Kristol: ‘Sober, Serious’ People Want Over 100,000 Troops In Iraq When Bush Leaves Office
Kristol: ‘Sober, Serious’ People Want Over 100,000 Troops In Iraq When Bush Leaves Office
Tomorrow, Gen. David Petraeus will testify to Congress to provide his perspective on the escalation in Iraq. The Washington Post reports this morning that the White House political office has been coordinating with Petraeus for months to market Bush’s strategy to the public:
Ed Gillespie, the new presidential counselor, organized daily conference calls at 7:45 a.m. and again late in the afternoon between the White House, the Pentagon, the State Department, and the U.S. Embassy and military in Baghdad to map out ways of selling the surge.
Petraeus’ testimony should be seen in that light — another way of “selling the surge.” The American public, however, isn’t fooled about what’s going on. 66 percent say Bush will stick with his policy no matter what Petraeus says, and 53 percent say Petraeus will try to make things in Iraq look better than they are.
This morning, Bill Kristol spoke plainly about the White House’s intentions. “The truth is we are going to have over 100,000 troops in Iraq when George Bush leaves office,” Kristol said. He added “sober Democrats who want to be serious about” Iraq and “who want to think about the consequences of losing” are coming to the view that “of course you can’t just pull out.” Watch it:
The Washington Post reports that CentCom chief Admiral William Fallon has been pushing a plan to substantially slash the number of U.S. combat forces in Iraq, and has been engaged in a bitter clash with Petraeus:
[H]is efforts offended Petraeus’s team, which saw them as unwelcome intrusion on their own long-term planning. The profoundly different views of the U.S. role in Iraq only exacerbated the schism between the two men.
“Bad relations?” said a senior civilian official with a laugh. “That’s the understatement of the century. … If you think Armageddon was a riot, that’s one way of looking at it.”
Only “sober and serious” flacks for the White House believe that a long-term presence in Iraq is a strategically sound decision.
Transcript:
WALLACE: Is it a consensus that’s forming? Or basically, has the president has won and the Democrats have lost?
KRISTOL: The president is winning, and sober Democrats who want to be serious about the fact that we are fighting Al Qaida in Iraq, and we are fighting Iranian proxies in Iraq, and serious people who want to think about the consequences of losing to Al Qaida in Iraq or the Iranian proxies in Iraq, are coming to the view that of course you can’t just pull out.
And Hillary Clinton knows you can’t pull out. And some of them want to draw down a little more quickly than Petraeus is going to draw down, and then the surge is going to unwind.
But the truth is we are going to have over 100,000 troops in Iraq when George Bush leaves office, and we are going to be winning the war in Iraq. And the next president is going to continue fighting the war in Iraq.
WILLIAMS: Well, you speak the truth. I mean, I think what you just said is absolutely right. We’re going to have 100,000 troops in Iraq for I don’t know how long.
I think if we ask the American people, Are you willing to have –to sustain that amount of commitment for what? Exactly for what? Tell me why, I think most Americans are going to say…
WALLACE: So why are the Democrats going to sign on?
WILLIAMS: Well, at this point — what you have had over the last several weeks is a campaign by the Bush administration — it’s going to be capped off Tuesday by Petraeus’ report. He’s in an untenable position, damned if he does and says, You know what? This is hurting the Army, and damned if he doesn’t.
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This guy, again.
September 9th, 2007 at 11:46 am
Bill Kristol is a case of Stanely Kubrick meets Yoga Berra. Dr. Strangelove all over again. Parody and ridicule are all that come to mind for me everytime I see his shmegege ass on tv.
September 9th, 2007 at 11:50 amThe American public, however, isn’t fooled about what’s going on.
fingers crossed…
we’ll know after tomorrow how good a sell-job this is…
lord help us…
September 9th, 2007 at 11:51 am…
This from one of the country’s greatest cowards, who equates sitting behind a microphone being heard by no one who is “sober and serious.” Krystol is a fool on a fool’s errand. He is just another WH patsie.
September 9th, 2007 at 11:52 am“Sober and serious Democrats” like…. um…. Lieberman? Yeah, yeah, that’s the ticket!
September 9th, 2007 at 11:52 amI meant to say he equates sitting behind the mike with being a true American patriot and hero.
September 9th, 2007 at 11:53 amOnly the silly drunks want to leave Iraq. Figures.
September 9th, 2007 at 11:54 ami couldn’t listen to all of it, distracted…
September 9th, 2007 at 11:55 ambut snowcroft (?) was on face the nation, after kennedy,
stating that it would be a mistake to get out…
i hope he was using better facts and reasoning than kristol…
…
Kristol go by Neocon’s book:
September 9th, 2007 at 11:55 am‘ Start and support a war that you don’t have to fight…’
with the oil law on hold till after ramadama ding dong , I would expect the Surge to be on hold as well ,
The week should show how hopeless the democrats really are
September 9th, 2007 at 11:56 amHe’s right we need to keep pounding al Queda.
Oh, wait, I forgot. You libs just want to coddle and appease the terrorists.
My bad.
September 9th, 2007 at 11:58 amfake questions and fake answers. A faux interview. Here’s the thinking behind the ’sober and serious’ faux discussion.
Chris Wallace: I ask Bill a question that’s really not a question. It’s pure propaganda.
“Is it a consensus that’s forming? Or basically, has the president has won and the Democrats have lost?”
Bill Kristol: I respond with more propaganda and non sequitors with a liberal use of the word ’sober’ to key the listener who isn’t really listening that i’m talking about sober and serious things
“The president is winning, and sober Democrats who want to be serious about the fact that we are fighting Al Qaida in Iraq, and we are fighting Iranian proxies in Iraq, and serious people who want to think about the consequences of losing to Al Qaida in Iraq or the Iranian proxies in Iraq, are coming to the view that of course you can’t just pull out”
So let’s deconstruct just these two statements by the masters of propaganda. What are they really saying.
Chris Wallace is the stooge, the straight man, delivering the soft serve to Bill. How his father can even tolerate the sight of his son is beyond me.
