National Intel Director: Bush Admin. Manipulated Iraq Intel ‘Because They Didn’t Like The Answers’
National Intel Director: Bush Admin. Manipulated Iraq Intel ‘Because They Didn’t Like The Answers’
In Stephen Hayes’s upcoming biography on Dick Cheney, he writes that the current Director of National Intelligence Mike McConnell appears to side with “those who believe that the administration manipulated intelligence on Iraq for political purposes before the 2003 invasion.”
McConnell reportedly said he had “serious reservations” when asked by President Bush to become the DNI because of the Pentagon’s manipulation of intelligence in the lead up to the Iraq war. Today, Meet the Press host Tim Russert previewed the relevant portion of the book:
McConnell was honored to be asked [to be DNI], but he had serious reservations. He had been unimpressed with many aspects of the Bush administration and its conduct of the war on terror, particularly what he felt was a politicized use of intelligence in the lead-up to the Iraq war. [...]
“My sense of it is their political faith and convictions influenced how they took information and interpreted [it], how they picked up and interpreted outside events. … I’ve read much more about the current set of players and they did set up a whole new interpretation because they didn’t like the answers. They’ve gotten results that in my view now have been disastrous,” [McConnell said].
Watch it:
McConnell decried the “secondary unit” established within the Pentagon to “reinterpret information” prior to the war. An internal Pentagon investigation released in February revealed that former Undersecretary of Defense Doug Feith utilized the Counter-Terrorism Evaluation Group within the Pentagon to create and promote false links between Iraq and al Qaeda.
Specifically, then-Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz “asked Feith’s analysts to ignore the intelligence community’s belief that the militant Islamist al-Qaida and Saddam’s secular dictatorship were unlikely allies.” Subsequently, Feith “disseminated alternative intelligence assessments on the Iraq and al-Qaida relationship…to senior decision-makers.”
McConnell stated, “The way you do intelligence is all sources considered. You have to factor one issue against the other and balance it.” Four years later, this administration is still reinterpreting intelligence.
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Well, sometimes you just have to go to war for oil with the intelligence you don’t have.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:02 pmWhy is McConnell saying this so late? I guess that the best that can be done with this information NOW is to use it as ammo for the Bush Maladministration’s impeachment.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:05 pmUh, okay.
Let’s simply talk some more about it.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:11 pmWell, means to the end and all that…
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:13 pmIf lying us into to a war of aggression is not an impeachible offense or a war crime, I sure as hell don’t know what is. Bush/Cheney, et al….OFF WITH THEIR HEADS!!!!
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:22 pmMcConnell reportedly said he had “serious reservations…â€
But he took the job anyway. What does that say about him? He is apparently willing to go along with an administration he knows is corrupting intelligence and producing “disastrous” results.
McConnell is as much a scumbag as the rest of them.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:24 pmUncle Ho: Congratulations on your nickname. It and the comment “off with their heads” pretty much labels you as a fringe left lunatic.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:27 pm3630 American Deaths Later.
Thx Mike.
RIP
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:34 pmSGT Stephen R. Sherman
C CO 1-5 IN (STRYKER)
KIA 3 Feb 2005
Mosul, Iraq
Hey maytag, someones got to be far left. What do you think would be a suitable punishment for starting a war on false pretenses?
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:36 pmIs that the same Stephen Hayes who wrote The Connection—How al Qaeda’s Collaboration with Saddam Hussein Has Endangered America, which was nothing more than a reprint of the Feith memo? And that cited al-Libi after al-Libi had recanted? And now he’s criticizing McConnell? Not that McConnell doesn’t need criticism, but I’d like someone with cred to do it.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:41 pmAaaah, that’s why! Hell, everybody knows it and all they do is talk. I’m with Elvis here:
“A little less conversation, a little more action please.”
I think the “Had Enough” idea is splendid. Remember the East Gemans? After church, each Monday evening they took to the streets, chantin “Wir sind das Volk (We are the People!)”. First there wer a handful, then the church ailes were full, then the crownd wouldn’t fit into the church, then the crowds were all over the place. Result: The Government was toppled peacefully, Germany reunited.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:42 pmsorry heaps of typos, I think you’ll get my drift anyway.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:44 pmWell, means to the end and all that…
Comment by MAYTAG Repairman
This comment along with your fake name lets us know that you are a 25% right wing nutbag. Thanks for the heads up.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:44 pmMake no mistake about it, the people who need to revolt live in Nevada, and they need to revolt, by electing someone other than Harry Reid.
Harry Reid is the biggest obstacle to the Democratic party doing what they were elected to do that there is.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:44 pmSen. Feingold proposes censuring Bush
AP 1 minute ago
WASHINGTON
Liberal Democratic Sen. Russ Feingold said Sunday he wants Congress to censure President Bush for his management of the Iraq war and his “assault” against the Constitution.
But Feingold’s own party leader in the Senate showed little interest in the idea.
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., said Feingold’s proposals showed the nation’s frustration.
But Reid said he would not go along with them
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:45 pmI don’t know why the right wing was so against Harry Reid and Pelosi becoming leaders of their respective houses of Congress.
They’ve been running interference for them since the day they took over.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:46 pmthe current Director of National Intelligence Mike McConnell appears to side with “those who believe that the administration manipulated intelligence on Iraq
the current… um… how much longer will THAT last?
…
no offense, sir, but it’s easy to see why they think
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:51 pmthey can steamroller right over you…
probably a nice upstanding guy in the real world, too…
…
But Reid said he would not go along with them
Comment by BARTLEBEE
I saw Reid on CBS this morning. Lame. If he and Pelosi don’t want to do the job why don’t they step down and let somebody more qualified initiate the impeachment.
Reid said well there’s only 17 months left and we have so many other things to do. Well in that length of time Chimp and Darth will have gotten us into more debt and another 1,000 soldiers will be dead. We can’t take that much more of any of them Bush/Cheney or Reid/Pelosi.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:53 pmAll the information is out there. Bush has been proven time and again of being guilty of abusing his office and the constitution. All that needs to occur now is the impeachment hearings.
But with WIMPS like Harry Reid, and Nancy Pelosi, we can’t even get a CENSURE VOTE!!! We KNOW Bush “cherry picked” the intelligence. We KNOW this! Its was PROVEN when they showed the two different reports on the intel. The one given to Bush by the Intelligence community, and the one he presented to the Congress, which removed the portions that pointed out that the information had “BEEN DISCREDITED”.
What more evidence do we need?
Impeachment MUST happen. It MUST occur if we ever hope to be respected in the world again, or if our people are ever to believe in democracy again.
The Constitution warrants Bush’s impeachment, and Cheney’s and their entire cabinet. But Harry Reid, and Nancy Pelosi won’t put it on the table.
Why is the question.
My guess? Because Joe Lieberman threatened to switch to the republican party if they did, giving the Republicans back the majority in the senate.
Either that or they have pictures of Reid and Pelosi playing a game of escaped convict and the wardens wife.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:56 pm“My sense of it is their political faith and convictions influenced how they took information and interpreted [it]
That would be lying, you dipshit.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:59 pmVice Admiral McConnell served as NSA Director under Clinton. 26 years in the intelligence field is pretty impressive. He is only the second director for DNI; he may be the most competent appointment yet that Bush has made, but no doubt will be fired before the end of the administration because of that.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:59 pmBush will likely not like what he hears from McConnell.
The report to Bush DISCREDITED the reports on the Aluminum Tubes, the Niger Yellow Cake meetings, everything!. The weapons inspecters including Scott Ritter told them there was nothing there. So they fired the inspecters, (and smeared Ritter when he dared speak up) removed the parts that discredited the intelligence, then took the discredited intelligence and presented it to Congress, the United Nations and the world, as credited thus starting a war.
Congress impeached Clinton over lying about a blow job!
If this doesn’t qualify as grounds for immediate impeachment I don’t know what does.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:04 pmAs long as wimpy Americans elect wimpy democrats like Pelosi and Reid, then nothing, and I mean NOTHING, is going to change.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:07 pmDNI Mike McConnell is about to get an invitation to go elephant hunting with deadeye Dick. By the by, the elephants have nothing to worry about unless they happen to be standing behind Mike, a dear friend of VP Cheney.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:13 pmComment by shane — July 22, 2007 @ 3:44 pm
The Maytag Repairman has also posted under the name ‘r’.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:18 pmAs long as wimpy Americans elect wimpy democrats like Pelosi and Reid, then nothing, and I mean NOTHING, is going to change.
Comment by BARTLEBEE
I hear you. These are “career” politicians who because of that status will not take bold moves.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:18 pmWow this is certainly startling news I’m sure the Democratic party is going to skewer these bastards for this un-American injustice… yeah whatever…yawn.
Face it, our political system is seriously broken.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:18 pm“The American people will have to decide that…” translation: Yes, but I am not going to say that on TV…
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:20 pmAs V, in “V for Vendetta,†said: “Now it’s my turn.â€
This is what McConnell said:
“My sense of it is their political faith and convictions influenced how they took information and interpreted [it], how they picked up and interpreted outside events. … I’ve read much more about the current set of players and they did set up a whole new interpretation because they didn’t like the answers. They’ve gotten results that in my view now have been disastrous,â€
Now this what McConnell should have said:
“My sense of it is their political stand point and their dogged intent to lie to the American public shamelessly took information and spun [it], how they picked up and spun outside events to their ends. … I’ve read much more about the current set of players and they did set up a whole spin operation, to deceive the American public because they didn’t like the answers. They’ve gotten results that in my view now have been a total and complete disaster,â€
My position: McConnell will never make his point if he continue to sugar coat it. The “disaster” in Iraq is not sweet. I can’t wait for those who are responsible for the disaster in Iraq to be begging for ice water in hell.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:23 pmWow!
I was reading Bartlebee, bashing the Democrats over and over again–as bad as a neocon.
Then I checked the record of accomplishments of the Democratic Congress, and I saw how Bartlebee was COMPLETELY WRONG!
I mean, look at all this incredible Congress has done:
House passes the College Cost Reduction Act, which “would boost college financial aid by about $18 billion over the next five years and cut federal subsidies to lenders,” the “single largest increase in college aid since the GI bill in 1944.”
Today House Oversight Committee Chairman Henry Waxman (D-CA) wrote to Health and Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt requesting documents related to political interference with the work of the Office of the Surgeon General.
Sens. Leahy and Specter introduce amendment restoring the habeas corpus protections stripped as a result of last year’s Military Commissions Act. The legislation would restore basic civil liberties to roughly 12 million legal permanent residents of the United States.
House Judiciary Committee Chairman John Conyers is “expected to move swiftly to conduct hearings on the commutation.”
Democrats Consider Plan to Cut Funding for Guantanamo Bay Prison, Forcing Its Closure
SENATE SUBPOENAS WHITE HOUSE, VP’S OFFICE
House Judiciary Committee To Hold Hearings On Bush Clemency Powers
Reacting to the Office of the Vice President’s assertion that it is not an “entity within the executive branch,†Rep. Rahm Emanuel (D-IL) announced that he will introduce an amendment to cut off funding to Cheney’s office.
