O’Hanlon Rips GAO Report: It Is ‘Flat-Out Sloppy’
O’Hanlon Rips GAO Report: It Is ‘Flat-Out Sloppy’
Last week, Gen. David Petraeus alleged a 75 percent reduction in “sectarian violence” in Iraq and is expected to say the same before Congress. In contrast, the nonpartisan Government Accountability Office recently reported that daily attacks in Iraq have “remained unchanged” throughout the escalation.
The Washington Post reports today that national security analysts are questioning the military’s statistics. National Intelligence Estimate authors, Iraq Study Group members, intelligence officials, and academics now “accuse the military of cherry-picking positive indicators.”
Brookings analyst Michael O’Hanlon, however, attacked the GAO, choosing instead to laud the Pentagon’s distortions. In an analysis only he could offer, O’Hanlon rips the GAO report for being both “overly rigorous” and “flat-out sloppy”:
During his recent tour through Iraq, [O’Hanlon] adds, every local briefing he received from the US military said that attacks in that particular sector were down. In addition, for the GAO to decline to judge whether attacks are sectarian or not is to take an overly rigorous approach to the numbers, says the Brookings expert.
“I just think they were flat-out sloppy,” he says of GAO.
By attacking the GAO, O’Hanlon has defied the community of national security experts he alleges to be a part of and has instead allied himself with the discredited ranks of the Bush administration and right-wing lawmakers.
Ironically, while O’Hanlon bashes the GAO when he doesn’t like what it says, his very own Iraq Index borrows heavily from GAO reports:
A senior military intelligence official attributed the Pentagon’s drastic reduction in violence “to a desire to provide Petraeus with ammunition for his congressional testimony.” O’Hanlon’s desire to provide that ammunition has left him in lonely territory in Washington.
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Don’t like the facts? Attack the messenger. Standard GOP m.o.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:47 pmOh, that’s funny…
As if O’Hanlon has any credibility left after his vapid cheerleading of the administration.
O’Hanlon, your attacks on the GAO report only serve to certify it.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:47 pmin other words, too reality-based.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:50 pmIt is getting really old that ANY news that the WH doesn’t approve of is, sloppy, ill-written, just not true. Yet we have Michael Ware of CNN, and Cpl Mark Finelli an Iraq veteran and 9/11 survivor agreeing with the GAO report. So who do we believe the WH groupies that have been lying since 2001 or the ones who live this horror everyday?
September 6th, 2007 at 2:50 pm“Overly rigorous”? Seriously? They were too rigorous?
But then, also “flat-out sloppy”? I can userstand how, say, pornography can be both vigorous and sloppy, but statistics?
This is Colbertesque.
- Chris
September 6th, 2007 at 2:51 pmwhat a twat.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:51 pm“here, if you drink this Neo-Con Kool-Aid and stare at it long enough, you’ll see the ponies too!”
September 6th, 2007 at 2:51 pmOverly rigorous, and simultaneously sloppy ?
Would some one please explain to me how any endeavor completed
with rigor can be synonymous with sloppy work ?
…and what is the objection towards rigor pertaining to a matter
September 6th, 2007 at 2:51 pmthat is costing people their lives ?
The only thing that’s really changed is the surge in propaganda that we are getting.

September 6th, 2007 at 2:52 pmSadly, O’hanlon will still be on the teevee spouting obnoxious and wrong ‘claims of progress’. Why would seemingly intelligent individuals hang their star on bush’s failed agenda? Is bush taking all of them to Paraguay when he leaves DC? Gosh, I hope so.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:53 pmO’Hanlon looks a little sloppy in that picture. Is it recent? He needs some sleep and a shower.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:53 pmBush and O’Hanlon made both their assertions from the safety of the base, how about going into country O’Hanlon and George. Oh, that’s right Republicans NEVER get into the actual war…just support the low class’s to fight, they aren’t as valuable as the Young Republicans hiding. Romney boys that would be you all.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:54 pmWhat a rusty tool.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:55 pmWhen will the radically extremist progressives acknowledge the infallible truth that O’Hanlon is ONE OF THEIR OWN??! The progressives are only implicating themselves increasingly as hardcore laughingstocks for now associating O’Hanlon with the right-wing and the GOP! Good God, progtards, your mania is even more irredeemable now than ever before. I’ll break it down for you pathological liars: O’Hanlon is a leftard because he is employed by the leftarded Brookings Institute, IS a Demoncrat, and before his latest trip to Iraq, was actually a ferocious critic of Bush’s war strategy! However, O’Hanlon has the saving grace that 99.9% of libtards (as seen on these mentally ill threads of TP) don’t have. That is the quality of intellectual honesty. That’s why despite his political ideology, O’Hanlon can confidently say the surge is working and Iraqi deaths and violence are down! He’s also right to chide the GAO because as all honest people know, they misused questionable criteria to measure Iraqi progress.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:55 pmO’Hanlon looks a little sloppy in that picture. Is it recent? He needs some sleep and a shower.
Comment by Jake D
Again, something we can agree upon :)
September 6th, 2007 at 2:55 pmO’Hanlon looks like he needs his mommy to change his diaper.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:57 pmI can userstand how, say, pornography can be both vigorous and sloppy, but statistics?
That’s really quite good, Chris.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:57 pmO’Hanlon looks a little sloppy in that picture. Is it recent? He needs some sleep and a shower.
Comment by Jake D. — September 6, 2007 @ 2:53 pm
Creating, Spreading and Defending wingnut propaganda takes a lot of anyone sane and semi-intelligent - you would know if you were either…
September 6th, 2007 at 2:57 pmHow the hell would O’Hannlon know? Where does he get his data? There is never a shortage of mopes ready and willing to lie for monkey boy.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:00 pmI don’t think anyone who still refers to it as the General Accounting Office gets to accuse anyone else of being sloppy.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:02 pmO’Hanlon’s detachment from reality and subsequent decent into delusional thinking continues. I said this on Media Mattters about O’Reilly and Limbaugh and it is appropos here. If this is the best that the Reich Wingbat media has or can do, then they’re in big trouble.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:03 pmComment by Shrill troll
When will the radically extremist progressives acknowledge the infallible truth that O’Hanlon is ONE OF THEIR OWN??!