Bill Kristol is the PR man for the coming attack on Iran.
Both men should be arrested, tried, and convicted for war crimes.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:00 pm” Kristol: ‘Sober, Serious’ People Want Over 100,000 Troops In Iraq When Bush Leaves Office “
So Kristol thinks that only 28% of the people in this country are “sober and serious”. Wow Kristol, you have a very negative view of the people in this country.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:00 pmif you want to know the truth about what the chimp intends in iraq just listen to kristol. kristol speaks to the base audience while the chimp spins the true message to the rest of the country. the neocons want permanent military (forward deployment) bases in iraq, iran and north korea. it’s no secret. the only thing left to do for congress if they don’t want this dunder-headed foreign policy is to use the power of the purse string.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:01 pmIF he wants to keep spouting this crap, he should do his reporting from the streets - OF IRAQ.
I can’t believe this moron STILL is allowed to speak!
September 9th, 2007 at 12:01 pm“Ramadama ding dong”? Nice, very nice. Why do you suppose it is that racists gravitate to the Right?
September 9th, 2007 at 12:02 pmI wouldn’t waste my hard-earned bits on a one whose only claim to fame is having “discovered” (before anyone else) how the phrase: “Stari Decisis” was relevant to Senate Supreme Court nomination hearings.
Thanks Kristie but no great thanks to you for your characterization of your fellow citizens.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:04 pm7. The “silly drunk” is sitting in the White House.
When has Kristol been right about anything? He has been wrong on every prediction he has made in the last 5 years. He’s living in an alternate reality with the rest of the WH crowd.
Remember when Andy Card said, “you don’t roll out a new product in the summer,” is report is the “new” product. Too bad that the majority of the country and the world realizes its the same old tired report refitted with newer phrases.
Kristol is despicable and intellectually dishonest.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:05 pmPetraeus Pan wants all the good boys and girls out there to help save the Iraq Fairy.
You all know what you are supposed to do. If we all just clap a little bit louder, just a little bit more with just a little bigger smile!
You KNOW it will be just fine to keep stumbling along the same straight line. Just clap louder and smile harder.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:06 pmHe’s right we need to keep pounding al Queda.
Oh, wait, I forgot. You libs just want to coddle and appease the terrorists.
My bad.
Comment by firehead
No firedick, you are wrong. The Democrats want to pound al Queda, but unfortunately they are not in Iraq, they are in Pakistan being protected by the government of Pakistan, supposedly our friend. The 2% or less of the fighters in Iraq (supposedly al Queda in Iraq) are a fly in the ointment only.
And no, Democrats don’t want to coddle and appease terrorists, we want to stop making new terrorists as a first step. Then we want to stop doing things that offend the entire Muslim world as a second step. We have no US interests in the middle east and we don’t have the right to try to steal their resources. If I was someone in the middle east, I would be furious with the US also, just like we would be furious with anyone who invaded our country and tried to steal our resources.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:06 pmHe’s right we need to keep pounding al Queda.
Oh, wait, I forgot. You libs just want to coddle and appease the terrorists.
My bad.
Comment by firehead — September 9, 2007
Yes, we need to keep pounding al Qaeda.
Oh wait, I forgot. You righttards think al Qaeda is in Iraq.
My bad.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:08 pmWhat we need to be concerned about now is what Bush plans for Iran. It wasn’t an “accident” that five nuclear weapons ended up at a US base that is the staging ground for flights to the middle east. Anyone who buys that stupid story really does need a new brain.
Someone in the military is trying to warn us what Bush has in the works or Iran. If the Democrats ignore this warning, they will be done for as a party.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:10 pm“sober Democrats who want to be serious about†Iraq and “who want to think about the consequences of losing†are coming to the view that “of course you can’t just pull out.â€
These bastards should have given serious and sober consideration before illegal and aggressive invasion and the murder of 600,000+ innocents. This propaganda tool is a war criminal.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:11 pmThe #9, Tobey Tall is a namejack.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:11 pmI sense a contradiction.
Comment by Dean CT — September 9, 2007
Me, too. Every time you post.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:11 pmIf the Democrats ignore this warning, they will be done for as a party.
Barksdale is …” home to the SAC 2nd Bomb Wing, the B-47/B-52 Bomb Wing, the 91st Bomb Wing, the 392nd Bomb Group, the 301st Bomb Wing, the 376th Bomb Wing and the 4238th Strategic Wing and trains all B-52 combat crew–it is one of the major bomber bases in the country. It is one of the major bomber bases in the country. It is one of the major bomber bases in the country. ”
http://www.counterpunch.org/secor09082007.html
September 9th, 2007 at 12:13 pmWilliam Kristol, son of Irving Kristol who is dubbed “neocon fascist grandfather” is a card-carrying member of PNAC and is pushing this sick, twisted agenda. Of course, if he listened to the polls about getting out of Iraq, he’s realize that his statement about how many troops the people want there is delusional.
This guy is a certified whacko.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:17 pmBilbobaggins: I’m with you there. Nothing Bushco does is ever by “accident”; instead, it’s part and parcel of his ongoing diabolical plot to end this democracy by engaging the rest of the world “against us”…..a world war in which we will be the enemy of all.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:18 pmPeople give Chimpya the “pass” saying that he’s so lacking of intellect that he’s “making mistakes all over the place”. I don’t think so. This guy is a certified manipulator who has been playing his “games” from his youth. He’s a sadist and a fascist.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:19 pmWill the US Really Bomb Iran?
By ALEXANDER COCKBURNhttp://www.counterpunch.org/cockburn09082007.html
“I knew Noam Chomsky used to be dubious about the likelihood of a U.S. attack and emailed him last week to ask if he is still of that opinion. Here’s his answer.
Yes, I was quite sceptical. Less so over the years. They’re desperate. Everything they touch is in ruins. They’re even in danger of losing control over Middle Eastern oil — to China, the topic that’s rarely discussed but is on every planner or corporation exec’s mind, if they’re sane. Iran already has observer status at the Shanghai Cooperation Organization — from which the US was pointedly excluded. Chinese trade with Saudi Arabia, even military sales, is growing fast. With the Bush administration in danger of losing Shiite Iraq, where most of the oil is (and most Saudi oil in regions with a harshly oppressed Shiite population), they may be in real trouble.
