3,498:
By on Jul 22nd, 2007 at 4:00 pm
3,498:
Number of Iranians the United States has accepted into the country in the past nine months. In contrast, the United States has admitted just 825 Iraqi refugees since 2003, “many of them backlogged applicants from the time Saddam Hussein was in power.”
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Iraqi ex patriots will vote for the Republican party.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:07 pmUh, Iraqi ex-patriots will more than likely not have the right to vote for either party unless they have dual citizenship.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:10 pmSo much for “Operation Iraqi Freedom.”
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:11 pmIraqi ex patriots will vote for the Republican party.
Comment by The Eck
They aren’t citizens, and won’t be for the next election…
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:17 pma story yesterday (?) about the danish taking refugees
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:18 pmwith them as they are pulling out of iraq…
…
Comment by barfly — July 22, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
Really, how stupid does ‘The Eck’ think we are?
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:19 pmIt is quite interesting that Iranian ex-pats are higher on the BushCo food chain than Iraqi’s. Guess the US doesn’t care about Iraq… except for the oil and the no-bid contracts for Halliburton and BlackWater private army.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:20 pmIranis have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. The Iraqis have no such skills which makes the Iranis more desirable.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:23 pmU.S. Ambassador in Baghdad, Ryan C. Crocker, came out earlier this week and described the mood of Iraqi’s; one word “Fear”.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:27 pmHe’s not long for his post there. Just as McConnell as DNI.
Iraqi-Americans would probably vote for Fred Thompson.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:31 pmSkeptics contend another reason the administration has been slow to resettle Iraqis in large numbers is that doing so could be seen as admitting that its efforts to secure Iraq have failed.
Everyone already knows we failed to secure Iraq. The entire world knows. But, Head-in-the-Sand Bush and Co. figure if they don’t admit a problem there will be no problem.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:33 pm#10 Iraqi-Americans would probably vote for Fred Thompson.
Comment by Jim
And you say this because……….?? What has this lazy bad TV and B movie actor ever done, for anyone, wheter in Iraq or in this country?
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:34 pm“Uh, Iraqi ex-patriots will more than likely”
They are actually expatriates, not “ex-patriots,” Jane.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:35 pm“And you say this because……….??”
Thompson supports freedom for the Iraqi people; none of the Dem candidates do.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:36 pm#8
Exactly. The U.S. doesn’t want a bunch of unskilled, uneducated refugees. However, many Iranians are educated, have family here, and can contribute to our society in some way.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:37 pm#14 “And you say this because……….??â€
Thompson supports freedom for the Iraqi people; none of the Dem candidates do.
Comment by Jim
What makes you say that? He doesn’t give a shit aobut the Iraqis, neither do the rest of the Repugs, except to make money. If they did care, they would have spent more on infrastructure and how to end this illegal occupation and foget trying to form a puppet fake democracy.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:39 pm“They are actually expatriates, not “ex-patriots,†Jane.”
Comment by Jim — July 22, 2007 @ 4:35 pm
Well, excuse the hell out of me, Jim. Why didn’t you criticize The Eck, too, or did you read that one and agree with it?
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:43 pm“Thompson supports freedom for the Iraqi people; none of the Dem candidates do.”
Comment by Jim — July 22, 2007 @ 4:36 pm
Says who?
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:44 pmFred Thompson lobbies for abortionists because he’s an elite Hollywood lawyer.
-GSD
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:49 pmAmazing… And how many attacks in Iraq have been ‘inside’ jobs?
Let’s welcome them with open arms into our country…
Way to go Bush, way to go…
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:51 pmGeorge Bush gave the Iraqis the right to vote in free elections.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:51 pm#
George Bush gave the Iraqis the right to vote in free elections.
Comment by LLD — July 22, 2007 @ 4:51 pm
#
And now we are fighting against the government they elected. Ever heard of Muqtada Sadr? He owns 6 ministries and 32 seats in the parliament. Trivia question for you: According to their constitution, is Iraq a democracy?
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:56 pmGeorge Bush gave the Iraqis the right to vote in free elections. Comment by LLD
They just have no infrastructure, all the rich and/or educated are leaving, 70% of their oil will be given to the Big Boyz, they will be in anarchy for the next 50 years. Other than that, I am sure they are ecstatic!
Get a clue!
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:57 pmKey McCain backer joins Fred!
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2007/07/22/mccain-loses-key-supporter/
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:59 pmExactly. The U.S. doesn’t want a bunch of unskilled, uneducated refugees. However, many Iranians are educated, have family here, and can contribute to our society in some way.
Comment by Mr. Kalashnikov
You don’t know much about Iraqis, do you? Do you seriously believe that Iraqis are just a bunch of ignorant goat herders? Or that a significant number of Irani immigrants are skilled in “fission bomb design and uranium refinement”?
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:59 pm#
Key McCain backer joins Fred!
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/ 2007/ 07/ 22/ mccain-loses-key-supporter/
Comment by Jim — July 22, 2007 @ 4:59 pm
#
Will his campaign go as well as McCain’s now?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:00 pmChrisL and Upside, Saddam should have been left in power?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:01 pm#
ChrisL and Upside, Saddam should have been left in power?
Comment by LLD — July 22, 2007 @ 5:01 pm
#
Saddam was one of MANY cruel, terrible dictators. Many of which we are still allies with – see Saudi Arabia. The power vacuum created by removing Saddam from power has created a place for a much worse leader to now fill. Saddam was horrible, his children even worse, but we had him under control. So, to answer your question, yes he should have remained in power. Nation building and regime change should not be part of American foreign policy. I can name 20 worse dictators off the top of my head, a few of which we consider “allies”. Do you want to go to war with the rest of the world?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:05 pmComment by LLD — July 22, 2007 @ 5:01 pm
#
When we first invaded Iraq in 2003, our leaders were saying the war would last “weeks, not months”. How much support would they have had if they said we were staying for the next 50 years?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:07 pmSo LLD, getting Saddam out of office because he was so evil is the reason you support this invasion and occupation?
Be honest, I want to hear this!!
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:08 pmBack on topic. It is good to see so many Iranians are moving to the US. I have only known a few, but their math skills are generally excellent, their work ethic phenomenal, and I think they will be wonderful for our society in general.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:13 pmYou don’t know much about Iraqis, do you? Do you seriously believe that Iraqis are just a bunch of ignorant goat herders? Or that a significant number of Irani immigrants are skilled in “fission bomb design and uranium refinement�
Comment by gummitch — July 22, 2007 @ 4:59 pm
They just have no infrastructure, all the rich and/or educated are leaving, 70% of their oil will be given to the Big Boyz, they will be in anarchy for the next 50 years. Other than that, I am sure they are ecstatic!
Get a clue!
Comment by upside00 — July 22, 2007 @ 4:57 pm
upside00 is closer to the truth then gummitch. I was only applying satire with the phrase: “fission bomb design and uranium refinement†– listen to W and Deadeye if you are too dense to get the rational for that. Many, if not most, educated Iraqis have expatriated to other countries in order to ensure their survival along with that of their families.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:20 pmYou don’t know much about Iraqis, do you? Do you seriously believe that Iraqis are just a bunch of ignorant goat herders? Or that a significant number of Irani immigrants are skilled in “fission bomb design and uranium refinement�
Comment by gummitch — July 22, 2007 @ 4:59 pm
———————————————–
Huh?
No. I was saying that the Iranians immigrants most likely have education and skills that Iraqi refugees do not.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:30 pm“And you say this because……….??â€
Thompson supports freedom for the Iraqi people; none of the Dem candidates do.
Comment by Jim — July 22, 2007 @ 4:36 pm
That’s because the only “freedom” the Iraqis face nowadays is the “freedom” to blow up or get shot while driving or walking somewhere ……
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:31 pmHuh?
No. I was saying that the Iranians immigrants most likely have education and skills that Iraqi refugees do not.
Comment by Mr. Kalashnikov — July 22, 2007 @ 5:30 pm
And how is that in any way relevant ?
You GOP/Chimpy backers lack lots of skills and are still allowed to vote (though I’m sure the rest of the country questions at to why that is)
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:33 pmJust proves the war was not about liberating Iraqis
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:33 pmIraqi ex patriots will vote for the Republican party.
Comment by The Eck
You mean all 825 of them? Wow, that’s going to swing an election in your favor. On the other hand, w/ the 5 Supremes, it just might help ya take Ohio or Fla again.
(BTW, how do you vote “for the Republican Party”??? What position is the Party running for?)
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:34 pmWe’d be strongerest as a nation if we admitted every Iraqi and every Irani on this planet into the country. Not doing so would be xenophobic!