Take a deep breath and calm down son. Your hot flashes and nightsweats should be over quickly. BTW, your post was nonsense. You cannot ascribe O’hanlon’s devotion to the bush administration onto progressives. That playground ploy will never fly here at TP. TP bloggers are smarter than that. All your rants do not move us one bit. History is going to frown on you who want the boy king to remain forever. Even your own children and grandchildren will wonder what YOU ever did to rein in this criminal enterprise currently squatting in our White House. Well, what have you done to curtail the power grab? Anything? bueller? Anybody home?
September 6th, 2007 at 3:03 pma little gem from the onion, good for a laugh at least.
http://www.theonion.com/ content/ news/ heartbroken_bush_runs_after_0
September 6th, 2007 at 3:06 pmPentagon criterias;
1. Do not include car bombs
2. I bullet to the back of the head is scretarian violence.
3. Bullet to the front is criminal and not to be counted.
I shit you not. See how easy it is to drop the numbers.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:07 pmIronically, Bill Clinton just undermined TP’s position that the surge has not been a success when he told Larry King in fact “we have now succeeded with this strategy” and we need troops to do this all over the country.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:07 pmIf it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and, for a few brief moments, wore a hat with horns on it, then its a viking!!
That’s how you can define O’Hanlon as a progressive.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:08 pmI love how O’Hanlon says that every military briefing he saw in Iraq, said things were getting better. Umm duh the military is going to help catapult the propaganda.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:09 pmSomeone on the Thom Hartmann show this morning was stating that if the dead civilians in Iraq had bullets that went through the backs of their heads, their deaths are added to the stats on sectarian violence. If the bullet holes show that bullets went through the front of their heads, the Pentagon is calling it insurgency and not counting the deaths within the stats that show civilian deaths.
So on the one hand, Bush considers the insurgents not to be soldiers for purposes of Gitmo and torture, but on the other hand they are soldiers for purposes of eliminating them from the body count regarding civilians killed in Iraq. And now, ChimpCo isn’t even applying any logical standard to know if dead people in Iraq are insurgents or innocent bystanders, but manipulating the statistics any which way they want.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:12 pmO’ Hanlon cannot be considered independent and objective with regard to Iraq war.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:13 pmHe supported a war with Iraq before it started in 2003 and called for toppling Saddam,and made stupid predictions on how things will be under control in no time .
Not smarter, just robotic. Comment by Gronkonian — September 6, 2007 @ 3:09 pm\
Ironic coming from a ROBOTIC troll…
The “smart†TP bloggers have said that 911 was an inside job, that an Israeli cabal really controls the White House and that we deserve terrorist attacks against us. Comment by Gronkonian — September 6, 2007 @ 3:09 pm
All strawman bullsh!t. That might work on redstate, or some other land of the retards, here you just look stupid.
The only reason you think youre smart is because youre surrounded by your fellow insane malcontents who nod and drool in unison no matter what any of you say.
Comment by Gronkonian — September 6, 2007 @ 3:09 pm
Funny, that better describes you, your posts, and redstate. Your projection is BORING, stupid wingnut.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:14 pmComment by Gronkonia
The only reason you think youre smart is because youre surrounded by your fellow insane malcontents who nod and drool in unison no matter what any of you say.
Insane malcontents = People who refuse to blindly follow bad leaders
Sorry, dumbass. Straw men are for pussies who can’t push over real ones.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:18 pm“We dont trust the dems to protect us”,”We” hahahha
“its why the WH will be lost to you again.”
bwahahahahahhahaha 28% ers will be powerless bwhahahahaaaaaaaa
September 6th, 2007 at 3:19 pmThe only reason you think youre smart is because youre surrounded by your fellow insane malcontents who nod and drool in unison no matter what any of you say.
Comment by Gronkonian
Because I am sure you were home schooled, I will be kind in my response. You didn’t read the post, did you? In between shoving food in your mouth you could have read more closely. I did not say I was smart - although I am educated. I said ascribing o’hanlon’s views to progressive is wrong and we here at TP are smart enough to know O’hanlon is wrong. Please try and keep up. I believe you spend too much time sniffing bush’s backside to know what is truly happening in our country. Please try and keep up. maybe some night school classes would help - maybe not.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:22 pmThe “smart†TP bloggers have said that 911 was an inside job, that an Israeli cabal really controls the White House and that we deserve terrorist attacks against us.
Comment by Gronkonian — September 6, 2007 @ 3:09 pm
Typical Troll Tactic #27: take the most extreme statements ever made by anyone and ascribe them to the “mainstream” of the group you wish to denounce. Then laugh at them.
Degree of difficulty: Very easy
September 6th, 2007 at 3:24 pmEffectiveness: Minimal
Doesnt matter anyway, blah blah blah WH will be lost to you again.
Comment by Gronkonian — September 6, 2007 @ 3:15 pm
I just love the smell of desperation in the morning, smells like insanity!
September 6th, 2007 at 3:24 pmSpeaking of sloppy, get a haircut Mikey.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:25 pmOr at least comb it.
So Ohanlon, the guy the press propped up as a “famous war critic”, is now attacking the GAO because they dare to question the success of the war.
Anyone who thinks Ohanlon is anything more than an administration water carrier is an idiot.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:27 pmLyle Lovett called, he needs his look back.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:27 pmYou know, he can’t be out of his 30’s yet.
If he loves the war so much, then why doesn’t he enlist?
September 6th, 2007 at 3:27 pmLyle Lovett called, he needs his look back.
