The troops were coming out anyway.
The troops were coming out anyway.
Tonight, President Bush will spin the drawdown of surge troops to the status quo ante as “progress.” In fact, the pullout is simply a natural result of the fact the military is overstretched. Gen. David Petraeus acknowledged this week that the 30,000 troops were coming home anyway. “Yes, the surge forces were scheduled to go home between April and mid-July, that is absolutely right,” he said. Watch it:
UPDATE: Editor & Publisher takes us on a trip down memory lane, recalling that Bush predicted in January that the “surge” would bring stability.
UPDATE II: The Center for American Progress released this video as a pre-buttal to Bush’s speech tonight, also noting the drawdown is simply part of the military rotation. Brian Katulis calls the speech “much ado about nothing“:
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Moreover, this morning on NPR, Petraeus admitted that the actual number of US troops withdrawn will be far fewer than 30,000:
Reporter: It’s been said that what you’ve described is a reduction in 30,000 troops. Is that, in fact, what you –
Petraeus: What I’ve described is a reduction of five brigade combat teams, Army brigade combat teams, the Marine Expeditionary Unit, which actually is coming out this month without replacement, and two Marine battalions. Now, we want to take out other –
Reporter: That’s a little less than –
Petraeus: Well, we have to do the math, candidly. We’ve got – I have not yet said how many thousands of troops.
Reporter: So when people have said 30,000, they’re not quite accurate. It might be 30,000 — it might be quite a bit less.
Petraeus: Well, we’ve got to determine what it can be.
September 13th, 2007 at 12:53 pmClassic spin:
1) A law is passed that says a cell phone customer must be allowed to retain his/her phone number when switching providers. RESULTING SPIN: Cell phone providers immediately advertise their “new” policy of allowing new customers to keep their old phone numbers.
2) President Clinton pushes a bill through Congress giving money to cities for the sole purpose of increasing their police forces (the cities wouldn’t be allowed to use the money for anything else). RESULTING SPIN: Giuliani brags about his increase of the NYPD as a great accomplishment of his.
3) The Iraq surge has stretched our military even further past the breaking point, and can’t be sustained at surge level for more than a short time. Troops must be drawn back to pre-surge levels, and soon. RESULTING SPIN: Bush claims we are being so successful in Iraq that we are drawing down about 30,000 troops, and claiming that it’s progress.
Don’t fall for it, folks.
September 13th, 2007 at 12:54 pmThis is already a well known fact but I bet you won’t hear a single mention of it during any of the post speech interviews that the “liberal media” will show. Republicans like to use the montra…”let’s wait and hear all the facts” but this is one little fact that will be “overlooked” of course.
September 13th, 2007 at 12:56 pmWow.
Who could have guessed that the meaning of “Surge” used by the U.S. Military and President Bush, was, in fact, the very same as that which can be found in any dictionary.
Surely not I, for I am merely a Lib.
:(
September 13th, 2007 at 12:56 pmI don’t have a lot of sympathy for the General, but sometimes, I swear, I see a glimpse of humanity in him. Not much, but a little glimmer, like part of him is saying “I can’t betray my President, but I can’t lie under oath. Puh-LEEZE ask me the questions that’ll get the truth out about Iraq, but let me retain my thinly veiled belief that I’m not betraying the President?” Granted, he’s doing a hell of a lot of skirting the truth with his misleading charts and his selective decisions on what is a war-related death and what isn’t. But we saw it with the assertion that he doesn’t know if the war is making us safer. We see it now with his admitting those 30K troops would’ve been coming home anyway. The Dems need to ask him the questions that he dreads, but kinda hopes they’ll ask anyway.
“If things aren’t better in Iraq by next summer, where will the new recruits come from? COULD they come from a draft?”
“All those deaths you’re not counting as war related violence…how can you be sure they’re not war-related violence?”
“Can you unequivocally swear to us there are currently no plans for attacking Iran in the next 2 years?”
“Would you swear that all, or almost all, US soldiers have all the training and armor they need?”
Come on, most of you are smarter than I, help me out…
September 13th, 2007 at 12:57 pmCOOL!
edwards has bought 2 minutes on MSNBC to air
a rebuttal to dubya’s speech tonight!
.
September 13th, 2007 at 12:58 pmI like edwards because of his hair.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:00 pmand another thing: “anyways.”
is that proper english? maybe i’m mistaken, but it seems wrong to me… drop the “s”?
petty, i guess… but that’s one that annoys me…
September 13th, 2007 at 1:04 pmit just sounds bad… adding an s makes it plural or possessive, not?
…
Look at me! I’m a lib!
September 13th, 2007 at 1:05 pm4 or 10 thousand American soldiers dead, ten times that severely wounded, at least a trillion dollars pissed away, unbefore seen hatred for America across the world, Russia and China emergence ahead of the USA, watching the sycophants wh*re themselves to the Bush God…..
All for the ego of one sick little man.
