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	<title>Comments on: What Petraeus and Crocker didn&#8217;t say.</title>
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		<title>By: Daveparts</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4072966</link>
		<dc:creator>Daveparts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Sep 2007 17:53:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4072966</guid>
		<description>Jamming with Geppetto
                                                        By David Glenn Cox




Recently a Bush supporter asked me â€œSo which is it? Is the President an idiot or a genius.â€  The idea being to paint the Presidents criticâ€™s into a corner either heâ€™s a genius and we were all wrong before or heâ€™s an idiot and we are all wrong now.
But the short answer is the President is neither heâ€™s a psychopath. 

A psychopath is mentally ill but believes he is smarter than everyone else, they live in their own alternate reality. Like Geppetto they live alone in the woods and dream of having a friend but instead of going out and making friends they go into the workshop and build one. Then they hope and hope with all their might that it might be so and then presto changeo the boyâ€™s alive!

But no, heâ€™s not, heâ€™s still just a piece of wood carved and painted to look like a boy. To Geppettoâ€™s mind however he is quite alive and Geppetto thinks, â€œI must be the greatest wood carver in the whole world I can carve wood into a real little boy.â€ The clues are obvious if you look for them, why would a lonely man living alone in the woods want to carve a little boy? Why is it that when that little boy, that carved block of wood tells a lie it is the boyâ€™s appendages that grow? You see Geppetto was neither fool nor genius Geppetto was a sick puppy.

Our own Geppetto is knee deep in wood chips happily carving away all the livelong day. He sends his puppets to testify on Capital hill, â€œGeneral Pinnocio you say the situation in Iraq is improving and that the surge is working?â€ But as the puppet lays limp on the table a voice that sounds strangely just like George W. Bush in falsetto answers. â€œThatâ€™s right Senator itâ€™s going sooo good that the surge that was supposed to be only temporary is going to be extended till at least next year.â€

â€œGeneral your testimony hasnâ€™t been influenced by the White House has it?â€

â€œOh no! Senator,â€ the falsetto voice replies, â€œthese strings are the latest style.â€

Serious people, sane people mainly ask themselves, â€œThey canâ€™t be serious.â€
Yet they are and in case you donâ€™t believe one puppet they send two. To corroborate the testimony of a pentagon puppet they send a White House puppet but they all speak with the same falsetto Texas twang. Geppeto watches from his wood shop and slaps his kneeâ€™s saying thatâ€™s working great! 

To this great deliberative body Geppetto sends hand carved puppets to give their honest assessment and they pass Senate muster. However in reality they are two wooden puppets laying limp on the desk and didnâ€™t make a sound that didnâ€™t come from Gepettoâ€™s lips.

The wood carver had promised us explanations and sends instead two chunks of carved wood and the Senators thanked them for their candor. Were it not so serious Iâ€™d think they were just humoring the old wood carver but this august body includes Larry Craig of who it can be said, â€œof all the Charlie Brownâ€™s on Capital hill youâ€™re the Charlie Browniest.â€ As if his decision-making abilities hadnâ€™t already been called into question Craig has now decided to fight his guilty conviction.

Craig mistakes sympathy for support, Charlie Brown gives up 10 runs and drops a fly ball but when Linus says, â€œThatâ€™s alright Charlie Brownâ€ Craig thinks maybe I am a good ball player after all? Craig canâ€™t tell the difference between a wooden puppet and a sap. Maybe because the puppet show has been going on for so long now we accept the foolish as sensible and knotty pine as oak and woodenheaded puppets as leaders.

But Geppetto has help he canâ€™t pull all the strings by himself, not one media outlet had the courage to say, â€œThose are nothing more than wooden puppets and thatâ€™s George Bushâ€™s voice!â€ Maybe the media just doesnâ€™t recognize one of their own? Most all major media outlets as well are run by the same wooden headed puppets and as their ratings slide and their readership declines they ponder how can we fix this? Real investigative reporting? Tell more of the truth? No, more cleavage and change her hair.

I know, weâ€™ll let six million people submit their own questions then we will select the questions we were going to ask anyway and weâ€™ll call it the You Boob Debates and then weâ€™ll let someone fair and non partisan moderate it like Wolf Blitzer! 

But they know, they know the difference between brainpower and balsa as illustrated by Michael Mooreâ€™s solid drubbing of Wolfie and Sanjay Gupta.
Moore exposed the strings and Sanjayâ€™s been staying at Robert Novakâ€™s house ever since. Because once the strings are exposed or flaws in the puppet appear the puppet it is trashed and Geppetto starts again. Six months ago when Donald Rumsfeld resigned all America wanted to know why and now we know, he was a bad puppet. Rumsfeld had given a list to Geppetto of everything that could go wrong in Iraq.

