Schakowsky On Iraq Visit: ‘Surge Is A Failure,’ Warns There Is ‘Major PR Effort Going On’
Schakowsky On Iraq Visit: ‘Surge Is A Failure,’ Warns There Is ‘Major PR Effort Going On’
Rep. Jan Schakowsky (D-IL) just returned from a visit to Iraq, a trip that she called a “PR tour” chaperoned by U.S. Embassy officials. In a conference call hosted by Americans Against Escalation In Iraq this afternoon, Schakowsky said plainly, “I believe overall the surge is a failure. Why’s that? Because the purpose was to reduce violence to create a safer environment, to create the space for political reconciliation. And Iraq is as far from that as it’s ever been. … It’s clear to me we cannot win someone else’s religious civil war.”
In addition to the lack of political progress, Schakowsky said that “the security situation in Baghdad is really bad.” As evidence of this, she noted, “You can’t go anywhere without being heavily guarded. To go a few miles from Baghdad to a training camp, we had to get into a Blackhawk helicopter. We had to put on our body armor and our helmets in order to get there.”
A member of the House Intelligence Committee, Schakowsky was one of six House members to visit Iraq. Her contingent spoke with Gen. David Petraeus and Ambassador Ryan Crocker. She said Petraeus told her “the U.S. would be in Iraq for 9-10 years if we want to win,” a comment he has made repeatedly. Listen to her remarks:
She warned that there is ongoing PR blitz from the White House and its conservative allies to build public support for a long-term occupation of Iraq:
It concerns me that they’re building up enthusiastically in much the same way that we led up to the vote and then the war in October 2002 and then March of 2003. It does worry me that some the media is buying in. [...]
What I feel is going on right now is that there’s a major PR effort going on to convince the Congress and the media and the public that just enough progress has been made to justify staying. A little more, and then maybe a little more, and a little more — perhaps to where Petraeus has said 9 or 10 years have elapsed. Calling for patience is not at this point going to work with the American people, and I’m hoping…are just too smart to be fooled again.
During one of the days she was in Iraq, Schakowsky said four soldiers were killed in the Diyala province, a British soldier was killed in Baghdad, 33 Iraqis were killed in Tal Afar in a residential neighborhood by a truck bomb, six street cleaners were killed by an IED in Baghdad, two people were killed on a minibus, and 17 bodies found killed by death squads.
“It’s so clear to me that our focus is on the wrong battlefield,” Schakowsky said. “And my experience in the region has convinced me more than ever that we must set a deadline to withdraw our troops from the religious and tribal civil war that’s going on in Iraq.”
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Of course we can't win a war that we're supply weapons to both sides, and stuck in the middle.. Divide and Conquer, then steal the oil was the plan all along.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:28 pmthere's been a major pr effort going on since 2002.
This war is immoral, financially ruinous and totally unconstitutional - and it's been that way since the day it started.
More troops, and more killing isn't going to change that.
The time to end this insane war is now.
Some further reading:
"Top-Ten Reasons to Get out of Iraq. Now!"
August 10th, 2007 at 6:29 pmhttp://www.populistamerica.com/top_ten_reasons_to_get_out_of_iraq_now
Iraq: Oil Tenders Next Month
Iraqi Oil Minister Hussain al-Shahristani said yesterday that the country hopes to offer tenders on certain oil fields as early as September for its oilfields, but this can happen only after the controversial oil law is passed.
Speaking in Moscow, he also dashed hopes that certain Russian oil companies would get preferential treatment, although said that Lukoil could have an advantage over other bidders because of its history in Iraq.
http://www.priceofoil.org/
August 10th, 2007 at 6:29 pmThe Moscow times
Iraqi Oil Minister Lays Out the Rules
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/stories/2007/08/10/001.html
August 10th, 2007 at 6:30 pmIraq hopes to offer oil tenders soon
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/breaking/2007/0809/breaking56.htm
August 10th, 2007 at 6:31 pmHe also said that all 27 producing fields in Iraq will be transferred to the national oil company, which will be free to decide whether it wants partners.
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/breaking/2007/0809/breaking56.htm
August 10th, 2007 at 6:33 pmHowever, Mr Shahristani said after the meeting the company could have an advantage over other bidders.
"Lukoil has done much in Iraq, has experience of working in our country, possesses vast data about Iraqi oil deposits. These temporary advantages raise the company's chances for winning free and transparent oil tenders," the minister said.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:34 pmShe said Petraeus told her “the U.S. would be in Iraq for 9-10 years if we want to win,â€
LETS HOPE BETRAYUS TELLS THE US PUBLIC THAT
August 10th, 2007 at 6:37 pmBetrayus is a bigger lair than CT, p or m12. Bush really went under the rocks to find this traitor.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:39 pmHe wouldn't be the first officer to piss on his men for another star.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:41 pm1 million dead in Iraq
http://www.craigmurray.co.uk/
August 10th, 2007 at 6:42 pm"She said Petraeus told her “the U.S. would be in Iraq for 9-10 years if we want to win,â€
August 10th, 2007 at 6:42 pmWe do.
Wow, Ms. Schakowsky better be watching her back.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:43 pmThey really don't like it when people tell the truth.
This admin. is liable to find a way for her to experience an unfortunate 'accident'.
Americans Against Escalation In Iraq
Is it me, or does this organization sound like it may be biased?
August 10th, 2007 at 6:43 pmYeah failure!
/ do I fit in now?
August 10th, 2007 at 6:44 pm“She said Petraeus told her “the U.S. would be in Iraq for 9-10 years if we want to win,â€
We do.
Comment by p — August 10, 2007 @ 6:42 pm
Actually that is one way to lose big time
August 10th, 2007 at 6:46 pmThe general [Petraeus] also highlighted progress in Anbar province, where former Sunni insurgents have turned against Al Qaeda extremists in recent months.
Cool!
August 10th, 2007 at 6:47 pm"To go a few miles from Baghdad to a training camp, we had to get into a Blackhawk helicopter. We had to put on our body armor and our helmets in order to get there.â€
-------------------------------------------------------------------
It's a freaking war you dumb (unt!
...of course if you'd rather walk without body armor and a helmet, be my guest.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:47 pmp, something tells me that when the average soldier in Iraq looks at this blog, sees the question of whether or not we want to be there for 9-10 years, and then sees your "We do" response, mordant chuckles ensue. No matter what you think, soldiers in Iraq don't appreciate tin-horn phony warmongers speaking for them, especially regarding the question of whether of not they should be stuck there for the next 10 years in 120 degree heat fighting for.... what, exactly?
August 10th, 2007 at 6:49 pm"It was pretty upbeat from his [Petraeus'] point of view,†Schakowsky said. “He said he wanted to be frank and honest. But still we would have to be there for some time -- for a long time.â€
Well, I'm glad that Petraeus is upbeat! The surge was a success!
Now the Iraqis need to get their sh!t together.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:49 pmComment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — August 10, 2007 @ 6:49 pm
Americans will be in Iraq for more than just 10 years.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:50 pmI see that the 101st Fighting Keyboarders are enthusiastically commiting our troops to another 10 years of fighting in Iraq. And, this is on a day in which the Fighting Keyboarders had absolutely nothing to say about Bush refusing to guarantee veterans their educational benefits. Gee, I'm sure the troops appreciate your "support."