Comment by norbizness — September 6, 2007 @ 3:27 pm
lol.
Actually I think he’s got more of a Jim Ignatowski thing going on there.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:28 pmSo the worst of what’s written by anyone here will be taken as part of the leftydestroysamerica handbook.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:29 pmSince when does a think tank analyst get briefings?
That alone shows what’s wrong with this government. When Bush does press chat ups, he invites those who will favor him. They cherry pick results. They spin and spin.
This is so f*cked up it’s not even funny.
No wonder those 25%ers still believe. Lies told enough times become truth.
What has happened to our country? Disgusting!!
September 6th, 2007 at 3:30 pmLook at the pout on the little bitty boys lip.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:31 pmLittle Wittle Miley O hanoland is gonna crwy.
snif snif pout pout pout.
Wait…the sources O’Hanlon cites in his own work, as shown in the last image in the article, are from the General Accounting Office, not the Government Accountability Office. You might want to retract that subsequent implication of hypocrisy.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:31 pmSo the worst of what’s written by anyone here will be taken as part of the leftydestroysamerica handbook.
Comment by hellinabucket — September 6, 2007 @ 3:29 pm
No - first they have to alter the quotes to fit their “Liberals = Traitors” agenda. If they used our words verbatim and in context, intelligent readers would see through their illogic.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:35 pmWho is this nutjob anyway?
Did anyone ever hear of him before a few weeks ago when the press came out calling him the biggest war critic since Cindy Sheehan?
I know I hadn’t. Who the hell is he anyway and why should anyone give a crap what he has to say.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:36 pmWait…the sources O’Hanlon cites in his own work, as shown in the last image in the article, are from the General Accounting Office, not the Government Accountability Office. You might want to retract that subsequent implication of hypocrisy.
Comment by silentpundit — September 6, 2007 @ 3:31 pm
Cute. The General Accounting Office was renamed the Government Accountability Office in 2004. Good try though!
September 6th, 2007 at 3:36 pmIn the Washington Times is a report, with the Headline:
“Dems already discount war report” !!!
Dick Durbin, Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi call the Petraeus Report
the *** “BUSH REPORT” *** !!!
Dick Durbin said: “I expect the Bush Report to say, The surge is working
September 6th, 2007 at 3:37 pmLets have more of the same”
First Photo Caption: What, did I just say that an “overly rigorous approach” was just “flat-out sloppy”?!?!? Hmmmm. . . . . . .
Second Photo Caption: Why can’t people just believe me rather than using their brains???
September 6th, 2007 at 3:37 pmO’Hanlon and Kristol and Bush (oh my!) and their ilk have acheived a certain ‘anti-credibility’ that leads one to doubt whatever they say, even if they said something that was patentely true.
Not that they’re capable of that, of course.
.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:37 pmGeezus, why is TP so stridently negative? The mentality of these posters is sad and despondent…
September 6th, 2007 at 3:37 pmFrom 2003 - thru 12/2006 O’Hanlon has supported the war, Rumsfeldt, Bush and pushed for the surge along with Freddy Kagan. So much for being a critic. As for his latest trip to Iraq, when asked why he just didn’t go without approval of the military, he was concerned with his safety. He could have phoned in his interviews, never going anywhere except where the military allowed and only speaking with “approved” sources.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:37 pmWhy does every story about O’Hanolon include a pic of Lyle Lovett?
Will somebody clue me in on the joke?
September 6th, 2007 at 3:37 pmBut those citations are from 2006.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:38 pmHow do all of you TPers know that the GOA report isn’t sloppy?
The truth is, you don’t.
ThinkProgress only reports bad news from Iraq and attacks anyone who reports even the slightest success.
TP and the Left will settle for nothing less than American failure and will purge even their own for anything that does not further that goal.
ThinkProgress (even the name is a lie) comes as close to sedition as possible without crossing the line.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:38 pmAt 47, I should have said ‘anti-gravitas’. Damn.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:40 pmI dont trust anybody who wears those butt-ugly, geeky yellow ties.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:40 pmWait…the sources O’Hanlon cites in his own work, as shown in the last image in the article, are from the General Accounting Office, not the Government Accountability Office.
Because he apparently didn’t get the memo that the name was changed in 2004.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:40 pm“During his recent tour through Iraq, [O’Hanlon] adds, every local briefing he received from the US military said that attacks in that particular sector were down.”
And this sucker believed what he was told. How increadibly naive. But then, he also believed that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction.
His motto: Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, you can fool me again.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:41 pmDamn, I only wish I had a big pile of poodle hair like that.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:44 pmWould you like some cheese with your whine Ringo?
September 6th, 2007 at 3:44 pmHow does one manage to be overly rigorous and sloppy simultaneously? Oh, I remember - by talking out of both sides of one’s mouth. Some times I forget my childhood indoctrination into the ways of Republicanism.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:44 pmWould you like some cheese with your whine Ringo?
Comment by Krazny
———————————-
Yes please.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:45 pm@ 44:
Cute. The General Accounting Office was renamed the Government Accountability Office in 2004. Good try though!
And I repeat: anyone who is still referring to it as the General Accounting Office in 2006? Doesn’t. Get. To. Call. ANYONE. Sloppy.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:46 pmThinkProgress only reports bad news from Iraq and attacks anyone who reports even the slightest success.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 3:38 pm
What kind of “slightest success” would that be? Bribing one Sunni tribe to stop fighting Americans and fight other Sunnis? Just over half of the Iraqi parliament bothering to show up for work? The Iraqi police force only being infiltrated by a few death squads? The highly successful Botemkin Market in Baghdad that’s thriving with vendors who we only have to bribe $2,500 apiece to open up shop, and shoppers who get searched before they can enter? Those kind of successes?