Did the President respond to the list? â€œNoâ€ Do you miss working with the President? â€œNoâ€ When was the last time you spoke with the President? â€œI donâ€™t remember.â€ A psychopath will invent the most fantastic story about train wrecks and space aliens to keep from admitting even a minor mistake. Geppetto may love his puppets but not more than he loves Geppetto. After all wood is inexpensive and itâ€™s easier for Geppetto to just make a new one than listen to them.

Thatâ€™s the scary part of this, a psychopath sees real flesh and blood humans as just things. Things to do his bidding and when heâ€™s finished with them or they donâ€™t perform as ordered he throws them away like scrap wood. Tens hundreds and thousands if need be Geppetto is indeed a sick puppy and needs to be removed to the old wood carverâ€™s home. This is far from a fairy tale this is a nightmare where instead of a harmless old man dreaming of making wooden boys become real a real monster makes real boys dead and doesnâ€™t care any more about it than a block of wood.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jamming with Geppetto<br />
                                                        By David Glenn Cox</p>
<p>Recently a Bush supporter asked me â€œSo which is it? Is the President an idiot or a genius.â€  The idea being to paint the Presidents criticâ€™s into a corner either heâ€™s a genius and we were all wrong before or heâ€™s an idiot and we are all wrong now.<br />
But the short answer is the President is neither heâ€™s a psychopath. </p>
<p>A psychopath is mentally ill but believes he is smarter than everyone else, they live in their own alternate reality. Like Geppetto they live alone in the woods and dream of having a friend but instead of going out and making friends they go into the workshop and build one. Then they hope and hope with all their might that it might be so and then presto changeo the boyâ€™s alive!</p>
<p>But no, heâ€™s not, heâ€™s still just a piece of wood carved and painted to look like a boy. To Geppettoâ€™s mind however he is quite alive and Geppetto thinks, â€œI must be the greatest wood carver in the whole world I can carve wood into a real little boy.â€ The clues are obvious if you look for them, why would a lonely man living alone in the woods want to carve a little boy? Why is it that when that little boy, that carved block of wood tells a lie it is the boyâ€™s appendages that grow? You see Geppetto was neither fool nor genius Geppetto was a sick puppy.</p>
<p>Our own Geppetto is knee deep in wood chips happily carving away all the livelong day. He sends his puppets to testify on Capital hill, â€œGeneral Pinnocio you say the situation in Iraq is improving and that the surge is working?â€ But as the puppet lays limp on the table a voice that sounds strangely just like George W. Bush in falsetto answers. â€œThatâ€™s right Senator itâ€™s going sooo good that the surge that was supposed to be only temporary is going to be extended till at least next year.â€</p>
<p>â€œGeneral your testimony hasnâ€™t been influenced by the White House has it?â€</p>
<p>â€œOh no! Senator,â€ the falsetto voice replies, â€œthese strings are the latest style.â€</p>
<p>Serious people, sane people mainly ask themselves, â€œThey canâ€™t be serious.â€<br />
Yet they are and in case you donâ€™t believe one puppet they send two. To corroborate the testimony of a pentagon puppet they send a White House puppet but they all speak with the same falsetto Texas twang. Geppeto watches from his wood shop and slaps his kneeâ€™s saying thatâ€™s working great! </p>
<p>To this great deliberative body Geppetto sends hand carved puppets to give their honest assessment and they pass Senate muster. However in reality they are two wooden puppets laying limp on the desk and didnâ€™t make a sound that didnâ€™t come from Gepettoâ€™s lips.</p>
<p>The wood carver had promised us explanations and sends instead two chunks of carved wood and the Senators thanked them for their candor. Were it not so serious Iâ€™d think they were just humoring the old wood carver but this august body includes Larry Craig of who it can be said, â€œof all the Charlie Brownâ€™s on Capital hill youâ€™re the Charlie Browniest.â€ As if his decision-making abilities hadnâ€™t already been called into question Craig has now decided to fight his guilty conviction.</p>
<p>Craig mistakes sympathy for support, Charlie Brown gives up 10 runs and drops a fly ball but when Linus says, â€œThatâ€™s alright Charlie Brownâ€ Craig thinks maybe I am a good ball player after all? Craig canâ€™t tell the difference between a wooden puppet and a sap. Maybe because the puppet show has been going on for so long now we accept the foolish as sensible and knotty pine as oak and woodenheaded puppets as leaders.</p>
<p>But Geppetto has help he canâ€™t pull all the strings by himself, not one media outlet had the courage to say, â€œThose are nothing more than wooden puppets and thatâ€™s George Bushâ€™s voice!â€ Maybe the media just doesnâ€™t recognize one of their own? Most all major media outlets as well are run by the same wooden headed puppets and as their ratings slide and their readership declines they ponder how can we fix this? Real investigative reporting? Tell more of the truth? No, more cleavage and change her hair.</p>
<p>I know, weâ€™ll let six million people submit their own questions then we will select the questions we were going to ask anyway and weâ€™ll call it the You Boob Debates and then weâ€™ll let someone fair and non partisan moderate it like Wolf Blitzer! </p>
<p>But they know, they know the difference between brainpower and balsa as illustrated by Michael Mooreâ€™s solid drubbing of Wolfie and Sanjay Gupta.<br />
Moore exposed the strings and Sanjayâ€™s been staying at Robert Novakâ€™s house ever since. Because once the strings are exposed or flaws in the puppet appear the puppet it is trashed and Geppetto starts again. Six months ago when Donald Rumsfeld resigned all America wanted to know why and now we know, he was a bad puppet. Rumsfeld had given a list to Geppetto of everything that could go wrong in Iraq.</p>
<p>Did the President respond to the list? â€œNoâ€ Do you miss working with the President? â€œNoâ€ When was the last time you spoke with the President? â€œI donâ€™t remember.â€ A psychopath will invent the most fantastic story about train wrecks and space aliens to keep from admitting even a minor mistake. Geppetto may love his puppets but not more than he loves Geppetto. After all wood is inexpensive and itâ€™s easier for Geppetto to just make a new one than listen to them.</p>
<p>Thatâ€™s the scary part of this, a psychopath sees real flesh and blood humans as just things. Things to do his bidding and when heâ€™s finished with them or they donâ€™t perform as ordered he throws them away like scrap wood. Tens hundreds and thousands if need be Geppetto is indeed a sick puppy and needs to be removed to the old wood carverâ€™s home. This is far from a fairy tale this is a nightmare where instead of a harmless old man dreaming of making wooden boys become real a real monster makes real boys dead and doesnâ€™t care any more about it than a block of wood.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4072966', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: the Mocha Messiah</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4072219</link>
		<dc:creator>the Mocha Messiah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Sep 2007 04:53:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4072219</guid>
		<description>&gt;no-oath means you â€œcanâ€ lie with impunity! 
&gt;
&gt;Comment by Democrat Soldier â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:32 am 
&gt;
&gt;But it doesnâ€™t mean that they would.