August 10th, 2007 at 6:53 pmWe'll be fighting Islamists for decades - maybe a generation - and in the end we still may not succeed.
The US will survive but much of the rest of the world will not.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:53 pmWe do.
Comment by p
Then get your ass over there, chickenhawk.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:54 pmNext comes her Swift-boating, branding, and discrediting by the Neo-con spin machines!
August 10th, 2007 at 6:55 pmYEA? YOU READY FOR ANOTHER CIVIL WAR?
HERE IN AMERICA?
Comment by GoTFreeDUMB? — August 10, 2007 @ 6:52 pm
huh?
Why are asking such a stupid question. IslamoFascists are in America, but they do not make up enough of the population so as a war against them would be dubbed a "Civil War."
LOL
August 10th, 2007 at 6:56 pmChickenhawk chickenshit little Ms. p. Do you never tire of licking the smag off of Bush's dick?
You sycophants should really move to another country and get the f*ck out of mine.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:56 pmYou sycophants should really move to another country and get the f*ck out of mine.
Comment by nanlichi — August 10, 2007 @ 6:56 pm
I'm in America. I don't know where you live.
August 10th, 2007 at 6:57 pmSomebody once said "six months, tops"...Can you name that clown>?
August 10th, 2007 at 6:59 pmWe’ll be fighting Islamists for decades - maybe a generation - and in the end we still may not succeed.
The US will survive but much of the rest of the world will not.
Comment by Ringo
So I guess we will a need draft then. Should we have a draft, Ringo? 10 yrs is a long time to continue to lower recruiting standards. I can imagine after a while anybody who can reach a trigger would be eligible to join the service. Then after that, even if you can't reach the trigger, they will still allow you to enlist. After that, who knows.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:00 pm"blah blah blaaah"
- Comment by "p" ---
.... Exley? .... Bro? .... Is that you, Exley? ....
August 10th, 2007 at 7:00 pmSlow news day. TP has to cover PR efforts.
Hey TP, how about some real news from Iraq!!!
The Surge is a Success!!!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:00 pm[Mr.] p got owned big time in the Sali thread, so I'll part for the day on this comment.
It's funny that the Troll known as Mr. P/Ringo/Conservatron/etc. is so quick to support Bush's war when it could be it that gets called when the draft is called up. Don't mention how much treasure that'll cost over 10 years. Again. My father, the hard-core goldwater conservative, can no longer call himself a member of the Republican party. Not that he's gone democrat, mind you, but you've managed to take a reliable 'R' vote and turn it off entirely.
Great move there. 10 years, indeed.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:00 pmRingo: "We’ll be fighting Islamists for decades - maybe a generation..."
What great vision today's conservatives have for our country. No, if we wean ourselves from the oil addiction, get our military out of their countries and shore up our own domestic defenses, this will be all but over in far less than a generation. If 50% of the cars on our roads were plug-in hybrids, we wouldn't have to import one quart of middle east oil. Chevrolet, Toyota and Honda will have many plugin models on the market by 2010.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:00 pmI’m in America. I don’t know where you live.
I thought you wanted to win? Can't win from over here, coward. Load up and ship out, chickenhawk.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:01 pmSo I guess we will a need draft then. Should we have a draft, Ringo?
Comment by Tom
--------------------------------------------------------
Not yet.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:01 pm"It does worry me that some the media is buying in."
When the media reports the efforts are working, they're buying in.
When the media reports bad news from Iraq they are objective.
Isn't it the same media?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:01 pmHow soon will it be before right wing goon Michelle Malkin launches a Swift Boat attack on Schakowsky?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:02 pmTroll alert.
p sounds a lot like P.
Ignore and proceed.
Now they want to give favorable treatment to Russian energy companies. The neocons who cooked up this mess cannot be happy about that. No wonder they want to bomb Iran.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:02 pmI thought you wanted to win? Can’t win from over here, coward. Load up and ship out, chickenhawk.
Comment by Seitz — August 10, 2007 @ 7:01 pm
I thought you wanted to lose? Can't lose from over here, coward. Load up and ship out, hawkchicken.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:02 pmYea, we stay in Iraq for 30 years and more (1 generation being 15 years x2) so that we would become similar to the former Soviet Union. What we are doing to the Iraqis is what the former Soviet Union did to Eastern Europe, which is to impose its communist ideology by military might.
We imposed our ideology (democracy) by military might in Iraq.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:02 pmYeah failure!
/ do I fit in now?
Comment by Ringo — August 10, 2007 @ 6:44 pm
Maybe you shouldn't start fights you can't win.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:02 pmthe Fighting Keyboarders had absolutely nothing to say about Bush refusing to guarantee veterans their educational benefits. Gee, I’m sure the troops appreciate your “support.â€
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — August 10, 2007 @ 6:53 pm
good form! ... such a pleasure to read your posts...
August 10th, 2007 at 7:03 pmso glad to have you around...
...
p sounds a lot like P.
---
No!!!!
Get outta town!!!
Ya don't say!?!?!?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:03 pmBetrayus is a bigger lair than CT, p or m12. Bush really went under the rocks to find this traitor.
Comment by ronjazz — August 10, 2007 @ 6:39 pm
That is a-b-s-o-l-u-t-e-l-y not true. I couldn't lair more than General Betrayus. Lairing on a regular basis, nobody could do that better than I. So stop passing lairs!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:04 pm... so... what are the Dems doing about the situation in Iraq? Bowing to the Toy Emperor?
Come on, Dems! DO SOMETHING!!!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:04 pmI live in the 80% of America who would rather see Bush with a 100 grain broadhead through his guts, than lose our finest soldiers to his War of choice.
The other 20% dumbf*cks who would rather support a pitiful man's ego than support our soldiers live in some country other than a true America.
Go f*ck yourself little p.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:04 pmHow idiots like "p" can continue to support the failed policies of this failed administration is beyond me.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:04 pmA legislator warns that the surge is a failure and that there will be a PR campaign to convince the gullable among us that this is not the case. On cue, the gullable Bush cultist types, "The Surge is a success!!!!"
This would be comedy if it were not so tragic.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:05 pmComment by p — August 10, 2007 @ 7:02 pm
Good point, p.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:05 pmThe neo-cons are a bunch of war junkies whose mantra now is "One more fix will do the trick".
Just one more fix, Lord might do the trick
August 10th, 2007 at 7:05 pmOne hell of a price for you to get your kicks
Ooooh that smell
Can't you smell that smell
Ooooh that smell
The smell of death surrounds you
Ooooh that smell
Can't you smell that smell
Ooooh that smell
The smell of death surrounds you
I don't know if drafting or enlisting these keyboard kommandos is such a good idea.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:05 pmI wouldn't want any of their whiny asses in a foxhole near mine.
I'd be deathly afraid that in their sheer panic they'd forget the safety was off, they were locked and loaded and their weapon would accidently discharge as they ran screaming away from the fight.
…. Exley? …. Bro? …. Is that you, Exley? ….
Comment by beavis — August 10, 2007 @ 7:00 pm
oh lord no... that is not exley... you really wonder?
but i am surprised he is not here to defend his "honor"...
...
there, i just did...
August 10th, 2007 at 7:06 pm.
#26, Seitz- Thanks, that's just what I was thinking!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:06 pmWhen the media reports the efforts are working, they’re buying in.
When the media reports bad news from Iraq they are objective.
Isn’t it the same media?