House To Bush Admin: Comply With Subpoenas Or Face Contempt
Senate Judiciary Committee Issues Subpoenas For NSA Domestic Spying Documents
John Conyers (D-MI) announced the launch of a new web page, to respond to the growing number of current and former Justice Department career lawyers and other employees raising concerns about politicization in the Department.†The page “provides a secure method for DOJ employees to communicate what they know to Committee investigators.†See the page HERE.
Congress to investigate Bush’s signing statements.
Congress Passes Major Gun Control Legislation in over a decade, spurred by the Virginia Tech campus killings and buttressed by National Rifle Association help. The bill improves state reporting to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System to stop gun purchases by people, including criminals and those adjudicated as mentally ill.
Senior House Democrats threatened Thursday to issue subpoenas to obtain secret legal opinions†and other Justice Dept. documents related to the NSA’s warrantless domestic surveillance program, “the most aggressive action yet by Congress in its oversight of the…program.
Senate Judiciary Committee announced it was preparing to approve legislation to restore habeas corpus on Thursday.
House oversight committee is expanding its investigation “into ties between jailed GOP lobbyist Jack Abramoff and the White House
The House plans to trigger another veto showdown with President Bush this week by clearing legislation that would expand federally funded embryonic stem cell research.
The Senate Armed Services Commitee has passed legislation “that would grant new rights to terror suspects held at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, including access to a lawyer regardless of whether the prisoners are put on trial.†It would also “narrow the definition of an enemy combatant and tighten restrictions on the types of evidence used to prosecute and keep a person detained.â€
Sen. Ted Kennedy (D-MA) and Rep. Rosa DeLauro (D-CT) have introduced the Healthy Families Act (HFA), which would guarantee that workers receive at least seven paid sick days each year. Tell Congress to support this legislation here.
House passes flag bill Bush opposed. Governors could order federal facilities to lower their flags to honor fallen military troops under legislation passed by the House Tuesday.
House Democratic leaders have decided to use their Honest Leadership and Open Government legislation from the 109th Congress as the basis for the lobbying reform bill that the House Judiciary Committee is expected to mark up this week. By doing so, the leaders are on a trajectory to meet key demands made by left-leaning advocacy groups favoring strong reform.
New union bill has the power to level playing field after conservative idealogues gutted workers’ rights
Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) introduced a measure Monday to force the Pentagon to close the detention facility at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, and move the trials of Al Qaeda suspects to the United States.
Congress Probes Allegations Of Wrongdoing In Bush Reading Program
After more than a decade of government inaction, gay-rights proponents in Congress have gotten several major bills moving through the Democratic-controlled chambers, a development that could result in the greatest expansion of federal protections for gays and lesbians in US history.
Kucinich Officially Moves To Impeach Cheney
Congress To Pass Bill For October Troop Withdrawal
The Justice Department is conducting a probe of a $6 billion reading initiative at the center of President Bush’s No Child Left Behind law, another blow to a program besieged by allegations of financial conflicts of interest and cronyism.
House and Senate Democrats reached a deal Friday afternoon on a package of tax cuts that will accompany a $2.10-an-hour increase in the federal minimum wage.
The Democratic National Committee sued the Justice Department, demanding it turn over any e-mail traffic with the Republican Party on the U.S. attorneys controversy and criminal investigations.
House Democrats propose bill to give shareholders at public companies a formal say in executives’ compensation packages.
The House yesterday passed the Taxpayer Protection Act, to protect taxpayers against “identity theft, deceptive Web sites and loan sharks.” It also makes it “easier for taxpayers to retrieve property lost as a result of a wrongful Internal Revenue Service levy and directs the IRS to notify lower-income people that they qualify for the Earned Income Tax Credit.”
House to Begin Probe Into 2006 Florida Election
In the wake of a news report that the Election Assistance Commission altered its findings to overstate the pervasiveness of voter fraud, U.S. Senator Robert Menendez (D-NJ) today asked the Senate Rules and Administration Committee to look into the matter.
President Bush is threatening to veto a Senate intelligence bill that’s laced with provisions that would force the White House and spy agencies to be more responsive to Congress
Senate Passes Bill To Widen Stem Cell Research
Kucinich demands answers on $4 gas as domestic policy chairman
Congress To Probe Lynch, Tillman Misinformation
By 280 to 152, the Democratic-controlled House voted to require sponsors of the pet spending items to be publicly identified, a move that sponsors say will do away with some of the most egregious waste of the taxpayers’ money.
A separate vote to reinstate the “pay as you go” rule [passed] 280 to 154. It requires that increases in spending on entitlement programs be offset by savings elsewhere, so as not to raise the budget deficit.
The new House rules bar members from taking gifts, meals or trips paid for by lobbyists, or the organizations that employ them. The rules also ban lawmakers from using corporate jets and reimbursing the owners.
House Democratic leaders prepare legislation that would permanently shift the tax burden from the have-nots back to the have-mores.
Dems Call For Investigation Into Bush Appointment Of Swift Boat Donor
“The Office of Special Counsel confirmed to ABC News it has launched an investigation into General Services Administration chief Lurita Doan, probing concerns she may have violated a ban against conducting partisan political activity at government expense by participating in a meeting featuring a presentation by a White House political aide on GOP election strategy.â€
Waxman To RNC: Turn Over Your Emails
House Bill Will Bring Back Paper Ballots
Nearly five months after Florida Republican Vern Buchanan narrowly defeated Democrat Christine Jennings in the state’s 13th District, a congressional committee has organized a task force to investigate the controversial election.
Dems Pass Bill To Bring Troops Home In 2008
Another criminal investigation has begun in Cuyahoga County, Ohio, where two elections officials were found to have rigged the 2004 Presidential Election recount.
FDA to enact rules to prevent experts with ties to drug industry from advising the FDA
The House Administration Committee will convene a special task force to look into the ongoing controversy of Florida’s 13th district congressional race
The Wounded Warrior Assistance Act of 2007, a bill aimed at “making immediate improvements in the treatment…of wounded combat veterans passed the House Armed Services Committee by a 59-0 vote Tuesday.â€
Senate Cancels Bush Admin Power To Unilaterally Name US Attorneys…
Rep. Jane Harman introduced a bill to require all light bulbs produced or used in the U.S. to meet current fluorescent bulb standards (60 lumens per watt) by 2012, 90 lumens by 2016, and 120 by 2020.
Top White House Staff May Face Subpoenas
Democratic Rep. Dennis J. Kucinich of Ohio has hired an avowed critic of Israel to work on his subcommittee of the Oversight and Government Reform Committee.
Congress Investigates Plush VIP Ward At Walter Reed.
This week, Sen. Hillary Clinton (D-NY) and Rep. John Dingell (D-MI) introduced legislation to provide health care coverage to all children. The Children’s Health First Act would boost spending on SCHIP by $50 billion and encourage states to cover all children with incomes up to 400 percent of the poverty level.â€
“Buried in the $124 billion House version of the wartime supplemental appropriation is an order to the Defense Department to release a report on the April 2004 death in Afghanistan of Army Spc. Patrick Tillman,†whose death by friendly fire Army leaders tried to cover up.
Yesterday, the “House Appropriations Committee unanimously approved a measure that barred the closure of Walter Reed Army Medical Center.â€
A bill granting Washington, D.C. “its first full-fledged seat in the House of Representatives passed the Judiciary Committee yesterday, clearing the final hurdle before a vote by the entire House, expected next week.â€
Democrats to open hearings on CIA leak on Friday. The Star Witness Will be Valerie Plame.
The Federal Communications Commission drew an ultimatum from the House Energy and Commerce Committee telecom panel: Return to your traditional role of consumer protection or else. “When the FCC loses sight of its proper role, consumers suffer,” said Rep. John Dingell, D-Mich., told FCC commissioners at a hearing Tuesday.
A Democratic plan to require the withdrawal of U.S. combat troops from Iraq passed its first test on Thursday as the House Appropriations Committee voted to endorse the proposal, overcoming Republican opposition.
Under attack for improprieties uncovered in its showcase literacy program for low-income children, the Department of Education will convene an outside advisory committee to oversee the program, known as Reading First, Education Secretary Margaret Spellings said Wednesday. Facing tough questions at a hearing before a Senate subcommittee considering appropriations for the Bush administration’s signature education law, known as No Child Left Behind, Ms. Spellings also promised to clean up the reading program in other ways.
The two election workers from Cuyahoga Co. Ohio who rigged the 2004 recount were each sentenced to 18 months in prison and the judge stated that he felt they were not telling the whole story and that they were covering for someone.
A new bill requiring the mandatory disclosure of donations to presidential libraries has made its way out of committee and is headed for the House floor.
The House passed three bills that would “roll back administration efforts to shield its workings from public view.†The measures would “streamline access to records in presidential libraries, expand safeguards for government whistle-blowers, and strengthen the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA).â€
Bush’s prosecutor power grab is backfiring.
Leahy Says He’ll Subpoena Rove, Discusses Potential Crimes
The Senate voted 60-38 to approve legislation “to implement many of the remaining reforms suggested by the Sept. 11 commission.â€
Brushing aside a veto threat, the House of Representatives voted on Wednesday to overturn a 2001 order by President George W. Bush that lets former presidents keep their papers secret indefinitely.
The Chairman of the House’s Oversight and Government Reform Committee has sent 11 letters to Condi Rice requesting info on the fraudulent Niger/uranium claims.
House approves bill spending $1.7 billion over five years for cleaner water. White House, forgetting the $9 billion a month spent in Iraq, says the cost is too high.
Hillary Clinton calls for GI Bill Of Rights.
Democrats add billions of dollars to Iraq war budget, earmarked for medical care, housing, and training.
“The House of Representatives voted today to create a new congressional committee, devoted solely to addressing the issue of global warming. Legislation creating the new ‘Select Committee on Energy Independence and Global Warming’ passed 269 to 150, with 44 Republicans voting in favor of its creation.”
Sen. Chuck Schumer (D-NY) and other senators met with Attorney General Alberto Gonzales this afternoon. According to Schumer, Gonzales said the White House will not oppose reversing the PATRIOT Act provision that allows U.S. Attorneys to be installed without Senate approval.
“thanks to voter outrage and a one-year moratorium imposed by Democrats after taking over Congress,” the “number and cost of pork-barrel projects is way down” after years of record pork-barrel spending.
House Oversight and Government Reform Committee Chairman Henry Waxman announced he will hold a hearing on whether White House officials followed appropriate procedures for safeguarding the identity of CIA agent Valerie Plame Wilson
Dems Push Legislation To Withdraw Troops By Fall ‘08
Senator Byron Dorgan introducing legislation compelling George W. Bush to actually go after Osama bin Laden
Senate Votes 51-46 to Let Airport Workers Unionize, Give 45,000 Screeners the Same Union Rights As Border Patrol, Customs And Immigration Agents; Bush Threatens Veto.
Congress has begun hearings on the substandard care for veterans at Walter Reed.
The Presidential Records Act Amendments of 2007 would nullify the Bush executive order and establish procedures to ensure the timely release of presidential records.
subpoenas will soon be issued in the matter of the allegedly coerced firings of U.S. Attorneys in the Department of Justice. A vote will take place tomorrow in the Subcommittee on Commercial and Administrative Law on whether to issue the subpoenas to Justice Dept. officials Carol Lam, David Iglesias, H.E. Cummins, III, and John McKay to compel them to appear before a subcommittee hearing next week.