Truly the blackest period in our history.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:08 pm#1 Arthur C
September 13th, 2007 at 1:08 pmYou got here first — Yes! I was just going to comment on the NPR interview. Petraeus says he never said 30,000 — he plans to bring home five combat brigades. Someone can correct me — I think a combat brigade is approximately 4000-4500 soldiers.
well, duh. but keep pushing it because too many people are going to think this is some kind of “redeployment” or “drawdown” when really it’s just a return to the pre-surge level.
also keep pushing this:
it’s damning. every american should be aware that the top general in iraq DOESN’T KNOW if what we’re doing there is making america safer.
and you know, i normally wouldn’t do this because i hate grammar freakouts. but it is your headline…
“anyways” should be “anyway”. the word with the ’s’ is non-standard usage.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:11 pm….a pre-buttal to Bush’s speech tonight
————————————————————-
Pre-buttal?
I guess that means that you disagree, not only wth everything the President says, but everything that he’s going to say….even before he says it.
Dang!…Bush is lying even before he speaks.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:13 pmOnly the cultists believe the lies spewed by the Bush administration.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:13 pmBush is one sick little sociopath, eh?
He wants the attention of the world, but everytime he opens his mouth feces fall out.
Tonight will be no different. Do the Dems get rebuttal time, aside from Edwards buying 2 minutes?
September 13th, 2007 at 1:15 pmDang!…Bush is lying even before he speaks.
Comment by Ringo — September 13, 2007 @ 1:13 pm
Hole in one their Ringo, glad you are seeing the light. Just a few steps more into the sunshine.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:16 pm#9 Dang!…Bush is lying even before he speaks.
Comment by Ringo — September 13, 2007 @ 1:13 pm
Some of us have learned from experience — you know “you can fool some of the people some of the time……….”
September 13th, 2007 at 1:18 pmDang!…Bush is lying even before he speaks.
Comment by Ringo
You just now noticed that?
“Welcome to the party pal!”
September 13th, 2007 at 1:19 pmZimzone, I heard that Reed or Ried (one of them) is going to have five minutes on CNN.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:20 pmDang!…Bush is lying even before he speaks.
Comment by Ringo — September 13, 2007 @ 1:13 pm
Now you’re catching on Dingo!
September 13th, 2007 at 1:22 pmWingo Dingo Ringo must be the only one who doesn’t know that our F*ck-up-in-Chief will tell us that the surge is working and 30,000 troops will come home by mid-2008. Or not.
Anyway, who believes anything Bush says? The Republicans I meet are vocal in their contempt for Bush, for lying to them about Iraq and squandering $1 trillion, and for what? To indulge his megalomaniacal delusions of grandeur. That man in the White House is one sick a-hole.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:31 pmahh, katy, you beat to the punch on ‘anyways’. the reason i know this is because i had an extremely annoying associate in high school whose pet peeve was people who said ‘anyways’.
ANYWAYS, this is the breaking point. either things change now and we start bringing troops home or we’re going to have 130,000 troops in iraq by election time next year.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:38 pmBush is crowing at dawn and claiming that he called the sun.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:46 pmyea, arthur…
bush doesn’t care about the troops.
he doesn’t care about the iraqis.
he doesn’t care about any american that doesn’t agree with him.
he only cares about his legacy.
this war isn’t about national security, or ending terror, or making iraq a stable nation. this war is the bush/cheney ego trip, with the additional bonus of war profiteering.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:46 pmOf course he is lying. Anyone who doesn’t understand that is f*cking stupid.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:47 pmYAY!
proper grammar prevails! … thanks, TP…
it’s a pet peeve of mine also, lonesomerobot…
September 13th, 2007 at 1:51 pmAND it’s how i know some of these troolls here are
really just young punks… it is generational…
…
hey, some of us non-trolls are young punks, too ;)
September 13th, 2007 at 1:53 pmThe Center for American Progress released this video as a pre-buttal to Bush’s speech tonight…
Let’s see if Bush proves them wrong. I doubt he will. I’m going to bed early.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:54 pmcheck out what colin powell said in gq:
well, well. i guess he finally is starting to get it.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:57 pmSpin it chimp followers! You’ll all be out soon! I can’t wait!!!
September 13th, 2007 at 2:01 pmhey, some of us non-trolls are young punks, too ;)
Comment by lonesomerobot — September 13, 2007 @ 1:53 pm
excuse me…
September 13th, 2007 at 2:06 pmat 54 i’m still trying to figure out what i want to do when i grow up…
but i was referring to the “75 yr old korean vet”… for one…
…
I understand that the anti-war movement is trying to counter this perpetual “wait and hear us out” tactic, which has delayed any meaningful debate indefinitely. However, a “pre-buttal” will inevitably backfire. Press releases (or ads) like this are too-easily dismissed as “just more attack politics.” It will not convert fence sitters, but only contribute to deeper emotional investment on both sides.
September 13th, 2007 at 2:31 pmOf course he is lying. Anyone who doesn’t understand that is f*cking stupid.
Comment by nanlichi — September 13, 2007 @ 1:47 pm
Like youself!
September 13th, 2007 at 2:40 pmNo Skank, I do understand he is lying.
Go blow the dog again, he’s lonely and misses your gentle touch.