Brilliant non-argument. If theres nothing to hide, why not take an oath to give the testimony more weight? 

 We already know Betrayus lied, look at the glowing report card he gave the Iraq situation 6 weeks before the 2004 election...sounds exactly like what hes saying now.. what a shock.. the dude is a total stooge, kudos to DantheCaveman for posting that list of generals fired for not towing the administration line, I&#039;d love to see a troll adress that..they never will..

dude.. the dems could have really made him look like a fool by starting to swear him in, then watch him stammer and stutter on live tv by saying.. 
&quot;b-b-u-t you said I didnt have to take an oath&quot;?


also, they could have nailed him by asking him to name ONE thing that he disagreed with the bush administration about, regarding the current iraq situation... 

another lost chance for the dems to make a bush crony look like a fool.. go figure..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;no-oath means you â€œcanâ€ lie with impunity!<br />
&gt;<br />
&gt;Comment by Democrat Soldier â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:32 am<br />
&gt;<br />
&gt;But it doesnâ€™t mean that they would.</p>
<p>Brilliant non-argument. If theres nothing to hide, why not take an oath to give the testimony more weight? </p>
<p> We already know Betrayus lied, look at the glowing report card he gave the Iraq situation 6 weeks before the 2004 election&#8230;sounds exactly like what hes saying now.. what a shock.. the dude is a total stooge, kudos to DantheCaveman for posting that list of generals fired for not towing the administration line, I&#8217;d love to see a troll adress that..they never will..</p>
<p>dude.. the dems could have really made him look like a fool by starting to swear him in, then watch him stammer and stutter on live tv by saying..<br />
&#8220;b-b-u-t you said I didnt have to take an oath&#8221;?</p>
<p>also, they could have nailed him by asking him to name ONE thing that he disagreed with the bush administration about, regarding the current iraq situation&#8230; </p>
<p>another lost chance for the dems to make a bush crony look like a fool.. go figure..<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4072219', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: timeisart</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4071803</link>
		<dc:creator>timeisart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 23:41:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4071803</guid>
		<description>What would one expect from these two side performers in Bush&#039;s circus of bozos. They are just saying what the CIC dictates.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What would one expect from these two side performers in Bush&#8217;s circus of bozos. They are just saying what the CIC dictates.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4071803', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: professorjoe</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4071494</link>
		<dc:creator>professorjoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 21:59:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4071494</guid>
		<description>Hey , DanCaveman.  Great Links. Good work. Thanks. I would wonder if the order will be used against the activists that were ejected from the Congressional report from Petraeus.  The chairman did say the &quot;full&quot; extent of the law.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey , DanCaveman.  Great Links. Good work. Thanks. I would wonder if the order will be used against the activists that were ejected from the Congressional report from Petraeus.  The chairman did say the &#8220;full&#8221; extent of the law.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4071494', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: professorjoe</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4071473</link>
		<dc:creator>professorjoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 21:51:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4071473</guid>
		<description>to Katy&#039;s REQUEST:  This is a sad commentary, but there probably is not any one link or a series of links that can change one&#039;s mind if they have bought the mis-perception promoted by this administration. The closest thing that I could suggest would be a personal review of the teachings of Dr. Leo Strauss, a former political science instructor at the University of Chicago. He was the father of neo-conservative thought. His ideas are essentially a political theory, but my studies have shown that it is a very flawed set of notions. Several of the Bush administrators  have been students of Strauss, Wolfowitz in particular wrote his dissertation under Strauss. He is a clear proponent of the war in Iraq and was certain that there were WMDs in Iraq. Strauss&#039; theory in a nut shell is Aristotelean in the  notion that the average man is not capable of moral virtue and the aristocracy should be allowed to do as they please, with the average people being &quot;controlled&quot; by whatever means possible. This includes taking away our rights. Strauss was a German Jew and one of the Hitler Youth whose family fled Germany to avoid the holocaust. However, his indoctrinations as a youth stayed with him throughout his life, including atheism. His view was that the average person could only achieve moral virtue through a combination of religion (Christianity, in America) and military service. The aristocracy, in association with the government, would then send them into battle to validate virtue, elevating them to &quot;hero&quot; status. The Bush Administration has bought this theory