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:34 pmMcMetal,
And they are SOOO happy with that freedom, aren’t they! The only difference now from before the invasion, is that the other side is killing more of the other side than before. That is all that has changed, and neither side will be better off 10 years from now.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:35 pmNo. I was saying that the Iranians immigrants most likely have education and skills that Iraqi refugees do not.
Comment by Mr. Kalashnikov — July 22, 2007 @ 5:30 pm
Perhaps you missed the many news stories about the hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of Iraqi refugees who went to Syria, Jordan, etc. Among them were most of the professors, scientists, and other educated and skilled Iraqis.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:36 pmChrisL and Upside, Saddam should have been left in power?
Comment by LLD
If it was so urgent and important to take Saddam out, shouldn’t we have taken out all the people who helped put him in power too? Ya know, like Rummy, Cheney, and Bru$ch’s father? Just asking.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:36 pmthat will be rich Iranians ONLY allowed to stay
anybody can buy citizenship in the UK for £1 million except for
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:36 pmMohammad Al Fayaid
Just proves the war was not about liberating Iraqis
Comment by Tobey Tall
Just their oil, Tobey, just their oil! Do barrels of oil vote?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:37 pmWeeeellll,
Hello, I’m Ronald Reagan, former president and Iran/Contra TRAITOR.
Now, I’m DEAD and BURNING IN HELL, and YOU CAN, TOO!
It’s EASY!!
Just continue to support the policies of the BIGGEST TRAITOR to AMERICA EVER, George W. Bush, the Saudi OIL-WHOREBAG!!
Treasonously yours from the pits of hell,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan…
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:38 pmI would like wheat people to replace white people.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:38 pmNo. I was saying that the Iranians immigrants most likely have education and skills that Iraqi refugees do not.
Comment by Mr. Kalashnikov
How would you know? Mr P thought Saudis weren’t Moslems. I hope YOUR grasp on affairs in the Middle East is, how shall we say, a tad bit more factual.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:39 pmComment by Ronald Reagan and his Master Satan — July 22, 2007 @ 5:38 pm
You seem like a tough guy.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:40 pmOperation Iraqi Liberation
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:41 pmNo. I was saying that the Iranians immigrants most likely have education and skills that Iraqi refugees do not.
Comment by Mr. Kalashnikov
And this is based in what? My opinion is that US are a bunch of fat lazy asses ignorant cheap beer drinkers and Wehrner Von Braun told you how to make rockets and Fermi told you how to sustain a fission reaction…
see how easy it is?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:43 pmComment by Ronald Reagan and his Master Satan — July 22, 2007 @ 5:38 pm
You seem like a tough guy.
Comment by Gumby
Weeeellll, yes…
BURNING IN HELL FOR ETERNITY tend to make the meat TOUGH!!!
Treasonously yours from the depths of hell,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:48 pmsee how easy it is?
Comment by Juan C
Psst… Juan? Whilst I don’t totally disagree w/ your characterization, one of the things that once made the US great was the immigrants – the Fermis and Von Brauns (even though Werner was a, gasp! – Nazi!) and the Einsteins and Teslas and Goldwyns and Pulitzers.
The only real native-borns were the Indians. Eveyone else is descended from immigrants. How quickly we forget.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:49 pmWe have come here many times before
To find your strategy to peace is war
Killing helpless men, women and children
That don’t even know what they are dying for
We can’t trust you when you take a stand
WITH A GUN AND BIBLE IN YOUR HAND
And a cold expression on your face
Saying give us what we want or we’ll destroy
“Saturnâ€
Stevie Wonder (1976)
Even MORE TRUE today….
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:49 pmanybody can buy citizenship in the UK for £1 million except for
Mohammad Al Fayaid
so therefore I presume America accepts Money too for citizenship too
I doubt very much Iranians staying in America has anything to do with their skills
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:50 pmComment by Traitor Ronald Reagan and his Master Satan
Gee Ronnie Raygunz, it seems like the Repugs have no option but to try to channel you back since there is no one running for Prez can win.
after Dubya, guess they need SOMETHING to recover, but reality bites and it can hurt bad.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:51 pmGee Ronnie Raygunz, it seems like the Repugs have no option but to try to channel you back since there is no one running for Prez can win.
after Dubya, guess they need SOMETHING to recover, but reality bites and it can hurt bad.
Comment by upside00
Weeellll,
Bush and Cheney are TRAITORS.
I was a TRAITOR, now DEAD and BURNING IN HELL for Iran/Contra!!
And ALL the rest of the field of “candidates” are TRAITORS….
That’s the Rapeublican Party!!!
Treasonously yours and ROASTING like a sonofabeeyotch,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:57 pmPerhaps you missed the many news stories about the hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of Iraqi refugees who went to Syria, Jordan, etc. Among them were most of the professors, scientists, and other educated and skilled Iraqis.
Comment by Jane E. Schneider — July 22, 2007 @ 5:36 pm
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:59 pm——————————————————————-
Well, there is a difference between immigrant and refugee status in the U.S. I am merely saying that the article is comparing the total number of Iranians with the number of Iraqi refugees admitted. The Iranians most likely did not come here for asylum, but rather to further their education, find jobs, etc. Therefore, it makes sense that more would be accepted.
The only real native-borns were the Indians. Eveyone else is descended from immigrants. How quickly we forget.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity
I was playing a Left Troll (so to speak). I dont believe what I posted.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:01 pmThough, yes, Von Braun and hundreds of his engineers were received in the US.
Amazing to see the progressives spinning around, eyes shifting side to side, trying to figure out if this is good or bad, or how to approach it. What do you think? I don’t know, what do you think? Thanks.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:04 pmI was playing a Left Troll (so to speak). I dont believe what I posted.
Though, yes, Von Braun and hundreds of his engineers were received in the US.
Comment by Juan C
Sorry. hard to tell sometimes. Things have been a bit strange here of late. It is my understanding that the US is still keeping informaton from the post-war years and what happened to alot of ex-Nazis secret. Wasn’t there one Nazi scientist that the Soviets got who was basically the father of their space program too?
BTW, your characterization of Americans as fat, lazy beer drinkers isn’t off the mark for a certain percentage of the population either. We’re kind of losing it as a country. Too much potato salad, if ya know what I mean!
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:05 pmAnd this is based in what? My opinion is that US are a bunch of fat lazy asses ignorant cheap beer drinkers and Wehrner Von Braun told you how to make rockets and Fermi told you how to sustain a fission reaction…
see how easy it is?
Comment by Juan C — July 22, 2007 @ 5:43 pm
One note that I would like to add – Ths Chinese invented the solid fuel rocket and Goddard (an American) invented the liquid fuel version. Fermi invented the graphite modulator. That extended a fission reaction to years instead of microseconds. It all depends on what your definition of “sustain” is.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:08 pmAmazing to see the progressives spinning around, eyes shifting side to side, trying to figure out if this is good or bad, or how to approach it. What do you think? I don’t know, what do you think? Thanks.
Comment by r
Still beats the look of dazed failure I see in most Repubes’ eyes these days. It’s like you’re all wondering which Senator or Congressman will get outted on a morals rap next. Diapers, pages, meth-snorting Evangelicals… what’s next?
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:08 pmThe Iranians most likely did not come here for asylum, but rather to further their education, find jobs, etc. Therefore, it makes sense that more would be accepted.
Comment by Mr. Kalashnikov
But… but… they’re almost assuredly MOSLEMS!!!
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:09 pmBut… but… they’re almost assuredly MOSLEMS!!!
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 6:09 pm
Or Jews or Christians.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:13 pmOr Jews or Christians.
Comment by WaltTheMan
Oh yeah, but more likely Moslems, unless they’re fleeing from religious persecution.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:16 pmhuh… OT… please excuse…
but i just heard on sam seder show… a caller from boston…
she said that since mitt romney bought 2 radio stations in boston,
they don’t get AirAmericaRadio anymore…
prit-ty clever…
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:19 pmthanks for your faith in democracy, mitt…
…
Too much potato salad, if ya know what I mean!
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity
Heh. Yeah, I was dying to eat a nice bowl of rice, vegetables and fruit when I was up there in Ohio. Still, beautiful country and superb bunch of folks.
Walt knows much more about the Nazi tech legacy in the US than me.
Comment by WaltTheMan
Hey, nice reading you! I knew you were there somewhere.