Comment by paul — August 10, 2007 @ 7:01 pm
Well paul, hate to break it to you, but things aren't working over there. When you have to change the rules like not counting deaths from car bombs to make the causality count lower, you're not winning. when more and more innocent people are dying, and thus creating more insurgents, you're not winning. When the Iraqi people want to control their oil, but the USA doesn't want them to, you're not winning.
When you have to ignore the body counts, and have third parties make those counts, you're not winning..
Next!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:07 pm“She said Petraeus told her “the U.S. would be in Iraq for 9-10 years if we want to winâ€
Win what?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:07 pmNow here is the name of one of our troops I know you liberals love and adore!
"Pvt. Scott Thomas Beauchamp"
August 10th, 2007 at 7:07 pmHoward Dean has looked at a videotape of the Republican Party and has determined that they are suffering from a mass induced psychosis.
Senator Jim Bunning(R-KY) explains the GOP's symptoms.
-GSD
August 10th, 2007 at 7:07 pmThanks, Katy! Keep up the good work yourself!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:08 pmComment by CT_Version 2 — August 10, 2007 @ 7:05 pm
Thanks, CT.
I can't stand all of these hawkchickens (you know... the Laptop Taliban) screaming and whining about how they want the US to lose.
Meanwhile, they stay safe behind their laptops and PC's.
You should have seen the video of the DailyKooze... it was a hawkchicken swarm, the likes I have never seen!!!
Most of the big-shot Dem hawchickens were there!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:09 pmThey haven't signed over their oil yet. Cheney won't let us go...well, perhaps we can go into Iran to try to get their oil, too.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:09 pmI don’t know if drafting or enlisting these keyboard kommandos is such a good idea.
I wouldn’t want any of their whiny asses in a foxhole near mine.
I’d be deathly afraid that in their sheer panic they’d forget the safety was off, they were locked and loaded and their weapon would accidently discharge as they ran screaming away from the fight.
Comment by Bush's Legacy — August 10, 2007 @ 7:05 pm
They'd go AWOL (like their hero) before boot camp is over.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:10 pmFrom an article published on Aug 3rd, 2007 titled "No progress yet on Mideast agend" we read...
...The Bush administration has little credibility in the Arab world after it largely ignored the Israeli-Palestinian conflict; backed Israel's failed war against Islamic militant in Lebanon; shunned the Islamic winners of Palestinian elections; refused to engage with Syria and launched a preemptive war against Iraq...
Some officials from countries, who privately have raged at Bush's policies and even questioned his trustworthiness, seemed to be counting the months until a successor takes office...
Since the Dems have done nothing to contain the Boy King, it seems that we're all relegated to waiting until a successor takes office.
This sucks! All talk and no real action against King George and his Thugs. Sh*t!!!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:11 pmInconvenient Data Adjustment
So, apparently a lot of the data people used to "prove" global warming is complete crap. I already knew the "science" based on the data was crap, but apparently the data used for it was wrong even on their own crap standards. So, 1934 was the warmest year for the past century... however it is someone determines the average temperature for a year.
But don't let that stop us from panicking and overthrowing our economies
August 10th, 2007 at 7:12 pm"They’d go AWOL (like their hero) before boot camp is over.
Comment by funky p — August 10, 2007"
Who went AWOL?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:12 pmYou all should be proud and happy that surge worked so well.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:12 pmCould "p" stand for Patrick? I haven't seen Patrick-stupidest-troll-ever lately, and this "p" guy is obviously dumber than a rock.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:12 pmThe Colonel gets it. Worthy of a re-post:
No, if we wean ourselves from the oil addiction, get our military out of their countries and shore up our own domestic defenses, this will be all but over in far less than a generation.
The ONLY solution to this problem is ending the oil dependency that is the root cause. Fix that, and ME conflict (involving us) will quickly die away. The only other reason for conflict flows from the End Times dreams of christo-fanatics.
Bad idea: putting the country in the charge of christo-fanatic oil tycoons.
Duh!
Let's, pretty please, have a REAL strategy.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:13 pm...how they want the US to lose.
Lefties want the US to win. We are, however, skeptical of the claim that America can win the hearts and minds of the Middle East by killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. Tell us again how that works?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:13 pm"Is michael — A RIGHTWING RETHUGLIGOON TROLL????
Comment by GoTFreeDUMB? — August 10, 2007"
Are you responding to a question?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:13 pmPretty funny, hawkchickens, especially coming from a pansy like p. When we're finished burying the GOP, maybe we can take to the streets and kick p's buggered ass for a while, if we can catch him as he runs crying down the stairs to mumsy. enlist, coward, or you're nothing but hot air and treason.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:13 pmHEY FRANK J, DID YOU SEE YOUR COMMENT IN THE NYDAILYNEWS.COM ARTICLE!!!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:13 pm"this “p†guy is obviously dumber than a rock.
Comment by VerbalKint — August 10, 2007"
Why? What did they say that is dumb?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:14 pmgee, a democrat saying the surge is a failure- why is this news- its predictable
August 10th, 2007 at 7:15 pm"by killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. Tell us again how that works?
Comment by Arthur C. — August 10, 2007"
Where did you get that figure? From Michael Moore? That figure isn't even clos!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:15 pmfrank j is worried that saving the world will overthrow our economy, as if Bushco hadn't already destroyed it for all but the very rich. How's that Dow today, trolls?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:15 pmTrolls are not even amusing anymore. What a big yawn.
I just have to scroll down and scroll down in order to find decent comments.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:16 pmWhat great vision today’s conservatives have for our country. No, if we wean ourselves from the oil addiction, get our military out of their countries and shore up our own domestic defenses, this will be all but over in far less than a generation.
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper
The Colonel is wise - and correct. The proper path would be for us to understand that OIL is the reason this has all happened. if we took the investment in killing innocent civilians - and our brave soldiers - then we would have the resources to utilize another energy source. The whole world will run out of oil in less the 100 yrs (some say a lot less than that). It seems silly, and criminal, to continue to fight and die for a resource which by its nature is finite. It will be all gone. then what do we fight about?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:17 pmthis “p†guy is obviously dumber than a rock...
This "p guy" is the same fool who once argued that Saudis aren't Muslims (actually, it's where Islam was born), and cited a fatwa by Osama bin Laden as his "proof."
August 10th, 2007 at 7:17 pm"Ann Coulter Went AWOL !DMBFUK!
Comment by GoTFreeDUMB? — August 10, 2007"
Oh! I thought you might have been stupid enough to refer to our great leader!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:17 pm#68 Wrong thread, Frank. Wrong century, too, if you think you are going to get anywhere with your global warming denial theology. The scientific community has reached a consensus on global warming so strong that to reject it is to reject science as a whole. Is that where you want to stand, Frank? Are you also a young earth creationist? Do you also reject evolution theory, the central plank of biology? Are you waiting for the rapture? Or are you just a liar, like the tobacco industry lobbyists who say that smoking doesn't cause lung cancer?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:17 pmNow here is the name of one of our troops I know you liberals love and adore!
“Pvt. Scott Thomas Beauchampâ€
Comment by michael — August 10, 2007 @ 7:07 pm
---------
heh.
You're right about that, Michael.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:17 pmThe truth is simple. You cannot win an occupation without complete subjugation of the people in the country you are occupying. Why should we occupy a country for 9-10 years bankrupting this country. Frankly, I would rather take my chances with the terrorists who are going to follow our troops home. We have no right to occupy Iraq. We have no right to try to steal their oil. We have no right to destroy their country.