hook, line, and sinker and implemented it. The problem with this theory is just that, it&#039;s a theory. And it should not be used unless in conjunction with other balancing theories as all other theories are applied. I ran across this theory working on my Masters in  Public Administration and when I presented the study in class the conservative students were outraged. Many were conservative because of indoctrination and its social acceptability. They were also very wealthy, all of them. The problem with the theory is that it was developed by a man who lucky to be alive, raised in a Fascist  society, did not believe in equality (except for right to life), did not believe in God or Jesus, thought man was generally a corrupt entity, but had no problem implementing religion as a tool to conjure a perception to the &quot;average&quot; person that, if he connected it to military and fought for his country in its name, that they could achieve a virtue which man desires, but cannot attain on his own. And, of course, in a capitalist country, anything is acceptable if it makes money in a perceived legality. Coercion is clearly acceptable. Strauss may have been a genius, but so was Constantine. So was Caesar. So was Augustus. In many ways, so was Hitler. They were also greedy and egotistic. But the theory should be consistent with the belief. It is also the great inconsistency of the Bush Doctrine. Your &quot;brother&#039; has probably bought the perception and his mind is made up. The facts are merely confusing. He is probably also comfortable in his economic social setting, which makes him part of the pseudo-aristocracy. Good luck. I hope this gives you a starting point in your search. Google &quot;Leo Strauss&quot; and follow the links. Then connect the dots.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>to Katy&#8217;s REQUEST:  This is a sad commentary, but there probably is not any one link or a series of links that can change one&#8217;s mind if they have bought the mis-perception promoted by this administration. The closest thing that I could suggest would be a personal review of the teachings of Dr. Leo Strauss, a former political science instructor at the University of Chicago. He was the father of neo-conservative thought. His ideas are essentially a political theory, but my studies have shown that it is a very flawed set of notions. Several of the Bush administrators  have been students of Strauss, Wolfowitz in particular wrote his dissertation under Strauss. He is a clear proponent of the war in Iraq and was certain that there were WMDs in Iraq. Strauss&#8217; theory in a nut shell is Aristotelean in the  notion that the average man is not capable of moral virtue and the aristocracy should be allowed to do as they please, with the average people being &#8220;controlled&#8221; by whatever means possible. This includes taking away our rights. Strauss was a German Jew and one of the Hitler Youth whose family fled Germany to avoid the holocaust. However, his indoctrinations as a youth stayed with him throughout his life, including atheism. His view was that the average person could only achieve moral virtue through a combination of religion (Christianity, in America) and military service. The aristocracy, in association with the government, would then send them into battle to validate virtue, elevating them to &#8220;hero&#8221; status. The Bush Administration has bought this theory hook, line, and sinker and implemented it. The problem with this theory is just that, it&#8217;s a theory. And it should not be used unless in conjunction with other balancing theories as all other theories are applied. I ran across this theory working on my Masters in  Public Administration and when I presented the study in class the conservative students were outraged. Many were conservative because of indoctrination and its social acceptability. They were also very wealthy, all of them. The problem with the theory is that it was developed by a man who lucky to be alive, raised in a Fascist  society, did not believe in equality (except for right to life), did not believe in God or Jesus, thought man was generally a corrupt entity, but had no problem implementing religion as a tool to conjure a perception to the &#8220;average&#8221; person that, if he connected it to military and fought for his country in its name, that they could achieve a virtue which man desires, but cannot attain on his own. And, of course, in a capitalist country, anything is acceptable if it makes money in a perceived legality. Coercion is clearly acceptable. Strauss may have been a genius, but so was Constantine. So was Caesar. So was Augustus. In many ways, so was Hitler. They were also greedy and egotistic. But the theory should be consistent with the belief. It is also the great inconsistency of the Bush Doctrine. Your &#8220;brother&#8217; has probably bought the perception and his mind is made up. The facts are merely confusing. He is probably also comfortable in his economic social setting, which makes him part of the pseudo-aristocracy. Good luck. I hope this gives you a starting point in your search. Google &#8220;Leo Strauss&#8221; and follow the links. Then connect the dots.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4071473', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: Ennealogic</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4071371</link>
		<dc:creator>Ennealogic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 21:01:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4071371</guid>
		<description>Why is there NO discussion in these repetitive hearings about the fact that nearly half of Iraq&#039;s parliament has resigned/walked out?