Under these circumstances, they’re unpredictable. They might go for broke, and hope they can salvage something from the wreckage. If they do bomb, I suspect it will be accompanied by a ground assault in Khuzestan, near the Gulf, where the oil is (and an Arab population — there already is an Ahwazi liberation front, probably organized by the CIA, which the US can “defend” from the evil Persians), and then they can bomb the rest of the country to rubble. And show who’s boss.
The peace movement had better pull itself together, remembering that should the bombs start to fall on Tehran, most of the Democrats in Congress will be on their feet, cheering.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:19 pm“
“When has Kristol been right about anything? He has been wrong on every prediction he has made in the last 5 years. He’s living in an alternate reality with the rest of the WH crowd.”
Yup. In 2003, during the run-up, he said: “There’s been a certain amount of pop sociology in America … that the Shia can’t get along with the Sunni and the Shia in Iraq just want to establish some kind of Islamic fundamentalist regime. There’s almost no evidence of that at all. Iraq’s always been very secular.”
Why does this bozo still get face time? His credibility is in shreds. My kid just got called up for another tour of duty. Thanks for nothing, Kristol.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:19 pmGet this neo-fascist William Kristol outta here! He’s psychologically deranged and personally toxic.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:20 pmIf we’re staying, then get ready for a draft.
William the bloody is no patriot.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:20 pmI wouldn’t be surprised if the dems are in it.
Pelosi refuses to impeach Bush and the rest of the Democrats keep caving in to Bush admin’s demands (like Reid’s latest compromise for the pull-out date). I’ve begun to think that maybe they’re not caving in. They are willing participants in the whole Iraq debacle and only pretend to challenge Bush so that they’ll get our votes.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:20 pmIt’s football season. That’s a game where controlling the clock is important. Bush should have owned a football team. He timed the surge and the report well. July and August always produce lower casualties due the extreme heat. We will here that the military is having success due less fighting and lower casualties than before the surge. July and August are always quieter than winter and spring months due the extreme weather. Of course, the numbers are up 50% if compared with prior years like periods but all we will hear about is how things are better than right before the surge.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:21 pmThis guy is a certified whacko.
Comment by razzmatazz — September 9, 2007 @ 12:17
How does this guy get a job in the first place let alone continue to be given a prominent public forum? Oh yeah…the liberal media. I think his obviously unvarnished propaganda amounts to war crimes.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:23 pm“I sense a contradiction.
Comment by Dean CT”
This folks, is what is wrong with the right wing. For them it’s all about the person, not idea. They can’t look at what someone says or does and seperate it from the preconcieved ideological stance that the person is supposed to take. That’s why they hate clinton. If you looked at some of the things clinton did during his two terms, NAFTA WTO agreements, welfare reform, you’d think he was a good republcan. If you look at what bush has done in his two terms, created the largest deficet in the nation’s history, supervised the laregest increase in the size of the federal government in history, engaged in two huge nation building projects, you’d think bush was a tax and spend liberal, yet he’s revered by the wingnuts.
Dean can’t understand why the “libtards” would like what fallon says about troop drawdowns because he can’t seperate the person from the idea. It’s not a contridiction Dean, it’s called thinking.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:26 pmOf course, if he listened to the polls about getting out of Iraq, he’s realize that his statement about how many troops the people want there is delusional.
This guy is a certified whacko.
Comment by razzmatazz — September 9, 2007 @ 12:17 pm
Based on your post, this Kristie fella’s subtle but derogatory characterization actually indicts the majority of the American People who want their loved ones home from a tiresome and wearisome war.
I agree!
And Sconset, I would extend your descriptive of Kristie to: ‘Intellectually BANKRUPT’ as well.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:27 pmWow, this country must be hammered then. Have we become the new Ireland?
September 9th, 2007 at 12:27 pmright wing = reich wing
September 9th, 2007 at 12:28 pm‘Sober, Serious’ people know Bill Kristol has been wrong about everything, so they wonder why anyone else would pay attention to his feeble propaganda.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:30 pmSo according to Kristol, the sober and serious are the bathroom lurkers and christian fanatics. Lock him up and cut out his tongue.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:31 pmKaty, did you listen to the ending comment’ on face the nation…Excellent BTW….If we have to ask are we winning and that BenLauden hasen’t been caught, we are not..The fact that people are dieing and they can not rome their street’s freely because of their civil war is proof posative..My thinking as well..Bush’s war is just that and it has caused more of the same..It is time to end the madness…..Their country was better off with their last dictator and so were we….Is it worth it.? Not to me nor all the lost lives…Time for football and the paint brush….Blessings
September 9th, 2007 at 12:31 pmI wouldn’t be surprised if the dems are in it.
SFProgressive, I have to agree with you. It appears that the war Democrats - Hilary, Obama, maybe Edwards (it’s hard to tell), would be willing participants in an expansion of the war to Iran, Pakistan and Syria. It also appears that they would might not have too much problem with a draft, based on the history of the Dem party’s collusion with Johnson’s pro-Vietnam expansion of the draft and war based on a phony attack in the Gulf of Tonkin
September 9th, 2007 at 12:33 pmDeano, Am I right in assuming you were all in favor of Fallon when your dear leader was pushing for his appointment?
September 9th, 2007 at 12:35 pmI see the chairman and co-founder of the Project for the New American Century has spoken. Why doesn’t he go on TV suggesting that the audience thoroughly read the PNAC’s Statement Of Principles that was signed by Cheney, Wolfowitz, and Rumsfeld to see what is behind his words about maintaining a strong presence in Iraq? Why isn’t William Kristol announced as one of the chief architects of the Project for the New American Century by those who interview him? Why don’t they bring up what Kristol himself calls “benevolent global hegemony” as the ultimate goal of the PNAC and that according to these principles, there will never be an end to the occupation of Iraq as it is intended to constitute a permanent military presence in the middle east?