We are wrong and it's time that we leave so that Iraq can make it's country whole again.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:17 pm"I just have to scroll down and scroll down in order to find decent comments.
Comment by Juan C — August 10, 2007"
When you find one written by a liberal, can you point it out to the rest of us?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:18 pmThe whole world will run out of oil in less the 100 yrs (some say a lot less than that).
Comment by Tom — August 10, 2007 @ 7:17 pm
---
How do you know?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:18 pmmichael, read comment #84 in answer to your question in #78.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:20 pmNow here is the name of one of our troops I know those wingnuts love and adore: Right-wing Porn Marine Matt Sanchez!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:20 pmmichael is never right about anything, he's just a koolaid-drinking cowardly liar, like p.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:20 pmYou cannot win an occupation without complete subjugation of the people in the country you are occupying.
Comment by bilbobaggins — August 10, 2007 @ 7:17 pm
We don't want to occupy Iraq, we want them to pull themselves up, and become contributing members of the international community.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:20 pmtest
August 10th, 2007 at 7:21 pm"he’s just a koolaid-drinking cowardly liar, like p.
Comment by ronjazz — August 10, 2007 "
Boy, I guess you told me!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:21 pmSomething to think about ...
(courtesy of blogger "markfromireland")
"Mindful of the political fallout from a rising American death toll in Iraq, the U.S. military has pulled back from widespread use of aggressive tactics on the ground this summer, helping to explain a modest reduction in the number of soldiers killed in July, according to intelligence and military sources.
The number of U.S. military fatalities declined to 80 in July after three months of a death toll in the triple digits (104 in April, 126 in May, and 101 in June). The lower death toll has been cited by some U.S. commanders in Iraq and Bush administration supporters in Washington as a sign that President George W. Bush’s “surge†of U.S. troops is working.
But the sources told me that the lower death toll reflects not some impending victory but just a slowdown in the U.S. ground offensive after the early phases of the surge, which poured more than 20,000 additional troops into Iraq. The sources cited a variety of factors contributing to the decline in U.S. casualties.
One U.S. military source said the American troops have not pushed as far from their forward operating bases as the U.S. news media has been led to believe. When Bush unveiled the surge, a key goal was to get American forces out of their secure bases and into small police outposts in Iraqi neighborhoods."
---
So one positive achievement of the "surge" (lower U.S. combat casualties) may have actually achieved by not "surging" ...
Well, ... how 'bout that ...
August 10th, 2007 at 7:21 pmmichael is never right about anything, he’s just a koolaid-drinking cowardly liar, like p.
Comment by ronjazz — August 10, 2007 @ 7:20 pm
----------------
We're not the ones hoping for America to fail.
YOU ARE!!!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:22 pmThe Iragis will not agree to the oil provisions set up by the US and the oil companies.
That's one subject all of the Iragis come together on.
They want us out, and they will deal with Al Qaeda themselves.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:23 pm#
test
Comment by p — August 10, 2007 @ 7:21 pm
Fail
August 10th, 2007 at 7:23 pmTP, it would be nice if you nulled these posts:
Comment by nanlichi — August 10, 2007 @ 7:04 pm
Comment by GoTFreeDUMB? — August 10, 2007 @ 7:08 pm
Both threaten the President. Null this one as well, please.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:23 pm"or are you not old enough yet to Join the Mil?
Comment by GoTFreeDUMB? — August 10, 2007"
5 years in the U.S. Navy, you?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:23 pmWho went AWOL?
Comment by michael — August 10, 2007 @ 7:12 pm
GW Bush...he was too busy politickin' to show up for duty, for over a year.
He also was banned from flying for refusing to take a physical (why he went AWOL)
You are obviously part of the PR campaign to label the 'surge' a success.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:23 pmNot.
Well, … how ’bout that …
Comment by beavis — August 10, 2007 @ 7:21 pm
------
But it is still a sign of improvement!!!
Or don't you agree?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:24 pmThe whole world will run out of oil in less the 100 yrs (some say a lot less than that).
Comment by Tom — August 10, 2007 @ 7:17 pm
—
How do you know?
Comment by p
Geez p. Because I pay attention and don't spend lots of time looking up Limbaughs skirt. Ya know: Read a book!. I read your posts and they are rather childish and just troublesome. The entire world of geophysicists have declared the oil reserves declining rapidly. These folks are smarter than you and I when it comes to this stuff. Also start getting used to the phrase Peak Oil. It was first described in the early-mid seventies and the Dr. who described it has been proven correct. Again, another very smart man. You make yourself appear foolish when you write what you write. maybe it's not your fault. I don't know and I don't care.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:25 pm79: gee, a republic believing more hype from bush and company. About that bridge in Brooklyn . . .
August 10th, 2007 at 7:25 pm"he was too busy politickin’ to show up for duty, for over a year.
Comment by funky p — August 10, 2007"
Where does it say that other than dumb liberal blogs?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:26 pmGreat Question for the Next Democratic Presidential Primary Debate
"What's more patriotic: serving in the military or protesting the war?"
August 10th, 2007 at 7:26 pmOnce the Iraqis pull themselves up by their bootstraps and sign over their oil rights to Halliburton, this war will be a success.
-GSD
August 10th, 2007 at 7:26 pmComment by Tom — August 10, 2007 @ 7:25 pm
You learned it from Al Goracle's movie!!!
Just as I thought!!!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:27 pmOnce the Iraqis pull themselves up by their bootstraps and sign over their oil rights to Halliburton, this war will be a success.
-GSD
Comment by GSD
-------------------------------------------------
Haliburton is not an oil company.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:27 pmGoTFreeDUMB, I'm waiting for your answer?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:27 pmComment by Tom — August 10, 2007 @ 7:25 pm
You learned it from Al Goracle’s movie!!!
Just as I thought!!!
Comment by p
And still again you display your ignorance to the world. Have a nice life.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:28 pmHave a nice life.
Comment by Tom — August 10, 2007 @ 7:28 pm
Thanks, I will. You too.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:29 pmGreat Question for the Next Republic Presidential Primary Debate
“Did any other President lose two wars?â€
August 10th, 2007 at 7:29 pm"Once the Iraqis pull themselves up by their bootstraps and sign over their oil rights to Halliburton, this war will be a success.
Comment by GSD — August 10, 2007"
And you are stupid enough to believe that?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:29 pmI appreciate her comments, but I didn't need her to tell me there was a MASSIVE PR CAMPAIGN from the White House to push extending the war and even escalating it.
I can see it on every news channel, and all over the internet. Yahoo keeps reposting the Ohanlon\Pollack story like its new news.
But its not. Its old news.
And its already been discredited.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:29 pm"“Did any other President lose two wars?â€
Comment by Arthur C. — August 10, 2007"
We lost this war?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:29 pm“What’s more patriotic: serving in the military or protesting the war?†- frank j
Yes.
Next question?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:30 pm109 Question for the next Republic debate: What's more patriotic: Blindly following an incompetent neocon policy or stripping citizens of their Fourth Amendment rights?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:31 pmWe’re not the ones hoping for America to fail.