&quot;Iraq&#039;s parliament has reconvened after a month-long summer break under pressure from Washington to take up key benchmark legislation.
 
The session opened on Tuesday with 158 members of 275 present - enough to form quorum, but the agenda was not immediately announced.&quot;

I keep hearing Crocker and Petraeus (and our own Congress) refer to the Iraqi government as if it were a solid, functioning body.  Last I looked, the government has essentially crumbled and disbanded.  Who is there to take any action toward &quot;political reconciliation?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is there NO discussion in these repetitive hearings about the fact that nearly half of Iraq&#8217;s parliament has resigned/walked out?</p>
<p>&#8220;Iraq&#8217;s parliament has reconvened after a month-long summer break under pressure from Washington to take up key benchmark legislation.</p>
<p>The session opened on Tuesday with 158 members of 275 present &#8211; enough to form quorum, but the agenda was not immediately announced.&#8221;</p>
<p>I keep hearing Crocker and Petraeus (and our own Congress) refer to the Iraqi government as if it were a solid, functioning body.  Last I looked, the government has essentially crumbled and disbanded.  Who is there to take any action toward &#8220;political reconciliation?&#8221;<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4071371', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: DanCaveman</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4071009</link>
		<dc:creator>DanCaveman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 19:03:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4071009</guid>
		<description>Hey Katy,

You wanted stuff that indicates that President Bush may be making an unprecedented power grab to become the dictator of the United states of America.

The first link is a link which describes the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&amp;aid=5853&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;National Security and Homeland Security Presidential Directive&lt;/a&gt; which was issued quietly by the president on May 9, 2007.

The second link describes how a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.phillyimc.org/en/2007/07/41369.shtml&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;July 17th, 2007 Executive Order&lt;/a&gt; can be used against peace activists or anyone who dissents from the President&#039;s policy.

I never would have thought that this country could become a dictatorship a couple years ago; however, current events, the President&#039;s insistence to do what he wants regardless of the consequences, and these two scary orders issued by our President has me a little worried.

