Seems you have an issue with people stereotyping “the left,” but at the same time you’re doing the very same thing to people on “the right.”

Comment by Man in the Middle — September 4, 2007 @ 8:10 am

And I agree with you that Bush is the US president, and is thus supposed to be the president of all Americans, I just don’t think he really is in the minds of most Americans.

To the rightwing the president is still Bill Clinton, its why whenever you hear of something Bush has done wrong, you will always find at least one righty who will mention Bill.

To the leftwing Bush isn’t their president because he consistently holds party loyalty as being more important then getting the job done (For example, Fema, the AG scandal, contracts only being given to Bush supporters etc…) and thus not behaved as if they are running things for the whole country.

Plus there is the whole Bush’s use of “Some people say…” to demonise his opposition.

Bruce, why are you trying to change the subject?

The rightwing/leftwing quiz:

1: Do you believe evolution should be taught in school biology?

2: Do you believe that the state and the Church should be kept seperate?

3: Do you believe that those in power likely to abuse powers such as the ability to spy on anyone they feel is “suspicious”?

4: Do you believe torture is wrong?

5: Do you believe that government has not place telling you who you can marry, or judging you for what you do in your bedroom, provided all involved are consenting adults?

6: Do you believe crazy people should not be given guns?

7: Do you believe it is more important to win, then to look tough?

8: Do you believe that once an argument is lost it is lost?

9: Do you believe that the strong should protect the weak?

10: Do you believe that spending 1$ in taxes is better then spending $3 to someone other then your government, for essentially the same service?

11: Do you believe two wrongs don’t make a right?

If you answered one of those questions with a yes you are a leftwinger.

A fairly cogent argument there, Bruce, but unfortunately you’re rebutting something other than what I actually said.

Of course a person doesn’t have to admire/respect the president, much less kowtow to the guy, but that doesn’t change the fact that he is their president for as long as he legally holds the office. (As a side note, I do favor impeachment.)

This is a fundamental essence of the democratic process, whereby we all own the decisions/actions of our leaders, whether or not they were our choice on election day. It’s rather unfortunate that some people think it’s their “patriotic duty” to marginalize their fellow citizens for the mere act of casting a legitimate vote for a legitimate candidate on election day.

Instead of angrily heaping scorn on people who are taking their civic responsibility seriously, those who insist on preaching to others in regards to their role in the political process ought be constructively criticizing the people who don’t even bother to vote.

Wow, you had to post three comments to my one, a clear sign you’re feeling rather convicted and a bit flustered as well.

Seems you have an issue with people stereotyping “the left,” but at the same time you’re doing the very same thing to people on “the right.”

By the fact that we can be surprised by something and by the fact that we can be wrong.

If we were incapable of either, then the perception-as-reality argument would win, but that is simply not the case.

A bullet fired by a sniper far enough away for you to not hear it, doesn’t simply cease to exist because you didn’t see it coming.

In other words: We know perception isn’t reality because our senses can be fooled – and our perceptions updated accordingly.

2: Our perceptions, whether accurate or not do not impact on whether reality is subjective or not.

Comment by Bruce Gorton — September 3, 2007 @ 6:23 am
————————————

It depends what you consider the nature of “reality” to be.

How do we know that anything lies outside of our own consciousness, when all we can know resides in our consciousness?

Too bad he’s VERY inconsistent about this. He tends to do this in spurts.

Comment by Man in the Middle — September 3, 2007 @ 10:35 am

Sickened to the point of vomiting is more like it.

Why don’t you address the issues I raised, which are not strawmen arguments, but actual situations?

Comment by Man in the Middle — September 3, 2007 @ 10:35 am

Heh. In your dreams.

Bush isn’t America, he isn’t even the idea of America. He is just a guy who happens to be president. To claim that only by kow-towing to the president can anybody be a patriot, is in essence an outright rejection of everything America stands for. THAT is unpatriotic, and the definition of fascist thinking.

And, it doesn’t matter who is president – the president does not get to play CIC with civilians.

Nice strawman arguments there. The use of profane, middle school vernacular was a nice touch, too. I can only conclude you’re feeling rather convicted by my observations/comments.

ASIANS are excelling past even the WHITES because they are CUTE and discrimination does not affect them like BLACKS…-scooter

Yeh, that explains it all.

IDIOT
================
there is no alternate reality where Bush is not your president and the Iraq War is not your war. -MIM

It has never been delared a war, first of all, and Bush may be the President but he is not my CIC. There are 13 dimensions, and Bush does not live in all of them. Nor do you.

IDIOT

David Gregory: Mr. President, critics of your proposed bill on interrogation rules say there’s another important test. These critics include John McCain, who you’ve mentioned several times this morning.

BUSH: My reaction is, is that if the nations such as those you name adopted the standards within the Detainee Detention Act, the world would be better. That’s my reaction.

Comment by Man in the Middle — September 2, 2007 @ 7:55 pm

F*ck you. Anyone who supports invading sovereign countries and telling their leaders to get out or else, based on spreading fear of some action that MIGHT happen in the future, is no patriot.

Anyone who supports a President and VP’s grab for unlimited power with no oversight whatsoever from ANYONE, is not a patriot.

Comment by michael — September 2, 2007 @ 8:25 pm

Well then, if terrorists can otherwise flood into the U.S. if we leave Iraq, then Bush has done a f*cked up job of protecting us, hasn’t he?

Bush (and Powell, and Bremer) were singing a different tune when they said we’d leave Iraq if the Iraqis asked us to. Not a damn complaint about Iraq or the Middle East falling into chaos. Not a damn complaint about the terrorists following us home. Not one word from Bush’s sorry mouth about the generals on the ground making the decision as to when we’d leave Iraq.

Comment by michael — September 2, 2007 @ 8:09 pm

More…

The CIA knew that the informant known as “Curveball” could not be trusted, and at least one agent told Tenet to take info out of Powell’s speech to the U.N. that came from Curveball.

The info was left in the speech. I can point you to the specifics if you’d like, but I doubt you care.