The Judiciary Committee will also hold hearings next week on matters related to “Election Reform and Irregularities.”
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:25 pmArmando ,
But the BushCo Boyz will hand this over to the Dems to settle this out and will blame them for ‘losing’ the fake war in Iraq as Bubya heads off to Paraguay to live with Mom and Dad and Darth to Dubai to run Halliburton free of the jassle of the Iraq ’situation. After all, … Fu(k the rest of us, they got theirs!
How does that set with the Blind Kool-aid slurpers of the NeoCons, anyway?
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:29 pmHis “sense of it?”
My sense of it is that the Steelers are going to win the super bowl.
Ain’t opinions grand?
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:31 pmComment by Perry Logan
So what?
We are standing here looking over the body of Iraq and one of our own (bushies) has the gun in their hand… what are going to do about THE situation in the room? The democrats are wussies that are trying to do everything but the one thing they were elected in 2006 to take care of… people didnt go out to vote democrats in because of that list of yours…
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:32 pmWow!
I was reading Bartlebee, bashing the Democrats over and over again–as bad as a neocon.
Then I checked the record of accomplishments of the Democratic Congress, and I saw how Bartlebee was COMPLETELY WRONG!
I mean, look at all this incredible Congress has done:
Comment by Perry Logan — July 22, 2007 @ 4:25 pm
Yea. Thats a long list of nothing.
Nothing.
Its the WAR STUPID.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:49 pmAnd its the fact that EVERYTIME someone puts impeachment or anything with TEETH on the table, the worms PELOSI AND REID SHOOT IT DOWN.
Just like REID SHOT DOWN RUSS FEINGOLDS CENSURE PROPOSAL THIS MORNING.
Get it?
You just printed a laundry list of RED HERRINGS.
If I’ve got cancer, and the doctor cleans my teeth, cures my arthritis and gives me pills for my restless leg syndrome, then he did NOTHING.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:51 pmBartlebee,
PULEEZE don’t dignify this illegal invasion and occupation as a war. It is disrespectful to all the troops and to the US citizens.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:52 pmAnd by the way, ASKING for emails, and issuing subpoena’s that they are unwilling to ENFORCE, means NOTHING.
NOTHING.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:52 pmBartlebee,
PULEEZE don’t dignify this illegal invasion and occupation as a war. It is disrespectful to all the troops and to the US citizens.
Comment by upside00 — July 22, 2007 @ 4:52 pm
Oh all right.
Its the OCCUPATION STUPID!
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:53 pmBUZZFLASH-NYTIMES REPORT NEW HALLIBURTON SCANDAL, UNCOVERING: FBI. Headline:Bribery Network to Bloat War Costs Is Alleged
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:55 pmIf Reid doesn’t play ball then Lieberman will switch sides, and give the repbulicans the majority. They’ll renig on their agreement to let the Dems retain control, and shoot down everything out of the house until Bush is out office.
Reids traded the lives of our servicemen and our liberties for some domestic housecleaning bills and a shot at minimum wage. He’s a hack and is the number one obstacle to ending the occupation of Iraq, and restoring our constitutional rights and liberties, like the unequivocal right to habeas corpus. Until Harry Reid feels the screws tighten, he won’t do a damned thing about the real issues we face.
July 22nd, 2007 at 4:58 pmupside00: are you referring to me #29, or to Perry Logan?#30?
What I heck—I’ll there anyway: whether the BushCo Boyz will “hand this over to the Dems to settle this out and will blame them for ‘losing’ the fake war in Iraq as Bubya heads off to Paraguay to live with Mom and Dad†or not, it’ll be up to the American public to deal with it. They bought the bullshit of the Bush administration, hoping they’ll die in their sleep. No such luck. We americans are still alive and awake. In short, because we believe in “Cowboy†politics out of Texas it’s we who will be crying for ice water in Hell—as well as the Kool-aid of their choice.
Note: “After all, … Fu(k the rest of us, they got theirs!†Sir, in that regard, you are correct. AG
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:12 pmArmando,
Why there are a few that still believe ANYTHING this Cabal says, fascinates me! Guess when you have drank the Kool-aid, there is no antidote. Kinda like at Jonestown.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:16 pmThe War in Iraq is more popular than the Democratic Congress!
http://www.dailymail.com/story/Opinion/2007072075/Don-Surber-Democrats-achieve-14-percent-approval/
WHEN I looked at the numbers last month, the Gallup Poll showed President Bush’s job approval was at 32 percent, and Congress was at 24 percent. Could things get any worse?
Of course they can. Never underestimate the power of the Democratic Party to self-destruct.
The first job approval numbers for July are in and the Reuters/Zogby Poll shows Bush at 34 percent, Congress at 14 percent.
Under Democratic leadership, Congress has gone from the brink of the abyss and leaped. Whee!
Pollster John Zogby broke down the numbers.
“The Democratic Congress gets poor marks across the ideological spectrum — just 21 percent of liberals and 10 percent of the very liberal give it positive marks, while 14 percent of conservatives and 14 percent of the very conservative give it positive ratings,” Zogby wrote.
“Among Democrats, just 19 percent give Congress positive marks, compared to 13 percent of Republicans and 8 percent of political independents.
“By way of comparison, the Republican Congress had a 23 percent positive job approval rating last October, just a week before voters tossed the GOP out of their leadership posts in both houses.”
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:20 pmm12,
And since over 65% of ALL Americans want us out of Iraq by any poll you want to look at, what are you trying to say?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:27 pmComment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 5:20 pm
Well, f*cking duh. Of course liberals don’t approve, we elected them to end this war and impeach Bush. And of course conservatives like the fact that the Republiskunks are preventing even the most minor legislation that the Democrats put forward to go through.
Of course, the framing of the poll doesn’t help: the “Democratic Congress” is bullshit. The House, with its bigger Democratic majority, manages to get things started, but the Senate, with barely a Democratic majority, just gets stalled.
Not that this hasn’t been explained to you over and over and over again, m12. You just don’t learn, do you?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:27 pmm12,
Because ther Dems don’t have enough backbone to do what the people in thsi country wanted them to do…. end this illegal occupation and end it NOW!!!
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:28 pmAnd since over 65% of ALL Americans want us out of Iraq by any poll you want to look at, what are you trying to say?
Ok, if you say so. But 86% seem to be unhappy with the Democratic Congress, where’s the other 21% coming from?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:29 pmComment by Jane E. Schneider — July 22, 2007 @ 5:27 pm
I’m sure you want Bush’s head on a plate. But those independents are fleeing; only 8% are in your dugout!
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:31 pm#47
See #46 above, and you are arguing with that? They are angry at BOTH sides of the aisle, but mostly at the Dems because they haven’t done what they were asked to do.
DO you not agree with that?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:32 pmHmm. let’s see… So if the OVP decided that the Intel they were receiving from say, Jennings Brwester and Co. regarding Iran’s WMD, wasn’t up to what they wanted, they might find it necessary to go ahead and shut them down. The only question is was this before or after Joe Wilson put them between a rock and a hard place?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:33 pmSee #46 above, and you are arguing with that? They are angry at BOTH sides of the aisle, but mostly at the Dems because they haven’t done what they were asked to do.
So why was the GOP Congress of Oct. 06 (which didn’t run from Iraq) more popular than the Dem Congress of July 07 (which isn’t running from Iraq)?
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:33 pm#43 m12,
You can’t argue with those numbers!
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:34 pmComment by Mr. Kalashnikov — July 22, 2007 @ 5:34 pm
You know you’re sunk when President Bush has 2.5x your approval rating….
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:37 pmM12’s posting innaccurate results as usual. Congress was not at 14 percent. He’s misreading the poll on purpose, like he does everytime. Just ignore the mook. This was probably from a cut and paste he posts with a bot in 300 different left wing blogs.
The fact is Americans know Congress was elected to end the war, and reign in Bush on his abuse of power. Since they have not done this, their approval numbers are assured of being low, until they do. Low approval for congress means more people are dissatisfied for Bush, and this thread is not about approval congressional approval ratings, its about the president leaving out critical information in CIA intelligence reports to start a war.
An impeachable offense if I’ve ever heard one.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:37 pmSo why was the GOP Congress of Oct. 06 (which didn’t run from Iraq) more popular than the Dem Congress of July 07 (which isn’t running from Iraq)?
Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 5:33 pm
If you can’t figure that out from the above posts (mine and Upside00’s, then it is more than obvious that you’re dumber than I thought. I guess you will never learn.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:39 pmm12,
You are delusional!! DO you really thinkj the majjority of Americans want this thing to continue?
I bet you only watch Faux NoNooz too, and read only the NY Post too. I bet you are a NeoCon as well.
But if I am wroing with these assumptions, let me know, but it doesn’t change the facts, just explains your delusions.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:39 pmThe fact that they impeached Bill Clinton for lying about recieving a blow job, but refuse to put impeachment on the table for Bush and Cheney for manipulating intelligence data to start a war, a war that they’ve now lost but are too dumb to realize it, says Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi are as bad as the republicans, if not worse.
At least we know where they stand.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:40 pm“By way of comparison, the Republican Congress had a 23 percent positive job approval rating last October, just a week before voters tossed the GOP out of their leadership posts in both houses.â€
Comment by m12
So it’s your fantasy that the country overwhelmingly wants to go back to Republican control of everything? One word – “Vitter”. Why does an overwhelming percentage want us out of Iraq? Speak up, m’boy. Hard to hear what you’re saying w/ your foot in your mouth like that.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:45 pmPeople like to give Cindy Sheehan crap, but the fact is she is right on the money. She speaks the truth, and you know how you can tell its the truth, aside from examining the facts? Because the truth is the stuff people always shout the loudest against.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:46 pmPatriot: the person who can holler the loudest without knowing what he is hollering about.
Mark Twain
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:47 pm“If Reid doesn’t play ball then Lieberman will switch sides, and give the repbulicans the majority. They’ll renig on their agreement to let the Dems retain control”
There was a specific agreement in some previous terms; there is no such agreement this term, so far as I know. If Lieberman changes his vote, it doesn’t change anything. The Democrats can block any attempt to change the Senate leadership.
“and shoot down everything out of the house until Bush is out office.”
They’re already doing this.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:47 pm“You can’t argue with those numbers!”
ROFL…. Well, sure, if you’re a moron, you can’t argue. Meanwhile, the rest of us, who look at the bigger picture and at more than one set of numbers, have no problem arguing.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:49 pmOh bs Paul. You honestly think once the republicans have the majority in the senate they’d honor any “agreement” to cede power?
If so then I’ve got some land for sale at a real bargain.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:50 pmupside00: Those who drank the Kook-aid in Jones Town can only die once. We in America are willing to die again and again. Yes, there might be no antidote for us and we won’t die outright but we will go bug-crazy and head to those who have tormented us—with torch fire—and burn down their houses. It happen in Russia and in China. God save us all—especially when we don’t deserve it.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:51 pmShow me the binding agreement. Show me proof that the republicans don’t already have a plan around their “agreement” with Reid.
Is the agreement based on one or two converts? Suppose a dem switched parties at the same time Liieberman did? What then?
I’ll believe it when I see it.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:53 pmComment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 5:45 pm
You all keep whining about Republican obstructionism, but the Republican Congress was more popular than yours!