September 6th, 2007 at 3:46 pm“When will the radically extremist progressives acknowledge the infallible truth that O’Hanlon is ONE OF THEIR OWN??! ”
Nonesense. O’Hanlon supported the war and the surge. He is one of the NeoCons.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:46 pmAnd I repeat: anyone who is still referring to it as the General Accounting Office in 2006? Doesn’t. Get. To. Call. ANYONE. Sloppy.
Comment by The Witch — September 6, 2007 @ 3:46 pm
You might want to take that up with Mr. O’Hanlon, then. He’s the one who incorrectly cited the 2006 GAO reports in his work for Brookings.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:48 pmtoasterhead,
Screw off, you sick freak.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:49 pmDemocrat Soldier - Strong people resent when cowardly pundits try to lie their history out. Strong people read and reach their own conclusions while the lazy and weak are happy to believe the fairy tales.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:50 pmAnd I repeat: anyone who is still referring to it as the General Accounting Office in 2006? Doesn’t. Get. To. Call. ANYONE. Sloppy.
Comment by The Witch — September 6, 2007 @ 3:46 pm
I’d also like to add that it’s not standard English grammar to place periods after single words. This practice merely produces a series of sentence fragments, making for an extremely sloppy-looking comment. I’ll be waiting patiently for you to retract the above statement and replace it with something grammatically correct.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:52 pm# 48 We are not sad and despondent we are shouting from the housetops that more and more people are realizing what a fake government we have and want a change !
September 6th, 2007 at 3:52 pmI think O’Hanlon is too invested in his own flat out miscalculations about Iraq to see the forest through the trees.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:52 pmRingo sez
TP and the Left will settle for nothing less than American failure and will purge even their own for anything that does not further that goal.
You have some insight there dontcha! man o man. I thought the shrillness of the right was winding down a little bit - but no. Do you really believe TP bloggers want the us to lose? Please don’t display your foolishness for the entire world to see. It makes you seem desperate and silly.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:54 pmBut if civilian deaths are only going down because we changed the definition of “civilian”, then they are not going down.
O’Hanlon knows it’s true because the military kept telling him it was true? Guy doesn’t have much reasoning skills. If you read The Pentagon Papers, you know the military lied to us for many years during Vietnam.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:56 pm(G)Ringo; I will send your cheese that matches you…. Limberger(as in you stink).
September 6th, 2007 at 3:58 pmEver notice how O’Hanlon resembles Eraserhead from d Lynch’s cult film?
September 6th, 2007 at 3:58 pmEver notice how O’Hanlon resembles Eraserhead from d Lynch’s cult film?
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — September 6, 2007 @ 3:58 pm
Or a very young Tom Waits.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:59 pmI have some nice Brie, but since it is French I doubt Ringo will want it. I do think Ringo needs to take some time off from TP, seems he is going off the rails more and more.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:00 pmO’Hanlon looks like he is ready to start clucking like a chicken in that photo TP posted of him. Is he deliberately trying to look like a banty rooster by piling up all that curly red hair on top of his head? Begock!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:01 pm(G)Ringo; I will send your cheese that matches you…. Limberger(as in you stink).
Comment by Uncle Ho
——————————————
Funny stuff there….Such wit!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:02 pmHow does a report become “overly” rigorous? Don’t we want our reports rigorous?
Normally when one accuses a study of failing to make important distinctions, you say they aren’t being rigorous enough. At what point does a rigorous report veer over the line into being ‘overly’ rigorous?
Oh, that’s right. When it refuses to ignore the piles of dead bodies the military briefers want you to ignore. So very sloppy.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:02 pmFunny stuff there….Such wit!
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:02 pm
No thanks to you, witless retard!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:03 pmtoasterhead,
Screw off, you sick freak.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 3:49 pm
Funny, that’s how all of the progressives here feel about you!!!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:04 pmDo you really believe TP bloggers want the us to lose?
Comment by Tom
—————————————–
Yes, isn’t that what I just said?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:05 pmYes, isn’t that what I just said?
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:05 pm
Yes, which proves you’re a retard, and a sick freak.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:06 pmtoasterhead,
Screw off, you sick freak.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 3:49 pm
Was it something I said? :(
September 6th, 2007 at 4:07 pmFunny, that’s how all of the progressives here feel about you!!!
Comment by JakeIsATerrorist
———————————————————————
I have a special dislike for toasterhead as he is one of those who believe we, the United States, deserved 9/11.
Do you feel the same way?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:07 pmIs it just me or is this dude the lead from the classic “Eraserhead”?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:07 pmWas it something I said? :(
Comment by toasterhead — September 6, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
Yeah, it was rational, thoughtful and sane - those are things Ringo and the other wackos don’t understand and DRIVE THEM CRAZY…
September 6th, 2007 at 4:08 pmWas it something I said? :(
Comment by toasterhead
—————————————–
Yes.
Why don’t you share it with everyone, as I’m sure most of the other sickos here would likely agree with you?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:09 pmEver notice how O’Hanlon resembles Eraserhead from d Lynch’s cult film?
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — September 6, 2007 @ 3:58 pm
oops missed this one
September 6th, 2007 at 4:10 pmYes.
Why don’t you share it with everyone, as I’m sure most of the other sickos here would likely agree with you?
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:09 pm
What, that you’re retarded hateful freak? Yes we do agree with toasterhead on that…
September 6th, 2007 at 4:10 pmWhat, that you’re retarded hateful freak? Yes we do agree with toasterhead on that…
Comment by JakeIsATerrorist
————————————————-
No, that the US deserved 9/11…..That the victims had it coming.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:11 pmEver notice how O’Hanlon resembles Eraserhead from d Lynch’s cult film?
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — September 6, 2007 @ 3:58 pm
Sitting through that entire movie gave me training to endure what the Bush admin. is putting us through now. I suspected the experience would be good for something, eventually, which is why I persevered, unlike half of the people in the theatre!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:13 pmNo, that the US deserved 9/11…..That the victims had it coming.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:11 pm
I think you’ve got toasterhead confused with Jerry Falwell.