Three men of the 20th century can justly lay claim to solving the problem and setting the stage for spaceflight. Working independently, Konstantin Tsiolkovsky in Russia, Robert Goddard in the United States, and Hermann Oberth in Germany designed and, in Goddard’s and Oberth’s cases, built rocket engines propelled by liquid fuel, typically a mixture of kerosene or liquid hydrogen and liquid oxygen. Tsiolkovsky took the first step, publishing a paper in 1903 that mathematically demonstrated how to create the needed thrust with liquid fuels. Among his many insights was the notion of using multistage rockets; as each rocket expended its fuel, it would be jettisoned to reduce the overall weight of the craft and maintain a fuel-to-weight ratio high enough to keep the flight going. He also proposed guidance systems using gyroscopes and movable vanes positioned in the exhaust stream and developed formulas still in use today for adjusting a spacecraft’s direction and speed to place it in an orbit of virtually any given height.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:20 pmmitt romney bought 2 radio stations in boston,
they don’t get AirAmericaRadio anymore…
prit-ty clever…
thanks for your faith in democracy, mitt…
…
Comment by katy
WTF??? AirRomney??? All Mormon talk all the time???
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:22 pmSorry, link here.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:22 pmWalt knows much more about the Nazi tech legacy in the US than me.
Comment by Juan C — July 22, 2007
Does Walt know anything about the Bush Family’s legacy w/ the Nazi Party? They do a remarkable job of keeping it out of the press.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:24 pmthat’s all i know, tros…
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:31 pmsam nodded/confirmed that…
well, to be precise – sam nodded when she said
no more AAR in boston…
Weeellll,
One of the jokes here in hell is that when a Mormon is excommunicated, they strip you of your second “M”, and demote you
to MORON…
I used to be a Mormon. So did Mitt…
Treasonously yours from the land of MORONS,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:31 pmDoes Walt know anything about the Bush Family’s legacy w/ the Nazi Party? They do a remarkable job of keeping it out of the press.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity
Weellll,
They know it here in hell. ALL of the Bush Crime Family (TM) is coming.
Especially that “mormon” W….
Treasonously yours from the pits of hell,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:33 pmno more AAR in boston…
Comment by katy
Gosh-darned those Stalinist-lefties, always out to censor the underdog-right!
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:38 pmDoes Walt know anything about the Bush Family’s legacy w/ the Nazi Party? They do a remarkable job of keeping it out of the press.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 6:24 pm
The Guardian did what appears to be a thorough job of looking into that in 2004, when severa; documents were declassified. You may want to bookmark the link, as it is a long article:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,1312540,00.html
And for the wingers who only trust American news sources:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,100474,00.html
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:53 pmDoes Walt know anything about the Bush Family’s legacy w/ the Nazi Party? They do a remarkable job of keeping it out of the press.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity
I only know about the technology. Dad was sent to Germany just after the war and brought tons of paper back with him. The work was translated and sent out to the proper defense contracters. On Saturdays, I would sit in the warehouse where things were sorted. Dad, being of German heritage would translate the documents while stenos would commit them to paper. Draftsmen on the side would render the diagrams into ‘American’ formats.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:54 pmOn Saturdays, I would sit in the warehouse where things were sorted. Dad, being of German heritage would translate the documents while stenos would commit them to paper. Draftsmen on the side would render the diagrams into ‘American’ formats.
Comment by WaltTheMan
Wow… what a fascinating experience to have had. My father was a bombadier on a B-17. He has some interesting things from the war – aeriel recon photos and such, but nothing like that.
He told me a story once. One of the P-51 pilots came back to the base one day all excited. He said he had been flying along in his Mustang, which was the fastest plane the Allies had at the time, when this strange German plane w/ no propeller pulled up along side him.
The pilots actually made eye contact. The German smiled, waved, and was GONE! No one believed the pilot at the time. (He had just seen the ME-262…)
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:02 pmI’m just shocked by the uncharacteristic overt racism.
Generally it’s very PC suppressed.
Iranis have critical skills – Iraqis have no such skills
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:23 pm
You want to throw out some good Jew and Irish stereotypes, or do you want to recant?
And the rest of you Tpers, you want to support this or reject it?
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:06 pmAnd the rest of you Tpers, you want to support this or reject it?
Comment by r
Ask WaltTHeMan what he really meant. It appears to be sarcasm and you appear to be deliberately distorting what WTM said. Next time, use the whole comment and not just the part that makes WTM look racist.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:12 pmI’m just shocked by the uncharacteristic overt racism.
Generally it’s very PC suppressed.
Iranis have critical skills – Iraqis have no such skills
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:23 pm
You want to throw out some good Jew and Irish stereotypes, or do you want to recant?
And the rest of you Tpers, you want to support this or reject it?
Comment by r — July 22, 2007 @ 7:06 pm
Why don’t you try posting what he really wrote instead of taking it completely out of context, douchbag.
Iranis have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. The Iraqis have no such skills which makes the Iranis more desirable.
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:23 pm
Nothing racist about that, it’s a simple fact. The Iranians do have more nuclear technology skills than the Iraqis, and that is usually a basis for letting immigrants into our country.
Don’t try to get away with crap like that. It doesn’t make you look in the least bit credible.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:14 pmWow… what a fascinating experience to have had. My father was a bombadier on a B-17. He has some interesting things from the war – aeriel recon photos and such, but nothing like that.
He told me a story once. One of the P-51 pilots came back to the base one day all excited. He said he had been flying along in his Mustang, which was the fastest plane the Allies had at the time, when this strange German plane w/ no propeller pulled up along side him.
The pilots actually made eye contact. The German smiled, waved, and was GONE! No one believed the pilot at the time. (He had just seen the ME-262…)
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 7:02 pm
If anyone wonders why I spent Saturdays in the warehouse, just understand that Mom had me from Monday to Friday. Saturday was Dad’s shift and Sunday was a day of rest. Nana took over the triplets who were born on June 06, 1944.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:16 pmComment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 7:12 pm
Was he being sarcastic? I didn’t read the whole exchange, I just wanted to see what WTM really wrote. I do happen to believe that the skills part could be a reason for letting more Iranians in than Iraqis, but I also believe that our government is, once again, renegging on a promise to help the Iraqi people after destroying their country.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:16 pmIranis have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. The Iraqis have no such skills which makes the Iranis more desirable.
Comment by WaltTheMan
there – the whole, accurate statement for you, not the part you editted dishonestly. Nice try, though.
Here’s an uneditted, direct quote from Rush Limbaugh…
“Have you ever noticed how all composite pictures of wanted criminals resemble Jesse Jackson?”
Now, THAT’S racism. Hope you’re a little clearer on the concept now.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:20 pmProbably not, but we can hope.
I also believe that our government is, once again, renegging on a promise to help the Iraqi people after destroying their country.
Comment by Wayne A. Schneider
WTM is still here. He just replied to a post I made. Let’s ask him. It sure sounds like sarcasm to me. I’ve heard more than once that the educated class is fleeing Iraq as fast as the can – the doctors, college professors.
What did you mean, Walt?
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:23 pmOf course, r seems to have run off rather than deal w/ his own words.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:23 pmOf course, r seems to have run off rather than deal w/ his own words.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 7:23 pm
Maybe he has another Maytag machine to go repair. :D
Like I said, I didn’t read the whole exchange and if I’ve offended you, WaltTheMan, I sincerely apologize. I do believe that nuclear skills would be considered a valuable skill to let in, if only to keep them out of Iran during this critical phase. I did not realize that doctors and college professors (also useful) were being kept out.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:27 pmMy question was to WTM. Is this how you think?
And TPers do you support it?
Wayne Schneider adds:
Iranis have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. The Iraqis have no such skills which makes the Iranis more desirable.
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:23 pm
Nothing racist about that, it’s a simple fact. The Iranians do have more nuclear technology skills than the Iraqis, and that is usually a basis for letting immigrants into our country.
Don’t try to get away with crap like that. It doesn’t make you look in the least bit credible.
Comment by Wayne A. Schneider — July 22, 2007 @ 7:14 pm
Wayne clearly supports it, without sarcasm. He thinks Iranians (as a people) have better skills than Iraqis.
Is this what TP advocates?
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:28 pmI did not realize that doctors and college professors (also useful) were being kept out.
Comment by Wayne A. Schneider
I don’t know if they’re being kept out, but they supposedly are fleeing that bloodbath for their dear lives. I thought they had been targeted specifically.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:29 pmComment by r — July 22, 2007 @ 7:06 pm
Completely debunked. Thanks for participating.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:31 pmHe thinks Iranians (as a people) have better skills than Iraqis.
Comment by r
You should ask your money from your elementary school back. You didnt learn to read quite well.
Walt never said better. He said critical, as in special skills of some sort. Try harder.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:34 pmIs this what TP advocates?