Comment by p — August 10, 2007 @ 7:22 pm
You keep saying this. Where is your proof that anyone here wants America to fail? It should be easy to prove. Please cite comments by number in this or any other TP thread that indicate someone posting here wants America to fail.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:31 pmAgain, the warmongering Bush cultists are showing up here to argue that our soldiers need to spend another 10 years in hell, but none of them had anthing to say on a thread about how Bush wouldn't support educational opportunities for veterans.
And, Michael, in the late 60's and early 70's, the technical definition the military used to define AWOL was out of contact with commanding officers for 30 days or more. There is no record of Bush being in contact with ANY commanding officer for a period of 4 to 6 months during his time of active duty. So, on evidence, yes, it does look like Bush was AWOL.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:33 pmComment by p — August 10, 2007 @ 7:09 pm
Excellent account. The anti-American, "anti-war" crowd is nestled and comforted. They tout failure, while not having to endure the pain of losing to proven enemies. Keep toutin', lefties.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:33 pmWe lost this war?
No doubt about it. It was unwinnable from the get-go. It was 100% predictable that the central government would collapse in the wake of a US invasion; and that, in the absence of a strong central government, Iraq would degenerate into economic chaos and secular violence. Bush and his minions, in their infinite ignorance, chose to ignore those warnings.
Rightwingers can't win wars: they don't have what it takes: regular contact with reality.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:34 pmBetter question:
What is more patriotic, signing up to serve in the military for a war for oil you support or putting a yellow ribbon magnet on your gas guzzling SUV?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:35 pmCT: Another example of illiterate republic mixed metaphors: Learn English, punk.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:35 pmSeriously, "Keep toutin" - you from the town of Bumfuk?
"We’re not the ones hoping for America to fail. - p
"You keep saying this." - VerbalKint
It's called a strawman. He will post something better when he stops molesting neighborhood children.
I think about 75% of the outrageous posts are not from real conservatives, but just monkeys playing games. They are people with nothing better to do and no ethical compass.
Certainly none of the conservatives that I know (and I know plenty) are as insane as these people pretend to be.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:36 pmZero republican I know are insane like these people either.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:37 pm#105
"p"
???????????
WTF !!!!!!
You're joking, right?
An NFL running back who misses less game time to injuries while carrying the ball at the same rate as before is considered to be MORE DURABLE.
An NFL running back who suffers fewer injuries because he doesn't play as much is an ENTIRELY different situation. You cannot look at his reduced injury rate and say he is "more durable" if he isn't playing as much.
Apologies to non-NFL / football in general fans.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:38 pmIf Thomas Jefferson thought American liberty was such a great idea, why didn't he serve in the military?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:39 pmZero republican I know are insane like these people either.
Ditto. The Republicans I know are totally disgusted with Bush.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:39 pmOn comment # 112, know it all troll says ''Halliburton is not an oil company".
Let's go to the computer and check that pompous, ill conceived comment.
Halliburton drilling services.
-GSD
The Bush supporters just lie when they feel like it.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:40 pm“We’re not the ones hoping for America to fail. - p
“You keep saying this.†- VerbalKint
It’s called a strawman.
--------
No, it true.
I have read countless posts saying "End this illegal occupation!" or "Bush is war criminal" when, in fact, we are not in Iraq to "occupy" as YOU would have people believe. America is helping Iraq pull itself together. Bush is any thing but a "war criminal" he is an American Hero and True Patriot!!!
By posting lies about the country, and wishing harm on the President, you are, in fact, displaying your hopes that America does not succeed.
Hence, you hope that America fails.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:41 pmZero republican I know are insane like these people either.
Comment by Spudge_Boy
--------------------------------------------------------
Most of the Democrats that I know are nice people - unhappy, but nice.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:41 pmComment by beavis — August 10, 2007 @ 7:38 pm
So you are saying that you think that less American deaths is bad!!!
Why do you want America to fail?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:42 pmEver notice that the trolls all served in either the Air Force or Navy? The two branches of the service where people don't get shot at.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:42 pmDitto.
Comment by Arthur C. — August 10, 2007 @ 7:39 pm
------
Typical Lefty Comment!
heYoo!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:43 pm!!+-+!!
"If Thomas Jefferson thought American liberty was such a great idea, why didn’t he serve in the military?" - Frank J
If Thomas Jefferson thought women were valuable human beings, why didn't he castrate himself and wear a dress?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:44 pmFrank: "What’s more patriotic: serving in the military or protesting the war?"
That depends on the war, Frank. How about this for a question to repubs: What's more patriotic - to support a war and join up or to support a war and not join up?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:44 pmInconvenient Data Adjustment
So, apparently a lot of the data people used to “prove†global warming is complete crap. I already knew the “science†based on the data was crap, but apparently the data used for it was wrong even on their own crap standards. So, 1934 was the warmest year for the past century… however it is someone determines the average temperature for a year.
But don’t let that stop us from panicking and overthrowing our economies
Comment by Frank J — August 10, 2007 @ 7:12 pm
-------------
Thanks, Frank J.
When TP posts a thread like this on a slow news day like today, I guess it is ok to treat it like an open thread.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:45 pmIf Thomas Jefferson thought American liberty was such a great idea, why didn’t he serve in the military?
Comment by Frank J
Because he foresaw that Chickenhawk cowards like AWOL Bush the WAR CRIMINAL and you and the young Rapetards would need an EXCUSE why YOU aren't DYING for the LIES of Bush, your hero...
Instead, REAL, non-traitor Americans are DYING for his TREASON...
August 10th, 2007 at 7:46 pmTP (Troll Patrol)
Rupert is proud of what has become of TP, so I say congratulations to Mr. Dog, P, pp, ppp, Mr. P. PPB, CT, and all the other 29%er's for your successful takeover of this site, you have proven that the right still has the fight to take it to the enemy. (sarcasm off)
August 10th, 2007 at 7:47 pmEver notice that the trolls all served in either the Air Force or Navy? The two branches of the service where people don’t get shot at.
Comment by Spudge_Boy
Be careful there! I was in the Air Force in Vietnam and was wounded as a member of ARRS (Air Sea Rescue). Just saying.
And I am not A repug!!
August 10th, 2007 at 7:47 pmDamn, we all responded to Frank J, prolific commentor here at TP.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:47 pmDitto. The Republicans I know are totally disgusted with Bush.
Typical Lefty Comment!
Well, it's the truth. Sorry if it displeases you anti-reality wingnuts. The Republicans I talk to say Bush is incompetent, and blame him for lying to them to trick them into suypporting his endledss, insanely costly invasion, and for ruining the future of their party.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:47 pmComment by Spudge_Boy — August 10, 2007 @ 7:42 pm
Ships do go to battle and planes do get downed. There's certainly a death risk; it's not a comfort zone.
You've served our country...shouldn't you know this?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:48 pmHey, Spudge_Boy.
If you haven't noticed, a bunch of us (Zooey, BnF, TMM, JPark just last night) have decided that the trolls own TP and we should go elsewhere.
I definately want to extend the invitation to you.
Any sites you think would be welcoming?
If you still have my email address, send your response there.
If not, I still (I believe) have yours and can write you.
:)
Have a good night.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:48 pmZero republican I know are insane like these people either.
The Republicans that I know are not Bush cultists. Most of them no longer call themselves Republican, because they are so embarrassed by what the party has become. This is why the party is shrinking, and why it appears to be getting more fascist every day: the sane, moderate centrists are fleeing the party.
