay wait for them with every kind of ambush: but if they shall convert, and observe prayer, and pay the obligatory alms, then let them go their way, for God is Gracious, Merciful.
- Medina
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 4:00 pm
What’s the context? The early followers of Muhammad faced violent opposition from the polytheist power elite then living in Mecca and Medina. There are a lot of verses in the Quraan about defeating this specific enemy that was trying to wipe them out. This does not mean that the entire religion condones violence against innocent people.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:13 pmMr. President, that passage is a great example of anger.
Just like this one:
“If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant, And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; … Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.”
July 17th, 2007 at 4:15 pm— Deuteronomy, Chapter 17:2-3,5
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 4:13 pm
But aren’t Muslims supposed to act like Mohamed?
If they perceived a threat, say, an infidel in Saudi Arabia, wouldn’t they be justified by the Koran to expel the infidels from the Holy Land, just like Mohamed?
July 17th, 2007 at 4:15 pm“If there be found among you,
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 4:15 pm
———————————————–
This is talking about an internal conflict.
I have no problem with that, but when Muslims declare war on the Z*onist-Crusader alliance and start to attack us, that is different.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:19 pmThe Spoils 12:
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 4:13 pm
This was God giving a pep talk to his angels before a battle. What does this have to do with the human followers of Islam?
July 17th, 2007 at 4:20 pmHere’s another, from “The Spoils, 15,” that says if a Muslim doesn’t fight the infidels or at least rally more muslims to fight, then he will be punished:
July 17th, 2007 at 4:22 pm
Mr. President, Do you know who is being talked to and about in that bible passage I posted? No you don’t. It’s too similar to your “proof” of the violent Islam but yet you quickly justify it because it’s the Bible.
If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman.
The Lord thy God giveth us all so within any of thy gates means anywhere.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:26 pmNow you know why I never get into the habit of defending someone elses religion.
Religion is one mans or a group of mens ideas on what God wants the rest of us to do. Its bullsh$t, all of it. People need to learn to tell right from wrong, and take it from there.
This thing calling itself Mr President, and those like him, doesn’t know right from wrong any more than Osama Bin Laden does.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:31 pmBut aren’t Muslims supposed to act like Mohamed?
If they perceived a threat, say, an infidel in Saudi Arabia, wouldn’t they be justified by the Koran to expel the infidels from the Holy Land, just like Mohamed?
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 4:15 pm
It depends. The word “kafir” literally refers to people who actively oppose and persecute Muslims. So if someone like you were to show up in Riyadh, they would be justified by the Quraan in showing you the door. If you were a real Christian, however, you would not be expelled. You would be considered an equal in the eyes of God, in fact:
July 17th, 2007 at 4:32 pm
This was God giving a pep talk to his angels before a battle. What does this have to do with the human followers of Islam?
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 4:20 pm
——————————————————————-
Go back and read the book. The passage is about god differentiating between two groups, the faithful and the infidels. This line says: When your god said to the angels “blah, blah, blah.” Saw of the head and fingers of the infidels.
Basically: when “this” happens, do “that”
July 17th, 2007 at 4:32 pmComment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 4:26 pm
The lord don’t give me shit, I take it!!!
July 17th, 2007 at 4:34 pmObviously Mr. President has never read Leviticus.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:34 pmComment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 4:32 pm
What about putting the laws of man above the Islamic Shari’ah law, is this acceptable according to the scripture?
July 17th, 2007 at 4:38 pmYes Mr. President you do take shit. And lots of it.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:43 pmYes Mr. President you do take shit. And lots of it.
Comment by hellinabucket — July 17, 2007 @ 4:43 pm
—————————————————-
Your cot damn right!
—————————————————
Still wondering about question in post #195, but I’ll have to check in later.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:45 pmGo back and read the book. The passage is about god differentiating between two groups, the faithful and the infidels. This line says: When your god said to the angels “blah, blah, blah.†Saw of the head and fingers of the infidels.
Basically: when “this†happens, do “thatâ€
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 4:32 pm
That’s an incorrect translation. There are no quotation marks in Arabic, so it. A more accurate translation is:
God told his angels to do something long ago, and they did it. That’s all this passage says. It certainly says nothing about sawing off heads.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:50 pmI’d recommend sawing off this trolls head, but I doubt he’d miss it.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:52 pmAfter all, he talks out of his ass.
July 17th, 2007 at 4:52 pmWhat about putting the laws of man above the Islamic Shari’ah law, is this acceptable according to the scripture?
Comment by Mr. President — July 17, 2007 @ 4:38 pm
From what I can tell from Sura 42, they have nothing to do with each other. The laws of men will punish men on Earth. The laws of God will punish them in the afterlife:
July 17th, 2007 at 5:02 pm
Amazing that on at least two threads today, religious fanatics have been able to derail legitimate political discussions and steer them into arguments about…
“Foolish rules of ancient date,
July 17th, 2007 at 5:04 pmDesigned to make you all feel great
As you bend, fold and mutilate
Those unbelievers from the neighboring state…”
al Qaeda = CIA Mossad M15. al Qaeda in Arabic slang means the “western toilet”. Why would a good terror organazation call themselves that?
July 17th, 2007 at 5:06 pmAgreed Col.
July 17th, 2007 at 5:16 pmAmazing that on at least two threads today, religious fanatics have been able to derail legitimate political discussions and steer them into arguments about…
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — July 17, 2007 @ 5:04 pm
Sorry. I took the bait, I know. But when people post bigoted blather I’m inclined to fight them with facts. It’s just how I am…
July 17th, 2007 at 5:22 pmYea Toaster, but know this.
They WANT you to defend Islam.