September 9th, 2007 at 12:36 pmOur government can’t even protect us from tainted China toys and toothpaste. This doesn’t lead a serious person to think our government can fix Bush’s mess in Iraq.
Historical statements by Kristol proves he is a crazy lunatic.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:38 pmMaybe Kristol played with toy coated with lead based paint as a child…..No he grew up in a time when the Government actually did its job of protecting its citizens.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:41 pmI love it when the trolls come in and tell us what Libs are about. I have to just chuckle. The GOP and all of it’s pseudo conservative mouth pieces, shmegege ass included, had control of the government for 6 years solo, and failed miserably at all of their campaign promises of smaller government, less government intervention, Social Security reform, immigration reform. Now that the Democrats have taken over all of a sudden accountability and solid explanations of policy are in vogue. shameless bastards all of them. All for the worship of Dear Leader.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:42 pmNot that it refutes my argument (my personal view on his appointment isn’t the topic), but no, I didn’t support Fallon’s appointment in the least.
Comment by Dean CT — September 9, 2007 @ 12:39 p
Just making sure…..anything I can do in the WAR ON CONTRADICTION.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:44 pmHas anyone coined the phrase Neo-douchebag yet?
If not give me credit.
-GSD
September 9th, 2007 at 12:45 pmAnd we all know that What Kristol says about the war in Iraq is always spot on, right? This worthless chickenshit, warmonger has been wrong about everything for over six years. He is as worthless as FAUXNOIZ.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:48 pmHow scary must it be as Mrs. Kristol? Living with a guy who has divorced from reality as Bill, I’d be scared he’d try some sort of “experiment in democracy” in the basement with the kids that involved high-stress bondage, and anal glowsticking.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:57 pmSober serious people?
Like Osama Bin Laden?
He doesn’t drink booze, and he’s always looking pretty serious.
September 9th, 2007 at 12:59 pmAnd I’m pretty sure Osama Bin Laden wants 100,000 troops (targets) in Iraq when Bush leaves office.
So I guess Kristol and Osama Bin Laden are on the same page now.
September 9th, 2007 at 1:01 pmSorry for the double post. TP is messing up again.
September 9th, 2007 at 1:05 pmDeano, Are you claiming that the admiral’s opinions should not be news worthy?
September 9th, 2007 at 1:06 pmDeano doesn’t think Admiral Fallon is sober and serious.
September 9th, 2007 at 1:14 pm†Kristol: ‘Sober, Serious’ People Want Over 100,000 Troops In Iraq When Bush Leaves Office “ — Okay, but what does Bush want?
September 9th, 2007 at 1:16 pmDoes Kristol think talk in that affected croak makes him “Kissengeresque”? What’s the deal with that?
September 9th, 2007 at 1:18 pmFunny how it isn’t considered something for lefties to take responsibility for, when, at the same time, they consider themselves the king of cogent arguments. Comment by Dean CT — September 9, 2007 @ 12:53 pm
Part of being RESPONSIBLE is choosing a path that will achieve responsible results - that’s something you wingnuts WON’T DO! All you care about is your BRUISED EGO and what people MIGHT THINK OF YOU IF YOU ‘APPEAR’ WEAK! COWARD!
Don’t attempt to trivialize my argument with a sarcastic comment, lefty. Either provide a clean rebuttal with links, or don’t post.
Comment by Dean CT — September 9, 2007 @ 12:53 pm
Don’t you mean don’t try to trivialized your SARCASM with an ARGUMENT? DUmbass!
September 9th, 2007 at 1:24 pmOther than Faux Entertainment, who gives kristol any credence? Guess the logo in the lower left will tell anyone with any intelligence (Leaving out the 28-36%ers) that nothing said on there is based on reality.
September 9th, 2007 at 1:34 pmDon’t attempt to trivialize my argument with a sarcastic comment, lefty. Either provide a clean rebuttal with links, or don’t post.
Comment by Dean CT — September 9, 2007 @ 12:53 pm
28% troll trying to lecture thinking people. Go back to Redstate or Drudge…and turn off FAUXNOIZ, crap for brains.
September 9th, 2007 at 1:34 pmKristol: ‘Sober, Serious’ People Want Over 100,000 Troops In Iraq When Bush Leaves Office
September 9th, 2007 at 1:39 pmSo why isn’t this PNAC author in Iraq fighting?
Sober, serious people want to know why Bin Laden is supposedly still out there, why we massacred a country that had nothing to do with 9/11, why our country is being robbed, our middle class shrinking, our jobs being out sourced, our masses without access to health care while corporate media continues to dumb down America while corporate America reaps the benefits.
“Your post is a poor attempt at a rebuttal. TP said it themselves, that he’s unqualified to lead a theatre of ground forces. That means he has no experience which to base his opinion as to whether these ground forces should stay or go. Certainly not over an Army General.”
Dean CT
So what are your qualifications on which you base your opinions? There have been plenty of generals who have said that the Iraq war is a complete mistake, General Schinceski, General Batisite, General Clark, to name three. Why do you accept bush’s opinion over these gentlemen? The only experience bush has is being drunk and awol, and being wrong, of course. Fallon may be unqualified to lead a theater of ground forces, but he’s not blind. If you’re on a bus that is being driven towards a cliff, do you just sit there because the bus driver has a CDL?
And please follow your own advice:
September 9th, 2007 at 1:42 pm“Don’t attempt to trivialize my argument with a sarcastic comment, lefty. Either provide a clean rebuttal with links, or don’t post.
Comment by Dean CT “
So why is TP deleting my comments this morning?
I haven’t done anything wrong, and just posted a simple comment, yet it just dissappears.
September 9th, 2007 at 1:54 pmThe Zionist has spoken for Israeli interests yet again!
September 9th, 2007 at 2:06 pmmr. p/CT is back to his “clever” namejacking again. What an A$$Klown.
September 9th, 2007 at 2:24 pmKristol should spout this drivel in the men’s room stall as that’s the only likely place he find any takers.