Those few Republicans I know who continue to support the party do it with considerable discomfort, and with some degree of denial and self-delusion. This usually takes the form of equivalencing, namely arguing that whatever Bush and the GOP do, the Democrats would have done worse. This absurd hypothetical is getting harder by the day for party defenders to swallow, however.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:49 pmComment by trueblue — August 10, 2007 @ 7:48 pm
Zo zo was here earlier today.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:49 pmI have served and it is exactly why I know this.
upside00,
Things have changed since Vietnam.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:50 pmTP (Troll Patrol)
Rupert is proud of what has become of TP, so I say congratulations to Mr. Dog, P, pp, ppp, Mr. P. PPB, CT, and all the other 29%er’s for your successful takeover of this site, you have proven that the right still has the fight to take it to the enemy. (sarcasm off)
Comment by I'm Out
I hear you.
Like I said to Spudge_Boy, most of us are outta here.
Care to join us?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:51 pmtrueblue,
I do have your e-mail. I will drop you a line so we can triangulate on a better position. Think Progress has allowed their site to be over run by trolls.
I would love to have some real republicans we could debate with, instead of these children.
Talk to you soon.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:52 pmi just started reading the comments, attempting to cut to the chase. instead, there's taunting crap from those like "Ringo". must be Lorne Greene's saddlemate. anyway... can we ignore those types with no life and playing with themselves online? this news was an inspiring bit of cut-the-crap, which we should demand of our representatives.
thank you.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:52 pmAnd, yup, Bush IS a WAR CRIMINAL.
And a TRAITOR coxucker PUNK to the USA of the WORST kind, like Libby.
And a BLASPHEMER and MURDERER who does NOT follow the Word of Jesus Christ, his "favorite philosopher".
His ACTIONS have spoken VOLUMES LOUDER than his forked-tongue WORDS...
August 10th, 2007 at 7:53 pm#136 Next time, idiot, try providing something resembling proof.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:53 pmTypical, when the Lefties lose, they run away crying foul...
August 10th, 2007 at 7:53 pm"No, it true." - p brain
Let's assume you aren't joking.
What you are saying is: because we disagree with your premise about Iraq, therefore we hope that America fails.
That's like saying "Worship Allah, or you will burn in hell". The conclusion does not follow from the premise. A logical leap, without external validity, is required.
Your proposition makes no sense logically.
Again, assuming you're serious, I don't think you want America to fail. Rather, I think you are just badly confused about reality. Your assumption that "we" want America to fail is crazy, and/or intended only to inflame.
Crack open the brain seal, and you might be able to grok the notion that we want America to succeed and believe that success impossible following the current political path. That's a very different thing from "wanting America to fail".
Listening? ** crickets **
August 10th, 2007 at 7:53 pmWe don’t want to occupy Iraq.........
We ARE occupying Iraq pee brain........oh and we DID win. We won the Iraqi's the right to have a hellacious religious civil war. Isn't Halliburton an OIL services company?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:54 pmSure, the bush cultists are taking over this thread. Funny, but when the subject was Bush not supporting educational benefits for veterans, none of them showed up.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:54 pmHey, Spudge_Boy.
If you haven’t noticed, a bunch of us (Zooey, BnF, TMM, JPark just last night) have decided that the trolls own TP and we should go elsewhere.
Comment by trueblue
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ahh....Mission accomplished!
Mr. Rove should provide me with a big bonu$ after I email him this thread.
'nite crazies.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:54 pm#136 Next time, idiot, try providing something resembling proof.
Comment by VerbalKint — August 10, 2007 @ 7:53 pm
ok.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:54 pm
Then why do you feel the need to come onto this blog and act like an a$$hole?
Oh never mind. I don't give a flying fu*k what you think.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:54 pmI LOVE America and WANT it to SUCCEED.
And George W. Bush is a TRAITOR who needs to DROP DEAD and go to hell, where he belongs...
For the record...
August 10th, 2007 at 7:55 pmWe know you aren't going anywhere you crazy fu*k.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:56 pmDont mind if I do Trublue. BTW I'm still Tired Of Fighting. Regardless of the censoring by TP.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:56 pmComment by trueblue — August 10, 2007 @ 7:51 pm
Could I be the troll representative in your new chat house? You know, just to be representin'.
August 10th, 2007 at 7:56 pm#138
"p"
In my own words ... (from #98)
... So one *** positive achievement *** of the “surge†*** (lower U.S. combat casualties) *** ...
Now - "p" - take your bullsh#t - put it in your bowl, and eat it.
When you are done - read the advice that the military had for this administraion prior to the war.
------
Conclusion #6 From the U.S. Army War College Feb. 2003 Report
"An exit strategy will require the establishment of political stability, which will be difficult to achieve given:
Iraq's fragmented population
Weak political institutions
and
Propensity for rule by violence.
----------
Wars are difficult, if not impossible, to win when good strategic advice is ignored. It leads to failure.
Bush ignored this good advice and a lot more like it.
Why did Bush - by ignoring sound military advice - want America to fail?
Why?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:56 pmBreaking News:
GOPervert from Indiana blows a sleeping fellow Republican.
His defense is the party is trying new forms of voter outreach.
-GSD
August 10th, 2007 at 7:59 pmDont mind if I do Trublue. BTW I’m still Tired Of Fighting. Regardless of the censoring by TP.
Comment by I'm Out
OK, great.
Looks like I'm going to have to post my email address.
UGH! ;)
I have a spam blocker, so forget trying to email me, all you nasty trolls.
I'm out, may I ask your real screen name?
August 10th, 2007 at 7:59 pm"If you haven’t noticed, a bunch of us (Zooey, BnF, TMM, JPark just last night) have decided that the trolls own TP and we should go elsewhere.
I definately want to extend the invitation to you." - trueblue
Hey, don't leave me here all alone!!!
Post where you're going...
August 10th, 2007 at 7:59 pmA logical leap, without external validity, is required.
I'm a Quinean/Humean Empiricist. That leap is required for every instance of logical deduction. However, it is not possible to validate an instance of deduction with another instance of deduction, so the validation that is required can never be provided.
That's why you have to have faith!
August 10th, 2007 at 8:00 pmIt was Tired OF Fighting
August 10th, 2007 at 8:01 pmComment by Spudge_Boy — August 10, 2007 @ 7:54 pm
There are certainly troops who've died in Iraq while serving in the Navy/Air Force. And a number of Air Force/Navy personell have been directed to serve on the ground, have they not? Multi-tasking?
August 10th, 2007 at 8:01 pm#136 Next time, idiot, try providing something resembling proof.
Comment by VerbalKint — August 10, 2007 @ 7:53 pm
ok.
And, yup, Bush IS a WAR CRIMINAL.
And a TRAITOR coxucker PUNK to the USA of the WORST kind, like Libby.
And a BLASPHEMER and MURDERER who does NOT follow the Word of Jesus Christ, his “favorite philosopherâ€.
His ACTIONS have spoken VOLUMES LOUDER than his forked-tongue WORDS…
Comment by Arn Gunnutes — August 10, 2007 @ 7:53 pm
Comment by p
Yeah, the TRUTH hurts you RIGHTWING NUTJOBS.
That's why TRAITOR Bush has to be SHELTERED from the TRUTH that he is the most REVILED and DESPISED "human being" in the WORLD,
and the crowds have to sign LOYALTY OATHS before being admitted.