If toasterhead did write that, I would strongly disagree. Sorry to spoil your illusions.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:15 pmNo, that the US deserved 9/11…..That the victims had it coming.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:11 pm
Ah, poor little retarded f*cker. You can’t tell the difference between a blowback we *helped* cause, and something we *deserve*? Only a f*cker like you would ever believe anyone *deserves* terrorism in order to justify you lunatic hatred of liberals. You’re a RETARDED IDIOT!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:15 pmAmerica hasn’t lost anything. One of the objectives of Bush was to topple Saddam. It has been done, we need to leave. Our military is being used to continue this mess to finance the companies supplying war goods. How much is your son or daughter worth?
Either we leave or institute a draft where everyone serves with boils on their ass (limbaugh) or trick knees (young republican’s excuse ) If you can’t fight, do the technology. Then see how fast we get our people home.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:15 pmI think you’ve got toasterhead confused with Jerry Falwell.
If toasterhead did write that, I would strongly disagree. Sorry to spoil your illusions.
Comment by gummitch — September 6, 2007 @ 4:15 pm
Yeah, isn’t it ironic that the only LEADERS that have ever said this are GOP RELIGIOUS leaders?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:16 pmIf toasterhead did write that, I would strongly disagree.
Comment by gummitch — September 6, 2007 @ 4:15 pm
———————————————–
He did say it, and defended it.
That’s why I called him a sick freak.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:17 pmHe did say it, and defended it.
That’s why I called him a sick freak.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
Where’s the exact quote. Link to it, LIAR.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:18 pmCould we please have intelligent conversations without schoolyard name calling?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:19 pmCould we please have intelligent conversations without schoolyard name calling?
Comment by texaslady — September 6, 2007 @ 4:19 pm
We can, but that will require all of the hateful GOP retards like Ringo to leave…
September 6th, 2007 at 4:19 pmI have a special dislike for toasterhead as he is one of those who believe we, the United States, deserved 9/11.
Do you feel the same way?
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
I’m sorry you feel that way. I thought I explained my position very rationally yesterday.
My position on the subject is this: if you carelessly play with fire, you deserve to get burned. This does not mean that I’m taking the fire’s side, nor does it mean I support the fire’s ideology. It is a statement about taking personal responsibility for one’s actions.
The United States has been playing with fire in the Middle East dating back to Operation Ajax in 1953. In 2001, we got burned. Is it too much of a stretch to say that the U.S. should bear some responsibility for what happened?
I thought the Right was all about personal responsibiliy. What gives?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:19 pmRingo, I don’t think that most people who say that the U.S. had it coming mean the individual victims “deserved it”- they mean the U.S. as a country.
I venture to add that if we as individuals ARE to blame for anything it would be in regards to the lack of thoughtfulness about the way we pick our leaders and our willingness to be manipulated and lied to.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:20 pmThe more he gets hammered for his neocon pandering, the more he looks like Lyle Levitt with a bad hangover.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:20 pmHe did say it, and defended it.
That’s why I called him a sick freak.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
Considering your history of LYING, unless you can link to it, noone believes you!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:20 pmOnly six senators read the Iraq intelligence before the Freedom Operation began. Why does what O’hanlon say now matter?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:25 pmor o’hanlon could do what #25/steed did — take snippets of comments to completely misrepresent what was said. here’s what bill clinton actually said:
“And the Sunni insurgents that are homegrown, they have a political agenda. They want a piece of the governance of the country. They want a piece of the oil revenues. They want a piece of Iraq’s future.
So that is fine. But in a way, the fact that we have now succeeded with this strategy also shows its limits, because we don’t have the troops to do this all over the country.
And it shows you that ultimately this is a political problem that has to be solved by the Iraqis themselves. Furthermore, I don’t see any alternative consistent with the responsibilities for national security to a substantial withdrawal of troops this year, because the military is so overstressed.”
September 6th, 2007 at 4:29 pmJake - Please don’t suggest that Ringo and others should not voice their opinion or beliefs. This is a forum where exchange of viewpoints is allowed. If we insist that only those agreeing can join in, how is that different than conservative posts?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:30 pmOr a very young Tom Waits.
Comment by toasterhead — September 6, 2007 @ 3:59 pm
How dare you smear Tom Waits like that!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:31 pmIronically, Bill Clinton just undermined TP’s position that the surge has not been a success when he told Larry King in fact “we have now succeeded with this strategy†and we need troops to do this all over the country.
Comment by steed — September 6, 2007 @ 3:07 pm
who? Bill Clinton, the biggest liar to ever hold office? The worst president ever?
I wish you morons would make up your minds, but since you never use them,they never have to be made up.
Love your nic, big boy. On your way to the theatah?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:35 pmHow dare you smear Tom Waits like that!
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — September 6, 2007 @ 4:31 pm
You’re right. I was out of line… My bad!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:35 pmJake - Please don’t suggest that Ringo and others should not voice their opinion or beliefs. This is a forum where exchange of viewpoints is allowed. If we insist that only those agreeing can join in, how is that different than conservative posts?
Comment by texaslady — September 6, 2007 @ 4:30 pm
When I do that, you can respond according. You said ‘can’t we’, and I pointed out the impossibility of your desire as long as wingnuts like Ringo come to disrupt the conversation you so actively seek. We aren’t insisting that only those that ‘agree’ join in, only those capable of a civil debate - of which Ringo isn’t a member.
How is it different? Because Ringo isn’t banned despite being a complete putz - or hadn’t you notice. And your ‘concern trolling’ is quite ANNOYING!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:36 pmLinda - Two choices 1) reinstate the draft, begin training, no excuses allowed. In the meantime bring in troops from Germany and Japan to relieve the present frontline.
2) Bring our military home, talk to surrounding countries and let our troops pull back and bring them home. Leaving only a partial group in the outlying bases. Work with the other countries instead of threatening them. Rebuild our credibility in the world.