Comment by r
Don’t know. Ask TP directly. Do you support overt racism like Rush Limbaugh’s? Do you always take people’s words out of context and then not take responsibility for your actions? So many good questions, so few honest trolls.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:34 pmRead about the sorry way he done somebody’s daughter
Chained her to a heavy thing and threw her in the water
And she sank into the darkness with their baby son inside her
A little piece of truth and beauty died
Burning up the atmosphere and cutting down the trees
The billion dollar bombing of a nation on it’s knees
Anyone not marching to their tune they call it treason
Everyone says God is on his side
See the lightning, hear the cries
Of the wounded in a world in Holy war
Mortal thunder from the skies
Killing everything they say they’re fighting for
Broken babies, broken homes
Broken-hearted people dying everyday
How’d this happen, what went wrong
Don’t blame God, I swear to God I heard him say
Chorus
“Not in my name, not on my ground
I want nothing but the ending of the war
No more killing, or it’s over
And the mystery won’t matter anymore”
Broken dreamers, broken rules
Broken-hearted people just like me and you
We are children of the stars
Don’t blame God, I swear to God he’s crying too
Better THINK, America.
Or you’ll end up BURNING IN HELL with TRAITORS like Bush and ME.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:36 pmI did not realize that doctors and college professors (also useful) were being kept out.
Comment by Wayne A. Schneider
I don’t know if they’re being kept out, but they supposedly are fleeing that bloodbath for their dear lives. I thought they had been targeted specifically.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 7:29 pm
To both of you, being “kept out” is equal to being assasinated. If you follow the news, about three or four Iraqi proffessionals meet an untimely end each day.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:41 pmWalt never said better. He said critical
Yes. I’ve been accused for tittering over little word meaning in an attempt to divert the subject.
So far nobody at this site is willing to stand against racism.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:47 pmTo both of you, being “kept out†is equal to being assasinated. If you follow the news, about three or four Iraqi proffessionals meet an untimely end each day.
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 7:41 pm
Well, that would be a bad thing. I knew that lots of Iraqis have been turning up dead every day, but I did not realize that the professionals were being targeted. I thought a lot of them were the result of blood feuds or tribal disputes, or plain old Shia-Sunni violence instigated by outsiders.
All I know is that this wasn’t happening on the scale it is now before we toppled their government.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:48 pmSo far nobody at this site is willing to stand against racism.
Comment by r — July 22, 2007 @ 7:47 pm
Racism is bad. There, I said it and I’m glad.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:49 pmIf you follow the news, about three or four Iraqi proffessionals meet an untimely end each day.
Comment by WaltTheMan
I assumed that. My comment was that I did not know how many of the proefessional class were coming to the US (825 is not a very big number), but that they were fleeing Iraq for their dear lives. It is my understanding that they are being targeted for he same reason teachers are targeted in Afghanistan. Not Islamic enough and way too Western.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:51 pmComment by r — July 22, 2007 @ 7:06 pm
Completely debunked. Thanks for participating. – Even though nothing was said.
Comment by Juan C — July 22, 2007 @ 7:31 p
He thinks Iranians (as a people) have better skills than Iraqis.
Comment by r
You should ask your money from your elementary school back. You didnt learn to read quite well.
Walt never said better. He said critical, as in special skills of some sort. Try harder.
Comment by Juan C — July 22, 2007 @ 7:34 pm
So this is your debate style. Ok, you’re smart as a box of flat rocks.
Case closed. Game, Set, Match… Juanc you lose. Next…
Same style, same substance.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:53 pmSo far nobody at this site is willing to stand against racism.
Comment by r
Let me be blunt. You’re full of shit. You’re distorting meanings and refusing to answer questions or take responsibily for your own words.
You’re a self-serving phony.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:53 pmComment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 7:51 pm
That makes sense now. Stupid religious fervor. When are people going to stop killing other people in the name of their “all-powerful” Gods, when those Gods should be able to do their own killing?
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:54 pmHey, r,
Don’t you have a Maytag machine to go repair?
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:55 pmSo far nobody at this site is willing to stand against racism.
Comment by r
You are the racist. You think Iraqis couldnt rise against Saddam if they had wanted to. You think they are but peasants and farmers who didnt stand a chance against the brutal dictator Saddam was. Thats why you think bombing them since 1991, starve the population and fabricate laughable proofs to invade them was such a good idea. Yeah, the Western civilization providing freedom all over the world.
Take a shot with China, you freaking moron.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:57 pmExactly what I’m trying to do is get folks to take responsibly for their own words.
Distorting meanings?
Refusing to answer questions?
Maybe I missed the post. To what do you refer?
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:00 pmMaybe I missed the post. To what do you refer?
Comment by r
It does appear you deliberately took WTM’s words out of context. You took his post and left part of it out. To me, that’s distorting the meaning of what he said, you smarmy phony.
And now, you refuse to answer that question. Why did you deliberately misquote him?
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:04 pmIt would be interesting to check into the backgrounds of the Iranis and Iraqis being let into the country and on what basis.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:06 pmMaybe I missed the post.
Comment by r
One gets the feeling you just didnt miss the point, you missed the boat completely. I have to go now. Go ahead, make a ridiculous comment when I’m not here to stick it back up your nose for ya, or quote me out of context. You’re a fraud.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:08 pmSo far nobody at this site is willing to stand against racism.
Comment by r
So far nobody at this site is willing to stand against racism.
Comment by r
Walt was being sarcastic and mimicking future pundit talking points like Limbaugh will likely do r:
The fact is folks Iranians now [rattles candy bar wrapper] how to build nukes folks, we gotta [swallows a pill] stop these mad educated mullahs!! [rattles twinkie wrapper] Next thing ya know they will be building remote controlled camels in America!!
Bow to Mrs Yeck Bleck eck =)
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:13 pmBow to Mrs Yeck Bleck eck =)
Comment by ECKs Momma
Thanks for the clarification.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:22 pm101 Juan C said:
You are the racist. You think Iraqis couldnt rise against Saddam if they had wanted to. You think they are but peasants and farmers who didnt stand a chance against the brutal dictator Saddam was. Thats why you think bombing them since 1991, starve the population and fabricate laughable proofs to invade them was such a good idea. Yeah, the Western civilization providing freedom all over the world.
Take a shot with China, you freaking moron.
Comment by Juan C — July 22, 2007 @ 7:57 pm
Um. I didn’t say anything about Iraqis ability against Saddam. I didn’t say anything about peasant or farmers or dictators. I never suggested bombing, or starving or fabricating proofs. You really should retract that post – you have no facts. Although, ending with “you freaking moron†suggest you won’t.
TP should be so proud of you.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:29 pm# 106 and 107 think Walt was being sarcastic and mimicking future pundit talking points.
Deflect the obvious racism
Juan C thinks he was right without sarcasm.
Get your stories straight.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:35 pmGet your stories straight.
Comment by r
Of course, you could always ask Walt directly, but you won’t. Not too brave, huh?
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:36 pmDid you, or did you not, take Walt’s words out of context?
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:38 pmFunny trolls. So wrong about everything and still showing their feces here.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:46 pmAgain, I have stirred a hornet’s nest.
This is my mindset – we should never have invaded Iraq. We should have finished the job in Afghanistan and Pakistan. W blindly followed Rove, Rumsfeld and Cheney into a black hole (from which we may never escape).
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:52 pmHere’s the entire post:
#8, look it up.
Iranis have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. The Iraqis have no such skills which makes the Iranis more desirable.
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:23 pm
Where did I go wrong?
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:52 pmWhere did I go wrong?
Comment by r — July 22, 2007 @ 8:52 pm
It was satire.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:55 pmWow, after 100 posts you decide your defense is satire. Heh. What about Juan C and Republic of Stupidity who have been trying to defend you all night.
Under the bus, just like the Iraqis.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:02 pmIf you do not understand the meaning of satire, read the following.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:05 pmIt was satire.
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 8:55 pm
Wow, after 100 posts you decide your defense is satire. Heh. What about Juan C and Republic of Stupidity who have been trying to defend you all night.
Under the bus, just like the Iraqis.
Comment by r
What about us? We simply have the intelligence to undrstand the humor.
What about you? Confronted w/ your attempt to maliciously distort Walt’s words, you simply wave your hands in the air and run off.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:06 pmHey, Walt, did you go out? I havent read much from you. I havent been in TP too much, neither.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:07 pmMore news of progress from Iraq:
Sunday: 76 Iraqis Killed, 64 Injured
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:08 pmHere it is again for new readers.
#8, look it up.
Iranis have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. The Iraqis have no such skills which makes the Iranis more desirable.