The PROOF is EASY:
Clinton can go ANYWHERE in the world and the people LOVE him and want to BE with him.
Bush can't go ANYWHERE without an ARMORED CONTINGENT.
Because the WORLD knows he is a SCUMBAG and a MURDERER.
REAL PROOF!!
August 10th, 2007 at 8:02 pmwe DID win - flo B
-
Well, partially, but there is still more to be done.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:03 pmWe’ll be fighting Islamists for decades - maybe a generation - and in the end we still may not succeed.
The US will survive but much of the rest of the world will not.
Aw, you're so beautiful when you salivate.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:05 pmGeez... the Dems want to escape from reality so much that they are starting a secret club!!!
Too Funny!!!
CT, they'll be back. I promise you that!
August 10th, 2007 at 8:05 pmgorn, tired of fighting,
My email is cforrest@capecod.net
Put trueblue in the subject.
It WILL be spammed, but I'll check them and let you 2 through. Don't bother filling out the form that will be sent to you.
Trolls, don't even think about it. I won't let you through.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:06 pmYou are pretty far removed from reality yourself, "p" ...
August 10th, 2007 at 8:07 pmCT, they’ll be back. I promise you that! -- Comment by p
You're talking to yourself, like a street-corner loonie off his meds.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:08 pmCT, they’ll be back. I promise you that!
Comment by p — August 10, 2007 @ 8:05 pm
Yet, you'll remain as stupid, ill informed, homophobic and hateful. You can promise that as well!
August 10th, 2007 at 8:09 pmYou’re talking to yourself, like a street-corner loonie off his meds.
Comment by Arthur C. — August 10, 2007 @ 8:08 pm
It's all of the mood altering self medication required to cope with being in the closet. Poor little thing. Next thing you'll know he'll wind up on the news like Glenn Murphy...
August 10th, 2007 at 8:09 pmWell, partially, but there is still more to be done.
Yes, vast areas of the globe still able to support life and a few remaining obstacles before the U.S. is a full-fledged authoritarian police state. No rest for the weary.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:09 pmI think about 75% of the outrageous posts are not from real conservatives, but just monkeys playing games.[...]
Comment by gorn by any other name — August 10, 2007 @ 7:36 pm
and spudgeboy...
i agree... i'd bet most of the comments are right from a script...
the usual talking points... a little ad lib, a little improv...
but the ONLY objective is to derail, hijack and polute the thread,
change the subject...
but you all know that...
August 10th, 2007 at 8:10 pm...
Comment by p — August 10, 2007 @ 8:05 pm
All they've been doing is feeling sorry for themselves since the "trolls" have been outing them, going on delirious, concerned rants and crying over their keyboards. The victim card is played, as usual. It gets annoying, but yes, it's still funny as hell.
Self destruction of the surrender monkeys, at last.
Excellent work, Mr. P.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:11 pmSince Republicans can't lead, can't govern, and can't prosecute a war. They do the only thing they are capable of. Stand in the corner, and whine about all of the people pointing out their lack of capabilities.
The republicans have destroyed and starved american infrastructure since Ronnie RayGun. Oh no, we can't tax, who cares if the bridges fall down, the schools fail, and we eat poison uninspected food?
The lunatic proposition, is why would anyone believe Republicans could deliver infrastructure to a hostile country? They can't even deliver it to their own constituents! Greedy, cheap, losers!
August 10th, 2007 at 8:12 pmha! i just notice something...
August 10th, 2007 at 8:12 pmthe thread border is color matched to her jacket!
fabulous! ... i love it!
:-)
Comment by katy — August 10, 2007 @ 8:10 pm
Hi ~katy~
= : >
August 10th, 2007 at 8:13 pmExcellent work, Mr. P. -- Comment by CT
Can't stop talking to yourself?
August 10th, 2007 at 8:13 pmEnjoy the circle jerk while you can, little boys.
TP: I'll check back after the 16th to see if you've gotten your act together.
Buh-bye.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:14 pmComment by Arthur C. — August 10, 2007 @ 8:13 pm
Can't stop repeating yourself?
August 10th, 2007 at 8:15 pmAll they’ve been doing is feeling sorry for themselves since the “trolls†have been outing them, going on delirious, concerned rants and crying over their keyboards. The victim card is played, as usual. It gets annoying, but yes, it’s still funny as hell. Comment by CT_Version 2 — August 10, 2007 @ 8:11 pm
Ironic you'd worry about being 'outed' - Glenn Murphy! More projection.
Playing the victim card? Wah, wah, Republicans have been professional victims for decades! Wah, my taxes are too high. Wah, the poor people scare me! Wah, the gays scare me! Wah, the Islamists scare me. Wah, the secularists and evolutionists insult my ignorance! You're a bunch of annoying whining little fools.
Self destruction of the surrender monkeys, at last.
Excellent work, Mr. P.
Comment by CT_Version 2 — August 10, 2007 @ 8:11 pm
You surrendered your intellect, bravery and conscience to evil long ago. Surrender monkey.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:15 pmCan’t stop repeating yourself?
Comment by CT_Version 2 — August 10, 2007 @ 8:15 pm
Can't make an intellectually honest point?
August 10th, 2007 at 8:15 pmour great leader!
Comment by michael — August 10, 2007 @ 7:17 pm
Ummmmm, according to the Pyongyang style book, Our Great Leader is supposed to be capitalized.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:15 pmp = Mr. P = CT_any_version. It's all the same screechy whiner.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:18 pmGeez… the Dems want to escape from reality so much that they are starting a secret club!!!
No, they want INTELLIGENT DISCUSSION on topics of GREAT IMPORTANCE, such as Bush being a TRAITOR to the USA, which he IS
and they are tired of people like yourself who diddle themselves to mental images of AWOL coward TRAITOR Bush in his aircraft-carrier flight suit...
August 10th, 2007 at 8:18 pmSchakowsky is right we can no longer win militarily in Iraq. The surge has failed.
August 10th, 2007 at 8:47 pmDAMN!!!! We now know that the French can make the best wine AND are smarter then the scumbags in the WH!
August 10th, 2007 at 9:27 pmThe Viet Nam war was a disaster for America and America's military, but a Major SUCCESS for the Republicans. Through political judo, they took Nixon's failed leadership and blamed the Democrats for being WEAK and Anti-Military. This got them the presidency for almost 20 of the past 27 years.
August 10th, 2007 at 9:40 pmThe strategy today is the same...hand off the Iraq War to the Democrats, and blame them for the aftermath .
This Iraq War is Bush's war. He got everything he asked for.
This summarizes the Bush administration for anyone who didn't already realize it. All PR and no substance. Thank God the Republicans are in their last throes.
August 10th, 2007 at 10:24 pmImpeach. Impeach. Impeach.
August 10th, 2007 at 10:29 pmIt's part of Congress' oversight responsibility to impeach and convict a president if he is found to have broken the laws.
August 10th, 2007 at 11:01 pmi coulda told her that the surge would have been/is a failure. IED attacks dont seem to have stopped, death squads dont seem to have stopped, truck bombs havent stopped, and you still need body armor to go a few miles. none of this sounds like success.
August 10th, 2007 at 11:10 pmIf "victory" was what Bush really wanted in Iraq would he have put Donald Rumsfeld in charge? Would he take advice from Wolfowitz, Perle, and Bremer?