September 9th, 2007 at 2:28 pmDoes Kristol realize that he is calling the majority of Americans who want our troops home safely frivolous druggies and drunks?
This is the same rhetoric we heard in the two or three years preceding the withdrawal form Vietnam. Didn’t work then, won’t work now.
Keep on keepin’ on.
September 9th, 2007 at 2:38 pmDean,
Your beginning a response by deriding my post as irrevelent doesn’t make it so. The fact that you think that constitutes reasoned argument only bolsters my orginal response to you. The fact that TP isn’t pigedon-holing someome seems to be a problem only to you. Again, what are your qualification to have an opinion on this subject one way or the other? By your logic, unless you have more experience than Fallon has, your opinion is meaningless. How are any of us, right-wing, left-wing, chicken-wing, eagle-wing, to judge anything that we are not experts on in your world? I guess we should all just take the word of people like Kristol, and bush with out question.
September 9th, 2007 at 2:39 pmDoes Kristol realize that he is calling the majority of Americans who want our troops home safely frivolous druggies and drunks?
This is the same rhetoric we heard in the two or three years preceding the withdrawal form Vietnam. Didn’t work then, won’t work now.
Keep on keepin’ on.
Comment by Street Smart — September 9, 2007 @ 2:38 pm
He doesn’t care! He is a typical Chickenhawk NeoCon who cares nothing for AMerica, our troops, our world standing; only what gets him his money and his Israeli base in the Middle East.
And it took us a long time to turn the tide in Vietnam as well , and now with 70% of this country calling bullshit on BushCo, we will get this Clusterf@ck over with, just probably 4,000 brave lives too late.
September 9th, 2007 at 2:46 pm“And it took us a long time to turn the tide in Vietnam as well , and now with 70% of this country calling bullshit on BushCo, we will get this Clusterf@ck over with, just probably 4,000 brave lives too late.
September 9th, 2007 at 2:50 pmUpside 00″
I wish i shared your optimism, but I don’t see any dems that will end this madness anytime soon.
I wish i shared your optimism, but I don’t see any dems that will end this madness anytime soon.
Comment by Bobwurst — September 9, 2007 @ 2:50 pm
True, and it will take some brave Republicans to speak out and grow some balls too. Assuming there are enough left that haven’t resigned or been thrown in jail.
September 9th, 2007 at 3:01 pmDoes Kristol realize that he is calling the majority of Americans who want our troops home safely frivolous druggies and drunks?
This is the same rhetoric we heard in the two or three years preceding the withdrawal form Vietnam. Didn’t work then, won’t work now.
Keep on keepin’ on.
Comment by Street Smart — September 9, 2007 @ 2:38 pm
——————————–
Hey idiot!
The Honorable WILLIAM KRISTOL didn’t call the majority of Americans “druggies and drunks.” HE CALL YOU moonbats and traitors “druggies and drunks”!!!
September 9th, 2007 at 3:02 pmWill anyone tell that moron that we have 160,000 mercenaries in Iraq in addition to the 165,000 soldiers and marines?
September 9th, 2007 at 3:04 pmWhen Kristol is not misleading, he is lying. The rest of the time he is wrong.
“Serious” people send young Americans to senseless deaths with no conscience or second thoughts. Seriously sick people, that is.
September 9th, 2007 at 3:12 pmI twist my own logic and will desperately defend my irrational loon-friends, the TP.org staff. I don’t make any sense, so please ignore me.
The contradiciton, I secretly admit, is a problem — period. And CT was the first one to call it out, but I need to cover that up.
Sincerely,
Mr. Irrational, AKA Bob “The Wurst” American.
September 9th, 2007 at 3:25 pmTP,
September 9th, 2007 at 3:43 pmGet this namejacking asshat mr. p off here! Now he is Habalaarz.
Get this namejacking asshat mr. p off here! Now he is Habalaarz.
Comment by upside00 — September 9, 2007 @ 3:43 pm
———–
How is “Habalaarz” a namejacking?
None of you guys used “Habalaarz” as a name before I did!!!
Quit your whining, lefy!
September 9th, 2007 at 3:59 pmHey idiot!
The Honorable WILLIAM KRISTOL didn’t call the majority of Americans “druggies and drunks.†HE CALL YOU moonbats and traitors “druggies and drunksâ€!!!
Comment by Habalaarz — September 9, 2007 @ 3:02 pm
BAHAHA, KRISTOL has HONOR? You thieves HAVE NO HONOR, HATEMONGER!!! As for DRUGGIES and DRUNKS, you’re not at the GOP Minister’s Meeting or a BUSH FAMILY REUNION - you’re confused again, go get another HIT OF METH Pee Stain and STFU!!!
As for your TIRADE, considering the DIShonorable Kristol was ATTACKING THE VALUES OF THE MAJORITY OF AMERICAN - you’re a RETARDED LIAR!!!
September 9th, 2007 at 4:00 pmHow is “Habalaarz†a namejacking?
None of you guys used “Habalaarz†as a name before I did!!!
Quit your whining, lefy!
Comment by Habalaarz — September 9, 2007 @ 3:59 pm
AH, Pee Stain, ALL YOU DO IS WHINE, PANSY BOY! Taking the name of a historic figure IS NAME JAKING, PEE STAIN!
September 9th, 2007 at 4:02 pmHey Pee Stain, Abelard wrote about ETHICS, you should read that treatise sometime, you LYING PIECE IF SH!T!
September 9th, 2007 at 4:03 pmComment by Habalaarz — September 9, 2007 @ 3:59 pm
It was your idiotic posts using michaelisretarded and kasinca, you wacko!
Go get a life.
September 9th, 2007 at 4:06 pmI’m an idiot. Rambling is fun, especially when I become a heated libetroll to the point of crapping myself.
Comment by michaelIsRetarded — September 9, 2007 @ 2:18 pm
Ah, PEE STAIN is such a WHINY LITTLE PANSY he has to NAME JACK out of FRUSTRATION AND INSECURITY!!! WAH WAH WAH!!!
September 9th, 2007 at 4:10 pmmr. p/CT is back to his “clever†namejacking again. What an A$$Klown.