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:23 pm
My non-racist contention is “All Iranis don’t have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. And all Iraqis are not necessarily devoid of such skillsâ€
I realize now that the rest of TP left you kids long ago.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:13 pmWalt’s words – straight from the horse’s mouth.
r’s words, straight from the horse’s other end.
You didn’t stir up a hornet’s nest,WTM. r did. He posted an edicted version of your comment and asked if TP supported racism.
r’s 1st post –
“I’m just shocked by the uncharacteristic overt racism.
Generally it’s very PC suppressed.
Iranis have critical skills – Iraqis have no such skills
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:23 pm
You want to throw out some good Jew and Irish stereotypes, or do you want to recant?
And the rest of you Tpers, you want to support this or reject it?
Comment by r
It certainly looks like a deliberate attempt to distort your words to me.
BTWI also agree 100% w/ your assessment below.
“This is my mindset – we should never have invaded Iraq. We should have finished the job in Afghanistan and Pakistan. W blindly followed Rove, Rumsfeld and Cheney into a black hole (from which we may never escape).”
Comment by WaltTheMan
I also agree 100% w/ your assessment.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:14 pmWow, after 100 posts you decide your defense is satire. Heh. What about Juan C and Republic of Stupidity who have been trying to defend you all night.
Under the bus, just like the Iraqis.
Comment by r — July 22, 2007 @ 9:02 pm
I said that it was satire in my post 32 (Base ten). What numbering system are using? It is neither base four (100= 16 (Base ten)), base five (100 = 25 (Base ten)) nor base six (100 = 36 (Base ten)).
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:17 pmMy non-racist contention is “All Iranis don’t have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. And all Iraqis are not necessarily devoid of such skillsâ€
I realize now that the rest of TP left you kids long ago.
Comment by r
Distort, distort, distort.
“My non-racist contention” – the main point being argued for in informal logic. Arue for your “contention” if you choose. Walt told you what he meant. You’re free to make up whatever “facts” you need to to fit your arguments.
Pretty pathetic, r. Pretty weinie.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:19 pmI said that it was satire in my post 32 (Base ten). What numbering system are using? It is neither base four (100= 16 (Base ten)), base five (100 = 25 (Base ten)) nor base six (100 = 36 (Base ten)).
Comment by WaltTheMan
Heh.
BTW, I dont agree with your idea of invading Afghanistan and Pakistan for terrorism acts. Terrorism is a criminal issue not an act of war. Invading countries wont solve terrorism as we have seen.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:20 pmI realize now that the rest of TP left you kids long ago.
Comment by r
Whatever.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:21 pmBTW, I dont agree with your idea of invading Afghanistan and Pakistan for terrorism acts. Terrorism is a criminal issue not an act of war. Invading countries wont solve terrorism as we have seen.
Comment by Juan C
At the time, Juan, the Taliban was the official government of Afghanistan and was harboring al Qaeda. I didn’t like it but I thought it was necesssary. I’m not sure Walt said “invade Pakistan”, although his actual wording is a little ambiguous. I do think once we went into Afghanistan, we should have stabilized it. Now, they’re back to growing poppies in huge numbers. No good!
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:26 pmWay late to the blogs today.
Iraqi ex patriots will vote for the Republican party.
Comment by The Eck — July 22, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
Okay. So they get 825 votes. Big whoop.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:28 pmBig whoop.
Comment by Marcus Aurelius
I dunno… could be enough to make a Repube dogcatcher someplace. You nevr know.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:33 pmHere’s the entire post:
#8, look it up.
Iranis have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. The Iraqis have no such skills which makes the Iranis more desirable.
Comment by WaltTheMan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:23 pm
Where did I go wrong?
Comment by r — July 22, 2007 @ 8:52 pm
You went wrong when you (apparently) characterized the post as racist.
That’s pretty wrong.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:34 pmJuan,
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:37 pmI microcoded translation routines that converted from and to all possible number systems fron base two to base sixteen. In base 16, 10 is equivalent to 16, while it is equivalent to two in base two. That was for the FS architecture that never came to fruition at a minor computer company.
Now, they’re back to growing poppies in huge numbers. No good!
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity
Seriously and respectfully, what did you expect? Lets go further, do you think it is convenient for US admin to stop terrorism at all? Lets go even further, do you think it is convenient for ANY govt to stop terrorism at all?
And I am talking about the real terrorist threat: those cells that are not supported and trained by G-8 and Israel. Cuz we all know there are a lot of fabricated threats.
Do you think war on drugs by Clinton was made in order to get rid of drug dealers and Columbian guerrillas? I read the other week that they are finding more and more mass graves where the govt supported paramilitary buried all the peasants who didnt cooperate with the plan for taking the drug business under governmental control.
Do you think NATO bombing Serbia was to protect Kosovar Albanians? mmmm…again, big NO.
You see? Every war has an economic goal. Not one war is made for religious, race or cultural reasons. Thats just the flavor that we feed on.
I apologize if I seem like Im trying to lecture you in stuff you probably already know.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:37 pmThat’s pretty wrong.
Comment by Marcus Aurelius
He either doesn’t get it or refuses to admit he was deliberately distorting WTM’s words. Even Walt told him it was sarcasm and r still keeps harping on racism. Once a troll, always a troll.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:38 pmMy non-racist contention is “All Iranis don’t have critical skills – like fission bomb design and uranium refinement. And all Iraqis are not necessarily devoid of such skillsâ€
I realize now that the rest of TP left you kids long ago.
Comment by r — July 22, 2007 @ 9:13 pm
No, you freekin’ instigating fascist pig.
It would be racism if you replaced “Iranian” with “Persian, and “Iraqi” with “Arab”.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:39 pmI re read my comment and I pretty much drifted. Sorry.
My point is that if you are going to invade countries that support terrorist cells planning to attack you…well, you have a very long way to go.
Raven summarized best in a past thread. (Im not quoting) Better respect other cultures, dont thread on people for economic interests, cuz all empires fall.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:42 pmWell r, I guess you trolls had no defense of the statistics in this thread.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:50 pmSo you pick a comment and split hairs over one sentence to divert attention from the fact that we have a total disregard for the welfare of the Iraqi people.
And you neocons dare to call progressives racist. The irony is hysterical, in a really sad, pathetic, morally bereft way. Do you Republicans have no soul whatsoever?
Juan,
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:50 pmJapan is still good and healthy. They had a minor setback in the 1940’s, but are as healthy as ever now.
Another missed priority.
http://OsiSpeaks.com or http://OsiSpeaks.org
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:50 pmdont thread on people for economic interests, cuz all empires fall.
Comment by Juan C —
Seems people have forgotten the lessons of Napoleon, Hilter, and Rome.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:52 pmSome people never learn or think themselves smarter than the people who came before them..
That was for the FS architecture that never came to fruition at a minor computer company.
Comment by WaltTheMan
Good post WTM. This should have little troll r’s head spinning for at least 10 minutes.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:53 pmThat was for the FS architecture that never came to fruition at a minor computer company.
Comment by WaltTheMan
Im at a loss at electronics. I had to work with thermoelectric modules for the Master´s degree and therefore I had to read about semiconductors, band gaps and well, quantum description of reality which is the founding of computers, lasers, etc. I admire you.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:56 pmGood post WTM. This should have little troll r’s head spinning for at least 10 minutes.
Comment by shane — July 22, 2007 @ 9:53 pm
The sin of it all was that the big iron could not produce a product. Intermediate and small systems could.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:03 pmSome people never learn or think themselves smarter than the people who came before them..
Comment by Nance
Sadly, they are learning. The vast majority of world population are working in order to survive while filling the pockets of very few people.
And you didnt have to enslave them (at least in some part of the world), you didnt have to invade countries to acquire markets (Hitler´s mistake), you didnt have force them with a gun to do that. The ruling elite is learning, of course. They even use fancy names such as: free trade, productivity, corporation fusions, etc.
Someone remembers how free trade was sold, how technocrats were going to solve everybody else´s economical problems…I remember the propaganda here in Mexico. I remember the propaganda in Argentina… and 20 years later, we have most of the population struggling below the poverty line. They are learning and we are dumber.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:03 pmRead an earlier post questioning education in Iran vs. Iraq so just did a little fact searching.
Iran Literacy: from information collected in 2003, 85.6% of males and 73% of females over the age of 15 are literate, Thus 79.4% of the population is literate.
Iraq Literacy: age 15 and over can read and write
total population: 74.1%
male: 84.1%
female: 64.2% (2000 est.)
Iran is suffering a huge brain drain of appx 200,000/year of higher educated.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:04 pmfounding must be foundation
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:05 pmAll,
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:17 pmI’m off to bed. Old farts like me require intense sleep.
