Okay, I wrong too. I wasn’t entirely clear on my beliefs, and I was overgeneralising a bit.

Alright, as long as my moderate conservative friends and I (who, by the way, are not global warming deniers) are not being grouped in with the heartless trolls, I have no problem.

Come on Dumplings you want to take me on come and do it.
Because frankly you have pissed me off.
Comment by Bruce Gorton — August 16, 2007 @ 10:09 am

I apologize, and I think that we are in agreement for the most part. I was offended by the generalization, but now I see where you are coming from and I’m right behind you. I find the troll’s comments just as despicable as you do, and I just wanted to make it clear that he does not speak for me (or any other human-being as far as I know).

Liberal in the current climate of ideology is not so much disagreeing with the right on everything, as disagreeing with the rightwing on anything. In particular, the Iraq war.

While I do hold that Republicans, in general are global warming denialists, due to what I have seen Republicans post, heard their commentators say, and seen their leaders do, and while I do suspect that every issue where a politician has a good idea to a Republican boils down to people simply trying to grab power, this is more to do with the fact that this has been my experience with Republicans.

There are good conservatives out there. They are currently, on balance liberal, because America is a country founded on liberal principals and thus, to be conservative includes a certain amount of liberal ideology. The two are not in fact opposite ideologies, but rather, under the right circumstances complimentary.

Except my post, which you were criticising, did not deal with that subject. There is a huge difference between saying people might do something because they are gay, and just accusing everyone who disagrees with you of being gay.

The question, at the end of the post you call a vicious over-generalisation was not entirely rhetorical, but it was an appeal for more serious, and less, well, disgusting conservatives to maybe debate the issue at hand.

Now you are cherry picking from a just one of the trolls’ posts (not to mention you already used the emboldened line as an example). However, your comment which I referred to made a generalization about all Republicans and conservatives, comparing our style of debate to that of “a retarded six year old.” Granted, Pretty Pretty Bird and others have made inappropriate comments here to get a rise out of you, but you can not take their sentiments as representative of conservatives in general. If you ask me, I would say that Pretty Pretty Bird isn’t even serious, and is probably pulling your leg. I would liken him to a stoned 23 year old.

Comment by ronjazz — August 16, 2007 @ 9:42 am

I didn’t know that Goering was a fan of the word “mention.”

Hey, you learn something new everyday!

Bruce,

I wasn’t referring to that comment.

Bruce and ronjazz, I had in mind the following post by firehead (representing the trolls):

That’s cause we allow liberal and gay soldiers. They have to be weeded out, so it’s for the best.

Comment by firehead — August 15, 2007 @ 11:44 pm

And katy’s post, which, while far more tasteful, also suggests that some of these suicides may have occurred because due to the shame and anxiety that homosexual troops must feel, and therefore katy and firehead are in agreement in a sense.

Comment by Egreggious — August 15, 2007 @ 11:29 pm

i mean no disrespect, but this post put a question to mind…
that obit states that the soldier’s father was a JROTC instructor…
a school friend of my daughter’s, same age, also committed suicide -
his father was an army recruiter… this boy didn’t want to sign up, but was pressured, as one could expect… under even more pressure, in that he was gay, but couldn’t come out – for the same obvious reasons… he got through basic, but went AWOL, hiding at his “friend”’s house… was found and jailed… before the military police came for him, he hung himself (small town jail)… very sad tale… i’m not sure his homosexuality was ever acknowledged, though his friends from school and mypage all knew… but his suicide shocked all…

i wouldn’t dare to suggest any kind of scenario in your case…
but this makes me wonder – how many of these suicides could be related to military dads… especially recruiter dads…
just wondering… suppose stats are kept on that?

sorry… hazards of the topic… nothing nice about it…

saddest thing i can think of… death as the best option…
sorry…

g’nite all…

Comment by katy — August 16, 2007 @ 1:14 am

I was merely pointing out to Bruce that the observation was not a “when all else fails” Republican mud flinging. But, in fact, at least one liberal (katy) saw the validity of the argument, which she backed up with anecdotal evidence of her own.

Comment by GSD

Just like Dubya’s hero, Tricky Dick, the last total loser Repug to command a war-time Army.

I am proud that when I returned from Vietnam, I was a member of VVAW and protested to end that immoral CLusterfu(k and hope this one will be over soon. ANd that we don’t wait for the big flush of 08 to get it done!

Israel ignoring UN resolutions=Israel good, UN bad.

Chimpy world is so easy.

-GSD

F*ckin’ loser.

-GSD

Because frankly you have pissed me off.

Comment by dumplings — August 16, 2007 @ 9:30 am

And you just demonstrated that you can’t read.

That would mean that a considerable number of non-military suicides in the U.S. were gender-confused democrats who had a lot of angst about their desire for manbutt. Im surprised you havent offed yourself yet, ronho, considering your prediliction for male flesh.

Now get back under the sink!

Comment by Pretty Pretty Bird — August 16, 2007 @ 6:41 am

Comment by mandolin

Perhaps you should play the violin to accompany your laments.

Comment by dumplings — August 16, 2007 @ 9:30 am

Mention? Mention is the word you used? Nice try. I don’t have to point out anything more; the wording of that statement is so perfectly Goerring-esque.

Except Pretty Pretty Bird wasn’t arguing over whether homosexuality caused these suicides. He was simply accusing people of being gay.

EG: Im surprised you havent offed yourself yet, ronho, considering your prediliction for male flesh.

In other words, dumplings, you have failed to follow the argument, not me.

I have to get back to work, but I feel that I must remind you that black is white and not white at the same time!

Comment by dumplings — August 16, 2007 @ 8:47 am

This is an important point, since the right wing tries to paint the UN as both a world-domination center AND lazy and ineffective. It goes to show the paucity of logic and rationale behind the hypocrisy of the right, the black & white thinking (a term used loosely when dealing with wingnuts), and the mentality of needing to win an argument at all costs rather than learning from it. dumplings is a perfect example of why Bush was allowed to steal the elections and wipe himself with the Constitution; because he “won”. It’s the same projection used by sports fans as they trash their own hometowns after “we” win The Big One. It’s mob mentality at its worst, and the mass ignorance of the easily-duped, simpleminded wingnuts is the favorite tool of the Republican corporatists. Rightards are not fully evolved yet; they’re several thousand years behind the curve. Until they catch up with the rest of humanity, they should be marginalized and watched closely. They have proven that in spades these past 6 years.