Comment by upside00 — September 9, 2007 @ 2:24 pm
It’s the AssBurgers (I mean aspergers), he doesn’t understand the social cues and ‘personal responsibility’ of being an ADULT, that’s why he’s a WHINY GOP BRAT…
September 9th, 2007 at 4:14 pmI’m talking to myself again. I love me a nice juicy assburger.
September 9th, 2007 at 4:16 pmBLAH BLAH BLAH I use CAPS. I LOOK MEAN BY USING CAPS. BLAH BLAH BLAH. I USED TO BE ValiantVenusfrommyanus BLAH BLAH BLAH. I DRINK TERRORIST PEE BLAH BLAH BLAH.
September 9th, 2007 at 4:18 pmWilliam Kristol = chickenshit, chickenhawk, coward, who has never been right about anything in his life…yet the 28%ers listen to his lies every week. Go figure.
September 9th, 2007 at 4:19 pmLOOK AT ME, I’m AN ADULT, LOOK HOW LOUD I CAN YELL OVER THE COMPUTER. I HOPE I DON’T HAVE ANY CHILDREN. BLAH BINLADEN
September 9th, 2007 at 4:19 pmLeave it to me to comment on critical thinking. It’s a hell of a hoot to support terrorists.
I’m a ditz.
September 9th, 2007 at 4:21 pmWhen is Kristol going to come out of the closet like Craig, Foley and the rest of the hypcritical reigh wing?”
September 9th, 2007 at 4:21 pmIt was your idiotic posts using michaelisretarded and kasinca, you wacko!
Go get a life.
Comment by upside00 — September 9, 2007 @ 4:06 pm
————
That wasn’t me, fool.
Jeez, lefties… no wonder your votes don’t count!
September 9th, 2007 at 4:24 pmHey pee pee. Supporting terrorists is allowing them to run free, like Dubya has done with Osama Bin Laden. You worthless cowards on the right call anyone with a brain a traitor and most of the veterans of wars are against you ignorant cowards. Go enlist and serve in a war like I did and then you tell me to my face that I support terrorists you worthless piece of shit. Go straight to hell and do not collect $200, asswipe
September 9th, 2007 at 4:24 pmLook, another talking-point from me! When will I do America a favor and go into the closet?
September 9th, 2007 at 4:26 pmPee Pee, go get a life, you worthless piss drinking coward.
September 9th, 2007 at 4:29 pmIf TP can’t banish that worthless pee pee, I am through with this blog. It is like reading kindergarten everytime I log on with that closet momma’s boy hanging out here. You can have it asswipe.
September 9th, 2007 at 4:31 pmLook, another talking-point from me! When will I do America a favor and go into the closet?
Comment by kasinca — September 9, 2007 @ 4:26 pm
Ditto
September 9th, 2007 at 4:48 pm‘Only “sober and serious†flacks for the White House believe that a long-term presence in Iraq is a strategically sound decision. ‘
Heh! I guess ThinkProgress missed this report today….Another bang-up research job, ThinkProgress! Keep up the sloppy and incomplete work:
“In a report to be released Sunday, a panel of experts assembled by the U.S. Institute of Peace calls for a 50 percent reduction in U.S. forces in Iraq within three years and a total withdrawal and handover of security to the Iraqi military in five years. . . . With some recent security improvements, the biggest problem facing the Bush administration and Iraq is the failure of politicians in Baghdad to reconcile Sunni and Shiite factions and pass critical laws to secure the fledgling new democracy. “The situation remains fluid, but a window has opened, fleetingly, for Iraq to proceed with political reconciliation. Iraq’s national politicians have been unable to take full advantage of this opportunity,” says the report, authored by USIP vice president Daniel Serwer.’
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ wp-dyn/ content/ article/ 2007/ 09/ 08/ AR2007090801144.html
September 9th, 2007 at 5:12 pmDean CT,
Thank you. TP has been in full panic mode for a few weeks now as news of the surge’s success has become more and more evident — So evident that even prominent Democrats are being forced to acknowledge the surge is working:
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS: “One senator said U.S. troops are routing out al-Qaida in parts of Iraq. Another insisted President Bush’s plan to increase troops has caused tactical momentum. One even went so far on Wednesday as to say the argument could be made that U.S. troops are winning. These Are Not Bush-Backing GOP Die-Hards, But Democratic Sens. Dick Durbin, Bob Casey and Jack Reed. Even Sen. Carl Levin, Chairman Of The Senate Armed Services Committee, said progress was being made by soldiers.†(Kimberly Hefling, “Democrats Praise Military Progress,†The Associated Press, 08/08/07)
SEN. CARL LEVIN (D-MI):“…The Military Aspects Of President Bush’s New Strategy In Iraq, As Articulated By Him On January 10, 2007, Appear To Have Produced Some Credible And Positive Results. (Sen. Levin And Sen. Warner, “Sens. Warner, Levin Issue Statement On Their Trip To Iraq, Jordan,†Press Release, 08/20/07)
SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D-NY): “We’ve Begun To Change Tactics Iraq, And In Some Areas, Particularly In Al Anbar Province, It’s Working.â€
Sen, Clinton, acknowledged this week that the surge is paying military dividends:
‘Clinton said new tactics have brought some success against insurgents, particularly in Iraq’s Anbar province.