Later, Walt. Domo arigato gozaimashita. ;)
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:18 pm#143
Comment by Juan C
Yep, here we call it NAFTA, CAFTA, and out-sourcing, and now they’re talking about a North American Trade Union. Tradw without borders.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:24 pmYou beat me to it, Nance.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:40 pmNight all, On EST, so it’s near my bedtime.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:49 pmIt’s OT, but did anyone see this?
Here’s the full text:
WASHINGTON — Oregonians called Peter DeFazio’s office, worried there was a conspiracy buried in the classified portion of a White House plan for operating the government after a terrorist attack.
As a member of the U.S. House on the Homeland Security Committee, DeFazio, D-Ore., is permitted to enter a secure “bubbleroom” in the Capitol and examine classified material. So he asked the White House to see the secret documents.
On Wednesday, DeFazio got his answer: DENIED.
“I just can’t believe they’re going to deny a member of Congress the right of reviewing how they plan to conduct the government of the United States after a significant terrorist attack,” DeFazio says.
Homeland Security Committee staffers told his office that the White House initially approved his request, but it was later quashed. DeFazio doesn’t know who did it or why.
“We’re talking about the continuity of the government of the United States of America,” DeFazio says. “I would think that would be relevant to any member of Congress, let alone a member of the Homeland Security Committee.”
Bush administration spokesman Trey Bohn declined to say why DeFazio was denied access: “We do not comment through the press on the process that this access entails. It is important to keep in mind that much of the information related to the continuity of government is highly sensitive.”
Norm Ornstein, a legal scholar who studies government continuity at the conservative American Enterprise Institute, said he “cannot think of one good reason” to deny access to a member of Congress who serves on the Homeland Security Committee.
“I find it inexplicable and probably reflective of the usual, knee-jerk overextension of executive power that we see from this White House,” Ornstein said.
This is the first time DeFazio has been denied access to documents. DeFazio has asked Homeland Security Committee Chairman Bennie Thompson, D-Miss., to help him access the documents.
“Maybe the people who think there’s a conspiracy out there are right,” DeFazio said.
This is a massive red flag. There are no (legal, legitimate) reasons for holding back information from a Congressman who has been specifically tasked with overseeing the very information you are denying him. Rep. DeFazio is on the House Homeland Security Committee. Homeland Security. If there were any one committee in all of the House that should have access to the plans for the operations of our government after a terrorist attack, it is the damned House Homeland Security Committee!
Think about all of the potential reason for preventing someone with the highest possible levels of security clearance in the specific field in which the documents he requests lie. At the least, the plans post-attack are inappropriate enough that the President doesn’t want any Constitutionally-mandated oversight on them. At the worst, all of the most horrific fears you or I could imagine could be planned, prepped and ready to go.
This one needs to be reported very, very loudly, and very, very clearly from the rooftops.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:20 pmThe Iraqis are once again getting the short end of the stick.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:29 pmStay the curse.
Moderation
DeFazio, I think represents Eugene Or, is one of the most respected. There was a push to get him to run against Sen Smith ‘08, but he declined as he says he can do more for the people in the House. Obviously he smells a conspiracy – good… he will get what ever needs to be fixed done.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:43 pmWe need any and all strong peole in both the House and the Senate. We need a strong majority in both houses.
And, being a fellow Westerner, we WILL be responsible for getting our country back!
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:52 pmBREAKING!!
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/davidswanson/160
Conyers says he will start IMPEACHMENT, regardless of Pelosi, if he can get THREE MORE members (presently 14) of the House to sign on!!
Call your Congressman TOMORROW and EVERY DAY.
Don’t let the USA fall to TRAITORS like the Bushes and Cheneys.
And ME, DEAD and BURNING IN HELL for my TREASON…
Treasonously yours from the pits of hell,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:53 pmRonald Reagan and his Master Satan
Thank you….. you made my night.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:58 pmCall congress tomorrow
1 202 225 3121
yes to impeachment;
sign on with Conyers.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:02 amRonald Reagan and his Master Satan
Thank you….. you made my night.
Comment by had enough
Weeeellll, Thank you!!
It’s time I did something FOR the USA instead of my usual commission of TREASON…
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:25 amThe de-programing and re-programing is time consuming.
July 23rd, 2007 at 3:04 amNo one is allowed to come here who has any memory of what is going on in their home country.
Can you imagine a few thousand people telling the truth about the gigantic mess.
And you ask how do they make them forget?
You gotta know this group has the all the keys to advanced memory loss.
I mean if there is any secret to forgetting everything these guys own it.
Iraqis are freedom fighters for the entire world. If amerika succeeds in stealing their oil, there’s no saying who they’d invade next to steal resources.
The US doesn’t make much of anything anymore apart from weapons and dodgy financial instruments (junck bonds), and with its 5 % of the world’s population it isn’t willing to give up it’s use of 25-35% of the world ’s resources (tin, zinc, copper etc). So it’s reverting to 19th century style resource wars.
The longer Iraqis hold out, the longer the rest of the world has to arm itself against amerika’s onslaught.
Everything else – all that talk of terrorism – is just hokum.
July 23rd, 2007 at 5:20 amGot to get all those “Former Iranian Nuclear Weapons Contstructors” over to the States for use in whipping up the base to clap louder for WWIII( part b).
July 23rd, 2007 at 5:24 amTHEY HAD TO KILL HIM.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/26/AR2006122601033.html
A soldier resisting return to Iraq – depressed and despondent?
KILL HIM!
The message has now been sent from the McCain/Lieberman Warmongers For Israel Tribe – “Kill or be killed!” His only other alternative was to be sent to one of the new CONCENTRATION CAMPS for those who resist the EMPIRE:
US CONCENTRATION CAMPS – IN WYOMING!
FIRST THEY CAME FOR THE MEXICANS, BUT I WAS NOT MEXICAN, SO I DID NOT SPEAK OUT.
NEXT THEY CAME FOR THE DRAFT DODGERS, BUT I WAS TOO OLD TO BE DRAFTED, SO I DID NOT SPEAK OUT.
THEN THEY CAME FOR ME.
“Swift Luck Greens”
What is it, Senator? ASK!
It’s located here:
Latitude: 41.92 Longitude: -106.521944
In Cheney’s home state of Wyoming.
Halliburton’s subsidiary KBR (formerly Kellogg, Brown and Root) announced on January 24, 2006 that it had been awarded a $385 million contingency contract by the Department of Homeland Security to build detention camps in the United States.
According to a press release posted on the Halliburton website, “The contract, which is effective immediately, provides for establishing temporary detention and processing capabilities to augment existing Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) Detention and Removal Operations (DRO) Program facilities in the event of an emergency influx of immigrants into the U.S., or to support the rapid development of new programs. The contingency support contract provides for planning and, if required, initiation of specific engineering, construction and logistics support tasks to establish, operate and maintain one or more expansion facilities.â€
What little coverage the announcement received focused on concerns about Halliburton’s reputation for overcharging U.S. taxpayers for substandard services.
Less attention was focused on the phrase “rapid development of new programs†or what type of programs might require a major expansion of detention centers, capable of holding 5,000 people each. Jamie Zuieback, spokeswoman for ICE, declined to elaborate on what these “new programs†might be.
“detention centers could be used to detain American citizens if the Bush administration were to declare martial law.†He recalled that during the Reagan administration, National Security Council aide Oliver North organized the Rex-84 “readiness exercise,†which contemplated the Federal Emergency Management Agency rounding up and detaining 400,000 “refugees†in the event of “uncontrolled population movements†over the Mexican border into the U.S.
North’s exercise, which reportedly contemplated possible suspension of the Constitution, led to a line of questioning during the Iran-Contra Hearings concerning the idea that plans for expanded internment and detention facilities would not be confined to “refugees†alone.
It is relevant, says Scott, that in 2002 Attorney General John Ashcroft announced his desire to see camps for U.S. citizens deemed to be “enemy combatants.†On February 17, 2006, in a speech to the Council on Foreign Relations, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld spoke of the harm being done to the country’s security, not just by the enemy, but also by what he called “news informers†who needed to be combated in “a contest of wills.â€
Since September 11 the Bush administration has implemented a number of interrelated programs that were planned in the 1980s under President Reagan. Continuity of Government (COG) proposals—a classified plan for keeping a secret “government-within-the-government†running during and after a nuclear disaster—included vastly expanded detention capabilities, warrantless eavesdropping, and preparations for greater use of martial law.