August 10th, 2007 at 11:56 pm"“She said Petraeus told her “the U.S. would be in Iraq for 9-10 years if we want to win,â€
We do.
Comment by p"
Please tell us how we can "win" in Iraq. How do you "win" an occupation? Inquiring minds need to know.
August 11th, 2007 at 12:56 am"#If “victory†was what Bush really wanted in Iraq would he have put Donald Rumsfeld in charge? Would he take advice from Wolfowitz, Perle, and Bremer?
Comment by ZalYanovsky "
"Victory" has never been one of Bush's goals. Chaos was his main goal. With Chaos he has created vast wealth for his cronies and has destabilized a country to the point where he thinks he can take over their oil assets.
George Bush always had two goals for Iraq. The first to punish Saddam Hussein for wanting to kill his daddy and the second was to make his buddies rich off of war profiteering.
I think it would be wonderful if the Democratic Congress would pass a bill outlawing profiting off the "war" in Iraq. George would have a hard time opposing it because if he did, his real intent would become obvious to the few remaining people who don't get it.
August 11th, 2007 at 1:13 amThe surge has failed. Time to get out.
August 11th, 2007 at 4:49 amIraq is Bush's Vietnam. If he'd served he know what our soldiers are going through in Iraq. He doesn't because he avoided combat service in Vietnam. Coward.
August 11th, 2007 at 4:51 amOne of the four killed in Diyala province is from my town in MN. What a waste of lives, money, and reputation George Bush's little adventure has cost our country. While our current Congress has absolutely no guts to hang the neocon chickenhawks and war profiteers.
August 11th, 2007 at 6:05 amLet's hope she is on all the talk shows.
August 11th, 2007 at 6:17 amThis is not news but at least she says this very clearly.
There has never been a plan to exit.There is no intent to leave,ever.
The plan is go in, get rid of any obstacles including humans and suck out the treasure.
The military are just guards now.Guarding the treasure to make sure it stays in the right hands.
Hey, go look at the plans for permanent bases.Those plans were drafted before making up all the excuses to be there.Years before.
But why does anyone listen to what this gang says anyway?
Is there nothing better to do?
Has it become enjoyable to be lied to??
No one is trying to "win" this war. The goal is to keep it going so that we have to stay there for "ten more years" (Patraeus latest). The idea is to stay until all the oil is sucked out and to give us a permanent base from which to attack all the other countries that are inconveniently sitting on the cartels oil.
Call a liar a liar. That is what "PR" means. LIES. MORE, BIGGER AND BETTER LIES. And even if the American people don't buy them the god damned incompetent impotent cowardly weasel democrats in office will.
The LIES have started already, and they are growing daily, even as the factual news reaches us at the same time. "The surge is working" reports two "critic"/bush lovers who spent 8 days in heavily guarded safety in Iraq. And yet we continue to hear about decapitated tortured bodies, car bombs suicide bombs, helicopters being shot down...... and Petraeus telling congress we have to be there for 10 more years.
All the major news outlets are repeating the LIES as though they are gospel.
How do we get back to an independent honest truth telling watch dogging press?????? I don't have any idea. I think it is too late. But for god's sake, call LIARS what they are. LIARS.
August 11th, 2007 at 7:02 am"All the major news outlets are repeating the LIES as though they are gospel.
How do we get back to an independent honest truth telling watch dogging press?????? I don’t have any idea. I think it is too late. But for god’s sake, call LIARS what they are. LIARS.
Comment by foolme1ns — August 11, 2007 @ 7:02 am"
Wasn't there a blog topic here on TP recently about how folks who watch Fox News don't trust the news?
August 11th, 2007 at 8:31 am"We don’t want to occupy Iraq, we want them to pull themselves up, and become contributing members of the international community.
Comment by p"
What gives us the right to tell Iraq what they should and should not do? Who or what gives us that authority. If the people of Iraq want to fight a sectarian civil war, that is their business. And who are we to define what is a "contributing member of the international community"?
Are you for subjugating the people of Iraq?
Also, how would you feel if Russia or China invaded the US and started telling us how to run our government?
August 11th, 2007 at 11:00 amThe tragedy of our day is the climate of fear in which we live, and fear breeds repression. Too often, sinister threats to the Bill of Rights, to freedom of the mind, are concealed under the patriotic cloak of anti-Communism.
Adlai Stevenson wrote this in 1952. Today, simply replacing the word Communism with terrorism makes this statement valid once more.
August 11th, 2007 at 11:50 amWith 160,000 troops in a country of 28 million, we should not... and CAN NOT tell Iraq what to do. To think we can control Iraq is delusional.
August 11th, 2007 at 11:59 amWhat makes Bush think he can control what's going on in Iraq? He can't even stop the parliament from going on vacation.
August 11th, 2007 at 5:07 pmSchakowsky is right "that there’s a major PR effort going on to convince the Congress and the media and the public that just enough progress has been made to justify staying."
In fact, all the dots are connecting.
September: chosen as the month to report on Iraqi progress, and what the "surge" has accomplished.
August: 1) Congress goes on recess, 2) the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad extends invitations to congresspeople on break to visit Iraq to see firsthand how "well" things are going over there, 3) Schakowsky's observations and assessments will be downplayed while all the wingnut Republican congresspeople will get extensive air-time on Faux News and wingnut radio. Plus, 4) Alberto Gonzales just visited the Green Zone, and now is reporting back how "great" the legal system in Iraq is working.
Even though attentive and patriotic U.S. citizens know better.
Question: where do most of those Iraqi bodies dumped on Iraqi streets come from, bodies that show signs of torture?
Answer: the secret prisons run by shariah-court Shias, who torture their captives, try them before a secret shariah religious tribunal, secretly execute them and then dump their bodies in public as a warning to all other Iraqis that they better bow to their shariah version of Islam or else they will suffer the same fate.
One of these secret torture prisons containing hundreds of tortured prisoners (primarily Sunni) was discovered several months ago in a Shia neighborhood. I bet the Shia have hundreds of these secret prisons as well as hundreds of secret shariah religious tribunals.
And Gonzo will report that things are going great in the Iraqi judicial system? Just as Gen. Patraeus will report that the "surge" is working wonders? Just as all the wingnut Republican politicians visiting the Green Zone while on August break will parrot the same "things are going great in Iraq" talking points?
Some people just don't know when to stop lying.
August 11th, 2007 at 7:58 pmIf Petraeus is correct the US will be in Iraq for 10 years, then how will the surge be maintained. We don't have the troops to continue the surge and people are not joining the military. Is the current strategy a goal for failure?
August 11th, 2007 at 9:52 pmIs the current strategy a goal for failure?
Comment by Reggie — August 11, 2007 @ 9:52 pm
It is because the surge was supposed to give Maliki room to make political progress. Yet no political progress has been made. The Sunnis have left his cabinet. The Joint Chiefs of Staff and Gen. Casey didn't support the surge. They knew it would fail and it has.
August 11th, 2007 at 11:48 pmIRAQ is an Absolute SUCCESS!
According to PNAC.
The plan was to pacify America with fear and continual promises and stay indefinitately... Mission Accomplished.
Bush, idiot or savant?
August 12th, 2007 at 2:35 pmKARL ROVE HAS SUBMITTED HIS RESIGNATION.
August 13th, 2007 at 5:11 amBy that measure, the good representative has nothing to fear.
August 13th, 2007 at 2:02 pm