“It’s working. We’re just years too late in changing our tactics,†she said. “We can’t ever let that happen again. We can’t be fighting the last war. We have to keep preparing to fight the new war.â€â€˜
(Sen. Hillary Clinton, Remarks At The Veterans Of Foreign Wars Convention, Kansas City, MO, 08/20/07)
SEN. DICK DURBIN (D-IL): “More American Troops Have Brought More Peace To More Parts Of Iraq. I Think That’s A Fact.†(Philip Dine, “Durbin Cites Promising Military Progress In Iraq,†St. Louis Post-Dispatch [IL], 08/09/07)
SEN. DICK DURBIN (D-IL): “The Surge Has Resulted In A Reduction Of Violence In Many Parts Of Iraq … And It Is, I Think, A Product Of More American Soldiers Bringing Peace To Areas Of Iraq That Have Been Ignored In The Past.†(Bernard Schoenburg, “Durbin: Surge Helping, But Iraqi Government Must Do More,†The State Journal-Register [IL], 08/09/07)
SEN. JACK REED (D-RI): “There Has Been Increased Tactical Momentum With The Increase In Forces. … In [Anbar Province], There’s Been Tangible Success In Terms Of The Security Situation.†“There has been increased tactical momentum with the increase in forces. As I’ve suggested, it’s been focused on trying to disrupt the movement of insurgents in and out of Baghdad. It’s also been aimed at displacing insurgents in areas like Baqubah and other cities where they are presence was becoming more not only noticeable, but more decisive. We have seen also, complementary to the augmentation of our forces, a positive development in Anbar. And that’s principally the result of a political shift by the Sunni tribal leaders, who have recognized that al Qaeda is a threat to them as much as it is to the Shi’a majority. They have been very effective in working with our military personnel. And in that area, there’s been tangible success in terms of the security situation.†(Sen. Jack Reed, Press Conference, 07/09/07)
SEN. JOE BIDEN (D-DE): “My Take Is Parts Of The Surge Are Working.†(CNBC’s “Kudlow & Company,†08/08/07)
Other Democratic members of Congress who have determined the surge may be working:
Democratic Rep. Brian Baird “saw enough progress on the ground that he will no longer vote for binding withdrawal timelines.â€
Democratic Rep. Jerry McNerney “suggested that his trip to Iraq made him more flexible in his search for a bipartisan accord on the war.â€
Also changing his tune is Democratic Rep. Tim Mahoney of Florida, who says the troop increase ‘has really made a difference and really has gotten al-Qaida on their heels.’â€
September 9th, 2007 at 5:31 pmLet’s face, Exley… TPers aren’t even Democrats, they are nothing but America-haters.
It’s sad really…
September 9th, 2007 at 5:34 pmKowardly Kristol, Rush Limpdick, Trannie Coulter are just a few of the 100.000 I’d like to see fighting in Iraq. (Along with the mindless trolls that support this war who post here).
September 9th, 2007 at 5:41 pmWell, Habalaarz, I wouldn’t go that far. ThinkProgress, as an organization, with John Podesta as its head, is an arm of the Hillary Clinton campaign…So, although I wouldn’t go as far as to call it an American-hating blog, it clearly has some very dishonest people on its staff….Plus, I have had many discussions with some very intelligent, very reasonable liberals on this site who have the best interests of the country at heart. While I may not agree with them, I wouldn’t call them “America-haters.”
But, you are undoubtedly correct that there are a large number of America-haters who post on this blog.
I just don’t think we should paint all of TP with the “American-hater” brush.
September 9th, 2007 at 5:41 pmI suppose you’re right. It’s just that so many of them sound like Osama, that the voice of Pro-America liberals is easily overlooked.
September 9th, 2007 at 6:01 pm* Sharon — September 9, 2007 @ 12:31 pm
sorry for this delay - i had to meet with my daughter for a few hours…
i didn’t get to hear schieffer’s comment this morning,
but i see it has been posted above… sounds powerful…
i’ve noticed that the past several shows, his comments have
been justifiably, reasonably critical of bushco…
i wonder if he and papa 41 are still buddies…
i, for one, am proud of schieffer’s commentary lately…
September 9th, 2007 at 6:05 pm…
#111, Habalaarz,
Believe me, I understand…There are indeed a large number of America-haters who post here and their bile is sometimes so venomous and prevalent that it drowns out the reasonable people here.
September 9th, 2007 at 6:09 pmMan, that’s some good ish Bill Kristol is smoking. Dude must have his talking points playing overnight for osmosis.
September 9th, 2007 at 6:51 pmIt’s just that so many of them sound like Osama, that the voice of Pro-America liberals is easily overlooked.
Comment by Habalaarz — September 9, 2007 @ 6:01 pm
And increasingly hard to hear over the lunatic ravings of righties like Habalaarz..
September 9th, 2007 at 6:53 pmYou all seem to be missing the point. The Iraq war is merely a diversion for what Bush/Cheney could not accomplish with domestic policy. First, the attempted Social Security heist to take the U.S. tax receipts and dump them into their own pockets via Wall Street, failed. This began in the Reagan Administration when the surpluses began showing up in S.S tax receipts. When the surpluses were found, the Republican Congress immediately used them for pork barrel bar-b-que. Senator Harry Reid has referred to this as “embezzlement.” which it is. The professional academics who have studied the issue called it “looting.” This was the deficit that the Clinton Administration repaired. While this was being argued, Bin Laden played right into Bush/Cheney’s hands. It gave them a trumped up reason to go to Iraq to take the heat off of their ridiculous drive to dump the American coffers into their own pockets through every piece of wool they thought they could pull. The perceived asswhuping we were supposed to deliver would show everyone who was smartest. “Shock and awe” became “aw, shucks.” It also gave them a reason to implement Straussian stupidity internationally and once again attempt to dump the tax coffers directly into their own pockets. With Iraq, it worked. It was also a diversionary tactic with regard to the cozy relationship between the Bush family and the Enron executives who thought that they were above the law and legally insulated. ALL GREAT EMPIRES FALL WHEN THEIR RESOURCES ARE DEPLETED! We may win the war after twenty or so years, but we will lose the battle when China decides to foreclose on our loans. They have more soldiers than we have people. Bush and Cheney are just getting rich while they have the opportunity to abuse the power and rig the game in their favor. Meanwhile, you guys throw mud balls at each other while they steal YOUR money. That’s what happens with an MBA presidency. It gives a whole new meaning to “mission accomplished.” Petraeus will give them more time to make more money. The argument always comes down to funding, regardless of withdrawal. And, of course, no oversight. Even if we lose the war, Halliburton is a clear winner and they will have enough resources to pay Cheney what they owe him. It is called “toxic leadership.” It is never about the perception, it is always about the actuality, which always includes obscene amounts of money.