They WANT to cast you in the light of defending Islam.
July 17th, 2007 at 5:27 pmIt is the goal of the neonazi’s to cast all liberals in the light of “muslim lovers”, just like it was their goal during the 60’s to cast us as “ni#$$er lovers”.
The current right wing is as evil and dangerous as AL Quaida, and they’ll stop at nothing to paste anyone who won’t join in the war chant as traitors.
July 17th, 2007 at 5:30 pmJuly 17th, 2007 at 5:34 pm
Yea Toaster, but know this.
They WANT you to defend Islam.
They WANT to cast you in the light of defending Islam.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 5:27 pm
They can cast me in any light they want. I’d rather be seen as defending Islam than defending bigotry and hatred.
July 17th, 2007 at 5:42 pmHey Toaster, there is absolutely no reason for you to apologize to me. You’re not the religious fanatic.
July 17th, 2007 at 6:15 pmI have to note that no Bush supporter/worshipper has responded to my original question. Five days ago, Bush said this:
“There is a perception in the coverage that al Qaeda may be as strong today as they were prior to September 11. That’s just simply not the case.â€
Since the NIE was published and released just yesterday, Bush must have been told of its findings or read it himself before he made this statement. The statement is, by definition, a lie; a lie told straight up to the American people about the most important threat our nation faces. I asked any Bush supporter to explain why this wasn’t a bald-faced lie. The only thing even approaching an answer was when one of them posted that Bush was irrelevant (whatever that means.) They can’t explain him. They can’t defend him.
Remember everyone, “I did not have sex with that woman” was univerally met with outrage and anger by our media. They told us it was a sign of his bad character. They asked if we could believe anything he said if he would lie like this to us. Some of them even used it as reason to remove him from office.
We need to ask why our media has no interest in this lie, but was obsessed with Clinton’s lie.
July 17th, 2007 at 6:23 pmThere is a perception in the coverage that al Qaeda may be as strong today as they were prior to September 11.
July 17th, 2007 at 6:29 pm19 Guys with boxcutters and airline tickets using their Real Names .That’s not strong…that’s incompetent homeland security policy!!
We need to ask why our media has no interest in this lie, but was obsessed with Clinton’s lie.
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — July 17, 2007 @ 6:23 pm
Amen. Bush just got through giving a press conference saying Al Quaida was on the run.
A few days later, they come out and say they’re stronger and ready to strike.
:|
Its so hard keeping track of their lies.
July 17th, 2007 at 7:06 pmOn the NBC Nightly News, Brian Williams just referred to the “war on terror” as “this SO CALLED war on terror”.
:|
People are finally learning.
July 17th, 2007 at 7:10 pmTerrorism is Real. The So Called War on Terror is a political machination cooked up by Rove & Co. to keep American’s frightened and Bush and the Republicans in Power.
July 17th, 2007 at 7:27 pmIt’s a tragic shame that these “political” thinkers weren’t any good at war planning. They got Bush re-elected (maybe) but made a disaster of our Middle East Policy.
Badger, early on in the administration, Paul O’Niell, the first Secretary of the Treasury and former CEO of Alcoa (no lefty) said that he was shocked that it was all about politics and no real substantive policy. People ignored him; Bushies called him “crazy” and “bitter.” Media asked no questions.
July 17th, 2007 at 7:32 pmHey Toaster, there is absolutely no reason for you to apologize to me. You’re not the religious fanatic.
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — July 17, 2007 @ 6:15 pm
Ah, coolio – no worries. :) I did break my “not feeding the trolls” pledge, but that’s another issue.
July 17th, 2007 at 10:18 pmAmazing that on at least two threads today, religious fanatics have been able to derail legitimate political discussions and steer them into arguments about…
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — July 17, 2007 @ 5:04 pm
Sorry. I took the bait, I know. But when people post bigoted blather I’m inclined to fight them with facts. It’s just how I am…
Comment by toasterhead — July 17, 2007 @ 5:22 pm
Yea Toaster, but know this.
They WANT you to defend Islam.
They WANT to cast you in the light of defending Islam.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 5:27 pm
It is the goal of the neonazi’s to cast all liberals in the light of “muslim loversâ€, just like it was their goal during the 60’s to cast us as “ni#$$er loversâ€.
The current right wing is as evil and dangerous as AL Quaida, and they’ll stop at nothing to paste anyone who won’t join in the war chant as traitors.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — July 17, 2007 @ 5:30 pm
…
i am back from my drive, winding down, catching up on the reading from where i left, at 3ish… this thread, in particular, captured my interest…
2 reasons: i learned alot, and i think mr.p did too…
he was actually asking questions without being a jerk (relatively),
and the whole conversation was civil and educational…
it was impressive…
i’m glad toaster was here, with a level head and patience of a teacher;
glad the colonel and bartlebee were here with their own particular brand of intellect and retort…
and all without the usual resorting to verbal abuse and defamation…
thank you…
(now, i haven’t read beyond bartlebee’s 530 post, and i can’t read more, so i hope you all haven’t let me down since…)
July 17th, 2007 at 10:40 pm;-]
The breaking news are nothing more than propaganda piece to cover up the Chertoff gut feeling that Al-Qaeda was going to strike during the summer. By releasing this data, Chertoff can stated categoratically that his hunch was right after all.
In order to make good of the claim, I wouldn’t be surprised if there would be another 911 events with evidence pointed to either Iran or American Muslim to create more fear especially when the Republicans and President poll rating was taking a beating due to the war. The neo-cons with utmost loyalty to Israel want to bomb Iran to ensure military dominant of the only remaining aparthied country in the world.
July 18th, 2007 at 4:43 am