Scott points out that, while Oliver North represented a minority element in the Reagan administration, which soon distanced itself from both the man and his proposals, the minority associated with COG planning, which included Cheney and Rumsfeld, appear to be in control of the U.S. government today.
The contract of the Halliburton subsidiary KBR to build immigrant detention facilities is part of a longer-term Homeland Security plan titled ENDGAME, which sets as its goal the removal of “all removable aliens†and “potential terrorists.†In the 1980s Richard Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld discussed similar emergency detention powers as part of a super-secret program of planning for what was euphemistically called “Continuity of Government†(COG) in the event of a nuclear disaster. At the time, Cheney was a Wyoming congressman, while Rumsfeld, who had been defense secretary under President Ford, was a businessman and CEO of the drug company G.D. Searle.
These men planned for suspension of the Constitution, not just after nuclear attack, but for any “national security emergency,†which they defined in Executive Order 12656 of 1988 as: “Any occurrence, including natural disaster, military attack, technological or other emergency, that seriously degrades or seriously threatens the national security of the United States.†Clearly September 11 would meet this definition, and did, for COG was instituted on that day. As the Washington Post later explained, the order “dispatched a shadow government of about 100 senior civilian managers to live and work secretly outside Washington, activating for the first time long-standing plans.â€
What these managers in this shadow government worked on has never been reported. But it is significant that the group that prepared ENDGAME was, as the Homeland Security document puts it, “chartered in September 2001.†For ENDGAME’s goal of a capacious detention capability is remarkably similar to Oliver North’s controversial Rex-84 “readiness exercise†for COG in 1984.
1984 – how appropriate.
http://www.democracyforums.com/showthread.php?tid=297
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:24 amhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_Inmate_Labor_Program
Wikipedia:
Civilian Inmate Labor Program -
The Civilian Inmate Labor Program is a program of the United States Army provided by Army Regulation 210-35[1]. The regulation, first drafted in 1997 and went under a “rapid act revision” in January 2005, provides policy for the creation of labor programs and prison camps on Army installations. The labor would be provided by persons under the supervision of the Federal Bureau of Prisons.
Prison camps
The regulation also sets forth policy for the creation of prison camps on Army installations. These would be used to keep inmates of the labor programs resident on the installations.
In January 2006, Kellogg, Brown and Root reported that they had received a contract from the Department of Homeland Security to expand ICE DRO facilities “in the event of an emergency influx of immigrants into the U.S., or to support the rapid development of new programs.”[3] A February news article comments that the “new programs” mentioned could include the Civilian Inmate Labour Program.[4] ICE has “joint federal facilities” with the Federal Bureau of Prisons.[5]
External links
1. ^ AR 210-35 Civilian Inmate Labor Program (PDF) (2004). Retrieved on 2006-03-09.
http://www.truthout.org/cgi-bin/artman/exec/view.cgi/47/17936
Bush’s Mysterious ‘New Programs’
By Nat Parry
Consortium News
Tuesday 21 February 2006
Not that George W. Bush needs much encouragement, but Sen. Lindsey Graham suggested to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales a new target for the administration’s domestic operations – Fifth Columnists, supposedly disloyal Americans who sympathize and collaborate with the enemy.
“The administration has not only the right, but the duty, in my opinion, to pursue Fifth Column movements,” Graham, R-S.C., told Gonzales during Senate Judiciary Committee hearings on Feb. 6.
“I stand by this President’s ability, inherent to being Commander in Chief, to find out about Fifth Column movements, and I don’t think you need a warrant to do that,” Graham added, volunteering to work with the administration to draft guidelines for how best to neutralize this alleged threat.
“Senator,” a smiling Gonzales responded, “the President already said we’d be happy to listen to your ideas.”
In less paranoid times, Graham’s comments might be viewed by many Americans as a Republican trying to have it both ways – ingratiating himself to an administration of his own party while seeking some credit from Washington centrists for suggesting Congress should have at least a tiny say in how Bush runs the War on Terror.
But recent developments suggest that the Bush administration may already be contemplating what to do with Americans who are deemed insufficiently loyal or who disseminate information that may be considered helpful to the enemy.
Top US officials have cited the need to challenge news that undercuts Bush’s actions as a key front in defeating the terrorists, who are aided by “news informers” in the words of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld.
Detention Centers
Plus, there was that curious development in January when the Army Corps of Engineers awarded Halliburton subsidiary Kellogg Brown & Root a $385 million contract to construct detention centers somewhere in the United States, to deal with “an emergency influx of immigrants into the US, or to support the rapid development of new programs,” KBR said. [Market Watch, Jan. 26, 2006]
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:27 amDid Cheney and Rumsfeld Cover Up a CIA Assassination?
“These documents show the lengths to which the government was trying to cover up the truth,” Eric Olson said, regarding memos that uncovered Cheney and Rumsfeld’s role in perpetuating the deceit. “For 22 years there was a cover-up. And then, under the guise of revealing everything, there was a new cover-up.” [Mercury News]
The London Sunday Express blared the headline: “Scientist Was Killed to Stop Him Revealing Death Secrets; So Did Cheney and Rumsfeld Cover Up a CIA Assassination?” [FrankOlsonProject.org] while the Guardian picked up where other U.S. publications did not. “This story is clearly less fun, and a lot more scary, than a CIA-LSD suicide, and it hasn’t received nearly as much coverage,” Jon Ronson wrote. “Few of the journalists who attended yesterday’s press conference are following up the evidence Olson presented. Instead they’ve written about Olson’s “healing process” and his “closure”.
Frank Olson’s legacy, for anyone willing to study it, goes beyond the Manchurian Candidate and implicates the U.S. government in crimes that surpass mind manipulation and run of the mill assassination. In fact, Olson’s case is reportedly included in the assassination curriculum of the Israeli Mossad as “a successful instance of disguising a murder as a suicide.”
Certainly, after studying Olson’s case it’s clear: What was once the province of kooky conspiracy buffs has been proven to be grounded in fact. And, in addition to questions regarding the Oct. 2001 anthrax attacks, others surface: Why did George W. Bush and members of the White House staff begin taking the antibiotic Cipro on Sept. 11, weeks before the anthrax attacks? [Washington Post]; How significant were Dr. David Kelly’s concerns that he’d be “found dead in the woods”? [BBC]; Did Dr. Don Wiley’s death have anything to do with other scientists who have died under mysterious circumstances? [Globe and Mail]; And why, as the Christian Science Monitor reports, is there a “deliberate effort to kill scientists,” intellectuals and human rights activists in occupied Iraq? [Christian Science Monitor]
http://www.buzzflash.com/farrell/04/05/far04017.html
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:30 amWe are not “AT WAR”
Cheney’s claim of this administration’s “War Powers” is overstated.
We did not “Declare War.”
You can’t have it both ways.
If we are AT WAR – then Cheney is a WAR CRIMINAL:
Last May, Cheney appeared on Larry King. He stepped in it big time, but few people caught it. I alerted Rude Pundit and he wrote about it.
an excerpt:
Then Cheney made this statement: “In a sense, when you’re at war, you keep prisoners of war until the war is over with.” So, like, if, in a sense, the Gitmo campers are “prisoners of war,” then, in a sense, don’t they get Geneva Conventions protections?
Cheney and Gonzales have been playing a semantics game to justify torture, since “war” was never formally declared. It’s pretty obvious why they chose to embark upon the path of war without ever formally declaring it – so they could not be held accountable for the War Crimes they knew they’d be committing.
Bush tells us every day that we’re at war. Cheney and Gonzales tell us that we’re not REALLY at war.
Problem is, Cheney is on tape stating not only that we are at war, but that we are holding “prisoners of war.”
The Geneva Conventions DO APPLY, and Cheney is guilty of war Crimes.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0505/30/lkl.01.html
KING: They specifically said, though, it was Guantanamo. They compared it to a gulag.
D. CHENEY: Not true. Guantanamo’s been operated, I think, in a very sane and sound fashion by the U.S. military. Remember who’s down there. These are people that were picked up off the battlefield in Afghanistan and other places in the global war on terror. These are individuals who have been actively involved as the enemy, if you will, trying to kill Americans. That we need to have a place where we can keep them. In a sense, when you’re at war, you keep prisoners of war until the war is over with.”
So this is the war without end, and these prisoners will be held forever?
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:37 amPresident Bush said the United States does not torture prisoners, commenting after Vice President Dick Cheney embraced the suggestion that a dunk in water might be useful to get terrorist suspects to talk.