Gotta suck to be a Dimocrat.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:53 pmIf you can’t figure that out from the above posts (mine and Upside00’s, then it is more than obvious that you’re dumber than I thought. I guess you will never learn.
All you’ve done is make excuses, Jane. Only 46% of this nation wants to impeach President Bush anyway , but setting those 46% aside, the Defeatocrats can’t make anybody happy!
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:54 pmI heard Lilly livered libergheist say words to the effect after the 06 elections that if they put impeachment on the table, then he’d likely switch sides because he didn’t believe that was a proper course for the country.
I am confident its at least one of the sticks their smacking the dems with. They’re caving on some domestic bs for show, and holding firm on all the imortant stuff, like Iraq, and unlimited power for the president to conduct his “war on terror”.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:56 pmFellow TPers,
Notice how m12 and AK47 are drive-by trolls….. throw out a few incorrect numbers and not face reality, and you see the same kind of mentality as we saw fater WWII when some Japanese soldiers were found in caves and still thought they were winning the war. Kinda sad when you think aobut it!
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:56 pmWhich should be renamed to “war of terror”.
:|
Or maybe just “terrible war”.
July 22nd, 2007 at 5:56 pmIt almost seems there’s a correlation between the popularity of Congress and the popularity of the occupation.
As the occupation becomes less popular, so does Congress.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:01 pmWeeeellll,
Hello, I’m Ronald Reagan, former president and Iran/Contra TRAITOR.
Now, I’m DEAD and BURNING IN HELL, and YOU CAN, TOO!
It’s EASY!!
Just continue to support the policies of the BIGGEST TRAITOR to AMERICA EVER, George W. Bush, the Saudi OIL-WHOREBAG!!
Treasonously yours from the pits of hell,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan…
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:03 pmIt almost seems there’s a correlation between the popularity of Congress and the popularity of the occupation.
As the occupation becomes less popular, so does Congress.
Yet the occupation is still more pooular than the Democrats.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:04 pmBut not the desire to impeach dumbass, which is at almost HALF the country for Bush, and OVER HALF the country, for Cheney.
So SUCK it.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:06 pmm12
Care to honor us with your answers to my questions in #56?
Probably not.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:06 pmCome on, pucker up.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:07 pmROFL…. Well, sure, if you’re a moron, you can’t argue. Meanwhile, the rest of us, who look at the bigger picture and at more than one set of numbers, have no problem arguing.
Comment by PaulB — July 22, 2007 @ 5:49 pm
—————————————————–
What?
Is math biased now?
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:07 pmMore people want to IMPEACH Bush, than approve of Bush.
Here. I’ll say that again.
More people want to IMPEACH Bush, than approve of Bush.
:D
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:07 pmYet the occupation is still more pooular than the Democrats.
And George W. Bush is the most POOULAR of all.
A true TRAITOR piece of zhit!!!! POOULAR!!!
Just like I was, before I DIED and went to hell for Iran/Contra!!
Treasonously yours from Master Satan’s bedroom,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:09 pmEverytime the little Maggot12 (12 being the IQ) speaks up with his inability to understand polls, you remind him more Americans want to impeach Bush and Cheney, than approve of them.
And for a President, thats all that matters.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:09 pmComment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 5:20 pm
Some observations in response:
1) Zogby is so traditionally twisted to the right, it can hardly be called objective. Pollingreport.com doesn’t even include Zogby in its list of polls when they report. Find a more credible poll.
2) Don’t read too much into finding a poll that showed a higher approval rating for Congress before the 2006 election than the current Zogby poll. If we thought the Republican Congress was so all-fired wonderful, why did we turn control over to the Democrats?
3) When approval/disapproval of Congress is broken down by party, more people disapprove of the job Republicans are doing.
4) People who disapprove of the job Democrats are doing are frustrated with the obstructionism. Look for people to vote for more Democrats in search of a veto-proof Congress, not more Republicans.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:11 pmBartlebee is disgusted with Congress.
I am disgusted with Congress.
Neither of us is voting the Republican ticket in 2008.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:11 pm“Is math biased now?”
LOL… No, dear, just morons who are incapable of using it.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:15 pmComment by upside00 — July 22, 2007 @ 6:06 pm
What is ‘this thing’?
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:16 pmComment by Egreggious — July 22, 2007 @ 6:11 pm
Yeah, so? Well see if the independents vote for the do nothing Democrats.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:17 pmYet the occupation is still more pooular than the Democrats.
Comment by m12
That’s just flat out delusional.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:18 pm“Yeah, so? Well see if the independents vote for the do nothing Democrats.”
ROFL…. They will, dear, just like they did in 2006. Particularly when the Democrats can legitimately point out that Congressional Republicans are, in fact, responsible for the “do nothing” Congress. But hey, you just keep living in your little fntasy world, if you want.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:19 pm“Yet the occupation is still more pooular [sic] than the Democrats.”
ROFLMAO… What can you say to someone so delusional?
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:20 pm• When asked what party they will vote for in the 2008 presidential election — a “generic ballot†question that does not include any candidate names — voters choose the Democrats by a sizable 18 percentage points, according to an NBC News/Wall Street Journal survey. We haven’t seen such a one-party advantage since the Watergate era.
Republican pollster Frank Luntz in todays LA Times.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:20 pmm12,
I will make it easy for you; here are my questions and please answer all of the questions. And if you can’t figure it out, “this thing” is the occupation of Iraq.
Figure it out yet?
m12,
You are delusional!! DO you really think the majority of Americans want this thing to continue?
I bet you only watch Faux NoNooz too, and read only the NY Post too. I bet you are a NeoCon as well.
But if I am wrong with these assumptions, let me know, but it doesn’t change the facts, just explains your delusions.
Comment by upside00
We are all waiting!!
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:25 pmHe is just like all the other neo-cons. Now that the ship is sinking he is trying to re-write himself in a better light.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:25 pmWe haven’t seen such a one-party advantage since the Watergate era.
Republican pollster Frank Luntz in todays LA Times.
Comment by Badger
Me’thinks in another year it wil be even more lop-sided!
Damn that liberal Luntz… er, never mind…
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:25 pmNow that the ship is sinking he is trying to re-write himself in a better light.
Comment by mbhdude
Could I be so bold as to make one tiny correction to your statement, mbhdude?
Now that the ship HAS SUNK… there, more technically accurate, see?
Glub… glub… glub…
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:27 pm“Me’thinks in another year it wil be even more lop-sided!”
That depends on what both parties do in the meantime. Reid’s recent bit of political theater didn’t help Republicans a bit. Senate Republicans have now even more firmly linked themselves to the Iraq War, which is still overwhelming unpopular and very likely to remain so.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:29 pmBut hey, you just keep living in your little fntasy world, if you want.
Comment by PaulB
Pssst… PaulB… ask Ding-dong if he’d like to put a little money on the outcome of the 2008 elections. Put his money where his mouth is.
We’ll see how much faith he REALLY has… snicker… snicker.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:29 pmTo upside00 #90: “But if I am wrong with these assumptions, let me know, but it doesn’t change the facts, just explains your delusions.â€
upside00: If m12 can’t explain why he’s delusional and believes that the majority of Americans want the Iraq occupation to continue here’s my explaination . It’s an email I once sent to a friend of mine two years ago:
Seeing the Light that wasn’t there
To Bernie Ward Email
Mr. Ward, July 2005
My name is Armando Gomez, an ardent listener to your nightly radio spot. Right now I’m writing this email as I’m listening to your program, and I may have the answer to the confusing question why Americans are voting against their own self interests. And the basic answer is that their (White America) sense of history and self-worth has come into question. To them this is unacceptable—at any and all cost, which is happening at this moment.
Realistically, all this began to manifest when Ronald Reagan was elected as president. But in all honestly, it really started with the Vietnam War and its shocking and unacceptable conclusion: we lost. And it wasn’t just the war we lost—we also lost our president, Richard Nixon. This sent a shock wave, border to border and coast to coast of White America. Both the war and President Nixon were proven to be a lie. This forced White America to question the very core of their moral foundation and their sense of purpose—the purpose of self-righteous, which they believe is their destiny, and guided by the Light from above. All this shattered when Nixon tanked. I remembered. I’m 57. But within a couple of years after Nixon’s fall, a new and up coming Religious Right movement went to work, scoring one victory after another. And I believe all this was spearheaded by the Heritage Foundation. The Foundation’s tactics: Accuse the Liberals of anti-family, anti-God, anti-America, anti-mother, and in short: anti-Liberal all around. And they made the word “Liberal†an expletive (remember the “F†word? Now you got the “L†word). And all this was pushed and funded by the multi-right wing millionaires and the corporate media such as the Bradley, Scaife and Olin foundation.
What this movement accomplishes was to exonerate White America of their failures, and blame “The Fall†on the dirty and back-stabbing Liberals. And White America went for it, hook, line, and sinker. They had no choice: To accept otherwise, they would have to question their entire “white†history. Without this history—or myth—they will have to accept a more realistic one—according to Ward Churchill. White Americans find that totally unacceptable. And for these White Americans or pro-White Americans they are ready to accept any politician, any judge, and any president that’ll tell them what they want to hear, especially when Jesus Christ is now considered as part of their White American history. That’s why they are more than ready to believe such phonies as Reagan, the first Bush, and this latest disgrace, Bush, Jr.
But with the present do-nothing White American voters, it gets worse: these Americans are willing to sacrifice their children’s and their grandchildren’s future, just so they can be bail out with the rapture in time or die in their sleep. For those Mr. Moneybags—to die rich in their beds is what they live for. Mr. Ward, to me these are the worst and the most rotten cowards any nation is unfortunately straddled with; stinking vermin who aren’t fit to be scurrying about. The disposition of Social Security, the bankruptcy bill, Medicare, pensions, college grants, aid to dependent children, job out-sourcing and others are examples of how far these Americans have sunk. The talk I hear is that these Americans are the stupidest piles of rocks on the planet. Wrong: It’s worse. Sept. 11 and the Iraq War only provide further excuses for these Americans to stab your fellow neighbors in the back—including our own veterans; a knife behind the door.
So, for Americans to swallow this new Direction of Bush, provided by the Republicans bashing machine, they have gone soft between the ears and soft between the legs. In short, STARK, RAVING PSYHOCITIC, not stupid. Even a flatworm can be educated; that’s why these Americans can’t or won’t be reached. And that is the answer why these Americans are voting against their own self-interest, and why they’re steering yours and ours, and our country into the toilet.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:40 pmComment by Armando Gomez — July 22, 2007 @ 6:40 pm
Wow, great letter, Armando! I hope that you got a response?
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:46 pmMore people want us OUT of Iraq, than want us there, so moron12 and his bullshit statistic doesn’t mean a thing.
MORE AMERICANS ARE AGAINST THE WAR, THAN ARE FOR THE WAR.
So SUCK it.
July 22nd, 2007 at 6:52 pmSo SUCK it.
Comment by BARTLEBEE
Hi Bartlebee. The trolls are all off changing their pantyhose right now.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:04 pm#96 Comment by Armando Gomez — July 22, 2007 @ 6:40 pm
Excellent overview of historical reality. Thanks for sharing. This needs to be understood in order to have an informed citizenry.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:27 pm#2 and #6
While I agree with the conclusion that the Shrubco so-called interpretation of so-called intelligence is a disaster, it seems rather self-serving that Hayes just mentions it now. I’ve got to ask – did he not see this at first and then get out ? Is this an attempt to deny his role in the disaster ? or is this an honest assessment.