But will not happen with this war mongering administration.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:38 pmWell Jake just don’t read my “concern trolling”. Glad to see you have an open mind.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:40 pmWhere’s the exact quote. Link to it, LIAR.
Comment by JakeIsATerrorist
——————————————————–
The day before yesterday toaster head said the the US deserved 9/11.
When I called him on it he defended the comment. I don’t remember which thread.
Yesterday I called him on it again and this was his response:
——————————————————————————————
I said that the U.S. deserved the attacks. That does not mean I feel they were justified.
If someone leaves their luggage on a bench at Penn Station and walks off to buy a pretzel, I feel that they deserve to have their luggage stolen for being so stupid. This does not in any way justify the theft, which is still a crime which I believe should be prosecuted accordingly. I just find it hard to feel much sympathy for the victim, who enabled the crime to happen through stupidity.
Comment by toasterhead — September 5, 2007 @ 2:34 pm
—————————————————————————————–
Fromthis thread: http://thinkprogress.org/ 2007/ 09/ 05/ goldsmith-politics-hiring/ #comments
September 6th, 2007 at 4:43 pmWell Jake just don’t read my “concern trollingâ€. Glad to see you have an open mind.
Comment by texaslady — September 6, 2007 @ 4:40 pm
Of course I have an open mind, but I also have plenty of experience with Ringo and the rest of the ugly trollies that frequent here. They have no interest, capacity or intention of debate, learning or relevant discussions. Just know what you’re up against! The few ‘reasonable’ conservatives that visit here tend to either not stay long, or not be the pain in the *ss that Ringo is so consistent at being.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:43 pmOk, if this piece
had this foaming at the mouth, then this
Author of secret Iraq report declares Iraqi government ‘in collapse’
http://rawstory.com/ / news/ 2007/ Secret_Congressional_report_declares_Iraqi_government_0906.html
will probably cause and aneurysm. We don’t have to act like best friends, but can’t we at least keep some semblance of civility in our public discourse?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:44 pmDuring his recent tour through Iraq, [O’Hanlon] adds, every local briefing he received from the US military said that attacks in that particular sector were down.
The operative part of this sentence is “every local briefing he received from the US military said that attacks in that particular sector were down.” The US military is telling him what they want him to hear, like they are for all those who attend the dog and pony show, and this guy takes it to be the truth. All he is trying to do is to justify his sloppy reporting.
Personally, I’ll believe the GAO before I will believe anything that comes from Bush and his minions.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:45 pmComment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:43 pm
Are you COMPLETELY illiterate? Read BOTH sentences you retarded redneck.
The US has in fact meddled, invaded, attacked and abused most of the middle east - so many ‘objective’ parties would argue we do ‘deserve’ blowback, even if we don’t believe that an attack is ‘justified’, it is ‘expected’.
You really are semi-illiterate, aren’t you, you little f*cker?
September 6th, 2007 at 4:46 pmYou know Jake, Ringo might just start having to question his loyalties having to read through all the posts with facts and debates. Even if he is a paid troll education from TP might sink in.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:48 pmHe did say it, and defended it.
That’s why I called him a sick freak.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
He didn’t say it, he said the policies of the US created violent blowback, and he is right, and you are wrong. The bullshit line “they hate us for our freedoms” is one of the biggest lies the right uses to justify its bloodlust and savagery. They hate us, justifiably, for our actions, not for our freedoms. They would have to be as insane as the rightwingers are to not hate us for what we’ve done or caused in the Middle East for many, many years.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:48 pmHey Ringo, here’s a new word for you to learn:
Noun: blowback
# Unintended negative consequences from some action or policy
“one can seriously suggest that the explosions in Morocco and Saudi Arabia represent the first stages of blowback from the Iraq invasion”
When our military and intelligence services engage in acts of political and military meddling the world over, that has blowback. Whether you believe we ‘deserve’ the particular blowback is you OPINION. However to deny that our actions aren’t in part or wholly responsible for that blowback is just denial and insanity on your part.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:49 pmYou know Jake, Ringo might just start having to question his loyalties having to read through all the posts with facts and debates. Even if he is a paid troll education from TP might sink in.
Comment by texaslady — September 6, 2007 @ 4:48 pm
Ah, the optimism of a ‘new’ poster. Sorry, but there are plenty of posters that give Ringo and his compatriots plenty of opportunity to do just that, they provide facts, figures and debate, I’ve even done it myself. But SOME posters like Ringo are unwilling and possibly incapable of ‘lurnin’ what you want to teach them. I applaud your efforts, I even encourage them! But know that many of us have more experience with the trollies such as Ringo, and know what a heart of darkness he brings…
September 6th, 2007 at 4:51 pmJakeIsATerrorist,
“I said that the U.S. deserved the attacks”
“I just find it hard to feel much sympathy for the victim, who enabled the crime to happen through stupidity”
Your are no better than toasterhead… a dishonest fool, an imbecile and heartless rat.
Sod off.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:51 pmEven if he is a paid troll education from TP might sink in.
Comment by texaslady
—————————————
I’ve learned quite a bit from TP…..I’ve learned that if you push enough buttons, Leftists will let the mask slip and their hatefilled hearts and vile, anti-Americanism will show.
Just read any comment by ronjazz for example.
September 6th, 2007 at 4:56 pmI’ve learned quite a bit from TP…..I’ve learned that if you push enough buttons, Leftists will let the mask slip and their hatefilled hearts and vile, anti-Americanism will show.
Just read any comment by ronjazz for example.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:56 pm
Says the pro-terrorist Ringo that believes we should let Osama go so Bush won’t look bad for the fiasco in Iraq. Says the little anti-american f*cker that believes we should shred the constitution so GOPturds can LOOK tough while f*cking everything up. Says the little t*rd that believes the US shouldn’t have ‘consequences’ for meddling in foreign countries, and that anyone that points out those consequences and tells the truth is anti-american. Says the t*rd that can’t tell the difference between anti-gop-nazi from anti-american!