I hope this helps.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Katy,</p>
<p>You wanted stuff that indicates that President Bush may be making an unprecedented power grab to become the dictator of the United states of America.</p>
<p>The first link is a link which describes the <a href="http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&amp;aid=5853" rel="nofollow">National Security and Homeland Security Presidential Directive</a> which was issued quietly by the president on May 9, 2007.</p>
<p>The second link describes how a <a href="http://www.phillyimc.org/en/2007/07/41369.shtml" rel="nofollow">July 17th, 2007 Executive Order</a> can be used against peace activists or anyone who dissents from the President&#8217;s policy.</p>
<p>I never would have thought that this country could become a dictatorship a couple years ago; however, current events, the President&#8217;s insistence to do what he wants regardless of the consequences, and these two scary orders issued by our President has me a little worried.</p>
<p>I hope this helps.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4071009', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: jessica b</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070838</link>
		<dc:creator>jessica b</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 17:36:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070838</guid>
		<description>just add &quot;for us&quot; to the end of all crockers and petraeus&#039;s statements.  it makes sense</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>just add &#8220;for us&#8221; to the end of all crockers and petraeus&#8217;s statements.  it makes sense<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070838', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: jessica b.</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070835</link>
		<dc:creator>jessica b.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 17:35:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070835</guid>
		<description>i find that, in order to understand their rhetoric better,  you just have to add &quot;for us&quot; to the end of all their sentences.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i find that, in order to understand their rhetoric better,  you just have to add &#8220;for us&#8221; to the end of all their sentences.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070835', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: katy</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070727</link>
		<dc:creator>katy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 16:43:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070727</guid>
		<description>A REQUEST

i was talking to a middle-road brother (with a dem wife) about how close this country is to becoming a dictatorship and i could tell he was mostly being polite and humoring me...

i would like to send a link to the proof of what i&#039;m talking about...
i have seen some youtubes and other copy, all great, but i want something that can capture and hold a busy executive mind...

something succinct and gripping...

any ideas?  please, and thank you!
...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A REQUEST</p>
<p>i was talking to a middle-road brother (with a dem wife) about how close this country is to becoming a dictatorship and i could tell he was mostly being polite and humoring me&#8230;</p>
<p>i would like to send a link to the proof of what i&#8217;m talking about&#8230;<br />
i have seen some youtubes and other copy, all great, but i want something that can capture and hold a busy executive mind&#8230;</p>
<p>something succinct and gripping&#8230;</p>
<p>any ideas?  please, and thank you!<br />
&#8230;<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070727', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: Nell</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070672</link>
		<dc:creator>Nell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 16:05:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070672</guid>
		<description>We have been manipulated into sacrificing the constitution and our guarantee of rights under it.
We have been manipulated into sacrificing 3800 of our young men and women.

And the Bush gang really really do cook the books in an effort to further manipulate us into sacrificing more of our young men and women.


In out system of justice, the jury (we) decides guilt or innocence, or assigns blame... not the defendant.

The Bush administration is the defendant (and Patraeus is his witness)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We have been manipulated into sacrificing the constitution and our guarantee of rights under it.<br />
We have been manipulated into sacrificing 3800 of our young men and women.</p>
<p>And the Bush gang really really do cook the books in an effort to further manipulate us into sacrificing more of our young men and women.</p>
<p>In out system of justice, the jury (we) decides guilt or innocence, or assigns blame&#8230; not the defendant.</p>
<p>The Bush administration is the defendant (and Patraeus is his witness)<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070672', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: r</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070648</link>
		<dc:creator>r</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:43:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070648</guid>
		<description>Both of them were NOT sworn in under oath, soâ€¦

â€œtheir testimony before House members was hearsay and lies.â€

Comment by Jay Randal â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:06 am

no-oath means you â€œcanâ€ lie with impunity!  

Comment by Democrat Soldier â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:32 am 

But it doesnâ€™t mean that they would.

Clearly more Democrat than Soldier if youâ€™re going to support Jay Randals slurs against a US General.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Both of them were NOT sworn in under oath, soâ€¦</p>
<p>â€œtheir testimony before House members was hearsay and lies.â€</p>
<p>Comment by Jay Randal â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:06 am</p>
<p>no-oath means you â€œcanâ€ lie with impunity!  </p>
<p>Comment by Democrat Soldier â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:32 am </p>
<p>But it doesnâ€™t mean that they would.</p>
<p>Clearly more Democrat than Soldier if youâ€™re going to support Jay Randals slurs against a US General.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070648', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: The Smiths Go To Washington</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070645</link>
		<dc:creator>The Smiths Go To Washington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:38:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070645</guid>
		<description>and... What Petraeus DID NOT Do....