I have no idea which is more plausible.
July 22nd, 2007 at 7:32 pmneocons just love to claim that it is the Democrats in Congress that aren’t getting anything done and haven’t stopped the war. The ONLY reason things aren’t getting down and the war is in another “surge” is because of the corrupt, incompetent, dishonest GrandObstructionistParty. The scumsucking boot lickers that support this criminal cabal in the White House have no moral terpitude and are the biggest wimps on earth and have fallen for Bushie’s fearmongering hook line and sinker. They are too stupid to notice that our occupation in Iraq has COST US A FORTUNE in lives, in money and in integrity since our slimeball Prez got us into it by lying and cheating, same way he “won” this Presidency. Its REPUBLICANS that are doing what they always do, lie, obstruct, lie, obstruct. They are such wussies, they CLAIM that they want our troops home but when it’s time to VOTE they weasel out like slime. Typical. GOP is goin’ DOWN with all these jack booted Neocons.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:06 pmThe thing to remember is that the Repugs are running scared now, as they are are sniping at each other, flip-flopping on every issue, more and more are being exposed as hypocritic scumbags and raising about half as much money as the Dems and realize the end is near.
Even the trolls here are whistling by the graveyard, spouting wacko polls and trying to hold onto the rope tied to a sinking ship.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:39 pmMcConnell had serious reservations but he put them aside and took Bush’s paycheck anyway.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:41 pmGotta pay those bills. Another whining, timid GOP sycophant. Nutless men like McConnell must spend hours talking shit to themselves.
Even the trolls here are whistling by the graveyard, spouting wacko polls and trying to hold onto the rope tied to a sinking ship.
Comment by upside00
Can i please make one small adjustemnt, upside00?
“… trying to hold onto the rope tied to a SUNKEN ship…”
Sinking, sank, sunken…
I think that’s better, isn’t it?
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:45 pmRoS,
Maybe, except that we still have many scumbags to drown to get our country back, so I won’t continue the ship sunk til all the passengers on SS BushCo go down with the ship…………AND they don’t float back to the surface.
July 22nd, 2007 at 8:51 pmWhy is McConnell speaking out now? Guilty conscience, or tired of his job? Perhaps he’s worried the WH is going to go down in flames and he’s protecting his butt.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:04 pm#101 Comment by MapleStreet — July 22, 2007 @ 7:32 pm
I have no idea which is more plausible.
Well, I go with the rats leaving the, “Sinking, sank, sunken…,” ship. The flight perils any one standing in the way. I must say, though, the sight of a naked Bush(Co) is frightening. The sh*t is hitting the fans folks, look out.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:18 pm#106 Comment by upside00 — July 22, 2007 @ 8:51 pm
I won’t continue the ship sunk til all the passengers on SS BushCo go down with the ship…………AND they don’t float back to the surface.
Yeah, like Elliott Abrams and the rest.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:20 pmThat’s just flat out delusional.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — July 22, 2007 @ 6:18 pm
Believe what you will….for all the Defeatocrats’ strategies and whining, there are more troops in Iraq now than Nov. 2006!
America wants victory in Iraq regardless of Reid’s rhetoric.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:27 pmAND they don’t float back to the surface.
Comment by upside00
Hey, you know waht Hunter Thompson once said…
“The scum also rises…”
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:28 pm“An internal Pentagon investigation released in February revealed that former Undersecretary of Defense Doug Feith utilized the Counter-Terrorism Evaluation Group within the Pentagon to create and promote false links between Iraq and al Qaeda.”
Isn’t the fact he created and promoted false links, that were used as facts to promote this war, a betrayal of his office and isn’t there anything legal that can be done.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:29 pmAND they don’t float back to the surface.
Comment by upside00
Remember, the beast snarls hardest when cornered.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:29 pmAmerica wants victory in Iraq regardless of Reid’s rhetoric.
Comment by m12
Let me correct your faulty thinking for ya, sonny.
Everyone, except Neo-cons and the oil companies, want America out of Iraq, regardless of m12 rhetoric.
Now you scamper on home, Li’l Feller. Mother Rove is calling. She’ll help you put on a pair of dry ones and fix ya a nice big glass of Koo-aid.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:32 pmRemember Aug ‘02… when Bush began his drum beat for the Iraq war…. Weapons of Mass destruction over and over and over…a fear tactic to stack congress…. Some of us KNEW this was a snow job then, but I wonder how the average public would react now if those news tapes of the run up to the illegal invasion were to be replayed.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:33 pmEveryone, except Neo-cons and the oil companies, want America out of Iraq, regardless of m12 rhetoric.
The President also wants us out of Iraq. The only people supporting an immediate cut and run operation are the fringe lunatics!
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:34 pmRemember Aug ‘02… when Bush began his drum beat for the Iraq war…. Weapons of Mass destruction over and over and over…a fear tactic to stack congress…. Some of us KNEW this was a snow job then, but I wonder how the average public would react now if those news tapes of the run up to the illegal invasion were to be replayed.
Remember December 98?
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:35 pmSome of us KNEW this was a snow job then, but I wonder how the average public would react now if those news tapes of the run up to the illegal invasion were to be replayed.
Comment by had enough
Probably like a clip from John Stewart w/out the ha-has…
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:36 pmAmerica wants victory in Iraq regardless of Reid’s rhetoric.
Comment by m12
Describe victory in Iraq…
There is no such thing as this was an illegal invasion now occupation of a third world innocent country. The best we can do is right some of the wrongs, bring to justice the guilty and do what the Iraqi people want – get the HELL out of Iraq.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:42 pm‘reinterpret information’….when you think about it,that IS scary – why bother with a DNI if all you end up doing is make stuff up and act on fantasy
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:44 pm#110 Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 9:27 pm
Believe what you will….
Actually, it’s you that believes. We go by what is apparent. Like the nose on your face.
…there are more troops in Iraq now than Nov. 2006!
Of course there are! Because BushCo wanted them there. And he put them there OVER the public’s demand that he not.
America wants victory in Iraq regardless of Reid’s rhetoric.
You really are a tiresome troll.
What does this America that you speak of consist of? Do you really believe you speak for America? Or is it only your piddley 28% that is American? The rest are “against us and for the terrorists” thus not Americans?
Answer those questions if you can.
Enquiring minds want to know!
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:45 pm“The President also wants us out of Iraq. The only people supporting an immediate cut and run operation are the fringe lunatics!”
Comment by m12
And you still believe him? Only the gullible swallow lies on top of lies.
I guess that’s you.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:46 pmDescribe victory in Iraq…
Victory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing into US coffers through US military bases that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:49 pmM12:
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:50 pmWhen the only option left available occurs, will you be calling it a “strategic redeployment” Sounds like nonthinking partisanship from where I live
Remember December 98?
Comment by m12
The republican congress were doing a lynching on Bill Clinton for the very deeds they themselves were doing in their private life. What a fine job Larry Flynt did exposing this.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:50 pm#116 Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 9:34 pm
The President also wants us out of Iraq.
You really want to believe that, don’t you? You care to define when he will withdraw the troops? Whether he is going to turn the bases we built and continue to build over to the Iraqi people?
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:50 pmWhat is BushCos plan regarding withdrawal?
There is no such thing as this was an illegal invasion now occupation of a third world innocent country. The best we can do is right some of the wrongs, bring to justice the guilty and do what the Iraqi people want – get the HELL out of Iraq.
Newsflash: The guilty Islamic Fundamentalists who invaded the United States are in Iraq!
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:50 pm“Victory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing into US coffers through US military bases that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.”
ROFLMAO…. Thanks for that delusion, m12. I do so love it when a rightwing troll posts something so incredibly stupid that no response is required other than laughter.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:52 pm“Newsflash: The guilty Islamic Fundamentalists who invaded the United States are in Iraq!”
Newsflash! No, they aren’t!
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:53 pmThe republican congress were doing a lynching on Bill Clinton for the very deeds they themselves were doing in their private life. What a fine job Larry Flynt did exposing this.
Yep, and President Clinton was detailing specific details on Hussein’s biological and chemical weapons.
“Saddam will strike again at his neighbors. He will make war on his own people.
And mark my words, he will develop weapons of mass destruction. He will deploy them, and he will use them.”
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:54 pmVictory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing into US coffers through US military bases that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.
Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 9:49 pm
Doesn’t really sound like democracy what with the part about the people’s resources being turned over to their masters.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:54 pmNewsflash! No, they aren’t!
Comment by PaulB — July 22, 2007 @ 9:53 pm
Newsflash! Yes, they are!
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:54 pmVictory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing into US coffers through US military bases that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.
Comment by m12
Why should the Iraqi people want this? Do you think this is really going to fly after we bombed the hell out of their country, tortured their people, raped their women and children? What do you think these folks are sub human – won’t care?
Racist to the extreme.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:57 pm#123 Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 9:49 pm
Describe victory in Iraq…
Victory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing into US coffers through US military bases that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.
Holy Sh*t! What an unbelievable statement! You must be insane! Jamming “democracy” down an unwilling people’s throat, taking their oil which does not belong to us and then starting another illegal invasion in Iran.
You share Bush’s megalomania. You are one scary dude if you believe this.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:57 pm“for all the Defeatocrats’ strategies and whining, there are more troops in Iraq now than Nov. 2006!”
Yes, dear, we know. So does the American public. That’s why Republican Senators are sweating bullets now and the Republican Party is horribly afraid about what will happen in 2008.
“America wants victory in Iraq regardless of Reid’s rhetoric.”
Yes, dear, most of us do, in fact, want victory. Most of us understand, though, that “victory” is, alas, not possible.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:58 pmThe guilty Islamic Fundamentalists who invaded the United States are in Iraq!
Comment by m12
Those that invaded the US were Saudis, you know the ones holding hands with Bush? They are now in Iraq killing our soldiers.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:01 pmWhy should the Iraqi people want this? Do you think this is really going to fly after we bombed the hell out of their country, tortured their people, raped their women and children? What do you think these folks are sub human – won’t care?
You think they preferred to be gassed by Saddam Hussein or brutalized by Al Qaeda? Absolutely not!
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:04 pmThose that invaded the US were Saudis, you know the ones holding hands with Bush? They are now in Iraq killing our soldiers.
All the more reason to kill them where they stand.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:05 pmYes, dear, most of us do, in fact, want victory. Most of us understand, though, that “victory†is, alas, not possible.
Comment by PaulB — July 22, 2007 @ 9:58 pm
PaulB:
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:08 pmIf victory is making an opportunity for the next president to fix the damage done to our global reputation and leading the world into a brave and new world in which we will all have to work together in a more thoughtful manner f0r global benefit than maybe these years of nonsense will have played an important role. Must be the buddhist in me or something…
#137 Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 10:04 pm
You think they preferred to be gassed by Saddam Hussein or brutalized by Al Qaeda? Absolutely not!
Ask the Iraqi people about that now!
Oh, thats right. That poll was done. The majority of them want us out of Iraq. They think we are after their oil. Imagine that! They think the oil under their country belongs to them.
How “quaint!”
So, what were you saying again?
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:12 pmOne thing remains crystal clear.