September 9th, 2007 at 6:55 pmI just don’t think we should paint all of TP with the “American-hater†brush.
Comment by Exley
Naw, it’s just the 70% of the American public (roughly 210 MM)… I have an elderly friend who’s wife is a life-long Nevade GOOPer. Her family was very close to Paul Laxalt. We’re talking serious, serious Republicanism here. When Brusch made his State of the Union speech this yr, she went shopping. She told her husband, “He’s got nothing to say I’m interested in hearing.” Damn, those “Bush-haters” are so unfair!
September 9th, 2007 at 6:57 pmProve your military service. Can’t just take your word for it.
Comment by Dean CT — September 9, 2007 @ 4:30 pm
I don’t have to prove shit. I was in Vietnam probably before you got out of high school or elementary school. Armchair heroes with (R) after their names are scumbag America haters. You hate our government and our liberties or you wouldn’t be so stupid to be in the 28% who support this crime family. 72% of the citizens of this country are smarter than you idiots.
This is about the profits of the military industrial complex and the oil companies. Dubya sounds ignorant to most of us because he is talking to the moron trailer trash like you trolls who waste space on this blog. Go talk to the other morons on redstate and drudge. They need your support.
September 9th, 2007 at 7:08 pm“I twist my own logic and will desperately defend my irrational loon-friends, the TP.org staff. I don’t make any sense, so please ignore me.
The contradiciton, I secretly admit, is a problem — period. And CT was the first one to call it out, but I need to cover that up.
Sincerely,
Mr. Irrational, AKA Bob “The Wurst†American.
Comment by Bobwurst ”
Apparently Homer Simpson is a right-wing, name jacking troll, who new?
September 9th, 2007 at 7:28 pmThe only generals with commands are bootlicking asskissers…and to think they would not disagree with a drunken, AWOL coward who has proven to be a miserable failure…Dubya the chief thug of the crime family. We are in a world of sh$t.
September 9th, 2007 at 8:21 pmWhy did someone post a pre-packaged list of positive statements about the “surge” working militarily, but not politically, here and put my name on it? Do nonsensical trolls completely run this place? Who said I supported any of those people such as Biden anyway? Don’t the Democrats have multiple people running for President who openly opposed the war since before it began such as Barack Obama who are quitemainstream and pro-corporation? What does this random collection of quotes have to do with what I pointed out?
September 9th, 2007 at 10:44 pmwhere can i get a pair / set of those Rubbery Lips that Kristol sports ??
i need a pair / set of Rubbery Lips like Kristol has so i can fellate bushcheneynazis like he does.
Ol’ Rubbery Lips is one disgusting sub-human type ….
September 9th, 2007 at 11:37 pmwhere can i get a pair / set of those Rubbery Lips that Kristol sports ??
i need a pair / set of Rubbery Lips like Kristol has so i can fellate bushcheneynazis like he does.
Ol’ Rubbery Lips is one disgusting sub-human type ….
Comment by Kristol’s Rubbery Lips — September 9, 2007 @ 11:37 pm
They come as standard equipment with all NeoCon Chickenhawks.
September 9th, 2007 at 11:41 pmI agree with this under the current circumstances. Leaving Iraq now before dealing with Syria and Iran would be crazy.
Our AIPAC influenced Congress will not let it happen. Saudi Arabia and Israel would scream. Besides, it would guarantee China access to the worlds largest oil reserves as it comes under Shia Iran control (most of Saudis oil are in it’s Shia populations area and while unlikely, could under some circumstances be at risk). Which means we won’t have enough oil to fight anymore wars or have NASCAR races.
Departing Iraq right now can only be done if we destroy Iran and Syria, and install a Sunni strongman to run Iraq. Thats going to take time. Not that I agree we can do it, or should do it even if we could.
The other option, which I favour, is to force Israel to pull out of the occupied territories and allow the Palestinians to have their own state, pull out of the Golan Heights and Shebaa farms, accept the Arab states peace proposal. These are the root causes of the problems of global Islamist terrorism, and in Lebanon (Hezzbollah, dispute over Shebaa Farms), Iran (supporting militant Hezzbollah to protect the Shia population in Lebanon against Israel and induce Israel to give up Shebaa Farms and release their prisoners), and Syria (militant Hamas and Hezzbollah support due to Golan Heights annexation). The Palestinian issue is behind the rest of the Arab states not recognizing Israel except for Egypt and Jordan whom we bribed, which puts Israels security at risk so long as the issue is not resolved.
The US needs to then work out a diplomatic solution with Iran and Syria to ensure they leave Iraq alone and stop supporting the armed factions of Hezzbollah and Hamas, which they will do in return for Israels actions above, and they will recognize Israel. Iran of course needs to agree not to go nuclear and allow the inspections need to verify this.
Then we can maintain a very limited presence in Iraq, say 50,000 troops in bases outside Baghdad and limit our activities to training, and support on request by Iraqs military.
This will not happen under Bush, any Republican not named Ron Paul, nor any AIPAC influenced Democrat.
September 10th, 2007 at 2:27 amWe cannot leave Iraq. Doing so would essentially hand much of the place over to the Iranians. We wil be in iraq in large numbers for at least abother 10 years. We will have people and bases in Iraq for decdes to come.
September 10th, 2007 at 6:56 amAnd we want you on the front line to run the show. Kristol should lead the first march on any insurgents. Go Bill.
September 10th, 2007 at 8:35 amComment by Kristol’s Rubbery Lips — September 9, 2007 @ 11:37 pm
I believe they are standard on neocons - they make it easier for them to lie, twist facts and suck up to Bush&Co.
September 10th, 2007 at 9:45 amBill Kristol-
Trust me, I drive in downtown DC occasionally.
It would behoove you to pay close attention to the “walk/don’t walk” signals.
September 10th, 2007 at 10:13 amWHY DO “SOBER, SERIOUS” PEOPLE LISTEN TO THIS FOOL?
Yes, I know I am yelling. I am yelling as loudly as this medium allows.
September 10th, 2007 at 11:04 am