Not many know that Petraeus WAS NOT sworn in yesterday â€¦ and when a CIA agent
yelled out â€œSwear Him In!â€ - he was expelled from yesterdayâ€™s hearing..
http://www.consortiumnews.com/2007/091007a.html

and what the media did not report....

The United States has not had a Legitimate Justice Department since 2000.
The United States has not had a Legitimate Government since 2000.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and&#8230; What Petraeus DID NOT Do&#8230;.</p>
<p>Not many know that Petraeus WAS NOT sworn in yesterday â€¦ and when a CIA agent<br />
yelled out â€œSwear Him In!â€ &#8211; he was expelled from yesterdayâ€™s hearing..<br />
<a href="http://www.consortiumnews.com/2007/091007a.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.consortiumnews.com/2007/091007a.html</a></p>
<p>and what the media did not report&#8230;.</p>
<p>The United States has not had a Legitimate Justice Department since 2000.<br />
The United States has not had a Legitimate Government since 2000.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070645', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: Democrat Soldier</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070636</link>
		<dc:creator>Democrat Soldier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:32:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070636</guid>
		<description>#25 - &quot; wouldnâ€™t expect you to understand the honor and integrity that a military general brings to the table.&quot;

Gen. Westmoreland, anyone?

&quot;The lack of a sworn oath does not change a truthful statement into a lie.&quot;  Comment by r â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:22 am

The lack of a swrn oath does mean that lies cannot be refuted with charges of perjury.  Ask right-whiner Mighty Aphrodite about perjury!  SHe&#039;ll be able to tell you that no-oath means you can lie with impunity!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#25 &#8211; &#8221; wouldnâ€™t expect you to understand the honor and integrity that a military general brings to the table.&#8221;</p>
<p>Gen. Westmoreland, anyone?</p>
<p>&#8220;The lack of a sworn oath does not change a truthful statement into a lie.&#8221;  Comment by r â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:22 am</p>
<p>The lack of a swrn oath does mean that lies cannot be refuted with charges of perjury.  Ask right-whiner Mighty Aphrodite about perjury!  SHe&#8217;ll be able to tell you that no-oath means you can lie with impunity!<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070636', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: dim wit</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070619</link>
		<dc:creator>dim wit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:25:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070619</guid>
		<description>Unless, of course, the ethnic cleansing occurs in Dufar, at which point he just doesnâ€™t care at all.

Comment by Democrat Soldier â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:05 am

ethnic cleansing is only important if oil is involved (or if you need an excuse to distract people from the fact you totally fu(ked up another country and have no way to fix it)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Unless, of course, the ethnic cleansing occurs in Dufar, at which point he just doesnâ€™t care at all.</p>
<p>Comment by Democrat Soldier â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:05 am</p>
<p>ethnic cleansing is only important if oil is involved (or if you need an excuse to distract people from the fact you totally fu(ked up another country and have no way to fix it)<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070619', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: r</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070613</link>
		<dc:creator>r</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:22:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070613</guid>
		<description>Both of them were NOT sworn in under oath, so their testimony before House members was hearsay and lies.

Comment by Jay Randal â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:06 am

I wouldnâ€™t expect you to understand the honor and integrity that a military general brings to the table.  The lack of a sworn oath does not change a truthful statement into a lie.

Sheesh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Both of them were NOT sworn in under oath, so their testimony before House members was hearsay and lies.</p>
<p>Comment by Jay Randal â€” September 11, 2007 @ 11:06 am</p>
<p>I wouldnâ€™t expect you to understand the honor and integrity that a military general brings to the table.  The lack of a sworn oath does not change a truthful statement into a lie.</p>
<p>Sheesh.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070613', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: Grand Moff Texan</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070611</link>
		<dc:creator>Grand Moff Texan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:21:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070611</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Agreed, Roger_Roger.&lt;/i&gt; 

Oh, no!  They&#039;re doing it troll-style!  
.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Agreed, Roger_Roger.</i> </p>
<p>Oh, no!  They&#8217;re doing it troll-style!<br />
.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070611', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: DanCaveman</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070597</link>
		<dc:creator>DanCaveman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:17:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070597</guid>
		<description>Roger_Roger,

The only argument for continuing this occupation has been apocalyptic and catastrophic hypothetical scenarios.  They are not based on any good facts, hard evidence or historical perspective.  I say that the cost is too great for both the US and the Iraqis to stay.  My proof is that most of the violence in Iraq is against the United States of America - move us out of the equation, and the Iraqis can start working out their differences.