The contention by Cheney that Iraqi drones were going to magically appear along the west coast and spray biological agents all over US citizens was complete and total bullshit.
How many Senators and citizens did that specific fantasy influence?
There was NO intelligence to support that traitorous lie.
NONE.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:14 pmthere is no such thng as victory in Iraqi, only the best options of terrible choices. And sadly any choice is going to be costly no matter what. There will be no winners.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:15 pmDon’t think about every lie and try to make the case against Cheney based on that. Just pick the BIGGEST lie and prove that he knew it was false at the time that he made it.
IMPEACHABLE OFFENSE
WAR CRIME
TREASON
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:16 pmAce, I so agree with you. Too bad, WE, THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, can’t by-pass Congress and impeach them oursleves. Ot Oh, am I going to get a one way ticket to Gitmo for that.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:19 pm#139 Comment by dbadass — July 22, 2007 @ 10:08 pm
If victory is making an opportunity for the next president to fix the damage done to our global reputation and leading the world into a brave and new world in which we will all have to work together in a more thoughtful manner f0r global benefit than maybe these years of nonsense will have played an important role. Must be the buddhist in me or something…
Yes, we have created a lot of bad karma in these last 27 years. I hope you are right that we take seriously our obligation and responsibility to help heal the world after we have healed ourselves.
And one does not have to be Buddhist to understand that.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:19 pmIt is amazing how candid Hayes has become. The secondary unit in the Pentagon is a very compelling development. I wonder what the WH interpretation will be to their current Iraqi employment problem. If US Iraq Ambassador Cocker is right, Iraqis will quit working for the US government if they don’t receive refugee status. The refugee problem in Iraq sure hasn’t seen much mainstream coverage. Will Bush increase the number of Iraq refugees to the US? I bet the US hasn’t admitted many Iraqi refugees lately. So, what rose colored glasses will the WH put on to talk about this?
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:21 pm#144 Comment by Nance — July 22, 2007 @ 10:19 pm
Too bad, WE, THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, can’t by-pass Congress and impeach them oursleves.
There is an excellent book written by Elizabeth De la Vega called “U.S. vs Bush.” She was a federal prosecutor for 20 years. Plenty of ammunition here. Check it out. (It is from TomDispatch, BTW.)
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:30 pm#147, Merlin
thanks, I’ll check it out. Her name sounds very familiar.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:37 pmOh, thats right. That poll was done. The majority of them want us out of Iraq. They think we are after their oil. Imagine that! They think the oil under their country belongs to them.
How “quaint!â€
Yes, they want us out after the job is done!
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:41 pmComments by ace
Just want to take a moment to say thanks for all your posts. I gain much from your thoughts and links. Keep up the good work.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:43 pm#149 Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 10:41 pm
Yes, they want us out after the job is done!
But we aren’t going to leave, are we? Or so you said and wish.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:49 pmAccording to you, that would be after their oil money is flowing into our corporate coffers. Is that right? And do you seriously believe that they will “greet us with flowers” (love us) as we steal their oil? And are they going to be happy to have us fight a war with Iran from their country bringing more death and destruction to them?
But we aren’t going to leave, are we? Or so you said and wish.
According to you, that would be after their oil money is flowing into our corporate coffers. Is that right? And do you seriously believe that they will “greet us with flowers†(love us) as we steal their oil? And are they going to be happy to have us fight a war with Iran from their country bringing more death and destruction to them?
You think they want a repeat of the early 90s, with Mr. Ahmadinejad utliziing his weapons of mass destruction on the region?
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:53 pmSo, they lied to take us into a war of vanity, not just Bush’s vanity, but the Neo-Cons’ vanity. That bunch of delusional morons was given a free rein with national Security. We saw what happened, and is still happening.
Wolfowitz, Cheney, Perle, and the Kagan tribe have been wrong about foreign policy in the Middle East from the minute they were allowed to open their mouth about it. They are a bunch of ideological morons without one iota of pragmatism.
Foreign policy — or government policy — should not be run by ideological zealots, the way it has been run for the past miserable six and a half year. Our government is run by crackpots who do not share one ounce of realism and pragmatism among them. These freaks are just like the freaks who used to run the USSR
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:03 pmYou think they want a repeat of the early 90s, with Mr. Ahmadinejad utliziing his weapons of mass destruction on the region?
Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 10:53 pm
Examples, or is this just more horse shit?
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:04 pmm12 -
Let me guess, you are either in the oil business, are in the military contracts business and NEVER have been in the military or have any family member in Iraq, right?
Let me know if I have that right, OK?
And be honest, I know that is difficult for the Repugs, but give it a shot, you might find it cathartic, OK?
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:05 pm#152 Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 10:53 pm
You think they want a repeat of the early 90s, with Mr. Ahmadinejad utliziing his weapons of mass destruction on the region?
You keep answering questions with questions. That is unacceptable in a two way discussion.
Answer my questions, or are you afraid of the picture you see?
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:16 pmOn Thursday morning, July 19th, the beloved GOP talking point “up or down vote” was officially declared dead. Its demise was little noticed in the aftermath of the Senate Republicans’ successful all-night filibuster to block the Reed-Levin bill seeking to begin U.S. troop withdrawals from Iraq. “Up or down vote” was killed by a desperate Republican Party trying to obstruct Democratic accomplishments at any cost in advance of the 2008 elections. And so far, the GOP seems to be getting away with the crime.
For the details, see:
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:17 pm“Up or Down Vote: Death of a GOP Talking Point.”
Hey! Look! Here! I’m posting in the style of m12! I don’t post! I exclaim! Exciting! Ain’t it!
This is where tie off-topic inflammatory statement goes!
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:18 pmThe Repugs are in the final throes of relevancy and are flopping around like a dying fish on the deck.
Sorry, Trolls, all your denials won’t change reality, even my 87 year old life-long Republican has seen the light. He is a WWII vet and thinks the whole BushCo Cabal is EVIL and needs to go, and go now.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:22 pm#159
Sorry, I left out that that 87 year old dude is my Midwest born and raised FATHER! And he just became the coolest guy in the world!
When HE rolls over, the Repugs are in DEEP SHIT!
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:24 pmDescribe victory in Iraq…
Victory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing into US coffers through US military bases that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.
Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 9:49 pm
Exactly, now that you have described it:
TREASON against the wishes of the American people and the USA.
Another TRAITOR, like the Bushes, Cheneys and ME.
THEY will be BURNING IN HELL like ME, too…
So will YOU if you support this TREASON against the USA…
Treasonously yours from the pits of burning hell,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:24 pmComment by Marcus Aurelius — July 22, 2007 @ 11:18 pm
Glad to see m12 has provided some value. And I thought he was a useless troll. See, there is “good” in every one.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:25 pmAnd notice that m12 refuses to answer my questions in # 155, which I have asked before. He is a typical Chickenhawk troll, never to answer any question that might bring him closer to reality.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:26 pmVictory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing into US coffers through US military bases that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.
Comment by m12 — July 22, 2007 @ 9:49 pm
Sounds like theft and misappropriation of a people’s cultural heritage and assets. Oh so commendable.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:28 pmComment by Merlin — July 22, 2007 @ 11:25 pm
Yes! Thanks!
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:29 pmIf the nation had a collective conscience, this would be grounds for impeachment, and the House would be forced to file charges, the Senate would be forced to convict both Bush and Cheney for sending us to war under false pretenses.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:37 pmRU,
I agree but a large percentage of citizens have been so traumatized by the Rover BS Shit-slinging and beaten into a false sense of fear, that they don’t know what to do… other than get this sliomy scum out of OUR WH and out of our lives!!!
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:41 pmpost #1 said it all:
Well, sometimes you just have to go to war for oil with the intelligence you don’t have.
Comment by HeartlandLiberal
Remember, The Downing Street Memos are true. The Niger documents were known to be a poor forgery 11 months before the SOTU. Ditto the aluminum tubes story. Cheney’s Energy Task Force divided Iraq’s oil fields in MARCH 2001. The weapons inspectors in Iraq said they had run out of places to look and could find nothing.
Now put all these truths together and what do you conclude? We were lied into the war so we could take control of the second largest oil reserves in the world and be stationed between #1 and #3.
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:53 pmIf the nation had a collective conscience, this would be grounds for impeachment, and the House would be forced to file charges, the Senate would be forced to convict both Bush and Cheney for sending us to war under false pretenses.
Comment by RUCerious
BREAKING NEWS!!
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/davidswanson/160
Conyers says he will start IMPEACHMENT, regardless of Pelosi, if he can get THREE MORE members (presently 14) of the House to sign on!!
Call your Congressman TOMORROW and EVERY DAY.
Don’t let the USA fall to TRAITORS like the Bushes and Cheneys.
And ME, DEAD and BURNING IN HELL for my TREASON…
Treasonously yours from the pits of hell,
Traitor Ronnie and my Master Satan
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:55 pmGallup poll 7-10-07
62% : it was a mistake to send troops to Iraq
22% : surge has made things better
71% (including 42% of Republicans) : Remove all troops by April 1, 2008; 26% oppose
July 22nd, 2007 at 11:58 pm#170 – WHOAAA!!! Are youi saying that the MAJORITY of the AMERICAN people are wanting the end of this illegal occupation?
Who’da thunk??
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:23 amComment by Ronald Reagan and his Master Satan — July 22, 2007 @ 11:55 pm
I’m calling my rep tomorrow to make sure that he signs on to this. (That’s if he hasn’t already–we’ve got John Hall, one of the new reps John Hall, that supposedly Karl Rove is targeting.)
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:27 amPosted on the “3,498″ board…
Ronald Reagan and his Master Satan
Thank you….. you made my night.
Comment by had enough
Weeeellll, Thank YOU!!
It’s time I did something FOR the USA instead of my usual commission of TREASON…
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:28 amI’m calling my rep tomorrow to make sure that he signs on to this. (That’s if he hasn’t already–we’ve got John Hall, one of the new reps John Hall, that supposedly Karl Rove is targeting.)
Comment by Jane E. Schneider
Weeellll, GREAT!!
Master Satan LOVES “Still The One”, “Let There Be Satanic Music” and “Dance with Me in Hell”!!
OK, he improvised a bit…
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:31 am#170 Comment by Keith G — July 22, 2007 @ 11:58 pm
Gallup poll 7-10-07
62% : it was a mistake to send troops to Iraq
22% : surge has made things better
71% (including 42% of Republicans) : Remove all troops by April 1, 2008; 26% oppose
Now if trolls were really interested in facts this would be both meaningful and relavent. I suggest posting it tomorrow on all the threads and rubbing their noses in it. Late night posts are made on dead threads and have little impact.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:38 amOops, didn’t mean to type John Hall’s name twice, missed it while editing.
RRandhisMS, I’d be pretty surprised if Master Satan really liked John Hall’s music – hell, I’m not particularly fond of it! :-) But I DO like his ideology!
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:38 amComment by Merlin — July 23, 2007 @ 12:38 am
Hey, Merlin, glad to see you’re still up and posting. This place gets so dead on a late Sunday night. I’m taking off tomorrow, so I’m hanging out a little bit longer.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:40 amFrom Orleans’ “Your Life, My Friend”
Everybody’s got to take a chance
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:42 amEverybody’s got to make a stand
You’ll be choosing in THE END
‘Cause this is YOUR LIFE, MY FRIEND
it’s not late. It’s only 9:46.