WATERBOARDING:
Waterboarding is a type of torture used in coercive interrogations or for punishment. The modern form of the practice simulates drowning and produces a severe gag reflex, making the subject believe his or her death is imminent while ideally not causing permanent physical damage.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterboarding
TORTURE:
The word torture is commonly used to mean the infliction of pain to break the will of the victim or victims. Any act by which severe pain, whether physical or psychological, is intentionally inflicted on a person as a means of intimidation, deterrence, revenge, punishment, sadism, information gathering, or to obtain false confessions for propaganda or political purposes may be called torture.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torture
ORWELLIAN:
The term “Orwellian” usually refers to one or more of the following:
Manipulation of language for political ends. Most significantly by introducing to words meanings in opposition to their denotative meanings.
Invasion by the state of personal privacy, whether physically or by means of surveillance.
The total control of daily life by the state, as in a “Big Brother” society.
Active encouragement by the state of “doublethink,” whereby the population must learn to embrace inconsistent concepts without dissent.
The denial or rewriting of past events.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orwellian
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:40 amWhy is the Department of Homeland Security spending hundreds of millions of dollars to construct Concentration Camps in the United States?
Did you vote for that?
Why is the Department of Homeland Security assembling a totally separate National Police Force (ICE)?
Did you vote for that?
Why was our National Guard sent under prepared into the kill zone with no way home other than a body bag?
Did you vote for that?
Why has our treasury been looted, leaving us vulnerable and exposed to the blackmail of our bankers?
Did you vote for that?
“Somethin’s happenin’ here, what it is ain’t exactly clear, there’s a man with a gun over there, tellin’ me, I’ve got to beware.”
STOP.
THINK.
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:41 amLet’s say that a career intelligence operative came to your house and sat you down and told you the truth.
Let’s say they told you that just for starters, there is no “Osama Bin Laden.”
Would you accept it? Then what? You’d be forced to think about ALL of the ramifications of that reality in the context of EVERY other piece of information that ties to that name.
Now who is your enemy? Who else knows this truth and what actions are they taking?
The media knows.
The politicians know.
Now what?
Swallow hard and listen.
Let’s say the next thing you were told is that it was going to be virtually impossible for the stock market to fall under Greenspan’s gamesmanship – thanks to the Treasury in the market whenever they need to be using their PPT operations to prevent declines.
Let’s say you were informed that “Nothing Is At It Apppears – LITERALLY NOTHING!”
Let’s say you were further told that the chaos in Iraq was actually by design, and that winning was never the goal.
Now let’s say you were informed that Dov Zakheim stole $7 trillion from the Defense Department and sent it to Israel.
Confusing, isn’t it?
But it is the truth.
Let’s say you were told to “go on about your business – just live your lives, go to your jobs, send your kids to college, watch your TV and take your vacations – and let us worry about the ugly stuff.”
How arrogant, right? Sounds true though, doesn’t it?
How would you feel?
What would you do with this information?
Would you still be trying to silence those who actually have this knowledge?
Just think about it.
Make sure that the uncomfortable feeling generated by these sad realities is not being misguided into hateful or hurtful energies on these threads, when your mind might be better utilized to bring about positive change to reveal the truth and put a stop to it.
The foregoing is the truth.
What are you going to do about it?
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:43 amConspiracy to Defraud the United States
923 18 U.S.C. § 371
Hass, 216 U.S. at 479-480. In Hammerschmidt, Chief Justice Taft, defined “defraud†as follows:
To conspire to defraud the United States means primarily to cheat the Government out of property or money, but it also means to interfere with or obstruct one of its lawful governmental functions by deceit, craft or trickery, or at least by means that are dishonest. It is not necessary that the Government shall be subjected to property or pecuniary loss by the fraud, but only that its legitimate official action and purpose shall be defeated by misrepresentation, chicane or the overreaching of those charged with carrying out the governmental intention.
http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/eousa/foia_reading_room usam/ title9/crm00923.htm
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:51 amGiven what we know about VP Cheney’s direct financial ties to Haliburton, isn’t it clear that he has committed a fraud against the United States for the purpose of illegal financial gain, in accordance with the following statute? Couldn’t the same be said of any US official who knowingly made false statements to advance the cause of war, while owning shares of companies that stood to gain substantially from that war? Cheney was acting specifically on behalf of the Contractor, Haliburton, to ensure no-bid contracts were awarded, based on knowingly fraudulent information generated by his own Office Of Special Plans. It might also be construed that any official who had a relationship to the Carlyle Group was also lying on their behalf – for their own financial benefit.
Section 1031. Major fraud against the United States
(a) Whoever knowingly executes, or attempts to execute, any scheme or artifice with the intent -
(1) to defraud the United States; or
(2) to obtain money or property by means of false or fraudulent pretenses, representations, or promises, in any procurement of property or services as a prime contractor with the United States or as a subcontractor or supplier on a contract in which there is a prime contract with the United States, if the value of the contract, subcontract, or any constituent part thereof, for such property or services is $1,000,000 or more shall, subject to the applicability of subsection (c) of this section, be fined not more than $1,000,000, or imprisoned not more than 10 years, or both.
(1) the gross loss to the Government or the gross gain to a defendant is $500,000 or greater; or
(2) the offense involves a conscious or reckless risk of serious personal injury.
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/casecode/uscodes/18/ parts/i/chapters/47/sections/section_1031.html
The financial links between those who lied, and those who benefitted as a direct result of the lies (primarily in the oil and military industries) are clear. The evidence that the President’s speech knowingly included a lie about the Niger Yellow Cake is proveable in a court of law under oath.
That the Vice President knew for a fact that the claim was based on a forgery in advance of the President’s speech is a given. That he instructed others to ensure that the sentence made it into the speech is also a given. What did the Vice President know, and when did he know it?
Everytime the Vice President knowingly lied to the American People to advance the cause of war, he committed a crime against the United States which both directly harmed other US citizens and directly enriched himself.
Indict Dick Cheney for Fraud.
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:54 amSomething like taking in and caring for refugees from a country we’ve wrecked in order to plunder, would be like asking Paris Hilton to take in and care for a cop she’d run down in the street. We wouldn’t want to get involved now would we?
July 23rd, 2007 at 7:13 amahh.. ace, you just don’t learn do you?
Remember when your whole “Secret Prisons in Wyoming” claim was debunked?
Yeah, the photos were actually of prisons in Korea. If I had the time I would go back and find the thread where you were proven wrong, maybe later today!
July 23rd, 2007 at 8:35 amWow, Ace. You made this thread worth reading. Thanks for all the links to the info, too.
July 23rd, 2007 at 9:02 amLet’s say that a career intelligence operative came to your house and sat you down and told you the truth.
Let’s say they told you that just for starters, there is no “Osama Bin Laden.â€
Would you accept it? Then what? You’d be forced to think about ALL of the ramifications of that reality in the context of EVERY other piece of information that ties to that name.
Comment by ace — July 23, 2007 @ 6:43 am
This would come as quite a surprise to the rest of the bin Laden family as well.
July 23rd, 2007 at 9:41 amTies with Dick Cheney
In recent years the company has become the center of several controversies involving the 2003 Iraq War and the company’s ties to U.S. Vice President Dick Cheney. Cheney retired from the company during the 2000 U.S. presidential election campaign with a severance package worth $34 million[15]. As of 2004, he had received $398,548 in deferred compensation from Halliburton while Vice President.[16] Concerns have been raised regarding the possible conflict of interest resulting from Cheney’s deferred compensation and stock options from Halliburton. However, before entering office in 2001, Cheney bought an insurance policy that guaranteed a fixed amount of deferred payments from Halliburton each year for five years so that the payments would not depend on the company’s fortunes.[16] He is legally bound by an agreement he signed which turns over power of attorney to a trust administrator to sell the options at some future time and to give the after-tax profits to three charities. The agreement specifies that 40% will go to the University of Wyoming (in Cheney’s home state), 40% will go to George Washington University’s medical faculty to be used for tax-exempt charitable purposes, and 20% will go to Capital Partners for Education. The agreement states that it is “irrevocable and may not be terminated, waived or amended,” preventing Cheney from taking back the options at a later date.[16]
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:31 am
An audit of KBR by The Pentagon’s Defense Contract Audit Agency (DCAA) found $108 million in “questioned costs” and, as of mid-March 2005, said they still had “major” unresolved issues with Halliburton.[citation needed]
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:32 am
“In the extreme, it could be interpreted as targeting the financial assets of any American who undermines the administration’s Iraq policy.”
Knowing the way that Shrub interprets free speech, am I being too paranoid to forsee the seizure from those who advocate leaving Iraq ? After all, if you question the war strategy, you are aiding and abetting the terrorist.
Next step, seize from Clinton, Olbermann, Colbert……
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:52 am