F*ck off you neo-nazi traitor!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:58 pmSee texaslady, Ringo is a f*cking lunatic!
September 6th, 2007 at 4:59 pmtexaslady,
See comment #127 for an example of an unhinged, Leftist lunatic.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:01 pmWell, I have been posting since before Bush starting pushing the war, not on this blog but others. And actually the artificial posters like Ringo etc eventually fade out. Not letting them push your buttons, staying on track really annoys them.
People like Ringo who may or may not believe what he spews are the same who instead of wanting to help correct America just pretend nothing is wrong. It is a lazy way of living your life.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:02 pmRingo - As you said you enjoy pushing buttons, not to enter into intelligent discussion but just to see if you can make others angry. Strange diversion rather sad tho. Interesting that you have so much time to spend here, a few hours once a week is all I can manage.
Think Progress is my choice because it is inciteful and concise. Most of all when I check the articles I can find backup not just someone spouting off.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:08 pmEither the GAO was “overly rigorous” or “sloppy.” The organization couldn’t be both!
September 6th, 2007 at 5:17 pmtexaslady,
I post here when it’s slow at work.
And I’m usually polite until I am called a Nazi or a fascist.
I agree that TP is ‘inciteful’……unfortunately, I think you ment ‘insightful’.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:18 pmDearest toasterhead @ 67 & 70:
It is, in fact, Mr. O’Hanlon with whom I would like to take such a matter up. In my mind, someone with such sloppily edited reports as to refer to the “General Accounting Office” in 2006 ought not to be lecturing anyone else on their sloppiness.
As for the English grammar component, I would refer you to a noted blog on that particular linguistic phenomenon.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:25 pmThank you for the correction…my free time is over.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:25 pmtexaslady,
Have a nice day.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:26 pmActually, here’s a better post on the subject. (cf. post 70)
September 6th, 2007 at 5:27 pmActually I did mean inciteful, the act of stirring up and I think you meant to say meant. See even adversaries can learn from each other.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:31 pmIt is, in fact, Mr. O’Hanlon with whom I would like to take such a matter up. In my mind, someone with such sloppily edited reports as to refer to the “General Accounting Office†in 2006 ought not to be lecturing anyone else on their sloppiness.
As for the English grammar component, I would refer you to a noted blog on that particular linguistic phenomenon.
Comment by The Witch — September 6, 2007 @ 5:25 pm
I do apologize profusely, good sir! I had you confused with the poster who initially tried to pin the hypocrisy on this web site for juxtaposing the General Accounting Office and the Government Accountability Office. It was the product an unfortunate reading error on my part and I do hope it was received with the jocular spirit with which it was written!
As for the linguistic phenomenon you cited, I am compelled to declare it a hideous affront to the language eclipsed only by this incorrigible Internettery!
September 6th, 2007 at 5:33 pmAhahahah! Good to see we are on the same page after all.
(I wouldn’t worry too much about the Worst. Ever., lolcats, or l33tsp34k, though, if you refer to witches as “sir”!)
Sadly, I must now go back to work… things need copy editing!
September 6th, 2007 at 5:38 pmtexaslady,
Very good.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:42 pm“O’Hanlon’s desire to provide that ammunition has left him in lonely territory in Washington.”
Well, except for:
SEN. CARL LEVIN (D-MI):“…The Military Aspects Of President Bush’s New Strategy In Iraq, As Articulated By Him On January 10, 2007, Appear To Have Produced Some Credible And Positive Results. (Sen. Levin And Sen. Warner, “Sens. Warner, Levin Issue Statement On Their Trip To Iraq, Jordan,†Press Release, 08/20/07)
SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D-NY): “We’ve Begun To Change Tactics Iraq, And In Some Areas, Particularly In Al Anbar Province, It’s Working.â€
Sen, Clinton, acknowledged this week that the surge is paying military dividends:
‘Clinton said new tactics have brought some success against insurgents, particularly in Iraq’s Anbar province.
“It’s working. We’re just years too late in changing our tactics,†she said. “We can’t ever let that happen again. We can’t be fighting the last war. We have to keep preparing to fight the new war.â€â€˜
(Sen. Hillary Clinton, Remarks At The Veterans Of Foreign Wars Convention, Kansas City, MO, 08/20/07)
SEN. DICK DURBIN (D-IL): “More American Troops Have Brought More Peace To More Parts Of Iraq. I Think That’s A Fact.†(Philip Dine, “Durbin Cites Promising Military Progress In Iraq,†St. Louis Post-Dispatch [IL], 08/09/07)
SEN. DICK DURBIN (D-IL): “The Surge Has Resulted In A Reduction Of Violence In Many Parts Of Iraq … And It Is, I Think, A Product Of More American Soldiers Bringing Peace To Areas Of Iraq That Have Been Ignored In The Past.†(Bernard Schoenburg, “Durbin: Surge Helping, But Iraqi Government Must Do More,†The State Journal-Register [IL], 08/09/07)
SEN. JACK REED (D-RI): “There Has Been Increased Tactical Momentum With The Increase In Forces. … In [Anbar Province], There’s Been Tangible Success In Terms Of The Security Situation.†“There has been increased tactical momentum with the increase in forces. As I’ve suggested, it’s been focused on trying to disrupt the movement of insurgents in and out of Baghdad. It’s also been aimed at displacing insurgents in areas like Baqubah and other cities where they are presence was becoming more not only noticeable, but more decisive. We have seen also, complementary to the augmentation of our forces, a positive development in Anbar. And that’s principally the result of a political shift by the Sunni tribal leaders, who have recognized that al Qaeda is a threat to them as much as it is to the Shi’a majority. They have been very effective in working with our military personnel. And in that area, there’s been tangible success in terms of the security situation.†(Sen. Jack Reed, Press Conference, 07/09/07)
SEN. JOE BIDEN (D-DE): “My Take Is Parts Of The Surge Are Working.†(CNBC’s “Kudlow & Company,†08/08/07)
Other Democratic members of Congress who have determined the surge may be working:
Democratic Rep. Brian Baird “saw enough progress on the ground that he will no longer vote for binding withdrawal timelines.â€
Democratic Rep. Jerry McNerney “suggested that his trip to Iraq made him more flexible in his search for a bipartisan accord on the war.â€
Also changing his tune is Democratic Rep. Tim Mahoney of Florida, who says the troop increase ‘has really made a difference and really has gotten al-Qaida on their heels.’â€
September 6th, 2007 at 5:42 pm“SEN. JOE BIDEN (D-DE): “My Take Is Parts Of The Surge Are Working.†(CNBC’s “Kudlow & Company,†08/08/07)”
And the political component isn’t.