Wasn’t Cong. John Hall on the Stephen Colbert show and Colbert kept pretending he was the singer?
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:48 amComment by Ronald Reagan and his Master Satan — July 23, 2007 @ 12:42 am
Hmmm, I may actually have to dig that one up–those lyrics are certainly appropriate to these times. I did some volunteer work for Hall’s campaign, and attended a few fundraisers and other “meet the candidate”-type get-togethers, but it was considered to be in poor taste to ask him to sing. I did enjoy he and Stephen Colbert harmonizing the National Anthem on Colbert’s show, though.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:48 am#177 Comment by Jane E. Schneider — July 23, 2007 @ 12:40 am
Hey, Merlin, glad to see you’re still up and posting. This place gets so dead on a late Sunday night.
Hi Jane,
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:51 amWell it is only 9:40 here in LA, California rather than 12:40 back east. And besides I’m a night person in my own business so I choose my hours. The bad part is I miss out on the best part of the threads, coming on to them late, and having to read 100 or 200 to catch up. Then I’m answering posts made a couple of hours ago, that everyone is finished with.
Other than that I enjoy TP and you folks! I have broadened my understanding since hanging out here, and you and Wayne have provided part of that growth. I appreciate both of you and your comments. :-)
it’s not late. It’s only 9:46.
Wasn’t Cong. John Hall on the Stephen Colbert show and Colbert kept pretending he was the singer?
Comment by Keith G — July 23, 2007 @ 12:48 am
It’s late here in NY! :) And yes, he was (we just crossed posts there), but I thought Colbert actually did a pretty good job. It’s hard enough to sing the National Anthem well, but doing the harmony is infinitely harder!
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:51 amt’s not late. It’s only 9:46.
Wasn’t Cong. John Hall on the Stephen Colbert show and Colbert kept pretending he was the singer?
Comment by Keith G
Yes, but Colbert was doing a skit confusing him with DARRYL HALL of Hall and Oates.
John Hall was one of the founders of Orleans (”Dance With Me”, etc.), and a GREAT musician http://www.johnhallmusic.com
And he is a GREAT congressman, environmentalist and STRONG DEMOCRAT…
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:51 amHe was with Orleans, but not Hall and Oates, right?
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:52 amComment by Merlin — July 23, 2007 @ 12:51 am
Why, thank you, Master Merlin, I’ll tell Wayne you said so. He’s more the Constitutional scholar and researcher–my stuff pales in comparison. And Wayne rarely resorts to stuff like “Shove it, asswipe”, the way I sometimes do!
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:54 am“He was with Orleans, but not Hall and Oates, right?”
Comment by Keith G — July 23, 2007 @ 12:52 am
Right. I found both to be more ‘pop’ music, which I was never particularly interested in.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:56 amI’m more into the Doors, Clash, Stones, Creedence, Joplin, Yardbirds, Dylan, Cash, etc.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:59 amJane,
Yes, it was on the “Let There Be Music Album”. I agree that the lyrics are ESPECIALLY APPROPRIATE.
Please remind John’s office of that.
I used to live in Hyde Park, home of FDR (and ME). John’s district includes Dutchess County:
http://johnhall.house.gov/
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:01 amComment by Ronald Reagan and his Master Satan — July 23, 2007 @ 1:01 am
Hey, so you’re an ex-neighbor! Wayne and I are in Pawling, former home (well, he’s dead now) of Norman Vincent Peale, of “Power of Positive Thinking” fame, as well as Edward R. Murrow–I’ve been to the house Murrow used to own, there’s wonder photos of him and various celebrities of the time.
Keith, I’m pretty much with you music-wise. Started with the Beatles, Simon and Garfunkel, Stones, Doors, The Band, Grateful Dead, The Who, etc. I’m still “Living in the Past” (can’t forget Jethro Tull!) musically.
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:13 amthere’s wonder photos of him
D’oh! Meant ‘wonderful’.
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:15 am#185 Comment by Jane E. Schneider — July 23, 2007 @ 12:54 am
He’s more the Constitutional scholar and researcher–my stuff pales in comparison. And Wayne rarely resorts to stuff like “Shove it, asswipeâ€, the way I sometimes do!
A constitutional scholar I am not, but but like everyone else I feel I have something of value to say (at least some of the time) when I am not playing with the trolls heads (Blappity blap and all that stuff.)
Of course, I believe that there is a time and place for “Shove it, and asswipeâ€. I prefer to resort to those things rarely, making the times when I do use them more potent. (Merlin said F*ck!!?? Gasp…) I would rather use psychology and creativity in creating a feeling (if that is possible) of impotence or irritation in the trolls. That is what they try to do to us, so turn around is fair play.
I have been noticing the use of questioning happening here with the trolls. I have been doing it a good bit lately. If you ask the right questions, they have no answers and ignore you. If they answer they are cooked. Lose, lose for them. If you allow them to question and you answer defensively you get bogged down in details that they ignore. So the questions should be broad and involve a challenge to their ideology. (Do you believe… How do you feel about… What is Bush’s idea about that?) put the onus on them to commit themselves, which if you’ve noticed, they never do. We hardly know where any of the trolls stand on anything as all they do is poke us about our open and stated beliefs or answer questions with questions.
Wayne does this (asks questions) and it is effective.
I would like to see us all turn the tables around on the trolls by doing what they do, rather trying to defensively prove them wrong via fact production and argument. Make them impotent and irrelavent by not being able to say anything.
My 2 cents on trolls. What do you think?
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:29 amHey, had enough, Merlin, barfly and the rest of the American patriots, point of notice: M12 by now have admitted the Bush administration’s true intent for the invasion of Iraq: to rob Iraq of its oil. He (or if he is a she) what he wrote back in #123:
Describe victory in Iraq…Victory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing into US coffers through US military bases that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.
Conlusion: M12 believes in using “Democracy†in rob and kill innocent Iraqis so that Big Oil can profit—at the expense of American lives! And to conquer Iran to further that flow of oil revenues for Big Oil. At the same time, we, the consumers will be stiff with the sky high price of gas at the local filling station. Nice work, M12.
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:37 amMerlin, most of the time I prefer to use the same tactics that you do. When you ask a question like “Do you really believe that liberals (insert right-wing talking point here)?”, they cannot honestly say “Yes”. The trolls like to pick one little part of someone’s post and attack that, rather than the whole. Some, like ‘michael’ and ‘m12′, tend to ask silly questions that have already been answered time and again.
Wayne can do both: provide facts AND ask the right questions. I, on the other had, sort of just go for the heart and sense of the matter (for the most part.) Sometimes it’s fun when the two of us are able to ‘tag-team’ a troll with both styles!
You certainly provide more facts than I do, but you also ask the right questions. I always enjoy your posts, it’s too bad I miss seeing the late-late-night ones.
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:42 amComment by Armando Gomez — July 23, 2007 @ 1:37 am
Spot on!
The questions he was asked today (and there was a number of us doing it all at once. He was really under pressure.) brought to light his ideology for all to see. We need to get more trolls out on the limb like this. Force them to commit and explain or we won’t talk to them. Then we can keep rubbing their noses in what they have said. It will nulify their ability to upset the thread!
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:48 amNow if TP can stop useless trolls like Mr. Pee with all his !!!!! etc we will have a great blog. There is no stopping his multiple duplicate posts and off the wall diatribes.
Comment by Armando Gomez — July 23, 2007 @ 1:37 am
Hi, Armando! Yeah, m12 is one of those “I’ve got mine, I don’t care about anyone else” types–you should hear him/it talk about the healthcare issue! He’s also extremely insular and apparently believes in the “America First-Right or Wrong” credo. He must be one of those “White Americans” that you wrote about–great letter!
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:55 am“Now if TP can stop useless trolls like Mr. Pee with all his !!!!! etc we will have a great blog. There is no stopping his multiple duplicate posts and off the wall diatribes.”
Comment by Merlin — July 23, 2007 @ 1:48 am
Some of us are working on him–in fact, he and Wayne were debating very nicely this weekend. BTW, his latest identity is “Kalashnikov”.
July 23rd, 2007 at 2:02 am#193 Comment by Jane E. Schneider — July 23, 2007 @ 1:42 am
I, on the other had, sort of just go for the heart and sense of the matter (for the most part.)
And I believe that “the heart and sense of the matter” are way more important than facts. They are our reality in friendship, communication and love. Yet they are what is repressed by the “right.” You see it often in their uptight posture and lack of a real sense of humor. They find refuge in facts and law while hiding from their feelings. Feelings make situations “gray.” Dualistic thinking cannot exist if gray complications enter the picture.
July 23rd, 2007 at 2:05 amGlenn Greenwald’s new book, “A Tragic Legacy,” about how the ideology of Good and Evil has brought down Bush’s Presidency is a great read. I am half way through and am really impressed. Check it out!
Merlin, I’ve enjoyed the few articles by Greenwald that I’ve read, so I’m sure that the book must be excellent. Right now, there’s a great many books out there that are on our ‘wish list’, but for now, money’s too tight for books. We do have a friend who works at a library, though, so we’re planning to go that route for the time being. Then, when we can afford to, we’ll go ahead and buy the ‘keepers’ for our ‘reference’ bookcase.
July 23rd, 2007 at 2:16 amTHOtz…(What the hell, I’ll go along even tho they’re a bunch of scumbags cause the money’s good and we’ll probably win in Iraq agin the towel-heads anyway an we’ll al be Heeros……. Oops! we’re not doing so hot(!)and the scumbags are being exposed(!) so now I’ll just flip this around in a jiffy and(hah!) they don’t got nuthin’ on me anyways (WHEW!!)…gosh, I feel like a real armchair patriot… [Nahhhh! Everybody does it, don't they???] )
July 23rd, 2007 at 2:20 amComment by nikolai — July 23, 2007 @ 2:20 am
Hmmm…somehow I don’t think those would be McConnell’s EXACT thoughts, but you’ve probably got the gist of them. ;-) Though I’m willing to bet that “they” do have something on him!
July 23rd, 2007 at 2:25 amComment by Jane E. Schneider — July 23, 2007 @ 2:02 am
BTW, his latest identity is “Kalashnikovâ€.
If Kalashnikov is the name of a Russian rifle (is it?) then it fits his style to a tee. There is much to be plumbed in a person’s choice of “handle.” In Merlin, I fancy myself to be the all knowing sage that I am not. Mr. Pee shoots off his posts wildly (by his own admission, “whatever comes into my head,” was the way he put it.) like a blind soldier shooting at all the noises around him.
Here was a post on another thread regarding name choice. I was attempting to draw willie onelung out because he wouldn’t answer my questions to him. The first part was in regard to a utube video he linked us to. Perhaps you saw it. He laughed uproariously about it without having the slightest idea that the joke was on him. Willie handled my taunt very badly, I’m afraid.
You ever heard of a “gallows laugh� Back in the days of public hanging in England, the condemned with a noose around his neck would “entertain†the “viewers†with funny comments until the trap door opened.
You are the “viewer†here laughing at what you don’t understand, as the trap door is about to be tripped sending BushCo and his oblivious “viewers†like you to twist slowly in the breeze.