Really what it comes down to is that everything above - whether the &quot;surge&quot; is working or not is irrelevant.  The fact is the &lt;strong&gt;Iraqis want us out of their country&lt;/strong&gt;.  We have no right or authority to stay in a country when the whole country (including the government we set up!) wants us out.

In addition to lying us into this occupation, mishandling &lt;strong&gt;EVERY&lt;/strong&gt; step along the way, making tons of money on the blood of the American Military and Iraqi civilians, &lt;strong&gt;this administration has refused, from DAY ONE, to commit the necessary resources and ask the American public to sacrifice&lt;/strong&gt; - No draft to give our troops a break and sustain necessary troop levels.  No taxes to pay for this occupation.  No conservation or civilian contributions to the &quot;war&quot; effort.   Even worse, they neglect our troops when they get home.

There is a reason they don&#039;t ask the American people to sacrifice - because many of the cowards that are cheer leading on the sidelines will change their tune when they have the lives of those they care about at stake.  It will no longer be worth it.  If it is not worth the American people to sacrifice (whether they have to or not) then it is not worth the military to fight.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roger_Roger,</p>
<p>The only argument for continuing this occupation has been apocalyptic and catastrophic hypothetical scenarios.  They are not based on any good facts, hard evidence or historical perspective.  I say that the cost is too great for both the US and the Iraqis to stay.  My proof is that most of the violence in Iraq is against the United States of America &#8211; move us out of the equation, and the Iraqis can start working out their differences.</p>
<p>Really what it comes down to is that everything above &#8211; whether the &#8220;surge&#8221; is working or not is irrelevant.  The fact is the <strong>Iraqis want us out of their country</strong>.  We have no right or authority to stay in a country when the whole country (including the government we set up!) wants us out.</p>
<p>In addition to lying us into this occupation, mishandling <strong>EVERY</strong> step along the way, making tons of money on the blood of the American Military and Iraqi civilians, <strong>this administration has refused, from DAY ONE, to commit the necessary resources and ask the American public to sacrifice</strong> &#8211; No draft to give our troops a break and sustain necessary troop levels.  No taxes to pay for this occupation.  No conservation or civilian contributions to the &#8220;war&#8221; effort.   Even worse, they neglect our troops when they get home.</p>
<p>There is a reason they don&#8217;t ask the American people to sacrifice &#8211; because many of the cowards that are cheer leading on the sidelines will change their tune when they have the lives of those they care about at stake.  It will no longer be worth it.  If it is not worth the American people to sacrifice (whether they have to or not) then it is not worth the military to fight.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070597', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: NeoCONS 'R' SCUM</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070596</link>
		<dc:creator>NeoCONS 'R' SCUM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:17:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070596</guid>
		<description>1- Waging &quot;pre-emptive&quot; war
2. Government- sanctioned torture with no habeas corpus rights for &#039;detainees&#039;
3. Aiding and abetting ethnic cleansing
4. Disrupting and harming regional balance-of power with disastrous results (..handing Iraq, to Iran, on a silver platter, and acting sur-prahsed when it happens, thereby rationalizing war with Iran)
5. Warrantless wiretapping and shredding the Constitution

IMPEACH, IMPRISON, and stop this NeoCON Nightmare.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1- Waging &#8220;pre-emptive&#8221; war<br />
2. Government- sanctioned torture with no habeas corpus rights for &#8216;detainees&#8217;<br />
3. Aiding and abetting ethnic cleansing<br />
4. Disrupting and harming regional balance-of power with disastrous results (..handing Iraq, to Iran, on a silver platter, and acting sur-prahsed when it happens, thereby rationalizing war with Iran)<br />
5. Warrantless wiretapping and shredding the Constitution</p>
<p>IMPEACH, IMPRISON, and stop this NeoCON Nightmare.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070596', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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		<title>By: Uncle Ho</title>
		<link>http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/comment-page-1/#comment-4070586</link>
		<dc:creator>Uncle Ho</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:14:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/09/11/what-petraeus-and-crocker-didnt-say/#comment-4070586</guid>
		<description>&quot;Better than Hiroshima and Nagasaki&quot;- commnet by Jake D(umb)

Again you show your ignorance. You a one sick f*ck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Better than Hiroshima and Nagasaki&#8221;- commnet by Jake D(umb)</p>
<p>Again you show your ignorance. You a one sick f*ck.<a href="javascript:void(0)" title=""  onmouseover="window.status=''; return true" onmouseout="window.status=''; return true" onclick="ddrc_popup('http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/plugins/dd-report-comments/report.php?c=4070586', 400, 400)"></a></p>
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