The surge has done nothing to aid in efforts at political reconciliation.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:52 pmA bit of cherry picking Exley you also have to admit there is a lot of may be’s and parts are working etc. The picture I am getting is that militarily the surge has has some success. However the political goals for the Iraqi government to reach have either not been met, or in a rather haphazard fashion. Please also refer to reports that the Iraqi military and police units need another 12-18 months to function, and that the Iraqi government has had little gains in creating a stabilized government.
Without making substantial gains on the political end, any military gains will be short term.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:52 pm“Without making substantial gains on the political end, any military gains will be short term.”
Agreed, Krazny (and Barfly). The Iraqi government needs to get its act together. However, the converse of your statement is also true — Without military gains on the ground, substantial gains on the political end will be impossible.
September 6th, 2007 at 5:56 pmSo Exley, what good is the surge, if the Iraqis treat it as just more of the same? The surge can’t be sustained, and all the military experts agree on this fact. So what do we do when troop rotations run out?
Care to enlist?
September 6th, 2007 at 5:57 pm“Without military gains on the ground, substantial gains on the political end will be impossible.”
Comment by Exley
We’ve had four years of “military gains” yet are no closer to a political solution.
The Vietnam syndrome.
September 6th, 2007 at 6:01 pmto be honest Ex, I don’t think the Iraqi government is functional enough to make any of the political goals. As barfly pointed out we have had 4+ years, with very little to show at this point.
September 6th, 2007 at 6:07 pmThe more untrustworthy he becomes the more he scowls and sulks. And look at hsi hair. Michael, bruch it once a day, huh?
September 6th, 2007 at 6:29 pmAgreed, Krazny (and Barfly). The Iraqi government needs to get its act together. However, the converse of your statement is also true — Without military gains on the ground, substantial gains on the political end will be impossible.
Comment by Exley — September 6, 2007 @ 5:56 pm
You’ve had 4 years of the most advanced military on the planet running the show, and THIS is your excuse? You’re a fool.
September 6th, 2007 at 7:00 pmI’ve learned quite a bit from TP…..I’ve learned that if you push enough buttons, Leftists will let the mask slip and their hatefilled hearts and vile, anti-Americanism will show.
Just read any comment by ronjazz for example.
Comment by Ringo — September 6, 2007 @ 4:56 pm
———-
Ain’t that the truth!?!!!
September 6th, 2007 at 8:07 pmAin’t that the truth!?!!!
Comment by mrp — September 6, 2007 @ 8:07 pm
Nope, but it won’t stop hateful jackasses like you from believing it!
September 6th, 2007 at 8:21 pmO’Hanlon has soiled himself; why does the media keep citing him? The answer is, only the neocon media cites him.
September 6th, 2007 at 9:14 pm““SEN. JOE BIDEN (D-DE): “My Take Is Parts Of The Surge Are Working.â€
Idiot! Playing right into the hands of the Bush administration. Another reason why he should not be the Democratic presidential candidate.
September 6th, 2007 at 10:19 pmRomney Senior, who was an honest politician explained the situation very well with respect to Vietnam. He said when you go over there they brainwash you. He indicated that this time he would seek to find out what is going on. This got him labeled as the “brainwashed candidate” and helped do his nomination bid in.
In Iraq its deja vu all over again. People whe go over there get systematically brainwashed by the military, and all too many are naive enough to buy the propaganda.
I guess that O’Hanlon should be called the brainwashed analyst.
September 6th, 2007 at 10:25 pmdoes o’hanlon actually get paid for shooting his mouth off? - man,get me a job at brookings!!!
September 6th, 2007 at 10:30 pmO’Hanlon looks like a young Soviet-era apparatchik. Curious
September 6th, 2007 at 10:36 pmCaption Contest:
“After Gannon’s and Bush’s frat-nite party I threw up on it!”
September 6th, 2007 at 10:42 pmhttp://thinkprogress.org/ 2007/ 09/ 05/ goldsmith-politics-hiring/ #comment-4059371
toasterhead is absolutely a traitor to the US.
September 6th, 2007 at 11:35 pmhttp://thinkprogress.org/ 2007/ 09/ 05/ goldsmith-politics-hiring/ #comment-4059371
toasterhead = traitor
September 6th, 2007 at 11:36 pmhttp://thinkprogress.org/ 2007/ 09/ 05/ goldsmith-politics-hiring/ #comment-4059371
toasterhead = terrorist
September 6th, 2007 at 11:36 pmO’Hanlon. Flat-out selectively credulous. When’s he leaving Brookings for AEI?
September 7th, 2007 at 12:09 amHow rich of the first poster. As if O’Hanlon wan’t immediately attacked once he strayed off the reservation by the same posters here. Hilarious.
September 7th, 2007 at 12:13 amHey O’Hanlon, nice hairdo. I’d ask if you just woke up but your opinions indicate you’re still sound asleep…
September 7th, 2007 at 12:44 am