Did you also know that psychologically, people often pick names that represent themselves in their own eyes? (I picked Merlin you will I’m sure make note of). And you picked a name representing what? A person who can’t get enough air? The air of understanding, perhaps? A brain starved of oxygen has great difficulty thinking straight.
Interesting stuff, us people!
July 23rd, 2007 at 2:28 amComment by Merlin — July 23, 2007 @ 2:28 am
You’re right, someone did point out to Mr. P that his new name was the name of a Russian rifle manufacturer.
I did see your back-and-forth with onelungwilly (I was debating him earlier in that thread.) Hey, if he’s going to go by a self-descriptive name, he should expect the occasional taunt.
I suppose that I could have come up with a “handle” for myself, but I would find it hard to choose one, or to stick with it once I chose it. But using my real name could be interpreted (by armchair psychologists such as ourselves) as my seeing myself as a ‘real’ person, no mask, no fakery, nothing to hide behind, just plain old me.
July 23rd, 2007 at 2:43 am#202 Comment by Jane E. Schneider — July 23, 2007 @ 2:43 am
I suppose that I could have come up with a “handle†for myself, but I would find it hard to choose one, or to stick with it once I chose it. But using my real name could be interpreted (by armchair psychologists such as ourselves) as my seeing myself as a ‘real’ person, no mask, no fakery, nothing to hide behind, just plain old me.
I took your name as you described it, and you come across that way as well. Consistency that comes from self honesty.
Actually my name is Paul Scott and I have no trouble advertising it. It is just more interesting, mysterious, entertaining or provacative to the reader (pick one, I challenge them.) I find it fun. Now that I have chosen this handle, I would not want to change it. It has sort of become an alter ego, I guess.
July 23rd, 2007 at 2:58 amAll this handle changing here on TP is confusing and as they never explain what they are doing it is hard to see where they are coming from. (Which is the point I suppose.)
“I took your name as you described it, and you come across that way as well. Consistency that comes from self honesty.”
Comment by Merlin — July 23, 2007 @ 2:58 am
Thanks, I’m taking that as a compliment. I guess that I’m pretty comfortable with myself at this stage of the game (and you know my age), and have few delusions about myself. I know my strengths, and I know my flaws, and I believe that I am, overall, a decent person. And that’s pretty much all I can ask of myself, right?
And on that note, I’d better get myself off to bed. Thank you for the interesting conversation, Paul, I’ve enjoyed it immensely. :-)
Goodnight!
July 23rd, 2007 at 3:09 amWhat does intelligence have to do with this??
July 23rd, 2007 at 3:13 amThat may sound funny.
But really,what does intelligence have to do with anything this gang does?
Intelligence is the least likely item to be incorporated into their plan.
If there was even a brain cell worth in anything they do ……. wow.I for sure would not be writing this.
Good night Jane,
Nice chatting with you!
July 23rd, 2007 at 3:14 amOf course the Iraq fiasco was due to “faulty intelligence”.
The Bush administration wrote the reports they wanted to hear and believe in, in spite of the lack of evidence that Hussein possessed WMD, and sometimes even against the available evidence (read the UN inspections and the claims of Iraq-AlQaeda “links”)
And then they feign surprise that no WMD were found in Iraq after the invasion. They are only fooling themselves and their blind followers who have been drinking their Kool-Aid since 2003.
July 23rd, 2007 at 3:21 am“America wants victory in Iraq regardless of Reid’s rhetoric.â€
Actually Harry Reid only puts up a show for the whacked out left while for normal citizens he makes comments like this:
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., said he agreed with Townsend that the U.S. should consider going after Al Qaeda militarily “wherever they are.”
“We have the NIE report, which just came out, that says Al Qaeda during this administration is stronger than ever. I don’t think we should take anything off the table. Wherever we find these evil people we should go get them,” Reid said.
I’m guessing this (”Wherever we find these evil people we should go get them”) means Iraq also.
July 23rd, 2007 at 3:30 amMcConnell just adds to the mountain of evidence that Bush and Cheney manipulated and misrepresented the intelligence to justify going into Iraq.
America will be paying the price for Bush and Cheney’s dishonesty for decades to come.
July 23rd, 2007 at 4:53 amWell, sometimes you just have to go to war for oil with the intelligence you don’t have.
Comment by HeartlandLiberal — July 22, 2007 @ 3:02 pm
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July 23rd, 2007 at 6:10 amLies, manipulations, violations of law, rule, regulation, moral abdication…
Nothing so much as the filthy getting a bit more filthy in Richistan. I mean hey, everyone’s doing it? Exxon, Mobil, Shell, Enron, Adelphia, Blue Cross, Fox, all the good captains of industry and all the kings men, couldn’t put humpty dumpty back together again.
July 23rd, 2007 at 6:52 amHow many trillions of dollars would still be in the Treasury if Republicans didn’t exist? How many people would still be alive?
July 23rd, 2007 at 7:15 am> Victory in Iraq is a thriving Democracy with oil revenues flowing
> into US coffers through US military bases
and what if that democracy democratically chooses to sell its oil to americans enemies, and to make peace with iran? what would you consider that? and how would military force prevent such a scenario from occuring..?
you have this deep, deep delusion that if you create democracy it will be pro-western.. how did that whole “democracy in palestine” thing work for yoU?
please, oh please, can you tell me which Iraqi political parties you think are going to help Iraq become this pro-american pipe dream you see in your meth-addled delusions?
> that can and will be used for further military action against Iran.
you think we are going to have as much luck in Iran as we did in Iraq?
>You think they preferred to be gassed
> by Saddam Hussein
newsflash..saddam didnt gas 99.9 percent of his population..but now 99.9 percent of the iraqi population is suffering….. in fact, if the iraqis he gassed were americans who did the same thing to america they did against iraq, you’d be calling them traitors who all needed to be gassed, as well.. you and saddam are more alike than you think..thats why your heroes used to be his buddy till he invaded someone they didnt tell him to…
> or brutalized by Al Qaeda?
thats the only option, right? their only two choices are 1) become a pro-american, anti-iranian democracy or 2) be brutalized by the paltry percentage of foreign jihadis that are in iraq?
> Absolutely not!
you seem so concerned about the will of the iraqi people.. if a majority of them want us out, and our military bases out, should be leave?
Bowel Movement 1-2, your posts have gotten even more delusional than ever..are you taking your meds??
July 23rd, 2007 at 8:26 amGood to see you back, Liberal See Liberal Do (LSLD)!
July 23rd, 2007 at 8:27 amSome minor SOS call here from one of our black brothers:Lil Wayne arrested on charges of weapons posession; when u click dont forget to click the utube link
July 23rd, 2007 at 8:30 amthat is all lie!
July 23rd, 2007 at 9:28 amThats all lie and they are manipulate by a higher people!!
July 23rd, 2007 at 9:29 amCall Congress Today for Impeachment
We’ve reached the impeachment moment for Vice President Dick Cheney. We’ve pushed the cosponsor list for H. Res. 333 up to 14. Chairman John Conyers says that if we get 3 more he’ll begin the impeachment proceedings.
And many Congress Members must be recognizing that there is no other path available. Cheney and Bush have repeatedly refused to comply with subpoenas, ordered former staffers not to comply, and announced that the Justice Department will not enforce contempt citations from Congress. When a special prosecutor attempted to hold this administration accountable, Cheney’s chief of staff obstructed justice, and Cheney persuaded Bush to commute his sentence. There is no course left for Congress but Impeachment.
On Monday, July 23rd, the fifth anniversary of the meeting that produced the Downing Street Minutes, Cindy Sheehan, Ray McGovern, Rev. Lennox Yearwood, Ann Wright, Debra Sweet, Dave Lindorff, David Swanson, Jodie Evans, Medea Benjamin, Kevin Zeese, and Tina Richards will lead a march to Chairman Conyers office and not leave until he agrees to begin impeachment proceedings.
If you cannot be there, you can take two minutes on Monday and do two things: phone Chairman Conyers at 202-225-5126 and ask him to start the impeachment of Dick Cheney; and phone your own Congress Member at 202-224-3121 and ask them to immediately call Conyers’ office to express their support for impeachment. Your Congress Member might be one of the three needed, not just to keep impeachment activists out of jail but to keep this nation from devolving into dictatorship.
Also email your Representatives:
http://www.democrats.com/peoplesemailnetwork/73
#####
Forward this message to everyone you know!
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:24 amNational Intel Director: Bush Admin. Manipulated Iraq Intel ‘Because They Didn’t Like The Answers’
Today, Meet the Press host Tim Russert previewed the relevant portion of the book:
Did he mention why he previewed this book ?
Are all it’s contents this non-explosive, non-surprising nor newsworthy?
Did Russert miss out previewing the good 20 odd books over the past 4 years that have each cycled the bestseller lists covering the same ground ?
Personally I’d like to see someone write a series of books about a boy studying to become a wizard. There seems to be a real lack of books about that in the market.
Or a book about JFK getting assassinated. Yeah, why did we never hear anything about that event in a book after the fact.
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:36 amHundreds of thousands of murdered innocents are waiting for Cheney, Rove & Co. to join them in the afterlife so they can dish out some payback.
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:13 pmI fear that all too many of our self-proclaimed masters will be around for years to come, but I sincerely hope that some of them stick around long enough to see the real patriots stand up and fight to take back this country. We will come for you all, and you will answer for your crimes; whether in this world or the next.
For those people who still believe that the ends justifies the means in relation to the wanton death and destruction of people who had nothing to do with attacking this country, who assume wrongly that America should be able to do what it wants, when it wants, and wherever it wants and that somebody had to pay for 9-11 and that these country of little brown skinned people who in their ignorance, going about their daily lives as we do, did not have anything to do with 9-11 but have been visited with daily horrors that we still don’t see because of censored TV, have been the scapegoats for the unconsciousable, that this nation has committed.
Somebody had to pay and these people were good as anybody else, right.
Now people who supported this immoral, illegal and tragic undertaking have “changed” their minds for reasons that have nothing to do with morality, namely it was a mis-managed war.
This alone is signs of a sociopathic mind that thinks that this country is entitled to do what it wants to anybody it declares a nusiance to us just steamrolling over somebody else’s culture, history and the way it conducts its business.
We went into these people’s country tore it up, have people fighting among themselves and now tell them they must clean up the mess we created. This sounds like somebody that manchild George Bush would say when once again others cleaned up his messes. To say that this is par for the course for this sociopath would be an understatement.
I hope that all those reading this who voted for that jackass, now realize the thousands of people who have perished through no fault of their own, and at the expense of people in this country who think that everybody should want to be like Americans and if they don’t, we’re going to force it down their throats — because after all we always know whats best.
July 23rd, 2007 at 1:54 pmI would love to share a new tool with your readers. BigString is a free email service that allows a user to easily send, recall, erase, self-destruct and modify an email after it has been sent. BigString users have unprecedented control over all of their email, whether they choose to send it through the BigString.com website or even Microsoft Outlook.
It is inevitable. At one point or another in your life, you’ve sent an email to a colleague, client, family member or significant other that’s been highly regrettable. Even before pressing send, you knew it was a bad idea, yet you rolled the dice and clicked anyway, only to cringe at what you wrote later on.
July 27th, 2007 at 2:57 pmtest
August 10th, 2007 at 9:51 am