September 13th, 2007 at 2:43 pmSpin it chimp followers! You’ll all be out soon! I can’t wait!!!
Comment by Garçon — September 13, 2007 @ 2:01 pm
That’s what you said when Gore was running. That’s what you said when Kerry was running. I’m beginnibg to see a pattern. Why are you so optimistic? Since 1980 we have had only eight years that have been run by a democrat, and he was not a true liberal. If you think the country(the majotity of the country, not the hysterical left) is ready for Hillary or Obama, you are crazy. They are going to have to move so far to the right to get elected. You love them now: Are you going to love them once the nominating process is over? You will, but they won’t be electible to the majority of the country.
Prey for a miracle! A twelve year old boy fond dead in(fill in the balnk) hotel room might help.
September 13th, 2007 at 2:52 pmJohnny Swank sez:
You’re a reprehensible, sickening little toad.
September 13th, 2007 at 3:00 pmNo Skank, I do understand he is lying.
Go blow the dog again, he’s lonely and misses your gentle touch.
Comment by nanlichi — September 13, 2007 @ 2:43 pm
Go blow the dog? You got a dog fettish huh? Skank? Creative.
They all lie! That’s a big news flash for you? It doesn’t really matter what W says does it? Bush proclaims “the sky is blue” and you would call for impeachment? Sad! The world is watching and you don’t care. They see us divided, and they see weakness, and you don’t care. It’s all about power. Funny thing is, whomever gets the nod in the democratic party, they will be way more to the right than you want to believe. And they will lie to you and me.
September 13th, 2007 at 3:01 pmJohnny Swank sez:
Prey for a miracle! A twelve year old boy fond dead in(fill in the balnk) hotel room might help.
You’re a reprehensible, sickening little toad.
Comment by TripMaster Monkey — September 13, 2007 @ 3:00 pm
Coming from you, that is truly a compliment. It was joke! It’s been said on TP many times that Republicans….forget it.
September 13th, 2007 at 3:03 pmClearly, Betray-us lied to congress right here.
September 13th, 2007 at 3:33 pmJust like his partner in crime, McConnell, lied to Congress about the new FISA powers and the terrorist plot. All sick, twisted liars. They all need to be put out of office on their ear.
IMPEACH NOW!
Don’t sit on the fence any longer if you are disgusted with the Democrats – register Independent today. When the numbers reach 40%, the I’s will have the power and clout they need to enter the picture. Then, and only then, will the political chicanery come to a screeching halt.
September 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pma “pre-buttal†will inevitably backfire… It will not convert fence sitters…
There are no fence-sitters:
AP-Ipsos: “When it comes to the situation in Iraq, do you approve or disapprove or have mixed feelings about the way George W. Bush is handling that issue?”
Approve: 33%
Disapprove: 65%
Mixed: 2%
Not sure: 0%
http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm
September 13th, 2007 at 3:37 pmI will make it a point to watch GW tonight, mainly to see how many of my predictions will come true. Whatever he does say, I am at a stage that I simply cannot believe anything he says. The “Stay the Course” theme in conjuction with more time and the drawdown next spring and summer will be among the top subjects I will be listening for.
September 13th, 2007 at 4:57 pmBush HAS a plan !!!
It’s a great and convincing ad. Senators where fast to debunk Petraeus’ withdrawal move as purely technical. Remember Petraeus replied that yes, the return of the soldiers were already planned, but that he could have extended their tour ! — acting more like a dreadful teacher restoring his authority, than like a general understanding the sufferings and lives of his soldiers and of his “enemies” are at stake. Couldn’t he also press the button just for the sake of making a pool afterward in Washington ?
But I beg to disagree with the punch line of the video.
Bush “has no plan“, Bush “has no strategy“, just as far as you believe the man has a decent goal. But Bush stated his plan very clearly the other day in Australia :
To be invited next year in the OPEC summit !
For Bush, and for his exceptionalists and neocons scene, subjugated Iraq is nothing of a “hot potato”, because he dreams history will remind of him as handing to the next president nothing but a 52nd state, carrying 15% of the world oil reserves. I mean they mean it, one way or the other.
When the pres. constantly says that things are for the better in Iraq, that might be, after all, because his not so hidden agenda is even worst than what’s happening out there. Listen to him :”stuff happens”, “we’re kicking ass”, until “Iraqis stand up”—from under military shoes, “we’re making progress” towards… read my lips. While the democracy kiss, on the ground, is only a full scale counter-insurgency op, including psy-op manipulations we cannot imagine.
Bush confusion between Apec and Opec seems very deliberate on video, and that looks like his jocular obsession with pork, last year in Berlin. If it’s a bad joke, he repeated it three time ! (see a comment on that one here ): //www.dailykos.com/story/2006/7/16/53317/3109.)
Why on earth the Dems have such a problem understanding the true nature of what is at stake with the present administration ? Are they naive or hypocritical ? History will say.
September 13th, 2007 at 10:16 pmwe need to pull the troops out of korea. 50 + yrs of occupation is enough! dmamit
September 13th, 2007 at 11:41 pm